{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":1.35,"endTime":2.183,"body":"- It seems as if"},{"startTime":2.183,"endTime":4.44,"body":"we haven't been able to"},{"startTime":2.183,"endTime":4.44,"body":"travel for a very long time,"},{"startTime":4.44,"endTime":5.64,"body":"so I hope, this evening,"},{"startTime":5.64,"endTime":8.973,"body":"you will enjoy a brief trip to Rome,"},{"startTime":10.09,"endTime":11.2,"body":"and there we go."},{"startTime":11.2,"endTime":13.552,"body":"Does anyone remember TWA?"},{"startTime":13.552,"endTime":14.61,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"startTime":14.61,"endTime":15.8,"body":"An airline so bad"},{"startTime":15.8,"endTime":19.202,"body":"it was known to stand"},{"startTime":15.8,"endTime":19.202,"body":"for Try Walking Across."},{"startTime":19.202,"endTime":20.035,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"startTime":20.035,"endTime":22.5,"body":"But like many other"},{"startTime":20.035,"endTime":22.5,"body":"airlines of that period,"},{"startTime":22.5,"endTime":25.56,"body":"they had these very alluring"},{"startTime":22.5,"endTime":25.56,"body":"and seductive travel posters,"},{"startTime":25.56,"endTime":28.41,"body":"and one of the most alluring"},{"startTime":25.56,"endTime":28.41,"body":"cities in the world is Rome."},{"startTime":29.28,"endTime":33.62,"body":"Now's quite an interesting"},{"startTime":29.28,"endTime":33.62,"body":"time to look at cities,"},{"startTime":33.62,"endTime":34.56,"body":"for a couple of reasons."},{"startTime":34.56,"endTime":36.05,"body":"First, post pandemic,"},{"startTime":36.05,"endTime":38.93,"body":"everyone is questioning can cities survive"},{"startTime":38.93,"endTime":40.29,"body":"with everyone working at home,"},{"startTime":40.29,"endTime":41.81,"body":"et cetera, et cetera."},{"startTime":41.81,"endTime":44.56,"body":"London has been remarkably robust."},{"startTime":44.56,"endTime":46.57,"body":"Another reason to think about cities now"},{"startTime":46.57,"endTime":47.71,"body":"is the fact that,"},{"startTime":47.71,"endTime":49.91,"body":"for the first time in history,"},{"startTime":49.91,"endTime":53.61,"body":"over half the population of"},{"startTime":49.91,"endTime":53.61,"body":"the world lives in cities,"},{"startTime":53.61,"endTime":55.55,"body":"and it's a good time to question,"},{"startTime":55.55,"endTime":57.0,"body":"what makes a city great,"},{"startTime":57.0,"endTime":58.55,"body":"what makes a city beautiful,"},{"startTime":58.55,"endTime":60.71,"body":"what makes a city workable."},{"startTime":60.71,"endTime":64.15,"body":"And one of the most"},{"startTime":60.71,"endTime":64.15,"body":"beautiful and magnetic cities"},{"startTime":64.15,"endTime":64.983,"body":"in the world,"},{"startTime":64.983,"endTime":66.943,"body":"of course, is Rome."},{"startTime":68.31,"endTime":69.9,"body":"How many of you have been to Rome?"},{"startTime":69.9,"endTime":72.33,"body":"Can we have a show of hands."},{"startTime":72.33,"endTime":77.33,"body":"Gosh, you are a frighteningly"},{"startTime":72.33,"endTime":77.33,"body":"sophisticated audience."},{"startTime":78.1,"endTime":80.66,"body":"Well for those of you"},{"startTime":78.1,"endTime":80.66,"body":"who have been to Rome,"},{"startTime":80.66,"endTime":84.37,"body":"and those of you who"},{"startTime":80.66,"endTime":84.37,"body":"are yet to go to Rome,"},{"startTime":84.37,"endTime":85.93,"body":"it's important to think of Rome"},{"startTime":85.93,"endTime":88.82,"body":"as a great theatrical city."},{"startTime":88.82,"endTime":90.15,"body":"Indeed, during the period"},{"startTime":90.15,"endTime":93.12,"body":"that we're going to"},{"startTime":90.15,"endTime":93.12,"body":"talk about this evening,"},{"startTime":93.12,"endTime":95.58,"body":"late 16th, early 17th century,"},{"startTime":95.58,"endTime":98.9,"body":"Rome was often known as Theatrum Mundi,"},{"startTime":98.9,"endTime":100.8,"body":"the Theater of the World."},{"startTime":100.8,"endTime":104.93,"body":"And indeed, it has a"},{"startTime":100.8,"endTime":104.93,"body":"certain stage set quality."},{"startTime":104.93,"endTime":106.86,"body":"Wherever you go in Rome,"},{"startTime":106.86,"endTime":109.783,"body":"you feel as if you're"},{"startTime":106.86,"endTime":109.783,"body":"taking part in some drama"},{"startTime":109.783,"endTime":111.59,"body":"that has great significance."},{"startTime":111.59,"endTime":115.61,"body":"And it shows the power of"},{"startTime":111.59,"endTime":115.61,"body":"architecture and design"},{"startTime":115.61,"endTime":117.93,"body":"to enhance everyday living."},{"startTime":117.93,"endTime":119.32,"body":"Whatever you do in Rome,"},{"startTime":119.32,"endTime":121.65,"body":"you feel as if you're playing a part."},{"startTime":121.65,"endTime":126.64,"body":"And it was very commonplace"},{"startTime":121.65,"endTime":126.64,"body":"of the 16th and 17th century"},{"startTime":126.64,"endTime":128.92,"body":"to think of the city as a theater,"},{"startTime":128.92,"endTime":130.42,"body":"the world as a theater,"},{"startTime":130.42,"endTime":132.5,"body":"and everyone as a player."},{"startTime":132.5,"endTime":133.847,"body":"So when Shakespeare wrote,"},{"startTime":133.847,"endTime":135.75,"body":"\"All the world's a stage,\""},{"startTime":135.75,"endTime":137.84,"body":"he was beautifully expressing"},{"startTime":137.84,"endTime":140.07,"body":"what was a commonplace thought."},{"startTime":140.07,"endTime":142.43,"body":"So Rome as this great theater,"},{"startTime":142.43,"endTime":146.31,"body":"constructed to highlight the importance"},{"startTime":146.31,"endTime":150.33,"body":"of civic, political, and religious ritual."},{"startTime":150.33,"endTime":154.01,"body":"Unsurprisingly, it features immensely"},{"startTime":154.01,"endTime":157.09,"body":"in the history of the cinema."},{"startTime":157.09,"endTime":158.67,"body":"Most recently, I suppose,"},{"startTime":158.67,"endTime":161.367,"body":"many of you saw \"La Grande Bellezza,\""},{"startTime":161.367,"endTime":162.997,"body":"\"The Great Beauty.\""},{"startTime":164.22,"endTime":166.36,"body":"People of a slightly older generation"},{"startTime":166.36,"endTime":168.06,"body":"will remember this scene,"},{"startTime":168.06,"endTime":171.81,"body":"when Anita Ekberg had her famous bath"},{"startTime":171.81,"endTime":173.39,"body":"in the Trevi Fountain"},{"startTime":173.39,"endTime":175.75,"body":"in \"La Dolce Vita.\""},{"startTime":175.75,"endTime":178.82,"body":"So Rome has this extraordinary power"},{"startTime":178.82,"endTime":181.82,"body":"to enhance our daily experience,"},{"startTime":181.82,"endTime":186.68,"body":"and also to enhance the imagery"},{"startTime":181.82,"endTime":186.68,"body":"of cinema and television."},{"startTime":186.68,"endTime":188.81,"body":"It's very important, when you go to Rome,"},{"startTime":188.81,"endTime":190.45,"body":"to prove that you've been to Rome,"},{"startTime":190.45,"endTime":193.64,"body":"hence it's been one of the"},{"startTime":190.45,"endTime":193.64,"body":"world's great tourist traps"},{"startTime":193.64,"endTime":196.22,"body":"and sources of souvenirs for ages,"},{"startTime":196.22,"endTime":197.78,"body":"I mean look at this stuff."},{"startTime":197.78,"endTime":199.46,"body":"I am particularly fond"},{"startTime":199.46,"endTime":202.65,"body":"of this collection of"},{"startTime":199.46,"endTime":202.65,"body":"nodding-head gladiators,"},{"startTime":202.65,"endTime":206.283,"body":"which I think could enhance"},{"startTime":202.65,"endTime":206.283,"body":"almost any household."},{"startTime":207.15,"endTime":211.04,"body":"Previously, the souvenirs on offer in Rome"},{"startTime":211.04,"endTime":213.883,"body":"were perhaps a little more sophisticated."},{"startTime":214.81,"endTime":218.69,"body":"This is a wonderful capriccio by Panini"},{"startTime":219.64,"endTime":221.7,"body":"of an imaginary picture gallery"},{"startTime":221.7,"endTime":225.5,"body":"full of the great sights"},{"startTime":221.7,"endTime":225.5,"body":"of ancient and modern Rome,"},{"startTime":225.5,"endTime":227.89,"body":"and it was painted for this guy here,"},{"startTime":227.89,"endTime":229.42,"body":"the guy with the black outfit,"},{"startTime":229.42,"endTime":231.66,"body":"who was the Duke de Choiseul,"},{"startTime":231.66,"endTime":233.63,"body":"the French ambassador to Rome,"},{"startTime":233.63,"endTime":235.34,"body":"and he wanted to take this home"},{"startTime":235.34,"endTime":238.88,"body":"as proof that he had"},{"startTime":235.34,"endTime":238.88,"body":"immersed himself in Rome,"},{"startTime":238.88,"endTime":241.14,"body":"because a familiarity with Rome"},{"startTime":242.47,"endTime":245.21,"body":"showed that you were"},{"startTime":242.47,"endTime":245.21,"body":"a member of the elite,"},{"startTime":245.21,"endTime":247.19,"body":"that you were sophisticated,"},{"startTime":247.19,"endTime":250.68,"body":"that you were at the top of society."},{"startTime":250.68,"endTime":253.23,"body":"Even people who were"},{"startTime":250.68,"endTime":253.23,"body":"never going to go to Rome"},{"startTime":253.23,"endTime":255.31,"body":"wanted to show that they were familiar"},{"startTime":255.31,"endTime":257.57,"body":"with the importance of the city."},{"startTime":257.57,"endTime":261.44,"body":"This is the great Falda map of Rome,"},{"startTime":261.44,"endTime":264.66,"body":"which was made in the 1670s."},{"startTime":264.66,"endTime":265.84,"body":"In its full version,"},{"startTime":265.84,"endTime":267.59,"body":"it is a huge map,"},{"startTime":267.59,"endTime":270.88,"body":"it's about four times"},{"startTime":267.59,"endTime":270.88,"body":"the size of this image,"},{"startTime":270.88,"endTime":272.81,"body":"and this particular map"},{"startTime":272.81,"endTime":276.24,"body":"hung on the wall of Samuel Pepys' study."},{"startTime":276.24,"endTime":278.28,"body":"Samuel Pepys was never"},{"startTime":276.24,"endTime":278.28,"body":"going to go to Rome,"},{"startTime":278.28,"endTime":280.02,"body":"he'd never been to Rome,"},{"startTime":280.02,"endTime":281.9,"body":"but having this map of Rome"},{"startTime":281.9,"endTime":284.77,"body":"was a great mark of his sophistication"},{"startTime":284.77,"endTime":287.34,"body":"and his intellectual prowess."},{"startTime":287.34,"endTime":288.61,"body":"So this is Rome,"},{"startTime":288.61,"endTime":291.61,"body":"17th century Rome, Baroque Rome,"},{"startTime":291.61,"endTime":295.83,"body":"is where we're going to spend"},{"startTime":291.61,"endTime":295.83,"body":"a little time this evening."},{"startTime":295.83,"endTime":298.923,"body":"So it's worth asking, what's baroque?"},{"startTime":300.03,"endTime":303.6,"body":"Baroque, it's easier to recognize"},{"startTime":303.6,"endTime":305.513,"body":"than it is to define."},{"startTime":306.79,"endTime":308.36,"body":"An analogy with music"},{"startTime":308.36,"endTime":312.6,"body":"might be that baroque is jazz"},{"startTime":312.6,"endTime":315.15,"body":"when compared to classical music."},{"startTime":315.15,"endTime":318.28,"body":"It's also a half joking definition"},{"startTime":318.28,"endTime":321.74,"body":"so that baroque is when you"},{"startTime":318.28,"endTime":321.74,"body":"choose to draw a curlicue"},{"startTime":321.74,"endTime":323.093,"body":"instead of a straight line."},{"startTime":324.0,"endTime":325.45,"body":"And this, for example,"},{"startTime":325.45,"endTime":328.86,"body":"this is the famous"},{"startTime":325.45,"endTime":328.86,"body":"University Church St. Ivo"},{"startTime":328.86,"endTime":333.793,"body":"of the University of La"},{"startTime":328.86,"endTime":333.793,"body":"Sapienza in Rome, by Borromini,"},{"startTime":334.67,"endTime":338.48,"body":"very well known for its crazy spire,"},{"startTime":338.48,"endTime":339.41,"body":"I mean look at that,"},{"startTime":339.41,"endTime":342.123,"body":"that's straight out of"},{"startTime":339.41,"endTime":342.123,"body":"a pastry shop, isn't it."},{"startTime":344.18,"endTime":345.013,"body":"And of course,"},{"startTime":345.013,"endTime":347.3,"body":"the baroque flourished not only in Italy,"},{"startTime":347.3,"endTime":349.33,"body":"but perhaps even more extremely"},{"startTime":349.33,"endTime":352.26,"body":"in Central Europe and Southern Germany."},{"startTime":352.26,"endTime":355.49,"body":"This is the Wurzburger Palace Chapel."},{"startTime":355.49,"endTime":358.84,"body":"It is all the antithesis"},{"startTime":358.84,"endTime":361.92,"body":"of the Bauhaus idea of less is more,"},{"startTime":361.92,"endTime":363.34,"body":"and you can think of baroque"},{"startTime":363.34,"endTime":368.34,"body":"as being a more is more"},{"startTime":363.34,"endTime":368.34,"body":"style of architecture."},{"startTime":369.41,"endTime":371.44,"body":"Unsurprisingly, it came between"},{"startTime":371.44,"endTime":375.283,"body":"two very rules-based"},{"startTime":371.44,"endTime":375.283,"body":"types of architecture,"},{"startTime":376.5,"endTime":381.4,"body":"Renaissance on one side and"},{"startTime":376.5,"endTime":381.4,"body":"neoclassicism on the other,"},{"startTime":381.4,"endTime":383.57,"body":"and it was adopted, as it were,"},{"startTime":383.57,"endTime":386.95,"body":"as the house style, the aesthetic style"},{"startTime":386.95,"endTime":389.45,"body":"of the Catholic Church,"},{"startTime":389.45,"endTime":393.33,"body":"and this all happened"},{"startTime":389.45,"endTime":393.33,"body":"at the Council of Trent,"},{"startTime":393.33,"endTime":396.33,"body":"which I will talk about momentarily."},{"startTime":396.33,"endTime":398.71,"body":"Baroque, of course, came to England,"},{"startTime":398.71,"endTime":400.36,"body":"it gained a foothold."},{"startTime":400.36,"endTime":404.01,"body":"This is one of the finest,"},{"startTime":400.36,"endTime":404.01,"body":"most obvious examples"},{"startTime":404.01,"endTime":406.0,"body":"of English baroque,"},{"startTime":406.0,"endTime":407.14,"body":"Blenheim Palace,"},{"startTime":407.14,"endTime":412.14,"body":"and of course here is our"},{"startTime":407.14,"endTime":412.14,"body":"greatest baroque cathedral,"},{"startTime":412.2,"endTime":413.04,"body":"there are two,"},{"startTime":413.04,"endTime":413.873,"body":"this is the greatest one,"},{"startTime":413.873,"endTime":415.693,"body":"this is St. Paul's Cathedral."},{"startTime":416.89,"endTime":419.89,"body":"Looking at this"},{"startTime":419.89,"endTime":422.47,"body":"compared to this,"},{"startTime":422.47,"endTime":425.02,"body":"you do feel that, English baroque,"},{"startTime":425.02,"endTime":428.203,"body":"it's a bit like Coke Light and real Coke,"},{"startTime":428.203,"endTime":430.024,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"startTime":430.024,"endTime":433.86,"body":"so the English baroque"},{"startTime":430.024,"endTime":433.86,"body":"is rather restrained."},{"startTime":433.86,"endTime":436.04,"body":"And this is because the baroque style"},{"startTime":436.04,"endTime":438.65,"body":"was regarded in England"},{"startTime":438.65,"endTime":442.75,"body":"as being too closely"},{"startTime":438.65,"endTime":442.75,"body":"identified with Catholicism"},{"startTime":442.75,"endTime":444.94,"body":"and with authoritarian government,"},{"startTime":444.94,"endTime":446.68,"body":"so in fact,"},{"startTime":446.68,"endTime":450.06,"body":"Christopher Wren was not exactly vilified,"},{"startTime":450.06,"endTime":453.11,"body":"but he was certainly"},{"startTime":450.06,"endTime":453.11,"body":"very savagely criticized"},{"startTime":453.11,"endTime":457.49,"body":"for the Italianate style"},{"startTime":453.11,"endTime":457.49,"body":"of St. Paul's Cathedral,"},{"startTime":457.49,"endTime":461.38,"body":"which we now regard as a"},{"startTime":457.49,"endTime":461.38,"body":"quintessentially English building."},{"startTime":461.38,"endTime":465.4,"body":"So where does this baroque"},{"startTime":461.38,"endTime":465.4,"body":"style get its impetus?"},{"startTime":465.4,"endTime":469.3,"body":"Well it gets its impetus"},{"startTime":465.4,"endTime":469.3,"body":"from the Council of Trent."},{"startTime":469.3,"endTime":471.96,"body":"The Council of Trent"},{"startTime":469.3,"endTime":471.96,"body":"is the great beginning"},{"startTime":471.96,"endTime":474.51,"body":"of the fight-back by the Catholic Church"},{"startTime":474.51,"endTime":476.76,"body":"against the Reformation."},{"startTime":476.76,"endTime":480.5,"body":"For nearly 20 years in the"},{"startTime":476.76,"endTime":480.5,"body":"middle of the 16th century,"},{"startTime":480.5,"endTime":482.84,"body":"all the top Catholic clerics of Europe"},{"startTime":482.84,"endTime":485.57,"body":"gather at Trent, in Northern Italy,"},{"startTime":485.57,"endTime":489.42,"body":"to figure out what to"},{"startTime":485.57,"endTime":489.42,"body":"do about Protestantism,"},{"startTime":489.42,"endTime":492.86,"body":"how do we face this new religion,"},{"startTime":492.86,"endTime":494.76,"body":"which, in the space of 30 years,"},{"startTime":494.76,"endTime":496.65,"body":"has turned the world upside-down?"},{"startTime":496.65,"endTime":501.43,"body":"And part of the fight-back"},{"startTime":496.65,"endTime":501.43,"body":"against Protestantism"},{"startTime":501.43,"endTime":504.04,"body":"involves the use of art,"},{"startTime":504.04,"endTime":507.55,"body":"of music, sculpture, and architecture."},{"startTime":507.55,"endTime":511.85,"body":"The great historian of"},{"startTime":507.55,"endTime":511.85,"body":"the Council of Trent"},{"startTime":511.85,"endTime":516.68,"body":"is a 17th century Jesuit"},{"startTime":511.85,"endTime":516.68,"body":"called Sforza Pallavicino,"},{"startTime":516.68,"endTime":518.87,"body":"and he writes very explicitly,"},{"startTime":518.87,"endTime":520.35,"body":"this is the real explanation"},{"startTime":520.35,"endTime":524.99,"body":"why the baroque took hold"},{"startTime":520.35,"endTime":524.99,"body":"in the Catholic countries."},{"startTime":524.99,"endTime":528.917,"body":"He says, \"God gilded heaven with light"},{"startTime":528.917,"endTime":530.937,"body":"\"to enamor mortals of it,"},{"startTime":530.937,"endTime":532.677,"body":"\"so it is fitting that churches"},{"startTime":532.677,"endTime":534.927,"body":"\"should be illuminated with gold"},{"startTime":534.927,"endTime":536.907,"body":"\"so that people fall in love with them"},{"startTime":536.907,"endTime":538.68,"body":"\"and run towards them.\""},{"startTime":538.68,"endTime":539.947,"body":"And then he goes on to say,"},{"startTime":539.947,"endTime":543.087,"body":"\"The people want theaters,"},{"startTime":543.087,"endTime":547.867,"body":"\"so it's imperative to make"},{"startTime":543.087,"endTime":547.867,"body":"the theaters curing sin"},{"startTime":547.867,"endTime":550.167,"body":"\"more sumptuous than the theaters"},{"startTime":550.167,"endTime":552.647,"body":"\"where sin goes to feed.\""},{"startTime":553.83,"endTime":555.13,"body":"So there we have it,"},{"startTime":555.13,"endTime":558.87,"body":"the baroque is going to"},{"startTime":555.13,"endTime":558.87,"body":"be a powerful element"},{"startTime":558.87,"endTime":560.14,"body":"in the Catholic revival"},{"startTime":560.14,"endTime":565.14,"body":"of the late 16th and early 17th century."},{"startTime":565.18,"endTime":569.21,"body":"Another way to get to the"},{"startTime":565.18,"endTime":569.21,"body":"essence of the baroque"},{"startTime":569.21,"endTime":572.55,"body":"is to look at two works,"},{"startTime":572.55,"endTime":574.963,"body":"the same subject, David,"},{"startTime":576.73,"endTime":578.573,"body":"created 100 years apart."