Paul and Geoff are joined by Jonny "Passenger" Mathers AND a veritable cornucopia of Thirteenth Doctor fans in this episode to talk about why we love Jodie Whittaker's Thirteenth Doctor!
And do you know what we called the episode?
We Love The Thirteenth Doctor - that's what!
As we near the end of her era, we wanted to celebrate our love for Jodie's wonderful Doctor with fellow fans and find out why they love her, what made them connect so deeply to her and what it was like when they met her at conventions...
We're joined by some Twitter names you might recognise...
Dom @domtoorwho
Mackenzie Flohr @MackenzieFlohr
Mark Clowes @vinyl_librarian
Matt The Whovian @Matt_TheWhovian
Annie TQED @AnnieTQED
Doctor Hugh @DoctorWhoHugh
Aiden @aidencg01
Follow us on Twitter!
Who Corner to Corner: Great guests and 100% positive Doctor Who chat!
Paul and Geoff are joined by Jonny "Passenger" Mathers AND a veritable cornucopia of Thirteenth Doctor fans in this episode to talk about why we love Jodie Whittaker's Thirteenth Doctor!
And do you know what we called the episode?
We Love The Thirteenth Doctor - that's what!
As we near the end of her era, we wanted to celebrate our love for Jodie's wonderful Doctor with fellow fans and find out why they love her, what made them connect so deeply to her and what it was like when they met her at conventions...
We're joined by some Twitter names you might recognise...
Dom @domtoorwho
Mackenzie Flohr @MackenzieFlohr
Mark Clowes @vinyl_librarian
Matt The Whovian @Matt_TheWhovian
Annie TQED @AnnieTQED
Doctor Hugh @DoctorWhoHugh
Aiden @aidencg01
Follow us on Twitter!
Who Corner to Corner: Great guests and 100% positive Doctor Who chat!
Good evening, everyone. Welcome to this special Who Call. It's called a podcast. Thank you very much for joining us. So you might have noticed that we're joined tonight by our special guest host, Mr. Johnny Mathis. Hello to you. Well, you may not recognize him without his second from the show, but if you. Look at that. Glass. We've got passenger. Seats. That are put back on here. All right. Yes. We discussed this. You said you'd worked the whole time. So thank you very much for joining us tonight, Johnny, to to chat with us and other fans about the 13th Doctor and the show. So, hello, Mike. How you doing? Your eyes? Oh, hi. So that's that's cool because it's weird. I know your voice is from the podcast, but I'm never quite sure he's. Sick right now. You could say. That. You see him? Yeah, and. You're still here, so that's a good thing. Now, you. Can. You can. You can put a face to the voice. So funny. So makes. Me laugh every. Time. Next time you listen. You know, we had a picture of us as well as our dulcet tones. So that was. If. You all. He's good. Jeff, I already hear your tweets in your voice. Oh, really? So I guess I must have figured out I'm. Is that good or bad? It adds to the gravitas. Yeah, I think yeah. I think it helps. You when you're getting angry about Lego set. Just it's just. I just want to order the Lego avatar. I. I know you do. I know. I've seen you going on about it. Yeah. I'm feeling in pain around. Like you said to me, you can order on the 1st of October. That's when you better get it on the first. I want to order it now. I want it. Now. I want it now. I won't tell him no. I know someone who works for Lego. Oh, man. Really? Yeah. So now I'm going. To buy me. Thanks for inviting the guy. Thank you. For was formally. Honored to be here. Yes. See that? Now this our profession, we are that our audience member has brought us on track. So thanks for that. Really remarkable to. Make. So okay, let's some let's get down to two to why we're here. So, Mark, we wanted to and everyone we wanted to do a podcast to, to talk about Jodie Whittaker 13th Doctor because as you know from listen to who corner to corner Paul and I love Jodie. We love her era and we're very lucky tonight to have Jonny with us, who was in flux and has hung out with Jodie Mandip in the cast and appeared in the show and saves a universe. Really, in a way. Didn't you, Jonny? I did. I did. You're welcome, by the way. You're welcome. So without saying a single word, which is really impressive, that. That's right. I might put in the charisma out there and the and the energy and the menace in the body. And so we wanted to to talk a bit specifically about Jodie and her doctor and why people love her so much. Talk to us a bit about your love for the 13th doctor. And what is it about her that you know, you connect with and why you love her so much? Sure. Well, I mean, there's lots of different things I could say. I've wanted to be a female doctor for ages. I've really thought it would be a great direction to take the character in, but I probably didn't anticipate quite how well it was going to work. I think Jodie is just she's not the person who I probably would have cast in the role because she's quite different, you know, in a real life persona from some of the previous incarnations of The Doctor. But what she brings when she's in character, it's just got elements of all my favorite doctors from the past. There's just the kind of the parents, there's the sort of supportive teacher sort of character, kind of, you know, be maternal towards the companions and particularly when she when she meets children, I think, kind of adventures. I think she's amazing with them, but she's also got a real childlike quality herself. And that takes me back to that thing that the fourth doctor says about what's the point in being grown up if you can't be childish? Sometimes I'm probably paraphrasing it badly, but you know, that seems to be summing up to me Jodie's enthusiast and positivity and, and I think something else that she brings to it because I mean, she's obviously a very attractive woman and they could have made her a very sexualized kind of doctor for the dads if they wanted to, you know, a kind of a Wonder Woman sorts of figure. They didn't go down that path at all. They might add gawky and geeky and awkward and, you know, things that I think well, certainly I and probably quite a few of the doctor who fans can relate to. Yeah. That sort of that slight alien quality that she has. Yeah. I mean people talk about the time when Graham goes to her for comfort and is it. Can you hear me? Yeah. And she doesn't quite know what to say, but she never likes empathy there. It's just that she she hasn't got easy answers. And I mean, how how would she have she's got all these different regeneration. She's that many different lives. So it's hard for us to understand that human mortality. Um, I just. Yeah, I think she's been a real breath of fresh air and exactly what I've needed from the show these last few years with all the dark stuff going on in the world. Doctor who's just an escape, isn't it? And it's it's been great fun, this area. Do you know that what you've just said there is very, very similar to the way I feel about it? You know, she she was a breath of fresh air and, you know, her doctor, you know, the child like and geeky aspect and the the hope, you know, there's there's a lot of kind of hope and optimism in her. And I also felt that she she did embody a sort of a lot of the traits of former doctors, you know, the kind of, you know, helping people. And there's a slightly tougher edge there. And you know, the hope and positivity and, you know, kind of she took all of the best elements and put them into one. And yeah, I think, you know, I loved, you know, series eight, nine, ten. But she came along and just kind of, you know, revitalized it all for me. And yeah, I think, you know, wasn't quite sure how it would all go, but it just worked so much better than I ever anticipated. Really? Yeah, it was. It was brilliant. Yeah. Yeah. So it's good to hear on the same page because, you know, sometimes I'm not sure exactly how old you are, but you're you look like my generation, put it that way. Oh, generations. Early twenties, actually. I didn't think so. But, you know, sometimes the the expectation is that we are going to be the not my doctors. We're going to be the ones who are against this. And it's the young people that like Jodie's doctor. And I don't think that's the case at all. Actually, she's she's, you know, revived my interest in the show. And I suppose one thing I didn't mention in my first little bit, though, is the connection that we have because we're both in Yorkshire. I'm not Yorkshire. Born and bred, but I've been there for the last 30 years of my life. So I think I'm kind of ordinary Yorkshire and I actually work in Sheffield. So, you know, the locations for this series, I've always thought watching Doctor Who, I wouldn't it be wonderful to work near St Paul's Cathedral and you know, he decided to take me down the steps. So, you know, these places in Cardiff that you see, but now that's what it's like in Sheffield. I see Park Hill Flats and I think that's where. Yes. His family live in. The soup kitchen. Exactly. I know I've invited myself round. And there's not returning my calls. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Maybe not so much the state. Yeah. Yeah. But it's just. Brought up magic in Sheffield. And it's, they've been a lot more you know, they've opened up the country a bit more, you know, hasn't just been stuck in London or kind of, you know, fictionalized in a country villages, you know, like, like Moffat said, we had a bit of and so it's been nice to see other places like saying, I think we know a couple of people, don't we pull like Mrs. McCrimmon, who is from Sheffield and has loved the fact that, you know, their town, their home has been so prominently featured in the show. So it's been really nice to see that. So and of course they did. Oh, sorry. Akinola, go, go ahead. Go ahead. Apologies. I was just going to say good at the launch event here as well for series 11. So I've got something to show you. Okay. And I was fortunate enough to be at the red carpet event, and Jodie signed an art card from Doctor Who magazine. Awesome. That was an outside Primark. But very down to earth. Yeah. But again, it's just like now, every time I go down the bullet and the shops, it reminds me of that day. And it's such a such a lovely thing. And I'm sure the people of Gloucester feel it as well, you know. Yeah, probably anticipate to do anything at every corner. That's really nice of you to ask if you if you met us. So yeah that's lovely that you got two. So what, how are you feeling about the centenary, the final episode, mixed feelings. I mean, it seems weird to talk about the end of an era when obviously there's other things going on today of the same nature. Yes, yes, yeah. Hugely. Yeah, hugely. Sorry to see her go. It seems like it's flown by and I don't feel like we've had as many episodes as I would have liked. Although all power to the crew for managing to get anything out in a pandemic. You know, it's it's been just what we needed. It's amazingly much to do anything at all. I just wish that be more of it. So I'm really sorry to see it go because there's always there's always so much packed into those episodes. And I know it's just going to fly by the Centenary Special, but, you know, it's the nature of Doctor Who, isn't it? I would love to see some Baker go. He was my first doctor. And, you know, we've got used to it over the years. It renews itself and I'm sure sheets he'll be brilliant. Everyone everyone who's seen it. I've not seen his British programs, but everyone's seen this. They say he's an. Amazing amazing he's been seen and yeah, I've watched a lot of stuff he's been in it just I think he's perfect for this. It's the next logical step in my opinion, anyway, you know, and looking at like how the doctors have evolved in a different, not different life they've had and everything else, it's just like, where are we going to go next? And this makes total sense. And I think it's going to bring an even bigger audience now because I think people, you know, Jodie attracted a different type of audience. This is, again. You know, one on the day that shoots costumes, announcements down in Brighton with my family and we went to a little ice cream place. This is actually true, the story, and there was a load of teenage early 20 year old girls and they're doing the ice creams and whatnot. And one of them said, Oh, look at this, he's the next doctor. And they will, oh my God, he's brilliant in sex education or definitely going to start watching. And I sort of literally just seen and heard it, you know, in my own eyes and is, you know, and like you say, Johnny, you know, that's a whole new audience there, you know, who are going to come into the show the way people were brought in by Jodie. And you know, bye bye, man. You know. So, yeah, I think it's it's an exciting time ahead. And like you, Mark, you know, and I've said this on the podcast before, you know, I'm sad for this era to end and I wish it wasn't and I wish there was more. And but, you know, hopefully in years to come, we'll have big finish and we'll have more books. And, you know, maybe I hope it'll be a 70th, you know, 70th anniversary reappearance, you know, who knows? But yeah, it's it's been. Wonderful to listen to that podcast on BBC Sounds. What was it called. Over, didn't it. Yeah, yeah. Brilliant. Yeah. Really good. Yeah. Did you listen to that Johnny. Know is on the list. Yeah. Yeah. To be honest, the big list. The ever. Growing list. Yeah. Yes. It was really good, wasn't it, what it was. And I thought, you know, it seemed to really fit into that audio format. Well, yeah, you know, it's as you'd expect to see. So let's hope there is some big finish. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Brilliant. Okay. Thank you very much for joining us. I hope you'll stay on the line and, you know, listening to what everyone else is saying. So thank you, Johnny. I'm going to come to you for a minute while Paul is sorting things out with our people who are waiting. So, Johnny, as as our listeners and our audience here know you were a passenger in the Flux series. So tell us what it is that you love about Jodie Doctor first of all. So I think for me it was the fact that Jodie has taken the doctor as we've just spoken about. So Jodie's very grounded. She's a very real person. She's not. She's not overly sort of like celebrity type of person. She's, you know, she talks to people and she makes time for people and she's very caring. And I think she brings that through in the role. But it's not like, you know, that hasn't been there before, but it's just a different type and engages people more. I mean, obviously being the first female doctor was a massive thing and that automatically brought a different type of audience in and it divided the audience. And we all know that. And you know, if you go onto Twitter, there's plenty of people in there throwing their opinion around and that's fine. But I think if you watch what Jodie's achieved in in the short space of time, she's out really. She's done an amazing amount of stuff and the episodes were more engaging, I think, because there was a lot more real historical things in there. A lot, you know, stuff that people historical stuff that people might not have known everything about. And it's a bit more of an education, but in an entertaining way. Yeah. And I just think that as a doctor she was just that right balance of she's quirky, she could be serious, she comes across really tough. She's got a lot of empathy, you know, and the whole like thing about what you said about, you know, the way she dresses, they could have really sexualized that, but they didn't. And she was a big part of that process. You know, I know that when she said before in interviews when you were going through a costume design, she wanted something that was more like early part of the century, kind of, you know, women in trousers and the braces and stuff. And it was all about, you know, being feminine but being strong. And that was why she wanted her costume to look like that. So I think it's I think she's just done something totally new and it got me back interested in it again. You know, I started watching it not not religiously, but I was more interested in watching Jodie than I had Peter Capaldi, you know, and like I said before, I kind of Tom Baker was my doctor and you know, and I did watch the Christopher Eccleston stuff. And then I kind of went off David Tennant. And I know why I'm halfway through that era now, and my watch list just keeps going and it's great. And the stories in a brilliant but just Jodie's just delivers it just a different way and I just think it was better. So yeah. She's, you know, for me, she's the coolest looking doctor. I just love everything. I don't I don't know. I think we still. Talk about. You got patriot whenever it is back in trousers and stuff. I mean, pat rocks. Yeah, they're cool, but they are Jody's coat and that t shirt and you know. But yeah. I don't know. They still about a massive scarf at some bakers and that flopped. Yeah. Yeah. That's. That's eternal. The nice. Thing. Jodie had a really cool brain. But she didn't have a cool look and she had a really a look that was, like, acceptable for everyone. Yeah, yeah. There's nothing about a look that put anybody off. It was, it was, you know it was just enough to look like an alien without it being too alien. Yeah. You know. And I quite liked the way that they introduced her clothes as well by she went to a charity shop. Yeah. Just, you know, ripped through everything. That was quite good fun. I'm going to I'm going to bring in Dominique now and and ask a question as to Dominique. Do you agree or do you think that Jodie is the coolest doctor? If you can have any. Say yes, don't. I mean, she's got a rainbow nurture. So obviously my anxiety is yeah, I mean, she's got all the points for that. So yeah. That's a good answer. I'm happy with that. So don't tell us. Tell us why you love the 13th daughter and Jodie. So I know that you've you've traveled a bit to meet Jodie, haven't you? So we met. Yeah. We need, we need to hear about this. Yeah. Yeah. So, well you can probably hear it from my accent. I'm not from the UK at all am I'm from Montreal. So I decided to go to London Comic-Con to meet Jodie and Mandip in last winter. So I did that. And yeah, I mean, the reason why I love 13 and Jodie is just like I started watching Doctor Who all really kind of hoping that one day the doctor would be played by a woman. So when that happened, I just, you know, I was already on board like 100%. And she kind of became my doctor before she was even on screen because of that. Right. Just because of what what it means, basically. So, yeah, yeah. She won them, you know, they were going to announce the, you know, the 13th doctor. Yeah, that would be rumors, you know, could be a woman and the various names being thrown around, as always. And, you know, when they had that little, you know, reveal video thing, did it go up to Wimbledon or something? I can't remember too much. Something like that, wasn't it? Yeah, it was a sporting event, you know, on a Sunday or something, losing it. And I thought, I is awesome, you know? And it was just, you know, so exciting that they did it. And, you know, I kind of there was something special about it, you know. And of course, it could have gone could have gone wrong when it all started. But, you know, it did. And, you know, like you said, it was just, you know, instant really thinking she was brilliant and liking her, you know, rendition of The Doctor, so and so. It was back in February then that you came over. So it was the same colonel I was that was near the London filming Comic-Con mum. I mean yeah I was saying yeah. Yeah. No I kind of couldn't, I couldn't see everyone I wanted to see because I was just overwhelmed. I was cheap as well. I was only ten quid for me. It wasn't expensive. It's not a. Missed opportunity. For me in the UK. I just. So John, are you doing autographs through the post or you know, if anyone wants to sort one out, you know. I. Just added to the list. I think I got about ten or 12. We do you really? Yeah. That's great. Yeah. So Paul and I get none. So, you know. I'll, I'll request one don't it. Please. So, Dom, when you met, tell us about meeting Jodie and, and then after to tell us about meeting Mandip. And how was it for you? I'm not going to lie to you. I, I guess I was. It is just. I guess the energy and everything that was going on that day. I kind of forgot everything and kind of forgot the details of everything. But I mean, Jodie was just like, I've done a lot of comic cons, like mostly here in Montreal and some in Toronto and that kind of stuff. And like what really took me by surprise is that even though she was like really busy, like, like so many people that got like diamond passes and that kind of stuff, she really took the time to make every single interaction special for that person. And to me, it's just it's just makes it every like, wow, I'm having a hard time speaking right now, but