Talking Teela and the Road to V1 w/ David Baxter | Ep. 206

In this week’s episode of the Biz/Dev Podcast, the script gets flipped. David is in the hot seat, talking candidly about Teela and the real journey to a V1 launch.

We unpack where Teela started, the messy operational problems that sparked it, and the decisions, missteps, and tradeoffs that shaped the product along the way. 

If you are a founder, operator, or builder navigating your own V1 moment, this episode offers real perspective on what it takes to move from idea to something people can actually use and trust.

LINKS:

Teela

David on LinkedIn

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David Baxter - CEO of Big Pixel

Gary Voigt - Creative Director at Big Pixel

The Podcast

David Baxter has been designing, building, and advising startups and businesses for over ten years. His passion, knowledge, and brutal honesty have helped dozens of companies get their start.

In Biz/Dev, David and award-winning Creative Director Gary Voigt talk about current events and how they affect the world of startups, entrepreneurship, software development, and culture.

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Music by: BLXRR

Transcript

[00:00:03] Gary: Hello and welcome to the Biz Dev Podcast, the podcast about developing your business. I'm your host today, Gary Voight, way better than David Baxter. But my guest today is David Baxter, and we're

gonna talk a little bit about the app that we're building called Teela. You might've heard us mention it before, so in the hot seat with us. Is the man behind the AI mirror, the wizard of, I guess you could say, cursor and David Baxter.

[00:00:35] David: this is so painful.

[00:00:37] Gary: Welcome David. How are you today? Now you know what happens to the guests we have.

[00:00:42] David: Oh, I know. I feel so bad for them. They have to listen to me say all that. Oh my gosh. 

[00:00:47] Gary: you don't say it as

good. I'm much better at this than you are.

[00:00:50] David: Are you okay? Alright, I'll let the, I'll let the audience determine that. And that's fair. You could just run the podcast. That's totally cool. this is fun. All right. Hello? Hi.

[00:00:59] Gary: All right, so three things versus, or this or that, let's say. Are you more of a deep dish pizza or New York style pizza?

[00:01:12] David: Oh, can I choose something? A third option?

[00:01:15] Gary: Okay. Let's just say deep dish or thin crust.

[00:01:18] David: Okay. I'll go to go thin. 'cause I don't like New York style 'cause it's too greasy. It just drips everywhere. I know. 

[00:01:24] Gary: grease isn't part

of the New York style. That was probably just one place you got it from.

[00:01:29] David: man. I've been to New York several times and that's what they always look like. And or the ones you have to fold. I don't necessarily need to fold my pizza. 

[00:01:37] Gary: And now there's a new quote, unquote style of pizza called the New Haven Style, which is the pizza that I grew up with as a kid. So that's by far now my ultimate favorite style of pizza.

So we made some this or that. That are specifically about Tela and more related to, I guess you could say, the business and the experience side of someone using Tela. So would you rather showcase a new feature that you know users are gonna love but your team does not like it because they don't feel it fits with the product?

Or would you rather kill a feature that you personally love because it just breaks the trust and scale of the product, and it's not really adding to the value for the users. So to shorten that, a personal feature that you love, would you rather add it just for yourself or kill it if the users don't like it? 

[00:02:32] David: Oh, I would rather add a feature that I know they'll love. And I have a perfect 

[00:02:36] Gary: No. No, not know.

They'll love of.

[00:02:38] David: You said my, the users will love, right? You said users will love.

[00:02:41] Gary: Yeah, users will find value in it.

a 

[00:02:44] David: I would, 

[00:02:44] Gary: you

love of no value, or kill a feature that you love because the users did not find value in it.

[00:02:50] David: No I don't have any problem killing a feature if no one likes it. Especially when you're using AI coding tools that changes. It's funny, it changes your relationship to code because. Before it would take weeks to build a feature or whatever, and you become attached to it because it's your sweat, blood, and tears that goes into X feature.

And so cutting it becomes like a really personal thing. It's like you're ma as a developer and I'm an old developer. I've been doing this for 25 years now and 26 this year. Anyway I know this from deep experience that it becomes very personal. And if you don't like my feature, you must not like me.

Every dev has this problem. I don't care how good you are. And so now that they're, you're you have these AI coding tools, a lot of that personal connection kind of goes away because you not only put it together pretty quickly, but the tool you didn't type every line, you didn't, you know what I'm saying?

It's different. So 

[00:03:49] Gary: Oh yeah, no.

