Nourishing Your Microbiome with Zach Aanderud

 In this insightful episode of Y Health, Dr. Cougar Hall from BYU's Public Health Department is joined by Professor Zach Aanderud from BYU's Plant and Wildlife Science to explore the fascinating world of the human microbiome. They discuss Zach's academic journey, the effects of diet on gut bacteria, and the microbiome's role in digestion, nutrient absorption, mental health, and chronic diseases. The episode emphasizes the importance of dietary diversity, highlighting the benefits of plant-based foods, probiotics, and the adverse effects of antibiotics. Listeners are encouraged to access reliable scientific information, with practical insights on optimizing gut health through food choices and understanding the profound impact of the microbiome on overall well-being.

 https://pws.byu.edu/directory/zach-aanderud 

Recorded, Edited & Produced by Averee Bates, Christy Gonzalez, Harper Xinyu Zhang, Madison McArthur, Kailey Hopkins, and Tanya Gale

Transcript

 Cougar: [00:00:00] Welcome to Y Health, a podcast brought to you by the BYU Public Health Department. I'm Dr. Cougar Hall, a professor here at Brigham Young University. Whether you are a student, parent, or BYU fan, this podcast will help you navigate the world of public health. Our podcast strives to help individuals receive accurate information about their health. 

Regarding public health. So whether it's global or local, we will discuss how it pertains to you. Just kick back and relax as we talk about Y Health. Professor Zach Aanderud, welcome to the Y Health podcast. It's great to have you on. 

Zach: Thank you for inviting me. 

Cougar: And we literally just met about 15 minutes ago, Zach. 

You've been educating me as, as our technician's doing a sound check here. I am blessed. So excited. I've been reading and listening all day about the human, you got to help me with [00:01:00] this 

Zach: microbiome 

Cougar: microbiome. In fact, there's a whole different language in your field, but the human microbiome project, which is a decade old now. 

So my mind has been sufficiently blown. And I know that the listeners will have their minds blown today as they listen to you. Can we back up though? Can you give us an introduction to who you are, where you're from, how you wound up at BYU and the department of plant and wildlife science? What the heck, huh? 

Zach: Yeah. Yeah. The I am in, in the, in the plant wildlife sciences, there is a, environmental science and sustainability. That is the part that I am associated with. I'm originally from Portland, Oregon on the outskirts towards the coast. I was at BYU as an undergrad. I did a conservation biology major because that was kind of the most environmentally major that was around at that time in BYU. 

I then went and did a master's in [00:02:00] ecology at UC Davis. I, and then I did a PhD in biogeochemistry at UC Davis. And then I went to Michigan State University and did a postdoc on microbial ecology. And I think along the way, I just realized that, you know, the small single cells, organisms of the world are incredibly important, metabolically diverse. 

And it was around the same time when the explosion of next generation sequencing was occurring. So before it was You know, a 96 well plate where you would identify several bacteria, build a tree and say, are these, you know, what are these bacteria doing? But with the explosion of next generation sequencing it has just been this amazing wild ride of rapid change and rapid growth. 

And it's allowed us to unlock a lot of those. Otherwise unknown community spaces or organization that [00:03:00] we would have seen before in, in something like the gut microbiome. 

Cougar: Well, it's all new to me in all honesty, Zach. So you are well prepared, well trained, and I'm sure you're an absolute treasure in your department and to your students. 

So really cool stuff reading about some of your research today, for sure. I kind of went down that rabbit hole and, but there really is a whole, It's a whole different language. I have to apologize. I'm going to botch everything I say. But there's this incredible intersection between the microbiota, if you will, and health. 

And in public health, we are always saying, you know, we're going to get upstream. We're not, we're not treating patients. We're, we're all about prevention and populations. And as I've been listening, and whether it was on YouTube or reading articles, I started to feel like you're just not upstream. You're at the headwaters of, of health of human health and these little bugs and have so much to do with our gut health with, with things like I was diagnosed with asthma [00:04:00] at age 12. 

