Moishe Mana - Founder and Chairman, Mana Common

In this episode, we sit down with Moishe Mana, one of the most unconventional and visionary developers shaping Miami today.

Moishe’s story is as wild as it gets. He arrived in New York with nothing, slept on park benches, started a moving company with a single van, and built it into the largest operation in the tri-state area. That hustle became the foundation for a sprawling business empire spanning logistics, media, art, and real estate. 

We get into his early days in New York, identifying opportunity in overlooked neighborhoods like the Meatpacking District, and how that same instinct led him to Wynwood long before it became what it is today. Moishe shares what it actually takes to bet on a neighborhood, assemble land at scale, and create a cultural movement, not just a real estate project.

The conversation then shifts to Miami: Wynwood, Downtown, and beyond, where Moishe lays out his vision for the city as a global hub connecting the Americas, art, fashion, and technology. 

This one is about grit, conviction, and seeing what others don’t, and having the courage to go all in on it.

Want to dive deeper into Miami’s commercial real estate scene?
It’s our favorite topic and we’re always up for a good conversation. Whether you're just exploring or already making big moves, feel free to reach out at info@builtworldadvisors.com or give us a call at 305.498.9410.

Prefer to connect online? Find us on LinkedIn or Instagram - we’re always open to expanding the conversation.

Ben Hoffman: LinkedIn
Felipe Azenha: LinkedIn 

We extend our sincere gratitude to Büro coworking space for generously granting us the opportunity to record all our podcasts at any of their 8 convenient locations across South Florida.

Transcript

SPEAKER_05 0:00

This episode is brought to you by Bureau, our title sponsor. With eight vibrant locations in Miami's best neighborhoods, Bureau is the perfect co-working place to work, network, and thrive alongside other entrepreneurs, creatives, professionals, and local businesses. Find your space at BureMiami.com.

SPEAKER_04 0:21

Good? Yeah, we're rolling. All right. Who are we here with?

SPEAKER_05 0:24

We're at uh Bureau Central with with Moishimana.

SPEAKER_04 0:27

Yeah. Welcome. Thank you. We our uh our listeners have been asking for you for a long time. Um, and so we're really excited to have you on the podcast. Um but uh before we get started, we got a couple questions, all right? Um because we hear a lot of rumors about who you are. Uh is it true that you're a Mossad agent?

SPEAKER_00 0:56

Anybody anybody with the name Moshe, yes.

SPEAKER_04 1:01

What's the other rumor we've heard? We heard you're you're an agent for the Chinese government. That's the other rumor we've heard. Absolutely. I'm not an agent for anybody.

SPEAKER_00 1:08

You can't confirm or deny either, right? And actually, talking about Mossad, I'm very much so much against the policies of Israel. So I'm not gonna have any of these war efforts. He's a free agent.

SPEAKER_04 1:20

He's a free agent, you know.

SPEAKER_03 1:22

Hey, well, we've got to start the appropriate way.

SPEAKER_04 1:23

Yes, we do. What are we drinking? We're drinking margaritas.

SPEAKER_05 1:26

Was this Moish's choice? It was Moish's choice.

SPEAKER_04 1:28

Uh let's uh let's get a cheers in here. Moish you can say right there.

SPEAKER_05 1:31

I even got a nice salt rim going.

SPEAKER_03 1:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:33

Cheers.

SPEAKER_00 1:34

So you're really going for it, huh? Cheers. Cheers. So you forgot the salt on top, but I forgive you.

SPEAKER_04 1:41

No, I didn't.

SPEAKER_00 1:42

No, it's done. It's done already. I can put salt in the side. It's okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:45

People usually don't like it.

SPEAKER_03 1:46

It's okay.

SPEAKER_04 1:47

Okay, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_03 1:49

Flip already blew the interview. I know, right? No, it's it's a it's a Jewish thing. You already owe me. I do. Now you're indebted. I know, it's true. There we go.

SPEAKER_04 1:58

Well, welcome. Uh, we're here at Bureau. Um, this is a long time coming. Thank you, Marcia, for hooking this up for us. Uh we've been uh working with Marcia for a while now. She was a guest on the podcast, and she always uh introduces us to some great guests. So we're excited to have you. So um we uh if you're not familiar with with a podcast, we really want to get to know you. Um this is a podcast about you and your story. So we know that you were born in Israel. Um, and so tell us a little bit about where you were born in Israel. Uh, we'd also like a little background on your parents. How did they get to Israel? If we could have that backstory, um, you know, fill us in a little bit on who your parents are, and uh and then we'll move into to your birth date and how you you grew up in Israel.

SPEAKER_00 2:51

Okay, sure. So I represent the regular Jewish story where my grandfather, my grandparents uh were in Iraq and very successful family. And what were they doing in Iraq, your grandparents? Business. Yeah. You know, one was logistic, one was the date and trading and what's not, and a very successful family in Iraq. And then started the whole pogroms against the Jews, and and the state of Israel was established and it was uh persecutions and they needed to leave everything and come to Israel. And when they uh came to Israel, of course, there was no Israel still, it was Israel in the early stage, living tents. Uh I remember my uh grandpa as I was growing up uh uh sweeping the street, a guy that had businesses, was a respectful man, never complained. He was always a happy man with candies coming, bringing me candies. Uh so this was in the 40s? No, no. Um my parents left is Iraq in uh 52, 53, I think. Okay. And um they went to Israel, you know. But uh the programs were started when the Israel establishment 1948, before this, also, because there was a big conflict between um the Arabs and the Jews about the issue of Israel.

SPEAKER_04 4:31

Yeah. So they so they got to Israel in 1948, you said?

SPEAKER_03 4:37

1952. Oh, 1952, okay.

SPEAKER_04 4:40

And uh so your parents, so your your who goes to Israel? You both your mom and your dad are go to Israel?

SPEAKER_00 4:47

Everybody, the whole family, everybody left. Nobody was left.

SPEAKER_04 4:50

Okay, and you so your parents were married in in Iraq and then went to Israel?

SPEAKER_00 4:55

It's a long story. Yeah, I won't get into it, but they ended up getting married in Israel.

SPEAKER_04 5:02

Okay, okay, so they met in, so they are in Israel, and so what did your parents do for a living?

SPEAKER_00 5:08

Of course, so when they came, uh as I'm growing up, uh uh uh my father was working for the Hossad.

SPEAKER_04 5:16

Oh, he was, huh?

SPEAKER_00 5:17

Because he spoke Arabic.

SPEAKER_04 5:19

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 5:20

But uh then again you almost killed him and he was working in Lebanon, according to the stories.

SPEAKER_02 5:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:27

And then he he ran away and he came back to where I grew up, which was a post, you know, one of these poor neighborhoods.

SPEAKER_04 5:36

In it in Tel Aviv.

SPEAKER_00 5:37

In Tel Aviv, kind of a pavella.

SPEAKER_04 5:39

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 5:41

And he ran away with his underwear on from Lebanon because they tried to assassinate him. A few times tried to assassinate him. And the Mossad blacked his way to get any job. So he ended up uh selling. You bring me back all the way back.

SPEAKER_04 5:59

Oh yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:00

Oh shit. I didn't get into this detail with anyone, but uh he ended up to be selling as a merchant on the street, on you know, like a horse and a wagon and selling vegetables. And I grew up with the horse, with the wagon selling vegetables and in the market and trading and everything else. Entrepreneur from day one. From early on. Yeah. Brought up in it. Yeah, I remember I was carrying the bags, I was five years old for a lady and for the wagon for my father because there was competition. Somebody else had the wagon and both selling, and the clients coming. And I was working and I was selling her the idea of my father's stuff. She came to my father and telling him, Your son was all the way telling me how great. You know, I remember when she was saying it, my son was convincing me that we have, you know.

SPEAKER_05 6:53

Where we have the better vegetables. I was selling, huh? But you were convincing her that you you had the better vegetables. Yeah, yeah, the vegetable fruits. Wow. And and you what did your mother do?

SPEAKER_00 7:03

Was she did she take care of take care of the kids or did she also No, no, no, no. My mother was the making of the house. Listen, we didn't have money. She was hustling throughout and you know, uh brokerage and you know, a wheelstead broker. And very, very poor situation. We went through different times. It wasn't uh um, you know, it it was uh an issue. It was poor at the beginning. There was no food almost. I mean, but they did everything to raise us in a good way.

SPEAKER_04 7:35

And how many siblings do you have?

SPEAKER_00 7:37

Uh we are five all total, two brothers, two sisters.

SPEAKER_04 7:40

And you were number which what which number were you?

SPEAKER_00 7:42

Number two.

SPEAKER_04 7:43

You're number two. Okay.

SPEAKER_00 7:45

Middle child. And so you uh you grew up in and actually maybe I'll get you into the distal, okay, another title, just that you know how to grow up. I'm number three, really. Because the first child was stolen by the Israeli government and was given to another family, and we never found uh my sister.

SPEAKER_03 8:07

Dang.

SPEAKER_00 8:08

Wow, that's crazy.

SPEAKER_04 8:10

Why why why was he stolen?

