

      <h2 id="exploring-the-impact-of-social-media"><a class="no-underline" href="#exploring-the-impact-of-social-media">Exploring the Impact of Social Media</a></h2>


        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>1:05</time>
      <p>
          Now ,   obviously   we   know   in   the   social   media   realm   there   are   negative   elements .   We&#39;ve   been   touching   on   that .   Can   you   highlight   some   of   the   positive   ones ,   right ,   I   mean ,   this   is   a   part   of   your   livelihood   and   what   you   do .   It&#39;s   a   part   of   what   we   do   as   a   ministry   as   well .   But   how   are   some   of   the   ways   that   Christians   can   steward   social   media   from   the   positive   standpoint   Can   I   mention ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>1:23</time>
      <p>
          one   more   negative   before   we   go   to   the   positive ,   is   that   okay ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>1:26</time>
      <p>
          You   mentioned   10   more   negatives .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>1:28</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   once   we   go   to   the   positive   side   I   don&#39;t   want   to   bring   the   conversation   down-   by   getting   negative   again .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>1:32</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   no .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>1:34</time>
      <p>
          And   there   are   a   number   of   negatives ,   and   we&#39;ve   thought   about   these   things   as   articles   online .   People   are   talking   about   this   often ,   but   one   thing   that   really   concerns   me   particularly   post-2020 ,   is   that   we&#39;re   seeing   the   erosion   of   community .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>1:46</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   good   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>1:47</time>
      <p>
          And   when   church   went   online   and   people   were   watching   live   streams ,   the   accelerated   pace   of   people   adopting   digital   technology   audiobooks ,   podcasts ,   all   of   this   sort   of   thing .   This   upcoming   generation   doesn&#39;t   have   an   appreciation   for   in-person ,   embodied   community   worship   and   we&#39;re   cold   not   to   neglect   the   gathering   together   of   the   saints .   And   there   are   many ,   many   people   that ,   when   they   think   about   what   a   local   church   is ,   they   don&#39;t   see   the   distinction   between   online   church ,   virtual   church ,   and   embodied   worship ,   with   a   group   of   people   where   there   are   pastors   that   know   your   name   who   will   give   an   account   for   you .   They&#39;re   caring   for   your   soul .   And   I   think   of   the   end   of   second   John ,   and   John   says   basically   there&#39;s   so   much   more   I   wish   I   could   say   to   you ,   but   I   would   rather   not   use   paper   and   ink .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>2:37</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;d   rather   come   to   you   and   be   face   to   face ,   so   that   our   joy   may   be   full .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>2:47</time>
      <p>
          Where   did   I   take   my   beloved   Father   in   Law ,   ray   comfort   for   Father&#39;s   Day ?   Nowhere   when   else   but   chilies .   Ray ,   that   was   fun .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>2:57</time>
      <p>
          We   had   a   good   time   and   I   liked   the   steak .   I   enjoyed   your   steak .   I   really   enjoyed   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:02</time>
      <p>
          I   can&#39;t   believe   you   got   it   medium   Medium   yeah .   No ,   it&#39;s   got   to   be   medium   well .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:08</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   the   only   right   way   to   do   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:10</time>
      <p>
          You   guys   seriously   think   you   know   something   about   meat   that   I   don&#39;t   know .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:13</time>
      <p>
          Yes .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:14</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;m   from   Lebanon ,   that   doesn&#39;t   matter .   I&#39;m   made   of   meat .   That   doesn&#39;t   make   any   difference .   That&#39;s   true ,   I&#39;m   made   of   meat .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>3:20</time>
      <p>
          You   kill   the   flavor   when   you   cook   the   best   medium   rare .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:23</time>
      <p>
          No ,   I&#39;ll   teach   you   guys   some   things   about   flavor .   Yeah ,   you   can   like .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>3:27</time>
      <p>
          I   can   respect   medium .   Anything   past   medium .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:30</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   too   close   to   beef   jerky   I&#39;m   speaking   of   that   I   did   have   some   seasoning   on   it   that   I   really   liked .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>3:35</time>
      <p>
          I   would   have   just   liked   the   seasoning   without   the   sauce .   I   was   cilantro .   No ,   it   wasn&#39;t   I   don&#39;t   even   say   that   word .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>3:41</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   the   seasoning   was   really   good .   Have   you   ever   had   steak   with   chimichurri   on   top ?   No   good   chimichurri   so   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>3:47</time>
      <p>
          That   may   be   what   I   had   I   don&#39;t   know ,   it&#39;s   green .   No ,   it   wasn&#39;t .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>3:53</time>
      <p>
          And   the   waiter   comes   up   or   the   food   runner   or   whatever ,   and   it   gives   the   food   and   then   Ray   offers   him   something   and   then   out   card   and   something   and   he   goes .   You   ever   seen   we   have ?   You   have   a   lot   of   YouTube ,   because ,   oh   yeah ,   I   see   all   the   time .   I&#39;m   from   Cerritos   College .   Oh ,   you&#39;re   right   away .   Seriously ,   I   would   not   be   surprised   if   one   day   you   become   the   mascot   of   Cerritos   College .   Is   he   tall ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>4:14</time>
      <p>
          enough .   You   know   I   wouldn&#39;t   be .   You   could   sit   me   up .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:17</time>
      <p>
          Then   we   start   talking   about   how   Ray   can   hardly   go   into   public   without   being   recognized   anymore .   And   right   then   these   two   ladies ,   like   right   as   we   get   done ,   saying   on ,   these   two   ladies   stand   up   from   the   table   across   from   us ,   come   over   and   they   go .   Ray ,   come   back .   And   it   was   so   cool .   The   lady   said   she   had   just   been   thinking   about   you .   She   watched   something .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>4:38</time>
      <p>
          She   said   you   owe   me   $40 .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:40</time>
      <p>
          They   mean   no   and   she   goes .   I   was   just   thinking   I   wonder   if   I&#39;ll   ever   get   to   see   Ray   come   for   it .   And   it   was   cool ,   we   had   a   lot   of   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>4:47</time>
      <p>
          I   was   thinking   the   same   thing   about   her   too ,   and   it   was   so   nice   to   meet   her .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:52</time>
      <p>
          When   will   I   get   to   meet   her ?   But   it   was   really   touching .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>4:54</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   they   were   very   nice ,   ladies .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>4:56</time>
      <p>
          She   called   her   son   because   her   son   is   a   big   fan ,   and   Ray   talked   to   him   on   the   phone .   Was   he   a   bit   shocked ,   ray ,   when   you   talked   to   him ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>5:02</time>
      <p>
          No ,   he   was ,   just   like   his   mother ,   really   Mellow .   No ,   she   wasn&#39;t   mellow ,   it   was   the   exact   opposite .   Very   enthusiastic .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:08</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   what   I&#39;m   saying .   Was   he   excited ?   Yes ,   he   was   excited .   Yes ,   yeah   what   do   you   think   I   said   I   wasn&#39;t   listening   to   anything   stupid ?   I   was   listening   to   something   else .   All   right ,   friends .   Hey ,   we   got   something   special .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>5:22</time>
      <p>
          But   first   a   comment .   This   is   from .   My   name   is   Sutter   Green .   I   am   13   years   old   and   I   love   this   podcast .   That&#39;s   who   it&#39;s   from .   I&#39;ve   learned   so   much   from   this   podcast   and   it   has   answered   so   many   questions .   When   I   saw   the   Living   Waters   YouTube   channel   and   podcast ,   it   inspired   me   to   start   my   own   channel .   I   started   a   YouTube   channel   called   777 ,   discipleship777 ,   where   I   had   the   honor   to   interview   Mark   Spence .   That   interview   was   such   an   encouragement   for   me   that   I   now   am   handing   out   Living   Waters   Gospel   Tracks   everywhere   I   go .   Every   time   I   need   some   inspiration   on   what   to   post   on   my   channel .   I   listen   to   the   Living   Waters   podcast   If   you   want   a   great   answers   to   tons   of   questions .   Funny   is   easy&#39;s   laugh   real   Christian   podcast   and   I   highly   recommend   the   Living   Waters   podcast .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>6:08</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   I   want   to   mature   13-year-old .   Yeah ,   isn&#39;t   he ?   Yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:11</time>
      <p>
          Barry ,   thank   you   so   much .   You   didn&#39;t   even   put   a   name ,   sutter .   Oh   yeah ,   my   name   is   Sutter   Green .   Yes ,   you   did .   Thank   you ,   sutter .   Sorry ,   it   was   Mark   you   interviewed .   Nonetheless ,   no   one   else   was   available .   Yeah ,   that&#39;s   what   it   was .   All   right ,   friends ,   this   podcast   is   brought   to   you   by   the   Outreach   Book   Pack .   We   told   you   before   about   the   kind   of   equipping   book   pack .   This   is   for   outreach   to   give   to   others ,   and   there&#39;s   six   different   evangelistic   books ,   scientific   Facts   in   the   Bible ,   the   Ultimate   Health   Foods ,   the   Mystery .   101   of   the   Dumbest   Things   People   have   Done ,   101   of   Things   Husbands   Do   it   Annoy   their   Wives .   101   Things   Dogs   Do   it   Annoy   their   Owners .   Man ,   that&#39;s   a   lot   of   books .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>6:47</time>
