Lost And Sound
Lost and Sound is a podcast exploring the most exciting and innovative voices in underground, electronic, and leftfield music worldwide. Hosted by Berlin-based writer Paul Hanford, each episode features in-depth, free-flowing conversations with artists, producers, and pioneers who push music forward in their own unique way.
From legendary innovators to emerging mavericks, Paul dives into the intersection of music, creativity, and life, uncovering deep insights into the artistic process. His relaxed, open-ended approach allows guests to express themselves fully, offering an intimate perspective on the minds shaping contemporary sound.
Originally launched with support from Arts Council England, Lost and Sound has featured groundbreaking artists including Suzanne Ciani, Peaches, Laurent Garnier, Chilly Gonzales, Sleaford Mods, Nightmares On Wax, Graham Coxon, Saint Etienne, Ellen Allien, A Guy Called Gerald, Jean Michel Jarre, Liars, Blixa Bargeld, Hania Rani, Roman Flügel, Róisín Murphy, Jim O’Rourke, Yann Tiersen, Thurston Moore, Lias Saoudi (Fat White Family), Caterina Barbieri, Rudy Tambala (A.R. Kane), more eaze, Tesfa Williams, Slikback, NikNak, and Alva Noto.
Paul Hanford is a writer, broadcaster, and storyteller whose work bridges music, culture, and human connection. His debut book, Coming to Berlin, is available in all good bookshops.
Lost and Sound is for listeners passionate about electronic music, experimental sound, and the people redefining what music can be.
Lost And Sound
Slikback
Underground Bass culture never sits still and when it comes to forward momentum, Slikback is at the heart of it. With at least 28 projects since 2018, his sound is restless, urgent—pushing bass, distortion, and rhythm into new forms. In this conversation, we get into the discipline behind his experimental process, how fatherhood has reshaped his approach, and the impact of his latest release on Tempa.
We also talk about the move from traditional labels to self-releasing on Bandcamp—a decision that cracked open new creative freedom, especially during the pandemic. For Slikback, aka the very charming Freddie Mwaura Njau, it’s not just about breaking industry norms; it’s about the raw energy of finishing ideas, pushing sound forward without losing the impulse that made it exciting in the first place.
From early influences growing up in Nairobi to global collaborations, from DIY scenes to Nyege Nyege’s cultural force, this episode traces the connections that shape his music. We talk process, community, and the balance between instinct and refinement in electronic music today.
If you’re enjoying the show, please consider subscribing and leaving a rating or review on Apple, Spotify, Amazon, or wherever you listen. It really helps to spread the word and support Lost and Sound.
Data by Slikback is out now on Tempa, listen or buy here.
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Lost and Sound is sponsored by Audio-Technica
My BBC World Service radio documentary “The man who smuggled punk rock across the Berlin Wall” is available now on BBC Sounds. Click here to listen.
My book, Coming To Berlin: Global Journeys Into An Electronic Music And Club Culturet Capital is out now on Velocity Press. Click here to find out more.
Lost and Sound title music by Thomas Giddins
I struggle to think of an artist right now that manages to glide across as many releases with as much restless creativity as my guest on Lost in Sound. Today I'm speaking with the forward-thinking producer, slickback. But first a shout to my sponsor, audio-technica, a global but family-run company that make the headphones that I'm wearing right now and whose mic you hear me do every interview through. They make studio quality yet affordable products, because they believe that high quality audio should be accessible to all. So, wherever you are in the world, head on over to audiotechnicacom to check out all of their range of stuff. Okay, so slick, let's dive in. Thank you, hello, and welcome to episode 157 of Lost in Sound.
Speaker 1:I'm Paul Hanford, I'm your host, I'm an author, a broadcaster and a lecturer, and Lost in Sound is the weekly podcast where I chat with an artist who works outside the box, from global icons to trailblazing outsiders and emerging innovators. We talk about music, creativity and perhaps that most daunting part of being an artist the praxis of life. Previous guests have included Peaches, suzanne Shiani, jim O'Rourke, cozy, funny Tootie, miki Blanco and Thurston Moore, and, as always, it's really nice to hear your thoughts about last week's episode, and last week's episode was with more ease, and there's been a lot of love for that going on in the DMs. And something I really took away from the conversation that we had was about making experimental music more inclusive something less gate kept, maybe a bit more gate opened. Um, if you missed it or if you're a new listener today, that's a really good one to go back and check out, and what you're about to hear in a minute is a really good one too.
