Sellin’ Paint | Ft. Jason Gimesky |

Today's episode we have Jason Gimesky of PPG Industries on!

Jason started his career affiliated with the autobody industry on 2011 in Transtar Autobody Technologies, Inc. As a Territory Manager where he was responsible for the sales growth and management of a multi-state territory that consists of Maryland, Washington D.C. and Northern Virginia. Jason oversaw maintaining and building a wide base of customer relationships, from distribution centers to end users. He worked within the company for 2 years.  

On April 2013, he then continued his passion within the industry and joined the PPG Industries. For 5 years, he was assigned as Territory Manager and he was responsible for developing distributor relationships and marketing to large multi shop organizations within the Baltimore-Washington Metropolitan area. After 5 years being the Territory Manager, he became the Regional Manager for a specific location for almost 4 years. He manage a team of 13 territory managers and 2 business development managers with primary focus on implementing sustainable sales growth plans and industry development in the collision market. Leading development of key distribution relationships and product growth planning with our pivotal partners in the industry.  

 Currently he has been assigned as the Zone Sales Director-East. He’s working as a Zone Sales Director for almost a year now. Jason has proven track record of sales growth at major automotive aftermarket corporations and multiple music sales companies.  

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Website: https://claritycoat.com
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Transcript

 This is the Autobody podcast presented by Clarity Coat. We'll get stories and talk to people from all over the industry, painters, body guys, manufacturers, and anybody in between. Let's do it. Welcome to the Autobody Podcast, auto Body Podcast, presented by Clarity Coat. Now, here's your host, Adam Hubert.

Hey everyone. Welcome back to the podcast. On today's episode, we have Jason Eski on from Atlanta, Georgia. He is the Zone Sales Director at PPG Industries. How you doing today, Jason? Doing well, Adam. Thanks for having me. Thank you, sir. Really do appreciate it. Um, so we're gonna kind of just hop right into it.

Um, Jason, you're kind of a young on. Kind of guy. Lots of energy optimism. I'm liking it. Um, how did you get started in the, uh, in the industry? Well, that's certainly good to hear. I don't, uh, put off a negative vibe, Adam. That's the first thing that's really good that, uh, that means I'm doing something right.

Um, . So, yeah, I got started in this business, uh, back in 2011. Um, I was right outta school. I'm wearing my, my Eastern Michigan polo today, uh, right out of eastern Michigan. And, uh, when I was graduating school at the time, uh, Adam, I, I really wasn't sure what I really wanted to do. I had, being from Michigan, I had a lot of family in the automotive industry, but if you remember in that, those days, and you know, I would call it 2008 through 2011, Uh, the, the, uh, the American automotive industry was not in a great spot, uh, with, uh, both, you know, Ford, Chrysler and GM pick one.

Uh, none of them were really in a great spot, and a couple family members and friends actually told me, they said, you know, you could probably try to come and, and work for us, but at the time, we, they just, they weren't sure how long they were even gonna be there. It's funny, we laugh about it now, but at the time it was a, it was a real worry.

But, part of, one of the pieces of advice they gave me was, you know, you really need to check out the, the autobody industry, the automotive aftermarket industry, uh, paint companies, basically because that industry is very durable and that industry is something that, although it'll evolve and it certainly is evolving, it'll always be there.

In some capacity, right? Uh, it, it, it'll, it'll change the way it's there, but it'll always be there. So I kind of took it under advisement. I didn't necessarily heavily pursue it. Um, but I'm attending a career fair at Eastern Michigan and there was a, um, smaller, uh, uh, company that was based out of Brighton, Michigan called Trans Star Automotive.

And, uh, that's where I got my start. Um, I kind of was introduced to some people that work for Trans Star and really what attracted me. Even more than the business Adam, was the people, uh, the people in the industry, the, the, the awesome people that I meet continually, uh, every day. And that's, that's what kind of drew me to it.

So my career began in, in two, yeah. Yeah. , my career began in 2011 and, uh, yeah, with, with Trendstar. Nice. Um,  Trans Star. Why is that ringing such a bell? What were, what were they really well known for? Well at they're known. They're known for a lot of things. So Trans star, um, , uh, sells, sells everything from, you know, paint to little odds and ends to, to chip guard, to rubberized undercoat.

And I, I'll tell you, it was the perfect spot for me to start, um, in a company where really you didn't have the, uh, you know, the resources, you kind of had to do it by yourself, . And that's really how I learned that, um, really was going out and, and talking to collision centers, talking to distributors. And, uh, yeah, they, they're, you know, they, and, and still to this day, I'm thankful I had that time with them.

Uh, they awesome. They were, they were really great. Great starting point for me. So, and you said that your family was heavily involved in the automotive industry, like are we talking about. Uh, they were mechanics. Is that, what, is that what you had said? Working for Ford, Chrysler, gm, uh, that, that, so on, on the line, different levels of the business.

Some of 'em were, were union assembly workers, some of 'em were management. Uh, I even have an uncle who has a test driver for Ford, which was pretty, which was pretty cool. Cool job. Um, so different levels. Interesting. Yeah. Um, you know what, I messed up because normally I have, uh, I have us kind of start off with like what you were like.

As a kid, like were you always kind of a car guy? I mean, I'm assuming that it seems like you have this whole family that's a part of cars, so it's called car, car culture. A big part of your guys' family then. Well, I, I would tell you car culture is, I would tell you in terms of the mechanics of it, no. Like I wasn't, and I'm gonna tell you that that is something that I kind of wish I had more of.

uh, you know, I meet when I meet young people in this business. By and large, not all, not always, but by and large, they come from the business. Like they have family that were heavily involved in fixing cars. Uh, sometimes they even owned collision centers or their father, uh, or, or mother was, was a tradesman.

And, uh, and I never. That exactly. But I can tell you that , every year we, you know, living in Detroit had a lot of advantages for cars. Right. Every year we were going to the North American International Auto Show. Yeah. That's, that's like back big . Oh my God. Ev Every year we were going to the dream cruise, uh, in, in Royal Oak.

Uh, that's where I kind of got to. Really love the classic cars and the hot rods and everything. If you got, if you've never been, that is a must see for car lovers. I'm sure many, many of your audience has, has, has been there. But that's really kind of where, where I got, I, there was a love of cars, but in terms of, you know, knowing the mechanics, knowing how to paint a car, that's something I didn't learn till later, Adam to mu much later.

