

      <h2 id="introduction-and-excerpt"><a class="no-underline" href="#introduction-and-excerpt">Introduction and Excerpt</a></h2>


        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>1:05</time>
      <p>
          Zacchaeus   and   Judas   have   quite   a   bit   of   parallels ,   but   yet   they   went   about   their   pursuit   of   money   differently .   Zacchaeus   left   God&#39;s   family ,   he   left   God&#39;s   will   to   pursue   money ,   to   pursue   wealth ,   to   pursue   creaturely   comforts .   Right ,   he&#39;s   the   sinner   who   ended   up   in   the   pigsty .   But   Judas ,   he   stayed   close   to   the   church ,   he   stayed   close   to   Jesus .   From   the   outside   he   was   a   whitewashed   tomb ,   he   was   a   moralist .   He   was   doing   all   the   right   things ,   he   was   following   Christ .   Yet   Zacchaeus   and   Judas ,   both   were   doing   something .   One   of   them   was   running   from   God   and   one   of   them   was   staying   close   to   God .   But   Judas   was   staying   close   to   God ,   as   it   turns   out ,   for   the   same   reasons .   Zacchaeus   was   running   from   God   for   his   own   wealth ,   for   his   own   comfort .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>1:51</time>
      <p>
          And   so   often   in   our   lives   we   can   do   the   same   thing .   Some   of   us   run   far   away   from   God   because   we   want   to   pursue   our   own   way ,   our   own   life ,   and   some   of   us ,   we   go   to   church   every   Sunday   and   we   act   the .   We   play   the   part   of   the   legalists   and   the   moralists .   We   do   all   the   right   things ,   we   say   all   the   right   things ,   but   we   do   it   because   we   want   control   over   our   lives ,   because   we   want   the   wealth ,   because   we   want   the   comfort .   And   the   difference   here   is   to   be   a   Christian   is   to   pursue   God   for   who   God   is ,   not   because   we   want   our   life ,   but   because   he   gave   up   his   life   so   that   we   could   have   a   life .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>2:31</time>
      <p>
          Guys ,   I   have   a   really   sincere ,   genuine   question .   It&#39;s   unique   because   I   never   ask   sincere ,   genuine   questions .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>2:39</time>
      <p>
          The   answer   is   four .   Two   plus   two   is   four .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>2:41</time>
      <p>
          This   is   how   you   know   when   someone   really   knows   someone ,   when   they   know   that   what   they&#39;re   gonna   say   is   not   what   they&#39;re   gonna   say ,   but   you&#39;re   wrong .   This   is   somewhat   genuine .   How   many   times   is   it   appropriate   to   say   excuse   me   to   someone   when   they&#39;re   telling   you   something   and   you   can&#39;t   understand   them ?   I&#39;m   talking   about   whether   it&#39;s   an   accent   or   it&#39;s   too   loud   and   it&#39;s   hard   to   hear ,   or   they&#39;re   not   speaking   clearly   enough .   I   mean   seriously ,   how   many   times   is   it   appropriate   to   say   excuse   me ,   Because   I&#39;ve   been   in   some   weird   situations ?   Right ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:10</time>
      <p>
          Three   times   and   then   you   slap   the   face   With   your   foot .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:14</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   have   you   guys   ever   been   in   those   situations   where   someone   is   telling   you   something ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:19</time>
      <p>
          Excuse   me ,   excuse   me ,   it&#39;s   gonna   be   the   same   thing   as   when ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:22</time>
      <p>
          the   timing ?   I   know   I   predicted   this   a   hundred   times   in   my   head   already   before   this .   Excuse   me ,   okay ,   I   can&#39;t .   No ,   but   someone&#39;s   trying   to   tell   you   something   and   you   don&#39;t   understand   them .   Sometimes   it&#39;s   been   an   accent   for   me   or   it&#39;s   been   louder ,   and   they   keep   saying   it   and   it   gets   to   a   point   where   you   get   embarrassed .   What&#39;s   he   talking ?   Excuse   me ,   why   did   I   put   myself   in ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>3:42</time>
      <p>
          this   position .   No ,   you   set   yourself   up   on   this   one .   You   set   yourself   up ,   I   know .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:47</time>
      <p>
          This   is   your   fault ,   ez .   But   seriously   though ,   does   it   get   to   a   point   where   you   just   nod   your   head ?   I&#39;ve   done   it   where   I&#39;m   like   yeah ,   there&#39;s   a   courtesy   thing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:58</time>
      <p>
          You   don&#39;t   want   to   make   the   person   seem   very   foolish ,   so   you   just   got   to   use   discretion .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:03</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   but   they&#39;re   asking   you   a   question   or   they&#39;re   telling   you   something   and   you   don&#39;t   know   what   you&#39;re   agreeing   to .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>4:07</time>
      <p>
          but   it   just   gets   to   a   point   where   it&#39;s   like   One   of   my   sisters   is   hearing   impaired   and   we   used   to   give   her   a   heart   tum   all   the   time   because   if   she&#39;s ,   what&#39;s   that ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:15</time>
      <p>
          Don&#39;t   do   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>4:16</time>
      <p>
          I   knew   it .   If   she   was   across   the   table   with   somebody   and   they   would   crack   a   joke ,   everyone   would   laugh   and   you   would   see   my   sister ,   sam ,   go   like   if   you   were   me   and   I&#39;m   Sam ,   she&#39;d   go   like   this .   What   did   he   say ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:28</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   it&#39;s   kind   of   like   that .   You   know ,   I   remember   a   friend   of   mine&#39;s   mom   when   I   was   growing   up ,   a   friend   that   I   actually   ended   up   reuniting   with   not   long   ago .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>4:37</time>
      <p>
          There&#39;s   too   many   details .   He   was   a   really   nice   guy .   He   had   nice   hair .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>4:40</time>
      <p>
          This   is   what   happens   when   you   get   older .   He   was   kind   of   tall .   He   was   born   in   Westminster   in   the   80s .   It   wasn&#39;t   Westminster   where   he   lived .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:48</time>
      <p>
          But   I   remember   she   said   something   and   just   always   stuck   with   me .   She   said   always   listen   very   closely   to   what   people   say ,   Listen   closely   to   their   words .   It   was   just   a   bit   of   wisdom ,   and   it   always   comes   back   to   mind   in   situations   where   it&#39;s   like   it&#39;s   easy   for   us   to   just   kind   of   brush   things   off ,   yeah ,   or   agree   to   something ,   and   then   end   up   finding   it   out   that   it   was   something   different   than   what   we   thought .   And   so   I   think   that&#39;s .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>5:15</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   biblical   too   be   swift   to   hear   and   slow   to   speak .   So   be   swift   to   hear   and   slow   to   speak   Slow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:23</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   so   you   guys   ever   tried   those   tests   to   see   if   you   can   hear   a   super   high-pitched   sound ?   Kids   ever   do   that .   You   mean   like   you&#39;re   singing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>5:35</time>
      <p>
          No ,   but   you   know   they   have   them .   They   like   the   beep   tests .   Yeah ,   I   had   one   when   I   was   a   kid .   Oh ,   they   have   them   on   your   phone .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>5:43</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   do   it   all   the   time   around .   When   I&#39;m   around   kids .   I   put   my   phone   in   a   conspicuous   place .   I   turned   that   little   thing   on ,   knowing   that   none   of   the   adults   can   hear   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:51</time>
      <p>
          You   can&#39;t   hear   it ,   right ,   I   can&#39;t   hear   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>5:53</time>
      <p>
          They&#39;re   just   like .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:55</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   like   a   dog   whistle   Kids   can&#39;t   hear   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>5:57</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   like   a   dog   whistle   for   kids .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:58</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   like   a   dog   whistle   for   kids .   Why   can   they   hear ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>6:00</time>
      <p>
          it   and   you   can&#39;t ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>6:01</time>
      <p>
          I   don&#39;t   know ,   because   we   just   get   older   and   are   hearing   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:03</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   think   that&#39;s   what&#39;s   going   on .   I&#39;m   playing   it   now .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:07</time>
      <p>
          But   I   wonder   that   you   know ,   like   how   much   better   did   we   used   to   hear .   And   then   time   goes   by   and   you   just   don&#39;t   know   anymore ,   you   don&#39;t   realize   anymore .   That&#39;s .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:15</time>
      <p>
          Richard   Dawkins   Millions   of   years   ago .   Yeah ,   crazy   stuff .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:22</time>
      <p>
          Mark   Scottedon&#39;s   phone .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:24</time>
