Healthy Influence | with Stephanie Alton

How do you help people grow without making them dependent on you?

That question sits underneath every sermon, podcast, book, Bible study, and ministry platform.

Christian leaders are called to guide people, encourage people, and point them toward truth. But healthy influence requires more than gathering an audience. It requires helping people develop their own discernment, wrestle with Scripture for themselves, and build a faith that can stand on its own.

In this episode, literary agent Stephanie Alton joins Julianne Rhodes for a conversation about influence, platform-building, discernment, and the responsibility that comes with having people's attention.

Together, they explore:

• What healthy influence looks like in Christian spaces
• Why discernment cannot be outsourced to pastors, authors, or influencers
• The difference between building a platform and building dependency
• How Christian communicators can point people back to God rather than themselves
• Why knowledge alone does not produce spiritual maturity
• The role of personal responsibility in faith development
• How readers and listeners can evaluate the voices they follow
• The importance of testing ideas against Scripture and seeking God directly

Whether you're leading a ministry, writing a book, hosting a podcast, teaching a Bible study, or simply trying to grow in your faith, this conversation offers a thoughtful look at how influence can remain both effective and healthy.

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Learn more about Stephanie Alton and the Blythe Daniel Agency:

https://theblythedanielagency.com

If you care about Christian communication done with more creativity and integrity, come see what we’re building at contrarytopopular.com. 

Transcript

Healthy Influence with Stephanie Alton

Stephanie 0:00

You want to be their friend, you want to show them the way, but you also have to help them have that independence in their own faith to figure out how to go and find the answers themselves.

Intro

Julianne 0:12

There is a ton of Christian content out there to consume. Books, podcasts, sermons, social media posts. And yes, while good Christian teachers can help us grow in our faith, there is a danger that we might start relying on someone else's discernment instead of developing our own. I'm Julianne Rhodes, and this is Contrary to Popular. Today I'm talking with literary agent Stephanie Alton of the Blythe Daniel Agency about influence and what it looks like to communicate in a way that points people back to God rather than simply building a bigger audience. Stephanie, you've spent years evaluating Christian books, authors, and messages. So tell us a little bit more about what it means to be a Christian literary agent.

Stephanie 0:52

Thanks, Julianne. I am sometimes referred to as a gatekeeper. Sometimes I'm referred to as a matchmaker, but really I am a middleman between an author and a publisher. And it's kind of closely related to a real estate agent. We try to help you find the right place for the right amount of money. Typically, I will look through someone's proposal, decide if it is something I think I could help shape enough to sell or think is in good enough shape to go to a publisher. And I will help an author basically seal a book contract. I think the neatest part of what I do is being able to make the phone call to let someone know their dream has come true. And that comes when someone has invested years of thoughts and prayers in shaping a message or a story or a combo of both into 55 to 90,000 words. And we've tried so hard to find the perfect place for it, and we finally get that yes, and making that phone call and just hearing the other side of the line just exhale in gratitude and excitement and relief and joy and the complex emotions that come with that. I think that's the real highlight of it all is just helping someone reach their dream. The downside to it is there's a lot of rejections that come with that. And so it's really sometimes pushing people to say something in a better way or a more clear way, helping people fine-tune some of that and then get their book ideas to the people who can make it a reality.

Why people write books

Julianne 2:41

What do you find drives most people to want to become influencers in this way, writing a book and kind of putting it out there to the world? What makes them want to do that?

Stephanie 2:50

The most common answer I hear is God told me to do this. And telling our story, sometimes it's the only thing we have, and we can use it to help others, but sometimes it's meant to help ourselves. And so figuring out why God told you to share your story is sometimes a key element in figuring out what to do with it.

Speaker 3:14

Yeah.

Julianne 3:15

So it's your job to filter through all of these proposals that you see. What are some of the biggest reasons that you might say no to a project?

