The Policyholder Podcast: Presented by Fenchurch Law
The Policyholder Podcast, presented by Fenchurch Law, the podcast that aims to bring insights from a variety of guests with different perspectives on the insurance market, in a way that’s relevant to policyholders, and the brokers who represent them.
The Policyholder Podcast: Presented by Fenchurch Law
S2E6 - Meet The Team: Michael Robin
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In this episode, Dru talks to Michael Robin, Partner in the London office, to reflect on a career that spans nearly five decades at the forefront of insurance and professional liability law.
Michael looks back on his journey founding Robin Simon, one of the most respected niche insurance firms in the market. He shares the remarkable story of how his insurance practice began with a small office in Lloyd’s during the early 90s – and how a chance encounter helped shape the path that followed.
The conversation also covers Michael’s move to Fenchurch Law in 2023, his shift from acting for insurers to representing policyholders, and why the human impact of claims work matters more than ever when a company’s survival is on the line.
Hello and welcome to a new podcast series hosted by Fenchurch Law. The series aims to introduce every member of our offices in a short, informal podcast. Today I'm delighted to be joined by Michael Robin, who is a partner in our London office and joined the firm in 2023. Very warm welcome, Michael. Thank you, Dre. So before we dive into the pod, we're going to start with some quick fire questions. Absolutely. So question one fancy restaurant or takeaway? Fancy restaurant. Ah, man of class. I thought you'd appreciate that. Book or podcast? Book. Cats or dogs? Cats, definitely. Um, and would you rather go on adventure holiday or a spa retreat? Spa retreat. Yeah. All predictable. I mean, to be honest, I think apart from cats and dogs, I'm with you all the way on those ones. Actually, wait, no, I should probably say podcast over book, given that I can't do this series. Nothing nothing technological for me. Yeah. Um, so Michael, welcome to the podcast. Very much looking forward to chatting with you. So you've obviously had lots of experience, and I think I'd like to start by tracing your your storied career. I hope you've got plenty of time. No, it's nearly 50 years. A junior colleague um assisted me with drafting these questions, and she's put here question one Did you go to university? But I imagine you sort of have to go to university to become a lawyer.
Michael :Yeah, even in those days, um I did. Yeah, I went to the uh London School of Economics.
Dru:Oh, I oh nice, you went to LC, I didn't know that. Um and did you read law there? I did. Did you enjoy it?
Michael :Yeah, I think so. I mean it it wasn't too taxing, it was quite a quite a leisurely degree, but yeah, I did enjoy it.
Dru:A leisurely? You're the first person I've ever met who said that studying law at undergrad is leisurely. Um so for the benefit of the listeners, what what's your specialism now? Like what sort of areas of law do you practice?
Michael :Uh now in line with what the firm does, it's insurance coverage um of all sorts, really. But I've um traditionally done quite a lot on the professional financial line side, um disputing um coverage you know, where insurers aren't indemnifying third-party claims. Um but yeah, gener generally across the board, pretty much everything the firm does, I do really.
Dru:Yeah, so let's talk about Robin Simon, because you f started and founded and owned your own law firm, which is I did, yeah. And it's had your surname in it, which is very Suits. If you've seen the TV show Suits.