      <p>
          Ray ,   it&#39;s   a   203   things .   Ray   does   it   Annoy .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:49</time>
      <p>
          Something   Always .   Mark ,   do   you   remember   the   first   book   of   Ray&#39;s ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>6:53</time>
      <p>
          you   read   I   believe   it   was   Revivals   Called   in   Key .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>6:58</time>
      <p>
          Ah ,   which   has   had   50   billion   different   titles .   Is   that   now   God   has   a   wonderful   plan ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>7:02</time>
      <p>
          No ,   it&#39;s   the   Way   of   the   Master .   Oh ,   it&#39;s   good .   God   has   a   wonderful   plan   for   your   life .   Is   the   cream   of   the   Way   of   the   Master   book ,   so   you   can   give   it   away   without   having   to   read   four   other   pages .   That&#39;s   what   it   is .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:10</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   all   right ,   friends ,   something   very   special ,   oscar   you   and   I   went   to   NRB   or   NERB ,   NERB ,   nerb   Did   you   make   that   up ?   I   think   so   Very   good ,   very   original ,   but   we   had   an   awesome   time   there .   We   did .   Yeah ,   you   and   I   had   a   great   time .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>7:26</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   we   met   some   rad   people ,   rad   people ,   rad   people   that   have   read   books   for   sure ,   rad ,   people   Zee   rad   Rad .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:32</time>
      <p>
          There   it   is .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>7:33</time>
      <p>
          We   met   some   great   people .   Did   you   get   sore   feet   walking   around ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:37</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   that   place   it   was   a   lot   of   walking ,   which   was   good ,   because   I   was   trying   to   get   some   more   walking .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>7:41</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   I   try   to   get   everyone   there   to   wear   big   orange   slippers   so   that   everyone&#39;s   comfortable .   Yeah ,   no ,   no   no ,   no   more   to   do .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>7:48</time>
      <p>
          What&#39;s   the ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>7:49</time>
      <p>
          NRB   National   Religious   Broadcasters   so   it&#39;s   kind   of   a   convention   where   people   that   are   involved   in   Christian   media   go .   It   was   great .   We   did   some   amazing   interviews .   So   we&#39;re   going   to   do   a   little   series   here   letting   you   listen   to   interviews .   If   you&#39;re   watching   the   videos ,   you&#39;re   going   to   see   us   in   the   same   shirts .   We   just   knocked   this   all   out   with   tops   and   tails   because   we   interviewed   all   the   people   there .   But   this   first   interview   was   really   refreshing .   It   was   with   a   brother   named   Nathan   Bingham .   He&#39;s   the   vice   president   of   ministry   engagement   for   Ligonier   Ministries   and   does   a   bunch   of   other   things .   You&#39;ll   hear   about   that   in   our   interview .   But   it   was   a   great   interview   and   we   really ,   really   enjoyed   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>8:22</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   we   got   into   detail   about   how   social   media   changes   us ,   which   is   relevant   for   everybody   everywhere ,   even   if   you&#39;re   not   on   social   media .   Social   media   is   changing   the   people   around   you ,   the   way   that   we   consume   content ,   the   things   that   we   believe ,   the   way   we   view   ourselves   and   the   world   around   us ,   and   so   I   think   Nathan   does   a   great   job   of   making   us   aware   of   the   water   we   drink ,   or   the   air   we   breathe .   If   you   will ,   and   as   a   teaser ,   towards   the   end   of   the   interview ,   he   told   us   a   story   about   you ,   ray ,   which   was   really   cool .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>8:54</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   think   people   are   going   to   love   it .   And   social   media   so   huge .   I   mean ,   ray ,   seriously   your   life   has   changed   because   of   social   media .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>9:01</time>
      <p>
          Yes ,   never   mind .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>9:06</time>
      <p>
          Mark ,   your   life   has   changed ,   hasn&#39;t   it ?   Actually ,   Mark ,   you&#39;re   always   pushing   social   media   and   the   importance   of   it   for   ministry .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>9:12</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   we   do   need   to   be   careful   with   it .   Right ?   We   should   not   be   getting   our   news   from   Instagram   memes .   If   possible ,   set   up   a   timer .   If   you   find   yourself   spending   too   much   time   on   a   social   media   app ,   whatever   that   app   is ,   we   need   to   use   it   and   make   sure   that   our   social   media   apps   don&#39;t   use   us .   It&#39;s   addictive ,   though ,   isn&#39;t   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>9:30</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   that&#39;s   right ,   and   that&#39;s   exactly   the   point ,   because   before   you   know   it ,   you&#39;re   going   down   a   real ,   a   short .   What   are   they   called ?   Shorts ?   Shorts ,   yeah ,   and   before   you   know   it   you&#39;ve   watched   like   20   of   them   and   time   is   gone .   So   we   need   to   be   careful .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>9:45</time>
      <p>
          And   it&#39;s   fun ,   but   it&#39;s   a   waste   of   time .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>9:49</time>
      <p>
          But ,   ray ,   all   the   people   that   you&#39;ve   been   able   to   impact   through   it   has   just   been   phenomenal .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>9:52</time>
      <p>
          Oh ,   it&#39;s   been   incredible .   It&#39;s   mind-blowing   to   think   that   we&#39;ve   got   such   a   big   reach .   I   remember   years   ago ,   the   pastor   that   got   me   over   here   knelt   down   it&#39;s   just   1989 ,   1990 ,   and   he   just   said ,   Lord ,   get   the   pastors   out   of   the   way .   And   I&#39;ve   never   forgotten   that   prayer   because   that   was   the   problem .   He   had   to   go   through   the   pastor   to   get   to   the   people ,   and   if   he   didn&#39;t   know   who   you   were ,   that&#39;s   it ,   it&#39;s   all   over .   He   couldn&#39;t   do   anything .   And   then   the   television   program   and   now   YouTube   and   social   media .   It&#39;s   got   straight   to   the   people .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:21</time>
      <p>
          Amen ,   all   right ,   friends .   Well ,   without   any   further   ado ,   we&#39;ll   be   back   on   the   other   side   of   this ,   but   here   is   our   dear   brother   Nathan   W   Bingham .   Well ,   friends ,   if   the   noise   didn&#39;t   give   it   away ,   yes ,   we   are   still   here   at   NRB   in   Florida .   I   wanted   to   send .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>10:40</time>
      <p>
          Oscar   over   to   Disneyland   it&#39;s .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>10:41</time>
      <p>
          NERB ,   nerb ,   nerb .   Yeah ,   we&#39;re   calling   it   NERB .   Yeah ,   that   fits   kind   of ,   but   yeah ,   I&#39;d   love   to   send   Oscar   over   to   Disneyland ,   put   him   on   the   Dumbo   ride .   Thank   you ,   please   don&#39;t .   Yeah ,   I   might .   Yeah .   Well ,   friends ,   we   have   a   special   guest   here   with   us   and   I   got   a   bit   excited   a   second   ago   because   I   found   someone   who   can   sympathize   with   me .   Nathan   W   Bingham   is   here   with   us   from   Ligonier .   Nathan ,   before   we   get   into   all   the   formalities   introducing   you   and   all   that ,   I   got   a   bit   excited   because   there   are   a   few   who   can   sympathize   with   me   because   I   have   a   teenage   daughter   who   just   got   her   driver&#39;s   license .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:14</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   a   terrifying   moment   oh   you   relate   right ,   oh ,   I   do ,   I   do .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>11:19</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;m   praying   more   now   than   I   have ,   I   think ,   in   my   entire   almost   40   years   of   existence .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:22</time>
      <p>
          Oh   yeah ,   like   never   before   and   actually   this   is   my   fifth ,   so   I&#39;ve   been   through   the   process ,   right   sitting   behind   the   wheel ,   training   them   yeah   five   times ,   but   we&#39;re   going   to   have   to   speak   afterwards ,   you&#39;re   going   to   have   to   tell   me   how   you   survived   this .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>11:35</time>
      <p>
          And   that&#39;s   in   California ,   by   the   way .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>11:36</time>
      <p>
          Yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>11:36</time>
      <p>
          California   freeway   isn&#39;t   all   of   that ,   which   is   a   big   difference .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:39</time>
      <p>
          I   have   some   advice   for   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>11:40</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   going   to   cost   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:42</time>
      <p>
          I   need   it ,   I   need   it   Well ,   Nathan   W   Bingham ,   we&#39;re   blessed   to   have   you   here   with   us .   We&#39;ll   call   you   Nathan   from   here   on   out ,   but   we   want   to   clear   it   up   with   the   W   so   no   one   misunderstands   who   you   really   are .  
      </p>

