Tell Us How to Make It Better

What You Eat Impacts You and The Environment

April 26, 2022 George Siegal Season 1 Episode 35
Tell Us How to Make It Better
What You Eat Impacts You and The Environment
Show Notes Transcript

April 26, 2022
35. What You Eat Impacts You and The Environment 

We all want to live long and healthy lives and we want our children to have a bright future. But how can we expect that future if our diet is not sustainable with the planet we call home? Ximena Yáñez Soto talks about what we do as individuals is not just a matter of free choice but is crucial to saving the planet and recovering our health. 

Here are some important moments with Ximena in the podcast: 

At 9:11 Ximena explains how proteins work in our food.

At 15:48 What is the trick to eating plant-based and healthy and not feeling hungry right after you are done eating?

At 19:42 What does it take for people to pick up your book and say “I’m going to change?”

You can follow Ximena through the following links: 

 Website: www.BelieveTransformBe.com

 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/believetransformbe/ (English)

 LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/ximenayanezsoto/

 Here’s the link to Ximena’s book: https://www.amazon.com/author/ximenayanez

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Ximena Soto:

So my whole life, I was sick, I had diseases, every kind of disease I had them. So I remember when I was living at my house at my dad's house he used to say hello in the morning. Hi, good morning. How are you? What's your new disease?

George Siegal:

Tell Us How to Make It Better. Is partnering with The Readiness Lab. The home for podcasts, webinars and training in the field of emergency and disaster services. I'm George Siegal and this is the Tell Us How to Make It Better podcast. Every week we introduce you to people who are working on real-world problems and providing actual solutions. Hi everybody. Thank you for joining me on today's Tell Us How to Make It Better podcast. I'm one of those people that would probably be defined as a picky eater. Gluten-free dairy-free soy-free. Try to eat as clean as possible. Don't always get that accomplished. Well, there's a whole other area of eating that I never thought about that my guest today is going to talk about, and that is eating in a way that is sustainable. My guest today is Ximena Soto. She spent more than 20 years as the CFO of a Mexican environmental fund, and now an award-winning and certified international health coach. She's the author of the book, Healthy Planet Healthy You simple habits to create a brighter future. Ximena welcome. Thanks for coming on.

Ximena Soto:

Thanks George. Thank you for having me. It's so such a pleaser pleasure to be in your program.

George Siegal:

Absolutely. Now tell us the problem that you've identified and what you think we need to do to make it better.

Ximena Soto:

Okay, let me explain it from the beginning, a short story. But I work for 23 years in an environmental fund in Mexico city. So I moved seven years ago to Denver, Colorado. So I knew that that chapter of my life was over. So I had to look for something new because I could go to another organization like the funding, but I wanted to do something different because when I was a CFO of these environmental fund, I used to work behind the computer and set all the rules. And I didn't care about people's feelings or thoughts. I was just like, this is a new rule and people would come to me why we don't want to do that. I don't care if you don't do that, there's the door. You can walk out the door. So they called me Doctor No. It was a secret, but I knew they called me. Dr. No. So when I moved, I said, let's see what I can do. So my whole life, I, I was sick. I had diseases, every kind of disease I had them. So I remember when I was leaving at my house at my dad's house he used to say hello in the morning. Hi, good morning. What's your new disease? Because every day I had something different than I went to see a lot of doctors and a lot of pills and meds and things. And once I had a wake-up call when I, I was feeling bad like two or three years ago before. These depressions, two episodes of severe depression. And so I went to see my, my psychiatrist and I told her, please get me something. And she said, you know what? I think this is something different. You should see a cardiologist. So I went to the cardiologist. I didn't want to, but I went and she did some tests. And I had a P O T S, which stands for postural orthostatic tachycardia syndrome. And the thing is that the, somehow the blood vessels they're weak and they can't bring blood again to the heart. And then to the brain, so many people faint, but in my case, my heart was just going, working hard. So I was very, very tired. So she told me back then you have to take a pill for the rest of your life. And then she also diagnosed high cholesterol and she said, you have to take two pills for the rest of your life. And I was used to pills and meds. But not for the rest of my life. I was used to take them for a couple of weeks, maybe a month. And that was it. So this was a wake up call. I had two little girls and I was like, I don't want to be dependent on a medicine for the rest of my life. And I asked her, isn't there a diet I can, I can switch my diet and then get healthier. And she said, there's no connection between diet and health. And something inside of me said, that's not true. And then she said, okay, but give it a try, try for two months. And then you come back and we'll see. So I went, I, I read a lot, I did some research and then I came back two months later and she was like what did you do? What you did is what all my patients have to do. I was feeling better than, than ever. It was, I was just a new person. So when I was thinking, what can I do when I moved to Denver? And I thought, what about, you know, studying something like to become a health coach and then help people in that are suffering the same way I suffered many, many years ago to live happy and healthy lives. So I was in between jobs and I wanted to connect these two worlds, the environmental world and the health world, because there's, there's a connection obviously. And I said, well, what might be the connection? So I was going through, you know, the UN papers about climate change and what we can do. And in between lines, I read something that caught my eye. It said reduce red meat consumption. And I said, I wanna, I want to research on that. I want to go into that and see what what's the thing the UN is saying, reduce red meat consumption. Why? So I started doing these research and what I found it was I said, I have to share these with the world. That's why I wrote my book. But what I found doing all this research is the question is how can we expect to be healthy if our diet is not sustainable with the planet we call home?. So that's the thing I found. That's the problem I found. And I think it's very easy. The solution is simple. We know it it's, it's not easy. It's simple and easy are not the same, but it's a simple solution. It's not going to be easy, but we can do a lot for the planet with that solution.

