The Imperfect Dads Podcast

Episode 252 | Todd Millenacker of Todd'n'Tina

• Devon Neisen • Season 4 • Episode 53

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On this episode of The Imperfect Dads Podcast, Devon sits down with Todd Millenacker, one half of the children's music duo Todd 'n' Tina, for a conversation about fatherhood, creativity, music, and building a meaningful life.

Todd shares how he balances a traditional career in logistics with his passion for writing and performing children's music. They discuss preparing kids for college, raising confident and creative children, finding stability while pursuing artistic passions, and how becoming a dad changed the way he approaches work and life.

The conversation also explores Todd's love of running ultra marathons, life in Minnesota, writing commercial jingles—including music for Little Caesars—and the story behind how Todd 'n' Tina was formed. He explains why lyric writing is his favorite part of songwriting, what makes children's music so rewarding, and why imaginative songs about dinosaurs continue to connect with kids.

Whether you're a parent, musician, songwriter, creative professional, or simply looking for an honest conversation about balancing family and creativity, you'll find something to enjoy in this episode.

Topics covered in this episode:

  • Fatherhood and parenting
  • Preparing kids for college
  • Balancing a career with creative passions
  • Children's music and songwriting
  • Todd 'n' Tina
  • Running ultra marathons
  • Living in Minnesota
  • Commercial jingle writing
  • Little Caesars music
  • Lyric writing and the creative process
  • Music for kids
  • Dinosaurs, imagination, and creativity

Audio Note: Due to a microphone issue before recording, portions of this episode were recorded using Todd's laptop microphone. You may notice occasional changes in audio quality, but the conversation was too good not to share. Thanks for listening and understanding!

If you enjoyed this episode, please follow The Imperfect Dads Podcast, leave a rating and review, and share it with another parent, musician, or creative who would appreciate the conversation.

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This podcast is part of the Never A Phase Network, follow them on instagram at @neveraphasenetwork and check out their podcasts like Emo Kids Anonymous  Wasting Time Podcast Certified Fangirl and The Ska Mailman

SPEAKER_02

Welcome to the Imperfect Dads Podcast. We believe dads go deeply about their family kids, but they don't always have a space to discuss what their life looks like. Our podcast has a space for dads to discuss the ups and downs of it and how they feel like they're holding it together. Thank you for joining us for this episode. This podcast is part of the Never a Face Network. Make sure to follow them on Instagram or go to the website NeverAffacedNetwork.com. On this episode, we have on Todd Millenacker from the kids' band Todd and Tina. We talked about being in charge of a logistics and shipping company, the ability a job can bring, kids getting ready to go to college, running Ultra Marathon life in Minnesota, writing jingles for little Caesars, how we form Todd and Tina, enjoying playing kids' music, how we find writing lyrics fun, and writing songs about dinosaurs. Before we start, I did want to mention that Todd had trouble getting his mic to connect, so I'd use his laptop mic. Some of the audio in this is a little bit louder and distorted from time to time. So apologies for any audio quality concerns. Just like one more thing. Oh, my bad. I guess first question to ask you is like, I know you did kids music. Are you a dad also? Do you have kids? Yes, I've got two kids.

SPEAKER_00

I've got a an eighth grader and a junior. So I'm I'm sorry to see the end of the tunnel.

SPEAKER_02

Oh man, how's that? I mean, you still got a good four or five years, right? Before your empty nesters and all that. How's it? I mean, my oldest is 10, so I'd like they aren't even in middle school yet. How's it feel to know like you will have a kid soon who's gonna like enter into college and high school, round two, and all that stuff?

SPEAKER_00

Sometimes you're kind of like, oh, I'm gonna miss that. But then is that natural? Once they get to be 16, 17, they're not quite as um concerned about you and they're in their own world in their own life. And every once in a while she freaks out and this or that, and I'm just looking at my wife, I'm like, where where are they moving out? I know we're not supposed to say that because we're supposed to miss them. Yeah. I'm right. It's kinda it's been 17 years for my daughter and all, like, to think all of a sudden they're gone and spend all your whole focus of your life. You said you got a 10-year-old in the oldest.

SPEAKER_02

So I have a 10-year-old daughter, eight-year-old daughter, and uh he'll be five pretty soon. Son. So yeah, we're still like in like the they still want my approval, they still want to talk to us. And I know like in five years, our world will look drastically different.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, my right now, my only son's still he's still pretty good hanging. Actually, most of my kids are pretty good hangs, but at the same time, you kind of want your space. And I remember putting on like Little Mermaid just hoping my daughter would fall asleep. Or so I can take a nap. Pull anything on the nap, and now I don't have that problem where I'm like, oh, I gotta find out what to do. It's like, okay, do I dare talk to her? Is she gonna freak out about something? But when I was 17, do I really want to hang out with my parents? No, no, so I I think literally we've been talking to our kids more these days than our parents talk to us. You know, like I thought like my parents just kind of existed in this different realm, and you know, they come back to serve me, and then it was like solving that it's finest, right? But now you kind of realize they got their own life, and even when I'm listening to music, I'll be talking to uh like my daughter about Taylor and Olivia's new single, and it's like, does it make me cool or does it make Taylor and Olivia less cool? I don't know. I was obsessed, a great gal, a girl always obsessed with Zach Bryan. And I'm like, I like Zach Bryan. You know, I'm like, what about we can? And you know, we think like, nah, I'm cool. I'm up, you know, she's fine, I gotta pull all the songs for my catalog.

SPEAKER_02

No. See, I would I always want to do like if they're like um like give them their reference points, be like, oh, here's this Olivia Rodrigo song. I'm like, oh, this sounds just like a Paramour song, and they're like, What's Paramour? And I'm like, it's Halo, and then I'm like, then I'm like, well, do they care that much? Because like she's you like I've listened to enough music where I can tell the influences, and then I want to share the influence.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, like on the playoff, obviously, has this review. Like, the ones you're like, okay, that's the pump it out left. And then it then there's a breakdown with a crazy synths, and I'm like, best icky thought. Like, yes, I play it for him, she's just like, I don't care. Albert Costello's pointed, I think he was well aware of that. And he even said, Ah, you know, there's always so many notes in music.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah. But that's where my nerdy dad music brain goes. It's like, oh, here's who they're referencing, here's who inspired them. Because like, that's what I will do whenever I listen to music is like, oh my gosh, how do I go back to the early stuff? I want to track their progression, and how do they get to where they are? And my kids are like, I like this song. And I'm like, okay.

