Can Obscure Content Marketing Help You Stand Out in a Cluttered Market?

In this podcast episode, Dave Loomis and Steve Miller discuss the concept of obscure content marketing (OCM) as a way to break through the clutter of regular content marketing (RCM). They share examples and strategies for creating personalized and targeted content that resonates with individual recipients. They emphasize the importance of building relationships, understanding customer preferences, and providing genuine value. The episode also includes a lighthearted conversation about Dave's wedding anniversary and Steve's lost wedding ring. Overall, the episode offers insights and practical tips for marketers looking to stand out and connect with their audience.

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Follow Dave:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidloomis/

Get Dave's book: Marketing Is Everything We Do

Interested in learning how Voice of the Customer can grow your business? Contact Dave: dave@loomismarketing.com

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Follow Steve:
https://www.linkedin.com/in/steveamiller/

Get Steve's bestselling book: Uncopyable: How to Create an Unfair Advantage Over Your Competition

Want to learn how to generate more business without spending a ton of moolah, and separate yourself from the competition? Steve's online presentations and consulting will make you UNCOPYABLE! Contact him: stevem@beuncopyable.com

Transcript

Can Obscure Content Marketing Help You Stand Out in a Cluttered Market?

Dave: Don't forget that I am THE Dave Loomis, also known as The Voice. 

Steve: Thank you for reminding me of that because I want to make sure we get that. We do definitely get that in there, okay? You ready? Hey everybody, this is Steve Miller, better known as Kelly's Dad, marketing gunslinger and not the rock star.

Welcome to the B2B Marketing and Sales Podcast. It's almost getting boring. That I'm able to just have that roll off my tongue 

Dave: anymore. Do you remember the old days when you couldn't 

Steve: say it? I stumbled through it. I called it all kinds of different names and confused Google to no end. But but so here we are and I am with my and one podcast is that it's not always, we're not always together every time.

Dave: Okay. Yeah, that's really cool, isn't 

Steve: it? It's it is cool because, we also, we have lots of friends that we both know and we are now interviewing these people. We have lots of BFFs, you people out there. If you have something to say to our BFFs, let us know because because we might put you right on here but Mr.

David Mayo Loomis, and as always, Those of you on video can now see that I'm holding up this really good book. What's it called? It is called Marketing is Everything We Do and boy is that's one of those platitudes that you know when you wake up in the morning and you're doing your meditation you should say that to yourself every single morning.

Marketing everything we do and get the book, read the damn thing. And I've got Mr. David Mayolimas on here, and like I say, we're not together all the time anymore, which makes this... That much more special. It really does. And today. Oh my gosh. I am actually very excited about this topic today because I, we think about these topics for weeks and we think of topics, we've put them on the table.

We throw most of the ideas away and we bring it takes forever to come up with the stuff. I'm lying. I'm completely lying. But Mr. Loomis, he just, he nailed it. He nailed it for today. I said, what should we talk about? And I am going to now... Hand it over. And I'm going to say, Mr. Loomis. 

Dave: Yes? What are we talking about today?

Funny you should ask. Today, I know you're on the edge of your seat every morning. 

Steve: I am. I am like the cat who ate the cheese and waited outside the mouse hole with bated breath. But, 

Dave: let's face it. We probably named this... We will name this podcast... By this name, probably. So whoever's listening clicked on it and probably saw the name.

In, unless you're 

Steve: I would if I saw this, I would click on it to 

Dave: listen to it too. So this is a obscure content marketing. We call it OCM. Yeah. It has to have an acronym and we have to use the acronym a lot. And just assume that everybody else understands what We're turning this 

into 

Steve: an industry wide acronym.

Oh, 

Dave: absolutely. OCM and the power of OCM. Obscure Content Marketing. Why? Why would we want to talk about obscure content marketing? Why? That's a great question. You know what? I think... It's been around long enough that everybody knows like what sort of regular content marketing is. R cmm, right?

