MUSED: LA 2 HOU
MUSED: LA 2 HOU
MUSED: LA 2 HOU | Luis C. Garza and Armando Duron | Time Refocused
In this special episode of the MUSED: LA 2 HOU podcast, photographer Luis C. Garza talks with collector and curator Armando Durón, museum director Megan Callewaert McAdow, and arts marketing specialist Melissa Richardson Banks.
This conversation was first presented as an online public program to coincide with the exhibition “Time Refocused: Photographs by Luis C. Garza" on view at the Marshall M. Fredericks Sculpture Museum in University City, Michigan (September 11, 2021 to January 15, 2022). Check out the virtual tour of this exhibition at https://www.marshallfredericks.net/luisgarza.html.
While recorded on October 9, 2021, this timeless conversation shares much of the backstory of Garza’s work of how he became a photographer and the inspiration for many of the images that he took while documenting his view of the Chicano civil rights movement, the World Peace Conference in Hungary, and even the women’s movement in New York during the late 1960s and early 1970s.
Garza's latest exhibition "The Other Side of Memory: Photographs by Luis C. Garza" is on view at Riverside Art Museum in California through Sunday, March 19, 2023. Details at https://riversideartmuseum.org/exhibits/the-other-side-of-memory-luis-garza/
Check out more in-depth articles, stories, and photographs by Melissa Richardson Banks at www.melissarichardsonbanks.com. Learn more about CauseConnect at www.causeconnect.net.
Follow Melissa Richardson Banks on Instagram as @DowntownMuse; @MUSEDhouston, and @causeconnect.
Subscribe and listen to the MUSED: LA 2 HOU podcast on your favorite streaming platforms, including Spotify, iHeart, Apple Podcasts, and more!
Thank you.
SPEAKER_04:Welcome to Mused, LADU. I'm excited to bring you this episode of a conversation that I had last year with photographer Luis C. Garza and curator Armando Daron when we had an exhibition of Luis's work in Michigan. I bring you the conversation. Enjoy.
SPEAKER_03:My name is Megan McAdow. I am the director of the Marshall M. Frederick Sculpture Museum, located on the beautiful campus of Saginaw Valley State University. You see our museum with the sculpture garden. We are home of America's public sculptor, Marshall M. Fredericks. We have over 200 of his sculptures on view. For those who may not know that they know Marshall Fredericks, he made the famous Cleveland War Memorial, also called the Fountain of a The Leaping Gazelle on Belle Isle in Detroit, Michigan, amongst other places was one of his very first commissions. Then also the Spirit of Detroit, which is one of his most iconic works. So he was very prolific doing monumental size sculpture based out of Michigan, but found across the world. And then we also do four to six special exhibitions each year, included related programming and events. And that's what brings us together today. So we'll be talking about our current special exhibition, Time Refocused, photographs by Luis C. Garza. Okay, so today we have the artist himself, a photographer, Luis C. Garza. I'm going to read a brief introduction before you get to hear directly from him. Luis C. Garza is an independent curator and photojournalist who recorded the tumultuous social events of the 1960s and 1970s, often on behalf of La Raza magazine, the journalistic voice of the Chicano movement. His images captured the attention of many and led to his multifaceted career in documentary production, including Emmy Award-winning television series Reflexiones or Reflections, arts marketing, including Luis Valdez's Zoot Suit, events coordination, LA Freeways, arts consulting with the Getty Conservation Institute, and exhibition curators. So, yes, a very multifaceted career. at the Autry Museum of the American West. That elevated his work as a curator, and he went on to collaborate with the UCLA Chicano Studies Research Center at the Autry on the blockbuster exhibition La Raza. And it's also had a blockbuster book as well, which is fabulous. And that was for the Getty's Pacific Standard Time LA LA. His 2009 exhibition Time Reflections photographs by Louis C. Garza, was recently revived and reorganized by Richardson Banks for a national museum tour, which launched at the Marshall and Frederick Sculpture Museum, where it's now on view again through January 15th. I mean, yeah, January 15th, 2022. Oh my gosh, almost there, people. Okay, and we also have with us the curator of this fabulous exhibition, Armando Durong, who has added He has avidly been collecting Chicano art since 1981. His extensive collection includes over 660 artworks and over 1,000 publications and books related to Chicano art. It represents the last 40 years of Chicano art in Southern California and reflects his own Chicano perspective on collecting Chicano art. Jerome curated Garza's debut exhibition of black and white prints in Los Angeles at the KGB Gallery, which was on view from October 2009 to January 2010. It was later displayed at the Latino Art Museum and California and from January through February 2010 and at the Mexican Cultural Institute of Los Angeles from March through April 2010. And we are so glad to have it at our museum. Talk about another multifaceted career. Melissa Richardson Banks is the founder of Cause Connect LLC, which is a Los Angeles based firm that offers consulting services related to the marketing, sponsorship and corporate social responsibility needs of companies, nonprofit organizations, and community projects, primarily in the areas of arts and culture, environment, education, and volunteer engagement. She is also an independent cultural producer. She manages and markets community festivals, concerts, art salons, museum exhibitions, and other cultural happenings. We will also put a link again to her website where you can get the book and a lot more information about all of the things that she does it's fantastic and so I do actually want to turn it over to Melissa