it just makes everything so, like, exciting and so much worth it because it much worth it, I guess. But, um, yeah. So that's really what kind of stayed with me since meeting Jodie. And then Mandip was just like so sweet and you know, she's just the greatest, honestly. So yeah. Yeah, it was amazing. You, you know, you only get that brief moment with them, don't you? But they, they made it really special. And if anyone else who's here tonight has met Jodie at one of the cons, let us know. So we are hopefully can have a chance to chat back with you about that a bit later. And now a more rewarding thing. And Dom, did you come over to see Mandip on stage recently? Were you going to do that? I did because like actually at first I wasn't going to go to Comic-Con at all. That wasn't part of the plan. I was like, no, no, no, covered that idea. I'm not doing it. But I've got like my dad's cousin's family in the UK, so we were all planning to go this summer, but just seeing family visiting and stuff. And then when it was announced that meant it was doing the play. Like I just texted my friends and it was like, Hey guys, we should go and I'm there. So we did that and but yeah, so yeah, I saw the play like late July and I mean, if you guys haven't seen it with Mandip, even though she's not on anymore, you definitely need to see it because that play is just insane. It's so good and like the twists in it, it's it's really well-written. So, yeah. I saw a little video on Twitter the other day. Someone had obviously recorded the show and they'd cut down all the mandip swearing into the video. So I. Knew I blew a little bit. That yeah. I've never heard Yaz talk like that, so. I wonder like, yeah. I know I'm not making any comment. If you watch. Yeah. Yeah you've. You've had mandate to like that I'm. Sure. Yeah. So Dom are you, are you going to meet Jodie when she's doing a con in America a bit later in the year. When is that. October. November time. No, I'm not going to the con in Ohio in December just because I need to kind of frustrate myself a bit. Like I need to calm down. Yeah, it's for a little longer. Yeah. It's it's difficult as I wanted to go to the one she did recently, but it just wasn't. I was working and it just wasn't practical. So, yeah, you have to have to be a little bit careful, don't you? Yeah. I've got a violinist somehow. Yeah. That's going on. You've got it. Yeah. Yeah. Well Po. You could, you could have come to the London coma. Jodie was I can you. But you said you you've got to do something with your family and then they all left you at home and then. He did it. YANCY One of. Life's little ironies that, you. Know. You could have come to see me and ignored me like everyone else could. Have done that. I would have made the point of it as well. I'd have gone. Yeah. It was more fully the. So I'm guessing Dom, you were the, the thing in the evening where she was talking to the audience remanded. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. So I was stood outside having a cigaret while everyone walked out and no one spotted me. I was standing right by the door and just people were walking past me. I was like, This is hilarious. And then the next day they were coming to get autographs and I was like, I saw you last night. Where we you. Know, now, if you did come last night, I would have given it for free. But they were. Saying, the thing is. Johnny, you know, you're quite tall, aren't you? A bit, you know, so. But I suppose people haven't seen your face often because of the ball. I think I just took it if they thought it was a lamp post because. So don't tell me what's your what's your most favorite thing about Jodie's daughter? I mean, God, that's that's such a difficult question for me. Yeah, I'm. I'm quite good at those. Yeah. Everybody have a think about that because when we come she would. Say you. Question. So stop. Right. So no. So we put Dominique on the spot. Everyone else gets a moment to think about it. Oh, my God. I mean, to me, my favorite thing about I mean, I guess it works both for Jodie and her doctor. It's just the light that that she brings in our lives as viewers, I guess, and the inspiration that gives to people as well. Like, I mean, for me personally, like I've said that before online, I wrote her a really long letter about all this, about how she inspired me to be kind of where I am right now in my life. And I mean, I'm getting my due right now in communication because Jodie became the doctor brilliant. So to me, it's like she it's really like everything about this doctor is really significant. So yeah, it's that's why it's so hard for me to kind of put it into words because it's a lot. That's really well, it's so great hearing how she's inspired people and, you know, often see things like that on Twitter and stuff. So that's great. So Dom, thanks for joining us. So I'm going to go over to Jonny again and and then we'll go on to someone else for, for a bit. So Jonny, tell us all about a story from, from the filming days that we haven't heard before. Oh, it's. Just so many, so many. So I think my, my sort of one thing a one time I spent with Jodie was practically just me. And Jodie was during filming us and we were just sat to the side waiting for whatever shot they were saying up, which was taking forever. And it was during the the siege in America when, you know, everyone started going up the hill and going for the go for the capital. And she was absolutely fascinated with it. And she would just kept looking at a phone. I was like, What? You read it? And she was telling me all about it. And she was she's really passionate about things like politics and things in the world. And stuff that affects like, you know, even down to small communities. She's just got such a big heart for people and how people's lives are affected. And we have this really long chat about, you know, politics and democracy and different countries. And it seemed to go on forever. It was probably like about 20 minutes, but it was just like a really nice moment to spend with that and chat to it, just like one on one, because you kind of put sometimes people on a pedestal, you know? And I think for me, like I've said before, when I first met Jodie, you've never seen anyone in a room with so much energy. She's like a firecracker. I mean, she just comes bouncing in and you just like, Whoa, she's here, you know? And it's a big thing when she walks on set, like, everyone gets really excited to see it. So to actually have like a normal conversation about things and things that were happening in the world is quite an interesting point for me because I just I've never spoke to her like that before, you know, and she used to tell us stories about different films and projects she'd been involved in, but that was like really a key moment for me and just how she really has a lot of strong feelings about things that happened in the world, and she wish she could do more to sort of, you know, change the. So I think she's one of those people in the future that, you know, use what she does for good rather than, you know, just letting it go away. She seems to be wanting to be really involved in different stuff. I know she just charity work and she's really generous. I mean, we have this little bit of a joke one day because she was constantly doing requests for funds. So when they were asking for like a birthday video or a message for their nan or whatever like that, she was recorded in between takes. Like, I got a minute, I've just got to do this. Happy birthday, Nelly. Bye bye. You been like, how many have you done to them today? And it's like, you know, God knows how many she don't assume a set of do you not like chatroom, like cameo and all that other stuff. You're like, why would you pay from Mum? Why she went, Why would anyone want to pay me to send a message? It's like people make a massive living off of you. Like. Na na na na. No, no, not for me. I won't do that because you can have it. I was like, okay, yeah. You know, lovely. Yeah. So now she's eight. Yeah, brilliant. Okay. Thank you, Johnny. That was that was great. We'll we'll come back to you shortly. So, Annie, let's come to you for a bit because you got in early a technology worked for you. So, Dawn, thank you very much. So, Annie, we know you you're quite active on our who corners corner Twitter and you listen in and we know that you're a big salesman fan. Any other thespian fans in the house? Put your hands up so quite bit. Yeah, quite a few. So tell us a little bit about Sasfin and your love for Jodie sought to and yes. And you know you've written a bit about it all as well haven't you. Yeah. I mean try to be trying to use this to us. It's quite difficult. But I think I might have managed it for me. I think Judi's more recent, an obvious depiction of a doctor that is essentially read as queer or Sapphic, who has feelings for her female companion, is genuinely affecting in a in a 60 year running program on mainstream TV that's not been aimed at adults depicting a simple yet quite complex love story without all the negativity, with all the homophobia, for me, I think really is a it's a real turning point in terms of queer representation, especially on on BBC, on BBC One. And personally, I've just been filled with this real sense of joy and grief in equal measure for what we have and for what I would have loved to have when I was younger. It's not something that's on it's not it's not killing Eve. Killing Eve is for adults. It's not it's not a gentleman, Jack. That's for adults. It's not the L word. That's for adults. This is a this is a show that has a it's an international franchise. And it will affect and impacts a wider range of people. And young people will see it and be affected by it. And because of this, she she's my daughter. And I think it will always be because of that. Yeah, it's been handled brilliantly really in the show isn't it. And quite close sensitively I think, and not kind of majorly, you know, overtly pull. And I want to go back and watch everything from Yeah in the first episode and you know pop, you know because we want to and enjoy that but look for. We don't really need much of an excuse to do. That. We will. Take any excuse that we can't. We we watch 72 but to look specifically for trans women staff and you know, all the little you know, because I think there has been, you know, little hints and clues and stuff from from quite early on. And then they become kind of more more developed and more