Dr. Abdeen, a former MMA fighter turned paramedic, now ER physician, shares the exciting transition between his diverse careers. Celebrating completion of his emergency medicine training month; We discuss our first month being a doctor, preparing to begin residency, anticipation of critical care rotations, and the imprints our families leave on our professional choices. A highlight of our conversation is Dr. Abdeen's insight into the emotional and technical aspects of the IVF process. His openness about the trials and tribulations he and his wife faced during their IVF journey is both enlightening and deeply moving. Enjoy!
Picmonic boosts confidence and grades. Our IRB study proved that with the Picmonic learning system students increase retention and test scores.
Years ago, psychologists and education researchers found mnemonics to be an effective tool in increasing retention and memory recall. Today, lots of different strategies for learning and memorization using mnemonics exist including keyword, phrase, music and image mnemonics.
Use code OFFWHITECOAT for 20% off
Dedicated technology for medical schools, residency and health programs looking to optimize performance on in-service and licensure exams. Students get access to the content, questions, explanations, and all benefits of the SmartBank to help enhance their performances on high-stakes exams. TrueLearn provides national average comparisons, including score, percentile, and category weaknesses according to the exam blueprint.
Use code OFFWHITECOAT for $25 off your purchase.
Dr. Abdeen, a former MMA fighter turned paramedic, now ER physician, shares the exciting transition between his diverse careers. Celebrating completion of his emergency medicine training month; We discuss our first month being a doctor, preparing to begin residency, anticipation of critical care rotations, and the imprints our families leave on our professional choices. A highlight of our conversation is Dr. Abdeen's insight into the emotional and technical aspects of the IVF process. His openness about the trials and tribulations he and his wife faced during their IVF journey is both enlightening and deeply moving. Enjoy!
Picmonic boosts confidence and grades. Our IRB study proved that with the Picmonic learning system students increase retention and test scores.
Years ago, psychologists and education researchers found mnemonics to be an effective tool in increasing retention and memory recall. Today, lots of different strategies for learning and memorization using mnemonics exist including keyword, phrase, music and image mnemonics.
Use code OFFWHITECOAT for 20% off
Dedicated technology for medical schools, residency and health programs looking to optimize performance on in-service and licensure exams. Students get access to the content, questions, explanations, and all benefits of the SmartBank to help enhance their performances on high-stakes exams. TrueLearn provides national average comparisons, including score, percentile, and category weaknesses according to the exam blueprint.
Use code OFFWHITECOAT for $25 off your purchase.
Hello everybody and welcome to the Off-White Coat podcast. This week is part two of my discussion with Dr Corey Abdeen, where we go over our first month of residency and delve a little bit further into Dr Abdeen's medical journey. So, without further ado, here's part two. Once again, he definitely has the best icebreaker answers because even if you try to hit him with the two truths and a lie which they made him also do and he just goes I have a USC career, a patent on something. And then he pauses and he goes and I like the color yellow, yeah, and then everybody knew what the lie was, but we were like, how the heck does he have a patent as well?
Speaker 2:Like so I mean it's one of these things. Yeah, I mean you got to be a Renaissance man. I mean it's important. I don't really like to talk about myself. I'm no different than anybody else. I just try to do things to the best of my ability and I'm willing to take chances. And if you those two things together, good things will happen to you, if you kind of keep your nose to the ground still.
Speaker 1:So what was the patent on? Like what? So, ultimately the specific thing that you were changing.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So really to kind of get into some of the more specifics of it, ultimately what we were doing is so these, this is a chicken plant, so this is a breading plant and there's also a kill plant where they they'll kill the chickens to create chicken breasts, chicken wings and all that. Then there's also a plant where not where they're killing the chickens and making the meat, but where they take the meat it's processed, they'll add breading to it and make chicken tenders that go to Buffalo Wild Wings or become Tyson chicken nuggets at the grocery store. And the wastewater from that plant so you think all the water that's involved in that entire process it's going to have salmonella, it's going to have various bacteria from chicken and raw meat and stuff in it, and that water all cycles out of the plant and gets put back into your local sewage system of whatever town that's in.
Speaker 1:That's problematic, right, you can't return that water back.
Speaker 2:Even though that water does get processed, there's still certain criteria it has to meet before it even can go to like what you would say is the water treatment or sewage plant. And that's sort of where we came in. It was this company in Camp Mississippi was having issues with meeting those benchmarks, and kind of just my dad, my brother and I a few other people too we just decided to come up with how can we solve this problem. And what we really did is we my brother sort of came up with the aspect in my dad of using like a physical separation of the particles, like separating the oil and the biological material and the actual water soluble material, physically separating it through a micro screen, just like you would think of any filtration device. Right Then, to make it even better than just a physical separation, I came up with a chemical process.
Speaker 2:We use a polymer that responds to sodium hypochlorite or bleach. Basically, if you add more bleach to the polymer, the polymer gets stronger. If you take the bleach away, the polymer gets weaker. The polymer in this case would bind very well to charged particles. So things that have DNA or proteins, things like that, you know charged molecules. Those are the way it was really a way to separate the biologics and you add those two together, the screen plus the chemicals combination of chemicals that we use. I can't really go into all the entirety of it, but you add those two things together and you actually end up getting a better separation than any of the local companies and I actually think nationally. We were sort of beating a lot of numbers also. So we now have our process. It's not only in Mississippi, but there's also chicken plants in Arkansas, alabama, I think even Tennessee, that have adopted this process. It's been a wild ride, man. It was never anything that I set out to do, but it just sort of worked out that way.
Speaker 1:Dude, that's very interesting. I bet that was great for your interviews.
Speaker 2:It was cool man. It definitely gave me something to say.
Speaker 1:So how did you figure out what chemical compound Like? How did you know that this compound bounded to that halt?
Speaker 2:So a lot of it.
Speaker 1:Did you run tests on it?
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we actually, like I remember we had this contract with Pico. It was the first chicken plant we ever had a contract with. Once we, on paper, came up with a theoretical way to sort of get this process done, we actually had to implement it in real life and we had a contract to perform testing. So we had a contract with this company, this chicken plant in Canton Mississippi. For one I think it was either two weeks or a month we were going to show up on site and we were going to be responsible for dealing with their wastewater 24-7 every day, seven days a week. Whatever volume we had, we were going to be there to deal with it. So for that, I think it was a two-week process where we initially had our trial period and I had to literally be there.