SPEAKER_04:Megan, thank you so much. I'm so excited to be here and to actually present this program, at least in terms of Luis and Armando, who are good friends of mine. And we share a similar history in terms of actually how we all came together. And it's so rewarding that this show, Time Refocused, photographed by Luis C. Garza, happens to be really the next step of what I'm going to be doing with my business, which is now in 20 years. It started right after 9-11. So I'm starting a new pro series of efforts that will really be showcasing artists traditionally underrepresented in museums but also particularly women and latinos men and so i'm super excited about this at you and that we partnered on this project to bring it to michigan i'm thrilled um so i've worked with luis and i've known him for well over a decade longer than that 15 years or more and we all came together i think armando and luis met at the same time around we did whether know if that's the same thing but but basically I'm so thrilled that we are got we've gotten to this point and I really want to start by I know Louisa's story intimately so I I'm going to help guide the conversation because I I know he's maybe new to you and others here so we'll share but I'm very interested in this particular show because it was his debut as a photographer and what you may not realize is that he had many of these images housed and archived at his home for years years until he brought it to light. And under Armando's amazing curation back in 2009, they worked together to bring this, to showcase the work that Louise has done. It's very important. And I'm curious, and I would like to start it off by really focusing on Louise. I'll have some questions for Armando as a curator as well. But I am, Louise, I would love for you to talk about in this context, like when did you become a photographer and why did you take the time off? I guess too, there's that time period, you know, in terms of your career. career.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you very much for the questions, and thank you, Marshall Frederick's Sculpture Museum, for hosting this exhibition. It's an honor, and the revival of the exhibition is really a rebirth. It's a renacimiento, as Melissa has taken it and has reshaped it to travel, probably. Thank you very much. something that just was totally unexpected. And again, I repeat, it's an honor to work with Melissa once again and with Armando in curating, re-curating the exhibition as it travels across country. And Melissa and Armando will tell you where it will finally reside in 2022. In regards to how I came about photography, again, to me, that was serendipity. I picked up the camera. Bye. by accident, although there are no accidents. And I started photographing. And I started with a Kodak Brownie. And I was impressed by my own images. So then I gravitated to a 35 millimeter Pentax camera, which began the seriousness of my photographing work, although I had no direction at all, as Bob Dylan would say, no direction to roam. And so I It was a series of events that led me into photography as a dedication and as a life choice. And that comes about through being parachuted into the Chicano movement. And I met a man by the name of Ed Bonilla who flipped my worldview. I was desperate. I had moved out from New York to Los Angeles. I had no work, no real friends. And so he looked at me and he said, you're from New York. I said, yeah, I'm from New York. And he said, you're Puerto Rican. I said, no, I'm not Puerto Rican. I'm Mexican. Although, yeah, I'm Puerto Rican by osmosis says I'm Jewish, I'm Irish, I'm Polish, I'm all the things that I grew up with in New York City. And he says, a Chicano from New York. Now, I had never heard the word Chicano. And so I thought to myself, Chicano, Mexicano, close enough. I said, yeah, I'm a Chicano. And he said, okay, you got the job. I said, great, what's the job? He said, you're going to organize the people. I said, how do you do that? He says, well, you come tomorrow at nine o'clock and you bring that camera that's strapped around your neck and we're going to start. And so he introduces me to the Chicano movement, to a number of people at La Raza magazine. At that time, Joe Russell and Raul Ruiz and Father Luz and a whole bunch of other people at La Raza. beginnings of the Chicano movement, 1968, 69. And that's how I began photographing. That's how my comes about. I find a purpose in life and I start photographing seriously. And so that's the beginning steps. It's a worthy of many bottles of wine, but I'll cut it there and we'll move on to the next question. Thank you.