      <h2 id="social-media-s-impact-on-society"><a class="no-underline" href="#social-media-s-impact-on-society">Social Media&#39;s Impact on Society</a></h2>


        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>11:52</time>
      <p>
          You&#39;re   with   Ligonier   Ministries .   You&#39;ve   been   going   at   that   for   a   while .   You   are   the   vice   president   of   ministry   engagement ,   executive   producer   and   host   of   renewing   your   mind   and   host   of   the   Ask   Ligonier   podcast .   Man ,   you&#39;re   from   Australia .   I   am   from   Australia .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>12:07</time>
      <p>
          Good   on   you ,   mate .   Yes ,   very   good   Very   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>12:10</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   I&#39;m   friends   with   Ken   Ham ,   so   he&#39;s   at   Ann   Ray   Comfort&#39;s ,   my   Father-in-Law ,   so   you   know   I&#39;ve   gotten   adapted   to   the   Down   Under   sound .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>12:16</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   you   know .   So   Ray&#39;s   from   New   Zealand .   Right ,   he&#39;s   a   Kiwi .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>12:19</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>12:21</time>
      <p>
          And   there&#39;s   a   bunch   in   there   between   Aussies   and   New   Zealand .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>12:23</time>
      <p>
          All   blacks ,   bro ,   all   blacks .   I   saw   you   get   heated   up   when   you   mentioned   he&#39;s   from   New   Zealand .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>12:28</time>
      <p>
          I   was   like   whoa   he&#39;s   eating .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>12:30</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   why   he&#39;s   not   here .   He   was   intimidated .   You&#39;re   all   Canadians ,   right ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>12:35</time>
      <p>
          We   didn&#39;t   want   to   trigger   you ,   brother ,   you   know   what ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>12:39</time>
      <p>
          Nathan ,   real   quick ,   tell   us   about   how   you   went   from   being   in   Australia   to   being   at   Ligonier   here   in   Florida .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>12:44</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   that   is   a   great   question ,   a   long   story ,   but   I&#39;ll   give   you   the   short   story .   Early   on   with   social   media   2008 ,   facebook ,   twitter ,   people   trying   to   figure   out   how   do   we   use   this   new   technology   to   glorify   God   and   I   was   very   active   online   at   that   time   and   I   was   tweeting   about   my   faith ,   reformed   Theology ,   things   that   I   was   learning .   I   was   tweeting   about   technology   and   some   individuals   Chris   Larson ,   the   current   president   and   CEO   of   Ligonier   Ministries .   Burke   Parsons ,   one   of   our   teaching   fellows .   He&#39;s   my   pastor   now   as   well .   They   followed   me   on   Twitter   and   so   I   was   very   engaged   in   the   Christian   conversation   at   the   time   and   I   was   studying   theology ,   was   going   to   go   into   pastoral   ministry ,   and   one   day   I   tweeted   this   simple   question .   It   wouldn&#39;t   work   today ,   mind   you ,   but   it   did   back   in   2010 ,   if   this   was   early   2010 .   As   I&#39;m   wrapping   up   some   of   my   studies ,   I&#39;m   needing   a   little   bit   of   extra   money .   Is   there   anyone   that   would   pay   me   for   some   social   media   consulting ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>13:39</time>
      <p>
          That   was   your   question ,   basically ,   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>13:41</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   not   word   for   word ,   but   basically ,   like   anyone   willing   to   pay   me ,   I&#39;ll   help   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>13:45</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   Like   not   much   different   than   a   beggar   on   the   side   of   the   street ,   really   with   a   cardboard ,   Exactly .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>13:51</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   have   some   experience ,   we&#39;ll   travel .   And   so   I   tweeted   that   and   I   believe   it   was   a   Friday   evening ,   chris   Larson   was   out   to   dinner ,   burke   Parsons   was   somewhere   else .   They   both   read   that   tweet   at   the   same   time ,   texted   each   other   this   is   what   I   found   out   afterwards   and   said   did   you   see   what   Nathan   just   tweeted ?   Maybe   he   could   help   Ligonier ?   Wow ,   and   he   just   sent   me   a   private   DM   and   said   would   you   consider   helping   Ligonier   Ministries ?   Wow ,   I   was   just   like   wow ,   what ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:16</time>
      <p>
          year   was   that ?   You   said   2010 .   That&#39;s   amazing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>14:18</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   amazing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:20</time>
      <p>
          You   know   this   is   a   surreal   moment   for   me ,   nathan ,   because   in   our   ministry   we   have   for   many   years   a   picture   up   on   the   wall   of   Ray   Comfort ,   who&#39;s   the   founder   of   our   ministry ,   sitting   down   at   a   table   much   like   this ,   being   interviewed   by   Dr   Arcee   Sproul   at   an   NRB .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>14:34</time>
      <p>
          I   heard   that   story .   I   heard   that   story .   Yeah ,   nrb ,   I   didn&#39;t   know   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:36</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   was   at   an   NRB .   I   was   sitting   with   you ,   so   you&#39;re .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>14:41</time>
      <p>
          Ray ,   I&#39;m   Arcee ,   yeah ,   why   are   you ?   Nice   to   see   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>14:44</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   brian ,   I   know   there   was   a   surreal   moment   for   you   because   I   was   trolling   on   Twitter   there   checking   you   out   a   bit   and   I   saw   a   picture   of   you   and   Dr   Arcee   Sproul   in   the   RYM   radio   studio ,   which   I   think   you   said   was   11   years   ago ,   and   then   there   was   another   picture   of   you   and   there   now   as   the   host .   Yes   man ,   what   was   that   like   for   you   that ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>15:04</time>
      <p>
          sort   of   changed .   So   February   2012 ,   we   moved   to   the   US   to   work   for   Ligonier   full-time .   So   my   wife   and   I ,   three   kids ,   we   sold   everything   we   owned   moved   here   with   10   suitcases .   We   had   never   stepped   foot   on   US   soil   before ,   had   never   met   anyone   that   worked   at   Ligonier   in   person   before ,   but   we   accepted   I   accepted   this   full-time   role   and   the   first   photo   I   got   with   Dr   Sproul   was   in   the   studio .   Wow .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>15:27</time>
      <p>
          So   he   was   very   gracious .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>15:28</time>
      <p>
          I   sat   down ,   did   a   selfie   with   Arcee   and   then   now   having   the   opportunity   and   privilege   to   be   the   host   of   that   radio   program   is   great .   And   then ,   on   top   of   that ,   if   I   go   back   to   my   time   early   in   my   marriage   in   Australia ,   the   first   thing   that   my   wife   and   I   regularly   consumed   and   dug   into   from   Ligonier   was   renewing   your   mind .   We   listened   to   that   podcast   Isn&#39;t   it   amazing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>15:49</time>
      <p>
          You   know   the   things   the   Lord   does   that   you   could   never   imagine   something   similar   with   me .   And   I   was   impacted   by   Razor   Ministry   far   before   I   knew   him ,   and   I   remember   one   day   I   dropped   to   my   knees .   I   said ,   lord ,   I   pray   that   somehow ,   in   some   way ,   this   man   can   one   day   disciple   me .   And   the   first   time   I   learned   about   him   it   was   through   a   book   someone   gave   me .   They&#39;re   like   man ,   you   got   to   check   this   guy   out .   And   then   the   next   thing   I   saw   in   connection   with   him   was   him   open   air   preaching   in   New   York   at   Washington   Square   Park .   And   how   crazy   it   was   when   one   day   after   he   became   my   father-in-law ,   of   all   things ,   he   comes   up   and   he   gives   me   a   reprint   of   that   book   that   I   first   learned   about   him   through .   He   had   secretly   inserted   a   chapter   with   poetry   that   I   had   written   in   that   same   book .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>16:28</time>
      <p>
          And   then   one   year   we   were   on   our   way   to   Israel   and   we   had   a   layover   in   New   York   and   I   found   myself   standing   there   side   by   side   with   him   open   air   preaching   in   Washington   Square   Park .   You   know   the   place   that   I   saw   him   in   in   that   video .   So   just   amazing   what   the   Lord   does ,   yeah .   So   social   media   man ,   this   is   your   world .   Today   we&#39;re   going   to   be   talking   a   little   bit   about   how   social   media   changes   us   and   what   we   can   do   about   it ,   and   so   I&#39;d   like   to   first   kick   this   off   with   a   question   to   you   about   what   ways   social   media   has   impacted   us   negatively ,   first   as   a   society   in   general ,   and   then   as   the   church   in   particular .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>17:05</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   that   could   be   a   five-hour   conversation .   Let&#39;s   do   it ,   we&#39;ll   run   all   day .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>17:10</time>
      <p>
          This   is   a   podcast   man .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>17:11</time>
      <p>
          Yes ,   this   is   not   radio   Right .   So   there   are   a   number   of   ways   that   it&#39;s   impacting   us   negatively   and   I&#39;ll   try   and   think   about   it   from   a   Christian   perspective ,   how   it   is ,   in   particular ,   affecting   the   church ,   and   that&#39;s   what   I   think   about   a   lot .  
      </p>

      <h2 id="social-media-s-impact-on-time"><a class="no-underline" href="#social-media-s-impact-on-time">Social Media&#39;s Impact on Time</a></h2>


