Ep. 138 | Ministry Partner Update: Carter & Danielle Jackson

On today’s episode, Astin Kahnk and Chip Parker joined by some special guests: Carter & Danielle Jackson! This organization is one of our ministry partners at The Orchard Community Church, and we’re excited to catch up with the Jacksons on their ministry in West Africa. Let’s dive in!

Resources:

info@emberglobalvision.org

emberglobalvision.org

If you have any questions about this podcast, or about The Orchard Community Church, we would love to hear from you! Visit our website at theorchardcc.org and fill out our contact form, or send us a message on Facebook (@IAmTheOrchard) or Instagram (@theorchard.cc). Until next time!

Transcript

SPEAKER_03 0:00

And you can see even where we are in West Africa. I think God is really doing a lot and there's going to be a shift taking place where there has been a lot heavy on the missionaries and Westerners coming in to share the gospel and do that work. But I think it's going to be shifting to God's going to be sending out locals back because there's kind of not a diaspora going on, but a lot of movement, people movement.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

And so in Christianity, we look at this person as made in the image of God, that they have dignity, that they have honor, that they deserve respect, and that we think there is something better for you in your life. Not just physically to get off the street and break that generational cycle of physical poverty, but there is a God who loves you, who sees you, who wants to redeem you and give you so much more in your life than what you're currently experiencing.

SPEAKER_05 0:49

Welcome to Let's Talk About That, the podcast where we deep dive into Sunday's message and explore your questions. I'm your host, Aston Kank, and I'm excited to share this journey with you. Whether you're a longtime member of the Orchard or a first-time visitor, Let's Talk About That is your space to explore, reflect, and connect. Join us as we navigate the intricacies of faith, spirituality, and daily life, seeking to understand how the wisdom shared on Sundays can be applied to our modern challenges. So grab a cup of coffee, find a comfortable space, and let's dive in together. This is Let's Talk About That, where the conversation about Sunday's message never stops. Well, welcome back to Let's Talk About That. We hope that you guys are having a great start to your week. Well, we are sitting down with two of our Orchard friends today, just catching up. Carter, Danielle, how's it going?

SPEAKER_00 1:46

We're doing great. Thank you for having us. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:49

Excited to be here. Yeah, absolutely. So uh you guys were in. Oh, and Chip.

SPEAKER_01 1:53

Yeah, just whatever's fine. It's fine. I'm here.

SPEAKER_05 1:56

I mean, by default, you're usually here.

SPEAKER_01 1:58

I know, I know. So I actually I'm glad that you brought me in because it's been a minute since we've done this. It has. Matter of fact, I think the last time that I asked this question, you might have been the one that we asked it to when you came on the podcast before you came on staff. So we have a question that we ask new guest on the podcast.

SPEAKER_05 2:15

Well, hold on, let's let's rewind. Since I've taken over, I've tossed the question out. But since Chip is here, he feels led to have this icebreaker question.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

Feels led, I like likes chaos, all the things back to high school student government. Lots of icebreakers. So, Carter, we'll ask you first, but then Danielle, you need to answer, answer too. We'll give you more time to think there. Okay. If you were a flavor, what flavor would you be?

SPEAKER_05 2:39

And this could be like coffee flavor, like any type of flavor.

SPEAKER_00 2:43

It's like okay, so I'm I would say I'm I love barbecue sauces. Oh, but I would also say my favorite flavor of chips, and not chip, the pastor of the orchard, but the chips that you can use. Easily can feed that you can eat. Uh my favorite flavor of chips are the Zaps voodoo chips, which I probably should not be saying. What a bowl. Yes, that's an elite bowl right there. I should not probably say the word voodoo on a Christian podcast.

SPEAKER_04 3:11

It's a flavor.

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Yeah, it's just a flavor. It's basically a combination of barbecue mixed with salt and vinegar. Oh and it's combined. And basically, if you go to a sub shop, a deli shop, a sandwich shop, it's the, in my opinion, the best chip combination to go with a sandwich. And that's just the name of their flavor of chips. But yeah, it's barbecue mixed with salt and vinegar. You don't think it would go together, but it is someone brought that over to us when we were overseas, and I was like, okay, I'm gonna ration these out because I don't get them very often. I ate them in like a day. I was just like sound the cows.

SPEAKER_01 3:46

I wish everybody around this table and listening to this podcast could know how happy I am with his answer because that is the type of answer I expected from my man Carter Jackson. What an elite pull. What an elite pull.

SPEAKER_00 4:00

I was like, I was thinking to myself, I could say ranch or you know, some sort of like same barbecue sauce.

SPEAKER_01 4:04

My favorite answer all the time on the podcast is when we were doing a mom cast and it was before my day. Yeah, it was three ladies, Mary Beth, Casey Dix, and I think Casey Young were on there. And instead of asking them what flavor they were, because none of them had could answer it, I said, What flavor would you know one of the others be? And Casey Dix looks at Mary Beth and goes, She's definitely a strawberry. And Mary Beth goes, Oh, thank you. Like, what how is how is that a thing? Yeah, how do you know? What is that new?

SPEAKER_05 4:33

Strawberry like sweet, kind, like goes in the flow.

SPEAKER_01 4:37

I've never thought of strawberry and kind in my life, but you know, sure.

SPEAKER_05 4:41

Well, even like strawberry shortcake, the little like character. Okay. Yeah, okay. Yeah. That makes sense. I think that character's kind. Like that's what I think about it.

SPEAKER_00 4:48

A character?

SPEAKER_05 4:49

Yeah, it's like a little like grab, it's a strawberry shortcake.

SPEAKER_00 4:53

It's like it's a food, but it's also like a little dog. Oh sorry. It's all about the food for me.

SPEAKER_01 4:58

Yeah, Danielle, save us. If you were a flavor, what flavor, what flavor would you be? I'm really curious what Carter would say.

SPEAKER_00 5:04

No, oh no, don't bring me. I already got my I already have my elite pool of a sauce. I don't know now. I mean, she loves her coffee.

SPEAKER_03 5:13

So I mean, I'm just gonna say the first thing that popped in my head when you asked the question was a lemon. A lemon.

SPEAKER_01 5:20

Oh, okay. All right, because so here's the thing. If Carter had said lemon, that might have been a kind of moment. But because you say lemon, you've got a reason in in your head about it. So so unpack lemon for.

SPEAKER_03 5:32

Well, again, it was the first thing that popped in my head. So I was like, why did I think that? So then I was trying to come up with the reason after, actually. I think I can be a bit intense, which when you taste a lemon, it's like, whoa, you're intense. You know, like I kind of come off like really intense with people. Yes, truth. And it can be kind of sour, but at the same time, I think lemons can, I think anywhere they go or any food that they touch, whether it's savory or sweet, it just enhances the flavor. Girl, enhances the flavor was exactly.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

That was such a good answer. Yes. That is a phenomenal discernment illustration. Will preach, as they say.

SPEAKER_00 6:08

That was that was really good. All the foods that you have, and you have like a side of lemon you can squeeze on it, fish and meat, and oh, do you want sweet tea? You want lemon with it, water and that's a really good answer.

SPEAKER_05 6:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 6:20

We can read lemon the day.

SPEAKER_01 6:22

Let's do this. I love that. That's that's phenomenal.

SPEAKER_05 6:25

Well, Carter, so we uh did the Impact Tomorrow magazine with you guys and your family. But since that magazine, I'm sure there's a lot that's kind of happened. So I would love to kind of hear, you know, where your family's at, what are you guys doing? Yeah, how is God working in you guys? Just a good update from you guys.

