{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.27,"endTime":2.52,"body":"- Thank you for coming to hear"},{"startTime":0.27,"endTime":2.52,"body":"about Toussaint Louverture,"},{"startTime":2.52,"endTime":5.1,"body":"and of course, this is"},{"startTime":2.52,"endTime":5.1,"body":"Black History Month,"},{"startTime":5.1,"endTime":7.23,"body":"so it's a particularly nice moment"},{"startTime":7.23,"endTime":11.253,"body":"to be talking about Toussaint"},{"startTime":7.23,"endTime":11.253,"body":"and the Haitian Revolution."},{"startTime":12.75,"endTime":16.02,"body":"What I want to do is,"},{"startTime":12.75,"endTime":16.02,"body":"really, to talk about,"},{"startTime":16.02,"endTime":17.97,"body":"through Toussaint Louverture,"},{"startTime":17.97,"endTime":20.25,"body":"to talk about the Haitian Revolution,"},{"startTime":20.25,"endTime":21.45,"body":"which is, I think,"},{"startTime":21.45,"endTime":24.21,"body":"one of the most comprehensive"},{"startTime":24.21,"endTime":27.12,"body":"and one of the purest examples"},{"startTime":27.12,"endTime":28.83,"body":"of revolutionary change"},{"startTime":28.83,"endTime":32.76,"body":"that we have had in the"},{"startTime":28.83,"endTime":32.76,"body":"history of the modern world."},{"startTime":32.76,"endTime":36.36,"body":"The Haitian Revolution was"},{"startTime":32.76,"endTime":36.36,"body":"really a series of changes"},{"startTime":36.36,"endTime":38.85,"body":"that took place between 1791 and 1804,"},{"startTime":41.324,"endTime":43.657,"body":"and it's generally described"},{"startTime":44.73,"endTime":49.73,"body":"as the only successful"},{"startTime":44.73,"endTime":49.73,"body":"revolution of enslaved people,"},{"startTime":49.98,"endTime":53.49,"body":"and it took place in the"},{"startTime":49.98,"endTime":53.49,"body":"French colony of Saint-Domingue"},{"startTime":53.49,"endTime":57.81,"body":"which is in the Caribbean,"},{"startTime":57.81,"endTime":60.42,"body":"and was France's richest colony,"},{"startTime":60.42,"endTime":62.283,"body":"and it led, in the year 1804,"},{"startTime":63.33,"endTime":68.01,"body":"to the establishment"},{"startTime":63.33,"endTime":68.01,"body":"of the state of Haiti,"},{"startTime":68.01,"endTime":69.55,"body":"which is the world's first"},{"startTime":70.56,"endTime":74.52,"body":"independent, Black, postcolonial state."},{"startTime":74.52,"endTime":77.583,"body":"So what I'll try and"},{"startTime":74.52,"endTime":77.583,"body":"do in this lecture is,"},{"startTime":78.48,"endTime":80.28,"body":"I'll talk a bit about"},{"startTime":78.48,"endTime":80.28,"body":"Toussaint Louverture,"},{"startTime":80.28,"endTime":81.113,"body":"but I'll also,"},{"startTime":81.113,"endTime":83.25,"body":"as the title of the lecture suggests,"},{"startTime":83.25,"endTime":85.08,"body":"talk about the Haitian Revolution,"},{"startTime":85.08,"endTime":87.84,"body":"because although my book is a biography,"},{"startTime":87.84,"endTime":90.06,"body":"I've really used Toussaint Louverture,"},{"startTime":90.06,"endTime":93.39,"body":"who was the kind of"},{"startTime":90.06,"endTime":93.39,"body":"leader of this revolution,"},{"startTime":93.39,"endTime":96.45,"body":"as a way of talking about"},{"startTime":93.39,"endTime":96.45,"body":"the revolution itself,"},{"startTime":96.45,"endTime":98.46,"body":"it's the revolution itself which, I think,"},{"startTime":98.46,"endTime":100.74,"body":"is the really interesting subject,"},{"startTime":100.74,"endTime":103.234,"body":"and Toussaint is like a vehicle,"},{"startTime":103.234,"endTime":107.43,"body":"like a means of talking"},{"startTime":103.234,"endTime":107.43,"body":"about this revolution,"},{"startTime":107.43,"endTime":108.84,"body":"because I think,"},{"startTime":108.84,"endTime":111.12,"body":"as I hope to be able to show to you"},{"startTime":111.12,"endTime":113.01,"body":"in the course of the lecture,"},{"startTime":113.01,"endTime":118.01,"body":"this is the world's greatest"},{"startTime":113.01,"endTime":118.01,"body":"and most impactful revolution,"},{"startTime":118.08,"endTime":120.0,"body":"and I mark my words"},{"startTime":120.0,"endTime":123.06,"body":"because we've had a lot"},{"startTime":120.0,"endTime":123.06,"body":"of revolutions in history,"},{"startTime":123.06,"endTime":124.2,"body":"but to my mind,"},{"startTime":124.2,"endTime":127.59,"body":"the Haitian Revolution is"},{"startTime":124.2,"endTime":127.59,"body":"the greatest revolution"},{"startTime":127.59,"endTime":128.61,"body":"of modern times,"},{"startTime":128.61,"endTime":129.963,"body":"and I'll try and show you,"},{"startTime":131.79,"endTime":133.953,"body":"through various aspects of it, why."},{"startTime":135.0,"endTime":136.02,"body":"So let me start"},{"startTime":136.02,"endTime":140.13,"body":"with just quickly describing"},{"startTime":136.02,"endTime":140.13,"body":"this revolution to you,"},{"startTime":140.13,"endTime":141.66,"body":"because you may not be familiar"},{"startTime":141.66,"endTime":144.813,"body":"with all the details of it."},{"startTime":146.07,"endTime":148.311,"body":"It happened in this place"},{"startTime":146.07,"endTime":148.311,"body":"called Saint-Domingue,"},{"startTime":148.311,"endTime":150.75,"body":"which was, as I say,"},{"startTime":150.75,"endTime":154.14,"body":"a colony of France in the Caribbean."},{"startTime":154.14,"endTime":157.02,"body":"It was France's wealthiest colony,"},{"startTime":157.02,"endTime":162.02,"body":"so one of its nicknames was"},{"startTime":157.02,"endTime":162.02,"body":"the Pearl of the Antilles,"},{"startTime":162.51,"endTime":166.71,"body":"it produced fabulous amounts of wealth"},{"startTime":166.71,"endTime":171.71,"body":"through the production of"},{"startTime":166.71,"endTime":171.71,"body":"sugar, coffee, cotton, indigo,"},{"startTime":173.7,"endTime":176.7,"body":"and various other products"},{"startTime":176.7,"endTime":181.17,"body":"which were greatly prized at the time"},{"startTime":181.17,"endTime":183.75,"body":"in the colonial world."},{"startTime":183.75,"endTime":185.67,"body":"However, all of this wealth"},{"startTime":185.67,"endTime":188.823,"body":"was produced by the enslaved population,"},{"startTime":190.2,"endTime":193.32,"body":"and by the year 1789,"},{"startTime":193.32,"endTime":196.77,"body":"you had about 500,000 slaves"},{"startTime":196.77,"endTime":199.67,"body":"in the colony of Saint-Domingue."},{"startTime":199.67,"endTime":204.57,"body":"To give you a sense of the"},{"startTime":199.67,"endTime":204.57,"body":"contrast in the numbers,"},{"startTime":204.57,"endTime":207.477,"body":"the number of white"},{"startTime":204.57,"endTime":207.477,"body":"settlers there at that time"},{"startTime":207.477,"endTime":209.7,"body":"was about 30,000,"},{"startTime":209.7,"endTime":214.7,"body":"so you had 30,000 white settlers"},{"startTime":214.8,"endTime":219.8,"body":"and about 500,0000 enslaved men and women."},{"startTime":221.01,"endTime":223.02,"body":"The thing about these"},{"startTime":221.01,"endTime":223.02,"body":"enslaved men and women"},{"startTime":223.02,"endTime":224.7,"body":"is that most of them were actually,"},{"startTime":224.7,"endTime":226.11,"body":"in the late 18th century,"},{"startTime":226.11,"endTime":227.7,"body":"born in Africa,"},{"startTime":227.7,"endTime":230.823,"body":"and they enjoyed no civil"},{"startTime":227.7,"endTime":230.823,"body":"or political rights,"},{"startTime":232.26,"endTime":233.88,"body":"none at all,"},{"startTime":233.88,"endTime":236.43,"body":"they were considered as property,"},{"startTime":236.43,"endTime":239.46,"body":"they belonged to their owners."},{"startTime":239.46,"endTime":243.45,"body":"So when the revolution"},{"startTime":239.46,"endTime":243.45,"body":"happened in France in 1789,"},{"startTime":243.45,"endTime":245.58,"body":"and you may heard of this revolution,"},{"startTime":245.58,"endTime":246.66,"body":"this was the revolution"},{"startTime":246.66,"endTime":250.86,"body":"that promised people liberty,"},{"startTime":246.66,"endTime":250.86,"body":"equality, and fraternity,"},{"startTime":250.86,"endTime":252.81,"body":"these great principles,"},{"startTime":252.81,"endTime":254.94,"body":"so when this revolution"},{"startTime":252.81,"endTime":254.94,"body":"happened in France,"},{"startTime":254.94,"endTime":256.98,"body":"the slaves turned round"},{"startTime":256.98,"endTime":260.52,"body":"to the new revolutionary"},{"startTime":256.98,"endTime":260.52,"body":"leaders in France,"},{"startTime":260.52,"endTime":263.64,"body":"and said, well what about"},{"startTime":260.52,"endTime":263.64,"body":"these rights for us?"},{"startTime":263.64,"endTime":267.99,"body":"Can we also have some liberty,"},{"startTime":263.64,"endTime":267.99,"body":"equality, and fraternity?"},{"startTime":267.99,"endTime":270.12,"body":"And the French said no, no,"},{"startTime":270.12,"endTime":272.88,"body":"this is basically only for white people."},{"startTime":272.88,"endTime":274.5,"body":"They didn't put it quite so crudely,"},{"startTime":274.5,"endTime":277.113,"body":"but that's basically what they meant."},{"startTime":279.75,"endTime":284.75,"body":"This is a representation"},{"startTime":279.75,"endTime":284.75,"body":"of a slave plantation"},{"startTime":286.62,"endTime":288.273,"body":"in the late 18th century."},{"startTime":289.77,"endTime":290.97,"body":"So very quickly,"},{"startTime":290.97,"endTime":292.02,"body":"the slaves decided"},{"startTime":292.02,"endTime":294.175,"body":"they had to take matters"},{"startTime":292.02,"endTime":294.175,"body":"into their own hands,"},{"startTime":294.175,"endTime":295.175,"body":"and in 1791,"},{"startTime":296.337,"endTime":298.775,"body":"at this very famous ceremony"},{"startTime":298.775,"endTime":302.607,"body":"at a place called Bois Caiman, in Haiti,"},{"startTime":302.607,"endTime":305.695,"body":"the slaves launched their insurrection,"},{"startTime":305.695,"endTime":307.557,"body":"in August, 1791."},{"startTime":307.557,"endTime":310.11,"body":"And basically, this is the insurrection"},{"startTime":310.11,"endTime":313.29,"body":"where they demand to be"},{"startTime":310.11,"endTime":313.29,"body":"given the same rights"},{"startTime":313.29,"endTime":316.29,"body":"as French citizens."},{"startTime":316.29,"endTime":319.23,"body":"And the revolution starts,"},{"startTime":319.23,"endTime":324.23,"body":"it very quickly spreads"},{"startTime":319.23,"endTime":324.23,"body":"to most of the territory,"},{"startTime":324.99,"endTime":326.64,"body":"there's a lot of violence"},{"startTime":326.64,"endTime":329.733,"body":"and a lot of white settlers are killed."},{"startTime":331.32,"endTime":333.75,"body":"However, by 1793,"},{"startTime":333.75,"endTime":337.14,"body":"the French realize that there's"},{"startTime":333.75,"endTime":337.14,"body":"nothing that they can do"},{"startTime":337.14,"endTime":342.14,"body":"to stop the demands of the"},{"startTime":337.14,"endTime":342.14,"body":"slaves for their freedom,"},{"startTime":342.9,"endTime":346.027,"body":"so in 1793, in Saint-Domingue,"},{"startTime":346.027,"endTime":348.777,"body":"the slaves receive their freedom,"},{"startTime":349.867,"endTime":352.034,"body":"and a year later, in 1794,"},{"startTime":355.764,"endTime":359.103,"body":"the French National Assembly in Paris"},{"startTime":359.103,"endTime":361.71,"body":"proclaims the abolition of slavery,"},{"startTime":361.71,"endTime":366.71,"body":"and so this is an important"},{"startTime":361.71,"endTime":366.71,"body":"moment for France as a whole."},{"startTime":366.9,"endTime":370.5,"body":"However, you will note that"},{"startTime":366.9,"endTime":370.5,"body":"the abolition in France"},{"startTime":370.5,"endTime":373.257,"body":"comes after the abolition"},{"startTime":370.5,"endTime":373.257,"body":"in Saint-Domingue,"},{"startTime":373.257,"endTime":378.03,"body":"and so Saint-Domingue is"},{"startTime":373.257,"endTime":378.03,"body":"really the main reason"},{"startTime":378.03,"endTime":381.57,"body":"why the French decide, in 1794,"},{"startTime":381.57,"endTime":383.658,"body":"to abolish slavery,"},{"startTime":383.658,"endTime":388.26,"body":"and that already is something"},{"startTime":383.658,"endTime":388.26,"body":"important to bear in mind,"},{"startTime":388.26,"endTime":392.04,"body":"because it's not always the"},{"startTime":388.26,"endTime":392.04,"body":"way in which the story is told,"},{"startTime":392.04,"endTime":393.99,"body":"even to this day, in France."},{"startTime":393.99,"endTime":395.85,"body":"The French themselves,"},{"startTime":395.85,"endTime":398.22,"body":"when they talk about"},{"startTime":395.85,"endTime":398.22,"body":"the history of slavery"},{"startTime":398.22,"endTime":399.99,"body":"and the history of abolition,"},{"startTime":399.99,"endTime":401.28,"body":"they often just say,"},{"startTime":401.28,"endTime":402.99,"body":"well, in 1794,"},{"startTime":402.99,"endTime":406.59,"body":"our glorious National"},{"startTime":402.99,"endTime":406.59,"body":"Assembly abolished slavery."},{"startTime":406.59,"endTime":407.97,"body":"What they forget to mention"},{"startTime":407.97,"endTime":410.88,"body":"is that the main reason they did this"},{"startTime":410.88,"endTime":415.87,"body":"was because the slaves in Bois Caiman"},{"startTime":416.73,"endTime":420.6,"body":"launched this insurrection in 1791."},{"startTime":420.6,"endTime":423.63,"body":"So at this point, 1791,"},{"startTime":423.63,"endTime":426.93,"body":"appears on the stage a man"},{"startTime":423.63,"endTime":426.93,"body":"called Toussaint Louverture."},{"startTime":426.93,"endTime":428.7,"body":"Nobody had heard of him before,"},{"startTime":428.7,"endTime":430.59,"body":"and indeed, in 1791,"},{"startTime":430.59,"endTime":434.603,"body":"he wasn't even calling"},{"startTime":430.59,"endTime":434.603,"body":"himself by that name."},{"startTime":434.603,"endTime":437.43,"body":"He would soon come to be"},{"startTime":434.603,"endTime":437.43,"body":"called the Black Spartacus,"},{"startTime":437.43,"endTime":440.002,"body":"but I'll come back to that a little later."},{"startTime":440.002,"endTime":443.919,"body":"Toussaint was born sometime"},{"startTime":440.002,"endTime":443.919,"body":"in the early 1740s,"},{"startTime":447.081,"endTime":448.921,"body":"I say sometime in the early 1740s"},{"startTime":448.921,"endTime":453.182,"body":"because we don't know for"},{"startTime":448.921,"endTime":453.182,"body":"sure when exactly he was born,"},{"startTime":453.182,"endTime":457.258,"body":"enslaved people didn't"},{"startTime":453.182,"endTime":457.258,"body":"have birth certificates."