prominent as it's gone on. And I think one of the other really interesting things is when you watch the morning show presenters and you reads the reviews. And so the morning show presenters before Legend of the Sea Devils were practically bouncing on their chairs asking Mandip Gill all about it ten years ago, you would never have got that. And then after it you've got Daily Telegraph journalists racing about how beautiful these scenes, where and how much their kids loved it. Ten years ago, the headline would have been Know Scandal and Scandal. Doctor Who, Lesbians on the TARDIS. This is it's a complete one, actually. The discourse has completely changed. It's almost it's just it's just there without any negativity. And I think that is it was really overwhelming, just sort of walking around in a world where suddenly the doctor was queer in a sense. And I don't know how you think, but but to me, you know, it really feels like a genuine relationship that doesn't seem like something that's being contrived. It feels like something that's been allowed to develop and also organically and naturalistically, right? If you're going to fall in love with your best friend and overnight in what exactly it's going to happen over a long period of time, that makes it seem more authentic. Yes, it does. Yeah, it's you know. That's and it's not like it's been signposted, you know. I mean, I love the ninth and the 10th docs from Rose. I, you know, I love that it's great. But it was it always felt like it was contrived from the very start to be that way, you know, that they were going to fall in love somehow and it was going to be blocked and stopped. And that would be the big tragedy of it. Whereas this feels, you know, much more much more relatable. I always say about the same with that. The one thing that I like about it is and it feels grounded and relatable. The characters feel like characters rather than archetypes. And I just love the way that this kind of relationship has as kind of exemplified that. You know, it's a good example of how that naturalism within this era has is kind of play through. And that's my piece. That's all I'm going to say on it right there. That's it. So, Anna, you've met Jodi. How many times I've spent now. Do you mean on the same day or how many kinds of things? Well, multiple times in one day, even, John, I was looking worried by this one that. Yeah, I. Mean. I saw it quite a few times in one day, but you know. Yeah, I want to see that. I want to. Know the answer. So I've been to two cons this year and twice on both occasions. So for a picture and an autograph. Yeah, yeah. So I've seen both your pictures and they're really good. So look, when we, we talk to them about it, tell us how, how was it for you? I know the recent one was quite special. Yeah. It's some you, you get, you get an idea in your head about what you want to say and then you get there and it's just you kind of like freeze up because she's nice. She find your mouth stops working. Yeah, my brain. My brain animals start working. But she's just so genuine, if you can imagine the nicest person you know. And then times it by the thousands this time. This time actually went with something together. The, the article I wrote for The Queerness about queer representation. And I think even that and when I went to get my picture taken, I managed to engage my brain long enough afterwards to turn round and say Thank you for 5 minutes. But that's all right. And of course, afterwards, then my brain start working again and I sit down. Yeah, lie down in a dark room for half an hour and just just chill out. She's just. She's just so lovely. It's just it kind of blew me away a little bit. I went up. I went up to get other people's autographs. I just didn't I didn't climb up in the same way. And I'm used to standing in front of adolescents and teaching all day. Which prepare you for anything you think. I. So you mentioned your article there. So I've read that you sent me the link for I've pulled you. I've read it as well I think. But why don't you tell everyone who's here now and our listeners when the podcast comes out a little bit about it and where they can find it? Okay. So I'm the the editor in chief of a free online magazine called The Queerness of the Queer Dot School. And we're a collaboration of British and international writers who contribute different or different topics within the queer community on politics or creative writing or in for the TV, for instance, I've done I've reviews of Doctor Who and other TV programs. I like to write about politics. We have some education writers, so we go to the queerness. Dotcom is a free queer magazine. Brilliant. So tell us, what are your hopes and fears for the final episode? Mm hmm. I think my hopes and my fears are the same thing, to be honest. I really hope that because and I'm really worried that they won't. I think in some ways if they don't, that will be a huge disappointment because it may sort of reaffirm worries I had about the BBC and their ability to just go there. But I really hope that it does happen in some way because if you look at it narratively, if it's a slow burn, as Christian Bale confirmed that it probably was, that's that's ultimately the only place it could go because it's we know from Monday that the stories are over, that the conversations that they had on the beach isn't over yet. And there there's going to be something that happens at the end. It's not just going to fall off a cliff. And. Yeah. Yeah, I just think that, you know, it kind of will go go there and the BBC are not going to shy away from it. I remember when we talked to Ray Hollman, you know, about his costume work and stuff and there was a brief conversation about change in the outfit and, you know, the rainbow and things like that. And the BBC were like, It's working. We don't want you to change it, which is why it never really kind of varied much because they loved it so much. And I think they've been on board the whole time on on everything and the direction it's going. So I'd be really surprised if, if it didn't go the way that kind of people want it to. So not long till we find out a couple more weeks, hopefully so. And that's really is there anything else you'd like to say? And we're going to go back to Jonny quickly and then we'll pick else from our gallery too. Just thanks for having me on. Well, thanks for your support on the podcast. Yeah. All right. It's great. Thank you for. Joining us tonight. So Jonny, tell us a little bit about your Connor experience on experience, the clean versions, the clean version. The Clean Version. It was probably one of the bizarre days of my life because I couldn't work out why I was there. And when you're like me, I do cosplay. I'm really into all that stuff, comic books and films and. Yeah, just, just, I'll just put it as everyone know what what John is called to play stuff is to tell everyone. So I cosplay chaos from God of War. So I, I dress up as a undead spartan and go running around in woods with a small girl dressed as a boy, taking photographs. That's our thing. And we live it. And, and we're all quite excited because in a couple of weeks time there'll be another one. But yeah, yeah. But I'm so going that con and being a guest was totally bizarre. So like the first night I got there, obviously I tend to go have a photograph outside, say it. But on Twitter and everyone's coming out from Jodi's talk, no one spotted me. That was the first funny thing. And then I've like casually gone to the hotel and gone in and I went up. It's a wee. And there's like two Jaguars, Boba Fett and Leatherface all sat at the bar over the drink. And you just it sounds. Like a. Joke. Yeah. Is it should be shouldn't. And you just. Like what's going. On. She's just really weird. And I couldn't quite get myself to have the courage to go and speak to these people because I know I'm nobody. And then, you know, in the morning, we're all on the same bus. I'm sat two seats away from the Highlander, just completely mental. And then you kind of, you know, get in all the all the drinks and food you want, which is great for me because I'm always eating. You know, I met Daniel. He was looking after me for the day. And then I got taken to the seat and I'm I'm sat next to Sophie, which is just weird because like, she's eight and she sat next to me. And then on this side is Chloe on who was Christine Kazansky? My biggest crush is a boy. And like, she was like, Oh, well, it will shake hands on ugly. And I was like, Please, please don't forget. Don't forget. I texted my mate going, That's why I'm sitting next to. And it was it was just it was amazing because I got to meet a load of people that I've spoken to on Twitter in real life and got to meet all these really fantastic, passionate people who love this series, just love everything about Doctor Who. And they came to speak to me and they got their autograph on the other photograph. And I signed still books and posters and God knows what else and no body parts. Luckily that was, I think slightly and but it's genuinely just how amazing everyone is, how kind everyone is, how, how engaging everybody is. And you know, people thanking me for being part of it and I'm like, I didn't really do anything, you know, I just I took a role that they offered me and I went and did it and yeah, it was amazing. But it's the it's what's come afterwards. It's been big for me, you know, going to the set every day and doing the filming was fantastic. And you know, it's an experience. Yeah, if anyone ever gets to do it, don't do it. But the bit afterwards been part of this. And like I've said before and the last podcast we did, I take this is a massive responsibility now you know, I'm part of something which is huge. It means a lot to a lot of people. And I do turn out quite seriously and meeting all them fans, I was just amazing plus of course I got to Monday all day so I kept hiding in the back of a boot so she didn't know I was there. The security let me in the behind it for 10 minutes. Making faces is selfies with people. So that was quite fun. But it's just yeah, I even now I still can't get your head around it. I'm, you know, sat in front of a massive picture of me dressed as passenger saying hello to all these people, having conversations and just seeing this fan base. And like they said to me the day before, which is when you were there, Geoff, I think they said it was the most people ever dressed up as one character that you've ever