Lost And Sound
Lost and Sound is a podcast exploring the most exciting and innovative voices in underground, electronic, and leftfield music worldwide. Hosted by Berlin-based writer Paul Hanford, each episode features in-depth, free-flowing conversations with artists, producers, and pioneers who push music forward in their own unique way.
From legendary innovators to emerging mavericks, Paul dives into the intersection of music, creativity, and life, uncovering deep insights into the artistic process. His relaxed, open-ended approach allows guests to express themselves fully, offering an intimate perspective on the minds shaping contemporary sound.
Originally launched with support from Arts Council England, Lost and Sound has featured groundbreaking artists including Suzanne Ciani, Peaches, Laurent Garnier, Chilly Gonzales, Sleaford Mods, Nightmares On Wax, Graham Coxon, Saint Etienne, Ellen Allien, A Guy Called Gerald, Jean Michel Jarre, Liars, Blixa Bargeld, Hania Rani, Roman Flügel, Róisín Murphy, Jim O’Rourke, Yann Tiersen, Thurston Moore, Lias Saoudi (Fat White Family), Caterina Barbieri, Rudy Tambala (A.R. Kane), more eaze, Tesfa Williams, Slikback, NikNak, and Alva Noto.
Paul Hanford is a writer, broadcaster, and storyteller whose work bridges music, culture, and human connection. His debut book, Coming to Berlin, is available in all good bookshops.
Lost and Sound is for listeners passionate about electronic music, experimental sound, and the people redefining what music can be.
Lost And Sound
Richard Fearless
Richard Fearless is a true lifer. The DJ, producer and Death In Vegas founder sits down with Paul to reflect on 30 years of musical evolution that has taken him from the hugely influential Heavenly Social to Mercury Prize nominations, a top ten hit about a serial killer sung by Iggy Pop to his current creative renaissance, working free from industry bullshit and producing his best work in years,
Growing up in remote Zambia with music-loving parents, Fearless recalls connecting with music at an early age. His path would lead through the emerging London techno scene of the late '80s and '90s, where he cut his teeth as a resident DJ alongside contemporaries like Andrew Weatherall and The Chemical Brothers before launching Death in Vegas. The conversation reveals a pivotal moment when commercial success led to a crossroads rather than continued mainstream pursuit.
What emerges is the portrait of an artist who deliberately stepped away from major labels, management, and industry expectations to craft a more authentic sonic identity. His riverside studio "The Metal Box" becomes central to this narrative – an analog sanctuary where tape machines, field recordings, and environmental sounds combine to create the stripped-back, trance-inducing techno of his current work. "I make my best music when I'm digging deep within myself," he explains.
Perhaps most compelling is Fearless's admission that he feels more proud of his recent, independent work than the commercial hits that brought him fame. His collaborative ventures with friend of Lost and Sound Daniel Avery and new dub-inspired night "Holy" demonstrate an artist still pushing boundaries rather than retreating into nostalgia. "I feel as excited about DJing as I was when I was 20," he confesses, signaling that artistic liberation has reinvigorated his passion.
Death Mask by Death In Vegas is out now. Listen on Bandcamp
Follow Death In Vegas on Instagram: @deathinvegasmusic
If you enjoy Lost and Sound, I’ve got a little favour to ask: please subscribe, leave a rating, and write a quick review on your favourite podcast platform. It really helps others find the show. You can do that here on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you like to listen.
Huge thanks to Lost and Sound’s sponsor, Audio-Technica – makers of vcry fine engineered audio gear. Check them out here: Audio-Technica
Want to go deeper? Grab a copy of my book Coming To Berlin, a journey through the city’s creative underground, via Velocity Press.
And if you’re curious about Cold War-era subversion, check out my BBC documentary The Man Who Smuggled Punk Rock Across The Berlin Wall on the BBC World Service.
You can also follow me on Instagram at @paulhanford for behind-the-scenes bits, guest updates, and whatever else is bubbling up
Hey, it's Paul here, and welcome back to Lost in Sound, the podcast that goes behind the scenes, with people shaping music and culture from the underground up. I'm speaking to you from a very, very, very hot Berlin, where I'm sat, as usual, on a chair somewhere in the city and I'm going to tell you about what's on this week's episode, which, as usual, I'm quite excited about. I'm going to tell you about what's on this week's episode, which, as usual, I'm quite excited about. I'm always quite excited because I love the guests I speak with, and this conversation is with a real music lifer, someone who's travelled the peaks of the industry, set themselves free and is right now making the best work of their career. It's Richard Fearless. But before we get going, lost in Sound is sponsored by Audio-Technica, the global but family-run company that make headphones, microphones, turntables, cartridges, studio-quality yet affordable products, because they believe that high-quality audio should be accessible to all. So, wherever you are in the world, head on over to Audio-Technicacom to check out all of their range of stuff. Okay, let's do the show. Thank you, hello, and welcome to episode 173 of Lost in Sound.
Speaker 1:I'm Paul Hamford, I'm your host, I'm an author, a broadcaster and a lecturer, and each week I have conversations with artists who work outside the box about music, creativity and how they're navigating life through their art. So whether you're new here or you've been listening for a while, it's super good to have you along. And this week I had the pleasure of speaking with someone who's a real lifer, someone who's been refining and purifying a vibe since the mid-90s. It's the DJ producer and founder of Deaf in Vegas, richard Fearless. So we had this chat because the first new Deaf in Vegas album in nine years has just been released. It's called Deaf Mask and it's a very, very different beast from the Deaf in Vegas that first rose to prominence.