        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>17:24</time>
      <p>
          One ,   I   would   say ,   is   in   the   area   of   stewardship   when   it   comes   to   time ,   because   we   know ,   as   Christians ,   that   time   is   a   gift   and   we&#39;re   called   to   steward   this   time   that   has   been   given .   We   can&#39;t   number   our   days   and   we&#39;re   called   Paul   Taylor&#39;s   Interfesions   to   redeem   the   time .   And   if   you   look   at   the   statistics ,   I   think   it&#39;s   about   35%   of   teenagers   say   that   they   are   almost   constantly   on   some   form   of   social   media ,   including   YouTube ,   and   then   if   you   broaden   that   question   and   just   say ,   well ,   how   often   are   you   online ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>17:54</time>
      <p>
          it&#39;s   almost   50%   that   are   saying   they&#39;re   almost   constantly   because   they&#39;re   using   it   every   hour   and   all   day ,   and   so ,   as   Christians ,   we   need   to   remember   that   we   have   this   great   stewardship   of   time   and   we   are   spending   so   much   of   it   just   kind   of   zombie   scrolling   through   our   devices ,   and   it&#39;s   not   exclusive   to   teenagers .   We&#39;re   all   guilty   of   it   at   times ,   and   so   we   need   to   remember   that   we   have   this   great   stewardship   of   the   time   that   the   Lord   has   given   us ,   and   I   think   when   we   meet   Jesus ,   one   of   the   things   we   will   have   to   give   an   account   for   is   not   just   every   idle   word ,   but   every   idle   minute ,   because   we&#39;re   living   in   a   period   of   time   in   history   where   we&#39;ve   never   had   so   much   time   to   waste   that   we   have   wasted .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>18:33</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   great .   You   know ,   one   of   the   things   I   think   it&#39;s   so   important   for   everyone   to   realize ,   and   the   first   step   of   understanding   the   influence   in   social   media   lives   is   to   realize   that   our   phones   aren&#39;t   like   utility   knives .   It&#39;s   not   a   Swiss   Army   knife ,   because   a   Swiss   Army   knife   doesn&#39;t   change   who   you   are .   It   doesn&#39;t   affect   the   way   you   view   the   world   right ,   it   doesn&#39;t   affect   the   way   you   respond   to   ideas ,   you   understand   other   human   beings   and   etc .   Etc .   A   little   bit .   But   your   social   media   devices ,   your   phone ,   has   that   power .   Ultimately ,   it   has   the   power   to   disciple   you ,   and   that&#39;s   the   thing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>19:06</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   important   is   that   the   hours   that   you   just   mentioned   are   actually   discipleship   hours .   So   the   question   is ,   who&#39;s   discipling   you ?   Is   it ,   you   know ,   joe   Rogan ,   andrew   Humerman ,   or   is   it   a   pastor ?   And   the   reality   is ,   so   many   people ,   so   many ,   unfortunately ,   so   many   Christians   will   spend   45   minutes   to   an   hour   and   a   half   at   church   on   Sunday ,   and   then   they   spend   the   rest   of   the   week   being   discipled   by   whatever   it   is   that   they&#39;re   following   on   social   media .   That   becomes   their   life   liturgy .   And   so ,   nathan ,   how   would   you   suggest   redeeming   that   time ?   What   are   some   practical   ways   we   can   make   sure   that   we   are   being   discipled   by   people   rather   than   algorithms ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>19:46</time>
      <p>
          I   was   reading   the   book   recently   and   the   gentleman   in   this   book   he   tells   the   story   of   basically   how   he   came   about   to   write   this   book   and   he   realized ,   I   believe ,   he   was   an   attorney .   He   was   just   so   busy   and   he   realized   he   a   Christian   man   that   he   was   waking   up   every   morning .   The   first   thing   he   would   do   is   reach   over ,   grab   his   device .   He&#39;s   checking   email .   He&#39;s   then   lost   into   the   world   of   work .   He&#39;s   thinking   about   all   of   that   the   day   he   goes   by .   He   gets   home ,   it&#39;s   nine   o&#39;clock   at   night ,   he&#39;s   saying   goodnight   to   his   kids ,   he   goes   to   sleep   and   that   whole   thing   starts   again .   And   so   he   made   the   decision   that   he   was   going   to   have   this   principle   that   he   would   put   in   place   in   his   life ,   which   was   scripture ,   before   smartphone   and   it&#39;s   so   simple   and   I   can&#39;t   point   to   a   chapter   of   verse   that   says   everyone   must   do   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>20:27</time>
      <p>
          But   it&#39;s   a   lot   of   wisdom   there   to   say   before   I   touch   a   device ,   I&#39;m   going   to   open   the   Bible ,   I&#39;m   going   to   spend   time   in   God&#39;s   Word .   That&#39;s   a   very   simple   thing .   It&#39;s   very   practical ,   tangible .   But   if   you   begin   your   day   in   God&#39;s   Word   like   that   changes   the   trajectory   of   your   day .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>20:42</time>
      <p>
          I   love   that ,   nathan ,   and   I   love   the   fact   that   you   highlighted   that   there   are   certain   things   that   we   may   not   be   able   to   find   chapter   and   verse   for ,   but   I   think   what   we   abdicate   when   that   becomes   our   mindset   and   everything   we   do   as   believers ,   is   the   realm   of   wisdom .   You   know ,   the   world   uses   worldly   wisdom   and   so   many   things ,   and   some   of   it   coincides   with   what   is   right   and   good   when   we   look   at   the   tone   and   tenor   of   scripture .   Right .   And   so   I   think   that   when   you   highlight   the   fact   that ,   hey ,   you   don&#39;t   find   chapter   and   verse   necessarily ,   but   what   is   wise ,   good ,   practical ,   how   does   this   also   comport   to   kind   of   the   grand   scheme   of   scripture   and   what   God   has   called   us   to   as   his   people ?   You   know ,   race   has   the   same   thing   no   Bible ,   no   breakfast ,   no   read ,   no   feed .   You   know ,   I   like   that   Again   now   not   to   be   legalistic   about   it ,   but   there&#39;s ,   there&#39;s   wisdom   in   that   principle   to   be   able   to   say ,   hey ,   what   would   be   beneficial ,   what   would   be   honoring   to   the   Lord ,   what&#39;s   gonna   maximize   my   growth   in   Christ ,   my   impact   for   him   in   the   world ?   And   then   I   also   love   the   fact   that   you   highlighted   the   reality   of   accountability   before   the   Lord .   On   a   recent   podcast   we   talked   about   respectable   sins ,   and   I   think   sometimes   when   we   think   about   accountability ,   we&#39;re   thinking   about   it   in   sort   of   the   grand   scheme   of   things .   But   if   we&#39;re   gonna   give   account   for   every   idol   word   spoken ,   how   about   those   idle   moments ?   You   know   that   we   let   just   kind   of   run   away   from   us   instead   of   using   them   for   God&#39;s   glory ,   and   so   I   love   the   fact   that   you   highlighted   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>22:05</time>
      <p>
          Now ,   obviously ,   we   know   on   the   social   media   realm   there   are   negative   elements .   We&#39;ve   been   touching   on   that .   Can   you   highlight   some   of   the   positive   ones ,   right ?   I   mean ,   this   is   a   part   of   your   livelihood   and   what   you   do .   It&#39;s   a   part   of   what   we   do   as   a   ministry   as   well .   But   how   are   some   of   the   ways   that   Christians   can   stored   social   media   from   the   positive   standpoint ?   Can   I   mention   one ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>22:24</time>
