This is the show for creative entrepreneurs who have a message to share and want to live a life of freedom. Learn how to grow your network and net worth. Hear from exciting guests and more. My name is Dylan Schmidt and welcome to Digital Podcaster. Welcome back to the podcast, Zach. I'm so glad you're here. Yeah, excited to be here. Pumped for round two. Yeah. And this is round three of this trying to record this podcast because it just dropped. So you were saying, and before the interview just tech glitched, it happens to even professionals like us. People are like, "It happens just to me." No, it happens to the most experienced. So you were just saying how you just started using ChachiWT for your podcast, analyzing your podcast audience. I would love to hear more about that.- Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So, so Christo did a training on this. I'm in his pro group and I've seen a lot of people start using PodSound School, a few people. And I played around with it a little bit, but I was like, I don't know about this.'Cause some people are afraid, hey, AI is gonna replace me. Everything I'm seeing though, it's just gonna make you 10 times more effective. Like I went in and I was like, hey, my podcast is really just hobby. Like I have really high ticket clients, their priority. But I like to talk, I like to create content. And so I'm doing that. And it's like, "Hey, analyze my podcast audience." Analyzes and I read it, I'm like,"That's actually who I'm trying to reach. So, okay, that's good." And then it's like, "Okay, well, give me 10 episode ideas. What should my 10 next episodes be?" And it gave me some, you know, three, maybe four of them were pretty good. It's like, "Okay, cool." And picked one, recorded it for five minute Fridays this morning and just started doing that. And after that, it's like, "Okay, give me a title for this. And here's the context." And they gave me that. And it's like, "Okay, here, give me a description for this episode. Here's the things that I talked about." in like two sentences and it gave me great description. And actually I think the first time it wasn't great and it's like, rewrite it more concisely, more powerfully. And it rewrote it and it sounded almost exactly like me. It's like, hey, perfect. Like copy and paste, like it's amazing what it can do.- And how did you feed it your episode information?- Yeah, so for that, I find chat GPTs, it's a lot more intuitive than, from what I'm hearing than other AI tools for sure, but a lot more intuitive than you think. Like lately I've started doing, and this was just yesterday, but I was like, hey, I wanna A/B test my thumbnail or my video titles for YouTube for clients that's the service we provide. And so if I can get tools that help that in any way, I'm all for it. So I took my videos and I said, hey, analyze this video from this channel, put in my video name, channel name, and it pulled it up exactly. And it's like, here's a summary. I was like, oh, that's really cool. okay, give me a better title for that video. And it gave me a title and it's like,'cause you have to use your expertise. Like here's five title options. It's like one of those is okay. It's like rewrite these and give it some sort of information. Like rewrite these to go viral on YouTube. It was one of the ones I did. And then two of them are really good. And it's like, hey, I'll just A/B test this. If it works better than what I'm doing, like it's you learning how to speak to the AI because it knows a lot more than you do just 'cause of the information recall. but yeah, it's just, you don't really have to learn. It's not like coding. You just have to play with it really and learn how to speak its language.- Yeah, yeah. And it's funny you mentioned that too. It makes me think of how people talk about AI and they're like, you know, it's very polarizing of course. Some people are like, this is, rightfully so. Like most people, we're all just like a little scared, hesitant, like, is this something we should be using? Is it good? Is it bad? Is it gonna destroy us? help us. And one of the things people I see are they're just like, "ChatGPT sucks. The outputs suck." And it's just funny because, like you mentioned, you have to train yourself a little bit on how to use it to get the good outputs. And then there's a little bit of a learning curve. And even with the learning curve, just like creativity and writing, it doesn't totally replace the need for that, thankfully, or at least yet. I think you just put it so well on how you use Chattopty because a lot of people will just put something in and then as soon as it gives something out, it's like, "I'll take that"'cause I trust it more than me." It's like you still have to have that trust with yourself. Oh, go ahead. No, please.- I was just gonna say, one thing that, and I just integrate this in my brain and I forget that he even said it, but Chris said that each thread is its own, almost like unique person. He didn't say it that way, Like if you want to get a good output and you want it to say, sound like you, before you start doing anything, give it something of you to analyze. Say, analyze this video, transcribe this video. Analyze like, so actually I used a tool, I think it's a YouTube digest. And so it transcribes your YouTube videos. And I copied like the first two minutes of the transcript. It's like, analyze this. And so I analyzed it and I was like, tell like, summarize what my style is. So it did that. So it learned what my style is. And I was like, write me a description based on my style or based on my audience. So it's a learning in that particular chat what you want from it. So the first things I'm getting, I'm like, they really aren't that great. It sounds like somebody else. But as you feed it information about you, then it can mimic what you want, but you have to teach it what you want.