Why Emotional Healing Is the Key to Quitting P*rn | Eddie Capparucci Interview

In this powerful episode of The Covenant Eyes Podcast, hosts Karen Potter and Theo McManigal sit down with Dr. Eddie Capparucci, a licensed Christian therapist and creator of the Inner Child Model, to discuss how faith, emotional healing, and practical therapy work together to break the chains of p*rn*graphy addiction.

Eddie shares his story of leaving corporate America to follow God’s calling into counseling, explains how unresolved childhood pain shapes addictive behavior, and offers actionable tools for emotional regulation and recovery.

You’ll learn:
•  Why understanding your “inner child” is key to healing from addiction.
•  How faith and psychology can work together seamlessly.
•  What to do after a relapse and how to regulate emotions.
•  How tools like Covenant Eyes support long-term freedom and accountability.

💡 Whether you’re struggling personally, supporting a loved one, or guiding others through recovery, this episode offers both hope and strategy for healing.

📘 Learn more about Eddie’s books and resources at https://innerchild-sexaddiction.com

✉️ Email Eddie at InnerChildModel@gmail.com
to receive his 20 Emotional Regulation Techniques PDF.

🔗 Download the Victory App and explore Covenant Eyes resources to start your own journey toward freedom.  https://cvnteyes.co/41YU8Od

#PornRecovery #ChristianCounseling #CovenantEyes #FaithAndHealing
#EddieCapparucci #InnerChildModel #OvercomingShame #QuitPorn
#ChristianPodcast #EmotionalHealing

CHAPTERS:
00:00 Intro – Welcome and episode overview  
01:30 Eddie’s journey from corporate to Christian counseling  
03:00 How the Inner Child Model began  
05:10 What makes the Inner Child Model unique  
07:20 Emotional healing and addiction recovery  
10:30 Bridging faith and therapy  
13:40 Overcoming shame through God’s perspective  
18:00 Why “sex addict” isn’t your identity  
20:10 Rewriting negative inner narratives  
24:00 Dealing with relapse in recovery  
26:00 Emotional regulation and practical techniques  
33:00 Caring for body, mind, and soul  
35:00 How Covenant Eyes tools support recovery  
38:30 Eddie’s message of hope and resources  
41:50 Closing thoughts and next steps

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Transcript

0:06

Hey, everybody, welcome back to the Covenant Eyes podcast. It's so good to have you joining us. Make sure you leave a comment, like and subscribe. We love to hear from you all. Make sure you also share this podcast far and wide because today's episode is going to be stellar. We have an old friend joining us. He's been on the podcast for years, and every time he brings amazing information and research from his own clinical practices and we're just really excited to have him. I also have joining me, Theo, and you all know Theo well. He has been on the podcast over the last 12 months, and he is one of the hosts here, and we're just excited to have you back today, Theo. Welcome back. Karen. And, the pleasure's all mine. I'm excited to be with you. Thanks for having me. How are you today? Doing amazing. Oh, my goodness. We've had a full day of recording today, so it's been fun. And actually, Eddie Capparucci is our final guest of the day, and he is a very skilled professional who is going to talk a little bit about some of the work that he does is in, in his counseling practice, as well as some of the content that he's created in our very own Victory app. So I'm really excited about that. Theo. That is fantastic. Well, let's hop right to it. Yeah. Eddie, thanks for being with us. Well, thank you for having me here. And, like, expectations are so high for what I need to say, so I hope I meet them. You will. Awesome. Well, Eddie, for anyone out there that has not been familiar with your content, your work, give them a little bit of your background and how you got started. Really, in the practice that you have now? Yeah, I don't like I been in practice now for 14 years. This is a God thing. Strictly a God thing. I was in corporate America for about 25 year. And I've my faith continued to grow and to build. He finally tapped me on the shoulder and said, I have something different yet because I'm moving away from corporate America, and I want you to go into the counseling world. And after fighting him for a couple of years, which my wife got a big kick out of watching that happen, I gave in and then I even realized what it was you wanted me to do. I thought, for you want me to go, to seminary to be a pastor? That I then found out and realized no one to me, it could be a counselor. You. I went back, and I did the master's degree and did all the state work, got licensed, then opened up a practice for general practice. Well, let me tell you, within a very, very short period of time. All these men started coming in that, you know, were dealing with corner and sex addiction and different things. And I'm like, oh my God, these look like me 15 years ago. And then it just all connected. I go, now I know what he wants me to do. So, when he got my certification and I've been working as a teacher in the field now for about 14 years. I guess I'm best known for the development of the Inner Child model that I created. Because I'm a big believer in the fact that