The Make Or Break Moments In Vet Med

Welcome to another episode of The Veterinary Roundtable! In this episode, the ladies tell their spookiest ghost stories, discuss four very unique cases, discuss the make or break moments in veterinary medicine, and more!

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TIMESTAMPS
Intro 00:00
Devyn Took Her Pharmacy Final 05:28
Dr. Duckwall's Barn Cat Almost Ran Away 07:20
What's Your Favorite Conspiracy Theory? 08:32
Do We Believe In Ghosts? 14:42
Dr. King's Case 20:47
Courtney's Case 24:18
Dr. Duckwall's Case 26:36
Devyn's Case 29:54
What Are Make Or Break Moments In Vet Med? 33:14 (@sammycarmona)
Are There Stereotypical Veterinarians In Different Fields? 40:45 (@sammycarmona)
Outro 44:29

Transcript

0:00

(upbeat music) Happy New Year and welcome to another episode of the Veterinary Round Table, the podcast where we answer your veterinary related questions while having some fun along the way. If you enjoyed today's episode, be sure to leave us a review on your podcast provider of choice. And if you have any feedback to offer to improve the veterinary round table, please let us know.- Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.- Mm-hmm.- Mm-hmm.- Okay, where's that hammer?(laughing)- I'm sorry.- Bring the hammer, did you bring the best day in?- Stay in heaven, no.- I was gonna say the podcast server.(laughing) Sorry, I was telling you this.- Okay, let's like, I think we rotate the mystery bag.- Yes, that's what I was saying. And it needs to be spent.- You don't like the pressure.- You don't like the pressure.- A surprise, like when it speaks to me, I'll bring it to surprise you guys. But I can't just expect it as well.- I can't just expect it every time.- Okay, well then I think we should just rotate the mystery bag.- Or we should do like that.- Or we should do like that.- Or we should do like that.- Like last month.- No, that's not the rotation.- No, let's rotate it.'Cause I deserve to experience it.- You do. - From someone else.- You do, yes, me.- Okay, sure.- It's like the big comfy couch. Everyone watch that show.- Oh, yes, back in the day.- It just gets old after a while. You keep pulling things out of the couch.- Yeah, we got it.- And like, I think in your couch.- And it's big.- It's got me.- Okay.- Okay.- No, just one when I was in the dressing room.- Okay, who gets the bag next? I need like a, a, a ton to pass.- I'll take it.- Okay, volunteer.- Volunteer.- We love the volunteers.- Okay.- Okay, that was really funny.- Okay.- I'm serious.- We also, yes, 'cause I always cry when I cry.- Onward today.- Okay, we are up on podcasts.- Yep.- Reviews.- Yep.- And we are almost halfway to our goal of 100 on Apple.- Almost halfway.- Almost halfway, which means we're almost halfway, which means once we're halfway, we're all together.- Which means we're there.- So, yeah.- That's, yes.- We're at 40 right now in Apple, so keep them coming.- We need to have an answer.- Keep them coming and then on's,- Audify.- Yep.- We're going 128.- I don't think we're going, a lot of Apple's 100.- No, first Spotify. We didn't have Apple.- Harrison, do we have a goal?- I'm a lot of FI.- No, we'll just go with Apple.- We're going with Apple.- Too many numbers.- Okay, cool.- Too many numbers.- So that's 60 people say something. And I know we got 60 followers.- Yeah, so.- Okay, so, and we still, do not, we have a couple of suggestions for Devon's, what she's going to do when we get to 100.- We should just keep them to ourselves now, so people can just listen and see what we decide.- Oh, we'll see, I think they should know because then they're going to be like,- I don't even know.- Hell yeah, I'm going to do this. Let's make sure this.- And we want them to comment ideas.- What is it?- It was trying all the different dog foods.- That's a good one.- Dry and canned.- All of them kinds?- What do you mean?- I think it's like cans.- Like the ones that we have in the clinic?- Yeah.- You're four favorite.- By said, first of all, that's the answer.- It's the answer.- It's the answer.- By a textur, what do you think is the best? ZD?- No, I was just messing up your face.- ZD, but it's probably ID.- If you have four ID?- If some of us, ID is supposed to be.- And some of us in treatment, or in magic, or in the...- That would be like, I think in any way.- Yeah, you could just swallow, you don't have to do it.- I got shivers.- Oh, you know. ID smells pretty good if you're really hungry.- Oh, no.- The turkey one is a fish.- It does like turkey one.- I mean, it looks like some kind of mashed taters.- Okay, so that's an idea. There you go.- There's some German, it's okay.- Tasting food.- I'll jot that down.- Drop that down.- Take into consideration.- Yeah, we just have to come up with some more clever ideas.- Okay.- Okay.- A little mile was the other one.- Yeah, it just was sterical.- We don't even have a track. I mean, there's still less.- We'll take you to a track.- You can run around the parking lot.(laughs)- Great, you'd better gosh this. Or she could race somebody, a dog.- You know what we should ever do. Here's a, remember that video where I had to eat stale cheeses and rice fillets? Yes, I just watched that last night. Maybe she should eat stale cheeses. That was disgusting. I'd eat off the ground. I've already had two dogs.- I already had two dogs.- You raised two dogs, there you go. Who won that?- Me.- Oh, you did.- I'd be both dogs.- I'd be both dogs.- I'd be both dogs.- I'd be both dogs.- Serious?- Serious.- Oh my gosh, that's hilarious.- Okay.- I don't know, that dog belongs to a good one.- Anyway.- Okay, before we get too much further, we need to introduce ourselves.- Oh gosh, yeah. Okay. Well, every time I say say something about yourself, it's obvious.- You don't.- You don't?- So we've all done it.