And I learned today that that may have been exposure or lack of exposure to different microbiota in, in utero during vaginal birth. I mean, everything, my mind was completely blown. Where do you see the intersection, whether it's environmental health, Or it's our own, our own very much human physiology and pathology. 

As we look at chronic disease, we look at what depression, anxiety, things like asthma that I just mentioned. I'm, I'm in teacher education. So my students are always trying to wrap their brain on how to help students that are have autism. And I learned today that autism spectrum disorder is closely associated with our microbiota. 

So. Maybe there's a question there, but maybe you can take that and run, Zach, save me here. 

Zach: Yeah. So the microbiome just means small community in, in the sense of how we're looking at it in human health. And one of our direct interactions with the environment is what [00:05:00] we eat. And early on, your mother probably told you, Oh, you are what you eat. 

That's. Unfortunately, not necessarily true, it's more true that you are what your microbiome or your gut microbiome eat. So when you start digesting, you put food in your mouth, your food sits in your stomach. There's very few bacteria in your stomach. And, you know, it's a really low acidic environment. 

Your food sits there for, at tops, like an hour or so. And then it moves on into your small intestine. And your small intestine is there for two to five hours. And that combination of your stomach and your small intestine, though, 90 percent of your energy harvesting is done. So when you're breaking down food, like starches and glucose and sugars and you're, and you're bringing them into your body to be used that those are those, those locations. 

So ultimately when after the small intestine, you come to your large intestine or now what we would call the gut [00:06:00] and in the gut, it's only really associated with 10 percent of that energy harvesting, but there are this myriad. Of beneficial activities that occur in your gut microbiome. So even in your small intestine, there's not many bacteria, there's hardly any, and then all of a sudden you get to your, your large intestine and your large intestine has more. 

It is one of the most densely populated spaces by bacteria on the planet. So if you take a soil from the rainforest, a water sample from, you know, this really murky swamp and you think, Oh, there's so much alive in it. It's actually that your gut holds ultimately a higher density of bacteria than ever before. 

Cougar: Amazing. 

Zach: So your gut could have trillions. of bacteria from tens of thousands of different species that usually are at a one to one cell ratio of your [00:07:00] body. So for every one bacteria that's in there, it's, you know, the cells of your body and they go back and forth between 10 to one or one to one. But what is new, what is true is they hold a complex genomic assembly of genes and they have a unique expression of genes that you yourself don't. 

never will perform. So you as an individual, you are a chemo heterotroph organism that is breaking down reduced carbon compounds and generating ATP for your energy. The bacteria that are in your gut can do a myriad of different metabolic processes, and they're what's called Anaerobic bacteria, right? So you're an aerobic organism that you need O2 to survive. 

They don't necessarily need O2 and same kind of fermentation processes that are happening in, you know, alcohol production or things like some of those are similar, but on a, I'm just an incredibly diverse scale. So, so orders of magnitude, more genes and [00:08:00] metabolic expression that is happening by your gut microbiome to influence. 

I think, I think people are now realizing that your gut microbiome and what you put in your food is incredibly important. Or what you put in your mouth to eat is incredibly important for human health. They, they have started calling it the center of human health. So one of the, one of the big things early on is, yeah, again, 10 percent of digestion. 

That's great. But it also, what it's digesting is not necessarily just generating or releasing those sugars. It's generating tons of vitamins. Sometimes these B and K items that are only made by your gut microbiome, it's releasing tons of metals for your digestion. It's generating these volatile fatty acids that are incredibly important to your your gut membrane interactions. 

So like, right, your gut membrane, And it has barriers, it has epithelial cells and this mucosal, intermucosal layer, outer mucosal layer. And these [00:09:00] compounds are being absorbed into your bloodstream. That's how you're harnessing this, this energy. So it makes all of these short chain fatty acids. It makes an immense amount of neurotransmitters. 