Speaker 1:So I remember in the 90s and into the early 2000s, fearless, with the Deaf in Vegas project Vegas project rose rode the wave of electronic artists that were incorporating a rock element into their sound. Like the Chemical Brothers always had that psychedelic element if you think of, like the private psychedelic reel or those tracks with Noel Gallagher, the Prodigy had their punk metal thing. And for Death in Vegas it was this dance music, absorption of the stooges, suicide, throbbing gristle, the velvets, my bloody valentine the kind of rock, the, exactly the kind of rock we like on lost and sound. And this stage of fearless's artistic evolution reached commercial peaks with the 99 1999 album, the contino sessions, which was mercury nominated and it had the top 10 hit, aisha, which featured the vocals of iggy pop on it, and also a few years later with the liam gallagher fronted scorpio rising. Then something happened which we talk a little bit about in the episode and since then big change of course. Fearless has been on a different course. I mean, of course I feel of purifying his practice of stripping back and focusing on the future and making music free of industry bullshit and he's also been making more a deeper electronic sound like, I think, of those suicide leaning elements that are still there, but they're now in spirit rather than overt like death mask. The new album it's stripped down, it's trance inducing techno. It's definitely definitely not heritage music, which it could be if it wanted to be, but it's not so anyway, I was really excited to chat with fearless back in the 90s.
Speaker 1:I remember being once the warm-up dj for a fearless set at london's metal box night. The metal box was the night that took over from heavenly social, the legendary heavenly social that fearless, the chemical brothers and and John Carter were residents of. But I didn't bring this up during the conversation. I did think about it but I thought, well, it's a bit of an obscure and on the spot thing to sort of say to someone like, oh, do you remember back in 1999, I DJed a warm up set for you once. I thought about it though, but anyway, I remember him being a gent then and he's a gent now. These days he's someone that seems to be in a very independent place and a very creative place.
Speaker 1:Um, but before we get going, a little personal critique, I guess, of myself. Um, you know, sometimes you do interviews and you're just like a little bit like I don't know what happened. Maybe, you know you don't sleep that well the night before, or you've got a lot of other deadlines or life pressure or work pressure, and I mean, we're all human and everyone's like that, and for me that manifests when that happens, in being a little bit more stuttery and jittery and a bit like more like what? What? Than usual, and I'm deaf.
Speaker 1:This is definitely one of those interviews where I'm I don't really have it all together. Um, that's no reflection on richard, and I might just be being a little bit like overtly self-critical there, but just wanted to flag it, um, because I really did enjoy chatting with him and I think you're going to really enjoy, despite me, this episode. But anyway, if you like the show and you haven't already, please do give it a subscribe. Give the show a rating and a review on the platform of your choice. Really, really, really does help. And so, yeah, we had this conversation on tuesday, may the 27th 2025, and this is me, paul hamford, talking with Richard Fearless for Lost and Sound podcast.
Speaker 2:Hey, hi.
Speaker 1:Hey Richard, Can you hear me okay?
Speaker 2:Yeah, all good, all good. How are you doing? Yeah, not too bad. One second I'm trying to distract the whining dog.
Speaker 1:No, I totally get that. I've got a cat who's luckily sleeping right now, right.
Speaker 2:He's 17 months and he's kind of he's been really quiet all morning, but now he's like ready for like some activities yeah, are you?
Speaker 1:uh, are you? Is this like your first dog or are you like a regular, like dog dad?
Speaker 2:I've always had a dog all my life. Yeah, yeah, we, we grew up, grew up with dogs, and then, um, and then yeah, in my 20s what that you know? For the first time I left time, I got a dog immediately.
Speaker 1:I've always, I've always, had one, really yeah, oh yeah, I mean I sort of gravitate between cats and dogs, but yeah, they definitely, definitely bring a lot, don't they to?
Speaker 2:yeah sure, yeah definitely. It's kind of weird to imagine a household without one.
Speaker 1:Really it's at that stage, you know yeah, I end up like actually having conversation like human conversations with my cat for no reason whatsoever. Like you know, I asked my cat the opinion on things like no, it's just sometimes I think why am I doing that? But I I feel like the cat does get something out of it get it um, thanks so much for joining me today. Um so you got the seventh death in vegas album. It's almost getting on for like 30 years since the first one.
Speaker 1:Hello 30 years wow yeah, I mean that was a bit of a wow for you. Is that like a? Does that sort of register in a way like fuck, that's 30 years? Yeah, is there like a through line for you that connects all of this work together?
Speaker 2:I mean I guess there is, I mean, all the records I kind of felt like, well, when I made the Deaf and Biggest Records, I tried to kind of carry on from where I left off. So there is to that level, for sure, but I think more sonically it feels like there's just the solo albums I made as Richard Fearless and Transmission, the one I did with Sasha Gray. In this album they all seem to be a lot more kind of tied in and and I think that's just where I'm at at the moment and where I've got to with the sound of the studio and the way I work and kind of not really, you know, working very kind of I mean I work as an engineer but not working with session musicians who I bring in, you know, and vocalists and stuff like that, like guest vocalists. This is kind of, you know, very much being the kind of fruits of of the metal box which is the studio. I've made the kind of all these last albums yeah, it's last four albums yeah, and and was that like?
