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The Unstoppable Marketer®
Trevor Crump and Mark Goldhardt bring you quick marketing and entrepreneurial tips, tricks, and trends for DTC business owners, entrepreneurs, and marketers. These are lessons they've learned through the years of being right in the thick of scaling dozens of businesses. Whether you have an established business looking to grow, just starting your business journey, or trying to become a digital marketer, this marketing podcast will not let you down.
The Unstoppable Marketer®
EP. 101 Trump vs. Harris: The Political Marketing Smackdown
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Is fear or hope the ultimate tool in marketing? We reflect on our own experience of dropping a podcast episode, spotlighting the crucial lesson of recognizing and steering clear of sunk cost bias. Then, we shift gears to the rollercoaster world of reality TV. Our conversation turns to Hulu's "Secret Life of Mormon Wives," a show that smartly piggybacked on a viral TikTok scandal to draw in viewers.
Despite Hulu's challenges as a streaming service, they struck gold with this show by leveraging key influencers to drive record-breaking viewership. While opinions on the show's quality and moral values are mixed, its widespread appeal is undeniable.
Finally, we examine reality TV’s captivating mechanics and how they parallel election campaign strategies. We transition to discuss the distinct media strategies of the Harris and Trump campaigns, revealing how they utilize different platforms to target their key demographics. By drawing parallels between political campaigns and business strategies, we emphasize the critical importance of advertising spend and the power of going viral.
Reality TV and Sunk Cost Bias
Speaker 1But that's what they're selling in the ad, like they both have messages of doing something different and making America better. They both kind of say that.
Speaker 2Yeah, everyone's saying, hey, we want things to be better. They're both saying the same thing.
Speaker 1One is saying hey, things are bad now, yes. The other one is not saying that, because that's the whole question, right, does fear sell or does aspiration sell?
Speaker 2Does hope sell or does fear sell? Yo, what's going on? Does hope sell or does fear sell? We also, just to let everyone know, we tried a podcast episode and we got like 30 minutes into it and we just weren't feeling it, so we scratched the whole thing.
Speaker 1Yeah, we did. We just said, let's just go home.
Speaker 2Yeah, yeah we weren't feeling it.
Speaker 1We can't turn this into anything. No, that's called turning your back on sunk cost bias.
Speaker 2Sunk cost bias Sometimes it's better just to back on sunk cost bias. Sunk cost bias. Most people can't do it. Sometimes it's better just to throw it away. Yeah, it doesn't matter how much time and attention you put into it. If it's failing, don't try to make it work. You can't dress up a turd. Yeah, you can't make a turd look pretty.
Speaker 1Yeah, yeah Right.
Speaker 2Feels like that's probably a saying that comes from Texas. Maybe I want to talk about something we haven't mentioned this before, but I do want to talk about something pop culturally that has been happening that I'm sure you've noticed, which is in July. They announced when I say they there was a TV show series announced on Hulu called the Secret Life of Mormon Wives. Have you seen all this, the scuttle about this? I know this is completely your jam. This is something you would totally be excited about to watch.
Speaker 1I have unfortunately been looped in to the reality TV series.
Speaker 2yeah, Well, you have, I have not watched it. Yeah, yeah, it's pretty crazy.
Speaker 1I guess for those listening I.
Speaker 2Mark does not watch reality TV.
Speaker 1I despise reality TV.
Speaker 2And on the flip side I have a visceral reaction.
Speaker 1when I see it, I'm just angry. Any reality TV show, I just get angry.
Speaker 2And on the flip side, I love it.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2So I was a big Laguna Beach Hills. Love the Bachelor.
Speaker 1Okay, here's my question Reality TV is fake. It's scripted to some degree. I think they take some maybe real plots, but it's not real, it's curated. So what is?
Speaker 2intriguing about it. To you, um, to me it's no different. I get it's like the wwe, okay, like it's not real wrestling. No, no, that's not true. It's not true. So, uh, that is scripted the wwe yes to to a large degree.
Speaker 2Yes, a movie is scripted. You don't think tv series are scripted? Right, people are memorizing scripts. Now, yes, in wwe there may be some like what do they call it? In acting like where you've like improvisation yeah, there's probably some improvisation like hey for two minutes. You gotta do anything, yes, but it's it's still fake, but it is scripted and it is fake, okay.
Speaker 1So do you think in reality? They're not scripting it, they're not cutting it up.
Speaker 2Yes, of course they are. I think that.
Speaker 1Showing you different stories that they want you to.
Speaker 2Yeah, I think that the producers script how they would like a scenario to go and then they're putting people in those scenarios that they are creating. Did you ever watch Jury? No, do you know what it? Was, I don't you never heard of jury duty I haven't no oh, you have to watch it.
Speaker 1Jury duty is about a guy who gets brought up on the podcast. He gets selected for jury duty, but he's the only one that he's the only one who is playing jury yeah, it's like the truman show, but yes, in a jury.
Speaker 2Yeah, everyone else is a paid actor, so they script scenarios, but then they get his reaction out of it right so his reaction to everything is real, I mean in this one it was okay now reality tv. I'm sure that there are certain characters within it who are part of the script trying to make something happen.
Speaker 2Yeah, but for the most part it's. It's like hey, we're going to create this and hope that this is a scenario that happened. So, yes, I think that the producers are curating. Okay, what's going to happen? That is my take on it.
Speaker 1I think that's why you think these people's reactions are genuine.
Speaker 2I don't know about genuine in the sense that, like the people in reality TV, are genuine people.
Speaker 1See, I just don't think people are very like. You're on camera, so you're eliciting. Totally, that's what I'm trying to get a certain response.
