{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":31.62,"endTime":34.208,"body":"Ahoy legend."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":31.62,"endTime":34.208,"body":"Welcome to another episode of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":34.269,"endTime":37.658,"body":"the Team Buffalo podcast. I'm"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":34.269,"endTime":37.658,"body":"your host, Travis Thomas."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":37.72,"endTime":41.602000000000004,"body":"Today's question is a little bit"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":37.72,"endTime":41.602000000000004,"body":"different than what we've done"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":41.663,"endTime":45.299,"body":"in past. And I think it's an"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":41.663,"endTime":45.299,"body":"important question. As always,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":45.361000000000004,"endTime":49.304,"body":"we only do important questions."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":45.361000000000004,"endTime":49.304,"body":"But today's is a tricky one. And"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":49.366,"endTime":53.186,"body":"this comes out of a number of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":49.366,"endTime":53.186,"body":"conversations that have been had"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":53.248000000000005,"endTime":57.007000000000005,"body":"over previous weeks and months"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":53.248000000000005,"endTime":57.007000000000005,"body":"with various organizations and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":57.068,"endTime":60.95,"body":"clients and coaching. And it is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":57.068,"endTime":60.95,"body":"around the question of how do I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":61.012,"endTime":64.832,"body":"know it's time to move on a poor"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":61.012,"endTime":64.832,"body":"performer? This is a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":64.894,"endTime":68.16,"body":"theme lately, there have been"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":64.894,"endTime":68.16,"body":"some things around poor"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":68.22200000000001,"endTime":72.042,"body":"performance and bad ideas. But"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":68.22200000000001,"endTime":72.042,"body":"this one specifically is around"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":72.104,"endTime":75.739,"body":"how do I know? And then the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":72.104,"endTime":75.739,"body":"second part of that question is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":75.801,"endTime":79.19,"body":"how do I deal with getting rid"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":75.801,"endTime":79.19,"body":"of someone who is a poor"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":79.251,"endTime":82.702,"body":"performer? It's a major"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":79.251,"endTime":82.702,"body":"challenge in for any leader that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":82.76400000000001,"endTime":86.646,"body":"really cares about their people,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":82.76400000000001,"endTime":86.646,"body":"or is invested time and energy"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":86.707,"endTime":90.46600000000001,"body":"in their people, which is, of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":86.707,"endTime":90.46600000000001,"body":"course, you if you're listening"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":90.52799999999999,"endTime":94.287,"body":"to this? How do you deal with"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":90.52799999999999,"endTime":94.287,"body":"the guilt that comes with that?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":94.348,"endTime":98.292,"body":"Because that's a big thing. You"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":94.348,"endTime":98.292,"body":"know, you're affecting someone's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":98.353,"endTime":101.989,"body":"career, their livelihood, their"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":98.353,"endTime":101.989,"body":"reputation, but you're also"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":102.051,"endTime":105.686,"body":"affecting yours by not doing or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":102.051,"endTime":105.686,"body":"doing that said, action. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":105.748,"endTime":109.322,"body":"let's unpick that a bit. First"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":105.748,"endTime":109.322,"body":"thing I asked leaders, when"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":109.383,"endTime":113.019,"body":"they're in this scenario of do I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":109.383,"endTime":113.019,"body":"keep or do I not keep this"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":113.081,"endTime":116.593,"body":"person is? Well, what have you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":113.081,"endTime":116.593,"body":"done? Talk me through what"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":116.655,"endTime":120.105,"body":"you've done. Tell me the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":116.655,"endTime":120.105,"body":"journey. If you're listening to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":120.167,"endTime":124.11,"body":"this, now, we're having this as"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":120.167,"endTime":124.11,"body":"a mock coaching session, I'd ask"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":124.172,"endTime":127.869,"body":"you to go away and take some"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":124.172,"endTime":127.869,"body":"time reflect on what am I done?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":127.931,"endTime":131.505,"body":"What's been the journey? What"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":127.931,"endTime":131.505,"body":"have I spoken to this person"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":131.566,"endTime":135.14,"body":"about? What examples have I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":131.566,"endTime":135.14,"body":"given them? How do I know that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":135.202,"endTime":138.529,"body":"their performance really is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":135.202,"endTime":138.529,"body":"poor, rather than it being"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":138.591,"endTime":142.16500000000002,"body":"something else like me being"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":138.591,"endTime":142.16500000000002,"body":"unclear as a leader or me not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":142.227,"endTime":145.924,"body":"giving explicit instructions or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":142.227,"endTime":145.924,"body":"me not having clear goals to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":145.985,"endTime":149.313,"body":"provide them? But you really"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":145.985,"endTime":149.313,"body":"want to work through that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":149.374,"endTime":152.94799999999998,"body":"journey? And understand? What"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":149.374,"endTime":152.94799999999998,"body":"are the specific things that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":153.01,"endTime":156.64600000000002,"body":"happened? And what did I do to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":153.01,"endTime":156.64600000000002,"body":"coach them to change them to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":156.707,"endTime":160.466,"body":"provide support along the way?