Stephanie 3:24

I think one of the most common things that I see is people want to tell their story and they are genuine in their desire to help others, but they've summarized their life story, assuming that people are going to get key takeaways from it. And the craft of telling your story in a way that is engaging for a reader isn't there yet. And so sometimes people will say this is a Christian living self-help, some sort of leadership book. And I'm like, great, this sounds fantastic, and I'll take a look at it. And then it really is just a summary of their life, and there isn't those elements there. So that gets a big no from me. Um it just isn't there yet. Sometimes I get projects that are very similar to something that I've already acquired and I'm pitching or is in production, and that changes, you know, from day to day. So the timing could be off. The market could be saturated with what someone's presenting. And it's a no for now, but maybe not forever, because a lot of times topics will cycle back through. There will be like a big buildup of them in production, and then we have to wait for that to filter out and simmer down before we send it through again. It's kind of like that old saying, There's nothing new under the sun. It it does come back around a lot of times. And if you can find a different way to say it, it could have potential, but just sometimes right now I can't do anything with it. And then there's some things that are just so far off course that I have it doesn't entertain me or teach me or engage my interest in any way. And then if it if it doesn't do that for me, then I I've got a pretty good sense of it's not gonna do that for readers and publishers are not gonna want to take it. I try to help people create their own pattern to follow within each chapter, and it gives a reader some anticipation of what to expect in the chapters to come, whether consciously or subconsciously, they're expecting certain things to happen within each chapter. And so helping the writer come up with the right kind of pattern for them and their audience is something that I can help them do.

Julianne 5:51

I coach people on what I call the skill story system. And you said that you look for patterns in their writing, and that when a reader can follow a pattern, they can sometimes digest the information a little bit more. And that's what this system is for, is to help develop those patterns that your reader can follow and learn a skill out of it, you know, instead of just taking in lots of information if they're not sure how to apply it. Right. So you had mentioned that you use your instincts, your discernment to be able to think about whether they're also biblically sound.

Discernment

Julianne 6:23 Stephanie 6:24

Yes. So I had someone on social media that I loved following, and she was she is super popular, and she's a great writer, super engaging in everything, and a popular speaker within the church. And then she shifted gears a little bit, and something inside me shifted as well. And I was like, this isn't aligning anymore. And so it takes going back to the Bible and checking it and praying over it. And so I I had noticed that was some influencers that were at one point very biblically sound, and then they became popularly sound, going with some trends and things, and that just didn't sit well. And it's very similar to what I see in projects. I have to look at it as probably true, but I need to make sure that it is true. And so checking anything and everything that you are taking in from somebody, especially if you have been burned by the church or been burned by leaders of some capacity or influencers, it's hard when you find an influencer that you really like and you have a lot in common with them and you think they're great, but then they start to sound a little bit different. And so I've I've learned with watching people over the years that once they gain that popularity in this big crowd of influence, sometimes they don't always stay true to the word. And it's really important in publishing that we do. And it's somewhat the process that I've gone through when I take on nonfiction books is is God giving me peace about the project? Is it aligning with the Bible? Is it helpful and is it crafted in a way that is beneficial to others?

Agency vs Dependency

Julianne 8:12

So when I coach Christian communicators and leaders, I'm always trying to encourage them to communicate in a way that builds agency in the person they're talking to versus becoming this influencer that sort of just creates dependency on themselves.

Stephanie 8:31

Right.

Julianne 8:31

In the industry overall, do you feel like Christian authors have been good at really empowering their reader, or has it been more of a here's how I interpret the Bible, here's what I think, you just need to get in line with what I'm saying because I'm right and the other guy is wrong, you know?