Speaker 1:was there like a conscious decision to do that? Because, like so, particularly looking at but you mentioned the last four albums, particularly this album, there seems to be this real line of purity to the sound you know they're, you know, not working with. Like you know you could have gone a different route, particularly from the early 2000s onwards, like thinking back to like scorpio rising and and contino sessions, to kind of follow the route of working with lots of featured artists, having, like um, keeping the kind of the the rock and roll element and expanding out that way. Was it a conscious decision to sort of like, sort of, I guess, sort of feel like strip things down and work on a more like pure sound, if that makes sense?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean it was, and I think a lot of that was just various different changes to.
Speaker 2:You know, I left a major label, I stopped having management, I started to do my own label and you know I put myself in a position where I was able to do that because I didn't really have to um kind of report to anyone on any level and I could follow what my instincts were and and not so much just what my instincts, but follow a direction that made me kind of like gave me creative satisfaction.
Speaker 2:And that was the path I chose and I think also like it was probably a truer path to what I was really into music wise. Like, even when I did things like continue sessions and those albums, I was still like playing Detroit techno at heavenly social and you know I was all into electronic music. But you know it's like everyone else is like into kind of crowd rock and but I think where I'm at now with death mask and the current stuff, it's more reflection on what I play out, what I DJ, the sounds, the music I kind of hunt for for my radio show, and I feel that it's kind of the Richard Fearless and Death in Vegas worlds have kind of come kind of joined, for probably for the first time really come kind of joined for, probably for the first time really.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I can hear that listening to the new album and the last richard fearless album definitely. But there was one thing that I was kind of wondering about in terms of connecting it all up in the. I feel and again, this is just my own interpretation, so please tell me if I'm off the mark with this but I feel that there is this line that certain few DJs and producers have, like Andrew Everall had, like you know you do this monthly night with Daniel Avery and I feel he has it like high, has it as well of where there is this like rock and roll or minimalist or noise lineage as well that that does sort of manifest in some way, like I can even hear it on death mask. You know, for you is there like a sort of a lineage that even if you're doing something, that's sort of sure, and you know, I kind of I think you know you get to the point where your your musical not just your musical, but your kind of life experience is kind of like shape.
Speaker 2:If you choose them you can really shape your work and I think all the say like okay, for example like rock and roll music, like it might not seem like an influence on this album but there is, you know, there's like bands like ramley, which you know um, uh, force exposure, and you know a lot of those kind of um noise bands you know, like that's, that's where my kind of my lenience and guitar music have taken me to, by bands like my bloody valentine loop. You know I've got more just like kind of, you know, power electronics and noise. You know like bands like sun and minimal artists like b mask and people like that, where it's just kind of, you know just taking down stuff to the barest components. But there's still, you know, all those people have gone on a journey, their own journey, to get to that sound and I do think this is, you know, I wrote this as Deaf in Vegas and I tried to kind of, you know, with Deaf in Vegas's songs.
Speaker 2:I still I try and go on kind of a journey in the songs you know and I guess you're just kind of you know you're just drawing it from all these kind of you know different influences subconsciously. You know people like Janelle Moss and Ramle and Mickie Vainio and his Panasonic projects he did as well and you know Underground Resistance and all those things are the records that I I was I've been listening to for the last 30 years but um, but straight up kind of guitar music. It looks like I don't really I don't listen to that kind of music really, you know no, I listen to people who might use guitars and amplification in their sound.
Speaker 2:You know.
Speaker 1:Back to the ramune acrid sample yeah, yeah, I, I, yeah, I I can. I can relate to that with death mask. Was there like a kind of a principle that you wanted to work towards going into it, or was it a question of getting in the studio and seeing where it takes you? Um, I mean getting?
Speaker 2:in the studio and seeing where it takes you. Um, I mean getting in the studio and seeing where it takes me. Really. I think that's really what I do. You know. That's what. What's something with this album.
Speaker 2:You know, some of the other albums I've had more of a kind of concept from the start, but with this album I just was just like. You know, I'm going through Y and Z at the moment due to what life's you know being thrown at and dealing with that. And as an artist, you know, one of the luckiest sides of being an artist is you can kind of use that as a kind of cathartic process of channeling stuff. So you know the situation in the world and family and loss and love and you know all those things. You know. I just try to kind of dig into where I was at that moment and not worry about it too much, but like going to the studio and kind of pour out how I was feeling at that moment and not be like, right, I'm going to make a song. The song's going to be about for my dad. You know it wasn't really a process. I make my best music. I know I can.
Speaker 1:I realize I make my best music when I kind of I'm kind of not trying to kind of do something in another vein, but I'm just like digging deep within myself a little bit yeah, yeah, I feel like there are definitely some artists who the whole thing is that they will approach something head on like probably very lyrically, and I feel so like music, just the process of making music can be like a kind of a catharsis itself, you know, like by just playing, how you want to play, related to how you feel at that time, and was that? Was that like more like the approach that you took with this? Sure, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Definitely.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, I think the other thing that I get, that maybe is a through line with a lot of the music over the different eras, is the sort of like a sort of cinematic quality to that. And like I know that you've got like a kind of a fine art background and work as a visual artist and have worked as a visual artist as well. Is there a way that, like when you're working on music, that you think visually?
