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The Unstoppable Marketer®
Trevor Crump and Mark Goldhardt bring you quick marketing and entrepreneurial tips, tricks, and trends for DTC business owners, entrepreneurs, and marketers. These are lessons they've learned through the years of being right in the thick of scaling dozens of businesses. Whether you have an established business looking to grow, just starting your business journey, or trying to become a digital marketer, this marketing podcast will not let you down.
The Unstoppable Marketer®
EP. 123 Breaking Down Brand Content Strategy Part 1: Americana Pipedream Apparel
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In this episode of the Unstoppable Marketer podcast, Trevor and Mark discuss effective organic content strategies for e-commerce brands, analyzing the success of Americana Pipe Dream's TikTok account. They explore the importance of storytelling, visual engagement, and consistency in creating compelling content that resonates with audiences. They also draw parallels between content creation and baseball, emphasizing the need for persistence and focus on the target audience.
Finding Your Content Format
Speaker 1You just do it until you find your format Like. Eventually you find the format that works. It's storytelling that generally has to do with a big problem that I resolved, or it's how I got somebody to wear my product, or it's I'm telling the most outlandish stories that no one cares about About surplus camo. But because I've told it interesting enough, people are watching my videos. Yo, what's going on everybody? Welcome to the unstoppable marketer podcast. It is Tuesday morning. I am here with Mark Goldhart on a lovely, lovely Utah morning. How are you?
Speaker 2Wonderful.
Speaker 1Springtime here.
Speaker 2Springtime. Yeah, I just got a rooftop tent.
Speaker 1Yeah, that's right you did. You told me that that's exciting.
Speaker 2Yes, it was very exciting.
Speaker 1Awesome. It's yard work city right now. It's kids' sports season right now. For me, every night, I have one to two things. Every night, every Saturday is one to three things.
Speaker 1That's my life right now that sounds fun it's awesome and not at the same time that's like the best way to describe it I, my wife and I, are like, oh, we don't ever see each other, we don't really get to hang out anymore. And then, but then, under the same breath of breath, you're like at this moment, I wouldn't have it any other way because your kids are doing the thing like you go and watch like jude's jude's undefeated seven no, in baseball right now, and last game he got the game winning rbi against the hardest team in the league and it was like you know, to me it's those like little things like that. That's just makes it so fun, even though you're like I really miss my wife, right now it's the busyness, yeah it's usually spring and fall
Speaker 3like.
Speaker 2I'm already busy yeah adding one more busy layer.
Speaker 1I mean, you guys, your kids are there. You need to, it's daunting. Sports is this year right. You getting them in some stuff this year. Yes, Maybe fall.
Speaker 2No, this yeah, yeah, they're going to do some wrestling this summer, nice.
Speaker 1So you'll know.
Speaker 2You'll know what I mean. Sounds like.
Speaker 1Sounds like we're gonna put theo in tennis.
Speaker 2Let's go. That's what I love, that christina wants to do oh, it's the best sport ever yeah so you here.
Speaker 1Let me tell you the other reason why tennis is the tennis is the best sport.
Speaker 2I'm trying to figure out the whole tennis thing, so we got to talk after for a handful, handful reasons.
Speaker 1Number one this is science, this is research. If you play tennis um more than just like, oh yeah, like once a month, like somebody invites me every now, but like if you regularly play tennis and I actually think this goes for racket sports yeah, you live longer, like 10 years longer. Your lung, the longevity is like 7 to 10 years longer.
Speaker 2That's what they say, but I don't know if it's really the sport. It's the sport. Well, according to studies, it's more of the socialization and the sport together.
Speaker 1Well, it's the cognitive and the you know, because you have to like, make a decision within two seconds and and perform at the same wouldn't?
Speaker 2I Guess golf isn't really much.
Speaker 1You're not reacting no reaction time in golf. So it's sports, it's not just what about fly fishing? Probably, but. But here's the. The, that's reactions. Well, well, but are you quick reflexes, but are you reacting every two seconds? Um, that's the thing, with tennis right. You hit a ball. Two seconds later it's back.
Speaker 2Boom, boom, boom boom no, I'm not saying it's more like sniper. I'm not saying it's more like sniper.
Speaker 1I'm not saying fly fishing, maybe. Maybe it elongates life three years, two years.
Speaker 2I don't know.
Speaker 1I'll go look at the research. But okay. So number one elongates your life, very healthy. Number two you can play it forever, like it's a sport that professionally, is very hard on your body Because you're yeah, but if you're just playing for, even if you're playing, you know, at a high school semi-competitively yeah, you can play your whole life, like I play every saturday morning with like 70 year olds but any professional sport is hard on your body totally number three and this is the reason why my dad loved me playing.
Speaker 1it was because, instead of michael jordan being the poster on my wall as a kid growing up and Michael Jordan as an athlete is awesome to look at, but as a human being he was not a great role model. Not that he was a bad guy.
Speaker 2Do you get what I'm saying? Yeah, well, no, he wasn't a bad guy. He just he was gambling a lot. Yeah, you know, it wasn't a great guy. He just he was gambling a lot. Yeah, you know?
Speaker 1Yeah, wasn't a great teammate to some of his people, Was you know?
Speaker 2I think he was a good teammate.
Speaker 3Just define just define what?
Speaker 1like I understand what you're saying, he wasn't an enjoyable teammate.
Speaker 2There you go.
Speaker 1He made his teams, his teammates, better. Yes, yes, it's better. Yes, yes, but like a Roger Federer, like most tennis players, were just what about? Andre, huh, yeah, you have your black sheet, for sure you definitely have your black sheet.