George Siegal:

Okay. There's a couple of things that come up during the story that I find that are interesting. I mean, probably more than a couple of things. First of all, it's very surprising that a doctor would be so dismissive of how there are other things you could do besides just taking medicine. That, that in itself is very disappointing. I've had doctors that have said that along the way too. It's usually the old school guys that say vitamins, don't . Matter. You know, what you really need to do is is this, this and this. And it's disappointing when you hear that because it's pretty ignorant.

Ximena Soto:

Yeah. And I didn't know back then, I didn't know anything about, I didn't know that what you eat is important for your body, because nobody taught me that I had to learn and I see that happens a lot with people. They don't know that what they're, because if everybody knew we wouldn't be eating. Humanity wouldn't be eating the way we eat. So actually we don't know. And many, many doctors they're just into surgeries or pills. That's what they do.

George Siegal:

That's fine. And nobody would be, nobody would be eating nutela anymore or stuff like that. And then I saw this, I guess they're called holistic doctors or whatever, the chiropractor, doctors, whatever the category is, but this guy told me, he had me get a blood test and he showed me all the things I shouldn't be eating anymore that cause inflammation in your body. And when I stopped eating those things, my health improved dramatically. So I definitely believe the connection, but let's talk a little bit more about the connection in your book. So tell me what the connection is. Connect the dots here for how this makes a difference for us?

Ximena Soto:

Well, You know that I'm telling you that the diet is not sustainable with the planet. We eat a lot of animal protein. That's the reality. We eat animal protein more than three times per day, at least three times per day, because we have been told by our doctors or parents or neighbors or friends, or everybody's telling us, eat your proteins. And if you, I ask you if I say the word protein, what comes to your mind?

George Siegal:

Wow. You know, would that be things that are in, in, in meat?

Ximena Soto:

Yeah, most, most people answer with that meat, chicken fish,

George Siegal:

but you're going to tell me this other foods that I'm getting protein in that I don't, that I don't know about.

Ximena Soto:

We don't know. That's the thing. Nobody taught us actually proteins. I'm going to break it down for you. Proteins are just long chains of a thing called amino acids. So when you have a long chain of amino acids, you have a protein. The way our stomach works, he said we eat the proteins and the stomach breaks the links in between the amino acids and your body stores the amino acids. And then your, your body is a protein factory. Your body builds the protein you need, according to your DNA requirements and information. So it's not that you eat the piece of meat and then the protein there is going to go somewhere in your body. Your body's going to build those proteins. The thing is science has discovered 20 amino acids. We, our bodies can make eleven of them. But nine, we have to get them from what we eat. And of course, a complete protein, we call complete proteins. Those foods that have those nine essential amino acids, which are meat and cheese and chicken and all of those things. But everything that grows from the ground, from the soil has also chains of amino acids. We call them incomplete proteins, but because depends on the family of foods, they lack one of the nine essential amino acids. So can we live with, without one of the essential amino acids? No, no, we can't. We need the nine essential amino acids. The thing is that if you combine different food families, let's say fruits and seeds or legumes and seeds you will have a complete protein. You will have all the nine essential amino acids and you don't need to eat them in the same meal. Your body will have all those nine essential amino acids, and then it will be able to build the proteins you need. So we've been living a lie. Of course, the food industry they want to make money. That's that's what they aiming for. They're not aiming for health or for a better planet, a healthier planet. They're aiming to become more profitable. So they're telling us that the only way we get our proteins are animal products. And that's a lie. If we combine that's called protein complementation, if we combine all different plant foods, we can have complete proteins.