Speaker 2:My dad who's an attorney, by the way, he's not an engineer, he's not a chemist, he doesn't do things like this but my dad took time away from his law career. He was there during the day, plus a few other people. They split the day shift 7am to 7pm, and then I got there every night, 7pm to 7am, and overnight I was the only one there, by myself, running the entire wastewater from an entire chicken plant through our screen and I was the one adjusting the chemicals. To not go into all the fine details of it. Polymers were something I had to get advice on. So I met with people in other industries to sort of say, hey, if I wanted to separate biological material effectively from a chicken wastewater plant, how would we do that? And I suggested, oh, you could use bentonite clay or you could use a cationic or anionic polymer. And just based on the sort of the advice that I got, we sort of settled on using anionic polymer to do it. So I had help in that regard.
Speaker 2:But really it was just all of us putting our heads together and said, hey, if we use a physical separation, a chemical separation, and also, too, we were trying to resell. So when they fry chicken it requires oil, right, well, that oil can be resold back onto the market. So that was another way to make money. Also, it was all the oil that was coming off in the wastewater. We used soap, in this case literally Dawn dish soap, in addition to our polymer and our bleach. The soap would help us separate the oil from the mixture and then we would take all that oil, collect it and then we would sell it back to the oil company where they would refine it, send it back. So we made money that way. Also, it was a way to sort of make it where our bids to these companies, because we were competing against, like waste management and all these big companies that do wastewater treatment. The way we were able to undercut them was by figuring out a way to effectively reharvest the oil and sell it back.
Speaker 1:So you could have money involved. Yeah, yeah exactly. And really great little business. So how old were you when you did this?
Speaker 2:So let's see, this would have been 2013 through 20. Right before I met my wife. So 2013 to 2016, 17?
Speaker 1:So you would have been in your mid 20s or whatever.
Speaker 2:So I was probably in my mid to late 20s.
Speaker 1:So you're just funneling through chicken manure?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, Essentially yeah right, I was in a lot of places that were not the best place to be.
Speaker 1:And then he goes, I'm going to med school.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, but the thing that was the best about the whole chicken thing. The thing that I am most proud of about it is really I don't care if I ever make it a lot of money off of it.
Speaker 1:But what it?
Speaker 2:did enable me. Hopefully, what it will enable is my parents. I have the best parents on the planet. They've worked their butt off to make sure my brother and I had everything we ever needed or wanted. I'm hoping that my dad's ownership in this company that we started Southeastern eventually, I hope it becomes where the stock price is worth enough money where my dad one day hopefully soon can sell his stake in the company and get a large sum of money and finally retire. That would make me happy, even if I don't make a dime off of it. If it can help my parents retire and be able to take the foot off the gas and just live the good life, that would be a win for me.
Speaker 1:That's awesome, man. I hope that that actually happens. We can only hope that we can buy low, sell high. Yeah, exactly, that's cool, the fact that you are even able to figure all of that out. The crazy thing is when you have chickens, especially when they're I assume you're at a very big factory.
Speaker 2:Yeah, very large plant.
Speaker 1:Yeah, or very large plant, that there are a bunch of chickens that, or at least I've seen, like the documentary, where with all the antibiotics and these hormones and everything they give the chickens, the chickens can barely even walk at some point, yeah, and they get so big, heavy, chested and everything that they fall down. And the one I watched, they were just scooping the chickens up with a plow or whatever. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:And luckily I was not involved in that aspect of it all.
Speaker 1:No, no, no, you're just shoveling the shit, or?
Speaker 2:if I was me, in fact. I mean, it was a very interesting to see that side of things. But sort of you bringing up the antibiotics and things of that nature actually brings up another good point. Those are other things that we were separating from the wastewater, right. So they treat these chickens with large amounts of antibiotics, other substances and other drugs also too, to sort of for lack of a better term make it where it kind of cuts down the bottom line for these companies to sort of make the chickens healthy, as opposed to giving them necessarily the best life right, you know, like living out free range, like a chicken normally, would they sort of substitute that by just giving them large amounts of drugs. Well, those drugs end up in the wastewater. That wastewater ends up back in the sewage system, which ends up back in our drinking water, right. So that was another motivation to try to come up with a way to more effectively separate those type of compounds like from our drinking water. That was another win from the process.
Speaker 1:Or at least that was one thing that we thought about when we were doing it.
Speaker 2:I used to have a much better command of all the specifics, like how many chickens at this plant and blah, blah, blah blah. But it's just been four years of med school and the first month of intern year, it's just. I've kind of lost command of all the exact numbers.
Speaker 1:But no man, I love it. The Abdeans are literally saving us in the ER, on the front line and on the back line in the sewage system.
Speaker 2:Yeah, my dad used to always say, in regard to the mixed martial arts and jujitsu aspect of it, was he always hoped that one day I'd be in a position where I could break somebody's arm and then hand him a business card.
Speaker 1:There you go, you might, you'll just be breaking their arm, and then you'll be seeing them at your business.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, yeah, that was awesome.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's crazy. This week we are officially in the hospital and they found out the aliens exist all in the same week, so we're waiting to get certified and we're laughing at the fact that.
Speaker 2:Man. It is funny. But at the same time, literally, a guy went before Congress under oath, under penalty of perjury, and he said on national TV, in front of the whole world, that not only do we have a craft, not of this world, that we've reverse engineered, but we also have bodies of aliens. I know that nowadays, with the how fast the news comes at you and you know Trump does this, biden does this it's easy to kind of get lost in the weeds, but if you really stop and think, that's pretty monumental news. I mean there's a high likelihood unless this guy is totally full of it that the aliens might be real man.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a crazy thing to think about and it's crazy that people don't really care and it's because you're like blinded by all the things going on and then all of a sudden you can actually get caught up in the weeds and not actually.
Speaker 2:I think that's by design right. I think they sort of pollute the news cycle and they put all this nonsense out because it makes it very easy to distract you from the real things going on Not to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but that actually does that.
Speaker 1:It was at least interesting like thank God for YouTube too, for some of these like monumental cases, because sometimes I see it and I'm like, oh, I would like to watch that. The guy's name was like Tyler, do you remember his name?
Speaker 2:So there's a guy whose last name was Graves. There's another guy named Favour.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's Commander Favour. Then there's a guy named Grush.
Speaker 2:Grush or Grush, that's the guy. He's the main one who dropped like the biggest bomb, saying that we have alien bodies and crazy stuff like that and that was that was wild.