      <p>
          Are   you   turning   it   on ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:25</time>
      <p>
          Mark .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>6:26</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   can   you   hear   it ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:27</time>
      <p>
          Oh   that&#39;s   so   loud .   Oh   wow ,   no ,   you&#39;re   not   playing   it ,   are   you ?   Yeah ,   no ,   I   can&#39;t   hear   anything .   Can   you   hear   it ,   oscar ?   No ,   not   even   in   your   headphones .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:36</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   an   intelligence   test   we   failed .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:39</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   called   a   dog   whistle .   Yeah   yeah ,   so   it&#39;s   just   crazy   when   you   think   about   that .   You   know   one   of   the   things .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:45</time>
      <p>
          Hang   on   a   minute .   A   wonderful   lot   of   kids   is   listening   to   you   just   blew   a   billion   eardrums   my   ears   are   bleeding .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:52</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   no ,   but   you   know   one   of   the   things   that   I   do   sometimes ,   rachel   and   the   kids   always   laugh   at   me .   If   I&#39;m   talking   to   someone   with   an   accent ,   I   start   to   mimic   their   accent .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>7:02</time>
      <p>
          No ,   it&#39;s   called   mirroring .   Is   that   a   thing ?   Yeah ,   it&#39;s   a   thing .   I   do   something   similar .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:08</time>
      <p>
          I   think   it&#39;s   because   I&#39;m   subconsciously   thinking   they&#39;ll   understand   me   better .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>7:12</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and   usually   the   person   that   does   it   is   delusional   into   thinking   the   accent   is   actually   genuine   sound .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:18</time>
      <p>
          Sing   us   a   song .   Oh ,   yeah ,   right ,   I   like   seven   days .   Right ,   you   know   that   I   spiked   just   long ,   yeah ,   and   then   just   like   the   way   you   tell   it ,   right .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>7:29</time>
      <p>
          Sounds   like   a   convict   Australia   being   tortured   in   Australia .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:33</time>
      <p>
          You   know .   Seriously ,   I   wonder .   Look ,   when   my   dad   moved   to   the   US ,   ray ,   you   were   probably   about   three .   My   dad   was   70 .   He&#39;s   now ,   you   know ,   112 .   That&#39;s   crazy   Every   time ,   those   numbers .   So ,   ray ,   I   wonder   what   it   would   have   been   like   for   you .   My   dad   never   learned   English ,   but   if   you   moved   to   a   place   like   Russia   or   China   or   you   know   wherever ,   if   you   would   still   have   a   New   Zealand   accent .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>7:55</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;d   learn   the   language .   Just   I&#39;d   say   it&#39;s   like   food   now   and   things   like   that   yeah   but   the   basics .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>8:02</time>
      <p>
          But   I   mean ,   like   would   you   do   it   with ,   like ,   a   New ?   Zealand ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>8:05</time>
      <p>
          accent ,   I   think .   So   I   think   I   wouldn&#39;t   mediate   Like   would   it   be   like   if   you&#39;re   in   Germany ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>8:09</time>
      <p>
          would   it   be   like   Flavik   Nogen ,   lena   Schnitzel ,   what   on ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>8:18</time>
      <p>
          If   there   is   a   Russian   New   Zealander   out   there   listening   to   this   podcast ,   would   you   email   us ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>8:23</time>
      <p>
          We&#39;d   love   to   hear   your   accent ,   but   I&#39;d   give   to   you   Ray   speaking   of   Russian   Record   it ,   record   it   and   send   it   to   us ,   just   unsubscribed .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>8:30</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;d   say   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>8:33</time>
      <p>
          All   right ,   friends ,   we&#39;ve   got   a   comment .   This   is   from   Garrett   Rose .   I   want   to   thank   y&#39;all   so   much   for   doing   this   podcast .   It   reminds   me   of   what   Christian   friendship   and   fellowship   looks   like   and   always   makes   me   feel   like   I&#39;m   with   my   friends   talking   about   the   word   of   God .   I   also   want   to   thank   Ray   specifically   because   of   your   evangelism   videos ,   I   realized   that   I   wasn&#39;t   saved   because   I   never   understood   the   weight   and   consequences   of   my   sin .   Thank   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>8:58</time>
      <p>
          Praise   the   Lord ,   praise   God   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>9:02</time>
      <p>
          I   mean   we   hear   of   one   person   that   got   saved ,   but   this   has   potentially   generational   impact   their   kids   and   then   those   that   know   them .   I   think   about   that   sometimes .   When   we   talk   about   the   number   of   people   that   watch   our   YouTube   channel   or   listen   to   the   podcast   or   watch   the   TV   show ,   you   have   to   think   that   the   extrapolation   of   that   because   those   people   all   have   a   circle   of   influence ,   you   know ,   I   mean   if   each   person   knew   10   people   really   well ,   you   know ,   you   multiply   the   potential   of   impact   by   10 ,   you   know ,   do   you   remember   that ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>9:32</time>
      <p>
          the   young   man   that   we   met   at   the   way   of   the   master   relaunch   season ?   I   can&#39;t   even   remember   now ,   but   he   came   up   to   us ,   he   had   one   of   the   original   evidence   Bibles   and   he   told   me   that   you   guys   have   to   remember   this .   He   told   me   that   he   started   watching   Way   of   the   Master   with   his   parents   when   he   was   like   a   kid ,   I   don&#39;t   know   five ,   six   years   old ,   and   now   he&#39;s   a   dad .   Oh   yeah ,   yes ,   he&#39;s   watching   Way   of   the   Master   with   his   kids .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>9:54</time>
      <p>
          I   totally   remember   that .   Isn&#39;t   that   crazy .   Yeah ,   yeah ,   it&#39;s   wonderful .   Yeah ,   it&#39;s   lovely   and   encouraging .   So   thank   you   for   that ,   garrett ,   and   may   the   Lord   continue   to   use   you   as   you   grow   in
      </p>

      <h2 id="zacchaeus-the-issues-of-being-short"><a class="no-underline" href="#zacchaeus-the-issues-of-being-short">Zacchaeus, the Issues of Being Short</a></h2>


        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:03</time>
      <p>
            him .   All   right ,   friends ,   this   podcast   is   brought   to   you   by   the   Equipping   Book   Pack .   Ray ,   this   was   your   brainchild ,   as   most   things   are .   This   is   World   Religions   in   a   Nutshell   how   to   Know   God   Exists ,   how   to   Overcome   Life&#39;s   Endless   Trials ,   anyone   but   Me ,   undeniable   Evidence   and   Banana   man   all   in   one   pack   for   a   really   good   price ,   banana   man .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:24</time>
      <p>
          Banana ,   Banana   man ,   Banana   man .   So   make   sure   to   check   it   out ,   friends ,   along   with   the   Living   Waters   podcast   Mug   and   the   Evidence   Study   Bible   at   LivingWaterscom   Dot   com .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>10:37</time>
      <p>
          We   started   putting   in   hot   chocolate   in   the   mugs .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:41</time>
      <p>
          Did   you ?   Yes ,   I   did   you ,   and   I   talked   about   that .   Who   gave   you   that   idea ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>10:43</time>
      <p>
          Ray ,   you   gave   the   idea   to   me   and   I   went   ahead   and   did   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>10:46</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   why   so ,   if   they   get   the   mug ,   so   wait ,   this   is   big   news   they   get   hot   chocolate .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>10:50</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   hot   chocolate   in   the   mug ,   it   spills .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>10:53</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   is   it   still   hot   by   the ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>10:54</time>
      <p>
          time   it   gets   there ,   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:56</time>
      <p>
          While   supplies   last   and   as   long   as   we   decide   to   keep   doing   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>10:59</time>
      <p>
          just   in   case   someone&#39;s   hearing   this   game   online   I&#39;m   glad   you   said   that   you   should   throw   a   marshmallow   in   there   too .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:04</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   they   should   get   it   with   the   hot   chocolate   already   mixed   with   everything   in   there .   Yeah ,   friends ,   that&#39;s   fun ,   so   make   sure   to   get   all   that   good   stuff .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>11:11</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   nice .   The   staff   has   been   drinking   it   before   it   goes .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:15</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   All   right   friends .   Today   we&#39;re   talking   about .   Zach .   Kias   was   a   wee   little   man .   A   wee   little   man ,   was   he ?   What   a   sick   song   he   climbed   up   in   a   sycamore   tree   Is   this   real ,   what   You&#39;ve   never   heard   Wait   stop .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>11:30</time>