SPEAKER_04:Well, I think what's interesting though, Louise, is that there is this time that you were actively photographing. And I think really, to me, the most iconic image that I knew you from, and I think Armando, we both were introduced to you, is the image that you captured of David Afero Siqueiros in Budapest, Hungary. Now, both Armando and I know this story to heart, but there are many that don't know this story. And I think, and who Siqueiros is, again, in context of Diego Rivera and Jose Clemente Orozco, I think it's important to kind of share that very quickly. And then how did you meet him? And then what What happened?
SPEAKER_01:That's a wonderful piece of history because that's also one of the major turning points in my life and my dedication to both photography and to the work of Siqueiros in Los Angeles, which is how the exhibition that you and I worked on came about. I was all of 25, 26 years old at the time, photographing at La Raza. Into La Raza magazine comes a tall, lanky gentleman by the name of Irving Sarnoff, who has passed away, but he was the director of the Peace Action Council, who was organizing a delegation of Americans to travel to Budapest, Hungary via the Soviet Union, the World Peace Conference that was being held in Budapest, Hungary. And so I take flight from L.A. to New York, meet up with my family, who is just, what are you, Russia? What are you going to Russia for? And so it's a whole scandal within the family. That's, again, another subplot to the novella. So I land in Moscow. We go to Budapest. And... Siqueiros is part of the Mexican delegation attending the World Peace Conference. When he finds out that there's a Chicano in the American delegation, which is about 25, 30 people from various organizations, national organizations here in the United States, he calls for a meeting. I'm escorted the next morning to his table where he stands up, opens his arms, and he says, compañero. Cuéntame de este movimiento Chicano. And he gives me a big hug and he sits me down between him and his wife, Angelica Arinal, and Raquel Tibol, and a number of the other Mexican delegates, and we begin the conversation. And he begins to ask me about this Chicano movement and what is it about. They've been hearing information in Mexico in regards to it. You've got to remember, this is 1971. And so... It's Brezhnev, the head of the chairman of Russia, and it's Nixon, president of the United States. It's the height of the Cold War, Vietnam War, women's movement, Chicano movement, Black movement, all these various movements. It's a worldwide turmoil. And so I, with my camera, you know, would get together with Siqueiros in the evenings, And we'd be smoking and drinking vodka and talking art and revolution. At least he was. I was in way over my head. But with every shot of vodka, I got bolder. And so we'd be talking about La Raza and the Chicano movement. And he would be questioning me about his murals, America Tropical in particular, which... Today is, ironically, metaphorically, and realistically, the 89th anniversary of the debut of America Tropical at Olvera Street. So I think it's quite auspicious that we're having this conversation today. But those images that I captured of Siqueiros were part of... an invitation that he gave to me. And these are the parting photographs that I take of him and his wife, Angelica, after we come out of an art school where he gave a presentation. But Siqueiros forever changed my life. He tapped me on the forehead like E.T., and it just transformed me. And when I returned back to Los Angeles, I dedicated myself to the work of Siqueiros and finding out more about him. And That's how it comes about. So in this shot that you see of Siqueiros pointing at me, he's actually doing the self-portrait that he did of himself in a painting that he did. So it's, again, it's a series of... confluence intersections and meetings and things like that, which forever transform your life and your photography and the work that you do. So he sets me upon a path that just reinforces everything that I'm doing and that I'm dedicating myself to. Okay, so I'll leave it at that.
SPEAKER_04:I'm going to bring in Armando here in just a minute, but I wanted to set the stage because I really am impressed and interested how Armando curated the show and actually, which really, I think the book may have been in some ways curated first, or at least the sequence, which led to the book and how it's presented, not only in the book, but in its execution at, in Michigan. And I wanted to point out that just to kind of set the stage here, Louise, as a photographer has been, you know, again, born in the Bronx, moved to Los Angeles, found himself involved in East LA and Los Angeles, generally in the Chicano civil rights movement, which by the way, was at this, you know, civil rights movements, generally the women's rights movement, the civil rights movements around the same time period in Los Angeles in particular, and also in Texas where I'm housed now as well. But there was the Chicano rising and uprising and continuing the movement to today. But, but then he also mentioned again, the Budapest and the world peace conference. And And as part of that, he also went to what was the then USSR, and he'll talk about that. So there's three. What's really great about this exhibition, and Armando will go in depth with this, and then I'd like to go back to the archives too. But Armando, can you, and I have some images that maybe the two of you can talk about. I've got some representative images here to share. How did you take these three different cities or bodies of work, this style, which for me, I think with Louise, He has gone from beyond a documentary photographer and a photojournalist to really an art photographer because they're artfully done. Would you address a little bit of that? And if you'd like me to share some images with that, well, just let me know and I'll change the screen as we go.