SPEAKER_00

Sounds good. Have you ever like the song machine about um the whole pop song industry yet throughout like the 2000s, like 95 through about 2010? Anyways, died driving around with his song and he heard a Kesha song on the radio, and he went into the whole mechanics of the Swedish songwriters. He won't song machine. And like it talks about the way Ace of Bass came to be known because actually Bert got stuck in the car of Dennis Pop. Seriously, of uh one while ABBA, uh not ABBA, Ace's Bass, yeah, and on some Backstreet Boys and all these things, and yeah, the guy goes on a whole research trip to Sweden and check out Max Martin's studio and all that stuff. Yes, yeah, yeah. I definitely recommend it. Yeah, no, I go deep on all that stuff, and well, who cares?

SPEAKER_02

No, okay, I'll suggest one podcast to you. Have you ever heard of um my buddy uh Dan Nornheim does it? It's called Life of the Record. Have you ever heard of this podcast?

SPEAKER_01

No.

SPEAKER_02

Okay, so he goes with like whenever it's like a band's like 20th, 25th, 30th, or something like that anniversary of an album. He like basically does a call with them and they talk about what the entire energy of that album was, and then they go track by track to describe what the album was. So like he's had on um The Violent Fems, Big Star, um, and like a bunch of bands like that, where he's just like, Yeah, let's just talk about your album, what your energy was making it and go track by track. And like those details are like, yeah, I live for it. I don't know why, but here I am, like fascinated deeply by all of that.

SPEAKER_00

You realize also when they were doing it, it wasn't quite the uh it wasn't quite this revolutionary process. Like, I like I love the Smash McTumpkins, and then like when I Corgan revisit melancholy, I was like, wow, I was thinking of three parts. Like, don't you work? You're just trying to fill space and yeah, and it's yeah, sometimes and that's what I like, like country music. I don't go deep on the artist, and I can just enjoy it for what it is. But if I know pop music or rock music, I'll go and like read everything about the making of like I'll read like like every they might be giants or Elvis Costello interview imaginable. Yeah, yeah. I know it all, and it's this crystallized knowledge that no one cares about. I know about it, and I'll bore people with like I teach I teach guitar over at my kids' school just to get them playing guitar for an electric. Yeah, and you know, I'll talk about the way like you know, sweet chat a while or sweet child on my and I'm like you know, once I require them to click and I had to rewind the tape, and slash had to like get it.

SPEAKER_02

So if you notice when the band comes in, they actually speed up and just like yeah, mm-hmm, yeah, yeah, yeah. See, yeah, yeah. Do you did you ever listen to Dinosaur Jr.?

SPEAKER_00

I am I'm aware of them, obviously with my huge.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Yes. I I think their league guitars is like that, also, where he's just like, people are like, How do you write, how do you do this? How do you write this beautiful guitar line? He's like, no, no, like because he's not classically trained in any way. He just felt it, did the track, and then moved on. And it's like, cool, I am so much more regimented in like here's how I do a solo, here's how I do the like that. I'm not good at listening to jam bands because I can't, I don't know how to play, like, I don't know how to be in the vibe, I don't know how to be in the zone. I know how to technically do something, and that's about it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I mean everything has its purpose. Like, I'll go into like EEM for a bit and be really yeah, I'll look into it for a while, and then after a while, I just think I just need to sell a head course. Right? I just figured out I'll on Ben Mouse's catalog, and you just put up on things and you make sure you know let's say, like, oh, that's where VC does that, then Mouse does that. Yep. It's fun, music great stuff.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, that's what I do for like um whenever my kids listen to music and stuff. If like, because they've gotten really into like uh descendants and zombies and those like Disney teen pop shows and movies that like I I personally can't stand. But like, so if we have to listen to the song like 20 times, I'm like, okay, what's the baseline? What's the what's the backing track here? And then I'm like, how do I focus on this? Because if I don't, then I'm gonna go crazy because I don't like these songs.

SPEAKER_00

Julia Michaels, uh, you got an issue writing too. Do you write about a song from a couple years ago? No, I don't. No, yeah. Uh she actually got to start writing for your Disney. It's cool. I now like I've never I haven't heard it because uh I haven't had the interest, but like the Kop's thing is like I don't know. There's some there's some hooks law on Songlow songs, even like Teen Beach movie or like who's it and all of it, you know, like okay, they got you know I can appreciate good. Yep. Actually, I kind of like Ellie and AJ. I think during COVID, my kids watch it on repeat to my son will be like, that's an episode five, you know, uh on season four. I'm like, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

That's awesome. What's uh what's your full-time job? So I'm moving trucks.

SPEAKER_00

Cool, yeah. I've been doing that for 25 years, and now it also gives me the freedom to go do music on the side and got a good little office here with four or eight employees, something like that.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. I just I I talked to a guy yesterday, uh, he was in a band called Smokin' Popes, and his kids are grown out of the house, and he uh he's he's a school bus driver now. Gets him out of the house, it's a very flexible schedule, it has summers off, and it's like I I think like a younger version of myself would be like, oh, why would you do that job? And it's like it's a lot of stability. Hell yeah, that's great.

SPEAKER_00

Well, and I mean I've been in this for 25 years. I finished college and fall into this whole thing. You know, I mean for a while, you want to like climb your layout because the illusion of like, oh, whatever, success, flying, quotation marks, and that I'm just like I you work because you gotta put food on the table, you gotta pay the bills, and uh the choice of something falls apart with this. I'm like, you know, I'm going to go find a job that's no I shouldn't say no brand new, because everybody's job they have something. Yeah, something where I actually I'd love to just like walk around Home Depot and misdirect people. I also I'll say confidently, flying. Or I'm about aisle seven, and I'll be completely lying. They'll be like, that guy like that. That's the way we get it.

SPEAKER_02

You would I would want to do my next level obnoxiousness would be say an aisle number that isn't an aisle number in the store. Like, oh it's aisle 75, I'll stop at 60, you know, and just have them walk around and be like, like like I said in the 70s, right? Like that would be, but that's too much you can't do it. But to me, that would be hilarious. It wouldn't be funny. That's a good idea.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. No, uh A17. Well, you gotta find the A first, yeah, right? Yeah. I like Yeah, yeah. No, um, yeah, so it's been good. I can't complain. Very fortunate, but it's just kind of like at the same time, you're not gonna be you're not gonna find me on LinkedIn after this game starts.

SPEAKER_02

Yep. Well, I mean, because it's like I think getting older, I do I have started to realize like stability matters more to me than like the having like a career where I'm like, look how impressive this is. It's like actually showing up every day, doing your job and treating people well is a really impressive thing to do. So do focus on that instead.