Speaker 2He's a little edgy, yeah.
Speaker 1And he was actually like my icon as a kid because he was such a bad boy. Shame he went bald. Oh yeah, that's actually one of the best like autobiographies I've ever read.
Speaker 2Wait, I mean, he looks fine bald, but like he was pretty iconic when. With the long hair mullet when he had the whole thing going on in the early 90s.
Speaker 1Good role models in tennis for the most part. Well, I would think of all the sports I've played, the best role models. I think personally Of the sports I've played.
Speaker 2Right when I would say tennis players are just quieter.
Speaker 1It's a gentleman's sport.
Speaker 2So whether they're actually better or not is totally up for debate.
Speaker 1They're just not in the limelight in the way, and you just don't hear about them either.
Speaker 2That's what I mean.
Speaker 1So in terms like the perception of a kid. Yes, yeah. So in other news, to get on topic, you sent me a. You sent me. I mean, we don't have a whole ton to say about it, but I thought, I thought it was interesting. You sent me a linkedin post solo brands supposedly solo brand so let me read this linkedin post here.
Speaker 2uh, where'd you? I thought it was interesting. You sent me a LinkedIn post, solo brands, supposedly Solo brands.
Speaker 1Let me read this LinkedIn post here Allegedly Where's your text messages to me? I've got you saved in my favorites.
Speaker 2I'm in the favorites.
Speaker 1Last week.
Speaker 2As you are for me Sorry last Wednesday. You're the only one who can get through. Do Not Disturb. It always says that I'm Do.
Speaker 1Not, do not disturb, but I always click notify well for text messages.
Speaker 2Yeah, but if you call me, it comes, sir.
Speaker 1Yes, you and my wife, nice, are the only one, because I know you're only going to call me if I need it, if I need you, if you need me or if I need a vent about a client, that's it. Last Wednesday, solo Brands, now worth $2 million, was delisted from the New York Stock Exchange, the NYSE. They'll be in bankruptcy before the end of the summer. Who wants to put a bid in for Chubby Shorts with me? Top line $112 million, ebitda, $15 million. So Solo Brands. They bought chubbies. Yeah, they did um. So solo stove or I don't know how it worked.
Speaker 2Yeah to be honest, I don't know if someone bought chubbies and then they bought it from that.
Speaker 1I don't know how that transaction happened solo stove, but very interesting, um, very interesting what's happening maybe with some of those brands. We don't have a whole ton of insights, but Well on March 14th, you know.
Speaker 2According to Retail Dive, it said that the company issued a going concern statement, citing challenges related to liquidity and existing debt. Their net sales fell 8% year over year to 450 million ouch.
Speaker 1So times are hard. Times are hard, which I feel like we have this conversation every week, so we're not going to dive into it, but the, the, I think the point, the reason why I wanted to bring up chubbies is the only one performing their portfolio too the only one I wanted to bring up was uh, or?
Speaker 1the reason why I wanted to bring it up was just to show like it's not just the small brands, but it's the big brands that are getting hurt too. Right, and what sounds like is debt oftentimes falls within the opex side of things, and that's a huge thing that we've talked a lot about, which is, you know, hey, in trying times, most people want to cut their marketing. Hey, let me find a cheaper media buyer. Hey, let me spend less here on marketing, when in reality, I would say, hey, find a way to squeeze your OPEX before you start cutting the hand that feeds you. So anything else you want to say to that, before we jump into what we wanted to discuss today, yeah, I think the other thing is just.
Speaker 2it's interesting. I think a lot of people that listen to this podcast don't have to worry about what Solo Brands is going through. Sure, you're probably not doing $450 million in total sales last year as a guy, as a company or an umbrella yeah but it does beg the question right like what is, what is the goal of an e-commerce company?
Speaker 1it's a great question. I think most people would say to grow and to sell.
Speaker 2Exactly like. I want to sell, I want to get acquired, which is great. It worked out for chubbies really well.
Speaker 1Totally.
Speaker 2But this might seem a little like Jekyll and Hyde from our last conversation, but if you listen to our last podcast, it was very. We were very pro growth yes like you have to be growing yes but there's a caveat with that, which is like it depends on what your business goals are. But I think a lot of people put the cart before the horse, right and like they just say, we want to grow at X percent, yeah, before realizing what kind of horse they need to get to actually pull that kind of cart.
Speaker 3Yeah.
Speaker 2And a lot of what we talked about last week was hey, if you want to grow and if your business relies on growing which most businesses do to some extent, just depends on what your goals are, yeah Well, do you want to get acquired eventually?
Speaker 1and if so, for how much?
Speaker 2too right like you're going to play a very different game than if it's like, hey, I want to be, I want to serve this subset of an audience right, because, like when you're talking about public companies generally, you're talking about pretty big Tams.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2Right, yeah, so If you're talking about a big tam, total addressable market then yeah, it's just totally different yeah but if you're, if you're doing, let's call it Baby shoes, you're doing, let's call it baby shoes. Like it is, like it is, but it isn't yeah, not a billion dollar tam.
Speaker 2I mean I'd say billion dollar sure but but a very hard, oh yeah, okay but, if you're sure, billion e-commerce company amongst many, yes, how do you get to a billion? Sure, but it's gonna be, you know, and maybe depending on, like, your unique Selling proposition, like it's a little, yeah, different. So just just know, when we, when we get adamant about things like, just remember, zoom out, like we talked about last week. Zoom out, like what, what is the actual goal here?