      <p>
          more   negative   before   we   go   to   the   positive .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>22:26</time>
      <p>
          You   mentioned   ten   more   negatives .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>22:29</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   once   we   go   to   the   positive   side   I   don&#39;t   want   to   bring   the   conversation   down-   by   getting   negative   again .   Yeah ,   no ,   go   for   it   and   there   are   a   number   of   negatives   and   we&#39;ve   thought   about   these   things   as   articles   online .   People   are   talking   about   this   often ,   but   one   thing   that   really   concerns   me ,   particularly   post   2020 ,   is   that   we&#39;re   seeing   the   erosion   of   community .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>22:46</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>22:47</time>
      <p>
          And   when   church   went   online   and   people   were   watching   live   streams ,   the   accelerated   pace   of   people   adopting   digital   technology   audiobooks ,   podcasts ,   all   of   this   sort   of   thing .   This   upcoming   generation   doesn&#39;t   have   an   appreciation   for   in-person ,   embodied   community   worship ,   and   we&#39;re   called   not   to   neglect   the   gathering   together   of   the   Saints .   And   there   are   many ,   many   people   that ,   when   they   think   about   what   a   local   church   is ,   they   don&#39;t   see   the   distinction   between   online   church ,   virtual   church   and   embodied   worship ,   with   a   group   of   people   where   there   are   pastors   that   know   your   name   who   will   give   an   account   for   you .   They&#39;re   caring   for   your   soul .   And   I   think   of   the   end   of   second   John ,   and   John   says   there&#39;s   basically ,   there&#39;s   so   much   more   I   wish   I   could   say   to   you ,   but   I   would   rather   not   use   paper   and   ink .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>23:37</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;d   rather   come   to   you   and   be   face-to-face   so   that   our   joy   may   be   full .   And   this   is   a   wonderful   conversation   and   we   could   have   had   this   conversation   any   week   for   the   past   year .   We   could   have   zoomed   together   and   sat   down   virtually   and   recorded   a   podcast   episode .   But   there   is   something   different   when   you&#39;re   sitting   across   the   table   from   each   other .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>23:56</time>
      <p>
          I   can   look   you   in   the   eyes .   Although   I   love   digital   technology ,   I   love   social   media   and   the   good   that   it   has   done ,   I   love   the   reach   that   it   is   enabled   for   the   gospel   to   go   forth   to   enter   into   closed   countries ,   we   need   to   say   and   have   a   firm   commitment   as   Christians   that   our   preferred   method   of   discipleship   and   our   preferred   method   of   growing   in   Christian   community   needs   to   be   in   person ,   embodied   face-to-face   across   the   table .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>24:23</time>
      <p>
          Man   that   is   so   crucial .   In   fact   that   was   I&#39;m   just   gonna   read   it   work ,   for   that   was   my   question   for   you   and   such   a   predominant   social   media   age ,   what   safeguards   can   we   put   in   place   to   protect   ourselves   from   disconnecting   from   real-life   community   and   interpersonal   face-to-face   interactions   in   the   real   world ?   Because ,   yeah ,   from   the   spiritual   standpoint ,   people   have   pretty   much   made   their   church   and   the   social   media   realm ,   and   especially ,   I   think ,   because   they   caught   accustomed   to   hey ,   with   COVID ,   some   churches ,   even   those   that   stayed   opened ,   ultimately   at   first   shut   down   because   no   one   knew   what   was   going   on ,   but   they   got   accustomed   to   that   whole   realm .   But   then   also ,   nathan ,   from   the   standpoint   of   just   human   interaction ,   for   the   sake   of   the   gospel   right ,   we&#39;re   talking   about   discipleship   and   church   community ,   but   for   the   sake   of   the   gospel ,   I   mean ,   what   advice   would   you   give   believers   in   terms   of   being   cautious   to   not   get   sucked   into   that   rabbit   hole ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>25:17</time>
      <p>
          I   really   would   appeal   to   the   older   generation   because   I   really   think   that   it   is   on   those   more   seasoned   Christians   and   those   that   may   be   baby   boomers ,   gen   X ,   to   reach   out   to   the   younger   generations .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>25:29</time>
      <p>
          That&#39;s   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>25:30</time>
      <p>
          What   I   see   happening   is   this   continued   generational   divide .   Now ,   if   you   look   at   church   history   or   American   history   of   the   past   number   of   decades ,   you   can   see   how   kind   of   the   younger   church ,   older   church   is   separated .   Contemporary   Christian   music   parents   are   saying   well ,   I   will   go   to   whatever   church   my   children   like ,   like   the   music   or   like   the   youth   group   and   so   those ,   those   churches   that   have   been   there   for   generations   faithfully   preaching   the   Bible   verse   by   verse ,   book   by   book ,   those   churches   are   going   smaller   and   smaller   and   smaller ,   and   there   might   be   30   faithful   older   saints ,   and   so   agrees   me   to   see   this   generational   gap ,   some   churches   where   they   take   the   children   out ,   and   there&#39;s   that   split .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>26:08</time>
      <p>
          Now ,   with   the   explosion   of   technology ,   you   have   young   people   who   basically   look   at   mom   and   dad   or   grandmire   and   granddad   and   say   you   have   no   idea   how   to   use   this   device   and   of   course ,   even   now ,   like   my   oldest ,   she&#39;s   the   only   one   that   has   a   smartphone .   She&#39;s   still   sometimes   laughs   at   me   and   I&#39;m   meant   to   be   this   tech   guy   like   dad .   What   are   you   doing ?   So   there   is   this   technology   divide   where   young   people   think   my   parents ,   my   grandparents ,   they   don&#39;t   know   anything .   The   problem   is   that   that   might   be   true ,   but   these   older   generations   actually   have   wisdom .   They   spent   time   in   the   word ,   they   know   how   to   apply   the   written   word   of   God   to   life&#39;s   circumstances   and   they   actually   have   a   lot   to   say   about   the   area   of   technology .   If   just   these   two   generations   spoke   to   each   other .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>26:51</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   wow   and   the   younger   generation .   They&#39;re   scared   now ,   like   if   the   doorbell   rings ,   I   have   a   panic   attack .   They   don&#39;t   want   to   answer   their   phone   if   it   rings   like   all   of   these   kinds   of   things   and   I   empathize   with   them   in   some   senses   because   they&#39;ve   been   brought   up   in   a   very   strange   environment .   That&#39;s   why   I   say   I   think   it   is .   This   older   generation   almost   needs   to   adopt   a   grandchild ,   yeah ,   or   adopt   a   son   or   daughter   in   the   church ,   to   just   have   a   conversation   with   them .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>27:15</time>
      <p>
          I   love   that  
      </p>