Gotcha. And that, uh, I, I would tell you if, if there was one thing I wish I had, uh, growing up a little more knowledge of, it would be that for sure. Gotcha. . So, uh, growing up in Detroit, um, when did you, when did you graduate high school? I graduated high school in, uh, 2004. 2004. Oh, well, you and I are similar age anyways.

Similar age, yeah. . Yeah. Um, yeah, you know, thinking back to, it's funny that you say that 2008, 2011 was like rough years for vehicles, uh, for, you know, any like, uh, US manufactured vehicles because. , just a simple example, but the Chevy suburban, like in, in oh eight, around that year where they switched over from the, the circular, um, elongated headlights to where it was more of like the square bodied.

Yep. Um, once. Hate those years of Suburbans . Just the worst interior quality. Just the overall worst build quality. Like just awful. But you give me. Like an early two thousands, one where it's like the, again, I, I don't know what the exact models of them are or whatever, but mm-hmm.  with the smaller circular headlights.

Give me one of those all day long. Yeah. Like I, I feel like they're way superiorly built, but yeah, that's, that, that's a great example of, right. And, and they, they were all guilty of this during that kind of period was we're gonna change something that's not broken. Right. We're gonna change for the sake of change, and it's not always the best way to do it.

A little bit like right. You know, a different industry, but like in the mid eighties when Koch came out with New Coke, right? Yeah. Like I knew it's like, what? Everybody stop it. . Yeah. Like why? So that's a, that's a perfect example. Adam is, and I think, I think it was around then that Ford, it might have been a little bit pre 2008, but I think it was right around the time that Ford came out with the, um,

uh, was it, was it a new series of engines that it was just like it, it was just disastrous, but it was actually, I think a little bit before that, that was a little before I remember because that, that period, and it's funny you say that, one of my first cars, company cars I bought was a Ford Fusion, and I remember I had a lot of questions about that.

And that was after they, the the whole engine? Yeah. I don't know. It just, it just seems like two thousands in general.  just wasn't really a lot of, uh, late two thousands, I guess. There's a lot of hits there. Yeah. You know? Yeah. Yeah. That, but when they, but, but I'll say this for em.  coming out of that period,

i, I think they're actually doing great things now. I mean, but they, it's sort of right. Like you need to get kicked in the teeth a little bit, right. And yeah. And evolve. And that's a, I think that's a , I'll tell you. I think that's very relevant to a lot of the things we're going through in our business right now.

Yeah. Were you, were you around and I'm sorry that we keep coming back to this, um, subject. Were you around in Detroit when they released, when Ford released the New Edge Mustang, like the retro styled, like Mustang? That would have been, I think I was gone by then. That would've been like, I wanna say, wasn't that like 13 or 14?

I was gonna say like 15, slightly after 2010. Yeah. That, that was, so I was, I was not living in Michigan then. I remember vividly when they did that, I, I wanna say it was that mid teen. Got it when they did that. But no, I was not living there then because I was gonna say man, being in Detroit and watching that thing unveiled.

Holy Hannah, that would've been a party. Yeah. So my dad, I wasn't at this one cuz I wasn't living in Detroit at that time, but my dad, I believe was at the International Auto Show when they unveiled that. So it was pretty cool. Man. That'd be awesome to see that in the flesh for the first time. Yeah. Oh yeah, that's anybody.

And that was the other thing, whoever hasn't been to that, that North American International Auto Show, they, it's in January. , uh, every, I think it's coming up here. Um, it, it's an unbelievable event. Yeah. Up for the concept cars, you see what's, what's cutting edge, what's on the horizon. It's the best. So. Okay.

So going back to Trans Star then. You're a younger guy, um, working at Trans Star. Um, what is it, what was, what'd you kind of start off with doing there? . Well, yeah. So, um, I'll kind of give you the, the synopsis. So, um, I was hired in as a territory manager, so territory managers. Um, and this is the same with with ppg, um, where I work now and, and trans star, you know, their, their responsibility is to, um, you know, sell to shops, but really what they, they do is they sell to distribution and.

Help grow, develop, manage distributors, uh, that that's really our customers. And with Trans Star, um, it was just on a much smaller scale, so I really had to find.  distributors who wanted to sell the paint because it was much smaller, unknown. They're used to dealing with a lot of the, the bigger guys, the, the PPGs.

Right. So that was my primary job, was going out and learning about collision centers, learning their needs, and then kind of selling a distributor on why they need.  our product. Right. Why they need, need to sell our product. So, um, and what I was gonna tell you was, you know, so I was in Michigan only for a short while with Trans Star.

I was only in Michigan, January through April. In April of 2011, they moved me to Baltimore. And basically that's kind of where I really got started in the industry was the B we'll call it the Baltimore. Washington dc, Northern Virginia, uh, market. And that's really where I started, you know, working for, for Trendstar.

Um, and then, uh, I did a really good, good job there, fortunately. And, uh, they had a little bigger market for them, uh, in South Texas. Uh, so I moved to to South Texas. And long story short, PPG was recruiting me at the time and I wasn't in Texas more. A couple months before PPG recruited me and I had to move right back out to the DC area, so Washington DC area.

So it was a ride tho those years, like 2013 neighborhood. That's when I started working for ppg. It's, that was a ride, but, um, but a lot of fun and very grateful. Which area did you like better? Baltimore, Washington, DC area or south? So unfair to compare, because I was only in South Texas for like three months.

So was that so I can't say like, oh, like definitely. Here's what I'll tell you. Um, love dc, love Baltimore. In a way, it's kind of like a second home because I lived there for Lord, like seven, eight years, almost, almost eight years. Spent a lot of time there, met my wife there. So, uh, like always gonna be very special for me.

But, uh, I, I will say this, when I moved to Texas, I was very kind of like fear of the unknown. Like I was kind of like, oh, you know, had, Man, I'm not, I'm not sure, but I'm gonna tell you, my short time in Texas was fantastic. All the people there were wonderful. Um, and I was in San Antonio, I was in, so I was in South Texas and great, I mean, just a great scene, just a great, great people.