      <p>
          Israel .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>11:31</time>
      <p>
          Is   this   real ?   Oh ,   there&#39;s   a   song   in   Israel .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:33</time>
      <p>
          No ,   no ,   no ,   You&#39;re   joking .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>11:33</time>
      <p>
          Israel ,   israel .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:34</time>
      <p>
          You   are   joking ,   Oscar .   You&#39;ve   never   heard   that   song .   I   didn&#39;t   grow   up   Christian ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>11:37</time>
      <p>
          I   don&#39;t   know   any   of   this   stuff .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>11:38</time>
      <p>
          You&#39;ve   never   heard   that .   No ,   it&#39;s   a   demeaning   song   about   a   man   of   God .   Yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:45</time>
      <p>
          Ray ,   why   am   I   feeling   like   personal   and   the   most   important   song   and   the   most   important   song ,   yeah   it&#39;s   because   I&#39;m   standing   at   this   table .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>11:53</time>
      <p>
          On   stealth .   Listen ,   you   really   got   to   hand   it   to   Ray ,   because   you   probably   can&#39;t   reach   it   anyway .   That&#39;s   a   good   dad   joke   there ,   Mark .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>12:05</time>
      <p>
          Ray   look ,   I&#39;m   looking ,   what   do ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>12:08</time>
      <p>
          you   want   to   ask .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>12:11</time>
      <p>
          I   remember   sitting   in   my   dad&#39;s   car   when   I   was   a   little   kid   and   I   saw   my   dad   talking   to   a   man   and   I   thought   my   dad&#39;s   short ,   he&#39;s   five   foot   eight .   He   was   five .   I   didn&#39;t   even   get   a   five   foot   five .   I   think   I   reached   five   foot   five .   So   my   dad   was   tall   compared   to   me ,   my   brother&#39;s .   The   thing   is   about   six   foot   or   six   feet .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>12:27</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   philip   is   pretty   tall ,   that   hasn&#39;t   made   me   better   at   all .   What&#39;s   it   like   to   duck   under   a   dog .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>12:34</time>
      <p>
          That   does   not   make   Ray   happy .   Well   then   which   one   does   it   make   you   You&#39;re ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>12:38</time>
      <p>
          not   happy   either .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>12:39</time>
      <p>
          That   makes   me   dopey .   So ,   ray ,   this   is   yeah ,   I   mean   Zachy   is   he&#39;s   in   God&#39;s   word ,   and   I   mean   this   is   what   he&#39;s   known   for   being   short   yeah   For   returning   and   people   singing   silly   songs   about   the   poor   guy .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>12:54</time>
      <p>
          What   do   you   see   as   glorified   body ?   So   I   tell   you   what   if   you   study ,   if   you   study   tall   people   in   scripture ,   they   didn&#39;t   come   down   very   well .   You   got   Goliath   down .   He   went .   You&#39;ve   got   King   Saul .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>13:06</time>
      <p>
          Oh ,   turn   that   to   be   a   rat   bag .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>13:07</time>
      <p>
          He   has   hidden   shoulders   about   the   people .   Jesus   looked   up   to   Zacchaeus .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>13:15</time>
      <p>
          My   grandson   Haddon   is   like   addicted   to   the   song .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>13:18</time>
      <p>
          He   just   sings   it   all   the   time   he&#39;s   going   to   be   about   eight   foot   six .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>13:21</time>
      <p>
          He&#39;s   going   to .   He&#39;s   in   the   99th   percentile ,   yeah ,   and   so   you   know .   Matthias   is   six ,   four   Summers ,   five ,   eight   tall   for   a   girl ,   and   so   I   met   him   the   other   day .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>13:31</time>
      <p>
          He   was   shaving   he&#39;s   getting   there .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>13:33</time>
      <p>
          Wait ,   how   tall   is   Matthias ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>13:35</time>
      <p>
          Six ,   four ,   wow ,   yeah .   But   he   just   loves   this   song   and   it&#39;s   like   we   don&#39;t   know   what   to   do   because   he&#39;s   at   the   park   the   other   day   and   he&#39;s   singing   it   and   he&#39;s   in   the   tree   and   he&#39;s   like   I&#39;m   in   a   sycamore   tree .   Who   put   them   in   the   tree ?   They   just   put   them   up   there   because   they   wanted   to   go   have   fun   around   the   park .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>13:51</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   the   babysitter ,   so   they   wanted   to   go   to   the   supermarket .   Can ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>13:54</time>
      <p>
          you   imagine   here&#39;s   son   stay   here .   But   but   yeah ,   zacchaeus   was   a   wee   little   man .   A   wee   little   man   was   he ?   He   climbed   up   in   the   sycamore   tree ,   the   Lord   he   wanted   to   see   Mark   no .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>14:05</time>
      <p>
          I   was   just   wondering   how   do   short   people   greet   each   other ?   Yeah ,   they   microwave .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:14</time>
      <p>
          You   did   your   dad   joke   research .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>14:16</time>
      <p>
          I   love   this .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>14:17</time>
      <p>
          I   love   short   jokes .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>14:18</time>
      <p>
          I   wasn&#39;t   going   to   do   any   until   Ray   gave   me   permission .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>14:20</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   right ,   because ,   well ,   the   good   thing   about   short   jokes   is   they   don&#39;t   go   on   too   long .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:25</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   so   good .   I   remember   years   ago ,   Ray ,   I   wrote   a   whole   long   list   of   short   joke   comebacks   that   Rachel   can   use .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:34</time>
      <p>
          She&#39;s   four   foot   10 .   Four   foot   10   mother   hen   is   what   we   call   her .   But   yeah ,   zacchaeus ,   let   me   read   the   story   for   us   and   kick   us   off ,   because   the   title ,   friends ,   of   this   podcast   is   Zacchaeus   Much   More   Than   Just   A   Wee   Little   man .   So   Luke   19 ,   1   to   10, .   Then   Jesus   entered   and   passed   through   Jericho .   Now ,   behold ,   there   was   a   man   named   Zacchaeus   who   was   a   chief   tax   collector   and   he   was   rich   and   he   sought   to   see   who   Jesus   was ,   but   could   not   because   of   the   crowd ,   for   he   was   King   James   says ,   because   of   the   press ,   because   of   what .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>15:05</time>
      <p>
          Because   the   media   really   appreciated   what   was   going   on ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>15:07</time>
      <p>
          Does   it   say   the   press ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>15:08</time>
      <p>
          It   says   the   press .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>15:09</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   the   press   Fake   news .   For   he   was   of   short   stature .   So   he   ran   ahead   and   climbed   up   in   a   sycamore   tree   to   see   him ,   for   he   was   going   to   pass   that   way .   And   when   Jesus   came   to   that   place   he   looked   up   and   saw   him   and   said   to   him   Zacchaeus ,   make   haste   and   come   down ,   for   today   I   must   stay   at   your   house .   So   he   made   haste   and   came   down   and   received   him   joyfully .   But   when   they   saw   it   they   all   complained ,   saying   he   has   gone   to   be   a   guest   with   a   man   who   was   a   sinner .   Then   Zacchaeus   stood   and   said   to   the   Lord   look ,   lord ,   I   give   half   of   my   goods   to   the   poor   and   I   have ,   if   I&#39;ve   taken   anything   from   anyone   by   false   accusation ,   I   restore   fourfold .   And   Jesus   said   to   him   today   salvation   has   come   to   this   house   because   he   also   is   a   son   of   Abraham ,   for   the   son   of   man   has   come   to   seek   and   save   that   which   was   lost  
      </p>

      <h2 id="the-significance-of-zacchaeus-story"><a class="no-underline" href="#the-significance-of-zacchaeus-story">The Significance of Zacchaeus&#39; Story</a></h2>


        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>16:00</time>
      <p>
          man .   This   passage   is   so   packed ,   there&#39;s   so   much   in   here ,   so   much ,   and   it&#39;s   so   Easy .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>16:05</time>
      <p>