},{"startTime":579.74,"endTime":581.42,"body":"Everyone knows this,"},{"startTime":581.42,"endTime":584.953,"body":"everyone has the fridge"},{"startTime":581.42,"endTime":584.953,"body":"magnet, the T-shirt,"},{"startTime":586.0,"endTime":588.107,"body":"Michelangelo's \"David\","},{"startTime":589.33,"endTime":594.33,"body":"a fantastic evocation of"},{"startTime":589.33,"endTime":594.33,"body":"idealized male beauty,"},{"startTime":594.87,"endTime":599.34,"body":"incredibly well carved, serene."},{"startTime":599.34,"endTime":600.873,"body":"I think it's a bit of a bore,"},{"startTime":602.15,"endTime":604.923,"body":"and that's not just because"},{"startTime":602.15,"endTime":604.923,"body":"one's been overexposed to it,"},{"startTime":604.923,"endTime":606.96,"body":"I think it's a bit of a bore"},{"startTime":606.96,"endTime":610.16,"body":"when you compare it to this David,"},{"startTime":610.16,"endTime":611.89,"body":"done 100 years later,"},{"startTime":611.89,"endTime":615.29,"body":"full of blood, full of dynamism,"},{"startTime":615.29,"endTime":618.4,"body":"full of action, full of danger,"},{"startTime":618.4,"endTime":620.2,"body":"because what Bernini does,"},{"startTime":620.2,"endTime":624.14,"body":"and Bernini is the sculptor of this David,"},{"startTime":624.14,"endTime":625.51,"body":"what Bernini does"},{"startTime":625.51,"endTime":629.63,"body":"is that instead of"},{"startTime":625.51,"endTime":629.63,"body":"capturing David at rest,"},{"startTime":632.91,"endTime":636.09,"body":"he decides to capture David"},{"startTime":636.09,"endTime":639.46,"body":"at the critical moment in his career."},{"startTime":639.46,"endTime":640.87,"body":"David is twisting,"},{"startTime":640.87,"endTime":643.61,"body":"he's just about to throw the rock,"},{"startTime":643.61,"endTime":646.29,"body":"which is either going to kill Goliath,"},{"startTime":646.29,"endTime":648.86,"body":"and make him one of the"},{"startTime":646.29,"endTime":648.86,"body":"greatest heroes of history,"},{"startTime":648.86,"endTime":650.803,"body":"or it's all going to end quite badly."},{"startTime":651.66,"endTime":656.31,"body":"So this is full of drama and life,"},{"startTime":656.31,"endTime":660.34,"body":"it's an incredible,"},{"startTime":656.31,"endTime":660.34,"body":"incredibly powerful piece,"},{"startTime":660.34,"endTime":661.5,"body":"and that, to me,"},{"startTime":661.5,"endTime":662.71,"body":"is the major difference"},{"startTime":662.71,"endTime":666.1,"body":"between Renaissance and Baroque art."},{"startTime":666.1,"endTime":671.1,"body":"So let's look at our hero,"},{"startTime":666.1,"endTime":671.1,"body":"Gian Lorenzo Bernini."},{"startTime":671.19,"endTime":674.54,"body":"Here is two self-portraits,"},{"startTime":674.54,"endTime":675.48,"body":"on the left,"},{"startTime":675.48,"endTime":680.48,"body":"in his youthful \"Pirates of"},{"startTime":675.48,"endTime":680.48,"body":"the Caribbean\" type look,"},{"startTime":681.01,"endTime":683.74,"body":"and on the right,"},{"startTime":683.74,"endTime":688.2,"body":"a much more introspective,"},{"startTime":683.74,"endTime":688.2,"body":"finely drawn self-portrait"},{"startTime":688.2,"endTime":690.723,"body":"of the aged Bernini."},{"startTime":691.6,"endTime":693.74,"body":"In his lifetime,"},{"startTime":693.74,"endTime":695.41,"body":"Bernini was regarded"},{"startTime":695.41,"endTime":700.41,"body":"as unquestionably the"},{"startTime":695.41,"endTime":700.41,"body":"greatest artist in Europe,"},{"startTime":700.49,"endTime":704.71,"body":"and his lifetime produced a"},{"startTime":700.49,"endTime":704.71,"body":"lot of other great artists,"},{"startTime":704.71,"endTime":706.51,"body":"amongst his contemporaries,"},{"startTime":706.51,"endTime":710.8,"body":"Rembrandt, Vermeer, Velasquez,"},{"startTime":713.374,"endTime":714.78,"body":"not a bad bunch,"},{"startTime":714.78,"endTime":719.78,"body":"yet he was regarded as towering"},{"startTime":714.78,"endTime":719.78,"body":"above all of his rivals."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":722.31,"endTime":725.84,"body":"he's born in 1598,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":725.84,"endTime":730.84,"body":"his father is a good, but"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":725.84,"endTime":730.84,"body":"not overly good sculptor"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":733.27,"endTime":735.77,"body":"who comes from Florence."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":735.77,"endTime":738.69,"body":"There's a lot of work going"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":735.77,"endTime":738.69,"body":"on in Naples at the time,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":738.69,"endTime":740.84,"body":"a lot of church building going in Naples,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":740.84,"endTime":743.38,"body":"and, hard for us to imagine now,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":743.38,"endTime":745.53,"body":"but in the late 1590s,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":745.53,"endTime":747.763,"body":"Naples was the biggest city in Europe."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":748.64,"endTime":751.46,"body":"So Old Man Bernini, Pietro Bernini,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":751.46,"endTime":756.02,"body":"is enticed to go to Naples"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":751.46,"endTime":756.02,"body":"to work on churches,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":756.02,"endTime":758.39,"body":"his son Gian Lorenzo is born there,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":758.39,"endTime":760.7,"body":"and then five years later,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":760.7,"endTime":763.95,"body":"Pop Bernini goes to Rome"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":763.95,"endTime":768.63,"body":"because he's employed to"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":763.95,"endTime":768.63,"body":"work at Santa Maria Maggiore."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":768.63,"endTime":770.43,"body":"Young Bernini grows up"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":770.43,"endTime":774.67,"body":"at the feet of his father, the sculptor,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":774.67,"endTime":777.59,"body":"his nursery is the sculptor's studio,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":777.59,"endTime":778.48,"body":"he grows up"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":778.48,"endTime":782.96,"body":"amongst the marble dust and"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":778.48,"endTime":782.96,"body":"the chisels of sculpting,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":782.96,"endTime":787.96,"body":"and he becomes a sort"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":782.96,"endTime":787.96,"body":"of Mozart of sculpture."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":789.36,"endTime":792.54,"body":"So let's look at one of his early works."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":792.54,"endTime":797.54,"body":"This is a funerary bust of"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":792.54,"endTime":797.54,"body":"the papal courtier Santoni,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":798.75,"endTime":801.51,"body":"it's in a little church"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":798.75,"endTime":801.51,"body":"called Santa Prassede,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":801.51,"endTime":802.81,"body":"which is just around the corner"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":802.81,"endTime":805.623,"body":"from the great Basilica"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":802.81,"endTime":805.623,"body":"of Santa Maria Maggiore."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":806.54,"endTime":808.1,"body":"It's a fabulous church, by the way,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":808.1,"endTime":812.59,"body":"it has some of the best early"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":808.1,"endTime":812.59,"body":"Christian mosaics in Rome,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":812.59,"endTime":815.74,"body":"and it also has this wonderful bust,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":815.74,"endTime":818.38,"body":"which is a beautifully carved likeness,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":818.38,"endTime":821.923,"body":"and is really not bad for"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":818.38,"endTime":821.923,"body":"the work of a 12 year-old."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":823.41,"endTime":826.61,"body":"So you can see that"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":823.41,"endTime":826.61,"body":"Bernini began to attract"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":826.61,"endTime":829.41,"body":"a great deal of attention as a youth,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":829.41,"endTime":831.4,"body":"and there's a big step forward"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":831.4,"endTime":833.66,"body":"with his next major work,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":833.66,"endTime":836.59,"body":"which is another funerary bust,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":836.59,"endTime":840.98,"body":"this is of the Florentine"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":836.59,"endTime":840.98,"body":"physician Coppola,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":840.98,"endTime":845.4,"body":"and this is an"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":840.98,"endTime":845.4,"body":"extraordinarily mature work,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":845.4,"endTime":848.453,"body":"it has a lot of psychological insight,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":849.29,"endTime":853.884,"body":"it seems to be the bust of a real person,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":853.884,"endTime":857.47,"body":"a real individual type,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":853.884,"endTime":857.47,"body":"highly individuated,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":857.47,"endTime":861.633,"body":"and it also references"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":857.47,"endTime":861.633,"body":"ancient Roman sculptures,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":861.633,"endTime":864.46,"body":"a very, very sophisticated work of art,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":864.46,"endTime":865.84,"body":"and once again,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":865.84,"endTime":868.253,"body":"pretty good going for a 14 year-old."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":869.35,"endTime":872.39,"body":"So this prodigiousness brings Bernini"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":872.39,"endTime":876.47,"body":"to the attention of the"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":872.39,"endTime":876.47,"body":"great princes of the Church,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":876.47,"endTime":877.44,"body":"because the Church,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":877.44,"endTime":878.74,"body":"as we mentioned earlier,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":878.74,"endTime":879.97,"body":"is on a great campaign"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":879.97,"endTime":884.119,"body":"to use the arts to enhance its status"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":884.119,"endTime":889.119,"body":"and also attract more devoted worshipers."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":889.22,"endTime":891.73,"body":"One of the greatest princes of the Church"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":891.73,"endTime":894.99,"body":"is Scipione Borghese,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":894.99,"endTime":897.87,"body":"and he becomes Bernini's"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":894.99,"endTime":897.87,"body":"first great patron."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":897.87,"endTime":901.1,"body":"He builds something"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":897.87,"endTime":901.1,"body":"called the Villa Borghese,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":901.1,"endTime":903.63,"body":"which many of you have"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":901.1,"endTime":903.63,"body":"probably visited in Rome,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":903.63,"endTime":905.37,"body":"not built as a house,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":905.37,"endTime":906.78,"body":"but built as the sort of place"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":906.78,"endTime":908.61,"body":"where he could entertain his friends"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":908.61,"endTime":910.23,"body":"and display his art collection."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":910.23,"endTime":912.3,"body":"He commissions the young Bernini"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":912.3,"endTime":914.53,"body":"to do three great works."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":914.53,"endTime":917.317,"body":"The first is \"The Rape of Proserpina,\""},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":918.93,"endTime":921.92,"body":"with Pluto on the left"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":921.92,"endTime":925.1,"body":"and his victim on the right,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":925.1,"endTime":928.73,"body":"the second, which is"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":925.1,"endTime":928.73,"body":"the most revolutionary,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":928.73,"endTime":931.277,"body":"is \"Apollo and Daphne,\""},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":932.21,"endTime":933.043,"body":"and once again,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":933.043,"endTime":938.043,"body":"rather like the David"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":933.043,"endTime":938.043,"body":"that we saw previously,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":938.39,"endTime":939.58,"body":"it's a cinematic,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":939.58,"endTime":941.77,"body":"it captures an instant,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":941.77,"endTime":943.59,"body":"and it captures the instant"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":943.59,"endTime":948.59,"body":"where Apollo is just"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":943.59,"endTime":948.59,"body":"about to abduct Daphne,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":948.99,"endTime":951.86,"body":"Daphne prays to the gods to save her"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":951.86,"endTime":954.263,"body":"by turning her into a laurel tree,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":955.23,"endTime":956.063,"body":"and you can see"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":956.063,"endTime":959.17,"body":"her fingers are turning"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":956.063,"endTime":959.17,"body":"into branches and leaves,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":959.17,"endTime":960.937,"body":"it's a thrilling moment,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":962.055,"endTime":964.47,"body":"and this is the work of art"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":964.47,"endTime":966.92,"body":"that makes Bernini an overnight success."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":966.92,"endTime":968.76,"body":"Contemporary people say"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":968.76,"endTime":971.73,"body":"that the day after this is first exposed"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":971.73,"endTime":973.23,"body":"to members of the Roman elite,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":973.23,"endTime":975.303,"body":"Bernini is stopped in the street,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":976.299,"endTime":979.5,"body":"he becomes a celebrity with this work."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":979.5,"endTime":983.91,"body":"So he does these three"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":979.5,"endTime":983.91,"body":"great works for Borghese,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":983.91,"endTime":988.91,"body":"the David, the Apollo, and"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":983.91,"endTime":988.91,"body":"the Pluto and Proserpina."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":991.1,"endTime":995.42,"body":"And Borghese is a person"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":995.42,"endTime":999.09,"body":"who thrusts Bernini"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":995.42,"endTime":999.09,"body":"right into the spotlight."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":999.09,"endTime":1002.93,"body":"He has an incredibly"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":999.09,"endTime":1002.93,"body":"powerful position in Rome,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1002.93,"endTime":1005.65,"body":"he is the cardinal nipote,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1005.65,"endTime":1007.13,"body":"he's the pope's nephew,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1007.13,"endTime":1009.593,"body":"he is the nephew of Pope Paul V,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1010.664,"endTime":1012.96,"body":"and cardinal nipote,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1012.96,"endTime":1015.163,"body":"from which we get our word nepotism,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1016.0,"endTime":1017.93,"body":"is a very powerful position"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1017.93,"endTime":1021.14,"body":"because the popes need"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1017.93,"endTime":1021.14,"body":"someone from their family"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1021.14,"endTime":1022.5,"body":"to run the show, as it were,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1022.5,"endTime":1024.62,"body":"he's papal secretary of state,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1024.62,"endTime":1028.27,"body":"he runs the whole mechanism of the Church,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1028.27,"endTime":1031.21,"body":"and usually, a nephew is chosen"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1031.21,"endTime":1033.833,"body":"to be someone that the pope could trust."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1035.02,"endTime":1040.02,"body":"He also amasses a very significant"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1035.02,"endTime":1040.02,"body":"fortune in the process,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1040.4,"endTime":1043.45,"body":"and he becomes someone"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1043.45,"endTime":1046.31,"body":"who is not only an arbiter of good taste,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1046.31,"endTime":1050.163,"body":"for example he's one of the"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1046.31,"endTime":1050.163,"body":"original patrons of Caravaggio,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1051.29,"endTime":1055.98,"body":"and he is very much concerned"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1051.29,"endTime":1055.98,"body":"with pushing Bernini forward."