SPEAKER_00 6:42

Yeah, and I would say just a quick recap for those that are listening that maybe aren't familiar with who we are and uh what we're doing. So I'm actually from Lake City, born and raised here, and my dad served on staff with the orchard for a long time and helped kind of start the youth ministry. So I grew up as a student all the way from student ministry, was back at the Holiday Inn all the way back from the original. OG D O G D Y O B. Yeah. Yeah, basically, truly. Um, I think we were there maybe in the first few weeks of the orchard getting started. And yeah, so was really raised in my faith through the orchard all the way through college, and then so blessed and grateful to be a part of this community. Even driving back into Lake City today, I just was like, honey, I'm home. I love it. And I'm like, this is there's just something about coming home to where you're from, your hometown, even though I've lived now all over the world. There's just a special connection and special feeling that you you get when you come back. And so I just want to say that, yeah, I'm a product of the Orchard Community Church and love the community, the church, the people that are here, even if I don't get to be here with you guys, with my physical presence, it's always a blessing to be back in town. And so raised in here, and then we lived in Honduras for three years, serving there with the ministry. Our son was born there, Emmett, and then we uh are currently living in West Africa. So we live basically, if you got on a boat out of Jacksonville and just went straight across the Atlantic Ocean, those countries that exist right there on the Atlantic Ocean and North Africa, that's kind of where we're located. Danielle, my wife, we met right before we moved to Honduras, and we've been our entire marriage really has existed on the mission field as missionaries.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

And we Yeah, how long did you guys uh how long were you married before you headed to Honduras? A month. I was gonna say I remember it be, I remember it being quick.

SPEAKER_00 8:32

Wow. Again, most people that want to go on the mission field as a married couple or even as a family, what's hard about doing that is you have to, I'm air quoting by the way, on the the uh the podcast, you can't see that, but it's you have to kind of break down your life in a way of oh, we have to get rid of the sports, the after-school activities. Our whole marriage has been founded on this house and this mortgage and our community that we've built. And then we have to think about going overseas. Whereas if you were, you know, young, mid-20s, and you just get married, that you don't have a house. You don't really have cars with car payments, you don't have a bunch of jobs that you have to think, well, I've built this career for the past 10, 15, 20 years. You're just ready to go. And so that's why I think it is a good but also challenging age because you have the freedom and the flexibility to go overseas as a missionary, but you also what some of the things you do is you lack the life experience, the, you know, like, hey, we haven't resources, connections, things like that. Yeah, so you're a little younger on the young side. So yeah, there was there were a lot of challenges to getting married and moving overseas. There was again, all we all we owned was in our suitcases. We didn't own cars, we didn't own houses, we just, you know, had our Bibles and suitcases and said, hey, we want to go serve in Honduras. And that's was was an amazing, beautiful thing. But at the same time, it was like, oh, and now we're on top of learning about married life and all that comes with marriage and the challenges that you face in early marriage. Now you're also learning a foreign language, living in a foreign country, being in a stranger in a foreign land, everyone constantly looking at you, whether it's the color of your skin or the accent that you have, or constantly being confused. And so the good thing about Danielle and I is that we both have a love for adventure and traveling and living overseas. I would even say, going back to being from Lake City, I just always felt like I didn't belong here. And that not in like a way that I felt like I was too good for where I was from. I just constantly felt like I'm just supposed to be somewhere else. And so I always mess with Trey, Trey Lee, shout out about him and I were best friends all through high school and even into college, and still one of my best friends today. And I always used to say, Trey, what are you doing, man? We got to go out, we got to explore the world, we got to go somewhere big, like we got to do. And he's always like, No, I'm really content right here in Lake City. I'm gonna live and die and be married right here in Lake City for and I would always just get so frustrated. And a lot of that was my immaturity at the time of not realizing that God calls people to different places and makes people content where they are, and and puts, I think, kind of this urge in other people to go and do different things, and that's okay. And we should celebrate all of those people. And so, but now, yeah, in in my 30s and off to West Africa, yeah, we've been over there for a year and a half, and we moved over there. I would say a lot of mission organizations and missionaries that they go to a specific country or region with a plan in mind. Hey, we're gonna build 50 schools over the next 20 years. We're gonna start, you know, 20 wells in places with bad drinking water. We're gonna build a bunch of medical clinics in these places because they need this. And when they get there, they basically bulldoze over a lot of people for the sake of what they want to go do. And again, I don't think it's inherently wrong if you have a dream and a vision for a place, but I think what we wanted to do specifically as the Jackson family was hey, we there were doors that opened for us to get into this country. We know this is where God is leading us, but we don't really know exactly what we're going to do there. And that's also really hard when you go speak at churches and support racing. We're like, so what are you doing? We're like, we don't really know yet.

SPEAKER_04 12:00

We're just gonna go. We're waiting on God.

SPEAKER_01 12:02

So we had that conversation, you know, before you went over there. You were like, we know this where we need to go. We know this is where we want to be. Not sure exactly what that's gonna look like two, three years from now, once we get roots down and get a clear sense of God's calling. But I mean, I think it, you know, when you're in ministry, especially missionary, you're supposed to have, you know, this strategic game plan, bullet points. Here's what we're gonna accomplish in the next, you know. But I mean, the truth is the Christian life is about obedience one step at a time, right?

SPEAKER_05 12:31

And yeah, and just being open-handed of like your will, not mine.

SPEAKER_01 12:35

Yeah, you you don't know what you don't know what the next step is until you take the one that's in front of you.

SPEAKER_00 12:40

Absolutely. And so when we went over there originally, it was humbling to go to people and say, we don't really know what we're doing yet. But I would say that sometimes also honesty is the best policy in that regard. Like, hey, we're being honest with you, that we're not, we're not trying to come up with some sort of thing to kind of deceive people that we a hundred percent have this idea put together. We just wanted to say, hey, we're gonna go over there and learn language. We're gonna acclimate to the culture and then meet people, locals that are there and say, hey, what do you need? What resources do we have stateside, or what experiences do Danielle and I have, whether it's our university degrees, experiences, things that God has equipped us as Westerners with in terms of organization planning, some things that maybe are needed to help start and sustain an organization or a ministry. And we'll just ask local people and kind of see what are the needs here.

SPEAKER_03 13:31

And so we went over there and started to I'm gonna interject real quick too, because I think it was a little bit different for us to share in that way that we didn't know what we were doing because we are part of a smaller organization. Like we're we're very much independent as missionaries. Okay. But if you go to a place like West Africa, for example, there most missions organizations, if you were to join that missions organization and move to West Africa, your first two years, you're only in language school. Oh, really? Like your full-time language school, you're not really doing much ministry. And so essentially what we were telling people was that same thing. It just wasn't under, you know, oh, we're with this big organization like Pioneers or Sim, or if if we were a part of any of those organizations, it would have been the same exact thing. What we had, being more independent, was we know that this is the first thing that we need to do. Learn culture because there's so much acclimation. It's such a culture shock. We, I think, went through it a little bit easier because we had the prior experience of living in another country like Honduras. But for people who are brand new on the field, like it's a pretty big, it's a big shock. And if you got young kids and you're trying to adjust your whole life, right? And this time, Honduras, we had no kids. This time we had two young kids. We've moved over there with a five-month-old and Emmett turned three a few days after we learned.

SPEAKER_05 14:48

So how have they been with like the language? Are you guys like, are they also learning the language as well? Or is it kind of just what you guys are teaching them?