seen. Hundreds of it was hundreds of, you know, they thought it was hundreds of them. Yeah. And and that carried on on the Sunday as well. There was loads, you know, I remember one girl. Was. Walking past me and she looked and saw the passenger sign and then she looked at me and then she looked again and she looked at me and I was like, No, it's really me and I'm quite cheap. It's only a tenner when I've. And erm. And a powerful fox you scared witless when I stood up. But um, you know, been able to do stuff that was just, just brilliant, you know, and meeting all the other characters from who you know. Oh, to see is down from Colin Baker. I met Sylvester McCoy, like I said, really quickly, because he kind of run past me very quick. So it's like pretty speedy. Um, but it was, it was just really cool. It was amazing. Yeah, it's awesome. That's one of the that, you know, one of many things about the fandom is why it brings people together like this. Tonight is great and in a chat with you John and things so it's it's brilliant so let's let's go over to someone else. Paul I feel like we went on an actual chat show. Let's yeah, we got. To another caller now and I'm going to I'm going to pick Hugh. You're going to pick Hugh, right? Okay. Hello, Hugh. Hi. How are you? Is my mind working? Yeah. Yeah, we can hear you loud and clear. How are you? Yeah, good, thank you. Good. Yeah. Thank you for getting back to us about this and and joining in. So I'm going to ask you a different question, first of all. So I'd like to know what has been your budget officer so polished by having all studio joints. Right. And Jeff. Yeah, I'll write down what you say and then if you replace it, bet and read it back to you. So you said that already. Sunshine. Sun. Yeah, but the original. There's no script, guys. We just wing it. I know. You know, there's screen. Okay. Confirmed on some previous incarnations. They do just wing it. And so, Hugh, tell us what's been your your single most favorite moment from Jody off. Of so many. It's questions coming to you guys. So you better start thinking now. I would probably say, yeah flux what was it was once upon a time when she comes out of the after seeing tax haven or or sock as she was called before she was revealed when she comes out and she's all distraught and upset and you know, I was just. Man yeah. And Yaz is there and is like, you know, it's okay, I can help. And then she goes, it's not okay. And it's I just that was a very defining moment for her as the doctor, for me. And it it really kind of it was a it was it was it was a great representation of, you know, where she was at the time as a as a character and how her grief surrounding her, you know, her her lost memories is affected. And I thought that that was it shocked me when I saw it, you know. Yeah, but November and and every time I watch it, I'm like, there it is. Yeah. We talked about that moment. To me, it was really quite, quite powerful moment. You know, she had so much ripped away from him at that point and that kind of, you know, anger and, you know, fury was was quite justified, I think. You know, she came really close to finding out stuff and lost it. And, you know, something that Yaz couldn't understand, although she wanted to. I think so. Yeah. Okay. That's that's a that's a really cool moment to go for. I was kind of wondering where the people would go for kind of fun and lighthearted stuff, but, you know, that's quite a powerful moment. And I think she was. Very loud that. Day. Really? Yeah. That was a very loud scene. I mean, it was a very cavernous set, isn't it? Was a great set. Yeah, it's a great set. And it was huge. But it was just everyone kind of talks in a normal voice because everyone's miked up. So no one really has to project themselves on set without our. She projected because it was it was loud. You know, I think even Sam heard it and he couldn't hear anything and that much. Yeah. If you listen to the podcast with Savvy, he couldn't see he couldn't hear as warm as the Cuban heels. Yeah, the Cubans. Yeah, yeah. But you walk so well in them heels, Mom. He looks good and. They look good. Yeah. Yeah. So, Hugh, I know you're from the Land Down Under. Yeah. And tell us a bit about what's Doctor Who like down there. You know, is it how did you discover it? Is it kind of, you know, as prominent as it is over here? It's definitely not as prominent, but it definitely has a fan base. I've got a few good friends who was, we would say, mates over a good few weeks. Holden People from England say that too, like me and my mates. Second Life. But yeah, no, it's not as prominent, but it's definitely got a presence down here. Like, you know, it involves like if you want to watch it first thing, it involves a lot of early mornings. Yeah. So like for Flux, I got up, it would have been 5 a.m. every day. That's dedication for you. That is. I mean, I'm just a doctor who. Is. There's a chap on Twitter called Cooper Hellier that you might know. So he's from Australia as well. So yeah. So do you remember Aiden's Northern Casino summers when he was saying the same thing? He was getting up really early or staying up really late. I can't remember which, but he had to watch it when it went out. So yeah. Yeah, it was the highlight of my week every Monday working up to watch Flux and oh, it was great, it was brilliant and I'm looking forward to doing it again. One more time. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So when did you get into Doctor Who? Because, you know, over here it's kind of just part of the culture, but was it's a little bit different from where you were. I was eight years old. It was the 50th anniversary, which is an interesting place to start because obviously it's got 50 years of history riding on the fact that, yeah. What's going on. I think I remember it was the scene with the, um, with the general and another time Lord in the wheel after the master. Not the ultimate sorry. The war doctor takes the moment that that was the first scene that got me into it. And yeah, I watched the whole episode and my mum said he watched this. I used to watch Doctor Who as a, as a child and maybe a moody eight year old was all, No, I've seen Doctor Who like it. And my my son's doing the same to me. He's lucky he still got some of the lift. And, um, yeah, then I watched it, I loved it. And I said to my mum, Is there any more? Which was kind of hilarious, given that it was the anniversary set list and then, you know, Matt Smith regenerated into Capaldi and then Capaldi into Jodie and. Yeah, no, it's it's it's been great. Absolutely I've loved it. Brilliant. So it is Jodie. I presume she's your favorite doctor, so. Yeah, absolutely she is. She's. What is it about her, the the my makes her your favorite. It took a while, sir. When I watched Capaldi, he was he was my number one. And you know, he was my first doctor, like, you know, the one that I first. Mm. Really, uh, you know, the one that I loved the first one. And then, of course, like pretty much everyone, I was like, there's no way that they'll, you know, replace anyway because, you know, whenever a new doctor comes along, it's kind of a cliche at this point that it's sort of like, you know, oh, no, there'll never be, you know, you know, as to say, like, they'll live. It's as good as what came before. Yeah, exactly. And I got proven wrong very quickly. And then, you know, it wasn't until Series 12 that because, you know, it usually took me about a series to really love Capaldi and then it was spiteful. Pop One was when I don't know it was resolution that moment when the when the scrapped Dalek came rolling out and you know that that was the moment where I went, no, she's making me, you know, she's my favorite. And then, you know, Series 12 with the Thomas Child Arc and Revolution. And then Flux just affirms that place of her at my one. Yeah, that's brilliant. Yeah, that's quite interesting. It took you a little while to really fall in love with the fact. So I'm Paul making out this question for our next guest I. Wanted sunshine. When did you fall in love with the. Doctor and I'm I'm I'm autistic so that that probably had something to do with it because you know, I get very stuck in my ways. But I guess that that's probably the best phrase. And also that's one thing that helped me sort of relate to her the most was, you know, because she's awkward. She doesn't exactly always know what to say. And it's something that I that's one of the main reasons why she is my doctor is because I can see myself, her character. Yeah. I've seen people, you know, say similar online as well. And, and, you know, I can understand where they're coming from with that and, you know, why she she connects and relate so much to them. And, you know, when you see people criticizing things like, you know, the can you hear me and stuff like that, I think, well, you know what? Maybe you don't really understand, you know, how her character is in that moment. And, you know, there wasn't anything I mean, intended by that, but I think, you know. Yeah, exactly. It seems quite, quite genuine, you know, reaction for for, you know, some people. So yeah, it you know, we we reviewed that episode again recently, didn't we, Paul? And we did. Indeed. And talks about that. So you got one more question before we go to someone else. And actually, Paul doing pretty much all the talking. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Very unlike your track on society. What about. Family? So you obviously a few people here have met Jodie, but I guess there's not much in the way of conventions down your way. I know Peter and Jenna came down a couple of years ago, didn't they. But yeah, she, they came down to Sydney for the world tour. Um, yeah, there are two main conventions. There's also Comic-Con, which is usually around June and the Supernova, which in Melbourne, I mean it's in Melbourne, it's around June which is I'm in Melbourne and then supernovas in usually March. So you know, she's, she's never come down to Australia. So I fingers crossed for next year. So yeah she seems to be like in the convention so you know she might make her way down the journey. You need to get on it, see if you can get it. Just what I was going to say. Try me. I've been trying. Yeah, all the good ones got second off. I have Chicago, I've got one in October. I'm invited to not one yet, you know, we'll get there. We'll start a campaign for it. Actually, Hugh, what time is it for you now? Is it in the morning?