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1055.98,"endTime":1058.92,"body":"This is a wonderful bust of him,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1058.92,"endTime":1062.68,"body":"and although it looks quite serious to us,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1062.68,"endTime":1067.44,"body":"it was regarded as rather"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1062.68,"endTime":1067.44,"body":"daring in the 1620s,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1067.44,"endTime":1070.47,"body":"because the cardinal is shown"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1070.47,"endTime":1075.35,"body":"with his vestments lightly rumpled,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1075.35,"endTime":1078.43,"body":"one of the buttons is half undone,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1078.43,"endTime":1082.42,"body":"and he looks as if he's"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1078.43,"endTime":1082.42,"body":"just about to speak,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1082.42,"endTime":1084.65,"body":"he's just on the verge"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1082.42,"endTime":1084.65,"body":"of saying something,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1084.65,"endTime":1087.61,"body":"and these busts by Bernini,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1087.61,"endTime":1090.92,"body":"which were known as talking sculptures,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1090.92,"endTime":1094.35,"body":"were regarded as an incredible innovation"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1094.35,"endTime":1098.82,"body":"within the context of"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1094.35,"endTime":1098.82,"body":"17th century sculpture."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1098.82,"endTime":1101.75,"body":"Bernini had a very close"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1098.82,"endTime":1101.75,"body":"relationship with him,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1101.75,"endTime":1105.423,"body":"and you can see it in this portrait,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1106.69,"endTime":1108.13,"body":"which reminds me"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1108.13,"endTime":1113.13,"body":"of one of those 1940s, 1950s"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1108.13,"endTime":1113.13,"body":"\"New Yorker\" caricatures."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1113.56,"endTime":1115.8,"body":"Bernini is one of the fathers,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1115.8,"endTime":1117.61,"body":"if not the absolute inventor"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1117.61,"endTime":1120.7,"body":"of the modern art of caricature,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1120.7,"endTime":1122.81,"body":"he does a lot of caricatures"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1122.81,"endTime":1125.96,"body":"of the great people of Rome,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1125.96,"endTime":1129.41,"body":"and the great people are attracted to him"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1129.41,"endTime":1131.85,"body":"because he is immensely talented,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1131.85,"endTime":1134.29,"body":"and he has a charismatic personality."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1134.29,"endTime":1138.723,"body":"So when he's carving"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1134.29,"endTime":1138.723,"body":"this sculpture of David,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1140.53,"endTime":1145.297,"body":"he is assisted by the young"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1140.53,"endTime":1145.297,"body":"Cardinal Maffeo Barberini,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1146.69,"endTime":1151.69,"body":"and what Barberini does to help"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1146.69,"endTime":1151.69,"body":"Bernini make this sculpture,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1153.21,"endTime":1156.563,"body":"and by the way, this is a"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1153.21,"endTime":1156.563,"body":"self-portrait of Bernini,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1157.52,"endTime":1159.8,"body":"and we know from contemporary accounts"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1159.8,"endTime":1161.53,"body":"that Barberini goes to the studio"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1161.53,"endTime":1163.65,"body":"and he holds up the mirror"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1163.65,"endTime":1167.16,"body":"so that Bernini can see himself clearly."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1167.16,"endTime":1168.1,"body":"So the idea that"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1168.1,"endTime":1170.78,"body":"one of the greatest princes"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1168.1,"endTime":1170.78,"body":"of the Church, Borghese,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1170.78,"endTime":1172.68,"body":"is his principal patron,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1172.68,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"and another of the great"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1172.68,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"princes, Barberini, is helping"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1177.35,"endTime":1179.86,"body":"just shows the incredible position"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1179.86,"endTime":1181.39,"body":"that Bernini got himself into"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1181.39,"endTime":1185.453,"body":"by the time he was 24 or 25 years old."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1188.06,"endTime":1190.95,"body":"Barberini becomes Pope Urban VIII,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1190.95,"endTime":1193.53,"body":"he's pope for just over 20 years,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1193.53,"endTime":1198.2,"body":"and he decides that Bernini"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1193.53,"endTime":1198.2,"body":"is going to be, as it were,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1198.2,"endTime":1200.28,"body":"the artistic dictator of Rome,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1200.28,"endTime":1203.76,"body":"he makes him architect"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1200.28,"endTime":1203.76,"body":"of St. Peter's Cathedral,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1203.76,"endTime":1205.28,"body":"St. Peter's Basilica,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1205.28,"endTime":1209.99,"body":"and he gives him lots of"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1205.28,"endTime":1209.99,"body":"other important positions."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1209.99,"endTime":1212.91,"body":"It's probably worth reminding"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1209.99,"endTime":1212.91,"body":"ourselves a little bit"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1212.91,"endTime":1215.58,"body":"about the nature of the papacy"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1215.58,"endTime":1218.19,"body":"back in the 17th century."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1218.19,"endTime":1219.703,"body":"Here's Italy,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1221.1,"endTime":1224.74,"body":"and we remember Metternich's"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1221.1,"endTime":1224.74,"body":"famous observation"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1224.74,"endTime":1226.3,"body":"that Italy is not a country,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1226.3,"endTime":1229.3,"body":"it is merely a geographical expression,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1229.3,"endTime":1231.8,"body":"and here it is made pretty obvious,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1231.8,"endTime":1232.89,"body":"because if you look at it,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1232.89,"endTime":1237.89,"body":"it's kind of a tossed"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1232.89,"endTime":1237.89,"body":"salad of principalities,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1238.87,"endTime":1241.348,"body":"and duchies, and"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1238.87,"endTime":1241.348,"body":"kingdoms, and city states,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1241.348,"endTime":1243.203,"body":"it's all a bit of a mess,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1244.19,"endTime":1246.47,"body":"and the big, purple bit"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1246.47,"endTime":1249.44,"body":"going across the middle of it diagonally"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1250.63,"endTime":1253.17,"body":"is something called the Papal States."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1253.17,"endTime":1254.677,"body":"The Papal States"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1254.677,"endTime":1259.677,"body":"are the secular, political"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1254.677,"endTime":1259.677,"body":"realm of the pope."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1260.52,"endTime":1261.353,"body":"So the pope,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1261.353,"endTime":1265.04,"body":"unlike any of the other bigwigs of Europe,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1265.04,"endTime":1266.53,"body":"the pope has this dual role,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1266.53,"endTime":1269.59,"body":"he is the spiritual leader"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1266.53,"endTime":1269.59,"body":"of the Catholic Church"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1270.61,"endTime":1273.513,"body":"and he's also a secular monarch."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1274.71,"endTime":1277.34,"body":"And this secular monarchy"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1277.34,"endTime":1280.55,"body":"gives him great strategic significance,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1280.55,"endTime":1284.04,"body":"and is also a considerable"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1280.55,"endTime":1284.04,"body":"source of income."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1284.04,"endTime":1287.21,"body":"So the pope has two roles."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1287.21,"endTime":1290.54,"body":"And unlike most other monarchs,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1290.54,"endTime":1292.683,"body":"most other sovereigns in Europe,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1293.84,"endTime":1295.823,"body":"the papacy is not hereditary,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1297.23,"endTime":1300.03,"body":"so every time the pope dies,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1300.03,"endTime":1301.67,"body":"there is a complete revolution"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1301.67,"endTime":1304.1,"body":"in Roman society, Roman politics,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1304.1,"endTime":1306.47,"body":"and the Roman artistic establishment,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1306.47,"endTime":1309.6,"body":"because every pope arriving in Rome"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1309.6,"endTime":1312.92,"body":"brings with him a new entourage,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1312.92,"endTime":1314.97,"body":"he brings with him his favorite poets,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1314.97,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"his favorite musicians,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1314.97,"endTime":1317.3,"body":"his favorite architects,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1317.3,"endTime":1318.67,"body":"his favorite painters,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1318.67,"endTime":1320.07,"body":"and of course his family,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1320.07,"endTime":1322.693,"body":"and all of these people"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1320.07,"endTime":1322.693,"body":"have to be enriched,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1323.65,"endTime":1326.81,"body":"so Rome becomes this very fluid society,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1326.81,"endTime":1330.93,"body":"it goes topsy-turvy"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1326.81,"endTime":1330.93,"body":"every time a pope dies,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1330.93,"endTime":1332.96,"body":"and the death of popes is fairly frequent,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1332.96,"endTime":1333.86,"body":"because quite often,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1333.86,"endTime":1336.59,"body":"they're not elected"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1333.86,"endTime":1336.59,"body":"until they're quite old,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1336.59,"endTime":1339.263,"body":"and not expected to reign for very long."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1340.34,"endTime":1342.76,"body":"Urban VIII gets to work right away"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1342.76,"endTime":1345.21,"body":"with making major investments"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1345.21,"endTime":1349.657,"body":"in the improvement of"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1345.21,"endTime":1349.657,"body":"St. Peter's Basilica,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1349.657,"endTime":1353.2,"body":"and the first thing he"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1349.657,"endTime":1353.2,"body":"commissions Bernini to do"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1353.2,"endTime":1354.79,"body":"is this thing,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1354.79,"endTime":1358.86,"body":"which is the great"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1354.79,"endTime":1358.86,"body":"Baldacchino of St. Peter's."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1358.86,"endTime":1363.86,"body":"It is a symbolic sort of shelter"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1365.04,"endTime":1368.15,"body":"for the high altar of St. Peter's,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1368.15,"endTime":1371.14,"body":"and it is a sort of mediation"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1371.14,"endTime":1374.54,"body":"between the huge space of St. Peter's"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1374.54,"endTime":1378.12,"body":"and this smaller human scale"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1378.12,"endTime":1381.593,"body":"of those who are celebrating"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1378.12,"endTime":1381.593,"body":"mass, and witnessing mass."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1382.7,"endTime":1385.703,"body":"It takes 11 years to create,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1387.14,"endTime":1390.36,"body":"and it is a sensation,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1390.36,"endTime":1392.87,"body":"it is described as,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1392.87,"endTime":1395.27,"body":"what appears to the viewer"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1395.27,"endTime":1397.51,"body":"is something completely new,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1397.51,"endTime":1401.003,"body":"something he'd never"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1397.51,"endTime":1401.003,"body":"dreamed of witnessing."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1402.3,"endTime":1403.99,"body":"This shocks people,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1403.99,"endTime":1405.72,"body":"people don't really know what it is,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1405.72,"endTime":1409.01,"body":"is it sculpture, is it architecture,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1409.01,"endTime":1410.41,"body":"is it a knick-knack,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1410.41,"endTime":1412.36,"body":"is it a bit of interior decoration?"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1412.36,"endTime":1413.38,"body":"And with this,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1413.38,"endTime":1414.97,"body":"what Bernini begins to do"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1414.97,"endTime":1417.18,"body":"is Bernini begins to"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1414.97,"endTime":1417.18,"body":"break down the barriers"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1417.18,"endTime":1420.4,"body":"between all the different art forms."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1420.4,"endTime":1423.91,"body":"So this is a significant"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1420.4,"endTime":1423.91,"body":"artistic achievement,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1423.91,"endTime":1427.61,"body":"it's also a great managerial achievement"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1427.61,"endTime":1428.443,"body":"because, as I say,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1428.443,"endTime":1429.91,"body":"it takes 11 years to build,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1429.91,"endTime":1434.01,"body":"it remains the largest bronze"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1429.91,"endTime":1434.01,"body":"structure in the world,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1434.01,"endTime":1436.68,"body":"it's 30 meters high,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1436.68,"endTime":1439.9,"body":"and it is an object of wonder of beauty,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1439.9,"endTime":1444.07,"body":"and a testimony to Bernini's"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1439.9,"endTime":1444.07,"body":"organizational abilities,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1444.07,"endTime":1445.9,"body":"so he can manage things,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1445.9,"endTime":1448.55,"body":"and the fact that he can manage projects"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1448.55,"endTime":1451.31,"body":"makes more and more people"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1448.55,"endTime":1451.31,"body":"want to commission him"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1451.31,"endTime":1452.57,"body":"to do major things."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1452.57,"endTime":1455.29,"body":"Here's a little detail of it,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1455.29,"endTime":1457.17,"body":"and you can see it's been decorated"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1457.17,"endTime":1460.43,"body":"with the Barberini heraldic symbol,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1460.43,"endTime":1462.35,"body":"the Barberini bees,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1462.35,"endTime":1464.94,"body":"and you see an enormous number of bees"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1464.94,"endTime":1466.67,"body":"when you look around Rome."