Double Bass and Beyond - Gary Upton of Upton Bass
Double Bass and Beyond - Gary Upton of Upton Bass
Episode 2 - On The River - With Travis Book
In episode 2 of the Double Bass and Beyond with Gary Upton of Upton Bass, Gary chats with Grammy Awarded double bassist Travis Book of The Infamous String Dusters about the latest in bass and music-life for Travis. You might not know how far Travis has taken the bass...literally. Checkout this YouTube video for just how far he has!
This is, uh, episode two of my impromptu podcast series. Um, we did a little intro and then we did one recently with Victor Wooten. Um, and here I am today with Travis book. For those people that might not know who Travis is, Travis, tell us who you are, what do you do?
Speaker 2:Well, I play big bass man, and I play, uh, I play bass in a, in a sort of pseudo bluegras band called the infamous string dusters. And we, we tour and make music. It's original acoustic music. And, um, I live in North Carolina. I don't know what else to say, man. I like, I like bikes.
Speaker 1:<laugh> what, but you've been, but, but you've been doing a lot of your own stuff too, right? Like you've been pretty regular on the open mic thing local to you. I think
Speaker 2:What I do is I, I have a, um, during the pandemic I started, uh, hosting something. I called the Travis book happy hour, which is a chance to interview friends, play music, get a little philosophical. And I was live streaming that by Facebook and out of that came a need to like work on that music, work on that show a little bit. And so I started doing Tuesdays the night before at a local venue in this little town ARD, um, place called 180 5 king street. And it's turned into, I mean, I've been doing for like a year and a half now. I, I, we basically, we call it Travis book and friends, and it's a different ensemble, almost every, uh, almost every week. A lot of times a little,
Speaker 1:No, you're, you're primarily guitar in that.
Speaker 2:Well, no, that's that the fun thing about that is I'm doing everything like I'll have, uh, I'll have like singer songwriters come in and I'll accompany them on upright face with maybe like a do player. And then sometimes I'll, I'll basically front my own band. I have like an, like an old time type band with banjo claw, hammer, banjo fiddle, and upright bass. I play acoustic guitar in that. I have another band that's a little bit more like country leaning with, uh, fiddle and Doro where I play acoustic guitar. I also, um, occasionally we'll play with this great drummer Jeff site who was in like aquarium aquarium rescue unit. And, and it's a total legend and I'll play electric guitar in that. And then, um, like sometimes I'll have people come and, and put together an Enso I'll play electric bass. I basically, the great thing about that gig is it's pretty low pressure. Um, you know, we can do about a hundred people in there, but, um, because I'm playing every week and it's always different ensembles, I'm getting the chance to do a, a really stretch myself musically in every direction. And that that's been incredible. So sometimes it's, it's, it's eBay sometimes it's the upright sometimes it's, you know, electric guitar, sometimes it's acoustic guitar. I I'm, and I'm really kind of doing a little bit of everything with that.
Speaker 1:So that probably wouldn't have happened if it weren't for being stuck at home with the pandemic thing. Right?
Speaker 2:No, and that's, that's really been a major silver lining of the pandemic for me is, is artistically and musically. I have grown and expanded in every
Speaker 1:Direction. You, you got to do your homework. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And, and, and, and establish this thing that has proven to be like really rewarding for me and the local music community. It's we built a whole scene Tuesday night. People are coming out to hear or whatever we've cooked up and, and it's, it's good for the brewery and the bar that I play at, it's good for, you know, I'm able to keep my, my buddies employed, you know, my local, local musicians employed. And, um, and, and yes, and, and beyond that though, just, you know, I, before the pandemic came on, you know, string dusters, we tour about half the time. And so I was, and I love that, but it's very one dimensional. I play upright bass in this certain style and I sing and sing a little bit of harmony. And, and that was really,
Speaker 1:And it's good. It's beautiful. And I've been lucky enough to go and see you do it live. It's been awesome. Uh, and you've guys have done things like the Grammy's and crazy stuff like that.
Speaker 2:Right.<affirmative> yeah, man, I, you know, we're, we're like, we're, we're, we're headlining red rocks this year. We've got a, we're nominated for Grammy for our, our last record that that came out. We, we won a Grammy a few years ago. We've, we've manage to do a lot with this band over the last 15 years. And we will be doing a lot more with this band forever. We're a band of brothers and we love it. We love it. It's it's a total honor or to be part of this, but it's
Speaker 1:It, it's kind of interesting to tease it out. It's like, it's, um, you know, everyone has this, this hip, there's a lot of this hip advertising with, with going, staying local and so on and so forth. But what, what you're really saying is you were forced to truly stay local people that were able to go and see big acts in big places were, wait, that's gone. And you, you weren't able to hop on a tour bus. Right. So you're like, I'm gonna go play at my local place. What was it called again?
Speaker 2:It's called 180 5 king street.
Speaker 1:And that was the, that was the Tuesday before the other night or that there was a, there were two.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's that's on Tuesday. And then Wednesday, we go up to Asheville place called the gray Eagle. And that's where I've recorded this thing, the Travis book, happy hour in about 20 episodes with, with a variety of different guests. And I've, I've actually turned that into a podcast. I have the first 10 episodes or eight episodes I've got, you know, cause it's like a 90 minute show. It has an interview segment there's we do about eight or 10 songs together. And so I've taken that, compressed it down to about 45 minutes to an hour, edited it down and have that in podcast form. You know, one thing I've learned about as a musician and as an artist is that you kind of have the opportunity to meet consumers or fans, uh, in, in a variety of places on their terms. And, you know, um, you know, so for some people like, they're like some, some artists starting to Spotify, they're not in streaming or they're not into some, some artists don't play live, you know, and that's, and, and, and that's a question I think we all have to ask ourselves as musicians is, is sort of like, well, the opportunity is really to do whatever it is you wanna do. You can do literally anything with your music and you can, whatever you're comfortable with. Right? Yeah, totally. And you could put it anywhere. The, the question is just sort of like, where, where do you wanna meet fans? You know? And so for me, being able to take it, edit it down to a podcast or live stream, you know, the show on, on YouTube or, or, or, you know, you can come see me live. Like, you know, there's, there's, those are the places I've decided to, to meet fans.