- I know, well, you guys saw those don.- We never said it was don't.- Okay, so let's go first. You can set the precipit.- Okay, I'm Emily King and I'm a veterinarian.- And my favorite color is orange.- Ooh, good one.- I don't like being put on the spot. I'm Courtney and what do you do in life?- I just got back into coloring and I really like it. It makes me happy.- I meant what's your job?- Oh, I should. She's the color artist.- Him and artist.- The green books, yeah.- What do you do?- Your color.- Oh, no.- You're a vet tech.- Oh!(laughing)- I'm the same.- Check out my animals as well.- There we go, there we go. We're getting there.- Whew.- I'm Devin, I'm a vet assistant. And in training, Technician.- Yes.- And school.- Second training.- I finally did my farm final last night.- Ooh, how the go.- It was proctors, like they were watching me and listening to me.- Really?- And it went pretty well. I don't have my grade back yet,'cause it was all for your response, but I feel pretty good about it now.- So they just asked you questions and you had to respond. It wasn't writing.- No, like it was writing on the computer. Like it was a question I had to type my answer. There was some math, but I feel like they watch you to make sure I'm not using notes.- Do they go into your computer screen and like you can see what my screen's doing?- So they weren't physically watching you. They were just like, "Okay, I get it."- No, there's a camera on me, and their screen recording my screen and my microphones on.- Oh, that sounds really like--- Very daunting, yeah.- There was a timer.- I'd rather just go to a building and do written down stuff.- I know, there was that option, but it took four weeks to set up. So, she's gonna-- - Oh, yeah.- Yeah, no, no.- I feel pretty confident about it.- Good job. - I'm gonna let you go.- Yes.- So is the hardest question you got asked.- There is a question. Okay, this is gonna sound bad, but there was a question that asked me to name the four fat soluble vitamins that like I kind of remember learning, but completely forget. So I guess--- I'm not gonna say that, I remember those.- Okay, so I guess I said vitamin A, B, E, and K, I'm like giving people answers, and then I looked it up after and it's A, D, E, and K, so I got three out of the four.- Nice job. - So, okay, way to go.- It's a little better.- I wouldn't like-- - No, literally.- On the camera, they could see me going.(laughing) Yeah, but I feel good about it, so.- That's terrific, that's great. Good job. - Next is my extension.- I think we start my paperwork.- You're not going, are you? - No.- Okay, no. - No.- Extrasion here. - No, wow.- Okay, for sure. - For sure. Okay, I'm Dr. Ashland Duckwall, I'm a veterinarian, and I had to run outside with wet hair and my jammies because my barn cat got out of the barn last night, and I saw on our camera, and I was like, ah!- How'd she get out?- She jumped, she jumped the horse tall gate and then got out the doll, the stall door.- Yeah, listen to me. And then I was like, it's okay, get in here. She's trotting away from me, and then in the way she came out and I'm like, it's okay, she's coming the front door.(laughing)- I don't know about it.- Why did you want her in at night just because?- I love her, she's so sweet.- This is the one who loves the rabbit.- She loves it.- She's a soul barn cat.- Oh, she just stays in the barn.- She never goes out of the barn?- Negative. But they also have a massive barn.- I know they have a massive barn, but like, she doesn't ever know.- She doesn't want to go out and like,- She's curious, but she's also content.- She's happy, she has her rabbit friend.- She just wants her to stay safe.- She loves her rabbit.- She's so sweet.- She is sweet, so sweet.- That's good, she came right back.- Yeah, do you remember what her foster name was?- Muppet.(laughing)- That's a funny name.- Yes.- That was her foster name.- She's cute.- Okay, let's go to Icebreaker, shall we?- Let's do it.- What conspiracy theory do you secretly believe?- I believe is the word.- Oh gosh.- Oh.- Holy cow.- I really can't believe anything is a whole other challenge.- Let's just change it.- Let's just say,- Okay, what is the conspiracy theory you'd like to talk about?- Okay. Okay, yeah, because like, let's just preface this with, I'm not sure I believe these.- Yeah, yeah. They're just fun to talk about.- They're just fun to talk about.- And funny, sometimes. Okay, let's go first. I think Cori wants to go first, because she's stressed on us.- Yeah, I'm not saying.- Yes, Cori, you go first.- But we did not land on the moon.- Ooh, that is a popular one.- So that's your claim.- That's the conspiracy theory.- I kind of actually do believe it.- Did we never land on the moon?- Yeah. Why haven't we been back? Do you know how amazing the technology is now compared to when it we did go?- It doesn't serve any purpose to go back.- Well, am I, our flag's already there. Is it an easy in the picture?- Is it there?(laughing) Is the flag actually there?- I don't know, I just--- We gotta replace the flag.- Why haven't we,- Is it in the universe?- Is anybody watched the show on Apple Man?- No, it says.- Yes, for all mankind. The season finale is tomorrow. Tomorrow.- Okay, I watched season four.- It's great.- What is it?- Season four has been really good.- Well, for all mankind, it's like about how like is if, it's kind of like, they set up fake history, but there's historical stuff in it, but then there's fake history. So like, as if they kept going to the moon.- Mm.- So like what would have happened?- And Mars.- Yeah.- Yeah, that's what anyway. So you don't, you genuinely don't believe that we went to the moon.- Kind of kind of not.- Like you know better but it's still intriguing to think that we probably didn't go to the moon.- Yep.- Got you.