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1466.67,"endTime":1469.243,"body":"One day, some PhD student will count them,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1470.1,"endTime":1473.01,"body":"but there must be hundreds"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1470.1,"endTime":1473.01,"body":"of thousands of them."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1473.01,"endTime":1473.92,"body":"It's actually quite funny,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1473.92,"endTime":1474.97,"body":"because originally,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1474.97,"endTime":1477.99,"body":"the coat of arms of the Barberini"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1477.99,"endTime":1479.79,"body":"did not have bees on it,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1479.79,"endTime":1481.023,"body":"it had horseflies,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1481.87,"endTime":1484.27,"body":"and as they became grander and grander,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1484.27,"endTime":1485.58,"body":"they decided that horseflies"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1485.58,"endTime":1487.66,"body":"were not the thing for a grand family,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1487.66,"endTime":1491.823,"body":"so they changed them to"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1487.66,"endTime":1491.823,"body":"the famous Barberini bees."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1493.2,"endTime":1497.3,"body":"What is Bernini like as a human, as a man,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1497.3,"endTime":1498.133,"body":"what is he like?"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1498.133,"endTime":1499.583,"body":"We know about his art,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1501.02,"endTime":1503.47,"body":"we know very little"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1501.02,"endTime":1503.47,"body":"about his private life,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1503.47,"endTime":1506.62,"body":"but perhaps the most emblematic episode,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1506.62,"endTime":1508.46,"body":"or the most revealing episode"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1508.46,"endTime":1511.73,"body":"is when he falls passionately"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1508.46,"endTime":1511.73,"body":"in love with this woman,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1511.73,"endTime":1513.593,"body":"Costanza Bonarelli."},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1515.06,"endTime":1518.62,"body":"Bernini is in his late 30s at this stage,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1518.62,"endTime":1519.8,"body":"and he's unmarried,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1519.8,"endTime":1522.36,"body":"which is slightly unusual for the time,"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1522.36,"endTime":1525.6,"body":"and he is passionately"},{"speaker":"So, a little bit about him","startTime":1522.36,"endTime":1525.6,"body":"in love with Costanza."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1530.18,"endTime":1534.563,"body":"number one, she is"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1530.18,"endTime":1534.563,"body":"married to his assistant,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1535.73,"endTime":1539.06,"body":"and number two,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1539.06,"endTime":1542.122,"body":"Bernini's brother is having"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1539.06,"endTime":1542.122,"body":"an affair with her as well."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1542.122,"endTime":1542.955,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1542.955,"endTime":1545.41,"body":"So there is a very uncomfortable"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1545.41,"endTime":1547.67,"body":"three-way relationship going on."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1547.67,"endTime":1549.963,"body":"When Bernini finds out about his brother,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1551.0,"endTime":1552.39,"body":"he gets enraged,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1552.39,"endTime":1555.257,"body":"and he chases his brother"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1552.39,"endTime":1555.257,"body":"with a drawn sword,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1555.257,"endTime":1557.52,"body":"he chases his brother"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1557.52,"endTime":1561.97,"body":"through the Basilica of"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1557.52,"endTime":1561.97,"body":"Santa Maria Maggiore,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1561.97,"endTime":1562.84,"body":"doesn't kill him,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1562.84,"endTime":1564.653,"body":"but breaks some of his ribs."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1565.52,"endTime":1568.49,"body":"This creates an enormous scandal,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1568.49,"endTime":1569.93,"body":"so what happens?"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1569.93,"endTime":1573.21,"body":"Well of course, in 17th century Rome,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1573.21,"endTime":1575.271,"body":"guess whose fault it is."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1575.271,"endTime":1576.104,"body":"- [Audience] The woman's."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1576.104,"endTime":1580.11,"body":"- Hers, 'cause it's always the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1576.104,"endTime":1580.11,"body":"woman's fault in 17th Rome."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1580.11,"endTime":1583.123,"body":"So Bernini's brother is exiled,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1584.46,"endTime":1586.8,"body":"told to leave Rome, and exiled,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1586.8,"endTime":1591.8,"body":"Bernini hires a thug to"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1586.8,"endTime":1591.8,"body":"go to Costanza's house"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1592.71,"endTime":1595.86,"body":"and slash her across the face with a razor"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1595.86,"endTime":1598.573,"body":"as punishment for her perfidy,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1599.51,"endTime":1604.483,"body":"she is ordered to go into"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1599.51,"endTime":1604.483,"body":"a home for fallen women,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1605.33,"endTime":1608.61,"body":"and then shut away for, I"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1605.33,"endTime":1608.61,"body":"think, two or three years,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1608.61,"endTime":1610.62,"body":"and Bernini's punishment"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1610.62,"endTime":1614.92,"body":"is he's ordered to get married"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1610.62,"endTime":1614.92,"body":"to someone respectable,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1614.92,"endTime":1617.43,"body":"which he does."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1617.43,"endTime":1621.73,"body":"But this testament to his"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1617.43,"endTime":1621.73,"body":"relationship with Costanza"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1621.73,"endTime":1625.55,"body":"is one of the most singular works of art"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1625.55,"endTime":1628.33,"body":"in the whole history of Western art,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1628.33,"endTime":1631.41,"body":"because a marble bust"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1631.41,"endTime":1635.16,"body":"is something that has"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1631.41,"endTime":1635.16,"body":"hitherto only been reserved"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1635.16,"endTime":1639.97,"body":"for sovereigns, great aristocrats,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1639.97,"endTime":1643.033,"body":"god and goddesses, and"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1639.97,"endTime":1643.033,"body":"mythological heroes,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1643.99,"endTime":1647.27,"body":"because a marble bust is"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1643.99,"endTime":1647.27,"body":"very expensive to create,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1647.27,"endTime":1649.17,"body":"and in the hierarchy of the arts,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1649.17,"endTime":1650.96,"body":"it's at the top."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1650.96,"endTime":1654.343,"body":"This is the first time in"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1650.96,"endTime":1654.343,"body":"the history of Western art"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1654.343,"endTime":1659.343,"body":"that an ordinary woman gets"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1654.343,"endTime":1659.343,"body":"the dignity of a marble bust,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1661.01,"endTime":1662.11,"body":"and this, as I say,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1662.11,"endTime":1665.53,"body":"is a powerful testimony"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1665.53,"endTime":1668.5,"body":"to Bernini's passion for this woman."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1668.5,"endTime":1670.99,"body":"It's one of the only major Berninis"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1670.99,"endTime":1672.55,"body":"that is outside of Rome,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1672.55,"endTime":1676.123,"body":"this is in the Bargello, in Florence."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1677.53,"endTime":1679.2,"body":"When Urban VIII dies,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1679.2,"endTime":1683.16,"body":"Bernini is terrified"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1679.2,"endTime":1683.16,"body":"that the new papal regime"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1683.16,"endTime":1685.31,"body":"will cease to employ him,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1685.31,"endTime":1687.3,"body":"and the new pope,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1687.3,"endTime":1690.713,"body":"he's not the friendliest"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1687.3,"endTime":1690.713,"body":"looking person one's ever seen,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1691.59,"endTime":1693.093,"body":"this is Pope Innocent X,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1694.2,"endTime":1695.75,"body":"the Pamphili pope,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1695.75,"endTime":1699.71,"body":"this is the famous Velasquez of him."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1699.71,"endTime":1701.63,"body":"And he is determined"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1701.63,"endTime":1704.15,"body":"that he will not employ Bernini"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1704.15,"endTime":1709.15,"body":"because he hates, he"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1704.15,"endTime":1709.15,"body":"hates the Barberini family"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1709.31,"endTime":1711.08,"body":"who have preceded him,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1711.08,"endTime":1713.73,"body":"he gets rid of most of them,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1713.73,"endTime":1716.05,"body":"he brings in his family,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1716.05,"endTime":1718.65,"body":"he wants to enrich his family,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1718.65,"endTime":1722.34,"body":"and while not as corrupt"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1718.65,"endTime":1722.34,"body":"as the Barberinis,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1722.34,"endTime":1727.16,"body":"he still does manage to amass"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1722.34,"endTime":1727.16,"body":"a very considerable fortune."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1727.16,"endTime":1729.99,"body":"But he ends up having to employ Bernini"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1729.99,"endTime":1732.61,"body":"because Bernini is the best,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1732.61,"endTime":1734.95,"body":"and what Innocent X wants to do"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1734.95,"endTime":1739.95,"body":"is he wants to enhance his"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1734.95,"endTime":1739.95,"body":"neighborhood, Piazza Navona,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1740.29,"endTime":1744.35,"body":"now one of the great"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1740.29,"endTime":1744.35,"body":"tourist magnets of Rome,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1744.35,"endTime":1745.86,"body":"a place, by the way,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1745.86,"endTime":1749.258,"body":"in which you should never order a pizza,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1749.258,"endTime":1750.81,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1750.81,"endTime":1754.27,"body":"Piazza Navona becomes the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1750.81,"endTime":1754.27,"body":"neighborhood power-base"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1754.27,"endTime":1757.08,"body":"of the Pamphili family,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1757.08,"endTime":1759.86,"body":"and in order to enhance the square,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1759.86,"endTime":1763.84,"body":"he wants to commission a"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1759.86,"endTime":1763.84,"body":"new fountain for the square."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1763.84,"endTime":1765.47,"body":"All the architects of Rome"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1765.47,"endTime":1768.89,"body":"are invited to take"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1765.47,"endTime":1768.89,"body":"part in this competition"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1768.89,"endTime":1770.92,"body":"except for Bernini,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1770.92,"endTime":1773.41,"body":"however Bernini manages to get a friend"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1773.41,"endTime":1775.63,"body":"to present his design to the pope,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1775.63,"endTime":1776.52,"body":"and the pope says,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1776.52,"endTime":1779.33,"body":"well I have to employ Bernini,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1779.33,"endTime":1781.73,"body":"because Bernini's ability"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1781.73,"endTime":1784.73,"body":"to be the most powerful papal propagandist"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1784.73,"endTime":1787.69,"body":"is unequaled by any other artist."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1787.69,"endTime":1789.8,"body":"The result is this,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1789.8,"endTime":1793.0,"body":"the Fountain of the Four Rivers,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1793.0,"endTime":1795.62,"body":"which is a great work of art,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1795.62,"endTime":1799.41,"body":"and also a pretty significant"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1795.62,"endTime":1799.41,"body":"work of engineering,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1799.41,"endTime":1801.44,"body":"because what it does"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1801.44,"endTime":1804.343,"body":"is it takes an ancient Egyptian obelisk,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1805.56,"endTime":1810.56,"body":"weighing about the same"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1805.56,"endTime":1810.56,"body":"amount as a jumbo jet,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1811.16,"endTime":1812.237,"body":"it takes that obelisk"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1812.237,"endTime":1817.237,"body":"and it balances it on"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1812.237,"endTime":1817.237,"body":"four pillars above a void."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1819.92,"endTime":1822.27,"body":"This causes an immediate sensation,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1822.27,"endTime":1827.27,"body":"it's such a powerful"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1822.27,"endTime":1827.27,"body":"image of papal munificence"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1827.67,"endTime":1829.56,"body":"that Innocent X commissions"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1829.56,"endTime":1833.75,"body":"a number of very large silver"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1829.56,"endTime":1833.75,"body":"models of the fountain,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1833.75,"endTime":1837.55,"body":"which he sends around to the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1833.75,"endTime":1837.55,"body":"various crowned heads of Europe"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1837.55,"endTime":1841.873,"body":"as a statement of his power,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1837.55,"endTime":1841.873,"body":"and generosity, and good taste."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1843.3,"endTime":1844.92,"body":"It remains, to me,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1844.92,"endTime":1846.704,"body":"the most beautiful fountain in Rome,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1846.704,"endTime":1848.3,"body":"maybe in the world,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1848.3,"endTime":1852.22,"body":"and if you look closely at the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1848.3,"endTime":1852.22,"body":"image on the right-hand side,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1852.22,"endTime":1854.4,"body":"you'll see why I think,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1852.22,"endTime":1854.4,"body":"and some others think"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1854.4,"endTime":1857.153,"body":"that it was also the inspiration"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1854.4,"endTime":1857.153,"body":"for the Eiffel Tower,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1858.6,"endTime":1860.52,"body":"so this is Bernini's influence"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1860.52,"endTime":1863.093,"body":"echoing through the centuries."