S6, E4 Twinkle Troughton | Landscape Painter

In this episode, we hear from Twinkle Troughton, whose paintings unravel the myths woven into the English landscape. Troughton explores how ideas of “Englishness” are constructed through idyllic scenery, stately gardens, and inherited cultural memory.

Her work digs beneath the surface of the so‑called “green and pleasant land,” revealing the colonial histories, class structures, and global plant migrations that shaped it. 

Twinkle also shares insights into her political and historical influences, from modern British history to intergenerational habits, and the role of satire and fable in her visual language. We dive into her 2026 Standpoint residency, where she traced the layered history of Hoxton Square’s trees, reconnecting with a place from her twenties.

Episode was recorded on 11 February 2026. 

Website: www.twinkletroughton.co.uk
Instagram: @twinkletroughton

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Website: www.artiststales.net
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Transcript

In this episode of Artists’ Tales, I'm joined by Painter Twinkle Troughton, an artist whose work unpicks the stories we inherit about the English landscape, the myths, the politics, and the quiet histories that sit beneath its surface. From the manicured gardens of stately homes to plants brought here through centuries of colonial trade, twinkle painting, invite us to look again at what we think of as quintessentially English.

Welcome Twinkle. Hi. Thank you for having me. It's really lovely having you. So I've, I've introduced you and given. A little bit of background, but could you tell us a little bit more about yourself? So, uh, I'm an artist. I currently, I'm living in Margate, my studio's in Margate. I'm currently speaking to you from a studio in Hoxton, though, where I'm currently finishing up a three month residency at Standpoint Gallery.

I was awarded the residency as at the end of my ma, which I just completed at City and Guild, um, in September of last year. And it's been a really fantastic opportunity. I've been making work responding to the trees in Hoxton Square, and I used to live in Hoxton about 20 years ago, so it's a very familiar space to me and I've come back to visit it anew and unearth some the history of the trees there and also.

Talk about my own connections to the trees there. When I lived in Hoxton, I was in a punk band called the Fairies Band. Um, and we wore fair, we fought, wore fairy wings every day. We had ripped fishnets and white stilettos, and we were raucous and wild. And the whole time I was also. Working as an artist, I would paint in my bedroom, which is like on Hackney Road, just a stones throw from Hoxton Square where I'm now.

And uh, I, yeah, just had an absolutely wild ride living in London for about 18 years. Then I moved to Margate where I. Continued to pursue my art career. I also started writing while I was living in, while I've been living in Margate, which has resulted in me somehow becoming the editor of a local hyper-local magazine there called The Margate Mercury.

But I am, yeah, I'm currently just about to hand the reins over to a new editor. Um, I just want to be able to focus my creative energies into my artwork entirely now, but that's been a wonderful. Wonderful few years doing that as well. So I guess, um, I do a bit of all sorts really, but I think it's always.

Creative endeavors, which drive me. Um, I was, I've tried to turn my hand to many different things. We even set up a record label when we were in a band called Pushing Pussy Records, and this was like in the mid, the sort of early two thousands. And the point of the record label was to champion female band members or, or band with a female, either singer or musician, or.

A manager who was female, but it had the band had to have some kind of female involvement and we put out eps and the band I was in, we also, we put out a few final records and we, we did some gigs in New York and Philadelphia and yeah, I've had like. I've, I've had a, had a very good laugh along the way and worked hard as well, but yeah, it's been an interesting few decades.

It sounds very eclectic. You know, your career, I, as you're speaking, the word that came to mind, as I said was eclectic. Sounds like you've been involved with quite a lot. Yeah, I mean, that's what I mean. I think I've, I get excited by, by various different creative outlet. I think the thing that's been a constant, and this is ever since I was a child, is painting, so that's been the thing that that I have come back to again and again in which.

Has, I guess, really has my heart. I mean, music and the band, they became my whole focus for a while and, and they were as important to me as the painting, but the painting is the thing that's always been there throughout everything that I've ever sort of turned my hand to or, or any roads that I've gone down, that's always been at the end of.

I'll get to the painting in a minute, but I'm conscious you have collaborated with Tinsel Edwards. Yep. Who I've interviewed for this series as well. So could you tell us a bit more about some of your collaborations including working with Tinsel? Yeah. Well, so Tinsel who I've done all of those project, all like who I was in the band with, along with my sister TKI and our best friend Sparkle.