George Siegal:

So do you eat no animal products at all? Is that completely out of your diet?

Ximena Soto:

The only thing I still eat? And I wouldn't say I wouldn't say don't eat animal products. The thing is we eat a lot of animal products and to sustain that we use this thing called industrial farms. And if everybody in the planet ate the same way, we in the U S or in Mexico, a lot of animal products, we would need seven them planet earths to supply that demand. So I, I still eat a little cheese, a little bit of cheese, my family we're plant-based so we mostly eat plants and some other, they, they eat meat or whatever they like, like chicken, chicken. So it's not like don't eat animals. We can eat animals, but not in the way we're eating any most right now.

George Siegal:

Okay. Well, here's where it's a problem for somebody like me because I I'm gluten free, soy free, dairy free. But when I go to the store and I look at plant-based things that are for sale in the market and you read what's in them, that ends up being a pretty toxic little package of food, in my opinion, with some of the oils they put in to make that, or some of the fillers they put in to make it. So tell me how you eat, because I'm curious to learn this, but I think I would starve to death if I just said, okay, I'm eliminating this completely. And if I tried to buy the plant stuff that has a lot of it just looks like it's not that healthy.

Ximena Soto:

Well, you know plant-based processed foods are still processed foods. So, you know, food is information for our bodies. So we have the good information that really best information that comes from fruits. And we have the really zero bad information that comes from processed foods. So plant based, whatever you read, vegan, gluten-free whatever, if it's processed it has zero than official information. So it doesn't matter if it's not, if it's not plant-based or it's not, gluten-free, it's just the same processed foods are just the same. So I'm gluten free too. So I eat a lot of plants. I eat legumes, a lot of legumes. Lentils, chickpeas. Sometimes I, instead of I have a cauliflower steak. I can do a lot of recipes with gluten-free noodles they're made of rice or rice. For example, yesterday, I'm going to tell you what we ate yesterday.

George Siegal:

Yeah, I would love to know because I'm starting just thinking about what you must be going through.

Ximena Soto:

Beautiful. Artichoke, with nothing, just, I prepared something with olive oil, a little bit of tamari sauce, that the one that has no gluten. So it's sauce with no gluten and a little bit of lime. And that was the thing I use to give bring some flavor to the artichoke and then we ate some chilies rellanos Which is which our stuffed chili peppers with lentils that I cook with spinach and coconut milk and tomatoes and onions and cilantro. So that was inside of a chili. And then aside of it could be sometimes I use brussel sprouts that I steam, and then I use almost the same that I told you I used for the artichoke. But yesterday we used a steamed rice. So, and you can go with the one that's not white, the whole rice. Yeah.

George Siegal:

And then you have to make all this stuff. Do you, do you cook it? Cause I'm not a cook. And so I, when I, I have a few friends that are, that are like you, that, that sound like they know how to cook. And so eating like that, you can make it clean. But if I went to go buy that someplace and I found a few places online, what happens is they send it to you frozen, and it's a small portion, so you're starving after you eat it. So I have my plant-based dinner and then I want to eat a bag of chips or something. Cause I'm so freaking hungry after that.

Ximena Soto:

Well, there's a trick, there's a trick. And yeah, I cook now when I lived in Mexico, Mexico, you are used to have help in the house. So I, I, I used to say that I burned the water. Like I couldn't cook anything. So I came to the U S. and ha ha surprise. You have to start cooking. So I started from knowing nothing. I didn't know anything about how to cook. So I started like that. The thing is you can have some tricks to feel fuller. One of the tricks I always tell my clients because we're used to eat a lot and we don't need that much. We're eating more than the needed. So in order to bring your stomach to a normal size you have to start like little by little, but when you're used to eat a lot of stuff, you can start with a big salad, a huge salad, like with all of the colors you can have lettuce and you can have some cabbage and tomatoes and cucumbers, cilantro, everything you like with a little bit of olive oil, salt, and lemon, but make it a big plate. And then go for the other thing and you'll see you have no space because what we're doing right now resemble animal products, they don't have fiber. That's one thing that plants, they have fiber, they will, they will make you feel satisfied. And we're leaving that when, when we eat a lot of animal products and I'm not saying they are the worst for our bodies, the worst are processed foods. Animal proteins are in between plants and, and processed foods. The thing is that when you eat a lot of animal products, you're leaving out a lot of things that have great information for your body, like antioxidants and vitamins and minerals, which are fruits and vegetables. So when you start with a big salad plate you are giving your body something that locks, because for some reason, we, during a few evolution, we have grown with this species of plants. They've grown with us this at the same time. Now we're eating things that we just invented 20, 30 years ago that have no information, not good information for our body. So when you eat these plants, the salad, your body is getting all the information it needs to work and be healthy to work at its best.

George Siegal:

Now, when you buy your fruits and vegetables, do you only get organic?

Ximena Soto:

I try to, there's a listing them. I think the page is called it E G E EWG, the environmental working group. And you can find there every year they do some research and they see what's, I think they call it the dirty dozen. So they see which fruits and vegetables are the ones with most pesticides and herbicides and all those things. And they recommend you to eat those you to go organic. So I don't buy for example organic avocados or organic bananas. I go for the apples or maybe the peaches and maybe the grapes, because those are the ones with, with more, you know, re residues of pesticides and herbicides.

George Siegal:

No. I always like to ask my guest what the biggest challenges and what they're doing. I think it's obvious what your challenges and that's people don't want to do it. They, they like eating the crap that they eat. You know, people want to eat hot dogs and hamburgers people still go to McDonald's and KFC which is a whole other subject. How do you, how do you change people's minds? Is it, do they need a health scare? What does it take to get people to pick up your book and go I'm going to change?

Ximena Soto:

Yeah, first of all, you, we need to be in awareness and consciousness. So the thing is that we are destroying the planet. One third of the greenhouse gas emissions. They come from agriculture from having these animals in these industrial farms. So we kill 8 billion people in the planet, almost 8 billion people in the planet. And the 96% of the mass of all mammals in the planet are us and the livestock we have domesticated, 96% of mammals. So that's we're not working to be bio diverse. We're working to keep it close. And if we don't have bio diversity at some point we're not going to make it. So that's one thing we have to bring awareness. The other thing is we're, we're sicker than ever our kids. When we were kids we didn't hear about, you know, diabetes or heart problems with the kids or liver problems. And now our kids are obese and they're sicker. I I've read different opinions. They say that our kids are gonna live longer than us, but in worst conditions, I read that this is the first generation at least my, my girls that are going to live less than our generation. So it's divided, but see what we're doing to the planet, what we're doing to, to our kids and climate change. It's a huge compute component. One third of the greenhouse gas emissions. And because we're feeding these animals, the things we feed them, which are not the natural food for them, it's seeds and grains, and we're, we're planting them. And we're doing these in, in huge expanses of space of land. And we're just it's the same crop over and over and over. So we have no biodiversity. And we we're, we're losing biodiversity in the soils. So the soils have very important component for trapping carbon, again, from the atmosphere to the soil, to the ground to bring it down to earth. And we're also depleting the seas from Marine animals, which are also a carbon sink. The way we leave and the way we have, we're always trying to satisfy or urgent needs. We're not thinking about the future. We're not thinking about our health or children. The things that could be start going, if we start like doing differently planting differently having deep diversity in crops. That will heal the soils and the souls will be able to capture carbon from the atmosphere. So we're talking about a huge component of climate change.

George Siegal:

Yeah. I mean, as you meet people and you talk about this, which. Which reason maybe get some to do action. I mean, if you told me, Hey, eat better because you're going to help the environment eat better because you're going to reverse climate change. I would look at you and go, no. But if you said your health is at stake and you could live an extra 20 years, I'm all in. I'm like, okay, tell me what to do.

Ximena Soto:

The thing is I'm doing this because there's an old saying that goes, we didn't inherit the earth from our ancestors. We oh my goodness. The word within any inherit planet from our ancestors, we borrowed it from our children. And we're not doing that. We're not thinking about our children. And we say, we love them and there's nothing we wouldn't do for them. And the only thing we should be doing, because in 10 years, they're not going to be worrying about getting the job of their dreams. They're going to be totally focused about climate. We're not doing the only thing. And you should know that because you have the documentary about we're being parents without knowing the only thing we should be thinking about is giving them a place to live. And we're not doing that.