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1864.15,"endTime":1867.22,"body":"The greatest tragedy of the 17th century"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1867.22,"endTime":1868.707,"body":"is the Thirty Years' War,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1868.707,"endTime":1871.19,"body":"and this affects Bernini."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1871.19,"endTime":1874.29,"body":"Between 1618 and 1648,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1874.29,"endTime":1876.13,"body":"Europe is torn apart"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1876.13,"endTime":1878.93,"body":"as the Protestant states"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1876.13,"endTime":1878.93,"body":"and the Catholic states"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1878.93,"endTime":1881.8,"body":"wage war against each other,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1881.8,"endTime":1884.85,"body":"although some states"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1881.8,"endTime":1884.85,"body":"find themselves allied"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1884.85,"endTime":1886.78,"body":"not with their co-religionists,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1886.78,"endTime":1888.46,"body":"but with the opposition."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1888.46,"endTime":1890.12,"body":"It's one of the first wars"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1890.12,"endTime":1893.13,"body":"that is waged against"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1890.12,"endTime":1893.13,"body":"a civilian population,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1893.13,"endTime":1895.8,"body":"there are hundreds of"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1893.13,"endTime":1895.8,"body":"thousands casualties."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1895.8,"endTime":1899.07,"body":"This is one of Jacques"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1895.8,"endTime":1899.07,"body":"Callot's famous images"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1899.07,"endTime":1903.07,"body":"of the savagery of the Thirty Years' War."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1903.07,"endTime":1904.99,"body":"It seems to be impossible"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1904.99,"endTime":1906.733,"body":"to bring the war to an end."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1907.65,"endTime":1908.483,"body":"The pope,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1908.483,"endTime":1912.23,"body":"usually regarded as Europe's"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1908.483,"endTime":1912.23,"body":"preeminent peacemaker,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1912.23,"endTime":1913.89,"body":"of course has lost traction,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1913.89,"endTime":1915.21,"body":"because the Protestant states"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1915.21,"endTime":1917.43,"body":"don't want to have"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1915.21,"endTime":1917.43,"body":"anything to do with him."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1917.43,"endTime":1921.01,"body":"Eventually, diplomats convene in Germany"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1921.01,"endTime":1923.44,"body":"and they spend two years in discussions"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1923.44,"endTime":1925.52,"body":"trying to end the war."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1925.52,"endTime":1927.07,"body":"It's complicated by the fact"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1927.07,"endTime":1928.53,"body":"that the Protestant diplomats"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1928.53,"endTime":1931.55,"body":"will not stay in the same"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1928.53,"endTime":1931.55,"body":"city as the Catholics,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1931.55,"endTime":1933.38,"body":"and vice-versa."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1933.38,"endTime":1936.75,"body":"The chief Catholic diplomat"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1933.38,"endTime":1936.75,"body":"sent to sort things out"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1936.75,"endTime":1937.72,"body":"is this guy,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1937.72,"endTime":1940.79,"body":"the remarkable Fabio Chigi."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1940.79,"endTime":1941.91,"body":"He is descendant"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1941.91,"endTime":1945.28,"body":"of one of the significant"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1941.91,"endTime":1945.28,"body":"families of Siena,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1945.28,"endTime":1949.68,"body":"his great-uncle was one of the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1945.28,"endTime":1949.68,"body":"most important papal bankers"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1949.68,"endTime":1951.24,"body":"of the 16th century."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1951.24,"endTime":1954.73,"body":"Chigi is a very talented Latin poet,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1954.73,"endTime":1956.94,"body":"he's got extraordinarily good taste,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1956.94,"endTime":1959.17,"body":"he's very interested in the arts,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1959.17,"endTime":1962.56,"body":"but he ultimately fails as a diplomat,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1962.56,"endTime":1963.9,"body":"and when the Thirty Years' War"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1963.9,"endTime":1966.24,"body":"is drawn to a conclusion in 1648,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1966.24,"endTime":1969.933,"body":"it's kind of just a qualified"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1966.24,"endTime":1969.933,"body":"win for the Protestants,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1971.03,"endTime":1974.15,"body":"so the Church is feeling rather battered."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1974.15,"endTime":1976.43,"body":"Nonetheless, when he comes back to Rome,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1976.43,"endTime":1981.43,"body":"he is eventually rewarded"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1976.43,"endTime":1981.43,"body":"by being elected as pope,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1981.87,"endTime":1983.32,"body":"and what he has to do"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1983.32,"endTime":1985.59,"body":"is he has to figure out"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1985.59,"endTime":1988.45,"body":"how to regain the prestige of the Church"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1988.45,"endTime":1991.8,"body":"following what was more"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1988.45,"endTime":1991.8,"body":"or less their defeat"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1991.8,"endTime":1993.433,"body":"in the Thirty Years' War."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1994.27,"endTime":1996.99,"body":"What he does is he looks to"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1994.27,"endTime":1996.99,"body":"some of his predecessors,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1996.99,"endTime":1997.91,"body":"what did they do,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":1997.91,"endTime":2001.61,"body":"how can I assert papal grandeur?"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2001.61,"endTime":2005.93,"body":"Well he looks to this"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2001.61,"endTime":2005.93,"body":"rough looking character,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2005.93,"endTime":2007.62,"body":"the pope with the best name ever,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2007.62,"endTime":2010.16,"body":"this is Pope Sixtus V,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2010.16,"endTime":2015.16,"body":"and Sixtus V is a very visionary pope"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2015.6,"endTime":2018.38,"body":"because in the mid to late 16th century,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2018.38,"endTime":2022.39,"body":"what he does is he re-plans Rome."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2022.39,"endTime":2026.75,"body":"Part of the big business"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2022.39,"endTime":2026.75,"body":"of Rome are holy years."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2026.75,"endTime":2030.63,"body":"Holy years originally"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2026.75,"endTime":2030.63,"body":"happened every 100 years,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2030.63,"endTime":2032.53,"body":"and they attracted"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2032.53,"endTime":2035.84,"body":"very, very large crowds"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2032.53,"endTime":2035.84,"body":"of pilgrims to Rome."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2035.84,"endTime":2037.01,"body":"This was very good"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2037.01,"endTime":2039.56,"body":"because it increased"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2037.01,"endTime":2039.56,"body":"donations for the Church,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2039.56,"endTime":2043.44,"body":"increased business for the"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2039.56,"endTime":2043.44,"body":"innkeepers, the horse hirers,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2043.44,"endTime":2046.82,"body":"the souvenir peddlers, the guides,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2046.82,"endTime":2048.46,"body":"such a success that someone said,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2048.46,"endTime":2050.73,"body":"well, this holy year is a wonderful thing,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2050.73,"endTime":2053.05,"body":"let's do it every 50 years,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2053.05,"endTime":2055.2,"body":"so they start doing holy"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2053.05,"endTime":2055.2,"body":"years every 50 years,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2055.2,"endTime":2058.75,"body":"and then eventually they start"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2055.2,"endTime":2058.75,"body":"doing them every 25 years."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2058.75,"endTime":2062.35,"body":"And Sixtus, his innovation"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2062.35,"endTime":2066.95,"body":"is to connect the seven"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2062.35,"endTime":2066.95,"body":"great pilgrimage churches"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2066.95,"endTime":2069.64,"body":"with a network of straight roads,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2069.64,"endTime":2072.98,"body":"and he also starts digging up"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2072.98,"endTime":2076.02,"body":"ancient Egyptian and"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2072.98,"endTime":2076.02,"body":"ancient Roman obelisks"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2076.02,"endTime":2079.6,"body":"and planting them in front"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2076.02,"endTime":2079.6,"body":"of the pilgrimage churches,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2079.6,"endTime":2083.5,"body":"so that even the most"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2079.6,"endTime":2083.5,"body":"illiterate visitor to town"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2083.5,"endTime":2084.73,"body":"can find their way around"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2084.73,"endTime":2087.29,"body":"by just looking for the next obelisk."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2087.29,"endTime":2090.38,"body":"So he uses obelisks and straight roads"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2090.38,"endTime":2093.75,"body":"to make Rome a very attractive place"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2093.75,"endTime":2096.67,"body":"for pilgrims to navigate around."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2096.67,"endTime":2099.35,"body":"This is one of his most famous obelisks,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2099.35,"endTime":2101.29,"body":"this is the wonderful obelisk"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2101.29,"endTime":2103.64,"body":"in front of the Lateran Palace."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2103.64,"endTime":2105.81,"body":"So that's why you see so many obelisks"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2105.81,"endTime":2107.87,"body":"planted around Rome."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2107.87,"endTime":2112.18,"body":"Fabio Chigi, as Pope Alexander VII,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2112.18,"endTime":2116.83,"body":"decides to continue with this"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2112.18,"endTime":2116.83,"body":"program of urban improvement."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2116.83,"endTime":2118.65,"body":"He knows Bernini quite well"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2118.65,"endTime":2120.67,"body":"because he's previously"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2118.65,"endTime":2120.67,"body":"commissioned Bernini"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2120.67,"endTime":2123.883,"body":"to do the family chapel"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2120.67,"endTime":2123.883,"body":"in Santa Maria del Popolo."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2125.01,"endTime":2126.97,"body":"Sometimes people overlook this chapel"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2126.97,"endTime":2129.5,"body":"because they're drawn"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2126.97,"endTime":2129.5,"body":"instead to the Caravaggios"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2129.5,"endTime":2130.94,"body":"at the other end of the church,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2130.94,"endTime":2133.74,"body":"but this is a wonderful space,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2133.74,"endTime":2135.61,"body":"and it's a collaboration,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2135.61,"endTime":2137.57,"body":"although they never met,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2137.57,"endTime":2139.88,"body":"it's a collaboration between Raphael,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2139.88,"endTime":2141.35,"body":"who designed the chapel,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2141.35,"endTime":2144.29,"body":"and Bernini, who did"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2141.35,"endTime":2144.29,"body":"the finishing touches,"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2144.29,"endTime":2148.34,"body":"like the pyramid and the side sculptures."},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2148.34,"endTime":2152.52,"body":"So the pope commissions Bernini"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2152.52,"endTime":2155.44,"body":"to do a major series of interventions"},{"speaker":"However, there are two difficulties","startTime":2155.44,"endTime":2158.013,"body":"around the Roman landscape."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2161.16,"endTime":2164.8,"body":"how did Bernini earn a living?"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2164.8,"endTime":2167.61,"body":"There was no market for art, really,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2167.61,"endTime":2170.0,"body":"there wasn't a commercial market for art."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2170.0,"endTime":2173.52,"body":"Bernini had a very interesting"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2170.0,"endTime":2173.52,"body":"method of doing business."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2173.52,"endTime":2177.16,"body":"Here is Francesco d'Este,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2173.52,"endTime":2177.16,"body":"the Duke of Modena,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2177.16,"endTime":2181.21,"body":"the richest aristocrat"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2177.16,"endTime":2181.21,"body":"in 17th century Italy,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2181.21,"endTime":2183.99,"body":"so of course he writes to Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2183.99,"endTime":2185.74,"body":"and he says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2185.74,"endTime":2189.16,"body":"I'd like you to do a portrait of me,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2189.16,"endTime":2191.71,"body":"and he also writes to"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2189.16,"endTime":2191.71,"body":"Bernini's great rival,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2191.71,"endTime":2193.17,"body":"Alessandro Algardi,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2193.17,"endTime":2194.99,"body":"and says, I'd like you"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2193.17,"endTime":2194.99,"body":"to do a portrait of me,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2194.99,"endTime":2196.483,"body":"can I have your terms."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2197.577,"endTime":2200.74,"body":"Algardi writes back immediately and says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2200.74,"endTime":2202.43,"body":"yes, I will do a portrait of you,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2202.43,"endTime":2204.36,"body":"it's 150 scudi,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2204.36,"endTime":2206.84,"body":"which is the major unit of currency,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2206.84,"endTime":2208.48,"body":"it's 150 scudi,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2208.48,"endTime":2209.783,"body":"and I'll do it in a year."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2210.88,"endTime":2212.49,"body":"And Bernini writes back and says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2212.49,"endTime":2214.873,"body":"I'm not interested."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2217.31,"endTime":2221.13,"body":"This gets the duke rather excited,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2221.13,"endTime":2223.6,"body":"and he writes back to Bernini and says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2223.6,"endTime":2225.31,"body":"no, will you just tell"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2223.6,"endTime":2225.31,"body":"me how much and how long,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2225.31,"endTime":2227.017,"body":"and Bernini says no,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2227.017,"endTime":2230.76,"body":"I don't take commissions"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2227.017,"endTime":2230.76,"body":"from people I don't know,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2230.76,"endTime":2232.94,"body":"I can't possibly do it."