},{"startTime":457.258,"endTime":461.258,"body":"We think it's probably"},{"startTime":457.258,"endTime":461.258,"body":"1740, 1741, around there."},{"startTime":462.74,"endTime":467.631,"body":"His parents were enslaved"},{"startTime":462.74,"endTime":467.631,"body":"and captured in West Africa,"},{"startTime":467.631,"endTime":468.917,"body":"from the Kingdom of Allada,"},{"startTime":468.917,"endTime":471.18,"body":"which, in today's terms,"},{"startTime":471.18,"endTime":474.51,"body":"in the Central African Republic of Benin,"},{"startTime":474.51,"endTime":476.757,"body":"and they were brought"},{"startTime":474.51,"endTime":476.757,"body":"over to Saint-Domingue"},{"startTime":476.757,"endTime":479.71,"body":"in the early 18th century,"},{"startTime":479.71,"endTime":481.923,"body":"and Toussaint was born there,"},{"startTime":482.79,"endTime":484.69,"body":"as I say, sometime in the early 1740s."},{"startTime":485.73,"endTime":489.39,"body":"He spent the first, really,"},{"startTime":485.73,"endTime":489.39,"body":"50 years of his life"},{"startTime":489.39,"endTime":491.64,"body":"in a single place, on this farm,"},{"startTime":491.64,"endTime":496.35,"body":"that probably looked rather like this,"},{"startTime":496.35,"endTime":498.809,"body":"it was a farm called Breda,"},{"startTime":498.809,"endTime":500.553,"body":"in the north of the colony."},{"startTime":502.101,"endTime":505.77,"body":"He started his career there, as it were,"},{"startTime":505.77,"endTime":508.05,"body":"if I could use that expression,"},{"startTime":508.05,"endTime":509.073,"body":"as a shepherd,"},{"startTime":510.3,"endTime":511.653,"body":"but very quickly,"},{"startTime":512.91,"endTime":515.31,"body":"the authorities on the farm"},{"startTime":515.31,"endTime":518.49,"body":"realized that he was prodigiously gifted,"},{"startTime":518.49,"endTime":521.4,"body":"he was a fantastic horse rider,"},{"startTime":521.4,"endTime":525.54,"body":"he learned various medical skills,"},{"startTime":525.54,"endTime":528.445,"body":"just herbal medicine,"},{"startTime":528.445,"endTime":531.24,"body":"he knew how to treat animals"},{"startTime":531.24,"endTime":534.45,"body":"that were suffering from various diseases,"},{"startTime":534.45,"endTime":535.62,"body":"so very quickly,"},{"startTime":535.62,"endTime":539.31,"body":"he rose within the ranks of the slave farm"},{"startTime":539.31,"endTime":540.81,"body":"and became, basically,"},{"startTime":540.81,"endTime":545.31,"body":"the kind of assistant"},{"startTime":540.81,"endTime":545.31,"body":"manager of the plantation,"},{"startTime":545.31,"endTime":547.44,"body":"under its leader,"},{"startTime":547.44,"endTime":549.003,"body":"a man called Bayon de Libertat,"},{"startTime":550.077,"endTime":552.57,"body":"and Bayon emancipates Toussaint."},{"startTime":552.57,"endTime":555.15,"body":"Again, we don't have the exact date,"},{"startTime":555.15,"endTime":559.47,"body":"but it's probably"},{"startTime":555.15,"endTime":559.47,"body":"sometime around the 1770s."},{"startTime":559.47,"endTime":563.04,"body":"And so by the time we've"},{"startTime":559.47,"endTime":563.04,"body":"got to the French Revolution"},{"startTime":563.04,"endTime":568.04,"body":"and the launching of the"},{"startTime":563.04,"endTime":568.04,"body":"insurrection in 1791,"},{"startTime":568.05,"endTime":571.89,"body":"Toussaint is already a 50 year-old man,"},{"startTime":571.89,"endTime":572.88,"body":"and that, I think,"},{"startTime":572.88,"endTime":574.8,"body":"is also something interesting."},{"startTime":574.8,"endTime":577.83,"body":"One often thinks of"},{"startTime":574.8,"endTime":577.83,"body":"revolutionaries as young people,"},{"startTime":577.83,"endTime":581.13,"body":"and revolutionaries are people"},{"startTime":577.83,"endTime":581.13,"body":"who are often thought of"},{"startTime":581.13,"endTime":584.49,"body":"as people who will be"},{"startTime":581.13,"endTime":584.49,"body":"prepared to risk everything,"},{"startTime":584.49,"endTime":587.19,"body":"are very romantic and idealistic,"},{"startTime":587.19,"endTime":590.523,"body":"well, Toussaint doesn't"},{"startTime":587.19,"endTime":590.523,"body":"fit that profile at all."},{"startTime":591.87,"endTime":593.52,"body":"In fact, he doesn't know it yet,"},{"startTime":593.52,"endTime":597.543,"body":"but he's already lived"},{"startTime":593.52,"endTime":597.543,"body":"most of his life by 1791,"},{"startTime":599.43,"endTime":604.43,"body":"he's a mature, sober, responsible person."},{"startTime":605.94,"endTime":609.75,"body":"And he joins this revolution in 1791,"},{"startTime":609.75,"endTime":611.04,"body":"and very quickly,"},{"startTime":611.04,"endTime":614.04,"body":"he rises within the"},{"startTime":611.04,"endTime":614.04,"body":"ranks of the revolution,"},{"startTime":614.04,"endTime":617.583,"body":"he becomes a general in"},{"startTime":614.04,"endTime":617.583,"body":"the French Republican Army."},{"startTime":618.42,"endTime":621.03,"body":"I want to go back to this cover."},{"startTime":621.03,"endTime":623.4,"body":"This is the cover of my book,"},{"startTime":623.4,"endTime":628.063,"body":"and it's by a Haitian artist"},{"startTime":623.4,"endTime":628.063,"body":"called Francois Cauvin,"},{"startTime":628.063,"endTime":630.963,"body":"who painted this in 2009."},{"startTime":631.89,"endTime":633.03,"body":"I'm very keen"},{"startTime":633.03,"endTime":636.45,"body":"not to use any of the images"},{"startTime":633.03,"endTime":636.45,"body":"of Toussaint Louverture"},{"startTime":636.45,"endTime":640.38,"body":"that date to the 18th and 19th centuries"},{"startTime":640.38,"endTime":643.56,"body":"because we don't really"},{"startTime":640.38,"endTime":643.56,"body":"know what he looked like."},{"startTime":643.56,"endTime":646.71,"body":"We know for sure that"},{"startTime":643.56,"endTime":646.71,"body":"he sat for one painting,"},{"startTime":646.71,"endTime":647.82,"body":"but that painting, sadly,"},{"startTime":647.82,"endTime":649.77,"body":"has been destroyed or lost,"},{"startTime":649.77,"endTime":651.273,"body":"so we don't have it anymore."},{"startTime":652.71,"endTime":653.73,"body":"I much prefer,"},{"startTime":653.73,"endTime":655.2,"body":"when I think about Toussaint,"},{"startTime":655.2,"endTime":659.07,"body":"and of course, when people"},{"startTime":655.2,"endTime":659.07,"body":"drew or painted Black people"},{"startTime":659.07,"endTime":661.2,"body":"in the 18th and 19th centuries,"},{"startTime":661.2,"endTime":662.46,"body":"they often painted them"},{"startTime":662.46,"endTime":665.55,"body":"in rather negative, stereotypical ways,"},{"startTime":665.55,"endTime":667.95,"body":"so I much prefer this painting,"},{"startTime":667.95,"endTime":671.85,"body":"which is a painting from a"},{"startTime":667.95,"endTime":671.85,"body":"contemporary Haitian artist,"},{"startTime":671.85,"endTime":675.42,"body":"and it shows Toussaint"},{"startTime":671.85,"endTime":675.42,"body":"Louverture as a French general."},{"startTime":675.42,"endTime":676.41,"body":"You might notice"},{"startTime":676.41,"endTime":680.37,"body":"that he has a guinea fowl on his head,"},{"startTime":680.37,"endTime":682.8,"body":"which you might think curious,"},{"startTime":682.8,"endTime":684.78,"body":"why would you put basically a chicken"},{"startTime":684.78,"endTime":687.693,"body":"on top of the head of"},{"startTime":684.78,"endTime":687.693,"body":"a revolutionary leader?"},{"startTime":688.86,"endTime":689.76,"body":"This is interesting"},{"startTime":689.76,"endTime":693.09,"body":"from the point of view of the"},{"startTime":689.76,"endTime":693.09,"body":"traditions and the folklore"},{"startTime":693.09,"endTime":695.76,"body":"of Haiti and Saint-Domingue,"},{"startTime":695.76,"endTime":699.48,"body":"because the guinea fowl was a bird"},{"startTime":699.48,"endTime":704.13,"body":"that was introduced in"},{"startTime":699.48,"endTime":704.13,"body":"Saint-Domingue by colonizers"},{"startTime":704.13,"endTime":706.53,"body":"in the 17th century, I think,"},{"startTime":706.53,"endTime":709.83,"body":"and one of its characteristics,"},{"startTime":709.83,"endTime":713.52,"body":"almost immediately upon its"},{"startTime":709.83,"endTime":713.52,"body":"being introduced in the island,"},{"startTime":713.52,"endTime":715.05,"body":"was that it ran away,"},{"startTime":715.05,"endTime":717.57,"body":"it refused to be kept captive,"},{"startTime":717.57,"endTime":721.71,"body":"so for the enslaved men and"},{"startTime":717.57,"endTime":721.71,"body":"women of Saint-Domingue,"},{"startTime":721.71,"endTime":725.43,"body":"the guinea fowl was always"},{"startTime":721.71,"endTime":725.43,"body":"a symbol of freedom,"},{"startTime":725.43,"endTime":730.43,"body":"a symbol of the refusal to"},{"startTime":725.43,"endTime":730.43,"body":"live a life of captivity."},{"startTime":734.43,"endTime":736.23,"body":"And up to this day,"},{"startTime":736.23,"endTime":738.48,"body":"the guinea fowl is a symbol of freedom,"},{"startTime":738.48,"endTime":743.19,"body":"and that's why Francois has"},{"startTime":738.48,"endTime":743.19,"body":"painted Toussaint in this way,"},{"startTime":743.19,"endTime":746.7,"body":"and I think it's just"},{"startTime":743.19,"endTime":746.7,"body":"a lovely representation"},{"startTime":746.7,"endTime":751.2,"body":"of his revolutionary spirit."},{"startTime":751.2,"endTime":753.36,"body":"So who was Toussaint Louverture?"},{"startTime":753.36,"endTime":756.96,"body":"I'll say a bit more about him"},{"startTime":753.36,"endTime":756.96,"body":"in more detail in a moment,"},{"startTime":756.96,"endTime":758.64,"body":"but just to give you a flavor"},{"startTime":758.64,"endTime":762.39,"body":"of the kind of revolutionary"},{"startTime":758.64,"endTime":762.39,"body":"leader that he becomes,"},{"startTime":762.39,"endTime":765.964,"body":"he was flamboyant, he was charismatic,"},{"startTime":765.964,"endTime":768.54,"body":"he had a prodigious memory,"},{"startTime":768.54,"endTime":771.12,"body":"he ate very little, slept very little,"},{"startTime":771.12,"endTime":773.69,"body":"on average three or four hours,"},{"startTime":773.69,"endTime":776.91,"body":"he rarely slept in the same"},{"startTime":773.69,"endTime":776.91,"body":"bed from one night to the other"},{"startTime":776.91,"endTime":779.88,"body":"because he was always on the move,"},{"startTime":779.88,"endTime":783.51,"body":"he spent a lot of his time"},{"startTime":779.88,"endTime":783.51,"body":"galloping on his white horse,"},{"startTime":783.51,"endTime":786.24,"body":"we know that he had several white horses,"},{"startTime":786.24,"endTime":789.78,"body":"so that's the kind of person that he was."},{"startTime":789.78,"endTime":794.78,"body":"He had massive support in the 1790s,"},{"startTime":796.05,"endTime":799.74,"body":"and that was one of the most"},{"startTime":796.05,"endTime":799.74,"body":"extraordinary things about him."},{"startTime":799.74,"endTime":801.995,"body":"He was supported by, obviously,"},{"startTime":801.995,"endTime":804.21,"body":"the former slaves,"},{"startTime":804.21,"endTime":806.91,"body":"the people that he had"},{"startTime":804.21,"endTime":806.91,"body":"helped to emancipate,"},{"startTime":806.91,"endTime":809.13,"body":"but also by the white settlers,"},{"startTime":809.13,"endTime":812.4,"body":"because they regarded him as their savior,"},{"startTime":812.4,"endTime":816.66,"body":"they thought that he would help them keep"},{"startTime":816.66,"endTime":820.56,"body":"at least some of their interests"},{"startTime":816.66,"endTime":820.56,"body":"and benefits in the island."},{"startTime":820.56,"endTime":824.28,"body":"And there was something"},{"startTime":820.56,"endTime":824.28,"body":"almost magical about him,"},{"startTime":824.28,"endTime":827.04,"body":"that's the only way I can describe him,"},{"startTime":827.04,"endTime":829.083,"body":"and this sense of magic,"},{"startTime":830.91,"endTime":832.532,"body":"his own supporters believed"},{"startTime":832.532,"endTime":836.67,"body":"that he had special magical powers,"},{"startTime":836.67,"endTime":840.1,"body":"and even his opponents,"},{"startTime":836.67,"endTime":840.1,"body":"even his adversaries"},{"startTime":841.59,"endTime":843.87,"body":"were mesmerized by him,"},{"startTime":843.87,"endTime":845.85,"body":"they were bewildered by him,"},{"startTime":845.85,"endTime":848.403,"body":"he was always wrong-footing them."},{"startTime":849.39,"endTime":854.19,"body":"And I have this quote"},{"startTime":849.39,"endTime":854.19,"body":"from a French officer"},{"startTime":854.19,"endTime":857.01,"body":"who arrives in the early 1800s"},{"startTime":857.01,"endTime":859.41,"body":"to try and topple Toussaint,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":861.847,"endTime":865.867,"body":"\"Louverture was a man who"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":861.847,"endTime":865.867,"body":"managed to make himself invisible"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":865.867,"endTime":867.727,"body":"\"where he was,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":867.727,"endTime":870.637,"body":"\"and visible where he was not."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":870.637,"endTime":874.657,"body":"\"He seemed to have borrowed"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":870.637,"endTime":874.657,"body":"his spontaneity of movement"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":874.657,"endTime":875.997,"body":"\"from the tiger,\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":877.837,"endTime":882.637,"body":"a wonderful way of characterizing him."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":883.92,"endTime":885.84,"body":"So what happens in the 1790s,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":885.84,"endTime":889.92,"body":"I'll come back to this in a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":885.84,"endTime":889.92,"body":"little bit more detail shortly,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":889.92,"endTime":893.16,"body":"but just to give you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":889.92,"endTime":893.16,"body":"the one-minute summary,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":893.16,"endTime":898.16,"body":"is that he gathers a group"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":893.16,"endTime":898.16,"body":"of supporters around him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":898.41,"endTime":900.093,"body":"rises to power,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":901.53,"endTime":906.09,"body":"defeats all the foreign forces"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":906.09,"endTime":910.56,"body":"that are trying to cling on"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":906.09,"endTime":910.56,"body":"to slavery on the island,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":910.56,"endTime":913.2,"body":"these are mainly the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":910.56,"endTime":913.2,"body":"Spaniards and the British."