Speaker 1:I had a conversation with slick back, who I really think is one of the most exciting producers operating right now, coming out of Nairobi's electronic underground. Slickback has, since he started releasing in 2018, built a sonic world that blends industrial textures, deep sub bass, fast cut percussion and something completely untethered to traditional genre structures, and he is so prolific too. I was having a scroll through his band camp, and there's a lot there. I think I counted 28 releases since 2018. He's put out music through influential labels like Temper, collaborated with everyone from Object to Bronski to former Lost and Sound guests Kamaru and Juer, and carved out a sound that feels as at home in dark, smoke-filled clubs as it does in a futuristic landscape. I can totally imagine some really interesting film director going and hiring Slickback to do a score very, very, very soon.
Speaker 1:But before we get going, and if you haven't already and you like what I do, please give the show a subscribe and if you would really like to as well, um, it would be really awesome if you fancied giving the show a rating and a review on wherever you listen to the show, on, whether that's spotify, amazon or apple or wherever else that could be. If you can't be bothered to think up the words, to leave it with you, but you fancy doing something, uh, just write what guest you would like me to speak to. Um, it'd be really interesting to find out from you who you would like me to speak to for lost and sound. Okay. So back to the conversation with slick back. We had this chat on monday, the 27th of january 2025. He's such a nice guy and this is what happened. Thanks so much for speaking with me today. How are you doing? It's monday morning, are you a? You were someone that gets up bright and happy and excited at the beginning of the week maybe not excited, but uh, I wake up quite early.
Speaker 2:I go to sleep super early, at least now, like maybe seven, maybe eight I'm out and I wake up at 4 am or something like that. Something weird.
Speaker 1:Wow, is that to do with your creative workflow, or is that just like? Natural rhythm for you.
Speaker 2:A combination of that and also just the fact that I have a son now and so, like the schedule just ended up, like I look for weird hours to work, so 4am seems like my favourite time to work now.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think when I've spoken with other artists that have new children, there becomes this thing sometimes about having to concentrate your work into very specific parts of time. Is that something that you've found and there have been ways that you've found that that's actually perhaps helped you concentrate more?
Speaker 2:I feel maybe not, I feel like maybe the opposite. Like my brain is so fried now, not because of lack of sleep or anything, just there's a lot to think about on a day to day, whereas in the past I used to focus on, not focus, but I used to just wake up, I have an idea, I just start it and finish it and next, next, next, but in a positive way. Um, like the positive side is that now that I have a kid, I feel more like patient with songs now, like I used to rush songs so much before, not that I was in a bad way, just I wanted to move on to the next idea, the next idea, and I ended up working on so many tracks like that. But now it's like okay, I have a song, so I have four hours here, let me do something on it, and then I have another six hours here, let me do this, so I end up building. I feel more of a journey now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, not that people have heard a lot of what I've been making during this period, but at least with the I just had a release come out on Tempa, yeah, and I felt like that one was more like ideas that I felt I had flushed out better than other ideas in the past that I, after I put it out, I'm like oh shit, why didn't I just do this on this part or this on this? But now I'm like I feel super satisfied with the song and nothing to change yeah, yeah, I mean, I love that EP, the data EP it is.
Speaker 1:It's fucking brilliant and thank you. There's a, there's a. The opening track has like a bit of a. I don't know if it's a conscious nod to the, the original dubstep sound, or whatever, but I was wondering if you could talk me through, like the inspiration for for that track and the ep.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like uh, I always, ever since I found out about Tempa, I was always like I love the sound and I love the scene, what it represented. You know I'm from Kenya, nairobi, so it's pretty contrasting to London and you know Bristol and all that. But I just felt like it spoke to me in such a way that I could have been born there and that would have been what I was, I would gravitate towards. And so for the longest time I'd always been like what would I do for temper? Like if temper were around, what, what song would I make for temper? And so like, uh, when they, when they hit me up, I was like it felt so surreal and just like a chance for me to put down ideas that I had like touch.
Speaker 2:I had like ideas of dubstep and stuff like that. What I liked about the sound that I would incorporate in other songs but they were not dubstep tracks like I would just use like the bass, how they do the wobbly bass, or like the spaciness and the abstract nature, stuff like that. But now it's like, okay, let me do a proper dubstep tune or temper. And yeah, it was paying respects to what came before, like this sound choices were very intentional and all that and the intro. It's quite long, but I felt like that's a thing I loved, especially in the um. Earlier dubstep stuff was like how the intros really set the tone and I always wanted to live in that intro.