George Siegal:

Do you eat fish?

Ximena Soto:

I don't eat fish because the seas are so polluted with mercury and I had a thing going on with mercury a couple of years ago, so, yeah. And I'm, I'm so sorry. There's there's people that say it's from, you know, it's salmon from Norway. The seas are all the same polluted with a mercury. And we are, you know, this is a fascinating number in the U S we kill every year, 9 billion animals for human consumption. We're 8 billion people in the world. The U S we kill 9 billion animals every year. And the, the figure, the global figure is 53 billion animals every year. And this figure does not include Marine animals. Marine animals are like five times that, that amount. So we are depleating the seas and the seas are becoming warmer and warming warmer. And they're unable to capture carbon from the atmosphere because we, a lot of animals, we just, this is not sustainable. Not sustainable.

George Siegal:

A buddy of mine sent me a, tik-tok video this morning. And it was about Costco chickens, and they have a $4 and 99 cent whole chicken that they sell. But if you read the ingredients that are in this thing, that is one toxic bird, plus it's raised in a chicken sweat shop and you know, my rule of thumb is if there's ingredients, I don't know what they are, why am I buying that? You know, I like the chickens, even though you probably don't need this, but, but maybe you do. Sometimes when I go to whole foods, the chicken has two ingredients in it, or to Sprouts, it's chicken and salt and water when they, whatever they do. So it is possible to get a better choice.

Ximena Soto:

It's possible. There's thing called. Most of our food comes come from industrial farms. They treat the animals in horrific ways. They have to give them antibiotics because they're sick because they're not eating their natural food. As in fish farms. Also, they swim in their feces and they're eating also pellets. So these animals are sick. So they have to have antibiotics and they give them hormones so they can grow faster and look better for the consumers. So we're eating sick animals. Now. There is another way of farming, which is holistic farming or regenerative farming. And this is goes hand in hand with sustainability. They leave all the animals, just to grace freely. They eat the grass. There are a lot of plant species around. So this is a place like more like nature, not things we haven't been to, to, to hoard animals or, or plants. So With this, these are, are, are healthier animals. They're they're healthy actually, so we can eat them. The only thing with that is that we couldn't eat the way we eat right now with holistic farms, because they, they wouldn't be able to supply the actual demand for animal proteins. So we should eat them. Eventually, like in the blue zones, you know, about, about the blue zones in those places where people leave more than 100 years. There's one here in California in Lomalinda, and there's one in Costa Rica and one in Italy, one in Greece. And the other one is Okinawa, Japan, these people some of them, they don't eat animals, but some of them, they, they use animal products just as a garnish on their plate. There are more, more plant-based so if you want to be healthier, it, yeah, eat plant-based. You can eat a little bit of animal protein and having these holistic farms, which are better for the environment wouldn't allow us to eat the way we eat now. We wouldn't be ... There's no room like for every carnivore, large, this planet was not designed to sustain large carnivores for every carnivore in the African Savannah, there are 100 prey animals that require a lot of space. So every time you, you are eating animals, you are demanding a huge spans of space from the planet.

George Siegal:

Are there recipes in the book if I pick up the book, so I'll be able to start eating like that?

Ximena Soto:

I have 16 recipes, they were made by a plant-based Mexican Chef. We have some Mexican recipes, but also Asian. And they're great. You, you wouldn't believe you have no meat? No. So, yeah, believe that because it's, it's true. Sometimes I, I invite people and I cook as I cook, and then they say, this is delicious. Are you sure this doesn't have any animal products? No.

George Siegal:

We just tried a new company that I saw online and they deliver the meals the first week. And out of six meals, four of them were packaged poorly. So the sauce broken or they weren't all the same size, they'd just look different. So it was really disappointing. So I definitely want to check that out. If you had to give some advice to any entrepreneurs out there, you, you kind of reinvented yourself. You went from, you know, Mexico city to Denver and started something completely new. What would you tell somebody who has an idea of something that they want to do and, and solve a problem and make things better for the rest of us.