          I   noticed   we   were   reading   the   whole   portion .   You   were   smiling .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>16:08</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   mean   because ,   again ,   Jesus   is   so   much   more   than   we   oftentimes   give   him   credit   for   being   and   did ,   so   much   more   by   way   of   significance   than   I   think   we   realize .   And   as   I&#39;m   reading   it ,   it&#39;s   coming ,   it&#39;s   all   coming   back   to   heart   and   mind   like   man .   This   is   really   amazing   and   I   think   context   is   important   and   understanding   those   things   is   key .   So ,   oscar ,   give   us   a   little   bit   of   background   and   fill   in   the   blanks   on .   He&#39;s   a   tax   collector ,   yes ,   and   that&#39;s   a   good   place   to   start .   Yeah ,   and   we   already   see   here   that   obviously   the   religious   were   in   an   uproar   because   he&#39;s   going   to   be   with   a   center .   So   give   us   a   background .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>16:47</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   the   context   of   tax   collector ,   I   think ,   is   really   important   as   we   come   across   those   words   in   the   scriptures   often .   It&#39;s   good   for   us   to   know   what   it   is   and   how   it&#39;s   different ,   because   even   if   we ,   if   we   knew   one   of   our   neighbors   worked   for   their   IRS   right   now ,   we   all   probably   wouldn&#39;t   like   them   very   much   already   right   Because   they&#39;re   a   tax   collector ,   but   it   was   even   more   so .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>17:07</time>
      <p>
          Remember   that   the   taxes   that   Zacchaeus   was   helping   collect   was   from   the   Jews   and   for   the   Romans ,   and   Zacchaeus   was   the   Jews .   So   what   the   Roman ,   what   the   Roman   centurions   would   do ,   is   they   would   come   in   and   they   would   go   to   a   Jew   and   they   would   basically   hire   them   away   from   the   people .   They   would   betray   his   own   people .   He   would   become   a   spy   for   his   own   people .   It   was   like   okay ,   zacchaeus ,   you   know   the   lay   of   the   land ,   you   know   how   much   Mark   is   making   and   what   easy   in   his   family   do   for   work   and   what   and   how   often   Ray   goes   out .   You   know   fishing .   So   it&#39;s   you&#39;re   going   to   be   the   best   equipped   person   to   be   able   to   tell   us   whether   they&#39;re   being   honest   about   the   money   they&#39;re   making   and   whether   or   not   they&#39;re   paying   us   the   right   amount .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>17:52</time>
      <p>
          And   so ,   to   the   Jewish   people ,   a   tax   collector   was   someone   who   betrayed   his   own   people .   He   was   working   for   the   enemy .   That   people   and   remember ,   rome   is   not   a   welcomed   guest   in   Israel   they   took   over ,   they   forcefully   took   over   the   land .   Right ,   they   are   occupying   the   promised   land .   And   so   Zacchaeus   and   all   of   the   tax   collectors   in   the   New   Testament ,   for   that   matter ,   they&#39;re   heavily   looked   down   upon .   He   is   categorized   immediately   as   a   sinner ,   while   we   are   all   sinners ,   but   he   is   especially   categorized   as   a   sinner   because   he&#39;s   betraying   his   own   people   by   being   this   tax   collector .   And   one   other   thing   to   add   to   that   context   is   that   the   better   you   were ,   the   more   money   you   made ,   the   more   money   Zacchaeus   found   in   the   crevices   that   people   were   hiding .   He   earned   a   percentage   of   that ,   and   so   he   was   directly   motivated   to   shake   people   out   of   more   money   for   the   Romans ,   because   it   means   he   would   make   more   money   himself .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>18:49</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and   I   think   the   text   really   gives   us   insight   into   how   rich   he   was .   He&#39;s   saying   I&#39;ll   give   away   half   of   everything   that   I   own   to   the   poor   and   then ,   on   top   of   that ,   I&#39;ll   restore   fourfold   to   anyone   that   I&#39;ve   ripped   off   and   I   assure   you   he   ripped   off   a   lot   of   people   that   reveals   he   knew   the   law ,   because   the   law ,   lord   Moses ,   said   you   pay   back   fourfold .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>19:10</time>
      <p>
          So   revealed   he   had   some   semblance   of   Jewishness   in   that   sense .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>19:15</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and   look ,   we   can&#39;t   really   downplay   how   hated   the   tax   collectors   were .   As   Oscar   said ,   you   know   there   was   a   betrayal ,   of   course ,   against   the   Jewish   people .   They   were   in   cahoots   with   Rome ,   but   then   they&#39;re   getting   ripped   off   blind ,   you   know .   So   they&#39;re   taking   their   livelihood   and   then   they&#39;re   consorting   with   the   enemy .   They   were   really   hated   and   we   see   insight   in   this ,   you   know ,   from   scripture .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>19:37</time>
      <p>
          In   fact ,   luke   18 ,   jesus   was   talking   about   the   unrighteous   versus   the   righteous   and   their   prayers ,   and   the   hypocrite .   And   he   says   the   Pharisees   stood   by   himself   and   prayed   God .   I   thank   you   that   I   am   not   like   other   people ,   robbers ,   evildoers ,   adulterers ,   or   even   like   this   tax   collector .   You   know ,   I   mean   it   was   they   were   grouped   in   with   like   the   most   hideous .   And   in   Matthew   18 ,   where   Jesus   was   talking   about   church   discipline ,   you   know ,   and   if   your   brother&#39;s   sins   against   you ,   approach   him .   If   he   doesn&#39;t   repent ,   take   one   or   two ,   then   take   it   to   the   church   or   whatever   he   says .   Even   and   this   is   what   he   says   in   Matthew   18 ,   he   says   1817 ,   if   they   refuse   to   listen   even   to   the   church ,   treat   them   as   you   would   a   pagan   or   a   tax   collector .   So   again ,   the   picture   is   being   drawn   here   that   that   Zacchaeus ,   he   was   a   very   detested   and   hated   guy .   And   so ,   ray ,   how   beautiful   is   that   picture   of   him   being   so   eager   to   wanna   see   the   Lord .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>20:34</time>
      <p>
          he   climbs   up   and   oh ,   I   just   find   it   very   thrilling   that   he   ran   ahead   because   he   wanted   to   see   Jesus ,   who   he   was .   Not   just   see   Jesus ,   but   who   he   was ,   which   is ?   You   read   scripture ,   you   come   up   with   the   same   thing .   You   go   who   is   this ?   It&#39;s   like   the   disciples   when   Jesus   still   the   storm ,   they   said   who   is   this   man ?   That   even   the   wind   and   the   sea   obeys   him .   And   so   he   climbed   a   tree ,   which   shows   humility   of   heart .   And   when   Jesus   said ,   make   haste   and   come   down ,   it   says   Zacchaeus   made   haste .   So   there&#39;s   a   sense   of   urgency   for   every   person   to   make   haste   in   coming   to   Christ .   Amen .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>21:12</time>
      <p>
          You   know ,   I   kind   of   put   this   into   effect   when   I   had   the   opportunity   to   meet   George   Clooney   and   give   him   that   gospel   track   oh ,   yeah ,   right .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>21:19</time>
      <p>
          He   was   over   in   a   section   where   everybody   was   kind   of   throwing   in   towards   him   and   I   knew   the   way   it   worked ,   that   eventually   he   would   make   his   way   down   the   line   where   other   people   were   at .   So   I   ran   ahead   to   where   he   would   be   at ,   got   into   the   front   row   and   then   he   made   his   way   on   over   to   me   and   I   gave   him   a   million   dollar   gospel   track   and   he   held   it   up   for   the   cameras   and   his   comment   was   look ,   now   I&#39;m   a   millionaire .   And   I   said ,   sir ,   what&#39;s   written   on   the   backside   of   that   is   more   important   than   all   the   money   inside   your   bank .   Wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>21:47</time>
      <p>
          So ,   real   quick ,   I   was   not   up   a   tree .   Real   quick   for   the   listener   who&#39;s   George   Clooney ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>21:54</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   that&#39;s   so   good ,   mark .   You   know ,   mark ,   I   do   want   you   to   comment   on   this .   We   often   talk   about   how   important   it   is   to   in   fact ,   you   talked   about   it   in   a   recent   podcast   about   how   important   it   is   to   hold   up   the   character   of   God ,   to   open   up   the   character   of   God .   Jesus ,   in   a   sense ,   was   a   novelty   to   Zacchaeus   and   to   those   that   were   living   in   that   region ,   and   what   we   see   here   in   America   oftentimes   is   the   opposite   of   this .   Like ,   get   me   as   far   away   from   hearing   about   Jesus   as   possible .   Zacchaeus   was   eager   to   see   him .   No   doubt   he   had   heard   about   him   and   I   would   assume ,   about   his   character ,   what   he   was   like ,   you   know   what   he   was   doing ,   his   great   power ,   so   on ,   and   so   forth .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>22:36</time>
      <p>
          Of   course ,   remember   the   press   was   there ,   so   he   obviously   had   to   know   about   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>22:39</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   the   press   was   getting   the   word   out ,   but   we   have   the   opposite   problem   today ,   Mark .   Do   you   think   that   we   can   capture   people&#39;s   attention   again   to   be   more   interested   in   the   Lord   by   speaking   about   his   character ,   as   opposed   to   just   like   assuming   they   know   what   Christ   was   like   and   what   God   is   like ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>22:58</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   I   mean   you   should   know   the   truth   and   the   truth   will   set   you   free .   You   know   Jesus   is   seeking   after   those   who   are   gonna   worship   the   Father   and   spirit   in   and   truth .   So   it&#39;s   good   to   have   a   proper   understanding ,   a   clear   picture   of   who   God   is   and   leave   the   results   to   God .   Right ,   I   mean   cause .   We   cannot   save   anybody .   I   do   think   that   the   more   we   are   able   to   share   scripture ,   the   better   off   we&#39;ll   be   inside   of   our   presentation ,   because   scripture   does   not   return   void ,   so   we   get   it   in   us   and   there   will   be   ample   opportunity   to   get   it   out   of   us .   It   might ,   ray ,   do   you   remember   several   years   ago   when   we   went   miniature   golfing ,   when   I   just   started   working   at   the   ministry ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>23:34</time>