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2232.94,"endTime":2236.27,"body":"Eventually, Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2232.94,"endTime":2236.27,"body":"decides that he will do it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2236.27,"endTime":2239.309,"body":"it takes him nearly two years,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2239.309,"endTime":2241.513,"body":"and of course he doesn't quote a price,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2242.46,"endTime":2243.7,"body":"he doesn't quote a price"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2243.7,"endTime":2247.53,"body":"because he wants to see how"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2243.7,"endTime":2247.53,"body":"much the duke will give him."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2247.53,"endTime":2251.87,"body":"The duke ends up paying him 3,000 scudi,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2251.87,"endTime":2255.893,"body":"which is 20 times as much"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2251.87,"endTime":2255.893,"body":"as Bernini's rival quoted."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2256.8,"endTime":2261.8,"body":"So Bernini often relied on, as it were,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2262.073,"endTime":2267.073,"body":"the propensity of many of his"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2262.073,"endTime":2267.073,"body":"great clients to show off,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2268.03,"endTime":2272.38,"body":"and to enrich him way beyond"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2268.03,"endTime":2272.38,"body":"what any contemporary artist"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2272.38,"endTime":2275.27,"body":"would choose to be paid."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2275.27,"endTime":2278.543,"body":"For example, when he carves"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2275.27,"endTime":2278.543,"body":"a bust of Cardinal Richelieu,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2279.43,"endTime":2282.01,"body":"once again, he doesn't quote a price,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2282.01,"endTime":2286.13,"body":"but he's given a diamond-encrusted"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2282.01,"endTime":2286.13,"body":"picture frame as payment,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2286.13,"endTime":2288.49,"body":"and a bag of gold as well."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2288.49,"endTime":2293.45,"body":"So Bernini very much relied on his clients"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2293.45,"endTime":2296.663,"body":"to determine the price of his works."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2297.61,"endTime":2302.31,"body":"Bernini becomes so"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2297.61,"endTime":2302.31,"body":"famous not only in Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2302.31,"endTime":2304.16,"body":"but outside of Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2304.16,"endTime":2308.52,"body":"that he soon becomes part of"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2304.16,"endTime":2308.52,"body":"17th century power politics."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2308.52,"endTime":2313.24,"body":"The rising star of Europe"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2308.52,"endTime":2313.24,"body":"in Bernini's lifetime"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2313.24,"endTime":2315.45,"body":"is Louis XIV,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2315.45,"endTime":2320.45,"body":"and Louis XIV decides that he"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2315.45,"endTime":2320.45,"body":"wants Bernini to come to Paris"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2321.63,"endTime":2322.72,"body":"to work for him."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2322.72,"endTime":2325.1,"body":"He writes to the pope to say,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2325.1,"endTime":2327.69,"body":"will you lend me Cavaliere Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2327.69,"endTime":2328.523,"body":"the pope says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2328.523,"endTime":2329.85,"body":"I can't, he works for me,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2329.85,"endTime":2331.7,"body":"we've got a lot of stuff to do,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2331.7,"endTime":2332.533,"body":"Louis says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2332.533,"endTime":2334.4,"body":"no, no, I don't think"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2332.533,"endTime":2334.4,"body":"you've really understood"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2334.4,"endTime":2336.64,"body":"what I was saying,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2336.64,"endTime":2339.43,"body":"would you lend me the Cavaliere Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2339.43,"endTime":2341.86,"body":"the pope says, very politely,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2341.86,"endTime":2343.35,"body":"I can't really,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2343.35,"endTime":2347.35,"body":"and Louis then moves a French army"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2347.35,"endTime":2348.743,"body":"to the borders of Italy."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2350.08,"endTime":2353.24,"body":"The pope, unsurprisingly, relents,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2353.24,"endTime":2356.57,"body":"and Bernini is sent to Paris."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2356.57,"endTime":2358.53,"body":"He's in his late 60s,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2358.53,"endTime":2359.95,"body":"he doesn't really want to go there,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2359.95,"endTime":2361.1,"body":"but he goes to Paris,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2361.1,"endTime":2363.44,"body":"he doesn't like the French,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2363.44,"endTime":2364.75,"body":"he goes to Paris,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2364.75,"endTime":2367.04,"body":"and he comes up with this design"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2367.04,"endTime":2371.25,"body":"for the new facade of the Louvre,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2371.25,"endTime":2374.07,"body":"for the western facade of the Louvre,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2374.07,"endTime":2375.733,"body":"just by the Cour Carree."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2377.55,"endTime":2378.883,"body":"The French don't like it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2379.9,"endTime":2381.56,"body":"they don't like it at all,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2381.56,"endTime":2383.46,"body":"and they don't like him"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2383.46,"endTime":2385.27,"body":"because they think"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2385.27,"endTime":2389.07,"body":"that he is constantly"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2385.27,"endTime":2389.07,"body":"criticizing their taste."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2389.07,"endTime":2394.07,"body":"And the king's principal artistic advisor,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2394.17,"endTime":2396.86,"body":"who is called Charles Perrault,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2396.86,"endTime":2398.85,"body":"says to Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2398.85,"endTime":2400.79,"body":"this just won't do at all,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2400.79,"endTime":2404.63,"body":"and Bernini, with fabulous tactlessness,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2404.63,"endTime":2406.5,"body":"says to Perrault,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2406.5,"endTime":2410.723,"body":"you are not worthy of wiping"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2406.5,"endTime":2410.723,"body":"the dust off my shoes."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2411.59,"endTime":2413.39,"body":"That doesn't really go down very well"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2413.39,"endTime":2416.13,"body":"in the court of Louis XIV,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2416.13,"endTime":2419.01,"body":"and Perrault, as they would say now,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2419.01,"endTime":2421.72,"body":"briefs heavily against Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2421.72,"endTime":2424.47,"body":"and unsurprisingly as well,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2424.47,"endTime":2427.5,"body":"the commission for the"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2424.47,"endTime":2427.5,"body":"new facade of the Louvre"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2427.5,"endTime":2431.69,"body":"goes to Charles Perrault's"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2427.5,"endTime":2431.69,"body":"brother, Claude Perrault,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2431.69,"endTime":2436.09,"body":"who does something not"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2431.69,"endTime":2436.09,"body":"a baroque extravaganza,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2436.09,"endTime":2441.09,"body":"but something that is a great"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2436.09,"endTime":2441.09,"body":"example of French classicism,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2441.49,"endTime":2443.12,"body":"very soothing to French taste,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2443.12,"endTime":2445.323,"body":"but not really terribly innovative."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2446.17,"endTime":2447.59,"body":"I suppose it's worth mentioning"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2447.59,"endTime":2452.26,"body":"that Charles Perrault's other"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2447.59,"endTime":2452.26,"body":"great achievement in history,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2453.97,"endTime":2455.51,"body":"aside from stopping Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2455.51,"endTime":2457.72,"body":"from building something in Paris,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2457.72,"endTime":2460.94,"body":"he is also the author of"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2457.72,"endTime":2460.94,"body":"the modern fairy tale,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2460.94,"endTime":2463.35,"body":"and he writes \"Cinderella,\""},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2460.94,"endTime":2463.35,"body":"and \"Sleeping Beauty,\""},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2463.35,"endTime":2464.183,"body":"and things like that,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2464.183,"endTime":2467.72,"body":"so he has made a major"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2464.183,"endTime":2467.72,"body":"contribution at any rate."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2467.72,"endTime":2469.96,"body":"Bernini goes back to Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2469.96,"endTime":2474.44,"body":"and amongst the many works"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2469.96,"endTime":2474.44,"body":"in Rome that we can see"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2474.44,"endTime":2476.428,"body":"that exemplify the genius of Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2476.428,"endTime":2479.24,"body":"one of the most remarkable"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2479.24,"endTime":2483.81,"body":"is \"The Ecstasy of St. Teresa of Avila\""},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2483.81,"endTime":2486.84,"body":"in the Church of Santa"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2483.81,"endTime":2486.84,"body":"Maria della Vittoria,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2486.84,"endTime":2490.47,"body":"commissioned by a Venetian"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2486.84,"endTime":2490.47,"body":"family, the Cornaros,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2490.47,"endTime":2493.48,"body":"for their chapel in Rome."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2493.48,"endTime":2495.07,"body":"And it pictures the moment"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2495.07,"endTime":2500.07,"body":"when St. Teresa is"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2495.07,"endTime":2500.07,"body":"approached by an angel of God"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2501.07,"endTime":2506.07,"body":"and is about to be pierced"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2501.07,"endTime":2506.07,"body":"by the arrow of divine love."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2507.2,"endTime":2511.593,"body":"And for a work of religious sculpture,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2512.62,"endTime":2517.053,"body":"it is regarded as being"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2512.62,"endTime":2517.053,"body":"pretty erotically charged."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2518.03,"endTime":2519.78,"body":"And as someone said,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2519.78,"endTime":2522.45,"body":"if that's what religious ecstasy is,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2522.45,"endTime":2524.74,"body":"I'd like quite a lot of it."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2524.74,"endTime":2527.007,"body":"(audience laughs)"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2527.007,"endTime":2529.31,"body":"It's a fabulous work of art,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2529.31,"endTime":2530.61,"body":"it's a fabulous composition,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2530.61,"endTime":2531.52,"body":"because, once again,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2531.52,"endTime":2535.53,"body":"you can see how Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2531.52,"endTime":2535.53,"body":"utilizes all the arts"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2535.53,"endTime":2537.79,"body":"to create a splendid theatrical effect,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2537.79,"endTime":2542.79,"body":"it's architecture, it's"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2537.79,"endTime":2542.79,"body":"sculpture, it's interior design,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2542.85,"endTime":2543.86,"body":"it's lighting,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2543.86,"endTime":2545.34,"body":"it has fantastic lighting,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2545.34,"endTime":2548.233,"body":"Bernini was very good with lighting."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2549.34,"endTime":2550.89,"body":"Wherever you look in Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2550.89,"endTime":2554.74,"body":"you see major contributions"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2550.89,"endTime":2554.74,"body":"by Bernini in terms of,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2554.74,"endTime":2557.11,"body":"I guess what we would"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2554.74,"endTime":2557.11,"body":"now call street furniture"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2557.11,"endTime":2558.58,"body":"or public art."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2558.58,"endTime":2563.58,"body":"The famous Triton Fountain"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2558.58,"endTime":2563.58,"body":"in the Piazza Barberini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2565.17,"endTime":2568.67,"body":"just shows the power of a work of art"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2569.844,"endTime":2571.89,"body":"to not only enhance,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2571.89,"endTime":2573.79,"body":"but to inspire"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2573.79,"endTime":2576.8,"body":"and to make city life an adventure,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2576.8,"endTime":2578.98,"body":"because every time you look"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2576.8,"endTime":2578.98,"body":"around the corner in Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2578.98,"endTime":2581.65,"body":"you do see something fascinating,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2581.65,"endTime":2583.89,"body":"and beautiful, and engaging."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2583.89,"endTime":2586.64,"body":"Bernini's own favorite church is this one,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2586.64,"endTime":2588.87,"body":"Sant'Andrea al Quirinale,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2588.87,"endTime":2590.08,"body":"just across the street"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2590.08,"endTime":2593.427,"body":"from where the president of Italy lives."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2593.427,"endTime":2597.07,"body":"But I suppose Bernini's most"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2593.427,"endTime":2597.07,"body":"significant contribution"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2597.07,"endTime":2600.99,"body":"to not only the cityscape of Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2600.99,"endTime":2604.23,"body":"but to urban design in general,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2604.23,"endTime":2608.663,"body":"is the wonderful Piazza of St. Peter's."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2609.93,"endTime":2612.12,"body":"And when you see it from this angle,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2612.12,"endTime":2615.66,"body":"you can understand why Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2612.12,"endTime":2615.66,"body":"said he wanted the piazza"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2615.66,"endTime":2619.082,"body":"to be like the embracing"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2615.66,"endTime":2619.082,"body":"arms of the Church,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2619.082,"endTime":2620.76,"body":"(audience member sneezes)"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2619.082,"endTime":2620.76,"body":"bless you,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2620.76,"endTime":2623.96,"body":"welcoming the faithful"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2623.96,"endTime":2628.53,"body":"and enticing those who are"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2623.96,"endTime":2628.53,"body":"yet to have found faith"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2628.53,"endTime":2630.002,"body":"into the Church."