SPEAKER_02:Sure. And first of all, thank you for inviting me to be here. You know, when I first saw these images in 2004 and I was immediately taken by not so much the documentary aspect of them, which I was somewhat familiar with, especially the Chicano movement, but the artistic aspect of them. Something really was compelling about them because beyond what they were intended for, which was basically photojournalism. Luis was, as part of the La Raza magazine photo team, was just documenting what was going on in the community. But I saw these images and realized that there was something else. It was like an accidental aesthetics that emerged from his work, which was very compelling. And a couple of years passed and From when I first saw them, as I said, in 2004 until 2009, when we actually mounted the show. But the show was designed to show that despite the fact that there are three different places, it's kind of the same story. And the narrative that people, the viewer can compose by looking at the images as they go back and forth through one city and one movement to another city to something else that's going on, like in Budapest or back in the Bronx in New York with the Young Lords, you can show that image first. If you want. But so what was happening between the three of them, there was a relationship between all of all of the various events of various cities and that that I saw was was we being weaved through them and that the individual photographs could speak to each other. across the cities. In other words, we don't have all the images to show you here, but when you see the show, whether it's online or in person, what I hope you'll find is that the relationship across the cities and across the movements was still there. It didn't matter that one thing was happening and maybe they didn't even know about each other because these are people who are caught up in a time and are involved in movements of various sorts. But then, bringing it forward to 2009, what was even more interesting was that they seemed timely. They were timeless. And that's why I came up with the title of Time Refocused, because they were just as timely in 2009 as they were in, say, 2007. I mean, excuse me, 1971. They were just as compelling to me. And I think now in 2021, they are equally compelling. And that's why the show can be brought up 11 years later or 12 years later. And it's as fresh today as it was, as the images were when he was taking them in 1968, 69, 71, 75. They're just as timely. And that's what was so compelling. And it was so great to be involved in that process.
SPEAKER_04:Maybe what I can do, because I have about five images here, and you can see I'm not really great about this PowerPoint, so I hope I'm doing it okay. But maybe, Luis, you can just kind of briefly at least let people know what city or a little bit about each of these real quickly here, and then we can go. And I'd like to talk a little bit also about your body of work generally and then also our next steps as well. So this particular piece, can you talk about what's on the screen? I hope it's on there effectively. And what country is this?
SPEAKER_01:This This particular image of the Young Lords Rally in the South Bronx is actually the neighborhood that I was born in. I come from the South Bronx. My family is from Mexico, South Texas, who migrated to New York City in the 1920s. And so I was born and raised in New York City in the South Bronx. And this particular street is 139th Street. So the backdrop of those buildings was part of me revisiting my youth, my past, And I was invited by the Young Lords to come and hang out with them, which I did. So this is just one of a series of rolls of film that I took of the Young Lords as I hung out with them. So the composition of it is one where... Well, I'll speak to that later. That's the aesthetic part that Armando is talking about. As Armando is my vision therapist, Melissa is my vision enabler. And so between Armando and Melissa, which I am blessed to have as friends and colleagues and associates, I've come to realize my work in a whole other way that I never did before because I never– I never interpreted my work outside of looking at and thinking about the imagery. Anyway, that's a whole other story. Go to the next. Go to the next shot. This is a thread bearer. This is Tashkent, Uzbekistan. in the Soviet Union or the then Soviet Union. We were invited after the Budapest Conference. I went back to Moscow and then they invited some of us to join them. And so I spent a week. What turned out, a two-week trip turned out to be a one-month trip as I traveled around the Soviet Union. And this was in a particular factory where, again, it's part of a series of photographs that I took. So each image really is just a reflection of many, many more other photographic works. What Armando did in turn in terms of his curatorial work was weaving all the various stories as he just expressed. So go on to the next shot. Ah, Sueño. Sueño, this is Whittier Boulevard, East Los Angeles. And this is a blind man. who is taking a nap on a bus stop. And that bus stop is the beginning of bus stop muralism paintings by Chicano artists. And so when you look at the image in the background, the full image, it says, hacen alteraciones, we make alterations. And it speaks to itself in terms of... What is he imagining? Armando can speak to the interpretation of it. He has a particular fondness for this particular image.