- Yeah, yeah, that is such a great point. You might appreciate this and you are incredibly busy. So I don't, you probably didn't see this. I posted and it got some good traction. So I took Alex Formosy's top performing videos on social media. Did you see that? Yeah. Yeah, I like that one. And then I'll just briefly say it, just for those listening, it transcribed, I used PullTube, which downloads the videos. I just downloaded an audio only version. Then I used Mac Whisper, which is a free transcription tool. it's the words from the videos. And then I input that in the chat, GBT, and I asked for the common themes, the structure of the videos, and then broke that down into a seven or eight part framework. And it is really cool, because there's different frameworks for copywriting, marketing, problem, agitate, solution. And it's just cool to see. And to me, it's just so cool for pattern recognition. Cause it's so easy to like, especially for ourselves, like we do what we do, but we can't always, we're in it. Like we're the, you know, creative and analyze at the same time. Do you have this anal now, this partner that can analyze how you do things, how you say things, how you can improve things, what's missing, what, you know, not that you have to do everything, but it's like, it's a, it's very, yeah, it's very cool. I got to ask you because, um, in my brain I was like, I'm going to start the episode asking you this, but, um, now we're already in. So when you spoke on the podcast last time you were doing video podcasts I know things have changed a bit. Do you mind just filling us in kind of like what you're doing now? Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. So last year had Evan Carmichael invest in the business. So if you don't know him you can look him up on YouTube but he's got his main channel I think has three point six million subscribers. He has about a dozen channels though and then pretty much anybody he brings on the show he's helped in some capacity on YouTube so he's been doing it for how long 20? 12, 15 years or just like in general. Oh I've always heard of like Evan Carmichael like as far as like coming into the marketing world. So I mean he he's in business first built a business sold a business pretty successful that way doesn't like He doesn't really talk about that a whole lot. He's written three books, but I mean, he started in YouTube really early. I'm trying to remember, I think 2008, maybe. Took him a long time. I think he said it took him 800 videos before he inspired himself with his own content. So I mean, he's made a few thousand videos at this point. And his team, a lot of people look at his content and they're like, why would you make that content?'Cause he's kind of DJing other people's content. He has team cutting and he's like, I make these videos to inspire me. This isn't just like, I'm not just saying, hey team, make videos that go viral so that I can make money. He's like, when he was down, when he was doing his company and he wanted to quit, he was looking at people like Steve Jobs and he was learning from other people and he's like, that's what got me from literally quitting my business to selling it for enough that I can do the things that I do. And so he's like, I do this for me so that I can level up, but I know it helps other people as well. So it's really cool that way. And he works with, so the areas he's in is thought leaders, educators, entrepreneurs, podcasting fits under that because it's long form. And so for that area of YouTube, because people are like, oh, I'm posting on YouTube. It's like, okay, but like if you go to certain channels, they'll tell you search is the best. And it is for certain types of content, but we play the recommended or suggested game because for long form, that is like, you have to know what you're doing there. And so for education, for podcasting, for long form, I don't know of anyone that has more data than our team. Just on Evan's channel alone, I think we've done 30,000 A/B tests. So we've got a lot of data. But yeah, so things have just completely changed. Like I'm doing a lot more of the things I like and working with world class clients. So it's a lot of fun. So you're doing, if you had to ask, this is my brain of 2023, Zach. If you had to ask chatGBT to like put into two to three sentences, but you were chatGBT, ZachGBT. I need a ZachGBT. What is it that you do? Like how you help people? Yeah, I like that. So I help thought leaders and educators, entrepreneurs to make long content on YouTube to grow their businesses, to get more clients and to make more money, and really to serve whatever mission they have and the impact they want to make on the world.- Sick, that's awesome, that's awesome. And so what do your days typically look like?- Yeah, so they've changed a lot. I used to offer a lot of versions of my service, and since Evan invested, he's like, nope, here's what we know works, here's what we charge, here's like, he's taking care of a lot of the stuff that I just, I have ADHD, I spiral on this. I'm like, well, how can I make that better? Or could I do, he's like, nope, this is what we do. Just go do your thing. I'm like, okay, cool, I can do that. But usually I have one to two client calls a day. Those are an hour. I meet with clients every other week, but I'm checking on clients, their backend metrics, the strategies that we're using, making sure they're working, like all that stuff every single day. Texting them or messaging them wins once a week, but it's really those calls. And then maybe if I'm looking for clients, I'll do outreach, but it's, I work a lot less and make more. Like it's just, it's amazing.'Cause I'm getting paid now for how I think and the information we have and helping their teams integrate the strategy. We'll do A/B tests for clients. And so I help set those up and run those, but it's, I used to handle channels and like post everything and do everything, but now it's teaching their teams how to do that. So it's a lot more interesting. Strategy consulting. Strategy consulting. And so you'll work with a company that they already have the video editors, the people that are making the content but maybe they don't have really up-to-date information or I know every team is also overworked as well. Is that kind of how you approach it?