Serotonin is one of the big ones, 90 percent of your serotonin that is associated with your wellness and your happiness. How well you sleep is generated in the gut and moves to the brain. And, and now what we understand is this. gut microbiome brain access that we really never understood before. People are showing that what you're eating is associated with your skin and associated with cancer inflammation and autoimmune disease inflammation because this breakdown Again, which is it's just not about harvesting your sugar and it's not about being regular this these products that are being made are Really keep your whole system your whole body in homeostasis, right? 

It just gives you this nice balanced area and again, there's Thousands of different chemicals that are being [00:10:00] generated in this gut and only by the bacteria that would be associated there. So the composition of what you have in your gut is ultimately depicting your 

Cougar: health and that community bugs. I'm just going to use that. 

It's okay. You can call 

Zach: them bugs. It's, it's, it's not, it's not offensive. 

Cougar: It's not all bacteria, right? But I would say 

Zach: it's upwards of 90%. 

Cougar: Okay. Then I'll use bacteria. You can call them 

Zach: bugs if you want. It's okay. 

Cougar: But that communities Much of that microbiota really helpful and have a symbiotic relationship with, with our cells, but some have to be pathogenic. 

Yes. And that's why we're talking about this. So it's, it seems from a public health perspective, we then want to know how do we change the demographics of that community for optimal health? And I read some stuff today I've read, and I'll probably say this wrong, but fecal microbiota, Transplantation. 

Zach: Yeah. 

Cougar: And then I also listened to a incredible [00:11:00] lecture from a guy from the university of California at San Diego. who talked about making tweaks to his diet completely changed the community in his large intestine and was, was, was taking daily stool samples and tracking mind blown. Yeah. So if we can translate some of that, that, that, Incredible bench science. 

What does that mean for me at breakfast, lunch, dinner? You've wrapped your brain around this a little bit. I'm sure. Oh, 

Zach: no, absolutely. Absolutely. So I think it's important to understand community structure. So in your community, in your gut microbiome, there are thousands and thousands of species that are commensal. 

They're there. They're benefiting you. They're, they're occupying space to discourage pathogens from, from coming on board. They're regulating that mucosal layer. They're not necessarily ones that you can point to a, here's a neurotransmitter that they're generating, or here is a specific thing then [00:12:00] associated after that, after those thousands, there's several hundred. 

Probably several thousand still that are beneficial bacteria that we've named probiotics. Okay. Right, so we've named these bacteria that we know are really important to our human health, these probiotics. And then there's relatively few that are pathogens. But they all do coexist at the same time. So, and your gut, you can think of it as You have two communities in your gut. 

One, you have a community that is associated in that mucosal layer that helps keep that mucosal layer boundary integrity high, right? It's beneficial and it has pretty low diversity. And then there is the community that is being generated all the time that is passively, you know, it's passing through you. 

It's, it's transient. It's kind of like, this is a community that's coming in with what I eat. Associate with my body and also what is already there. So ultimately that bacteria that [00:13:00] are in that kind of like free space can be Inoculated and you can have that same community be there over, you know days and months depending on what food you're eating But they can change right your gut microbiomes absolutely change Based on how you're living what you're eating your level of stress your age your sex you know Injury, trauma, all of this stuff can change your gut microbiome and you, you yourself can change it to be increasingly beneficial for you. 

So the way I look at it, there's one one of the things that we learned early on was just overall diversity is declining associated with Western diets. So we eat a lot of fats, oils, and grease. We eat predictable foods that are, that are very processed. And we are just getting a lot of this just we're getting a lot of sugar, right? 

We get a lot of glucose and again What happens is then that diversity of our gut microbiome goes down because if you can imagine you're eating And when you're eating all of this sugar your your stomach and your in your [00:14:00] small intestine are doing a fabulous job At grabbing and holding on to that sugar, but ultimately when you get down to your small I mean your large intestine. 

There's not anything there to feed your microbiome. So although So We are seen as more efficient at what we're, when we're eating these kind of diet. That is again, similar straight jacket, high sugar coming down to us. There's nothing left for our gut microbiome to, to really feast upon diversity drops. 