SPEAKER_00

Well, I know, and that's where it's like, I don't know, it's just well that's well, that's a whole business podcast if you want to talk about it. Right, yeah, yeah. Yeah, I mean, it's sadly there are always factors, and it's never quite as easy as what you think it should be. I mean, it's like you're taught one thing, you're expected to believe one thing. You go to school, you get an education, you do assist this, and then you realize there's all these other factors at play. And um yeah, again, I don't want to get into all that because then it'll turn into something where I'll say something that I should. Yeah. Why do no, you're getting much more things are much more complicated than what you're taught to believe. And that's where I'm always like when I was a kid, I wanted to be garbage man, and still part of me is just like, again, not an auto garbage man at all. And I'm just like, yeah, I think I had it right and I've been off track all these times.

SPEAKER_02

It's it's a lot to untangle. You have like your own ego in there, you have your own like personal social expectations and everything. And if anything, hey, it sounds like you're at a place where like you're you're like, hey, I make I'm able to support my family, I'm able to have mental space to make music and like be around for my kids. And that that's that's a good value to have, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_00

Right. Yeah, it is. And especially like when you run a business, all of a sudden you've got these other responsibilities like employees and personality. And again, you've got a great setup.

SPEAKER_02

It's over time, it's not as easy as just saying my wife um works a pretty high-level, high stress job, and she always has like the moments of like, what if I just like did retail for a year? What if I just like ran a cash register? Huh? The income would not be what I would want it to be, but like imagine the simplicity of just showing up doing one thing and then going home and leaving it all behind.

SPEAKER_00

I know, and but then I know, and that isn't just a like type dream, and are you thinking like, oh yeah, I feel easy after a while, or would I I mean it could be awesome too.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, it can be.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Right? Uh with your kids getting older and everything, do you know if your oldest kid is gonna go to college yet? Have you guys started having discussions about that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, she means she wants to go. I actually and like do what you want. And I say take a year off. Um actually, I keep saying, I'm half kidding, but I'm half serious. I'm like, you know, if you go to college, and I'm a big runner, so I'm like, you go to college and you don't like it, I want to my one of my oldest to run across America. And I say, you can go and drive the van. I'll go, you're just really gonna do what you want on the day, just moving three miles up the street, and I'll buy you dinner every day. Um, you know, I'm like, that's not bad. I could be in four-month showing ran across America. Well, yeah, she's planning on it. And one many things, one Awire for her. I think she'll want to hang out with her old man and do that.

SPEAKER_02

That's cool. Well, I do think kind of like you're alluding to earlier, is like I'm intrigued to see when my kids get older for college what college looks like. Because I definitely also had the same thought of like, I need to go to college so I can get the degree, so I can go to so I can do all these steps. And it doesn't seem that clear anymore. Unless like you want to be a doctor, a lawyer, or something like that. So college I feel like has a different meaning than it did when we were growing up.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. So I mean, I mean, I don't know, we're gonna phase well page company.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

But uh, it's kind of like yeah, you're expecting and now even information has gotten so it's everywhere. Well, you have to talk and just dates me, but I just talk about the way there is like those Mac bubble computer with the blue and orange, and that was state of the year at the U of them. And like, oh yeah, it's this Ethernet thing, and now everybody's got that in their phone, and if you need something, you just look it up and it's um it's just uh thinking. And yeah, I mean, if I went back to school, if I were starting it all over again, I'd probably go to be a doctor. Yeah. Really? Because you can get the right hours, it's launch school, and you get paid well. I mean, it's like a $300 to $500,000 UH on tour. You get on school and then Brian, you also like I mean, it's a dermatologist. How awesome is that? Like why can't you get angry people about how dare you? What? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

How dare yeah, yeah. I I forgot to tell you about the contingency of dermatologists that listen to this podcast. I forgot to tell you.

SPEAKER_00

Well, energy brings me making money and uh going on expensive vacations, they have time to worry about that.

SPEAKER_02

Right. No, it it does feel I'll be very fascinated whenever my oldest is even ready for college, how she'll approach it. Because yeah, it's just a different world. It's a very different world. And um, to me, like my brother um like is a college professor and everything, and so is my sister-in-law, and I've a brother-in-law as a college professor. And they they've always kind of indicated like if you have a college degree, what that kind of means nowadays is like you showed up, figured out what you needed to do, and you got it done. So it's almost like to me, it feels almost like you understood the process and were able to complete the process, which honestly is a skill set that you use in your career. So it's not a bad thing to learn.

SPEAKER_00

No, it's not. And like, but again, once you're on the inside and you've seen it, you're kind of like, okay, I know how sausages are made. Isn't quite uh like, oh wow. I mean, ultimately, a doctor, and everybody's like, oh, he's a doctor. You know, you're like, uh funds to the doctors, you know, yeah. You know, you gotta be with a dentist, and he's just like, I should have just I shouldn't say yes, but he wanted to be a mechanic, and he's like, I should have just go back. Like, why did I do the rest? And I mean that's that's just something you look back and you figure out after the fact, which is a bummer. You gotta leave your life once and then do it again. And as a point, you try and tell your kids these things, but they don't want to hear. They're just you're they don't make your own mistakes too.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, you do. But I I do think like one thing I think like the newer generation, if you will, of parents is doing is like I feel like trying to let kids into their mental space a little bit more of like, hey, here's what it looks like to have this career, here's what it means to do this day in and day out. Where I feel like, yeah, our parents are more like, hey, I'm doing this job because I love you guys and want to support you, so let me take care of this, and da-da-da. And it's like, oh, actually, what was that like for you? What was your mental space like that for you? Like, and now I feel like parents are, or at least I know my parents are willing to discuss, like, oh, here's what it was like for us whenever we had three kids, what's it like for you guys? Like it's a two-way conversation, but like that's because we did the work to put into the relationship when we can talk about the realities of being parents, even though I'm the subject matter for them, you know?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, no, yeah, and but you know, it's commerce, and I'm it's the same thing, but they also sort of like nobody goes up and dreams of opening a dry cleaning place. And if you don't logical thing, you know, maybe there are people, but what we are passionate about like clean. Which is too. I mean, at this point, 25 years into frame brokerage, I'm not like yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, let's move some trucks today. You know what? I agree. And I I shouldn't disturb you because it's totally legit. Yep.