- Yeah, yeah, and I've worked with people just starting, but when I say just starting, they had like an audience of 500,000 and they sold a seven, eight figure business before this. And they're like, "Hey, I wanna go to YouTube." It's like, "Okay, cool, we can help you with that." But usually most of my clients are in the mid six figure range as far as subscribers on YouTube. I mean, we do have clients that are seven figures, but yeah, it's really teaching the information. Like when you're looking at a podcast or a long form video, how you get that scene and have YouTube do the work for you is very, very different than like keywords or search or anything like that. If you play that game, you're fighting for 30% of the views and you have to do the work instead of 70% of the views and let YouTube do it for you. It's kind of like AI, like we were talking about before. It's like, do you want something to magnify this or do you wanna fight and, you know, have to try to get the results yourself?- And when do you do like, is it a mixture of podcasts and video is created specifically for YouTube or do you try to work with one type or how does that?- Yeah, yeah. So there's a few of us that Evan's invested in and we all do the same thing but not really. Like we all have the thing that we're specialized in that we'd like to do. I like podcasts because if you have the grit to grow a podcast with how terrible discoverability is, either you already have video going or it's really easy to add video. It's like, hey, this is not a hard thing for you to just pop on a camera while you're recording and make sure that when you're getting the audio, you're editing the video. Like it's pretty easy that way. Usually I'm seeing a lot of podcasts on YouTube that are just uploading the audio and that does not work very well. It's like, hey, just flip that camera on. Even if it's not great, it will do a lot better because people aren't there for how good you look, how good you sound. Your podcasters should already sound great. They want to know, can you solve the problem that they have? Are you giving them information that's actually useful? Yeah, and love that. This is something that I see, and I don't really have that many people to talk about it with. So when people talk about podcasting specifically, and then you work with more high-ticket clients, something I see, and this is probably just, And this generalization is happening here. But when you come across clients that are like,"Hey, I see this as a hobby." Like for yourself, for your own podcast for example. Like how you mentioned it's a hobby. But for someone that already has maybe an audience to get them to invest in their podcast. To me, it's clear to me because there's a pathway here. And like you said, if you have the grit and you've got the dedication to it, but a lot of people have struggled with seeing the value long-term. How do you like to paint the picture or just highlight the opportunity there for clients that it is worthwhile to do and you should invest in it?- Yeah, so I mean, I'm looking for people that are already ready, usually. But if I did have to convince someone I have a client story that I usually, I mean, I don't give details obviously, but it was a client that had created content for 10 years. Amazing content, phenomenal.- Joe Rogan, it's Joe Rogan, right?- I wish. This was before Evan, I wasn't working with that level yet. But amazing content, seriously. And she came to the point where she's like, I wanna launch a book and I feel like there's, I have value here. I've talked to so many people and people that you know, like, I mean, Evan level people, like very, very high level. And it's like, okay, cool. It's like your content. And throughout the 10 years, they hadn't done anything to position themselves as an expert. And it's like, you are the interviewer. Nobody remembers you. And like, it's, so that could be a good thing if that's what you wanted, that's not what she wanted. And so if you're going to be creating content anyway, what is your goal for the content? Why are you creating a podcast? Why are you putting in the effort to create video? Why are you doing these things? If it's to be known in three, five, 10 years for something, to build a personal brand, to build your business, it's really, really easy to say, hey, let's shortcut that and not have you learn the lessons that our team has had to learn over the past 15 years. Let's just make it easy for you. And things change so frequently. So when I have access to all the high-level clients I do, I can see trends and patterns. People are like, hey, why is this going down? It's like, actually, I'm seeing that across the board, everything, it's not just you. If it is just you, we need to fix that. But everybody's seeing this right now. So something in the algorithm changed, like I don't know exactly what it is, but you don't need to worry, we'll figure it out. But you wouldn't know that if it's just you. You're like, oh my goodness, like everything's just tanking, like what's going on? But the other thing there is, too many people start with their thought leadership type content and they're like, why am I not getting clients? Why is my business like growing? It's like, well, that's thought leadership type content is, do you wanna sell a book in five years? Cool, make that, let's do that. But there's two other show types that need to come first. Like, if you want business now, you need to do something different than if you want to sell your course or like, what's the goal for the video? And you have to make sure that type of content is actually accomplishing that goal. And so talking through some of those things like, oh, well, I can waste a bunch of time creating content for a few years, or I can just ask Zach and say, hey, I want a client right now. What kind of content should I be making and how should I do it? It's like, okay, cool, we've got a framework for that. And to close the open loop for myself and everybody listening, at a high level, if you don't mind sharing, if you're open to sharing, what is if you wanted a client right now? What's the difference between that and something that's planning for five years out? Yeah, actually I'll go through all three show types right now for you. So the first one is biz dev. It's essentially plan on this episode, video, whatever it is, getting zero views. Like, if it got zero views, what value are you getting out of it? Yeah, you're hoping it gets more than zero views. But if it didn't, there still should be some sort of business value outside of that. So is this a potential high ticket?