Speaker 1:Nice. Yeah. I, I, I, myself, I kind of enjoy, uh, jamming and recording my, in my pajamas. Um, yeah. And I, and I don't have all that long, long time. Uh, I mean, you've got so much experience playing life. It is, it's AB it's not even second nature. It's first nature for you. Um, but I mean, I think it's interesting. Like, I mean, people could come, someone could hear this in California and decide to come meet you in Brevard or up in Asheville. Right. And they could prob they could probably come next week, or right now you're on tour right
Speaker 2:Now. I'm on tour. Yeah. I won't, I won't be there next week, but, but, um, but the, but the two Tuesdays that I am home, I am playing down there and that's, it's, it's a little bit, it's like, it's a little bit like my own, like my own personal, like, it's like Branson, you know, where like the artist doesn't leave, you know, or like Vegas, where the artist doesn't leave, you go to the artist and that's, you know, it's, it's kind of turned into that sort of thing. If you, if you want to, if you want to hear me do my thing, or if you wanna see me and my friends do our thing, you can pretty much find us every Tuesday down on king street in Rivard. And, and hopefully I'll, hopefully I'll be doing it down there for forever. We got a great, we got a great little group of musicians, some really, really heavy musicians in, in bbar. And we have a blast making music together and
Speaker 1:It's it's and, and the, and the restaurant does. Okay.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The restaurant does great. It's it's I, the best brewer, that's
Speaker 1:The biggest, that's the big, it's a brewery too. So they've got, they've got the liquor sales. That's the biggest thing I've seen. Um, you know, in, in my mentor, early days said to me, Gary promise me, you'll never open a restaurant. Yeah. And I, I remember when he said it, I was like, I mean, restaurants are in place and they're never going anywhere. And then, you know, I'd see him on his Wednesday night jam with these, with these old time Dixie guys. And I used to go all the time, took it for granted. And now then you find out that Ashby's the lobster place in mystic that appeared to be making probably 10 million bucks a year selling overpriced lobster, put gone. And there's, and now, now there's a dunk of donuts, you know? Oh, okay. So that's why it's good to hear they're brewing some beer cuz that's, that'll probably keep'em there. Right? Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I mean, that was, and that was, that was one of the, you know, there's probably like 15 reasons is why I wanted to do this. Yeah. Start playing on Tuesdays. And one of them was to try to support this venue because they had just done a bunch of renovations, new owners that had a lot of new energy. And I knew that, you know, things are always touch and go for any venues and that, and, and, you know, as, as a musician and as an artist, I can, I can always take, I can always move on to the next thing. I can always make music here. I can go there.
Speaker 1:You can play in a field as you do.
Speaker 2:Exactly. And sometimes we do for field hippies, but, but you know, the, the, the, the people who own these venues and are paying the rent, man, they they're the ones that really have it all on the line. Yeah, absolutely. And, and I don't think that, that, that the small venue owners really get enough respect in, in, in the industry. Well, I think a lot
Speaker 1:Of, a lot of consumers don't realize, you know, just to, to key in a different thing. I, I do in my life, but it's like, I'll talk to people about the gym that I have. Right. You know, I've got ups and base that I do as Jim, as a, as another project, man, we pay$14,000 a month in rent. You, I mean, you, I can sell what, 300 memberships that you'll, you'll tell me it's expensive for 150 bucks a month. We're not even covering the rent. Right. You know, nevermind a thousand dollars electric, never mind the cost of the employees. You look at that nut at the end of the month, it's 25,000 bucks. Yeah. And you know, the breweries paying the same thing, they probably got some pretty significant loans out on their equipment. And unless they just dumped a bunch of cash in, in which case they still wanna get that cash back, you know? Totally. No one, no one's looking to just burn money, you know? Totally.
Speaker 2:Yeah. The, the, the overhead and the margins on a small venue are, it's ridiculous. And it's a labor of love for these people. And, and, and that's, you know, uh, uh, the older I get, you know, the question in part kind of becomes not just like, well, what, what do I want outta my life? But kind of like, what, how, you know, how can I serve and how can I, you serve the greater good. How do you share, man? Yeah. And what's the need and how can I help fill it? You know? Yeah,
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Um, and, and, you know, I think I'm feeling today when we, when I, I know I sent you a message saying this, but like, um, Travis is running around at, at, you know, is this, are you at the gig basically right now where you,
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm, I'm in like the offices of blue point brewing company up in long island where I've got a little bit of quiet space.
Speaker 1:So Travis is running around, you're running around saying, saying to me, Gary, I don't know if we could do this today. Cuz it's, it's, it's crazy loud<laugh> and, and my response was, you know, better done than not done. Perfect. And I, and I think, right, that's another line for the application of what happened during the pandemic. Uh, and by no means, do I want this podcast series to continue with that theme, but we can't ignore how crazy this has been for all of us. Yeah. I mean, before this happened, I was down in my van. Where was I seeing you? Uh, worm town. Remember I, I showed up to the van, I slept in the van behind the stage and you know, I mean, life was so free and easy, but yeah, you, you wouldn't be doing this Tuesday, Wednesday night. Yeah. And if it weren't for this and, and, and I bet going back to Victor's, uh, you know, podcast, we did, I bet you kinda like it this way. You know, it, it, it plugged you into things that, that, that were never gonna get plugged in
Speaker 2:Very early on with this pandemic. I, you know, I, I had, some of my contemporaries were sitting around twidling their thumbs waiting and yeah, for me, all I, all I ever see are opportunities. And it's always a question of, well, what can I do in this context? You know? And so, um, you know, I, I I'm, I'm starting to really get sick of COVID, but for a long time there, I didn't really have a big beef with it because I just sort of saw it as the natural unfolding. And it was, it was very interesting. And I could, I could be upset about it or I could, you know, I, you, you can always, you can always get, you can always get all worked up because things aren't how you expect them to be, or want them to be, or you can start from right here. Right. And see that, that, that there is endless opportunity to do whatever it is you want to do and need to do.
Speaker 1:I think that seed though, one of the things I've said at a, a million people have said it, but I've, I've noticed people only became richer for versions of themselves. Both, both, both positively and negatively. Right. So like, yes, if, if there were negative Nancys that focused on how everything was terrible, well, they dug into it, you know? Yeah. And, and for those people that are used to being survivors, um, you know, maybe it maybe goes back to the bicycle. I mean, it never feels good when you're riding the bike, but you keep doing it. You know what I mean? I just keep digging, dig, and dig and dig and dig and dig in. You
Speaker 2:Know, it never gets easier. You just go faster. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:<laugh> feels, but I think that application you're like, okay, I'm presenting. I presented with these chips. Oh, oh. Someone took 27 of my chips. Now I've only got these seven over here, whatever, I'll make my next thing.