SPEAKER_02:And I do, if I may, I really love this image because I see a man dreaming perhaps about his youth, about when he was young and strong. And that's what's being reflected on the park bench. And you can't see it on the slide, but on the original image, it does say, we make alterations. And it was just so poignant to me. It was practically a conceptual piece of work. in which the sign is telling you, we can alter you, we can change you, we can bring you back to that youth, and that's what he's dreaming of. And so the three, the sign, the old man, and the young man portrayed on the bus, are in a sense in conversation. Something's going on there. And so this is one of the images that I really, just really speaks to me. And that tells me that this idea of this accidental aesthetics is very much alive in Luis's work, as well as some of the other La Raza photographers. But this image I think really captures what I'm talking about when I talk about accidental aesthetics. simple aesthetics.
SPEAKER_04:I'm going to go to the next slide. I'll let you guys talk about this. This is, again, and for purposes of this display, some of these have been detailed so you can see them, but there's so much more, as Armando was mentioning, when you see it in person and, of course, online. But this is an iconic image and also resulted in another project. Maybe you both can discuss that. I actually have one of these myself, so you can talk about that. So I know Armando does, too. So let's talk about this particular project. these boys and where they are located and a little bit about your latest project with this.
SPEAKER_01:Armando, continue with the description of this particular photograph.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I think it's important to note that, first of all, I think, Luis, you can talk about where it is, and then I'll talk about why I think it's such an appealing photograph across time, why it was so iconic right from the beginning.
SPEAKER_01:these two young men again this is just one image of a series of photographs that were taken this is Aliso Pico housing project in East Los Angeles and it's 1972 I believe that I took this photograph and I'm a street photographer so I would pick different spots in Los Angeles or wherever I was and I'd walk and go into neighborhoods. And so I came across this group of young men that were at the children's monkey bars in the background that you see. And I just... Started photographing them. And they looked at me. They're in their mid-teens. And they're exemplary of barrio youth with the hat and the Pendleton and the shirts and the hairdo and all of that. And... It became iconic from the beginning. Corky Gonzalez of the Crusade of Justice out of Denver, Colorado, used it as the book cover for Yo Soy Joaquin, I Am Joaquin, his epic poem. And that was the first time it came into a book publication. Prior to that, it was only an image in La Raza magazine. And then since that time, it's been used by any number of people and number of publications. So it also became one of the iconic images within the La Raza exhibition that the Autry did in 2017, which was part of the Pacific Standard Time show. And it became a street banner of all things. I damn near crashed my car when I first saw it waving in the streets of Los Angeles. And it generated a lot of feedback and also helped to propel more of a recognition of my work, which is what La Raza exhibition did for not only myself, but my fellow colleagues. When we put on this exhibition, which is a whole other story, but I'll hand it over to Armando.
SPEAKER_02:Well, you know, as I said in the in the catalog, I said that the young men so enigmatic of the barrios of East Los Angeles pose proudly their innocence fleeting. but still discernible. And I think that's what I really love about the image is that, yeah, they're acting tough, you know, especially the guy with the hat, uh, wearing his Pendleton. And as you notice, I'm wearing my Pendleton. I'm from that era. So I wear Pendletons. Um, and, uh, and yet you could see, right. You know, you could still see the innocence of these young boys. And of course now, uh, 40 years later, 50 years later, we're here wondering, you know, what happened to them? You know, and that's true with various of these images in this show is you wonder what happened to some of the individuals and the movements that they were involved in and the struggles they were involved in. But certainly with this image, you wonder what happened to that youth? What happened to that bravado? to that innocence, what happened to the rest of their lives. And they're gonna be, they're probably in their 70s at this point, if they're still with us. The image, of course, that Luis has now transformed into a serigraph with a very light coloring to each of the images. They're individually colored and they're really beautiful. And when he first showed them to me, I was trying to choose one and I realized that I couldn't really choose one because something was happening. And what was happening was that the images, as much as they were the same image, were different and they were differentiated by the coloring, the very light coloring that Luis did on each of the Pendletons and the hat, especially, we're differentiating the images into something else. And so I asked him to do one, I bought two of them and put them together and called it Double Homeborns. And later on, I realized that what he had done with it essentially was do what Andy Warhol did with, say, double Merlin or double Elvis, et cetera. And that in that way, we said. taken the imagery into a different level. And it's a wonderful piece that I have in my office currently. But this image, I think, will be just as fresh 100 years from now. It'll seem just as poignant, just as compelling 200 years from now. And that's what I love about it.