Speaker 2It's more real than an office episode. Maybe, and often time you find people like. So, for example, let's get back to this mom talk.
Speaker 1We'll go back to it. Secret Life of Mormon Wives.
Hulu's Successful Reality TV Strategy
Speaker 2These were regular people. They're not famous people. I mean, they were maybe TikTok famous, but anyways, the reason why I want to bring it up there is somewhat of a marketing lesson, or not even a marketing lesson, maybe a marketing lesson but I want to give a kudos to Hulu because Hulu took something that took the entire world by storm two years ago by this woman who was like this bombshell here in Utah, of this woman who was soft swinging, that blew up TikTok. No one had answers to exactly what had happened and Hulu came in and said hey, we I would probably say Hulu of all the people is one of the more struggling streaming services, except for the only thing I would say. The only reason I would say not is at least for Well, they're owned by Disney.
Speaker 2For original content.
Speaker 1Oh, maybe Right for original stuff.
Speaker 2Because they'll do like the yeah.
Speaker 1I'm not educated enough on that, but I think all the streaming services are struggling.
Speaker 2But they hit a home run because they just said, hey, these ladies have distribution, they know how to get attention. Can they get attention? Whether it's ethical or whether you believe that it's okay or how they do it is up to you, but they got distribution so let's, they hit on emotion, because what's the emotion?
Speaker 2like everyone was wildly curious yeah about this right like hey, whatever happened to that? That mormon soft swinger like it seemed like everyone got divorced. There was like 30 moms a part of this group, was it all of them? So there was, like people got really into it ton of unanswered and it seemed like everyone got divorced. There was like 30 moms a part of this group, was it all of them?
Speaker 1So there was like a ton of really into it A ton of unanswered and it was like international news.
Speaker 2It wasn't national news, it was international news.
Speaker 1Okay, it was international it was international news for sure. Crazy.
Speaker 2What so they? So they got the distribution. They hit on an emotion which we talk about all the time. The emotion on that one, I think, would be curiosity, and then there's the value factor.
Speaker 1You got to provide some value which is entertainment didn't they have like a company at the time back then, a company who they had, an e-commerce company like who did one of them, I don't know it's like called happy valley or something, maybe I know one of them.
Speaker 2One of them, uh, one of them does uh hair extensions, and this is one we have to clip. By the way, she has a hair extensions company and she has billboards all over and her hair extension company is Jay-Z Hair.
Speaker 1I know. And so it reads like jizz hair, Jizz hair, I know. Every time I go by it I'm like that is the most absurd name you could have ever come up with for hair extensions Utah billboard.
Speaker 2It's Jay-Z hair. Anyways, it ended up smashing any record Hulu's ever put out from a show they produced.
Speaker 1It's got the most views it has. Yes, that's verifiable.
Speaker 2I saw it on Yahoo News.
Speaker 1Okay.
Speaker 2So I only believe Yahoo Only.
Speaker 1I mean, I didn't know, yahoo was still around.
Speaker 2Not to mention the other thing that was crazy is it was announced like early to mid-July and launched early September the actual series and within that like less than 30 day time period if you typed in secret life of mormon wives hundreds of millions of views of people talking about it. So they just, like hulu, just tapped in on on something that was almost just like low-hanging fruit just sitting there and how the other streaming services or what, or mtv, or how they didn't. That seems like an MTV thing. Mtv should have done that, how they didn't. So it was a huge win for Hulu.
Speaker 1I really don't like MTV either.
Speaker 2They've confirmed a second season. I think so that I did not get on Yahoo News, so I don't know how true that one is. Massive win for Hulu. Sad Bravo to them. I watched less than 30 minutes of the first episode as a reality TV person because I felt like I just had to see what was going on and it was so painfully awful to me.
Speaker 1Oh, it's not intriguing, not at all. It was bad, it was so dumb, I thought it was so painfully awful to me.
Speaker 2Oh, it's not intriguing, Not at all. It was bad, it was so dumb, I thought it was so stupid and I'm sure people are going to be like how dare you? Because people are blown up saying they love it.
Speaker 1Oh really, there's a lot of people that love it.
Speaker 2A lot of people loved it. Yeah, they loved the drama. Yeah, I thought it was boring.
Speaker 1People, people love a little drama.
Speaker 2I thought it was boring and I thought it was very high school-ish, like it didn't feel, and it felt like I could have just. I know for a fact that in that 30 minutes I could have walked up to every single one of them and said, hey, you know what? I'd make your life just like a little bit better if you just did this. That's what I just kept thinking.
Reality TV, Marketing, and Election Strategies
Speaker 1I'm like I could just come to her right now. You wouldn't be feel so dramatic if you didn't do this. That's how I felt. You know, the most reality tv I've ever watched is, uh. I was flipping through the channels and I watched a reunion of vanderpump.
Speaker 2Vanderpump rules I. I never watched it, but I know what you're talking about because I went you went to high school with one of them.
Speaker 1Right, not to high school, but yeah, I knew her okay yeah yeah, shout out to Lala Kent. That's right, she's great, she really is Like. I really like her. But I watched it and it was like, oh, this is what reality TV is Like they just. Yeah, it was just like a bunch of fighting like in a reunion show. I'm like ugh, yeah Well, let's pretty much all reality TV taps into is it's like a lot of emotion, right the curiosity, Like hey, this seems like I'm really curious about their lives.
Speaker 2That's generally the emotion I feel like reality TV show and intrigue brings.
Speaker 1Yeah, they just kind of tap into that primal monkey brain where you want to eavesdrop on a neighbor Totally.