How boring is that? Okay, let's do another blog post and hope that a lot of people read it and click on it and you know it's been around. How 

Steve: about infographics? Can I re, can I retitle that? Sure. You said regular content. Mark, can I call? Yeah, I can I call? Can I call it.

Everybody does this content marketing. 

Dave: What's the acronym for that? 

Steve: E. T. No, 

Dave: EDTCM. EDTCM. Yeah. I like it. Yeah. Everybody does this content marketing. Okay. And because of that, your inbox and every other kind of media that you consume is probably Overwhelming you with that kind of EDTCM, right? It's just, it's, and how much time do we even have in the day to consume that much content?

So I think one of the things that we have to do as marketers, B2B marketers, is we've got to We got to find some different things to do and that's where OCM comes in, right? 

Steve: Obscure content. For those of you that are not watching the video. Obscure content marketing. Dave is referring to his notes.

Dave: Yeah I can't, I have to. I have to look down and say OCM. I know. I, yeah, I'm sorry. My notes. Exactly. Go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead. Steve's laughing. I am. It's very 

Steve: funny. 

Dave: That's what I'm thinking about what we can talk about. So we promised not to talk about any typical or regular.

Or everybody does this content marketing. 

Steve: Because you know what? You know what else? You know what else I'm going to say about that? All the other podcasts are talking about the, everybody does this boring content marketing. That might have to be changed again. It's that everybody's doing the same shit and I'm sorry for using that word.

No, 

Dave: I'm not. No, I'm not. That's okay. That's okay. No apologies. No apologies here. 

Steve: I hope it doesn't change our rating on listen. 

Dave: No, I think it's fine. I think it's fine. Steve, why don't you kick us off by giving us an example of something that is not. Yeah. EDTB for boring content marketing. 

Steve: Yeah, let me share something with you that I have used with multiple clients and especially after COVID first hit and the lockdown started, it's locked down, shut down, turned down, whatever it was because, and I have always hated just the normal everyday yeah.

Let's do an email blast, type of stuff. Or let's, we can do a video. That's a demo of our product. Okay, no. So the concept I came up with was what can we do as a marketer? Think of yourself and, most of the people we're talking to are in the B2B world, and so we are selling to, selling and marketing to another person who represents a company.

Dave: We're not just selling to a company, we're actually selling to a person? 

Steve: Shockingly, that is the truth. That's crazy. Yeah, whoever called this B2B marketing? Because actually 

Dave: They missed the boat, it really should be named, renamed. 

Steve: And in fact, and this might actually be, this actually might be another discussion, but in fact, we, in the B2B world, actually have more it's more important for us to be selling to a person, okay because that person is going to be responsible for choosing somebody to help them and it's usually a much more long term relationship.

This is not, it's not a consumer product, okay? So B2C really is not relationship building. B2B is very much relationship building with a person, okay? So I started thinking about, okay, if I'm the person, if I'm trying to help that person on the other side, If I'm a supplier, the typical thing for me to do is to just simply tell them, here's who we are.

Oh, we make this widget and we make it better than anybody else. Here's why we make it better than anybody else. And, we, and we will deliver it to you on time. We will do, and we'll do all this stuff. Okay. And everybody is talking about. themselves. Yeah. Now I started asking the question, what else is this person concerned about?

Certainly that's important. If they have a project, if they have a hurdle, if they have a challenge that our product. can help them with, certainly they are concerned about that, but that, but then all the other suppliers are going to be talking, and they're all talking the same type of language that we would be talking, if we have that approach.

Is this making sense? So 

Dave: far, so good. We don't want to be me too. We want to break through the clutter. That's the idea of Obscure 

Steve: content marketing. That's right. We want to be different. We, in, they're not going to buy from you because you're similar to the competition.

They're going to buy and they're not going to buy from you necessarily just because you're better than the competition, but they will buy from you if you are different from the competition and different in a way that is meaningful, valuable relatable. All this stuff. So anyway, here's the idea I came up with.

I started asking myself, what else are these people worried about? So so maybe somebody that you are trying to sell to is also concerned with, I don't know. They're also in charge of customer service or maybe they're, maybe they are part of what they are doing is they have a staff.