our path still haunt us today and that the inability to sit and cross that with a lot of subconscious, emotional distress that drives us to a gate through addictive behaviors. And so therefore, I put the Inner Child model is about one educating, men and also women. Now we do it for women. And we've also just started doing that for the trade partner. But helping them understand that their power is impeding their ability to heal today. And the big emphasis with all of this is with the Inner Child model, the idea of self-reflection, insight, answering the why question. Why do I think feel empathy the way I do? Because if I have the answers to those question, I'm empowered to make not just sit down to change it, but light life and change it so that that gives you a little overview of me. That's that's fantastic. So thanks for sharing that. This Inner Child model definitely seems to have gained a lot of traction. But tell us what makes it, unique and how does it differ? So 2.2 things I want you to hit on. And number one, what makes the Inner Child model unique. And so and what in regard to how it differs from, traditional approaches. And then number two, how does it, help the individuals you talked about who have sex addiction or pornography addiction or other such behaviors? Yeah. Well, Theo, that's a great question. But the thing is, how does it differ? It Giffard because it brings together many different types of other therapeutic approaches. Now, I did not realize that when I created it, it was through one of my peers that I, we wrote a book about how the model works with all addiction. He he is the Director of the Treatment of Addictive Behaviors Center center in London. Nathan Jones. And he in his practice in his practice. He and his colleagues have been have been using the model for several years. I didn't even know this. And he approached me to said, you know what? We use it for all addictive behavior. So we wrote a book about that using a lot of his case studies. To go back to your question, I mean, it is part of, you know, it has cognitive behavioral therapy in it and narrative therapy and schema therapy at it. There are 6 or 7 different types of therapy that come together that make that model what makes it different and unique, I think from all the rest is, number one, the fact that it has a lot of different components. Number two, the fact that what it does, it really works on not just helping an individual to learn how to manage their their addiction, so that what we're doing, we're managing it, okay. We're not curing it, we're managing it. But also help them in learning to become more emotionally engaged, more aware of their surroundings, more mindful, and that we know what it comes to sexual addiction. Well, we're talking about an intimacy disorder that what part that could calm, you know, identified, you know, decades ago. And therefore many of the men I'd come to understand in my practice and many of my colleagues have confirmed it, neither of you can. Then I work with their emotionally on the develop. So this program also helps them in that at that dance. And the second part of your question, it goes back to what I said before. What the mark does it help the individual to learn more about themselves again, why they think the way they do, they act the way they do and feel the way they do. And it is usually driven by their path. And what are the things that they got that you should not have gotten in the way of abuse? And what are the things they didn't get that they should have gotten, which was that emotional nurturing from people. So now having that understanding that many of them don't understand, that they don't understand that their path is troubling them today, and to both them don't know how to sit with emotional discomfort. And when we talk about emotional discomfort, it takes on a lot of different facets, including boredom. Boredom’s emotional discomfort. You don't know how to sit with that. So therefore the model also teaches them how to do that. They realized I can sit with my emotional pain and I process it because we go through this. Think about it. What do people who struggle with addiction give? What is the coping strategy that they used to escape? Right. That's what they're doing. They are keeping something. They're running from something. With the model, what we're doing is we're teaching them to take the raw emotion that they're running from, how we get them that you. My number one rule. Slow everything down. My number one rule. The recovery. And take all the raw emotion process through those. And then put them to rational thinking so that they can start to see what the difference between what I feel and what if we go. And the way they do that, they're looking at it from reality, what they do if they're following out everything that the consumption they're throwing out, everything that's pure base and they're throwing out everything that's an internal lie that people need about themselves. I'm not good enough. I, I'm, you know, not lovable. And when you do that, what you do is you take the stock of raw emotion and you whittle it down to just a few. I get what you can handle that you don't have to run away any longer at that is the biggest key to the whole thing. For tomorrow. So that