- Sounds like my YouTube journey.- There you go.(laughs) Yeah, like, like, and it's seriously, like it's have someone on and say,"Hey, are you a potential high ticket client?" Sweet, like, I'm, I wanna promote your business for an hour. And if you ask people that are like, you wanna do free promotion for me? Like, heck yeah, I'll do that. This is the CEO of a big company. Like there's someone at every company that you can get, maybe not the CEO, but it's like, hey, I just wanna interview you. Most people are shocked enough and humbled enough that they come on. You spend an hour of time with them, once, twice, maybe three times throughout. As questions are coming up, you're like, yeah, actually when I work with clients, we do this. Not in a pushy way, just whenever it comes up naturally. If it does, it should, 'cause you know what they do and you know they're a good fit. And usually at the end of the call, they'll say,"Okay, wait, you mentioned this,"like what is it that you do?" And you have a conversation that way. And so if they do become a client, you've spent an hour with them, getting to know I can trust them and them with you as well. Or maybe they're a good referral partner. Maybe they have other clients that would be a good client for you. And they're like, "You're my guy, like sweet."Like when I need some,"like I have a lot of people that need this service"and I'll just send them your way, see how it goes."- Which I have to highlight. I have to highlight just something because it's applicable here. Like I'm not a natural networker. I'm like introverted, all that stuff. But when I like connect with somebody and it's just effortless, like with you, if we lived, if I lived in Colorado, like if I was close by, I'd like be wanting to hang out in person and like, it's not like that with everybody, but when it is like that, it's easy, it's cool, it just flows. And with you, when you first came on Digital Podcast, you were like, "I didn't have any, I just wanted to talk to Zach. I'm like, "This is so cool." Everything in the first episode, like I had said, you were one of the first cool creators that came across on TikTok that I was like, "This inspires me to want to make content." And you do it in your way that makes me feel comfortable doing it in my way. But then afterwards you were like,"Hey, content clips, what's going on with that?" And signed up for content clips. And I was like, "Whoa, this is awesome and unexpected." But it wasn't like, "Oh, I want to have you on and then sell you content clips." And so it was like, we're an example of that, natural example of that, which is just how easy it could be and not like, it doesn't have to be like this thing of a wholesale's call on a podcast. Maybe it can, maybe you have a framework for that. I just saying it was effortless. Or it wasn't even, I don't know, that makes sense.- No, and that's exactly the way to do it too. When you're natural like that, when you just be yourself and you're like, "Hey, I'm just making another podcast episode, we connected and I was like,"I like what you're doing, I need it."Let's try it out, let's do it." My client loved it and it doesn't have, if you push and you're trying to be salesy, then it's all of a sudden like,"Whoa, you said you were gonna promote me, we were going to like, what's going on here? Like, hop off me, man.- Yeah, send him like a sales page link after the podcast to be like, and then there's like bonuses and timers and things like, whoa, what's going on?- Yes. - What is this? Yeah.- Yeah, and that's the problem. Like a couple of the clients I've worked with, they'll post YouTube videos. It's literally an ad. Like nobody's coming to watch an ad. Like if they see an ad, they click off unless it's on a video that they really want to watch and they'll suffer through the ad. Like, but it's, it should be natural. It should be easy. I meant to say this too. All these things I was going to say at the beginning of the episode. But our first episode, our first episode we did together on Digital Podcaster, is my most listened to episode. So hopefully it's the second most listened to. But I just want to say too, there was no advertising going on in the first episode. There's no real advertising. It's just a byproduct of conversation. Just wanted to say that before I forget. but please keep going, I'm like eating this up.- I like that, I like that a lot. And that's the thing about a podcast, it has to be something you're interested in, it has to be something that's effortless for you. If you're using this to build your business, make this the fun part of your job, make this the part that you like, and you happen to get clients. Maybe one in five people you have as a guest are gonna sign up, that's okay, that's still pretty good, and you're having fun doing it, so just be okay with that. Second show type, if this one's more for, if you have coaching services, some sort of education, knowledge base, maybe courses, things like that, groups, but you're gonna show the process. And so if I have a coach, I can't do it with my coaching clients'cause we keep that information private. Like we don't let anyone know who we're working with unless they happen to post on social media, had that happened one time. But it's, show the process. If you have a group, say, hey, you know, today we have in Chad, Chad