      <h2 id="teen-mentoring-and-navigating-social-media"><a class="no-underline" href="#teen-mentoring-and-navigating-social-media">Teen Mentoring and Navigating Social Media</a></h2>


        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>27:16</time>
      <p>
          there&#39;s .   There&#39;s   somebody   who   ran   like   a   mentorship   program   and   I   was   reading .   He   had   a   little   pamphlet   and   he   was   talking   about   the   struggle   of   finding   mentors   and   he   said   he   goes   into   these   churches ,   you   know ,   go   to   the   younger   generation   and   he&#39;ll   say   how   many   of   you   are   interested   in   having   a   type   of   mentor ,   discipleship   relationship   with   somebody   who&#39;s   older   than   you ?   And   the   hands   went   up .   He   would   get   10 ,   15 ,   20   young   adults   saying ,   yes ,   I   need   an   older   mentor   in   my   life .   We&#39;re   talking   about   millennials .   Gen   Z   is   saying ,   yes ,   that&#39;s   what   I   need .   And   then   he&#39;d   have   a   meeting   with   the   older   generation   and   he   would   say   how   many   of   you   guys   see   that   the   younger   generation   needs   mentorship ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>27:51</time>
      <p>
          They&#39;re   like ,   oh ,   they   definitely   need   mentorship ,   those   whippersnappers ,   this   and   that ,   blah ,   blah ,   blah .   And   then   he   would .   He   would   ask ,   okay ,   how   many   of   you   are ,   have   the   time   and   are   willing   to   mentor ?   And   very   little   hands   would   go   up .   I   think   it   was   like   a   10   to   1   odds .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>28:04</time>
      <p>
          And   so   I   like   that   call ,   the   way   that   you   initiated   that   response ,   which   is   a   calling   to   the   older   generation   to   say ,   hey ,   how   can   you   redeem   the   time   by   putting   yourself   out   there   and   being   willing   to   have   a   meaningful   conversation   with   the   younger   generation .   And   there&#39;s   a   sense   of   uncomfortability ,   probably   a   discomfort   Like   what   would   you   know ?   Some   young ,   blended   old   Gen   Z   want   to   do   with   me .   Surprisingly ,   a   lot   actually ,   the   younger   generation   is   really   open   to   being   mentored   in .   What   we   need   that   is   that   generational   connection .   I   love   the   way   you   put   that .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>28:39</time>
      <p>
          Let   me   ask   you   this ,   because   you   mentioned   you   got   a   17-year-old   daughter   what   about   social   media   and   teens ?   You   know   Jonathan   Haidt   has   done   a   really   great   job   of   helping   us   understand   the   impact   that   social   media   has   on   teenagers .   He   shows   that   the   correlation   between   depression ,   anxiety ,   body   image   issue   with   young   females   and   so   much   of   that   can   be   related   to   the   moment   they   get   online ,   and   one   of   the   things   that   he   talks   about   is   that   social   media   is   ultimately   designed   to   be   addictive ,   just   as   addictive   almost ,   as   cigarettes   or   alcohol .   And   yet   we   don&#39;t   give   12   or   13   year   olds   cigarettes   or   alcohol   right ,   because   the   young   mind   is   not   developed   and   ready   to   consume   something   so   addictive .   And   yet   so   many   teens   are   on   this   addictive   behavioral   product .   And   so   the   question   is   what   are   the   choices   you&#39;ve   made   with   your   children ,   and   how   can   other   families   navigate   that   in   a   world   where   every   teenager   seems   to   have   social   media ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>29:34</time>
      <p>
          So   when   you   look   at   the   statistics   now ,   what&#39;s ?   I   think   it&#39;s   95%   of   teenagers   have   a   smartphone ,   so   nine   and   a   half   teenagers   I   don&#39;t   know   if   I   get   the   right   five   but   basically   nine   out   of   ten   teenagers   have   a   smartphone ,   so   they&#39;re   on   social   media .   For   us   as   a   family   basically   because   of   my   work   and   the   things   that   I&#39;ve   read   and   thinking   about   these   things   earlier   than ,   I   guess ,   most   parents   we   made   the   decision   that   our   children   don&#39;t   need   to   have   a   smartphone .   We   did   have   some   iPads   in   the   home .   We   had   time   restrictions   when   devices   came   out .   We   live   on   a   two-story   home ,   so   first   floor ,   second   floor   bedrooms   are   upstairs ,   which   I   love   this   in   the   design   because   we   just   made   the   rule   no   technology   upstairs .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>30:14</time>
      <p>
          So   they   couldn&#39;t   take   it   into   the   bedroom .   Now ,   my   oldest   she&#39;ll   turn   17   next   month   and   she   now   has   a   smartphone .   She   got   a   smartphone   because   she   got   a   job .   She   got   a   job ,   she   needed   to   have   a   phone .   We   needed   to   be   able   to   communicate   with   her .   It   could   have   been   a   dumb   phone   and   there   is   a   resurgence   and   people   saying   we   just   want   a   device   where   mom   and   dad   can   call .   She   demonstrated   great   wisdom .   She   had   demonstrated   that   she   was   respecting   boundaries   that   we   put   in   her   life   throughout   her   early   teen   years   and   her   teen   years ,   so   we   felt   like   we   could   trust   her .   I   think   it   was   Tim   Chalise   had   said .   Some   of   the   restraints   we   put   in   our   lives ,   whether   it&#39;s   internet   filter   devices   and   certain   rules ,   it&#39;s   almost   like   a   scaffold   that   you&#39;re   putting   over   your   children   and   as   they   get   older ,   you&#39;re   removing   things .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>30:58</time>
      <p>
          So   we   trusted   her   with   that   device   and   continued   to   talk   with   her .   That   generational   thing   is   parents   to   children   too .   So   how   are   you   using   this   device ?   Now   I   will   tell   you   I   am   a   blessed   father   that   all   of   my   children   say   to   me   they   do   not   want   social   media ,   so   I   don&#39;t   have .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>31:14</time>
      <p>
          I   have   three   teenage   girls   and   then   a   boy .   None   of   those   girls   are   asking   me   dad .   Can   I   please   be   on   Instagram ?   I   will   tell   you   this ,   though ,   and   I&#39;ve   mentioned   this   in   a   number   of   settings   I   am   blessed   that   my   wife   homeschools   our   children .   Many   husbands   say   we   homeschool   my   wife   does   the   homeschool .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>31:34</time>
      <p>
          But   they&#39;re   very ,   very   active   in   our   church   community .   Many   times   throughout   the   week   they&#39;re   there .   They&#39;re   speaking   to   people   of   their   own   age ,   of   multiple   ages .   But   there   is   a   danger   because   there   are   parents   that   say   we   have   made   the   rule   that   our   children   will   not   be   on   social   media ,   but   they   give   them   internet   enabled   iPads   or   other   tablet   devices   and   they   are   group   texting ,   whether   it&#39;s   Google   Chat   or   some   other   thing ,   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>31:57</time>
      <p>
          they   have   their   own   instance   of   social   media ,   just   localized   to   that   church   community   or   that   local   community ,   wherever   they   are   people   in   the   sports   team   or   in   school   or   whatever   the   case   may   be   and   what   is   happening   in   those   group   chats   is   just   as   unhelpful   absolutely   just   as   foolish   as   what   you   would   see   on   Twitter   or   Instagram .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>32:15</time>
      <p>
          Absolutely   yeah ,   and   I   love   that .   Nathan ,   you   know   that&#39;s   what   we   did   with   our   own   children .   We   have   five   and   we   didn&#39;t   let   them   get   a   smartphone   until ,   basically ,   they   started   driving ,   because   similar   to   work .   You   know ,   we   needed   to   have   contact   with   them   in   case   there   was   an   emergency   or   whatever ,   but   we   didn&#39;t   allow   social   media   until   until   they   turned   18 ,   but   we   discipled   them   up   to   that   point .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>32:37</time>
      <p>
          And   I   think   that   that&#39;s   often   the   missing   element   sometimes   in   parenting   today   with   Christians   is   that   there   isn&#39;t   a   build-up ,   there   isn&#39;t   that   communication   like   you&#39;re   talking   about ,   so   that   when   they   get   there   they&#39;re   ready   to   handle   it .   You   know   they&#39;ve   seen   all   sides   of   it   from   the   most   important   disciples   in   their   lives   and   that&#39;s   their   parents .   And   it   was   kind   of   similar   with   us   because   our   daughters   especially   said   thank   you   for   not   allowing   us   to   get   on   social   media ,   because   they   saw   the   drama   that   that   caused   in   the   lives   of   their   friends   and   and   just   the   insanity   that   gave   birth   to .   And   so   you   know   there   are   certain   social   media   platforms   that ,   especially   our   boys ,   will   not   go   on ,   because   that&#39;s   another   big   problem   it&#39;s   the   dangers   of   what&#39;s   on   social   media ,   all   the   God   dishonoring   filth   that   we   see   there ,   especially   in   the   pornographic   realm .   And   so ,   oscar ,   were   you   gonna   say   something ?   You   look   like   you   had   something   to   say .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>33:28</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   well ,   no ,   just   relating .   I   mean   I&#39;m   thinking   about   all   the   family   and   parents   out   there   that   are   struggling   through   this   right   now .   I   certainly   feel   your   pain .   There&#39;s   been   moments .   I   have   a   13   year   old ,   gonna   be   14   next   month ,   and   we&#39;ve   taken   the   same   route .   18   is   gonna   be   the   number   for   us   and   and   she ,   she   does   have   a   mobile   phone .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>33:43</time>
      <p>
          But   what&#39;s   great   about   some   of   the   phones   now   is   you   can   keep   them   really   restricted   because   of   the   way   we   move   around   and   travel .   We   felt   it   was   necessary .   The   phone   numbers   that   she   has   on   there ,   they   come   through   us .   We   accept   them ,   we   deny   them .   If   she   gets   a   text   message   from   somebody   that   doesn&#39;t   is   not   an   accepted   contact ,   it   doesn&#39;t   go   through .   She&#39;s   got   no   internet .   It&#39;s   basically   a   dumb   phone   right   with   ten   contacts   on   there .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>34:04</time>
      <p>
          But   there   has   been   those   moments ,   if   I&#39;m   being   honest ,   where   my   kid   will   come   home   and   they&#39;ll   say   man ,   I ,   you   know ,   everyone&#39;s   on   social   media .   I&#39;m   not   sure   why   I   can   have   it   and   it   doesn&#39;t   make   sense   to   me   all   the   time   and   I&#39;m   responsible ,   aren&#39;t   I ?   I&#39;ve   had   those   conversations ,   but   we&#39;ve   pressed   through ,   we&#39;ve   explained   ourselves ,   we&#39;ve   given   our   daughter   articles   to   read   that   quote   stats   and   talk   about   anxiety   and   depression   and   similar   to   your   experience ,   yuzzi .   She   has   come   back   at   times   and   and   has   seen   what   is   going   on   in   her   friends   live   and   has   gone .   Wow ,   I   get   it   now   I   get   it .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>34:38</time>
      <p>
          And   one   of   the   reality   is   it&#39;s   not   just   social   media   what&#39;s   out   there ,   but   it&#39;s   also   being   able   to   remove   yourself   from   school   relationships .   Because   if   you   think   about   it   and   this   is   one   of   the   reasons   why   anxiety   and   depression   is   so   high   if   you   think   about   it ,   when   we   were   growing   up ,   if   we   had   a   bad   day   at   school ,   if   we   got   an   argument   with   a   friend ,   we   went   home   and   it   was   done .   We   went   home   and   we   were   disconnected   from   that   friend .   And   now   we&#39;re   home   and   we&#39;ve   got   our   neighborhood   kids   and   we&#39;ve   got   a   family   and   it   was   separate .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>35:02</time>
      <p>
          But   nowadays   some   of   these   teenagers ,   they&#39;ll   get   into   an   argument   and   they&#39;ll   go   home   and   they&#39;ll   continue   online   or   in   text   and   they&#39;ll   lay   down   in   bed   and   if   they   got   their   phones   with   them   in   bed ,   they&#39;re   sitting   there   watching   it   happen   at   two ,   three ,   four ,   five   o&#39;clock   in   the   morning .   I   mean ,   I&#39;ve   heard   these   stories   of   girls   that   will   stay   up   all   hours   of   the   night   tormenting   themselves   because   of   one   comment   that   was   made   at   nine   o&#39;clock   the   morning   before   at   school ,   and   so   that&#39;s   ultimately   what   parents   are   trying   to   protect   their   children   from .   But   what   about ,   nathan ,   protecting   ourselves ,   because   we   are   all   fallen ,   and   it   would   be   foolish   to   think   that   the   dangers   of   social   media   are   primarily   Teenagers .   I&#39;m   39   years   old   and   I   have   dangers .   What   are   the   pitfalls   that   we   have   Ourselves   as   consumers   of   social   media   and   and   how   can   we   identify   the   way   it&#39;s   impacting   our   lives ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>35:51</time>
      <p>
          so ,   being   recently   reading   our   screw-tape   letters   so   good   and   the   big   takeaway ,   as   I   read ,   that   is ,   realizing   how   Skilled   we   are   at   rationalizing   our   sin   like   when   you   think   of   the   psychology ,   of   how   screw-tape   is   suggesting   that   you   manipulate   Christians ,   yeah ,   and   we   need   to   remember ,   as   you&#39;re   identifying ,   that   we   can .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>36:13</time>
      <p>
          We   can   think ,   yeah ,   this   is   a   problem   just   for   teenagers ,   but   it&#39;s   for   us   as   well ,   and   we   are   very ,   very   skilled   at   rationalizing   the   time   that   we   spend   on   a   device
      </p>

      <h2 id="smart-devices-and-social-media-impact"><a class="no-underline" href="#smart-devices-and-social-media-impact">Smart Devices and Social Media Impact</a></h2>