Stephanie 8:49

Well, I see that in proposals and I try to reject it, or help them say it in a different way that isn't so much finger pointing. Um so it's it's a tricky line to walk because you do need that element of trust building. And I think that's where we use personal story to catch that engagement from someone that yeah, I've been there too, or I've I've had really tough times. And that creates that connection, especially when you're bringing in somebody new to faith and you want to be their friend and you want to show them the way, but you also have to help them have that independence in their own faith. It's kind of like teaching a child to some degree. Like you got to show them how to do it for a while, but then you've got to teach them the tools on how to figure out how to go and find the answers themselves. And that creates that agency that you're talking about. And so it's a it's a balance that is unique to each writer and influencer or speaker, where you blend those techniques of storytelling, teaching, and sending believers out on their own to figure some things out.

Consumption

Julianne 10:07

Yeah. So when I'm online lately, I feel like I see a lot of people who are deconstructing, falling away from the faith. And obviously that's heartbreaking. And I'm wondering if part of the reason that's happening is because the way we've structured our modern Christianity is that we sort of outsource our discernment. We outsource our biblical knowledge to authors, to pastors, to leaders, to our husbands, whoever it may be. And when things get tough, we don't actually have the faith rooted in ourselves. So when that leader fails publicly, then our faith can fall. When that author goes off into left field and starts talking about new age stuff, well, then Christianity must not be real. So I don't know, do you want to talk about that?

Stephanie 11:01

Sure. I think we're all a little more prone to consumption or input of knowledge, but we're not always great with application. And so we listen to the podcasts, we listen to the online sermons, we go to church, we take it in, we take it in, but putting it into action, I think, is sometimes lacking. We're we're not fact-checking, we're not, and not fact-checking is probably not the best choice of word there. We're not Bible checking, we're not going back to our Bibles as often. We're just relying on what the podcaster is saying. If they're going off in a different direction, you don't have to keep supporting them with your views and likes and comments and things like that. You know, before you hit the internet for the day, God help me know who should I spend my time following, who should I not? It's a relational building with God that each person has to do on their own. It's not something we can gift to one another. We can share our wisdom and experiences and ideas and techniques and everything, but that discernment comes directly from God. And I don't have to fully follow this one person and everything they say. The only one person I should be following is Jesus.

Platform & Celebrity

Julianne 12:24

Yeah. So a lot of what you do is helping authors and leaders build a platform, which just means their presence online and out there in the world, right? What's the difference for a leader to build celebrity versus to build like a pipeline to God, like making God the celebrity?

Stephanie 12:46

So when somebody stays a little more focused on themselves and all they are doing, and you see like the popularity grow and they're doing all the cool things, and then other people are trying to copy it. I think when they lose sight of gratitude and recognition of what God has brought to the table for them, that is where the difference lies. And it's a tough line to walk. They start to collect an audience where they are not following them because of their faith, but because of different activities or skills that they have. And so they don't the person doesn't want to lose those followers that they have, whether it's from income revenue or leads that they get through them or whatever the case may be, they start to turn off the faith element. And it's disappointing in some ways. Like you're excited for them to have success and growth, but at the same time, that could be the difference between Christian publishing and traditional publishing. The the markets are different where in Christian publishing, it's critical that we include the faith element where in traditional anything goes. And so um building yourself up is acceptable, encouraged, applauded, whereas it's a little more frowned on in Christian publishing. But at the same time, you also have to have some of that so that you can sell books. So it's it's a complex answer on that. It you just you gotta do a little bit of the self, but you can't leave God out of the element.

Measure of success

Julianne 14:34

So a lot of pastors, podcasters, authors, if they were thinking about success metrics, it's easy to look at numbers, right? It's easy to look at how many people are showing up to my church on Sunday or how many people downloaded my podcast this week or whatever. Right. And that, like you said, is absolutely necessary to see growth and to have that reach that you want to have. But outside of that, in your experience, how would you tell an influencer to measure success in a different way, maybe a more meaningful way, uh over and above those numbers that they're looking at?