I did the record label with Tinsel and myself and Tinsel also collaborated on quite a few kind of. I guess we called them like public intervention artworks, where we would, we would, I guess, become different characters like traffic wardens or, uh, what else did we do? We've done so many, it's so hard for me to remember off the top of my head, but everything would have a purpose or a political motivation or a political message to, and we'd find a way of going out there to interact with people.

And there, but there was always like an artwork at the source of it as well. So yeah, myself and Tinsel have been long time collaborators. Even like going back to when we first met, when we were nine years old, we were in a group, we were in a gang called the Yoga Gang. But even though it's got the word gang, we were just all about peace and living hippies.

And then we formed a band called the Jesus Mirrors, and we've just constantly done stuff together like that. Our whole life, since we met at nine years old. She's brilliant. Yeah, no, it sounds like quite a, a, a good and creative collaboration with, with uh, tinsel. We have absolutely inspired and driven each other creatively throughout our whole lives.

Definitely. When we lived together in London, we lived together for a long time and we would. We would put on group shows together, we would curate exhibitions together. We would always end up talking into the, into the early hours of the morning about our work. Then when we both moved out into our own separate places, we would still meet up to have like critical conversations about our work and we would both bring new work along.

And, uh, yeah, she's, she's been a huge, had a huge part to play in. In everything I've done throughout the years. She sounds like quite a big in influence for you. Yeah, definitely. I mean, we were at school together and when my dad was our art teacher, so he's also had a very big role to play. Um, but we also then went to different universities, but we ended up collaborating on our, a whole degree show.

So, uh, we ended up. Like joining forces and putting on identical ratios in each other's colleges. So. That was quite funny because we both didn't get into each other's universities, so I didn't get into Goldsmiths and she didn't get into Kingston, but we ended up having degree shows in each other's colleges anyway.

So I think that was kind of like we were having a bit of a laugh at the system by doing that, but also it was just a great opportunity to get our work seen to each other's audiences. And we were, yeah, we've been creating a whole body of work about the group we were in called the fairies. That sounds brilliant.

That sounds really quite a, a nice creative collaboration. I do wanna get onto your painting because as you've said it, it's a constant, you know, thing in your life, even though you're doing other things as well. So that seem, it seems to, you seem to cover quite a number of different topics. So I did talk about, you know, in the introduction, the theme about the English landscape.

So could you talk a little bit about that and, and you know, the myth of the English landscape. Yeah, sure. So. I've been making work kind of delving into and inspired by the English landscape, probably for about four or five years now. But going back further than that, trees and nature have been present in my work for a long time.

However, when I started first making work about the English landscape. It was literally just, I'd seen a picture of a topiary garden, thought how bonkers topiary looked, but also how magical and weird it looked, and just one, and just, that was my main instigation for just starting to paint it. At the time, I'd also, so I'd gone back to the drawing board with how I was painting, so I'd been painting quite tightly and almost photographically.

Very tally, and I knew I hadn't found my own language with paint at that point. So I'd kind of reached this crisis in the studio and I just thought, I need to, there's something in me. I need to find what it is, how I want to use paint. And so as I was painting these topiaries, I then also started.

Literally flipping how I painted on its head. I just thought I've got to, I've got to just do the opposite of what I've been doing to try and find what it is that I want to do. So I started just covering surfaces, like whole sheets of paper with oil paint and then using solvents to lift the paint off the surface.

Creating like translucent, like translucent. And there's a kind of corrosion that goes on. And, um, and the two things just seem to work really well together. But at that stage I had no idea why. I didn't know why they complimented each other or what the story was yet. And then I started, um. And then I, I got to the stage where I knew I wanted to do an ma I'd ne I hadn't painted, I didn't do painting at university.

I did a course called Fine Art Intermedia, and then started painting as soon as I graduated. It was like I knew I wanted to be a painter. Somehow I'd veered off the painting course, and so I'd kind of been self-teaching ever since I graduated, and I just really knew that I wanted to go back to an institution to learn from really knowledgeable tutors and actually really get to grip to my practice.

So that's why I. Did the MA at City and Guild and it was there that I really sort of did a deep dive into the English landscape where I really got to grips and understood what it was that, about the English landscape that fascinated me, but also then how my paint. My painting technique helped to tell the story of the English landscape and what it is that I discovered about the English landscape is that much of it is made up from species of flora and fauna from around the globe.

So actually what we look at and think is like a quintessentially English landscape. Or has, you know, the green and pleasant land. It's like it fits into this myth of the green and pleasant land. It's actually not English. It's actually, um, very culturally diverse. And then the other thing that started to come to light through my research was that these spaces were, especially in, especially in relation to like estate stately home gardens.

