S5 E16: Spiritual Beings in the Unseen Realm

Season 5 covers the supernatural and paranormal from a Spirit-led perspective. In this episode, Glenn takes a high-level look at spiritual beings other than God and humans. When were beings like angels created? Do angels have wings? And what about the possibility that Bigfoot or aliens can be fallen angels? Glenn answers what he can, and acknowledges that in some areas we can only speculate.

The Bible will be the source of truth for this season, even though extra-biblical books and podcasts will be discussed. As discussed in Episode 1, Glenn will be kind to the authors and podcast hosts discussed throughout the season.

This episode has a transcript. If your podcast player does not support transcripts, please go to the Transcripts section of https://spiritledhope.com/ These transcripts have been edited for accuracy and are typically of higher quality than those produced automatically by many podcast apps.

Transcript

S5 E16 TRANSCRIPT 

SPIRITUAL BEINGS IN THE UNSEEN REALM

INTRODUCTION

Hello everyone, and welcome to Spirit-Led Hope. My name is Glenn Erichsen, and in this episode, we are talking about:

     SPIRITUAL BEINGS IN THE UNSEEN REALM

I have noticed that as we get deeper into the Season, it is getting harder not to talk more deeply about spiritual beings, like angels and demons. For example, I do not know how to talk about the dangers of seeking out the dead without mentioning evil spirits. I thought that it would be good in this episode to step back and look at what the Bible says about spiritual beings, other than God and humans.

One of the dilemmas we will face right away, is that the Bible feels a bit stingy on many of the details we would like to know. There are well-known parts of the Bible which include angels and demons, but there are not a lot of intricate details. We see the mention of cherubim and seraphim, but only a few notes about their function or how they look. There are a couple of sentences in the Bible mentioning creatures like goat-demons. That sounds mysterious.

I am going to tell you right up front that I do not know a lot of the answers. This last year I listened to many hours of podcasts and read several books by content creators, and it frustrates me a bit to see how confident many of them are about their theories. I am not saying this to criticize them, I am just saying that I have some cautious skepticism about some of these things. And I am frequently reluctant to go as far as they do.

For example, recently I have heard a lot of conversation surrounding a pre-Adamic flood. This belief looks at Genesis 1:2 and says that the earth was without form and void because Lucifer launched an angelic uprising that occurred before Adam and Eve were created. Because of this uprising, the creation of life on earth gets a do-over which we read about in Genesis chapter 1. You might hear some of this approach called the Gap Theory, and it has been around since the 1800’s.

Now, do I think such an angelic uprising and flood happened? I think it might be, maybe, possible. I think if you are careful with Scripture, and pull in some extra-biblical material, you might make a strong case for it. And you can probably make a case for it without saying something heretical. But if you are not careful, you can also use this belief to build a house of cards. The cautious skeptic in me wants to be very careful how I treat anything that seems tangential to the clearest teachings in Scripture.  

Remember how earlier in the season we discussed Dr. Heiser’s book “The Unseen Realm?” I have noticed that this book seems to have stimulated the growth of more belief in things like the Gap Theory. Many Christians are developing a much greater and cohesive picture of how spiritual beings in the unseen realm fit into the Christian faith. This in turn is getting many Christians back to reading their Bibles.

That is all good. But, again, the cautious skeptic in me wants to be careful. I am very interested in spiritual beings. But I never want that interest to elevate above my desire to know God better, or to be transformed to look like Jesus, and to do the things Jesus did, through the power of the Holy Spirit. It is those things that are essential for living out the Great Commission. And it is those things that are essential when it is time to judge spiritual beings or to take authority over them. We will look more at that in later episodes when we talk about exorcisms.

THE ORIGIN OF SPIRITUAL BEINGS

Let us now look at the origin of spiritual beings, other than God and humans. We first see other spiritual beings mentioned in the third chapter of Genesis. That is very early in our Bibles which I believe tells us something about the importance of understanding these things. The first mention is where the serpent appears in Genesis 3:1. This is what we read…

Now the serpent was the most cunning of all the wild animals that the Lord God had made…

Genesis 3:1 CSB

If this were the only verse we had, we might be tempted to say that the serpent was a creature, like other animals, who had the power of speech. But as the rest of the story unfolds, and in the hindsight provided in later books of the Bible, we discover that the serpent is a powerful spiritual being.