SPEAKER_00 8:12

Uh because it was a time a communist regime engineered society, so they take them from the poor families and they give them to Holocaust survivors and everything else. And uh I never believed my mom when was telling me the stories. I was growing up, and just before she died, it came, the story broke out, and it was thousands of thousands of kids. She told me that just they took she went, she was a minor issue, and they kept the kid, and next day, you know, your kid is not here, there's no body, there's nothing. Just leave.

SPEAKER_04 8:45

Holy shit.

SPEAKER_00 8:46

That's heavy.

SPEAKER_04 8:47

Yeah. Um, so you went to high school in in Tel Aviv. Uh did you graduate high school? You graduated high school? Yeah. Yeah. Uh what uh what were what were you good at in high school? What what subjects?

SPEAKER_00 9:05

In math, I was very good. Okay. Math physics. This is an Iraqi thing, you know. I mean all Iraqis are good at math? Iraqis are good at math, yeah, of course. Mathematics always negotiating. No, mathematics was embedded in Iraq-Iran. Ah, okay.

SPEAKER_02 9:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:21

You know, this formula of mathematics. I didn't know that. Um, but uh no, I mean, today in Israel, the bankers are the bankers, the IRS, the accountants, we have within our um tradition, the mathematics. Yeah, it's kind of a DNA, I think, you know. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Makes sense. And uh but I was good in different subjects.

SPEAKER_03 9:45

I was open for history, literature. You enjoyed those. You enjoyed history and literature as well. Of course, of course, of course. Uh you know, Bible. Any you play any sports growing up? All the time. What sport? Soccer. Soccer.

SPEAKER_00 10:01

You're a footballer. We played soccer on the street, yeah. Until now I played. Oh, you still play? Yeah. Really? Yeah. Holy shit. I just came back from Colombia and I go to this island called Baroo Island.

SPEAKER_02 10:14

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

And I go play with the kid, with the kids, and the people there. They're great players. Yeah. We play on the beach. What position do you like to play? Uh and the big game, midfield. Midfielder?

SPEAKER_04 10:26

A lot of running.

SPEAKER_00 10:26

A lot of running, but then when I was fast, I was right in the right wing, left wing. But uh so I play once a week, big game. An hour and a half. Here in Miami? Yeah. Yeah. In Boca. In Boca. Wow. And um I trained like twice a week, soccer, running, doing stuff like this. Good. But I keep my my shape in good shape.

SPEAKER_04 10:50

Good, good. So so you so exercise is still important for you.

SPEAKER_00 10:55

That's what really keeps my sanity, you know.

SPEAKER_04 10:57

Yeah. But do you so you you play soccer a few times a week? Anything else you do, or you you run? I run, gym, everything else. Okay, cool. A little weight weight training as well. Yeah. Yeah. A combination. Okay. Cool.

unknown 11:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:12

He looks fit. He does look fit. I'm not questioning any of that.

SPEAKER_02 11:14

No. No, ever.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Listen, I mean, I spent two hours every day, two and a half hours, uh, sport, running, gym. Good. We were in high school.

SPEAKER_04 11:24

Yeah, we were.

SPEAKER_03 11:25

So you graduated high school, and then what'd you do?

SPEAKER_00 11:28

In high school, listen, I it's really like it's just a thing. Uh because I came back from poor neighborhood and I went to a high school, which was a different society. Your high school was a different society. It's a different society, different culture. I needed to read, to uh uh teach myself to learn the new Hebrew. It's different. Uh it was beginning very difficult. It was very it was the best school in Tel Aviv, and I was persistent that I want to go to this school. I was very determined. Were you a good student? I'm explaining to you. So the first year was horrible. It was I was afraid to be. I tried hard, you know. It was not easy. And you know, you come as a different kid, uh, you're dark, short, tall, white, blonde. It's uh not easy integration, you know.

SPEAKER_02 12:23

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 12:25

Uh I tried very hard, but it was difficult. But the following year I caught up, third year became very good, and the rest is history. But uh, yeah, it was um a very good experience, the school. I was a very good student.

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SPEAKER_04 13:25

And during high school, did you did you work at all? Did you have a job?

SPEAKER_00 13:29

Uh during high school, no. During the primary school, yes. Yeah. Because we lived over the market and and uh it was easy to get a job. Working in the markets, working in the markets, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 13:39

Gotcha. So you graduate high school. Uh what happens after high school?

SPEAKER_00 13:47

I went to the army. And I was three years in the army. That was the IDF, right? The IDF. Is that mandatory service? Yes, it is mandatory. Yeah. I was uh working more in the intelligence trans uh translations and and others.

SPEAKER_04 14:10

Because you also spoke Arabic.

SPEAKER_00 14:12

I spoke Arabic, I studied Arabic.

SPEAKER_04 14:14

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

So it was very familiar to me. You know, my parents came from Iraq, so it was so you grew up speaking Arabic? Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:21

That was a very important thing. I mean, I'm very I I'm very Arab by my culture, you know. Yeah. I I relate very much. I I listen to Arabic music. Uh um I feel at home when I'm around this kind of people, you know. I am Mediterranean.

SPEAKER_04 14:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:40

You know. So uh Arabic. I'm Israeli, Iraqi, uh, very proud with my heritage, Iraqi Jews.

SPEAKER_04 14:49

Yeah, and so you you you grew up your first language is Arabic.

SPEAKER_00 14:54

Arabic, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 14:55

Yeah, okay, interesting. Didn't know that.

SPEAKER_00 14:58

So Arabic, Hebrew, you know. We spoke both languages. My mom spoke to me Arabic at the beginning. Yeah. All she knew just Arabic.

SPEAKER_02 15:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 15:11

Later on, as I grew up and I tried to bring friends home, she ticked on me Arabic. I was very embarrassed. You know, mom, speak Hebrew.

SPEAKER_04 15:19

Yeah, of course. That's how my uh that's that's how I was. You know, my parents spoke Portuguese to me. And you know, when you're growing up, you you want to speak whatever you want to be with everybody. Yeah, you want to, you know, I wanted to speak English. And you know, mom, don't speak Portuguese to me. I totally totally get that. Yeah, it's not cool.

SPEAKER_00 15:38

Until you're older, it is cool. Yeah, exactly. I remember I used to be bearest.

SPEAKER_04 15:42

Yeah, exactly. I I was the same way. Um so you're you're in the IDF. Um, you were there for three years. Uh were you a good soldier?

SPEAKER_00 15:55

That's debatable. Um I was okay, I was smart. Uh I did not uh uh today the commander I caught up with him, and we became good friends after so many years. And he used to tell, he told me, I used to tell his kid that he told me this thing when he met when he was my commander in the army. He said, either you're a genius or would be belong to a mental institution. Because I did not conform. I bet. And I was already opinionated about the war about Israel, and but uh I had my issues, and but we connected, he later on became the deputy Mossad. Oh yeah, yeah, and until now we're very, very good friends. Today you understand what I was talking about when I was younger.

SPEAKER_04 16:55

Um that's uh yeah, I I can imagine that um someone that is you know eventually became a real entrepreneur, um, taking orders um in the IDF. That's that's gotta be a little challenging, I would assume.

SPEAKER_00 17:12

It was challenging. I was very independent, yeah, independent thinker. And you know, you grew up and you take you have pictures in your head and the unjustice that was the occupation and everything else. So it was part of my service also.

SPEAKER_05 17:31

So yeah. And you were there for three years? Yeah. And then after that, is that when you went to uh Tel Aviv University? Afterwards I went to for one year.

SPEAKER_00 17:41

Okay. And I left America. I said it's not for me the place. I had my own paper, my own newspaper, kind of uh newspaper that I published.

SPEAKER_04 17:54

Oh, you published a newspaper in Tel Aviv during college?

SPEAKER_00 17:56

Uh yeah, no, after the after the army.

SPEAKER_04 17:59

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 18:00

And of course, people didn't like what I have to say and demonstrations and whatnot, because I wrote the editorial, it's by my house the way it is. And I was making money from the advertising, but I had my own columns. So my father told me, You're gonna go to jail. Because at the time to talk about the Palestinian state was a very courageous thing to do. So I said, okay, I'm leaving and I don't want to be here. Uh I I can't, I saw what's coming. And I said, this place has no future, and I don't want to tie myself to a place that doesn't have a future. And at a young age, I was very clever and I do not know where I got my wisdom from. But I saw the upcoming and I said, I'm not coming back, I'm leaving. I told my mom, I'm leaving. And and so you you went to college.

SPEAKER_04 18:51

Um, what did you study for that that one year?

SPEAKER_00 18:54

It's kind of it's it's it's not the same college, like here, it's high school more, you know. Uh high school is high school, study all.

SPEAKER_04 19:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:04

And then university, I studied law.

SPEAKER_04 19:07

Pre-law, okay, pre-law for the for one year.

SPEAKER_00 19:10

For one year.

SPEAKER_04 19:11

And then but they gave me a lot of tools. This year gave me a lot of tools. I bet. And so you studied pre-law for a year, and then you said, This is not for me? This is not for me.