- I think we went.- Yeah. - And confident.- No confident, okay. You know how I'm an opinion?- I think we, I just haven't thought about it.- Yeah. - I just assume we went.- Yep, me too.- Okay, I really just don't think about it.- I didn't until I just read it.(laughing)- Okay.- I don't know.- Aliens.(laughing)- Just, just aliens.- Do they, do they exist?- Aliens, what do you think about them?- Mm.- I think they exist. Maybe not like as prominent on earth as people.- Yeah.- Kind of make them out to be. I don't know about the whole area 51. Like them doing procedures on aliens there but definitely believe in them.- I mean, in the universe.- You're so large.- I just think.- It's overwhelming.- Yeah.- That it's reasonable to think there's other life out there.- Yep. Probably so. I don't know. It's so hard to know.- I know.- Yes.- You never know, you never get all of the information.- No.- So someone knows, which are not telling us.- We're aliens to them.- This is true.- Mm-hmm.- Yep.- Okay.- Okay.- Good job.- Cool.- Aliens is, yeah. Oh boy.- Got me got that.- Yeah.- Yeah.- Yeah.- Where is stuff that happens in this guy?- Yeah.- It's like people swear by the D-R-U-F-O.- Did you guys see the Starlink in this guy a few weeks ago?- No.- Maybe like a couple months ago. I think like Elon Musk launched a new Starlink thing and in this guy, there was a line of dots.- I heard about that.- Colorful dots, the people thought were UFO things.- And they were really Starlink.- It was just the, just Elon Musk.- Just him, just Elon Musk doing his thing.- Yeah.- It was crazy.- That's amazing.- Yeah.- Then I never know those pictures are real. You know, it's like is it edited to start some- Is the flag actually on the moon?- Well, I only know it's real because my neighbor should have a picture he took.- Yeah.- Is it photoshop?- Well now though, that stuff, you can put people in places that you didn't, you know. So like, it's really cool.- You know what I think is too much? AI.- Yeah, it's really taking over the world. That's too much.- Yeah.- They're doing too much of that.- Yeah.- Okay, mine is that birds are cameras from the government.- Watching us.(laughing)- Wrong.- I think birds are real.- Okay.- I think it's a real animal.- I'm sure that the government has made some robotic birds that are actually cameras, but I think all birds are cameras.- Maybe some of them are like a flock.- Or they train a bird to carry a camera.- Like in important areas, I'm sure it's just.- They have a bird today.- Why do they need a bird? They wash us through our phones.- Yeah.- Yeah.- Yeah.- Birds no longer needed.(laughing)- Word vans.- Word vans, that's right. Mine is that I heard from one of the doctors I won't say in the office that someone in her family still believes that the earth is flat. That is not really round.- Hmm.- Hmm.- Okay.- So.- What's your opinion on that?- And it's called something. I think the earth is round.- I don't agree with that.- But some people say, nope, that is not true.- What do they think it's flat?- I don't know, 'cause I'm not one of those people.- Yeah, they have some pretty good reasons. I mean, I know the earth is round, but. Why do they think it's flat?- I don't know the mock top of my head.- Oh.- But.- Interesting.- Or like.- But I think here is what are the people called to believe the earth are flat?- Flat earthers.(laughing)- That was really beautiful.- So technical, that is the name of it.- Yes, it was.- I knew it was something.- Or round earthers.(laughing)- Yes.- And so there's a lot of them.- Yeah.- People think that there's a diagram and it's just like the earth flat and then it's just like a core basically. I don't know. I don't know how to describe it. But it's weird.- I don't get any of it. We should look at what they say now.- How, I just, I don't get it.- We don't fall off the edge.- The right, yeah. Where's the edge?- Right, isn't that what they used to think? The people that were sailing the seas back when they didn't know where all the countries were and they were sailing from like clumsies fall off.- They would fall off.- They'd fall off. You can't go any further because you know, the, as far as your eye, they just kept going and going and going.- I don't get it.- I don't know, look up reasons.- Yeah.- Just all things I just don't worry about.- Yeah.- I know.- I mean, either.- We have enough going on.- Yes, we do.- Okay, but it's a good topic to just play around.- Are you gonna change anything?- All right, do you believe in ghosts, Devon?- Why?- Yes.- Have you had any spooky experiences?- No, I've not had a good experience.- Oh, yes.- You have?- What?- So it's gonna sound really stupid and cliche. But it happened.(laughing)- Sounds like a story story.- Are you okay?(laughing)- So my uncles, neighbor, they don't live in this house anymore, but they did. I babysat their little girl and two things happened. So this first one is really stupid, but the garage was closed and the rake's on the wall kept moving.(laughing) Like the rake's hanging like wind, but everything was closed.- Oh, that's right.- And the second thing.- And the second thing.(laughing)- And then the second thing that happened is we were down in the basement. I should probably preface. Before they moved into their house, someone had committed bad things to themselves in their basement. And so in the basement, me and the daughter were just playing something and she stops, like dead in her tracks and just stared at a corner and said there was someone there.- Oh, weird.- I just thought it just got goosebumps.- Like it happened and I was like, okay, I don't like that at all.- I would leave the house.- Yeah, they happened on different days, but it was still like, I never would have gone back after the first instance.- Yeah.- Yeah, I would.- It was my car.