that's the most unique aspect of the model. He is taking the idea of teaching people what they feel, the raw emotion, and being able to realize they don't have to walk away from them. What I just need to do is put them in the proper perspective so that I then can manage them. So now, if I don't need to run, if I don't need to keep. I should be in a pretty good place so that that what the model tries to do. I know a very long answer. No, that was extremely detailed, and I think it was really helpful for our listeners to understand that because you really impacted, I want to lean into the fact that, you know, you are you're a Christian therapist as well. So in your work, you also, I would imagine, integrate biblical principles as you're, you know, coaching and counseling people. How do you bridge the gap between the therapy side and the biblical side, or do you see that just kind of naturally building a, you know, a bridge to all together very easily because, so much of what the Bible teaches us is practical and therapy. Yeah. But my training was the integration of theology with psychology. So therefore it never seemed to be, to your point, caring a gap. It's just very natural for me to move from one to the other. And so therefore what I use, I use the Christian aspect not to shame, not to condemn, but to mold a thing and to help to build a sense of, you know, excitement for them. So therefore, I'm using the clinical practices of a clinical component to be able to say, okay, these are what one has called the problem. And two, these are things solution that we need to help to. We do that problem. But at the same time in order to be able to give you hope, to give you confidence that she with that negative knowing that place in our head, those negative narrative, that point I can turn to, you know, the dialog of talking about Christ and talking about, you know what Jesus, Jesus sees the client because the one thing I like to say to him a lot is, you know what? We have to move away from how you see yourself, to how God sees you. Yes, because that's where you will have so much growth. So forget I've never looked at it and go a bridge or a gap between the two. It just seemed to flow very natural. That's incredible. I love that. I just have to, observe. Either. Have you ever seen The Shack? Yeah, I have it a long time ago, but I have seen. Or read the book. Yeah, there's there's there's a scene where, I don't want to spoil too much, but the main character is, asked to make certain decisions about his own children, and it helps him realize that God sees everybody in the world as his child. And so, you know, I, I just can't help but see so much of faith as well as God's own vision of us in the Inner Child model. That's not to necessarily say we should see ourselves as children, although God, Jesus himself did say, unless you be like children, you can't enter my kingdom. But that just kind of stuck with me. You know, if I, if I can tell you this. So how did this Inner Child model come to be that her child model? And if just based on what you were talking about, you know, the idea again, of how men saw themselves who are coming, you come I often I saw a lot of shame and to me shame that number one deterrent that helped people to get to that sense of freedom. So originally that began and right now there are 12 Inner Children that I pray that abide and the Inner Child to metaphor to that what he did, it's a metaphor for our emotional pain point. So I think that applied the 12 what I believe are the most common pain point, we suffer from when we gather, for example, the idea of, you know, I'm on a person or I'm unnoticed or I'm sexually abused, you know, it's those types of things that we have strength. So I came up originally with nine, and they were just the nine reasons men abuse sex. and I gave I had a sheet of paper and I had the nine written on there, and I had a line or two about each, and I gave it to my client to say, tell me, which one do you identify with? And they did, and we would go through those. But then I started thinking about you know, what the shame that the men are carrying, what can we do to help them? What can I do to help them alleviate that? And I took an idea from another book, which I can't remember the title, and that would externalize the addiction. We're going to externalize it. So therefore I think, you know what? I'm going to turn the reason into children. And now the children are the area where you get your life. So I want I presented that to the dive. It was like, oh my God, you know what? I can help this kid. I can nurture this kid. I can make this kid better. And and that's what we saw. So to go back to your point of what you're just saying now, a moment ago, with the shocked and thought part of the problem there, when we can't accept how God sees it because of the shame that that is a big barrier that we need to break through it. And I know that are many wonderful books that have been written on the topic along the way. But, you know, I think you got to go beyond just reading a book to get to the idea of removing shame. You have to ultimately start to look at yourself differently. And I can think of nothing better, nothing more powerful to do help you look, to look or feel different then to understand