SPEAKER_02

Nope. And I think that's the reality of like how do is anyone end up. I think that's one thing that's like will be interesting to try to teach my kids is like you'll end up where you end up. So like be good to people, be kind to people. Because, like, honestly, I don't know what career you're gonna have. I don't know what state you're gonna live in. What I do know is treat people well, be kind to them, and be a decent. If you say you're gonna do something, like all those basic lessons that are really hard to follow through on is like you're gonna turn into whatever you turn into, be a decent person, and that's more what I care about than like live here, do this. Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Well, it's like Warren Buffett has that quote that says, it takes you worked your whole lifetime and it takes one bad decision or five minutes to destroy your reputation. You do one bad thing. And then it's also trying to ingrain the idea of I mean, how much is a dollar really worth to you if you do it under bad circumstances? Like, do I believe you want one dollar if I got it under questionable circumstances? And that's one of those things you can say only when you're fortunate enough to have a dollar. Correct, yes, yes. That's where it's like that's that's where I always you trip yourself up because you can have these self-evident truths to say, like, well, yeah, of course, everybody should do that, but you know what, if your kid's starving, maybe you're not quite as stand about the moral justification of whatever. So I mean, there's one of those things that I mean I read a lot and you just learn these things and you try and impart some of the you hope something goes through. But then at the same time, I look at stuff I thought two years ago, and I'm like, I was an idiot. Uh last two years ago, let alone a few more than that, right?

SPEAKER_02

Yep. Pretty much I think my hope is always to be if my kids are like, why did you say this like two years ago? Big that's where I was back then. If I was an idiot, uh, here's my moment to admit, I'm sorry I was so stupid that I thought this was correct. Uh now that I have more information, I'm sorry I am who I am.

SPEAKER_00

And this Yeah, well, now unfortunately, it's um in whatever you say, there's so many counterarguments on everything. Yeah, I mean it's both good and bad because it used to be so like this is right, this is wrong. And now if you dig into stuff, I like the idea of not really weighing in an opinion unless you actually know both sides and you can argue the other side stronger than what you can. It's also unfortunate because it gives me a lot of agnostic, like I don't know, use uh yep, and which is not nothing that anybody wants to. Here in the world, it's like, well, I could argue this just to be contrarian. Like, you know, that's what I always joke in Minnesota. It's like whatever it is, I'm against it, but then I go to South Dakota, I'm exactly against that. Like, whatever it is, because people are so passionate, and then but at the same time, it's like that's not the way to be either. Because it's it's not and it's your time just to argue a case, just to Yeah, ha ha ha ha, I'll get my point.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. So I I think, yeah, I I think when someone seems like their entire identity is like, this has to be right, this has to be accurate. Then I'm like, now I have to poke fun at you because like you're taking this so seriously, which I'm glad you're passionate about something, but like there's other ways to view the world. And then I also get into like the almost too agnostic, like, but who knows if anything is a red and then I'm just like, dude, that's too much. You gotta, you gotta, you gotta zoom in, zoom in a little bit. You're too zoomed out, you're too zoomed out.

SPEAKER_00

Uh I was proud of my daughter did a uh sophomore paper on if our reality's computer simulation. So I'm like, all right, some of some of my uh ramblings have worked away into the mind, and the even my English teacher was like, I don't know what your daughter.

SPEAKER_02

You raised your daughter on the matrix. You just said her, here's your babysitter for the day.

SPEAKER_00

No, yeah, it wasn't even that. Yeah, it was actually more about all this more computer simulation stuff, and then you went on those radicals, and then after a while you're like, well, why would it be? And what difference does it make even if it is? Like, I just pretty much think that was one thing I realized like I mentioned a philosophy major back in college. And when it was time to debate and listen to that, and then after a while, you're like, you know what, I'm hungry. I want a burrito. Yep. Uh I still want a burrito with some cheese and maybe a diet cup. Yeah, it'll be great. Like, it doesn't really matter.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. I I remember taking like philosophy classes in college and come to like the debate part of it, and I always felt like it was just way, it was more about ego and then about curiosity. It was always like, well, here's the have you read this book? And it's like, no, I haven't read that book. Well, if you did, you'd understand. And I'm like, well, I don't, so I don't understand. So where's the so you win? Like, what the have fun winning and not in this conversation dying right now.

SPEAKER_00

I know. And then I well then uh to turn back around to uh life and jobs and all that, it's like for better or worse, in a capitalist society, it's kind of like, well, whoever makes the most money ends up winning. Or I mean, I should say, to a point, because it's lying to me to eat and live your life the you want. Again, we get to the point where it's greed with excess, blah, blah, blah. But it's just yeah, once you get to a point where uh you can take care of yourself, you can afford the basics. What more do you need? I mean, it's like it's just a matter of opinion and what's important to you.

SPEAKER_02

I think one thing I hope to be able to teach my kids is how much defining things for yourself matters. So, like, what's wealth? Well, what do you think wealth is to you? What's success? What do you think success is to you? Because everyone around you is gonna tell you what this definition is, but the one that you believe in is the one you're actually gonna live by. So let's develop that definition because everyone around you is gonna tell you what success is. But if it doesn't line, but if you don't care, don't chase it. So just figure out what you think that answer is.

SPEAKER_00

Exactly. And and move out of my house at some point, right?

SPEAKER_02

And maybe I'd like my basement back. That'd be great, thank you.

SPEAKER_00

By the time my man just seems to be like, ah, we'll just take it over, dad. And you're like, oh, fine. Just oh that's fine. That's cool.

SPEAKER_02

That's we so we're still since our kids are still so young, like we're still at the like point of like um for us to go on a date or something like that. We've got to get the sitter, we've got to pay for the sitter and all of that. I would imagine your kids are almost to the age where you're just like, hey, your mom and I are gonna go out to dinner, don't burn down the house, and we'll be back later. Is that is that true? Is that what phase of life are in right now?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's kind of nice. Oh man. Like when I was 17 and driving, you know, so you get the weather and one kind of thing. So you're still kind of uh like uh uh you know, yeah. It's it's good in the sense if something happens, but then at the same time, it's also like my parents didn't know where I was. Yep. At the same time, the world was smaller. I stuck it in my hometown, like it was the eight-mile radius, and I didn't get on a highway or anything. It was just like that was my world. You know how the world expanded. It's a dealt one and bad. And but then I'm also gonna sit there like, okay, I figured it out, and they gotta figure out these things themselves. Right? Fly away, fly away. Something like that. I don't know. It's uh we're still navigating it. Trying to bite my lips as much as possible and let them do what they're gonna do.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I honestly I think that is one of the hardest things of being a parent. And whatever age your kids are, I feel like you experience it because you watch your kids start to take a step and you're like, you're gonna fall. You're gonna fall. Please don't do that. Please don't. You're really close to the edge. And like, if but if that reminding yourself like you're supposed to be the safe space and safe environment for your kid to take risks, to trust stuff, to know that you'll catch them when they fall, is really it's a uh to know that that's loving them and teaching them is like still really hard because you still want them to experience pain and discomfort.