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2Yes, if you're not growing as a business, you're probably not going to be around super long.
Speaker 1But define what growth is right. You don't have to be growing, you don't have to be 10xing, you don't have to do 50% every year. Yeah or yeah or yeah you don't have to, yeah, you can. If you don't have to, yeah, you can. If you don't grow, yes, you will become extinct Eventually. Eventually, that's just Absolutely, but you know, this happened here, that's a universal law.
Speaker 1Yes, you happen here. This happened here in Utah. Like. So Utah is a big e-com hub and there were tons of brands that just like what would you say? Between 2014 and 2018, that started and just they became like the darlings of utah and and darling e-commerce companies in a lot of ways but, then just kind of dissipated and a lot of it dissipated because they tried to grow too fast, like like 30 growth year over year wasn't good enough, and so sometimes when you make and full disclosure.
Speaker 2we very much were in that kind of train of thought. Oh yeah, for sure, in 2016, 17, it was like, hey, let's just grow. But part of that though just to give everyone a little grace here who was going through business at that time it seemed a lot more doable because costs were so cheap with ads, sure and as of the organic reach well, and you didn't have the creator economy that was as much in play.
Speaker 1You also didn't have, like Alibaba and all these things that have made it so much easier for competitors to come in. So even though there was competition it was it was significantly less back in 2018 than it is today right.
Speaker 2Yeah, it was just like a brand new tree. There wasn't any moss on it, there was nothing like living off of it, it was just like growing straight towards the sky. Yeah, uninhibited.
Speaker 1Well, so that's that. So that's not what we want to talk about today. We've already gone into that, we've already gone into that, we've already dove into it.
Speaker 2Yeah, but I just want to preface that with this conference, conversational Conversationist.
Speaker 1Conversation. Okay, move on.
Speaker 2What do you? We did talk a lot about who succeeded back then, and it had a lot to do with organic content totally, which is a great segue which the organic content game has changed, changed significantly in 2018. Pretty pictures yeah which, depending on your brand, that might still work, but probably not yeah, the picture, pretty picture.
Speaker 1Game works when it's very unique. Yes, right, but it's not that same. I always game works when it's very unique. Yes, right, but it's not that same. I use it.
Speaker 2It's like the pastel flat lay you know Well, basically, are you high fashion or are you not?
Solo Brands and Modern Business Challenges
Speaker 1Model in front of a really cool setting.
Speaker 2Yeah.
Speaker 1Like that just all blends in, that's all noise. Yes, like, did that come from anthropology? Did it come from Nordstrom? Did it come from, you know, boutique A here?
Speaker 2Boutique B yeah.
Speaker 1I don't know, maybe all of the above.
Speaker 2Probably not so. Okay, so, speaking of, okay, so what has changed?
Speaker 1Who's winning? We want to show you guys some winning, yeah, okay. So, yeah, let's, let's preface this. So I get a ton of questions on my personal social media, which ties into the podcast, into our overall right. My personal social media is essentially marks like that's kind of how we operate things together, and One of the biggest questions I get from everybody is like okay, I do not see anything on there, though, so if you do want to talk shit on me, you can DM him. I will defend you though.
Speaker 1I will not see it. I get a ton of people who are saying, oh, what should I do if I'm this company? Or, oh, can you give me some good examples of brands that are doing organic right, and we figured, you know what. We talk a ton about organic all the time and how important it is and how people suck at it and how people should be doing better, and sometimes we feel like we're beating a dead horse where we're like hey well, we're not really giving you any.
Speaker 1Yeah, we thought, hey, what if we? In order for us to still talk about it. What if we start taking brands that we discover and they're not going to be the brands that everyone else talks about, the brands that everyone else talks about, Just to let you know, I hear all the you know social media gurus. Look at what Chipotle is doing, Look at what Ryan air is doing. Like, those are like your two, like, go to the biggest brands. I, we don't care about those people. Those are the easy ones for you to find.
Speaker 1We're we're talking about people that you've, if you've heard of them that you can hopefully be able to replicate they're. They're most likely in a very similar, um, size of business that you were, or at least at one point were, and this is the thing that catalyst and took them to another level, Um, so hopefully there are brands you haven't heard of. So, with that said, we'll pull it up on the screen. But also, if you're watching, highly recommend you watch this YouTube. So, if you're watching this by, or if you're, if you're listening to this, this episode you need to watch. So so you got to go to YouTube. You got to go to the unstoppable marker podcast, um, because we're going to be showcasing these videos. I came across the Americana Pipe Dream Apparel Company and I've like fallen in love with this TikTok account. It's like unreal. So I sent this to Mark last week, was it? You want to give them, like a rundown of what this company is?
Speaker 2It's a military surplus company.
Speaker 1Which means what?
Speaker 2They sell. It's like a giant. It's a giant second-hand shop of it's not always used stuff, but it's just like surplus stuff from like military-type outfitters. Yeah, so stuff that maybe so, like tents, canvas.
Speaker 4Pants knives.
Speaker 2Jackets yeah, canvas like canvas jackets yeah. That the military issued in 1985 and it's been sitting in a warehouse for like 20 years.
Speaker 1yeah and or I have no idea how they buy it, but they, you know, they probably just like bid on something yeah, it's just stuff that people find in boxes and they're probably like, hey, let's get rid of it sell it for pennies on the dollar yeah you know, and then you guys turn around and make a big profit on it and I think they're doing relatively well.