UNKNOWN:Thank you.
SPEAKER_04:I'm going to stop sharing on the screen because we have the image here, but I was going to say, you know, Louise, you... From 71 to, let's say again, 2004, when you first met me too, I think you first got to know Armando better. I think you might've known him before that. But what I think is really interesting is that you have this archive of images that have yet to see the light of this world, if you will. I mean, you have the 35 images that are in Michigan that have been shared in Los Angeles and in Southern California. And now on this tour, but you have five, we were talking the other day, you have 5,000. images from this time period that are an archive that we're wanting to bring to light to this world. I mean, there's so much depth to what you've done. We've just really not even hit the tip of the iceberg. We've hit the tip of the tip of the tip of the tip of the tip. And there are so many stories that can be told from this. And that's what's really exciting to me because there's just so much. And some of the pieces that are on view in Michigan, by the way, are the original silver gelatin fiber prints. Now we had to reprint a few of them from the original negatives. But what's really exciting is that what you see in Michigan, so those of you privileged to see the show in Michigan through January 15th, you are seeing not only this fine art, this documentary photography as well as fine art, but in addition, you're seeing artifacts in many of these cases. These are those beautiful prints from that time period. And I think what's exciting too, as we move on from Michigan, we're going to take it to Riverside, California. and we've actually unearthed another 35 that Armando and Louise have carefully chosen to double the show. And then some, it's going to be one of these, like the old shampoo commercial, you know, kind of doubles and doubles and doubles. And I think this is what's really exciting is to be able to reveal this story. And as Armando and Louise and others have shared, this story is relevant today as it was years ago and it continues and it's just an opportunity for continued storytelling. And I think that's what's so beautiful about unearthing a lot of these things and starting to get it back in the world. And which is one of the reasons why I wanted this to. come to life again. And there was this wonderful opportunity to partner with Megan and the team in Michigan at the Marshall M. Fredericks Museum. I'm grateful for that because they really had the foresight and just to look at this and say, this is what we need to tell this story. We want to be a part of it. And we want to learn more about this story because it's not just a Southern California story. This is an American story. And this is part of our history as part of our present. And it's part of our future. I hope we can change some of it, but we need to know this in order to to know who we are as well. So is there, Louise and Armando, is there any other thing you'd like? I know we want to leave some time in the next few minutes to see if there's any questions from our audience, but is there, and even from the team at the museum, I'd love to hear from the museum about their experience when they opened it up. I believe, I think it's Jeff, I can't remember the name of the man, excuse me, the exhibits team. I remember when he called me and he saw these, he's like, these are amazing. He goes, I want to do this justice. And I just thought it was just such careful care of the museum team and and understanding it. So they really wanted to know not only the photographer's vision, but the curator's vision and staying true to that. And if you get a chance to look at their virtual museum, please do, because Armando really designed a show also to these. Again, it's not. chronological it's not geographical but it's it's so that these photographs talk to each other i think that's how you referenced it armando
SPEAKER_02:that's that's correct and so that so the photographs talk to each other but then you as the viewer gets to join in the conversation and so one of the things that that i hope you'll do it if you go see the show either virtually or in person is you join the conversation uh don't try so much to figure out what's going on on as a viewer, but experience the pieces, join the conversation with the various groupings, the way the Michigan Museum has put it together, and be part of it. And that's what's gonna make it come to life for you. And I think that's gonna make it exciting and deep.
SPEAKER_04:I appreciate that. Louise, any comments before we see if there's any? Are there any? And we'll get questions. If not, I'll make some questions of my own.
SPEAKER_01:I think I've said what I can say. So I turn it over to the Q&A that is to follow here, because 15 minutes will be eaten up rather quickly. And I'm always the fly on the perennial wall. And I'm curious to hear what everybody else has got to say. So thank you so much for the invitation.