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":913.2,"endTime":916.59,"body":"The British are the baddies"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":913.2,"endTime":916.59,"body":"in this period, I'm afraid,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":916.59,"endTime":921.33,"body":"they're there from 1793 up to 1798,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":921.33,"endTime":924.15,"body":"and they're basically"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":921.33,"endTime":924.15,"body":"trying to maintain slavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":924.15,"endTime":925.35,"body":"on the island,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":925.35,"endTime":929.28,"body":"so not one of the most glorious moments"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":929.28,"endTime":931.083,"body":"in British colonial history,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":932.026,"endTime":933.48,"body":"I'm not sure there are many others,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":933.48,"endTime":936.27,"body":"but anyway, that's something else,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":936.27,"endTime":939.57,"body":"but this is a particularly dark episode."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":939.57,"endTime":942.99,"body":"Anyway, Toussaint defeats"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":939.57,"endTime":942.99,"body":"them and kicks them out,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":942.99,"endTime":946.26,"body":"and he does the same"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":942.99,"endTime":946.26,"body":"thing to the Spaniards,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":946.26,"endTime":948.33,"body":"so he's a great general,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":948.33,"endTime":949.32,"body":"but he also,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":949.32,"endTime":953.79,"body":"and this is another"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":949.32,"endTime":953.79,"body":"interesting part of the story,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":953.79,"endTime":957.48,"body":"he tactically outflanks"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":957.48,"endTime":959.46,"body":"the French administrators who are there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":959.46,"endTime":961.8,"body":"and who are notionally"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":959.46,"endTime":961.8,"body":"administering the island"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":961.8,"endTime":963.36,"body":"in the name of France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":963.36,"endTime":967.05,"body":"and Louverture kind of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":963.36,"endTime":967.05,"body":"befriends them, bullies them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":967.05,"endTime":969.42,"body":"uses a wide variety of tactics,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":969.42,"endTime":973.23,"body":"and basically packs them"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":969.42,"endTime":973.23,"body":"off one after the other,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":973.23,"endTime":975.66,"body":"and the last French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":973.23,"endTime":975.66,"body":"administrator who's there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":975.66,"endTime":978.36,"body":"who arrives in the late 1790s,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":978.36,"endTime":982.41,"body":"Toussaint, I have to say,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":978.36,"endTime":982.41,"body":"perhaps not very elegantly,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":982.41,"endTime":984.54,"body":"basically arrests him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":984.54,"endTime":987.57,"body":"and sends him into internal exile,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":987.57,"endTime":989.61,"body":"where he's kept for two years"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":989.61,"endTime":991.26,"body":"before being sent back to France."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":992.19,"endTime":993.127,"body":"So anyway,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":993.127,"endTime":996.97,"body":"Toussaint establishes"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":993.127,"endTime":996.97,"body":"control over the island,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":996.97,"endTime":998.394,"body":"and in 1801,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":998.394,"endTime":1001.144,"body":"he promulgates a new constitution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1003.105,"endTime":1005.3,"body":"for the colony of Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1005.3,"endTime":1007.16,"body":"and this new constitution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1007.16,"endTime":1009.53,"body":"makes him governor for life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1009.53,"endTime":1012.26,"body":"abolishes slavery forever,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1012.26,"endTime":1016.07,"body":"and effectively makes"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1012.26,"endTime":1016.07,"body":"Saint-Domingue an autonomous entity"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1016.07,"endTime":1018.353,"body":"within the French Colonial Empire."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1019.58,"endTime":1021.26,"body":"So at this point,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1021.26,"endTime":1023.42,"body":"somebody else enters the scene,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1023.42,"endTime":1024.77,"body":"I haven't mentioned him yet,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1024.77,"endTime":1028.01,"body":"but he plays a very"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1024.77,"endTime":1028.01,"body":"major part in this story,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1028.01,"endTime":1029.9,"body":"this is Napoleon Bonaparte."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1029.9,"endTime":1033.53,"body":"Wendy mentioned that I"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1029.9,"endTime":1033.53,"body":"had written about him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1033.53,"endTime":1037.01,"body":"he also plays a very"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1033.53,"endTime":1037.01,"body":"negative role, unfortunately,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1037.01,"endTime":1038.42,"body":"in this story,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1038.42,"endTime":1042.14,"body":"because Bonaparte has come"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1038.42,"endTime":1042.14,"body":"to power in France in 1799,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1042.14,"endTime":1044.12,"body":"and as soon as he comes to power,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1044.12,"endTime":1047.96,"body":"he wants to restore order in the colonies,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1047.96,"endTime":1049.82,"body":"and what that means for him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1049.82,"endTime":1052.25,"body":"is he needs to get rid"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1049.82,"endTime":1052.25,"body":"of these Black people"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1052.25,"endTime":1053.78,"body":"who are running things."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1053.78,"endTime":1058.063,"body":"So he sends a military"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1053.78,"endTime":1058.063,"body":"expedition to Saint-Domingue"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1058.063,"endTime":1059.84,"body":"in late 1801"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1059.84,"endTime":1062.75,"body":"basically to topple Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1062.75,"endTime":1067.15,"body":"and not to put it in any subtle way,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1068.18,"endTime":1069.95,"body":"because he says so explicitly,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1069.95,"endTime":1072.89,"body":"his aim in sending this"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1069.95,"endTime":1072.89,"body":"military expedition"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1072.89,"endTime":1073.79,"body":"to Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1073.79,"endTime":1075.83,"body":"is to restore white rule,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1075.83,"endTime":1079.01,"body":"he wants to get rid of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1075.83,"endTime":1079.01,"body":"this new Black leadership"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1079.01,"endTime":1081.32,"body":"that has emerged on the island."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1081.32,"endTime":1083.75,"body":"Toussaint leads the resistance,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1083.75,"endTime":1086.36,"body":"unfortunately he's captured in 1802"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1086.36,"endTime":1089.06,"body":"and sent to a French fort,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1089.06,"endTime":1091.19,"body":"where he dies in 1803,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1091.19,"endTime":1093.2,"body":"but the Haitian people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1093.2,"endTime":1094.37,"body":"they're not yet Haitian,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1094.37,"endTime":1096.083,"body":"but about to become Haitian,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1097.1,"endTime":1100.61,"body":"they rise in a kind of final insurrection"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1100.61,"endTime":1102.71,"body":"against the French invaders,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1102.71,"endTime":1104.12,"body":"they fight them off"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1104.12,"endTime":1107.046,"body":"and defeat them at the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1104.12,"endTime":1107.046,"body":"Battle of Vertieres,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1107.046,"endTime":1109.91,"body":"in November, 1803."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1109.91,"endTime":1112.468,"body":"The French troops then"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1109.91,"endTime":1112.468,"body":"leave Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1112.468,"endTime":1113.78,"body":"and as I said,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1113.78,"endTime":1117.08,"body":"Haiti becomes an"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1113.78,"endTime":1117.08,"body":"independent state in 1804."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1118.247,"endTime":1120.2,"body":"And so Toussaint Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1120.2,"endTime":1122.33,"body":"didn't live to witness this moment,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1122.33,"endTime":1124.85,"body":"he had died one year before,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1124.85,"endTime":1129.85,"body":"but I think we can properly regard him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1130.07,"endTime":1133.13,"body":"as one of the founding fathers"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1133.13,"endTime":1135.503,"body":"of modern Haitian independence."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1137.18,"endTime":1140.03,"body":"Before I talk in a little bit more detail"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1140.03,"endTime":1142.19,"body":"about this revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1142.19,"endTime":1145.49,"body":"and the role that Toussaint"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1142.19,"endTime":1145.49,"body":"Louverture played in it,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1145.49,"endTime":1148.4,"body":"there's one little question"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1145.49,"endTime":1148.4,"body":"that I want to touch on,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1148.4,"endTime":1150.02,"body":"which is a comparative one,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1150.02,"endTime":1153.143,"body":"which is, why did this revolution succeed?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1154.4,"endTime":1156.92,"body":"Those of you who've done"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1154.4,"endTime":1156.92,"body":"a little bit of reading"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1156.92,"endTime":1158.99,"body":"about the history of slavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1158.99,"endTime":1163.28,"body":"will know that slaves"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1158.99,"endTime":1163.28,"body":"resisted in many places."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1163.28,"endTime":1165.89,"body":"In fact, we now know that in any place"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1165.89,"endTime":1168.59,"body":"where there was a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1165.89,"endTime":1168.59,"body":"significant number of slaves,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1168.59,"endTime":1172.25,"body":"they didn't passively"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1168.59,"endTime":1172.25,"body":"accept their condition,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1172.25,"endTime":1173.39,"body":"they fought,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1173.39,"endTime":1175.13,"body":"I mean, it was a very uneven fight,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1175.13,"endTime":1178.19,"body":"but they rebelled against their condition."