Oh, especially like from the 18th century and give or take, um, a few decades, is that they were actually funded by, a lot of 'em were funded by profits from the slave trade or were the result of this country's like imperial and colonial pursuits. So often species would be brought back into the country by colonialists who had gone off venturing around the globe and, um.

So a lot of the reasons why these species exist within our landscape kind of has have these really dark roots. There's a real darkness to how and why they came to be here. But what they've become are these really incredible spaces that foster biodiversity and to, and. They have become sites for healing in, in like in light of climate change.

And so they've kind of got this duality of darkness and light to them, which I find really fascinating. I've always been extremely passionate about trees and verdant spaces. It is always been somewhere that. Just long and yearn to be in. I grew up in the countryside for a few years as a child, and I think that really those formative years really have had an impact on, on the reason, on my love of being out in these natural spaces.

So it's not like an arbitrary. Love of being in these spaces, but I'd never really considered their origin before, until I'd done the, until I'd sort of done this deep dive during the ma. And so, uh, sort of also having an in, uh, kind of intrigue in spiritual. Uh, I guess rules of can't have light without darkness and drawing light from darkness and removing darkness to reveal light.

And these all come into play with these in terms of these spaces, but then also with how I paint with removing paint from a surface to create light. So I'm removing darkness to create luminosity. So there's a lot of para, there's a lot of kind of parallels that are going on with the spaces and the paint.

These kind of spiritual ideas, just listening to you. That's quite an interesting thread in terms of what we take for granted as the quote unquote English landscape. But as you say, it touches on Colonial Legacy class. You know, some of those big estates, you know, that's class hierarchies and also like healing and ecology.

The light and darkness, I think both in terms of nature, but also the human experience. You know, in terms of, you know, the colonial legacies are quite a dark history in human history, you know, and how that can then influence so many different things and. In a way as, as listening to you, it's, you know, what I'm hearing is kind of the environment, the, even the natural environment reflects kind of human history and human experience and human intervention even.

Yeah, I mean the landscapes are filled with, with intervention and, and that's it. So the class that you mentioned there as well, the class, our class system is ingrained in our landscape and that was another thing that I just had not realized. Literally so much of its design, even when you think you are out in a wild space, actually it's.

Been more likely than not to have been designed that way, and a lot of it will always end up being connected back somehow to this country's class system, which just really shapes so much more than we realize. So the reason why pheasants are in our landscape is because. Because they're connected to shoot, shooting and hunting.

They're actually an Asian bird and they were brought here as a game bird and hun shooting and hunting. This is like not even as a, uh, a means to of survival. This was, this is sport. You know, they were brought here as sport, as entertainment for. Always for the rich and wealthy. Quite often COTAs of trees that we might see just out in the landscape would've been planted specifically for hunting.

There's mon jacks and squirrels that are, that the gray squirrel, for example, was brought over here by, um, by a, by a Duke, her and Russell at the Woburn Estate. He was a Duke who it thought he was responsible in introducing the gray squirrel to the uk. He basically imported 10 grade schools from New Jersey to live on his estate.

Obviously, he didn't. Somehow register that a squirrel can just hop off and do whatever it wants to do. But he would also start gifting them because to a lot of these, um, rich, wealthy landowners, to have unusual animals on your land was a way of showing off. It was a way of showing, of having status. It was a way of showing people how powerful you were.

So he would gift these squirrels. To other people, such as he gifted them to Regents Park in Q Gardens. And it was, it was all just in the name of, of showing off really. Um, and then they clearly reproduced and, and now they, you literally can't go anywhere in the UK and not see a great gray squirrel. And the same is with the Jack.

The same Duke or Mu Jack. To live on his estate and they escaped and started breeding and have become naturalized over the centuries. So it is these little flashes of everything has, all these things have a story. They're connected to someone or something in our history. More often, not than not, that's connected to our class system or to like the, the, like I said, the country's like kind of colonial pursuits through the centuries.

And I think, um, it's just for me, that thing, like I love seeing squirrels. I, I'd never have even thought something. So in assuming had some, had such a sort of significant story attached to it that, that these animals were kind of play things as a tool for showing off. It is. It is. I just would never have put that to it.

And so the more I unearthed about what I've seen. Landscape and realize that it's got a story as to how and why it exists there. The, the more, I guess, intrigued and the more work I realized I've got to do to kind of keep like, you know, there's so many stories to unearth here and tell. Yeah, and I think you're not alone, you know, in terms of learning that history, because I think most of us probably wouldn't be aware necessarily.