SPEAKER_00 19:20

And I left.

SPEAKER_04 19:21

And so you left and you went to New York?

SPEAKER_00 19:23

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:23

Okay. Have you been to New York before?

SPEAKER_00 19:28

I never been on an airplane before. Wow. And there was no Google, there was nothing like this. Of course, yeah. Uh I have$800 in my pocket and I just lend it. I don't know where I've been where I'm going, you know. This is 1983, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:40

1983, you arrive in New York.

SPEAKER_00 19:42

With 800 bucks in your pocket? With 800. But later on, I gave it to someone because he told me a sub story, and I ended up with no money, but it's okay.

SPEAKER_04 19:52

So you land in New York. Do you know anyone in New York?

SPEAKER_00 19:57

No. It's a long story how I ended, how I managed. But I landed and I managed.

SPEAKER_04 20:03

Yeah. Okay. So you arrive in New York. How do you get a job?

SPEAKER_00 20:10

Somehow I ended up uh going to a Jewish camp, washed this wash parts for$300 a month. I said it's going to be training for me. I stayed there for two, three months. I got some friends. Um I was the best part washer in the camp. They always told me this thing.

SPEAKER_04 20:28

The best what, I'm sorry?

SPEAKER_00 20:30

The best part washer.

SPEAKER_04 20:31

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:32

They always told me. They were they were proud, proud of me. Um then I came to the city and I looked for a job as a dishwasher, running the street, selling on the street, uh whatever I can make money. It's a long story, the whole journey on the street and wandering the street, but very hid conviction. I love America. I love, you know, I was full with energy. It's it was not an option for me to look back, you know.

SPEAKER_05 21:04

And so you kind of just went from job to job, just trying to learn more, build a network, figure it out. And you eventually landed at uh a construction company, right? Where the guy couldn't pay you, but he gave you the company van or something like that to sleep.

SPEAKER_00 21:18

I wanted to write it as a movie. Now you're telling me yeah. What happened? I was selling on the street, and this guy, middle of the night, uh, and I was questioning, should I live, so I stay in New York? Shouldn't I stay in New York? Should I go to California? It was on West 4th Street. One o'clock at night, and I have a few jumpsuits and a couple of sneakers. I'm sizing it up, what should I do with it? And this guy came from nowhere. He said, Where have you been? I said, Where are you? I said, I bought from you underwear about three days ago. Remember in the village. I said, Okay. So, what are you asking me? What are you doing? You're looking for a job? Said yes.

SPEAKER_04 22:01

So you were just selling uh stuff on the street.

SPEAKER_00 22:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 22:05

Amazing.

SPEAKER_00 22:08

And he said, What are you doing? I said, I said, You're looking for a job? I said, Yeah. If you have a job for me, I said yes. So, okay. Took the staff, organized it. We went to some coffee shop in the back. And I ended up it was he had this big abandoned building he got from the city in Park Slope. And he got me to stay there. I cleaned the room. There was no electricity, there's no heat, there's no, you know, it's summer still. And uh I was able to clean and fix a room for me and sleep there and work there, but I ended up to be a crook. I was it's a long story how I got uh to do because he didn't couldn't pay me. And I work at night delivering with his van, delivering towels to the gabet houses and doing deliveries from time to time, making money and giving it to him a saving. I worked very hard at the time, but uh he ended up not paying me the money, and I realized it because his cousin told me he would never pay you, and I came and told him, Listen. And I I didn't understand because I was arguing with him, this is not right, this is not right. And it's clicked because I was still a naive kid. And and I said, Okay, now I understand that he's a crook, really. I wasn't as smart, I was so naive. I couldn't figure it out, he's a crook until somebody from his family told me. And I asked the money, he said no. He ended up giving me a van, a small van. And with this small van, um with gas, and I had no money in my pocket, very little money, a few dollars in my pocket, really literally. And I was able to build a big moving company called Moishes Moving.

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SPEAKER_00 25:08

Moving, I put flyers in the laundromat on the street, hire me, easy to get me,$10 an hour, and with the van,$15,$20, and uh running around.

SPEAKER_04 25:20

And so you you start moving the things yourself, then you start hiring people, I imagine. Yeah. Um, it was a long process, the moving company. It was so um when when does the moving company start getting traction? How long does it take for you to get your first van? Um because that's where you kind of start really making money, right?

SPEAKER_00 25:44

It's it's a long story, really. I mean, I I can't get together in details on how I got the van, what happened with the van. The van was mortgage, it didn't have money. They can't repossess the van by the time I knew something was going on. I didn't know what's a mortgage, what's not a mortgage. I luckily I had something in reserve, another truck that I bought by then. They came to took the van and never heard from the guy again. Good, I didn't kill him because I was thinking about killing him all the time. It took for me$3,850. This was the number I remember. And when I left him, I told him I will be a millionaire, I'll be a billionaire, but I will never forget this$3,850 because this is everything I have. Yeah, and it just stuck everything. And you know, I took a place, started really buying more trucks. It's a huge, it's a long story, really. It's not so simple to go get a truck in New York City and get a van and running it on the street.

SPEAKER_05 26:47

And you were just basically undercutting all the competition, from what I understand, right? You were just doing it cheaper than everybody else. See, it's it's not just cheaper because moving used to be controlled by the mob.

SPEAKER_00 27:03

And you couldn't run a truck in New York City without being part of the union and park organizations. It was very organized business. And from here today, you see little guys with have a truck, a broken truck, and and uh and and it was expensive for people to move. So what I did took time to organize it. I painted the truck red, a great logo. At one point, I started really I started uh I started buying big trucks and I made my own design. And the trucks look like spaceships. Really, literally spaceships. I think it was the most sexy trucks I've seen in my life. Seriously, I I used to look at it as a sexy thing, you know.

SPEAKER_03 27:52

And so it kind of just I used to look at the truck in a sexual way. You don't anymore? That went away, huh?

SPEAKER_00 27:59

It was like a spaceship, really, flying through the city. Yeah. And I put so not only this, because a lot of movies wouldn't show up, it's a broken down industry, fragmented. I used put last-minute uh jobs, and the I get trucks run all over the city, and last minute many trucks wouldn't show up. And within two minutes we had beepers, and we get five minutes into the customer house, ten minutes we get there.

SPEAKER_04 28:26

So you you adopted the beeper technology. So we did we did a lot of stuff.

SPEAKER_00 28:30

It didn't come out of nothing. Uh the name Moisha's caught up because it was Jewish town. Uh, it was a good marketing. We did a great marketing, but also we did a very good job moving people, yeah. Everybody with uniforms, uh, young people, energetic people. It was interesting. Looking back, uh you know, this was uh a journey. Um of course I ran into the union and and shooting and John Gatti and a whole story.

SPEAKER_04 29:05

You were rubbing elbows with John Gatti? So again, you were rubbing elbows with Changatti? No, no, no.

SPEAKER_00 29:11

My soul rest in peace, but uh uh calling me, threatening me. Yeah, and I told him he can't kill me. I give him my address. I'm listed in white pages, and I go every day, I live on the 12th floor, I go to the 10th floor, I tell the dogman no delivery, no no no no pizza, no laundry. And they used to drive motorcycle and shoot in my office and shoot my car. It was a big intimidation campaign. But uh, I had no other choice, I needed to continue, you know. So it was a big thing to I ended up breaking the so-called whole trucking industry union that was a very, very close industry, and many people who worked for me started doing their own, and the rest is history.

SPEAKER_05 30:04

Yeah, is it is it is this true? I I saw somewhere within six years your cut your company was one of the top residential movers in New York City.

SPEAKER_00 30:12

We were number one moving company in six years, number one moving company, and God forbid I see anybody in the upper east side, upper west side, and that's my truck. I mean, I was very hands-on.

SPEAKER_05 30:26

Were you working all day, every day? Like what was the what was the workload like? You must have been going. No, I worked 24 hours.

SPEAKER_04 30:33

Yeah. How many trucks did you have after six years?

SPEAKER_00 30:36

We had 120 trucks. We were making thousands of moves a year. I mean, tens of thousands. I mean, we moved to New York City and the everyone, they paper and TV, clip, clip, video clips. We were the and we did very cool stuff. It's not only we did really good stuff.

SPEAKER_05 30:59

What was that like to go from you know, growing up in a poor family in in Israel to I can't even imagine what the cash flow is like from something like that. Like that's a full whiplash moment in six years. I didn't have to think. You were too busy. Uh too busy to think, too busy to enjoy it. Uh Did you have a nice did you move in and live into a nice place? Like what did you what did you spend your money on in those early years?

SPEAKER_00 31:26

At the time, listen, we don't go out and we don't date, and uh we don't have time for this stuff. Right. Uh we don't watch TV, you work. You work. You just keep going, keep growing. You keep going, you keep accumulating, but we diversified to many other areas and the movie became more liability than uh and I got rid of it, you know. So I gave it back to the employees and stuff.