SPEAKER_03 14:53

Yeah. So we we did want, we do want our kids to to learn the language where we are. There is a an American school for missionary kids and anyone else who wants to send their kids there, but it's a Christian American school, so it's all in English. But something that can happen with that is you kind of you can get kind of pulled into this bubble. Uh yeah. And your kids go to that school and then come home to an English speaking home, and they they don't interact much with the locals or the community outside of the walls of their school. And so when we went there, our kids being so young, not in full-time school, and it was, you know, bad ability to go to a preschool. We did put him into a a preschool, a local preschool. Just so you know, like we have to be very vague about some things. If I catch my words, sometimes that's what I'm doing. No, you're we can't. This is being online. And so he went to a local preschool in the mornings and then where he was immersed in more of the culture and language, and then in the afternoon he would go to missionary school or emerging school. So we kind of had the best in both worlds, and we were able to still be a part of that community with some of the other missionaries and expats, but also know that our kids, Emmett, was getting a little bit of that local flavor, I guess, and experience. And then Shiloh had we have a nanny at home. Okay. And so she's immersed in three languages pretty much at all times today.

SPEAKER_00 16:11

Yeah, Emmett He'll count wild. I don't speak English well. I speak country boys. That's right. I'm from trailer county, baby. No, I laugh because Emmett, oh, he will he loves to show that he can count to 50 in French and he has the colors and the days of the week.

SPEAKER_03 16:27

So it's is French the language. Most of West Africa was colonized by the French. Okay. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 16:33

So, you know, and again, every country has tons of tribal languages in Africa. That's just the reality of where we live. But one of the differences where we live in our country is that there's a tribal language. It's actually every tribe speaks that language. Okay. Because that's the dominant largest tribe in that country. But French is still spoken by, I would say, more people with more access to education, more men are going to be able to speak French where we're located. And it's sometimes it's kind of like a mix between, you know, people say Spanglish, Spanish, and English, sometimes like El Taco, you know, stuff like that. Well, where we are, it's kind of a mix between French and the tribal language. So you'll hear kind of both, and you're sitting there thinking, okay, I'm learning educated, formal French. And then I try to speak that, and they think I'm speaking, you know, like some like Shakespearean version of French to them, but I'm like, I thought this is what I'm supposed to speak.

SPEAKER_03 17:21

The best part is when they're talking to you and they're explaining something to you, and you just kind of look at them or you ask them to clarify, and the question you always get is, Do you speak French? You're like, Yes, I speak French, but you are not speaking French.

SPEAKER_00 17:35

I know what I'm saying. Like, bonjour. I got this. Exactly. You understand the words that are coming out. Truly.

SPEAKER_05 17:42

No, did you take French in high school or did you take Spanish?

SPEAKER_00 17:44

No, I took I to four years of Spanish.

SPEAKER_05 17:46

Okay, so it's in French. So I would know a little bit of Miss Wise and Picania. Miss Monopolized. Shout out Miss Wise.

SPEAKER_00 17:52

Yeah, well, I'm again. I took it was really funny. I laugh. Anybody listen to this and think that so I took four years of Spanish in high school at Columbia High School and shout out Go Tigers and sorry to any Brantford, Swanier, four white people. We're just better. Um I might make some people angry. I'll allow it. I'll allow it. I'm sorry. Uh we're here for all the shifts for all of my high school than each other. It's great. It's great. No, it's a good rivalry, lots of friends. But no, I I took four years of Spanish, but when by the time you get to Spanish four at CHS, for example, there's only like three or four students left that made it all the way. And it was me and three students that are Latino. And so I was like, this is not fair. You know, one was from Mexico, one was from Puerto Rico, another one was from Peru, I think. And then there was me, you know, just some Lake City kid, and I'm, you know, struggling to speak, and they're over there just having full conversations in Spanish. And I was just sitting there like, why did I do this to myself? But it really helped when we moved to Honduras that we picked it up so much faster. Whereas now going and starting language number three in West Africa and learning French, there's it's great because the Latin romance languages, you know, Portuguese, Spanish, French, Italian, Romanian, so oh, it's easier to pick it up, but the problem is I don't have any real base for French. And so I would say if there is a frustration, Spanish was like, oh, I love this language, it's so colorful and romantic and exciting and so expressive, and I have this great bass. French, you definitely have the bonjour, comme ça va, pull subit, on va.

SPEAKER_05 19:23

And you're just sitting there, like, oh, it's uh more than I knew and I told French three years ago.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

So I think he asked where the restroom was.

SPEAKER_00 19:29

Yeah, but Chick-fil-A number one pickles.

SPEAKER_03 19:31

Um the restroom is easy, it's toilet. Restroom is easy, so you can do that one.

SPEAKER_00 19:37

Yeah, so there have been some, I would say, frustrations with French where I'm just sitting there going, like, oh, I didn't hate this language. And then, but then when you have a decent conversation with somebody where you ask them where they're from, how many kids they have, you know, what are you doing here, and blah, blah, blah. And you get done with that conversation, you walk out and you give yourself like a little mini fist bump to yourself. You're like, I did it.

SPEAKER_04 19:56

I spoke Rush.

SPEAKER_00 19:58

Yeah, three sentences in French.

SPEAKER_01 20:00

I know that language is such a big deal, right? Because you're coming down there again. You don't want to be short-term missionaries who go in and just kind of, hey, we're gonna do our project and see you, you know. You want to build long-term relationships. But one of the things that, you know, when I talk to missionaries and, you know, especially when I was in college doing like some translation work is they is they always talk about the heart language of the people. Like everybody has a heart language. Like when you're talking to yourself, what are you, what are you thinking in? You know, when you when you're praying to God, you know, in your heart, what what are you praying in? And I know that, you know, that it's hard to communicate with somebody else's heart language when it's not yours, right? Especially when you get into a lot of those, you know, truths of the gospel and you know what it means to follow Jesus. And how do you explain what you just encountered with the Lord and somebody else's encounter with the Lord? And you're trying to use, like you say, you know, I know it's not, but like Shakespearean French, you know, like how do you communicate the passion and death behind that? So how do you how do you kind of overcome that? Like communicating emotionally, not just, hey, this is my textbook class.

SPEAKER_00 21:07

Yeah, right. Yeah, I I would say I'll let Danielle talk a little bit about kind of what we're doing with some of the women that we're serving, but I would say briefly, every time I hear, for example, if I hear a sermon in French and I'm sitting there and I'm listening, and I I can understand what they're saying. And I understand, okay, I can understand. Is this a gospel message? Is this not? Is this doctrinally right? Do I understand? Okay, I understand it, but I'm not sitting there. It's hard to for me to hear a sermon in French and feel the conviction of the Holy Spirit. I'm just sitting there trying to hold on. Yeah, I'm just like trying to hold on, like, okay, can I just sit there for 45 minutes and understand what he said? Not did I actually encounter and feel what this was supposed to make me feel. And so I would say, yeah, there is a truth to that, to where like it when I hear in English my mother tongue, that is when I truly feel not just understand the gospel, but feel the impact. Impact of it in my heart and soul and walk away changed, hopefully, from conversations or sermons or what I'm reading. And so that's a challenge to where we're located, is because the trade language is French, but that's not the heart language of the country that we're serving. The heart language is a different language. But the women that we've in this, I can kind of transition to Danielle, but hey, what are we doing now? Is yeah, we've we have found kind of a niche of what we feel like the Lord is leading us to do. So, Danielle, you want to maybe talk about that?