Speaker 2Gossipy, they didn't even have to figure out distribution, because they just found people who had it. It was already viral on TikTok oh yeah, Well, not only was it viral on TikTok, but the word secret, the word Mormon and the word wife together, those are the three most clickbaity words ever. You add those three things together. When you add them together, not the word wife.
Speaker 1Wife is not clickbait.
Speaker 2But when you add secret Mormon wife that's massive clickbait. People are intrigued with the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, the Mormon religion.
Speaker 1They are.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1Win for them, win for the Hulu series, and then you add drama.
Speaker 2Right, it has a little cherry on top.
Speaker 1Yeah, I'm just waiting for the Hulu series around soaking.
Speaker 2Yeah, maybe it'll come up.
Speaker 1Well, it's crazy, though, because everyone acts like it's a big deal. But soaking is great. I don't know why people are so upset about it. In fact, I what are you doing? In fact? Whenever it's my turn at night, I always go to soaking, and my wife hates it, but there's no better way to clean off dishes than to let them soak in the kitchen sink for a little while.
Speaker 2I feel like I'm blushing right now.
Speaker 1Why? What do you think soaking is?
Speaker 2I just didn't know where you were going to go with it. I'm sweating, my brow is sweating. I'm glad we got these napkins. Yeah, soaking is a tried and true practice.
Speaker 1It works soaking.
Speaker 2The dishes are great.
Speaker 1I do the same thing. It's like a slow cooker, but for cleaning Yep. Leave it in there for an hour and then you come back and there's no scrubbing.
Speaker 2On that note, we'll be done with a reality TV segment of pop cultural moments, but I think there's some good marketing lessons in there. That's why I wanted to bring it up.
Speaker 1Yeah, human emotion drama Distribution Clickbait. It's big stuff.
Speaker 2How can you introduce more clickbait into your advertising and how can you tailor that into the right audience too right, they knew who the audience was going to be.
Speaker 1So, speaking of audiences, new topic um speaking of audiences, let's do an election update.
Speaker 2No, just kidding so no, but we do want to.
Speaker 1We do want to talk about that yeah, we are talking about the election for sure right now. So I think what's interesting right now is, yes, the election is going to affect advertising mostly. It looks like it's going to be mostly swing states, though based off of the numbers I'm pulling and the expenditures going into swing states, it looks like if you're an e-commerce company and you have a big profile of advertising in a swing state, like you're going to get hit more than if you're a little bit more for sure uh, in, not in neutral states, but just states that are already decided, like, for example, we're in utah.
Speaker 1Trump and har Harris are not spending any money or time in Utah.
Speaker 2Sure yeah, they already know who's getting Utah.
Speaker 1But if you're in Michigan or Wisconsin or Pennsylvania or Ohio and that's where a large subset of your customers are, I think you're going to get hit a lot harder. So, yes, you just have more advertising in general. There's local races too, but what I want to talk about more specifically is the difference in the way the Harris campaign is approaching advertising and the way that the Trump campaign is approaching marketing. I should say marketing, not just advertising Marketing. Can I say one?
Speaker 2thing, because they have two very different approaches.
Speaker 2Very much so. Can I say one thing in between, to talk about how it's going to impact people? Yes, one thing I just did was I went back, and I've gone back and looked at every account we have access to, and I went in and aggregated CPMs over the last I want to say like four months, just to see. Are we seeing a trend increase? For sure, and what was that? Does that same trend follow last year? Okay, you can't go back four years in meta no, they cut it yep, which sucks because I wanted to go back in meta anyways, whatever.
Speaker 2Uh, for at least accounts that we're looking at it this, this time last year, or the same thing, cpms, across all the accounts almost stayed the exact same. Let's say the, let's say it was 11. Okay, now they're up like it's up to 14. I think so. One just year, year over year. It's a year over year, it's up for sure. It was up, I want to say, from 11 bucks to 14 bucks, but from June to now it starts at 14 and the average is about $17 now.
Speaker 2So things are rising, whether that is from and it starts mid-August. That's when you start to see it rise is mid-August. So if you are seeing things and things are feeling tighter there, yeah, they're gonna happen.
Speaker 1That's what's happening but I think you're just gonna hit harder in swing states I agree with that because that's where most of the at least presidential spend is. Yep, sorry, but anyways proceed.
Speaker 2We want to talk about the differences between how marketing.
Speaker 1Donald.
Speaker 2Trump is using his marketing tactics, and if that's a good thing for what he needs to accomplish, versus versus what Kamala Harris is doing with her marketing tactics. Yes, okay so anyways the Harris campaign.
Speaker 1Harris is doing far more of what you would call like a traditional approach. Okay, so you can compare this to the e-commerce company where the founder doesn't really want to be in the limelight all the time. Yep, like, yes, she's doing like a few interviews and stuff, but they're running big tv ads and they're they're doing more like really curated it's very curated traditional settings.
Speaker 1That's what the Harris campaign is doing. So there's not a lot of like off-the-cuff stuff. It's not, you know, I would call more of like an organic viral strategy when the Trump campaign is taking a far more like new age approach. Very much so Like more like new age approach. Very much so Like more of a TikTok approach.
Speaker 2Yes.
Political Campaign Media Strategy Analysis
Speaker 1Which is he's? I mean, if I read this right right, the Harris campaign has done, I think, three interviews now. Okay.
Speaker 2Total. Yeah, it's not a lot Only with mainstream media. And generally more so, left-leaning mainstream media Right, right, right.
Speaker 1So mainstream media like she's going to the traditional broadcasters and she's doing a few interviews. Same with Walsh Yep, when the Trump campaign has done seemingly countless interviews with podcasters Yep and they've gone on the Just countless interviews with podcasters Yep and they've gone on the Just countless interviews. Now Trump has not done any big interviews. I don't think to this date with the main broadcasters Like a lot of the mainstream media.