Stephanie 15:14

I think when you start to get messages from other people acknowledging something that you said or something that you did, and then you know, it coming to you with testimonial stories, that you're doing something right. If the ultimate goal is to help people through your life experiences so that others don't have to suffer the same way you did or struggle or spend so much time not knowing how to do something, then then you are successful. As long as your heart stays true to helping others be better off than where you were, then you've reached success with it. You're doing it right. It's not always gonna be like, oh my goodness, you saved me from this, that, or the other. It's just, oh, you helped me think differently, or you helped me solve a problem, or I was afraid to open my Bible, but you encouraged me to do it. And that's the first time in years that I opened my Bible, you know. So those are big wins, and that's what we're in the game for is helping each other.

Stephanie's Story

Stephanie 16:20

. We often hear God to tell our story, and we do it, and it may lead us in a way that you don't expect. And I have like a random story I can share with you. I initially heard God tell me to write my story, and for the next few days, I was like, God, I need you to confirm. And like every single scripture I was reading was affirming, telling your story, and I was like, Yeah, I'm gonna do this, but I made all the rookie mistakes, okay? I did. I made every single one of them. I went and I pitched my story, and it was rejected. I was told my writing was above average, and I'm like, oh, dagger to the heart. And so I was a little devastated, set back a little bit. And but when I was there, I had pitched my idea to Blythe. And I was like, I hope to cross paths again with her. And I ended up moving to the same city in which she lives in Colorado Springs. And one time she posted about writing she's needing someone to do a review for a movie. So I sheepishly stuck my hand up and was like, I'll do it. And I expected rejection. And she said yes. And she not only sent me one movie, she sent me two movies to review. And so I get an email from Blythe and she's like, I feel like God is telling me to come to ask you to come work with me. And I was like jaw on the ground in awe. I had no idea, just in our correspondence, you know, sheepishly saying yes, I'll review a movie. And I stayed in contact and I just prayed a real snarky prayer, and God was like, That's all you got. Here you go, you know, and I took that affirmation from God, you know, early on to write my story. It got me to the conference to experience all of the rejections and realize all the mistakes I had made. And then I connected with my now colleague. And over the course of the last 10, 11, 12 years, something like that, I have just continued to say yes and ask for God to, you know, affirm, am I supposed to keep doing this? And my role has just evolved. And what I thought was me writing my story for publication became me writing my story to get me in the door to where I belonged. And it hasn't turned out the way I thought. And I most definitely will not be publishing the initial proposal that I put together. But someday I'll have some sort of story, maybe a fiction book or something. But I have spent the last decade learning the industry, connecting with people, fine-tuning my craft, helping others, and it's all come from hearing God write your story. So if you're hearing that, do it, but just be prepared for it not to be what you expect, because it surely has not turned out that way for me. And I know so many others in the industry who have incredible roles. And if you ever get the chance to ask them how they got there, I'm sure they would love to tell you because it's probably some wild story too, like mine, just saying yes and snarky prayers. I mean, I mean, not all of them have been snarky, but there's been a few of them. Like maybe I shouldn't be so proud to say it, but God can handle it, you know. He he knows what I need, a confirmation, a yes or a no. I just wait for it to show up, and it usually does, one way or another.

Julianne 20:13

Yeah. And those kind of prayers are so honest. And I think that's what he wants, right? He just wants us to be real with him, just be a person and connect with him.

Stephanie 20:22

Right, right.

Julianne 20:23

Yeah. Well, I love that. I love that God's ways are higher than our ways, right? His plans are not what we had planned, but they're good. Yeah, so good. Well, Stephanie, thank you so much. This has been really fun.

Stephanie 20:36

Thank you for having me.

Julianne 20:37

Yeah, absolutely. So uh anyone who would be interested in working with Blyth Daniel Agency, tell us more how we can get connected with you.

Stephanie 20:46

Sure. So our website, the BlythDanielAgency.com, generally has links to conferences that we'll be at. And those are always great ways to get appointments with us or just meet us. There's also our submission line is on there so you can send your proposal in. We generally update the type of projects that we're looking for from time to time up on the website.