SPEAKER_03 22:30

I think that's one thing for missionaries, language is is very emphasized, kind of backing up a little bit. And I think that's one reason why West Africa still remains so unreached. And one reason the gospel hasn't taken hold is that French is the Western language spoken there, but it is no one's heart language. Ah, okay. It's what they learn in school, but in the homes they're they're not really speaking French unless it's a more educated family, and that's they're preparing their children to be able to go to Europe or something. Like they want, you know, that more French education. Very rare. Very rare. Yeah. But I will say also, just kind of backing up on something that Carter said, I think, I think he does a lot of things about listening to like a sermon, for example, in another language. But there is something really powerful, I think, and the Holy Spirit can move in a really special way if you're in these situations and you do hear these people worshiping in their heart language, even if you do not understand, it's it's kind of like the groaning is too deep for words that he talks about in Romans 8, where even though you can't understand the words being spoken with your mind, like you can feel it in your spirit. Yeah. You can feel the worship in the Holy Spirit, it's there. But being in a local church, when they're when they're singing in their local language and their heart language, it was really, really special. And so yeah, I think I think language is such an incredible thing. And you can see even where we are in West Africa, we can talk about it if you want, if you guys are curious at all. But I think God is really doing a lot, and there's gonna be a shift taking place where there has been a lot heavy on on the missionaries and Westerners coming in to share the gospel and do that work. But I think it's gonna be shifting to God's gonna be sending out locals back because there's kind of not a diaspora going on, but a lot of movement, people movement coming to our city and from other countries around, from West African countries, kind of becoming a hub. But you can see how there's been a foundation laid by missionaries over the years because most of these tribal languages that are the heart languages, they were not written languages. And so these missionaries have gone into these other countries and lived among these tribes, learned that language, created an alphabet, a Roman alphabet for that language, or even an Arabic either the Roman script or Arabic language. Or Arabic script, which was something I had never even heard of. The thought that you could create a written language in Arabic script or Roman script.

SPEAKER_01 25:02

Yeah. Yeah, it's crazy to hear the stories of translators who have to go in and decide, okay, how are we gonna write this language before we can even begin to translate it? Like it's grace on what they're used to and comfortable with.

SPEAKER_03 25:11

Yeah. And so they the these missionaries have gone into West Africa and they have done all this work. They've and then so not only created the written language or the alphabet for that language, but then translated the Bible. And so now there's these Bibles are being written down in these, in these heart languages. And now we have all these people moving to these cities, to this main city, to escape, whether it's, you know, Islamic terrorism or poverty or political unrest, instability. But also not only are these locals moving to our city, all these missionaries are also getting kicked out of these countries.

SPEAKER_07 25:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:52

Because it's not even where these countries are religiously closed, but even politically now, because of some of the stuff that's gone on Trump's policies. And not saying that the policies are bad, I agree with a lot of the policies, but these countries are responding to Trump.

SPEAKER_00 26:05

And it's tariffs or they come into our country, so they're like, Well, then you can't come into our some of these things affect us directly and our ability to move around.

SPEAKER_03 26:15

But if you're an American citizen, like you can't even get into three of these countries in West Africa anymore with an American passport. It has nothing to do with religion. It's just yeah, they're unhappy with Trump. And so they're like, well, you know what? Like Americans can't get pieces anymore. And that's just what they do over there. You're like, I don't think this is a good way to get policy. But anyway, so all these missionaries, they're having to leave these countries that they've lived in for years, you know, and have gotten the missionaries. And they're coming to our city and they're like, what do we do? And something, so as Carter mentioned, we we've kind of found this niche. A lot of people are moving to this city for work. And we when we moved there, we lived, our house ends up being on this main road in this, you know, middle class, upper middle class neighborhood near the missionary school.

SPEAKER_00 27:04

And when we say upper middle class, yeah, it's do not think of what you think of here in America. I would say like for the locals uh for the locals, dusty, dirty, trash, yeah, nasty.

SPEAKER_03 27:17

Um, and so we we walk out of our door, and every day we'd see these women sitting on the street with their young children. You also see street kids all over the place, and which is a whole nother story. But there's all these women with babies, like they're pregnant women, they're babies, they have toddlers, kids all the way up to maybe ages about 10, sitting on the side of the road every day. Like literally seeing the same women every single day. And where we live in West Africa, it's not nice weather. It's dusty, it's sandy. We're just south of the Sahara Desert. I was gonna say, is it a desert climate still over that? I don't know for sure. So we have a wet season and dry season.

SPEAKER_00 27:57

All the dust storms that you'll get here come directly from where we are. Yeah, yeah. I thought so, but out that that's interesting.

SPEAKER_03 28:02

Yeah, you have to dust a lot. Your house and everything. Yeah, and so it's hot, and these women and these children are just sitting in the dirt or on this concrete every day in the same spot, and they beg. They because of the culture, for example, Islam, giving alms to the poor is one of the five pillars of Islam. And these women are able to survive off of that, basically. That these people they feel obligated to to give to them in a in a way and to do their good works, which is very different from Christianity. Yeah. And we would just walk by these women every day. And me being a mom, yeah, I'm sure I can't imagine. Broke my heart every day. I just couldn't imagine that life for my kids. And I started asking some of my local Christian friends, like my language teacher, my nanny, who are these women? Like, where are they coming from? What are they doing here? This was within a few months of us being here. And I'd already been starting to learn about the life of women in West Africa and just how much they suffer, and they are just really crushed under, I think, cultural and religious the ways there. And so seeing these women, it was just like a whole nother level of yeah, suffering for just a life of suffering and hopelessness and despair. And but they would all tell me, like, these women, they choose this life. Like this is what they want. They don't want to get off the streets. And I that just didn't sit right with me. I also learned that these women were not, most of them were not from the country that we were currently in, and that they had come from these other neighboring countries. And but the reason that was shared with me is that they don't speak the language. Gotcha. They don't speak the the local tribal language.

SPEAKER_00 29:50

Or French, neither one of the people. And they don't speak French as well. Okay, because they're not they're not educated.

SPEAKER_03 29:55

So not only do they not speak French, but they do not even they don't speak, which would be like a unifying language for all of West Africa amongst the tribes. Even within this country, they don't speak any of those tribal languages, unless they had been there for a long period of time.

SPEAKER_00 30:07

They're from so the surrounding countries of the country we're in that are coming to our country to beg in our city.

SPEAKER_03 30:14

And so essentially it was no one can talk to them. They and they can't do anything either. That would be so important. And even, you know, missionaries that are coming to this area, they're not learning those languages or when they're moving to the country that we're in. So long story short, we really just felt the Lord, you know, love your neighbor.

SPEAKER_06 30:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:32

Just gospel is very simple.

SPEAKER_06 30:34

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:35

And so we're like, okay, how do we love our neighbor? And because that seemed at the time impossible. Yeah. Like when you can't even communicate and they're not, you're learning, you're already learning a language, and you are, you know, you feel led to minister to people that is not even speaking that language. And it's not even that they all speak one language, it's they all speak various languages.

SPEAKER_01 30:54

So how do you over So they're not necessarily talking to each other lying in it? Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 30:58

Well, they sit in their little groups, right? And and so we just began interacting with the women, you know, giving them the dignity of a handshake and eye contact and interacting with their kids, playing with their kids for a few minutes, or you know, they're sitting there under their little umbrella or whatever next to the wall, and you go across the street to the little boutique and buy a soda or some yogurt for the kids and just show them that you see them and that you care. Because again, you are literally walking, almost in some places, walking over them on the sidewalk.

SPEAKER_00 31:27

Like they're just step over them.

SPEAKER_03 31:28

Like it's not like you have to go out of your way to find these women, and they're right there on the main street at the round points, things like that. And so we just began interacting with them. I would take my nanny or my language teacher, start walking, asking them questions about their life. And what it turns out is that most of these women, they the younger, the younger moms, they're widows. Okay. So their husbands have died, or their husbands are sick and are not able. So not full, complete widows, but essentially living as if they're widows. Yeah. The other thing is in our culture is a husband, a man can have multiple wives.

