EP. 29 - Beyond the Blind: What Turkey Hunting Teaches About Patience and Persistence

The springtime symphony of gobbling turkeys takes center stage as we share triumphs and near-misses from this season's turkey hunts. Brandon kicks off with his recent success, describing not just the tactical aspects of the hunt, but the pure, unbridled celebration that followed - comparing two grown men's reaction to "sorority sisters who haven't seen each other in a long time." This raw emotional response captures why turkey hunting hooks us so deeply.

We journey through several heart-pounding close calls, where Dub and John found themselves just one move away from success in. Turkey hunting truly is "a gentleman's chess game." These stories reveal the mental fortitude required when birds hang up at 100 yards, circle but never commit, or disappear after being just seconds from stepping into range. Each tale carries that familiar sting of opportunity slipping away that every turkey hunter knows all too well.

The conversation shifts to equipment preferences, with some hunters maintaining loyalty to traditional 12-gauge shotguns while others embrace newer technologies like tungsten shot that allow effective hunting with smaller gauges. We explore how the physical demands of turkey hunting vary dramatically depending on hunting style and location, challenging the notion that ounces always matter when choosing gear.

Throughout the discussion, one truth emerges repeatedly - turkey hunting delivers immediate feedback on your skills and mistakes. As John puts it, "A turkey will tell you if you do something wrong." It's this unforgiving nature that makes success so sweet and keeps hunters coming back season after season, chasing that perfect moment when preparation, patience, and opportunity converge.

Thanks for joining us on The Bowtreader Podcast. Leave a comment to let us know where you are listening from as well as any topics that you would like to hear us cover. Be sure to like the episode and subscribe to follow along. 

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Transcript

Speaker 1 1:19

let's do it there. It is liquid death there it is didn't get it on camera.

Speaker 3 1:32

Oh, that's great. No, it's already open. Now it's done. It's done. Why, why? Because I know you want to listen to this at least they don't have headphones on to like get it why? Why? Because I know you want to listen to this At least I don't have headphones on to get it in stereo here. I'll do it for you. I'm good, I'm good, all right, so let's get going. So, brandon, you got some stories to tell. You're the only successful 2025 turkey hunter sitting at this table.

Speaker 2 2:06

How's that feel? How do you define success? Just?

Speaker 3 2:08

take that in. Here's your chance.

Speaker 1 2:15

I'm going to soak in this for a minute.

Speaker 3 2:17

You better buddy, because it ain't going to last long.

Speaker 1 2:19

No, it was good I actually went with a mutual friend of ours, rustamott oh yeah he and I went and, um, it was cool, man, it it wasn't a very long hunt. Um, the bird came to us pretty quick after he flew down and actually got it on video, so that might be something we can share at some point, there you go okay so I haven't even gone back and looked at the footage yet as far as that, but it was a lot of fun.

Speaker 1 2:47

Bird gobbled a lot. It was actually a young bird, um, not a jake, but just that you could tell a younger bird and but he came in gobbling, you know, like crazy. Um came down the road to us so we could actually we could see him coming, which was pretty cool, you know. We got to watch him and then um got to shoot him in the head, so that was pretty cool. Shotgun or bow? Um, yes, both shot bow no, it was shotgun, definitely you ever seen those arrowheads that have a um, what is it?

Speaker 2 3:24

a 357 357 in it oh, wow and it hits and it pushes the bullet back into like a pin.

Speaker 1 3:31

Yeah, basically a firing pin yeah, are those legal during both seasons?

Speaker 2 3:36

absolutely not nor are they recommended, yeah because what happens when you, when you shoot a an arrow and it just like catches on a vine close to you yeah it's not, that's not good yeah so, but what's funny about it is russ and I had, we had a great time.

Speaker 1 3:56

We um, we've hunted together a couple of times this year already, and so I shot the bird, and it's funny how grown men turn into like sorority sisters that haven't seen each other in a long time when they kill a turkey together. It's like you're jumping up high five and hugging. It's like you just won a million dollars or something. So I've never experienced that, have you? No, you got to kill a turkey to do it.

Speaker 3 4:25

Not like what he's talking about it's different with his father's son okay man, I got real, real sad for a second but it was good, man, we had a great time, um, and getting the, the first bird under your belt.

Speaker 1 4:43

You know that's fun, and getting to share that with somebody, um, is a lot of fun too.

Close Calls in the Field

Speaker 3 4:49

So, um, and I've had I've had two other really close calls, man, that you walk away almost like mad in a way because you're like that should have happened and it didn't, yeah, so yeah, in a way because you're like that should have happened and it didn't, yeah, so yeah, so saturday morning, dub and I hunted and man it was um, we get outside, you know, we're, we're listening, it's dark and and, uh, an owl breaks off and a gobbler starts going on the roost. He gobbled once and we're both like, all right, we know where we got to go. So we basically, you know, fast, walk, slow, run, trying to get there Because where he was.

Speaker 3 5:36

He was at the backside of a clear cut and where we were going to be coming into the clear cut, which was the fastest way to get to it. We were going to have to walk the full length of the clear cut.

Speaker 3 5:46

And I didn't know if he could see it or what. So we get around there and we go to kind of walk in the clear cut and he gobbles again and I'm like oh my gosh, he's right there. I said there's no way we can walk out in this clear cut. We just got to set up right there. You know, I said there's no way we can walk out in this clear cut, we just got to set up right here. So I told Wes where to get and I went out and I kind of crawled out and put out a hen decoy. And then, you know, son comes up and he's still gobbling on the roost and I'm calling and he's, you know, I'd call a little bit and he'd gobble. And then we sit there for probably 10 minutes or so and a hen walks right out in the middle of the clear cut and I'm like this ain't good which we're not close enough that we can talk. Yeah, you know.

Speaker 2 6:37

So dad was on a mission to get a turkey with his bow yeah, and I'm just I'm there with my gun because I mean, if he misses, or he hits a vine and something happens and or the bird flies off with his arrow, I'm I'm there for backup. So I'm trying to get in the thickest stuff I can because I'm not blowing this hunt right. So I'm like tangled in vines just here with my gun like this, so I can't hear anything my gun like this, so I can't hear anything you couldn't.

Speaker 2 7:08

You could hear the gobbler, though, right?

Speaker 1 7:10

no, you couldn't hear, no good grief dude, I was tucked in there anyway in a hole.

Speaker 3 7:13

Yeah, he was he was laying down on his stomach and like, yeah, he was, he was ready to go, but anyway. So this hand walks out in the middle of the clear cut.

Speaker 3 7:21

She she's probably 75 yards from us or something and she's just walking around you know popping and stuff she's mad at me right and I'm thinking, okay, well, I'm going to keep calling, I'm going to try to make her mad, so she'll come down here, because if she stays between me and him he ain't coming to me. I'm sorry, you can sound real sexy with a turkey call, but you're not beating the real thing, okay and uh. So anyway, the gobbler gets down. I didn't see him fly down, but I heard him gobble from a different spot and I'm like, okay, he's down yeah something's about to happen, you know.