As a designer, I know exactly what you're saying.

[00:03:53] David: but I will.

[00:03:55] Gary: AI is not quite there enough to help us do that same thing, but.

Things like the image generation models that are pretty good. We can go through 10 to 15 ideas before we do something that's really gonna be good enough for us to spend time to fix and create.

You know what I mean?

Like We're imagining a composition of images together, that would actually convey a story we're trying to tell. It's not gonna take us three to four days to put something together. You know what I mean? We could do 15 to 20 options and just see if it's even gonna work first. In

[00:04:26] David: I have a perfect example of this and you're gonna appreciate this 'cause I'm really digging at you secretly. So there was a feature I built that I did just for me and you hated it. You still hate it. The accent color. That you can go. So when you sign up for Tela, you can choose from eight or nine different, we call them accents that change the logo, the favicon, the accent color throughout the app, and you can do it all over the place.

And Gary's like, dude, he's a designer. And he is huh, it's, you're diluting our brand man. It's not orange is tea, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was like, okay. I ignored him. Here's why. Here. Don't say, hold on. So what I love to do now, I will, I, so I'm helping our pilot users and I'm, I have to impersonate them through our tools to see what they're seeing, to find bugs.

Almost every user I impersonate uses a different color on their accent. They're all using it. It's like they all just jump to different colors and that just makes me all warm and fuzzy. One, 'cause I know it annoys you, but two, it was, that was a personal. Feature that I added just 'cause. 'cause I wanna play and it worked.

Anyway, there you go. 

[00:05:38] Gary: So this kind of leads into another question,

which isn't really a this or that. It's what hurts more? A customer

misunderstanding the app or you realizing that you created something because you misunderstood the customer's needs. 

[00:05:54] David: Oh, the first one for sure. It Tila is now it's my baby, right? Every startup guy it's your baby. And building something that they, them misunderstanding them. That's hard for me, it's, it usually that means I failed in some way. That you take that personally, again, back to that developer thing it is hard when you put something in and it makes sense to you because you've done it since the beginning and they're like, this makes no sense whatsoever.

That hurts. It, I appreciate the feedback because a lot of times. You don't see the forest for the trees and the U. The users are very good at 

[00:06:30] Gary: Yeah, I think usually that. just comes

down to a little bit of a question answer communication type thing, where some people have preconceived notions and

then you built it to do a certain thing, and that was not communicated well, not by any fault of, yours or theirs. It's just people will open something and just assume they know what to do based on. Experience with other apps and stuff like that. So 

patterns like that

are just,

[00:06:59] David: It's interesting being on this side. 'cause normally we were talking earlier off before they started, one thing that's interesting about Tela is it allows me to build a lot of. Features and stuff that our clients big pixel clients would not pay for because they're ancillary, they're not to the core mission 

and.

It's really fun to do that, but at the same time little popups here and there to guide a user. But it's also interesting when you're early on in the pilot thing, I haven't built a lot of those, and so there's no help built for Tela yet, right? It doesn't exist because we're, we haven't built it yet.

And so these piloted users are getting in there and they're just assuming everything and sometimes they're just completely off. And when you see. See the app being used in ways that you didn't expect or they're, it's breaking in ways. You're like, why are they doing that? And it's because you haven't built that help yet.

It's not a mature application. That's been very eye-opening. 'cause I don't see that, big pixel, we build you the app and, but we're not involved in going line with it. We're not involved in user experiences unless there's a bug. We don't see that side of the table as it were. And so seeing that has been very eyeopening.

As a developer.

[00:08:08] Gary: we guide the client and the client has ideas usually of what their user's expecting, and then we'll just based on. Normal visual patterns and stuff like that and how apps

should work. We'll get it as far as we can, but we are not getting the user testing data back from the client in most cases. Let's say you put six months of work and quiet progress into something in Tela, and no one really notices a difference. No one really sees anything. Or they're like, oh wow, this is new or This has changed, or This is definitely more helpful. It's just oh, okay. No big deal. Or. If you have a really lo like loud launch week of a new feature and it just breaks everywhere and people are just like, oh, that was a waste.

[00:08:53] David: Oh the nature of Tela is quiet, right?

Most of the heavy lifting is completely invisible. Like it's no one ever thinks they're power company. They just turn the light on. The only time they ever think about their power company is when they flip the light and it doesn't work.

[00:09:08] Gary: Or if they have to pay the bill and

it's higher than they expected.

