
The Leader Learner Podcast
The Leader Learner podcast is for readers and leaders of all kinds.
Rather than talk to authors about the professional development books that they have written, the Leader Learner podcast spotlights readers and delves into their process the book(s) that have had an impact on them and their work.
This podcast is brought to you by Theresa Destrebecq, founder of Emerge Book Circles.
Join me as I discuss books, learning, and leadership with the guests.
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The Leader Learner Podcast
S02E22 The Care and Challenge Episode
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Theresa Destrebecq & Vincent Musolino
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Season 2
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Episode 22
Check-In Question
- If you were invisible, what's the first thing you would do?
- What good can you do while being invisible?
Big Ideas:
- 4 quadrant matrix - Caring Personally, Challenging Directly
- High Care, High Challenge - Radical Candor
- High Care, Low Challenge - Ruinous Empathy
- Low Care, High Challenge - Obnoxious Aggression
- Low Care, Low Challenge - Manipulative Insincerity
- Industry dependent (ie, manufacturing more direct, healthcare less direct)
- gender dynamics at play - women not wanting to challenge directly for fear of being labelled a "B*tch", men don't want to be seen as weak
- Can compassion be radical?
- Compassion using the heart and the mind
- Radical - getting to the root of things
- lay down unilateral power, hold each other accountable
- Radical means essential
- end of command and control with pandemic
- "I can't believe this trust thing is working." ~CXO of some company
- Invite them to give you feedback first and make it a regular part of your day, even in small conversation
- Get to know your team about their career aspirations
- Assumption that people want to advance - Rock Stars versus Super Stars
- Assess how giving and getting feedback
- Ebb and flow between being a rock star and super stardom
- Often only way to grow is to be a manager - what about those who don't want to be a manager?
- Often only reward the managers financially, not the ICs
- Difference between learning and growing up the ladder
- Pair the care and the candor all the time
- Passive, aggressive - assertiveness as the third way
- Not falling prey to either or
- Permission parenting, authoritarian parenting, authoritative parenting - finding the middle ground
- We are human and won't always walk the perfect path
- Bill Gates - "Give me the bad news."
- Cultural implications around radical candor
- Use too many disclaimers to soften negative feedback, which takes away the candor
- Recency and latency biases make us forget the middle in the "Sandwich" technique
- So many nuances
- Normalize radical candor
- Invite public criticism as a leader, so you show people you are willing to take it
- Otherwise, give all radical candor in private
- Often more care than candor
- Fear in speaking up and saying things
- When impact doesn't match intention
- I can't always measure the impact I will have on people
- Sometimes the way we see the truth can hurt someone, but does that mean we shouldn't say it?
- Can people take your "Radical Candor"?
- Inquisitive radical candor - test the waters first?
- Knowing the right time to give feedback - it will land different in different circumstances
- "Radical candor is not measured at the mouth of the speaker, but at the ears of the listener."
Resources Mentioned:
- Radical Candor by Kim Scott
- The Culture Map by Erin Meyer
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