SPEAKER_04:While we wait for if there's any questions, again, what I can do is I'd love to tell you that, again, just to remind you that the show is on view in Saginaw, Michigan at the Marshall and Frederick Sculpture Museum through January 15th. It then travels to California where it'll be on view February 26th through June 26th in an expanded version. What I'm going to do also is that that'll be a rename. What you're seeing in Michigan will be a one time opportunity to see it, but it will be moving forward and we really appreciate that. Louise, as I'm going forward too, I'm just curious, what are your next steps, if you will? I know that this, I think the archival project we're talking about as well, what would you love to see happen with your work and what would you hope to see? Hold on. You're muted. I'm sorry. I had muted you because there was some background. Try it again. You're still muted. Louie, you're muted. There you go. Okay. Sorry, I muted you because there was background noise and I apologize.
SPEAKER_01:That's okay. That's all right. In terms of what I'm looking at, I'm very thankful to both you and to Armando to be collaborating once again, as we are. I think we make one hell of a team. The vision that both of you have in regards to my work, I find to be quite an honor that you see what many are beginning to see now. And this exposure helps to solidify the interest in my work. The 5,000 to 7,000 photographic images that I have here at the house is the next project, as you mentioned, for us to to scan, to digitize, and to expand the exhibition narrative of my work. If I'm gonna live 200 years beyond now through my photographic work, as Armando says, then I think it's important to document and archive my work. I'm gonna be 79 years old in January of this coming year. And so I expect to live a few more years beyond that. And so this would be an important part of the next major project. And so again, that's what I'm working towards. And I thank you, Melissa, as the vision doer, the vision enabler of my work and Armando as my vision therapist, as I like to say, because it gives greater meaning to my work. And so I'd like to hear more from everybody else in terms of what their impressions are of the work.
SPEAKER_04:I have a question actually that I was posed and I, and I realized that it, that we need to give some context because not a lot of people know about Davide Ferro Siqueira's work and why The pointing is so significant. And the question is, what's going on with the photo about David Ferraziqueras? Why is he pointing or how was the context about what's going on? And before we talk about what's going on, I think it'd be nice if you could explain about the artist as a muralist. He was considered Tres Los Grandes, the three great muralists in Mexico, along with Diego Rivera, who was a household name because of a woman. I'm sorry. Yay, Frida.
UNKNOWN:Fantastic.
SPEAKER_03:He's a household name in Michigan. In Detroit, we have the Detroit murals at the Detroit Institute of Arts. So Diego Rivera and Frida are well beloved in Michigan as well.
SPEAKER_04:Well, my feeling is that Siqueiros was kind of lesser known for many years because he was communist and people, it was not, they didn't want to talk about it, you know. So Diego Rivera and Clemente, Jose Clemente Orozco got a a lot of play, right? And as you mentioned, the murals in Detroit, Rivera, but also in Los Angeles, it became important because of Siqueiros. Siqueiros also was, and maybe this is something both Luis and Armando can address, Siqueiros was kind of like to me, one of the iconic symbols of the Chicano civil rights movement. Would you say, am I saying that correctly, Armando? And would you, you're on mute too. So Luis, maybe what you could do is talk about like, why Siqueiros is significant. And then Luis can then, could you answer the question of what's happening? I think the pointing and what he was saying to you, because I think that's important.
SPEAKER_02:If I may, Siqueiros was important to the artists in the movement. And this is a movement, the Chicano movement is a movement that very much involves artists. unlike other movements, artists were very much part of the movement, and one of their heroes was Siqueiros, in part because of the whitewash that occurred of America Tropical. And then the other mural, which Luis discovered, and he can talk about that, the workers at Chouinard School was also whitewashed. So there was only one mural left, and that was It was in a private home. It is now at the Santa Barbara Museum of Art. But that's where the connection is between Siqueiros and the movement. And I'll let Luis talk about the image, where that image comes from originally.