Speaker 3 7:57

So I'm watching, and then I see the tom walk out and there's recently clear-cut, so there's still a fire break that's running the length of it, which we had in place before we clear-cut this section. And so I see him walk across the fire break and then another one comes right behind him and then another one comes right behind him. So the first two they just walked right through the fire break, no big deal. The last one jumped over it. Wow, bro, he wasn't stepping in that fire break I don't know if he saw something they didn't, or what but he jumped over the whole fire break and then they started walking and the front bird went full strut and I'm like, okay, they're going to make their way down here. I mean they're only.

Speaker 3 8:46

I don't know, 150 yards from us or something.

Speaker 2 8:49

They were close enough that.

Speaker 3 8:50

I could see their beards when they were walking. I don't know, I couldn't see anything, but you know how long that clear cut is.

Speaker 2 8:56

I don't know where they were in the clear cut.

Speaker 3 8:57

They were all the way at the end. At the end, oh like right in front of where that double lock on set is.

Speaker 1 9:08

That's way further than 150. I can't see that far anyway. Did you have to dig him out of the vine? No, no, he got out he got out, yeah.

Speaker 3 9:16

So anyway, they, they kind of started working their way around and I did, I kind of, you know, I was on my knees because I'm going to be shooting, you know shooting my bow, so I was staying up on on my knees so I kind of crawled over to him.

Speaker 3 9:29

I said, hey, I think they're going to come around and come up right in front of us. I said so, whatever you do, do whatever you want to do, but don't move for any reason. Don't move because when they pop up, all that's going to be there is a head to start with right, and so that hen kept walking around, you know, doing her thing, clucking and popping and all this kind of stuff, and she did that for probably another five minutes and then she just walked to that back corner where those birds were roosted and disappeared. I never heard her again, never saw her again or anything, which it was weird that those toms didn't go to her.

Speaker 3 10:09

I mean, I kind of really, that's what I expected to happen. We were just going to, you know. Basically, you know, watch them do whatever they were going to do, trying to get over to that hen and not be able to do anything. But about 10 minutes go by and I'm still calling a little bit. I was kind of unsure because I didn't know where those toms were. I mean, they could have been, you know, 20 yards in front of me, on the other side of that little ridge, and I'd have never known it. And then I see something over on the side of that clear cut. So I call a couple times and I see legs going back and forth. I'm like what the heck is this? Is this another group? And then this, this jake walks up. Well, he's in this hole, right tucked in. Yeah, he has no idea, he hadn't seen this bird, the bird hadn't made a sound. So he walks along the edge of the clear cut and probably walks four or five feet in front of Wes before he sees him.

Speaker 2 11:12

That's awesome, I thought it was a hen because he had really no visible beard. I was just focused on his head to make sure he wasn't looking at me. Yeah, I could have destroyed him.

Speaker 3 11:23

Oh yeah.

Speaker 2 11:24

The wad would have been stuck in his everything yeah, yeah, he was super close.

Speaker 3 11:29

I thought wes was gonna shoot him, I mean, and I I didn't care, you know whatever. But and then he walked out and he walked over to the decoy and I could have shot him. I was like, man is going to be my first turkey with a bow. I just didn't want to shoot a Jake Now.

Speaker 2 11:46

I'll shoot a Jake, but I told you even before we left the house you are first shooter unless something weird happens.

Speaker 3 11:55

Yeah, but he didn't gobble. I mean, like Wes Chester said, if you gobble like a man you get shot like a man or die like a man. Yeah, die like a man. Yeah, yeah, yeah, but he never did so, I just didn't shoot him. But anyway, that was. You know, he walked off down that hill where I thought those toms were going to be, and then Wes said he actually saw him fly off.

Speaker 2 12:17

Yeah, I saw him fly off.

Speaker 3 12:18

I didn't see or hear that, and we stayed there for probably another 20 or 25 minutes or so and then some crows down in the creek started doing their thing, their morning ritual routine, waking up, going crazy. Not a single one of those toms made a peep.

Speaker 3 12:39

I mean there was probably 30 crows just going crazy and nothing sounded off at them. It's just a shot gobbler or whatever. So we bounced up and came back and looked somewhere else to try to see if we could see a bird. Saturday mornings are tough for us because we open at 9, so we're not able to give it a whole lot of time and we needed to get to the shop.

Speaker 2 13:04

We got to go get chocolate milk right.

Speaker 3 13:07

Yeah, somebody had to have chocolate milk. I think he wound up getting a quart of chocolate milk saturday morning and he drank the whole thing. Nice, I would surely die. Yeah, I'm just telling you, I'm just telling you it would. It would not be good for me if I drank a quart of chocolate milk.

Speaker 2 13:26

Me and Dawson went this morning and he was just there to film me. He didn't even bring his gun, he was just there to film me and call a little bit. So we kind of get out in this field, different field, and he sets up his little camping chair, because old knees and um, old knees. We just listen for a minute and don't hear anything. He stands up and does an owl call nothing, owl sounds off nothing and a crow goes off and he swears he heard a bird.

Speaker 2 13:58

yeah, I didn't hear it phantom bird, but I had my hood up because the mosquitoes were tearing me up so I mean he might have heard it. So we go down this fire break and set up under this pear tree. So there's a pear tree that's like almost like full bloom, and then a pine tree. So it was like perfect for like cameras and stuff because we were just like right up under it. We get like like 20 minutes in call a little bit, and then I kind of hear something. I'm like what is that? So I look out into this pine, into these pines that were kind of set up on, I see a fan go up like shoot. So I throw my gun up, not thinking, and he calls a little bit because I'm like strutter, strutter yeah because I'm freaking out and then never saw him again.

Speaker 2 14:52

I think he saw us moving, yeah, and then, 20 minutes after that happened, we hear clucks behind us.

Speaker 1 15:00

Yeah.

Speaker 2 15:00

Like and this hen she came up to like 40, kind of circled around, came up to like 40, and then came to our decoys at like 20. Wow, Started pecking the hen decoy. We got it all on film. It's pretty cool that is neat. Started clucking and stuff, yeah, and we were like clucking back. She was mad, yeah, and we were like, after she left, we're like we can just call it, because if a gobbler is in the area, he heard that and he's coming to that yeah, that's pretty wild.

Gear Talk: Shotguns and Strategy

Speaker 1 15:30

Yeah, I had one. It was one one morning I can't remember what morning it was and I was just gonna go real quick before I headed to the office, which it turned into more than real quick because the bird didn't gobble until late. It was one of the mornings it was like foggy and the air was just super humid and heavy.

Speaker 3 15:54

It was like that three mornings this week or two mornings this week, and so.

Speaker 1 15:58

I finally heard him, but he had to be like 250 yards away and I just kept calling. I was calling with a box call, just so it'd be louder, make sure you could hear it. So he starts coming to me. He's across a creek from me and usually there's not a ton of water so you can get through if they really want to. But he kept getting to about 100 yards and he'd make almost like a circle, just um, at about 100 yards, go out to about 200. I mean this went on for like an hour, and so finally I realized something's up.