Speaker 2:Totally I'll work with
Speaker 1:That. Yeah. I've always said that. I'm like, I don't care if I gotta go wait tables again or paint houses. I won't do it for long, but I'll, you know, I, I, I, I don't have a plan, but I, but there'd always be the next plan, the next thing, the next grind, you know what I mean? Yeah.
Speaker 2:You gotta play, you gotta play the cards you're dealt, you know, but, but you gotta play. You can't, you can't just like, sit on the sideline. You play the cards you don't, but, but you gotta play, you know, and you gotta play, you gotta play fearlessly, you know?
Speaker 1:And, and then look at all those people that came out and said, Hey, we, we, we still need this. You know, like we, we want this. And so, um, changing gears, looking at your social media, what's going on with this two thing.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah.<laugh>
Speaker 1:Cause I, I did see that on Instagram. Like he's got no tooth.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Yeah. I got what's that all, what's that all about? I had, I had to have a root canal done years ago cuz you know, I took a fall and killed my tooth. And then I think when they did the root canal, they took entirely too much material out of it. And so the other day I was kind of absent minded. I was on the phone with the buddy and I was fidling with my tooth and literally broke it off right at the bottom. Aw. So, oh, so I gotta do an implant here. See it here.
Speaker 1:Oh man scare here, here, come the bluegrass music. This is the bluegras side of the string dusters<laugh> and then we can combine back in the, uh, the grateful dead side and he can have his tooth again. Maybe. I don't know
Speaker 2:It it's only temporary, but it's actually pretty, pretty rich comic relief, not having a tooth. So I'm trying to really embrace it. How is this
Speaker 1:Singing like that?
Speaker 2:Um, well I put in this, like I got this Invisalign tray with a fake tooth and it works okay. But you know, I have, it gives me like a little bit of a speech impediment, but the S singing with the SS is
Speaker 1:A little tough. I would feel like a lot of air might be escaping that you don't want to, that you're, that you're hitting at the top of your mouth or something.
Speaker 2:You know, some, some, some people would be bothered by it, but I, it's just a really humbling. It's just a really good opportunity to be humbled and to not take any of this too. Excuse me. Any of this stuff too seriously? You're fine. You're fine. You know, you're fine. So, so it's it, it's, it's pretty honestly, it's pretty hilarious. You know, I, no nobody wants to lose their front tooth. Um, but it's not, you know, it's not because of poor dental hygiene or meth or anything like that. So I feel okay about it, but it's, it's pretty silly math. Thank
Speaker 1:You for clarifying that. It's not,
Speaker 2:Yeah, I didn't lose it because of Matt. We had
Speaker 1:Some questions over here that were saying, could you add? No, not really. So, um, the, so where are you playing tonight?
Speaker 2:We're uh, we're up in, uh, Hawg New York playing the blue point brewing company. We were at the, we at the capital theater last night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We're we're on tour of the dusters. We've been, we've been playing with this other great band called green sky bluegrass tonight. We're we're on like basically like a three week tour. We'll be in Boston next week. And then down to DC the weekend weekend. After that
Speaker 1:You said tonight's just you guys, right?
Speaker 2:Tonight's just us. Yeah. All right.
Speaker 1:But yeah, the, the, the, uh, internet connection did one of those, but we're, we're in the matrix for a second. Ah, I hate that. We had a, I hate, so, um, that's cool. All right. So tonight you're playing there in New York Saturday night. Nice. And then in a couple weeks you said in Boston.
Speaker 2:Yeah. We'll be in Boston. Uh, next we'll be in Boston this next weekend. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Nice, cool. Um, so, you know, I mean, you've kind of answered a lot of my questions that were basically like, you know, how'd you roll through everything with the pandemic and you know, how have you been, uh, how, how are the kids? How, how are the kids doing good?
Speaker 2:Oh, they're great. They're just beating each other up all the time. Driving, driving, everybody insane.
Speaker 1:How how's how's Ry guy tell Ryan. I was asking about him. I
Speaker 2:Will, I will. I'll let, I'll let him know.
Speaker 1:I'll let him know like, like you remember Mr. Gary. See if you see if he remembers me when I was over at your house.
Speaker 2:I'll I'll I'll I'll he'll he'll remember the birthday. Yeah. Birthday bit.
Speaker 1:Good. Yeah. Um, so the biggest kind of the theme of this podcast for me, isn't, you know, to talk about base strings or bases or base gear that like, I mean, we, we do that all day and like, there's plenty of people already doing that. That's not what I wanna do. Um, and everyone agrees. Yeah. Um, my thing I wanted to ask you, and it might not just be one, but my thing is like, I wanna hear the story of the craziest places the base has taken you cuz as I was putting, as I was putting this together, I'm like, you know, whether it be, uh, flying on a plane to drop a base off in Colorado or Ireland or Copenhagen or, and, and just the crazy driving I did during the pandemic to deliver bases, you know, 65 bases, like 40,000 miles. I was, you know, I mean, you know, I parked in your backyard and, and stayed there. Yep. Um, but I, I got to think it I'm like man, the privileges, the double base has afforded me. Um<affirmative> and then I'm like, well, my friends probably have the same stories where they're like this one time. Um, so I was just thinking like, what's a, you know, I mean, as elaborate or not, as you want to tell us, like what's, what's a story where the, the bass base playing bring in a bass doing whatever it be, tell me, and I don't know this. Right? So like this could be this, this might surprise me.
Speaker 2:<laugh> well, the, the really, so I, so I'll, I'll, I'll, I'll give a little context. So, you know, one of the things that first drew me to the, to the upright to the double bass was, was I was, I got into playing bluegrass music and, and, and what, one of the things that was so appealing about bluegrass was that it was made entirely on acoustic instruments. So I was like jamming. I was like playing, you know, playing electric music like everybody does in a garage, but you know, there's like drums and there's amplifiers and you gotta have electricity. Right. But with it, you could take that base, take an acoustic base and wherever you can get the, a bass, you can play it. And wherever you can get, uh, a group of guys with acoustic instruments, you can play music, you know? And so we, you know, going, going to music festivals and being able to jam in, in, in the campground was, yeah,
Speaker 1:Right, right here right now without like, oh, let me plug it in and let's get our balance and oh, Hey man. And then the drummer's going crazy cuz we are too loud and right. Yeah. I hate it. I just, I hate it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That's, that's one of the coolest things about, about bluegrass or folk music or what acoustic music, whatever. And so that, because we can play this music everywhere, it's afforded us the opportunity to play in a lot of really interesting places, you know? Yeah. Just a, just a jam whenever. Yeah. Like wherever and whenever, you know, whether it's like a, a, you know, uh, like a rest stop on tour, that kind of thing, but nice. But, but the most interesting place that, that the, that the base has taken me and that I have taken the base was, uh, we did a seven day raft trip, um, in, on the middle fork of the salmon river. And, and at the time I had, uh, you know, one of your, one of your removable neck bases and a case that it went in and the
Speaker 1:Raft company and you, and you used that as the raft. Yeah, totally. Cause it's so
Speaker 2:Free. Totally. The RAF company, the RAF, the RAF company ordered a custom dry bag that, that that case would fit in. And we packed the base, you know, to get to the river, no return. You gotta fly in on these little tiny planes into the middle of the wilderness.