SPEAKER_06 32:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 32:02

The man's gonna have a favorite. You know, it's just, I mean, you see that in the Bible too. You know, they're like, oh, there's what is it called when you have multiple wives?

SPEAKER_07 32:09

Polygamy.

SPEAKER_03 32:10

Polygamy. There's polygamy in the Old Testament too. So God must allow it's like, no, like you that's not how God intended it. And where it did happen in the Old Testament, you see things fall apart. Like Rachel and Leah. Like, just look at Rachel and Leah. Look at Sarah and Hagar. Like it never turns out well.

SPEAKER_06 32:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 32:26

And one of the women always ends up not being the favorite and kind of getting rejected and neglected or, you know, not treated well. And by the other, by the favorite wife or the other wives, too. So these women, they end up having, for whatever reason, they're just not being taken care of and their kids are not being taken care of. And so this, yeah. So this is their this is their option, is is to leave their village. Most of the time, they're leaving their older children. So children probably like eight or older, they'll leave behind in the village with grandma or somebody. And then they bring their young kids, their babies, their toddlers. They come to our city and they just they survive. They they're not sleeping on the streets, most of them. Some of them are, and those are ones that we try to help.

SPEAKER_05 33:07

But you want me to ask them where do they go if they're not sleeping on the streets?

SPEAKER_03 33:10

Yeah. They so, like I said, there's a lot of people coming to this city. Gotcha, gotcha. And people would just get together and you can rent a room. Okay. And they split back comments. And they'll even to the point where they're like, they'll take shifts of when like your family is allowed to sleep. Okay, gotcha. So they'll like kind of rotate. Yeah. In the worst parts.

SPEAKER_00 33:30

Six hours, and then the next family gets it for six hours. And that's how they survive every day.

SPEAKER_03 33:34

So they have like their shifts and family sleeping. And I don't know if that's what all the women do, but that is a reality that happens in this city with the women and just with people in general that aren't even on the street. So these women are widows, and then you also have this older population of widows where they're just old women that essentially probably can't do much in the home. And so their family sends them to the city to sit on the side of the road and beg and send money back.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

You know, it's it to me, I think that there's a book. I think, Carter, I'm probably sure you've read it. It's called Misreading Scripture with Western Eyes. And when we read in scripture commands to take care of widows and orphans, we don't get the full impact of that, you know, because like when I think of widows in our community, usually they're surrounded by a massive family that's helping take care of them. It's grandma, she's the matriarch, you know, she's she's got people coming by every day, you know, sees her family all the time. But we forget there's still countries out there where if you're a widow, well, all right, sorry, good luck, you know. And if you're an orphan, okay, sorry, you know, good luck. And it's not the same as America. The family support network is not the same in every country that you experience here in the deep south. Like it's not the same.

SPEAKER_00 34:53

And I would say, too, one thing about third world countries is that, because people will will often use this as a critique of what we're doing. They'll say, Well, well, you why can't you serve Jesus here? Why can't you come to the U.S. and serve Jesus? There's plenty of people who are lost and don't know Jesus and there are poor people here. I'm like, you are absolutely right. And what I want to say is, you know, what are you doing about it? Um, but what I but that's what I want to say, but what I actually think is the international third world country life is that here in the States, you have nonprofits, you have churches, you have government assistance and aid, there's resources that you can get to help if you are falling into abstract poverty. But when you go to these other countries, there is no help from the government. If your family doesn't want to help you or you offend someone in your family, especially in these patriarchal cultures, you can get cast out with the snap of your fingers onto the streets, no matter who you are and what you're doing in that family. And there's, again, limited resources from whether it's nonprofits and churches, and again, where we are in a majority Muslim country, because of the five pillars of Islam and giving alms to the poor is one of those things you have to do in order to get to paradise. The poor almost need to be there. They they they have to exist for me to get my good works in. So they view as this is Allah, this is God's will for your life is to be poor and to stay poor so that the rest of us can do the good works to get to heaven. And so in Christianity, we look at this person as made in the image of God, that they have dignity, that they have honor, that they deserve respect, and that we think God doesn't want this for you. There is something better for you in your life, not just physically to get off the street and break that generational cycle of physical poverty, but there is a God who loves you, who sees you, who wants to redeem you and give you so much more in your life than what you're currently experiencing. And so that's one of the things that we've realized is that this ministry that we've started is for these women and children. And it's it's translated the word that we use is called, it's we call our ministry door of hope. And so we want to, because these women have no hope. And one of the funny things was, you know, when Danielle started coming up to me, she's like, Hey, by the way, I just went and talked to all these women and I basically invited them into our house. So that's going to be happening. And I'm sitting there going, Wait, what? You know, like who, where, why, when. And definitely was a leap of faith because again, even in a community where there are a few other missionaries and missions organizations, they're kind of hiding, these women are hiding in plain sight because nobody can figure out how to talk to them or engage with them. Because that's not there are other unreached people groups in this country that we're in that other missionaries are focusing on and with great intention, and that's amazing. But we just kind of saw we don't see anybody really talking to these women. And so that's kind of what we started to do.

SPEAKER_01 37:34

And I think it's interesting to me that, like, no matter where you live at, there's always invisible people.

SPEAKER_06 37:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:40

You know, like if you live in Columbia County, right? I know everybody at small town. No, you don't. There are people here that you don't see at all every day because they're not from here, they don't look like you, they don't live like you. But that's a principle that's true everywhere, and it's, you know, something we don't think about. But on the mission field, surrounded by missionaries, they're still invisible people, you know. And I think that's why it's so important that to answer that question that people ask you, why don't you do that here? Well, because we each have to be obedient to where God's calling us to go, because what he's calling us to do, he's calling us to do. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 38:12

And often looks foolish to the world. Yeah, absolutely. It doesn't make any sense that, you know, we would move to West Africa with two young kids. Yeah. That's incredibly unsafe. And like that's that's really what people think. Yeah. Is we're crazy. And what about our what about your children?

SPEAKER_06 38:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 38:26

And you just have to trust like my kids are safest when we're in alignment with the Lord. Like his plans are gonna be way better and bigger for my kids than anything I could come up with. Yeah. And I have to trust him with that. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:38

I think it was William Carey who said that I'm invincible until the Lord's done with me. You know, true.

SPEAKER_03 38:44

When you're when you're in alignment with him, when you're in alignment with him, right? Like we can step out of alignment and then we can, you know, open the door and we can, you know, start pestering us, coming after us, things like that. But I think when we're in alignment and we're we're on the assignment that God's given us, He is there's gonna be divine protection. Yeah. And until, I mean, look, you look at Paul, it's not that bad things didn't happen to Paul, but the Lord never let it go too far. Like it never, you know, and Paul was like, he talks about in Philippians, you know, if I'm so alive, it's because there's more work to be done. Yeah, that's right. And I'm gonna, and that's why I'm here and that's what I'm gonna do. Yeah. And then when that work is done, then like I'll go to the Lord, praise God, because I want to, that's where I really want to be. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 39:21

Yeah. I mean, my my loose translation is I'm here for a good time. It doesn't have to be a long time. Yeah. That's where I'm at. We're just gonna we're gonna rock with it. So what working with with these different women from different countries, different tribes, just but the same situation. What is the biggest obstacle to the gospel as you're having these conversations with them?