And all of these benefits that we have with the gut microbiome are basically canceled out. 

Cougar: Is that where we keep getting messages about fiber? 

Zach: No. So fiber is fibers. Okay. So fiber is, this is not a story about feces. Although it happens in your gut. I think that's one thing that's really important for, for everyone to understand, like your gut microbiome is about all of these other secondary metabolites that are being generated, that really control much about your body. 

So [00:15:00] there, so it's okay to. Think about fiber, but it's what's called soluble fiber and plant polyphenols So when you eat a when you eat more of a plant based diet, right that has a high level of diversity That's coming from multiple sources and you're eating things that are higher in what's called soluble fiber those chemicals are basically Passed through your small intestine into your large intestine and then feed Your gut microbiome, you can never, you're never going to be able to digest the, you know, what we think of fiber, the insoluble fiber, right? 

That is what helps you regulate going to the bathroom. But for the most part, what you want is food that is resistant to the breakdown in the small intestine and then get to that location of your large intestine to fuel. Your gut microbiome, all the thousands of species that are there. 

Cougar: So, so what types of macronutrients in [00:16:00] particular are going to make it all the way through to the large intestine? 

Are we talking more complex carbohydrates or are we talking more proteins? 

Or, or I would say, I would say both, both, 

Zach: like, like pretty much anything that can, that will, that is chemically complex enough to resist that, you know, two to three hours in your small intestine. Because then once it gets to your large intestine, it stays there for, you know, anywhere from. 

14 to 24 hours, really. And it can actually generate all these other metabolites. 

Cougar: So I'm trying to think of a former guest we had, Dr. Benjamin Bickman, endocrinologist here in the college and very much has created a career and wrote a fantastic book about insulin resistance and gave a BYU devotional where he cautioned about eating highly processed foods that would, you know, Filled with simple sugars. 

In fact, I think he said, avoid thinking anything that comes in a, in a bag or a box or has a barcode. And I'm, and I'm hearing, I'm not trying to lump you together, but I'm hearing what [00:17:00] you're saying about our diet has become less and less diverse, even on a simple level. I think of myself and my neighbors, we probably all buy the same hundred items at Costco in all honesty. 

It's, it's not, it's not the world that I grew up in that maybe you grew up in where my mother made casseroles from scratch, or we had everything on the table, either grew in my dad's garden or he shot it on opening day. Like that was the world I grew up in and not a slight against my family or against modern living, but we very much. 

by what is on rebate at Costco each week. And that's what we eat that week. And so I imagine, and especially as we're, we're doing a very good job of exporting the Western diet throughout the world, it appears to me this lack of diversity is limiting and changing the community of the microbiome. And what I'm hearing you say is we need to be more diverse and avoid just, [00:18:00] just easy, easily digested and processed. 

Yeah, absolutely. Simple sugars. Yeah. And I would 

Zach: say, I would say more even plant based, right? Just more of that plant based, that's where all these polyphenols come from. There's thousands of different secondary chemicals that, that are harnessed from eating, you know, again, apples are good for something. 

Pears are good for, they're getting polyphenols. They're getting you insoluble fiber. Or soluble fiber, there's avocados, there's, you know, a whole myriad of beans and lentils and sometimes those soluble fibers and those Insoluble fibers come together in the same food, right? It's not like it's, it's not like it's just one or the other, but it's, it's really, you know, just really saying, look, can I bring in a whole diversity of, of plant based diet as possible myself as a environmental scientist who is really interested in sustainability high protein based diets are, are insustainable for, or [00:19:00] unsustainable for our world. 

Like we all can't. Eat like we do. So one of the things, you know, I mean, I can understand that there's, there's some benefits of, of eating more protein and eating more red meat. And I, I understand that, but really being plant based eating lower on the food chain, not only has a less impact on our environment. 

But it also is, is giving you all that you need for that, for your gut microbiome. 

Cougar: It's adding the diversity. It's adding that diversity. Less of a strain on our planet. Okay. 