Speaker 1:I still have to make it all the way through, but definitely good. And Commander Favour and all them. They're very official sounding.
Speaker 2:They're unimpeachable man. I mean, that guy is anything he says, you can take it to the bank. He's not like some kook living out in a trailer in the middle of the desert. He's not out there looking for Bigfoot. He's not one of the crazy conspiracy guys. This guy is totally legit and he's saying that. Okay, while I was flying one of the most high you know, the highest level of technology as far as aircraft go that the United States has, he was flying one of that with the most sensitive radar and imaging system and he saw a vehicle that is not able to be explained. It's technology that we, or none of our enemies or allies, possess, and he is totally convinced that he saw a craft not of this world and just all this stuff coming out. Over the last year it used to kind of be fun to talk about the aliens bro, the aliens bro, but now, sort of officially, it's kind of hard to say, or at least it would be very difficult at this point to say that it's totally untrue.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. That's the thing that has changed over my lifetime. Yeah, it was a course of even when I was a kid. Like it was laughables, Everybody. I think signs came out.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was a joke. Oh yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, it was just a high stigma that it wasn't, and then it's just which.
Speaker 2:I think it's pretty cool that we're at least finding out, you know you know, I mean it doesn't really mean that it's aliens from another planet. Right, it could be that maybe the United States came up with some technology that nobody else has, and if I developed something that is technology well beyond what currently anybody has available, I might also try to say that it came from aliens, if I was trying to obfuscate that. It could also be that the aliens, instead of actually coming here physically like in a rocket, coming themselves. Maybe it's a drone, just like we sent Voyager out to Saturn and we sent probes to Mars and Pluto. Maybe it's an unmanned vehicle from some other intelligent being. I don't know, it's just kind of fun to think about.
Speaker 1:Man, oh it's definitely fun to think about, and the fact that it's so close and things are changing day by day I mean a congressional hearing too is a pretty big thing. It's a big deal, man, I mean at least I see that they at least had a point to give out.
Speaker 2:For sure, and we live. We're very fortunate. We live in a very interesting time. We're sort of where that generation that was right on the cusp of when the internet kind of really broke loose, where the computer generation were. We made that transition from everything being, you know, analog to digital, and you're close to my age too, so you kind of went through that transition also, where you didn't grow up necessarily with an iPad or an iPhone. I didn't get stuff like that till I was in my first iPhone. I was in college, yeah.
Speaker 2:I said that that sort of changed everything, but also the cool part about being alive right now, and Sort of circle back to medicine, the level of technology and stuff that we have now, particularly with AI, which a lot of people are afraid of, think that it's gonna replace us as doctors and you know, everybody talks about the chat, gpt past the USMLE. Ultimately, I think it'd be a good thing. It'll allow us to be able to provide the most up-to-date management. It'll reduce medical errors. I think it'll be something that ultimately makes us better clinicians. I think it'll make us better as people in all disciplines. It's not something to be afraid of, it's something to sort of embrace. But the idea that it maybe came from like Alpha Centauri or some other planet is also cool. I mean, I'm gonna nerd on that.
Speaker 1:I want aliens to be real, so it's hard to be objective, but yeah yeah, how do you think they came up with all the AI and all the tech? Any owner man? Some people think by logics.
Speaker 2:Yeah, they think it was aliens. The aliens, bro.
Speaker 1:Not to get off of necessarily the aliens, but I didn't realize that chat GBT had passed the USMLE. Yeah, yeah that's. I think that was probably a few months, three, four months ago, but yeah, it effectively passed.
Speaker 2:now I don't know if it was what is effectively mean?
Speaker 1:because we are, we are chain. We are literally Competing with each other. When you take these tests, it's a comparison between you and the rest of people, so I'm interested to know what their score was compared to mine, because they had the whole Internet at their back right right. So this is the way I got even close than I'm the way. Yeah, exactly right. So there's a couple ways of looking at it, right? So I?
Speaker 2:know I can't sit here and tell you definitively, like what they mean by Effectively passed. I assume what that means and what I recall is that the computer took the exam and again, I don't know if it was step one, step two, step three, maybe it was all three of them, I don't know. It was one of those exams. The computer scored a passing score. The computer would have passed the test just passing.
Speaker 2:I mean, they're not luxury maybe the Computer may be now at the point where it's making top scores. I don't know. But I know, when I initially heard about it, that the computer was at the point where it was passing the exam and some people looked at that as well. Damn, here so the computer. I barely passed the computers doing as good as me. But, like you said, the computer has access. It's basically the computer when it's taking it AI, but is always open book. Every exam a computer takes its open book, right? You're having to use just the old noggin, right? You don't get to have a copy of first aid in your pocket when you're taking it.
Speaker 1:Yes, and it doesn't feel the eight hours of stress that comes along with that test Right, doesn't feel that at all.
Speaker 2:And the other thing, a computer will never be able to replace, is there's a certain art to medicine, right? It's sort of cliche to say, but there is a certain thing where there's experience. You sort of you don't treat values, you don't treat numbers right, you treat the patient. You hear that all the time.
Speaker 1:There is something that is very.
Speaker 2:I just think there's an aspect of medicine that a computer couldn't necessarily Like make the same assessment of, particularly like an undifferentiated, like crashing patient. It wouldn't be able to make that decision the same way that a very experienced person would right.
Speaker 2:That's that's why I don't really have a fear that will be replaced. I think, if anything, it's just gonna give people who are very experienced, very knowledgeable Clinicians are gonna now have this ability to. Oh, I've recognized that this person has, you know, a COPD exacerbation. But uniquely, this person with the COPD exacerbation also has AFib, this medical history. They're on these drugs. This is like certain you know data points in their life and you can take all those things together and say for a person with a COPD exacerbation that has this history and takes these drugs and fits all these boxes, what would be the best treatment for that specific person, just like they're doing with drugs where they do see which people Like at a DNA level.
Speaker 2:Who is gonna be what drug? Is somebody gonna respond to you better versus another person, right? I think that's sort of gonna be the benefit of AI and medicine. It won't replace us, but it will help us.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, the good thing about being a human is that I have the one up on a machine, because I Know the human experience a little bit more you know like you get. You're like I, being a human, you can right?
Speaker 2:No, that's actually a better way of saying it.