SPEAKER_03 39:44

Yeah. So I I would say, and I want to kind of go back to something that we were talking about earlier too. So don't let me forget that. I'll just touch on this real quick and then I'll kind of answer your question because it's kind of tied in. But we were talking about just ministering to the women and and in missions and things like that. And I think a lot of people in ministry, they want there's a big focus on going to, for example, in West Africa, the focus has been the men. Because if the men convert, then the rest of the family is more likely to convert. And also men are more educated. Men can be in more leadership roles and things like that. And so, and I understand that and I agree with a lot of that. But what I'm seeing, again, like the kind of this shift, I feel like God is putting the least of these on a lot of missionaries' hearts. Where like they're kind of shifting, there are people that are still focusing on these unreached people groups. How can we pour into you know the people that could potentially lead or more qualified, I guess you could say, in in the worldly way. But women and especially children, the the street kids specifically. But I just see the Lord, like He's putting the least of these on these people's hearts. And so people will look at these women and like, what do you have to offer? If I bring you to Christ, what do you have to offer in return? Like, how are you going to be used? You know, like you can't read, you can't write, you're you have so much trauma. You know, how are you going to be able to lead others to Christ one day? You know, disciples making disciples, you know. And so we, and I think for a good reason, people are very strategic about who they go after, right? But I think looking at these women, you know, because you're kind of like, oh man, they convert to Christ, and that's kind of like the end, right? Like, what are they gonna do? And I'm realizing more and more with this shift of what's going on, these women are all coming. So they're speaking all these different languages, these languages, tribal languages, unreached people groups coming from villages. And these women go back and forth between this city and their villages. Like we have women literally from near Timbuktu. That's a real place in West Africa.

SPEAKER_06 41:43

It's an actual reality. Oh, really? Yeah, it's a city.

SPEAKER_03 41:45

It's a real city called Timbuktu. Did you know that? I did. Oh, wow. My mind was blown. I didn't know that. And so we have women from Timbuktu coming to our program. And I just the way they go back and forth, like all these countries, again, they're becoming more and more close to Americans, whether religiously, politically, Islamic extremism, they go back and forth. And so it's almost like discipling them, like they are have their kids there, discipling them. Hey, what you're learning, teach it to your kids. We're teaching, we're teaching them songs in their own language, or we're giving putting the Bible on their phones because they all have phones now. They can all get data. We're giving them resources, Bibles, even in French, and we know that they can't read them when they go back. Like there's someone in their village that speaks French.

SPEAKER_06 42:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 42:30

And so we're able to almost, and that's where I see God creating this movement. He's bringing all these missionaries, he's bringing and all these unreached people groups to this one city. And these missionaries who've been kicked out, they're coming to us and saying, I've lived in this country for 20 years and like I don't know what to do. But like you're reaching the people like in this language that I spent so much time learning that I can't use anymore. So they're coming and wanting to volunteer and help teach and disciple these women. And I know that when these women, and we've already had some come to Christ, but discipling them in a way that, hey, when you go back to your village, share what you've learned. The peace and the joy that you feel in this courtyard, you can take back with you and share that with your village. Yeah. Or your kids. Like, don't just keep it to yourself, but give it to your kids too. Because there's so much to like their biggest fear is sickness and death.

SPEAKER_07 43:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:21

These people. And that's one of our ministry. One way that we started helping with these women, they that opened the door was just helping with their medical needs, getting to the doctor, getting their kids to the doctor, showing them that we care about them because we're willing to care for their health. Yeah. And buying medicine for them when they when they have, because they would go to the doctor, which is cheap, but then they would have these prescriptions and they couldn't have the money to fill the prescriptions. And but so one of the biggest things, especially there, there is a lot of Islam, but there's a lot of animism as well. And I would say animism is actually at the core the stronger, the stronger thing, this fear.

SPEAKER_01 43:52

I would also say that animism is pretty high here in you know the southern United States.

SPEAKER_03 43:56

It's growing, it's growing for sure.

SPEAKER_01 43:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 43:58

Um I think New Age New Age is the fastest growing religion in the United States right now. And you look at if you look at Netflix and all these movies coming out, it's just if you're a parent, just be aware like they are starting to normalize it, indoctrinate it.

SPEAKER_00 44:13

Yeah, we went and saw Toy Story Five in the theaters the other day, which was like Yeah, Toy Story Five. And I went with my son and watched it. And you're of course you're watching the commercials, the hour long of commercials before the movie. And one of the Disney movies that was there was like called like Hex, like being a witch. And I'm just like, wait, this is a Disney movie.

SPEAKER_03 44:29

Like you don't fit in. You don't fit in. And this girl, this girl in middle school like doesn't fit in. She just can't figure out why. And then it turns out she's a witch. And they're like, if you don't fit in, maybe you're a witch. And we're just like, which all that stuff's real guys just saying. Oh, all of it's real. Don't think like, oh, it's just, you know, it no, it's and we see it every day in Africa.

SPEAKER_00 44:47

And um again, because there's a here in the US, we like to we like to clean up the darkness, and so we don't see it as much, or we choose to kind of look the other way. And so it's easier to kind of hide the spiritual darkness in America. We've gotten so secular, or even that secular idea is kind of moved into the church that the spiritual stuff that we hear about in the Bible doesn't really happen. The demonic, that was more like an old idea, blah, blah, blah. And that gets kind of it can creep into the church a little bit to where our head knowledge of Christ is so intellectual that we lose it. No, there is a battle going on uh in in the heavenly realms. And so we go to Africa, it literally is in your face, and the only way to not see it is to close your eyes.

SPEAKER_03 45:29

What I was going to or it's with like these these women, they they're so terrified of these spirits attacking their children. And so even the ones that have come to Christ, you know, they'll show up and their kid has a new like charm on them. Essentially, I'm not gonna use the actual word, but a new charm in a way, and it's like, hey, we trust Jesus to protect our kids.

SPEAKER_06 45:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 45:48

And that is so counter-cultural, and they get so persecuted for that because and so much fear. Like, oh, you're gonna make the spirits angry, or like your kid's gonna be open to this. And it's like discipling them. And hey, we don't depend on these things. We don't, we don't go. Satan can't cast out Satan. Yeah, right. There's no light magic, there's no good magic. It's all of the king, if it's not Holy Spirit, if it's not Jesus, it's all of the kingdom of darkness. And it's just, you know, he wants you to agree with that stuff. Like it wants agreement, right?

SPEAKER_00 46:17

I would say it's actually not Islam necessarily that keeps them from Jesus. It's the animus. It's the animism because they're like, they're fine with mi where we live in what's called folk Islam. So it's not orthodox Islam, like you would consider a North Africa, the Middle East, where they're very that's a very strict form of orthodox Islam. Where we live is it's again a kind of a combination between Islam and animus African ancestor worship and idols and witch doctors and voodoo, going back to that word, kind of a combination of those things. And so what we've seen is that they're very open to having conversations about religion and Jesus, and it's not like, oh, you don't worship the prophet or or you don't aren't a fan of the prophet Muhammad or anything like that. It's very much like, oh yeah, we're we're cool with Jesus, but but we're also gonna but we're also gonna yeah, Jesus, yeah, but we're also gonna do, and that's very and that's the thing is the universalism we serve the same God.

SPEAKER_03 47:09

Because the Christians that they know there is Catholics, and the Catholic and there's a lot of, I'm not saying Catholicism is the same as Islam, but there's a lot of similarities. There's a lot of similarities, at least over there, where it's more workspace. I mean, they both have like the rosary beads, they celebrate their holidays pretty much the same weeks.

SPEAKER_00 47:27

Like it's and so yeah, there's it's very interesting. You'll just like there's folk Islam, there's also folk Catholicism, and there can be forms of folk Protestantism as well. We call that Southern fried Christianity. Jesus plus or something plus Jesus.