- It was very unsettling.- Who is the girl?- She was like four, I think at the time, four or five, how old were you?- 13.- Oh my God.- Yeah.- Yeah.- That's it. I was gonna say, and Harrison knows the play of the story. I'm gonna tell him about this, but he was like three and my grandfather had died. My grandmother had died. And we were out of town and at a conference, veterinary conference, and my parents were watching him, so my parents went back to my grandmother's house, where all my dad's siblings were gathering, and they had Harrison with them. So they were all gathering at my grandmother's house and they were outside the door and they opened the door and Harrison said, there are ghosts in here. And my mom and dad were like, well, grandma just died, you know, to the done. He was like, no, there's someone sitting in the rocking chair or whatever. It was really, because he was three, it's not anything on his radar.- No, it was the same instance with the girl.- Why would they make something like that?- I feel like they always, like kids don't make tourists for picking on young children.- Well, I don't think that they're picking on them. I think that they're picking them out.- Because they're more open. They don't have like, they're not like, close off like the biases are close off like the idea. So they're more open to that being a possibility.- Wow.- And so it was really, I thought it was really cool. I was like, no, no.- Nightmares to see my grandpa. He was sitting in the rocking chair waiting for my grandma.- Oh.- So yeah, it was really, I think it was just really interesting.- I believe in spiritual warfare and angels and demons and stuff. Like, there's that going around us and happening and fighting and stuff. So I guess if you consider that ghost, then sure.- I'm gonna say yeah.- But yeah, like, I feel like you can sometimes feel presence of good and bad and.- Yeah, when common goes,- When common goes, just like spirits.- I guess now that we're talking about it, my sister had an experience. We, or her cat, had passed away and then she claimed that she felt like a cat rubbing on her while she was sleeping.- Oh, speaking of that, Amber has seen cats in the hallways here before when she stayed overnight. What? Like walking through the hallways.- This is too much for me.(laughing)- Well, how can I not cannot stay in the hallways?- How many cats are probably stuck here in animals? Like, you know, in Amber has seen a cat multiple times, same cat on the same night. Seeing them walk in the hallway by.- Oh my god.- I am Terry Hindenburg's office.- Yeah.(laughing)- I don't know what?(laughing)- I don't know what.- Because she feels the cat's spirits are out there.(laughing)- I mean, this stuff can get really creepy.- Okay, I'm done now.- Sorry, sorry.- Okay, I know.- It's my cat a crying, it's fine.- Don't stay here by yourself.- She's never gonna be able to do technician treatments at night now, girl.- Great, it's a good job, Courtney.- It gets really intense, so I get it.- But I think those are the happy cats. Those cats are happy.- I like to be here.- Yeah.- They feel happy when they were here.- They stay here for a reason.- By chance, what?(laughing)- This is her.- The while you made the question.- Oh god.(laughing)- Oh my god.- All right, we better move on.- Yeah, let's case collections.- I'm okay.- She's good, she's good. Does someone have water for her? Okay.- It's fine.- I'm getting water.- Can you get tissue and water?- When he tissue, he has really water.- Come on.- Mayday, mayday.(laughing) Hit the button.- Somebody, press pause.- Press pause.- Oh my god, I'm so sorry.- I mean, oh gosh.- What's going on?- Something happy.- You know what though? I've gotta go back to this for just a second.- Stop!- I have to, I never even thought about that as a place where...- You have to stuck here.- Right. Or maybe they just, like I said, I don't know if they feel like they're stuck here. Maybe they genuinely are here supporting everybody else that's here.- Yep, yeah.- That's what I'm going with.- Yeah.- Speaking of angels, they're all over the place here.- Yeah.- Yeah.- Oh my gosh. Now, that's what I was gonna say. It's just angels and...- Yes.- People watching, yeah.- People, animals watching over us.- Yeah.- They're there to protect us.- Yeah.- If the bad ones come around.- Yep.- Yeah.- It's amazing. Okay, case collections. On your case collections.- Okay, okay, okay.- You go first.- Well, I'll go first.- I'll go first.- Do you want me to go first?- No, I'll just get the saddle. You go first because then the camera will be on you while I demo.- Okay.- Genius logic, good job, genius.- Okay, so my case is a 10 month old male-nuder, domestic short and hair cat who presented for not eating great and just doesn't seem like his self. And he is breathing faster than he should normally breathe and maybe a little more raspy than when he should normally be. And the client brought him in for those reasons. On physical exam, we looked at him and he was a young cat so you expect them to be pretty active in the room. They should be up and down and at least not sitting perfectly still on the countertop on the exam table. So I knew right off the bat when you're walking in, okay, something's not right. He's just not himself. And you know how they have that sick sitting position they sit in? You know, they always like like this sit like, you know. And so I was like, all right, this isn't good. So she told me a little bit more about kind of where she acquired him and how long she's had him. And then on physical exam, he had labored breathing which was definitely there. So he was doing a lot of up and down breathing. He was pretty well flush, but he had lost some weight. You could tell that he wasn't his normal weight. And so then we proceeded to take X-rays of him and he had a ton of plural of fusion.