Speaker 1:That's more elegant than the way I said, and the interesting thing about it is that even though it can compile all that information Like when people come to the ER to like you don't really get all that information right. Like, if the AI can figure it that out, that's gonna be great, but with usually you get very limited information. Oh yeah, any at all right and you're lucky to even get like a vital sign.
Speaker 2:I mean that's one thing that I think a lot of people, when they make the transition from medical school to, you know, actually working as a doctor, a big transition that people have to make is when patients present. Now I can only speak to the emergency room because that is my chosen specialty and I've sort of been around that particular area of medicine more than any others. But whenever you're dealing with a situation like that, it's they're just our variables that a computer is never gonna be able to Pick up like you would like. I don't have. I can't even really think of a better way of saying it. I had an idea but I forgot. No, it's one of the downsides of podcasting, that is dude.
Speaker 1:That is. I promise you that is gonna happen many times if you do it again. Yeah, but to what you were saying the feeling that you get when someone when I'm looking at someone sick Like I, it's weird, but you can almost feel that they're sick, like you can just look at them, put your eyes on them and right kind of at least get the feeling that something's going on. Now, sometimes, especially with me being new to the game, I may be a little bit More, I may chase the zebra every now and then when I should it. Right, but you can get that feeling.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, with all the and so that that is a. That's when I knew that I was gonna be in In healthcare right, care, anyway. I knew that I was gonna work in a hospital one way or another, because I loved all those stories about I wanted to be helping and be in medicine. I just didn't know what I was gonna do. Right, right, and so Then, when I started to realize that you could do all that, I was like, ah, I mean kind of like a superhero.
Speaker 2:I remember what I was gonna say now, so what it is. When you're in medical school, some people get really good at like taking a board question, right? Where it'll say, a 35 year old male presents the emergency room with these vitals, these labs, these symptoms. Well, in real life, they don't show up with a piece of paper that says this is all the stuff that's going on with me, right? You have to actually elicit that information from them. You have a person who's having a bad day? You have to get them in a room. You have to get them to tell you this is my history, these are the meds I'm on. This is how it happened. This is what I was doing when the symptoms started, but this is like the way it felt to me.
Speaker 2:There's a lot of subjective information that you take for granted that you get in a board question, but in real life you actually have to like elicit that information, you have to go out and find that information, and that is a skill right, and then you also On a board question too. They just give you the labs, but in real life you actually have to make the decision like I need to order these labs.
Speaker 1:You have to have the foresight to do that.
Speaker 2:There's just a lot more going on than you have going on in a board question. Now I do understand, the further I go along, why you need to learn medicine in that paint by numbers fashion first. But yeah, there's, there's a lot more going on like. So, if you're out there in medical school and you're listening, this is not me trying to say, oh, if you're good at board questions, that you're going to be a terrible doctor. You know, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that it's important to have the knowledge. But don't take for granted just because if you are the person that has a 4.0 or does make a perfect score on all your board exams, that is definitely a good thing. But just don't rest on your laurels If you're that person. Also keep in mind that when you the ultimate goal is to get to where you can take that information, take that skill and apply it to actually making Real human beings in real life, like fixing them, fixing their problems, making them better. Those are two very different things, very big, different things.
Speaker 1:And the thing about it, too, is it takes that extra experience to Like, when you're when you're in medical school, you're not even thinking about the forethought to order the test like that. It's a whole. Another aspect of the job and it can probably be the toughest thing is to figure out, like, even if you see somebody that's sick, you're like, oh shit, what do I need to do?
Speaker 2:right for this person right now. Oh man, that to me that is the hardest part, that that, to me, is the scary aspect or the difficult aspect of where we are In. Our training is like we have a lot of knowledge, we know. If you say, oh, this person has acute decompensate heart failure, we know what that is and I could, we could both rattle off drugs that you may need to give for that Right. But the discretion and sort of the the calculus you have to make in real life is like Really for me, one hard thing is knowing when do I need to pull that trigger, like when is somebody actually sick enough for me to say, oh, I need to stick a tube in this person's chest or I need to make the decision to give rsi drugs and actually Intubate this person. Knowing when you need to make a critical intervention versus not.
Speaker 2:That is to me the difficult part of this transition is like sort of knowing when you need to be freaked out when you need to do stuff, when you don't need to do stuff, when you can send somebody home, when you absolutely can't send somebody home. Those are the things that you're going to learn as you move through residency, whereas in medical school and rightly so you just have to spend your time and focus on learning the vast amount of Information that you sort of take for granted where we are.
Speaker 2:We have a lot of knowledge in our head that when somebody says pulmonary embolism, all these facts and figures and lab tests and Decisive all these things pop in your head. But it's when you're in medical. That's what your goal is is to learn all those things. But now you got to harness all that and actually like use it in a way that's coherent and makes sense and apply it to a situation. It's. It's humbling, but it's also cool. I kind of see it as like a superpower in a sense the vignette is now.
Speaker 1:The person comes in toxic appearing right vomits once. What do you do?
Speaker 2:Yeah, right, yeah. And it's just like you like reading that on a piece of paper versus seeing that person in the Tromba room or in the er, whatever bay. You're in seeing that person and I actually like saying, oh, this person looks toxic. When you read that word You're like, oh, I know what that means, but like actually identifying somebody just visually. When you say, what does it mean when somebody looks quote toxic? I know it sounds simple, but that is something that you kind of have to learn to learn skill Identifying like sick versus not sick. It's something that people say all the time and it sounds easy. But I pour anybody out there, whether you're medical or not medical, walk it into an ER and just look at it somebody and saying this person is in trouble versus not in trouble. It's not as easy as it sounds to make that decision and to make it quickly.
Speaker 1:Yeah, the one thing that I noticed like growing up we talked kind of about how I was in the hospital early growing up Is that when I was around like the ER physicians yeah, the best ones I noticed that they could get information Out of somebody. Yeah, and even a little bit more that would help make a decision, but it was quite impressive and you would see those people being Like I just remember they all had one super talent, which was whatever. No matter how else they acted, they could get whatever information they needed out of somebody.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean it's important, man, because you gotta keep in mind and you and I are kind- of we're just on the precipice of this situation.
Speaker 2:But you realize now, whenever you make the decision to give meds or do an invasive test or do an invasive procedure, like it's one thing to select A, b or C that says do that thing, but we actually have to do that to an actual person. Like that's a big decision to make and you're making that decision based off of like questions. You're asking the patient and you're asking that question. You gotta be confident to say, if the patient tells me this, that means that that information is gonna make, it's gonna make me so confident in my decision that I'm willing to, based off of that information, I'm gonna make some critical action that all procedures have risk, right. Like it's one thing to say, oh, I need to intubate this person, but like there's more to it than that.