Of people who work under them. They might not be involved in sales, they might not be involved in marketing, anything like that, but they have a staff, they have people who report to them, so they are concerned about leadership. See what I'm saying? 

Dave: Not yet, but I'm 

Steve: ready. If that's what they're concerned about, then why don't we get, let's say leadership.

So why don't we help them be better leaders? So what I had my clients do, and I'm still doing, I've got clients now still doing this movement ahead, is using video, which is a great tool to use. But we would go out and we would find people who wrote, who were experts on leadership, who wrote books, bestsellers on leadership, professional speakers, who are in demand speakers around the world about leadership, and we would hire them.

To do a brief, a short, 30 minute conversation about leadership and we would, we would teach them ahead of time of, okay, this particular company is this guy is in charge of their company has a whole fleet of trucks. They're a big delivery company or they're a big 

Dave: landscape.

So the company, yeah. And the person, yeah. In the buyer it's a company from a truck fleet or widgets or whatever. And, so leadership is not like in the bullseye that other competitors are telling, they're sending the the other kind of content marketing, the boring content marketing, that person, just the usual stuff.

Yes. And we're actually making them better at their careers and jobs. And 

Steve: we're saying, Hey, look, we're going to give you all that, all the information about why our trucks, are best for you. But while we're doing that, you know what? We're also going to help you be better leaders because that is something you are doing every single.

Dave: Now, you have done this or it's an idea? Oh no. 

Steve: I've been doing this for several 

Dave: years. Okay, and can you say what's an example of a reaction that afterwards that, that this person that, that. No, is it 

Steve: the reaction that, it, the reactions, I've done this with multiple clients.

Okay. The reactions are always the same. The reactions are this. is amazing. Okay. You're in you're interviewing people and you're telling, you're giving us information about how to be a better leaders or for example everybody wants to be more productive in their day to day work, right?

Definitely. So we've gone out and we found productivity experts who then come in and teach productivity. Tips and systems 

Dave: and stuff like that. It's not free to your client. Is it hard to talk your client into doing this and spending the money for it? The 

Steve: very first, the very first client it, yeah, of course.

First client it was, what, everybody we're talking to right now, the first guy, the first person you sold to was the hardest one to sell to. Yeah. And I will say this. And Mr. Loomis is in this as well. We are both authors.

Authors like each other. Authors will respond to other authors. And what I've been able to do is I've created this system, and I, and, again, go out and do this. Steal this idea, I'm not trying to keep it proprietary to myself. What I will go to authors, who authors and speakers.

like productivity people, leadership people, right? I will go find people and I will say, hey, I would like to hire you to come and talk to this group, right? It's not going to be a huge group, right? You guys might be used to talking to a thousand people in your audience. But this one, there's going to be 50 people, maybe a hundred people in the, in this audience.

Okay. But they are clients of this company. And I would like to interview you for 30 minutes and I will pay you. And I create, I put a dollar sign out there. Okay. For them. That is a fraction, a small fraction of what their normal speaking fee is. Okay. But what I'm saying to them is number one, this is brain dead.

You're going to sit in your home. And you're gonna do, and you're gonna do this with me, and in 30 minutes, you're done, I'm gonna send you a check, and you just, you made fun money. 

Dave: I like it. I like it. I think it's a good, it's a great... It's a great idea. It's not something that a lot of people have thought of.

I'm sure when it comes to content marketing, maybe you're the only person that's thought of it. I think I am 

Steve: the 

Dave: only person who's thought of it. It falls into the category of obscure content marketing. It definitely falls into that category. Exactly. 

Steve: Exactly. And then what I also, and what I also encourage my clients to do.

is these people are authors, right? So I encourage them to buy this person's book, a bunch of this person's books, have them assigned, and we send them out to the people who attend. Now, so what is happening now? We're sending these out to people who are working for companies. Yeah. Who may hire them.