Speaker 1When I looked up, uh, their revenue numbers, I can't remember off the top of my head, but I wanted to showcase a couple videos and, and I want to break it down, um, the first one I have to do is just like the hook just says the word the talabans.
Speaker 2All right, so let's watch the here, the one to the left.
Speaker 1Yeah, the one to the left. Oh, but this dude's a legend. All right, let's watch this here.
Speaker 3The Taliban's favorite shoe, the Service. Cheetah Service is a shoemaking company based out of Pakistan that started in World War II when they began manufacturing boots for the British military. Since then, they've expanded their lineup to include anything from work boots to running shoes and, of course, the white cheetah high top sneaker. During the NATO occupation of Afghanistan, us troops were told to be on the lookout for anybody seen wearing a pair of these cheetah high tops, because they were most likely members of the Taliban. White cheetah high tops back in stock at AP sizes 7 through 13.
Analyzing Americana Pipe Dream's TikTok Success
Speaker 1So so like let's break this down. Like that video has 1.9 million views 1.9 million views, 169,000 likes, 1600 comments, 23,000 Saves, 10,000 shares. Um, what do you like about this like? Why did it? Why are you thinking it's getting that Outside of the hook? Because the hook is crazy? You say anything about the Taliban's favorite shoe or something like that. That's just a wild.
Speaker 2It is a wild hook, but what they do well is A. They're using Interesting transitions and zoom ins and zoom outs, so editing is really good. So the editing is real and if you look at all their videos, they do a really good job of this right like they'll have like interesting backdrops that they'll swap in and out like little animations that they put into it. So, yeah, they're keeping it catchy throughout the entire because, like, what he's saying and how he's saying it he's saying and how he's saying it he's not that no offense.
Speaker 2He's not giving it with like a ton of gusto. Sure, in most of his videos he's not. It's not like he's this big. In fact he's more dry. Yeah, he's really dry. He's not like this big guy. I don't know Big acting type personality, he's just kind of chillin and hanging out, but it's like, look, he changes the position that he's in a few times. Like, if you go through the video, you're gonna see him like standing. You're gonna see him sitting Right like that interesting zoom out. See how I like that it cuts him so it keeps you at the back to the front.
Speaker 2Yeah. Anybody keep going and then it goes in and then you're gonna have another one of. But if you see that first transition we talk about this a lot with people is that that happens usually within one to two seconds.
Speaker 1Yeah, and then that's him like on a different step, now set back. So I think the editing's good. And so he does this a lot. I think like oh, whoops, I got my. Uh, I've been on TikTok for too long today. Um, I like. So I think there's a lot of visual hooks to it as well. Right, he is dressed somewhat like Taliban-y.
Speaker 2Well, yeah, his outfit is interesting and funny yeah.
Speaker 1Um.
Speaker 2So I think they he crushes it with visual hooks but I think the most important things is what's really really cool the homie's just on a staircase.
Speaker 1Is he? I think the reason why he crushes it is because he's telling interesting stories. He definitely is. So he's taking. He's taking something like. He's like he's telling a story about how these shoes that the Taliban wore like would you have ever thought you cared about that story? Uh, no, would you have?
Speaker 2ever thought you cared about that story? No, but it's interesting.
Speaker 1But it's interesting, right, and so you have one. I think you have people who just fit this world of like you know, kind of more military, you know, I don't know, it's more of your man's manny type, person, camper, whatever their audience is.
Speaker 2I don't even know Like at this point with Gen Z.
Speaker 1This could just be, yeah, a fashion thing for sure gen z girls could be into this too, yeah but I think that I think that's where, so let's go to another. Another one here how much did world?
Speaker 3war ii german camo impact. Post-war militaries well, it's a lot actually. Today we're going to be talking about taz 83 alpenflage at the end of world war ii. The germans thought that it might be.
Speaker 2But if you notice he uses in the editing right Like, yes, the storytelling, for sure, but the way he keeps people visually engaged even though he doesn't have a lot to be showing.
Speaker 2Sure yeah, he's in the same spot, I think that's the trick that TikTokers have figured out is in your strategy. If you are not cutting every second, almost you're going to miss out on on view length. Yeah, and that's what we see running ads. Right, the more you're cutting something up. And when I say cutting it up up, it doesn't necessarily mean a full transition to a different scene. It's just like zoom in, sure, zoom out. Yeah, right, like there's something visually happening. There's like a set, like a caption.
Speaker 2It gets really big yeah right, the captions become colored and big and then and then go back down, depending to like to emphasize a word. Yeah, yeah, like that's what we're talking about, like creativity, and in the the process yeah, it's just different, because this guy's in a warehouse right now and, like this thing has 110 000 likes yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1And this one had I can't remember how many views, but a couple, a couple million maybe, but so a stories are interesting what's really cool about this when you say stories but he's keeping you visually engaged through the process, totally.
Speaker 1I love that. Like it's funny Cause you've thought you've kind of focused more on the editing, the jumping, the back and forth, and like my big takeaway was not not not that you disagreed with the stories, but what I think is really cool is is I think a lot of people, a lot of brands, have a hard time. Um, they have a hard time justifying the content they create because they're not talking about the product. So like if, if it, if it's not product focused, they think it's not going to sell. So like, if a video doesn't have anything to do with the product or whatever, that brands just get like caught up and and and I, if you're listening to this, I don't know if you feel this way, but I've I've heard this from time and time and time again from brands is that they're like well, we have to sell the product if we're creating content around it.