        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>36:23</time>
      <p>
          .   I   sit   here   and   I   say ,   you   know ,   it&#39;s   consuming   our   time ,   it&#39;s   eroding   at   time .   We   need   to   give   an   account   for   it   all   the   while ,   like ,   what   was   I   doing   on   my   device   an   hour   ago   before   I   came   here ?   Yeah ,   what   am   I   doing ,   as   I&#39;m   meant   to   be   employed ?   Am   I   making   the   most   of   my   time ?   Am   I   getting   sucked   in   to   those   things ?   I   would   say ,   as   I   always   say   make   sure   that   you   are   connected   in   a   local   church ,   make   sure   that   you&#39;re   part   of   some   kind   of   accountability   or   discipleship   group   that   you&#39;re   not   just   dropping   in ,   dropping   out .   It   is   the ,   the   means   of   grace   working   in   our   lives   by   the   power   of   the   Holy   Spirit ,   that   helps   us   see   those   areas   of   sin   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>36:58</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   not   possible   for   us   to   lock   down   our   device   to   say   I   can&#39;t   receive   calls   and   I   can&#39;t   receive   texts ,   but   we   have   to   pray   for   wisdom   yeah   we&#39;re   told ,   if   you ,   if   you   lack   wisdom ,   ask   for   it ,   it&#39;ll   be   given   to   you   yeah   and   we   need   to   be   continually   praying   for   wisdom   and   have   the   willingness   to   ask   ourselves   or   our   brothers   in   Christ   the   hard   questions ,   yeah ,   about   how   we&#39;re   using   our   devices .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>37:20</time>
      <p>
          I   have ,   I   have   a   friend   that   just   says   I   don&#39;t   have   Instagram   on   my   phone .   Mm-hmm ,   he   just   knows .   If   Instagram   is   there ,   it&#39;s ,   he&#39;s   going   to   see   things   he   doesn&#39;t   need   to   see .   Right ,   that   doesn&#39;t   help   him ,   so   he   chooses   not   to   use   it .   And   I   think   that   there   is   a   lot   of   wisdom   in   and   a   lot   of   courage   and   being   able   to   say   I&#39;m   I&#39;m   going   to   make   the   hard   choice ,   because   I   know   how   frail   I   am   and   this   individual   is   not   doing   what   most   teenagers   are   doing .   You   know ,   85%   of   teenage   boys   have   been   exposed   to   pornography .   That&#39;s   not   his   story .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>37:49</time>
      <p>
          Yeah   but   he   just   knows   this   is   not   helpful .   Yeah ,   for   me .   And   we   need   to   be   willing ,   as   men   and   as   Christian   women ,   to   make   these   hard   decisions ,   to   say   I&#39;m   gonna   say   no ,   I   won&#39;t   put   this   app   on   my   device ,   or   there   are   other   things   you   can .   Honest ,   on   an   iPhone ,   you   can   change   the   color   scheme ,   yeah ,   to   be   grayscale ,   yeah ,   and   a   simple   thing   like   that   Psychologically   stops   the   drawer   of   the   screen   yep ,   yeah ,   and   Nathan ,   wouldn&#39;t   you   say   as   well   that   I   mean ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>38:17</time>
      <p>
          ultimately ,   obviously ,   it   comes   down   to   the   fear   of   God ,   yeah ,   in   our   hearts ,   because   I   mean   we   all   know   that   those   who   do   have   said   time   and   again   that   they&#39;re   not   gonna   look   at   porn   again ,   they&#39;re   not   gonna   do   this ,   or   that   they   even   may   put   things   on   their   phone   that   will   restrict   them .   Accountability   software   if   someone   wants   to   find   a   way   around   those   things ,   they   will   Comes   down   to   the   fear   of   the   Lord ,   but   at   the   same   time   too ,   I   mean   in   keeping   with   the   principles   that   Christ   taught   us   about   plucking   out   your   eye   and   cutting   off   your   hand ,   taking   those   extreme   measures   In   terms   of   cutting   sin   out   of   your   life ,   don&#39;t   you   think   there   are   some   people   who   have   proven   that   they   can&#39;t   trust   themselves   with   social   media   and   they   just   need   to   get   off   of   it   altogether ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>38:59</time>
      <p>
          It&#39;s   really   good .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>38:59</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   no ,   I   think   absolutely .   You   know ,   I&#39;ll   bring   this   up .   I   can   remember   Adele   the ,   the   music   artist ,   when   she   was   in   the   height   of   her   fame .   She   was   making   mistakes   on   Twitter   and   things   like   that ,   and   I   don&#39;t   know   all   what   was   going   on   in   her   personal   life ,   but   I   believe   there&#39;s   alcohol ,   pills ,   perhaps ,   these   things   happening   that   she   was   just   making   very ,   very   foolish   decisions   publicly   and   so   the   people   around   her   and   probably   the   music   label   that   want   to   continue   making   money ,   they   took   her   device   off   her .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>39:29</time>
      <p>
          You   cannot   have   this .   You&#39;re   demonstrating   that   you   cannot   control   yourself   and   use   this   device .   No ,   I   understand   she&#39;s .   She&#39;s   different   now   than   she   was   and   I   don&#39;t   know .   I   don&#39;t   know   what   hell .   But   we   need   to   be   able   to   recognize   the   fullness   of   ourselves ,   the   weakness   of   our   flesh ,   and   say   perhaps   this   isn&#39;t   for   me .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>39:45</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   mean   even   more   relevant   recent   than   that .   There&#39;s   a   incredibly   talented   NBA   star ,   john   Morant ,   right   now   who   is   self   Destructing   his   life   via   social   media ,   which   is   another   prime   example ,   and   we   talked   about   the   pornographic   issues .   One   of   the   other   aspects ,   which   you   touched   on   it   earlier ,   is   the   way   our   phones   Turn   us   into   consumers ,   and   and   you   mentioned   apps ,   and   something   that   we&#39;ve   talked   about   before   on   our   podcast   is   that   our   phones ,   they   don&#39;t   work   for   us .   This   is   ultimately ,   that   you   know   the   smart   device   that&#39;s   in   your   pocket   is   actually   not   working   for   you .   It&#39;s   working   for   all   of   the   companies   that   create   the   apps   that&#39;s   on   there ,   and   every   single   app   that   you   have ,   whether   it&#39;s   Social   media   or   anything   else ,   is   designed   you   can   almost   summarize   to   do   one   thing ,   which   is   to   make   you   want ,   to   make   you   feel   unsatisfied ,   to   make   you   think   you   know ,   if   only   I   had   that   experience ,   that   vacation ,   that   product ,   that   car ,   that   family ,   then   I&#39;d   be   more   happy .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>40:43</time>
      <p>
          And   when   it   succeeds ,   it   causes   us   to   spend   and   to   consume   more   and   more   and   more   in   pursuit   of   this   supposed   peace   and   Happiness ,   which   goes   back   to ,   I   think ,   paying   attention   to   the   liturgies   of   our   lives .   If   the   liturgy   of   my   life   is   being   determined   by   apps   that   make   me   want ,   then   I&#39;m   gonna   long   for   all   the   things   of   this   world ,   the   liturgy   which   you   talked   about   before ,   about   prayer   and   reading   time   in   the   morning .   If   the   liturgy   of   my   overall   life   and   my   overall   days   pointing   me   towards   Christ ,   then   I   will   find   the   satisfaction ,   satisfaction   and   joy   that   is   found   in   Christ   and   that&#39;s   probably   a   great   transition .   To   go   back   to   the   question   that   you   asked   earlier ,   which   is ,   with   that   said ,   how   can   we   use   our   smart   devices   and   social   media   For   the   glory   of   God ?   And   what   ways ,   nathan ,   has   it   been   beneficial   in   your   life   other   than   your   career ,   but   seriously ,   and   what   ways   has   it   drawn   you   closer   to   the   Lord ?   

      </p>

      <h2 id="ligonier-ministries-and-christians-understanding"><a class="no-underline" href="#ligonier-ministries-and-christians-understanding">Ligonier Ministries and Christians&#39; Understanding</a></h2>