Speaker 1You've seen, I think, his running mates, His running mates done a lot but Trump has done a lot of podcasts and rallies Yep rallies right podcasts um he he's been on with like elon musk yeah, so I mean no x lives, yeah x spaces, spaces that's what it's called. Yes, so he's done some x spaces he just did one with like a crypto yep influencer, yep Influencer. Yes, he's gone on. He was it like the Nelk boys. Yeah, he was on Theo Vaughn.
Speaker 2Theo Vaughn Lex Friedman.
Speaker 1Lex Friedman.
Speaker 2He was on Aiden Ross.
Speaker 1Who's a streamer?
Speaker 2Who's a big streamer, and then he was on Logan Paul's podcast as well.
Speaker 1Oh, that's right, he did Logan Paul and Jake Paul.
Speaker 2Right Yep.
Speaker 1OK, yep.
Speaker 2So which have mass? I mean all those podcasts are some of the biggest podcasts right now in the world.
Speaker 1And they have a huge Gen Z following, which is interesting, Massive Gen Z following. So, if you would have asked me because what politicians do in these campaigns is similar to your business they look at the demographics, they look at who their core base is and then they say who can we? Because really every presidential election is decided by this little group called independents, and then you can sway some right from, like the right side or the left side over, depending on the situation, but they're trying to get these independents to vote for them. So who is my base and how do I not alienate my base? Sure, you always talk about that. Don't alienate your base. So when they're asked certain questions about certain policies, they'll often just talk around it because they don't want to be pinned down to upset their quote base.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1So now they're trying to get this other group. So if I would have said, hey, who is this group of people that they're trying to get right? So, harris campaign, they're going. Traditional media, I mean who? Who watches traditional media at this point, right, like you're thinking, probably 35 and older, maybe 45 and older, yeah, yeah, I would probably say you got to be 40 plus, because I'm 35 and older and I'm I never. I mean like we weren't watching the news the way I consume news through Twitter and through Tik TOK.
Speaker 2Right, you know, never do I turn my TV on.
Speaker 1And so for the president, I would have just thought, I don't know. I would have thought that maybe Harris would be more of the podcast, because she would have been trying to rally up the young demographic, or she already established that the young demographic she's got more of the young demographic.
Speaker 2That's the question, right? So the young demographic are really generally interested in two big things, right Climate control and, oftentimes, abortion.
Speaker 1Actually it's split into two right, because you do have females versus males.
Speaker 2That are interested in different things. Yes, but they say so.
Speaker 1They say that those are as far as the bigger hot things.
Speaker 2Yes, that the gen z world is very interested in right, and so she feels like so is that she feels like that's her base.
Speaker 1So maybe she feels like she doesn't need to reach out to the older, because she's trying to fight like a left, like she's trying to fight off the image that she's ultra left wing correct not actually right, correct. So she's trying to come across as I can be moderate yeah, so I, so maybe it's a smart campaign strategy to say I want to go traditional, to try to influence people that are in the boomer to Gen X.
Speaker 2Who tend to lean more towards what a Trump voter might be.
Speaker 1Yeah, just like an older, more traditional subset.
Speaker 2Now what Harris does do well and I don't know if this is something Harris does do well or if just naturally this group of people tends to lean more left. Therefore, they support harris, which is more of the celebrity world and she, yes, she has celebrity endorsements. Yes, she has traditional, but she also kind of has this like it might be more influencers might be like traditional new age. Right, it's like traditional new age.
Speaker 1I wouldn't see a celebrity yeah, you do have to almost bucket them in two different things, because I would say celebrities are more of a traditional strategy. Sure from advertising, sure like you're gonna get a celebrity. Yeah, this is the face of our campaign to do a cologne with ken griffey is gonna be on the box of wheaties yes yes, that's fair enough.
Speaker 2I, I agree with that, I agree, agree with that. Yeah, so, yeah. So she's got the celebrities right that are coming out and speaking, and a lot of times celebrities can speak to the Gen Z audience because they look to her right. Right, you just saw.
Speaker 1Like the Billie Eilish.
Speaker 2Yeah, well, her audience actually is a really big audience. Right, You're getting 40-year-old moms, 50-year-old moms. Yeah, you've got a good— and their 13-year-old daughters.
Speaker 1Now, obviously, with politics it's a little different than products, because we all know why, but it is interesting to think about. Yeah, she has a huge reach and audience and dedicated following to her, so that's a big one.
Speaker 2That could be a smart thing of hers, like, hey, I don't need to go put as much time into this audience because my celebrity group of people are talking to those people.
Speaker 1But see, what's interesting about the Hulu example is you have this new age form of media, which is social media, and the Harris campaign is far more scripted. Right, it's a little bit more of a scripted. Hey, we're going to follow the script. We're going to present what we want to present.
Speaker 2We're going to control the narrative. Yes, very much so.
Speaker 1The Trump campaign seems like far less of that Totally. Yeah, it's like, oh, we'll just go on all these podcasts, let's talk with all these new age. Because, again, when you're talking about why are movies suffering, or like, why are Hollywood studios suffering, it's because, in my opinion, people just don't consume media the same way.
Speaker 2They're not taking the new age approach to advertising their movies.
Speaker 1Like reality TV, as much as I despise, it really was a foreshadow of social media content and creators Totally.
Speaker 2Totally.
Speaker 1And it still is that. I mean now you're just seeing as Hulu did. They just pluck them out of the social ether and then just plug them into a reality TV show, and that's probably how they're going to get new shows made from now on is just finding what's viral and you just go grab them.