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1178.19,"endTime":1180.38,"body":"and we know, even in the 18th century,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1180.38,"endTime":1185.38,"body":"that there were massive"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1180.38,"endTime":1185.38,"body":"uprisings of enslaved people"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1185.48,"endTime":1190.48,"body":"in Jamaica, in Dutch Guiana,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1185.48,"endTime":1190.48,"body":"in Venezuela, in Cuba,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1191.6,"endTime":1193.64,"body":"in the United States even,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1193.64,"endTime":1195.68,"body":"so in all of these places,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1195.68,"endTime":1196.97,"body":"slaves revolted,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1196.97,"endTime":1198.26,"body":"but they only succeeded,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1198.26,"endTime":1200.54,"body":"in the way that the Haitians succeeded,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1200.54,"endTime":1202.912,"body":"in one place, in Saint-Domingue."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1202.912,"endTime":1207.26,"body":"So why, why did it succeed here and fail,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1207.26,"endTime":1208.093,"body":"at least fail"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1210.35,"endTime":1213.2,"body":"to the extent the objective"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1210.35,"endTime":1213.2,"body":"is to overturn slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1213.2,"endTime":1216.92,"body":"why did it fail in all these other places?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1216.92,"endTime":1218.417,"body":"Well, I think there's a number of reasons,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1218.417,"endTime":1220.13,"body":"and in spelling them out,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1220.13,"endTime":1223.249,"body":"I think I'm already starting to talk about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1223.249,"endTime":1226.55,"body":"the broader characteristics"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1223.249,"endTime":1226.55,"body":"of the Haitian Revolution."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1226.55,"endTime":1228.683,"body":"The first reason is just numbers."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1230.57,"endTime":1232.88,"body":"As I indicated to you earlier on,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1232.88,"endTime":1234.65,"body":"there's this huge disparity"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1234.65,"endTime":1237.95,"body":"between the 30,000 white settlers"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1237.95,"endTime":1242.21,"body":"and the 500,000 Black slaves,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1242.21,"endTime":1246.683,"body":"so the slave army was much bigger."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1248.21,"endTime":1249.86,"body":"Numbers aren't everything,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1249.86,"endTime":1252.59,"body":"but numbers played a significant role"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1252.59,"endTime":1256.46,"body":"at least in allowing"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1252.59,"endTime":1256.46,"body":"the slave to fight back."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1256.46,"endTime":1257.63,"body":"The second reason, I think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1257.63,"endTime":1258.71,"body":"is an interesting one,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1258.71,"endTime":1261.05,"body":"because it's to do with their ideology,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1261.05,"endTime":1264.08,"body":"and the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1261.05,"endTime":1264.08,"body":"is really interesting"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1264.08,"endTime":1268.99,"body":"because it's really a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1264.08,"endTime":1268.99,"body":"very original revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1268.99,"endTime":1272.57,"body":"in the sense that the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1268.99,"endTime":1272.57,"body":"ideas for transformation,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1272.57,"endTime":1274.25,"body":"the ideas for change,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1274.25,"endTime":1278.21,"body":"the ideas for the better society"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1278.21,"endTime":1279.98,"body":"that they're hoping to build,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1279.98,"endTime":1282.95,"body":"come from a wide range of sources."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1282.95,"endTime":1286.76,"body":"They come from the Enlightenment,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1282.95,"endTime":1286.76,"body":"they come from Europe,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1286.76,"endTime":1289.16,"body":"they come from revolutionary"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1286.76,"endTime":1289.16,"body":"ideas of change"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1289.16,"endTime":1291.56,"body":"that have gained currency there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1291.56,"endTime":1294.26,"body":"but they also come from the Caribbean,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1294.26,"endTime":1296.45,"body":"and indeed, Louverture himself"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1296.45,"endTime":1301.45,"body":"is someone who has his"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1296.45,"endTime":1301.45,"body":"own brand of Catholicism,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1301.46,"endTime":1303.56,"body":"he's someone who taps into"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1303.56,"endTime":1308.39,"body":"the existing spiritual"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1303.56,"endTime":1308.39,"body":"system of belief in Haiti,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1308.39,"endTime":1310.04,"body":"which is called Vodou,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1310.04,"endTime":1312.181,"body":"and which plays an important role"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1312.181,"endTime":1315.473,"body":"throughout these revolutionary periods,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1316.31,"endTime":1318.2,"body":"but there's also Africa."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1318.2,"endTime":1321.23,"body":"These enslaved men and"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1318.2,"endTime":1321.23,"body":"women come from Africa,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1321.23,"endTime":1323.78,"body":"as I mentioned to you at the beginning,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1323.78,"endTime":1325.7,"body":"most of them were born in Africa,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1325.7,"endTime":1329.57,"body":"and many of them bring their beliefs,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1329.57,"endTime":1332.75,"body":"their values, their practical skills,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1332.75,"endTime":1336.14,"body":"many of them had been combatants"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1336.14,"endTime":1338.6,"body":"in various African armies."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1338.6,"endTime":1340.373,"body":"One of the things we know now,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1342.95,"endTime":1346.25,"body":"colleagues who've studied the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1342.95,"endTime":1346.25,"body":"Transatlantic Slave Trade,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1346.25,"endTime":1349.28,"body":"we know that probably"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1346.25,"endTime":1349.28,"body":"a significant minority,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1349.28,"endTime":1351.32,"body":"if not a majority of the slaves"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1351.32,"endTime":1353.6,"body":"who were sent from Africa"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1353.6,"endTime":1358.6,"body":"to various parts of the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1353.6,"endTime":1358.6,"body":"Caribbean and the Americas"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1359.48,"endTime":1362.09,"body":"were actually people who were captured"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1362.09,"endTime":1364.52,"body":"during military conflicts."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1367.58,"body":"So these were people who"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1367.58,"body":"already had some kind of,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1367.58,"endTime":1368.87,"body":"in some cases,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1368.87,"endTime":1373.16,"body":"quite advanced military"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1368.87,"endTime":1373.16,"body":"training, military techniques,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1373.16,"endTime":1376.28,"body":"and they used these military techniques"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1376.28,"endTime":1381.28,"body":"in their war against the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1376.28,"endTime":1381.28,"body":"British, the Spaniards,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1384.08,"endTime":1386.6,"body":"and then finally the French."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1386.6,"endTime":1387.65,"body":"And there's also,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1387.65,"endTime":1389.24,"body":"I think what is really interesting"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1389.24,"endTime":1391.13,"body":"about the Haitian Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1391.13,"endTime":1394.97,"body":"is that this is a revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1391.13,"endTime":1394.97,"body":"which brings together"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1394.97,"endTime":1398.033,"body":"many different kind of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1394.97,"endTime":1398.033,"body":"political organization,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1398.93,"endTime":1400.31,"body":"political organizations"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1400.31,"endTime":1404.18,"body":"that are offshoots of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1400.31,"endTime":1404.18,"body":"the French Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1404.18,"endTime":1406.31,"body":"but also political organizations"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1406.31,"endTime":1408.89,"body":"that are based locally,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1408.89,"endTime":1412.73,"body":"and which derive from the runaway slaves,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1412.73,"endTime":1417.29,"body":"which derive from local"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1412.73,"endTime":1417.29,"body":"Catholic organizations,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1417.29,"endTime":1422.29,"body":"which derive from the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1417.29,"endTime":1422.29,"body":"mobilizations of different groups."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1422.48,"endTime":1424.49,"body":"This is a revolution, also,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1424.49,"endTime":1428.66,"body":"where women play an important role."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1428.66,"endTime":1430.7,"body":"One of the striking characteristics,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1430.7,"endTime":1435.41,"body":"both of the early slave"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1430.7,"endTime":1435.41,"body":"revolt, after 1791,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1435.41,"endTime":1437.63,"body":"and what I think one could call"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1437.63,"endTime":1442.63,"body":"the war of national liberation,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1437.63,"endTime":1442.63,"body":"in 1802, 1803, 1804,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1443.45,"endTime":1445.583,"body":"is that a lot of the combatants are women,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1446.42,"endTime":1447.71,"body":"so this is a revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1447.71,"endTime":1451.88,"body":"in which women play a major role."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1451.88,"endTime":1454.61,"body":"And so in all of these respects,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1454.61,"endTime":1459.61,"body":"this is an insurrection, a revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1459.71,"endTime":1461.33,"body":"which is distinct,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1461.33,"endTime":1462.59,"body":"and that, I think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1462.59,"endTime":1465.08,"body":"is the reason why it succeeds."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1465.08,"endTime":1466.94,"body":"And last but not least,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1466.94,"endTime":1468.86,"body":"and of course I would"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1466.94,"endTime":1468.86,"body":"say this, wouldn't I,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1468.86,"endTime":1470.63,"body":"having written a book about him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1470.63,"endTime":1472.973,"body":"but I think leadership"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1470.63,"endTime":1472.973,"body":"is also very important."