SPEAKER_01:The image of him pointing is, as I referred to earlier, it's a self-portrait that he did of himself when you look at his work. At the time that I was photographing him, I had no idea that he was doing what he was doing. And I come to find out later on as I begin to research him. I'm not an art historian. I had very little arts background. I'm self-taught in terms of my photographic work for the most part. And Mr. Kedos opens up a door to me. He is the inspiration of the mural movement in this country and internationally in terms of outdoor muralism. He plants the seed in 1932 here in Olvera Street for the future of muralism that grows out of his work as the mural begins to reappear through layers of whitewash paint. We're currently involved with trying to resuscitate the first meeting first mural that he did at Chouinard Art School called Street Meeting or Mitín Obrero. I'm currently working with Dave Torgé and Armando Vázquez Ramos and Gonzalo Santos and a number of other people in regards to this particular mural and recovering it and the building itself to create a cultural arts center. That's a whole other project. That's a whole other case of wine. It's an involved story, but That finger pointing by Siqueiros at me is an iconic image that I come to later find out as I begin to research him. And then I work with the Getty Conservation Institute in regards to the conservation of America Tropical, which took some 20, 25 years for it to happen. So again, it's an involved history. It's a novella, a very interesting novella as well.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, the image comes from a 1947 painting, self-portrait called El Coro Lenazo. There you go. Because Siqueiros not only fought in the Mexican Revolution, but then went to Spain and fought in the Spanish Civil War. And so he... 10, 11 years later, he paints this self-portrait called El Coronazo, and he reprises that image in the photograph that Luis took. unbeknownst to me at the
SPEAKER_04:time. Well, and a lot of his work has that perspective. It all has that, you know, it's that it's the idea. I love that. And that that iconic piece you mentioned really kind of puts that in there. And I think that's what's really interesting. The more that I learned during the course of working with Luis on the Siqueiros project that we did with the exhibition, it was just so rewarding to learn and to share so much more about this artist. And and I'm so glad that because of the work that especially that louise did with the exhibition and moving forward people do know more about this artist and he is really a great one of the great ones and i i loved his work and i was really glad that we had that exhibition I think this has been really wonderful. I'm curious if there's anyone else on the museum team that has any thoughts or if they have any of their favorite pieces of people that have seen it that you might want to ask Luis about if there's or just any curiosity about anything else about how the show's going in Michigan and so forth.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I wanted to kind of jump off of what Armando was talking about with the organization and organization of the images and how they they invite a new conversation. And sometimes we in the museum world, even, you know, taking a step further and really, so what we're trying to do is intentionally encourage that conversation. And we came up with a series of prompts, maybe around 10 to 12 prompts that ask people to, we call them reflexiones, to reflect on and comment back on topics you know, um, what, um, maybe what the years they're seeing in the images or what it reminds them in present day. Cause again, it is just so timely and, um, or what people, um, you know, what movements are they involved in and what things are people passionate about and what, how are they, um, carrying forward their movements and passions. Um, and then we're going to take that and, um, and make it into an interactive installation where they can, um, clip them up with clothespins like photographs waiting to dry in the processing. And so we have a little fun with it. But really, we want people to not just reflect internally, but to have those conversations with other people and carry the movements forward and really take action, be it personally in their personal lives or collectively in the community. And so we were just so thrilled to bring this to our community. The community in Saginaw has actually quite a large significant Chicano population as compared to other places in Michigan and across the country. I think, you know, over 20% of our population in Saginaw. So it's quite significant. And so we were so happy to bring this not only to to kick off our Hispanic Heritage Month, but to continue on. And like I said, these conversations and topics will continue on. And wow, just each and every photograph on their own, they just stop you in your tracks. And the prints aren't overly large, oversized prints, but they have an oversized impact. And we hung it just a slightly little bit lower usually might hang a show. So you're really just face to face with these people. You feel like you're, you're really just right there with them in whatever space environment they are in. And you, you do, you are thinking, what are these people thinking? Where, where are they now? Where are they then? And some, it is, it definitely, yes, you know, has that documentary element to it, this historic element, but it really you know, does what art, good art does. And it really, you know, just it's arresting. So we're thrilled to have it. We're so thrilled to have you all on this call today to get to meet you virtually, Luis, Armando, and Melissa. And I've had lots of phone conversations as well. But we are getting fabulous feedback. Again, we're on a university campus. And so seeing the students come through, we're right across the hall, actually, from the photography studios and dark rooms on campus. And so we're excited to see what students and community members are going to do with their cameras in response to this. But everyone's really enjoying the show. So thank you for sharing it with us. Thank you for letting us bring it to Michigan. Thank you very much. And thank you for this time. Thank you. Any final words from Armando or Luis?
SPEAKER_02:No, I think just to thank Luis from my perspective, just to thank Luis for the eye that he has and had for the honesty of the work. And that's what I think makes them timeless is there was an honest effort to capture a moment in time and that moment became timeless.
SPEAKER_01:I want to thank Armando. I want to thank Luis. Melissa and the Marshall and Frederick's staff. A big hug, a big abrazo to everybody. And thank you.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you. Thank you so much.
SPEAKER_04:Adios to everyone. Thank you so much. We are
SPEAKER_00:saying goodbye to you all. I'm still submerged in fog.