SPEAKER_05 31:49

So when you started making real money like that, did you have a vision of for what's next? I mean, what what did you once you kind of were making money and you had cash flow coming in? Were you like, I'm gonna transition to this or I want to grow to be this size? Like what what was your mindset back then?

SPEAKER_00 32:03

Of course, I I'm a very progressive guy, and and uh the fact that we started, all of us as movers in the same, even guys who work for me started the same position a year or two years later. I mean, but I but I bypass everybody by far, anybody from moving company, nobody in the history of America would do, I would think they do something what I did with the moving. And uh I built the third largest document management in America, in the world. How did that how did that come about? It's it's progression. It's again, I cannot get into the detail and building it and how I built it. And there's so much creativity in the process and implementing technology. There was no barcode at the time uh in the industry in the document management. I was the first one to implement barcode technology in the document management. And I don't want to get into detail how they used to be, but it used to be a very problematic industry where if you want a box, you need to pay$500 to$600. It wasn't FedEx or situation like this because it's sitting in rooms and they need to go search for the room, and three guys deliver the box. And I came with this idea uh with the barcode and uh and next day delivery, four hours delivery, Tuesday free delivery. I copied the FedEx business model on a local basis. That's what I did.

SPEAKER_05 33:29

That's pretty cool. But how do you even stumble into something like that? Going from moving apartments and residential to document storage? Like, where does that even come from?

SPEAKER_00 33:37

It's a progress. I'm I told you, I'm I I even today, I don't do one thing. I am you're always talking to people, seeing opportunities. No, no, it's no no. I just like I'm interested in many areas, and for me, money was not always the challenge. Uh so that's why when people ask me what's the title of my life, I just said it was some the was the um the business uh journal. The man asked me what's your title if you say for I said I'm a business novelist, I write, execute, and and create impact. So uh, but today I focus really on stuff that have social impact. You know, at the time, what is really going to make the most money for me? What's most sustainable? And I always looked at business long term. But the document was the document, mini storage, just gave me the entry to the real estate business.

SPEAKER_05 34:34

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SPEAKER_04 35:28

Yeah, so so you're you're moving basically furniture for the first six years. Um and then companies are starting to ask you if you can move files, I imagine. And is that is that how it happened?

SPEAKER_00 35:43

No, it's interesting. You know, I was moving people into warehouses and I see these boxes and asked white people, those all these boxes, and then I started searching into it, and it's a long story. We got I was very creative. I was very, very curious and creative. So I diversified right away from moving to mini storage to storage, then when we got to the meat picking, also at one point.

SPEAKER_04 36:13

But but so you you you you start getting into document storage, and then is that when you start buying real estate as well?

SPEAKER_00 36:19

Earlier.

SPEAKER_04 36:20

Earlier.

SPEAKER_00 36:21

Earlier with the mini storage. Because I have mini storage, I have to take also another niche of business.

SPEAKER_04 36:27

Oh, so your your people need temporary space to store some of their stuff, and then you saw the opportunity to buy storage, mini storage, self-storage, what it is today, right?

SPEAKER_00 36:37

You see, philosophically, I looked at the big companies and I said, what's left from them? The building and the storage. So I figured out right away. I said the business is not the moving. Let me look into the storage, start studying the storage. So I start buying a abandoned building. So you have empty space, you put furniture, and what is these boxes? Why do you need boxes? So it's a process of learning and creating. It's not that somebody came and taught me.

SPEAKER_05 37:05

And once you build that foundation of the moving cash flow, you could be more creative and use that cash flow to do these other things.

SPEAKER_00 37:12

There was cash flow, but it always was tight. And remember, I did not go to study uh business administration. And uh, you know, I mean, for me Delhi to go and to develop to a supermarket overnight, it's very difficult management-wise for me to understand it, to comprehend uh system, procedures, control. We had our way on share. We have a we had our own share. It was not easy. It's not just you come like today, okay, business plane, show me the plane, you put management, none of this stuff. You couldn't Google it.

SPEAKER_05 37:52

I'm sorry? You could not Google it. No. Or have Chachi P Tell you how to do it.

SPEAKER_04 37:58

How do I run a uh a document storage company?

SPEAKER_05 38:01

Yeah. Right. Yeah, yeah. But so you started buying real estate with the self-storage, the mini storage.

SPEAKER_00 38:07

We got, yeah, so mini storage, buying buildings everywhere. And later on, I got into the meat packing, it was an abandoned building. What turned you onto the meatpacking district? It was abandoned building off Saks Fifth Avenue where I bought it.

SPEAKER_05 38:20

It was Saks was there and they left. It was abandoned by them.

SPEAKER_00 38:24

It wasn't abandoned, it was like doing nothing with its storage for them, and they wanted to get rid of it.

SPEAKER_05 38:29

What what made you think that that was a good area to buy real estate in? It's a bad area. I like bad areas. We can get it cheap. Yeah, because you can get it cheap. But what about the bad area makes you think this will appreciate what it's like?

SPEAKER_00 38:42

Well, I started that's what taught me what to do in Wynwood and many other cities. Uh the meat making was my school.

SPEAKER_04 38:50

And back then it was, I mean, the meatpacking district was historically a lot of warehouses, five, six-story warehouses, right, with freight elevators in them. Um, though those are what you started buying.

SPEAKER_00 39:03

I bought different places.

SPEAKER_04 39:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 39:05

But meat baking, it was an area where they sell meat. Yep. Disgusting, broken down buildings, broken down elevators, prostitute.

SPEAKER_04 39:18

Those are the areas that Ben really likes. Yeah, so the dirtier the neighborhood, the better for Ben.

SPEAKER_00 39:26

But from there, it was really a very, very bad area. And uh we ended up for mini storage developing the uh milk studios. We're fashion designers and uh it became a big company later, the Milk Studios.

SPEAKER_04 39:45

So and and what what what were you doing in the studios? What were you guys producing there?

SPEAKER_00 39:52

You see, again, it was a storage and I had other storages. I had document storage, I had many areas. Already I'm doing stuff. And then this guy, Rasy Nazdag, approached me. I was out and about in a bar, and he and he was talking about the idea of doing photography studios. What would you do, Soto? Ah, they need it for the industry. I said, okay, can they do it in their homes? I mean, what do I know about it? Then he convinced me that we should try it. And from there it became a whole new journey. This changed the meat picking. The milk studio was the beginning, the very, very beginning of uh meat picking. We brought Calvin Klein to do his shows. I mean, you had to see I mean it smells like you cannot walk like this. I mean, you have to walk like this, blood on the street, and you had satellites TV coming, making taking uh you know videos of his show, of his fashion show. Then we got many fashion design and it became a nine division movies, commercial, uh makeup, milk makeup.

SPEAKER_04 41:00

And when did you start uh Milk Studios?

SPEAKER_00 41:03

96.

SPEAKER_04 41:04

96.

SPEAKER_00 41:07

And this was the big change uh because you start really getting the the younger, the hip people into the area. The clubs opened up, so it was a collaborative. Were you one of the clubs? Of course. Tunnel? No, a tunnel is it was too early for me. I didn't have uh I wasn't as you know from time to time. Yeah, yeah. Were you partying at the time? But lotus, lotus in the meat picking. Yeah, that was your spot.

SPEAKER_04 41:33

Yeah, but uh at the time I started already going out and checking out girls and yeah, so now you have a little money in your pocket, you're starting to have a little fun going out, making up for the past, yeah. This is where the podcast really starts exactly 96. 96. This is where the story starts. Moish is out party, great years, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 41:57

And I did party, as you should, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 42:03

You know, but uh sometime, seriously, now with the serious way, sometime we go you go on the road and you can get lost. And I got lost as a result, you know.

SPEAKER_03 42:17

I got uh involved in relationship and and uh any good drugs? You're doing drugs too, or no?

SPEAKER_00 42:26

If I did drugs, luckily I did I didn't do much. I did here and there to try it to see what it is, but I wasn't drugging. Yeah. But when you go with friends and you do this, okay. Yeah, you want to be, you know, you want to try it. I'm curious, so of course, but uh no, I didn't uh uh you go that path. But uh you know, then you go parties and then you got lost a little bit along the way.

SPEAKER_04 42:53

I mean, listen, New York in the 90s. I mean, the the the the scene there, the the the you know, the electric electronic music scene, the house music was I mean the hot girls and yeah, I'm not used to this, and all of a sudden yeah, you got some money in your pocket, exactly. Yeah told another planet, yeah. Shit happens.

SPEAKER_05 43:16

Oh boy. That might be the title of the podcast. Yeah, shit happens.

SPEAKER_00 43:19

And then going to Miami and the whole thing. But that's really I got derailed for 12 years. 12 years. 12 years, I guess. What do you mean, derailed? Derailed. I neglected my businesses. Uh I did, but not as much as that I was doing. Uh traveling the world, uh going to China, and uh breaking my heart twice. One of the, you know, it's uh heartbreak is very difficult. Yeah, you know. I don't know if that's derailed, that's all part of the journey. Made mistakes, huh? It's all part of the journey. It's part of the journey, definitely.

SPEAKER_05 43:52

I don't know if that's derailed, I think that's all part of it.