Speaker 1:Tell, tell everyone what state we're in, where
Speaker 2:Are we? We're in the middle of Idaho on the, on the middle fork of the salmon river and largest contiguous, uh, piece of wilderness in the entire country. And you, the only way to get in there is to fly these little tiny dirt airs strips on these little tiny planes. There's like three of us packed in there with all of our gear, you know, like a thousand beers yep. And an upright base. Right.<laugh> nice. Yeah. And, and, and so, so we spent, I think it was maybe five days or seven days, um, you know, we float down the river all day, pull into camp, unpacked, the base set up and, and play music in the middle of the wilderness, um, on the side of, of the river. And, and, you know, and, and at one point we played in, in, in this big natural amphitheater with, you know, pet, you know, uh, Petro cliffs all over the walls. I mean, you know, there there's without, without, without the upright base, you know, if I, if I was an electric bass player that would not have been an option,
Speaker 1:But imagine even, even imagine even an acoustic, like, no, thanks,
Speaker 2:Totally. The thing doesn't push any air. Yeah. Um, so that would, that, you know, that far and away, the sort of the most unique thing I've ever done with the base itself is, is taking it down the middle fork of the salmon river. It was a legendary trip.
Speaker 1:And, and so you said it's, it's basically a river, is it the, is it the state line of, of, of Idaho or is it somewhere in the middle in
Speaker 2:That, at that part of the river I think is, is, is, is dead center in the middle of the state.
Speaker 1:Okay. But it's in the largest contiguous section of wilderness in the USA. Yes. That's crazy
Speaker 2:Largest roadless area in the us. And I,
Speaker 1:I, I remember that, um, I know for a fact there are little glimpses of that on YouTube. Totally. Some right. So how, how does someone find that? Cause I'm sure someone's gonna hear this and go, oh man, I wanna check that out. So string dusters, what
Speaker 2:Look for, yeah. I would look for, I would, I would, I would search string dusters, middle fork.
Speaker 1:Okay. String dusters, middle fork. And you'll probably see Travis and the guys with the little, I remember that little video was very, it, it, yeah, it touches you deep. It's like, wow, that's cool. It,
Speaker 2:It was far and away. One of the coolest experiences and, and to be able to, yeah. To pull, to pull the base outta the raft every day, put the neck on, stringing up and be picking, right. Like right there picking on the middle fork. It was, it was incredible. Yeah.
Speaker 1:I was, I wanted to do something similar, um, uh, down in Utah cathedral. Yeah. You know, but you know, backpack up, get up there and, you know, get way up there and where they say the vortexes are and just see what it sounds like. I mean, cuz the, the other than the helicopters, it's just, it's surreal, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, that's cool, man. So is there anywhere else that you could think of, or like a great event or a bad event? I mean, obviously the base is dragging you, you were dragging the base, the base dragging you around doing this dusters thing, but uh, anywhere, any other crazier things that you can think of that are like that?
Speaker 2:Oh, crazier things. Um, what,
Speaker 1:Hey, how old were you when you first started playing the bass? Wh when did you first touch a double bass?
Speaker 2:The first time I, the first time I touched one, uh, uh, a guy who, who would, would become basically my musical mentor, uh, a guy named Benny Galloway, great songwriter. Um, he, I was at, I was at a, I was at a jam it when I first discovered bluegras I was at a jam in Durango, Colorado, and he was playing the bass and at one point he kind of stopped and looks around and he goes, does anyone else play this thing? Who else play this thing?<affirmative> and my buddy ands was like, dude, you know, I'm standing right behind him. And he, and he hands it to me and he kind of shows me how it works. And that was the first time I'd ever played it. You know, I've been playing a lot of electric bass at the time. I had a Tacoma, you know, thunder, chief
Speaker 1:Acoustic with, with, with a little hole up here. Yeah. And I was, do you still have it or
Speaker 2:Did you get rid of it? No, no, no. I had to sell that thing so I could buy an upright, I sold, like I had like a five string Warwick and I had like all these regular bases and I sold'em all. So that, I mean, once, once I got bit by the upright bug. Yep. Uh, that's all, that's all I wanted to do. So I sold, you know, it's only been, it was 15 years. I went or 10 years without even touching an electric base. Now I'm obsessed with electric base. Again, I have, I have cause to play it, but for forever, I was just, it was all I cared about was just playing upright. I just wanted to jam play. Bluegras.
Speaker 1:How old were you at that? At that jam in Colorado,
Speaker 2:20 20, 21 20.
Speaker 1:So you had, but you had some electric base fundamentals. You just had to do this and then learn how to make some sound. Yeah. And it
Speaker 2:Took me a little while, but then the turning point was I went to this music festival, four corners, spoke festival in, in Posa Springs where I would go every year and, and I went one year and I took the upright and, and I played 10 hours a day for five days straight. And, and that was it like that, that was what it took. It was a really, it was a tough trend before that. But once I put in all that time and I had, I believe it was a Gibson upright.
Speaker 1:Yeah. We just had a really cool effect. You know, when you, because of the internet effect, uh, connection, it said, uh, once I put in all that time<laugh> so you had a Gibson first. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And I, I mean, I, I am, I, am I right? Does, did, did Gibson even make up up, did they make well double
Speaker 1:Bases? So Gibson did make double bases, Epiphone K uh, American standard. And just to plug this fund bit in there, we had a client recently who I forget the exact story. Eric will be able to tell us, but, um, friend worked at Gibson when they were making bases. We imagine they were scrapping, they were scrapping all the molds. He grabbed the molds and we got a, we got a phone call about a month ago. Like, Hey, I noticed you have all that old case stuff cuz you know, we got all the molds from the case. Um, would you be interested in this outside and this inside mold set on the old and if you remember the corners were kind of long, it was, it's a funky model. Yeah. Um, and uh, so I just got that in. Like I think we probably bought it a month ago. We got it in about two weeks ago. So we got the Gibson that, that base would've been made on the very mold that I just got.