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":156.707,"endTime":160.466,"body":"So that's the first bit what's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":160.528,"endTime":164.04,"body":"the journey that they've been"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":160.528,"endTime":164.04,"body":"on? The second is, can they"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":164.102,"endTime":167.922,"body":"under any scenario, you could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":164.102,"endTime":167.922,"body":"see with any amount of coaching,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":167.984,"endTime":171.619,"body":"any development, any workshops,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":167.984,"endTime":171.619,"body":"any anything that you could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":171.681,"endTime":175.255,"body":"reasonably, within budget wise"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":171.681,"endTime":175.255,"body":"and time wise provide them?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":175.316,"endTime":178.829,"body":"Could they get better? Could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":175.316,"endTime":178.829,"body":"they that's, that's a tricky"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":178.89,"endTime":182.464,"body":"question that, do you if you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":178.89,"endTime":182.464,"body":"stopped and you ask yourself,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":182.526,"endTime":186.223,"body":"honestly, do you think this"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":182.526,"endTime":186.223,"body":"person will improve? And I would"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":186.285,"endTime":189.735,"body":"ask you that in a coaching"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":186.285,"endTime":189.735,"body":"session, you might say, Well,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":189.797,"endTime":193.617,"body":"I'm not sure. So that I would"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":189.797,"endTime":193.617,"body":"say, All right, we need to pause"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":193.679,"endTime":197.499,"body":"this decision you're about to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":193.679,"endTime":197.499,"body":"make, and I need you to go to do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":197.561,"endTime":201.32,"body":"some reflection, and some real"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":197.561,"endTime":201.32,"body":"problem solving. If you're not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":201.381,"endTime":204.709,"body":"sure if the person could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":201.381,"endTime":204.709,"body":"improve, then you need to get"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":204.77,"endTime":208.714,"body":"clear on what a plan to improve"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":204.77,"endTime":208.714,"body":"that person could look like. You"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":208.776,"endTime":212.719,"body":"have to how could you not, it's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":208.776,"endTime":212.719,"body":"not something that's negotiable."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":212.781,"endTime":216.478,"body":"Or you want to look back in a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":212.781,"endTime":216.478,"body":"year and go, I really, they're"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":216.54,"endTime":219.991,"body":"doing so well, in this other"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":216.54,"endTime":219.991,"body":"organization. I'm happy for"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":220.052,"endTime":223.873,"body":"them. But I wonder if I could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":220.052,"endTime":223.873,"body":"have done something to make them"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":223.934,"endTime":227.631,"body":"perform that way here. So if"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":223.934,"endTime":227.631,"body":"you're not sure that they could"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":227.693,"endTime":231.39,"body":"improve, this is part of the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":227.693,"endTime":231.39,"body":"second part, if you're not sure"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":231.452,"endTime":235.087,"body":"if they could improve, you need"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":231.452,"endTime":235.087,"body":"to go away and be clear and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":235.149,"endTime":238.846,"body":"figure out what evidence you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":235.149,"endTime":238.846,"body":"need to have that clarity on if"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":238.908,"endTime":242.913,"body":"they could. Now if the answer is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":238.908,"endTime":242.913,"body":"yes, I think they could improve."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":242.975,"endTime":246.795,"body":"Great. So that takes you down"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":242.975,"endTime":246.795,"body":"pathway A which is I'm not going"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":246.857,"endTime":250.739,"body":"to move forward on performance,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":246.857,"endTime":250.739,"body":"managing or getting rid of this"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":250.8,"endTime":254.682,"body":"person or whatever step on that,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":250.8,"endTime":254.682,"body":"because I'm going to take that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":254.744,"endTime":258.688,"body":"plan that I came up with that I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":254.744,"endTime":258.688,"body":"think will work and getting them"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":258.749,"endTime":262.385,"body":"on track. And I'm going to do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":258.749,"endTime":262.385,"body":"the things required. And that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":262.446,"endTime":266.20500000000004,"body":"combination of things required"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":262.446,"endTime":266.20500000000004,"body":"could be things like training,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":266.267,"endTime":269.533,"body":"they might need to go through"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":266.267,"endTime":269.533,"body":"some level of training,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":269.594,"endTime":273.04499999999996,"body":"mentoring and coaching."