SPEAKER_00 43:56

But it was a real derail because I was very close. to lose everything.

SPEAKER_05 44:02

How so?

SPEAKER_00 44:04

Because you give your you know your key the keys to some people and to other people and you walk away and and and people it's not the business. It's not what it's not they don't know what they do or they got their own agenda in the process and it's a long story how I bet I came back after two years I was not in America and I took the keys I fired whoever I need to fire I cleaned the house and I started my journey all over again. What was the what was the beginning of starting over again? First of all I needed to talk to myself and I took myself a talk seriously and and standing from the mirror and and and convincing myself to come back and this is it and I made this decision I was very disappointed with myself you know because I totally got lost and so when I came back I cleaned house and and I'm sorry where did you go? You went to China you said China Israel the world Europe you were just traveling not working right over the phone yeah um but even when I was here because I was really heartbroken so so I couldn't work I couldn't work uh stay away from girls stay away from girls if you want to build a business um but anyway to cut the story short when I came back this is it I cleaned house you you come back what year 2009 was a recession time in the midst of the recession management even talking to me about bankruptcy and uh I I needed to clean the top management and uh I started all over again. Did you still have the moving company at this time or no the moving company already was third party already so I didn't want to have a moving company I was running away from it like hell yeah because people think you can make money from moving company it's not it's you can't make any money from moving company um it's not the business and well it was a stepping stone for you it was a platform for me to do other stuff right and good I understood it back in the late early late 80s I understood it.

SPEAKER_05 46:42

You know Felipe ever since we moved into Bureau my productivity has been through the roof. I mean I might actually be getting things done for once the energy at Bureau just makes work fun.

SPEAKER_04 46:50

Plus with eight locations across South Florida from South Miami all the way to Hollywood there's no excuse for not finding a spot to get your shit done Ben.

SPEAKER_05 46:58

And we're not alone over 500 local companies call bureau home everything from creative agencies and real estate firms to tech startups, law firms and media companies it's a melting pot of brilliant people and we don't include ourselves in that category.

SPEAKER_04 47:09

We definitely don't include ourselves in that category. Bureau really has space for anyone whether you're flying solo or have a team there are suites starting at 100 square feet all the way up to 2000 square feet. They also don't try to lock you into long term agreements and everything is month to month.

SPEAKER_05 47:21

Let's not forget the important stuff either the coffee is top tier staff is incredible and has a very entrepreneurial vibe. It's not just a workspace it's a place where work actually gets done.

SPEAKER_04 47:30

That's right Ben so if you want to level up your workday like we we try to do every day check out Bureau. You might even catch us sipping some expressos between podcast sessions.

SPEAKER_05 47:38

Or tequila. Definitely tequila tell Bureau the built world sent you and you'll get 50% off your first month's membership. See you out there. Cheers later well it sounds like you got into real estate at the perfect time in New York in in the 80s and 90s and then again at the perfect time in Miami in 2009. Right.

SPEAKER_00 47:54

So I got 2009 I cleaned the business organized everything the document that this the that uh should be taught in business school how I did it really seriously how you just come clean house and uh like I told the person in charge you know I said it's tough timing and I understand that now on this board cannot be two captains must be one captain and understand I cannot fire myself like this I must fire you. And he said okay I gave him compensation what he wanted we shook hand and he left and then I started doing the clean house and the cleaning because it was very political also and this is when you when there's no ownership it's become political many times. So we need to clean up uh I keep saying the word cleanup it was little cleanup and we organized everything and went on my way I went to Jersey City I was able I was some more warehouses for the document because at the time also lost money in the stock market I had no cash so I needed to work with you know with what I have. But you had real estate you had you had I had real estate I have ever but it wasn't it was uh all the cash disappeared so I needed to start really Ocus pocus it did the planet helped me you know somehow I don't know I cannot even redo it if I to explain you how it happened. One thing led to the next and I got to Jersey City and I came up with the whole idea of uh of the mana contemporary to build this art center with one of the buildings and then I ended up buying everything around in Jersey City in Jersey City because you see I used to move people and move arts and store it uh in storage unlock the the room and walk away and I would say what a waste such a beautiful piece sitting in this room and my idea was to create a facility like Milk Studio what we did over there but to have a lifestyle to it also so we built huge shelves where you put the your arts and and and and big room we built for people to come party with the arts bring the friends for parties and this and that and from there it was like a fire in a field and and it became uh uh a big success where artists came to work to to work there live there collectors uh today is by any means it's better than a museum so when when did you start buying property in Jersey City long time uh 2009 i ex again my expenditure was 2009 where I came back uh with vengeance angry upset disappointed and I start because my the meat picking was a good experience how I can change areas same time I came to Winwood almost simultaneously and when was the first time you came to Miami 2009 2009 as a business yeah and Winwood was I came originally to expand my storage business to uh to Winwood to buy a warehouse but uh I saw something totally different in Wynwood that storage it was broken down warehouse the whole thing again it's interesting story how I ended up getting it back it was 15 million then it was I walked away and then one day I I called the guy the broker from nowhere what happened to this building and said in foreclosure I was able to get it for five million for five million and I borrowed money from a friend of mine made soul rest in peace and I bought it and the idea was to build the cultural hub of Miami because I was a victim of South Beach I call it a victim you go out to the clubs and and and the charge I'm in a leg and and I didn't like this scene were you were you you said those 12 years were you drinking a lot were you were you just just partying too much partying also broken heart for big part of it big part of it was broken heart were we drinking a lot too or no drinking more than the usual yeah but it wasn't the problem with drinking yeah it was broken heart it was broken heart yeah yes yeah yeah yeah but uh I was but also I was in relationship uh it's a long story somehow you can easily lose 12 years and not know what you what happened you know easily and say holy shit what happened uh but good I caught myself on time and then I came to Winwood and and I figured this is the opportunity here to move South Beach over here and I started buying left and right I didn't have money I had money I needed to borrow from friends uh anything I if I need to sell anything buy buy buy buy I did 160 deals I bought it at$20 a foot$30 a foot twenty five dollars a foot people did not want it and I said here we're gonna move south which you're gonna be the sustainable cultural hub of Miami and I was able to assemble 45 acres in Whitewood yeah yeah and then I was doing the street arts the music event the fashion event uh I spent money I didn't have two three million dollars a year as I was making more and getting banking to help me a little bit because beginning banking didn't want to deal with it and I was really mortgaging properties in order to do street arts you know it's uh and uh everybody I told five to ten years five you know it's and the first time when I drove by I used to check the neighborhood from time to time when I saw two girls walking with skirts it was 11 12 o'clock I called my friend and said we made it again I told you so you know what uh you obviously saw a parallel to the meat packing district how how long did it take for the meat packing district to take off like to to to become what it was from what five years five years more or less so that's why I said five years.

SPEAKER_05 54:38

So it's the same thing with yeah you could see like yeah five years four years yeah but it's exactly the same timetable of Winwood interesting but it took a lot of active involvement right you're doing a lot of a lot of activations a lot of events a lot of activation like three points I will I give them the money to start I came up with the idea I didn't even take any shares I wasn't interested in owning a party and I don't regret it.

SPEAKER_04 55:03

I mean every time I see it I'm so glad that uh that we're able to do it they they moved three points now right they've been doing it at our place are they gonna do it next year as well there this year they're doing it oh okay cool so 6000 people and I gave them the space I gave them money helped them in the process and uh uh this is what we did at the end of the day you know we were like a big major catalyst of the transformation of uh Winwood and so but you still own the real estate in Jersey City you still own real estate in New York City as well in the meat packing district no real meatpacking I have some real estate and I have some real set in New York but um actually I'm trying to limit my my will get rid of you because you know I I'm doing I'm selling really basically what's not relevant for for for what I'm doing and focusing and putting the money where I need it to be.

SPEAKER_00 56:03

And that's in Florida? Florida mainly yeah only only yeah and I have properties all over so I sold some you know to do what I was doing and so the we would start really happening and it's happening and it's a cra I'm very proud to be a leader in this transformation and uh at the same time I came with the idea I'm I'm an idea admin and I'm not afraid to do because as I was putting my foot on the ground my boots on the ground they say I realized Miami is very weak economically and people ask me for jobs and I didn't understand how weak it was talk about 2010 11 13 so I came up with the building global hub to facilitate the tr the trade between Latin America North America and the Far East and I had businesses in China this is for the people they say that I'm a Chinese agent I think that's where the rumor started for sure right yeah no I was trying at the beginning to help Chinese to come seriously yeah because at the time China was a different China yeah so I came to build this global hub with the idea a robust idea where we can uh we can uh uh create economy in Miami and because you see trading used to be B2B physical when the internet came up it was the early time of the internet still everybody went digital but I said we need digital digital and physical to do um to do business and people forgot the physical let's do the physical and digital so instead of flying to China or flying to Latin America or Latin to America where they're flying let's make a place where everybody's going to meet a marketplace B2B and we got 10 million square feet from the city from the county was okay 10 million for the vision and I put so much money and time running to China and running to Vietnam and running to Latin America signing agreement and then Trump came America first with all of his this nonsense that I I I didn't connect because from a young age I was a globalist and I was thinking global and blew me out of the water really I mean the speeches and the language and everything about immigrants and it blew out everybody in the world out of the water you know so we I froze the project so and then I came up with the phrase closing your home doesn't make your home safe and throwing your garbage through the window doesn't keep your home clean this is a rebuttal to the 2016 so one night I went early on already I was looking at the downtown and the downtown was uh empty.