Yeah. As a speaker or as a consultant. Yeah there's, this is a whole win situation for everybody. Okay. And like I say, it's just, it's bringing that they don't have to get on an airplane. The speakers don't have to get on an airplane. They, my guess, they don't have to plan huge, they don't have to do a lot of research to get ready.

They don't have to do any of that stuff. They don't have to prepare any presentations. I just, we just put together a series of quick questions. 30 minutes goes by. Just like that. Yep. And every single time the person on the other end, the client of my client every single time they go I 

Dave: want more.

Yeah. Yeah. I love it. I love it. Okay. That's great. All right. Here's one and I'll just I'll set this up by saying that one of the themes and threads that has run through just almost all of our conversations is that if finding your moose, you say finding your moose. I do a lot of market segmentation and there's lots of different words for it.

I've started using the term like micro niche marketing, like just the more focused we can be with our messaging, forget about the 99. 9 percent of others who, they don't care. It's the 0. 1 percent of people that are going to buy your scientific instrumentation or whatever it is. It's okay, that's a pretty focused topic.

And then within that, there's like very, very micro niche topics that scientific instrumentation geeks. want to know about, right? They want to know about, the curve of a lens or the, I don't even know, I'm not in that business, but, anybody listening, there's lots of of Very specific things that these, the engineers and scientists and things that are involved in either product management, buying putting it in, whatever application it is that they buy.

How do we reach them those people, and just talk about stuff that they love to hear about. And maybe it's not 1%, it's 0000001 percent of people.

And, I joked about, if people remember the movie Inception, if you ever saw it. 

Steve: Oh my gosh, I've seen it probably four times. 

Dave: It's hard to follow, but once you get into it, you do follow it, and you realize that it's like a story within a story. Yeah. Ironically, I'm going to mention podcasts in a podcast. 

Steve: It's like a 

Dave: Russian doll. It is. It really is because our podcast is. For B2B marketing salespeople, which is, it's pretty targeted. It's maybe not as targeted as what I'm going to say, but let's just say that we do sell, scientific instrumentation and our buyers or people that are interested in that.

So if I have a company and I'm a marketing person for this scientific instrumentation company. I have a bunch of people that almost never see, they never see the light of day, they're in the back and they may actually, in this case, be wearing lab coats. That's right. And they are toiling away.

We actually don't let them go home once in a while. They can go home for the 

Steve: dinner, but they don't want to go. They don't want to go. No, they don't. They don't. 

Dave: They want to toil. We're being general, we're generalized, 

Steve: but they don't want to, they don't want a life 

Dave: folks. These people exist and they also hold the most amazing amount of knowledge in their heads.

Incredible amount of knowledge. 

Steve: You've just you've just plused. What I was talking about. Can we just put them 

Dave: on the air? Can we just... Boom. Can you just 

Steve: put a calendar... Interview them! 

Dave: Put a calendar invite on that lab person's calendar every month. A couple different ones. And you say to them, Hey, every month at this time, come to this conference room for an hour.

And you have the recording stuff there. And you record a podcast and you ask them questions about what they do and it gets into the nitty gritty details that almost nobody in the world understands or cares about, except guess who does care about it? You're a buyer. And are 

Steve: you asking The buyer, the same people on your buyer's team.

Exactly. And are 

Dave: you asking this scientist, Hey, what are the value proposition key selling points of our product? Hell no. You're just asking them about, like, How did this come about? What was the problem you faced? How did you solve this problem when the lens thing had, Oh we had to do blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.

It's like guys, there's a coffee. There's a there's a podcast called roofer's coffee shop. Have you ever heard of it? Probably not. No, unless you're a roofer. And then you listen to it. I guarantee it because I've been interviewing roofing contractors. And there, and I said, whenever I do my voice of customer interviewing, I say, Oh, by the way, like Columbo at the end of a, episode, if anybody remembers Columbo, but, Oh, just one more thing.

What media do you listen to? Oh, I listened to that Rufus that Rufus coffee shop podcast. Oh, do you? Interesting. 

Steve: I think, yeah, I'm sorry. Bottom line. 

Dave: Put your technical people on the air, 

Steve: make them rock stars. Cause what you can do there. You just plus you plus what I was talking about.