how God sees you and that God that you want unconditionally. And he loves you unconditionally. Absolutely. And he took all of our shame, all of our sin, all of our guilt on that cross, you know, I mean, that's something that we need to be reminded of, that he took on all of that for us to redeem us. And that gift is waiting for each and every one of us to accept you. Probably as many people don't accept it because they don't believe it. Yeah, well, no, no, he did that to someone else, not me. I mean, you don't understand the magnitude of my sin. You don't understand what I am done. And it's like, no, brother. Yes, I have, and sister. Okay, because it's the same thing there. No, I do understand. I've been there. I've been down that road and. But you know what? That's not, it's a key. I don't like the term sex addict or porn addict. I don't like it and I don't. It's not that I don't like it because I'm embarrassed by it or anything. The reason I don't have my clients use it is because that does not define who they are, okay? That is not what define them. And so therefore they need to find the label that God like for example, my label where I am a prince of the King, that that my label that what I wear I’ve worn it for for decade. And if not, then truly do I have a predictive brain? Yeah. Do I have a compulsive disorder? Yeah. Do I have an attachment wound? Yeah. Those three things I have which everyone who deal with this disorder have, they're all pretty clinical in nature. They don't define who I am. They're just things I have to take care of. So therefore, why am I going to walk around with a label such as a drug addict? Or that's alcoholic or a sex addict or porn addict? Again, that is not who we are. God did not design that way. We are creatures of habit and we are products of our environment. All right, we had this. We didn't come out of the womb like death, right? It is through the scars, through people and circumstances that got us to where we are today. Not excuses. All right. I needed to make changes along the way. I should have made them a long way before I get. I should have been able to pick it up and catch it long before I did not give it that rationale. I got attacked the rationale of what happened, the circumstances that led to the creation of almost a full blown dark picture that fortunately got here over 25 years ago. But this is what we're dealing with when men can start to lift that shame, and see healing happen so much quicker. And so that brings up the question. And so how can people, regardless of, you know, our listeners, those who might be carrying a lot of shame, especially due to their struggle with pornography, or if they're in a different place, whatever the case may be, how can how can our faith, our Christian faith and how do you use in your therapeutic practice, our Christian faith to get your clients or anyone listening? How can we how can the faith help us see ourselves and each other differently? Yeah, well, the first thing I do is I want them to start to understand what is all this noise, this up in their head, this negative noise. So therefore we start to identify, okay, what are the negative narratives that you have with many people that they don't? I mean, they may say it to themselves, but they don't think about it on a regular basis. But yet they feel it. So therefore now I'm going to have them identify. I can't name the pain. Okay. I'm I'm not good enough. Okay? I'm stupid. You know, I get go down the list. There are hundreds of different negative. And once we have them all established right now what I'm going to do is I'm going to have them start to define for me. Why should I believe that I like what they need to do for themself? Why should I believe this? And it has to be something that they can actually prove. And in many cases, the other thing I asked them to do also is where did this negative narrative come from? Where did it? Again, we don't come out of the womb with the negative narrative that we have. The where do we get the sense or the feeling that I'm not good enough? Oh, well, you know, my father used to call it that way, you know, criticizing me about this, not about. Okay. All right. So that was dad criticism. You know, you think I was objectify? Well, all the probably some of it. Okay. Yeah. Probably go up. We all can be justified in some way, but do you think you deserved all of that when you got. No, I didn't, all right. Do you do nothing. Well no I can do something with it. Oh what do you do? Well. And so therefore we take and we are again flipping the script. We're going away from the what I feel which are all the negative narrative. And we're moving over to what is real, and we're starting to get them to see them through from the light of true understanding. Also, you know, again, what happens. God see you. God sees you, you know, at that individual that he created, who he again accepts and loves unconditionally. He knows that we're flawed. He knows we're broken. Right? And all he asked is that we believe and that we repent when we make our mistakes. And with all of that, there's again that lovely word of grace accepting grace that if I can accept grace to understand, you know what? I don't have to be perfect. It's okay to be broken. But I can also be on