SPEAKER_05 59:26

Well one time walking in it was a ghost town I said why is it like this all this but and right away I understood what I could do with sitting I didn't know downtown even as much as I was in Miami two years or three years I didn't know yet I never seen it but I fell in love with downtown immediately immediately so this is 2016 2016 what's up builds we're interrupting the podcast because we want to make some money together with you guys we have a uh lease coming up that we're representing the uh landlord on it's in East Hylia this thing is sweet then it's a really sick warehouse I mean probably one of the nicest warehouses we've ever been it is the nicest warehouse we've ever been in probably been the nicest warehouse we've ever been in this thing's got 25000 square feet of total space 5000 feet on two floors of class A office I mean class A-ish industrial dude no this is sick this is a sick office it is a sick office it's the sickest office I've seen in industrial space yeah marble floors really nice bathrooms these guys built it out for themselves but aren't ready to occupy this space yet so they hired us to find a a short term tenant looking for a three year lease term on this thing uh 18 bucks a foot modified gross the the 2000 square feet of the industrial space has 19 foot clear ceiling heights and everything's brand new brand new LED lighting everything's clean 2400 amps of power three phase more than you could ever use it's a it's a beast fully air conditioned too fully AC'd yeah yeah so um they're looking for a short term lease they're super reasonable if you got a tenant reach out to us cheers I had a a company that I started um that was a a zoning software company called Gritics and our office was in the DuPont building right um and so I love the DuPont building it's beautiful isn't it um and uh I so I I've I've lived in in downtown for almost the last 10 years I feel like you still live but no no I mean you know I've I I I've worked in in downtown you know I I I spent the last 10 years working in downtown so I've seen what's been happening there so you and that's about the right the time that I started our office in downtown and was 2016.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:34

So it was abandoned so over the last within 10 years I was able to accumulate 80 properties. Yep a zero bye bye bye no question ask because the time I had the arguments with we work folks um because I told them that their business model gonna end up uh is going to fail and they're gonna go to jail at one point I told them in my house. Well it failed but it didn't go to jail and you made it about a shitload of money I'm glad they didn't I'm glad they didn't uh but I really and I wrote it here I explained why the software and why Bigway is going to go would get bankrupt when it was 50 billion dollars and because it was not a community that was selling and it was not technology companies selling it's a real estate location business. Yeah and I warned them it's the it's controlled dilution of uh the culture and we'll sit with no upside and I gave them million reasons why it's going to go bankrupt. I call it so you were you were talking to Adam I talked to Adam I talked to his people I talked I have a long story with them. But at one point I tell them go leave my house and you're gonna go to jail I I disagree with you all. And they say give me the money what do you want to do I said it's better not taking the money than taking the money and go to jail you realize it uh I it's$1520 a day I call it the nightclub business model without a thousand dollars bottle upside of a thousand dollar bottle you know but I told them listen you want to build community it has to be physical also physical and digital and downtown fit this vision and I came to them and said listen 500 million dollars we can buy in Thai downtown but they didn't want to have hard assets so called I didn't have the money and I didn't have even the vision that I can buy so many. But somehow again it's a planetary thing it's a karma whatever you call it the planets are just sending you equity partners huh? Listen I mean we all we do not know why how what you know but I'm definitely I'm positive there was a planetary help it did not come out of nothing. It's a miracle I ended up buying 80 properties um I designed the street I designed the street the flagler the flagler street which has taken six years to do I put the money I put the money I sat with Joe who sat down in Dillon we put the Steve into the street I went to Imenas at the time he was mayor and he convinced him to give me money for this to start it he committed seven million but we needed more later on Francis just got elected he gave us the rest of the money and then the FPL and the whole thing and that's the way we did the downtown and in a funny way in upsetting way I can say you know I mean people uh whoever they are the the commissioners or they give big speeches sometimes I don't even get invited and they give these pictures about how it was their vision totally denying me for what I did. And I put the first$150,000 to do it you know and what is the vision for downtown okay so let me explain you how the vision evolved over the years and and this is something that it's again it's like an onion that you peel it and then you find the best of it and my whole work in Miami and my whole work in the Far East my whole work in Latin America I was able to conclude that Latin America and North America should be one economy and China's one and a half billion people at one time China freaked the f the shit out of me the way they were controlling everything I sold my business in China luckily ahead of time I had a big business over there with 13 cities and I ran away from China a little to say it because it became very controlling. What was your business in China? Document management. It was the largest document management in China. And I come to the conclusion that if America wants to compete with China, one and a half billion. And I saw China from 1996, I saw China running like this. And we'll compete with India, that still is going to come roaring, one and a half billion people. We're only 20-50 million people, declining, declining population. So we cannot compete with them as an economy. So the only way is to make Latin America North America one economy, 1.1 billion people economy, capitalizing on the resources of Latin America, capitalizing on the brain of Latin America. So the vision is because you see, Latin America is very fragmented. It's rich continent, but poor countries. And no one country can compete by itself unless it becomes part of a union. Europe is a union, America's Union, China's Union, India is a union, UE is a union. So it has to be a cluster of economies. That's why Africa is so poor and getting cannibalized daily. And then now Latin America, which China started doing it. And the resources, the the rubbing of the resources, I figure this was something that I was so so like so aware of what's happening in real time. At one point, talking about an agent of China. 2016, I was in China invited by the president of Panama in Chinese. It was a room about 40 people, 50 people. They're talking about creating a huge, building a huge project on the mouth of the canal, the Panama Canal. A colony, literally a colony. Housing, warehouse, trades, billions of dollars investment. And I freaked out at that meeting. I said, Where is America? America is sleeping. Because I saw maps of invasion, literally. Buying the seashores, buying the fishing. It was a plan. And where is America? What's happening in America? And 2019, right before the pandemic, when the new president of Panama got elected, I went to him and I ended up having two meetings with him, every meeting an hour and a half. The guy fell in love with me. And I told him, and I had ideas what to do, what to correct. But I told him, basically, if you think that Panama can be the nomad show for the Chinese people, you're wrong. America is sleeping on the steering wheel. But then when I wake up, it's a sleepy tiger gonna wake up. You know what they're gonna do? They're gonna take the canal away from you. America, I have the right to take the canal away from you. He said, What should I do? I said, cancel the agreement. Because already they start working over there doing work. And he did cancel the agreement. I know I was able to, I do not know how he was able to cancel it. But a friend of mine brought a British company, uh England from England to buy the asset of the Chinese that they built 10 cents on the dollar. But I can't even imagine Trump waking up and seeing Chinese sitting on the canal, you know. So uh I was early on with what's going on. So today, for the first time, I'm again I have huge disagreement with Trump about everything just about. But he's the only one who woke up and said, wait a minute, what is going on? He's looking at Canada, he's looking at Mexico, the Drua Cartel, he's looking at El Salvador, he's looking at Colombia, he's looking at Panama. This deal Panama that he was uh he was upset about, it was done in the 80s, 90s with uh the Hutchinson group. So America woke up of a sudden, what's going on next next to us? And the invasion for Venezuela did not come out of nowhere. So today, when I speak about it, I laugh. Because everybody who comes talking about Latin America, he's talking about part of the elephant, but not about the whole elephant. How do we approach Latin America issues? So if we approach it the way Europe, the European market approached it, it's union collaboration of military, economic, and human resources.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:46

So you you envision like an American Union like the European Union?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:50

100%. It's going to happen. You think so? And Miami to become the Western Hemisphere global hub.

SPEAKER_04 1:10:56

So this would be the capital of it all?

SPEAKER_00 1:10:58

The Western Hemisphere Global Hub, yes, the capital.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:01

And is that your vision for downtown? Is that how that all links back?

SPEAKER_00 1:11:04

So once I was doubling my then I was sure that this is the direction I should take. Because matter of time when my mind is going to be coming, it's a matter of time when America is going to wake up and realize it. And the vision is, of course, build live, work, play kind of situation. Um make a real downtown that we have tech, we have fashion, we have art. Remake the meat packing, actually, if I can. Um not to do brickle, with all respect to brickle. So it has really something that because they have to marry the old and the new together. And that's what we've been doing.

SPEAKER_05 1:11:51

What would be different from it from than Brickle? Like, what would you not do downtown that Brickle has done? What would you do to differentiate it?

SPEAKER_00 1:11:59

Brickle is mount on the glasses, with all due respect. It doesn't, it's it's uh it's a city by all means, it's not a neighborhood. That's where the suits hang out. It's all where all the suits are. Yeah, it's a good idea. It's not a neighborhood. But you see, again, I don't look to develop every building, although I can. I look more what legacy I'm gonna leave behind. And uh it's like something that you are drawing, and you want to leave something that's nice. And and I don't want to really uh many is this building I need to, some of the building I need to demolish. I have no idea how much heartbreak I had in the process.