Speaker 1:Sometimes I'm like okay, wait, like push the drop further so it's like the intro is the the most important thing yeah, I always felt like that.
Speaker 2:Of course, in the club, the drop, you know, the bass when it hits you, you feel it. But at home, like or when you're driving or something, I always felt like the intro really set the tone for was very important and so, yeah, that that was my mentality going into it.
Speaker 1:Yeah that's amazing. I guess maybe, in a way, like with films, the opening scene of a film really sets the tone and no matter what happens afterwards, it's like having a good opening like that. That's something that I feel connects it to this early dubstep exactly, and sometimes this the rest can be shit.
Speaker 2:No offense, like for some tracks I've had, but the intro is so powerful that it kind of it makes the part if you would hear it outside of the intro makes sense if that, like some tracks have had only the drop in a club and I'm like I don't know if I like this. But then I go home and I hear the intro and it kind of brings you into that world and you kind of accept what's coming next and and you kind of love the song from there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and I love what you're saying, that you know you're really into into the label anyway, and then this happened.
Speaker 2:That must've felt I pretty much do you do you have these like points in your career where you think, wow, this is a, this is one of those points where you know I could tell my younger self that I would get to here yeah, yeah, like, uh, I think yeah, I don't have many points like that, but they're very special, like I think one of the first ones was a fixed twin playing, uh, one of my tracks, and that felt quite surreal because of just the kind of how the whole scene views him. You know, like he's like this, like godfather of, like you know, this kind of music and I kind of picked up a lot from his albums and things like that, especially the ambient stuff. And so to hear him playing my song, I felt very like, humbled and like that it didn't make sense because he played a song that no one barely has any plays. So I was like that. That felt even extra special, like, oh, you're not just picking out some random, you're actually like.
Speaker 2:And then another one was meeting a producer from fr called Brodinski. Yes, he's like huge, huge, massive inspiration for me and he's super nice. I met him and that whole day I was like a kid, like, oh my God. And then Temper this is another one I feel like is quite touching. Like I couldn't believe the email. I thought it's a scam Because they've been gone for so long. I was like, is this really Tempa? Am I being scammed or something. And then, but it was actually someone that we had bumped into each other in Poland and, like I think he's now doing A&R stuff for Tempa and he thought of me and I was just like when he confirmed that, I was like, okay, this is real, okay, and yeah, it just felt so surreal.
Speaker 1:Wow, so are you based in Poland now.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, for like two years now I've been here because my kid is half Polish, so I'm staying with my wife's family is around around, so we're just like we are all just yeah chilling here for some time, yeah oh, amazing, and I think one.
Speaker 1:Something I really wanted to ask you about though I think we've touched on a little bit already is just the sheer prolific nature of of your output. Like, um, I don't know how many albums you put. I counted roughly 28 releases, and I don't know if that's true, but this is since 2018. I mean what? What do you think is behind this incredible output?
Speaker 2:um, I think a bit of it was kind of rebel, not rebellious, but kind of like okay, I had just come from working with labels in 2018, 2019, and not that it's a bad thing, but they, you know, they choose what they put out very carefully and they go through loads of tracks and they choose like five best ones and all that. But at the time I think I was just frustrated by that and also I was very new to the scene. Like I just started making music like around 2017, 2016. And then 2018, the first EP comes out and 2019, I'm touring like everywhere, and at the time it was so it was kind of overwhelming in a way that I didn't process and it translated to me being like frustrated with, like the label or like I wanted to do this, but I felt like it didn't make sense for this person or didn't make sense for this festival or this and that so when the pandemic hit in 2020, yeah, I ended up like um, deciding to do my own thing and just self-release only because I felt like I I wanted to say more and I had so many thoughts and ideas and all that. So it just became like a flood of emotions and things like that On my Bandcamp page, like the first two releases are 60 tracks and everything was just flowing like so rapidly because of like the gates, I felt like I had suppressed so much and so everything was just overflowing so rapidly because of like the gates, I felt like I had suppressed so much and so everything was just overflowing, overflowing, and then went into 2021, 2022, onward just, I have something to say, next, next.
Speaker 2:But it kind of in a way, made me like now, after that experience on my band camp, now I felt like I did what I wanted to do, I said what I wanted to say, and now I got to appreciate labels more, because I kind of now see the importance of completion of an idea which is something like it's something to say something, but it's a different thing to complete the sentence.
Speaker 2:I don't know if I'm making sense, but like I get an impression of what you're saying.