[00:09:11] David: Oh my gosh. Yeah, that's me every month now. But Telas like that. It's just, if it's working, it should be silent. You just get answers and you move about your day and you don't think twice about it. It is not something you're excited about. It's not sexy. It's not, you know what I'm saying?

It's just. It's a workhorse, a of a application. So we, by definition, we'll be quiet trying to get feedback all. They're like, yeah, just answer all my questions. That's amazing for me. But they're just like, eh, it just did its job. What do you want from me? So I never get those loud things.

[00:09:45] Gary: There's the same thought in design. Good and great design will usually disappear into the background,

[00:09:52] David: Yeah, it's weird when you do your job right, it makes you invisible, and that's true for any software. Any software should be invisible. You should, because it's just a means to an end. Software is not the reason you're doing something. You don't get up to get excited to open an app. You want the results of that app.

The app should banish and give you results. Whatever those results are, whether it's. Instagram I'm here to be entertained and to see what's going on in the world. Instagram should fade to the background. If you're thinking about the application, something's gone wrong.

[00:10:24] Gary: If you're noticing the UI elements

Big fat images in front of your face, then yeah, something 

[00:10:28] David: Yep. Something's gone wrong and Taylor's very similar to that.

I should, your data is what is the star. And data is data.

[00:10:42] AD: BigPixel builds world class custom software and amazing apps. Our team of pros puts passion into every one of our projects. Our design infused development leans heavily on delivering a great experience for our clients and their clients. From startups to enterprises, we can help craft your ideas into real world products that help your business do better business. 

[00:11:09] Gary: So when you started creating Tela, was there an actual set of pain points that you saw like potential customers had that you were trying to solve for? Or was it more of a feeling you had that, Hey, I think there's something here and let me see where I can go with this, and then maybe someone can use it in a way after that.

[00:11:31] David: I think the answer is yes and no. So we have always. For almost 13 years now, we've been, we build customer reports. That's a huge part of what Big Pixel does, right? I need to see my data. The only way you get to see it is a customer report. So we've been building dozens of those for years and years, and I've always thought it was weird that they 

[00:11:53] Gary: Wait, I don't know if you said

that clearly. Custom reports, is that

[00:11:57] David: Customer reports. Yeah. Yeah. Sorry. Yeah, so you know right now, pre Tela, just in the regular world out there right now, if you want access to your data that you have in your system, you really have two options. You hire a SQL guy or you have a customer report built, right? That's pretty much how data gets out, and so Big Pixel has been for almost 13 years now.

The SQL guy and the customer reports guy. So we're intimately familiar with that world, right? We do it all day, every day. And when ai, so we're looking, gosh, April maybe is when the ideas of Tela started coming about as not even, it wasn't tla, it was just an idea. We were like, we wanted to play with ai 'cause it was finally getting legs underneath it.

The code that it was generated wasn't trash. We were really trying to dive deep as developers to understand what this new world was gonna be like. And we're like, okay, this has been an ongoing thorn that annoys clients, always has, always will. Maybe we can solve something here. And so we went about, we had a client who was like, yeah, I'm willing to invest a little bit of development time to see if you could build me something for my company and.

So we took a couple of weeks and built a godawful prototype. Actually, Jeff, your brother, built the original and it's not godawful because he did a bad job. It was amazing, but it was super basic, right? It was just a little bit of work to see if this thing could do something. 

[00:13:20] Gary: Yeah,

here that, lemme get this right. My mom sent me a note. Jeff is the best developer in the world. Okay. So I think she's gonna send

me like 50 bucks now.

[00:13:29] David: Good. Yeah. It's sponsored content. I, he built this thing and really I think the original client was a landscaping company. And the question that made us realize, and I've told this story before, but the question that made us realize that Tila was going to be something was when it answered this question.

So they have, you pay as one of their customers for services. Like you're spraying for weeds you're 10 tending the flowers, whatever. Those are services you buy from them. And then they have service techs and we built big pixel's. Been building their software forever. Now, five plus years.

We have service techs. We have a mobile app that their service tech said, Hey, I sprayed the weeds today. I did this, I did that. So we have all this data in the system, but to answer the questions, what did I pay for that I did not get? That's an enormously difficult sequel question. It's just really complicated to get SQL to get data to answer that.

And in this little cheesy prototype, we actually answered it and the sequel was like a page and a half long. It was huge. But we were able to answer it in this very basic, simple prototype with, we had no concept of training or anything. We're like, oh wow, this might really work. And that was okay.