Yeah, at 6:31 a.m.. Oh, okay. Well, thank you. Thank you for joining us. Oh, my pleasure. Looking forward to it. Brilliant. Thank you. Really appreciate that. Johnny, I'd like to go back to you again for a minute. Um, can you keep doing in that face? Because I'm always nervous about what you don't want to be next. Yeah, that's what. It does say. Creeps up on you, Johnny. I'll come to you. Oh, God. I'm going to. I'm going to. I've got a quite an easy one, hopefully. So when when Flux went out, did you sit down with family and friends to watch and they knew that you were in it by that point? No, they didn't. Know. Did they. Believe you? That's me. So it was. Obviously, you know, a lot of talk about it. You know, the first rule of not through, you know, talk about sex, you know. Like. Well, I'm the third and the fourth. And the first rule is you're not allowed to talk about either. So obviously, the wife had to know because I couldn't just keep disappearing into hotels in Cardiff because that looked a bit dodgy. So I just go away for a week. And. I think the eldest who kind of knew that was in something, so they were, they were kind of a but I didn't really tell many other people because you weren't allowed to. And then obviously the first episode came out and I knew I wasn't in that, but I'd like hinted to a lot of people like, you know, you got to watch it all through this week. I would have watched Doctor Who, but why wouldn't to watch amazing TV? I've never seen an episode in my life. I would just simply watch it. Yeah, definitely worth watching. And then obviously when the second episode works, the time has come for a little thing. I know you watch Dr. Ruth tonight because I'd already spotted my name in the Radio Times, so I've taken it and I didn't vow. I didn't buy the Radio Times. I'm not going to pay for it. But I took a picture of it inside the magazine, so I put it on Facebook and it was like it was still through the Cussler. It's interesting. No one got it. Absolutely no one got it. I don't know why, but yeah, we watched it and it was amazing. First of all, just like See Me, that was the first thing. And then watch everyone's reaction. And especially like the kids was like. You okay? Yes, it is. We can tell from your belly. Thank you very much. Yeah. No. It's just it was. It was just amazing to watch everyone's faces. And then, like, I started getting messages through and and everyone's reaction was really positive. And and I think for me as well, seeing watching it with a family, just just just changed my experience of it because like, you know, seeing how much fun the kids are watching it and for me as well been a piece of story together because I didn't have a clue what was going on with filming it. I mean, I don't think any of us did. To be fair, there was plenty of days on set going, Do you know what's going on? No, I'm totally brilliant. No one knew. And like I said, I never knew about company stuff or any of that stuff. So, you know, it was really enjoyable for me to watch it and see where I fit into this complete chaos of a story. It was brilliant. Yeah, I didn't I didn't tell most of the farm. It was it was quite funny, I think, because people are always up to something. But I didn't know what it was. Um, yeah. But first job though on television. I don't. Know. Ryan's living the dream. If I spoke to everyone here tonight would jump at the chance to. Yeah, we can. We can do that. We can live live vicariously through you, Jonny. We can we can do that. If you could grow to seven foot two, you can do it yourselves. Just Yeah. I might, I might just. Yeah, just do that. Yeah. Just some. Yes. Don't do it to yourself. Um. Thanks, Julie. I'd like to go over to Matt right now, who's been sitting there patiently. Very patiently. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Matt. And we'll get to the rest, you guys in a bit as well. So, Matt, tell me, what was your favorite moment in flux? Obviously, when passenger walks in oh. Two on a list as good, the correct answer is all of it, because it's one long episode. And I'm sitting down with my my glass of water. Here. Yeah. Off the top of my head. I think the best moments would probably have to be, um, uh, yeah, well, and you give episode one. Yes, that was good. Halloween apocalypse. That was. Following apocalypse. That was a good ending. Yeah. Okay. What, what did you think of the cliffhangers across the series? Oh, that's a shocking, unexpected sight, but very, very well executed. It's like the warmth of village of the angels just nearly shattered my heart. That was a cracker, wasn't it? Do you mean the single best doctor who cliffhanger of all time? Oh, truly. Just like Joffrey in that one to. Just to make you look. Yeah. If you haven't listened to our podcast. If you haven't. Listened to our podcast when we reviewed that episode, I was literally. So you were very excited. You're literally jumping up and down on your sleeve. What? I just seen here. Jodie's an angel. Oh, my God. It's amazing. So, what is it that you love about Jodi's doctor? What draws you to her? Oh, wow. I think the classic list would actually be to go the way back to her stuff as to the start of her era, because, well, I've said this to a few people, but I went into her first episode with my love for who actually being on a bit of a tightrope. Okay. I mean, so going up to that point, I rewatched Moffat's last series, but I just felt like, as though I was loving classic cape, I just felt like a star. I knew I felt like I was falling in love with it and I was actually terrified. My mm. But, but then I watched Jodie's last episodes and, uh, it's almost like I. So that worry that shroud lifted right off. And I think the thing I love about her doctor most is just the fact the I well, I'm, I'm suspecting neurodiverse. I think, um, I feel like I've just been like that for a while and it's like, it's someone I call member who I think was he who suggested he set her coming across as neurodiverse and autistic, just maybe relate to her a whole lot more. So it's like her not knowing what to say to Graham. I completely understood. That always frustrates me when she that when people say that's not the doctor, it is. So mad. I've I've seen on your Twitter profile you've, you've met a few people from the show, haven't you? So do you want to tell us a little bit about your us? So I went to the fair on Saturday just gone. Oh yes. Science say I achieved I achieved a who meet and I've wanted to wanted to have some sleep but I can't speak I chance meeting someone from who I've wanted to meet for years. Mm. Frazier. How's that? Oh, well done. That's your profile picture, isn't it? That's my profile picture. Complete with Eve of the Dalek book. Nice. And how was a. It was amazing. It's like I said to him that in waiting to meet him for 12 years because I start judge conventions 12 years ago and he just simply said, what conventions do you go to that. I got the wrong ones. So that was. And did you have a chance to have a little bit of a chat with them? Oh, not really say but I mean I think I just have a chat with a few others. I it wasn't just Frasier. I've met I met Andrew Smith who wrote Full Circle. Oh yeah. Stephen Veitch, who wrote Paradise Towers. So I had a chat with both of them and Stephen even praised my continuing to wear a face mask throughout the course. I, I still feel like a star. I feel like a, the pandemic is not over and I'm going to do what I can to keep themselves safe. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, say, Andrew went on to answer as I am too was Andrew was very nice. I met Tanisha Palmer a.k.a Sonia Khan. Oh, yes. Oh, yeah, yeah. We know. And I met her. Did you meet? So I carry on. And I also met Jonathan Watson, who played the hostess on Tones and Flux. Oh, brilliant. Scuse me. And perhaps lovely, isn't she? She very much is. Yes, she is. She's very, very positive. Yeah. So but I want to try and do more conventions next year. Yes, I will. I would do anything to go to the house. Josie. Yeah, awesome. I suspect most, most people here, if the opportunity arose, we would do that. And I think I did. I said to Paul, didn't I? So Aiden was at the convention last weekend. We'll talk about that in a bit. Then he met Jodie again and I think I mentioned this earlier. I thought, you know, I'm working. I can't I can't go to Birmingham. It's quite far from here, sir. I've already met Jodie. Then I saw these pictures and I texted Paul. I said, I'm actually quite jealous. Of you now. Wish I'd gone. Yeah. But they'll. There'll be another time. Yeah. So, Matt, tell us, what are your thoughts about the upcoming last episode? What are you looking forward to? What are you worried about? I'm worried about my heart breaking because my heart broke at, you know, devil's like it's like I, I, I'm in my mind. I tend I struggle with so much in the way of emotion. So but for my heart to feel like it was breaking at the end of that, I made this sad afterwards. What's my heart going to be like after the Sun? Television? Yeah. But yeah, we'll, we'll all have to have a chat about it afterwards for the Council. On the Air. We need some kind of therapy. Yeah, we got another one of these. Yeah. Economic cry. Out. But my hope very much is that's just my hope is that Jodie goes out on the high. I love her like I'm. Matt thank you very much for for joining us tonight. We'd like to go over to Mackenzie now because she's been waiting very patiently. So hopefully it's going to work for us this, yeah. Oh. Yes. Hello, Mackenzie. Welcome and. Thank. You for sticking through it. Oh, well done. We will get the hang of this with Matt. I'm part of another program. Test. Test. And you couldn't hear me. I'm like, test, hasn't I? I finally figured out I have four different settings for my mic and I finally figured out which one was really brilliant. So you're. Here now. Growing your hair now? Yes, indeed. So are you wearing a rainbow striped t shirt there, Mackenzie? I am, yes. Yeah. No, those mock marks been showing. Marcus as well. Yeah. He's stuck in his. On. This point, but I wasn't sure if I would be over the top or not. Know. You should have done so well. Forget your rainbow t because. You got. There. You love it. They know where it is. It's very sweaty, you know. Buckets. But it's things a man doesn't it? It's not. Right. It's. Hey, I. Think what the real one actually smells like. Nobody saw. Oh. Oh, my. So, Mackenzie, tell us. Tell us about your love, the 13th doctor. Well, gosh, mine's kind of complicated. So it started off for me to pull in the very first question