Speaker 2:Yeah yeah, yeah, like um, I want to make a trap song, so I just make a trap song, but there's something like okay, what are you actually trying to structure with that? What are you actually? What are the sounds you're going to tweak and this and that? And sitting on a song helps with like, finalizing an idea where you don't. Once the release is out, I don't think about it anymore. Like I feel like I feel like this now temper, like it's out and it's out of mind. I love the songs and I have nothing to say extra on that, whereas all my other releases I'm always like going back and silently changing the band camp file like, oh my god, what I like. What did I just do here?
Speaker 1:yeah, we're kind of like waking up in the middle of the night and going yeah, I've got a thought. Oh no, the drum there is not exactly, exactly, yeah that's. I love the idea of the, the. The online has allowed us to be able to do that. At the same time, that work can be continually rethought by an artist, rather than that's what it is.
Speaker 2:You know, 5 000 copies have gone to the shops yeah, exactly, and also the fact that you get to see in real time people, what people respond to, like some songs I tweaked, but people like the original version, and then I listen, I I go back and I ask myself, like what did that? What captured the imagination with this? And I get to kind of see where people's heads are at in real time.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, and I mean I guess I mean, what were you saying about stepping away from labels for a while? Um, I guess and you did mention, is that the idea that you know labels do have an idea about where they want an artist to go and they want to have like a foothold on that, and you have this period where you're allowed to be completely free with what you are doing and there's such an incredible collision of influences that have gone into so much of your music. Like this morning I was listening to Tapestry and you know I pick out like industrial noise quite heavily in that I mean, quite often are there things that you want to try out, or does it that these sounds kind of emerged like naturally from playing around and being creative?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, like it's quite natural. It's not. Not really, especially with the albums that are singular ideas. I feel like people assume, okay, he wanted to make a noise album or he wanted to make a trap album or this or that. But it's never like that.
Speaker 2:Like I just have these periods where either I'm watching a bunch of film or anime or I go into a club and I hear a sound that I feel you know at the time, like almost like a teenager who hears a song, and it completely shatters. They're like, oh my God, like I didn't know reality can be like this. So I have moments like that and then I try and like quickly, like put that down on a track and capture my emotion in that specific moment. And later on I feel sometimes it's cheesy. I listen back and I'm like I don't know if that's exactly how X music sounds or how ambient music sounds or you know, like the standards quote, unquote. But I feel like that's what ends up making my music what it is. It's not quite trap, it's not quite noise, it's not quite this, that or the other, but it's just my interpretation of the sound or of the idea or of the emotion.
Speaker 1:yeah, yeah, um, I feel a lot of the time. Yeah, this, this way, this process of interpretation that the that goes through the artist. It's like I could tell. I could tell my friends like the same joke that you could tell me and it'll be a completely different joke, you know, because of my voice, or like just the way I maybe picked up on like one angle of the joke you know, and and I feel like that's the same with like using different genres is that you know you're not like necessarily trying to.
Speaker 1:The end result isn't necessarily the same genre, but it's, it's like the influence that goes in and it always comes out as who the artist is. Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2:And In the music scene I feel like when I listen at least it's quite few people I find who I feel are so unique in their approach to the sound that when I look at who I listen to over the years, it's like almost the same names for five years straight because I cherish their sound so much and I always hope that someone else finds that in my music where they hear it and they're like okay, this is an artist I listen to for the next 10 years because they're always making me excited and things like that. And you know I never try to um, I know, for example, like techno does well in festivals and stuff like that and I love techno, but I'm not going to force myself to make a techno track, but if I do make a techno track, that's okay as well, like it's something I wanted to do, so I just have fun with everything.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, yeah, that's a really lovely philosophy. I, I I was wondering if you could take me a little bit back to the start. You know growing up in Nairobi, and how did music come into your life?
Speaker 2:I think my mum is always like she works as a. She somehow still works, but used to work more prominently as a house help, as a maid, and she would wake up like super early and stuff like that and you know, prepare everything for everyone. Because we used to live with the families that she works for and so she would wake up super early to prepare for them and for me everything, as she would sing everywhere like gospel tracks. It doesn't make any sense, but gospel music was like quite a big impact when I was growing up. But she sings in like her mother tongue, which I actually don't understand. So it ended up being like I just liked melodies, I just hummed stuff. I had her humming and then growing up I kind of wanted to write lyrics for songs.