is part of my group. And Chad comes on and he's like, yeah, the group is amazing, I love it. I've grown, I'm making $10,000 a month more than I was before. And you're talking about how amazing your group is without actually talking about it, you're just like, it's natural. Then you say, Hey, today with Chad, he's actually having a problem with this in his business. We're going to do a coaching call. We're going to walk them through this. I'm gonna help them solve it today. And you go through and someone who has that same, same or similar problems going to watch that. And the things they're going to learn is one, how can they potentially solve their problem? Two, you know what you're talking about. And three, you have services to sell that they could sign up for to get their problems solve just like Chad. And so if you have that kind of content, you solve all the problems the thought leadership type content doesn't solve. Like thought leadership's like, hey, here's what I think, here's how you could do this. Cool, I don't know who you are still. I don't know if or what you sell. I don't know where I could sign up. Like, it's just, it's good information. It's great, you're helping people. You could sell books later, but the show me the process is like, this isn't big top of mind thinking. this is what is Chad's problem? I'm gonna show you me solving Chad's problem so you know I'm an expert in what I do. And by the way, halfway through the video, say hey, if you want more information on coaching, just click the link in the description below or I have a free checklist that we're kind of going through with Chad. And if you want that, you can actually get in the link and then they go through your email funnel and we have frameworks for that as well. But it's like, show people the thing you sell and not in a salesy way, and it's maybe one to 10% are actually gonna buy from you, but you've given them free value. They know I can trust you and they know you sell something. So and then was there a third one or was that the third one? Yeah, that's thought leadership. Thought leadership is the third one. So that's the one most people start with. That's the, hey, here's how to do X. Here's how I do these things. It's good, but it's good to get people, like you'll take up a box in people's minds of, hey, you're the podcasting guy. It's like, oh, sweet. That's helpful, but it doesn't give you business right now. And so to recap and put a box in my brain, and yes, I'm taking notes over here, but also being in the moment. So first one, what would you call it?>> Yeah, first one's biz dev, so business development.>> And then second one is?>> Show the process.>> Show the process. And that is sharing when you say you're working with a client, but you're sharing like, "Hey, this is how I do it." Yeah. Then thought leadership is the thing you get paid for. Yeah. Got it. And then thought leadership. So I'm like definitely under the thought leadership kind of be that under that one. So say I'm like thought and thought leadership you said is the most common, right? Yeah that's where almost everyone starts and gives up because they don't build their business the way they need to. I could totally see that. I 100% could see that. And it's interesting, real quick sharing my experience, which then would be interesting to hear your thoughts on that is, so I've easily could have given up many, many of times with talking about podcasting.'Cause my personality, ADHD as well, but I am also persistent and I like to see something through or else, so I'm competitive, but then competitive with myself. And so when it comes to podcasting, yes, there's plenty of times, just like anything, it'd be so easy to give up. And then there's dips, it's not just all highs, highs, highs, as much as that would be nice. But pushing through, and then the more I've stuck with it, the more gold I get. The more people share these awesome stories with me, the more people perceive me as the expert, the more I find myself doing it for a while that I have more like, I'm always learning and it's not like I've reached this spot, but like six months into something is way different than being like a week into something. And I can see it now with other people that talk about podcasting where it's like, oh, like that's, I can like poke holes in things, and I have my own experiences and my own things with clients. So it feels like a slower thing, but it feels like investing in something that's like a, I'm blanking on the name, it's tax season, but the long-term funds, like a Vanguard, what is it, like an ETF fund or something? Yeah, like IRA. Like IRA, yeah, like a Roth IRA or something where it's like, "All right, by the time I'm 55, this is going to be incredible, hopefully. But I don't know. It's not like there's a blueprint of someone's going to be like, "Dylan, this is the future." Because there's other variables, right? Like health, life, all of these things. But yeah, so I say that just because it's getting better the longer I've stuck with it. But at the same time, it's not like,"Oh, I have Ferraris in my garage." that I would want a Ferrari. Honestly, I don't even know if I need a car. Like I just don't even drive. But I'd probably get a Tesla or some cool electric vehicle. Anyways. Or the Rivian or whatever. Yeah. Just. Yeah. So. So sharing that with you. And if I was like, I don't know, like, I don't even know if to frame anything, but just sharing that with you. Any thoughts on that? Yeah. Yeah. So I think you've- You have it spot on, that's actually it. And one of the analogies I use is like, this is thought leaderships you're investing. Like when you invest, you don't invest 80% of your income into it unless you're very, very well off. Like you've already made it, so that's good. Most of us are like 5%, 10%, maybe 20%. Like it's not very much compared to the rest. And so if, you know, I started my first YouTube channel was talking about men's clothing for muscular guys. Like that's not something I wanna talk about the rest of