Michael :Yes, I was the eponymous uh partner, yeah. Um They don't call you the Harvey Specter of Light Street for nothing. He's got more hair than me. Um yeah, I mean it it it was a slightly unusual route that I um pretty much when I when I started doing litigation way back, insurance was the province of a very few firms, the uh Bilo Lyden Gilbert as they were, Reynolds, Porter, Chamberlain and what have you. Um so it was pretty difficult to break into. And um I was with a a general commercial practice doing litigation and um decided, we took a bit of a punt and um opened a very small office actually over the road here in Lloyd's. And at that time Lloyd's was under severe threat. In fact, it was uh in the early 90s, um, and Lloyd's was facing this was in the days where there weren't uh well there wasn't corporate membership. So it was all all the names, individuals. And they had um been saddled with enormous exposures from the US, particularly uh asbestosis, and the and it their reserves were almost exhausted. The government had already announced that they weren't gonna bail Lloyds out. Um so it was it was a bit of a punt to open up an office there. And um I I was sitting at my desk one evening and um a gentleman came in who I now or later found out was Sir David Rowland, who was the the the chairman of Lloyds, who'd been recently appointed, yeah. And he was just chatting to me and he said to me, Um, you know, this is a fantastic show of support for the market that that that an outside firm has come in, and and just when everybody's the rats are leaving the sinking ship, I think he put it, because the people who had sweets in Lloyd's were leaving. And he said, you know, we look after our own and we'd like to show some support. And um very shortly thereafter, we started getting in work through brokers and syndicates that we didn't know, had never met, and um started building an insurance practice on that basis. And that that was acquired by another large firm, Hammonds. After a few years, myself and David Simon uh decided to do a management buyout, and we started Robin Simon. And uh again, it was quite unusual. It was a it was a a new firm in four different locations because we um we were tapping into the regional market as well. Hence Robin Simon was born and our our our sort of place in the insurance market became quite entrenched.
Dru:So that so I I'm hearing a lot of this for the first time. I hadn't appreciated that it was a so would you say that the one that started in Lloyd's in the early 90s, but that was that was that called Robin Simon.
Michael :No, no, I was in a much smaller firm.
Dru:I I I started uh So you started two law firms?
Michael :Yeah, well that that was a firm I was already at. It was a well-established firm, but they didn't do insurance. So I started the insurance practice.
Dru:Oh, okay.
Michael :Once once we got the office guy up and running at Lloyd's a big firm, Hammonds came in and adopted it, if you like. And then after after a while we decided to do a management buyout and took it out as a niche firm.
Dru:And they am I right in saying they specialised in PI claims against solicitors?
Michael :Yeah, well, professional liability was a big part of what we did after the uh solicitor's indemnity market opened up, it had been a closed shop under the solicitor's indemnity fund. In in 2000, it opened up, and we got in on the ground floor on that and became the lawyers of choice for some very big city firms, so we did all their claims. And um because we were non-competitive, we didn't do anything else, we carved out quite a niche doing that.
Dru:Um, well, thank you. I've that's fascinating. I hadn't appreciated lots of what you've just said. And astute listeners will notice that you have the same last name as our deputy managing partner, purely coincidental. No, it's it's the big reveal, Michael. Michael is the father of our very own Dan Robin. Indeed. So, how does it feel to work so closely with your I mean I say so closely, but obviously you guys don't do that much coverage work together. But yeah, it's it's not the first time that it's happened.
Michael :So Well, no, again, it again it's slightly unusual route that um uh Dan um was a earned, he would say, a uh training contract at Robin Simon. I think that's the word he used in his podcast. He did, yes. There was no nepotism involved whatsoever, I can assure you. We gave him a very hard time. And um uh at the time Robin Simon went well n nearly about 20 years actually before it was acquired by um uh another big firm. And um at that stage Dan decided quite understandably he w wanted something niche again, and uh he ended up at Fenchurch. Um and to cut a long story short, the way I ended up at Fenchurch was that um when I too decided I didn't want to be part of a big firm again, um I was approached by David Price, the uh uh obviously the the senior managing and now senior partner. And David had been about to join us at Robin Simon in in in the early years when we started there. So uh it it it's all it's all very incestuous. Yes, I was gonna say it's all very it's all very incestuous.
Dru:It's a great I mean you know yeah, you almost wouldn't believe it that there's this yeah, this sort of price-robin access that's been going around for 25 years.
Michael :Yeah, and I was very pleased to to join. It it in many ways the two the two firms have very, very similar cultures and philosophies, which I guess is why David was gonna join us before he set up his own firm.
Dru:Well, there's a there's a palpable power struggle every time both you and Dan are in the office. I mean, you could say that the student has become the master since the Robin Side. There's a bit of Darth Vader in there, without doubt, yes. Um so I was gonna ask you what drew you to Fenchurch Law, but I guess you've just sort of described it in sort of a alignment of cultures and not just specialism.