Of that history that we're seeing. But also I think it's, from what it sounds like you're unearthing history. It's almost like you're peeling back, you know, the, perhaps the assumptions that we, you know, we now have over the. I don't know, years, decades, generations of, you know, people doing things and bringing animals or plants back or, you know, whatever.

And how that has influenced country and, and the natural landscape. So I'm just, uh, curious too, we did TA talk about Tin Edwards in terms of the collaborator. Are there any other collaborators or influences that you have had over your career so far? I mean. So I wouldn't sort say collaborators as such, but there's a wonderful gardens near where I live in Ham.

I don't live in Faversham, sorry. The gardens are near Ham in Kent. It's called Doddington Place Gardens and the they found me on Instagram. I think I'd been posting my topiary paintings. They just got in touch and said, why don't you come and paint here? And it's, it's a 19th century stately home in amongst this, it's actually like 19th turn of the century, 20th with a garden that was kind of recreated in the image of an 18th century garden.

But it was a wonderful experience that they gave me an opportunity to just go along whenever I wanted and paint out in the space and just. It's the first time I'd ever actually done that, like gone and painted in a, in a landscape. And, and so I, I normally work from, from imagery within a studio, so they've been really supportive and given me lots of opportunities.

And also Lucy Adams, who's their head gardener. She has also been really supportive and helpful to me with my dissertation. She took me on a whole tour of the gardens and we did a tree tour and she talked about all the species that she knew about. We talked about old L you know, historical landscape designers like Capability Brown, who himself is uh, very responsible for a lot of the landscapes that we.

That we see now and he almost made the green and pleasant land. He was the person who kind of realized that and manifested that, that aesthetic, the, the kind of looking out of your garden and seeing a sweeping landscape. And so she really helped me delve into the world of botany a lot more, which then inspired me to go off and do with the tours around arboretums and, and just sort of really get to know what the people who work within that world.

No, and and to find out what it is that they can teach me about what's going on in these spaces. One of the things that I think is so fascinating is that, so Lucy said that there's a lot of people, they are now having to look outwards in light of climate change. A lot of species that have just existed for centuries in this country are now struggling to survive.

They're struggling to to survive the wet winters and the the summers, which are gonna become hotter and drier. And so they're now having to look outwards around the globe again at other species that they can bring in that match the climate that we're experiencing now. So we are still having to look outwards.

To bring it in, but this time it's from a place of collaboration rather than taking what's not ours or just taking for, to enrich ourselves. This time, it's um, it's botanists and, and experts from around the globe working to together to try and create flourishing types of biodiversity to keep the planet healthy.

So there's lots of really interesting. Work that these people are doing, that I've been learning about through my research as well. That sounds really interesting that you've been invited to property, to to paint, and it sounds like you're really learning quite a lot of, you know, in terms of botany and and that sort of thing.

I guess there are a couple of questions I have. Firstly, are there favorite places? Are there favorite kind of landscapes that you find yourself being drawn back to time and again? Not specific places as such, but I do seek out going to green spaces where I live in Margate. We've got a really low tree count.

I mean, it's one of the lowest in the country. And it's, to me that's really, really noticeable and the lack of green. There is something that, I mean, in the whole 11 years I've lived there, I've done one painting of the sea. Everything else has been mostly of trees, even though there's like not many trees there.

So I do specifically go out to look to be amongst trees and in the Midlands where I'm from. When I go home to visit my parents in Warwickshire, I will just try and get out walking in the landscapes there because they're where I grew up with the rolling kind of green hills and, and lush trees and, and there's just an abundance of green there and I just seek out, I just feel like I need to be amongst it.

So it is not that I necessarily have a space that I return to, but I do go and seek out those spaces. There's some really interesting stately homes in Warwickshire where I'm from, where I used to visit as a child that I've gone back to now to go and research what's growing there as well. There's um, child, is it Child House or Child Hall and Compton Verney, and both of those are actually.

Capability Brown gardens as well. So there's a lot of history embedded there. But as I said, you know, that's the thing. So about these spaces, the duality of the light and dark, it's, although I understand that the origins of these places are dark, I'm not saying that they shouldn't exist, and I definitely don't.

I don't want to, I'm not trying to lead any kind of campaign of hate against them. Because I think they're beautiful at the same time, visually beautiful. But they, they have a darkness to them. And that's what I try and draw out in my work is the beauty and the darkness. But they, there is a place for them and there is a place for them in that they tell our story.