- Yeah.- I know, it was sad, which is. Oh, fluid in, free fluid in his chest cavity. So as long as we're floating and he couldn't breathe very well, that's why he couldn't breathe very well. So he was concentrating on breathing and you know, just sitting basically trying not to overexert himself. And so we, with the technicians, tapped his chest to relieve a bunch of fluid. We got about 200 mils off of his chest to provide him some relief. But ultimately, unfortunately, there aren't great things that cause plural of fusion. Meaning that prognosis is poor no matter what the cause. We're assuming that it's FIP, which is feline infectious paratitis, which can present as a wet form with plural of fusion. But we didn't send off the fluid, but that's what we're thinking because of his age and some of his other lab findings on his workout. So he's still here right now. And the owner is just providing good quality care and loving him for as long as he can. Nice. So we don't see a ton of FIP anymore, but. If you by chance have a cat that's been diagnosed with FIP, there's that really cool Facebook group. I think it's called FIP Warriors or something along those lines. And they're like a support group for people that have cats with FIP. Because there is the new oral drug which isn't on the market for FIP, but they're using it for FIPs is unfamiliar to cool. I honestly have no idea. I can't think of the name of it off the top of my head. I know, Schmoke has had an instant. Yeah, you have to get it from Canada or someplace else. And then, and they've had some luck with treating it, but we don't have a great, it doesn't have a great prognosis. Yeah. So that's my case. Okay. It was interesting. Yeah. Especially young, such a young baby. Yeah. I was really hoping you had asthma. Yeah, right. You can treat asthma. Yeah. Mm-hmm. Okay. Well, mine is, do you want me to break up the sadness? Yes. Okay, sure. Is that okay? That's fine. We'll take a break from the sadness. Okay, so that will go on a happy note. And then her. Okay, great. So this is A. Jones patient. He's a long-term Jones patient. He's a little old, maltease, little guy. He's super cute. And he came in just as, he's here all the time. He came in for, I don't know what the problem was. I think it may have been just a recheck just checking up on him, seeing how he's doing recently. And they found this issue months ago, but they had to trim it this time. He had a nail on his tail. It's technically not a nail. It's just a whole, it's pretty much a keratin deposit and it just keeps building up. So then it grows like a nail, but then you just cut it. And so it doesn't bother him. It doesn't hurt him or anything like that. They just maintain it like a nail. And he just sent him on his way. Yeah. That's funny. So that's interesting is we see those on tails. They like to show up on tails. Yeah, that's weird. Yeah. Usually I just feel like I always pick it if I see it. Yeah, so you can just like peel it off. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how deep his was or how, but yeah, I'm not sure, but they just clipped it and do they blood supply? Because like I saw the video of her trimming. And like she was like, oh, that's short enough. I don't know. Not the not what's growing out away from the skin that you would cut. Not like a quick. Right. You don't have that. Yeah. No, it's not like a true nail. It's just keratin. Yeah. Yeah. Looks like a nail. It does. Yeah, it really weird. Because I can happen on pop ads too, right? That's not the opposite. Yeah, remember when I first started you were like, we can cut that off and I was like, what? I can't cut the pop out off. I was like, okay. I think on pop ads, don't they think it's related to a virus when the, when the, because I'm up here, the kids are really. The papal umphazard. No, the little keratin gross on pop ads that is related to having a virus when they're younger. Because bulldogs usually get it, but I thought it was just a bulldog. Yeah, I thought it just, I know a virus. Yeah, I didn't know that. No, I'm talking about those solitary single solitary gross that'll come out of it. I was talking about just like bulldogs when they have like, yeah, yeah. Okay. Okay. I'm talking about the carotid, umph, everywhere. Love your carotid. That was it. That's what I got in the hair. In the hair. Shall we keep going? Yes, keep going. Oh, I'm, oh, I'm, I'm happy to go. No, I'm happy to go. I'm happy to go. No, I'm happy to go. I'm happy to go. I'm happy to go. Okay. So this is um one of my best friends, dogs and she lives in Florida, but I feel like, you know, we talk about our animals all the time and I met this dog. So she's had urinary issues. She's an old English master named Demi and they've been dealing with that, dealing with UTIs. She's done everything under the sun. That's not really the case though. Unfortunately, she was just diagnosed with osteosarcoma and um, I think she's like eight or nine at this point, but she, my friend Courtney had said like they recommended euthanasia, like ASAP and I'm like thinking wonder why? Because yes, they're a pain, they're in pain. That she had been limping for a little bit at that point and um, I don't know, I usually just say, okay, we can give them a little more time, not like ASAP. We'll send me the X-ray. The ulna on her right front, I think is obliterated. Like legitimately one raw step. Yeah. And yeah, exactly. Oh my gosh. So they're so worried about pathological fracture and of course at that point, that's just not humane. And so I have the X-ray if we put it up on the thing, but yeah, I mean, we see bad osteosarcoma but it's, I feel like it's usually not to the point where like I can't find the cortex on either side of the bun. Yeah, most