This being deceives Eve, Adam then sins, and this results in the expulsion of Adam and Eve from the Garden of Eden. This is where we see more spiritual beings as we read again from Genesis 3… 

The Lord God said, “Since the man has become like one of us, knowing good and evil, he must not reach out, take from the tree of life, eat, and live forever.” So the Lord God sent him away from the garden of Eden to work the ground from which he was taken. He drove the man out and stationed the cherubim and the flaming, whirling sword east of the garden of Eden to guard the way to the tree of life.

Genesis 3:22-24 CSB

So here we see that the cherubim are named, but we are not given too many details. As we have also noted in other episodes, God said that “man has become like one of us.” The “us” in this verse is often argued to be God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit, or you can make the case that the “us” refers to spiritual beings of the Divine Counsel. Both views can be defended.

One of the main points we want to see in this episode is that the serpent and the cherubim were present at the very start of human history. The question now is whether they were created before or after humans, or maybe at the same time.

To find the answer to that question we jump to verses like Job 38:7. In Job, God answers Job’s questions with his own questions. For example, God says to Job…

Where were you when I established the earth? Tell me, if you have understanding. Who fixed its dimensions? Certainly you know! Who stretched a measuring line across it? What supports its foundations? Or who laid its cornerstone while the morning stars sang together and all the sons of God shouted for joy?

Job 38:7 CSB

We saw earlier this season that the “sons of God” language in this verse is the language used to refer to the Divine Council. This verse indicates the pleasure of the Divine Council as God established the earth. We can see from this verse that members of the Divine Council, and other beings like them, came before humans.

TYPES OF SPIRITUAL BEINGS

Now that we know spiritual beings were created before humans, what can we say about them? And this is where we enter the realm where we risk blending facts and speculation. Despite what I said earlier, it is perfectly fine to speculate about things in the unseen realm and spiritual beings. We just need to be careful not to build our faith and doctrine on speculation. But speculation is part of our curious nature, and it is one of the tools we use to discover the truth. It can also be a lot of fun. Let us start by looking at some of the facts about these spiritual beings. Later, let us have some fun and start speculating.

One of the things we see in the Bible is that non-human spiritual beings are described in a few different ways. We see the Bible talk about their nature, and their status in relationship to humans and each other. The Bible also describes some of their functions. Dr. Heiser, the author of “The Unseen Realm” has a book called “Angels” which goes into this more deeply. He also wrote a book called “Demons.” These two books are academic and go way deeper than anything I am going to say. If you enjoy the writing style of Dr. Heiser, and he is not for everyone, then you will find these two books useful.

While the Bible does not always give us the details we want to know, it does talk extensively about angels, demons, and other spiritual beings. For example, we read this about angels from the book of Hebrews…

Are they not all ministering spirits sent out to serve those who are going to inherit salvation?

Hebrews 1:14 CSB

Here we see that angels, by nature, are spirit. Unlike us, they are spiritual beings without a physical body. We also see that one of their functions is to minister to humans. They do that in several ways. In fact, the word for “angel” means “messenger” and one of the roles of angels is to deliver messages. An example of this is found in Matthew 28:1-7.

After the Sabbath, as the first day of the week was dawning, Mary Magdalene and the other Mary went to view the tomb. There was a violent earthquake, because an angel of the Lord descended from heaven and approached the tomb. He rolled back the stone and was sitting on it. His appearance was like lightning, and his clothing was as white as snow. The guards were so shaken by fear of him that they became like dead men. The angel told the women, “Don’t be afraid, because I know you are looking for Jesus who was crucified. He is not here. For he has risen, just as he said. Come and see the place where he lay. Then go quickly and tell his disciples, ‘He has risen from the dead and indeed he is going ahead of you to Galilee; you will see him there.’ Listen, I have told you.”

Matthew 28:1-7 CSB

In this account we see an angel giving a message, but we also see more of what angels can do. This angel was able to roll back a massive stone, and his presence terrified the Roman guards who were probably pretty tough. 

We also see in this account that angels, even though they are spirits, can take on human form and interact with physical objects. How this works is never explained. But remember, in an earlier episode we saw this in Genesis chapter 6 when the sons of God took human women for wives. We also see this in Genesis 19 where two angels visit Lot in Sodom. These angels were certainly in physical form because men of the city wanted to have physical relations with them. 

One thing I find interesting about these angels we just mentioned is that there is no indication they had wings. Even in the book of Luke when the heavenly host appear to the shepherds, the Bible just says they appeared and then left. There is no indication that they flew using wings or had any visible means of transportation. Suddenly they were there, and suddenly they were gone.