And now I think I'm going to plus what you're talking about is that you can create a community easily create a community. Where you say you're you facilitate this. All right. Yes, and You go to your people who are these lab white coat people, right? Geeks nerds, whatever you want to call them. Okay, who have brilliant they are working on really important stuff and you can go to them and you can say, okay, it doesn't have to be once a week, it could be once a month or something like that.

And you go to them and you say, okay, on, on this date, every month, we're going to get together, right? And I'm going to, and I'm just going to come in and all I'm going to do is, either you say, you can ask your clients, you can say to your clients, what problems are your people working on?

And then you could use that question, right? You could say something like here's a problem that we're getting. We're hearing about how would you guys respond to this? Or you just simply go to them and you say what are you working on now?

You know what? And they start talking about it. And then you reach out to the client, to the people who are on the on the other end of the webinar or something like that. And you say, are any of you working on this? And they start doing this. They start talking to each other and sharing with each other.

It's brilliant stuff. 

Dave: Yeah. Yeah. And I'll give a little shout out. If anybody is interested, there's a really cool company that's been around for a few years out of Dallas, Texas called MarketScale, and they'll help produce podcasts for you and actually help you bring, help you build the community around it.

And just for B2B companies. So there's a, there's another example of micro niche, a B2B company that creates media and podcasts and things like that for, that is really interesting. That'd be very cool. So that's, 

Steve: That's another, you can take these types of ideas, you, you take ideas and it takes some of our ideas.

And ask yourself, okay I can't do that exactly. Or you just say you know what, that might work, but we could plug it in over here. And then we adjust it for that. But it, but what does it end up doing? It ends up creating an obscure content marketing tool that is highly valuable.

That, here's the thing about content marketing. I want to make sure everybody understands this. Content marketing isn't just sending content out about your company. It's not just sending content out about your products. It's sending content out to help your clients be more successful. 

Dave: Exactly.

And help educate them. It's really no different. I read this article recently and it was about how this person still cuts out physical articles from the paper and puts them in an envelope and then puts a stamp on it. With a little note that says, I really thought you'd love this 

Steve: article.

My dad used to do that almost every single day when my dad was, when he had the eight track and all the other stuff he was working on almost every single day, he would look for. In magazines, newspapers, and stuff like that. And he would cut out articles right now. And we're talking 50 years ago now, alright?

Maybe not even 50, maybe more than 50 years ago. And then he would do that. Here's what I love about what you just said. Was that this person is absolutely breaking the rules.

And I love 

Dave: it because it's old school. My mom used to up until five years ago, you'd walk into the front hall of my mom and dad's house. And on the little table, there would be two piles, one, one that's labeled Dave and one that's labeled. You're not going to believe that my sister's name is Muffy.

But yes, 

Steve: No, no comment. 

Dave: Preppy handbook. So yeah, they would be these articles. No, seriously, it is. And my mom's name was Bunny. 

Steve: And we're, you know what, we're going in a direction where it's going to have to be a different podcast. How your parent how your family got their 

Dave: names.

Yeah, exactly. That's obscure content marketing too. But yeah, go old school. Go 

Steve: old school. I love that. Oh my God. Cut out a physical article. Oh 

Dave: my God. Put a little note and get a little pen of paper that says From the desk of Yeah. and your name. That's right. And 

Steve: then . And even if it goes to, other, to, to multiple people.

Then go Xerox it. CC it. Go Xerox. No, don't cc, this is not email. We are talking about Xerox it real mail. Go Xerox it. For those of you who are not seeing me, I'm quote mimeograph it quotes, yeah. Go mimeograph it. And then send it out to everybody. And all my dad would say was I saw this article and I thought of you.

That's all my dad would say on the note. Yeah, of course. And send it to the people. And I have a client who, he's in the manufacturing world and he is big time in the manufacturing world, all right? Years ago, I found out he, he loves roses. He has a garden full of roses. And I'll tell you, every single time I have found articles.