      <p>
          Is   there   any   other   kind   of   golfing   career ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>23:36</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   that&#39;s   what   I&#39;m   saying .   He   doesn&#39;t   remember   it   because   he   just   simply   called   it   golf .   Yeah ,   it&#39;s   just   golfing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>23:40</time>
      <p>
          I   thought   why   are   the   clubs   so   big ?   Yeah ,   oh ,   was   that   your   joke ?   You   had   no   point .   I   thought   that   was   a   real .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>23:46</time>
      <p>
          If   you   ask   me   how   tall   I   am ,   I&#39;m   gonna   say   I&#39;m   about   six   feet .   But   if   you   ask   Ray   how   tall   he   is ,   what   do   you   say   Ray ,   Five   point ,   five   feet ,   five ,   Five   11   inches .   No ,   I   say   four ,   four ,   14 ,   I   think ,   or   something   like   that   Five ,   11   inches ,   it&#39;s   always   just   more   specific .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>23:59</time>
      <p>
          Four ,   yeah ,   five ,   11   inch ,   Something   like   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>24:03</time>
      <p>
          Mark ,   was   there   a   note ?   What   was   that ?   No ,   that   was   it .   Listen ,   we   don&#39;t   need   to   climb   a   tree   to   see .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>24:07</time>
      <p>
          We   don&#39;t   need   to   climb   a   tree   to   see   truth ,   but   listen ,   you   draw   near   to   God ,   god   will   draw   near   to   you .   So   if   we   open   up   God&#39;s   word ,   he&#39;s   gonna   meet   us   more   than   where   we&#39;re   at ,   but   where   we   need   to   be .   And   imagine ,   to   his   surprise ,   zacchaeus&#39;   response   when   Jesus   looks   up   to   him ,   gets   eye   contact   and   says   today   I&#39;m   going   to   dine   with   you .   Just   what   took   over   him   to   where   he   goes .   Yeah ,   man ,   let&#39;s   do   the   flamingo .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>24:37</time>
      <p>
          Probably   hasn&#39;t   had   any   Jews   dine   with   him   for   40   years .   Yeah
      </p>

      <h2 id="difference-between-zacchaeus-and-judas"><a class="no-underline" href="#difference-between-zacchaeus-and-judas">Difference Between Zacchaeus and Judas</a></h2>


        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>24:41</time>
      <p>
            that&#39;s   probably   true .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>24:42</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;ve   been   thinking   a   lot .   This   is   unformed   thoughts ,   but   this   morning   I&#39;ve   been   thinking   a   lot   about   the   parallel   between   Zacchaeus   and   Judas ,   and   it   kind   of   reminds   me   of   the   Prodigal   Son   story ,   because   Zacchaeus   and   Judas   have   quite   a   bit   of   parallels ,   but   yet   they   went   about   their   pursuit   of   money   differently .   Zacchaeus   left   God&#39;s   family ,   he   left   God&#39;s   will   to   pursue   money ,   to   pursue   wealth ,   to   pursue   creaturely   comforts .   Right ,   he&#39;s   the   sinner   who   ended   up   in   the   pigsty .   But   Judas ,   he   stayed   close   to   the   church ,   he   stayed   close   to   Jesus .   From   the   outside ,   he   was   a   whitewashed   tomb ,   he   was   a   moralist ,   he   was   doing   all   the   right   things ,   he   was   following   Christ .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>25:23</time>
      <p>
          Yet   Zacchaeus   and   Judas ,   both   were   doing   something .   One   of   them   was   running   from   God   and   one   of   them   was   staying   close   to   God .   But   Judas   was   staying   close   to   God ,   as   it   turns   out ,   for   the   same   reasons .   Zacchaeus   was   running   from   God   for   his   own   wealth ,   for   his   own   comfort .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>25:39</time>
      <p>
          And   so   often   in   our   lives   we   can   do   the   same   thing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>25:43</time>
      <p>
          Some   of   us   run   far   away   from   God   because   we   want   to   pursue   our   own   way ,   our   own   life ,   and   some   of   us ,   we   go   to   church   every   Sunday   and   we   act ,   we   play   the   part   of   the   legalists   and   the   moralists .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>25:53</time>
      <p>
          We   do   all   the   right   things ,   we   say   all   the   right   things ,   but   we   do   it   because   we   want   control   over   our   lives ,   because   we   want   the   wealth ,   because   we   want   the   comfort .   And   the   difference   here   is ,   to   be   a   Christian   is   to   pursue   God   for   who   God   is ,   not   because   we   want   our   life ,   but   because   he   gave   up   his   life   so   that   we   could   have   a   life .   And   that&#39;s   the   beauty   of   this   story .   Zacchaeus   climbs   a   tree   to   see   the   savior ,   who   would   die   on   a   tree   for   him   and   for   us ,   to   make   sure   that   we   don&#39;t   become   a   pre-saved   Zacchaeus   or   a   Judas ,   we   have   to   do   the   same   thing .   We   have   to   look   to   the   cross   and   to   see   what   God   has   done   for   us .   And   only   when   we   really ,   truly   understand   the   love   of   God   can   we   put   away   our   own   way   of   doing   things ,   our   own   legalistic   ways ,   our   own   antinomian   ways ,   and   pursue   Christ   for   the   sake   of   Christ .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>26:49</time>
      <p>
          And   Zacchaeus   came   alive   by   a   tree   and   Judas   died   by   a   tree .   That&#39;s   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>26:53</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   really   good ,   ray ,   would   you   call   that   humility ,   what   Zacchaeus   did ?   Because   I   mean   I&#39;ll   tell   you   now   Humility ,   but   I   mean   yes ,   yes ,   because   he   was   basically   putting   himself   on   display .   I&#39;m   a   short   man ,   you   know   what   I   mean .   I   don&#39;t   care ,   and   maybe   that&#39;s   what   was   behind   it .   And   not   only   that ,   he&#39;s   doing   two   things   he&#39;s   putting   himself   on   display   as   I&#39;m   a   short   man ,   and   he&#39;s   also   drawing   attention   to   himself   from   everyone   that   hated   him .   Here   I   am   the   tax   collector .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>27:24</time>
      <p>
          Up   a   tree .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>27:25</time>
      <p>
          Up   a   tree .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>27:26</time>
      <p>
          It   might   be   good   to   give   some   thought   as   to   why   he   was   a   tax   collector .   Why   would   he   betray   his   people ?   Perhaps   he   was   despised   because   of   his   shortness ,   Because   we   tend   to   do   that .   You   don&#39;t   get   people   being   bullied   that   are   six   foot   eight .   In   school   it&#39;s   usually   the   little   kid   they   get   or   the   shorty   they   get .   My   first   memory   as   a   kid   was   being   put   to   the   front   of   the   class ,   cross-legged   for   the   school   photo .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>27:49</time>
      <p>
          Really .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>27:49</time>
      <p>
          Because   I   was   the   shortest   and   I   wouldn&#39;t   block   any   views ,   but   didn&#39;t   they   have   you   just   stand ,   no .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>27:56</time>
      <p>
          The   water   evaporates   in   the   shower   before   it   hits   me .   I&#39;m   teaching   this ,   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>28:03</time>
      <p>
          So   maybe   he   was   a   tax   collector   because   people   despised   him   because   of   his   lack   of   stature .   So   it&#39;s   always   good ,   like   Rachel ,   your   wife ,   she   really   didn&#39;t   like   people   looking   down   on   her   to   want   better   wording .   But   yeah ,   we   need   to   be   very   careful   how   we   talk   to   people   with   their   physical   attributes .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>28:25</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   but   there   is   something   in   mankind ,   in   the   heart ,   that   I   think ,   whatever   you   are ,   I   mean   sometimes   people   think ,   oh ,   you&#39;re   tall ,   so   that   must   be   all   good   for   you .   But   I&#39;ve   heard   a   lot   of   tall   people   say   I   wish   I   wasn&#39;t   that   tall ,   right ?   I   mean ,   look   how   awkward   Mark   is .   Anything   that   stands   out ,   at   least   I&#39;m   able   to   reach   my   goals ,   yeah .   Anything   that   stands   out   from   the   norm ,   I   think   it   becomes   fodder   for   people .   What   is   it   in   the   human   heart ?   Like   what ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>28:56</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   if   everybody   was   four   foot   six ,   no   one   would   be   short .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>28:59</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   true ,   right ,   I   mean   it&#39;s   that   standout .   I   think   that   draws   the   attention .   But   the   human   heart ,   I   mean   you   wanna   see   the   extent   of   the   sinful   fallen   nature .   Just   look   at   how   kids   treat   each   other .   Nothing   kills   me   more   than   when   I   see   kids   being   bullied .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>29:17</time>