Speaker 1:You could hurt somebody, you could kill somebody, you may not get it.
Speaker 2:So like knowing when, like hey, I definitely need to put take the risk of giving this person drugs, paralyzing them, sticking a tube down their throat, you know, potentially causing trauma to their throat, trachea, all those things. It's a big decision to decide to do something like that to a person because it's somebody's mom, brother, grandma, sister, friend. To me, that's the most humbling part of making this transition from medical student to doctor is realizing that these decisions that we make based on we're used to just reading these questions and having these hypotheticals and saying, oh, we're gonna do this. But it's a different thing when you make that decision and it actually is gonna happen to a person that you've met their family and like they have expectations that you're gonna help them and not hurt them. It's a humbling job. It's definitely the hardest thing I've ever done. So you know again, this is another endorsement. If you like a challenge and you're not squeamish about blood and you kind of like chaos, look into emergency medicine.
Speaker 1:That's one of the things that I like is the fact that you don't get a lot of information and you just gotta figure it out. Now at UMMC you can get transfers and all these other things.
Speaker 2:No, you got all kind of back. You have a lot of help.
Speaker 1:That's what people want when they see a doctor. It's hard, man, it's hard. That's a like every other specialty, has its points. We're obviously biased, right, we're biased, we're biased, but obviously you can't tell it there.
Speaker 2:We both love emergency medicine, and it's not to say that other specialties aren't awesome too. I think it's all awesome. I love surgery, I like specialty medicine, I like it all. I think everything has its place and has its own sort of like, level of like I say a superpower to it. But for me the ER was a unique challenge and that you sort of have to take. You gotta remember and know a little bit about everything. You have to be able to stay cool under pressure. You gotta be able to make like big, consequential decisions with not complete information.
Speaker 2:And going back to it, cycling back to what I said earlier, a quote from my dad fighting is high level problem solving with dire consequences for failure. That is a perfect description of emergency medicine. Also, too, right, you're playing a high stakes game that if you mess up, I mean the consequence is death, whereas in a fight it's just you may get knocked out, you may break your nose, you may have to tap, I mean whatever. But we're playing a very high stakes game and it's humbling and it makes me want to be the best version of myself because I don't wanna make a bad decision right.
Speaker 1:Love it. That fear will keep people alive. Do you do good at those tests Like the standardized? Do you do good at the standardized tests?
Speaker 2:Not I mean historically. I'm one of those people who does about average. You know, it's one of those things that I always walk away and if I was gonna tell you about it, the way I've always thought about it is that my level of medical knowledge and my ability, like in the actual clinical scenario, is not reflected by how I perform on the test.
Speaker 1:I say the same thing, and that might be why we are under endorsing the USMM.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, again, again. This is not me and my people who do really good at the test, Like I have a lot of respect and I am in awe of the people that can make 15,000, 15,000 Anki Cards and make a perfect score. Like to me, that is a amazing skill and it will give you opportunities that, like Jordan and I, may never have. We wouldn't even get our foot in the door that. If you make a perfect score on USMM, you may get that opportunity. But to the people out there and I would probably say the majority, more people out there who were the standardized test is not necessarily your thing. Or if you feel like your board scores don't really reflect your actual ability, rest easy and know that there is more than just your board scores.
Speaker 2:You'll end up where you wanna go, but at the same time, I'm not gonna be one of those people who knocks the people, who bust the 265 on the USMLE and get to do whatever it is they wanna do. That's also very impressive, no, man, that is super impressive.
Speaker 1:I wish I had that skill. There was one thing, though, that I wanted to ask you, which was we just got done with this month, and it's a training month. What was one thing that you benefited from having the training month?
Speaker 2:Right. So to me, the biggest benefit of having this month to get to do a lot of simulation and training and work on all the procedures fundamentally was and everybody out there who is a fourth year med student will either either knows this already or will come to know this that you kinda get a little rusty going from match day to actually starting your intern year. So it was a good opportunity to kinda get get my head back in the game, kinda get serious again, as opposed to just starting day one in some working in the hospital and having no idea what you're doing. So it was a good way to get acclimated. It was also a great way to get to actually meet all of my co-residents in a real way as opposed to just saying hey, I'm Corey, I like long walks in the beach and puppies, Like we actually got to know each other.
Speaker 1:That was good. Not in your fourth month of your residency and you finally meet them.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like when you're super busy and don't even really care. And then, just as far as the medical aspect of it, I think the thing that was most beneficial for me and again this is very specific to me because I'm starting in the medical ICU is that the opportunity to really hammer down on all the procedures, and I don't even just mean like the physical action of doing the procedure. I've had a good bit of experience doing a lot of procedures and I feel like I've gotten to as a medical student and in my former job and stuff I've got to do a lot more than a lot of people but really taking the time to not just do the procedure but learn what are the indications, contraindications, what, drugs do.
Speaker 1:I need to give why do I need to give this drug? What?
Speaker 2:does just like really learning the ends and outs of why I'm doing something, when to do it, and also getting to have to practice the reps of doing it. So for me, I feel like the procedural aspect was probably the most beneficial, because in the MICU it's a very procedure-heavy situation. There'll be a lot of lines, a lot of people that will either be on the vent or will need to be on the vent, people that will be excavated and have to be re-intubated, people who will need chest tubes and things like that, and having the opportunity to practice not even just doing a chest fever, doing an intubation, but also getting to also practice those things but also really hammer down on when I need to do them, why I need to do them, be able to say out loud and articulate these are the things I need. This is what I'm gonna do if things go south. It was awesome. I really felt that it was.
Speaker 2:I think a lot of EM programs do something similar. Maybe, maybe not, but I can say that the OP EM month at UMMC, as far as their program, it's clutch, it's everything I know. I heard a lot of people in our class say that man, I'm ready to get in the game, but and I am ready to get in the game, but this month was.
Speaker 2:It was great. I feel like it was irreplaceable. I think it's gonna make all of us better starting off?
Speaker 1:I definitely think so too. The one thing about procedures is whenever you haven't done a skill in nine months and then all of a sudden they're like hey, hop on this bike. You never forget how to do it, but you're a little wobbly going in.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a good way of putting it.