Or information videos or stuff like that about roses. I sent it to him. Sometimes it's in the mail. Sometimes 

Dave: email. Yeah, and this is that's the mic. The most micro niche is a a segment of one for sure. 

Steve: Okay. Keep going. Cause 

Dave: I'm going to share with you something I brought that 

Steve: I learned from somebody else.

So go ahead and just keep going. 

Dave: This is the problem with regular, boring, whatever the content marketing, whatever that the letters that we said every day, typical content marketing. It's because people are hitting the easy button. What they're doing is creating content that they think will appeal to as many people as they can that are in their database.

Okay. And they're blasting it out and then when they're finished writing or they have their agency write the blog post, or maybe they have ChatGPT write it now, they're finishing it and they're heaving a sigh of relief when they push send and they're like, I've got that checked off my list now. I hope maybe a couple people respond to that.

And if you're on the receiving end, you know exactly what you just got. You basically just got pretty much generic content, and now you're really actually suspicious that ChatGPT wrote it, because it's probably written pretty well. 

Steve: If you read my stuff, and then you read ChatGPT's stuff, you know I didn't write it.

Dave: Exactly. Exactly. I think that we're going to go into a period where people are intentionally going to write poorly just so that it comes across as authentic. But when you send somebody like. for a bourbon cocktail because you know they love bourbon. That's a hell of a lot different than saying, I'll bet sustainability is on your company's mind right now.

Look, here are three things you can do to get your staff aware of sustainability. Or 

Steve: if we take a step, step up on that, we even say, okay, they know we know they love bourbon. Yep. And

we sent them a bottle of bourbon with a new recipe. Yeah. On a drink. And see, you don't treat it like, oh, I'm sending you this gift. No, you, what you do is you say, I read it. I heard about this new recipe for this drink. Here's the note, right? I found this out because you and I both love bourbon, right?

That's what you're saying to the person. You and I both love bourbon and I got this recipe. It's amazing. So here you go. Yeah. Thought of you. Try this out. Thought of you. Thought of you. Here's this out. Now, I'm going to give you, I'm going to give you what I consider to be the most amazing piece of advice I ever got that I have never used.

Dave: Buy low, sell high. 

Steve: Regarding marketing. Oh, to a, to an audience of one. 

Dave: Okay. Okay. All 

Steve: Okay. And and of course I have to give credit where credit is due to my buddy Nito Cobain. Oh, Nito. Nito. Yeah, he's Nito. Who is, yeah, 

Dave: he's the he's the the university guy, high Point President 

Steve: Of High Point University.

Here's the thing. Okay. I've known Nito for over 30 years. We met through the speaking industry. We became good friends. He is like up on a level that I dunno, I'll never see. But but as Nito and he's, I don't want you want to tell you. Yeah. Yeah. Just look at Nito Cobain.

I might stick 

Dave: it in the notes. What is his what is his advice? This was 

Steve: unbelievable. I'm having a, I was in a meeting with him down in high point and and he said, Hey, Okay. I just came up with this really great idea about if you have a moose, one, if you have a moose, because if we look at our lit our target market, and we start and as you go up the pyramid the market gets narrower and narrower, it gets high, up, up to the top. All right, where you find the one the ones who are the best moose. He said he would write a book, self publish a book. He would have a book and he would have that's eight chapters.

So now, and for lack of a better example, I'm going to grab this book right here. Okay. Marketing is everything we do. Yeah. Now, Nito said, what you do is you take this book. And nowadays you are able to and I know he used to do it through Amazon. I don't know if the Amazon has that service anymore, but there are services out there where you can go and you can print one book.

Dave: Yeah. Actually, yeah that's still a thing. That's definitely still a thing. So what he would do, he would customize the actual book 

Steve: for the person. He would write one chapter. It was for that person title it or something like that. I don't know if he would change. I don't know how much he would change.

You could certainly do that. But the main thing he said was that chapter 1. was aimed at that person. And he would take the information that was in the rest of the book. And then he would say to the people, here is what your situation is. Here are the challenges that I know you are facing.