      <p>
          I   don&#39;t   know   what   it   is .   All   the   flies .   Do   you   remember   that   movie ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>29:19</time>
      <p>
          Oh   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>29:20</time>
      <p>
          Just   terrific .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>29:21</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   it   just   became   this   animalistic   kind   of   a   thing ,   but   yeah ,   but   I   think   that   there   is   that   importance   so   far   as   believers ,   to   be   secure   in   who   the   Lord   has   made   us .   You   know ,   there   are   some   people   that   won&#39;t   put   themselves   in   certain   situations   cause   they&#39;re   embarrassed   or   fearful   about   what   people   might   say   about   them   or   how   they   might   be   perceived .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>29:47</time>
      <p>
          You   bring   up   a   really   good   point ,   easy   and   actually   just   preached ,   on   Psalm   139 ,   in   which   it   reminds   us   that   God   is   the   one   who   creates   us ,   our   formed   substance   and   our   unformed   substance ,   our   personalities ,   our   dispositions   and   our   physical   appearance .   And   I   think   that&#39;s   really   important   to   remember ,   because   oftentimes   what   happens   as   believers   is   that   we   start   to   believe   the   lies   of   the   devil ,   that   God   wasn&#39;t   paying   attention   when   he   made   us ,   that   he   messed   up .   And   when   we   believe   those   lies ,   we   begin   to   speak   accusations   against   God .   Why   am   I   not   tall   enough ?   Why   am   I   not   pretty   enough ?   Why   doesn&#39;t   my   body   look   like   hers ?   Or   why   am   I   not   tall   like   him ?   Why   am   I   not   shorter ?   Why   am   I   not   shorter ,   as   Mark&#39;s   always   asking   himself ,   like   Ray ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>30:35</time>
      <p>
          And   here&#39;s   the   thing   that&#39;s   important   to   remember   is   that   there   is   not   a   freckle   on   your   body   that   is   misplaced ,   there   is   not   a   hair   on   your   head   that   does   or   does   not   belong   there .   Right ,   god   shaped   you .   And   it   reminds   me   when   I   was ,   a   couple   of   years   ago ,   like   for   Valentine&#39;s   Day ,   I   wanted   to   make   my   family   heart-shaped   cookies ,   and   so   I   kind   of   formed   the   dough   and   I   put   the   you   know ,   the   four   hearts   in   the   oven   and   they   all   came   out   and   most   of   them   look   like   hearts .   But   one   of   them   did   it   and   you   know   like   I   handed   them   off   to   everybody .   I   handed   it   to   my   daughters   I&#39;m   like   here&#39;s   your   heart-shaped   cookie   and   to   my   son ,   and   then   to   my   wife   I   gave   her   the   deformed   one .   I&#39;m   like ,   here&#39;s   your   liver   cookie ,   you   know .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>31:14</time>
      <p>
          Here&#39;s   the   thing ,   though ,   is   you&#39;re   not   a   liver   cookie   Like .   God   didn&#39;t   mess   up   when   he   made   you .   He   shaped   you   in   the   way   that   he   wanted   to   shape   you   for   his   glory   and   his   good ,   and   the   more   we   listen   to   the   devil ,   the   more   we   begin   to   believe   in   his   own   lies   and   make   accusations   against   God .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>31:33</time>
      <p>
          Wow   you   know   there   was   in   church   history .   I   was   talking ,   I   was   looking   up   the   appearance   of   the   apostle   Paul   and   the   question   was   asked   how   do   we   know   who   Paul   is   when   he   comes   into   town ?   And   the   response   was   this   Paul   was   a   small   man   of   stature   with   a   bald   head ,   crooked   legs   and   a   good   state   of   body ,   with   eyebrows   meeting ,   I   mean .   He   had   a   mono   brow   and   a   nose   somewhat   hooked .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>31:57</time>
      <p>
          Who   said   all   this ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>31:59</time>
      <p>
          However ,   his   wife ,   full   of   friendliness   For   now ,   he   appeared   like   a   man   and   he   had   the   face   of   an   angel .   That&#39;s   good ,   friendly   in   the   face   of   an   angel ,   you   know ,   but   otherwise   he   looked   like   one   of   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>32:15</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   yeah .   Well ,   you   know   you   think   about   Jesus .   I   mean   Isaiah   53   talking   about   you   know   there   was   no   comeliness ,   form   or   comeliness   or   beauty   and ,   depending   on   how   it&#39;s   translated ,   yeah ,   you   see   the   hand   of   God   in   his   creation .   Obviously ,   we   know   it&#39;s   a   fallen   world ,   so   there   are   imperfections   from   our   perspective ,   but   that   perfection   is   attributed   to   the   fact   that   this   is   what   God   willed   ultimately   and   I&#39;ve   shared   this   quote   before ,   but   it&#39;s   one   of   my   absolute   favorites   this   is   by   George   McDonald   I   would   rather   be   what   God   chose   to   make   me   than   the   most   glorious   creature   that   I   could   think   of ,   for   to   have   been   thought   about ,   born   in   God&#39;s   thought   and   then   made   by   God ,   is   the   dearest ,   grandest   and   most   precious   thing   in   all   thinking .   This   is   such   a   powerful   and   insightful   quote   because   I   mean ,   really ,   you   could   have   been   the   grandest ,   most   beautiful   thing ,   but   hypothetically ,   not   made   by   God ,   but   imagine   being   exactly   who   God ,   from   his   hand ,   had   its   functioning   in   making   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>33:20</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   the   master ,   artist ,   sculptor .   Right ,   he   didn&#39;t   just   give   you   freckles ,   he   strategically   placed   every   freckle ,   every   hair   strategically   placed .   Knowing ,   then ,   the   number   of   hairs   on   her   head ,   that   is   who   God   made   me .   

      </p>

      <h2 id="repentance-and-transformation-in-christ"><a class="no-underline" href="#repentance-and-transformation-in-christ">Repentance and Transformation in Christ</a></h2>


        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>33:36</time>
      <p>
          I   guess   way   back   in   my   memory   banks ,   but   some   study   was   done   years   ago   of   seniors   in   university   that   were   most   likely   to   succeed   and   they   went   back   to   them   10   years   later   and   they   had   fluffed   it   almost   all   of   them   Really .   Yeah ,   they   were   the   successful ,   good-looking ,   the   tall ,   the   intelligent ,   the   strong   and   in   society   just   didn&#39;t   work .   Yeah ,   you   know ,   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>33:58</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   good .   And   so   how   about   the   impartiality   of   Christ   in   this ,   though ?   You   know ,   oh   beautiful ,   he   didn&#39;t   act   differently   toward   Zacchaeus   because   he   was   a   short   stature   and   because   he   was   a   tax   collector ,   yeah ,   you   know ,   and   he   got   flack   for   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>34:16</time>
      <p>
          Yep   Stayed   with   sinners .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>34:18</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   look   at   you .   What   are   you   doing .   You   know ,   but   why   did   they   get   in   New   York ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>34:23</time>
      <p>
          What   are   you   doing ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>34:24</time>
      <p>
          What   are   you   doing   over   there ?   What   are   you   doing   over   there ?   What ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>34:26</time>
      <p>
          are   you   doing   over   there ?   What   are   you   doing   with ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>34:27</time>
      <p>
          that   short   little   fella .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>34:32</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   kevin   D   Young   about   that ,   says   this   the   Savior   goes   to   stay   with   sinners ,   but   too   often   we   separate   from   sinners   Instead   of   helping   those   far   from   Christ   come   near   to   him .   We   act   as   if   hanging   out   with   people   who   don&#39;t   know   God   will   cause   us   to   contract   a   sin   disease .   But   sin   isn&#39;t   a   disease   you   can   catch .   Sin   is   a   sign   of   death   that   only   the   Savior   can   defeat   and   overcome   with   new   life .   And   he   goes   on   to   say   like   when   is   the   last   time   you   took   the   opportunity   to   invest   in   someone&#39;s   life   that   isn&#39;t   already   saved ?   When&#39;s   the   last   time   you   had   someone   over   for   a   meal ?   When&#39;s   the   last   time   you   got   your   hands   dirty   with   the   homeless ?   Like   we   often ,   I   think   we   want   to   keep   them   at   arm&#39;s   length   from   us .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>35:19</time>
      <p>