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2630.002,"endTime":2632.13,"body":"It is, to me,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2632.13,"endTime":2635.01,"body":"one of the great urban"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2632.13,"endTime":2635.01,"body":"spaces in the world,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2635.01,"endTime":2636.29,"body":"and I think,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2636.29,"endTime":2638.5,"body":"whether people are of deep"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2636.29,"endTime":2638.5,"body":"faith, a little faith,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2638.5,"endTime":2639.82,"body":"or no faith at all,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2639.82,"endTime":2642.5,"body":"it is impossible to stand there"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2642.5,"endTime":2646.32,"body":"and not feel uplifted and inspired,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2646.32,"endTime":2649.48,"body":"and many other cities have been inspired"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2649.48,"endTime":2653.074,"body":"by this particular design."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2653.074,"endTime":2654.56,"body":"I'd just like to finish"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2654.56,"endTime":2657.78,"body":"with a look at Bernini's relationship"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2657.78,"endTime":2659.34,"body":"with Pope Alexander VII,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2659.34,"endTime":2660.173,"body":"because of course,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2660.173,"endTime":2662.85,"body":"we talk about Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2660.173,"endTime":2662.85,"body":"and the making of Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2662.85,"endTime":2664.4,"body":"the remaking of Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2664.4,"endTime":2668.52,"body":"but no single person can remake Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2668.52,"endTime":2669.353,"body":"and of course,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2669.353,"endTime":2671.7,"body":"within the context of the 17th century,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2671.7,"endTime":2674.56,"body":"no artist could do anything"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2671.7,"endTime":2674.56,"body":"without a great patron,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2674.56,"endTime":2677.52,"body":"and the greatest patrons"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2674.56,"endTime":2677.52,"body":"of all were the popes,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2677.52,"endTime":2680.38,"body":"and the greatest patron"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2677.52,"endTime":2680.38,"body":"of the 17th century popes"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2680.38,"endTime":2682.91,"body":"was this man, Alexander VII."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2682.91,"endTime":2686.33,"body":"This is a very intimate,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2682.91,"endTime":2686.33,"body":"little terracotta sketch"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2686.33,"endTime":2688.54,"body":"of Alexander VII,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2688.54,"endTime":2689.61,"body":"it's in the V\u0026A,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2689.61,"endTime":2691.19,"body":"who have a very nice collection"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2691.19,"endTime":2693.95,"body":"of little Bernini terracottas ,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2693.95,"endTime":2697.23,"body":"and this was designed"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2693.95,"endTime":2697.23,"body":"for Alexander VII's tomb."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2697.23,"endTime":2698.66,"body":"But the work of art"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2698.66,"endTime":2701.64,"body":"that most significantly represents"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2701.64,"endTime":2704.45,"body":"the relationship between"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2701.64,"endTime":2704.45,"body":"Bernini and the pope"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2704.45,"endTime":2706.06,"body":"is this one,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2706.06,"endTime":2709.453,"body":"the elephant of the Piazza della Minerva."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2710.898,"endTime":2711.91,"body":"The Piazza della Minerva"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2711.91,"endTime":2714.76,"body":"is an exceptional Roman square"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2714.76,"endTime":2716.52,"body":"because it's one of the few Roman squares"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2716.52,"endTime":2719.533,"body":"that doesn't have either"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2716.52,"endTime":2719.533,"body":"a cafe or a fountain."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2720.4,"endTime":2722.59,"body":"What it does have,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2722.59,"endTime":2723.67,"body":"and this is unique"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2723.67,"endTime":2726.52,"body":"among the 800-and-some-odd"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2723.67,"endTime":2726.52,"body":"churches in Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2726.52,"endTime":2728.43,"body":"what it does have is a Gothic church,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2728.43,"endTime":2733.16,"body":"that is the only Gothic church in Rome,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2733.16,"endTime":2735.8,"body":"Santa Maria sopra Minerva."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2735.8,"endTime":2738.24,"body":"It was very much a church"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2738.24,"endTime":2740.29,"body":"used by the Florentine communities,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2740.29,"endTime":2744.38,"body":"so for example, Fra"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2740.29,"endTime":2744.38,"body":"Angelico is buried there,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2744.38,"endTime":2746.86,"body":"and next door to it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2746.86,"endTime":2749.63,"body":"that narrow building to the left of it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2749.63,"endTime":2752.4,"body":"is the entrance to a Dominican monastery,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2752.4,"endTime":2757.4,"body":"and this Egyptian-Roman obelisk"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2757.45,"endTime":2762.45,"body":"was found in the garden of"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2757.45,"endTime":2762.45,"body":"the Dominican monastery."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2764.419,"endTime":2766.47,"body":"It of course became the"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2764.419,"endTime":2766.47,"body":"property of the pope,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2766.47,"endTime":2769.25,"body":"because it was a valuable"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2766.47,"endTime":2769.25,"body":"piece of archeology,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2769.25,"endTime":2773.06,"body":"and the pope asked Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2769.25,"endTime":2773.06,"body":"to do something with it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2773.06,"endTime":2773.893,"body":"Bernini said,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2773.893,"endTime":2776.77,"body":"well I know there's a very famous book"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2776.77,"endTime":2778.5,"body":"called \"The Dream of Poliphili,\""},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2778.5,"endTime":2779.72,"body":"which has an illustration"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2779.72,"endTime":2782.34,"body":"of an elephant carrying an obelisk,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2782.34,"endTime":2785.25,"body":"and I think that would be"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2782.34,"endTime":2785.25,"body":"quite an interesting to do,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2785.25,"endTime":2786.083,"body":"and in fact,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2786.083,"endTime":2788.68,"body":"I came up with an earlier"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2786.083,"endTime":2788.68,"body":"design based on this"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2789.65,"endTime":2790.79,"body":"for the Barberini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2790.79,"endTime":2793.54,"body":"but I've always wanted to put an obelisk"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2793.54,"endTime":2794.71,"body":"on the back of an elephant,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2794.71,"endTime":2795.787,"body":"so I'll hope you'll let me do it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2795.787,"endTime":2796.66,"body":"and the pope says,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2796.66,"endTime":2799.11,"body":"yes, that sounds like a splendid idea,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2799.11,"endTime":2802.283,"body":"and Bernini goes off and does this."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2803.28,"endTime":2804.63,"body":"When I first saw this,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2804.63,"endTime":2806.96,"body":"and I think anyone walking"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2804.63,"endTime":2806.96,"body":"through this square,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2806.96,"endTime":2811.96,"body":"your first question is, an elephant?"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2814.44,"endTime":2816.37,"body":"And of course,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2816.37,"endTime":2817.66,"body":"in the 17th century,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2817.66,"endTime":2821.13,"body":"any educated person walking"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2817.66,"endTime":2821.13,"body":"through this square would say,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2821.13,"endTime":2821.963,"body":"oh, an elephant?"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2821.963,"endTime":2825.04,"body":"Yes, it's a symbol of religion,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2825.04,"endTime":2828.6,"body":"because elephants were widely regarded"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2828.6,"endTime":2833.05,"body":"to be symbols of piety and"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2828.6,"endTime":2833.05,"body":"religion in the 17th century,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2833.05,"endTime":2835.38,"body":"and the whole ensemble"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2835.38,"endTime":2839.02,"body":"is a tribute to Alexander VII, the pope,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2839.02,"endTime":2844.02,"body":"it says, \"It takes a robust"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2839.02,"endTime":2844.02,"body":"mind to bear divine wisdom,\""},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2844.36,"endTime":2847.12,"body":"so it's very much a"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2844.36,"endTime":2847.12,"body":"person tribute by Bernini"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2847.12,"endTime":2850.17,"body":"to his friend Pope Alexander."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2850.17,"endTime":2852.94,"body":"And if you look at the"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2850.17,"endTime":2852.94,"body":"elephant a bit more closely,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2852.94,"endTime":2853.79,"body":"you can see"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2853.79,"endTime":2857.763,"body":"it's not really a David"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2853.79,"endTime":2857.763,"body":"Attenborough type elephant, is it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2858.91,"endTime":2863.1,"body":"it's got a very human"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2858.91,"endTime":2863.1,"body":"look, a very human look,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2863.1,"endTime":2865.52,"body":"and some people do regard it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2865.52,"endTime":2867.43,"body":"I think with some plausibility,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2867.43,"endTime":2870.753,"body":"as a caricature of Alexander VII."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2872.01,"endTime":2874.72,"body":"Unfortunately, Alexander VII dies"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2874.72,"endTime":2878.87,"body":"two weeks before the elephant is unveiled,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2878.87,"endTime":2880.01,"body":"he never gets to see it,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2880.01,"endTime":2884.59,"body":"but it remains a touching,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2880.01,"endTime":2884.59,"body":"and very beautiful,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2884.59,"endTime":2888.173,"body":"and very entertaining tribute to him."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2890.31,"endTime":2893.18,"body":"It also shows us something"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2890.31,"endTime":2893.18,"body":"really interesting"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2893.18,"endTime":2896.51,"body":"about people in the 17th century, because,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2896.51,"endTime":2897.343,"body":"I don't know,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2897.343,"endTime":2900.1,"body":"you sort of have the mis-impression"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2900.1,"endTime":2902.74,"body":"that people in the 17th century"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2902.74,"endTime":2905.47,"body":"spent a lot of time"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2902.74,"endTime":2905.47,"body":"praying, and writing poetry,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2905.47,"endTime":2907.1,"body":"and being terribly serious,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2907.1,"endTime":2910.17,"body":"and being very worthy, and high-brow,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2910.17,"endTime":2911.79,"body":"and elitist, and so on,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2911.79,"endTime":2915.25,"body":"but we know that the Roman population,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2915.25,"endTime":2917.893,"body":"even the Roman elite"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2915.25,"endTime":2917.893,"body":"at the time of Bernini,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2919.06,"endTime":2920.383,"body":"were very earthy,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2921.35,"endTime":2924.77,"body":"they had a tremendously"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2921.35,"endTime":2924.77,"body":"scatological sense of humor."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2924.77,"endTime":2927.01,"body":"Bernini, one of his favorite pastimes"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2927.01,"endTime":2929.54,"body":"was writing slightly risque plays,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2929.54,"endTime":2933.43,"body":"which were performed"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2929.54,"endTime":2933.43,"body":"for the elite of Rome."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2933.43,"endTime":2937.403,"body":"And when they were deciding"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2933.43,"endTime":2937.403,"body":"where to place the elephant,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2938.381,"endTime":2940.98,"body":"and thinking, should it be"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2938.381,"endTime":2940.98,"body":"facing towards the church,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2940.98,"endTime":2943.14,"body":"away from the church,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2943.14,"endTime":2945.06,"body":"this way, that way,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2945.06,"endTime":2947.92,"body":"Bernini insisted that the elephant's bum"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2947.92,"endTime":2950.673,"body":"should be facing the Dominican monastery,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2951.65,"endTime":2954.23,"body":"because he didn't like the Dominicans."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2954.23,"endTime":2956.2,"body":"All of Bernini's friends were Jesuits,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2956.2,"endTime":2958.19,"body":"he didn't like the Dominicans at all."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2958.19,"endTime":2961.7,"body":"And then at the last minute,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2961.7,"endTime":2965.72,"body":"he also changed a bit of the sculpture,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2965.72,"endTime":2970.44,"body":"where the elephant's tail in"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2965.72,"endTime":2970.44,"body":"the original is hanging down,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2970.44,"endTime":2971.97,"body":"and as executed,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2971.97,"endTime":2974.24,"body":"the elephant's tail is lifted to the side,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2974.24,"endTime":2976.51,"body":"as if he's about to defecate"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2976.51,"endTime":2979.63,"body":"in the direction of the"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2976.51,"endTime":2979.63,"body":"Dominican monastery."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2979.63,"endTime":2983.103,"body":"And this was regarded"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2979.63,"endTime":2983.103,"body":"as a sort of huge joke."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2984.54,"endTime":2987.12,"body":"We probably don't get it quite as much"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2987.12,"endTime":2989.51,"body":"as the average 17th century Roman did,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2989.51,"endTime":2992.09,"body":"but I think what it shows"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2992.09,"endTime":2997.09,"body":"is that this civilization"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2992.09,"endTime":2997.09,"body":"which produced such great art,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":2998.36,"endTime":3001.05,"body":"so much, so beautiful, so profound,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3001.05,"endTime":3002.52,"body":"such moving art,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3002.52,"endTime":3004.35,"body":"was also full of people"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3004.35,"endTime":3008.93,"body":"who were full of flesh, and"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3004.35,"endTime":3008.93,"body":"blood, and joy, and humor."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3008.93,"endTime":3010.719,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3010.719,"endTime":3013.67,"body":"(audience applauds)"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3013.67,"endTime":3015.68,"body":"- Thank you very much, Dr. Grossman."