Speaker 1 16:31

So I walked into the edge of the creek I was calling him from a food plot and where they they like to come out in that plot. So I'm like, surely you know he'll come to this. Well, I'll look in the creek and it's just tons of water. So I realized he's just hanging up somewhere in the in the creek and so this is like the one time I actually feel like I did a really good job of hunting. And so I figured out like I'm not going to get him into this food plot, but about 350, 400 yards further up the river or up the creek, not the river up the creek. I knew it was a lot more narrow and so I'm like, if I can kind of walk him down the creek to to that spot, he might cross it into this other food plot. And so I'm literally on one side of the creek, he's on the other and I'm just walking and calling and staying just ahead of him and he's following me, gobbling every now and then down the other side of the creek.

Speaker 1 17:44

I get down there and I set up and I can see the creek, I can see the food plot and there's a road that comes around the creek into the food plot. Well, I call, he gobbles about 150 yards away. Give it a second. Call again 100 yards. I'm like he's coming. Well, sit there for a few minutes. Call again 100 yards. I'm like he's coming. Well, sit there for a few minutes. Call again 50 yards. He's on the road. So he has crossed the creek, coming down the road to the food plot. So I just turned the camera.

Speaker 1 18:21

I turned just a little bit and I had a really thick, just run of briars and bushes in between me and him, run of briars and bushes in between me and him. So I turned the camera, turned my gun and I'm just waiting. I'm like I'm waiting to see that white head pop out on the other side of the thick. Stuff never happened and I still don't. I still don't know why I don't. The only the two things I thought of is one when I called he, he had gotten so close and I called with that box call. I don't know if it was just really loud and it kind of shocked him or probably he couldn't see a hen in that food plot and didn't want to come, come in when he couldn't see what he was hearing or looking for. And the third thing would be if he somehow saw me through that thick stuff, but I just don't know how he would have.

Speaker 3 19:13

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 19:13

And so, but there was something he didn't like and he, he just ended up drifting off and that was one I left and I was like just a wasted opportunity, you know, and I don't know what happened, I don't know what I did, I don't know if I did anything Right. He just changed his mind. Yeah, he may just change his mind, but it's a chess game, man.

Speaker 3 19:34

I mean it's. You know it's. If you do anything wrong, they're going to they're, they're done. They're out out, you know, but and I think that's, I think that's part of what makes it fun really, you know a turkey, a turkey will tell you if you do something wrong yeah, or somebody said, um, it's a men's chess game. Yeah gentlemen's chess game. Gentlemen's chess game. Yeah, gentlemen's chess game, that's good yeah except somebody's supposed to die yeah, I don't know it's.

Speaker 1 20:07

It's a gentleman's game until you blow their head off and that's not you know, necessarily a gentleman but yeah more savage yeah, braveheart yeah meat on the table

Speaker 1 20:19

baby Reed and I went the last one for me that was interesting is Reed and I went. We got home it was pretty late in the afternoon and there's a pasture that we'd been seeing some birds in, and so right near our house. So we changed clothes real quick, slipped down inside the wood line in the pasture, set up decoy, start calling. Here's some jakes and hens off kind of to our right a little bit and then we start hearing a gobbler coming kind of off to our left front, and so he's coming, man, and every time I call he's gobbling.

Speaker 1 21:04

This is an afternoon, so you know, like you got a good chance. Well, these jakes are over there, they're trying to gobble. We can hear some hens. Well, he's coming, he's coming straight straight to us, he right right inside the woods. And then there was a little bit of a it. It was almost just like a wet weather pond with just a little bit of water that jutted out maybe 30 yards in that pasture. Well, he's coming and I glimpsed him right on the edge of the pasture. Well, the hens and jakes are calling to our right. We're calling and he runs into the water so he goes into the woods to go around. The hens cut us off and, like I'm literally within five minutes or so, they're 250 yards oh my god, the other way yeah you know.

Turkey Hunting Challenges and Techniques

Speaker 1 21:59

And so again, he was within 75 yards of us and just couldn't quite close the deal. And I'm not the greatest turkey hunter in the world, but I feel like those two are ones you kind of kick yourself.

Speaker 3 22:14

Should have got those, yeah. So what do you turkey hunt with?

Speaker 1 22:17

20-gauge, 12-gauge, 14? I just use a 12-gauge man, I'm still kind of old school with that stuff. I'm shooting 12-gauge man. I'm still kind of old school with that stuff. I'm shooting 12-gauge three and a half.

Speaker 2 22:28

Just smoke them man Out of what kind of gun?

Speaker 1 22:30

It's a Browning A5. And it's got a full choke. I shot that turkey with a mixture of four, fives and sixes and shot him at about 50 yards. Oh, wow, I'm talking about just smoked him, fried him, I mean, and so that was cool.

Speaker 3 22:55

When I first started turkey hunting, buckshot was my.

Speaker 2 23:01

Out of that Remington.

Speaker 3 23:07

That's what I killed my first bird with with buckshot, buckshot. Yeah, double all buckshot.

Speaker 2 23:11

Yes, sir yeah, dad's got this, took him down. Dad's got this. Old, like 70 yards really gosh. Dad's got this old 12 gauge 870 express mag. I mean, I think we did the math the other day. You've had that gun for 31 years yeah is that it yeah something like that.

Speaker 1 23:29

That's cool and and you got people too that with the tungsten shot now I mean you can go down in your you know, to a 20 gauge or less, even yeah, and also was saying he killed a bird at 50 with a 410. Yeah, there's a lot of people that are doing that now with 410, because the tungsten is so much more dense, and you know, and, and so I just, I don't know, it's what I've always done, you've got a 12 gauge and so yeah yeah

Speaker 1 24:00

that's so. It's just what I do I use my.

Speaker 2 24:04

It was my first gun. It was uh, it's a youth model 870 and I just bought a turkey chuck for it.

Speaker 1 24:11

Yeah, I mean eight, 18 inch barrel, yeah that little thing is, sweet, man, that little thing is sweet and and I I get it, man it the the weight difference between a 12 gauge and 20 gauge, or a 12 gauge and a 410. I mean like that's huge. It is as much as you walk and everything we're not walking miles or anything.

Speaker 3 24:32

Though I'm, you know like I, I deal with western hunters a lot. Yeah, that are they're. They're looking at every ounce and some of them I know where they're going hunting and it's like, dude, you're, you ain't walking, you're going, you're going with this bougie, know where they're going hunting and it's like dude, you ain't walking, you're going with this bougie guide. And they're going to put you right where you need to be and you know you might walk a few miles or something.

Speaker 1 24:52

Yeah.

Speaker 3 24:54

You know. But if you're going to be walking, you know 30 miles a day or something. Yeah, ounces definitely matter, yeah, but I mean seriously the amount of walking we're going to do turkey hunting in Georgia. I mean what? What do you think the most that you've walked Like that crazy story you told us when you crossed the creek and all that kind of stuff how much did you walk that day?

Speaker 1 25:16

That day was actually less walking. The days that I kill turkeys are usually days I walk the least. I mean, you know, it's the days that you hunt all day and you're either chasing them or, you know, trying to get ahead of them, or you're just trying to locate one, and I don't know. I mean, I'm sure last Saturday I had to walk somewhere between five and ten miles. Had to, really. Yes, I mean I walked.