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":269.594,"endTime":273.04499999999996,"body":"Definitely coaching for me along"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":273.10699999999997,"endTime":276.865,"body":"the way, some interim goals. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":273.10699999999997,"endTime":276.865,"body":"they'll just say, Hey, you're"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":276.927,"endTime":280.378,"body":"missing your quarterly target."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":276.927,"endTime":280.378,"body":"Let's see how you go next"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":280.43899999999996,"endTime":284.198,"body":"quarter, no interim goals, how"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":280.43899999999996,"endTime":284.198,"body":"do we know if they're on track"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":284.26,"endTime":287.957,"body":"throughout that whole quarter"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":284.26,"endTime":287.957,"body":"clarity and support mechanisms"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":288.019,"endTime":291.408,"body":"for them where they can say, I'm"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":288.019,"endTime":291.408,"body":"not sure about this, I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":291.469,"endTime":295.413,"body":"understand this is something you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":291.469,"endTime":295.413,"body":"want me to work on and improve,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":295.474,"endTime":299.048,"body":"but I'm struggling with how to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":295.474,"endTime":299.048,"body":"fix it. Great. I'll provide"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":299.11,"endTime":302.129,"body":"support and I'll set"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":299.11,"endTime":302.129,"body":"expectations around when you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":302.191,"endTime":306.011,"body":"come to me for help. So that's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":302.191,"endTime":306.011,"body":"pathway a we set that that kind"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":306.073,"endTime":310.017,"body":"of journey and the expectations"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":306.073,"endTime":310.017,"body":"and then we tell them we need to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":310.078,"endTime":313.652,"body":"see marked improvement by this"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":310.078,"endTime":313.652,"body":"date. And we will be having"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":313.714,"endTime":317.411,"body":"conversations along that weekly"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":313.714,"endTime":317.411,"body":"or possibly fortnightly, but"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":317.473,"endTime":321.231,"body":"generally weekly, to see how"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":317.473,"endTime":321.231,"body":"you're progressing against those"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":321.293,"endTime":323.82,"body":"measurable targets that I've set"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":321.293,"endTime":323.82,"body":"for you."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":324.83,"endTime":328.215,"body":"If the person has bad behaviors"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":324.83,"endTime":328.215,"body":"that you're saying, then the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":328.272,"endTime":331.939,"body":"measure is quite clear. We don't"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":328.272,"endTime":331.939,"body":"want to see those bad behaviors."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":331.996,"endTime":335.551,"body":"We want to see them deep precent"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":331.996,"endTime":335.551,"body":"volume to the point where they"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":335.607,"endTime":339.275,"body":"don't exist anymore. That's path"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":335.607,"endTime":339.275,"body":"A. And then depending on if they"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":339.331,"endTime":342.886,"body":"achieve or don't achieve, that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":339.331,"endTime":342.886,"body":"then takes us down path B, which"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":342.943,"endTime":346.441,"body":"is the same path that you might"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":342.943,"endTime":346.441,"body":"set down to begin with, if you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":346.498,"endTime":349.771,"body":"answered the question, second"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":346.498,"endTime":349.771,"body":"question with, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":349.827,"endTime":353.382,"body":"they can ever get better? Well,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":349.827,"endTime":353.382,"body":"if the answer is they can never"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":353.438,"endTime":356.824,"body":"get better. And I know based on"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":353.438,"endTime":356.824,"body":"everything I can see and all"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":356.88,"endTime":359.984,"body":"their patterns and their"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":356.88,"endTime":359.984,"body":"motives, then I'm not going to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":360.04,"endTime":363.426,"body":"waste my time trying to push"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":360.04,"endTime":363.426,"body":"them I've already tried to pass"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":363.483,"endTime":366.925,"body":"and they're not committed. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":363.483,"endTime":366.925,"body":"path A could lead to B, if they"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":366.981,"endTime":370.649,"body":"don't adjust their behaviors, or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":366.981,"endTime":370.649,"body":"B could be simply the thing that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":370.705,"endTime":373.978,"body":"you know, based on all the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":370.705,"endTime":373.978,"body":"evidence you have and what your"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":374.035,"endTime":377.251,"body":"gut is telling you. I mentioned"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":374.035,"endTime":377.251,"body":"gut and people have mixed"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":377.307,"endTime":380.693,"body":"feelings about gut. But there's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":377.307,"endTime":380.693,"body":"truth to this, your gut will"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":380.749,"endTime":384.248,"body":"tell you something, you know,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":380.749,"endTime":384.248,"body":"when a decision might feel a bit"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":384.304,"endTime":387.859,"body":"scary, or a bit concerning, but"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":384.304,"endTime":387.859,"body":"your gut is saying this is kind"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":387.916,"endTime":390.794,"body":"of the right thing."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":387.916,"endTime":390.794,"body":"Alternatively, if your brain is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":390.85,"endTime":394.236,"body":"saying you need to do this, and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":390.85,"endTime":394.236,"body":"your gut is going or I'm not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":394.292,"endTime":397.903,"body":"sure I'm not quite sure this is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":394.292,"endTime":397.903,"body":"the right thing to do. They need"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":397.96,"endTime":401.346,"body":"to go Why is my gut instinct"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":397.96,"endTime":401.346,"body":"telling me this isn't right. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":401.402,"endTime":404.675,"body":"pay attention to that we do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":401.402,"endTime":404.675,"body":"literally feel those things in"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":404.731,"endTime":408.23,"body":"our gut. And it's our brain and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":404.731,"endTime":408.23,"body":"other parts of our body trying"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":408.286,"endTime":411.559,"body":"to reconcile what we're about to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":408.286,"endTime":411.559,"body":"do logically, versus what"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":411.615,"endTime":414.493,"body":"emotionally or maybe"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":411.615,"endTime":414.493,"body":"subconsciously, we're aware of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":414.55,"endTime":417.992,"body":"as a factor in this decision. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":414.55,"endTime":417.992,"body":"once your gut tells you that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":418.048,"endTime":421.49,"body":"that's what you're going to do,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":418.048,"endTime":421.49,"body":"and you need to do it. How do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":421.547,"endTime":424.537,"body":"you do that? Now, you'd be"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":421.547,"endTime":424.537,"body":"remiss not to have the big"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":424.594,"endTime":426.964,"body":"conversation, the big"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":424.594,"endTime":426.964,"body":"conversation is that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":427.02,"endTime":430.406,"body":"conversation where we sit the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":427.02,"endTime":430.406,"body":"person down, and we say, look,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":430.462,"endTime":433.679,"body":"we've had this chat, we've"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":430.462,"endTime":433.679,"body":"spoken a number of times about"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":433.735,"endTime":436.895,"body":"Miss performance, we have set"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":433.735,"endTime":436.895,"body":"really clear goals, and we"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":436.951,"endTime":440.394,"body":"haven't quite landed them. How"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":436.951,"endTime":440.394,"body":"do you think you're going? And"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":440.45,"endTime":443.779,"body":"the person might say to you,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":440.45,"endTime":443.779,"body":"Well, okay, doesn't sound like"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":443.836,"endTime":447.503,"body":"I'm doing very good. And like, I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":443.836,"endTime":447.503,"body":"don't think I'm doing very well."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":447.56,"endTime":450.833,"body":"Or they might say, I think I'm"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":447.56,"endTime":450.833,"body":"fine. I don't I don't think"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":450.889,"endTime":454.444,"body":"there's a problem. And I think"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":450.889,"endTime":454.444,"body":"you're exaggerating the problem."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":454.501,"endTime":457.886,"body":"In either scenario, once we've"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":454.501,"endTime":457.886,"body":"gotten to a point where we've"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":457.943,"endTime":461.046,"body":"already given them evidence,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":457.943,"endTime":461.046,"body":"we've already had multiple"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":461.103,"endTime":464.658,"body":"performance conversations, our"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":461.103,"endTime":464.658,"body":"role as a leader is no longer to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":464.714,"endTime":468.212,"body":"make them accept the details."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":464.714,"endTime":468.212,"body":"You know, whether or not someone"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":468.269,"endTime":471.824,"body":"believes they did the thing they"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":468.269,"endTime":471.824,"body":"did, if the evidence is there,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":471.88,"endTime":475.379,"body":"it's there. And so one of the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":471.88,"endTime":475.379,"body":"things I often say to leaders in"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":475.435,"endTime":478.595,"body":"coaching these specific"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":475.435,"endTime":478.595,"body":"scenarios is do not go down into"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":478.652,"endTime":481.868,"body":"the level of detail, it's not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":478.652,"endTime":481.868,"body":"necessary to argue back and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":481.924,"endTime":485.536,"body":"forth over bits and pieces. It's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":481.924,"endTime":485.536,"body":"not there simply isn't, there's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":485.592,"endTime":488.921,"body":"no benefit to it, you're not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":485.592,"endTime":488.921,"body":"going to be happy, they're not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":488.978,"endTime":492.081,"body":"going to be happy, you're"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":488.978,"endTime":492.081,"body":"probably not going to land in"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":492.138,"endTime":495.693,"body":"agreement, by the end of that."