Speaker 2:In school I always used to write like in class I would write like lyrics for songs. The lyrics themselves weren't good, I felt, but I really loved the melodies I was coming up with for them. And at the time I knew nothing about production, nothing about electronic music, none of that. And it was only until end of high school that I had like the first EDM song at the the time, which was like a vichy, and my friend played it for me after when we went home from school and I couldn't believe it. I was like, wow, like music can have parts without um lyrics. Oh, my god, like. And then I went into uni and I got like music production software from a friend and it was just like all. I started putting down like quick little ideas I had from back in the day, melodies and structures for how I would imagine hip-hop beats and things like that.
Speaker 2:This was like fruity loops, like yeah yeah, and fruity loops is great because you can. The sequencing I felt was so good like I haven't found another software with a better sequencer. Maybe I'm just I have limited scope, maybe.
Speaker 1:But yeah, do you still still use fruity loops? Yeah, yeah, I still use it.
Speaker 2:yeah, so I started putting down ideas that I had for what I imagined. Edm Like I'm trying to play Tomorrowland or something I found out about that.
Speaker 1:So like the big room stuff as well.
Speaker 2:Exactly Like big festival, like make the sound as massive as possible. But I knew nothing about actual um, song theory or anything like that, so it was very hard for me to come up to. I had the melody in my head but it was so hard for me to put it down on a laptop. So what I ended up doing was I would start a project, make the drum patterns and all that, make it super complicated at least that's what I imagined at the time. Oh, it's so complicated, but uh, but uh. I would then be like, okay, I'll add melodies later when I can feel, when I figure it out. But it just ended up that I was playing it to my friends and they were like, oh, my god, this is experimental music. You know. Like, oh, this is quite experimental, just like what is experimental music? And then they showed me, um, a couple of stuff.
Speaker 2:And actually at that time is when I found out about temper, he played me like I think it's a track by Corky, I don't know, but I just remember the video has like a squid pulsating in the video and I was so like I didn't even know such sounds existed. And to see the views I'm like people are actually listening to this what? And so I became quite excited. I was so excited Like, oh, oh, my god, there's a whole other world I can explore and I don't need to force something that I don't quite have. So let me explore the stuff I like about and the things I can do, and so I I started fully just doing stuff with drum patterns and choosing weird sounds to add and recording on my phone, like my friend saying something, and then chopping that up into something, yeah, and it just progressed from there wow.
Speaker 1:And did you make a decision that this is what you were going to do for your life at the moment? Or did you have something else going on and you had to go?
Speaker 2:okay, I'm not going to, I'm gonna I'm gonna be a musician yeah, at the time, as I said, I was in uni, I was studying architecture, but my mom couldn't afford like the payments for for the you know, the hostel and food and stuff and I was struggling a lot and I was staying in my friend's room and he was also giving me food and stuff like that. So I felt like a bit of a burden to my friend and family. And so when I got introduced through a friend to a festival in Uganda called Nyege Nyege- yes yeah, yeah, they were like I.
Speaker 2:I mean, even that story is weird, because my friend told me oh, there's a festival called nyege, nyege, I think they would love your music. And so he forced me to go to a venue to show my music to them. They're like come please. And I never gone out, never gone to any bar, never drank alcohol at the time, and so I was so scared I was like, should I be doing?
Speaker 2:this and so we ended up at the bar. I played one song to some run, a random DJ that I had recognized through Facebook Like hello, my name is so-and-so.
Speaker 1:Can I play your song? It's the classic.
Speaker 2:Yeah, in the middle of a, in the middle of a club, uh, venue, not a club, but like a music venue. And he then is the one who introduced me to njage, he was like, yeah, it sounds sick, let me show you, check out these guys. And they liked my stuff and they introduced me to the villa, which is like a space they have for artists that you can just, you know, work and sleep there and all that. And they said, yeah, you can come through anytime. You know, we are open, just make music as long as you're productive, you know, yeah. And I just so I saw that like, okay, maybe, let me see where this goes. So I moved from school to the villa and at the time I was still trying to finish school, but as I was going back and forth, it became like a point where I had to choose one or the other and I just called my mom and I told her hey, mom, I'm done with school, I'm gonna do music. And she was kind of relieved, to be honest, really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she was super relieved.
Speaker 2:She was like yeah, you know, just do good, you know, don't do drugs. I love you, I support you, you because I think she was also struggling at the time, you know so yeah she felt like if I, if I have an idea that I can pursue, why not? You know, why not see where it goes? Because I didn't think the other thing was going to work. So yeah just fully moving in making tracks and everything moved from there yeah, and what was life like in the villa?