Zach: And it's, and well, because, Yeah. ultimately beef production and pork production are incredibly inefficient, right? I mean, the conversion of, of plant based material to meet like the, a pound for pound kilogram to kilogram transition is wildly inefficient. 

Chicken is, is pretty good. Fish is pretty good. So, I mean, if, if someone's eating lower on the food chain, but still wants a high protein [00:20:00] diet, Chicken is chicken's not bad, right? Right now. I tell my students I teach environmental biology here and, and biogeochemistry. And I tell them, you know, about 90 percent of the mammals that are walking around the planet are us and the animals that we eat, you know, there's 8 million of us on this planet, or sorry, 8 billion of us on this planet. 

There's that many cows. Right. And pigs. And then there's like something like 21 billion chickens. And so our impact of us managing those high protein based, if they're, if they're energy intensive, they're fought generally fossil fuel, intensive, intensive. It's just, it's just not sustainable for the whole global population to eat this way. 

However, eating diverse. And eating more than, you know, eating, I never really like to call anything a vegetable because I don't really believe in vegetables, but I believe in tons of plant based materials. But yeah, it is just incredibly beneficial because [00:21:00] again, that nourishment, thousands of other things in, in your, in your, in your gut that are essential for your health. 

It's just, it's just amazing. 

Cougar: Yeah. You know, it's interesting. I've been, I've been teaching as a, as a high school teacher and now training my teachers. In, in every curricular package you're going to find, it'll say, we need a diverse diet. We need five fruits and vegetables a day. We know, but, but we never get to the why. 

Yeah. And you're explaining the why Zach in a really compelling manner. Yeah. And I'm thinking, well, I do get my, my fruits but I, it's all five bananas. I have five bananas a day. Well. That's, that's not giving me the diversity that my biome needs 

Zach: to support a D a really diverse community. Right. Because that's, again, if you can think I want, yes. 

And we had talked about probiotics in specific here in a second, but the more, the higher level of diversity, Generally in communities, it leads to functional stable [00:22:00] stability, right? It's a more stable environment. So if there is a stress or you eat something different, it is ready. It's more resilient. 

It recovers more easily. The diverse, it just gives you a lot more options. It all of when I think of my gut it's all these bacteria. They're eating stuff and then they're puking other stuff out. And they don't have mouths, so they're really not doing it, but they're secreting it out. And then those foods are for other populations. 

So there is these close community interactions that are what we call a consortium, what they're eating and what they generate from their eating is, is used by something else. And then so on and so on as far as bacteria wise. So there's this linkage associated with them. So having that diversity allows a lot of other bacteria species to ping and be active. 

In, in your gut and to be sustained in that gut. Because again, you can change your gut by, you know, there's only so long that these bacteria are going to hold out. Like you probably have a banana rich [00:23:00] microbiome right now that it's just like queued into bananas. So stoked when the bananas come, but it might be only 20 species that are benefiting in your gut where the other 200 would have liked to see some raspberries and maybe like you know, a mango or two or some carrots or some salary and, and, and that would have allowed them to be in your gut. 

But again, it's that transient gut that it gets pushed out. And if they're not associated with that inner gut lining, they're not going to be replaced in your gut when you go back 

Cougar: there. What's so, so this is an impossible question. Probably. What, what's the lifespan? If I don't, you know, the, the community members that really want some blueberries from me today, but it's been three weeks cause they haven't been on sale. 

Are they flushed out? And I have to reintroduce those. 

Zach: They're there, but they're usually in a really low, low level. So bacteria, most communities. And we don't know this about the gut yet. I think we're still trying to get this idea is when we go out in the environment as seasons change, [00:24:00] especially or can our environmental conditions fluctuate about upwards of 70 percent of that community can be what's called dormant. 

So they just kind of like slow down and they just. Barely eke out an existence and they're there. So they're there in your gut. Yeah. But, but again, if they're probiotics associated with specific foods, right, we don't, we eat, you know, hopefully we'll eating more of that plant based, but if we're not eating a lot of fermented foods that have some of these beneficial, incredibly beneficial bacteria for us they're not going to stay around. 