Speaker 1Where what's happening right now, especially on Tik TOK, is that that just doesn't work. Like talking about your product over and over and over again, selling, selling, selling. It's the old way that we talked about the pictures of a girl behind a castle wearing a cute top, that anthropology is selling. That stuff doesn't work anymore. It used to work really, really well and now it doesn't. So people don't like the product-focused stuff. However, what's really cool about this? Everything they're doing is product-focused. So why does it work? Because they're telling a story about the uniqueness of the product. Correct, right, so you can have all of your content be about product. I think that sometimes, at least on my TikTok, I'm always saying stop talking about your product, stop selling the product, stop, stop, stop. But at the end of the day, you can do it if you do it right.
Speaker 3Like if I fast forwardforward this watch, and it was asking $600 for a shirt. Luckily for you, these jackets are only 35 bucks. And you can't forget the matching pants and the rock.
Speaker 1It's like they have a call to action that's selling after every video. Very true, but they can do it because he's intertwining stories on how that product came to be.
Speaker 2Yeah, I mean, but I think that that's goes back to like if you're, if you want to talk about your product without talking about your product because, again, most, most companies aren't going to fall into this category.
Speaker 2Yeah, like he's got interest, like the products that he's that he is selling all have an interesting war story to it or a tit like a nice, weird fact, right? However, the lesson that you can learn as a company is he's weaving in these stories as he's talking about and just showing the product. So if you go on tiktok, a lot of the viral content or a lot of the stuff that people get stuck on is just like somebody telling a story about something. But then it's just like visual, I don't know, like visual Addictive scenes going on like a factory line or things getting crushed or whatever you know yeah well, they do that because it'll keep you visually engaged, but like it's also the story, so it's like you're kind of
Speaker 1trying to hook you in like two ways yeah and a hot ball melting ice?
Speaker 2yes, just something like that, right, and you can, you and you can use those weird things as, just as, hooks, yeah, so if you're a I don't know, let's, let's say uh, what's a brand that you like right now?
Speaker 1I mean I like standard issue cool.
Speaker 2So if you're, if you're an apparel company, yeah, what can you be talking about while you're telling stories wearing your products?
Speaker 1You could be talking about how you made it. You could be talking about how you make it like, how you decided to. You know especially something unique to, maybe why you design the pants slightly different compared to somebody else, right? Or you could talk about a challenge. Do you remember the company? Uh, they rebranded, I think I can't remember they rebranded too, but they were called suckers. We had them on the podcast, so he would just retell this story over and over again.
Speaker 2So he was constantly talking about his product yeah, but how hard it was to make the yeah, which was?
Speaker 1it was hard candy that was not healthy but healthier, right, you know, less sugar, and I think they rebranded to. Bad mouth is what what they rebranded to. But anyways, he would tell the story over and over again about how hard it was to find a manufacturer, and it was constantly about him testing, you know, and the visuals were about him and his, his I can't remember if it's his girlfriend or wife creating this company together. And you know, he also had this story about how one time he pressed like a red button that ruined their production and lost them 20 grand, or you know. So it's. It's these interesting stories that have the product all intertwined. Yeah, is that kind of what you were looking for?
Speaker 2Yeah, and so you can do that, and then you can also tell stories about your audience. So if you are selling to I don't know let's just call it 25 year old men and you're selling shirts to 25 to 40 year old men, like, what stories are interesting? Yeah, what are they interested in?
Speaker 1Yeah, this is how we got LeBron james. Let's let's standard issue right 25 to 40 year olds hey, this is yeah, this is how we got lebron james basketball, but what a cool story everybody knows lebron, what a cool story yeah, to be like hey, this is how we got lebron, james and jay-z to wear our hoodies. Like that hook is a good hook and and the hook is like the visuals, like a slide of lebron, a slide of jay-z jay-z, and then it's the founder or whomever telling this story.
Speaker 1Okay, cool, and we know these guys, so we're giving them right. So, for example, one of the founders, his name is jimmy and he's a professional skateboarder, right, and so he has ties into fame, right. Whether he knows lebron directly or he knows his agent, I can't remember, but it's like, oh, hey, cool. Uh, you know, this is how we got lebron and jay-z to wear our stuff.
Speaker 2I'm a professional skateboarder or they had like bryce harper wearing their stuff yeah, yeah, because he's from philly yeah, exactly, hey.
Speaker 1This is how we got a collaboration with the philadelphia eagles, because they did that too, but those cool stories that have everything to do with your product, but it's such a unique story. It's not talking about your product yeah, exactly right, but it is and it isn't at the same time well, you're not just like, hey, this is what my product is, yeah, it's.
Speaker 2Here's this fun story while you're seeing my product and like cool people wearing my product totally and like why my product's cool so this works awesome.
Speaker 1This guy works awesome because he's just breaking down. You know he's telling really cool and this guy's a great storyteller too, right, yeah, he's finding really interesting stories.
Speaker 2Yeah, that tie into the surplus pants he just bought, or the so this, this is the one that I liked, because this is two days ago. It's already at 34 000 likes and if you watch it, you want to press play. Yeah, go back. Okay, this man lived alone in the okay. This is what I'm talking about the transitions you start. It's him like always this is a story about goes and do it right. Has this like nice little edit cut where he's like pasting the image of this homie here.
Speaker 1Yeah, and then within, let 's see yeah, like within, and then it zooms in and it's all within like three different scenes?
Speaker 2Yes, yeah, it's like within a second, like he's just doing these visual transitions to To hook you in. Now the story is really interesting, right? Yeah, but people aren't on tiktok to listen to an audiobook yeah like they're.