Speaker 3 25:49

Well, you got an Apple Watch. It'll tell you.

Speaker 1 25:51

Yeah, I don't even know. I have to go back and look at my steps. I think it was 137,000.

Speaker 3 25:57

I'm kidding, I don't know how many it was Let me tell you something All you did was walk from midnight to midnight. That's all you did was walk.

Speaker 1 26:10

But it was a long ways.

Speaker 3 26:11

Yeah.

Speaker 1 26:12

And I'm kind of I don't know stupid and determined. And those are not necessarily two good combinations stupid and determined um, because you're determined sometimes to do stupid things, and so I, you know, but it's like not taking no for an answer, so I just keep going, you know, and but yeah, so I, but that's not very often. You know what I mean. It's not very often, you're know what I mean. It's not very often you're going to walk that much. But it was my first real day of turkey season. I'm fired up so I'm just all day at it, went home, collapsed, went to bed I don't even know if I took a shower, like. I was just like so exhausted, so but it was fun, yeah, yeah that's good, I love it, man.

Speaker 3 27:08

So my first time ever turkey hunting, I was like I don't know, I was probably 11 or 12 years old. I have no idea what the law was. I don't know if I was supposed to be by myself or not, but I was the only person in my family that hunted and um, so I've got this old single shot, 12 gauge that dude this thing has a turkey hunting oh yeah I love that gun.

Speaker 2 27:37

I got that thing in my room right now. That gun is awesome yeah I want to kill.

Speaker 3 27:41

Tell you what I think so bad yeah, it's got a paper thin barrel, so I don't know how it's gonna do.

Speaker 2 27:46

I'm just gonna shoot like blindside yeah I've shot blindside out of that yeah, let's not shoot.

Speaker 3 27:52

You've shot steel out of that before. Yeah, it probably cut that barrel up no, I looked at it, it's fine but anyway, so I'm, I'm, I'm hunting with that and I've got a mouth call and that's all I've got. You know something I picked up at walmart or whatever and like night and hail yeah, I guarantee you that's what it was. Um but um because we didn't have. We didn't have bass pro or anything like that. You know, you grab something at walmart or hendrick's shop or something like that.

Speaker 3 28:20

1990s probably, yeah, early 90s yeah yeah, it would have had to been um so and we, we had turkeys, but not. It's not like we, not like it is now yeah, and so I'm in this past you were turkeys, but a lot less fewer turkey hunters oh, yeah, yeah, for sure, yeah, yeah, yeah, I only knew.

Speaker 3 28:44

I only knew one or two turkey hunters at the time and you know, like I said, I'm 11 or 12 years old, so I'm not really, you know, in the hunting game or whatever. But so I'm in this pasture and the guy that cut hay on it, he would just stack, he'd line the bales of hay up. He wouldn't put them end to end, he'd put them side to side. So you could, you could. It was like you know, you figure, you put two circles next to each other yeah, you got that big spot right there, right, so I I crawled in right there that was my blind.

Speaker 3 29:24

So I'm sitting there calling and I got the gun you know laid up under me. I have no idea how I was going to get it up to shoot a bird, if a bird were to come. I'm sitting there calling, calling, and apparently I sounded like something dying because here comes the coyote.

Speaker 3 29:38

Oh my gosh, yeah and you know, like I said, I'm 11 or 12 years old, so I didn't have it in my mind that I needed to shoot this coyote. I just when I saw him, I just kind of like started hitting the ground, like get away from me. Anyway, that was my first experience, turkey hunting, so your first experience was a whole lot different.

Speaker 2 29:58

Well, I'd hunted before that. Yeah, that's true, we've been turkey hunting ever since we got the property.

Speaker 3 30:06

Yeah, your first time with a gun, though, where you were actually going to be harvesting a bird.

Speaker 2 30:11

Be harvesting, oh so those times on youth weekend back, no, no, no, it was like wow no, no, wow, I'm sorry I've misspoken.

Speaker 3 30:23

You've hunted a lot, actually I've hunted a pretty decent few times yeah forgot about all those man yeah remember we anyway I know with griffin.

Speaker 2 30:37

Griffin lost column calling privileges pretty quick. Anytime we go anywhere we take his calls.

Speaker 3 30:44

Yeah number one way not to kill a duck give Griffin a duck call. It's so bad at.

Speaker 1 30:51

RNT calls up in.

Speaker 3 30:52

Stuttgart, arkansas. They've got this big thing on the wall that says I'm going to butcher it, but it says something like the best thing for conservation is a duck call in somebody's hands who doesn't know how to use it yeah it goes something like that but um, yeah, it's, yeah, he's, he's, he'll get there, he's, he's got that drive and that determination and an extra dose of stupidity so yeah, yeah so he'll, he'll get there.

Speaker 3 31:25

But anyway, jackson went um. He works here in the shop. He got a bird up in dublin this past uh, monday, tuesday, yeah, tuesday, tuesday morning, so he had a successful morning. We actually posted that up on social media all that. That bird had the whitest legs I've ever seen. It was nuts. Yeah, I mean, I've, I've seen in videos, I've seen birds with light legs, but man the picture didn't do it justice. It was white, it was pretty wild.

Speaker 2 31:54

I mean old bird. His spurs were dull, Dull spurs. You know how you see on younger birds. I'm sure the bird you shot was sharp Good bird though. He had a good time.

Speaker 3 32:06

He was going to join us for the podcast this afternoon.

The Unpardonable Sin Discussion

Speaker 2 32:10

Currently he is drowning in homework.

Speaker 3 32:12

Yep, yep, yep, he has to get ready for a test or either is taking a test right now or something Gotcha. I tell these boys you know, guys, listen, we're going to have a lot of fun, we're going to do a lot of work, but school comes first. Yeah, that's what they're here for. So I want to make sure that I'm encouraging them in that way so they stick it out. They get somewhere around that third year and they're, they're, they're over it. Yeah, like they're done, they don't care, they don't, you know, and I'm like it's, it's.

Speaker 3 32:40

At that point I started asking you know, how'd you do on this test, right, no, no, no, not. Okay, how'd you do? Like, what did you actually get? And, um, not because you know I'm going to give them something that they did great, or not give them something that they did bad or anything like that, but just to talk through it with them and encourage them a little bit because, man, I get it it's. You know, sometimes when you get to that point, whether you're hunting or going through school or whatever, you'll get to a point where you just want to quit. Sure, you know.

Speaker 2 33:10

and so I've enjoyed being able to encourage those young guys with that, With all those years you spent in college, I mean you can help them with all those tests.

Speaker 3 33:21

I learned pretty quick that I needed to get as far away from school as I possibly could, and so that's what I did.

Speaker 2 33:31

Didn't go to college.

Speaker 3 33:32

No, no, look deep in my eyes. There's no college there.

Speaker 2 33:36

Fake one or your real one?

Speaker 3 33:38

Yes.

Speaker 2 33:39

Okay, yeah, yeah, you didn't know that he's got a fake retina. Is that what it is?

Speaker 3 33:46

Lens.