Speaker 1:And when they're asking you to put a catheter in your neck, which involves you to prick the vein with a needle. Sometimes you can get a little you would like to be on the job for multiple. You know For sure, a little bit of time off, it makes you a little bit more worrisome, so I was actually really glad we got to have that, was there? Any event, that you did that sticks out in your mind, that you really enjoyed.
Speaker 2:One thing that I've really enjoyed was all of us doing ATLS together. I felt like our ATLS which I know a lot of people do ATLS and all that but the group of people that we got to do it with at UMMC so really, really, really good trauma surgeon at UMMC this Dr Zaza. He we got to have instruction from him. Most of the people that were teaching all the stations were general surgery residents or trauma surgery attendings, and I felt like our ATLS was very beneficial, not just for the actual steps of ATLS, but I felt like we got to learn a lot of good tidbits as far as dealing with the trauma. And the reason that's important is a lot of times, especially as a med student, you're not really involved in high level trauma situations. I mean, you may be watching it right but you're not really doing anything. But as an EM intern at UMMC, you're gonna be head of bed on a lot of crazy things.
Speaker 2:Oh crazy, yeah, and so having that opportunity to go through the motions but also to really hammer down and learn, under the pressure of having people evaluating you, be able to say I need to do this because this I know I've kind of harped on that but being able to make that transition to not just know the steps but to know why and when I need to do X, y and Z.
Speaker 2:I can't stress enough how important that is. So much stuff as a EMT or so many things as a medical student, you know in an algorithmic fashion and that's very similar to when you're learning Jujitsu, for example you learn it by paint, by numbers, but then as you get better at it, you don't have to say step one, step two, step three. You kind of understand it from a like a more global perspective where you can kind of put your own spin on it. And I feel like that's the same for medicine. But you and I are at the stage where we're white belts, blue belts, you know emergency medicine. So we need we benefit from being able to say we have to do this, I need these materials, we need to do this. What are the indications, contraindications, like it's something you take for granted, but it's super important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, we have a solid group there. We had the whole team together. Everybody could interact, and then we actually we had Dr Zaza and he was great to even bounce questions off and say like this is going to be how it is when this thing rolls into UMC. The one thing that has really impressed me about UMC is the fact that every there's so many resources and they've been done so well, like even all the simulations, in that they have a simulations lab coordinator. Shout out to Dr Verant.
Speaker 2:Yes, she's awesome. That was also super beneficial too. That's her name, right? Yeah, Verant. I think Dr Verant Shout out to.
Speaker 1:Dr Verant, she's great. Yeah, she's awesome. And so they have, like, all of these resources and every one of the courses and things that we had to do, cause when you're going into, you have to get all of your certifications up to date. So that means not just ATLS and ACLS, but that's NRP and essentially all the things that could happen.
Speaker 2:And I've never done NRP before. That was the first time I got a.
Speaker 2:NADLS certified. I've been ACLS certified, but that was the first time I've ever been through the Neonatal Resuscitation Program and that was really cool. Like I hope I never have to be involved in a resuscitation of like a kid in that situation, but at least now we've been through the training and if you did God forbid find yourself in that situation like we would know what to at least have some idea of. We need to do this. These are the things we need to at least start moving towards. I thought that was really cool.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and we saved the baby. It was a miracle. The baby had a hard time getting out and the baby was still not as big as I was when I, when she said the weight, I was like, well, you know, we're going to have to deal with the fact that this baby is obviously large. But at the same time I was like, hmm, I was 10, 10 when I came out.
Speaker 2:So I was like oh wow, you were huge. Yeah, you were a big boy.
Speaker 1:Were you a C6, maybe or not.
Speaker 2:No Good, old fashioned man. Old fashioned, that's awesome man.
Speaker 1:So even when I go to medical school everybody essentially says any baby over 10 pounds the mother more than likely has justational diabetes. That's my mom about that.
Speaker 2:She was like no not me, you're a soss.
Speaker 1:Rect that thing.
Speaker 2:The other thing too, that now that we're talking about it, so many things pop in my head. But, like another really good, humbling thing about OPM was we really harped on not just resuscitation skills and procedural skills, but we went through adult medical simulation, pediatric medical simulation. We also had lectures from neurosurgery either residents, fellows attendings that, like, told us, these are the things that we care about. When y'all call us for these things, we wanna know this. We had the same thing with ophthalmology. Like, hey, if you call us, these are the things we really like, these are the buzzwords that we wanna hear when you're giving a presentation. These are the things that call us to action.
Speaker 2:We also worked on eyes, ears, nose, throat, lungs. We had a day where we did obesity before. We worked on like dealing with postpartum hemorrhage and actual emergent deliveries, in addition to resuscitating the kids after they're born if they're not doing well. So we really got a wide range and review of almost all of medicine and it was humbling because you know, I don't know about you but I'm not there's certain areas where I'm weak.
Speaker 2:We all have weaknesses and strengths and, like, for me, ob is something that is probably like in my mind.
Speaker 2:I would say that's like my bugaboo, that's like the thing that if on the spot, if I have to answer your questions about. Like to me that was kind of a humbling scenario to be in, like normally on the adult medical Sims or the resuscitative Sims, like I was cool being the team lead. But I remember on the first day when we were with Dr Tara Lewis and we're working on, like the emergent delivery scenarios, I had to be team lead because my last name, abdeen ABD I think it was because I was on the top of the list she made me in front of everybody be the team lead and in my group and I was always confident in every scenario and like a lot of the people in our class were all like, oh yeah, you know Abdeen's, he's on top of it, he's confident. But in that scenario in the back of my mind I tried to portray confidence but I was like this is going to be scary. I got pushed outside of my comfort zone, which I needed. I needed that. That's great.
Speaker 1:What a cool mannequin too, because the mannequin literally gives birth.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, the technology, the stuff they have up there is so cool yeah.
Speaker 1:You're comfortable with the trans-vaginal ultrasounds, but the second that they yeah, I was like whoa.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it was. You know you're never going to know everything, and I feel like the moment you ever start to think you know everything, that's when you become a liability and when you become dangerous, not only to yourself but to the patients. I just think you have to have a healthy respect for what we do. It's difficult and there's a large body of knowledge and you can always be better at things, and I think OPEM did a good job of reminding us of that, but also reminding us that we need to be humbled. But it also reminded us that it is feasible, that we're going to be able to do this, particularly if we work together. If we put the work in, put the time in, we're all going to get through it, but it was the kick in the pants that I needed.