SPEAKER_00

But they have to. I mean, it's they have to uh it's profitable course, that's how you learn, and unfortunately, it is. Well, still I know. So it's kind of that transition of just like letting them do their thing without being too much of an egg. Well, if I'll get annoyed by us, and hopefully, in you know, by 22 or something, they'll come back around. Yeah, maybe. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

If not, I'll have some money for charity. That's right, yeah, yeah. We haven't talked about like kids' music yet. Tell me about like your kids' band and how you got that started and everything. Well, well, actually, uh well, I've always done music.

SPEAKER_00

That was like my love in high school, you know, back in like 14, 16, always doing that stuff. And then I went some bands through our college where I toured and all that fun stuff. Cool. And you know, we get we get on a week of vacation and we put a U-Ha on the trailer and play as many shows as we could all around the United States and we'd like to get a sort of South Carolina and cool. And then that, and then as I got a little older, I kept doing music, of course. And then actually when my kids were uh probably five and eight, or maybe even a little younger than that, I I found the jingle lighting, actually. So I got the music. Cool. And actually, yeah, this is a fun story. We were at this one place, family deflace, we had a couple families, and we went to Metropolis, which was like this, you know, adventure fun park, whatever, and they had a pizza evil challenge. And uh it was two adults eat a 30-inch pizza in one hour and you get a free pizza in a shirt. And you know, and I was like everybody and I were looking at each other and we're like, You want to do this? You wanna do this? I got this. Yeah, we were like, well, we got it. So you're not going to imagine like once two and a half large dominoes of pizza.

SPEAKER_02

You were doing the logistics of the pizza into the mouth.

SPEAKER_00

So we win that and at the time, so we're like, Yeah, let's do it. And like, you know, the calm before the saw and the kids were like, maybe they was four and seven or uh whatever. I I'd have to look yeah, yeah, yeah. And we're doing this room when we're slowly eating, and then the high school girl was sitting at the table with a timer, just watching us. What a high school girl wouldn't want to do that, watch old guys eat pizza. Yeah, it's great. It's a dangerous. He got green all, he was a small one. I got pepperoni. And he was putting it down, and this is what a good friend he was after he finished. He actually finished all his before mine. Probably he was done with about 30 minutes and he had his whole half done. And I'm still looking like I was maybe at like the two pizza mark, maybe a little, maybe one and three-fourths pizza, or just three pizza. And you know, my buddy essentially invite you, like he's like, We're gonna win this, and he started eating my half and all that, and then like I could start to feel like pepperoni in my throat and all that, and like I was like, well, actually, my wife was like, Should I get a bucket? And I was like, I'm glad and then like now be walking around, and then the girl's like, Oh, five minutes left, and the wine was about nine pieces left.

SPEAKER_02

It was like God, yeah, dispute everywhere.

SPEAKER_00

So that was sad, and then my buddy just pushed the pizza away. But my whole friends had gathered around, like, oh my god, these are gods. Like, nobody's done this for five years. Yeah, yeah. But so when you're back at the hotel, and my buddy's wife is like, You got you got a couple pizza babies in your belly, and I was like, that's funny. And I went on a song called Pizza Babies. Pizza Pizza was so nice to meet you when I saw you at the party that day. You were thick you were thin, I knew I was gonna win. Anyways, but when nice Yeah, yeah. But I wrote the song, and I recorded it, and I actually sent it to Little Caesars through Little Caesarsless.com.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

All the time. I've always been like, oh, this is this is the one that's gonna do it to my wife. So I did it on a Friday, on a Wednesday, she gets a phone call because I put my home address on there, and you don't ever think anything's gonna get there. And yeah, uh, he was like, is talking her? And always like, no, and she's like, Well, this is Walt Frederickson, the the um senior VP of marketing at Little Caesars, and she like she's like, You heard of the song and start saying pizza, pizza or something? And she's like, Are you kidding? And she started talking about how much she loves Little Caesars Pizza, and so and anyway, and he's like, Well, I don't call me. So I called him at his office in Detroit, and he's like, Todd, Todd, it's a hit, it's a hit. And I'm like, why I said this to LittleSaussarsListons.com, like you said it's a bot even back then. Yeah, he was like, I'm gonna need you to change some lyrics. Um, I'm like, that's cool. This isn't dark side of the moon. I can I can look at it yeah, yeah, you're good too. And like, if one people go to school to learn how to do uh marketing, well yeah, I actually worked it all out to send me a contract, I had to go back and forth for our lawyers and whatnot. I had a lawyer to defend my song, and I developed this relationship with them, and I actually ended up writing like nine tangles for little Caesars, which is awesome. Like I was my team would see on TV, and they're like always like I thought you were in like the after all the things we'd watch the Allen game of games, and like, dad, it's your song, it's your song. That's ridiculous. Yeah, it's crazy to think, and I use that to spring more with the other job opportunities because once you have that on your resume, that's like legit, and you know, nothing makes you more legit than one person saying you're legit. Pretty much. That seems to be the way it goes. But anyways, I did all that, and then when come fast forward to get to the Todd and Tina stuff, fast forward, I was working with Quirky who's Tina in Todd and Tina. But some jingles I have about three elts I can hit most of the time. And um, I used to do some jingles for car washes and stuff like that. Well, I mean, the female voice, and she's an elementary music teacher, a friend of mine, and um I had her come say on some jingles to uh you know build my resume. And then during COVID, I started just writing these goofy songs. Actually, I went on a road trip with my family to South Dakota and I kept hearing the presidents of the United States of America, you know, that teaches. And then I got back home and I kept hearing them, like, what's this? And then I'm like, what are they even up to? And I left him out. Yeah, Mr. Lou is a children's musician. Yep. It's kind of like I checked out his stuff, and I was like, Yeah, I was like, wait a second, I'm like, this isn't that much different than the jingles I'm doing now. If I'm singing Yeah. So I think what happens is when you're young, you're very passionate about everything. Yeah, I gotta my heart's breaking. I gotta tell you how I feel younger, and you're like, even if I'm passionate, it's gonna take six months to a year for the song to even come out. I'm not gonna feel the same. Yeah. I started writing these goofy songs. Um, I have one song called Dermatologist Astronaut, because I I actually after being dermatology, I went to the dermatologist. Um I should have been a dermatologist, that would have been like the best job. And then like, you know, I was watching a doctor after he had spools, and I said to my wife, I'm like, I should have been an astronaut. And she's like, You should be a dermatologist astronaut. And I'm like, Nice, wall up. Yeah, sliding board. And then so I'd say, I think I had lots of so many ideas, and then I had Finchie come over and record some. This was kind of during COVID or at the end of COVID, and we just pulled together this thing, and then we're like, okay, well, we got 10 signs, let's see where it goes, put it out, and then we just play farmers markets the first year, and then we've just been building constantly. Yeah. And that was pretty cool because like we had boom shows before the summer in January, and it's like nice. I mean, she's a teacher, so we're kind of a full schedule. Yeah. Um, and I'm more happy to disappear for more and spending this this snow building now. This is our fifth summer, we've put out very track full of records already. That's cool. Yeah, and so it's just been a little fun thing, and it's just learning to interact with kids. And uh fun thing is it's um, they're very involved in this song. Yes. But it's also fun because I can still make pop songs that I think are good pop songs. Uh-huh. Whereas it was stuff that I think's important in pop, but it was not quite the emotional you can write a goofy song about a spooky cat, you know, like spooky cat, spooky cat, no, yeah. And like it's fun. I'm occasionally really into it, and at the same time, I can get what I want out of it, which is about constructing pop songs. Yes. The kids, I should say Tina. Um, she's got the teacher's vibe, so she knows how to interact with them. Because like I mean, I'm an old guy. A kid isn't over to his house to look at his sound and after fun. I'm just like what am I supposed to say? And I I think it helps too to have that off balance of like Yeah. You got this friend friendly friend, uh friendly, fun, fun woman there, and I can be back there doing my frame and chime in and my innate comments to say my goofy stuff and write my goofy stuff Yeah. So it's been uh boy balancing it, but yeah, it just kind of keeps going and it's fun just to see where it's led. I mean, we got a like this place radio, King Splunch Live on CS radio, so that was fun, and we've been featured in the local payloads that keep showing up on local. That's awesome. And you know, it's kind of now it's just a question of how far we want to jump in because you know, obviously there's only X amount of money in music to do with, and we have careers, yeah, careers. Yeah, and um it's now so now it stands the question of okay, how far do we want to take it? Then we have a great time here. We get along really well, and just this this spawning thing, and because of what my jingle things kind of take me on the backseat because I've been so busy holistic. And it also tells my need to do music, which you know that's the Which is great, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