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1474.05,"endTime":1476.84,"body":"Revolutions, and particularly"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1474.05,"endTime":1476.84,"body":"slave revolutions,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1476.84,"endTime":1478.82,"body":"are more likely to succeed"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1478.82,"endTime":1481.16,"body":"if they are effectively led."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1481.16,"endTime":1481.993,"body":"And very often,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1481.993,"endTime":1483.41,"body":"when you look at slave revolts,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1483.41,"endTime":1485.81,"body":"particularly in the 18th century,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1485.81,"endTime":1488.15,"body":"often, the one thing that they don't have"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1488.15,"endTime":1493.15,"body":"is a clear, distinct,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1488.15,"endTime":1493.15,"body":"strong, charismatic leader,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1494.45,"endTime":1497.51,"body":"so I think having that"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1497.51,"endTime":1499.65,"body":"actually helped them enormously"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1502.13,"endTime":1507.13,"body":"in the late 18th and early 19th centuries."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1509.69,"endTime":1513.65,"body":"So that's the broad picture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1513.65,"endTime":1514.7,"body":"now what I want to do"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1514.7,"endTime":1518.93,"body":"is focus back onto Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1518.93,"endTime":1520.79,"body":"and the Haitian Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1520.79,"endTime":1523.67,"body":"and just pick out some of the big themes"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1523.67,"endTime":1526.46,"body":"that I think come out of this revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1526.46,"endTime":1531.46,"body":"and really justify us paying"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1526.46,"endTime":1531.46,"body":"continuing attention to it"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1532.67,"endTime":1534.17,"body":"in the 21st century."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1534.17,"endTime":1536.99,"body":"Because one of the things"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1534.17,"endTime":1536.99,"body":"about this revolution is that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1536.99,"endTime":1541.7,"body":"although it was an enormously"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1536.99,"endTime":1541.7,"body":"significant historical event,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1541.7,"endTime":1546.02,"body":"I think it also still speaks"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1541.7,"endTime":1546.02,"body":"to us in the 21st century,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1546.02,"endTime":1548.42,"body":"and I'll try and say something"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1546.02,"endTime":1548.42,"body":"about that very quickly"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1548.42,"endTime":1551.48,"body":"at the end of the talk,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1551.48,"endTime":1556.48,"body":"but I'm going to try and go"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1551.48,"endTime":1556.48,"body":"a little bit more quickly now"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1559.04,"endTime":1560.09,"body":"to make sure"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1560.09,"endTime":1562.973,"body":"that we have a little bit"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1560.09,"endTime":1562.973,"body":"of time for questions."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1564.59,"endTime":1568.853,"body":"So what are the main"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1564.59,"endTime":1568.853,"body":"characteristics of this revolution?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1570.11,"endTime":1571.46,"body":"The first thing, I think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1571.46,"endTime":1575.36,"body":"is that this is a revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1571.46,"endTime":1575.36,"body":"which is about slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1575.36,"endTime":1577.22,"body":"fundamentally about slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1577.22,"endTime":1580.433,"body":"slavery is the unifying"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1577.22,"endTime":1580.433,"body":"feature of the revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1582.2,"endTime":1585.62,"body":"it is obviously the reason"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1582.2,"endTime":1585.62,"body":"why you have the revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1585.62,"endTime":1588.113,"body":"in the first place, in 1791,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1589.19,"endTime":1592.49,"body":"the slaves are fighting"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1589.19,"endTime":1592.49,"body":"to emancipate themselves."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1592.49,"endTime":1595.73,"body":"When you look at Toussaint"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1592.49,"endTime":1595.73,"body":"Louverture's strategic objectives"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1595.73,"endTime":1596.75,"body":"as a leader"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1596.75,"endTime":1598.49,"body":"throughout the 1790s"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1598.49,"endTime":1601.85,"body":"and all the way up to the early 1800s,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1601.85,"endTime":1603.26,"body":"you'll see that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1603.26,"endTime":1607.37,"body":"very firmly on his horizon,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1607.37,"endTime":1612.37,"body":"is the goal of preserving"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1607.37,"endTime":1612.37,"body":"the abolition of slavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1612.41,"endTime":1616.07,"body":"and protecting his people"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1612.41,"endTime":1616.07,"body":"from re-enslavement."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1616.07,"endTime":1619.91,"body":"'Cause one of the things about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1616.07,"endTime":1619.91,"body":"Louverture is that he had,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1619.91,"endTime":1621.89,"body":"I talked about his magical powers,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1621.89,"endTime":1623.69,"body":"he had a very uncanny sense"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1623.69,"endTime":1626.12,"body":"of anticipating what might happen,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1626.12,"endTime":1631.01,"body":"and he knew that if the Black"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1626.12,"endTime":1631.01,"body":"people of Saint-Domingue"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1631.01,"endTime":1632.99,"body":"abolished slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1632.99,"endTime":1637.34,"body":"that the colonial powers in Europe"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1637.34,"endTime":1638.39,"body":"wouldn't just say,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1638.39,"endTime":1641.24,"body":"wonderful, how fantastic,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1641.24,"endTime":1642.68,"body":"three cheers to you,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1642.68,"endTime":1646.28,"body":"they would try and find"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1642.68,"endTime":1646.28,"body":"ways of restoring slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1646.28,"endTime":1648.71,"body":"and that's eventually what Napoleon did"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1648.71,"endTime":1650.72,"body":"in other parts of the Caribbean,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1650.72,"endTime":1652.745,"body":"he reimposed slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1652.745,"endTime":1657.653,"body":"and France only finally"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1652.745,"endTime":1657.653,"body":"abolished slavery in 1848,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1658.79,"endTime":1661.13,"body":"but Louverture wanted to stop the French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1661.13,"endTime":1663.74,"body":"from re-enslaving the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1661.13,"endTime":1663.74,"body":"people of Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1663.74,"endTime":1668.74,"body":"so that's absolutely one"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1663.74,"endTime":1668.74,"body":"of his cardinal objectives."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1668.75,"endTime":1671.24,"body":"So this is a revolution which, I think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1671.24,"endTime":1673.4,"body":"fundamentally establishes,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1673.4,"endTime":1675.11,"body":"in the eyes of the world,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1675.11,"endTime":1678.71,"body":"the legitimacy of the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1675.11,"endTime":1678.71,"body":"fight against slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1678.71,"endTime":1682.61,"body":"it's the first major revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1682.61,"endTime":1684.923,"body":"that brings this to everybody's attention."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1686.3,"endTime":1688.49,"body":"Secondly, it's a revolution about race."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1688.49,"endTime":1689.96,"body":"You can't talk about slavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1689.96,"endTime":1691.52,"body":"without talking about race,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1691.52,"endTime":1695.9,"body":"and of course, slavery is"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1691.52,"endTime":1695.9,"body":"based on a racial hierarchy"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1695.9,"endTime":1698.12,"body":"in which Black people are at the bottom"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1698.12,"endTime":1700.7,"body":"and white people are on top."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1700.7,"endTime":1704.63,"body":"And this is where the originality"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1700.7,"endTime":1704.63,"body":"of Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1704.63,"endTime":1708.14,"body":"and of the Haitian Revolution, comes in."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1708.14,"endTime":1710.12,"body":"Toussaint imagined a way"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1710.12,"endTime":1715.12,"body":"of moving towards a new kind"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1710.12,"endTime":1715.12,"body":"of society after slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1716.871,"endTime":1721.34,"body":"he imagined this through a concept,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1721.34,"endTime":1724.7,"body":"which I think is central"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1721.34,"endTime":1724.7,"body":"to his political ideas,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1724.7,"endTime":1728.24,"body":"which is the concept of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1724.7,"endTime":1728.24,"body":"brotherhood, or fraternity."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1728.24,"endTime":1730.319,"body":"When you read his speeches,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1730.319,"endTime":1733.463,"body":"and I spent a lot of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1730.319,"endTime":1733.463,"body":"time reading his letters,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1734.3,"endTime":1736.673,"body":"this is his squiggly handwriting,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1737.69,"endTime":1739.49,"body":"I spent a lot of time in the archives"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1739.49,"endTime":1742.337,"body":"trying to decipher what he was saying."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1743.277,"endTime":1745.37,"body":"This is an especially nice letter"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1745.37,"endTime":1749.15,"body":"because he wrote it himself."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1749.15,"endTime":1750.68,"body":"He had five secretaries,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1750.68,"endTime":1753.23,"body":"so he spent all his"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1750.68,"endTime":1753.23,"body":"time dictating to them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1753.23,"endTime":1755.18,"body":"so most of the letters that we have"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1755.18,"endTime":1758.0,"body":"are letters that have been"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1755.18,"endTime":1758.0,"body":"written by his secretaries."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1758.0,"endTime":1760.88,"body":"I was very keen to show you this one"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1760.88,"endTime":1765.41,"body":"because this one is a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1760.88,"endTime":1765.41,"body":"letter that he addressed"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1765.41,"endTime":1768.17,"body":"to one of the French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1765.41,"endTime":1768.17,"body":"colonial administrators,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1768.17,"endTime":1769.43,"body":"and he was so cross with him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1769.43,"endTime":1771.56,"body":"that he just wrote the letter himself,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1771.56,"endTime":1775.01,"body":"so I wanted you to see"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1771.56,"endTime":1775.01,"body":"his own handwriting."