And so I went and I had this idea. That I wanted to say favorites is what I called them at the time, where if I really got a question right? I wanted to save it to get it again. And that's what became the foundation of what we call data clips now. And so I took that little cheesy prototype and I just started running with it.

'cause I was enjoying it. I was learning the tools and playing with it. And Telo became that. And now I don't know how many months later six months later, we are almost at V one and going live this quarter. So Very cool.

[00:15:11] Gary: Was there any part of the process after the prototype and. As you were continuing to build and see it grow, was there any part that you were just like, that should be easy. That's simple. I'm sure AI can do that. And then it turns out it was almost like just a roadblock you had to climb over and destroy. Became brutal.

[00:15:32] David: Basically the core engine of Tela fits that description. 'cause we have that simple prototype of we could answer these questions like right off the bat. We're like, oh it's great, it's perfect. But to get it so that it would be it not blow up. That sounds so silly to be able to answer more and more questions.

I think we honestly. S just needle in the haystack with our question, right? It should not right outta the gate, been able to answer that question without any training or any of the stuff that we do now. 'cause at the time, we literally were doing nothing. We pointed the, our little cheesy app at a database that said, answer some questions and it pieced together answers to make that reliable.

Early on, if you ask the question the same question, same person has the same question within a minute of itself, you would get two different answers. There's nothing more frustrating than that

[00:16:31] Gary: Yeah. 

[00:16:31] David: and digging 

[00:16:33] Gary: it worked

so good the first time

[00:16:35] David: yeah it you think you nailed it outta the park, and then you realize that was just.

A fluke that we nailed it. And so now we have to do it for real. Now we have to do it in a consistent manner. And it's ai, right? 'cause AI, by its definition is not, doesn't want to be consistent. In fact, the new models really are built to not be consistent. 'cause they want to be more creative. These multimodal models, they want to be more reasoning, more thinking, more creative.

So consistency is actually against their. They're foundations. They don't want to do it. And so that was something I thought would be easy and was, has been basically the center of development ever since features of this, that and the other. Making dashboards and making cool UIs. Co creating cool UIs is hard no matter what you do.

But I knew that was gonna be hard. Like that was gonna be hard and it was hard surprise. But but that was, yeah, building that engine in a reliable way. Has been hard and we're still working at it. It's still not perfect. It's 

[00:17:35] Gary: Was

there any part I guess made you nervous or made you a little bit scared to continue? Was there any part that you were like, you know what, maybe I bit off a little more than I can chew. Maybe I made promises that I don't know if this is gonna be able to achieve, or.

[00:17:50] David: Yeah, there was a time I was gonna say no and then that just remind remembered. So we had this thing. It was a sample question that a client gave us. It was like, show me the sales of this specific product name. I'm trying to, the iPhone 17, I'm just picking this up, show me the sales of last year for the iPhone 17.

That question almost broke Teala in half because if you really take that question apart, it's horrendously complicated. What is a product? What does sales mean? What does an iPhone 17 mean? All of these are things that the AI has to figure out based on your data structure. And so I originally was having to tear apart the question and answer it, and I went down, two weeks I went down and built a thousand different ways of doing, answering this question, and they all failed and I was super frustrated, and then I realized.

I did a massive pivot that the way to solve that was to make Tela smarter when you signed up. So now when you sign up for Tela and you connect your database, we do an enormous amount of work to understand your data as well as we possibly can. We have multiple steps. We do all this metadata, all this stuff.

This is our secret sauce, of how we do it. One of them is the onboarding quiz. That's something that we talk about pretty regularly, but it's all these things so that when you ask this question, I know what the product table is, I know what your sales tables are. The hard part is knowing what the products by their very name are.

But I know where the product table is, and then I can go. The problem with product names, just so you know, no one knows the name of the product in the database. 

[00:19:39] Gary: That's true. It's only the tag, whatever the developer

assigned it at that 

[00:19:42] David: It is whatever they named it. Yeah. It could be iPhone 17 in all caps or with underscores or it could be something completely different.

And 

[00:19:49] Gary: could be IP one dash

7 20 25 or whatever.

[00:19:52] David: And so that's becomes its own problem. But it's, it that almost broke me. I was really struggling 'cause I. I had a couple of pilots, early, early pilots, and they, I was like, I broke the system. I'm sorry. It's totally broken right now. You cannot use it and that's not good.