And also like if you do like um I don't know, if you write a song about a spooky cat or something like that, you know every kid's gonna like lose their mind, laugh and dance to it. If you write a song about heartbreak and how alone you feel and the crowd has no response to it, that hurts.

SPEAKER_00

It's fun too because there's not really uh a level of coolness when it comes to kids' music. Whereas, yeah, I think there are the scenes regardless of what's happening. There's who's in, who's out with younger. Obviously, I'm old, so not bad. But you know, once you get older, you're not quite part of the whole hit scene and or wannabe. So it's like you think the kids like it or they don't, you're like, well, that song worked really must do a song on Fresh Toast, and the kids like it, and we have fun doing it. We get this great train out. I'm sorry, my hundred 200 kids show up at your show, and you're like, this is awesome.

unknown

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So you know, you hear about kids pointing one and pretending to be tied to Tina.

SPEAKER_02

That's sweet. That's sweet. That's really cool.

SPEAKER_00

That's pretty cool because they're not reading something, some something on the internet while it's flowing, so it's really cool because nobody in the right mind is gonna be like, yeah, like well, then it's also fun because bowls that do pay attention seem to get these jokes inside songs, these little subtle, yeah, like more golf jokes or themes buried in there. And they're not gonna be able to do it. It's been a blast, and it's obviously the most success I've had with a band.

SPEAKER_02

Well, cause because yeah, like if you are if you're going to write like a new kids album, you're just trying to think of like what's gonna make what's gonna entertain. Whereas, like, yeah, if you were doing personal music, to me, it's like, what pain did I experience recently that I now need to share, that I need to then put into song for the people to write? So it's like, write a song about a cat, write a song about a dog. I don't know, can that dog fly over the moon? Let's figure it out.

SPEAKER_00

You know what's funny though? It's like it's not even I don't even sit around and think about like, oh, like what will a kid like? I'm like, oh, it's kind of funny to me, right? And I Yeah, yeah. Yeah. You know, like, oh, well, uh, it'd be funny to do a song, like we have a song called Not Another Dinosaur Song. It's about how people want kids to play dinosaur songs. Well, we're not gonna play another dinosaur song. Yet at the same time, it's called Not another dinosaur song. And then the cool thing was that we were able to get into the science museum in Minnesota to film a video. Cool, like living dinosaurs. So I mean, it's pretty cool. Like, so like the adults were the joke of not another dinosaur song. And the funny thing with that video is we filmed it, and then I actually run it by the science museum to make sure we were saying velociraptor tear it act up, but I'm pointing to the right dinosaur. Of course, yes. There's actually seem like griffin's actually an allosaurus or something like that. Like Yeah, yeah, that'd be the worst. Right. Yes, yeah. So that's what's been fun, and it's just stuff. I mean, I have fun coming up with the songs, and it's yeah, I I do think there's something when you get older, you were not I mean, there's a reason lots of bands that I loved or best work was in their twenties and early thirties, because I think the emotional upheaval in your life is a lot more conductive. So to that, yeah. When you get older, it's like you know, hopefully it's pretty steady. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, even somebody like Bruce Priesty, he gets more double bug stuff, but it's not the same as you're not gonna get like one you're run, you're not gonna get another melancholy or uh I mean anything you mean, oh I'm just gonna cheek still pull it out, but that's because he's a boardsmith. Yeah. Like it's uh Yeah. Oh, I mean Leonard Cohen is able to do it too later in life.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, but oh no one you're not no one's getting Leonard Cohen. There he's the there's only one Leonard Cohen, and you we all can agree on that.

SPEAKER_00

No one and one Leonard Cohen, but I mean something like the killers, well love. Like they're not they're they're gonna get like shear. Like Brandon Flower's gonna get cheered. Yeah, he's not gonna get sheer. You're not gonna have to go to the Mr. White side. Or LinkedIn.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

So I mean, you know, and it's just kind of like organs like Athan too. It's like, although he's he's he's pushing it up there, Brian Traveler.

unknown

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Some of those people, there's a reason when you're really young and passionate and you you feel like you got something to say. And then when you get older, you still love the craft, but you're also like, well, I don't like a little different. Well, yeah, I think it also ties into the whole like longer you get the less confident, at least for me, the less confident I am on everything. So I'm like, I don't need to show up and tell you how to do things because Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Like, yeah. The that I don't know if arrogance is the word, but it's like, no, this is how it needs to be done. And you're like, as you get older, you're like, actually, no, that's the way I feel comfortable doing it. That doesn't mean it's the way it needs to be done. It's just what I that's familiarity, that's not yeah, truth, you know.

SPEAKER_00

Start as Porn Plus music, you know, blowing up a change on a change. And then by the time like my back pages, he's talking about, ah, but I was so much older then, I'm younger than that now. And then people just say it's saying that at what was he, 24, 25, to just get everything he thought because he became the person that he was protesting against. Yeah, maybe and then it's even more moving when you realize that's only on the fourth disc of a three-song great estates. Correct. Pretty much. Right. Yeah. I could go on and on about that guy.