And some of those big ones there was A long time ago, you know, more than a hundred years ago, this Eli mentioned a cough. He was this Nobel. He won a Nobel prize associated with understanding phagocytosis by eukaryotes. And he looked at this Bulgarian community of peasants that drank fermented milk products and they were long lived [00:25:00] individuals, right? 

They lived for an incredibly long period of time and he was like, there's something in this drink that is stopping that putrefaction. This was his word, putrefaction of the large intestine. And it brought this big revolution about, oh, let's eat these things that are fermented drinks. So when someone says, oh, let's have a probiotic, it's usually associated with a fermented milk based product that is delivering Most often lactobacillus, right? 

There's a bunch of different strains of lactobacillus. We're really good at culturing them. The other ones are, are called bifidobacteria, these kind of Y shaped bacteria that look much like that Y on the mountain up there. But, but these are generally the ones that you're getting from fermented, fermented foods, and that are transient participants, but are essential participants in your, in your system. 

Cougar: So if I have to summarize this, cause I know your, your time is probably Running short here. I'm gonna eat a variety of foods. I'm going to really focus on a [00:26:00] plant based diet if I'm going to, if I'm, if I'm desirous to include some animal source protein I can eat a lot more chicken and have far less, you know, far less demand on whether it's water or soil or air. 

Absolutely. Probiotics. Should I be seeking out foods that, I mean, this is like a 50 billion industry from what I read today as far as supplementation and any, any thoughts there as far as, yeah, yeah, no, 

Zach: absolutely. 

Cougar: And maybe we should distinguish between those times when I'm taking antibiotics or my wife's on an antibiotic and maintaining a chemical balance in her body is going to be really important. 

Any, any thoughts? 

Zach: Yeah. So I consult for a a company here In the valley, it's called love biome. And I would say one thing that happens is people have had bad experiences with probiotics. They've expected probiotics to do some certain things. They Pick the wrong product or they picked a product that didn't have the [00:27:00] correct diversity or that did not have, you know, they call them these, they'll say in your probiotic, oh, it has so many CF use. 

These are called what's called colony forming units. But the idea is like, you don't really know how many of those are still alive. How many of them are going to pass into your, from your stomach and the low pH in your stomach and your small intestine into your large intestine. So there's a, there's. 

There's a lot of people who have had a bad experience with a probiotic. And really quickly, when someone says this is a prebiotic, so a prebiotic is really just the foods, the polyphenols. and the soluble fiber, right? Or sometimes they call them, um, the resistant starches that will ultimately get down into your gut. 

So that's all that a prebiotic is a food that feeds a probiotic. And then a postbiotic Second is the chemicals, the secondary chemicals, the things that are essential. Butyric acid, acetic acid prop, NOIC acid. All of your [00:28:00] neurotransmitters, your vitamin Ks, your vitamin Bs, your serotonin. That would be what's called a post biotic. 

Okay? The probiotic, I think you can never actually eat enough of fermented foods and eat enough of probiotics. 'cause again, these are transient members that are in your gut. They are not necessarily the ones that are there on high levels. What you eat every day. Yes, absolutely. If you eat a high plant by a base diet, you're still going through fermentation in here, right? 

So like yogurt, those kinds of things, bring in new types of species that you would look at. There are getting incredibly better at target probiotics. So not only just fecal transplants, but it's bringing a whole new a whole new system, a whole new community of people that have been devastated by high levels of dysbiosis, right. 

Or, you know chronic bowel disease intestinal gastritis, enteritis. I mean, all of these things, like you can bring that in, but you can also By [00:29:00] changing your diet, increase that integrity of that space. Protect yourself from invaders. You know, that would that would would cause harm. I mean, there's just so many benefits associated with it. 

So my, my approach is I think people are doing what's better. What's called targeted probiotics, right? We're starting to understand what all these species do, and we can make products now that are specifically targeting your level of wellness. Or that would help you with sleep. So you're taking it at a certain time or ones that would basically helping you break down those materials and, and make more of that serotonin that would increase that, that gut brain microbiome access. 