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":492.138,"endTime":495.693,"body":"There's nothing great that comes"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":495.749,"endTime":499.191,"body":"out of that. So don't do it."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":495.749,"endTime":499.191,"body":"Now, obviously, if you've missed"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":499.248,"endTime":502.295,"body":"some substantive things, and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":499.248,"endTime":502.295,"body":"they've got evidence that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":502.351,"endTime":505.229,"body":"actually they had been"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":502.351,"endTime":505.229,"body":"performing well, you need to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":505.285,"endTime":508.897,"body":"deal with that. But most likely,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":505.285,"endTime":508.897,"body":"they're just going to argue the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":508.953,"endTime":512.3389999999999,"body":"nuance of well, yes, I might"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":508.953,"endTime":512.3389999999999,"body":"have done this wrong. But I did"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":512.395,"endTime":515.668,"body":"this a little bit better than"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":512.395,"endTime":515.668,"body":"you're saying I'm doing it's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":515.725,"endTime":518.9970000000001,"body":"like, well, but you still"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":515.725,"endTime":518.9970000000001,"body":"completely missed the target. So"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":519.054,"endTime":522.6089999999999,"body":"it's kind of irrelevant. So you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":519.054,"endTime":522.6089999999999,"body":"have that big conversation, you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":522.665,"endTime":526.277,"body":"ask them how they think they're"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":522.665,"endTime":526.277,"body":"going, you then lay out the kind"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":526.3330000000001,"endTime":529.719,"body":"of evidence of what you've seen"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":526.3330000000001,"endTime":529.719,"body":"and where you think they are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":529.775,"endTime":533.3299999999999,"body":"your assessment. And then it's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":529.775,"endTime":533.3299999999999,"body":"the big question is, are the big"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":533.387,"endTime":536.7719999999999,"body":"statement, I should say is like,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":533.387,"endTime":536.7719999999999,"body":"I don't think this place is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":536.829,"endTime":540.384,"body":"right for you in this role, you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":536.829,"endTime":540.384,"body":"know, in the current conditions"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":540.44,"endTime":543.939,"body":"you're in and the roles and the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":540.44,"endTime":543.939,"body":"targets. Given you cannot meet"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":543.995,"endTime":547.606,"body":"those expectations, what do you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":543.995,"endTime":547.606,"body":"think some options are? What can"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":547.663,"endTime":550.879,"body":"we do? And I think this is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":547.663,"endTime":550.879,"body":"interesting. People might say,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":550.936,"endTime":554.208,"body":"well, I should just tell them"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":550.936,"endTime":554.208,"body":"that they're not working, or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":554.265,"endTime":557.481,"body":"they should quit or whatever."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":554.265,"endTime":557.481,"body":"You could do that. But then"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":557.538,"endTime":560.867,"body":"you're forcing a hand and you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":557.538,"endTime":560.867,"body":"might get embroiled in stuff."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":560.923,"endTime":564.196,"body":"And then fireworks gets involved"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":560.923,"endTime":564.196,"body":"because they think you're"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":564.253,"endTime":567.864,"body":"following them or whatever else."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":564.253,"endTime":567.864,"body":"It's, there's an easier path to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":567.92,"endTime":571.532,"body":"start with. And the question is,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":567.92,"endTime":571.532,"body":"well, what could an alternative"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":571.588,"endTime":575.03,"body":"to this be if this role, or this"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":571.588,"endTime":575.03,"body":"project or this job or these"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":575.087,"endTime":578.303,"body":"team is not a good fit for you?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":575.087,"endTime":578.303,"body":"What are some alternative"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":578.359,"endTime":581.463,"body":"options we could explore? And"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":578.359,"endTime":581.463,"body":"I've seen things you'd be"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":581.519,"endTime":585.018,"body":"shocked to see, but I've seen"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":581.519,"endTime":585.018,"body":"people put their hand up and say"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":585.074,"endTime":588.404,"body":"actually, I want to move out of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":585.074,"endTime":588.404,"body":"projects and I just want to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":588.46,"endTime":591.733,"body":"focus on business as usual Bau"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":588.46,"endTime":591.733,"body":"and I just want to be in an"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":591.789,"endTime":594.893,"body":"operational role Cool No"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":591.789,"endTime":594.893,"body":"worries. Let's look at is that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":594.949,"endTime":598.335,"body":"possible? Can we make it work?