Speaker 2:You've gotta be kidding me, man. That's incredible,
Speaker 1:Man. This stuff just keeps showing up, dude. It's so cool. Like, so I wanna make a copy, you know, I mean, I don't know if we can call it a copy. I wanna use their mold to make one of their base.
Speaker 2:Um, I would, I would, I would love to see that this, it was this really cool base and it, um, but it had been known by a drunk and he continually would fall downstairs with this thing. And so the front of the base had been knocked in like at least twice. Yeah. So the, you know, the whole, the whole front was just, it, it was is not, it was not good. It was not a good looking base.
Speaker 1:I'm looking for Gibson rib, uh, rib mold shots. Uh, they're still in packaging, but I know they're here somewhere. That's I wonder that's incredible. I wonder if I can hold it up to the camera and show you<laugh> um, yeah, they just, they just showed up. Uh, it'll be fun to rip a out. So yeah, he used to fall down the stairs with the thing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. He, he, he, someone loaned me the space because they saw me playing the thunder chief at a gig with, with this bluegrass band. I was just starting to learn how to play bluegras and he pulled me aside afterward and he was like, dude, you can't, he's like, you can't, you need, you need to play. You need to play the big guy. Yeah. He's like, and I got one you can borrow. And so I played that thing for a couple of years before I had to give it back.
Speaker 1:Yeah. I mean, it, it amazes me, you know, on that note in the world of double bass, kind of requisite music like jazz, um, you know, and bluegrass and obviously at the symphony, one of the play where most prolifically seeing those, those electric uprights where I won't name them, uh, on stands in little slabs is in the bluegrass world. Whenever I go to the, the conventions and different things, I see the most stick uprights and I'm going of all the Americana music. If you don't have that, that junk in the trunk, man, I, I don't know how they're pull. That seems crazy to me.
Speaker 2:Well, and a lot of the contemporary, a lot of my contemporaries on the scene, you know, uh, uh, Ben Kain from yonder mountain and, and, and Mike Dal from green sky bluegras and a ton of other guys who are my contemporaries, they all play these<affirmative> electric stick uprights. And part of why they do it is because the travel is way easier. It's just
Speaker 1:Part of why they, it just, it just kills you, right? I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's hard work.
Speaker 2:The travel is a challenge. The other reason that they do it is, is, you know, if you're trying to push really, really big volume, basically put on a rock show. Yeah. Uh, with, with, with, with an upright, it, it, it poses some challenges. Now I'm up to the challenge and our sound guy is a genius and we work extremely hard, getting the base to work, to sound the way we want on a massive stage at massive volume. And,
Speaker 1:And it show from going and seeing you play. I mean, you're not only are you like playing and singing, but you're pretty much dancing and walking around the stage and the bass sounds tight, you know, like I've, I've been there. I've felt it I've listened and that can go very easily. Boom. You know? Yes. I, I mean, and the thing I've seen you, like in little fancy theaters in Hartford, Connecticut, and then at little festivals and red rocks and the bass sounds like the bass. Uh, and I, and that's not something that is that common amongst performers on the double base. And I, I don't know if the guys don't know what they, don't, what they sound like out Outback<laugh>, you know?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Sometimes I wonder if they even really know what they sound like, you know? Yeah. And, and I think a lot of times guys get out and, and they just, they just want to be heard. Yeah. So they don't, you know, you tone goes out the window if you're, if you're, you know, like it's like volume first and then they worry about the tone and, you know, yeah. One of the issues I've got with, with, with your bases is that they, they sound so good and they're, so they're so resonant and they have so much depth. I mean, the upright has this in general, but anyway, yeah. You know, I specifically experience it every time I get a new one of year basis. It's even better than the last one. And it's almost harder for us to control because it's so resonant. You know, I joke about like when I'm, when you make me another base, I wanna like have like a little, or in the back that I can stuff foam inside of it to try to get the thing to, to quiet down. I already stick a big piece of foam behind the tailpiece. And I put foam in the Fs E right. To try to get the base to just, uh, to, to, to, to, to slow down a little bit and be less resonant. Now, the great thing about that is I pull that foam out and I plan acoustically. And it's like the well,
Speaker 1:You know, massive with, with the, both of us liking bikes and air pumps. Maybe we need to just put a simple air bladder in the base. I wonder, I wonder if it would, I wonder if it would dampen it though, because sometimes, you know, um, one of the acousticians I work with he'll explain that base frequencies, don't see certain things it's, it's, you know, it's why, it's why a car can drive down the street with a guy playing boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. And he can rattle your dishes. Yeah. But you know, if he's got violins in the car, you're not hearing that, you know? Right. So I wonder, I was thinking about making a, um, I think I told you this a while ago, like imagine a, a blade you could turn on the back of the base and when it was, when it was vertical, it would say leave the chambers open. Yeah. And then you would, then you would turn it and it would almost close off the whole lower bow. Yeah. But again, I don't know if it would actually impede the, the base's ability the base would probably say, I don't even see that. And it would just play right through it. Yeah.
Speaker 2:So yeah. I want I've, I've wondered that too, like, uh, uh, uh, you first mentioned like some type of an air bladder, or like a, you know, like just take like a big bicycle inter tube and put it in there. Yeah. Blow that thing up.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:We, well, we've, we've, we've got a, we've we're satisfied with our solution, which is just a little of foam and a lot of, a lot of work, uh, you know, good. A really good sound engineer with, with some decent gear can get that thing under control and make it sound, make it sound like it still sounds like an upright. And I still get that. I still get that, um, attack and, and swell and decay.
Speaker 1:Decay. Yeah. That's the key, right?
Speaker 2:Yeah. Which is that's, that's so crucial. And what, and that's what, that's one of the things that those sticks don't have is that, is that
Speaker 1:When you get that ball, ah, yeah.