Speaker 1:was it a very creative atmosphere?
Speaker 2:yeah, it was pretty nuts, like uh, and I had so much stuff I I had never had before and people were constantly moving in and out from from uk, from europe, us. You know all these locations and you know you get to speak to artists who are coming in for like a week and they tell you their experiences touring. And you get to dream. You know, I always used to dream like playing a festival, what's that? What's what's that? Like um, traveling for a show, like what's that, like you know all that stuff, and so it just sparked a lot of imagination and the sounds they were playing were like super interesting and I picked up a lot from them and they kept giving me tips about like mixing a song, effects, how able tone works, how this works, you know hardware, things like that, and so, yeah, it was super important for me that I went through that and, you know, picked, absorbed all this information to create. Yeah, create.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I. It's so interesting because I think people come to electronic music for different reasons, like some people come to it because they're already like clubbers and they're already like very immersed in the world of dancing. And other people come to it like I get the impression that you did because it's like you're really into music and you find a way of making music with the equipment and the satin here in the sounds and, and so I guess the role of community is such a galvanizing force for inspiration and realizing that there are people all around the world that are making interesting sounds that you can connect with yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely, and like oh sorry, uh, no no, please carry on yeah that's cool, but uh, yeah, but on top of I feel like on top of community being like a big source of um inspiration, I feel like another big part that many people, I feel like in better situations, overlook is how important it is for survival, like you know, because we used to, you know, help each other.
Speaker 2:We chip in for food, we chip in for electricity, things like that and so like it. It gives you the headspace to not worry about rent or like to worry about x, y and z and you just be full-on like a creative, which is so rare to have, especially for people who are working like nine to five jobs. They barely have time to put down an idea or like dream of this or that.
Speaker 1:That community really helps like solidify, being a musician, you know, like just on top of inspiration, survival for sure, yeah yeah, yeah, I think people need cheap rent, people need circumstances that are getting more and more squeezed out everywhere, really, yeah, and how do you feel like nyaki nyaki has played as a cultural I mean, you sort of told me a little bit there but, like you know, has acted as this sort of big cultural force for african experimental music around the world?
Speaker 2:Yeah, like it's. I can't imagine a lot of the artists I know existing without Nyege Nyege and the whole scene, how they view East Africa, is heavily influenced by Nyege Nyege and their output and you know what they curate and the artists they gravitate towards and the sounds, that artists we share information and what we end up making very much influenced what people perceive as East African electronic music. Of course there are other labels that do their own thing, but Nyege Nyege to me feels like the biggest one that gives the outside world an impression, like a snapshot of what the electronic scene is in east africa, especially the more local genres, like singeli, which is tanzanian, it's like 180 bpm gaba, but with like some crazy melodies and things like that. So I feel like otherwise the outside world would never know about that, or rather they would look at it not as electronic music but as local music, which I feel like is quite different.
Speaker 2:Like through Nyage Nyage they give it like a stamp of like this is electronic music from here. They give it like a stamp of like this is electronic music from here. Like don't look at it like something niche or you know something like that, you know it's. It can't be global. They're using laptops to make the sounds. It's not like you know, of course, and of course there are artists who play instruments and all that, but for the ones who are making it on their laptops, like I was, I feel like it gave people the impression that we were making electronic music like this qualifies as electronic music, and I feel like that was important for the scene for sure.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. And then in the last few years, taking what you do out to festivals ranging from like unsound to, I mean, this week, ctm. I mean what? What do you feel has been the biggest sort of transition for you from making the music, being in the villa, like releasing music, to going out to all of these different global places and like these very sort of like intense electronic music festivals?
Speaker 2:yeah, like I, I don't quite fully have an answer to that like I know.
Speaker 2:I think one is that the festivals I think 2019 was the year that kind of maybe solidified for people to know what I do and stuff like that and so I think it was just a thing of the festivals were looking for. They're always looking for different sounds from X location, y location, and I was just lucky enough to be born from Kenya and to make what I make that they were interested enough to check it out and they thought it was interesting enough to share and you know they're always pushing boundaries, so it just everything was fitting at the time. Same with the east asia like movement, electronic movement. There. They were also like being looked at for inspiration, for newness, for something different.