SPEAKER_02

There's a yes, there's a children's author named Bob Shea. He's based out of like Connecticut. You're talking about you're not another dinosaur song. He has a kids' book about a sheriff, but the sheriff is obsessed with dinosaurs. So he goes into town to like wrangle up these bandits and stuff, and he the bandits are like, Ha, we're the bandits, you're not gonna get us. He's like, actually, I'm looking for dinosaurs. And then he tricks the bandits into getting into jail by telling them about dinosaur facts. And like, it's such like uh, you have like the I love whenever you take like a pretty predictable plot of like, I'm gonna tell you about a dinosaur. It's like, actually, I'm just gonna turn it upside down a little bit and make it really silly, and like then you're gonna learn more about dinosaurs because I didn't come up about this and like the approach you predicted, so now you remember it more. It's like I love that stuff.

SPEAKER_00

I think I was thinking through the Mac more as opposed to just like those things on what you've gotta learn now now.

SPEAKER_02

Yep, pretty much. So, how I end every episode is I ask every guest a series of five questions, just they're kind of fun, lighthearted icebreaker questions. Five, you held up the correct number of kids. You should have done this at the beginning, right? Right? Um, okay, so first question did you have any backup names for your kids? Like, did you have anything that you almost named your kids?

SPEAKER_00

I don't know. I mean, my son Levi was almost gonna be Theodore. But small Alexi and Levi, so that way I had to stop it two kids. Because there's no more L names. We're done. We're out of L. I guess it was L E X I L D V I like. Well, I was delighting.

SPEAKER_02

Like I had no place to go. Nice. Um next question. Question, who's like your favorite TV or movie dad? You know what I like is Flow from Modern Family.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, he's perfect. Yeah, yeah. But he's pretty bad. I I like that. I mean, oh my god, maybe dad likes to thinkfully got some flow in him, but I probably don't. But I give him my belusions of dancering.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, but I want to be like more and more to Al Buggy. You you know, Phil is actually one of the most common answers. It's because people are like, he's goofy, he's fun, he doesn't take himself too seriously, but he he knows when to take himself seriously. So he's aloof, but like he also knows when not to be aloof. I think is like a more accurate depiction of a dad's like, I want to be dumb, I want to be fun, I want to be lighthearted, but also know when it's not the right time to do it.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, no, exactly. I think, yeah, I think he's he's a pretty good example of like dads wanna be. Mm-hmm. Yep. But you're right. Something like that. I know I have short forever, then every once in a while I catch it on TV and I'll be like, yeah, that's pretty like Yeah, it's good.

SPEAKER_02

But you're right, though. The reality is most of us are probably more albundi. Come home, we're like, oh my god, what else do I have to do? What else do you need? Next question. Did you ever have a replacement curse word? Like whenever you would like stub your toe, you get mad about something, did you just say the curse word or did you say something else instead?

SPEAKER_00

No, I actually try not to curse it on my kids, period.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

At all. You know, every once in a while I hear my kids say something, and I know it's that whole thing where they're trying to find that identity with their friends, and yeah, I just remember even the back in the dream, like if there's an F word on on you know a tape or whatever, my mom was like, Oh my gosh, it's you know, yeah, when the hell. You know, I mean now you hear it all the time in every two other Swiss side. So now we don't even think about it, but yeah, I mean obviously when I'm by myself, things slip out, but I mean it's just not in my vocal.

unknown

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

I'm just more like I'm just not like oh.

SPEAKER_02

I think I'm more prone to do sound effects, so I'm with you. As opposed to being like flippin' or or frick, I'm just like and that's what I say instead.

SPEAKER_00

I I probably say frickin' too much, but like get out of the frickin' shower. You better get out of the freaking shower.

SPEAKER_02

I do. I'm not buying I'm not buying a new water heater so that you can still have hot water at minute 40. You know, people like to think they'll flow, but they're oh I'll buy and I in the heart of hard telling you guys I'll buy me. Pretty much, pretty much. Next question: what's like one of your favorite activities to do with your kids? Actually, my daughter's got into running.

SPEAKER_00

So we've got cool five marathons together. We we actually like doing a 12-hour run together. So they start the clock at 8 a.m. and we run until 8 p.m. So that and my son, he's a big sports guy, so we'll always play something. Um video games I can't handle, but it got too complicated after two buttons. Um, I was just slightly for my eye, you have fun doing that. But I mean you can just go into a restaurant and I have to sit here talking to him lots of times.

SPEAKER_02

Cool. Nice. What uh okay, so which Minnesota sports teams does he follow the most? Which ones does he care the most about? Which one breaks his heart the most often?

SPEAKER_00

Well, right now it's the Tim Timor's and long-suffering Vikings fans. So that's and while he's trying to get into hockey, but it's not the twins. We gotta win something for us to care.

SPEAKER_02

That's fair. That's fair. I mean, living living in Denver, I you know, I watched one of the sports franchises out here lose to a Minnesota team, but I think people out here care more about the Aves than they do the Nuggets. Nuggets have a great fan base out here, but the Aves fan base is it's a different world.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, no, yeah, he likes that. And actually he even uh on Motherfucker, he even convinced my wife to take him to the uh to Moral's game. That's cool. He's pretty uh he's just like, oh no, Tinker's ain't gonna bad. Like he's like, we can go to the game, and you know, he's 13, 14. And I was like, oh, it's gotten too expensive. So he was like, actually, they're not that bad. And I've got a few gameplay here at $450. You know. Oh my gosh. Would it be fun? Well now, why do you want to go into call the atmosphere?

SPEAKER_02

I'm like okay. Yep. Well, also, like, I think I'm now realizing like, what does my wife want for Mother's Day? She wants an activity where all the kids seem to enjoy it and it's a happy experience. So if that's a basketball game, if it's a baseball game, if she has a moment when she's not making decisions and everyone seems like they're content, that's that makes her happy on Mother's Day.

SPEAKER_00

Although I will say for Mother's Day, I keep saying, I'm like, I'm just gonna let you enjoy McKillings. I'm getting alone.

SPEAKER_02

Leave me alone. So Yep, yeah, yeah. Your gift for Mother's Day is your children. I'll see you. I'm going to the bar. I'll be back in a half. I got a math. I get that. That's great. Um, and then last question like, if you had any form of like parenting advice, like what would it be? If you had like, hey, someone's about to be a dad, what would you tell them? Anything like that?