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Speaker 2This bodes well for Trump, I think, to go in this direction, simply because he is so known to say things that just shock you. Right, he says it. He may say the stuff that are that is true, but he, he says it in a shocking manner, right? So, like one of those like. A good example of this is in the debate, if anyone watched the debate. There was one thing that he said that has gone completely viral online, which was they're eating the cats and dogs. Right, you said like this this is like a tiktok trend now and now. What's happening is is everybody is putting like a funny face to their dog or their cat and reacting to it and like.
Speaker 2So the dog will be something like this. It'll be like. You know, his eyes are kind of like looking at, like away from the camera, while he's saying they're eating the cats and dogs. But that's trump's strategy, right? I, I, at least I, I think it is. I think he says things in ways, the ways he does, because he knows he's got a really good chance of going viral and everybody's doing it, you know. And now what's actually happening is there's tons of people who are fact-checking to be like, actually, like he seems like he was right. There are videos of these people doing that kind of stuff. You know what you know. You know whether it's happening all the time or just once, who knows?
Speaker 1But yeah, well, it's interesting. So if you go back to July, I don't know when Harris, after his assassination attempt, he peaked. Harris peaked In July and now this month month they're both at a 16 it is hard to understand google.
Speaker 2There has been some.
Speaker 1There has been, there's also hard because I'm trying to do it apples to apples and compare donald trump to kamala yes but, you don't know which ones. But people don't search Donald, they search Trump.
Speaker 2They're going to search Trump?
Speaker 1Yeah, so I would put Trump and if you'd put Trump it's, it's light light years light years ahead of of her full name. But that's what's hard is like, cause people don't search.
Speaker 2Well, you what you probably could do on different graphs.
Speaker 1Yeah, and then you'll see who comes out.
Speaker 2Yeah, I don't think anyone's putting Donald J Trump in.
Speaker 1I think they're just going to put Trump.
Speaker 2But yeah, he's going on the Theo Vaughn podcast, he's going on the Lex Friedman, he's going on Spaces with Elon Musk. He's doing these new age things. That just gives him more opportunity for other people. I mean a huge thing that's happening right now. A massive thing that's happening right now in the social media sphere. It's like social media reporting. You guys know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1So if you add them all together, if you're looking at this graph, trump kind of came back, even over the last couple of months, but so far in September Trump in Google search terms is far ahead. So he's at a 35. Just the term.
Speaker 1Trump Just the term Trump, just the term. Kamala is at a six. Now, if you aggregate their full names too, they both are at a four. So Donald Trump would be at a six. Now, if you aggregate their full names too, they both are at a four. So Donald Trump would be at a 39. And then, if I did, I did Kamala and Harris as two separate terms, which is 16. So that brings her out to 20. And that brings Donald Trump out to almost 40.
Speaker 2So he's double. Double the search interest, but it's because he's giving, so Obviously, none of this is positive, all positive for both of them.
Speaker 1But just to give you an idea.
Speaker 2Yeah, this is stuff we're just looking at, but I think part of the reason why he's being searched significantly more is because he's putting himself out there in these new age ways that you get these people who are coming on and being like, hey, I want to create a video of this video that Donald Trump was around, but you're not seeing enough videos, I think, of Kamala Kamala for that kind of stuff to happen. Right, because she's not doing the podcast interviews, she's not doing those things, whereas I can get on and be like, hey, did you just hear what Theo Vaughn just said about Donald Trump and people like that kind of, that kind of content creation there's far more virality around that, for sure, totally now there's also on the flip side.
Speaker 2We've been talking really positive for like, like you know, positive in the sense of like he's getting smart, he's getting a lot more reach yep. The negative is, this is in this is he's being put in so many more situations to say something that which he has a.
Speaker 1he has a history of saying things that are very dumb at times, which is generally, and when I say dumb, we're not taking a political stance here. What we're saying is stuff that can always be misconstrued, whether you believe it or not, stuff that's offensive or deemed as offensive.
Speaker 2Yes.
Speaker 1It's just, he's a polarizing figure for sure, and the debate's still out on whether he does that on purpose or not yeah like. Is that just who he?
Speaker 2is and he talks like that?
Speaker 1or does he do it because he knows it creates those moments?
Speaker 2yeah, so the con right, the pro is, but we don't want to dwell into like intentions.
Speaker 1We're trying to just look at strategies, the.
Speaker 2The pro is that you've got more chances to go viral and, it seems, now you also have two assassination attempts on the man which is going to lift.
Speaker 1Well, the highest peak of interest in him was right after the first assassination attempt, so that's going to obviously and then there was another assassination attempt this month, recently, yep.
Speaker 2But it also puts you in a scenario where, like you said, you could say some really off. He could say some off-colored stuff that could. Right now there's. There's this uh thing going on called uh trump derange syndrome. Is that what it is?
Speaker 1tds derangement syndrome.
Speaker 2Yes, where people are so engulfed in how he says and what he says, things that they just cannot get past it.
Speaker 1Right? Well, yeah, because he's so polarizing with the way he presents it.
Speaker 1Yeah, it can be a great example of that polarization, which, from a branding perspective, let's just assume he's doing it on purpose. Sure, for a moment. Okay, yeah, so for our listeners, what he does if this is on purpose is it's really smart from a marketing perspective, because you draw this line in the sand and then it calls all of this attention to this thing Because, for example, he said they're eating the cats and dogs and everyone said that's crazy, that's stupid, right? There's not a ton of evidence out there that they're eating cats and dogs? There's not.