Speaker 2:I can't say enough about the OPEM program that they have at UMMC's EM residency for that first month. I'm sure other programs do similar things, but it was great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, a good kick in the pants is all you need. Sometimes it was very. It was really good too, because you got to work through some of your first mistakes. Yeah, because everybody's going to be is going to fumble around a little bit at first and even if you know what's going on, it's hard to like separate the fact that you're still new at this, so you can kind of work some things out. I remember one of the answers to one of the simulations so kid a baby, very new baby. We all know of SIDS, which is sudden infant death syndrome. There's really the syndrome means that there's nothing you could really do the baby just yeah, there's nothing that could be done.
Speaker 1:What it just happens.
Speaker 2:But when you get faced with that and you're sitting there and they're simulating it.
Speaker 1:you realize that you're trying to think that there is a solution and that which that was? Actually Corey had a moment of shine. He was being humbled at one point, but he shined then because he was ready. He was ready to call it Now. He was also doing the most work out of all of us and that. But then the answer was that so they would let you flaunder and keep going as much as you could. But which is the funny thing is you? I said something about you doing chest compressions for 10 minutes or whatever. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1:And the other group said something like they did it for 25 minutes.
Speaker 2:Yeah, one thing that I'll. One thing I will say if anybody out there is listening, whether you're in emergency medicine or some other specialty, because I don't know. I will admit I don't know anything about what the other specialties do. Jordan and I are just in emergency medicine, so I can speak to that. But if you are in emergency medicine or any other specialty and you go through, you know, a simulation of a resuscitation or any scenario like that one thing that Any scenario especially high stress, yeah, man it's tough and one thing that we don't do a good job of and it's kind of about design, right, we need to
Speaker 2:have that idea that we can fix anything. I think that's important mindset to have at the beginning. But I think it is also an important lesson to realize that you gotta know when your efforts are no longer helping and when now you're just sort of causing a detriment. I think that's a very important discretion to have. And that particular scenario that Jordan brought up, the exact scenario was, you know, a kid I forget the age, but very young four or five months had been down so unknown downtime had been asleep in the bed with mom.
Speaker 1:Hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up. I don't think you're allowed to say what the-.
Speaker 2:Oh, that's right that's right.
Speaker 1:I think you did sign a confidentiality.
Speaker 2:That's right. Yeah, I'm not gonna leave the specifics out, like, at the end of the day, it's a long time down on arrival.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and there's really nothing you could do, yeah, and so like they're down a long time before they even got there.
Speaker 2:And then, once they get there, you start immediately doing like all the outward suscitation You're doing chest compressions, you're giving up a nephron, you're doing all the the mom's crying.
Speaker 1:We got. We had one of the chiefs doing a great acting job.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, it was it was high stress man and the two, like I just remember sitting there and 10 minutes go by, 15 minutes go by, we've done pretty much everything we could do and I just had this thought that came over me, like, and we needed to start considering like when we need to stop this Cause. I just thought, in real life, like you know, cpr works and it's life saving, but at a certain point if you're not getting blood to your brain, like sometimes making it is not always the best thing. I know that sounds harsh but, like you know, sometimes you can make it where you're physiologically alive, but like your ability to have a normal life afterwards is gone and I feel like, as a physician, being able to make that discretion as to like you gotta think about how the person, not just like life or death, you also have to think about the quality of life that person's gonna have after your intervention. Like again, it all just sort of circles back to that.
Speaker 2:It was all encompassing. They taught us a lot of medical knowledge. They taught us a lot of like no-when-defold-em situations. I just thought that the OPE I can't say enough about how good it was and the lessons that it taught all of us. I think if you asked all 16 of us, like if we learned something that we all walked. I think we all walked away from this month with something that is gonna stick with us throughout this year and definitely with this next month, like something we learned over the last few weeks, like you're definitely gonna use on day one and you're gonna be glad we did it.
Speaker 1:You know yeah, that was my moment of humbling is when that scenario happened. Everybody kind of we all kind of rush up, we realize you know, shit's gone sour part of my French, but the so everybody. You start chest compressions and I peel back, I'm like, okay, I'll take the team lead, we'll figure this out. And at that moment, now that I mean like we said too nothing you can do but just working that through with the simulation, like I know that not to wait to minute 15 to start speaking and trying to get things planned out, whether it's with the mother, and there was a couple times where I did speak to the mom, but I did not.
Speaker 1:I should have been more eloquent with how I handled the situation.
Speaker 2:Well, I thought you did great man.
Speaker 1:That's a hard thing in real life, yeah, and so getting that one chance to work it out in my head. Like I know now that I will start if I'm standing back right. If I'm not, I kept just wanting to hop in and do chest compressions because I didn't know the next step to do it.
Speaker 2:But you did a great job. Man, Like somebody, has to be the team. The team leads an important job. Even if you're not physically doing a thing, I would actually argue to say the team lead. I mean, that is the most important job.
Speaker 1:Somebody's gotta bring more to that Somebody's gotta at least direct it. It is, and it's, a tough job, but I now know how I'm going to handle it in real life, so that's one of the things that I get to take away.
Speaker 2:At least you were forced to think about it. Right, you had to think about it. I wouldn't have thought about it. What if I'm in this scenario?
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's just like consent. You never think about having to get consent for a procedure.
Speaker 2:This is something you take for granted, right, but you actually have to have that conversation with the patient. You know that's important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's a funny thing when you go to get tested and then they go okay, well, now tell us, like how you would get consent for this procedure.
Speaker 2:And you're like, oh, I didn't think you were gonna ask that, yeah, well, yeah, it's one thing that you, on paper, it seems like it would be easy, but, like if you're not used to having those conversations with an actual person, like the moment where you're kind of forced to, but it's a see, I'm not gonna cast mistakes, it wasn't me this time, but yeah, it's like one of those things that you you always think about, like, oh yeah, this would be no big deal. And even though it was a simulated scenario, but when you actually have to take that moment and you're oh, what are you gonna say to this person?
Speaker 2:There's always gonna be a part of you that thinks about I'm gonna actually be doing this like pretty soon, and like what am I gonna say?
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. It's not as intuitive as you would think, it's difficult, like I said we both said it this was a humbling month.