Speaker 2:That kind of, and, and, and, and what the, you know, when bluegrass, it's so important that the notes, you know, it seems really simple. It's like bump, bump, bump, but, but a huge part of that is getting that swell. And then when the note stops is how it swings, you know, and any, any jazz player will tell you that too, if you want it to swing, your attack is one thing. But when the note stops is the other, and yeah, we
Speaker 1:Can't be having B, B, B totally. Doesn't feel like goes back to the, it goes back to the tuba. I mean, it needs to be yes. Home, right? It's, it's, it's really an interesting thing. You know, I'll get a call. Some, you know, often, uh, it'll be a recording engineer in a studio or a bass player. Who's a recording engineer. And unless you have a guy like a crazy, crazy bass player, who's really dialed his stuff in. And he happens to be a master level, you know, engineer who there's a couple of Google'em and you'll figure out who they are, but they'll often, you know, I'll be talking to a guy about, you know, an old Hawks promo or something, and I'll be like, honestly, plywood is the most digestible sound in studio. Like you get a little plywood base, you might get upright, you know, use a little pickup sound. It's very controllable. It's very recordable. And no one will know. I mean, if you're bringing the bow out, you're gonna get a little bit of this. But other than that, very few, I mean, sure. You know, what are there a thousand of us that would know, is that a plywood? You know, the rest of humankind doesn't know a bloody different between a carve top and, and a plywood top.
Speaker 2:It's funny, you mentioned that because I do, I do some session work at this local studio and it's come to the point where, when, when I go in there, they're, they're happier when I bring my standard laminate. Like your, your guys' bottom Bo the most basic base you guys may, you know, seven years ago when I bought it, they'd rather have that than, than, you know, than the solid top hybrid. That's up a much better base.
Speaker 1:You get the overtones, you got overtones, you've got ringing, you've got sustained the backs, doing stuff, the tops, doing stuff, the, a lengths are doing stuff it's too much to figure out. You know, you could spend a, you could spend a week dial on the sun. Sorry. We broke
Speaker 2:Up. And, and that's a, that's kind of a big, that's a, that's a big question. I'm sort of asking myself as I'm getting ready to, to have a conversation with you about another base. Hmm. Um, is it's one, it's one thing for me to be playing in my studio, practicing by myself. Yeah. And you want
Speaker 1:Everything. Yeah. You want everything? Yeah.
Speaker 2:I want everything, man. I want, I want, like, I want everything, but when I'm playing on the road, when I'm playing through a sound system, when I'm in the studio turns out, I don't really want everything. Yeah. And, and, and it, and it, it may be that I'm probably, I'm probably better suited as a working basis with a much more basic instrument.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well, I wonder, I wonder too, if we could, um, you know, now we're, we're going to, we're totally basic geek in here, but I wonder, I wonder if, if it were two things, if, if we're able to get inside the base from some proportion, whether it be a suitcase base or something that's slightly disassemble above. Yeah. Could I, could I back the F holes with just some scrap veneer that the tops are made out of paint, paint, those wraps black and have, have, have maybe two, like thumb screws that would set in, so you wouldn't see that the F holes are closed. Yeah. And then at the same time, that would also stiff in the top up. Oh yeah. So it, you might find you use one, maybe foam might foam might be actually doing more than we realize it, stop the base acoustically, but it's still letting the top do this. Right,
Speaker 2:Right, right, right. I hadn't thought I hadn't thought about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah. We'll have to, we'll have to see what we can do there. I mean, maybe, maybe we throw a, a retro piece in a suitcase base to see how it affects that to at least substantiate then how it would affect the real base, you know? Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I mean that the suitcase base offers a ton of opportunity for, for innovation and, and, and to experiment with things because you can get inside the thing. Right. You know, and
Speaker 1:Spots, I never knew I could get. Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So like, for me, like, I'll, I'll, I'll a lot of times I'll take the big pieces of foam that I use to pack the base. And as I'm assembling and I'm stacking that foam in there. Yeah. So, and, and, and putting pressure on the top and the back, and, and, but I've found that I've like, I've put too much foam in and sometimes like, you know, I, I like it. I like the foam better when it's in the lower about, and I don't like it as much when it's in the top. And I, you know, but putting a big piece of foam right next to the right next to the, to the Les, you know, will change things. It's really remarkable. How, how, um, how sensitive the instrument is and how much, what you can do with that foam placement, you
Speaker 1:Know, do you, do you find if you foam in the upper bouts, does it impede your ability to feel and hear the base more than the lowers?
Speaker 2:It does. It does. And it, and it, it, it, it, it makes the whole thing a little bit kind of, yeah. It makes it like a, feels like it's a little mushier. Hmm. You know, it's like, it doesn't have the, the instrument loses a lot of the crispness when I put that foam higher up in the base. And part of that may be my own perception. Um, but I
Speaker 1:Find that it's, I don't, I don't think so. I I've always said that the upper bouts, how thin or thick they are, how stiff they are, how they turn, how they're lined internally, that the upper it's not necessarily exactly this way, but I, as a rule, cause I'm always careful to say, cuz then I get quoted. Gary said, if you do this, the base sounds like this, but generally speaking, the upper portion of the bass acoustically is kind of the enjoyment of the player's section of the instrument. Ah, a lot of that resonance and sound that we need to stay in tune is not that sound that's out there. It's the sound that's here. And I find it comes through the upper bounce. It, it, it just does,
Speaker 2:Man. You, you got, you guys put something on the internet this week about, uh, uh, sort of the, it was a, a discussion about like, and, and I can see him in the background there violin versus the, the GABA GABA, GABA. Yeah. However
Speaker 1:You wanna say it. And,
Speaker 2:And man, that really got me thinking, I, I hadn't thought about how that island corners make it, make it, make it stiffer. Yeah. What does that, what does that do? Sonically?