Uh, from my customers to, uh, just the people I would meet to the shops, it was, they so can't say enough nice things to say. What I like. Just tough cuz I don't, you know what I mean? I don't, I, I didn't spend enough time there to be like, for sure it's better. But I did love, love Texas. Great place. I'm gonna, I'm gonna ask a question.

Yeah. And I don't care what your opinion is, but my opinion I know is gonna be highly controversial. Okay. First question, not the controversial question. Okay. But did you do the, was the Riverwalk there when you were Oh yes. Oh yes. What's your thoughts on that? Ooh, Riverwalk. Um, if you even remember. Yeah, so here's what I'll tell you.

Um, lots to do, certainly lots to do, um, but a bit touristy is what I would tell you. A bit touristy. A place one of these places like I don't get me wrong, would love to visit, love to visit once, but I could show you some much better places in San Antonio  if you wanna experience authentic San Antonio. I don't know what your opinion is, but that's, that's kind of mine.

So we, my wife and. Uh, toured there for our an, uh, sorry, not anniversary, our honeymoon. Um, cause we didn't want to do something like the Caribbean or, you know, whatever. Like we wanted something, just like an experience. Right. And I remember the river walk just being like, oh, like this is it ? Like this is, it was just a little overhyped on our end.

Yeah. You know, like, yeah. No, and that, that's fair. I mean, like I said, there, it, it's kind of what I find on the river. It kind of depends where you are on the Riverwalk because like there'll be like a section that'll be full of like life and like a lot of good, and then you go down just a little bit and it's like a, just a river, it's like a ghost town.

It's kind of like, that was like a hard tactic story. Yeah. You're in, you're in the, so that's what I mean. So like for a little section. Oh, it's, it's really cool. But then you go down and it kinda like, you know, what's the deal? So yeah. I. We align on that, Adam, we align. It was, it was like, it was what was, what was really interesting is the house I was walking along and I was like, okay, I'm, I'm like trying to put myself into a place where I'm like, Our rivers are, our rivers are really big deal in Texas.

Like do they not have a lot of rivers? And like, this is like we have a river in South Dakota. . Yeah. I'm like, I'm next to it all the time. . Wow. Oh, absolutely. Now the controversial opinion. I'll state mine first. Texas barbecue. Least favorite barbecue I've ever had in my entire life. And every Texan on here I know is just gonna get riled up and immediately say, oh, well you went to a bad Texas.

I have been to San Antonio, Dallas, Fort Worth, Austin, all of those tried multiple different barbecue places. All of them, just straight average barbecue. Okay. I, I, I will say this, I, you've had more experience there than I do. I only went to San Antonio Head Barbecue. I'm not gonna say it was bad, but I am gonna tell you, one of my best friends in the world lives in Kansas City.

Yep. And when I moved to Atlanta as a regional manager for ppg, Memphis was a part of my region. Mm. So I can tell you Memphis and Kansas City, both are immensely better than what I've experienced anywhere else, not just Texas, anywhere else. Um, I, I go back and.  on what I like better. I usually say Kansas City, but that's because I tasted Kansas City first.

So I feel like I'm biased. Like my, my palate like goes to what I saw first, but both incredible. I'll back. So, Kansas City and Memphis. I will say, I think the re we, it took us a while to distill down why, um, why we have that preference. And here's, here's what I think we have figured out. I, I think it comes down to two things.

First of. , Texas is like a dry rub culture. Yes, yes. And South Dakota in the Midwest were sauce. Yes. Right? Yes. So first of all, you already have that difference, but number two, the sauce, the base of the sauce is also like a mustard base in Texas.  and that is not how we do it here. Yeah. So I think those two things combined just make it a no-go.

That sounds like South Dakota is more like Memphis. Memphis is more wet, very wet barbecue. Very, very delicious. Here's that, we'll tell you though. Kansas City, if you ever get to go, they're dry as well. Very much dry rub. But the flavor, the flavor cannot compare. To anything I've experienced any, anywhere else.

So that, that's what got me because it was almost like deceiving. Cuz I would look at their ribs and be like, oh man, like I guess I'm gonna have to kind of drench, but then first bite without any sauce, I'm like, oh my God, this is like the greatest thing I've ever tasted. So, yeah. But, but again,  it. I I It's your first love.

It's first love. That's, that's why I'm biased with Kansas City. It's my first love. Yeah, that's right. Well, now that we have thoroughly pissed off, um, every single Texan in here, , I will per I'll, I'll end it by saying I think the best barbecue I've ever had is a, probably a tie between, um, Arkansas and, um, me, Memphis.

Yeah. Well that's definitely, that's kind of all Arkansas, Memphis, it's kind of the same cuz they're right next to each other. But, uh, yep. No, me, me, I. , and I can't argue with that. Memphis, I mean, is fantastic. It's, it's a wet barbecue and it is delicious. Yeah. I mean, it's, it's amazing. So, okay. Uh, , so I hope, I hope I, I, but you know what, you're gaining viewers in Tennessee and Missouri right now,

So keep, keep that in mind. . Uh, I can't wait to see her, the comments and reviews on this, like telling me to kill myself or whatever. Yeah. Because I have an opinion about Barbie . Okay, so PPG head hunts you, snipes, you, grabs you, whatever you wanna call it. Um, you're in DC so you're a territory manager for PPG then, um, for them.

So what was that transition like going from, I'm just gonna make an assumption here with Trans Star, you're probably having to do a little bit more hand to hand combat trying to overcome stipulations on like, oh, why trans star? You know, why should we go with you guys versus ppg? It's. Yeah, you're like, you're it, you know?

Yeah. Uh, very, very different. Um, so you go from, easiest way I can explain it is I went from trying to actively find any and all distributors who would wanna sell my paint and my sales process, even in the shops was buy anything. Right. Whatever, whatever you need at the moment, buy anything. So now I'm going to ppg who is, I mean, the, the class of the business.

I don't mean to, you know, too, but like one of the, the, the top ones, right? Um, going to PPG and the distributors are already set, right? They're already, they're already primarily selling your paint. They have reps that are actively, uh, servicing and selling the paint.  and now my approach in selling is system selling.

Now I'm not going in there saying, Hey, you want some, you know, undercoat, you want, you know this. Now I'm looking to system sell. I'm saying, Hey, we, we wanna service your whole business. Here are our, here are our features, advantages, and benefits of doing that. Here are our value added tools. And it was a completely different process.