Speaker 2Evidence, meaning you've got footage of somebody actually in the act of doing it.
Speaker 1As far as I know, I don't think there is any footage of it happening in Springfield Ohio, but what it did is it created this moment, this polarizing moment where people now are investigating, well, what are the impacts of what he's saying? And there's negative ramifications, there's positive, whatever you believe. But the point is, if he does that on purpose, some people claim he does, because what it does is it creates these moments where people go, oh, let's draw the line in the sand and fight each other over it, and from a marketing perspective, we talk about that all the time. Let's draw the line in the sand and fight each other over it and from a marketing perspective, we talk about that all the time. Like, you draw a line in the sand. We're not saying to like, just make something up, but what we are saying is hey, there's these moments where you can really galvanize people around your cause and you can do it in a way that like that's kind of a clickbait way to do it Right.
Speaker 2It. When you draw a line in the sand, it forces you to take a side. Yeah Right. So the moment you start saying polarizing things, I hate such and such, you're an idiot. If you do that, you know what I mean. You start to draw this line in this. So, for example, I hate reality TV, show TV. You either like it or you hate it. Now, so which?
Speaker 1side are you going to pick?
Speaker 2definitely hate it right? Are you team trevor? Are you team mark?
Speaker 1don't watch reality tv. People right and it's.
Speaker 2But you have, you have to start to do it. So I for sure polar we had. I mean, I know we talk about this all the time, but that was like one of the things that, uh, that leo olsen guy said is like draw lines in the sand, like say polarizing things, he says. I think he put it as create an enemy create an enemy. Create an enemy and like who's your enemy and go against it.
Speaker 1Is it against? Another brand or is it against a?
Speaker 2is it against a belief system?
Speaker 1Like, for example, we're consulting right now with someone who just went through this exercise of creating an enemy and it right now with someone who just went through this exercise of creating an enemy and it was beautiful to see it play out of like, okay, this is what we're attacking and this is why, yeah, because a for them it was like hey, we just have a better product period, so why aren't we going after these people that have an inferior product totally, but are out working us from marketing?
Speaker 2have more dollars than us, more so yeah.
Speaker 1So it's like why, why don't? Why aren't we doing anything that galvanizes anybody? Or why don't we turn this into a movement against? Hey, that's a crappy product.
Speaker 1Here's why literally yeah this is like a terrible product for you yeah, here's our solution for it. And it's like, yeah, do that, more people should do that. If you have a terrible product for you yeah, here's our solution for it. And it's like, yeah, do that, more people should do that. If you have a good product and you can stand by it, then you should run comparisons Like you should educate people on why your product is better.
Speaker 2And maybe that's, maybe that's.
Speaker 1And I've heard some people say oh, us for STEM ads. Like some Twitter, people say Bush League, bush League, us for STEM ads like some Twitter people say Bush League, Bush League. I've seen us for STEM ads work phenomenally.
Speaker 2I love them especially if you're the underdog, yeah Right, like if you're going up against I don't know let's say you're going up against Nike you will never have. Like if I'm an emerging shoe company and I'm going up against Nike, like there are people who Unless, for some reason, your style is just the best thing in the world, that nobody yeah, but there are running, there are athletic.
Speaker 2I won't just say running because I know you and me got in an argument about, you know, nike being a running company versus just an athletic. So like, let's just say athletic shoes, right, okay, there are savant, like athletic savants, who are like Nike's garbage, like they're like this is a group of people who think like I can't, like they think that Nike's just for the like, the beginner, the greenie, whatever you want to call them.
Speaker 1Like runners.
Speaker 2Yes, runners and basketball athletes anyway. So they, they want to go for these like people who are creating stuff that's a little bit more specialized, you know. So you could. You could turn nike into that enemy right and you are immediately going to identify with those people who've drawn a line in them, sand in the sand for themselves, and you might actually start to educate other people to be like wait, I just thought nike was awesome well, yeah, and also just the the very simple fact that if you're a nobody, then then why should anyone care about you?
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1The easiest way for someone to care about you is if you say, hey, this is why I'm better than what you've been using.
Speaker 2Totally.
Speaker 1It's the easiest, quickest way to do it.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1And you galvanize people for sure.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1So, but anyways, going back to the subject, it's this new age approach versus the traditional approach. I don't think one's wrong, but I do think it's interesting. It'll be interesting to see how this election plays out over the next couple of months, because, hey, they're going to start spending more ads in ads over the next 40 days. Because what are we 45 days out?
Speaker 2Something like that, yeah.
Speaker 1So ad spend will go up, cpms will go up for sure I think it'll affect.
Election Campaign Marketing Strategies
Speaker 1They're gonna spend the most in swing states. However, let's start looking at how much they're spending over the next couple weeks. We want to do like an election update of how much they're spending each campaign. Yeah, meta TikTok how they're spending it, and we're trying to aggregate these results too, and maybe we can predict who the winner will be before, just based off of like some kind of analysis. Right? What are the total amount of impressions that Trump gets from people on Twitter, for example?
Speaker 2And we'll just have to like.
Speaker 1How many does Harris get?
Speaker 2We'll make our predictions of just what we think also based off their marketing campaigns.
Speaker 1Yeah, right. Well, that's all it'll be. Is like marketing campaigns plus.
Speaker 2Plus the somewhat data you can gather, can we?
Speaker 1aggregate data, that's not surveys and polls.
Speaker 2Yeah, because we know that those can be misleading, because we already see the polls. Yeah. And there's predictors out there. How often does somebody say somebody's up this high, but then the other person ends up winning and yeah.
Speaker 1But it'll be interesting to see how these play out, because Harris does not have a lot of FaceTime but on the flip side she but she has a control. She controls narrative of when she does have it.