Here is what I'm going to be talking about in this book. And here's how you can use this book. And he would talk directly to one 

Dave: person. Wow. That is obscure content marketing at its best.

Steve: It goes back to, here's, see, one of the questions that you don't get a lot in marketing, which is really important, is how much are you willing to spend to get a customer?

Dave: Great question. Great question. If you are 

Steve: selling something that, that, or if you're selling a service or a product, let's say 500, 

Dave: 000. Oh, you're, you should be willing to spend a lot. If it's 10 cents and you have to sell like 5 billion of them in order to make money, that's tough. Oh, if it's to five different, 5 billion different, individuals that's tough.

When it costs a lot, you're willing to go above and beyond you got, you've got to, 

Steve: Tommy, that was Stu Leonard the owner of Stu Leonard grocery stores, 

Dave: grocery store. Yeah, Connecticut. 

Steve: Stu told me this. He said that he, whenever somebody walked in through the front door of his store.

He saw a sign on their forehead that said 50, 000 and he said what that meant what and he came up with that because he realized his average customer spent 100 a week at his stores and then he thought he thought to himself, okay, if that person shops at my store. 50 weeks out of the year, give them two weeks vacation.

That's 5, 000 a year. If they continue to shop in my store for 10 years, that's 50, 000. So in other words, they're not a 100 customer. They are a 50, 000 

Dave: customer. Yeah. Lifetime value of a customer is an incredible thing to understand, especially for B2B. It's not about just that one sale. It's right.

It's a, it's about the future sales. And when you add in the cost to acquire a new customer versus acquire, or just retain a current customer, then it becomes. Even more important. So also, which brings up another point, a great one, which is people think content marketing is for, getting new customers.

It's for keeping current customers, maybe even more, 100 

Steve: percent more. Yeah, 100%. So 

Dave: We can't just get people and just assume that they're going to, stick with us forever just because we have the greatest product on earth. No, we have to take care of people just like we take care of people in our family.

And our friends. And we've got to care 

Steve: 100%. And I think that that's a great place for us to end this episode. I think 

Dave: it is too. You got to care and using obscure content marketing, also known as OCM. 

Steve: We, we are going to, I'll tell you what, we are going to keep talking about this. 

Dave: Yeah, because it really fits with what we really have been saying in a lot of our for a couple of years.

We don't 

Steve: want to do the, everybody does this boring content marketing. No, 

Dave: No, we're not about 

Steve: that. No, we are not about that. Real money. So take us out of here, Mr. David Mayo Loomis. And I'm going to tell everybody on this episode that today is his anniversary, his 31st anniversary. 32nd. I was so 

Dave: close.

It's confusing when you say 32nd, it sounds like 30 seconds. That's, 

Steve: that's what I thought you meant the 

Dave: first time when you said it. I know. And actually in the card that I wrote to my wife, I started to write 31st and then I had to scratch it out and write 32nd. But fortunately I put my, the date of the actual date of my wedding on the inside of my wedding band.

I have a reference at all times. Wow. That was smart. Yeah. Just in case I didn't do that. Yeah. Anyway thank you for that. Congratulations. We're going out to a nice dinner. Yeah. I lost 

Steve: my first ring. I lost my wedding ring. My first wedding ring. That's a story that we don't need to get into.

Oh, no. I was playing golf at my class reunion. Nevermind. We're not going to talk about that anymore. 

Dave: No, we won't. All right, folks. Thanks for listening. And Steve and I will be talking for a long time now for another few minutes, but I need to hear about that because I think I'm going to hear about this class reunion story.

Anyway, folks, thank you so much. Thank you for listening. This has been great. And of course you have been listening to the B2B Marketing and Sales Podcast with Steve Miller, not the rock star, Kelly's dad, marketing gunslinger, all that great stuff. Author of Stealing Genius and Uncopyable and a Future Book.

about personal branding. Uncop make yourself uncopyable. Uncopyable you. be hearing a lot about that. You, too, can be uncopyable as a person. You should be. Own it. All right. We'll talk to you later, folks. Bye bye.