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":594.949,"endTime":598.335,"body":"Are the goals something other"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":598.391,"endTime":601.721,"body":"behaviors the right way to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":598.391,"endTime":601.721,"body":"deliver on that? Others Michael,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":601.777,"endTime":604.937,"body":"actually, need I need to be"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":601.777,"endTime":604.937,"body":"knocked down from the skirt?"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":604.993,"endTime":608.492,"body":"Yeah, I was taking a punt at a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":604.993,"endTime":608.492,"body":"senior role or taking upon that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":608.548,"endTime":611.878,"body":"a project manager role and I'm"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":608.548,"endTime":611.878,"body":"not fit for what was good to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":611.934,"endTime":615.432,"body":"learn and actually don't like"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":611.934,"endTime":615.432,"body":"this type of work. So could I be"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":615.489,"endTime":618.762,"body":"moved back to my old lower level"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":615.489,"endTime":618.762,"body":"position? Yep. Let's work"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":618.818,"endTime":622.147,"body":"through that. If that position"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":618.818,"endTime":622.147,"body":"is available, we can promote"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":622.204,"endTime":624.8,"body":"someone else to take their"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":622.204,"endTime":624.8,"body":"current role great."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":626.1,"endTime":629.46,"body":"Or they might say something to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":626.1,"endTime":629.46,"body":"the effect of I I don't think I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":629.514,"endTime":632.657,"body":"want to be here anymore. Okay,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":629.514,"endTime":632.657,"body":"cool. Well, how can we help"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":632.711,"endTime":635.692,"body":"support you moving on there is"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":632.711,"endTime":635.692,"body":"an actual service called"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":635.746,"endTime":639.052,"body":"outplacement services. That's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":635.746,"endTime":639.052,"body":"not the name of a business, but"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":639.106,"endTime":641.924,"body":"it is referred to as"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":639.106,"endTime":641.924,"body":"outplacement services. And it's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":641.978,"endTime":645.23,"body":"this thing where we support"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":641.978,"endTime":645.23,"body":"people in moving to the next job"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":645.284,"endTime":648.59,"body":"helps them get their CV prep"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":645.284,"endTime":648.59,"body":"coaches them on career decisions"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":648.644,"endTime":651.733,"body":"and thinking about the career"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":648.644,"endTime":651.733,"body":"they want. And to help them"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":651.787,"endTime":655.093,"body":"identify opportunities, you'd"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":651.787,"endTime":655.093,"body":"have to pay for it as business."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":655.147,"endTime":658.345,"body":"You know, alternatively, you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":655.147,"endTime":658.345,"body":"might have some roles that you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":658.399,"endTime":661.922,"body":"recommend them for, but you need"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":658.399,"endTime":661.922,"body":"to be careful about putting your"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":661.976,"endTime":665.39,"body":"name on those things. So it's,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":661.976,"endTime":665.39,"body":"as we said, there, we've got the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":665.444,"endTime":668.533,"body":"opening of kind of, how's it"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":665.444,"endTime":668.533,"body":"going, What am I seeing? And"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":668.587,"endTime":671.839,"body":"then what are the options from"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":668.587,"endTime":671.839,"body":"there. Now, if they're a poor"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":671.893,"endTime":675.091,"body":"performer who doesn't think"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":671.893,"endTime":675.091,"body":"they're a poor performer, those"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":675.145,"endTime":678.342,"body":"options are going to be fairly"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":675.145,"endTime":678.342,"body":"limited, and you're probably"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":678.396,"endTime":681.486,"body":"going to have to tell them the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":678.396,"endTime":681.486,"body":"hard truth. But if there's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":681.54,"endTime":684.629,"body":"someone who just can't get"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":681.54,"endTime":684.629,"body":"across the line, they've tried"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":684.683,"endTime":687.88,"body":"their best, but they really"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":684.683,"endTime":687.88,"body":"aren't cut for the role. That's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":687.935,"endTime":691.24,"body":"a different scenario. And the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":687.935,"endTime":691.24,"body":"reason I flagged these with you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":691.295,"endTime":694.655,"body":"is because leadership is nuanced"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":691.295,"endTime":694.655,"body":"and