Speaker 2:And ever since that, I feel like that year was the year of getting me from being like known as a kenyan artist to slick back. It was like I felt like a tough battle, like to. I tried to play as much different stuff as I could. I tried to make you know as much as I thought was like could make people see me not as just an ex-artist or a Nyege artist, a Kenyan artist. I just always wanted to be an individual and so I just over the years, that's all I ever wanted to do. So I just kept pushing, pushing, pushing, working as hard as I can, and you know it's, it's all I have. I don't work a normal job, so like I work like a dog, you know like I really push.
Speaker 2:I go, I do as much as I can and so I feel like now I've got into a stage where I can play and the festival and the people. Maybe they see me as slick back. You know not, as sometimes you even forget to mention I'm from Kenya, or like you forget to mention my association with X label, y label and yeah it, it's also comes from. You know, not staying too close to a single label or a single location. I'm always open. I move around everywhere. I work with who I work with because I like them and that's it. And I try not to be too held down by like I make GOM or I make Techno or I make gorm or I make techno or I make trap or I make dubstep or whatever. I just always try to diversify myself as much as possible, to not be one, one thing. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that that is the stamp stamp of the artist as well, and it goes into what we were talking about earlier on about genre and and how, once it filters through, you know it becomes something else. It becomes. You know your voice, really, and and I mean and with that you mentioned about collaborators as well and you've collaborated with some incredible people like object and shape, noise and cameroo. I mean, do you have like a specific? You know, you said that you just want to collaborate with people, that you want to work with. You know, but is there like more like? I guess, like, is there like a specific vibe that you look for with people you know that you collaborate with?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think the main vibe is like friendliness and kindness, like that's actually it like there's so many artists. I know who I'm scared to talk to. But I love their sounds, you know. But I would never work with them only because I'm scared of them.
Speaker 2:But some people have like very cool approachability, because now I don't do as much as I used to, but when I was touring I was meeting so many artists here and there and I always remembered who was nice and who was like their sound matched the person you see before you. And so I ended up just always having them at the back of my mind and listening to their stuff all the time. And they range all the time and they arrange, I feel like musically. There's no specific thing about them that connects them like of course you can find like one or two that match up, but for the most part I feel like they were quite different, making ambient noise, you know all that stuff. And so I ended up just reaching out to friends that I know and I'm like hi, do you want to do a track in this?
Speaker 2:When I was making the two albums called Melt and Condense those are like collaborative albums and every track is with a different artist when I was working on that, I always just had this idea, but I was always scared to ask them and then my girlfriend at the time now wife she was like no, I just message them, they will be down. So I just messaged them. And because these are people that are friendly and they're kind and they're open to ideas and that we vibe with each other. Musically, it just ended up that the connection works and working with them was super fluid and there was, you know, they sent stuff that was amazing. I feel like I'm not worthy of that, but you know, what they sent was great and I was so excited also to work on the stuff. Yeah, it was just all because of their kindness and they're all super nice people, super nice yeah, I love that it boils down to kindness and just being nice.
Speaker 1:That's just such a really good way to do it. I mean I have like a little bit of I don't know. It's not a test. That sounds a bit cruel, but I always have. I can get a bit judgy when I meet people in a social context. If someone doesn't ask you questions, like. I always think like when you meet someone, you should always ask them how they are, rather than going into just talking about yourself. You know, there's a. There's a bit of sort of like give you give something in a conversation you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry, I can't. I'm sorry, I have no questions for you. But yeah, no, no, no, this is an interview, it's totally I wasn't telling that. I realized the context of that sounds really funny, I know, I know, yeah, but yeah, they like exactly what you said just now, like that's something I hadn't realized. But that's actually. It's like they. You know, we are conversing, we are sharing stories, we are asking each other questions, we are curious about each other and that that's what made them like me, think they are awesome people.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, and I think that's what connects it to collaboration in a way is is someone that is curious, shows a little, maybe tells you a little bit that they're perhaps a good collaborator because they want to like, absorb.
Speaker 2:You know they want, they're interested in care absolutely, and when someone is too uptight, they tend to, um, take an idea and completely destroy your part of it. You know, because they are so they want it to be something completely else, whereas where, if you both have that like I don't know what it's called, but you can back and forth you can kind of end up both being considerate of the other person's sound and appreciating it and not destroying it in the final product, you try and amplify elements of the other person, but you're also putting your personality and I feel like that leads to some of the other person and you but you're also putting your personality, and I feel like that leads to some of the best collaborations. They may not be successful, they might be, but the track itself is, I feel, special.
Speaker 1:Because of that, yeah, yeah, yeah, that's actually a really nice way to say it. And just to round off, I was wondering if you, um, could go back in time to your younger self, just as you were starting to, perhaps, like maybe a week before, you found fruity loops, what, what would you tell? What would you tell your younger self?