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3015.68,"endTime":3016.98,"body":"You'll be pleased to know"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3016.98,"endTime":3021.41,"body":"that your lecture has provoked"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3016.98,"endTime":3021.41,"body":"a number of questions online,"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3021.41,"endTime":3023.36,"body":"I'm sure there'll be some"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3021.41,"endTime":3023.36,"body":"questions in the room."},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3023.36,"endTime":3025.69,"body":"I'm going to start off with"},{"speaker":"It's good to talk about money","startTime":3023.36,"endTime":3025.69,"body":"one of the ones online,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3028.61,"endTime":3031.043,"body":"what happened to Costanza?"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3032.694,"endTime":3036.8,"body":"- Costanza got out of the"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3032.694,"endTime":3036.8,"body":"home for fallen women,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3036.8,"endTime":3038.52,"body":"I think she was there"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3036.8,"endTime":3038.52,"body":"for two or three years,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3038.52,"endTime":3042.72,"body":"and settled down to a fairly"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3038.52,"endTime":3042.72,"body":"average domestic life,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3042.72,"endTime":3047.23,"body":"and was regarded as a pious"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3042.72,"endTime":3047.23,"body":"woman of very good character."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3047.23,"endTime":3049.81,"body":"I think she lived into her late 50s,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3049.81,"endTime":3052.64,"body":"so Costanza was okay in the end."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3052.64,"endTime":3054.95,"body":"Whether she ever got over"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3052.64,"endTime":3054.95,"body":"her affair with Bernini"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3054.95,"endTime":3056.71,"body":"is a different question."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3056.71,"endTime":3057.543,"body":"- [Questioner] Did he have"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3057.543,"endTime":3058.59,"body":"quite a large studio of assistants,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3058.59,"endTime":3059.423,"body":"or did it vary"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3059.423,"endTime":3061.21,"body":"depending on what project he"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3059.423,"endTime":3061.21,"body":"was working on at the time?"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3061.21,"endTime":3063.573,"body":"- He had lots of assistants."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3064.429,"endTime":3065.262,"body":"I think,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3065.262,"endTime":3070.262,"body":"and Simon, I hope, will"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3065.262,"endTime":3070.262,"body":"agree with me on this,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3070.51,"endTime":3072.0,"body":"we've got this idea,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3072.0,"endTime":3074.67,"body":"I blame the Impressionists, basically,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3074.67,"endTime":3076.71,"body":"because the Impressionists"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3074.67,"endTime":3076.71,"body":"have given us this idea"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3076.71,"endTime":3078.07,"body":"that all great artists"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3078.07,"endTime":3080.443,"body":"are just these solitary workers,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3081.5,"endTime":3083.85,"body":"and that the artist has"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3081.5,"endTime":3083.85,"body":"to do everything himself,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3083.85,"endTime":3086.54,"body":"and of course there are great works of art"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3086.54,"endTime":3089.61,"body":"where the artist even"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3086.54,"endTime":3089.61,"body":"did the frame himself,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3089.61,"endTime":3091.71,"body":"or certainly designed the frame."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3091.71,"endTime":3093.59,"body":"But really, if you look back"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3093.59,"endTime":3097.03,"body":"throughout much of art history,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3097.03,"endTime":3098.17,"body":"a lot of our great art"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3098.17,"endTime":3101.43,"body":"is the project of fairly"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3098.17,"endTime":3101.43,"body":"significant workshops."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3101.43,"endTime":3104.35,"body":"So you look at a Rubens, for example,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3104.35,"endTime":3106.97,"body":"and you know that there was"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3104.35,"endTime":3106.97,"body":"someone painting the drapery,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3106.97,"endTime":3108.79,"body":"and there was someone painting the dog,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3108.79,"endTime":3110.5,"body":"and there was someone painting the tree,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3110.5,"endTime":3111.71,"body":"et cetera, et cetera."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3111.71,"endTime":3113.58,"body":"So in that tradition, yeah,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3113.58,"endTime":3115.92,"body":"Bernini had a huge workshop"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3115.92,"endTime":3119.6,"body":"because he had such a"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3115.92,"endTime":3119.6,"body":"great volume of work to do,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3119.6,"endTime":3122.47,"body":"work of such scale and such complexity"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3122.47,"endTime":3125.76,"body":"that it needed a whole lot of specialists."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3125.76,"endTime":3127.06,"body":"So even, for example,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3127.06,"endTime":3128.73,"body":"if we look at this elephant,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3128.73,"endTime":3132.75,"body":"the elephant itself was"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3128.73,"endTime":3132.75,"body":"carved by Ercole Ferrata,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3132.75,"endTime":3135.25,"body":"who was a pretty good sculptor,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3135.25,"endTime":3137.19,"body":"but nothing compared to Bernini,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3137.19,"endTime":3138.5,"body":"and what Bernini did"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3138.5,"endTime":3140.59,"body":"was Bernini provided,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3140.59,"endTime":3143.17,"body":"there are very detailed"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3140.59,"endTime":3143.17,"body":"drawings of this, for example,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3143.17,"endTime":3146.9,"body":"most of which are at the"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3143.17,"endTime":3146.9,"body":"Royal Library at Windsor,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3146.9,"endTime":3151.23,"body":"Bernini provided the"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3146.9,"endTime":3151.23,"body":"design and the control,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3151.23,"endTime":3153.95,"body":"and he then delegated"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3151.23,"endTime":3153.95,"body":"different bits of it."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3153.95,"endTime":3154.783,"body":"So for example,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3154.783,"endTime":3158.26,"body":"in the famous statue of Apollo and Daphne,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3158.26,"endTime":3160.57,"body":"Bernini didn't carve the leaves,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3160.57,"endTime":3164.07,"body":"he didn't carve the fingers"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3160.57,"endTime":3164.07,"body":"turning into branches,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3164.07,"endTime":3165.95,"body":"but it was his idea."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3165.95,"endTime":3168.5,"body":"And I think it is fair"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3168.5,"endTime":3173.01,"body":"to totally attribute the work"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3168.5,"endTime":3173.01,"body":"of art to Bernini himself,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3173.01,"endTime":3175.88,"body":"just as we didn't expect Christopher Wren"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3175.88,"endTime":3178.53,"body":"to actually be doing the"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3175.88,"endTime":3178.53,"body":"brickwork and the stonework"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3178.53,"endTime":3181.463,"body":"of St. Paul's."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3181.463,"endTime":3184.87,"body":"Bernini was in charge"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3181.463,"endTime":3184.87,"body":"of this vast enterprise,"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3184.87,"endTime":3187.873,"body":"but he was very much in"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3184.87,"endTime":3187.873,"body":"control of every aspect of it."},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3189.01,"endTime":3192.117,"body":"- I'm going to take another"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3189.01,"endTime":3192.117,"body":"question from the online audience:"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3192.117,"endTime":3195.397,"body":"\"Stephen Greenblatt, a Harvard"},{"speaker":"which is a very simple one","startTime":3192.117,"endTime":3195.397,"body":"professor of literature,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3195.397,"endTime":3199.967,"body":"How the World Became Modern,'"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3199.967,"endTime":3203.057,"body":"\"described Rome of the early modern period"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3203.057,"endTime":3205.617,"body":"\"as a muddy sewer."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3205.617,"endTime":3209.327,"body":"\"How should we reconcile"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3205.617,"endTime":3209.327,"body":"your view of Rome's grandeur"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3209.327,"endTime":3214.327,"body":"\"with Greenblatt's much less"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3209.327,"endTime":3214.327,"body":"flattering, quotidian reality?\""},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3215.83,"endTime":3218.283,"body":"- Well I guess by saying we can disagree."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3219.289,"endTime":3220.247,"body":"(audience applauds)"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3220.247,"endTime":3221.76,"body":"- [Simon] Excellent answer."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3221.76,"endTime":3223.903,"body":"- I think if you require,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3224.789,"endTime":3228.1,"body":"to paraphrase Christopher Wren's tomb,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3228.1,"endTime":3232.06,"body":"if you require evidence"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3228.1,"endTime":3232.06,"body":"of the genius of Rome,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3232.06,"endTime":3234.07,"body":"just look around you,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3234.07,"endTime":3235.56,"body":"go to Rome and look at it,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3235.56,"endTime":3236.393,"body":"and tell me"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3236.393,"endTime":3238.75,"body":"that it's not one of the"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3236.393,"endTime":3238.75,"body":"greatest cities in the world,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3238.75,"endTime":3240.07,"body":"and a great deal of it"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3240.07,"endTime":3242.207,"body":"was created in the 17th century."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3242.207,"endTime":3246.07,"body":"- \"Where was the second"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3242.207,"endTime":3246.07,"body":"funerary bust to be found?\""},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3246.07,"endTime":3248.63,"body":"The one of the emaciated man."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3248.63,"endTime":3249.73,"body":"- The emaciated man,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3249.73,"endTime":3252.4,"body":"that's not a very flattering description,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3252.4,"endTime":3257.4,"body":"the emaciated man is in a church"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3252.4,"endTime":3257.4,"body":"that very few people visit"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3258.68,"endTime":3261.343,"body":"called San Luigi dei Francesi,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3262.61,"endTime":3265.513,"body":"sorry, San Luigi dei Fiorentini,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3266.44,"endTime":3268.21,"body":"no, I'll get it right this time,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3268.21,"endTime":3271.01,"body":"San Giovanni dei Fiorentini,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3271.01,"endTime":3272.84,"body":"San Giovanni dei Fiorentini,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3272.84,"endTime":3276.98,"body":"which was a church built"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3272.84,"endTime":3276.98,"body":"in the early 17th century"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3276.98,"endTime":3279.64,"body":"for the Florentine community in Rome,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3279.64,"endTime":3284.64,"body":"and it's just on the side of"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3279.64,"endTime":3284.64,"body":"the river opposite the Vatican,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3285.33,"endTime":3287.38,"body":"so San Giovanni dei Fiorentini,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3287.38,"endTime":3289.11,"body":"it's a fascinating church"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3289.11,"endTime":3292.093,"body":"with some great other works of sculpture."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3293.17,"endTime":3295.653,"body":"- [Questioner] Thanks very"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3293.17,"endTime":3295.653,"body":"much for your lecture."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3295.653,"endTime":3297.27,"body":"I just had a quick question,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3297.27,"endTime":3300.87,"body":"you compared Michelangelo's"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3297.27,"endTime":3300.87,"body":"\"David\" with Bernini's,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3300.87,"endTime":3301.9,"body":"and I just wondered"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3301.9,"endTime":3303.8,"body":"had Bernini expressed any opinions"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3303.8,"endTime":3305.72,"body":"on the great Renaissance artists,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3305.72,"endTime":3307.97,"body":"and was he equally as snooty about them"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3307.97,"endTime":3309.843,"body":"as he seemed to be about everything else?"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3312.16,"endTime":3314.993,"body":"- He didn't seem to give,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3317.66,"endTime":3319.61,"body":"of the two contemporary biographies,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3319.61,"endTime":3321.61,"body":"one written by his son"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3324.09,"endTime":3326.51,"body":"says that Bernini greatly appreciated"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3326.51,"endTime":3327.67,"body":"the work of other artists,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3327.67,"endTime":3329.14,"body":"he was very generous towards them,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3329.14,"endTime":3330.14,"body":"et cetera, et cetera;"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3330.14,"endTime":3333.363,"body":"I've found nothing to show that."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3334.46,"endTime":3336.9,"body":"And I think what is typical"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3336.9,"endTime":3340.51,"body":"is that Bernini was"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3336.9,"endTime":3340.51,"body":"quite clearly inspired,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3340.51,"endTime":3344.53,"body":"if not taught, by his father,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3344.53,"endTime":3348.38,"body":"and the biography scarcely"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3344.53,"endTime":3348.38,"body":"mentions his father at all."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3348.38,"endTime":3352.08,"body":"So I think, like a lot of great artists,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3352.08,"endTime":3355.14,"body":"Bernini was also a great ego,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3355.14,"endTime":3360.14,"body":"and was not really overly"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3355.14,"endTime":3360.14,"body":"generous towards many others."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3361.93,"endTime":3364.28,"body":"- Well thank you very much, Dr. Grossman,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3364.28,"endTime":3367.86,"body":"for a fascinating"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3364.28,"endTime":3367.86,"body":"lecture, a great evening,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3367.86,"endTime":3371.285,"body":"and I think we'd all like to"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3367.86,"endTime":3371.285,"body":"give you a round of applause,"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3371.285,"endTime":3372.118,"body":"thank you."},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3372.118,"endTime":3373.25,"body":"(audience applauds)"},{"speaker":"\"in his 2012 book 'The Swerve","startTime":3373.25,"endTime":3374.9,"body":"- Thank you very much."}]}