Speaker 2 33:46

Lens. He's got a fake lens in his right eye yep, so you can.

Speaker 1 33:51

Can you see out of it?

Speaker 2 33:52

yeah, okay, it's actually like it's a thermal lens, ah yeah there you go there.

Speaker 1 33:59

Can you like zoom in and out with it? So?

Speaker 3 34:02

that's the catch. Yeah, you know, men can build some really cool stuff. Yeah right, I mean they really can, but we're not nearly as cool as god is.

Speaker 3 34:13

Yeah, so that lens that god gave you when he knit you in your mother's womb can focus yeah right you can look at, you can read something right here and then you can look up and you can see something you know 20 feet away or 20 yards away I'm dialed in at 20 feet with my right eye, that's it. That's I mean, like I can close my left eye. I can read, you know, the stuff on those targets over there. Um, I can read the stuff on that on, on that light over there and stuff like that. I can kind of make out some of the the packaging you know hanging up over there. But uh, if I, if I try to, you know, look at my phone with my right eye, dude, it's just a blur. I mean it's I can see the light from the phone, but that's it so like you, shoot right-handed shoot right-handed.

Speaker 3 34:58

Yeah, shoot with both eyes open, okay, always yeah, shotgun and everything, yep gotcha yeah gotcha so um and like with a scope or something, I'm fine. You know, I got to kind of play with the relief a little bit, but I'm fine. Iron sights it's a little bit of a challenge. Shotgun no problem at all. That's good, yeah no problem at all.

Speaker 2 35:21

When I figured out that, you know, I knew dad had something wrong with his right eye. I mean, he told me before, but I mean I mean when I was a kid I couldn't really understand it. I just knew he killed a bunch of stuff. Yeah, ducks, I mean, whatever he pointed the gun at, it was gonna die. And now that I'm older and I'm starting to hunt more and I start missing stuff yeah, with two perfectly good eyes.

Speaker 2 35:44

So much more mad when he kills more ducks than me, because I'm like you do it yeah but not having depth.

Speaker 3 35:52

Depth perception is tough, yeah, with a lot of things, yeah early on, like after I had to have the surgery and stuff. Like that man I'd walk into walls and stuff all the time. Like it it was, it was legit, like it was comical. It's funny except when it hurt you. It wasn't that funny, then it's funny to everybody else. It took me a little while to get used to it, no, big problems.

Speaker 2 36:16

Little shammies in eyes Not good.

Speaker 3 36:19

Yeah, it'll mess you up. People say that instead of wearing safety glasses, they get their safety squints. Don't work, don't work. Went straight through my eyelid Straight into my eye. Work, don't work. Went straight through my eyelid straight into my eye. So yep, there you go.

Speaker 2 36:32

Safety glasses, not safety squints.

Speaker 3 36:34

Yes, definitely, and you know, I was always the one who had safety glasses on, Like I always wore them because I, you know, would work outside and I just wore safety glasses that were tinted. They were sunglasses, but they were safety glasses and I actually broke my sunglasses earlier that day and got in a hurry doing something. That's when it happens. I didn't think about needing safety glasses on and took a chisel and was beating it with a hammer Something popped right in my eye.

Speaker 3 37:09

That's when you were doing piping atlanta yeah, I was uh doing, uh doing a tunnel in atlanta, yeah, so, yeah. So had I gone to college, I would have gotten that fun experience of, uh, you know, traveling the country and doing all kinds of crazy stuff before babies started coming along so it's good stuff ally ruined it no way, man. She's the best thing that ever happened to me. Besides, your mom guaranteed wow. Wow. I mean like in order, just wow, that was yeah, open mouth insert foot, so it was more of a timing thing.

Speaker 3 37:51

It was more of a timing thing.

Speaker 1 37:54

There's no way you made this right.

Speaker 2 37:55

No, you're digging yourself a deeper hole.

Speaker 3 37:57

There's no way.

Speaker 2 37:58

But you're great, you're great, I'm just great. What are you a?

Speaker 3 38:03

woman. Stop, stop. No, it's just. It was a timing thing, man. I don't know how old I. I was 22 or 23 or whatever when ally was born. So I was turning 23 the year she was born.

Speaker 1 38:18

So rock and roll so funny thing talking about sticking your foot in your mouth, and it made me think about this. So evidently my age is showing a lot more um. So the other day I'm yeah, the other day I'm I'm going through mcdonald's to get breakfast and I pull up to the to get my food and the girl working at the window she looked at me. She goes sir, did you have the senior coffee? Yes, yes, I did. And I was like absolutely, that's cheaper. And so then, um, I'm talking with a lady and, uh, my youngest son is with me and so we're talking and she's talking about her kids and they're a lot younger than mine. She's a lot younger, and we were talking about, um, just, you know our, our families and that kind of thing. And so when she looks at my, my youngest son, and she goes well, I figured he was the youngest one that you had.

Speaker 3 39:30

And I'm like I thought she was going to say your grandson it was not as bad as. I thought it was going to be.

Speaker 1 39:37

That wasn't it, but it was just one of those things where she wasn't thinking like what she was saying, but I definitely heard it. So yeah. I've seen your coffees and yeah, so definitely getting older and you feel it hunting too, like just the walking and stuff like that you do feel it you'll be carrying a 410 before we know.

Speaker 3 40:00

I know man?

Speaker 1 40:01

yeah, I'll just start letting my youngest son carry my gun for me.

Speaker 2 40:06

See, see him carry you what he couldn't do that no yeah, we, we wouldn't get 20 yards, he'd be broke down trying to carry me in illinois the first time he went up there. Um, I have not grown a lot since then, maybe two or three inches maybe. I rode on a bike trailer rated for a hundred pounds. Yeah, for like half a mile, that's on a paved road.

Speaker 2 40:40

It was smooth, it was no big deal yeah, it made the the skid marks a lot worse. That that trailer breaks my elbows just eat it, because I'm holding two bows and yeah, you were holding all the crap.

Speaker 1 40:55

Yeah, so are y'all. When are y'all hunting again?

Speaker 2 41:00

y'all hunting tomorrow I'm hunting tomorrow, yeah dubs hunting tomorrow.

Speaker 3 41:04

I don't know if I will or not. Um I may, but I don't know.

Speaker 2 41:09

Yeah.

Speaker 3 41:10

So we'll see.

Speaker 2 41:11

I know where I'm going to. I think I know where that bird's roosted Maybe I have no idea, not a high level of confidence, though.

Speaker 3 41:20

They're not like us. They're not going to the same house every night.

Speaker 2 41:23

Exactly.

Speaker 3 41:24

You know, I mean they're going to be in the same area. It's not like that bird's going to be in Dublin tomorrow or something, but they're not going to the exact same house. If you did, that'd be kind of cool. Yeah, it'd be easy. You just figure them out, then just go to that spot, boom done, so anyway, but yeah, so that's where we're at so far. We've gotten a lot of stories from people about successful turkey season so far.