Speaker 1:It's hard. So again, being careful with rules, right? Yeah. I don't wanna, I said that when this happens, this happens, but all other things being created equal, we're lucky because we've made thousands of bases that I can be pretty on point with knowing and having them sit right next to each other. The only thing that's different is the, you know, bouts of the instrument or it be the top of the back. Generally speaking, speaking, generally speaking,<laugh> the, the stiffening, that's where I was going with that. The stiffening of the ribs does give a little more point to the sound. Um, but we often combine it with a bigger boomer mushier sound. That's why like the brush in which has the deepest of the ribs that we can do. And if, if, if we make a Brion in all it's glory, it's got dark, you know, a, a nice big arch on the back. That's dark, it's a soft wood, you know, it can be combined with a top, a tight top, the mitten wall, which is not the one in the video, but the mitten wall is the contrast for us. Our mitten wall model is just a GOBA cornered brushing base with different F holes. Interesting. So yeah, it's, it's a bit, it's a bit softer. It's got a little bit more junk in the trunk, but then, because I know that I'm able to make up for word in the brush in, by using a softer back that's round. So a lot of the bases can get the same sound. You just need to pull out the different tools, you know? So if you sure
Speaker 2:That makes sense if said perfect
Speaker 1:Sense. Yeah. If you said, make the sot darkest, deepest, sounding, whatever, I guess we'd do some big GABA or maybe we'd go corner list. Um, but then corner list. Wouldn't offer enough structure for the top and the back. And now you'd have the top and the back rip in the base apart because<laugh> remember like, like the cable that comes out of your tailpiece for the removable neck, that goes all the way up to the neck block. Every time you pull, every time you pull on the strings, the back of the base gets stretched, right? So you pull on the strings, the neck gets pulled forward. The top gets pushed in and the back gets stretched. So if the ribs, if the ribs are too weak, you, you next you'll have a nice big crack in the back, a crack in the top, the ribs are gonna take themselves apart. You know, then you could say, oh, well, let's just use thicker plywood. Okay. Well now it's not gonna make any noise. Right. So those are thoughts that I never got to have until I made a base that was in pieces in a suitcase. Ha ha. Yes. You know, it's like, why do flat backs crack? You know, I don't know that it's cuz the back's flat. I don't know that it's the bracing I think a large piece of is that it doesn't have that elasticity that the round back does so that when I play the string and the neck pulls forward, that the, I imagine the round back does something like this. Right. Right. Or, yeah, maybe it does something like this or maybe it does a combination of the two, the flat back sitting there, like this eventually just gets sick being pulled on and it has on a grain. There's
Speaker 2:Not really not really anywhere to go. There's no, it's like, like, like almost like a, you know, a round back has, has, it's almost like a spring where there's, it's able to flex, whereas the flat back there's, there's no give.
Speaker 1:Right. And it's why a lot of modern day makers are now playing with different bracing or they'll actually build a little spring into the back where like, I don't do this, but they'll, they'll make the back flat or they'll, and then they'll make the brace concave or convex. So the back has to come in or vice versa, a million different X versions, these versions, that version, I've seen some of this crazy stuff like this. I, I I'm, I still believe other than the upper bout where we can it into the neck block. I like it flat as a pancake. I cause I, when, when you glue two pieces of wood together, I just want them to be happy. You know, I don't want this one pulling on this cause someone's gonna win that battle. Totally. But you know, so in with the rip question we play with, um, and again, this there's like back of house stuff we don't talk about because like, I don't necessarily want to tell China how to do it, you know? Right, right, right, right. Then they get it, then they get it wrong. But like our ribs, aren't all the same thickness. So that's, that's that I would say, uh, it's it's a really interesting place to investigate. It's very of research. I mean, you know, you'd be like, oh yeah, let's make a base. Like, and that's what I told you the day one when we started, I'm like, dude, we're gonna do a bunch of bases, you know? And I find, it's not a client will say, I want this. And I'm almost like, well, tell me what you don't want. Cause usually that list is a lot longer and it has a lot more points for me to work off of than the like sure. I wanna a base. That sounds one, two and three. I'm like, nah, give me the list. That's 30 things that you don't like. Cause I can make sure I don't do those. And then I end up bringing you over here and boom, there you go.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's so interesting.
Speaker 1:So what's, what's next for you? Are you just kind of like grinding on, on this? I mean in a good way, like, is it, is it like get the dusters thing rocking again? Like what's kind of like the one year plan. What do you think Travis?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we, we've got, we got a new record coming out in February. Uh, nice. We made, uh, you know, last year and um, and it's, and it's killer, man. It great. Um, have some songs on there I'm really, really, really into, uh, so we've got, yeah, we've got like steady tour schedule doing the club winter on the bus and then a bunch of festivals this summer. Uh, and, and pretty much still plug along, man. I'm trying to fit in some episodes of the happy hour so that I can be, you know, build that content. Um, yeah, make sure you send over the
Speaker 1:Podcast, send me over that. So I can share that, you know, just, just harass me with that. I will please. Um, when are you at red rocks?
Speaker 2:Uh, may I think it's May 24th. It's a Thursday
Speaker 1:May, which I would recommend to all Upton base fall to get your butt on a plane and get out there and go see Travis in an amazing setting and listen to good music and have a nice time.
Speaker 2:Yeah. And that place is legendary and we're playing with this awesome band called the California honey drops. Nice. You ever heard them? They're so cool. And then this amazing electric bass player, Karina Rickman who plays with, uh, Marco Benevento and does a bunch of really cool stuff she's on that bill as well. So that's it's I mean, and that's, that's really, that's the best thing about being, um, being in a band in, in this sort of larger music and, you know, for lack of a better word kind of jam band scene is that we come in contact with so many incredible musicians yeah. For, um, all, you know, not all stripes, but, but a huge, huge cross section of the, of the music world and, and build these relationships and also get heavily influenced by this stuff. You know, it's just really, it's just really mind bending to get, to see, you know, to, to, to be at tell, you know, Telluride bluegras and to be sitting there watching the original FONES watching Victor do his thing is yeah. You know, it, it, it, you know, I, I walk, walk away from that set, just so inspired and so, so ready to, to, to, to, to continue to dig in and, and, and find, find my own voice, you know? Cause I'll never, but then you're Victor, but,
Speaker 1:And Victor will never be you. That's what he would say. I'm telling you.
Speaker 2:He would. Exactly exactly. Well, I'm, I'm in the I'm, I'm ha I'm halfway through his latest book right now. Um, you know, I read the music lesson a few times and I can't remember what the new one is. Everyone loves that, but I'm, you know, I'm, I'm deep on in, in that Victor philosophy of, you know, music is, music is love and love is music and, and you gotta be open minded and you gotta, you gotta, you gotta treat it with, with love and, and respect and, and honor the music, you know, Victor's really and
Speaker 1:Such a gift. And, and it sounds like what I would, what I'm taking from what you're saying is you're getting the opportunity just to have different people float in, play with them, you're floating in and playing with other people. It's, you know, you're, you probably have, I mean, I've seen you with random guests, different, you know, at different shows. And are you getting to, are you getting to really musically share with lots of different people even on and off stage? Yes.
Speaker 2:Yes. That's nice yes. And it, and it, and that's exciting, right? It never ends. Yeah. I mean, and that's, that's the name of the game, you know, to just continue to, to, to learn and to, and to study and to be open-minded and to take, take every, every situation as a, as a, as a musical challenge and to sort of see what you can do,
Speaker 1:What we should wrap it up in a minute here. I mean, cause the two of us that talk all day, typical bass player, what would you say to musicians that are, you know, they they've, they're at home, they're playing the bass. They feel like they live in the middle of nowhere, Iowa or, um, wherever it is, what would you say? The thing they should do to try and get that juice flowing? Like how do they, you know, what's what, what's your advice?