contextual. If you do not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":694.709,"endTime":697.744,"body":"factor in the nuance, and the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":694.709,"endTime":697.744,"body":"context of the things that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":697.798,"endTime":701.104,"body":"you're dealing with, you will"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":697.798,"endTime":701.104,"body":"use too big of a brush to paint"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":701.158,"endTime":704.409,"body":"things, or you will push people"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":701.158,"endTime":704.409,"body":"in a direction that actually"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":704.464,"endTime":707.498,"body":"probably isn't the best"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":704.464,"endTime":707.498,"body":"direction and or is more painful"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":707.553,"endTime":710.696,"body":"for you, as the leader to carry"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":707.553,"endTime":710.696,"body":"that direction out. So get"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":710.75,"endTime":713.514,"body":"really clear on what's the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":710.75,"endTime":713.514,"body":"nuance there, is there a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":713.568,"endTime":716.495,"body":"performance issue because of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":713.568,"endTime":716.495,"body":"will because of skill, or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":716.549,"endTime":719.692,"body":"because of process, if it's a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":716.549,"endTime":719.692,"body":"process problem with most, I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":719.746,"endTime":722.89,"body":"need to fix that if the process"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":719.746,"endTime":722.89,"body":"is poor, how is that their"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":722.944,"endTime":726.25,"body":"fault, it's a skill issue, and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":722.944,"endTime":726.25,"body":"I've tried to build the skill,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":726.304,"endTime":729.501,"body":"then, you know, we can't get"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":726.304,"endTime":729.501,"body":"them to that level. That's why"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":729.555,"endTime":732.861,"body":"some people are never going to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":729.555,"endTime":732.861,"body":"be the best engineer, well, we"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":732.915,"endTime":736.275,"body":"can't push them to be a better"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":732.915,"endTime":736.275,"body":"engineer, if they're as good as"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":736.33,"endTime":739.31,"body":"they can be. And they need to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":736.33,"endTime":739.31,"body":"step back down. But if we"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":739.364,"endTime":742.128,"body":"haven't given them the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":739.364,"endTime":742.128,"body":"opportunity to be skilled at"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":742.182,"endTime":745.326,"body":"that thing, and we've promoted"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":742.182,"endTime":745.326,"body":"them into it, then that's a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":745.38,"endTime":748.848,"body":"problem, of course. And then the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":745.38,"endTime":748.848,"body":"third one I mentioned was will."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":748.903,"endTime":752.1,"body":"So process skill, and will will,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":748.903,"endTime":752.1,"body":"is very, very difficult to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":752.154,"endTime":755.406,"body":"change, you know, leadership and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":752.154,"endTime":755.406,"body":"some of the Guru books talk"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":755.46,"endTime":758.874,"body":"about this notion of, you just"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":755.46,"endTime":758.874,"body":"need to motivate people and give"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":758.928,"endTime":762.126,"body":"them the purpose. Some people's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":758.928,"endTime":762.126,"body":"motivation is anarchy. Some"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":762.18,"endTime":765.594,"body":"people's motivation is just pure"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":762.18,"endTime":765.594,"body":"chaos, or to do the minimum or"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":765.648,"endTime":768.792,"body":"to make a high salary and not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":765.648,"endTime":768.792,"body":"really give a shit about the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":768.846,"endTime":772.26,"body":"things around them. That's true,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":768.846,"endTime":772.26,"body":"we know that like you can look"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":772.314,"endTime":775.566,"body":"around anywhere in the world."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":772.314,"endTime":775.566,"body":"And you'll know that there are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":775.62,"endTime":778.33,"body":"some people who thrive on"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":775.62,"endTime":778.33,"body":"anarchy, some people are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":778.384,"endTime":781.69,"body":"sociopaths, if you have one of"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":778.384,"endTime":781.69,"body":"those people in this role, you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":781.744,"endTime":785.104,"body":"are not going to convince them"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":781.744,"endTime":785.104,"body":"to be motivated to do the right"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":785.158,"endTime":788.41,"body":"thing and to be good and tick"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":785.158,"endTime":788.41,"body":"all the boxes, you're just not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":788.464,"endTime":791.499,"body":"you can if it works, that way,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":788.464,"endTime":791.499,"body":"we wouldn't have half the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":791.553,"endTime":794.859,"body":"problems we have in the world."