It did. It took. . Mm. A good . I'm gonna tell you a year or two to really figure it out. To really figure out, you know, what, what the differences were, what separated us, what, um, what are, you know, the high end customers that I was really getting to know. Um, what they valued and that, that, I gotta tell you, the first year or two for me, and I'm gonna tell you the first year or two in every job I've had at ppg, to be honest with you, has really been learning.

It's been just learning about how can I make an impact on my customer's lives? How can I grow this business? What makes P P G a household name in a collision center? That's, that's really, that was really it. So very different, Adam very. Uh, so the, one of the, the pre two, previous two episodes ago, if we release this in, you know, sequential order.

Yeah. Uh, we had a guy on, um, Danon and Danon was talking about how he had to help a shop, or they were releasing a, the company that I was working for was releasing a water-based paint. They were releasing it in this, uh, Pennsylvania. Yeah, Pennsylvania was switching over, I'm trying to remember the exact conversation, but Pennsylvania was switching to waterborne only paint, water-based paint only, and he had to be on the ground floor helping the painters learn water-based and everything like that.

And if there's a podcast that you're gonna listen to, Jason, that one was actually incredibly interesting because, um, dam. Just really dives into the nitty gritty of like the chemical structure of paint and like exactly how stuff dries and everything like that. And my question to you is, is um, it seems like he went one step, like way above and beyond.

And we actually talk about this in the, in the show and the advantages, disadvantages to that, but having that extra knowledge. Yep. It really helps you a lot with building some rapport and everything like that with your customer to where you're not just a salesman, it seems like, and you're there like figuring out the technicalities and problems with, with them one-on-one.

Is that kind of what you've run into in your time? A hundred percent. So, wow. That's, that's very relevant. Um, so Daniel, so I believe Pennsylvania was very close to. Putting in the regulations, which I'll go into in a minute, that required everybody to switch to either water or low voc, but I don't think they ever did.

Okay. I think they were very close to, but I don't think, but still, um, you know where this comes from, where, when I say regulations, this is all basically from the Clean Air Act that was signed in the seventies. I mean, this goes way back. And really what it is, is states have been. Very apprehensive and understandably so in some cases, to adopt it, right?

To, to adopt the, the act state to state. Um, so I come back from Texas, this was April, 2013, and at the time, Delaware had already gone VO C compliant regulations, meaning. Solvent lines that weren't low VOC they could not use, which was a good portion of PPGs business. Um, So I come back and I, my territory at the time was sort of Washington, DC and Southern Maryland.

So I come back in April, 2013 and July 1st, 2013, Maryland is due to switch. So I come back in the middle of a conversion storm because we are now having to talk to painters and to, to. That, was it d Danen? Was that his name? Danen. Danen. I'm sorry. Dan Canyon. But Dan Canyon. It took me a little bit to get it right, to Don't worry.

To, yeah, to Dan's point though. Yes, yes. I mean, you had to because these, everybody, right, we're all wired to resist change. Everybody was so apprehensive, especially ones that, that went from a, a solvent line to a water line. To them it was like night and day. Now, PPG did a tremendous job formulating a product that was easy to spray, that was really very similar to how you spray solvent.

But even with that, There was a lot of training that had to be done. So I came in right in the middle of that and I had to get educated on, okay, what are the key differences? How can you, how can you help it dry on humid days? What's the color a match process? What's, you know, why are these clears specially formulated to work with water and you know, how do you, so there were a lot of things right off the bat, me coming from Texas to Maryland that I had to get.

And then, so Maryland switch. And I believe it wasn't two years later that DC switches. So in that area of the country, you have dc, Maryland, and Delaware, that all are VOC compliant markets. And then other places in the country you've got, not all of California, but I'm gonna say most of California is VOC compliant.

And then I believe Salt Lake City, Utah is also VOC compliance. So you know, what we're finding though, is once people.  have that knowledge and see the benefits of water and understand that the OEMs are painting the new vehicles in water and see the color match capabilities. It's a winner. And, and most of our business now is water, which is great.

Um, but to your point and to Daniel's point, yeah, there, there's a lot you had to impart, teach, make people comfortable with right off the bat cuz it is a change. It's their livelihood and it's, it's, it's a big change. What do you think, why do you think. , the regulations have taken so long to take effect.

Well, purely, purely opinion here. Uh, I think there's probably a number of, of things. I, I, I, I think it all comes down a lot of times to money. Right. Um, shocker being Right. Right. I mean, they, there's probably a lot of a, a lot of business owners in these. That are worried about the financial impact it would have to their business, should they, should they take it over?

Um, I would tell you from a purely paint, automotive paint perspective there, there really isn't a a, a huge difference there. Um, but then when you start talking about factories and you start talking about everything that goes into. I'm sure it gets a little noisier, uh, at that level. So, yeah. Um, I, I think for like, like with anything, right?

People are, you know, what, what is the compelling reason, um, for me to change? And I think for, for a lot of states, you think about who they're responsible for, what businesses need to operate, they probably struggle with that a little bit. You know, what is the compelling reason for me, um, other than environmental, um, which is important.

Um, That's probably the question. They, the pros and cons they have to weigh. Yeah. It's interesting because, um, the company that we have, we deal with different markets globally. Mm-hmm.  and, uh, a lot of the customers that we have in Europe, they, they're, they're, they're all water-based. Like, they wouldn't even dream of spraying anything solvent.

Yep. Unless you, Eastern Europe or something like that, where, you know Yeah. , right? You just, they just don't care. . Right. Um, and then you, you come over to the states and there's just this very clear division between solvent based, water based, and there are people of vehemently on either side. Yeah. There's, it's not very often that you run into a shop that's like, yeah, you know, I can spray either one of 'em and they're both fine.

Um, you know, our particular product requires, or we. Push doing water based because our product is so heavy, solvent based that you can spray solvent. It's just that there's a lot of precautions that go into doing it, which, you know, I don't really necessarily want to go into. Yeah. But, um, you know, I can't imagine you being a guy that you know, wasn't in the industry.