        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>41:38</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   I   can   think   back   almost   20   years   ago   and   I   was   at   a   little   Bible   study .   I   had   been   a   Christian   for   I   don&#39;t   know .   I   think   I   think   a   couple   of   years   at   least   in   church ,   had   prayed   sinners   prayers   and   Would   have   called   myself   a   Christian ,   and   maybe   I   was .   But   I   was   still   trying   to   understand   this ,   this   Christian   Religion .   And   I   was   in   this   Bible   study   and   somebody   said   to   me   you   need   to   go   to   living   waters ,   dotcom   wow   address .   They   said   no   way ,   yeah ,   and   you   need   to .   There&#39;s   two   messages   you   need   to   listen   to   Hell&#39;s   best   kept   secret   and   true   and   false   conversion   yeah .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>42:15</time>
      <p>
          So   I   went   home   from   that   Bible   study   and   it   was   a   Friday   night   I   watched   both   of   those   messages   and   that   was   the   first   time   that   I   I   had   this   almost   Isaiah   6 ,   to   reference   R   C   Sproul   the   holiness   of   God   moment   where   I   was   taken   through   the   law   of   God   and   for   the   first   time ,   truly   Understood   just   how   sinful   I   am   and   the   need   I   had   for   a   savior ,   and   that   was   revolutionary   in   my   life .   You   know   our   C .   When   he   talks   about   getting   saved ,   he   speaks   about   his   second   conversion ,   where   he   Encountered   the   holiness   of   God   and   became   aware   of   God   in   all   of   his   fullness .   I   don&#39;t   know ,   maybe   it&#39;s   a   similar   experience   to   that   where   I   just   for   the   first   time   saw   God   in   his   majestic   holiness   and   me .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>42:56</time>
      <p>
          So   in   my   loneliness .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>42:57</time>
      <p>
          So   that   is   at   least   for   one   sinner .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>43:00</time>
      <p>
          That   was   an   incredible   way   that   the   Lord   has   used   technology   that   is   moving   Nathan   man .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>43:05</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;m   so   glad   you   shared   that   you   didn&#39;t   know   that   story ,   no   idea   what   a   blessing .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>43:09</time>
      <p>
          I&#39;m   gonna   share   that   with .   Ray&#39;s   gonna   be   so   blessed   and   encouraged .   And   you   know ,   it&#39;s   amazing   because   when ,   when   I   was   a   biblical   studies   and   theology   major   back   in   college ,   one   of   my   teachers   played   for   us   the   holiness   of   God .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>43:20</time>
      <p>
          Oh   my   doctor ,   rc   Sproul ,   and   that   had   a   massive   impact   on   me .   In   fact ,   in   devotions   I   watched   it   through   with   my   wife   and   kids   a   few   years   ago ,   and   so   what   a   blessing   to   see   how   our   ministries   and   our   lives   have   intersected   and   we&#39;re   just   so   excited   about   what   you   guys   are   Doing .   Can   you   just   quickly   here ,   as   we   wrap   up ,   tell   people   about   how   they   can   connect   with   Ligonier ?   I   mean ,   one   of   the   things   I   love   about   your   ministries   that   you   guys   aren&#39;t   just   about   Teaching   people   but   you&#39;re   about   getting   them   to ,   and   I   love   this .   This   is   straight   from   what   you   guys   say .   You   want   to   equip   Christians   to   know   what   they   believe ,   why   they   believe   it   and   how   to   live   it   and   how   to   share   it .   Obviously ,   the   sharing   part   is   a   big   part   of   what   we   do ,   but   tell   people   about   Ligonier ,   how   they   can   connect   with   you   personally   on   social   media   and ,   well ,   how   you   guys   can   serve   him   now   that   we&#39;ve   convinced   people   to   not   be   on   social   media ,   how   can   they   connect   with   you   on   social   media   For ?   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>44:08</time>
      <p>
          hours   on   hours   just   scroll   through   all   of   my   feeds   and   Ligonier&#39;s .   Yeah ,   so   Ligonier   Ministries ,   founded   by   RC   Sprawl   1971 ,   so   we&#39;re   over   50   years   old   now .   In   fact ,   at   NRB ,   we&#39;re   receiving   an   award   tonight   for   more   than   50   years   of   ministry .   It&#39;s   really   exciting   that   you   know   our   found .   It&#39;s   not   exciting   that   I   found   it   went   home   to   be   with   the   Lord .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>44:29</time>
      <p>
          But   it   is   for   him   not   for   us ,   but   he   went   home   to   be   with   the   Lord   at   the   end   of   2017 ,   and   what   is   exciting   is   that   the   growth   the   ministry   has   experienced   in   the   five   plus   years   after   his   death   is   More   than   the   growth   we   experienced   in   the   years   prior ,   and   it   is   just   so   humbling   to   see   the   way   that   the   Lord   is   taking   truth   well   told   and   Sending   it   not   just   throughout   the   United   States ,   but   throughout   the   world .   So ,   if   you&#39;re   listening ,   you&#39;re   not   familiar   with   Ligonier   Ministries .   If   you   can   spell   it ,   I   encourage   you   to   go   to   Ligonierorg ,   l-i-g-o-n-i-e-r .   We   mentioned .   I&#39;m   the   host   of   renewing   your   mind .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>45:03</time>
      <p>
          This   really   is   our   flagship   podcast   and   broadcast   renewing   your   mindorg .   Every   single   day   we   have   RC   Sprawl   or   other   trusted   teachers   opening   God&#39;s   word .   Really   good   liturgy   to   be   a   part   of   your   life ,   to   just   listen   and   be   in   God&#39;s   word   every   single   day .   And   if   you   want   to   follow   me   on   social   media ,   at   NW   Bingham ,   basically   anywhere   yeah   Well ,   nathan ,   let   me   just   say ,   since   you   shared   that   story ,   likewise   Dr   Spuyl   had   such   an   impact   on   my   life .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>45:27</time>
      <p>
          I   was   an   atheist   in   high   school   and   college   and   then ,   when   I   became   a   Christian ,   I   went   to   a   sort   of   seeker-friendly   as   church   and   remember   being   a   part   of   a   Bible   study   and ,   and   you   know ,   I   was   showing   up   on   Wednesday   preparing   reading   my   Bible   and   starting   to   get   access .   Remember   listening   to   the   holiness   of   God   and   then   I   watched   a   series   by   RC   and   I   don&#39;t   remember   the   name .   It   was   so   meaningful   and   so   I   brought   notes   from   RC   to   this   Bible   study   and   it   caused   an   uproar   and   I   was   so   shocked   because   it   was   my   first   experience .   You   know ,   again ,   I   have   no   clue   about   the   Christian   realm ,   the   world .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>46:00</time>
      <p>
          I   didn&#39;t   know   that ,   like   good ,   theology   was   controversial   to   some   people   and   so   there   was ,   there   was   a   lot .   I   remember   it   getting   into   a   bit   of   an   argument   with   people   that   were   there .   It   was   like   theology   isn&#39;t   that   important   and   I   was   like   wait ,   what ?   Like   I   didn&#39;t   know   this   was   a   thing ,   that   this   was   a   thing   To   even   be   argued   for .   And   just   since   that   time   until   my   life   now ,   like ,   I   don&#39;t   think   you   can   unwind   my   understanding   of   God&#39;s   word   and   not   see   the   impact .   The   RC   and   Ligonier   the   rest   of   your   teachers   ahead   of   my   life ,   so   I&#39;m   really   glad   you&#39;re   here .   Thank   you   for   joining   us .   And   again ,   just   to   re-emphasize ,   if   you&#39;re   not   familiar   with   the   ministry ,   they   have   so   many   tools   and   resources   that   it   would   be   a   good   way   to   spend   your   liturgical   week   Embedding   yourself   in   what   they&#39;ve   done .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>46:42</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and   you   know ,   nathan   let   me   just   say   this   too   as   I   close   Mission   drift   is   such   a   huge   problem   for   so   many   ministries ,   especially   when   the   founder   is   gone .   Thank   you   guys   for   sticking   with   the   mission   and   For   doing   it   with   excellence ,   because   that&#39;s   one   of   the   elements .   Unfortunately ,   that&#39;s   absent   from   a   lot   of   Christian   ministries ,   and   so   we&#39;re   honored   to   call   you   guys   friends ,   we&#39;re   honored   to   call   you   fellow   laborers   and   God&#39;s   kingdom ,   and   we   look   forward   to   many   more   connections .   So   you   thanks   for   coming   on   with   us   today .   

      </p>

        <cite>Nathan W. Bingham</cite>
      <time>47:12</time>
      <p>
          Thanks   for   having   me   grateful   for   you .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>47:14</time>
      <p>
          Well ,   friends ,   I&#39;m   sure   you   can   see   why   we   said   it   was   such   a   great   and   refreshing   Interview .   Nathan   gave   us   some   great   insights .   It   was   delightful ,   wasn&#39;t   it   Oscar ?   Yeah ,   it   was   rare ,   was   your   favorite   part .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>47:25</time>
      <p>
          Just   the   whole   thing   just   meant   so   much .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>47:28</time>
      <p>
          Boy ,   isn&#39;t   it   encouraging   to   see   what   hell&#39;s   best   kept   secret   and   true   and   false   conversion   can   do   With   an   individual   and   I .   I&#39;m   surprised   time   and   time   again   when   we   come   across   people   who   are   excited   to   meet   different   people ,   different   speakers ,   different   teachers ,   but   then   they   come   up   to   us   at   events   and   they   say   you   are   pivotal .   That   teaching   hell&#39;s   best   kept   secret   Was   pivotal   to   get   me   to   walk   on   that   straight   and   narrow   path   to   examine   myself   to   see   if   I&#39;m   in   the   faith .   And   I   think ,   as   we   examine   hell&#39;s   best   kept   secret   and   true   and   false   conversion ,   as   was   mentioned   here   by   Nathan   Boy ,   that   that   is   the   testimony   of   so   many   people .   

      </p>

        <cite>Oscar Navarro</cite>
      <time>47:59</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and ,   by   the   way ,   if   you&#39;re   not   familiar   with   Ligonier   ministries ,   they   do   an   amazing   thing .   They&#39;re   founder   RC   Sproul .   They   have   so   much   great   content ,   including   podcasts   and   videos   and   articles ,   so   feel   free   to   visit   their   website .   They&#39;re   a   trusted   resource ,   yeah ,   not   only   in   theology ,   but   also   apologetics .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>48:15</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   and   it&#39;s   interesting   because   when   we   were   there ,   we   reminisced   about   how ,   ray ,   you   had   at   one   point   been   interviewed   at   a   CBA   by   Dr   RC   Sproul .   Yes ,   we   used   to   have   before   we   renovated   here .   We   had   that   picture   up   on   the   wall .   

      </p>

        <cite>Ray Comfort</cite>
      <time>48:28</time>
      <p>
          Yeah ,   I   had   a   great   time .   I   was   able   to   bluff   it   for   an   hour .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>48:31</time>
      <p>
          He   is   brilliant   man .   I   mean   Ben   Stein ,   number   one .   Ben   Stein   did   an   interview   with   that&#39;s   right ,   you   are   so   smart   he   was   like   brilliant .   Yeah ,   so   he   didn&#39;t   say   it   that   enthusiastically .   You   are   so   smart .   

      </p>

        <cite>Mark Spence</cite>
      <time>48:44</time>
      <p>
          Common   knowledge .   

      </p>

        <cite>Emeal Zwayne</cite>
      <time>48:45</time>
      <p>
          I   know   it&#39;s   not   well ,   friends ,   there   you   have   it .   Don&#39;t   forget   to   check   out   the   outreach   book   pack   and   the   evidence   study   Bible   and   the   Living   Waters   mug   all   living   waterscom .   Remember   to   comment   and   to   give   us   ratings   and   to   send   us   your   thoughts   at   Podcasts   of   living   waterscom .   Thank   you   for   joining   us .   We&#39;ll   see   you   here   next   time   on   the   Living   Waters   Podcast ,   where   we   still   have   no   idea   what   we&#39;re   doing .   

      </p>