Speaker 2They're not right, so, like you're, they're not just gonna sit there and listen to a story every single time, totally so how do you keep people engaged visually? Is, a, he's telling an interesting story. B, he's using interesting, just visual hooks. And these are nothing crazy. This isn't anything that, like, you can't do depending on your budget. Like this isn't like oh sorry, like I got to go hire a high end agency to make these edits. You can figure this out totally as a small company. Yeah, it's not. It takes time. I'm telling you it takes time. It's not easy, but you can figure it out.
Speaker 1Well, I do this not to bring this into like my world here, but like, if I like I have been doing this with Like. Like, watch this here. I do all my editing in CapCut and if you go to this video, they got four hundred and five thousand views. So like, see that transition right there, cut. And if you go to this video, they got four hundred and five thousand views, so like, see that transition right there. Like, I do all this in CapCut. So I say the hook and then boom, there's a, there's a whole new transition. Right there, there's a new transition. You know, like you, you can go in and out and use different, different scenes, different jump cuts. One time you're zoomed in on a face, the other time you're zoomed out on a face. There's several different ways you can do this. I film all this on my iPod and or my iPod, my iPhone, and edit in CapCut, ipod Nano.
The Power of Visual Hooks and Storytelling
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Speaker 2The moral of the story here guys, is go watch some interesting content if you're. If you're struggling with getting out of the mindset of, like I need to sell, I need to talk about my product directly, it's's, it's zoom out, and how do you talk about it indirectly and honestly, the best way for me to get into this frame of mind is I like, think of a good book. You like, like I love the Lord of the Rings trilogy. I'm going to put this down. I keep touching it and when.
Speaker 2I'm thinking about Lord of the Rings. It's like, well, what's the actual message of the story and how do authors create the message of the story? But it's like you have this journey that gets you to the message, right, and then the message comes together at the end. They're not just telling you right at the beginning, right. It's not like you start lord of the rings and like, hey, it's about overcoming trials and here's the tldr maintaining innocence and the face of evil and right, whatever right it's it's.
Speaker 2Hey, let me introduce you to some interesting characters. Let me take you through this journey. Let's suffer with them. Let's like watch them get over things. Let's go through a journey together. Through this journey, let's suffer with them. Let's like watch them get over things. Let's go through a journey together, yeah, and then let's weave it all at the end. Yeah, totally like no good movie gives you everything right at the beginning. Yeah, right, yeah. But why does it keep you drawn in throughout the entire movie?
Speaker 1yeah, you usually good stories are. I think there's probably. I'm probably missing here, but if I remember it's like it's like three different steps. It's like let's go four steps.
Speaker 2You have a good hook, then you give context, then you give conflict, then you give a resolution and the good hook the good hook for a story generally is I care about this character for some reason.
Speaker 1Yeah, why should you care about this?
Speaker 2yeah, so I care about a character for some reason. Yeah, why should you care about this? Yeah, so I care about a character for some reason, like I'm emotionally invested into a character. Yep, right, severance. Everyone is emotionally invested into the characters of the show Marcus, marcus mostly, and Helly DLG Irving.
Speaker 2So why are you emotionally invested into these people? Now you have the way people and then the way they do. It is. There's often, you know, a book's different, but in a movie they'll keep you visually engaged. Yeah, of course. Yeah, and that's what these people are doing. Right, like a movie. A great movie will keep you visually engaged, even though you're not like totally bought into a character right off of sure. Scene one. Yeah, although there are some movies where scene number one will have you.
Speaker 1Like rooting or hating that person immediately and that's the Dark Knight.
Speaker 2Yeah like if you watch the Dark Knight, scene number one is the bank Robbery. Yeah, that introduces you to Like if you watch the Dark Knight scene number one is the bank robbery.
Speaker 1Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2That introduces you to spoiler alerts. The Joker, right. So from scene number one, you are drawn into excitement. Yeah, although you don't know who these people are. Like you know something bad's happening. You can kind of figure out they're robbers, right. But it draws you in in a way and then introduces you to the Joker within five minutes. Yeah, that has you captivated for the rest of the show, yeah, of how it's going to play out. Yeah, but it's very visual, right. It's exciting. Think about how you do that in your 30-second TikTok videos.
Speaker 1Yeah. It has to be visually exciting or interesting for someone to stick around for a story, and I think nowadays the visual is just as important as the actual story itself, because there's so much more content and so much competition that maybe just telling a story in front of a camera worked really well without any of the transitions or anything like that, and it still works for sure Like if it's a very if you're not telling any story, do that.
Speaker 2Yeah, start telling just a story to the camera.
Speaker 1But I like the idea with stories with hooks is like, oftentimes the hook is is usually the end Like hey, like we said, hey, hey, this is how we got jay-z and lebron to wear our stuff. You know, in this guys it's like, hey, this is the taliban's favorite shoe, you know, it's like it's like this you got these like just kind of punchy punchy hooks. Sometimes also a really good hook is just like you jump into the story.
Speaker 2So last night, and I'm telling you right now, your hooks probably aren't fast enough last night the craziest thing happened to me well, the last one we watched. He said this is a story about this guy who survived 20 years or 30 years in the wilderness yeah and that's interesting yeah like 30 years and done in three seconds. What does that mean? Yeah, and then he goes into the story. Yeah, that's posted two days ago.
Speaker 1Like that's not an old no, yeah, it hasn't been just gathering. What was that one, that one had like? 35,000 or 38,000 something views, but for brand accounts to be getting no that one had 252,000.