So that was rough. But we got there. We, once I had that epiphany and we then became an effort of how do we raise the floor of training so that I minimize, I can't get rid of, but I minimize how much training a user has to do when they sign up. Because most of the systems that are similar, you have to do a lot of training before it can answer any questions.

And we've gotten into about, we can answer about 75% of questions without any additional training. That's been pretty good. 

[00:20:36] Gary: If someone is trusting Tela with their company's data, what are you doing to secure it and keep it safe?

[00:20:42] David: Early on we're gonna ask you to connect to your database. And probably most of the people who are interested in TLA are not technical people. So they gotta go talk to their IT guy, their nerd, whatever, to go get this connection to their database.

And I know as a dev if some rando comes up to me and says, Hey this, they want access to our database. I have 

[00:20:59] Gary: Tad from sales needs you to connect the database to Some pilot program of a

random company you've never heard of. and he needs it by noon. So 

[00:21:08] David: And so I have kept this in the back of my mind knowing if I got that e that email that you just described from Tad I, how would I answer that? How would I make myself feel warm and fuzzy?

And so we built layer upon layer. The simplest thing is, we rarely touch your actual data. So when you sign up and you connect to your database, we do this big extraction process, we need a better name for it, but that's what we're doing and all we're doing there is we're extracting the structure of your data.

We don't actually look at your data at all, which is the sensitive stuff. No one cares about the structure of a data, not really like how your, how do you call your database columns? That's not sensitive. What is sensitive is the actual data, and so we, the system only touches your actual data. On that initial hit when we have to learn about your database, we do a little bit there.

And then when we finally, when you ask a question, we do, we structure the query and then we run that query. But other than that, we never touch your database. The other thing that we do is we have multiple layers where you cannot run anything but a select. We are a query engine. We cannot, even if you ask us, you can beg us to, you can tell us that your grandmother's gonna die if you don't answer this question, which I know is a hack for a lot of the AI things to get them to do.

We tried that actually. We won't do it. Your grandmother just sadly is gonna have to be bad things anyway. We don't allow anything but queries. So that is another way we protect your data. We cannot do it. The last major piece. Is we don't allow any AI to train on your data to even see your data.

We do use open ai, but we use open AI through Microsoft Foundry and they have an SLA that says Open AI. As a company, we'll never see your data. That's a huge deal for us. I don't trust these AI companies any more than anybody else. I don't want, but Microsoft, we've been using them for 20 years. If I don't trust Microsoft.

I'm toast, right? 'cause they have all the databases we built. We've been in there and the same with Amazon. Do you trust Amazon? But I don't trust these newcomers. I think I, it's just me. It's my bias. So we specifically have SLAs on all of our ais that we use, that 

[00:23:25] Gary: an SLA? 

[00:23:27] David: Service level agreement. 

Service level agreement is when you sign with a third party and they say, we promise these things, and if we break them, these things happen. So it's a way to say like a really easy one is your web host. If you have a website, they say, we have, we'll be up 99.99% of the time. 

A Microsoft promises that no one, that one, your data never leaves Azure, which is where our database and our AI stuff is.

It will never leave Azure, meaning no third party will ever see it. That's important. And two, nothing is ever trained or stored or anything or your data. So that's a big deal for us from a security perspective. So we have built that. Those are basically the three pillars of our security. We've worked really hard to make sure that we're gonna keep those IT guys happy.

[00:24:12] Gary: All right, so now that Telas gone from an idea to a possible product to becoming what will be a real product. What does ready, actually mean for you?

[00:24:25] David: They told me to stop building. That's what ready means.

[00:24:29] Gary: No. Now Stop building. Stop

adding features.

[00:24:33] David: stop adding features. Ready for me means that the promise was kept. I had an idea of what Tela can do, and that meant these, this suite of features and those suite of features that, that separates us from the competitors that are out there.

Those had to be there. But I also, this is. This is a big pixel project. Even though t L's its own entity, big Pixel is everywhere in this because they're both my companies, but I didn't want anything that would embarrass Big Pixel as well. So there was a certain level of Polish that the app even at V one had to have in terms of UX and flow and all of that.

So that we could say, this is something we built and we can be really proud of it. 'cause that's a big deal to us as big pixel ux, design, flow, ease of use, all of those things. And so it had to meet that level of standard. So those two things had to be there to be ready. 