my life. I thought it was cool. I made a lot of free clothes. I made actually like 20 grand off of one video, which was cool. And it was with less than a thousand subscribers. So I was like, hey, there's something here. It sparked my journey. It's not something I'm gonna talk about forever. I still like clothing, but like I work at home and I just don't care as much anymore. So that said, I don't wanna sell a book on that in five years. So thought leadership, what is it that you believe now? What do you think you want to be in five years and create content around it? You're going to learn who you are. you're going to learn those things. Maybe you're already in a spot where that's solidified and it'll lead to that book or that podcast dealer or whatever, but the rest of it should be focused on what are your problems now? Like, do you have enough clients? If you're not overwhelmed with clients and making enough money, then you should probably focus on biz dev or show the process. Like these other two, you could very, very easily hop on. And you're doing podcasts, you post these on YouTube? Trying to remember. I did I haven't like posted every well I didn't post every episode of like I'm not this will be episode some around 137 138 and There was like some spot where I just didn't but then I would say that I think though I think the last like 30 40 episodes have been consistently I know they've been consistently about I forget if it's been like 30 or 40, but yeah, I do upload them now Yeah, so uploading them. They're making the podcast. I mean When you are doing content clips, I know you do the clips do you do any kind of consulting or like any kind of strategy or anything else other than just the You know the clipping of that like do you have any sessions where you're talking about that? Yeah, so well, I do podcast consulting and I have podcast Academy okay, but it's not something that like I've Well, basically with content clips it it's eight months old but it took off so fast that it really quickly became such a thing that it was like, "Oh, this is now as far as number one, as far as my income goes." And it was like the path to scalability was there rather than figuring out, "Okay, how am I going to position all of these things? How am I going to improve the completion rate of Podcast Academy?" That of course takes, it's almost in a way kind of like when I look at the frameworks, kind of falls into thought leadership a little bit because it's a slower process as well. And I've been able to help a lot of people through that, but it's not like there's a lot of a creating of "why now" for signing up for something like Podcast Academy. And if there's not a reason to sign up now, most people are just like, "I'm going to get to that." And I've heard that so many times, of course, like, "I'm going to get to that." And instead of me creating a proper launch for it in this current time, I've just been like, it hasn't needed to be a priority to like fill that from like an income stance of me. So I've closed enrollment for it. And I've just been like, basically doing podcast consulting, but also content clips. So yeah, I just rebuilt podcast Academy. It's like so robust now 300 plus like, exercises for every area. it's like so in depth and frameworks, it's like templates and all this stuff. That is possible because content clips. It's not like I would have had that, you know, availability to do that.- Yeah. On like, so all the lights going off in my head, but one thing I would say for here is if you have someone that's like, hey, I'll get to that eventually. One thing you could do, you can make it a podcast segment. You could also put it on YouTube, but like, hey, let me just give you a free session. Like, I don't care if you ever work with me or not. I just, I really love what you're doing. I want to see you win. Could we do a half hour, an hour session for free? I'll make content out of it. So that's what I'm getting out of it. But I really do want to help you. And maybe they won't always say yes, but if they do, you give them, just treat them like they paid for the session. This is what I do when I have clients, like potential clients come on. I give them an hour long free strategy session. And by the end of it, they're like, okay, where's the pitch? Like, this is freaking amazing. I was like, what do you mean? Like, well, are you gonna pitch me? I'm like, well, no, like I told you, I just, I wanna help. It's like, okay, well, how can I work with you then? What do you, how much, tell me, I want to, I wanna, and you give the secret sauce away, and they want more'cause they realize all the things that they're missing out on. So even if it's like, hey, you're a good potential consulting client, and you're at the, like, they'll come up with questions at the end, and maybe they're just like, hey, like, I really wanna do consulting, I don't think I can afford it. It's like, hey, well, I've got the Academy, it's a lot less expensive, just, you know, here's a discount for you. I really want to see you win. And all of a sudden you have more passive income coming in. You have content on the podcast, you have content on YouTube and you have money coming in your pocket because you're helping people and doing what you love anyway. That's such a great point and something that you highlighted that I've part of the success of content clips has been how it's been set up in the beginning and it's been slow. So like I don't, I can't work with everybody because the way our system is in like I am not in trying to get rich quick overnight. Like I want it to be like sustainable longterm and I want to have like it set up in a way that's not stressful and like causing me, you know, like all these problems. And I, so it's not just me. People always think it's just me making the clips because they're like, they're like, they'll respond to the emails that are like automated or an editor or someone on the team will send like Dylan this. I'm like, it's whatever. I never really correct them. Yeah. Um, but, uh, Yeah, but