And if we can acknowledge our story, acknowledge our path. I feel like that's where healing can take place or where accountability can take place or where we can or where people can start to come together. Again, when we acknowledge things that, that you UK may have or has done that have, have had been atrocious in the past, but that legacy of those green spaces, really they belong to everyone.

Because culturally there's gonna be a connection to you wherever you are from somewhere within that space. I think we have a problem of accessibility to those spaces because a lot of them, there's a very high price to get in. You know, there's a high ticket charge to get into them, but once you start to understand what grows there, you then see where those spaces exist outside of those gardens.

What might have once been a stately home garden, but is now. Part of our kind of a landscape, which you could go walking in, and so I'm just hoping that these stories help would help. Well, my kind of dream would be that they would help people feel connected to the landscape somehow that it contains all of our stories.

Somewhere within that, there's a connection to who you are and where you are from. And I think that's so important because it's being honest about the place. So it's seeing the beauty, but also being honest that it does have a history and quite often it can be quite a difficult dark history as well.

Yeah, incredibly painful. I mean, this is the thing, so I'm, I don't attempt to speak on behalf of other people. Obviously. My background is not from a background connected to. Slave trade, either, you know, either side, but I'm definitely not connected to a family that is here because I was brought here as a result of slavery.

You know, I'm not in any way trying to speak on behalf of people who those painful stories are connected to. But what? But what I'm fascinated in, and this is someone who I'm myself, you know, my own lineage is. Is quite diverse as well. It's, it is just about no matter who you are, that the English landscape, it's just actually a space that reflects all of us and, and I, and I think these, and Ithing, these stories can.

Just help find that connection. And I'm, that's certainly coming across, and I was going to say, what I'm hearing is connections. Yeah. And you said it's about connections. So yeah. That, uh, that does sound like quite a strong theme in, in your work. The other question I, I thought of as well is you mentioned that you were commissioned.

Property in, in Faversham. Have you had a lot of people come to you or have, have you had organizations come to you for commissions? It wasn't a commission with Doddington Place. They just said that I could just go there whenever I wanted to, to dupe, to paint and use it as a space for research. So it wasn't a commission.

Oh, sorry. I misunderstood. No, um, and I haven't really, that I haven't, having only just graduated, I've literally gone from the graduate, from the MA to this residency. So my whole focus at the moment has been working on, on the trees that are growing in Hoxton Square. And that sounds like quite a, an interesting project in itself, and as you said, it's kind of, you know, you know that area.

So is it, does it feel like a bit of a homecoming? Yeah. I've absolutely loved being back here. It is like, it's been so nostalgic and I also keep forgetting that I don't live here. So I, I've had times where I've been walking around and I feel like, oh, I'm just, I just live around the corner and then I remember that I don't, I live in Margate, like, but it is, it's, uh, been just such a wonderful.

Experience coming back and working here and being part of everyday life here again, and the space that I've been given is brilliant. It's just been so, because the, the square for me, when I was in my twenties, it was a place of partying. It was a place of like hedonism for me. It was a place where me and my friends would meet with cans of beer and sit on a Saturday afternoon after band practice and where friends would come and meet us.

Or we even did a photo shoot for one of our bands, EP covers in the middle of Hoxton Square and I. I would never have even considered as much as I loved trees then, and I would never have considered that there was any history to the reason why those trees were there. So again, it's been really interesting to unearth the story of those trees.

The main tree that grows there is the London Plain. It's a hybrid tree. It's Asian and American, and it was discovered in the nursery of a tree hunter. Called John tde, the younger, I think that's how you pronounce his name. Apologies if I've said that wrong. Um, he was a famous tree hunter and his dad was a tree, a famous tree hunter as well.

And between them, they traveled. This is in the 16 hundreds, they traveled. To three of the continents, which was a lot of traveling back then. And while, while it's known that tree hunters themselves didn't necessarily have imperial ambi ambitions, they would often follow in the footsteps of, of the empire or of.

Of colonialists that were going out to find new lands or you, because they wanted, because the, the path was already trodden and then they would go out there to research the botany that was in these places. I think what's become known later on is that often botany and knowledge were taken. No credit or remuneration was ever given back.

So this botany enriched the empire. The knowledge, the scientific knowledge that was gained from the botany. It all enriched and empowered the empire, the all European empires. But, so anyway, going back to this tree, it was discover. As an accidental hybrid discovered in this nursery in vha, but it is, it emerged that this tree was really, really resilient to pollution.