Your family didn't spray. You're coming into this huge, dramatic, um, change that's affecting people's live. And then you gotta be the guy that  helps him switch. Like there had to be a lot of curse words thrown, thrown your way, , you know, and, and you know, luckily, like, and I'll say it again, luckily I've been blessed that I've befriended and met some fantastic painters, technicians, you know, who've really kind of helped me and.

What I, what I would say there were, yeah, there were some curse words now that I remember, but it was, it was just kind of general frustration. Right. You know, in their mind, which is completely fair. If it's not broke, don't fix it. Right. We're just kind of talking about the, the, the, the Chevy issue. Right. I mean, we were just talking about that.

So, um, you know, in their mind, this is working. I have this huge color library now that's all messed up and I get that. I get it. And you know, that was honestly beyond the technical knowledge. , the, the, the biggest challenge was making sure they knew everything was gonna be okay, right? Everything's gonna be okay.

Um, sometimes I had to elicit shops help who already were spraying it, right? And, and were having mega success with it to tell 'em, Hey, listen, everything's gonna be okay. It's a little bit different process, not as different as you think. , but it's all gonna be okay. And, and what's funny, Adam, is I still keep in touch with many painters and technicians back in those compliant markets.

And if they changed law today and said, yeah, you guys all go back to solvent, none of them would. None. They, they would, they would all say, no, no way. It's, it's better, better color match, saves me time. It would be. So it's just interesting, you know, it's, it's, I think, I think the fear of change itself sometimes.

You know, more, more scary than the change itself. Hey guys. Adam from the podcast. I hope you are enjoying today's episode. Just wanted to ask you a quick favor. If the show has brought you value in some way, would you mind giving us a review and sharing the show? It really helps the show get out there.

Also, if you are looking to expand the services that your shop offers and you want to do more than collision work, you should really check out our company Clarity. Clarity Coat is a peelable paint that allows body shops to offer color changes cheaper than a repaint, while still looking like real paint.

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All right, let's get back to. What, when did, uh, when did the OEMs start switching over to spraying, uh, water based in their factories? Because it wasn't really all that long ago, was it? Well, I guess that depends how it means all that long ago. I would tell you it's been certainly since two, two thousands, I would say it's been more than 10.

It's certainly been more than 10 years. Okay. It was before I got into the business. Um, I would say probably early 2000, maybe even nineties, but I, I think it was mostly two thousands I think.  and I, and I, by the way, Adam, there are some exceptions to that. Like I do believe Ford, I could be wrong here, but I think Ford might use a VOC compliant paint, which is still Gotcha.

Which is solvent, but it's vo, you know, it's, it's VOC compliant solvent. Um, but most, the vast majority are using water to spray oem. And that's been going on for a while. Okay. For, for, for a while. Gotcha. Yep.

The, the next question I have is who, who was, uh, who was another paint company out there that you guys were having to do battle with? You know that you had two pretty competitive, um, water-based lines. Oh, yeah. Um, so from a PPG standpoint, You know, our competitors, the, the primary one's gonna be Exalta.

Right? Um, uh, which was DuPont right now. Exalta, yeah. , they, the, they are consistently our, our biggest competitor. We also get competition from, you know, B A S F, and we get some competition from Sherwin Williams. Um, but, uh, but yeah, we've, I think we've done a tremendous job. Um, what I, what I will tell you, this isn't, you know, I know this show isn't meant to promote necessarily ppg, but what I would say is, um, where we.

uh, whether it be on a water or a solvent, um, is service, is service, is support, is helping shops understand how they make money being a partner, right? Yeah. That's, that's how we're gonna win. Um, , the products that, that Exalta and our competitors have. Yeah. They, they work. They work and, and, and they're, they're all good.

Um, but what we're gonna win is on the partnership that we deliver to collision centers all over the country. So that's, that's kind of what I promote, uh, in my organization. Yeah. Well, I mean, that's all, that's not a bad way of going about it. Like, instead of just dropping off product and saying, here you go.

Yeah. And heading out. Yeah. Um, so how long, how long would you say before. You kind of got to the point where like things were clicking, clicking along, these shops were able to spray co, um, confidently without any real issues that we're talking just a couple of, couple of months type of thing. Uh, it varied.

What were some of the common issues you ran into back then? Well, at, well, I'll tell you the, the biggest issue for me at the beginning at least, was honestly, there were a few not. , but a few painters that just fought it. They right, they just fought it. Can't imagine that. You know, um, one, one thing I will say, and this, this is pretty, pretty universal, um, not complete universal, but listen, the, the water product, um, Differs from solvent in this way.

The solvent, you know, pain, and you probably know this, you can, you can hammer it on, right? You can hammer it on pretty thick. Um, that's okay. The water really isn't meant to be hammered on, uh, it's, it's, which is, which is a good thing. Right. You're saving, you know, material. Doing that. It's, it's really is a good thing.

It's, it's not, it's not a spray to hide product. It's a spray to match. Right. It's a, it's not, it, it's not meant to be hammered on. . Most everyone got that, but there were a couple that just, they fought it right, and they just said, no, I'm gonna, I'm not gonna change the way I spray. Uh, but I will tell you of those ones, and I remember 'em vividly, um, eventually they, they caught on and now they love it.

Right? It's just, you gotta give it a chance, right? You gotta, I, I would always say, I joke around with them, I said, give change a chance. And they're like, you sound like a politician. And I'm like, I'm just, I'm just telling you man, I mean this, I, I didn't ask for the change. We have to, we have to evolve, we have to deal with it.

And they, they got it and it's, and it's great now. So what, uh, what are some. Advancements that you guys are, um, have worked on in the last couple of years, have come out with in the last couple of years. That was, was really cool to you. ? Um, well, I'll answer that a couple different ways. Um, I would tell, answer it as many ways as you want.

This is podcast. We can go, we can talk forever. . Yeah. So, um, I, I would tell you from an automotive standpoint, uh, well from an automotive paint standpoint, um, I would tell you. , um, what we've done, uh, getting off of water, uh, what we've done to elevate our solvent line, uh, has been fantastic. Um, uh, advancing our liquid pearls, going from d BBC to NX t uh, for the next generation of solvent users.

Uh, just, just fantastic coming out with new color tools. Um, I can tell you our new digi match color camera is just state of the art. Um, I think it's gonna change the way we, we find color, um, our, our visualized tool that helps compare different colors is just incredible. So I would tell you, The tools and the product advancement on there is continuing to evolve and get better.