          But   Christ   gives   us   this   wonderful   example   of   staying   with   sinners .   And   he   didn&#39;t   stay   with   sinners .   Like   the   point   here .   That   can   devolve   right .   It   could   be   like ,   oh ,   jesus   was   partying   with   sinners .   Like ,   no ,   jesus   wasn&#39;t   like   hanging   out   partying   with   sinners   necessarily .   What   Jesus   was   doing   was   investing   intentional   time   with   the   focus   of   the   cross .   But   he   wasn&#39;t   afraid   to   get   his   hands   dirty   to   a   degree .   But   he   wasn&#39;t   wasting   his   time   with   sinners   either .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>35:49</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   right ,   I   did   the   breathe ,   which   means   I&#39;ve   got   something .   So   verse   eight   I   love   it ,   where   Zacchaeus   stood   and   said   Lord ,   I   give   half   my   goods   to   the   poor .   He   stood .   There   was   a   resolution   and   a   spirit .   It   just   didn&#39;t   land .   I&#39;m   saying ,   behold ,   he   stood ,   and   I   think ,   when   it   comes   to   righteousness ,   each   of   us ,   as   Christians ,   have   got   to   make   that   resolution   stand   and   not   compromise .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>36:13</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   it&#39;s   that   determination   of   saying   I&#39;m   going   to   respond   to   what   I   just   heard .   I   mean ,   I   think   of   Josiah .   You   know ,   king   Josiah ,   when   they   found   the   law   of   God   and   it   was   read   to   him ,   he   tore   his   clothes .   And   then   we   see   his   response   Eight   years   old .   Yeah ,   he   was   eight   years   old   when   he   became   king .   And   then ,   you   know ,   later   they   read   to   him   the   law   and   he   responds   this   way   and   then   he   has   the   idols   crushed   to   powder .   It   wasn&#39;t   just   destroy   the   idols ,   and   he   was   one   of   the   first   kings   to   actually   get   rid   of   the   high   places .   You&#39;d   always   hear   about   a   king   and   he   was   righteous ,   but   he   did   not   remove   the   high   places .   Josiah   removed   the   high   places   which   were ,   you   know ,   indicative   of   pagan   worship .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>36:59</time>
      <p>
          He   destroyed   them .   Sexual   connotations ,   didn&#39;t   it ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>37:01</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   there   was   that   too .   Remove   them   and   then   took   the   idols ,   didn&#39;t   just   throw   them   away   or   break   them ,   ground   them   to   powder   and   then   disperse   them   Like   they&#39;re   gone .   That&#39;s   how   I   want   my   heart   to   be .   You   know ,   I   don&#39;t   want   to   grow   dull   of   hearing .   These   words   of   Christ   were   fresh   to   Zacchaeus ,   he   was   connected   to   them   and   it   resulted   in   this   powerful   response .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>37:27</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   it   may   have   been   sorry   the   first   time   anyone   spoke   kindly   to   him   for   years .   When   you   think   about   it ,   wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>37:32</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   so   good .   It&#39;s   also   a   great   reminder   of   what   repentance   looks   like ,   and   Zacchaeus   is   mine   and   the   example   that   you   just   gave .   Easy   repentance   takes   action   Like   repentance .   Wasn&#39;t   just   Zacchaeus   going   whoops ,   I   messed   up   and   now   I   was   a   sinner   and   now   I&#39;m   just   a   really   wealthy   saint ?   Repentance   costed   Zacchaeus   something   right .   It   costed   him   his   comforts .   His   idol .   His   idol   was   his   comfort ,   and   that&#39;s   the   exact   thing   that   he   was   giving   up .   He   was   sending   back ,   he   was   restoring   the   thing   that   he   took   from   others ,   and   oftentimes   repentance   requires   us   to   go   make   right   what   we   made   wrong .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>38:07</time>
      <p>
          How   powerful   that   is   in   the   sight   of   the   unbeliever .   I   heard   a   preacher ,   so   this   is   an   original .   I   mean   he   just   spoke   of   a   poor   Jewish   family   hearing   a   the   door ,   open   the   door   and   there&#39;s   the   tax   collector   and   he   says   I&#39;ve   come   back   to   pay   back   fourfold .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>38:23</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>38:25</time>
      <p>
          And   how   powerful   is   that   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>38:27</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   so   good   Wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>38:28</time>
      <p>
          You   think   of   when   Jesus   went   to   Zacchaeus&#39;   house   and   he&#39;s   looking   around   at   all   of   the   amazing   things   inside   the   house   that   were   received   through   ill-gain .   Yeah ,   you   know ,   at   any   given   moment ,   right ,   jesus   wants   to   come   to   our   house ,   if   you   would ,   knowing   what   he&#39;s   going   to   see ,   also   knowing   that   he&#39;s   going   to   require   those   things   from   us .   Zacchaeus   knew   it .   You   just   imagine   what   was   going   through   Zacchaeus&#39;   mind   as   Jesus   is   kind   of   looking   around   at   the   house   the   guilt ,   and   then   the   stand   up ,   listen ,   if   I&#39;ve   done   anything   wrong   and   he   knows   what   he&#39;s   done ,   but   able   to   go   that   extra   mile ,   thomas   Watson   said   that   repentance   it   flows   like   a   river .   In   other   words ,   it   just   flows   and   it   flows   and   it   flows .   Everything   and   anything   that   I&#39;ve   ever   done ,   it   just   comes   out .   Well ,   that&#39;s   what   I   think   happened   to   Zacchaeus   that   he   gave   until   he   didn&#39;t   have   anything   else   to   give ,   because   he   couldn&#39;t   differentiate   between   what   he   received   through   ill-gain   or   not .   It&#39;s   just ,   listen ,   I&#39;m   not   my   own ,   I&#39;ve   been   bought   with   a   price   and   he   just   surrenders .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>39:29</time>
      <p>
          What   a   joy .   And   I   think   you   know ,   when   someone   encounters   the   Lord   they   just   want   to   be   right   in   every   way .   We   know   in   Christ   we   have   imputed   righteousness .   That&#39;s   given   to   us   as   a   gift .   We&#39;re   declared   completely   righteous .   But   we   want   practical   righteousness ,   we   want   to   please   God .   Everything   shifts .   I   mean ,   ray ,   when   you   share   your   testimony   you   always   talk   about   how   your   desires   changed .   Our   relationship   with   sin   changes .   We   go   from   being   at   peace   with   sin   and   loving   sin   to   hating   it ,   even   though   we   struggled   with   it   and   we&#39;re   tempted   by   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>40:06</time>
      <p>
          And   so   I   remember   when   I   got   saved   I   was   eager   to   make   things   right   To   a   point   where   people   thought   I   was   stupid ,   like ,   don&#39;t   do   that .   But   I   remember   going   to   the   convenience   store   that   was   in   our   neighborhood   and   I   said   to   the   cash   register   guy   I   said ,   hey ,   I   used   to   steal   cigarettes   from   here .   I   remember   one   time   I   walked   down   to   a   whole   carton .   I   was   one   and   a   half   years   old .   I   took   a   whole   carton   of   cigarettes .   But   I   did .   I   took   a   whole   carton   of   cigarettes   and   I   shoved   it   down   my   pants   and   put   my   coat   over   it   and   walked   out .   And   so   he&#39;s   like   oh ,   thanks   for   letting   us   know .   Kind   of   like ,   what   are   we   going   to   do   about   it   now ,   but   I   needed   to .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>40:42</time>
      <p>
          So   did   you   give   him   some   cigarettes   or   something ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>40:44</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   gave   him   a   hookah .   It   was   my   head   of   hookah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>40:48</time>
      <p>
          Well   then ,   now   the   transition   and   the   transformation   has   searched   me   and   tried   me   and   see   if   there&#39;d   be   any   wicked   way   in   me   and   lead   me   in   the   way   of   everlasting .   Only   a   Christian   can   say   that   there&#39;s   no   skeletons   in   our   closet .   We   are   open   and   naked .   This   is   who   we   are .   We   have   no   secret   life .   Lord ,   I   want   to   walk   that   straight   and   narrow   path ,   for   whatever   you   need   to   do ,   no   matter   how   much   it   hurts ,   no   matter   how   comfortable   it   is ,   I   want   eternity   over   the   temporal .   So   whatever   you   have   to   do   is   okay   with   me ,   and   I   give   you   that   permission   today ,   because   tomorrow ,   when   the   fire   has   turned   up ,   I&#39;m   going   to   say   ouch   and   stop .   Yeah ,   you   just   reminded   me   easy .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>41:23</time>
      <p>
          I   know   I&#39;ve   told   this   story   before ,   but   when   I   first   became   a   Christian   about   two   years   after   I   became   a   Christian   I   remember   back   to   this   girl   that   I   was   dating   as   an   atheist .   Her   dad   was   a   retired   pastor .   She   was   going   to   a   Christian   college   and   by   the   time   we   weren&#39;t   together   anymore .   She   was   no   longer   a   Christian .   She   had   left   that   college .   She   had   a   big   Marxist   tattoo   on   her   side .   She   had   left   the   faith .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>41:46</time>
      <p>
          Two   years   after   me   becoming   a   Christian ,   I   felt   that   conviction ,   like   I   participated   in   this   thing .   I   influenced   the   faith .   I   participated   in   this   thing .   I   influenced   this   person .   I   can   remember   I   was   like   I   need   to   go   apologize   to   her   parents   and   I   need   to   get ,   I   need   to   find   her   and   I   need   to   tell   her   I   was   wrong .   And   so   they   lived   in   Westminster .   I   was   like   45   minutes   away .   But   I   can   remember ,   like   it   was   yesterday ,   driving   on   that   freeway   to   her   parents   house .   They   don&#39;t   know   I&#39;m   coming ,   I   don&#39;t   have   their   phone   number .   I   just   remember   where   they   live ,   mind   you   right .   And   I   remember   sweating   Wedding ,   like   should   I   turn   around ?   Is   this   a   good   idea ?   Am   I   overreacting ?   It&#39;s   been   so   many .   It&#39;s   been   seven   years .   Like   are   they   gonna ?   Like   this   is   crazy .   You   know   what   I   mean   To   finish   the  