that pathway of sanctification where I am thriving to become better. That's it. I'm get trying to get better. Be better at a person. I may follow through. Okay, I get back up that myself up and down the road, but people feel some time that they have to be perfect because you don't wait in very rigid religious household, you know, with all the rules, all the regulation. And it's like, no, see, the thing about Christianity, it's so wonderful is that it is so light that what Jesus said about my yoke is not heavy, that when people start to understand that, we are like, wow, you know what? I have to take and believe in Christ, that even my board and my Savior and I have to accept it. Great. Wow, that's so effective. Way too easy that there's got to be a hook. There can be something else. And it's like motivation. There's nothing else. It's so that, you know, the thing that, a lot of people who are going through addiction recovery or pornography addiction recovery, they often talk about the experience of and you mention this briefly, but, you know, they'll get some progress. They'll feel like they're making some headway and they get a step back. How do people really work through that? And not just, you know, throw the baby out with the bathwater, as they say, because oftentimes that can be really discouraging if you fall and slip in your journey. But, you know, like when you're climbing a mountain, if you make a misstep, you don't just go all the way to the bottom and start over again. Right? You just get up where you're at and keep going. But how does that work in recovery, you know? And what have you encountered with some of your clients? What does that look like? I think the most important thing, what somebody have a relapse, is to be able to, one, to take a step back. And you're right, it is devastating for them. Understand that. But one thing that we as therapists need to do is not be beating somebody up about like, yep, we get down like, really? Don't you going to be good? No. Okay. Happened. So what to me it most important thing is why you think it happened. What went well along the way to get you there. And we're going to find in both cases, a large majority of the cases is that that individual was drained mentally, emotionally, physically or spiritually. If one or more of those four areas because what were drained get why we lose sight of everything else that we're supposed to be focused on, because we've now become emotionally regulated? I've come to believe, and I've been making a big, strong push with this over the last six months. Emotional regulation in recovery. Think about it for a moment. If you're emotionally regulate it. What could go wrong despite the circumstances surrounding you, the fight or whatever in your life is going on? If you're able to stay emotionally, regulate it. Here you you can pretty much handle anything. And so therefore, what you're gonna find when someone relapse, they have become emotionally regulated. So therefore it now all right. Let's identify what the problem was. What could we have done differently to prevent it from happening. Right. What if the new plan to make sure that I get put in place? But most importantly, again, what are you doing to almost surely regulate yourself or keep yourself as emotionally regulated as possible? Because let's face it, none of us live in that window of tolerance 24 seven but you know, if I could be there 85% of the time, and even if what I'm trying to get out of it, maybe I keep one foot in the that center window, right? Maybe before instead of getting hyper disregulated, or hypo disregulated. If I keep one foot there, I can maybe move myself back faster. And in doing that now I'm what? I'm where what am I? I'm grounded. Grounded people don't relapse. They don't grounded people don't relapse emotionally, regularly. People don't relapse because they are very aware of their of their surrounding, of their circumstances and more importantly, they're very aware of what's going on within them mentally, emotionally, physically, spiritually. That is so good. And, you know, in the business world, you know, one of the big skills that they really lean into is emotional intelligence, right? And so, so often in the business world, we talk about a magician, emotional intelligence, and how that's such an important factor as you continue to move up in your careers and move on. So it's a skill that's appreciated across many different industries. And I think that that's interesting because I often think about my own personal experiences where, you know, I have been dis, you know, dysregulated emotionally and responded, you know, maybe to my spouse or to my kids and, you know, and not so gracious way. And really, if you take a step back and look at that, there was a trigger, there was something that, you know, was off in my life that led me to be emotionally deregulated. So unpacking that with people has got to be powerful, because once you can learn to master that and your emotions are no longer mastering you, there's so much that we can do, we can be more present for other people, were more aware of how we're interacting with the world around us. It's just such a powerful principle. Eddie. Oh my goodness. What you just talked about. Karen, it's so true that there