of the time we can like use it, give them a little bit more time on pain meds and give them that one or more time to digest the nerves, but oh, I'm sorry. So they're keeping her, her fiancee travels a lot. So they're just keeping her like really comfy, literally sleeping with her on her big bed and like making sure she doesn't get up and move around bringing food to her and all of that. And they're gonna use an eyes around Friday. But I'm sorry. Gosh, those big dogs in their bone cancer. Yeah, it's kind of, it's very sad. I don't know. She said she had lent a little bit before Christmas. They did remodeled and get better, which is why we always are coming X-ray. That is like the classic. Yeah, I think that's historical presentation. I was gonna say it's always osteo, it just like shows up and then you get whacked in the face with your dog has bone cancer and then they're, like osteosarct doesn't give you time to process. Well, it's always like they don't respond to remodeled anytime if you're a veterinary student or a veterinarian out there or whatever and you're giving dogs remodeled and they're older and they fit the breed and don't get a response because you think it's arthritis. I mean, that just doesn't happen. Yeah, they should respond to remodeled or lebrella. And when that doesn't happen, you gotta be like, hmm, we should probably look. Well, and I would just imagine that. And that's why to your point, why we always recommend X-rays if you don't see it improvement. I'm sure she didn't say we didn't go into detail, but I'm sure she was so painful if the vet pal pated that line. Yeah, it would have been bone pain, which is very, very uncomfortable. Yeah, yeah. Even the nicest dog will try to bite you. Yeah, that was like who we had. Yeah, Bruno. You can keep us being managed very well, yeah. Yep, big dog, massive too. Gosh, darn. I know. osteosarct is frustrating. But I did see, I think I told you guys about it at the tick talk I saw. I remember, or a new Finland had osteosarct in the Gave a little lebrella and he's acting great. He feels better. Comfortable. I mean, he's still as cancer, obviously, but it's just to give the owner more time. And he has wanted to watch the fractures because that's what happens. Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Okay. That was mine. Okay. I'll be demy. Here I go. I have some notes. Is there a stella? Okay. Okay. Okay. Okay. I'm not sure if you're old, unneutered male and Bernie's not in dog. He just a note, he and his owners primarily reside in Florida. So they were just here visiting for the holidays, I think. But he presented for a year and a. Needing blood, straining and painful when sitting down. Upon getting more information from the owner, he wasn't licking his pre-puse. He wasn't vomiting or having diarrhea, but he was very lethargic. And he got out of the car. He was very uncomfortable and his back legs were super straight, walking weird, very uncomfortable. Got his temp, which was also uncomfortable for him. And it was 1028. It's like a low grade fever. Dr. Dudley. This is a Dr. Dudley patient and she asked the owner if he was used for breeding or whatnot. The owner said no, but he was still exposed to other dogs. And she also mentioned that she had had flu like symptoms the week prior. The owner that is. Yes, yes. And that the dog was to be neutered when they got back to Florida a few weeks later. So Dr. Dudley did some diagnostics. We did a lateral radiograph, which showed an enlarged prostate with no evidence of stones. And then she did a prostate ultrasound, which also showed enlargement, but no evidence of cysts or abscesses. And then they sent out a urine culture and a brussella PCR, which brussella is basically like a dog STD. That's my understanding of it. That's my understanding of it. Yeah, it's a bacteria. It's a bacteria. It's a bacteria. Okay. People can get it. So that's why the breeding dogs. Yes, the breeding dogs. So that's why it's important that he was not a breeding dog and that the mom was sick a week prior. The urine came back, well, okay, so we started him on enroquin, remodil and gabapentin. The urine came back negative, but Dr. Dudley suspects it was a false negative. And then the brussella PCR actually came back negative too. That's good. And when we gave them those results, they said that he was doing great. He was controlled. So they're still planning on getting him neutered. And then if his issue returns, then they're going to treat it, but no brussella. Interesting. You just go through the state, you just hoard it like it's a big deal. It's a big deal. Yeah, it's a poor little disease. Especially because it's zoononic. Yes, yeah. So fun. Yeah. And I think we had the neurology or the neurologist come talk to us in our clinic and she said that she had seen some cases. So I think that was why it was on her radar too. Yeah. Usually. Because we're dealing mostly with neutered patients. Yeah. You know, bless you. And so I think the available population for us to manage, we just don't see it, right? Because we don't manage intact patients very often. Yeah. But yeah, it's definitely testicles we're hurting in this prostate. Yeah, he was uncomfortable walking like those hurt. Yeah. Yeah. Or guy. I know. Or before him. Yeah. But I'm glad he's doing better. Yeah, that's a cool case. That's a cool case. Yeah, that's interesting. Okay. Questions. Okay. What is the ugly? This is questions. Here we go. Oh, I was jumping in. Oh, do it. Yeah. What is ugly truth and or make or break moment in this field that set people aside and actually making a career out of that medicine? Dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, I guess I'm kind of confused. I agree. Is it like they get into it and then they don't like it? Yes. Or that pushes them out