Speaker 3 41:54

When we posted that picture up, that, uh, the bird jackson got man, we got this, uh, this onslaught of of pictures and uh, youtube videos that people have taken and everything. So, um, you know, like I said, you know, when we first started talking about turkey season a couple weeks ago, I think the bird numbers are really healthy. I think I think we, we should have a very good season. You know, that's just that's my, that's my take on it. Um, looking at it so, um, but anyway, yeah, that's where we're at. So, so, a conversation that Dub and I were having this week and we kind of touched on it a little bit before we went hot with the mics and everything today was, I guess, was it a video that you watched or something? How did this come up? Tell me again how we got here.

Speaker 2 42:46

I was just scrolling TikTok one day.

Speaker 3 42:49

On knick-knack, there we go I was bored, I didn't really have anything, you were what.

Speaker 2 42:53

Bored. I didn't really have anything else to do.

Speaker 3 42:56

I was bored. We're going to fix that, but go ahead with your story.

Speaker 2 43:00

It was a Monday and it was raining.

Speaker 3 43:02

Oh, yeah, okay, All right. Bored, bored anyway his heart rate immediately went up.

Speaker 2 43:10

You can't fix this anyway, I'm just scrolling tiktok and I see something about somebody talking about the unforgivable sin. I'm just like I just I was just curious about it, so I asked dad.

Speaker 3 43:25

And what did dad?

Speaker 1 43:25

do? He said go look at TikTok and find out the answer. Yeah, I said boy go figure it out.

Speaker 2 43:31

Get out of here.

Speaker 3 43:33

Get out of here, go figure it out.

Speaker 2 43:34

Go have a meeting with Reverend Google.

Speaker 3 43:36

Reverend Google Speaking of that, did you see the pastor that told the ushers to lock the doors?

Speaker 1 43:45

No, Lock the doors until he got $40,000.

Speaker 2 43:49

What yes?

Speaker 1 43:51

So basically he kidnapped the whole congregation.

Speaker 2 43:53

Yes.

Speaker 1 43:53

Something like that.

Speaker 2 43:54

Yeah, If my family was in that church which it wouldn't be to begin with, I mean bam, we'd get out of there. Yeah, Bro.

Speaker 3 44:04

Yeah, I mean, and that was in Georgia where that happened. Yeah, told them to say there was 1,000 people there, that $40,000 shouldn't be a number that they can't meet or something. I haven't watched all of it, I just saw. I started seeing some stuff about it on X that's where I get the majority of my news is X, because I don't like watching the news or TV period. So, anyway, I saw something about it there and I'm like what the heck is this about? And then saw some more stuff about it and then another pastor was like trolling him.

Speaker 1 44:39

Yeah.

Speaker 3 44:40

And so I guess maybe this was not this past Sunday but the Sunday before, yeah, and then this past Sunday or something, at another service that the pastor was like um said all right, all right, y'all go ahead and lock the doors, or something you know. He said no, no, no, we don't do that here. We don't, don't worry, we don't do that here. But that that is insane, man, it is insane, that is absolutely insane, but I don't know a whole lot about it. I'm sure there's somebody that's going to listen to this, that knows everything about it and could tell us everything that took place, but that's pretty wild, yeah, but anyway, talking about the unforgivable sin and what this guy said in the video that Dub watched, was that the unforgivable sin is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. And he did.

Speaker 3 45:28

He cited a Bible verse and I'll pull that up right now and we'll look at it Matthew 12, 31. And, by the way, I don't know if I've talked about this before on the podcast, but the app called Bible Ref, I think is the name of it. Yeah, bible Ref. Download that app. It's awesome.

Speaker 1 45:53

Yeah, it's really good.

Speaker 3 45:54

Click a verse, you can click on a verse and you get all the different.

Speaker 3 45:56

All the different ones, All the different versions of it right there. So it's. I highly recommend it. It's new. So anyway, Matthew 12, 31. Jesus said, therefore I tell you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven, people, but the blasphemy against the spirit will not be forgiven. And whoever speaks a word against the son of man will be forgiven, but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or the age to come. So that's the. That is the scripture that he referenced when he was answering that question about what is the unforgivable or unpardonable sin or or, you know, however you want to, however you want to state that, and that's true, that is there, it is in scripture. But the catch, or the the kind of the caveat for us is that Jesus is no longer here, walking on this earth as a man performing miracles. Right, so what? What had happened there was, the Pharisees has said um that Jesus was his power came from an evil spirit.

Speaker 1 47:06

Yeah, he was casting out demons right, the power of demons. Yeah, he was casting out demons, right, the power of demons. Basically, yeah, so he was casting out demons.

Speaker 3 47:12

He was healing blind people, doing the things that he was doing with gaining power from an evil spirit. So that's what Jesus was talking about. And then from there, there is a distinct difference in the way Jesus was teaching. That took place and that's something that Brandon's been going through at church recently, so we're going to kind of talk through some of that today. That distinct difference was after this happened. Jesus began teaching in parables, right, and so if you look at parables, parables and proverbs are very similar, but they're not the same. Okay, so a proverb would be. Okay, so a proverb would be a proverb. I guess you could describe it as saying kind of part of a story or something right, Trying to put you out of the way he should go and he'll never depart from you.

Speaker 1 48:22

More like it's just a statement.

Speaker 3 48:23

Yeah, it's like a snippet of something yeah, it's like a snippet of something Whereas a parable you tell a story that is like how it is in the kingdom of God, that's how Jesus was doing that. So that's kind of the difference between a proverb and a parable, but they could both be kind of categorized in the same thing. You understand that? Yeah, okay so, brandon. You understand that? Yeah, okay. So, brandon, you said that this is something that you guys have been looking at at church and kind of teaching through.

Speaker 3 48:58

So what have y'all been looking at as far as that goes?

Speaker 1 49:01

We've been going through a series called Kingdom of God, and so we're looking at parables that Jesus said the kingdom of heaven or the kingdom of God is like, and so, and what do we learn about the kingdom from those parables? But one of the things that we've talked a good bit about is why Jesus spoke in parables. You know why did he do that in the first place? And so you know, in Matthew 13, 34, this is obviously right after he's talked about the blasphemy of the Holy Spirit, I think that was sort of the last straw, so to speak, with him and the Pharisees, and so who were the religious leaders of that day? And he realizes, as he's Jesus, he knows that their hearts are so hardened towards the truth, and so there were prophecies that the Messiah, the one who came to save, would speak in parables.

Speaker 1 49:59

In Matthew 13, 34, it says Jesus spoke all these things to the crowd in parables. He did not say anything to them without using a parable, so was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet. I will open my mouth in parables. He did not say anything to them without using a parable, so was fulfilled what was spoken through the prophet. I will open my mouth in parables, I will utter things hidden since the creation of the world.

Speaker 1 50:16

And so to me, what's really cool about that is, especially in that area of the world and in that time, the goal of a teacher was for truth to be discovered, more than truth to just be given. And if you think about discovering truth, how much more powerful that is than just me telling you something. So Jesus begins to teach in parables so that truth seekers would discover truth. And it wasn't that he didn't want people to know the truth, it was that he wanted those who desired, who would seek, who would knock, who would ask. Those are the ones who would discover the truth that he was speaking about. And so you look at um the disciples. They come to him after some of the parables and they say you know, master, explain this to us.