Speaker 2:yeah, for sure, I still wish it weirdly think myself as a visual artist, not a kind of solid one all right and um, I mean, it's interesting like the you know the way where the studio is located.
Speaker 2:It's a very, you know, it's a very inspiring kind of spot to be in. And you know, I definitely try, and you know, kind of have a visual picture when I kind of go into the writing process. Visual picture when I kind of go into the writing process, um, and sometimes that can be, you know, can it be my own work that I'm going to be using. I'm kind of staring at something or pitching. You know, I quite often have like kind of images in the studio and I always used to do this, like, especially in my old the container rooms I'd had films playing all the time, you know, without sound on.
Speaker 2:I kind of have found, like you know, visual kind of content going on moving images very inspiring to me when I'm working on music. But now the visual stimulation was very much what I was looking at the studio, like looking down the river and you know kind of understanding the river and kind of seeing weather systems coming in and stuff. But as far as like the kind of cinematic side, I think that just comes from a lot of that comes from kind of always being drawn to music and film, you know, still that moving image which is kind of conjures emotion with the barest kind of components. So you have, like you know, the best dub and the best techno to me is the stuff where it kind of still has a level of feeling, but with just the barest possible hints of it.
Speaker 2:You know, the best dub to me is when it's so stripped down, it's like you know, and down it's like you know. And with techno as well, like you know. Artists like Panasonic I never know how you say it, but the O with the dash across that project.
Speaker 1:Right. Yeah, I don't know how you say it either. It's one of those sort of.
Speaker 2:Like it's. You know I mean it's minimum techno at its best and, and I think you know, creating music has a lot of space, takes some confidence and you know you have to have. Even though there can be a lot of space, you still need for me to do it, I still need to have like quite a lot of movement in that minimal piece. There still has to be like some a lot of movement in that minimal piece. There still has to be like some journey, whether that's like the way you use effects or whatever, or delays. You know you still need to, I still need to put movement into that.
Speaker 2:But I think I think that's kind of something I feel like I'm kind of probably getting better at, so get older, and I think it's probably one of the reasons why deaf and big so these are probably used for quite a lot of film music is there is a lot of space in music and and one of the other things that's really lovely about trying, when you do achieve that you achieve with, you know you have that space as it lets the listener imagination go on a different journey, because you're not like cementing them with lyrics and making them think about one particular thing, but you're creating this space for them to kind of really kind of go on a kind of cerebral kind of journey on, and that's that's kind of a nice aspect of it. So there is, there is it's not pre-planned for that just kind of that kind of start of the sound, if that makes sense yeah, yeah, totally.
Speaker 1:I mean it's interesting you mentioned about like being you know the different focus music being used in films because I think one of the most famous ones I can think of is is Lost in Translation and when you've seen like how you know, like using that like maybe as an example, like when you've seen like someone else's interpretation of like a piece of music you know, or the way they've used your piece of music, how did that feel?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean, it's normally, you know, it's normally like there's a certain intensity. I mean the amount of times I get certain like scripts and like and they describe the scene. It's like, and then the person's taken down an alleyway and it's like there's always something really intense going. Yeah, it's never like, you know.
Speaker 2:And then he saw her for the first time and yeah, yeah and then his head explodes and then it ends with um, I mean it's I try to. As far as the stuff getting used and what film, you know some of it we don't have any control of, but the things like things like on the you know like thing on the BBC or whatever, or I don't know like match of the day, it just kind of happens or something like that. But as far as like kind of proper requests that come in, I've always been trying to be somewhat precious with what it's used for. Yeah, I mean not somewhat precious what it's used for, yeah, I mean not somewhat precious, precious of, like you know, if things come in a lot of a kind of quite shitty progress and even though I could desperately do with the money, I've always tried to like kind of guard it a little bit, you know, and a lot of that. That's not just for me, that's kind of like for the fans of the music, you know yeah, yeah, I, I mean.
Speaker 1:So I wanted to kind of ask you a few questions about sort of like going back to the beginning and going through your life. Is that's okay and um, so I mean, how was there like a particular moment that you sort of felt that music particularly came into your life?
Speaker 2:yeah, I mean not a particular moment, but from an early age music was in my life. Definitely that was very much due to where we were, where we were living, and my parents loved music. And you know we lived in a really remote part of Zambia, right on the border of the Congo Belgian Congo at the time literally right on the border. And this was. My parents moved in the 60s and I was born in like 72 in in Chingola, but my dad was into in Belfast. My dad was really into like the big band scene and would kind of follow bands around when they came over, the kind of big band leaders, and was really into dancing and would enter dance competitions and stuff.
Speaker 2:And my mum our mum was a scholar. She was into the Highland Games and would do dance in the Highland Games. So when we were living in Africa my dad was in the Highland Games, my mum was as well, and from an early age. So my mom was an art teacher in africa and a lot of her friends were like kind of like kind of zambian and congolese and some africanas and so and this was during you know there was a lot of late night drinking and partying and the the record player was a kind of was a kind of holy thing in the house and both my sister and I think from an early age kind of, I can recall the kind of power of putting on the record and trying to make your parents, make our parents dance and that was kind of that was a.