are driving force and that lead has to be regulated. But those don't always sometimes happen in a flash. Sometimes they build upon themselves. So therefore you're just slowly moving toward going up to be hyper disregulator or slowly drop dropping down to be hypo disregulated. And I what I did was I actually went and did a I did some research, and I found what I thought were the most the 20 probably the most easiest simple way to emotion day emotionally regulated and I so I have a list of those at what I do with my clients. I give that to them and I say I want you three times a day proactively, three times a day, morning, afternoon, evening, picking one of the different, you know, techniques and using it to use it and then regulate it so you can feel and say, oh, oh, that calm that, that what peace is. So the reason I have 20 because not everybody is going to be able to implement all of that. And there are some that take a little bit more time than others. Like for example, immersing your face in a bowl of ice water. Okay. You're not going to be able to do that in the midst of a meeting at work, right? That's not going to work. Sometimes I'd like to, though. Yeah, I'm sure you all would, but but but there's a lot of other things. Like you don't get it with this piece of, skin between our thumb and our index finger, where we can actually push it a little bit. It's very, very soft. So we take your thumb on your other hand and just rub it in a circular fashion very slowly. And what it does is it just feels this calming sense that you have that, that, that, that other one that you're there. So, so there's 20 different techniques that people can use. I usually tell them pick for it by mix them up and just make sure that you're doing it every day, three times a day, so that you are proactively regulating yourself. And that again, as I say now, you know, oh, if what it feels like to be regulated, because, again, people who struggle with addiction, we're not very mindful of how we are doing mentally, emotionally, spiritually or physically. We're just running through life with our head down. We need to stop, slow everything down and be very, very aware of what if my mind, my body and my soul killing me? You mentioned the the mind, the body and the soul and I just have to ask, do you do you consider or look at even what people are doing with their bodies as far as what they're eating or how they're, you know, physically active or inactive in, in part of your, therapy process. Do you have techniques that help them look at that? Because I know for me personally, you know, if I eat a lot of carbs and get that glucose spike, it really can take me on an emotional rollercoaster. I have to really regulate myself well because I get spikes and I I'm a little unhinged when I have too many carbs. You know, I mean, it's and everybody's different, but is that part of the process is helping people even assess that part of their body and how it's interacting? Yeah, it have to be. It has to be because there are many different factors to your point that if you're dehydrated. Yeah, okay. Get up. It's going to be playing havoc on your body. There are so many things, if we're not doing exercising, okay. If we get sitting around all day long, that could play havoc on our not just our body, but our mind and also on our soul. What would our emotion, you know, to make people and go, you know, wait too long? Yeah. You had put them away and and really challenged yourself to find things that are intellectually stimulating for you. So yeah, that definitely part of it. Again, that is the self-care that anyone dealing with any type of addictive behavior need to be engaged in. Because as I said before, between between that type of self-care where we are covering the gamut, how I can keep and empower for positive influence on how my body, my mind and soul is going plot, making sure emotionally regulate it. I get that is recovery. You know, sometimes it's so easy to forget that pain is actually a gift. It's telling us that something's wrong. It's telling us that there's something we need to be attentive to. But it makes also makes total sense that, someone who develops a, an addiction or a bad habit, I mean, that's really what they're trying to, you know, avoid the whole time. I want to pivot, just a little bit here. And, so for our listeners who are using Covenant Eyes as part of their accountability journey, how can tools like internet filtering and accountability reports, be complimentary therapeutic approaches like your Inner Child model? Well, I think, you know, those tools are like mandatory for the folks who are beginning the process of recovery. And the reason they're mandatory is twofold. One, again, it is that accountability. Two, there's also a sense of deterrence out there trying to learn how to manage the compulsive nature that they have. But also it's also beneficial for the betrayed partner to make them feel more secure. It can make them feel safer that they know, okay, you got something on your devices and you have this accountability partner who checking on this for you. And I hope that the case I hope the the trade partner, the accountability partner, I don't think that's really a very positive thing for them to do. So I, for me, anyone who comes