Speaker 2:I, the, the, the only thing that's ever moved me forward musically is, is playing with people and playing out and playing as part of ensembles. I can, I can shed, you know, I, I, I play a lot at home, uh, because it's fun and I love the way the instruments sounds, but the only time I'm really moving forward is when I've got gigs in the books when I'm playing with other people. And so, you know, if you're, if you're, if, if you're out there in the middle of nowhere and there's no one to play with, it's gonna be tough to move, to move forward and to expand your musical context, you know? So I, I always tell people, any musicians, man, find, find, find some people and play.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Maybe, maybe band play. Yeah. Maybe we won't get to play what you want. I remember when I was younger, I was, there was some Christian rock band that needed a bass player. And I was like, man, I don't do that. And I, Lou, you know, my mentor, he's like, just go play, you know? And, and I, and I couldn't play what they wanted to play and I learned a whole lot, you know? Yeah,
Speaker 2:Yeah. That, that, that put, put, yeah, put, that's what that's always, my advice would be to put yourself in situations where you're playing with other people, because it, it puts the impetus on you to learn it, it, it, you know, and especially if you, if you have, if you have a band, you know, you, you, you, you gotta bring material and you gotta bring you, you, you know, uh, you form a repertoire that way. And, and, you know, you can learn. It's great. You know, this guys all over the internet that are incredible players and, and can play all this crazy stuff. Um, but it it's, it's when you're making, you know, it's when you're making music with other people that it means something and that it, and then it gravity, and then you start to
Speaker 1:Grow. Even the simplest things with others just can sound so beautiful. Right. You know, you think you could do so much, like you said, you do this, you do all these acrobatics by yourself. Uh, and that, I mean, I think that's what makes the real masters, the masters that can do the acrobatics and do it with other people like those guys make my mind go, you know, like, like we're saying with Victor and Bayla,
Speaker 2:Like Victor. Yeah. Yeah. He a great example of a guy he's, he's doing this stuff in the live context<affirmative> that, that, you know, that the showoffs can do on their computer from home, he can actually into live context, right? Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1:They're like, take one, take two, take 27, take 200 off. That'll be good for Instagram. He's he's doing it on the stage. Yeah, yeah, yeah, man. Well, um, so maybe we could try and follow up maybe on red rocks or after, um, love that my goal will be to have that Gibson rib mold to talk about, uh, at least have it on camera. And, you know, we'll, we'll talk about Travis's first base that was made on that very mold.
Speaker 2:That would be, that would be awesome. And hopefully, and hopefully by then too, we can, we can be talking about, um, you know, the next base that we're gonna absolutely. Well, you're gonna build for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Let's, let's get that going. Let's get that going, uh, offline here and, uh, um, kind of make, we'll get that don't want list going. Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah. Well, that's, that's, that's really good for me to know that that's where we're gonna start. Cause I, I I'll I'll cuz I've got an idea of some things I want, but to be able to articulate what I don't want is, is gonna be a really useful exercise for me.
Speaker 1:Yeah. And, and gotta haves don't want some gotta haves and you know yeah. If, if I, if I get 90% of those, you'll be like, perfect. Yeah,
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Well, I've been, I've been thrilled with every base that I've ever played of yours, especially, um, with, with maybe the exception of the first one, which was, which was before you guys actually made'em yourself. Yeah. Way back in the day,
Speaker 1:The imports we were finishing. Yeah.
Speaker 2:That was still a good base. But, but it's, it's, you know, the last four, uh, that I've played that you guys have made every single one, man, it's just like, it's, it's a, it's a whole quantum leap forward it, every time I get one of your guys' face and I'm so psychs. So I mean, I mean, you know, in the suitcase base, man, I've been blowing everybody's mind with that thing.<laugh>, you know, it's, it's, it's, there's nothing like the first time you pop that thing open and pull all those pieces out and you guys like what the hell is going on and then you put the thing together and it sounds amazing. It's just really remarkable. Um, and even that there's like a couple of things from, there's a couple of things from that base and the development of that base that I wanna apply going forward to, to a regular yeah. Well
Speaker 1:We could do, we could do all or some or none of that to a regular base. I mean, and that's where I think it's not, it's your mindset, but you know, it's, it's mine and yours mindset to like mine was be like, we can make a base that comes apart. And then your willingness, probably a from who you are B the cycling thing, you're like, I've put a bike in a box. I mean, I've put a bike in the box and flowing over around the world. You know what I mean? Yeah. You know, how, and we, we don't care. We show up and squeak, squeak, and our bike works and we put our lives on the thing and go down a hill 50 miles an hour. Totally. Earlier that day it was at pieces. Right.
Speaker 2:So just give, gimme, gimme a, a base and a box and a four millimeter, a wrench, and I'm good to go. Yeah, let's do this.
Speaker 1:I show, and it's made outta wood. Things are gonna break. Um, you know, I, I, I'm gonna tell you, I I'll leave you with, with a couple things. I'm working hard, uh, on developing, just even for the neck off, we're working hard on the case thing, man, the case thing is, is the bane of our existence. It is, we, we will have an in-house case that is, is happening. And then secondly, exciting. And probably by the time, next time we talk, we are in, we're currently in development mode and we are, they are being constructed string making machines. Very exciting. So we'll be having we're we're pacing. Yeah. We're, we're, we're having another, we'll have another company kind of, uh, with the up to, but separate from Upton base that we'll be selling base drinks. So that's kind of, you know, fun stuff. The, in
Speaker 2:The innovation never stops over there,
Speaker 1:Man. It's awesome. Well, man, I got, I gotta, we need this stuff and honestly, some of the suppliers, I can't rely on em and yeah. You know, necessities, the mother of mention yeah. If I need tomatoes from my tomato sauce, I'm gonna start plant of plants. Yeah,
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You know, that's a great way of putting it.
Speaker 1:All right, Chad. Well stay warm, man. And it was good talking to you and uh, thanks
Speaker 2:Gary. Good to see you, man.
Speaker 1:I'll send you a message. Uh, and let really please harass me. Let's go back and forth on the base and let's make sure we're on the same page.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I'll I'll get, I'll get some stuff written down and then we'll get on the phone and we'll hash it
Speaker 1:Out. All right, bro. Have a great gig tonight. Thanks brother. Good to talk to you. Thanks for being on. See you.