      </p>

      <h2 id="a-life-changing-encounter-and-transformation"><a class="no-underline" href="#a-life-changing-encounter-and-transformation">A Life-Changing Encounter and Transformation</a></h2>


        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>42:33</time>
      <p>
          story .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>42:34</time>
      <p>
          I   get   there   and   I   knock   on   the   door   and   the   mom   and   the   dad   are   there   and   I   give   them   my   testimony ,   I   start   telling   them   what   happened ,   you   know ,   and   they   sit   me   down .   The   dad   doesn&#39;t   say   a   word .   I   am   not   exaggerating .   Not   a   hello ,   not   a   sit   down ,   not   a   come   in .   He   didn&#39;t   say   a   word .   The   wife   sat   me   down .   I   tell   them   my   testimony ,   I   tell   them   I   was   wrong ,   I   tell   them   I&#39;m   sorry .   I   tell   them   I   want   to   reach   out   to   her   and   I   want   to   apologize   that   I   was   wrong .   And   the   dad&#39;s   just   like   stoic   looking   at   me .   He   doesn&#39;t   say   a   word .   The   mom   gets   up ,   walks   into   the   other   room   and   like ,   leaves   me   with   the   silent   father   and   I&#39;m   like   is   she ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>43:13</time>
      <p>
          gonna   get   the   gun .   What   is   happening ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>43:16</time>
      <p>
          Here   you   go ,   honey .   Yeah ,   he   sort   of   like   prompts   me   to   get   up   and   walk   to   her ,   to   the   front   door ,   and   then   she   hands   me   a   piece   of   paper   and   is   like   thank   you   so   much   for   coming .   Like   we&#39;re   really   happy   for   you ,   closes   the   door   and   I   open   it   up   and   it&#39;s   a   paper   with   her   phone   number ,   the   girl   that   I   was   dating   at   the   time .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>43:36</time>
      <p>
          So   I   called   Wait ,   did   the   father   still ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>43:37</time>
      <p>
          didn&#39;t   say   a   word .   Didn&#39;t   say   a   word ,   dude ,   oh   wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>43:41</time>
      <p>
          Even   when   you   left ,   even   when   I   left .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>43:42</time>
      <p>
          And   he   was   a   pastor .   Yeah ,   yeah ,   yeah ,   no ,   he   didn&#39;t   say   a   word .   Well ,   he   was   a   retired   pastor .   Oh   wow ,   he   was   a   retired   pastor .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>43:49</time>
      <p>
          He   may   have   been   talked   out   Probably .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>43:51</time>
      <p>
          No ,   I   mean ,   you   could   have ,   like   I   put   them   through   some   things ,   you   know ,   like   they   there&#39;s   a   lot   to   that   story   when   we   were   dating   that   I   see   now ,   as   a   father ,   how   brutal   it   must   have   been   for   him .   Yeah ,   that   the   two   years   that   me   and   that   girl   were   together ,   yeah ,   right ,   I   call   that   girl ,   we   meet   up   for   dinner   and   I   tell   her   that   I&#39;m   a   Christian   and   I   share   the   gospel   with   her   and   I   share   my   testimony   with   her .   And   at   the   end   of   that   long   conversation ,   I   mean   her   jaw   hit   the   floor   and   she ,   just   the   first   words   out   of   her   mouth   were   you ,   you&#39;re   a   Christian ,   you ,   wow .   And   we   sort   of   had   a   bit   of   a   sword   fight   at   dinner .   And   then   I   walk   her   to   her   car   and   at   her   car   she   starts   to   cry   and   she   like   confesses   that   she   knows   it&#39;s   all   true   and   that   she   wants   me   to   pray   for   her   and   stuff ,   wow ,   wow .   And   I   think   back   like   that   Oscar .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>44:37</time>
      <p>
          this   could   be   part   of   the   movie ,   but   that   was   sort   of   that ,   zikias   moment ,   I   think ,   for   me ,   where   it   was   like   I   didn&#39;t   take   something   but   I   contributed   to   something   and   I   need   to   look   beyond   as   uncomfortable   of   this   moment   was   going   to   make   me   feel .   I   just   knew   that   like   the   truth   of   what   God   did   in   my   life   was   more   important   than   my   comfortability   and   I   stuck   out   in   faith .   I   don&#39;t   know   where   she   I   haven&#39;t   seen   her   since ,   but   hopefully ,   by   the   grace   of   God .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>45:05</time>
      <p>
          You   haven&#39;t   seen   the   parents   since .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>45:06</time>
      <p>
          No ,   that&#39;s   the   last   interaction   I   had   with   all   of   them ,   wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>45:11</time>
      <p>
          I   don&#39;t   even   run   and   no   one   be   warned .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>45:14</time>
      <p>
          Still   silent .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>45:16</time>
      <p>
          Oh ,   man   Ray ,   how   absolutely   just   joy   infusing   it   must   have   been   when   Zacchaeus   heard   Jesus   say   today   salvation   has   come   to   this   house .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>45:30</time>
      <p>
          I   mean ,   you   know ,   here&#39;s   this   guy .   He&#39;s   just ,   yeah ,   he&#39;s   hated ,   he&#39;s   rejected ,   he&#39;s   got   his   conscience   probably   constantly   plaguing   him   and   he   was   just   like .   I   just   want   to   get   a   glimpse   of   this   Jesus   as   he&#39;s   walking   by ,   you   know ,   he   climbs   up   in   a   tree   and   then   I&#39;m   going   to   your   house   today .   Wow ,   he   comes ,   he   makes   that   declaration   half   of   my   goods ,   I&#39;ll   pay   back   four   fold .   And   then   Jesus   declares   salvation .   I   mean   he&#39;s   like   declaring   this   guy   his   eyes   are   open ,   he&#39;s   you   know ,   I   mean ,   what   must   have   that ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>46:01</time>
      <p>
          been   like .   It&#39;s   such   a   lesson   for   us ,   because   the   words   that   Zacchaeus   spoke   showed   that   he   was   genuine   in   his   repentance .   He&#39;s   going   to   bring   forth   fruit   worthy   of   repentance .   And   how   often   have   you   been   in   a   church   when   someone   makes   a   decision   for   Christ   and   the   whole   church   bursts   into   applause   and   there&#39;s   no   evident   fruit ,   there&#39;s   no   time ?   It&#39;s   like   they&#39;re   all   saved ,   that   have   come   to   the   front   and   made   a   decision   for   Jesus   and   prayed   the   sinner&#39;s   prayer .   No ,   give   them   time ,   see   if   there&#39;s   fruit   and   then   applaud .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>46:27</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   that&#39;s   good ,   amen .   See ,   if   there&#39;s   fruit   that   demonstrates   they   were   regenerated   at   that   moment ,   that   demonstrates   that   that&#39;s   so   good .   And   what   a   man ,   what   a   life   for   this   guy .   And   I&#39;m   always   curious ,   like   what   happened   after   that ?   You   know ,   who   did   he   become ?   What   happened   his   life ?   Right ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>46:46</time>
      <p>
          All   around   the   world   there   are   churches   named   after   the   apostle   Paul   and   John .   I   don&#39;t   know   this   any   first-hand   church   of   Zacchaeus   oh   that&#39;s   right .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>46:55</time>
      <p>
          The   church   of   the   Holy   Zacchaeus .   What   a   great ,   great   testimony .   And ,   friends ,   we   know   that   some   of   you   listening   now ,   and   I   remember   one   time   we   read   a   comment   from   an   atheist   who   listens   and   he   says   he&#39;s   an   atheist   but   he   absolutely   loves   the   podcast .   We&#39;re   honored   that   he   listens .   Hopefully   he   still   does .   Maybe   there   are   others   who   are   in   the   same   boat .   Maybe   someone   told   you   about   the   podcast .   You   came   across   it   randomly .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>47:17</time>
      <p>
          We   just   want   to   remind   you   that   you   can   have   that   Zacchaeus   moment .   You   can   recognize   that   there   is   nothing   good   in   you ,   that   you   need   this   Jesus   and   you   need   to   humble   yourself   and   recognize   that   you   can&#39;t   save   yourself .   I   think   that&#39;s   one   of   the   biggest   things   that   keeps   people   from   truly   repenting .   They&#39;re   trying   to   earn   their   own   salvation .   That&#39;s   an   impossibility .   You&#39;re   a   sinner ,   you   violated   God&#39;s   law ,   you&#39;re   deserving   of   His   wrath   and   judgment   and   Christ   lived   the   perfect   life   you   could   not   live   and   then   he   became   the   substitute   for   sinners   on   that   cross .   If   you   repent ,   cry   out   to   Him   and   repentance   and   faith ,   god   will   wipe   away   every   sin   you&#39;ve   ever   committed ,   past ,   present ,   future .   He&#39;ll   grant   you   the   gift   of   everlasting   life   and   transform   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>48:00</time>
      <p>
          So   that&#39;s   the   gospel .   Turn   to   Him   today ,   that   the   Savior   who   died   and   rose   again   to   set   sinners   free .   There   you   have   it ,   friends ,   no   silliness .   Check   out   everything   we   talked   about   at   the   beginning   of   the   podcast .   Go   back   to   the   beginning   if   you   can&#39;t   remember   it .   We&#39;ll   see   you   here   next   time   on   the   Living   Waters   Podcast .   

      </p>