Ximena Soto:

Yeah. It would go for something that has to do with cooking, maybe for people that don't have the time, but I should say, make the time for cooking. That's one of the most important things of your life, what you're bringing to your body, that those are the building blocks for your body. So it's not a minor thing, cooking is, is a, is a blessing. So if you can spend half an hour, 45 minutes, some of these recipes in my book, there are 45 minutes. It won't take more than that. Because you can touch the ingredients, you can touch the onion and there's something going on when you touch them, there's an exchange of energy and things that are happening. When you touch the carrots or you touch the lentils, there's, there's something going on. And I read, I don't know if this is true. It's it's it happens when you plant your own things. In my case I have some, some like Sage or you know, thyme or cilantro if I have them, and you touch them, you're going to start exchanging some information and there they're there all their chemicals are going to arrange in a way that they're good for you because they can sense you. They, they read you. So what happens when you touch an onion? When you touch an apple you're, you're giving information to that plant and it's changing its chemical composition for you. So that's what everybody says when you're cooking. That's what's happened, you're exchanging

George Siegal:

Wow, that that's a little out there. I mean, I've seen a lot of unhealthy looking chefs that, that are obviously touching a lot of food. Maybe they're touching the wrong food, but my question was really more along the lines of like to other entrepreneurs, somebody who has an idea and maybe they're, they're living someplace, they want to do something different. What would you say to give them a kick in the tail to say, go out there and try your idea? It worked for me. I think it's a good thing.

Ximena Soto:

Yeah. I think what worked for me is I review my life and the things I didn't want in that moment, in that moment, I felt like nobody loved me because yeah. I was like I had something in between people on me. Like, you have to do this. I don't care about you. I don't care. So that was the thing I didn't like. Then I was like, what things have happened in, what am I an expert on? Like, I was an expert on changing diet and seeing with my own eyes, how I had always had a deteriorating health and suddenly I was strong and healthy and I was feeling like never before in my life. So what has worked for you? Where are you an expert? Because everybody has experiences. You are an expert in something because in your life you live that maybe you're an expert in sorrow, for example, or pain like spiritual pain or something like that. So we'll use that if you want to change, use the things that work for you, but, you know. Look at the things that you don't like anymore, you don't want any more in your life and bring that together. That worked for me. And then I started finding these things and now I have a book. I never thought I would write a book. And now I have a book and I'm trying to bring this knowledge to people. We can do something. He's decade to do something for kids. So yeah, I'm going to do it and I'm going to, until I'm tired. And even if nobody listens, I'm going to keep telling people we have to change. We have to change ourselves, our economies, our societies. Imagine if all consumers team up to change our diets, it's not about politicians anymore. Like making the rules. It's about us demanding them. And if they don't change, we can change the, the demand and supply chain. Because we are changing from the bottom. So it's the bottom up revolution. That's it. We change. And then our economies and societies will change.

George Siegal:

Now. The book is called healthy planet, healthy use simple habits to create a brighter future. Where do people get the book and how can they find you?

Ximena Soto:

Yeah, well, the book is on Amazon. So there, and they can find me. I have a website, www.believetransformbe.com

George Siegal:

I'll put it in the show notes too, so people can see it. And then you're on all social media platforms.

Ximena Soto:

If you go to my website, there's, you can find the links to my social media..

George Siegal:

All right. Well, I got to check out the book just to see those recipes. Cause I'm running out of food to eat.

Ximena Soto:

They're amazing. And we can, we can do it. I know I did it. I, I didn't know how to boil water.

George Siegal:

No, that's certainly a motivational example. I mean, I love hearing stories from people that actually have done something and they swear by it and it's actually good for people. I mean, I can think of no reasons not to do it other than the time it takes to do it. And what you're saying is that's really not a good excuse.

Ximena Soto:

It's not a good excuse. Check the time you, you, you are in your socials checking. You have the time you have 45 minutes.

George Siegal:

All right, Ximena. Thank you so much for coming on today. I appreciate your time. And I look forward to reading your book.

Ximena Soto:

Oh, thank you for having me. It was really a great experience. Great. Thank you.

George Siegal:

Thank you for joining me on today's. Tell Us How to Make It Better podcast. If you liked what you were listening to please share the link with your friends. You can even leave a review online, and if you have ideas for future guests, there's a contact form on our website. Tell Us How to Make It Better dot com and I would value hearing from you any thoughts that you have about the program? Once again? Thanks for listening. See you next time.