of the field or how do you become successful? Right. Or they don't pursue it because they find out money is not the best in it. Yeah. So what is the ugly truth that basically set people aside and actually making like keep them from wanting? So they try it and then they're like, yeah, yeah. Or that like they are thinking about it and then they they learn this truth and they're like, no, I feel like money is probably a big deal. If you get in it, I think mental fatigue. Yeah. I was going to say mental stuff for sure. Passion fatigue. I would say it's 100% number one burnout. Yep. And then to your point, Devon, money, especially based on like student loans, if you're a veterinarian or a veterinary student who had to take loans for undergraduate school, and now you have loans for veterinary school. And I like when I, you then have a salary that can't meet the, you know, the debt ratio of, I mean, that would be a reason why you'd be like, no, I can't choose this field. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm just about to feel like I got to pay my bills. Yeah. And inflation right now is not helping anybody. Yeah. Which adds to your compassion fatigue. But yeah, in terms of like being in the career and then like getting burnout, I think like where you work and the people you work with has a big contribution to that. I agree. And how they take care of you, how you're appreciated. So that's what you're talking about, things that make it like things that, well, it could make or break like if I work somewhere for a while and then I'm like, if I'm not treated or you because you may not think there's something better and then you're just like, no, I'm done. That was too much. We're not treated great. I'm sure that would make some people like peace out. Yeah. Yeah. Or the opposite if it's good, then yeah, that encourages you. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, veterinary medicine like is mentally and emotionally very exhausting and difficult. And like, there's a high suicide rate in our field. There is a lot of burnout in general and there's not the right amount of resources for people to handle it. And it's always like, we got to do better. We got to do better, but no one's doing better, which is very frustrating. And so you have to take it upon yourself, which is fine. You have to have that ownership of what you need for your life and stuff. And if you're in such a dark hole that you don't recognize it, it's just, that's where it gets frustrating when you don't, some clinic, some places in schools, just don't have the avenues or the resources to help. So I think that's, I don't know, I just think that that's such a huge issue in our field and maybe in human medicine too, I'm sure. But like, there's nothing that's being done about it. I mean, yeah, there's maybe a school counselor, or they tell you watch for this. Right. They tell you about it. I mean, I tell you, you have no idea. There's no advocating for you. And I think the people that enter the industry typically would have the characteristics of being like servants, like having servant hearts. Sure. Yeah. Then when you get destroyed on some days by clients because, and we've learned, we constantly are preaching, you know, you don't know what's going on in that person's life. You don't know, you know, what happened to them before they came in for the appointment. You don't know, you know, trying to depersonalize, you know, those types of experiences. But when they say hurtful things out of their own hurt, it could be hard. It's hard, you know, to be able to put that aside. And you know, you need to put it aside. But yet you keep coming back to like, I'm only trying to do my best. I'm only doing my, I'm trying to do my best. I'm not intentionally telling you something that you don't want to hear or telling you something. And so I think that there are things like time that only can make those situations better. But you sit and stew on them as the person handling the case or the people handling the patients or, you know, and so I think that that is mentally exhausting. Yeah. And depending on the area where you live and the clientele and what their expectations are and I mean, all of that. And you try not to take it personally. But some days it's hard to do that. I mean, you're human. You're gonna, you're gonna sit and think about it a little more when you go home. Like you're, you're gonna be really heartbroken about it. You're gonna be sad. You're gonna be worried. Like, it's just one of those things we're human too. Like in people, I think unfortunately it goes back to we're only in it for the money and we don't care about their animal and that's not the case at all. And I think that the only, the other thing too that we always, that we deal with that and other medical fields don't deal with is euthanasia. We are the field where we have to sit and decide and talk through and use our best education and use our best knowledge, resources to tell them if this, this patient, this animal's life that can't talk to us is affected or if it's suffering. And then we have to tell that to the person connected to it and then we have to then soak in those persons response their emotions to it. So that's a lot of baggage that we also take on. Yeah. Not saying that, again, human doctors, human medical field, like they, they have their own set that they deal with. Yeah, with humans, but because we deal with euthanasia and we are the ones acting on that, that's where I think it's a whole other set of mental health you have to watch out for. Then we take their grief into our own. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, that's probably all the hardest part. Yeah. I would also say speaking from my experience as a tech or a technician, another thing that's really frustrating and that can also, I feel like in certain cases cause burnout or cause you just just not want to do what you do anymore is which I get it. People are not educated. I'm not mad at people for not knowing. And I give all the credit to human medical workers because I cannot do what they do. That's incredible. But I feel like we don't get the recognition that we deserve like they do. It's just sometimes it's like constantly beats you down because you're like, oh, you don't do anything. You get to go to work and play with kids and get these all day and you don't have to like the doctors of the euthanasia. But like I give you guys the credit to but we do the after care. Like that's not easy either. We are that we talk to the client. Like so, yeah, it gets really frustrating when you don't when people don't understand like the importance you have as well. Yeah. That's another thing is just not talked about enough. And this is very and very eating. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So talk about it more. Talk about your feelings. Talk. Talk to someone. Yes. Yeah. Everything's not fine. It doesn't have to be fine. It doesn't have to be. Say when it's not there. That's right. Yep. Yep. Okay. We're done. Okay. Next question. Last question. In a previous episode, you guys mentioned the different types of fields you could go into like equine or marine biology. Is there a stereotype about or a specific type of person that fits best into each field? And these questions come from @Sammy. Carbonna. Cool name. Okay. I don't know if there's a stereotype. It's a stereotype necessarily, but I think like people that grow up with horses are more likely to go into equine medicine. And then I don't know about marine biology, but maybe like people on the coast are more likely to go into that field. Oh, that's my two cents. I think there are people who are more comfortable behind like a microscope or behind the desk and stuff where they don't have to have that personal one-on-one with pet owners and people in general. So yeah. If you don't, like I would say people that are outgoing, like that aren't necessarily introverts are probably out in general practice. Yeah. Yeah. Wouldn't you say that they're more, because they're more talky and they like to spend time with people. Yeah. So then, because that's what you have to do over and over and over and over again. I would say that people in general, I start my stomach scrolling because it is that time. People in general practice probably also like to solve problems. Yeah. So they're interested in problem solving and they're day changing from day to day. Yeah. Whereas people that like consistency might be doing like specialized practice, like you know, ophthalmologist or dermatologist or they like the same thing every day. Yeah. They like to be really good at the same thing every day. Yeah. We need to know. That's what I was going to say is I feel like sometimes the way people's brains operate, like I feel like in general, a lot of veterinarians are people in industry are type A, but they're still like very more analytical type A's or I mean, everyone's type A, but you know what I mean. Yeah. Like the just the way they look at the problem and you know, maybe orthopedics, they like more of that physics and math, right? Stuff to it. So, or working with tools. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. That's fine. Get out that hardware, those hardwares, hardwares. Yeah. Yeah. Get out the drill. Get out the saw. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I think you just have to find what you enjoy the most, right? Vast number of options you have. You like swimming? Maybe you'll like marine biology. Yeah. I don't know. Well, when I was doing all that marine work and I finally decided I wasn't going to do it, and I was with the penguins. Not struggling, but shoveling the penguins. I was like I can't do, I'm not going to sit and do research all day. Yeah. Like that is going, I will stab my eyes out. Yeah. Yeah. Now I wanted to work with that specific type of, or that those specific types of animals, but that I realized was not what was going to be happening. So I was going to be a lot more research than he ends on. So I think paying attention to all of those things. Yeah. When you're trying to contemplate what is it that? Job shadow. Yeah, job shadow is huge. Yeah. You're not sure. There's so many options. There's so many things you can be as a veterinarian. Yeah. We're men. Dry them all. Yeah. Yeah. I still would like to work with sea-like animals. I think it's so fascinating. Yep. I've been intrigued in water animals since I was little. I love them. Yeah. Yeah. You just need to go job shadow, Kristen. Yeah. I know. That'd be so cool. I tried to get into the zoo, but it was a big process. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It's very-- I tried that extra in there for college, and it was-- It's really hard to do. Because you have to volunteer in Zoom medicine. Yeah. You have to volunteer for so long at the zoo, and then they'll let you do certain things. Yeah. It's a long process. Yeah. Maybe worth it though, but-- Yeah. Yeah, about. Okay. We answered your questions, Sammy. Yeah, it's a great question, Sammy. Thank you for sending them in. Yep. Okay. Thank you so much for tuning into another episode of The Veterinary Roundtable. Remember sending those questions and be sure to follow us on all social media platforms at AllStar Veterinary Clinic. If you enjoyed this episode or previous episode, leave us a review on your podcast provider or choice. We'll see you in a few weeks for the next episode of The Veterinary Round. Stay tuned for King's Mystery Bag. Yes. Oh, yeah. I'm going to be-- I'm going to be cool.[MUSIC PLAYING](upbeat music)(upbeat music)