SPEAKER_04 1:12:39

Okay, because there were there were a couple of buildings just in the last six months that have been demolished. Um and uh and listen, I I agree with you. I think downtown has a lot of potential, but you are one of the largest landowners on Flagler. And listen, the it's taken six years for them to do Flagler Street, which is unacceptable.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:02

That should have been six, seven years, yes, endless.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:04

It should have been done two years ago. That whole construction is is just terrible for every business on Flagler Street, every luggage store, every luggage store, every perfume store.

SPEAKER_05 1:13:17

There's like 400 luggage stores in Flagler Street.

SPEAKER_04 1:13:20

Um but you know that uh who knows when that's gonna reopen, but it's it's sort of open now, but cars can't go on there. Um, but there's a lot of vacancy downtown now. Um how do we uh are are you are you gonna start offering, I mean, a lot of that retail. You just bought another office building for 110 million. Are you gonna are you gonna be able to offer that at a discount so people can really start moving in there um and and start bringing businesses in there? Because we we really need businesses downtown, and you walk that place and it's an absolute shithole right now.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:03

Okay, so I explained too. You know how long it took to build the Miami Walt? Like 20 years. 30 years. How long have I been buying properties? 10 years. Okay, number one. Number two, I depend on the city to do the job, the street, because nobody in the right mind wants to open a business over there.

SPEAKER_04 1:14:30

Okay, not during construction.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:32

Okay. Third, Miami, and I'm looking at the mechanic, I'm saying it's the worst city absolutely to do any kind of innovation. In fact, now I'm about to sign some deals for restaurants, and I wanted to curate it very carefully because I had the experience of. I'm sitting now, and I can tell you it's gonna be a three year process, no matter how, by the time they open up. It is such a difficult process for everything, everything takes weeks, takes months to okay, so many agencies involved. It's the West City absolutely to do any kind of innovation.

SPEAKER_04 1:15:14

You think you think with Eileen Higgins now being the new mayor, things will improve? Or is is this just the the red tape that has been you know created in the city over decades? Is is she gonna be capable of breaking that down? All right.

SPEAKER_00 1:15:32

Well, first of all, I wish Eileen Higgin good luck. And um I wish her good luck. The problem in the in Miami, you have Mawa, uh you have mayors that have no power. It wasn't that Francis was bad, they just don't have power to make any decisions. But I'm kind of disappointed from Eileen, I tell you something right now, and I'm not ashamed to say it. But she because she never really bothered to see what we are doing in the process when we don't have when we don't have this construction. Okay. I know you she was counting and I and I'm still waiting for her to come to my office and say, Moshe, how can I help you? Okay, to expedite things. But during these years, have you heard about the Manatech Organization? I'm sorry? The Manatech Organization? I've heard of that. I've heard it. Okay. So what the Manatech Organization really basically is to execute the vision of the one America. We bring all these technology companies, I'm financing it. We bring them to downtown education, connection, raise money, collaboration, anything that they need. Last year, we have 35,000 members in our place, in our membership. Last year we did 135 events, this year 250 events. We raised 90 million dollars last year for these companies. We brought the French chambers with French Viva Tech. We are so active, I spending millions of dollars doing it. Do I get credit for it to anybody? Zero. Why? Because they don't know. So they want to be translated to buildings that I cannot build. You understand? So I am critical of really the the way the uh the bureaucracy and over the years it was a very long process to get in line with the city and and uh and they steal so many things. We just now opened the street, okay? For God fucking sake. Is it open now? It's part of the street. Yeah, they wouldn't let us sit outside. So we need special regulation, and the guy closed the street, closed the restaurant, closed everything because you got ticketing. Come on, man. I mean, yes, Eileen just got involved. Hopefully, she can solve it. But so many rules and so many regulations from the 50s, from the 90s, from the 40s, from occupancy rate, and uh, you want to connect to building, you got to do file. It's a piece of paper. I need to wait a year. You understand? Yeah, but we have big plans for downtown. I think downtown is gonna be the coolest city. I'm paying eight million dollars maybe a year just taxes for the city. I believe it. Not to mention, not to mention the mortgage, and but I have patience. Yes, I can go real right away, build cheap construction, and uh and make it a dumb place, but it's not what I want to do. It's a downtown of Miami. What is it? So it's not even economic, the most part of it, but it will come economic. I believe in it. I believe in downtown, I believe in what I'm doing. But uh now finally the street is open, so I I people start to see the vision. Actually, the last few days and the last few weeks approached some people and they were there two years ago, they couldn't believe me, but very major players in the in the uh food and food entertainment. Now they understand. People need to see it. You know, but I wasn't meatpaking, I was in Jersey City, I was in Wynwood. I just wait. I think it's a jewel downtown. I love downtown. I think strategically sitting there the best place anywhere north of uh the bridge, gonna be uh the future of Miami. People do not want to go onto the bridge.

SPEAKER_05 1:19:44

No, no, no one wants to deal with percentage traffic with the bridge going up, and you have World Center on the north anchored that, so downtown is kind of the domino.

SPEAKER_00 1:19:52

So not only we did for the uh for the mana tech, mana fashion. Have you heard about mana fashion? I have. Okay, now we are in the process of finally renovating that building. It's a dump, but still we're able to put to build material rooms, showrooms, material, uh uh um uh uh showroom for for designers. Uh a lot of fashion events that we're doing. I'm trying to bring the spirit uh of New York. For the first time last year we did uh an event with Colombia Moda in Winwood, and I can breathe in because I can see New York, uh, how it started, what we did in the meat packing, and and and how we supported fashion design and how it started and the culture we brought in. So basically, I tell people, you know, I don't build buildings, I build culture. That's the most important fundamental thing, you know. Uh I mean the building is really to house the culture. So I'm putting emphasis on the culture that we need in Miami. Miami still has a long way to build it in terms of passion, everything, you know. And uh they tell me why you're critical of Miami. I'm not critical, it's something that for the longest time Miami was a tourist destination, and and now it becomes a full year, and people want facilities and they want services, and and that's what we are doing. So I don't look at it as terms of okay, it's okay, this is the building, and that's what I do. For the longest time, I try to get partners for the entire project, but nobody has the vision that I have. Nobody. Give me a building. I want to deal with the building. And at the time I used to say, listen, I bake the cake because I have a vision, because we invest in the tech, we invest in fashion, we invest in the restaurant, we invest with everything. I bake the cake and you want for me sugar and dough. Go buy your own sugar, go buy your own dough. You don't need me. So it was very hard to get uh investors, but finally I got to realize I got to cut the cake to pieces and partners with different, which now I'm dealing with some different kinds of uh of developers, investors, uh to uh to build the next phase. But first of all, we need to bring some life to the street with the restaurants and bar. We have the gallery over there of Aura and Lakato, and we have other art events we're doing. It's a lot of work every weekend, there's so much events. Again, you know, uh, you had to see my office this week. I mean, they want to to close this street fair because there's no budget for it, because the police out of it take a big chunk for this art for this uh event. So there's a lot of problems within the how this city is managing, helping managing this project. Uh and and I'm facing a lot of obstacles, not help.

SPEAKER_05 1:22:46

I think it's it's always tough to find partners, especially with what your your vision is, because you're not just interested in making money, which most developers are, just put up, maximize profits, move on. And that gets stale and boring. That you end up with brickle. That's how much you don't you don't want to do that. You want to build something with culture, and building with culture is finding thesis-aligned partners, which is exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:23:06

And I like to say, I I'm building culture, I'm selling culture, I'm not selling a building, I'm not selling an apartment. It's something you want to be in this neighborhood. But how do you do that? Is that a curation of tenants or curation of course? Of course, curation of tenants. It starts with the restaurant, and once the news comes, hopefully I can close the deal that I'm taking, I'm I'm working. Then you're gonna have a new face to it. And and I tell people who who can, and some people really not nice, maybe because they are ignorant or they just like to poke and criticize. Can't stand the they cannot stand the heat, get out of the kitchen, you know. Uh we're cooking, we're working, we're doing. I got big team, I have a big team doing it.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:50

How big is your team?

SPEAKER_00 1:23:51

Big team. Big team. We got Winwood, we got downtown, we got uh construction, development, repairs.

SPEAKER_04 1:23:57

Uh how many people work at Mana?

SPEAKER_00 1:24:00

I can't tell you. Really? I can't tell you. But uh, you know, we have, you know, we have different teams for different purposes. So we have the fashion tech, the okay, the fashion team, you have the tech team. The tech I know is about 10, 12 people. So most of it I'm financing again. I keep saying it. And then you have the food entertainment. Have you seen the Mona Lisa downtown? No. Have you seen the Mona Lisa? No, I can't believe this. It's the largest Mona Lisa in the world. It's most inspiring piece of art sitting one of my building walls. Okay, I brought this artist from Mallorca. And every time I go there, I'm saying, wow, I want to sleep here. So beautiful. Where is it? It's in Flagler. It's off Flagler? Have you seen the girl with the pearl earring? No, I don't know, I don't think so. Each mule cost me$150,000. Did I get any refund for this for money? No. But these are still up right now? It's gonna be forever.