Speaker 1 51:12

Jesus is not like no, you're dumb, I'm not going to tell you. Jesus explains the parables to him, and so it's not that he didn't want anyone to know, it's just that he wanted people to seek after truth. And a lot of times we think about parables and we think about you hear people say well, jesus spoke in these ways that people could understand, like so the farmer goes out to sow seed. They could relate to that, they can understand that, and so it made it easier to understand. But it was the exact opposite reason that he was teaching in parables. It was so that it wouldn't be the truth of that parable wouldn't be readily apparent. It was so that you would have to seek to understand.

Speaker 1 51:57

And so it's really cool that Jesus is revealing the mysteries of the kingdom through these parables and it's there for us, if we'll seek the truth and we have the promise that the Holy Spirit will lead us into all truth, and so. But I think it is pretty interesting how Jesus sort of switched his teaching style so that it would be those who sought him and sought after God. That would be those who sought him and sought after God that would be able to understand truth. And so to me that's just a really cool thing to know that if I ask, you know, if I seek I'll find. If I knock, the door will be open, that he's going to reveal himself to us if we just seek truth.

Speaker 3 52:52

Right, yeah, so in verse 1 of Matthew 13,. This was after he had kind of had his dialogue with the Pharisees and kind of said they're in bad shape because they're not getting forgiven for you know what they've done. Right? It says that same day Jesus went out of the house and sat beside the sea and great crowds gathered about him so that he got into a boat and sat down and the whole crowd stood on the beach and he told them many things in parables, saying a sower went out to sow and he and he, and as he sowed seeds, some seeds fell on the path. The birds came and devoured them. Other seeds fell on rocky ground where they did not have much soil, and immediately they sprang up, since they had no depth of soil. But when the sun rose they were scorched and since they had no root, they were withered away. Other seeds fell among thorns and the thorns grew up and choked them. Other seeds fell among good soil and produced grain. Some are hundredfold, some 60, some 30. Who? He who has ears let him hear then verse 10.

Speaker 3 54:01

Then the disciples came and said to him what the heck are you doing, right?

Biblical Insights on Repentance

Speaker 3 54:05

They said why do you speak to them in parables, and he answered them and said to you it has been given to know the secrets of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it has not been given.

Speaker 3 54:15

So basically, to your point, what Jesus is saying, I want to tell it to them in a different way, and I want them to want to know, I want them to have that desire, I want them to figure it out, I want them to have that desire, I want them to figure it out because, you know, I mean, planting seeds is something that most people have done at some point, you know. But, yeah, I know, in in Western society, we have this idea that if you know we want to eat something, we just go to the grocery store and get it. But somebody had to grow that right, right, so, um, so, evidently, or you know, presumably these people would understand that, okay, seeds have to be planted and they have to be planted somewhere where they're going to grow. So it would help them understand it in that way. But then they would really have to seek and understand and dig deeper. And he was just giving them something to kind of sink their teeth into.

Speaker 1 55:17

Yeah, something that they have to ponder, because the illustration's simple, but the core truth behind it is not easily understood.

Speaker 3 55:31

You know, and I think, something else that we need to keep in mind anytime we're reading the Bible and studying Scripture. Number one without the Holy Spirit, we're not understanding any of it. We don't understand any of it without the Holy Spirit. Number two we have a benefit that they did not have, because we're reading all of Scripture from a New Testament perspective, right, right and they didn't have that.

Speaker 3 55:59

They didn't have the whole story. So I just love the way that Jesus went in and he found ways to get people. He seasoned his speech with salt and it made people thirsty, it made people want to eat, it made people want to know more and I just think it's awesome.

Speaker 3 56:17

To me it shows, it is a picture of God's mercy that he did that that he said no, I'm going to do it this way, I'm going to change the way I'm doing it. Those Pharisees, they've made their decision. To your point. Their hearts are completely hardened, they have hearts of stone. And even though he offered, he said I will remove your heart of stone. That's what was prophesied. And they knew that prophecy. Yeah, they knew it. Yeah, better than anybody else did.

Speaker 3 56:53

You know, I mean, the way the Pharisees kind of got started was a great. It was a pure motive to start with. You know, you have these 400 years where there's nothing happening, yeah, just complete silence. And they wanted to make sure to preserve the way they wanted to do things, to make it so people were not just going to forget, yeah. But then they became so legalistic about it and created so many rules and laws and statutes that you had to follow that it became more about the law and less about, you know, the, the, the idea of a messiah is coming, and you know what? What is that going to look like? Why is he coming? You know it was, it was, it wasn't even part of their, their, thought anymore.

Speaker 1 57:42

It completely got away from the intent of the law that was given by God and the heart condition behind fulfilling it, and just to the act of doing it, and which is legalism.

Speaker 3 57:57

Right yeah.

Speaker 1 57:57

Doing the right thing with the wrong motive is not good.

Speaker 3 58:03

It's wrong.

Speaker 1 58:04

Yeah.

Speaker 3 58:04

Yeah, I mean it's just wrong and that's true in anything that we do. You know if we're doing the right thing, but with the wrong motive, you know it's okay. I guess, if, if you know, hopefully, if we'll do the right thing let's say you're struggling, like we talked about before, you're struggling to forgive somebody, but you know you don't need to do wrong to that person just because you're mad at them Well, do right and hopefully the rest of you will follow suit, right, right. So I mean, I guess not having the right motive is not necessarily cut and dry. It's not like it's black and white there.

Speaker 1 58:41

I mean there's a process of forgiveness and things like that that you've got to go through, and restoration may never truly happen, but anyway, I just think that the doing the right thing with the wrong motive is true when it comes to, like, the core of your relationship with god.

Speaker 1 58:59

Like if I'm just doing the right thing because I'm trying to earn god's favor and his love and be a good person, then that's where I think we're missing it, you know, because that's just having a form of religion, you know, and denying the power of God that actually changes our heart. So that's where I think that motive comes in. To me, I think that's what separates legalism from a true, you know, relationship with the Lord is if has God changed my heart? Has he taken my heart of stone and given me a heart that desires him and desires to follow him? Has he put his decrees in my heart and move me to follow him? Or is it still just, um, a task oriented type of thing that I do just because this is what Christians do, or good people do, or because I'm afraid of hell, or whatever it might be?

Speaker 3 1:00:01

So right, yeah, all right. So let's get into what the unpardonable sin is. Did we answer your question about that? So what is the unpardonable sin?

Speaker 2 1:00:11

Not choosing to forgive.

Speaker 3 1:00:13

No.

Speaker 2 1:00:13

No, not choosing to repent.

Speaker 3 1:00:15

Not choosing to repent right so, having a hard heart, never accepting the fact that you need a Savior, right so, and a good story about that is when Christ was being crucified, and we talked a little bit about this before and I've shared with y'all we're going through the seven sayings of Christ on the cross. Jesus went through and he said, father, forgive them, for they know, not what they do.

Speaker 3 1:00:58

He was talking about. You know the severity of what they had done. Then they cast lots to divide his garments and the people stood by watching. But the ruler scoffed at him, saying he saved others, let him save himself If he is the Christ of God, his chosen one. The soldiers also mocked him, coming up and offering him sour wine and saying If you are the king of the Jews, save yourself. There was also an inscription over him that said this is the king of the Jews.