Speaker 1:That was a strong memory, you know, but that was something that I remember from a very early age, that kind of the power of a piece of music to make someone kind of enjoy themselves yeah, and was there a point where you felt like, because you know what you said so far, it sort of feels like there was a lot of influence from your parents and a lot of influence from the surroundings and, uh, was there a point where you felt like you were finding your own influences like outside of that?
Speaker 2:Well, that came.
Speaker 2:That came definitely later and and that was.
Speaker 2:You know, it's very fortunate enough to have an older sister and a cousin who are really into music and you know my cousin, ollie, was the first person I went to, a few years older, would go to gigs with and you know, we kind of started really following bands and then and then and I'd started kind of collecting records, quite, you know, buying records when I was quite young. But you know, that kind of obsession with kind of following music became kind of very much. You know I was, I lived near reckless records and I would kind of be in there every day, the one in islington and um, and yeah, through that kind of that year I started to kind of I get more into kind of I guess kind of like um guitar bands like my buddy vantine loop and felt they were like the first bands I was really into. And then I we had NME journalist live in the house and go out with someone in this housing car like live with this was kind of just as Acid House was kicking off.
Speaker 1:Right, so sort of like late eighties.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and she kind of gave me a copy of the Sound of Detroit compilation and I remember that was a real like eureka moment of like listening to this kind of. You know, in hindsight when you listen back to the album I still got a few copies of it floating around. But it's like you know people like Eddie Flashing Foulkes and you know a lot of the music I kind of it's really funky. You know that a lot kind of music and I remember that particular album and also what was going on around me, you know, like being in London during the kind of I guess it was slightly at the end of Acid House but I was discovering around that time and started to party and whatnot.
Speaker 2:But that album particularly was a, was a kind of definitely an album where I can remember as like a kind of a huge introduction to the electronic stuff, which kind of was the path I kind of carried on probably the deepest into yeah, what was the sort of scene like at the beginning for you, when you, when you sort of jumped on well, the the first, the first kind of rave scene I got into was actually out of london, because a friend at art college and um and I got on this bunch of lads who were like northern lads and so they were like they were kind of going to like shelly's and this is when sasha had his residency and stuff like that.
Speaker 2:So this isn't like kind of. This is probably like 90, 89, 90 around that time. So slightly later I think I've got one acid house, but early, late, probably 87 was it?
Speaker 1:I think so. I mean the summer of love.
Speaker 2:This is a little bit later but um, so they were going up and going up to kind of like you know they'd go to Shelleys and then like kind of hit car parks afterwards and like Nate would pull up in a van and play. You know I was kind of going up there and in London it was more like raves outside of London so like things in Chislehurst caves and parties like that. The clubbing, the clubs in Londonondon didn't really start coming to until I was kind of a little bit older and then that was places like the milk bar and wag and lover arch and then later on like drum club was a big club for me. You know, getting into weatherall and kind of following weatherall and, you know, catching him anytime I could. He was probably the dj at the time. It was most the english dj was most influential on on me when when I first started as well, you know, and certain characters in the record shops were a huge influence on all of us.
Speaker 2:You know alex knight at fat Cat, ashley at Black Market forget the guy in Co-op. But there were certain people in those shops you'd go in. They were just such good selectors and they would just be able to kind of and I've worked in record shop stores and it's a real art. There's people who kind of just know what to play at the right moment and you know like someone like Alex Knight had a huge influence on you know someone like alex knight had a huge influence on.
Speaker 2:You know people like weber or myself, just from going to fat cat and what he was playing behind because he was just constantly mixing records and things were kind of work. We're kind of coming in at the same time but very fortunate enough to be back to the partings of the partying even before that. But like the earliest stages was probably like the squat party scene, like people like got mutually waste in camberwell because I was in art college in camberwell so they were doing all these around there. So that was probably the kind of the earliest kind of rave scene was. More, though, their parties like I kind of avoided the bigger baglies and all that kind of stuff. It started getting a bit too grim for me or that.
Speaker 2:In what way grim just kind of too big and too much going on and just a bit, like you know, just kind of some wrongs involved and, you know, lost a lot of its kind of openness and the freeness associated with the scene.
Speaker 2:But we were just getting the rave scene of the kind of, you know, everyone being kind of one under one, kind of unifying kind of blanket of acid house kind of started to become just a bit more like you know, get a lot more gangs involved and yeah, there's money to be made here you know like anything yeah but fortunate enough, then I started kind of djing and, you know, getting kind of involved in the club scene in my own way what were the sort of steps that but that happened with?
Speaker 1:was there like heavenly social at that point?
Speaker 2:well, that was really from being a record collector and then having a lot of records 18 getting decks, and then people just come back to our house because it was like a housing cart and people could come back there late and having turntables in the room, and and some friends who are a bit older, who kind of had a bit of money, decided they wanted to start putting on some parties just to kind of really to get to book weber, weber, all and um, and I just started getting kind of the odd support slot as a dj. And then the next thing, I got asked to be a resident at this club, the job club in soho, which ran for a couple year and a half or something and it was fantastic. Club um, where you know they used to get some amazing you know guests in like claudia and derrick may and weberall and um, paul daly and babby powers, you know the kind of those kind of the harder edge techno djs, and that's where I kind of got my chops really just being a resident. And then around that time I started deaf in vegas and deaf in in Vegas kind of took off quite quickly. And then I got asked to be the resident for the Heavenly Social and did three years doing that with Tom and Ed and John Carter.