Speaker 2Well, not only that, but she also. I was just thinking about this. She doesn't have a lot of FaceTime, but maybe because she doesn't need it as much, Because when you add all the media outlets together, there's really only one. That's against her. I mean, that's verifiably true, yeah, yeah right, and I don't think that's a hey Trevor.
Speaker 1You're biased, no, that's like if you look at the coverage of one versus the other Exactly.
Speaker 2Yeah, so does she not need it as much because she's got these seven media outlets who are doing it for her and that's part of her strategy, is it?
Speaker 1part of it. I don't know, see, but that's again like how many people watch those networks? Now, you're right, and are those swing voters like, does it matter totally? Is she getting the message out? Is she showing who she is?
Speaker 2because right now it's like surrogates that are talking for her well, the polls are already out that those most every media outlet, both left and right is, are down, yes, right they're down year over year. But when you add all of them together, sure right?
Speaker 1sure it. Sure it matters, but that's not again. That's the question.
Speaker 2Exactly. I'm not saying this is the right thing to do for her, for her.
Speaker 1I look at her and I say like if I was consulting her I would say we live in the day of TikTok and Instagram. The news cycle is so fast it doesn't matter if you say something that can be misconstrued or whatever. What matters is that you are top of mind.
Speaker 2Yes, I agree, I totally agree. Like I said, I say whatever you want about him. I'm not sitting here saying that Donald Trump is the best guy. I'm not saying that at all. I know what you're saying.
Speaker 1I'm just sitting here saying that Donald Trump is the best guy. I'm not saying that at all, but I am saying the man, but I've said this since. He knows how to get attention and control attention. I said this in 2020.
Speaker 2Now I can say it a little bit more freely, without people wanting to cancel and kill me, but I've always said that Trump is a marketing genius.
Speaker 1I've always said it. I'm not saying that you don't build what he's built without being a salesman a great salesman and a great marketer.
Speaker 2He's doing it because, guess what, everyone talks about him, even the people that hate him.
Speaker 1Well, his name is always top of mind, yeah it is, I mean you just look at Google Trends From a political perspective, though, in 2020, sometimes being top of mind can be negative, Of course it can. Not all press is good press Now some people argue that, but in a political campaign, that's a little different right, because, like you, have to win over a certain amount of people For sure. However, just from a marketing perspective, yes, he's. I think the Trump campaign has been interesting to watch because of all the podcasts, because of all this like new age gorilla stuff, and that's really where a lot of the attention is now. Like Logan Paul, think about how much attention that guy gets. Totally.
Speaker 2A lot.
Speaker 1On a daily basis. He gets more attention than I would say Taylor Swift does. People listen to Taylor Swift's music On a daily basis. Yes, but on a daily basis, when taylor's doing something important? Probably not right yeah but on a daily basis, like people tune into that group of people, yeah, every day, every other day, weekly, yeah, and hear them and watch them well, same with the theovan, but theovan one was brilliant liken, because you've got two people who say the craziest stuff in the world on a podcast together.
Speaker 2Yeah, Right, yeah, that's true, like everything that comes out of Theo Vaughn's mouth is viral.
Speaker 1And from a marketing perspective, I just think it'll be interesting to see how the elections play out. This isn't like a direct comparison to business, but what you can take from a business perspective is trump is always top of mind. There's a lot of advertising spend that's going into this campaign. Like, so you have to spend ads. Ads are important. Usually who spends the most in ads is favored because they're top of mind. Is his approach of getting virality and going down these other paths? Is this going to getting virality and going down these other paths? Is this going to sway voters? Sway voters away for him, away from him, and it'll be interesting to see and for businesses, is that the approach that a lot of businesses need to be taking too? Do you? You have to spend ads like that's just what it is sorry. Yeah, like business is hard, ads isn't a silver bullet, but like you have to be in the ad game. But is there a way to get like an undercurrent of attention?
Speaker 2A good example of this right now. Have you, have you heard about what Nutter Butter is doing with their social media?
Speaker 1Yes.
Speaker 2Because of you. Just look at this, because Nutter Butter just recently, they're up to 615,000 followers.3 million likes, but everything is getting 7 million, 2 million, 1.8 million. But just look at how crazy this is like. What is this?
Speaker 1it's the weirdest who took over their account.
Speaker 2All right, it's some gen z kid, you know that just. But I'm bringing this up because the question I have for nutter butter well, this goes back to not all attention is good attention just because you can gain attention. And this is what trump has got, what's gonna have to which we'll see play out exactly what we'll see play out or not, is he definitely has more attention than kamala?
Speaker 1yes, he does the question is does that?
Speaker 2translate and translate sales or, in his case, votes whereas in in nutter butter's case, they are getting the attention of everyone and also the other thing that's happening is people are coming out and they're giving their take on like what the hell is this nutter butter? Like their people are are like freaking out about how it almost looks like the person who's operating it is high while they're doing it. It's like very like strobe-y and light-y and stuff like that Is Nutter Butter seeing sales.
Speaker 1That's a good question.
Speaker 2I don't know Now. In Alex MacArthur's words, search follows sales.
Speaker 1Yeah, so if you take trends, so does search follow votes?
Speaker 2I don't know.
Speaker 1Yeah, I think it's a little different with votes because it's a little bit bigger and more sensitive of a topic than buying a Nutter Butter.
Speaker 2It is, it is.
Speaker 1But look at this Nutter Butter, but it isn't at the same time it's a vote.
Speaker 2It is, but look at this, but it isn't at the same time it's a vote, you're not spending money.
Speaker 1When did this start with them?