So I think we're getting more strategic where antibiotics, antibiotics. Kill everything, right? They're mostly just general antibiotics. They're horrible for your gut microbiome. I would, I would, I'm not, I'm not saying that antibiotics aren't incredibly useful because Selman Waxman from Berkeley, I mean, antibiotics as a [00:30:00] microbiologist are amazing, right? 

And they're these, these beautiful chemicals that do so much. And that's actually why they called them probiotics, right? They were, here's an antibiotic, but here's a and they don't work exactly. It's not exactly the opposite of them, but But it's really this idea that they're beneficial bacteria that are really necessary for your overall health. 

And we have not given them their due. We've actually waged a war on our gut microbiomes by eating a high Westernized diet. Not introducing things through different foods that are fermented. A lot of the fermented foods are chemically fermented. You know, just, just not. Not having dogs and letting them lick our faces. 

I mean, we, we have really constricted not being outside, not touching soil, not, I mean, we should touch nature every day, drink a lot of water and think about our gut, you know? I mean, that's a kind of a good, a good thing to call my 

Cougar: wife. Yeah. Would, would Kim Chi for [00:31:00] dinner with that work? Kim Chi is great. 

Okay. We'll do it. I mean, all those are good. I mean, 

Zach: Kim Chi is a beautiful, it has specific whole groups. Of, of, of different types than you would see in just yogurt of that fermented cabbage. I mean, there's all this, there's, there's all, but again, if you are, you have your own fermenter, you are your own fermenting pot. 

There are ones that you might be missing that could be really beneficial to you. And that's what I think a probiotic is, is fabulous about is, is, is. Increasing in that up, or some people can take a good prebiotic, right. That has a lot of polyphenols, a lot of that diversity that they would never see. 

Right. So like this company that I work for, they have a great product that that basically brings in all of this high level of diversity, all these polyphenols, not so much of the insol the insoluble fiber, but it does have insoluble fiber in it. You know, there's those kinds of products and I'm not. 

You know, plug in there. I'm just, 

Cougar: Oh, you're welcome to [00:32:00] make a plug. It's okay. Oh, no, it's, yeah. I hope people do some Googling. 

Zach: Yeah. No, it's, it's called love Biome. And they call this product, it's called Phyto Power. Cool. And it has, it has a bunch of probiotics in it that are the essential ones that we don't necessarily get that are for high level of our health. 

And it has tons of these phytochemicals that, that are really essential to us. And then they've started doing more pro more targeted probiotics and we've been working with them to design specific biotic, you know, probiotics that are helping the individual, right? So I have this. Hey, these are the consortium of bacteria, the synthetic community that may help your gut extremely well. 

So it's kind of where we're at. 

Cougar: I love it. I love that. We're taking bench science and yeah, and we're targeting specific elements And I mean if you just look at modern life it We're, we're going the wrong direction and yet science, I think will help us fill in that gap. You know, I mean, just as you're talking about, we need to be outside, touch [00:33:00] dirt, play with your dog. 

Like these are things that I don't know that our children are doing or that we as adults are, are doing because we're in a cubicle with a computer or in a car in traffic. And so many, so many things are stacked against us as we learn more. I think I think we can. I think it's possible to make a U turn. 

I do, too. I'm very absolutely. Yeah, 

Zach: I think just even Recognizing that your gut microbiome exists and recognizing that you, you, yourself, you're an individual, but you are a incredibly complex community of a microbiome. We haven't even talked about the microbiomes on your skin, the ones, you know, in different parts of your, in, in your nasal passageway that are associated with disease, your skin for your responses, when you get cuts or agitations, the idea of cancer, the brain, you know, like we've, it's, it's really just touching on the surface. 