Speaker 2:We were the residents and that was an amazing experience. That was, like, you know, taking it turns once a week, being the warm-up, the middle DJ or closing. You know it was a fantastic club but yeah, like that kind of as a DJ, you know, going through the kind of resident kind of thing and learning how to kind of warm a club up with, that was like really invaluable to you know how I still play really is, I think jay yeah, I, I was speaking with lauren garnier a while back and he was talking about the importance of beginning as a resident, um, sort of equating it to like being like a chef in the kitchen and starting off doing something.
Speaker 1:Quite that could seem quite menial to other people but like, um, you get to understand the nuances and you know, you get to sort of like understand like the room from from the most basic way up. You know how would you relate to that?
Speaker 2:very much. Yeah, definitely, um, and it's, you know, it's really important that kind of initial experience people have when they walk in of how it feels, because that carries on with you from you know nine, you know there's, you know, learning, but not to kind of be really loud at the beginning, just kind of respecting kind of the person you're playing before and kind of building up for them, and in the right way. I mean it's. Yeah, definitely, I can definitely relate to it. It is a um, it's like an apprenticeship of some level. But, um, it's funny because that now I do this club with daniel avery.
Speaker 2:We record them all and it's, you know, we we did one this weekend in scotland and it's so nice to kind of I wish I'd done more of that back in the day of recording sets because of this, because when you play to a room and there's no one in there, it doesn't matter if you know it's recorded, because at least someone who's going to sit down. You know we put all six hours of the mixes up but like it's really nice to listen to the beginning of it's, just like an hour ambience, but you know you're listening in out of context. It's, you know it's, it's, it's. It's a nice way to kind of play, knowing that you're just not playing these records to no one, so someone's going to hear them further down the line.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and that kind of changes the emphasis of how you're playing as well, doesn't it? Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean I, you know sort of round about that time. So we're sort of talking about like the time that deaf in vegas, um, you know you form that um and you know you sort of mentioned about like tom and ed as well, djing with them and john carter, um, round about that time mid to late 90s. I mean, I guess before then we'd already had, like you know, like you know, chemical Brothers first album came out, what, like 95?
Speaker 1:They'd already been like Left Field and Underworld and there was this sort of like movement towards like electronic British electronic artists like actually making album albums and it felt like Death in Vegas were kind of part of that. Um, did you feel like you fitted in and a lot of that might just be like press perceptions of like just the genuine evolution of like artists kind of progressing, you know, um through the industry as much as anything else. But did you feel like there was a sort of a vibe between of like electronic dance music at the time or do you feel like that was something that was like, you know, a bunch of journalists trying to sell uh like mixmag and and melody maker yeah, probably more the latter.
Speaker 2:Really, I didn't feel like. I felt like we're all doing something really really different. I mean, I was an electronic artist, someone who loves, you know, dance music, but I was trying to make these albums and make more of a traditional kind of album in a traditional sense and I wanted it to be very different to what I was. My club experience, you know, I never played Death and Vegas records for years when I was DJing Like hardly ever, you know. Well, I just didn't. And because I just seemed as a very separate kind of like, you know, I would consider myself a techno DJ. I was a techno DJ who was trying his hand at making kind of like a straight up rock albums and as far as like being associated with everyone, I felt like, you know, left field had their own thing, tom and ed had their own thing and we'd all you know I didn't feel like we were kind of any of our music was kind of sounded similar at all really.
Speaker 1:But they're all people you know, I knew and liked most of them yeah, like, I guess, like sometimes, like the press picks up on like the kind of scene aspects of it, like they, you know, sort of sell it as, like you know, these guys have got this thing going on somewhere like um and yeah, and then it kind of, I guess, like you know, the contino sessions was like I guess the sort of the album but like had that kind of initial crossover thing. You know like there was the mercury thing with it. There was like the top 10 single, uh, with iggy pop. Um, as someone who I feel like has always got like a very strong attachment to sort of like musical integrity and following the path, particularly, like you know saying at the beginning of this conversation, um, towards like a quite kind of a pure line of exploration back then, being put in that situation or finding yourself with deaf and vagus in that situation of big exposure, um, what was this? A comfortable situation to be in? Was this something that you embraced at the time?
Speaker 2:it wasn't a comfortable situation to be in at all and um and and it brought me a lot of angst and you know I I was very happy that I left the major and kind of got to go on my own path and I I definitely, you know I listen I don't want to go into certain songs but there's a lot of my work. I wish I'd never done loads of it and you know it is what it is. But I kind of feel like I'm kind of, you know, I don't really even feel, feel like I feel like it's the last few albums that I'm actually kind of more proud of than the kind of work.
Speaker 2:And a lot of that was like kind of being with a major and feeling I had to kind of work with, collaborate with people and not being that involved in kind of the actual mixing side and yeah, it is what it is um, you know, I feel like the best move I ever made was like leaving a major and not having management for a long time, and that allowed me the choice I mean, it's not the choice that allowed me to really go on this path of setting up drone, doing these other albums, learning, just learning my craft a bit more, and I'm not sure if it was probably the you know the best thing for my career, some of my decisions, but I've carried on doing something where I'm like I'm making. Remember, when I got into doing this last record, I was like I'm going to do it again. I have to make it, I have to really excite me. I could be really, really into this. I can't be making music like a fan base from 30 years ago. I have to make music that really pushes me and excites me.