[00:25:35] Gary: Okay, so we're wrapping up on Tela itself. I just wanted to ask something more. Based on your perspective from this process, because we are actually gonna be dropping V one pretty soon

For beta testing or alpha testing, what did you call it, beta or 

[00:25:53] David: It is beta. It's 

[00:25:54] Gary: it's beta. We need Pilots to break it. Yeah.

Okay. So what has this journey done to reaffirm the way you feel about building things? 

[00:26:05] David: Oh, 

[00:26:06] Gary: from the standpoint of writing

every bit of code to just coming up with concepts and letting AI do it, has that kind of built a new spark? 'cause I know you, you transferred from writing code

Products to helping write code and build products and then to helping write code and manage products and then to getting people to buy products for us to write code and manage so you've wrote yourself out of the game of writing code by running the pixel over the years, but this is

A way for you to get back into that building game without wasting a ton of time writing every line of code.

[00:26:44] David: I can't tell you how much fun it's been to do this. I have, yeah, like you said, my journey. I have stopped writing most code in the last few years. I wrote a little bit here and there, 

[00:26:54] Gary: Now you just poorly prompt. 

[00:26:56] David: Well,

but I'm just poorly prompted. It's very true. I use a billion tokens a month. I, but I think I, I love coding.

Coding is in my blood. I've been a developer forever. I always tinker. But I've enjoyed this process more than I can say. It is just so much fun, and the reason why is because I have a lot of ideas. It's just, it's who I am. And to be able to say, I wanna make it so that they can click a button in all the colors, the accent colors change, right?

In the pre AI world, that would've taken a decent amount of time to do that. 

[00:27:33] Gary: Yeah.

[00:27:33] David: Because it affects everything. You can imagine how many pieces of code and all the variables and all of the CSS and stuff that has to change just to do something that stupid. But I have this idea and I was able to have it done and very short period of time.

And I'm like, look at that, and then I can move on to my next crazy idea, which is why they have to reign me in because there's always something I wanna add. But this has been so much fun. Now I also get to experience, I'm about to experience something I've never experienced before, which is going live with my own product.

I've never done that before. I'm applying for, to speak at events for Tila. I am applying for accelerators in the local area. These are all things that are very interesting and I've just never sat on the side. So this is so much fun. It's also really interesting. I'm learning Go ahead.

[00:28:25] Gary: I was gonna say, you've given other people advice on how to do this. You've mentored people

on how to do this everywhere from college on up to, like older entrepreneurs.

do it yourself different 

[00:28:38] David: of startups. I'm not even exaggerating at this point. Hundreds of startups have I've done something with them, whether it's just an evening of advice, meeting someone for coffee speaking at on a panel. Building, designing it. Mark, I've never marketed it 'cause that's not our world, but I've done everything.

I've, it's funny, I am, talk about full circle. So I applied, there's a thing called Venture Connect, which is a big to do here in the area where the top, and I say top, I don't know what even what that means. They choose a group of startups to get on stage and pitch and. You can also buy tables to have your startup be there.

And early in big pixel career, we would have tables. This is when it was just me. We would've tables for our clients and I was their CTO standing there pimping out their wares and now I'm pitching to, to pitch. Does that make sense? I'm applying to pitch on stage. So it's like it's, this is a long circle and it's been really interesting and it also I think makes me a better.

Leader of big pixel because now I'm getting down in the weeds with all these startups that we work with and even non startups, like it's just even our existing clients that are big. This whole experience will make me much better at my other job.

[00:29:56] Gary: Very cool. All right, so if anybody wants to learn more about Tila. Right now I guess the best place to look at pieces and parts of where it's started and where it's going is on our LinkedIn for Tiva.

[00:30:11] David: LinkedIn, we are doing a big push there 'cause that's where we do most of our marketing for Big Pixel, so we're continuing that. We're good at it. Tila.ai is our website. Right now it is just the beta site, but in the next few weeks it will be become our marketing site. So tila.ai is where?

You can learn more about it and that's where you can sign up to be in the beta if you want. And yeah, me, I'm all over LinkedIn. If you search David Baxter, I'm pretty sure you'll find me. And yeah, that's pretty much, you can email me, David@teela.ai. That's me. 

[00:30:43] Gary: All right. I guess that wraps up this week's episode of Tela Talk with David. So 

[00:30:49] David: Taylor talk with David. 

[00:30:51] Gary: as our

special guest go visit him on LinkedIn. Go check him out. Keep your eyes

open Be out soon. 

[00:30:57] David: That's the saddest way to describe a podcast. Alright. Thanks everybody. Bye.