So it, it then became, it's now the most populous tree in London because of that. And it's also been exported globally around the world. So you'll find it growing in cities around the globe. New York is absolutely full of the London plain. I think they've growing. They grow, they grow in all sorts of places because of the, because of its resilience and its strength.

So again, it's one of these trees that's kind of got this, the reason for it being there is from our darker, the darker sides to our history, but it is purpose has become really important and filled with light and filled with. Like this energy that we need. And so it is, again, it's that duality that the tree has.

And it's also, I read an article in the New Yorker by a writer called, I think she's called Alice Inkin, and, and it was all about the London plane. And in it she describes it as the tough immigrant tree. New York doing the work that immigrants have always done, that this tree is the one cleaning the air.

It's the one consistently there cleaning up, making the place sustainable and, and a nice place for people to live in. And it's that likening of the tree to the connecting it to stories of migration. It's just what constantly draws me back and, and drives me on and what I just find so continually fascinating about.

Natural world is just how connected to stories of migration it is and, and again that it presents that opportunity for connection and there's so many layers there. And that's, I guess, part of human history, but also part of the natural history as well. Yeah, so much, and I haven't even like touched the edges.

There's like, there's so much more to even talk about. You know, the fact that they were planted in. Hoxton Square in the early 17 hundreds by the local residents at the time who wanted to turn the square into a pleasant place to be because the square had undergone a period of decline. And actually Hoxton Square has always gone through periods of decline.

And then, and then sort of came back to life again. And, and it all, it is attracted religious dissenters and it's always kind of had this kind of rebellious edge to it. And. So, yeah, there is so much. There's so much you can draw from learning about a tree into, you know. You can draw the stories from the area it's in and why it's there.

I think you are so right on that. And I think, you know, with trees there's such history. Even, you know, the rings around the, the tree, like if you cut, you know, a section of it, you know, you can kind of tell when there is, you know, a lot of rain or when it, there's drought, you know, how thick or thin each ring of a tree is.

So it, it does have that kind of collective history. Yeah, they really tell their own stories. That's the title of the show. So as part of the residency here, I get an exhibition at the end of the show and the title of the show is Conclusions of the City Forest. Part of the City Forest is because London is actually classed as a forest due to it's high tree count, which, so for me, coming from somewhere with a really low tree count, I actually feel like I come somewhere leafy when I come to London.

But occlusions are actually the wounds on a tree. Um, so they tell the tree's story and they never heal. They never go away. They become part of the tree's, physical makeup as it were. Like you can see the gnarly wounds in the tree's trunk, and. So again, the tree carries its own story, and I thought it was like quite pertinent to have a word connected to wounds there because, because our landscapes are so full of wounds, stories to do with pain and suffering, but then with the tree, it's resilience.

They carry on growing. They keep reaching for the sky, they keep putting, they keep doing what this, what this. Wonderful thing that they've been put here to do, which is make our air clean and make our world beautiful. And so it's about overcoming those wounds but not forgetting them. Indeed. And is that duality, isn't it?

So my final question is, looking forward, what's next? What do you see on the horizon? I mean, I feel like I've kind of only just started this work in a way. There's, I feel like there's so much to learn. Uh, just doing this residency has pushed my work on so much from between the MA show and now there's a already I can see the growth in the work, the, the, the knowledge that is deepening.

There's a new fascination creeping in with the actual bark of trees. And, and also just pushing my technique, this technique of removal, of paint, of using solvents. So the, the thing that I. Have kind of acknowledged about my paintings is they are quite toxic in and of themselves because I use solvents and oil paints to create a painting.

So the paintings themselves are toxic and I mean, I'm not saying I make beautiful paintings, but of beautiful things and also a lot of our landscape. Beautiful and toxic. So there's kind of this parallel again that goes on there between the two. So it's about continuing to explore these, this thing, the removal, the dualities, the, the toxicity, the beauty, the dark light, and just seeing how this keeps winding its way into the stories of our country and, and just keep, I guess the more places that I can delve into.

The more I can hopefully tell these other stories of England. Well, thank you. It's been wonderful speaking with you and it's been such delight to, I say delight. I don't know if delight's the right word, but such an interesting and in depth and enriching conversation about your work and how, how we can all see and look at the landscape around us.

So thanks again. It's been wonderful speaking with you. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thanks for tuning into my conversation with Twinkle. Speaking with her has really opened my eyes to the layers and influences on the English landscape. More information on Twinkle are in the show notes. In the next episode, I'll be speaking with Casey Orr, her photography centres on identity, community fashion and youth culture.

You won't want to miss it.