Speaker 2:And and I'm not just in music but everything involved in it you know, I have to want to own, do it under my terms and doesn't matter if I don't sell as many units as going with a major. I just want to have control of that. Yeah, artistic kind of reasons. Yeah, you know, and I'm kind of happy the space I've got, I'm happy with what I've got what I've done with Drone and you know kind of where I'm at as a DJ. Now I feel as excited about seeing as I was when I was like 20, you know.
Speaker 1:That's awesome. That's awesome. I get the sense of like feeling quite free with where you're at, and what kind of impact did your studio Metalbox have with that?
Speaker 2:Well, I think probably the biggest influence from the studio is the sound of the record, because of just the way I run the studio and the way I use the computer just as a kind of recording device, and it's an analogue studio and I'm using tape machines and I use the mixing console as a kind of part device and it's it's an analog studio, I'm using a lot of tape machines and you know I use the mixing console as a kind of part of the recording process, the way I kind of record things and and then I kind of you know, once I've recorded stuff, I kind of then take those stems and I do dub mixes of my tracks using my desk, and my the desk is a big part of the the sound studio is.
Speaker 2:I think the sonic tapestry of the sound is from the studio and that's the same equipment I've had for years and years, but it's just the way I have it all running, synced and live and so. So there's an influence there. And then there's the, the actual location of the studio being on the river and this kind of very intense part of this kind of ballardian landscape opposite a factory and in the flight path at city airport, and so the. You know the rivers, you know that spot has been a big influence for various different reasons and you know it's a noisy area. A lot of ambient, the ambient noise is really loud and I kind of tried to channel that a lot and I use a lot of field recordings and all that's just added to the kind of the sound of the music. But I think then you know, on top of that you have like just the last three years of life and what I've gone through in life and kind of trying to kind of pour that into the process when I'm in the studio.
Speaker 1:So yeah I think those things combined so it seems, it seems like it's such a good place now, um, the industry, of course, you know unshackled from a long time ago from like a lot of these aspects of the industry that perhaps can lead artists down a path that perhaps isn't of, no, I wouldn't say like of their choosing but, like you know, wouldn't have, I just wouldn't arrive at necessarily. Uh, given the space and time, what, what you know, what were your reflections on the industry now? Is it something that you feel you're glad to have, like a step away from, like from say, you know, how do you relate to things like the sort of algorithmical nature of like, sort of like spotify and things like that?
Speaker 2:um, I mean, I don't really I don't relate to any of it. To be honest, unfortunately enough, I have some you know've actually say I've been unmanaged. I've actually been the last year being taken on by a fantastic manager and it's been great, really, really a great experience to be, to have someone you know, you trust and respect, kind of working with you, working with you, and on top of that, I've also had someone for the first time helping with the label, which, which has been brilliant, because you know that's a worry that they can take on. I can kind of concentrate on you know where I think I can bring something to the table on the visual side and the music and the curation, the Spotify stuff, it's like.
Speaker 1:It's like speaking another language, yeah, it's fucking horrible to be honest with you, but I, I like you know, in terms of like collaborations, that you don't like, you know, like back in the day there were like the kind of collaborations with the recordings Like now, I'd say sort of more like in terms of like, like running, like uh, goo, uh with daniel avery, what like taking that as an example, what, what is the sort of you know like sharing the decks with someone like so, someone you know, which is something that you, you know, you've done throughout you, uh, your, your practice, like what, what? To be honest, not not to be honest, I haven't actually, oh, really Okay.
Speaker 2:Stan corrected, the first time I did them, the first time I did play with Dan was the first time I'd ever played show the depth of anyone's 30 years. I've never done that. And and I was. And I was kind of because I as a DJ I've always liked the kind of slow burn and doing going on my own little journey a little bit. And and I was kind of because as a DJ I've always liked the kind of slow burn and going on my own little journey a little bit.
Speaker 2:And the back-to-back thing just seemed too, I don't know, it just didn't really appeal to me. But then Dan and I talked about doing this club and we kind of very much wanted it to be a daytime club for various reasons, but Dan was at first I thought we were going to do like an hour on and an hour off or something, and Dan specifically did three records on and it just seemed nutty to me. And then we did it and I mean it's, it's a lot harder than playing on your own and you know we're constantly, dan and I, we're constantly pushing and pulling each other. But it adds to the kind of magic of the night pulling each other. But it were, it adds to the kind of magic of the night and and it's he's also someone, but you know, I really, you know I really love dearly, he's a good friend and it's just very easy and I think that's a big part of it.
Speaker 2:It's like to me like the best kind of collaborations work when, for me, work, when someone I'm comfortable, really comfortable with them, then you just ease with them. And also, you know, we musically like, we just kind of we could. There's a similarity in what we're drawn to, you know, and the kind of, especially with goo, you know, we've tried to kind of push it more in the kind of psychedelic. You know, we've tried to kind of push it more in the kind of psychedelic end of our spectrum, like as far, but I'm talking about dance music and like the trippier end, um but um, but it's been great and you know, and it's it's great to kind of work with someone on a regular, on a regular party. And we're doing now, we're doing the map, we're doing one in new york next week and in los angeles the same weekend and did one in the berkey suite in glasgow this weekend do you find yourself making each other on?