And the science is just exploding around it, right? It was just not many mentions of the, the [00:34:00] human microbiome. And now it is just in the last five years, you know, there's thousands and thousands of paper. And I'm just really excited to, to bring this to BYU to share it with undergraduate students. So if there's students out there in the health department that are interested, I have already I've had students in my lab from MN bio, from biology, from environmental science and human health. 

And we are, you know, doing this a lot of gut microbiome community analyses with machine learning capabilities, which we've never been able to do before to really help us sort out all these complex interactions and really get down to here is, here's the ones that are the most important to really high levels of wellness and, and to treat specific diseases. 

Cougar: I love it. 

Zach: Yeah, I love it. 

Cougar: I think I told you when you walked in, I said, Hey, the rest of us are playing checkers and you're playing chess and there's a lot of ketchup. I'm so thankful for the internet truthfully, because I did go down the rabbit hole for eight hours today and mind blown. And I'm [00:35:00] embarrassed that I've taught things like nutrition and have But I've never even gone to this level really to look at the science. 

And I, I think the science is really convincing. We're all trying to make better choices with you know, our health and our behavior, but sometimes to understand the details is exactly what we need. That like, that is the cue to action is no, I actually understand what this particular food Item is going to do for me and my community. 

Zach: Yeah. It's no longer just thinking you're eating to get energy, right? You're eating ultimately who you are, your center of health. And I, and I said it once before, it is you, you are what your gut microbiome eat. Right. Again, you have the energy, but everything else, all those thousands and thousands of other processes that are occurring in your body are regulated. 

In part by this closest interaction you have, you know, so you think of it, it's open to the environment, right? You're putting things in, it's passing through, you're chemically transforming them with the help [00:36:00] of bacteria. And it's coming out the end. There is no other, we do nothing else in our lives that is so intimately and interconnected with the rest of the natural world. 

You know, I mean, it's just, you are this huge diverse. Super organism that's walking around and you need to be, you need to be aware of it and you need to feed it appropriately. 

Cougar: Be a good host, right? Be a good host. That would be a great way. I have to cut you loose because you have bills to pay. You actually have a job and a lab to get back to. 

Zach: Thank you for having me. 

Cougar: On your way out the door Zach, is there anything you're listening to? Anything you're, you're reading that's keeping you motivated? We're both mid career here and we, we love what we do, but what is it that gets you excited? Anything you're listening to or reading right now? 

I didn't give you any warning. Did I? Yeah, no, I. 

Zach: I am in my classes in this class that I teach for PWS one 50. It's called environmental biology. It, it has two general [00:37:00] rules or two outcomes. One. I want, I want to help people understand how to access science, right? And to find truth and not be swayed by miss and disinformation, right? 

Because the, the, the, the, Majority of us out there are being overloaded with the internet, with social media, and it's, and it's really hard for our students and for the general public to access science. 

And then the other one is I want them to be informed enough that they can make their own decisions and participate in these conversations intelligently. 

And I think I wish the same so that I, I, I'm more on, I would encourage everyone out there to like, be a little more familiar with Google scholar, like Look at where you're getting your information and realize oftentimes we don't know enough about the things we think are true to really substantiate where we stand on those things. 

And this is one of those, right? We think we understand health, but really there [00:38:00] is this huge, complex organism that is, that is now being realized is, is, is much at the center of what we do and, and our health. I love it. Google scholar, Google scholar, just goof around, realize that, that to you, and you don't have to read a whole science article. 

You can just read the abstract. That's it. And then find those new sources where either the, the information that is being generated is being vetted because there's nothing like the microbiome. Like people's, I'm not saying podcasts, but like their blogs or their right. You know, and they're excited. They want to share that information, but we want to make sure that, that people are getting those, that right information. 

They don't, when they come to maybe try a probiotic or they try to eat more healthy, they're not turned off because of, you know, a bad experience associated with it. 

Cougar: I love it. Zach, thanks again for your time, brother. No worries. Thank you. I can't wait to have you back. All right. Thanks. Yeah. Yeah. for joining us today. 

Catch us on our next episode and don't forget to subscribe [00:39:00] to future Y Health episodes.