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1775.01,"endTime":1778.19,"body":"But basically, what he argues for"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1778.19,"endTime":1781.103,"body":"is that after the end of slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1782.24,"endTime":1783.47,"body":"the people of Saint-Domingue"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1783.47,"endTime":1786.14,"body":"should be united in brotherhood,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1786.14,"endTime":1789.26,"body":"and he talks about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1786.14,"endTime":1789.26,"body":"brotherhood in two ways,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1789.26,"endTime":1791.3,"body":"two related ways."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1791.3,"endTime":1793.88,"body":"One way is that he wants"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1791.3,"endTime":1793.88,"body":"all the Black people"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1793.88,"endTime":1794.713,"body":"to forget about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1794.713,"endTime":1798.36,"body":"all the ethnic, religious,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1794.713,"endTime":1798.36,"body":"tribal differences"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1800.84,"endTime":1803.69,"body":"that they were born with in Africa,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1803.69,"endTime":1805.55,"body":"he says, leave all of that behind,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1805.55,"endTime":1807.5,"body":"we are now a new people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1807.5,"endTime":1811.13,"body":"and we need to work together"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1807.5,"endTime":1811.13,"body":"and live together in harmony,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1811.13,"endTime":1812.72,"body":"us Black people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1812.72,"endTime":1817.01,"body":"and Black unity is something"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1812.72,"endTime":1817.01,"body":"that he talks about constantly"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1817.01,"endTime":1819.44,"body":"throughout the 1790s."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1819.44,"endTime":1823.4,"body":"But brotherhood is also something"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1819.44,"endTime":1823.4,"body":"that he intends to apply"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1823.4,"endTime":1825.08,"body":"to all the people of Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1825.08,"endTime":1827.96,"body":"and what is extraordinary"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1825.08,"endTime":1827.96,"body":"about his message"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1827.96,"endTime":1830.57,"body":"is that he says to the white people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1830.57,"endTime":1832.79,"body":"the mixed race people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1830.57,"endTime":1832.79,"body":"and the Black people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1832.79,"endTime":1835.25,"body":"everyone who's living in Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1835.25,"endTime":1837.17,"body":"he says, we are all one people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1837.17,"endTime":1841.49,"body":"and we all are going to build"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1837.17,"endTime":1841.49,"body":"this new colony together."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1841.49,"endTime":1843.44,"body":"And he says to the white settlers,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1843.44,"endTime":1845.6,"body":"I know that you have been slave owners"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1845.6,"endTime":1848.33,"body":"and that you have done"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1845.6,"endTime":1848.33,"body":"terrible things to us,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1848.33,"endTime":1850.07,"body":"but we're prepared to forgive you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1850.07,"endTime":1853.97,"body":"if you're prepared to live"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1850.07,"endTime":1853.97,"body":"with this new principle"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1853.97,"endTime":1858.2,"body":"where all of us enjoy civil"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1853.97,"endTime":1858.2,"body":"and political equality,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1858.2,"endTime":1860.96,"body":"not economic equality,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1860.96,"endTime":1862.67,"body":"that's something that, if I have time,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1862.67,"endTime":1863.87,"body":"I'll come back to,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1863.87,"endTime":1866.9,"body":"Toussaint didn't want to"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1863.87,"endTime":1866.9,"body":"dispossess the white settlers"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1866.9,"endTime":1870.26,"body":"and take away their properties,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1870.26,"endTime":1872.243,"body":"he said, you can enjoy your properties,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1873.32,"endTime":1876.53,"body":"and you can have wage laborers,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1876.53,"endTime":1880.43,"body":"all we ask is that you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1876.53,"endTime":1880.43,"body":"pay them a decent wage."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1880.43,"endTime":1882.71,"body":"So that's the kind of new settlement"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1882.71,"endTime":1884.54,"body":"that he proposes to them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1884.54,"endTime":1889.54,"body":"so this idea of fraternity"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1889.91,"endTime":1893.42,"body":"is something that plays"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1889.91,"endTime":1893.42,"body":"an absolutely central role"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1893.42,"endTime":1897.593,"body":"in his political philosophy."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1901.7,"endTime":1905.543,"body":"Then there is his republicanism,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1906.98,"endTime":1909.263,"body":"I want to say a word about this too."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1910.82,"endTime":1912.77,"body":"I've already sort of implied it in a way,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1912.77,"endTime":1914.933,"body":"but just to dwell on it a little bit,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1916.16,"endTime":1918.47,"body":"in the literature,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1918.47,"endTime":1921.29,"body":"a lot of people have written"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1918.47,"endTime":1921.29,"body":"about Toussaint before me,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1921.29,"endTime":1923.84,"body":"and in fact,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1923.84,"endTime":1927.293,"body":"I've learned a great"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as 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follows","startTime":1943.73,"endTime":1948.29,"body":"The most famous book on"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1943.73,"endTime":1948.29,"body":"the Haitian Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1948.29,"endTime":1949.85,"body":"still to this day,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1949.85,"endTime":1954.053,"body":"was written by a Caribbean"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1949.85,"endTime":1954.053,"body":"historian called C.L.R. James,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1955.04,"endTime":1958.58,"body":"the book is called \"The Black Jacobins,\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1958.58,"endTime":1960.77,"body":"and it's a biography of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1958.58,"endTime":1960.77,"body":"Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1960.77,"endTime":1962.27,"body":"but Toussaint Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1962.27,"endTime":1966.56,"body":"presented as a disciple of the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1962.27,"endTime":1966.56,"body":"French Revolution, basically."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1966.56,"endTime":1968.15,"body":"And I think that's fine,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1968.15,"endTime":1968.983,"body":"Toussaint was someone"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1968.983,"endTime":1971.99,"body":"who genuinely admired"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1968.983,"endTime":1971.99,"body":"the French Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1971.99,"endTime":1974.42,"body":"but that wasn't everything for him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1974.42,"endTime":1979.34,"body":"he was also someone who drew"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1974.42,"endTime":1979.34,"body":"upon the religious, scientific,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1979.34,"endTime":1983.87,"body":"and military traditions of African people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1983.87,"endTime":1986.33,"body":"he drew upon his own Catholicism,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1986.33,"endTime":1989.51,"body":"he drew upon even the spiritual ideas"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1989.51,"endTime":1992.57,"body":"of the original inhabitants"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1989.51,"endTime":1992.57,"body":"of the land of Haiti,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1992.57,"endTime":1995.48,"body":"who were the Native American Taino people."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1995.48,"endTime":1997.04,"body":"Haiti, by the way,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":1997.04,"endTime":2000.103,"body":"is a word that means Land of Mountains,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2001.69,"endTime":2004.93,"body":"that was the way that"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2001.69,"endTime":2004.93,"body":"it was first described"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2004.93,"endTime":2008.62,"body":"by the Native American"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as 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as follows","startTime":2060.04,"endTime":2065.04,"body":"people were carrying with them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2065.35,"endTime":2070.15,"body":"it's what you might call a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2065.35,"endTime":2070.15,"body":"kind of creole republicanism,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2070.15,"endTime":2071.26,"body":"creole in the sense"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2071.26,"endTime":2075.64,"body":"that it's taking different"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2071.26,"endTime":2075.64,"body":"elements and motifs"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2075.64,"endTime":2077.89,"body":"and combining them together."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2077.89,"endTime":2081.61,"body":"And I have a really nice,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as 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follows","startTime":2100.12,"endTime":2104.77,"body":"ah, fantastic, he's"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2100.12,"endTime":2104.77,"body":"taking his name from us"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2104.77,"endTime":2106.99,"body":"so he's recognizing"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2106.99,"endTime":2111.99,"body":"that we are the people who inspire him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2112.45,"endTime":2115.66,"body":"so in the French literature in particular"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2115.66,"endTime":2117.16,"body":"on Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2117.16,"endTime":2120.16,"body":"the choice of this name, Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2120.16,"endTime":2121.72,"body":"is typically seen"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as 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follows","startTime":2138.4,"endTime":2142.78,"body":"different gods, deities,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2142.78,"endTime":2147.247,"body":"and one of them is a"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2142.78,"endTime":2147.247,"body":"deity called Papa Legba,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2147.247,"endTime":2151.09,"body":"and Legba is the guardian of the gates."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2151.09,"endTime":2155.65,"body":"Basically, he's the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2151.09,"endTime":2155.65,"body":"deity that you appeal to"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2155.65,"endTime":2159.76,"body":"when you're trying to take"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2155.65,"endTime":2159.76,"body":"a new turn in your life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2159.76,"endTime":2163.87,"body":"when you're trying to"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2159.76,"endTime":2163.87,"body":"move out of a situation"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2163.87,"endTime":2167.32,"body":"where you think things are"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2163.87,"endTime":2167.32,"body":"not going terribly well,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2167.32,"endTime":2168.49,"body":"and you need help"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2168.49,"endTime":2171.37,"body":"to be able to move into the next phase,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2171.37,"endTime":2174.13,"body":"the next or better phase of your life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2174.13,"endTime":2177.88,"body":"and Legba is the guardian of the gate,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2177.88,"endTime":2180.76,"body":"the gateway to this better life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2180.76,"endTime":2185.76,"body":"so he's the guy who gives you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2180.76,"endTime":2185.76,"body":"the opening to the new life."