Speaker 2:I learned a lot. We were fortunate to have good co-residents and all of the upper levels were very involved in the process, so we got to meet them and learn from them in the process. And it was also cool, like how many attendings like took time out of I'm sure being super busy to either, after a night shift, come in the next morning and like teach us ultrasound, like Dr Hoda did for several hours, or like the ortho fellow comes in after working all night, came in and like gave us a fracture lecture for an hour and a half. It's just little things like that go a long way. And it made me even more excited about being part of the UMMC team and like kind of getting to be a physician that's gonna be involved in the madness, so to speak.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, it made me super excited. I could not be more thankful, and it would be moving to Mississippi. Now I just feel more comfortable, I'm ready to roll. Yeah, like it. Really, I've been humbled, definitely very excited, though, and I'm really looking forward to the next couple of years. Dude, to be honest, this is gonna be great.
Speaker 2:I mean, we're gonna grow a lot as people and like. Can I ask you a question?
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude.
Speaker 2:So let me sort of ask you a version of what you asked me earlier what, as far as like, what's to say for this next month, which really the next month starts Monday. When's your first shift?
Speaker 1:My first shift is on Wednesday.
Speaker 2:You work a night or a day Night. So you're working next Wednesday at night, right? So, as far as this first shift, when you think about it in your mind, like what are your goals for this?
Speaker 2:like first, like your first opportunity to be doing the real thing, Like what are some things that you want to make sure that you work on, get better at? Like, what are you afraid of? Like what, just like? I wanna know what your thoughts are about approaching this first day, cause I'll be honest with you, man, especially since you and our friends, you normally in medicine we don't like to show vulnerability. We always like to act like we're the smartest person in the room, and that's an important thing to have as a doctor. We want to instill confidence, but I'm nervous about being in the mickey. Like, are you nervous about working your first shift in the home?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm certainly nervous Now when you ask me about goals. I don't have a specific number, especially because it's the first one, but I definitely know that when I go in there I want to pick up enough and be able to operate at a certain level to where I'm able to pull more off the rack than would be expected of me.
Speaker 2:I don't mean, like you know, come to one good differential Like make sense. I want to be able.
Speaker 1:I'll get there early. I'm going to map out exactly, you know, the exact macros and all that stuff. Get my stuff set up, Cause what I want to be able to do is be able to pull patients off the board and treat responsibly and do the right thing. But I want to. I want to get into the workflow quickly and smoothly, and so what I'm going to try to do is set that up Now.
Speaker 1:I know it's going to be a nice shift. It's going to be my first time. There's going to be chaos. So, of course, what I'm looking to do is, by saying something that probably is not going to happen on that first shift, Like I'm not going to be at workflow, but I won't be satisfied until I am. So I will be. That's what I'm looking forward to is like getting in there and doing it Now. I'm certainly nervous. That's why I'm like well, I know that if I go and I prepare and I know that I need to if I can just try to get to an average one on my first time, then I'll be good.
Speaker 2:Let me ask you this so what specifically scares you the most about now being you're not a med student anymore, you're a doctor. Now, you're a doctor admin. What scares you the most, whether it be a scenario, whether it be whatever it is, what aspect of it? When you say you're nervous, what is it that scares you the most about now having this higher level of responsibility and expectation?
Speaker 1:Quick Sam man, the quick Sam. Have you ever seen the replacement?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I've seen it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Quick Sam, when you start sinking and then you feel like you can't climb out. But no, that was really just, I was tying that into it. But my biggest fear, to be honest, is going in there Now. I know that I will have an attending and I know that attending doesn't expect much of me, probably on that first day. But what I have a problem with is, my biggest fear is that somebody will come in and they will be thinned out no matter what, and I won't be able to do what is right for that in the moment.
Speaker 2:If I'm the only one stuck in there, because that's kind of how the ER works.
Speaker 1:Every now and then you've got the whole team, or most of the time you have the whole team, and then every now and then everybody kind of disperses and then some shit happens.
Speaker 2:It could go south.
Speaker 1:And then you're stuck. You wanna be able to figure it out and I just don't wanna hurt anybody since then.
Speaker 2:You just said the magic words. For me, what it is more than anything is I know that I have knowledge. I know that if I walk in unless I just have a really bad day I know I can go in, take a good history, I can talk to them, get a good story, come up with some differential, be able to have some reasonable way of working it up. More so for me than anything, it's like I know that, like you said, we're not gonna be expected just to be hitting the ground running day one, but every time I go in there and this is a good thing too, this is a mentality that I'm always gonna have and I think it's important to have, even though it puts more pressure on ourselves you always have to walk in there knowing that, anything you do now, any scenario, even if you have an attendant there to help you back, the day's coming where it's just gonna be. You. You know what I mean, and so it's like I really, really, really wanna be good and I don't want to hurt anybody.
Speaker 2:And what I mean by that is yes we're doing high level, high acuity patients, so bad things are gonna happen and I can deal with that. But what would bother me more than anything is knowing that somebody got hurt because I was inept or because I made a bad decision.
Speaker 2:Right, I know that sometimes no matter what you do, even if you do everything right, some people, a certain percentage of people, are not gonna make it right. I even had a paramedic instructor that said 33% of patients who come to the ER are gonna be fine, no matter what you do. Another 33% so another third are gonna do bad, no matter what you do. And then there's a third that you can actually help, and even though that's kinda simplistic, there is some truth to that. Oh, certainly.
Speaker 2:I just wanna make sure that when I do encounter somebody who's in that third of where my intervention can determine life or death, good or bad function, not function I just wanna know that I worked hard enough to rise to that occasion.
Speaker 1:Yeah, man, that fear is what my mom has always told me that the fear you have of hurting people is going to eventually make you a good doctor.
Speaker 1:So if you can just keep that and that seems maybe a little simplistic or whatever- but you really and yeah, we understand, because when you really are nervous about whatever, you start looking things up and sometimes you can be chasing Z-bros or whatever. But that's what also makes a good doctor. And so, yeah, man, I'm excited We've got a heck of a crew coming hospitals. Beware, license to kill. I'm definitely excited to be with the group. And so, yeah, man, unless you've got anything else to say, we gotta wrap this thing up.
Speaker 2:Last thing to say Dr Abney and Dr Abdeen rolling up to UMMC this coming week ready to do some damage.
Speaker 1:Double A's everybody beware.
Speaker 2:Good luck everybody. Jordan, thanks for having me on. I really appreciate it. This was fun.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, it was a blast, so see you later again everybody, thank you for listening.
Speaker 2:Praise, praise Cool.