SPEAKER_01 47:43

Yeah, and uh we really ought to have a conversation one day about my take on animism in the southern United States. Well, we'd love to have a conversation about that.

SPEAKER_03 47:51

It's here, we just it's our Jesus tainted next year. Yeah, we'll come back next week.

SPEAKER_00 47:56

And even if we don't see it in it's the the phrases and the terminology that we use, and yeah, it's just very, very interesting.

SPEAKER_03 48:05

So it's creeping more and more into the church too, the the new age stuff.

SPEAKER_00 48:09

And we don't have to go down we don't have to go down that road.

SPEAKER_03 48:11

I'll focus back on kind of your question though, of so what is the biggest obstacle? I would say the two things I mentioned is language. But it's so cool because I'm like sitting on the other side, like hindsight 2020, when when the Lord opened this door and called us to start working with these women and children, I was like, this makes no sense. How is this even gonna work? We can't speak this language, you know there's so many different languages, but now I I see what God's already doing. Like there is this movement of locals and missionaries, people who are being displaced, these missionaries that are being displaced and wanting to continue to work with these people groups, but not having the opportunity. And so when I started, when we just take that first step of obedience and that step of faith, these people just started coming, even local Christians that because the city, these people, locals are coming to the city as well for university, for work, for jobs. So they're coming from these other their home countries as well, and they're Christians and they want to serve as well. And so we have that. And then the other thing I would say that big obstacle, but again, I think the Holy Spirit has just really been intervening in this way and doing a lot of healing, is these women have never been in an environment of education, so school or anything. And also, I think just psychologically and and physiologically, just the trauma of their life, like it their their brains, like they it's not even like they're choosing just to live for today, but it's like they don't even have the capacity to be able to think ahead. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 49:41

A lot of learned behaviors.

SPEAKER_03 49:43

Yeah. Yeah. It's they're kind of just going like they're just surviving. And so we would find where we would even just share these simple stories from the Bible and then be like, okay, what did you guys learn? And they wouldn't be able to give us anything. And they'd be like, okay, who is the main character of the story? And they like don't know how to answer. Whether it's they they just can't process things in that way yet, or there's shame in a community. So if you say the wrong answer, like shame and honor, like that, that there's fear and power and the shame and honor culture. So it's like, which one are we dealing with right now? But it's been so cool to see, you know, being almost a year into the program and working with these women, especially the women who've been coming from the beginning, how different it is. When we first started, you know, we had a missionary and she's a teacher, like she's a gifted teacher, spoke the language, and she was kind of like, Yeah, I got this. Like, you know, you don't need to write the lessons anymore. I got this. I'll teach them. Because in her organization, they have these very clear ways of how you teach people. And that first session, she came back and she was like, I don't even know what just happened. Like they didn't get anything. Yeah, it was very humbling.

SPEAKER_00 50:52

I'm sorry, we preached a few sermons like that before you were just like, I don't think anybody understood the word I just said.

SPEAKER_03 50:58

Because you're like, you're going as a missionary and you're like, I'm gonna communicate the gospel to them, and they may not get it, but like we'll work it. And it's like they couldn't even tell me the character's first name. Like, they can't.

SPEAKER_00 51:07

This isn't kindergartners we're talking about. These are full-grown adult women who you'll share for the water. Like up to like 70 years ago. Jesus walking on water, and you're like, who was the main character of the story of Jesus walking on water? And they're like, uh, and they just like look at you and you're like, oh my. Okay, so there's a it's not just sharing the gospel, and we like the simple gospel that we talk about even here at the orchard. It's there's so much work that goes in that. Again, sometimes Danielle and I look at each other and we're like, we're not this is not what we're qualified by. We don't have an education degree or anything in regards to like working with like traumatized people groups or people who have been through these kind of things. Like this is outside of even our skill set. So, like, Holy Spirit, please lead us to know a place of desperation.

SPEAKER_03 51:48

Like, yeah, God, we literally cannot do this unless you intervene and you come in. And we have seen him do that, and it's been so amazing, and as hard of a place it is to be, where every day you're just like, I have no idea what to do. Yeah, like so.

SPEAKER_05 52:03

I kind of want to lean into that. So you guys have there's a lot of just heaviness. So, how do you guys, I guess, get poured into so that you can pour out?

SPEAKER_00 52:13

Here's what I'll say about that question is you spend a lot of your time over there just trying to survive in a third world country. And even though we live in a city which is a little bit better than maybe going 13 hours out into the village somewhere way, way, way out in the middle of the desert. There's things that you go over there and you have these ideas and visions of we're gonna go over there and we're just gonna share the gospel with people, and it's just gonna be so amazing. And we have this missionary heart and this evangelistic spirit, and it's just gonna be amazing. Sharing Jesus is the easy part, it's all the other stuff that you experience in a third world country that just keeps you busy. Like, for example, I'm sitting here right now getting text messages from a person staying in our home currently about our plumbing and water system that's basically exploded in our house. And so I'm like, okay, I'm not there, but our house is falling apart. And you live over there, and you realize all anytime anyone's listening and you go to the DMV or the county courthouse or any office and you get frustrated, trust me, you have it great. You have it amazing going to West Africa and dealing with just any government office or any company or any professional work environment. It is just so easy to get frustrated and down on yourself. And then again, you're far away from home. I grew up in Lake City on the same property as my aunt, uncle, my cousins, my grandparents. We all grew up together, had Monday night dinners together with my grandma and her house, and I lived that life. And so when we go over there and we exist as just the fam, the Jackson 4, uh, we have a turtle, so we can be the Jackson 5, I guess. So we can be the Jackson 5. You it becomes very apparent very quickly that you like it's uh it's us and the Lord. And I'm thankful that God has brought us friends and He has brought us people to kind of help carry the weight of just being a friend and like wanting to, hey, can hey man, do you want to just go get lunch? Or do you want to like hang out at our house this week? And just normal things, not like not like every single thing we have to do together has to be some sort of ministry focus, but can we just be normal people in West Africa? And sometimes that helps me whenever I feel like, okay, this is getting very heavy, the spiritual darkness, the overwhelming workload of a third world country of just living here, the foreign language, the being all the way across the ocean, or even things that are happening in my with my family and friends backstayside that I wish I could be there for. Something happy and jovial, like a birthday or an anniversary, or someone graduating, or someone like hitting their first home run. Like, oh man, I wish I I don't get to be there for that. Or something tragic and dark and and hard and marital conflict or difficult, and I can't be there, and we can't be there. And the normal things in life sometimes help me personally, feeling like I can just go to the beach with a buddy and go fishing or go swimming or driving my little 125 CC motorcycle around for like 25 minutes around the circle and like feeling the wind in my hair. I just like just a second of normality. Or just to breathe. Yeah, just to be able to do that.

SPEAKER_05 55:16

I'm sure it's all the time. I mean, when you are in ministry, ministry is everywhere, it's all the time. But it's like you do have to carve out that little time to be Carter, to be Danielle, just to kind of breathe for a second. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 55:27

Yeah. I think I'll answer that question a little bit differently as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 55:32

We're not the same.