Speaker 2:um, yeah, I mean it's more. Yeah, we do. I mean there's like you've seen that lemmy sketch when he's talking about teasing. He's like making techno and he's like teasing them about holding out on the hi-hats.
Speaker 1:No, I haven't, but I will.
Speaker 2:I think that's the big thing. We try and edge each other on to like kind of like hold back as long as we can with it, the Lemmy moment, but yeah no, it's good, it's inspiring, and it's good, it's inspiring and it's fun and yeah, we'll see how it goes.
Speaker 2:But yeah, we're currently looking for a new London home because the co-factory got sold fuck. But I'm doing that and I'm actually doing another thing as well. If you're a dubhead, I've been doing this. Yeah, but I'm doing that, and also I'm actually doing another thing as well, which you know. Um, if you're a dub head, but I've been doing this, we just we just did the first one. It's a new night called holy, which is myself, and tom dubwise, who runs the fantastic shop dubwise, and um, so it's a dub, but it's a dub inspired, kind of sort of like dub, techno, ambient dub would you have some basic channel on there?
Speaker 2:yeah, that kind of thing, but then a lot of you know roots lovers.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just like finally, um, thinking about like your evolution, where you're at now, if you were like speaking to yourself, right as you were setting out, like starting to kind of like get on the decks for the first time, is there like one piece of advice that you would give to yourself?
Speaker 2:I would move to berlin a bit earlier did you live? Here. No, I didn't, no, but I was saying that to dan. Actually, on the weekends, I wish I. I remember the first time I played at Berghain. I remember I remember just saying, fuck, I wish I'd come here when I was younger. Yeah, it just blew my mind. It blew my mind. I was just like why have. I waited so long for this experience, but it's. I would have liked to have moved to Berlin in my twenties.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think also it's about the years of it as well, isn't it like? I think, like I, I started coming here in about 2012 and I felt like it was why you know that that early energy was sort of transferring into something else. By that point, I felt, like a friend of mine described it at the time, like you know, like berlin's like a bus that is full of passengers and it's just about to kind of like leave, but you can just about get on the bus still, um, if you run for it. Um, I definitely feel like there's some I'm very envious of, like when I speak to people who were here in the 90s, you know, and even like the early 2000s, about, like the kind of experiences that they had yeah, sure, I think, I think.
Speaker 2:I think I would have like, if I was speaking to my older self, I would. I would have told myself to kind of wait a while before I started putting music out right, okay.
Speaker 1:Yeah, was there like a bit of a pressure to, um, maybe from yourself even? You know to sort of think okay, this is an. You know to sort of think okay, this is an opportunity. You know, I think we are trained to sort of take advantage of opportunities.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean I was. I mean I was I was DJing and I and someone asked me to do a remix and I got put into a studio and I did a remix and had a bit of downtime and did a track and that track got signed and got single of the week and music week and then, off that track, I got a five album deal and then the next thing I had to do I had to make an album to tour. You know to. I had to.
Speaker 2:You know, it was like I was forced into this. I felt like I kind of just it wasn't a kind of decision that I'm going to start a band and I'm going to do this. It was kind of like a little bit of a mistake. And at that time I was like, you know, I had this, this idea. I was just going to be this fine artist and I was still trying to work out what my kind of, what medium I was working in and which one I was happiest. And music was something I was into, but it wasn't a plan, I think. And then the next thing, I was like kind of assigned to a major and I was like trying to come up with these album concepts and really I wish I kind of just taken a bit of money and just kind of bought some equipment, just spent a few years just kind of finding myself a bit more than just kind of like just trying to make an album from the get-go you know, yeah, yeah, I think, um, I've been in the 90s particularly.
Speaker 1:There was still that sort of more of an industry industry like getting signed to a label uh, this is your opportunity, go for it, kind of thing, wasn't there? Yeah, um, richard, thank you so much for your time thank you for taking time out as well yeah, great all right, take care.
Speaker 2:Nice to meet you, yeah nice to meet you too.
Speaker 1:Take care, have a great. Okay, so that was me, paul hamford, talking with richard fearless for the lost and sound podcast, and we had that conversation on may the 27th 2025. Thank you so much, richard, for sharing your time and thoughts with me there. And death mask, the really excellent new death in vegas album, is out now on his own drone label, and if you like the show and you haven't already, please give it a subscribe. If you want to give a show a rating, a review, on a platform of your choice, it's doubly, doubly awesome and appreciated.
Speaker 1:Um, if you like what? What I do, and you want to check out more of what I do, you can listen to my bbc radio documentary the man who smuggled punk rock across the berlin wall by heading on over to the bbc sounds app or on the bbc world service home page, and my book coming to berlin is still available in independent and good bookshops or from the publisher's website, velocity press. If you're in berlin listening to this, I just did a restock this week in rough trade, rough trade, uh, berlin. Um, plenty of. There's actually signed copies there, if you fancy that.
Speaker 1:Um, and lost and sound is sponsored by audio technica, the global but family-run company that make headphones, turntables, cartridges, microphones, studio quality yet affordable products, because they believe that high-quality audio should be accessible to all. I've been using their staff since I was like a little wee indie electronic musician back in the 90s, but anyway, yes, the music that you hear at the beginning at the end of every episode of Lost in Sound is by Tom Giddens Hyperlink in the podcast description and so that's it. I hope, whatever you're doing, you're having a really, really good one. Um, take care and chat to you soon. Thank you you.