like part of the process has been like, there's a bit of qualifying involved. Like I hop on a call with them, but they can't just like pay me right away, you know, like, because then it's then I have to refund them if I'm like, is this a good fit? So there's like just a little bit of a pause to it. So I can be like, learn, but during that kind of discovery call, which I don't call it a discovery call, but basically is and it's, it's kind of just like what their needs are. Because again, I'm genuinely trying to figure out if this is a client. Because I've refunded a couple of clients of just saying, "Hey, this isn't a good fit, and these are the services I would recommend you check out." It's not anyone's fault, it's just how we can help people best. And that pause though has also just made me feel more confident because I'm not trying to be like,"Hey, buy this thing." Because it's just coming from such a place of integrity. And on those calls also though, is like talking about strategy and then they realize how much they don't know or how far they're behind and what their goals are of like doing things naturally. So hearing you say that is like, so like, like a light bulb moment of like, yes, because you know, we think we've given giving away all this content in the podcast and, and, you know, Instagram, Tik TOK, whatever. And we are like, there is a lot of value in that, But I'm sure that you've learned with your partnership with Evan is like, there's so much more when it's one-on-one and it's directed at you. Like the value of just our conversation. You know, if this was me listening to something on a podcast, it's one thing, but it's faster, you know, when it's like straight laser focused at you. And I don't, you know, if you haven't experienced that, if you're listening and you haven't experienced that, I urge you to like find those kinds of situations, put yourself in those situations. Now they have to take everything. It's not like chat, GPT, where everything he gives you, you have to use, but you know, do a gut check and like, oh, this is in alignment and everything like feels good here and do your research. So yeah, that is, I love that. So kind of how you're suggesting that too, of like doing some content with people that say that, say not right now is the second part of the framework, which is like show the process, right?- Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And one thing that came up when you were talking about that is like if like consulting is, people want to pay for access. Like you can give it all away. Like even we went through the three call types, but the light bulb, I didn't see it go off in your brain until I was like, you can do this like this. And like, oh, it makes sense now. Like I gave you the information, but you didn't know how to apply it to you. And so you're showing the process, the people in the video that you're talking to that could potentially become clients for one of your three services are getting all these light bulb moments of like, oh, I need that, I need that, why am I not doing that? Like, okay, if this is what free looks like with Dylan, what does paid look like? Like, I need access. Someone's watching it, they're like, oh, I'm just like Chad, like, I have that problem, but mine's a little different. And so I think Dylan would give me a different answer. And mine's a little different there too. And it's like, I think some of these would work. Like I know Dylan knows what he's talking about. So if I have more time or more money than time and I just want to fast track this, I'm going to hire you. If I'm struggling to make it and I'm not able to pay you anyway, I'm going to DIY it and you don't want to work for me as a client anyway because I would be really needy and it'd be too expensive and like it's just all the wrong fits. So you weed out people, you get warm leads that know I can trust you and you're getting content out of it at the same time. Like I have a buddy that has 20,000 subscribers on YouTube. He actually just sent me his book that they published, but they did nine figures in sales last year from leads just from YouTube off of 20,000 subscribers. So it's like, you can build--- A category.- That's real estate.- Real estate, okay.- So yeah, so--- Which to me, I'm not like super familiar with real estate. So to me, I'm like, how does that even happen?'Cause it's like, what do you sell houses through?- Yeah, yeah, selling houses through videos basically. I mean, you create content showing you know you're an expert and so if you wanna move to some area, you're like, okay, well, I don't know any realtors there, I'm moving, I don't know any people there, I'm moving and so if you see a video of someone saying, hey, here's the best neighborhood for this, here's an area you wanna avoid, if you like this, live here, you're like, oh my gosh, like, I've just narrowed down my area that I wanna live in because of this guy, like, can I call them? And they do and they sell houses to you, Like, so that works and same with everyone's services can work that way. If someone is in need of a service, they have to have someone they know, I can trust before they're gonna pay you. And you're scaling your time with a podcast, with YouTube. I prefer YouTube because of the discoverability, but either way, like you are bridging so much of that gap and doing so much of that sales work by doing it once and posting it.- Got it, and so the biz development, here I'm going back through the, Just using me as an example, how to kind of concrete it into my brain, thought leadership makes sense, show the process, biz development. Could you tell me the slight differences of how that would be different than thought leadership?