Speaker 2Oh, I'm sorry. Likes is what I was referring to. But yeah, 252,000 views on that video in two days and if you go through this guy's stuff you'll see video in two days and if you go through this guy's stuff, you'll see I mean, he is, he's consistent. Oh yeah, like he's, he's batting he's batting over 300, right?
Speaker 1yeah, like to see, to see like a 4 000 viewer like that one right there on the top right like that's. That's very rare in this guy's account. Most of them are 20,000, 30,000, 19,000, 260, 330, 113, 10.
Speaker 2And he's got some misses, but that's just called life, guys.
Speaker 1Look, I can click on most popular right.
Speaker 2So when we've consulted with some businesses, sometimes we'll bring up some strategies for them to utilize, and oftentimes you'll hear someone in the company say, well, we do that, we've done that, and it doesn't work. Yeah, and you say, oh, you have. Okay, Like, explain to me how you've done that. Yeah, like, how many times did you do that? And it's usually like we did this thing one time, yeah, and it didn't work.
Speaker 1We tried it once yeah.
Speaker 2Or we thought about doing this and like the execution was pretty bad and like they didn't do it again. Yeah, so what I love about these guys and if you just go and look at anyone who's successful at telling stories, this isn't, this is not an overnight thing.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2Like you will, you will. You will most likely fail pretty pretty miserably for the first couple months. Yeah, yeah, one of my favorite like Trevor is a good example of that.
Speaker 1Sure, like I was, I was super successful with my content early. So from like 20 to 2022, it was awesome, but from like 2022 to 2024, it was abysmal. It was like a downhill slide, you know. And then up until the last like four or five months, it's gotten significantly better. And what's great about this kind of stuff is you you don't need home runs every time At any given time.
Speaker 1On my own Instagram account, I have between 500,000 and 700,000 people viewing my profile and if you go look at it, you'll see plenty of videos that only have 1,000 views. But then you have two or three in there that were 10,000 to 30,000, and then you have one in there that was 400,000. And you know, really all it takes is a few videos a month. That that brings in the majority of that.
Barry Bonds' Marketing Mindset
Speaker 1One of my favorite lines from a podcast this was probably like in our first year of podcasting. We had the founder of seek supply, which is like a uh clear protein powder. His name is Ben Zaver, if anyone remembers. This like the episode was awesome and we were interviewing him because they he crushes it with Tik TOK and brand content, and one of my favorite lines he said was like you just do it until you find your format. Like, eventually you find the format that works. You know, uh, it's storytelling that generally has to do with a big problem that I resolved, or it's how I got somebody to wear my product, or it's I'm telling the most outlandish stories that no one cares about. But but the you know, about surplus camo. But because I've told it interesting enough, people are watching my videos, you know.
Speaker 2So you just have you seen the new Barry Bonds video where he's getting interviewed about his mentality when he was at the play.
Speaker 4Yep, mathematically calculate what a pitcher can and can't do. Once I can calculate you, then I can beat you and then and then. Then it becomes this what is beating him right? The goal of hitting is it's me and him, and if I can keep that tunnel vision between me and him and forget the goons that are around him, because in theory my job is just to hit him and be good against him. Understanding the velocity of a pitch, just a fastball. So we're just going to use a fastball analysis, because you have a guy that throws batting practice to you every single day and he only throws a fastball right and he tries to help you be really good and we screw that up half the time.
Speaker 4So I had to figure out how to master batting practice first, because this guy is trying to help me, you know. So how do I can direct that? Now? I'm going to piece it to speed. Now I have to understand what my swing technique is and then understand the velocity of a pitch and velocity of the ball. The further. The faster it comes to me, the further it goes. Right, but I don't change who I am Right Now. If I can focus on him, I already know the speed of a ball off. My bat goes a certain speed. I don't care how many people are over here, I can still squeeze it through you. It's not like you're going to catch every single thing, right? So my job is, my victory is to make contact off of him.
Speaker 4Once I do that, everything else is out of the equation, right. So in theory, I win. I really do win, even though the pitcher standing on the mound going I got you out. No, the second baseman did all. Right now, filler did not hit you, this guy. You were already out of the equation. So we took all these people off the field.
Speaker 4You, you would lose so much. It'd be really crazy, right? So now I have to redirect my brain into this tunnel vision of understanding. If I can concentrate enough to me and him, they'd slowly disappear. But I can't fight two people at once. I can't say I hit a line drive to a shortstop or hit a line drive to the outfielder and he made a catch.
Speaker 4Now I want to try to beat them both. You can't One-on-one. I can fight, but I can't fight two-on-one. I'm going to lose. So I have to refocus and go right back to here and go. Let me try to do that again, let me try to do that again, and let me try to do that again, and then we're going to play chess constantly, right? But in theory there's a lot more to the game than it is, because he's 60 feet 6 inches and he has to throw a ball with a 17-inch home plate within this gap. Well, laws of physics tell me he can only do it so many times. Even if I just stand there and never swing, he's only going to be able to do it so many times, and then, mathematically, he has to come to where I get the advantage.
Speaker 2Okay. So when I heard this interview with Barry Bonds, I loved it, because what he's saying and how this applies to business and marketing especially is what he's saying is hey, if I just focus on the pitcher right and forget about everyone else on the field, like that's all I have to focus about to win, yeah, like sure, maybe things are gonna, I'm gonna get out if I hit the ball to somebody else, but if I'm trying to fight two battles at once, like it's never gonna going to work, sure, okay.