Michael :I I think that that's certainly true, but um the the in being on the other side of insurance was also something I was quite interested in doing, having always acted for insurers and um not to necessarily be poach a turn gamekeeper or whatever what whatever way you want to look at it, but applying the the knowledge and skills and the experience learned on the other side of the fence for the benefit of policyholders was was obviously something that appealed to me.
Dru:Yeah, it's it's interesting because I mean I've thoroughly enjoy representing policyholders because I I I've full disclosure, I've never actually worked for the insurer, so I I I don't know if this is also true. But although some clients are obviously they have the I don't want to describe them as peculiar, but uh by and large, when you if you get a result for a policyholder, even though we work for companies, often the can't the person you're being lazy with has been heavily involved in the company, maybe even started the company, and and the gratitude and the human aspect of the law that we do for policyholders, I think is a really lovely part of our job. And I can't imagine that someone at a £100 billion insurance company would feel that emotionally invested in it.
Michael :I I think you're absolutely right, Drew. You know, as as a lawyer, we sometimes lose sight of the fact that you know we're very very learned in the law and think we know everything. But it it all depends on the client, everything should be client-focused, the client pays your bills, and uh as acting for the insurer side, you began to lose that kind of connection because the appointments of lawyers tended to be made by people on procurement or senior management, and the the claims people, the people who were dealing with day to day, probably didn't have very much say in it, and um at the end of the day they left their their desk at five o'clock. You know, it wasn't their business if if a claim didn't go the right way or or you know something happened that that was unexpected, nobody nobody cried, nobody lost their job over it. Whereas of course many of the cases we deal with are life and death in in the in the in the sense of corporate existence of some of our clients. Um so yeah, I I that appeals to me for sure.
Dru:Yeah, it's it's um we're very lucky that we do sort of top-tier, big ticket work, but also have that always on the side of David versus Goliath. I think that's a part of my job which I really really enjoy.
Michael :Yeah, but even the big corporates, you know, when you've got the bet the company type cases, you're dealing with the chief exec, the the the the the CFO, etc. Um, and and you you you really feel for them and want to get the result for them.
Dru:Yeah, no, absolutely. I I couldn't agree more. So coming towards the end of the pod now, but I was gonna ask you if you can I mean it's obviously it's probably confidential, but have you had a particular work highlight uh since you've been at the firm of Fen Church Law?
Michael :Yeah, I mean mm obviously the cases are confidential until they come into the public domain, but the variety of cases has been very interesting. Um and they they you know they tend to follow insurance issues like we've had COVID, etc. We've now got the cladding claims and and and the like. So they're quite cutting edge, so I I enjoy all enjoy all of that. And actually the variety of clients is something I I think we've got clients from every walk of industry. Um and vast differences in size as well. Yeah, totally, totally. And um, you know, a smaller company can get a big claim and that's very important to them, but a bigger company can get a smaller claim, and that can, on a point of principle, be very important to them as well. So the the variety is the thing that appeals to me.
Dru:Thanks. And finally, this is Meet the Team, so we do have to learn something about you which maybe the listeners can't find out from your work profile. Um I noticed you said cats over dogs in the quick fire round, and I've seen with my eyes on Zoom that you have a few I don't want to say dodgy, but interesting cat t-shirts as in t-shirts with photos of cats on them. So, how many cats do you have? Um, what are their names?
Michael :No, we only have two, Rosie and Ralph. They're they're Bengals, and um both my wife and myself had never had pets growing up, and um yeah, and just later on, as our our children grew up and left home, we just wanted somebody around the house, and uh yeah, so they're they're they're they're from uh the same litter, and uh we've had them for 17 years.
Dru:Oh what wow, right? Yeah, my parents did exactly the same thing. They got a main coon when they became empty esters, and now I swear they love that cat more than all their children combined.
Michael :Dan would agree with that. I mean, uh, you know, the cats have their own bed and he sleeps on the sofa when he comes.
Dru:But uh it's just fascinating how they become the second round of children. Later indeed. Um, Michael, I've I've had as much fun as I knew I would. Um, thanks so much for coming in. Thanks for talking about your um your experience, and uh yeah, it's a pleasure to talk to you, pleasure to work with you as well. Indeed, likewise. Thank you, Drew. Thanks.