SPEAKER_05 1:25:09

Okay. What do you mean still up? Well, I know you're demolishing a lot of those buildings down there.

SPEAKER_00 1:25:13

That's I know no, it's$150,000 investment, and I'm not getting rid of this. Uh now we're doing it by the courthouse, a huge mural. Forgot the name of the artist. It's all renaissance. I'm putting Renaissance arts, not contemporary. I like that. Cool. And uh in front of the courthouse, we're doing uh Moses with the Ten Commandments. Because our society is so outlaws, I was trying to be smart as and make it a broken Ten Commandments. But I said, okay, let's go with what happened. Because I wanted to put a twist to it too, but let it go.

SPEAKER_04 1:25:52

So you think you think Miami, downtown Miami is gonna look a lot different five, ten years from now? What's what what do you think?

SPEAKER_00 1:25:59

Uh I think uh five, ten years from now, you want you know to come downtown, you're gonna call me, Want you do me a favor, can I come into downtown? I it's too crowded. Uh no, seriously, like listen, we're just finishing the Nikola Tesla building after so many years. This was one of my worst investments, I can tell you. But I was I fell in love with the idea of creating a tech hub and called Nikola Tesla. Go downtown, see a beautiful mural, a beautiful lobby. Cost me millions of dollars lobby. It's a class A building, it's a boutique class A building. Uh go see, I mean, we're finishing it soon. Um, so we're doing stuff and we're renovation of the of the uh uh fashion building, renovation of different buildings there that we're doing now. We're in process, uh you're doing it, but again, it's not easy process. Everything takes weeks and months, and we're and do you have you have you have sometime I want to disappear and come back in five seconds.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:00

I believe it. I believe it. Do you have uh a master plan for all these for all these sites already? Like are there what's going to be the mix of officer?

SPEAKER_00 1:27:08

We have kind of a master plan, but you see, every every every plan can is subject to change. Um but also with the economic situation that we have today, the instability and the craziness and the madness of uh our president, I'm kind of very careful, scared. Uh I'm not scared, but very cautious. Cautious. Because I can't wake up like with this war, for instance. I mean, where did you come up with this one? I mean, um anyway, so it's uh every day something different. And it's very difficult to project four years and five years ahead of time. Because I'm afraid we're heading towards a recession. This can bring us, this war can bring us to a recession.

SPEAKER_05 1:27:56

Real estate's tough with high interest rates, and if you have to raise any kind of LP. Capital, it's not easy to get development out of the ground.

SPEAKER_00 1:28:03

Environment for instability is uh not a good environment for business in general. And uh living by the by the tweet is very uh yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:28:15

So meat packing, Wynwood, downtown. Where's the next spot? Isn't that enough?

SPEAKER_00 1:28:23

I don't know, knowing you, you know, you're always looking into the future. No, listen, I uh I mean the vision is connecting Latin America and North America and anything to do, it's connect, it's connecting that really. Anything to do with it. Listen, I'm in Colombia involved. I'm going to go on a big tech event uh event with that uh we're we're part of, and I'm a keynote speaker. There are gonna be thousands of people. This week I'm flying to Venezuela for two or three days. Uh uh it's about connecting that. I've been in Saoudia from since 2016 and you know, 19 and and so forth. So I'm not the uh you know, it's it's it's it's something how this vision can can can become real. Bringing mayors from different cities we work on it because mayors connect cities, the world to cities, and mayors use technology, bringing economy ministers together, bringing um uh ex-president. We start with ex-president of countries together. And basically, I said uh one day I was I was talking in public and and this guy approached me, and this is maybe people who don't understand what I'm doing. And he came to me, he's a German guy, successful man. He researched the Medici family and wrote books about the Medici family. He came to me, he said, introduced himself, say, you know what? You remind me of what the Medici did, basically. They invested in art, they invested in fashion, they invested in in real estate, they invested in technology, they finance a lot of this, uh, you know. So you're doing this kind of of uh uh, you know, this kind of vision that you have. And basically that's what I have. Some people want to believe me, believe me, don't won't believe me, don't believe me. I mean, it's your choice. But at least I have good intention. If I'm gonna succeed, time will tell. Hopefully, you're gonna be happy if I succeed. And and those are people criticizing me. Uh uh you know, will be on board as well.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:27

Are you still looking to buy more property in downtown?

SPEAKER_00 1:30:30

I'm big on downtown. I love downtown. Um, if anything, any piece that I can have uh that can really uh can that can help the vision, it's a puzzle they put together? Yes, definitely. You know, do you we just bought this building at 10,000 square feet? Yeah, yeah, 450,000 square feet.

SPEAKER_03 1:30:55

And you bought it at a discount from when it traded in 2018.

SPEAKER_04 1:30:57

Huge discount.

SPEAKER_00 1:30:58

Yeah, but I have plans, you know. I mean, uh did you see the museum tower, the museum cafe that we did? No, I have not seen that. Okay, so the museum tower, it's sitting right in front of the courthouse. So we're building share office space for lawyers, first-class share office space for lawyers. We built the museum cafe downstairs, and the first phase, but now we have a second phase, gonna be cafe bar. And we have the Vincent Van Gogh, uh the street cafe or Vincent Mengogh at the at the entry, a huge mural. And now I'm flying to New York. There's a statue that I want to buy or maybe create for Vincent Mengogh sitting and and and and and and creating, and a chair next to him, and he can come and ask him questions. Okay, so this is what part of building culture. You understand? Um, how much the the sculpture is gonna cost me? 200,000? This is part of the puzzle. And I'm not hesitant. I have the money and uh and um and I don't measure everything with uh dollar and sense, you know. So the future, first of all, you need to survive, we need to survive this crazy time. And let's see. I think that's we we take the future like it's I mean, we we don't know. It's really a difficult time now we're facing with the whole AI and everything else that's uh coming up.

SPEAKER_04 1:32:27

Well, listen, I think Ben and I are big believers in downtown. We'd love nothing more to see downtown prosper. It it it's it's kind of like the like Ben was saying, the donut hole right now. We have Brickle, we have um, you know, uh Miami World Center to the north. Um the the piece that we really need to fill in is Flagless. So um, you know, hopefully people are listening to this podcast. Um, maybe we can, you know, drive some tenants your way that want to be part of this, you know, transformation of downtown and whatever we can do to help too. I mean, we're big believers in downtown. We'd love to.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:04

It's a very heavy lifting, believe it or not. It's not a regular pro it's a regular project. You go and you take a piece of land and you put the building up, and you know what, you know, there's pl plenty around you. Yeah, it is a broken-down neighborhood, you know, and uh uh it it it takes a lot to bring back to life, and I will bring it to life.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:25

I hope so, because it needs it.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:27

I hope so too, because I have all my money and my life running around Flagly District.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:31

How much money have you dumped into the Flagler district or downtown?

SPEAKER_03 1:33:35

It's becoming into the billions, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:37

Yeah, of course.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:39

Of course, it's a big bet.

SPEAKER_04 1:33:41

It's a big bet, huge bet.

SPEAKER_05 1:33:42

I think it's a safe bet, though.

SPEAKER_03 1:33:44

Yeah, it's and don't ask me why I'm doing it, please, because I have no answers.

SPEAKER_00 1:33:53

Driven by the universe. Yeah, we don't know. We do what to the best of our understanding.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:00

That's it. All right. Well, it's beautiful to hear your story, and it was great getting to know you, Moish. I appreciate you coming down and sharing with us.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:07

Seriously, it was uh I'm um I think this is gonna be a podcast that a lot of people are gonna listen to. Um, a lot of people have been wanting to hear your story. Uh, and uh a lot of people I think are are rooting for downtown, and hopefully uh you're gonna be a big part of that transformation.

SPEAKER_00 1:34:24

Thank you, thank you. We need many horses, it's not one to push this this uh wiggle.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:30

And hopefully the city of Miami is listening to this. Yeah, get your fucking shit together, right? Get it together, guys. All right, thanks, Moish. Thank you, thank you so much. Have a wonderful evening. Thank you.

SPEAKER_03 1:34:41

Thank you, everybody. Yeah, thank you.

SPEAKER_05 1:34:43

Okay, looking forward. Bye-bye. This episode is brought to you by Built World Advisors. Yeah, that's us. We're not your typical commercial brokerage. We combine deep market knowledge with a media platform that actually connects to people doing deals, the developers, brokers, architects, and attorneys.

SPEAKER_04 1:34:58

Let's not forget the investors, Ben. From warehouses in East Hilia to off market gems in Alapata, we help you find value where others aren't looking. If you're tired of waiting for opportunities to land in your inbox, let's talk.

SPEAKER_05 1:35:09

Built World Advisors, real estate for the people who get shit done. You can check us out at Builtworld Advisors.com.