Speaker 2So what often happens with with marketing and companies is they start focusing about everybody instead of focusing on who are you trying to beat right now and that is not necessarily beat, but who are you trying to win over? It's, it's just your, your customer.
Speaker 1Yeah.
Speaker 2And you're not going to be able to convince everyone all at once. Like, and you're not going to be able to convince everyone all at once. So when you start trying to do everything all at once and try to figure that out, you're always going to lose. In marketing period You're always going to lose. But again, then I love how he talks about there's only so much space there that the pitcher has to work with and mathematically, eventually he has to arrive to where he gets the advantage in his swing. But like you talked about, like he loses More than he, that he was winning right and everyone in baseball knows that right, like you know, you're losing more than you quote win on as a batter totally yeah, cuz like what's an average?
Speaker 1What's that? What's the? What's a good batting average? You the number out, it's like 250. If you're at 300, you're unreal, which is essentially meaning you're hitting 30% of the time 30% of the time you're hitting a ball.
Speaker 2Yeah, as marketers, though, you try something seven times and you like he said he just focused on doing the same thing Like, hey, if I just keep doing this, eventually the math plays out in my favor, the probability you start working in my favor if I'm consistent.
Speaker 1Yeah, and that doesn't hold. Can I pause you for a second? And that doesn't mean you keep. He also said something. He said something there is. I have to master batting practice. Yes, so he's not saying, you know, there's the. The old ad, the old definition of like insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, expecting a different result. So it's not it's not. I'm doing this exact same hook over and over again.
Speaker 1It's I'm creating content over and over again, using the same principles, but I'm changing things. Yes, right, it's the same thing with batting practice. It's not like you know I'm you know I mean. It's not like I quit batting because I'm only hitting 30 of the time.
Speaker 2It's I'm gonna keep working at it so I can hit 31 of the time or, and, and guess what, it might take you a hundred swings to hit one ball yeah, your first time. So to get one content that works, it might take you a hundred swings, yeah, or a thousand your first round, yeah. But then, once you figure out, okay, this one worked. How do we start thinking about this and the principles that worked with it? Yeah, okay, it was a story. It was this Like how do we dissect it? How do we start then going to the batting cage again?
Speaker 1Yeah, Mr B said it was like 1,000 videos.
Speaker 2He was cranking out a crazy amount of videos.
Speaker 1Before anything happened, like he started at like 11, and things didn't start hitting until he was like 16 or something. I mean it was crazy. So I love that, because you're talking about someone who was considered one of the best hitters ever Steroids or not?
Speaker 2Yeah, steroids or not, I mean, my hot take is everyone's on steroids, probably. But anyways, I love the mentality right, guess what Steroids doesn't help you. It might get you more home runs, right, but in terms of like it's not helping you make contact the mentality to make contact and to be that consistent over that long.
Speaker 2That's incredible, and I think every marketer should understand that concept. Yeah, I agree. Like you're only trying to get a hit off of one person right now. Yeah, who's your customer? Like that's all you need to focus on. Don't focus on trying to please everyone. Don't focus on trying to make something that works for everyone all the time. Yeah, it's hey, this segment, this person, how does it work? And that's all I'm, that's all I care about until I figure out how to make it work. Yeah, right, that's like batting.
Speaker 2That's like batting practice, like you're just trying to get that to work, yeah, with your audience, and then, hey, maybe you can start expanding from there, sure, and maybe you can start mastering the curve maybe you can start.
Speaker 1Yes, yeah, start moving forward.
Speaker 2Yeah, I like it, but you're gonna strike out way more than you're gonna hit. So don't. So don't say we tried this, because I'll guarantee you just didn't do it enough. You did it three times and decided that it didn't work yeah, roger fetter has a very similar quote.
Consistency and Patience in Organic Marketing
Speaker 1Tennis player like he, he says, like you know, of of all of the points in his career that he's ever played, he, he throws out like some crazy number of points he's only won like 55, he only won 54, but then he like rephrases the question.
Speaker 1He goes like how, how many games, though? Like how many, how many matches did I end up winning? And it's over 80, right, and so it's like you just have to figure out how to win enough and you'll end up winning those. Those wins will compound and get you on top. So I like it. Well, dude, I like this. Yeah, that's good.
Speaker 1Yeah, hopefully, hopefully, you know once again, you guys, if you ever have any questions or thoughts or like hey, how do I do xyz, feel free to reach out. It's sometimes hard for me to answer everybody's questions there. I'm a lot easier with DMs. But yeah, we're going to keep doing this, probably monthly, where we'll break down different accounts, walk through different strategies on how you could go about doing it. But we're in a time, day and age, right now, where acquisition costs are rising. We're in a struggling economy, just like you know. Tariffs alone are eating into your profits. Like you have to. It is no longer, it's no longer an option to ignore organic creative. We've said it enough. It's's no longer an option. No, and every single brand can do it, and so hopefully this gives you a little taste on where to start.
Speaker 2Boom, muy bueno Okay.
Speaker 1Well, thanks everybody.
Speaker 2We'll see you guys next week.
Speaker 1Adios. Thank you so much for listening to the Unstoppable Marketer Podcast. Please go rate and subscribe the podcast, whether it's good or bad. We want to hear from you because we always want to make this podcast better. If you want to get in touch with me or give me any direct feedback, please go follow me and get in touch with me. I am at the Trevor Crump on both Instagram and TikTok. Thank you, and we will see you next week.