about like the moment that I really attached with Jodie's doctor. Why I say it's complicated. It's because I've been a fan of Doctor Who since I was very, very young. I don't even remember what age I was that my dad introduced me to Doctor Who. I all I know is that Peter Davison was my doctor. And one of the things about me personally is I have a B PD, which stands for avoiding personality disorder as well as PTSD from some childhood trauma. And for me, the moment that really connected me to Jodie was that moment when she opened the TARDIS and saw that Gallifrey had been destroyed. Now, during the 50th anniversary, obviously we saw that the doctor saw the Gallifrey had been destroyed. And for me personally, having going through the new who, where, I felt very attached to our customs doctor for the same reason of being so like the emo doctor, simply because of the Gallifrey being destroyed. I felt cheated that I had fixed it. So when that happened all over again, I'm like, Oh my gosh, I can finally again, I feel an emotional perspective for that empathy perspective for the audience. That's what really brought me to Jodie's doctor. And then with me being an author and a screenwriter, there was a publisher out in New York that had heard about my series, The Writer Awards, which is a fantasy series, and they asked me to write deep and to watch your guide of Doctor Who. So that's what I have, is this is the first one, and I'm working on the second one right now where I'm covering 12 and 13 series. So let me get this straight. Did you get paid to watch Doctor Who and write a book? I'm sort of kind of in a way I didn't get paid to watch Doctor Who. I did that out of my own body, but. I. Read for doing it. As for writing, yeah, yeah, I get I got paid in that aspect. Yeah. Awesome. Yeah. That's a good job. Yeah. Yeah, that's, yeah. That's kind. Of yeah. Living the dream a bit there. Yeah. So I. So how far through the rewatch are you at the moment? I've gone through all through all of all through flux and I'm actually very excited to have Johnny here because if you had been Edge like Border City Comic-Con, I would have definitely got off to your hotel. Oh, thanks. That's nice to know. So, you. Know. So what's to say to me? That's good. You just get me over that. I'll be great. I can just put your name in there. I will definitely do it. Yeah. Do you do it right now? Yes. There are witnesses right here. Yeah. First day of people. I'm going to be like an exclusive commit. We we're going to put in as an exclusive if I'm writing down stuff for the blurb, that's what I'm doing so. Well it's it beats to enjoy the make. Lose save. So which con was that McKenzie Motor City. No, there's two different ones. There was one in May and then there's going to be one in October. It's going to be actually I believe it's going to be the same week that rumor has it that the next series episode or the last episode will actually premiere. So that should be interesting. So I'm waiting to finish my man script and have that last episode because the publisher wanted me to do it beforehand and I'm like, It doesn't really make any sense to not have that in there because that's kind of like a critical. So in that also gives me the opportunity to get some what I do with my series is I go into it's like the ultimate guide. So I go into the psychological what's going on with the doctor and the Companions, my opinion of the episodes, what kind of politics might be going on? Like in the last I covered that, not my doctor era with that. And then I also have interviews where I am. I talk to different people from the show or who have some type of influence, whether it be in a podcast. And then I put that interview in there, not to put you on the spot. Johnny, may I have you in here. Talking to him? Right. Yeah. Let's do that. So Paulinho is agents? Yeah. Yeah. People in. The chapel and. Jeff made a bit of a cut off, that's all. But, yeah, we could sell the out. It would be awesome. So. So you've kind of done some, you know, critical in a study, an analysis of stuff then. So I just read one of the what they call pull the the the black hole. Kind of yeah, it's my calling cause they don't. Know the ones I mean. So I read they're haunting a village diodati one and I really enjoyed it actually, because it kind of reminded me of like doing my dissertation and, you know, analyzing stuff. And it was, it was really good to kind of read something like that. And that was kind of, you know, positive as well in looking at all the films and, you know, stuff like that. So what's been your kind of main take on the whole year in assignment in particular as well? Well, for me being, I'm also part of the LGBT community. So when I first met actually happened where Yaz came out to the doctor or I should say more was talking to Dan. It was almost verbatim of what she said to Dan that my wife said to me. So it was like kind of like, you know, it's. Even more of a connection. Yeah, even more of a connection is because the two of us were completely in denial. We were completely denying ourselves for who we actually were because of our background. Tell us a little bit about your writing and your book series and also would you or have you written any Doctor Who stuff? Well, that's kind of the weirdest thing about is I brought a little bit of fan fiction, not like deluded a type, but I actually it kind of helped me into getting into the Right Wants, which is my series, and it has a Jovian connection to it. Oh that's where that's this one here. Yeah it is. The connection is that I actually wrote that I was working on this book for it's a series, but I've been working on it for over 20 years and one of the problems that I had is I could not figure out who the main character was. He just was in the background. He wouldn't talk me. You know, one of those kind of like characters that's in the corner setting with a dun hat and you're just like, Hello, hello? And just like. Like me books. I was going to say that. Yeah, but you think it it. I could only. See you thinking. It. Yeah. So I finally the moment that the character finally spoke to me was actually when I met Matt Smith and the character one day, just like he comes out with Matt's face and voice is like my name is Morty and that is not how it happened. So when the whole story kind of came flow, I'm like, really, really? And so it's been pretty cool in the aspect that the Doctor Who fans have been very loyal and following that series as well. And a lot of the Smith isms you can find in me too as well. I purposely did that, but then some people didn't know I had written it for, so I actually had a couple of people email me, go, Hey, have you heard of Matt Smith? I think he was really good to play this part. I'm like. Oh. No, never thought of it. Matt Who? But that's the dream. Yeah. Brilliant. So what are your what your thoughts and and hopes for the for the centenary episode. I was I would say I'd probably go with a lot of what other people have said, where we are hoping that there's going to be a resolution and that this isn't going to be it is and that things will be the Tasman may have that option because it just would break my heart to being denied that get that feeling even knowing I understand from the doctor's perspective that she can not get involved. I understand that too, but I do. I just want to see that type of moment. And then just for me, just for me personally, I really want Jodi to have that God moment where she gets so angry that blows. And if it doesn't happen, then big finish for that. It sounds like we're heading for something either massively explosive, incredibly upsetting and possibly life changing. I think at the end of it as well as. Yeah. It's what I'm hoping kind of what happens is it a theory that I had with Capaldi, as I actually had hoped when he regenerated, that he was going to split into two so that you would have Jodi, but then you would have an alternate doctor as well. And Joey's doctor had fallen out of time and was in an alternate universe, and then the other doctor would come together. And that's kind of a way kind of weirdly happened. What what the watch. Yeah. Be interesting to see what happens when the Yeah. Regeneration comes because I don't think anyone really knows. Yeah. So we set that on our, on our last podcast we that for the first time really in the doctor who arc we don't know what's going to happen we know we oh we know that the doctor is going to regenerate, but we've got absolutely no idea what's going to lead up to that. And every other occasion we've had some inkling at this stage what's going to you, the little clues as to what might happen. But we got nothing. And I find that really exciting. Yeah. Yeah, I actually and I knew we were going to learn about shooting ahead of time, but I really actually didn't even want to know who the next doctor was. I wanted that regeneration. Yes, I do love that. Yes, I did. See, now, a lot of that was. A complete shocker, just like no. Very hard work. Mackenzie, thanks very much for joining us and being so patient to to wait to chat with us. I'd like to go over to Aiden now because I'm aware he's, been sitting there for a while as well. So Aiden, this is your second time on Who Corner to Corner podcast, isn't it? It is indeed, yes. So if you've got machine going on in the background and. Next to my fridge, so it might be that. Oh, it's gone because that's. The best place. To be is actually the fridge. I'm next where it's like. It's not the washing machine that broke it up the other day. All right. So if anyone doesn't know, Aiden has met Jodie three times, including the weekend just gone by. He had one of the absolute best convention photos ever seen. You'll see. Yeah. Yeah. So do you have it with you, Aiden? So I'm. Going to. Show, but I know it's. Now. It's. It's getting there now in blown out. It might sort of oh basically we get the idea. Look at that. Yeah. And if everyone looks upstairs. But I don't want to run upstairs again, I want you to get this to work. So I know Jodie are doing their best doctor impression together and it's an absolutely brilliant face. She was put in until I got the photo back. So I. And tell us a little bit about meeting Jodie now. So you've met a three times now, wouldn't you tell us about those? So the first time was after the filming for Fugitive of the Doing at Gloucester Cathedral, and that was a pretty manic day. So we were in a chat group, Aiden and Paul and I and Aiden were you at uni college? College. And Aiden texted. He said, They're filming Doctor Who down in in in