SPEAKER_03 55:33

I think kind of segueing, I think rest and solitude is super important, whether you're an extrovert or introvert. Like you just need time to process. Yeah. And you also see Jesus did that. Yeah. Like he would constantly go away and and spend time just with the Father because there's so much in our culture that we are just blind to, but Jesus saw it all. He saw all the darkness and all the brokenness. And I just can't imagine how crushing that was for him. And you see kind of like these little outbursts from Jesus. And I don't think I'm not saying Jesus did like it just happens because it is heavy. Yeah. I think something that I've had to learn too as I've processed things and really it's kind of it kind of goes along with the theology of suffering in a way. But just recognizing when you have the theology of like God is in control of everything, it's like, okay, then why are these women and kids? Why are the why is this whole region of Africa just like just rough? You know, like everyone is suffering. Like when I was in the hospital, the nurses just it was almost they were so numb, like there was no empathy or sympathy. And another missionary of my mentor, she was just like, but they like you have to understand, Daniel, everyone suffers in their life. Yeah. Like it's just day to day. And so they're just so like just hearts of rock, yeah, stone. Like they just have they have to just cut it out. Like they can't, they can't feel it all. But that's not what we're called to as Christians. So it's like, okay, how do we how do we balance this? And for me, it kind of goes back to that theology of like, okay, I do believe God is in control, but the Bible also says that the systems of this world, the prince and the ruler of the heir and and other the ruler of this world is is Satan. Yeah. Right? Like when when Jesus was tempted and Satan said, Hey, I can if you bow down and worship me, I will give you all these kingdoms. Jesus didn't say, Well, those aren't yours to give, those are God's. He said it was that's not what Jesus said. He acknowledged that that was in Satan's right to give those things. And so when we're over there, it's not like I don't have to wrestle with God, like, God, why are you allowing these kids? It's like, no, like there is a stronghold, there is a power, there is an enemy that has blinded these people, that is keeping them in bondage, like so much bondage of fear and shame, both physically, spiritually, emotionally, like in all these different ways. And he's doing everything he can to keep these people in bondage, but God sends us as his ambassadors into this. And so it's like I'm working with God because I want the same thing as God. God doesn't want these people. This isn't his will. His will is for us to come and set the captives free by the spirit of God, yeah to heal people and to share the gospel, share the good news. Yeah. You don't have to live in this darkness anymore. That this is where the enemy wants you, but this is not where God wants you.

SPEAKER_06 58:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:28

Right. Like if God willed everyone to just suffer like that, then what would be the point of our of what we're doing, right? And so I think for me, it's I don't have to wrestle with that, you know, like, God, why'd you wait, why would you kill babies? Yeah. Because I know like that's not God. Yeah, that's not his heart. He's for life. And yes, he allows suffering to happen. Like I just went through an immense amount of suffering. But I also know like it was the enemy attacking me. Yeah. But God and God allowed that. Yeah. But it was for my good. Yeah. And I clearly saw that and knew that the whole time. Yeah. He, there was clear boundaries of protection around that.

SPEAKER_06 59:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 59:05

But it's like these women, it's like, yeah, these women are on the street and they're growing up on the street. But it's like, why would God do that? It was like because they're there and suffering the way they were suffering, that they're walking in our door now.

SPEAKER_06 59:15

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 59:15

And they have an opportunity to hear the gospel that so many other people in this unreached country don't. Yeah. Because they are suffering the way they are suffering. Yeah. So it is essentially for their good that they have the option now to hear the gospel. Yeah. Whereas the other people living are other neighbors on our street, we're not talking to them. Yeah. We we we will when we can, but like that's not what God, like, God has a heart for these women. And he's like, Danielle and Carter, go talk to these people. Like this is my assignment that I've given you. And so I think for me, when I sit and I process like everything, my heart breaks, but I can find comfort and rest that this is not what God wants for them.

SPEAKER_05 59:52

That's so good.

SPEAKER_03 59:53

And he wants to use us to help and to and to bring his light and his power into that.

SPEAKER_06 59:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:00

And that's, I think for for anyone in just as believers, this isn't even just as a missionary, as a ministry. We're vessels. We're just jars of clay carrying the power of God within us. Yeah. And so every time I interact with these women or they come into our courtyard, my main priority is to create a space where the Holy Spirit is welcome to move. Because when Danielle shows up, nothing really happens. Like I can't do anything in my own power. As we've talked about, like we're not qualified. But when Jesus shows up, anything is possible.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:32

And so yeah, I think that's just the way like you can just trust God and his goodness and his kindness and his mercy to these people. And when you know that that is his heart towards them, you're you're willing to serve and you're willing to go to these dark places and you and and you know that it's a battle. Yeah. And you hate, you love the people, but you hate the sin. Right. Like we love Muslims. We love these women that are practicing animism. But we hate the bondage that they're in, right? And and that's what we're fighting against. We're not fighting against humans, we're fighting against principalities and powers of the air and you know, and against Satan.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:08

And so I don't know how that makes things better or easier to carry, but maybe it's because you're not, you don't feel so you feel hopeless in the humility of admitting that you can't do anything, but you also have so much hope because you know God is on your side and fighting for that.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:28

We are we've already read the end of the book. Yeah. Right. So we there is a victory, there is a win, but sometimes as humans and normal, everyday average people, there is a weight that comes along with it. And so we encourage people. Missionaries are not superhero Christians. We're not the elite of the elite, the special Delta Force names. We're average, just like pastors, just like elders of churches. We are just normal, average. I love my sweet tea, Jacksonville Jaguars, FSU Seminoles. I'm a normal average guy. Yeah. But we in those moments of darkness, when we do struggle and we do question and we do wrestle with what we're going through, your text messages, your emails, your FaceTime calls, your letters that we get in the mail, those are things that your the visits when people come to visit us in West Africa, those are things that help us so much. They help us stay there, they help us continue to do the ministry. So even if you're here listening and you're thinking, I don't even know what I could do to help them, just find a small way to be present in our lives, even if we don't know you, we've never met you. Those little things do go a long way.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:30

I was actually just about to ask, if someone did want to start, you know, getting updates from you guys, figuring out how they can support you, pray for you, what is the best way for them to do that?

SPEAKER_00 1:02:38

Yeah, the best way with them uh would just be to send an email to our email, which is info at emberglobalvision.org. Okay. And so that's that's the best way. And we can put them on our email newsletter list, and we would love to continue to share and talk with people who would love to know more about what we're doing, what we're passionate about. And like I said, we you know, I have a vision of one day and the orchard coming to visit us and coming to do a mission trip. So getting a few people together, coming on an initial visit, and then making that a regular part of this church and the culture of the Great Commission around the world. So yeah, that's something that I I have in my mind one day. So low key plug, I'm starting to hear on the podcast today. It will happen. So if you're like, that's me, I want to go, sign up, tell, tell anybody and everybody, we'd love to tell Chip, like grab his arm, strong arm, like, hey, this is happening.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:29

Yeah. And the other thing too, we do have a website, so it's emberglobalvision.org. So the same thing as that email that Carter just said. But if you, you know, if you just want information, see some pictures, videos, things like that about our ministry and in West Africa, you can go on that website as well. And also our contact information is on that website as well.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:52

Awesome. I'll I'll make sure I write that at the end. But Carter, Danielle, thank you so much for being here today, just to update us and to know how, yeah, we can connect. Man, God is doing some really amazing things in and through you guys. And I cannot wait until the next update to hear what he's doing even more. But well, thanks for listening today to today's episode. If you have any questions for Carter, Danielle, or if you want to connect with them, you can reach out to the church at info at theorchardcc.org, but I will also link their contact info. But in the meantime, have a great week and we'll catch you next time. Thanks for joining us for this episode of Let's Talk About That. We hope it encouraged and challenged you as we continue to grow on this journey of faith and embrace community together. If you have more questions, thoughts, or feedback, we want to hear from you. Be sure to reach out to us through our social media or visit our website to stay connected. If you found today's discussion meaningful, don't forget to subscribe, share, and leave a review. Until next time, we hope that this episode inspired you and will keep Sunday's message at the front of your mind. See you next week.