Speaker 2I don't know. All I know is it's recently popped up on mine.
Speaker 1Because in the last 30 days, oh wow, Dude, Nutter Butter has gone from a 14 to a 100. On Google Trends On Google Trends I believe it 100, I mean literally. I mean they went as high as you can possibly go on september 16th and it only took them.
Speaker 2It was three days yeah, yeah, like still at like an 80 when you go down, when you go to, like last year, like march of last year, they're getting seven to seven thousand views, fourteen thousand views, and then, if you go to the last 50 videos, nothing, very rarely is anything under a million.
Speaker 1That's incredible. I shouldn't say that, but does it actually?
Speaker 2Under 100,000.
Speaker 1I mean, I don't think. When did I have a Nutter Butter?
Speaker 2Nutter Butters are decent.
Speaker 1I honestly can't tell you when I last had a Nutter Butter, oh yeah.
Speaker 2Well, there's such a. Well, the other thing that's funny about a Nutter Butter.
Speaker 1What is a Nutter Butter A?
Speaker 2Nutter Butter is a boomer cookie.
Speaker 1Isn't it like a waffly thing with some peanut butter in?
Speaker 2it yeah. Yeah this is like my dad a boomer candy for sure. Yeah, maybe Gen X, but not millennial, like we had him in our house only because my dad loved them, it's like saying it's like saying that a classic rock like Millennials, like classic rock, but it's only because the boomer parents would listen to were listening to journey, Passed it down to them. Yeah, that makes sense, Right, Like no one's just being like dude.
Speaker 1have you ever heard of Journey before you know. Have you ever listened to Aerosmith Unless you had a parent. Journey's so much better than Aerosmith, though Aerosmith has like two songs.
Speaker 2I agree, but I do like Aerosmith has like two songs. I agree, but I do like Aerosmith. Journey was like the.
Speaker 1Journey's got like a Better catalog.
Speaker 2For sure, that was like everyday music in my house. Really that's good America Boston Journey. Like that's what I grew up with Van Halen.
Speaker 1Pink.
Speaker 2Floyd, my mom was more like.
Speaker 1Journey.
Speaker 2ACDC Styx, styx, no, no, no, my dad was Styx. My dad was the softer classic rock, my mom was the harder classic rock.
Speaker 1Oh, that's funny.
Speaker 2So that's kind of how we operated in the house.
Speaker 1That's really funny.
Speaker 2Rolling Stones.
Speaker 1The Beatles.
Speaker 2We'll see, we'll see, we'll see who's going to win.
Speaker 1Yeah, we'll see.
Speaker 2We'll give our predictions here. Yeah, let's look at the trends, but yes. Sales follow search.
Speaker 1And interest and so, yeah, it'll be fascinating to see. I mean, we could even break down. If anyone's interested, we'd love to break down their ads, Because I think there's actually.
Speaker 2We should actually do that in the next podcast episode.
Speaker 1Yeah, what's really interesting about their ad approach too is if you look at both of their ads and their campaigns and their message, right Like the Kamala campaign is really focused on this idea of an aspirational future, but that's what they're selling in the ad Like they both have messages of doing something different and making america better, whatever you want to. You know they both kind of say that, but their, but their approach of presenting and their messaging is very different.
Speaker 2Everyone's saying, hey, we want things to be better. They're both saying the same thing, but one is going to make things better one is saying, hey, things are bad now, yes.
Speaker 1The other one is not saying that, yeah. And again, yes, we understand there's like political implications to why each of them take these stances, and you guys can argue about that. But it is interesting because that's the whole question, right Does fear sell or does aspiration sell?
Speaker 2Yeah, that's a good podcast topic.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2It's heaven or hell breaking down different. I like it.
Speaker 1Does hope sell or does fear sell yeah, because you look at the obama campaign and that absolutely sold this like whole aspirational yeah cultural movement how do you parent?
Speaker 2you parent based off hope or fear.
Speaker 1Depends on how tired I am, honestly, yeah that's actually a good answer.
Speaker 2Depends what time of day Morning, Dude. I'm all about hope. Guys, today's going to be an awesome day. Oh, if you guys all get your stuff together we'll be able to go throw the baseball around before school.
Speaker 1Get your shoes on, Like night it's like it's like dude, if you're not just get in bed out of the shower by nine o'clock, bro.
Speaker 2You don't get to play friends tomorrow.
Speaker 1It's like a complete reverse I think it's both, though like you just have to have. You have to have both in parenting, but in marketing you have to have both too, yeah, and so depends on the product significantly. It is interesting just to think about like, does the message, how does that message resonate with people? Because, also, when people are hearing these messages, they have real life experiences, that they're measuring those messages too. Yeah, and as as a company, when you, when you play with that messaging, you have to realize you can't just gaslight people into thinking a situation that's not necessarily a lived experience or something they can relate to, from their perception.
Speaker 2So who are you voting for?
Speaker 1Voting for me.
Speaker 2All right, everybody, I like that. Let's end there, okay. Dm Mark, though Ask him who he's voting for, see if you can get there. Okay, dm Mark, though Ask him who he's voting for, see if you can get out of him.
Speaker 1DM me.
Speaker 2All right, everybody. Thank you so much for tuning in and watching and listening, wherever you are coming from. We love you and we will see you next week. Thank you so much for listening to the Unstoppable Marketer podcast. Please go rate and subscribe the podcast, whether it's good or bad. We want to hear from you because we always want to make this podcast better. If you want to get in touch with me or give me any direct feedback, please go follow me and get in touch with me. I am at the Trevor Crump on both Instagram and TikTok. Thank you, and we will see you next week.