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2186.16,"endTime":2188.8,"body":"So when Toussaint chooses"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2186.16,"endTime":2188.8,"body":"the word l'ouverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2188.8,"endTime":2190.21,"body":"he's speaking to the French,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2190.21,"endTime":2191.173,"body":"and telling them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2192.55,"endTime":2194.32,"body":"don't worry, I'm one of yours,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2194.32,"endTime":2196.06,"body":"I believe in the Enlightenment"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2196.06,"endTime":2200.32,"body":"and in all the principles"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2196.06,"endTime":2200.32,"body":"that you claim to uphold,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2200.32,"endTime":2204.22,"body":"but he's also speaking to his own people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2204.22,"endTime":2207.07,"body":"the vast majority of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2204.22,"endTime":2207.07,"body":"whom were born in Africa,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2207.07,"endTime":2209.86,"body":"and who celebrate the Vodou religion,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2209.86,"endTime":2210.693,"body":"and he's saying,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2210.693,"endTime":2214.75,"body":"I'm a man who's going to be"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2210.693,"endTime":2214.75,"body":"opening the gates for you too,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2214.75,"endTime":2216.79,"body":"and that's a really good example"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2216.79,"endTime":2221.79,"body":"of how skillful he was"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2216.79,"endTime":2221.79,"body":"as a political leader."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2227.98,"endTime":2229.87,"body":"This is another one"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2229.87,"endTime":2233.083,"body":"of the rather more recent"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2229.87,"endTime":2233.083,"body":"representations of Toussaint."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2235.03,"endTime":2240.03,"body":"I like it because it"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2235.03,"endTime":2240.03,"body":"has this mystical aura."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2242.17,"endTime":2244.06,"body":"Time is running out,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2244.06,"endTime":2245.17,"body":"and I wanted to spend"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2245.17,"endTime":2248.053,"body":"at least three, four"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2245.17,"endTime":2248.053,"body":"minutes before closing,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2250.57,"endTime":2251.53,"body":"as I promised,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2251.53,"endTime":2253.48,"body":"talking about the legacy,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2253.48,"endTime":2255.04,"body":"'cause this is a fantastic story,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2255.04,"endTime":2257.23,"body":"and I could go on and on talking about it,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2257.23,"endTime":2261.22,"body":"but let's leave some time"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2257.23,"endTime":2261.22,"body":"for what happens afterwards."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2261.22,"endTime":2263.06,"body":"So Haiti becomes"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2264.16,"endTime":2269.16,"body":"the first independent,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2264.16,"endTime":2269.16,"body":"postcolonial, Black state,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2269.56,"endTime":2273.107,"body":"and the story of the Haitian"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2269.56,"endTime":2273.107,"body":"Revolution after 1804"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2274.9,"endTime":2277.03,"body":"is a very interesting one,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2277.03,"endTime":2280.39,"body":"and it's a story in which, in many senses,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2280.39,"endTime":2282.25,"body":"the success continues,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2282.25,"endTime":2283.69,"body":"because the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2283.69,"endTime":2288.69,"body":"continues to inspire antislavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2283.69,"endTime":2288.69,"body":"and anticolonial movements"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2289.42,"endTime":2291.13,"body":"across the Atlantic,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2291.13,"endTime":2293.768,"body":"and it inspires, obviously,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2293.768,"endTime":2296.41,"body":"the ongoing fight against slavery."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2296.41,"endTime":2299.77,"body":"And you must know that one has to realize"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2299.77,"endTime":2301.96,"body":"slavery isn't fully abolished"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2301.96,"endTime":2304.18,"body":"in all parts of the Atlantic world"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2304.18,"endTime":2307.12,"body":"until the late 19th century,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2307.12,"endTime":2309.686,"body":"so this is a battle that continues"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2309.686,"endTime":2313.36,"body":"in many parts of the Atlantic World,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2313.36,"endTime":2316.54,"body":"and Louverture is celebrated as a hero"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2316.54,"endTime":2321.54,"body":"by very many people who are"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2316.54,"endTime":2321.54,"body":"continuing this struggle,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2322.09,"endTime":2327.09,"body":"it's a fight for racial"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2322.09,"endTime":2327.09,"body":"justice, for self-determination,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2327.37,"endTime":2329.17,"body":"for popular sovereignty."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2329.17,"endTime":2332.29,"body":"And just to give you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2329.17,"endTime":2332.29,"body":"some specific examples,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2332.29,"endTime":2335.65,"body":"there's this great Latin"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2332.29,"endTime":2335.65,"body":"American revolutionary hero"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2335.65,"endTime":2337.45,"body":"called Simon Bolivar,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2337.45,"endTime":2342.45,"body":"who goes on to liberate Latin"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2337.45,"endTime":2342.45,"body":"America from Spanish rule,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2342.52,"endTime":2346.09,"body":"the Haitians help him at a crucial moment"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2346.09,"endTime":2349.18,"body":"in his struggle against"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2346.09,"endTime":2349.18,"body":"the Latin Americans."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2349.18,"endTime":2351.88,"body":"When you look at the United States,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2351.88,"endTime":2354.31,"body":"perhaps the greatest figure"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2354.31,"endTime":2356.89,"body":"to emerge in the fight against slavery"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2356.89,"endTime":2358.69,"body":"is a man called Frederick Douglass,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2358.69,"endTime":2360.19,"body":"you may have heard of him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2360.19,"endTime":2361.75,"body":"and Frederick Douglass was someone"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2361.75,"endTime":2366.75,"body":"who just went around talking,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2361.75,"endTime":2366.75,"body":"campaigning against slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2366.79,"endTime":2368.77,"body":"and in every lecture that he gave,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2368.77,"endTime":2371.113,"body":"whether it was in America or in Britain,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2372.25,"endTime":2373.65,"body":"he talked about Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2373.65,"endTime":2376.87,"body":"he was absolutely obsessed with him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2376.87,"endTime":2381.46,"body":"and regarded him as a great"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2376.87,"endTime":2381.46,"body":"example of emancipation."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2381.46,"endTime":2382.75,"body":"And these appeals"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2382.75,"endTime":2387.04,"body":"to the ideas of Black"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2382.75,"endTime":2387.04,"body":"dignity and Black equality"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2387.04,"endTime":2389.56,"body":"continued in the 20th century"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2389.56,"endTime":2394.56,"body":"in the various anticolonial"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2389.56,"endTime":2394.56,"body":"struggles of the 20th century."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2394.75,"endTime":2399.75,"body":"You see it both in the formation"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2394.75,"endTime":2399.75,"body":"intellectual movements,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2401.56,"endTime":2403.78,"body":"such as the Negritude Movement,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2403.78,"endTime":2408.78,"body":"or in movements that were"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2403.78,"endTime":2408.78,"body":"fighting to free themselves"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2409.15,"endTime":2411.64,"body":"from imperialism and colonialism."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2411.64,"endTime":2413.74,"body":"For example, Fidel Castro,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2413.74,"endTime":2417.64,"body":"before he comes to"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2413.74,"endTime":2417.64,"body":"power in the late 1950s,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2417.64,"endTime":2420.85,"body":"he's someone who's a great"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2417.64,"endTime":2420.85,"body":"admirer of Toussaint Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2420.85,"endTime":2422.89,"body":"and of the Haitian revolutionaries,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2422.89,"endTime":2424.87,"body":"Ho Chi Minh, in Vietnam,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2424.87,"endTime":2427.48,"body":"talks about the Haitian Revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2427.48,"endTime":2428.71,"body":"so this is a revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2428.71,"endTime":2433.54,"body":"that becomes emblematic, if you like,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2433.54,"endTime":2436.96,"body":"across the 19th and"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2433.54,"endTime":2436.96,"body":"across the 20th centuries."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2436.96,"endTime":2439.45,"body":"And when we look at Toussaint today,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2439.45,"endTime":2441.55,"body":"we see that he's celebrated, of course,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2441.55,"endTime":2442.81,"body":"by the Haitians,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2442.81,"endTime":2446.32,"body":"this is a coin in his honor,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2446.32,"endTime":2447.76,"body":"there's a statue of Toussaint"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2447.76,"endTime":2451.96,"body":"in the province of Allada, in Benin,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2451.96,"endTime":2454.933,"body":"which is where his ancestors came from,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2455.95,"endTime":2458.233,"body":"there's a bust of him in Montreal,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2459.64,"endTime":2460.803,"body":"in La Rochelle, in France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2460.803,"endTime":2465.613,"body":"there's a very striking statue of him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2466.72,"endTime":2471.12,"body":"and, and this perhaps is the most fitting,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2471.12,"endTime":2474.22,"body":"in the Pantheon, in Paris,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2474.22,"endTime":2475.42,"body":"the Pantheon is the place"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2475.42,"endTime":2478.06,"body":"where the French bury"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2475.42,"endTime":2478.06,"body":"their national heroes,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2478.06,"endTime":2482.02,"body":"they bury and celebrate"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2478.06,"endTime":2482.02,"body":"their national heroes,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2482.02,"endTime":2484.09,"body":"Louverture, you will remember,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2484.09,"endTime":2489.09,"body":"was captured, imprisoned,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2484.09,"endTime":2489.09,"body":"and died in France in 1803,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2491.74,"endTime":2494.47,"body":"now, since the late 20th century,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2494.47,"endTime":2497.95,"body":"the French have put up this plaque."