Speaker 3 1:01:24

One of the criminals who were hanged railed at him, saying Are you not the Christ? Save yourself and us. But the other, meaning the other criminal, the other guy that was on the other cross, the other criminal, rebuked him, saying Do you not fear God, since you are under the same sentence of condemnation and we, indeed justly, for we are receiving the due reward for our deeds. Now here's what we have here. This is, this is. This is a cool picture of humanity right displayed in these two, in these two thieves that are hung on on, that are nailed to crosses, being crucified on either side of Jesus. At first, both criminals were, you know, jeering at Jesus and saying you know, what are you doing up here. I thought you were the Messiah. All this kind of mess, right, they were making fun of him saying things, saying ugly things and all this kind of stuff.

Speaker 3 1:02:51

But then, at some point, one of the criminals who was who was being crucified had a complete change of. He had a complete change of posture. Yeah, when one of the criminals said you know, aren't you the Christ? Get yourself down and save us too. You've got to believe. He said it in a sarcastic way or with a negative connotation to it. Come on, man, what are you doing? You can save all of us right now. You're not who you say you are. And the other one said man, are you crazy? This is the John paraphrase. Are you crazy? Don't you fear God? Now, what? What does he mean by that? Don't you? Don't you fear God? Yeah, what do you think he meant by that? Wes, I'm putting you on the spot, but we're just having a conversation. Remember, nobody listens to this. I don't know. You know what I mean, brandon. What do you think he meant? Don't you even fear God?

Speaker 1 1:03:55

Yeah, I think that you can look at it a couple ways. In that situation he may be speaking of actually the fear of God that, hey, you're about to die, and your soul's about to go to hell.

Speaker 3 1:04:09

Yeah, so the NLT version says. But the other criminal protested don't you? Don't you fear God, even when you have been sentenced to die?

Speaker 1 1:04:16

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:04:17

You know meaning. Hey bud, this is like your last chance, yeah exactly, and so he's about to face eternity.

Speaker 1 1:04:23

Um, and what I like about that is the one who did turn to Christ. He said we are condemned justly. He realizes that their condemnation is right.

Speaker 3 1:04:37

All right. So stop right there. We're condemned justly. So what did he do? He dealt with the fact that he was wrong, yes, right. He dealt with the fact that, okay, I have sinned against, I've broken the law. Okay, let's take the word sin out. Y'all know I don't like speaking christianese. He, he had broken the law, he had done wrong and there was a penalty, there was a consequence for doing that, and he was. He was experiencing his consequence for doing what he knew was not right to do. Okay, continue. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off.

Speaker 1 1:05:09

That's good, but you know, obviously he realizes he's condemned for doing what he knew was not right to do. Okay, continue. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off. No, that's good. But you know, obviously he realizes he's condemned and so he turns to Christ.

Speaker 1 1:05:18

But what had to happen in order for him to turn to Jesus is he had to have a change of mind about Jesus, and I believe that's what repentance is. Is it's a change of mind that leads to a change of mind about Jesus, and I believe that's what repentance is. Is it's a change of mind that leads to a change of direction? And so, or a second thought that corrects, you know, a first thought, that changes our direction. And so sin is not just an act, sin is a direction of life, it's moving away from God, it's rebelling against God. And so when we, as the prodigal son did, come to our senses and we have a change of mind, we realize we have a change of perspective about who Jesus is, we turn and we begin to walk towards God. And that seems to me to be what happened for the one who did repent, who did turn to Jesus. He had a change of mind about who Christ is. The other one never did, and so the unforgivable sin is the one who refused to repent.

Speaker 3 1:06:24

Right and all right. So we can't ignore the fact that the Holy Spirit was working on both of those criminals while this was taking place, right? And so we can't ignore the fact that the Holy Spirit was working on both of those criminals while this was taking place, right, right, because there's no salvation apart from the work of the Holy Spirit. There's no understanding scripture apart from the work of the Holy Spirit. So there was a veil removed. I believe there was a veil removed from both of their eyes, as they're now. I believe there was a veil removed from both of their eyes as they're now. You know, this is just. This is my perspective on it. I just can't imagine being nailed to a cross next to Jesus. Regardless of what my beliefs are or anything, I can't imagine being nailed to a cross next to Jesus and not thinking. You know even for a moment. Man is, he, is he who, he who.

Speaker 3 1:07:08

he said he was you know what's going on here and so I don't have anything to back it up with the, with the criminal who continued to rail against him and everything. But with the criminal who said you know, he doesn't deserve this, we deserve this. God, you know or not, god, but I don't even know if he called him by name. He just said remember me, and that was it. That's all he had to do. There's no magic words that you have to say. There's no ceremony that you have to go through. Should you be baptized? Yes, absolutely you should be. It's out of obedience to Christ that you should be baptized, but I'm telling you right now that dude that did that we're going to see him in heaven one day. I am 100% certain of that. He's there.

Speaker 1 1:08:01

Well, yeah, Jesus didn't lie to him. No, no sir.

Speaker 3 1:08:05

No sir, he didn't start sinning once he got hung on the cross. I think it's a really cool thing that we look at and that it didn't really tie in with our hunting stories today. But that's okay, it was something that came up this week, something for us to talk through. It's good for us to understand what our like you said, what our trajectory is. We come into this world where our trajectory is a crash course with hell.

Final Thoughts and Wrap-up

Speaker 1 1:08:36

Yeah, period, that's it.

Speaker 3 1:08:38

You know, and God in his mercy made a way for that not to be our final destination, and it could go all the way to the point of, you know, a deathbed confession, so to speak.

Speaker 1 1:08:55

I wouldn't take that chance.

Speaker 3 1:08:57

There's so much more to life than that. You know, I'm not saved for heaven, I'm saved for today, and I get to look at life in a completely different way. I get to look at people in a completely different way. I get to look at people in a completely different way. I'm so thankful to God that he decided to lift that veil from my eyes and give me the opportunity to live under his grace and mercy, here and now. That's a long way of answering that question, but we got there.

Speaker 1 1:09:33

It's good stuff. I can tell by the look on your face, Dub, that you tracked every bit of it.

Speaker 3 1:09:40

He is literally about to starve to death. He's a 16-year-old boy and he hasn't eaten in the last 40 minutes.

Speaker 1 1:09:48

Yeah, he just needs a quarter of chocolate milk. That's what he needsyear-old boy and he hasn't eaten in the last 40 minutes. Yeah, he just needs a quarter chocolate milk. That's what he needs.

Speaker 2 1:09:53

Oh boy, next podcast. No, I'll get one, I'll get two.

Speaker 1 1:09:58

Where are you going to?

Speaker 3 1:10:00

get milk in the can. You're going to get milk in the can. Do they make that? No, yeah, yoo-hoo.

Speaker 1 1:10:08

That's not milk, that's not milk.

Speaker 3 1:10:10

That's not milk, all right. Well, that's it. Let's kill it, hit the button, let's get out of here.