Um, but I, I'm even more excited about the tools that aren't even here that are gonna be here soon. Um, can you talk about it? Well, the, so the one I, the, the one I'll prepare you for is we're gonna be, we're gonna be advancing our water line. We're gonna be changing some things in our water line that, um, and, and believe me, we, we admit that we are still state of the art in this, but there are gonna be things that, that we advance, that are gonna.

um, that are gonna help us spray, they're gonna help it help painters even more than we already do. So is it gonna apply itself? , you know what? Come out of the camp. You know what? And just Yeah, between you and me, we're gonna, we're gonna do a little Yeah, yeah. Self application on its own. Yeah. Is it, is it paint AI where it just like itself, , that's funny.

But, uh, but, um, but I tell you, but, but that, so that's one way I'll tell you though, but the things that are really starting to excite me, you know, not too long. Uh, PPG acquired em, and I think a lot of the things we're doing from that standpoint and being a one stop shop for everything from glues to, uh, to, to a bondo, to all kinds of stuff that se provides.

I think is really gonna give us an advantage in the marketplace. And the third thing I'll tell you is our new commercial line, uh, cannot say enough about it. Uh, we've come out with a new commercial line called Bell Fleet one, and the way this product covers is unlike anything I've ever seen. Um, and I'm gonna tell you the, the early returns are very good.

Um, we are really excited. So the thing that excites me about kind of the way we're evolving is we're branching out, right? We're continuing to try to elevate the experience from an automotive paint side, but we're, we're thinking bigger than that. We're thinking bigger than that. We're gonna add on, we're gonna try to be a one-stop shop.

We're gonna try to be, uh, someone who provides more than just automotive paint. It's gonna be service, it's gonna be, uh, you know, se it's gonna be commercial, it's gonna be a lot of different things coming for p. Gotcha. Uh, this is the first time I've ever done this, but I keep, I'm gonna keep referring back to, um, Danny and I's conversation because Yeah.

It's just weird how these are lining up, but yeah, Danny and actually got to talking about the Color match cameras a lot as well. Yeah. And something he was saying that I did not realize was that the cost of the color match chips that the companies have to. He said it's just absolutely unsustainable. It is an enormous cost for, it ain't cheap you guys.

Yeah. For you guys to sustain. And he was saying how that is why, in his opinion, or maybe factually the color match cameras are gonna be something that is not only necessary, but is gonna be something that really accelerates the entire industry forward. But one of the things that he was talking about, and I'd love to get your opinion on this, is.

There is a lot of education that needs to go into properly prepping the surface in order to do a good color match. Um, and one of the examples that he gave was, I mean, Baltimore is probably a really good example of this, but where he's at in Pennsylvania, there's a lot of industrial fallout. So you could clean the surface and then put the camera on there, but if you have a bunch of metal particles, it's gonna show up as Pearl or flake, or.

and so then you're gonna get the wrong color Coat or, you know, uh, mixture. So he said it's just as simple as like educating people that if you're in these areas with lots of industrial fallout, clay, barring the surface so that you get rid of those iron particles. And then, um, and then doing it, he would have all these side by side images of a hundred times, 200 times, 300 times of the paint surface.

And sh and he would ask a painter like, okay, clean it to where you think it's, it's good. Painter would clean it and then he would do the camera where it was at a hundred times or 200 times. He's like, this is what your camera sees and this is what it's gonna tell you is the the color to try and match.

And then he would actually prep it and do it good enough. He's like, now this is what it's gonna tell you to do. And show him a side by side of like just how different the color match is. , is this something that you guys are running into a lot as well? Um, yes. Um, I would tell you in a, in a couple different ways.

So the first way is exactly what, what it sounds like Daniel talked about, um, One of the things, cause I told you I never worked in a shop as a kid. So one of the first things I did when I got into this business was found, uh, someone who was very experienced. He's still a, a great friend of mine and he painted on the, on the side at night.

And that was the only time I could really learn cuz I'm working during the day, right? So at night I would meet with him and we'd basically go over painting a car and, and I learned pretty. Prepping a car is everything. Everything, uh, that is, it is just very, very important. So you're a hundred percent right on that.

The second thing, um, that, that we are really big on is using what we call the correct gade. Okay? So that's basically the shade of gray that will go underneath. , um, in a form of like a, a sealer or, or even sometimes, uh, like a regular color. And that makes a tremendous difference on what, what it shades.

First thing I would do when I was a territory manager and somebody was having a color problem, I would check that, I'd say, what gade did you use? And if they use the wrong one or one, or, or even if they use the right one, I would, you know, play around with it real quick and.  that would make a tremendous difference.

Mm-hmm. . But getting back to your really quickly to talk about your chips conversation. No, you're, you're absolutely right. They, they are not cheap to make, they're, they're certainly a large investment. However, um, I am a huge fan of, of chips and always have been. Uh, I, I think they give you a great indicator.

I think one of the best things PPG continues to have is, is our color documentation through chips. , what we're trying to do is kind of try to find that happy medium, Adam. Like, you know, without keeping that and keeping that as you know, one of our tools while also promoting and investing in this new color technology, and I'm gonna tell you.

Um, you, you mentioned Europe earlier, you know,  out in Europe, Australia, I mean, they're almost a hundred percent using, uh, the camera. I mean, it's almost, almost a hundred percent. So, um, trying to find that balance though, because I tell you, I, I do love our chips. It, it's a great resource. Um, but, you know, I, I don't think there's anything wrong, right?

With changing for the better. And if we can help people find the right color even quicker, um, and paint cars quicker, that's what we're gonna try to do. It's, uh, there was, uh, there was a lot of things that in that episode that were just brought up that I just had never really thought about. Um, it's same, I mean, that's with every episode, so Right.

I'm always constantly learning . Yeah. Oh, you gotta be in this business. You gotta be, I'm gonna tell you. It's there  there, there are things I think about when I started in this business, like today compared to just how much it's changed. It, it's, you, you gotta be learning every day. Yeah. Is there. , o o Other than what you guys are coming out with and and doing, is there anything that you have seen in the automotive world, paint world in general that really kind of gets you excited for the future and possibilities, um, of paint or, you know, anything that might have any relevance to it?