in, you know, we have company nine that's going on their devices. Just. And do they need to keep it on forever? No, both people don't. Some people do. Some people keep it on. They will only keep it on mine. But we don't always have you. But we need it there just to serve as that edge. Okay? To be able to, because let’s face it, what are we doing when someone comes in to therapy? Discovery is just happen, right? We we need to provide a lot of education and insight. Plus this is the real key is you have to really emotionally get regulate it people at the moment. Right. We we are asking you know, the person who had betrayed to, you know, hey, I need you to stay regulated. I need you to be calm. I need you to focus on your recovery. I need you to be engaging with your partner. And I need you not to walk away from all this emotional distress, to go to you. Something that you to you did to comfort yourself before. So we've taken away the number one comforting tool we have. We throw them into this hot pot of boiling water. I said, hey, let's do that. That's why we need something like Covenant Eyes there for them. So therefore, because if not, if you're not for that, these folks are going to be...gotta run, gotta run. Well guess what? This is one place you can't run to because if you want there somebody can find out. Somebody can realize it. So again, it just gives them an edge while they're trying to learn the skills that they need and also to be able to uncover what are the reason why I'm turning to addictive behaviors. That's so important. And I love how you frame it to that. It's kind of the guardrails that we need during that, that period of time. So I think that's that's so beneficial. Well, as we bring today's episode to a close, Eddie, I would love for you to leave our listeners with a message of hope or some encouragement and also point them to where they can learn more about you and your book and any of the resources that you have available. Yeah. Well, I think from a standpoint of, hope to it. And I know what a struggle it is for many people, especially those who were at the very beginning of recovery, and especially to be trade partners who feel like, you know, it's, it's ever going to get better. Is this ever going to you? Well, I ever be able to trust again and the answer is. Yes. Yes you will if everyone does what they need to do and recovery and healing in that process, I guess it is time consuming. It is difficult. I go for the betrayed partner. It's like, why do I need to do something? I did nothing wrong. No, you're right, you did nothing wrong. The briefing you're doing get it? Because somebody hurt you. Okay? If you're in a car accident, somebody hit you and you got hurt. Look, like. Much like we're going to say, well, you don't go to a heart, but we don't need to go because you didn't. You weren't going to call to action. No, you're you have pain. And so therefore we need you because you need to learn how to you emotionally regulate also along the way because that is just going to ultimately help you, benefit you. Stay the course that’s what I ask. Stay the course. It’s going to be a rocky road that you all dealt. You've been through it for a while, but also after yourself. This question, especially for those of you who've been doing this for two plus years, three year and four years, and the work being done, what are we trying to accomplish? What what are we trying to ultimately accomplish? And what we're trying to ultimately accomplish is to help people being able to come back together, actually develop a relationship unlike anything you've had before. Don't lose sight of that goal. Many people do, because they get so caught up in their resentment and their anger and their sadness and more importantly, and their. Fear will cripple you. Please don't let fear quickly. And if you want to learn more about the Inner Child model, you want to learn more about Eddie Capparucci, all my books there, I think there's six of them now are available at Amazon, exclusively on Amazon. If you go to www.innerchild-sexaddiction.com innerchild-sex addiction.com. You can find out more about the Inner Child model and what that entails also. Oh and by the way, if anybody wants a copy of those 20 techniques, I'd love to give that to them. And you could do that by sending me an email at InnerChildModel@gmail.com. Again, InnerChildModel@gmail.com. And I will send that I've given out, I think over 750 in the last month and a half, so I'd love to have a copy of it. That is incredible, and we will be sure to put all the links in the show notes, and we'll include that email address. So if you want to get your own copy of the Inner Child, document that you mentioned, I think that would be a great tool to have in your toolbox. So definitely check out the show notes and you'll find all the links there. Listeners, I just want to thank you for tuning in. I know that you learned so much because I did and it was a great conversation. Eddie, we are so grateful for your time and you're just so wise and have so much knowledge. We're so grateful. Theo, it is always a pleasure to have you. Thank you for your thoughtful questions and listeners. Thank you for tuning in. We'll see you next time on the Covenant Eyes podcast. Take care. God bless.