SPEAKER_00

Probably don't open plan and keep an open mind. It's yeah. I think sometimes you've got to, I mean, while I'm lucky, my wife knows what she's doing. So that helps, you know, like as a dad. I even say that even with uh my partner Todd and Tina, where I realize the mom, she's the like as much as I want to be involved, it's like a 35, 65 split on a generous day. Why didn't like all the stuff that comes home for reports and all that? My wife's the one that's like, you're doing this, you're doing this, you're doing this. Yeah. And I'm like, Did you really seriously? And you know, and that's where my as for Tantina, like, guys, she's the mom. So when I'm kind of like, well, why don't we pull that show? I also respect that, like, okay, she's got a little more work at home than I'm the bad though. Yeah, like I think uh plan and yeah, I don't know. You gotta give kings as a choice to figure out their own things. It's it's weird because my goddamn for better worse worse. For better or worse, definitely worse sometimes. It's turning out to be much more carbon copy of me. You're gonna get lost. Oh, I'm sorry. Yeah. No, I didn't mean to say that. But I think it was funny and music, and my sala is much more my wife's temperature. It's much more laid back with the flow and we can force these things, it just kinda is the way it falls. And you can't force it, you know, and at the same time, we're not done developing, so it'll probably change again when you will.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, I I always think of the Ben Folds as a song called Still Fighting It, and I feel like the pre-course is like, You're so much like me, I'm sorry. And that has always resonated.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, and I mean at the same time, you've got to give them space, and you've got your visions of what you want them to do, but ultimately it's their life, and it's kind of a weird mobilization to realize like, what just shoot a guy at them for 18 years and put them into the world? Like, the idea of them living under a wing forever is not really the way it should be. It's not no. You know, sometimes like, oh, it's sad, but I don't know. And I also advise the parents is to make sure to keep your own identity too, because you get so wrapped up in your kids, and then I'm like even Blood of Night. My wife and I were able to go with friends we had before kids, and for a while, you know, everything that's with kids, and it's like, oh, we'll just go to dinner and shoot the boys players for three hours. Yeah, because you're so wrapped up and everything's the kids, we gotta get to soccer, we gotta get to Fizzbooth, the basketball, and it's like they're extensions with us, but they are not us.

SPEAKER_02

Correct. Yep. And also, I think your kids like want to see you have a hobby, they want to see you like have an identity outside of them. So, like, figure it out. Or it's um, prioritize yourself. It's really hard to because you think by prioritizing yourself you're damaging, you're hurting, you're taking away, and actually you're feeding and you're giving, and it's really hard to believe.

SPEAKER_00

When I was on the TV a lot with little CZ, it's even though they don't say it, I think in the back of your mind, they're like, Oh, cool, like Dan's doing something. The crap he's thinking around with in the basement is making its way into the world, and like a little show, and there's all these kings there, like, this is my dad. Who's this cloud? You know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's like it's like, oh, Dan's got other things to do, or like, I know why I want you to know that. Oh, like they kind of know my dad from lying too. Like, how many what? Yeah.

SPEAKER_02

Yep. I think it matters, man. I'm with you. And I think it um it then also gives more of like identity to like tell your wife about or tell your partner about. Because if you just like if you if I'm in a rut of do this, do that, do that, and it's just like playing it. I think it's easy to get bored and to get lethargic. And like hobbies are how you avoid some of that, and that keeps everything interesting, and to me, it guarantees better connection with people that you love.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, there's nothing worse than like sitting in a restaurant and seeing an old couple just sit in silence. So and again, you don't Yeah, yeah. You also say, Well, maybe they had a rough day, maybe we're going through something. Maybe people just want to sit in silence together, but then sometimes you just say, Well, maybe they're just bored and they have nothing to say about again. It's like you project all these things onto other people, but the truth is you know what anybody's thinking or what they're going through. But you don't mind by it. I'm like, I don't want to be that person that has nothing.

SPEAKER_02

My mind will still say I have nothing useful to say.

SPEAKER_00

Well, you shall still talk.

SPEAKER_02

That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know a lot of words, not many of them mean anything, but I can say a lot of them.

SPEAKER_00

I don't know. Well, exactly. Like community facts. Oh, like born her to death with this stuff, and she'll just go, huh?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah. Sounds good. And that's why you really need other friends. Because yeah, my wife doesn't want to deep dive into a music scene that she didn't know existed, and then I'm trying to tell her every detail about. And she's like, Can you just find someone else who knows what any of these words mean, please?

SPEAKER_00

It's like when I'm telling my wife about the Swedish black mellow scene and how I blame a mess on somebody in a church and burned it down. She's just like, What are you talking about? They're like, no, it's not happening. It's just like it's quite careful.

SPEAKER_02

Don't don't you notice all the Chicago references in in Melancholy and the Infinite Sadness? It's littered with Chicago references, and she's just like, I don't know any of these songs. You haven't listened to this album for 30 years? No, I haven't. Have you listened to any of the news now show punkins? No, I haven't. I feel like I stopped with them in the early 2000s. Uh Machina. Machina was probably the last album theirs I really dived into.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean, you know, it's just like, yeah, you just I've I've been a lifelong fan and I follow up, but then when Billy starts making it words, it's just kind of like, I just just like your simple stuff, but again, it's that point where he's an artist, he's got a vision, and it's not he's obviously done something right. It's like when I sit around and like I'm like telling my battery how this Taylor's toolback is gonna be better. Like, I think she's doing just fine without she is fine. Yeah, I want to attack people are hitting quite the same book as Taylor Swift. Quite fun. Yep, pretty much cool. Thank you for having the onions, it's fun.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah, of course. And then other things is just like moment for self-promotion. So, like, how do we find your music? Are you guys on like socials? How do we like your website? Anything like that?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, just check out toddand.com or go with Spotify or wherever you find streaming music, Apple. Not to swingle anybody out. Um switch for zombie woodwalls. It's more everywhere. You can't miss us. Nice. Have you never done a two-question interview?

SPEAKER_02

No, I haven't. That'd be fun though.

SPEAKER_00

Now that it now that you have, how does it feel?

SPEAKER_02

That's awesome. That's a phenomenal dad joke, also. That's that's solid. That's well done.

SPEAKER_00

Gosh, yeah. I know. I actually actually sent from the other day, too. I was like, oh my gosh, it's a dad joke. Cool. Thank you for having me on, and love and welcome to anything else.

unknown

Cool.

SPEAKER_02

Well dude, thank you so much, Todd. I really appreciate it. Thank you so much for listening to the episode. Make sure to follow us on Instagram, TikTok, and YouTube at the Imperfect Dance Podcast. And make sure to give us five stars for every listen to us. Music, editing, and production is all done by me. Make sure to tune in on Mondays and most Thursdays for an episode. This podcast is part of the Never at Faith Network. Make sure to go to NeverFaithNetwork.com to learn more about it.