Well, yeah, I mean, I, I, I would tell you, um,  the, the things that get me excited.  our advancements in education. Um, I see more things happening not just with paint companies, but with, um, local collision, uh, repair associations. Um, I know we've got a couple down in the south here that are tremendous. Uh, there's a lot of, there's a lot of companies out there that do it, uh, that, that provide a lot of education.

And I think the more both techs and owners get, On what the future of this business looks like, what, how, how we can work together, uh, to make ourselves a, a sustainable industry, I think the better we're we're gonna be. Um, the other exciting thing, and this is something I'm trying to involve myself in whenever I can, is.

Uh, the, the continued growth of ev uh, of electronic vehicle. I mean, it, I mean, electric vehicles aren't going away. Um, I, I, I think they're gonna continue to take more and more share. I just read a report that I think it's the highest share it's ever been in the United States, and, um, I think there's some exciting things that go with that.

I really do. Um, I, you know, for, for the longest time it's, you know, kind of just been Tesla that's kind of taken the, the bulk. But I'm now seeing Rivian, I'm seeing even gm, I'm seeing all kinds of ev uh, vehicles that are really being more and more prominent in the market, and I think that's exciting. I do, I think that's, that's gonna be something new and it's gonna be, um, I, I think also it's gonna create more business.

I really do. Hmm. Why do, what? Do, what do you think? , what do you think specifically out of that is gonna make, uh, more. Couple things. So the first thing is those cars, and I've, I've l learned from a lot of people. They're, they're a little bit complex. Uh, they're a little bit complex. So when, when they get in accidents, there's usually a lot more to repair.

There's usually a lot. It's not like a normal boom, boom, boom job, which, which can be a good thing, right? . Um, the other thing, and this is kind of a double-edged sword, I get it and I always hear about this, um, while all the accident avoidance technology is gonna, you know, hurt our business, hurt our business, and sher kind of fair, but you know what also I see in these cars a lot of distractions.

A lot of distractions, a lot of things. I mean, iPads and all these things to do. And believe me, I was just in an EV shop up in Delaware that's exclusive recently, and they weren't hurting for work. I can tell you that . So I'm just, I'm just saying like, uh, you know, I, if, if they're so. You know, you know, they're so great and there's so, so much accident avoidance.

Uh, why, why is this, you know, they seem to be everywhere, right? So, um, there's that, there's that old saying, you can't fix stupid. And if people are, if people are gonna get into accidents, they're just gonna find more and better ways to get into accidents. Absolutely.  never, never, never count 'em out. But it's a, listen, I.

I, I, I think there's a lot of exciting things coming in the industry, but it, listen, we're, we're gonna have to evolve. I, I get that. Um, I think everybody gets that. Um, but that's not always a bad thing, you know, that's, that's a good thing. And, and I'm, I'm excited. Um, you know, the, the interesting thing, uh, so on the ev note, I think it, I think Audi, uh, I'm a, I'm a big Audi guy, so yeah, just putting it out there.

I think Audi announced that in 24, 25, something like that, that they were gonna go all ev. Mm. Uh, every car they make or every vehicle they make was gonna be all ev. I could be wrong on that, but, uh, I think, I don't think it was too long ago that Ford announced that every car, not suv, crossover pickup thing, but every car that they, no wait, they did away with cars.

Um, they said they were just, um, just gonna do away completely with cars. But now you got trucks and, yeah. Yeah, I heard that too. But, but now you've got the cr, the Mustang crossover, which is electric, right? That's all electric. They don't make a hybrid. Uh, yes, I believe. I'll check my facts on that. If anybody's from Ford listening correct me.

But yeah, I believe so. We've got someone listening from Ford hit me up and give me a free F-150 plus. Thanks. Appreciate it. Well consider, I'll let you, I'll let you be a sponsor on the show. There we go. . There we go. Yeah, it's, it's, uh, I, I agree with you. I think it, I think it absolutely is coming and there are parts of the country where I think it makes a, uh, it makes sense to own an ev.

I will say that South Dakota is not one of those places where it makes sense to own an EV personally. And that has more to do with the fact that, um, great runaround town car, but there's only two or three charging stations across the entire. So if I wanted to go to the west side of the state, which is roughly about a four and a half hour drive, I've gotta hit those charging stations at just the right moments to not be stranded on the side of the road.

Then you take into account that sometimes, like a month ago, we were negative 50.  and you know, the battery life gets PR takes a pretty significant hit when it's that cold. No doubt. So definitely not against it just has a little ways to go, uh, as far as this region. No doubt. No doubt. And I, I was just, you actually took the words outta my mouth.

You know, when you see change. Uh, you know, a a a dynamic change like that would be, you are rarely gonna see it do this, right? Like, oh, all of a sudden. I mean, I guess sometimes like when Netflix replace Blockbuster or the I iPhone, yeah. Occasionally you're gonna see a paradigm shift radically like that.

But this isn't one of those times, right? We, there is such a, an infrastructure with, with the, we'll call 'em the classic automobiles, the engine automobiles, that it, it's not gonna happen like that. What I would say is it is happening, but it's happening. Gradually, right? Yes. And I gotta believe when I see what is being the kind of capital that I see being poured in to this, to this, I mean, both, both by the way, from private equity and the government, right?

Uh, a a lot of the bills being passed now are being, you know, to, to ev infrastructure. You gotta believe that exact situation you brought up. They're, they're working on that, right? And they're gonna make it wherein maybe 5, 10, 15 years. . It's easier, it's easier to get around South Dakota in an ev so, um, I, I would be pretty confident in saying that South Dakota will probably be a holdout for a while.

Well, hey, hey. If there's, if, if I just told you about the, uh, the regulations, there's still a lot of holdouts, so you're, you got a point there I think. I think South Dakota just, it's just in our nature to be like, nah, , we're good. If you're a gas car, enthusi. You have, you have, uh, a recluse here that you can come home to and  Well, well, and, and that, that is a good point.

And I, I've always said this, I say I see the change happening, but. I just my opinion, I never see gas cars going away ever. No, I, I don't see that ever happening. So that the, the amount of time that's gonna take, it's not even gonna, it's not gonna be in your i's lifetime. I, I don't see it. I don't see it. I, I do, I see it changing and, and EV's taking more share.