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":791.553,"endTime":794.859,"body":"But it doesn't. People who are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":794.913,"endTime":798.327,"body":"built a certain way and who do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":794.913,"endTime":798.327,"body":"not have an affinity or interest"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":798.381,"endTime":801.362,"body":"towards changing those"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":798.381,"endTime":801.362,"body":"motivators to positive ones that"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":801.416,"endTime":804.668,"body":"get them the right outcome are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":801.416,"endTime":804.668,"body":"never going to come around to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":804.722,"endTime":808.245,"body":"your way of thinking and to what"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":804.722,"endTime":808.245,"body":"the position requires. So if you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":808.299,"endTime":811.388,"body":"discover that the person has a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":808.299,"endTime":811.388,"body":"will problem, and they are"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":811.442,"endTime":814.423,"body":"genuinely not interested in"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":811.442,"endTime":814.423,"body":"changing their thinking and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":814.477,"endTime":817.729,"body":"behaviors, you need to force"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":814.477,"endTime":817.729,"body":"their hand and you need to move"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":817.783,"endTime":821.197,"body":"to act on that. Now, of course,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":817.783,"endTime":821.197,"body":"work with your HR partners work"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":821.251,"endTime":824.611,"body":"with HR consultants, whatever"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":821.251,"endTime":824.611,"body":"you need to do consult fair work"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":824.665,"endTime":827.754,"body":"to ensure that you follow the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":824.665,"endTime":827.754,"body":"correct framework for doing"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":827.809,"endTime":831.06,"body":"that. But definitely, if you've"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":827.809,"endTime":831.06,"body":"got someone on your team who"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":831.114,"endTime":834.529,"body":"just doesn't want to play ball"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":831.114,"endTime":834.529,"body":"and doesn't want to do the right"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":834.583,"endTime":837.943,"body":"thing, you must act on that you"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":834.583,"endTime":837.943,"body":"have a duty as a leader to the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":837.997,"endTime":841.086,"body":"rest of your team, to the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":837.997,"endTime":841.086,"body":"organization and to yourself to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":841.14,"endTime":844.609,"body":"do that, for the right outcome."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":841.14,"endTime":844.609,"body":"So that's the question of how do"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":844.663,"endTime":848.023,"body":"you ensure that you are dealing"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":844.663,"endTime":848.023,"body":"with the performance issue and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":848.077,"endTime":851.437,"body":"having a process to go through"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":848.077,"endTime":851.437,"body":"that if you follow that process"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":851.491,"endTime":854.58,"body":"that then resolve the second"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":851.491,"endTime":854.58,"body":"point which I covered at the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":854.635,"endTime":857.669,"body":"beginning, which is how do I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":854.635,"endTime":857.669,"body":"reconcile and deal with the"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":857.724,"endTime":860.921,"body":"feelings that come with us? The"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":857.724,"endTime":860.921,"body":"feelings are dealt with, by"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":860.975,"endTime":864.389,"body":"being really clear on a process"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":860.975,"endTime":864.389,"body":"and following that process to a"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":864.444,"endTime":867.749,"body":"point where you can go you know,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":864.444,"endTime":867.749,"body":"I did everything I could. It"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":867.804,"endTime":871.272,"body":"didn't end in a happy way. But I"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":867.804,"endTime":871.272,"body":"did the right thing. And I know"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":871.326,"endTime":874.578,"body":"that I did, as best I could as"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":871.326,"endTime":874.578,"body":"the leader, and I don't think"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":874.632,"endTime":877.829,"body":"anyone could have done better"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":874.632,"endTime":877.829,"body":"than I did it. Awesome. Well,"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":877.884,"endTime":881.027,"body":"that's been it for today's"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":877.884,"endTime":881.027,"body":"topic. There's some useful tips"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":881.081,"endTime":884.549,"body":"and tactics in there for you. If"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":881.081,"endTime":884.549,"body":"you'd like more tools, tips and"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":884.604,"endTime":887.801,"body":"tactics, you can head over to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":884.604,"endTime":887.801,"body":"Teambuffalo.co/newsletter And"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":887.855,"endTime":890.89,"body":"subscribe for our weekly"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":887.855,"endTime":890.89,"body":"content. Lots of great stuff in"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":890.944,"endTime":893.925,"body":"there. And if you're not"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":890.944,"endTime":893.925,"body":"following the podcast, be sure"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":893.979,"endTime":897.177,"body":"to subscribe and follow for more"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":893.979,"endTime":897.177,"body":"of that. I look forward to"},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":897.231,"endTime":899.67,"body":"seeing you in the next episode."},{"speaker":"Travis Thomas","startTime":897.231,"endTime":899.67,"body":"Stay awesome."}]}