So why do we often think of angels as having wings? One reason is because some spiritual beings are described as having wings. For example, there are the seraphim and cherubim. 

We mentioned the cherubim earlier when we read about them guarding the tree of life. We know from this, that cherubim are guardians, or at least that is one of their functions. And we know that cherubim have wings because they are the beings who covered the ark of the covenant. If you have ever seen the movie “Raiders of the Lost Ark,” or you know details about the ark from the book of Exodus, you know that figurines of two cherubim were on the top of the ark. Their wings spread out over the ark and touched in the middle. An account of cherubim in the book of Ezekiel, describes cherubim as having four wings. We know then that a cherub has either two wings or four wings, depending on how it presents itself.

Seraphim are a whole different species than the cherubim. Listen to how they are described by Isaiah…

In the year that King Uzziah died, I saw the Lord seated on a high and lofty throne, and the hem of his robe filled the temple. Seraphim were standing above him; they each had six wings: with two they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they flew. And one called to another: Holy, holy, holy is the Lord of Armies; his glory fills the whole earth. The foundations of the doorways shook at the sound of their voices, and the temple was filled with smoke.

Isaiah 6:1-4 CSB

You can tell that Isaiah is overwhelmed by the appearance of these winged seraphim. They must be awesome in their holiness. That makes sense, because they are in the Presence of God.

SOME FUN SPECULATION

I said earlier that we were going to do some speculating, but it feels like we have only scratched the surface covering what we do know about spiritual beings. We have barely talked about angels, and we certainly have not talked about what good angels or fallen angels can or cannot do. 

But let us take a moment now and have some fun speculating about spiritual beings. The reason why I think this is valuable, is because there is a whole group of Christians and non-Christians wondering how the Bible relates to the paranormal and supernatural sightings of creatures.

For example, is it possible that Bigfoot, or abominable snowmen, are spiritual beings? What about aliens? Let us think about that for a moment.

We know from Scripture that God created thousands upon thousands of spiritual beings. We also know that he created different kinds because we just talked about some of them. Could it be possible that there are thousands of different kinds of spiritual beings, that seraphim and cherubim are just two examples?

I do not think that is a stretch. When we look at the variety of life on the earth, why would we expect anything less in heaven? We also know, for a fact, that there are fallen angels. So, would it be surprising if there were angels of many different types that had fallen and are on earth? That does not seem like a stretch either.

With only a little logical speculation, it does not seem far-fetched to believe that creatures of all types could exist in the world with abilities to evade discovery, or to look like they have supernatural powers. All it would take is an intrusion of spiritual beings into our realm. We already know that angels can take on human form. Is it outlandish to believe there are spiritual beings who look like Bigfoot or gray aliens?

What do you think?

And then there is the issue of technology. The Bible does not describe how angels travel around. But in extra-biblical books like the Book of Enoch, the Watchers transferred technology to humans in exchange for females. Could it be that in heaven, spiritual beings use technology like transport ships? If so, could fallen angels have spaceships made with heaven’s technology?

It is fun and a bit mind boggling to think about, isn’t it?

The important part here is that we are not making doctrine out of any of this speculation. But at the same time, this type of speculation could come in very handy. What if, tomorrow, an alien spacecraft lands at the base of the Washington Monument? And strange looking creatures get out and start explaining that we are life forms planted by them on a previous intergalactic trip?

Would that destroy your faith in God? Think about it. Would that destroy your faith in God? It is speculation like this that can help us reason out answers ahead of time. We do not need to be shocked or caught off guard if aliens do appear and say they are our gods.

At the same time, we do not let speculation fuel fears that our homes will be overrun with leprechaun-like creatures. Or that we will not be able to recognize if aliens are good or bad if they do show up. Here is the bottom line…the Bible does seem to allow for some latitude when it comes to bizarre creatures. But it never, never, leaves the door open for confusion or fear. I suspect we will talk more about this in future episodes.

CLOSING

In the next episode let us continue this discussion about spiritual beings and our relationship with them. I may even share a couple of stories where I believe my life was saved by an angel.

As always, you can send me comments by email at glenn@spiritledhope.com. You can also send me a text message or voicemail by going to the episode show notes and clicking on the link with your smart phone. Please spread the word and share this podcast with your friends.

As you have some fun speculating…

May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace as you trust in him, so that you may overflow with hope, by the power of the Holy Spirit.  

Until the next episode, take care.

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