Absolutely. I do. Do I see, you know, gas cars going away? Absolutely not. So, no. Um, no. I think, I think what'll happen is it'll. Let's say when you and I are like 70, 80 years old, it'll be 60, 70% of the market share will be EVs probably mostly out of just like pure necessity because what's gonna end up happening is it's going to be easier.

You're gonna have gas stuff your, your gas parts in your.  engine transmission, you know, whatever it might be Sure. Are gonna break down. Right. Because Sure they do. They break down. Yeah. And then to try and source those parts is gonna become more difficult. So you're gonna have more and more people that are like, you know what?

Fuck it. It's just easier to get electric and um Yep. That's where the change will start. That's where you're absolutely right. That's where the change will start. And then, um, but you're always gonna have those old holdouts of guys that. , they know how to fix their own stuff, or they know the shop around the corner that's kind of in a dun dingy alley or whatever, like, yeah.

Um, one of the gals that we had on, actually, uh, this was really interesting. Um, I, I do not remember her name, but she has this amazing junkyard in California that is all Porsche parts. The only thing they stock is just Porsche parts and that's it. Well, what she was talking about it towards the end of the episode, we got to talking about.

what is she gonna do when it comes to storing EV stuff? Because sure, you can store a Porsche nine 11 turbo S motor, you know, whatever, right? And you can just have pallets of those things. But now you start talking about housing a warehouse full of these humongous lithium ion batteries in the dangers. In doing that, like, yep, like you can only stack those things like two or three high because the pallet racking itself has to be just insane.

Powerful to hold those batteries cause they're so heavy. Yep. Yep. Um, so anyways, but you're always gonna have people like her that have just this trove of parts that you could always replace your gas engine stuff, but people are lazy. They take the lea the path of lease resistance, right? Mm-hmm. , and they're, uh, they're just eventually gonna say, you know what?

It's just not worth fixing this car anymore and I'm just gonna get rid of it, blah, blah, blah. Because if it, if that weren't. There would be. Hundreds of thousands of Mustangs, 65 Mustangs and 67 Mustangs out on the road, right? Like mm-hmm.  that we churn through old technology all the time. Yeah. Yeah. Um, yeah, no, you're right.

All, all good points. I mean, it really is, and it's that, that's kind of my, my general point, right, is, I mean, , the, the, this type of change, when you consider the infrastructure, it's, it's, it's good. And I think it does present opportunity, not just, you know, for, for technicians, but a lot of business owners who are thinking about finding a niche, right?

I think it does present, but all that being said, Uh, certainly not saying that it's gonna be so radical that that gas cars are going away. I, I don't see that happening. I'm just, I'm just waiting for the electronic tuner companies , like That's right. I'm just imagining a world like. 10 years from now where it's like, Hey, did you buy the buy baseball, Tesla?

Well, if you come into our shop, we can upgrade you to a stage three electric motor. . You want 10,000 watts of power to your wheels? We got it.

You're right. Well, Jason, uh, it's almost towards the end of the episode. Um, this one has flown right by for me. , where can people get ahold of you if they wanted to talk to you? Learn a little bit more about ppg, what you guys might be able to offer. By the way, should also quickly note, this was not sponsored by ppg.

No Money Exchange Hands . It's really interesting. Sometimes I get a comment or a message or whatever that says like, oh, Must have been nice to get a little cash from that. It's like, no, I just, I wanted to talk, I wanted to talk to everybody. Well, you're, you're, you're, it's funny, hopefully your, your audience here is, especially those that use our competitors.

I'm even hesitant. You're kind of poking me to talk about it and promoting. I'm a little hesitant to, I'm like, oh, I don't wanna, I don't wanna do that. I, this is laid out there industry, so I believe me, I, I get it. And yes, if, if you want to get ahold of. Uh, I, I am very open, uh, Adam, if you want, I can give you my, my email address, uh, phone, phone number, whatever works for your viewers.

Uh, yep. I'd, I'd love, love to talk to anybody. Uh, who's I, what, what I would say, you know, to, to all your viewers young, you know, young viewers who are considering a career in this industry. Um, one thing the industry has proven, and I go back to the reason kind of I chose it, what a lot of my friends and family told me.

It is a durable industry. It is a very, very durable industry. People have been driving cars for a very, very long time. It's evolved. Sure. It's changed. Um, but I never see it going away. Frankly. I never, never do. Um, they're, you know, I, I think about all the fears people have had over the years of, oh, they're gonna wrap cars.

I dunno if you've ever heard about that. Instead of painting, we're gonna rap. Uh, you know that one by the wayside. Now the big fear is self-driving cars. And I'm, and, and I'm just telling you, I don't see our business ever going away Change. Yes. And that that's okay, but I don't see it ever going away. And the second thing I would say to.

um, it is one of the. I, I'm not gonna say every industry, cuz certainly there are some out there, but I would tell you, you have, you would have a tough time finding another industry that rewards hard work like the auto autobody industry does. Uh, the automotive aftermarket does, um, you know, use me as an example, right?

I got in here, I knew little to nothing about repairing a car. Um, but you worked hard, right? You worked hard. And I've lived, I've told you some of the places I've lived, you know, Atlanta, DC, Baltimore, San Antonio. . It, it, it, it wasn't because I knew everything. Right. Certainly not. And, uh, I would tell anybody, uh, the opportunities are tremendous getting into this business at this time.

Awesome. Well, thanks Jason again for coming onto the show. Um, we will link your LinkedIn in the sh show notes. Perfect. And, uh, your email too, if you're okay with that. And then that's fine. We'll put it. And if you guys want to, you can reach out to Jason and um, thank you for coming onto the show. Possibly just throwing it out there.

Might be nice to hear a thank you every once in a while. And, uh, yeah, thanks Jason. Really appreciate it. I hope you have a great rest of the day. Thank you, Adam. Thanks for having me. You've been listening to the Autobody podcast presented by Clarity Coat. Our passion is to talk to and about anyone in the industry, from painters, body guys, manufacturers, and anyone in between.

We hope you've enjoyed the show. Make sure to like rate and review and we'll be back soon. But in the meantime, visit us@claritycoat.com. And find us on Facebook and YouTube at Clarity Coat. See you next time on the Autobody Podcast.