the town. But I've got to go to a lecture in a bit. And we all my. First lesson. Was I'm not going to let you do it. We were going to. Go, go, go and just sort of the lecture and gone down straight away. Yeah. And you were going, oh, you know, I'm not sure for sure. You know, it's math. And we were like this. There's no question about it. You've got to go and you did the right thing and you sex or. I good. Getting period laughs so I just talked to him for that and broke off. I like. It. But the thing is that day I missed it twice so far. Time. Okay. Yeah, that's good. I remember you sent us the picture and we were like. Yeah. It was just one the World Cup. Everyone was cheering because I need you to show me the tape before. But then I overheard a pink one of the crew saying, Oh, she's not here today, but she'll be here tomorrow. So that was fun. Just just seeing the you do on the neutral grounds was surreal. Yeah, that was cool. And then you were Comic-Con earlier in February, didn't we? Didn't you? We both went as well for. The first time. Yeah, that was fun. Yeah, it was good. We've got a few other Twitter friends and it was kind of like, you know, we knew each other, you know, really well. Yeah. You know, we've been talking daily for years and then yeah, you might try to get the we can just just call you. And that was so that was. Very, very nice. I heard you were recording. Why don't you tell everyone and. These showed her the two previous times. So I've never driven done that last time but I was too scared to come on. I'm sorry she moved on like that the last time. This time it was so much better organized. You actually were able to speak to her. So I'll show up the photos and she goes, Oh, that's really cool. I mean, I, I can't really do our accent when you if you can't get on well. She's agents poorly too. I think we've got such a flu. She's like, Oh, that's really cool. That's really cool. Make us just, like, uptight. And so it heartbreak. Very surreal. So, Aiden, what is it about Jodie's doctor that you love? Because I know you're, you know, her initial casting news, your reaction was a little bit different to how you answered it. I wasn't sure about if I was going to like the thought of being a woman. I'm glad I do. But if I just put that now, I think it's so enthusiasm, which I like the most because she's so happy and all the crap that's going on in the world right now. It's nice to have somebody like Jodie to cheer you up. And I think is her doctor as well as her. Isn't it wonderful to talk to a huge amount about her in herself as well? But yeah, she always comes across as really positive, doesn't she? Not, you know, the pictures from the conventions and particularly. The one she was having a lot of fun. Yeah. Especially in the duo shoot she was doing with Sasha and Joe. Yeah. So yeah. It was good wasn't it. Yeah. And, and she obviously loves, you know, the show, the character. Yeah. And the fans. And I think that's brilliant. You remember when we were at London? Yeah. And we were just wandering around and she came round the corner. Yes, she was in the. She surprised the cosplayers, didn't she. She did. But this is when we just happened to see it. Yeah, yeah. We just met up and we all just walked in the water. Yeah. Yeah, I remember now. Yeah. And you. Oh hi. Hi Jodie. And she said oh yeah. And you said you have a having a good time so just, just, you know, really a brief moment. But she was so enthusiastic and excited about it and she. Spoke both times. She looked like she was having fun so that. Yes, she did. Yeah, that was brilliant. So what are your hopes for the center anyway or your fears? And by which I mean like your heart getting broken. By. I said one. Apart from my heart broken I'm happy to see a and England return. Mm. Definitely. I want to see Ace better at Dalek again. It's sure I in the trailer so we go back to look forward to. Yeah I think the regeneration scene is just brightening. Mm hmm. I think that probably, I think everyone here would agree with that. Yeah. We're all going to be broken by the end of the episode. Yeah, I think it depends how they do the regeneration as well because obviously there's rumors that she is going to turn into David Tennant. I don't know how often but. Right. Yeah. It depends how they did it. It does doesn't it. Yeah. Again we've got absolutely no idea. That's alright because you can see lines what you think's going to happen. Mm. I mean you don't see the. Emotion in the group. Way. Yeah. Yeah. Johnny, I don't suppose you've got anything that you could tell us have you. Oh and you understand. This connect. Is connections. Oh I'm going to. Be totally honest with you. I mean, I was on set actually filming the thing and it didn't tell me anything. So I doubt very. Much they're. Going to I mean, one thing I will say is that during the whole time I was doing looks, there was obviously rumors that Jodie was going to go. And between like two or two stints of filming, it was announced that she was leaving. Oh, God. But she never talked about on set and it never sort of came up. Yeah, I think she was always quite adamant that she wanted to like go out with a bit of a bang. And I think I don't think she should, she would have let him let this finish in any other way than being the best she could possibly do it. So yeah, I don't think I've got a clue what they're going to do. I don't know how they're going to do it if she does regenerate into David Tennant. And that's going to be interesting because I know that doing stuff, but where that fits in with everything else is you don't know, do you? It'll be interesting to see how they they go about doing it. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think just, you know, everyone's got to have a decent stack of tissues that night because I. Think they're going to cry a lot. But Paul and I got to a podcast afterwards, so yeah, it's going to be enough to do that. I'll be I'll be on the line from most people, gents. Yeah, I think. Yeah, that's probably the rule. It's shocking. You know? So I know we're. Like, What you worried about? I saved the universe, not me. With my special mask. With my special mask, we go away. See, I think it's just going to be. There's no way Jodie was ever going to let it go. Just that it'll be some respect events. It's going to be a brilliant idea. And thanks for joining us again. It's always great to have you on. Very much so, Paul. I can see Tony is there. We can't see his picture at the moment, but Tony, are you there? I'm not sure he is, actually, he was, but he is. And he's actually Tony has emailed me. Oh. So I can read out and see. I see. Tony says, sorry, guys kept trying to get the system to work and would occasionally blah blah blah blah blah. So we don't need to read that. But so okay. So he apologizes that he couldn't get the but the electrics just didn't work for him tonight. The technology just, just wasn't happening. But thanks for trying, Sony, and thanks for your note as well. So I'll read this out. He goes, I would have said something like this. Hmm. For me the 13th doctor is a fabulous mixture of classic Doctor Who energy and new purpose from the ninth doctor on there being a certain angst to the doctor and who's not up for angsty doctoring when it's done as well as our first four new doctors did. It's hard, but right from the moments of a regeneration and that dream, that's all brilliant. The 13th Doctor just felt like permission to be free and run around being daft, pointing a screwdriver at things like the eight year old. I was when I first joined the fandom with Tom Baker and Linda Ward in the TARDIS and Douglas Adams on script editing duties. Jodie Whittaker was a breath of fresh young air, and during the 13 doctor's era it felt like Doctor Who was a show that was for kids again, first and foremost. And you had to engage with your inner kid to get it. That's a gift and a privilege that the 13th doctor brought to Sunday night's the chance to properly be a kid again. And yeah he's actually written. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So yes, he tackled topical issues just like Pertwee and Baker did, but that's what felt like new, too. She was no avatar for acceptance. I like that. I was going to write that one down because that's good. That is for a brighter, bolder, more accepting universe. And it was brain physically exciting to watch this 13th doctor was awkward and compassionate and clever and protective and dead. Good fun. She was the thing the doctor at their best should always be. She was a person in the universe who children could trust to take the hand. And stand. Between them and the bullies. And she did it with a succession of doff hats, bad jokes, and the occasional custard cream. What more could you want in the world from the worlds favorite time? Lord Oh. That's what you wrote. That was to say, Well. Does Tony talk like that? I don't know. They might just be doing is going to pull. That it's said that so much. Stuff I'm like I'm even cheaper than you are it. I want stop. So I just like to say I'm poor. You might have something to say as well. But thank you so much, everyone, for joining in with us tonight. And for us about doing this. It's been absolutely brilliant talking to you, really almost 2 hours here, talking about stuff we all love, which has been just wonderful, really. I hope you've all enjoyed it as well. If you haven't, don't tell us. But but Jan, thank you for for doing this. I know you know Hugh and Don and Kelly, you guys and Mackenzie, you're in different time zones and. Yeah. That's incredible. You Know that you've done that to to to talk with us tonight. And you know, thank you everyone for listen to the podcast and supporting us is absolute incredible pull out. I still can't believe our luck people. People actually listen to this idea that's out. Of our. Well, that's because you're quite good. Just to say, you know. If you weren't good, we wouldn't be here, would we, number one? Well, that that's true. And number two, you know, you keep producing very good shows repeatedly. Oh, thank you. So did you send him the check for that? Yeah. Yeah, it's in the post, Mike, that. You can pay. And not so. About getting to gushy you guys are awesome and everyone who listens and supports. Yeah definitely just. Absolutely. Brilliant really Jeff and John especially for joining us. For joining. You, Mackenzie, dominate, Matt, Aidan and Kelly and everyone else and Annie who was on as well. Thank you all. We love you all and thanks for listening and we'll see you all again. See, so. Half an hour is.