- Yeah, so for biz dev for you, maybe you're trying to get a podcast consulting client. Maybe you find a podcast on the top 100, You know that like you see things they're doing wrong, things they could do better. And you say, "Hey, I love your podcast."Can I have you on the show?" And get to know them, get them to like and trust you. Like really make it about them. 98% is about them. 2% here and there. If they bring up something in one of the questions you asked, you're like, "Yeah, actually, it was my clients."When we're talking about podcasts,"this is kind of what we try." And just little hints, like 1% or 2% hints. Maybe they want to work with you, maybe they don't. You get good content with it, but also you're building a relationship with this person. So if they feel like they need someone like you, you're the one that they think of, you're top of mind. Or someone like me, like I help people with YouTube podcasts, but audio only podcasting is different. Like the algorithm's different, how you're tied, like a lot of things are different. Where you're putting ads, how you're getting sponsored, making money, a lot of it's different than YouTube. So if I have clients and I'm like,"Hey, I need someone, they need a podcast strategy consultant or help that way, I am a good connection for you in that way because I can send clients to you. So if you find people like that, like okay, who offers services complementary to mine, but their clients probably need my service and you're going to create a relationship with them through a podcast. Again, it's like, if you get zero views, that's fine. But the cool thing there is, could potentially be a referral partner for me. So it's the business relationship that you're after, not the views.- So similar to using podcasting as a networking tool kind of thing.- Yeah, 100%. Except you're a little more targeted in this is building my business. It's not like, "Oh, hey, that's a cool person. I just want to know them." It's like, "Okay, what benefit do I get here and do I benefit them as well?" It's not a selfish thing. It's how can we all help each other grow each other's businesses.- Yeah, I love that. And I love how collaborative you are in general because, I don't know, my perception is that some people, nobody that I've had on the show or else they wouldn't have come on the show, but people just sometimes, like in the podcasting space, this happens in every industry, every category I know, but some people are just like, "Oh, there's competition," or it's, "Oh, it's this." It's like, we can all learn and grow from each other. There's no shortage. There's a shortage of help for sure. If everybody flipped on the switch was like, I need help with, you know, YouTube, with podcasting, with all this stuff. We would be understaffed, of course, you know, and so it's like, I just love the collaborative spirit. One last thing, which is not related to anything we've been talking about, but on the first episode, you mentioned you had 22 microphones. Has that number increased, decreased, or stayed the same? That number has decreased significantly. Most of the microphones I had, I was sent from brands that I wanted to work with. I've purchased one microphone since then. It's my most expensive microphone. Which one is it? It's this guy right here the Electro Voice RE27. It's like the RE20 but it has adjustable mid treble and bass. So I like it a lot. It's clear. It's still I like the proximity effect. This doesn't have it. So I have a Heil PR40 that I still kept. I love like when you get on It's just like really deep and boomy, but it's a little muddy. So this is clear and still a little deep, but I had a lot of friends, family, people I know that they're like,"Hey, I wanna start a podcast."What do I do?" I was like, "Here's a microphone, just start." And I think I've sent that to at least six people, I've sent microphones. So it's, I just been giving away, I got most of them for free from companies or I got paid to make content or whatever. And so I'm just like, "Hey, it's not affecting me at all." I could sell it. I've tried selling some of them. I still have some of them for sale, but if someone's like, "Hey, I need a better microphone." I'm like, "Yep, here you go." Cool, like I've given away, I don't know,$1,500, $2,000 for the microphones. So yeah, it's gone down significantly, but I did keep some of the nicer ones, like Blue Baby Bottle SL, I kept. Heil PR-40, this one. Heil PR-37 is like sleeper microphone for podcasts. If people want a good like, it's like 270 bucks, but it can be handheld and you can take it with, it's a sleeper microphone. So yeah, it's gone down a lot.- You're the person to know, like during Christmas time, everyone's like, you know, people in like, if they do content around you, they're like, what's that gonna give me for Christmas?- Yeah, like, do I get a podcast set up? My brother has like traveled, like literally backpacked across the world, like on like no money, just like hitchhiking down through South America for like two months. And he's like, I wanna start a podcast. I wanna tell some of my stories. It was like, dude, on your, like he moved across the country from Idaho to, oh, I'm gonna get it wrong, like not Pennsylvania, anyway, East Coast. It was like, dude, on your way, stop here, we'll get you set up and gave him a full setup. And he's like, sweet, I'm gonna do it. It's like, I wanna see people win. Like I love podcasts. If you love the same thing I love and I can help, then I'm more than happy.- Yeah, you're gonna have people hate you in your DMs, like cozy up to you. Hey, this is a client. And then they're just like, can I have a mic? So how can people work with you? Yeah, so I work with only a small handful of people. More than happy to hop on a call, see if it's a good fit though. People can connect with me on LinkedIn, pretty responsive there. So Zach Mitchum. I'm working on building out my site. I was, I think when we talked last, I was We Are Video Makers. Evan's like, if you want to be a personal brand, be a personal brand. So everything's going under Zach Mitchum dot com. So hopefully the site's built up better by the time you find it than it is now or branding with video podcast, wherever you like to listen to podcasts.- Awesome, thank you so much for joining me again, Zach.- Yeah, absolutely, I love it.