Speaker 2:oh, I would tell myself to just keep doing what you're doing, because I think even before I found Fruity Loops, I always had this mentality like everything was going to be okay. I feel like, of course, when you find a tool, you feel even more secure, like, okay, the next few days, have a plan.
Speaker 2:I have a plan and yes but at the time I didn't quite exactly know, I didn't have a plan and everything would have been scary. But I was just always chill and maybe it goes, you know. Know, I had no responsibilities. Of course, now that I have a son, you know, he's all I think about in my family, you know.
Speaker 2:But at the time I was really like, so chill, like it's not that I didn't want to be successful or that I wasn't striving for success, but it's just I always felt like I'm doing as much as best I can and that will lead to something. You know, like even in school, I was always like, you know, even when I struggle understanding a topic or x, y and z, I'll just do my best and always at the end of the semester, somehow I'll pass, maybe barely, but I always kind of had this mentality of always just doing your best and everything would be okay. So, leading up to that, yeah, it was a very weird time, for sure, but I wasn't scared and I wasn't stressed. Of course, I felt for my mom that was the main thing I felt, for I felt her struggle and so I always wanted to take things off her shoulders and, yeah, I think, other than that, I was really like just easy and like not panicking in the face of like crazy shit happening.
Speaker 1:Yeah yeah, and what? What does your mum think of your music? Does she have particular favorites?
Speaker 2:zero, she doesn't. It's not that she doesn't like it, she just I think that it's just so completely different from what she knows. So in the same way I can compare when I first had noise music, I was so not, I was so confused and and stuff and I was, I didn't understand, especially because of the type of noise music I was introduced to. Like it wasn't, it was like people playing on fences, like playing bows, um, like bow strings right, yeah, the fire, the violin, kind of yeah, a fence, like they're playing that on a fence, you know, and like it sounds mad.
Speaker 2:like when you come from a world of none of that and that's the first thing you get introduced to, you're like I felt like I would never understand it, you know. But I just respected it because and like they would speak about it and they would speak about how important it is to them. Like they would speak about it and they would speak about how important it is to them and like they studied it their whole life and the sonics and the technicalities and all that. And that's how I feel where my mom is at, like I speak about what I do so passionately to her. Like I have this tendency to talk, talk, talk.
Speaker 2:Like when I meet her I'm just like rapid fire, rapid fire. And I just see her smile and like, okay, I get like all this is not even clicking, but she sees how important it is to me and she also just respects it and she leaves a comment here and there on my post saying like may god bless. You know, she's very christian, so every everywhere she speaks, she's talking about god and yeah, thank god for you and I pray for you and all that and I'm always amen, thank you, yeah, even though my world is like completely different. But yeah, yeah, I, yeah, she, she respects it.
Speaker 1:yeah that's beautiful. I love the idea of respecting something even though it's not your jam. Basically, it's not your jam basically it's not your thing. You can kind of understand the artistry and the passion and something.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, freddie, thank you so, so much for chatting with me today thank you for having me okay, so that was me, paul hamford, talking with slickback, and we had that conversation on the 27th of January 2025. Thank you so much, freddie, for your time and thoughts and for sharing all of that with me. I really really enjoyed that chat and the Data EP is out now, released on Tempa, and if you haven't already and you really like the show, give the show a rating and a review on the platform of your choice. Do subscribe. It all really helps. It really, really really does help build the show. Give the show a rating and a review on the platform of your choice. Do subscribe. It all really helps. It really really really does help build the show.
Speaker 1:You can listen to my radio documentary the man who smuggled punk rock across the berlin wall by heading on over to the bbc sounds app or in the world service home page, and my book coming to berlin is still available in all good bookshops or via the publisher's website. Velocity pressocity Press Audio-Technica. Sponsor Lost Sound, the global but family-run company that make headphones, turntables, cartridges, microphones. They're wearing the headphones I'm speaking to you right now in. They're wearing the microphone that I do all of the podcast interviews in. They make studio-quality yet affordable products because they believe that high-quality audio should be accessible to all, so head on over to Audiootechnicalcom to check out all of their range of stuff. Okay, so the music that you hear at the beginning at the end of every episode of the show is by thomas giddens, hyperlink in the podcast description. So that's it. I hope, whatever you're doing today, you're having a really fantastic one. Thanks, as always, for listening. Take care and I'll chat to you soon. Thank you.