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2497.95,"endTime":2499.42,"body":"They don't have his body anymore"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2499.42,"endTime":2503.11,"body":"so they can't re-bury him there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2503.11,"endTime":2505.427,"body":"but at least they've put"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2503.11,"endTime":2505.427,"body":"up this plaque, saying,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2505.427,"endTime":2507.737,"body":"\"To the memory of Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2507.737,"endTime":2512.737,"body":"\"fighter for freedom, artisan"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2507.737,"endTime":2512.737,"body":"of the abolition of slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2513.617,"endTime":2515.147,"body":"\"Haitian hero,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2515.147,"endTime":2518.8,"body":"\"died at the Fort de Joux in 1803.\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2518.8,"endTime":2522.67,"body":"So Toussaint Louverture's spirit lives on,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2522.67,"endTime":2526.993,"body":"and it lives on also in social movements."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2528.13,"endTime":2530.8,"body":"We noticed that, for example,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2530.8,"endTime":2534.22,"body":"in the most recent Black"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2530.8,"endTime":2534.22,"body":"Lives Matter mobilization,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2534.22,"endTime":2538.12,"body":"people were mentioning"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2534.22,"endTime":2538.12,"body":"Toussaint Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2538.12,"endTime":2539.65,"body":"colleagues of mine told me,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2539.65,"endTime":2541.78,"body":"particularly in America,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2541.78,"endTime":2544.96,"body":"Louverture or Haitian flags appeared."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2544.96,"endTime":2549.7,"body":"And I'll end with a quote from Louverture,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2549.7,"endTime":2551.23,"body":"which I think is a quote"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2551.23,"endTime":2554.95,"body":"that both captures his own philosophy"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2554.95,"endTime":2559.95,"body":"and also the reason why"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2554.95,"endTime":2559.95,"body":"he continues to matter,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2560.56,"endTime":2562.72,"body":"and this was something that he said"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2562.72,"endTime":2566.5,"body":"when he was captured in 1802,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2566.5,"endTime":2568.51,"body":"and he's about to be taken away,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2568.51,"endTime":2573.017,"body":"he tells the people who've captured him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2573.017,"endTime":2574.427,"body":"\"By striking me,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2574.427,"endTime":2577.007,"body":"\"you have cut the tree of Black liberty,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2577.007,"endTime":2580.277,"body":"\"but it will spring back from its roots,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2580.277,"endTime":2582.97,"body":"\"for they are many and deep.\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2582.97,"endTime":2584.65,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2584.65,"endTime":2587.65,"body":"(audience applauds)"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2590.508,"endTime":2595.175,"body":"- I think I'm going to start"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2590.508,"endTime":2595.175,"body":"with the villain of the piece,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2597.036,"endTime":2597.869,"body":"and the question is,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2597.869,"endTime":2602.447,"body":"\"There are various stories"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2597.869,"endTime":2602.447,"body":"about his capture by Bonaparte."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2602.447,"endTime":2605.537,"body":"\"Some say he was duped"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2602.447,"endTime":2605.537,"body":"into going to France"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2605.537,"endTime":2606.947,"body":"\"and was captured there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2606.947,"endTime":2608.98,"body":"\"is this correct?\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2608.98,"endTime":2610.54,"body":"- Yes."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2610.54,"endTime":2614.863,"body":"Basically, what happens is that"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2610.54,"endTime":2614.863,"body":"there's a military stalemate"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2616.93,"endTime":2619.63,"body":"after a few months, after the French land,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2619.63,"endTime":2622.72,"body":"and Toussaint negotiates a ceasefire,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2622.72,"endTime":2625.99,"body":"and basically, he had realized"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2625.99,"endTime":2628.12,"body":"that the best way of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2625.99,"endTime":2628.12,"body":"getting rid of the French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2628.12,"endTime":2633.1,"body":"would just be to let local"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2628.12,"endTime":2633.1,"body":"conditions take care of them,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2633.1,"endTime":2638.1,"body":"and they would probably"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2633.1,"endTime":2638.1,"body":"be defeated over time"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2640.03,"endTime":2645.03,"body":"by disease, and just the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2640.03,"endTime":2645.03,"body":"attrition of that kind."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2647.5,"endTime":2650.71,"body":"However, Bonaparte had"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2647.5,"endTime":2650.71,"body":"given express orders"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2650.71,"endTime":2654.55,"body":"that Toussaint should be captured"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2654.55,"endTime":2656.53,"body":"and brought back to France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2656.53,"endTime":2658.933,"body":"and so they set a trap for him."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2660.49,"endTime":2662.2,"body":"Perhaps the only time in his life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2662.2,"endTime":2664.05,"body":"because he was normally very careful,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2665.615,"endTime":2667.66,"body":"but he went to this meeting"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2667.66,"endTime":2671.26,"body":"with just one or two people with him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2671.26,"endTime":2674.17,"body":"instead of taking a military detachment,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2674.17,"endTime":2676.18,"body":"and so the French captured him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2676.18,"endTime":2679.48,"body":"and immediately put him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2676.18,"endTime":2679.48,"body":"on a boat with his family"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2679.48,"endTime":2681.61,"body":"and took him to France."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2681.61,"endTime":2682.72,"body":"- It's slightly surprising,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2682.72,"endTime":2686.11,"body":"that lapse in his judgment,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2686.11,"endTime":2688.961,"body":"when he's been so"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2686.11,"endTime":2688.961,"body":"assiduous all those years,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2688.961,"endTime":2690.628,"body":"and being strategic,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2691.6,"endTime":2693.76,"body":"and one step ahead of the enemy."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2693.76,"endTime":2694.933,"body":"- Yes, yes."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2697.03,"endTime":2700.48,"body":"Again, there's various thoughts there."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2700.48,"endTime":2703.9,"body":"One was that he had perhaps"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2700.48,"endTime":2703.9,"body":"become a little overconfident,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2703.9,"endTime":2706.453,"body":"and thought the French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2703.9,"endTime":2706.453,"body":"were on the back-foot."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2709.57,"endTime":2710.74,"body":"Even more farfetched,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2710.74,"endTime":2711.76,"body":"I mean, I don't buy this,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2711.76,"endTime":2714.1,"body":"but there are people who think this,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2714.1,"endTime":2717.94,"body":"some people thought he"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2714.1,"endTime":2717.94,"body":"almost sacrificed himself,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2717.94,"endTime":2721.75,"body":"that he felt that he had done"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2717.94,"endTime":2721.75,"body":"everything that he could,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2721.75,"endTime":2725.187,"body":"and that his lieutenants"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2721.75,"endTime":2725.187,"body":"would pick up the fight"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2725.187,"endTime":2728.44,"body":"and carry it to its conclusion."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2728.44,"endTime":2730.21,"body":"I don't think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2730.21,"endTime":2731.56,"body":"he wasn't that sort,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2731.56,"endTime":2733.42,"body":"he was someone who basically thought"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2733.42,"endTime":2737.803,"body":"he was the best person to do the job."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2739.78,"endTime":2743.623,"body":"Even very clever people make"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2739.78,"endTime":2743.623,"body":"mistakes sometimes, alas."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2744.97,"endTime":2748.757,"body":"- One from Elizabeth, she says,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2748.757,"endTime":2751.907,"body":"\"Louverture seems to show"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2748.757,"endTime":2751.907,"body":"a very well educated mind,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2751.907,"endTime":2753.937,"body":"\"but how did he get that education?\""},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2755.74,"endTime":2757.3,"body":"- That's a very interesting question."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2757.3,"endTime":2761.62,"body":"We don't absolutely"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2757.3,"endTime":2761.62,"body":"know for sure, because,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2761.62,"endTime":2766.21,"body":"to give you a sense of the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2761.62,"endTime":2766.21,"body":"disparity in the documentation,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2766.21,"endTime":2768.91,"body":"we have hundreds, thousands of documents"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2768.91,"endTime":2771.85,"body":"about Toussaint after 1791,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2771.85,"endTime":2776.41,"body":"but for the whole 50"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2771.85,"endTime":2776.41,"body":"year period before 1791,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2776.41,"endTime":2777.243,"body":"we have, I think,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2777.243,"endTime":2778.783,"body":"a total of three documents,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2779.74,"endTime":2780.613,"body":"so we don't know,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2781.75,"endTime":2785.98,"body":"but we think that he was"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2781.75,"endTime":2785.98,"body":"educated partly by the Jesuits,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2785.98,"endTime":2789.733,"body":"the Jesuits were there around"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2785.98,"endTime":2789.733,"body":"the north of the colony,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2790.6,"endTime":2792.49,"body":"and they probably taught him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2792.49,"endTime":2796.843,"body":"the rudiments of reading and writing,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2797.71,"endTime":2799.57,"body":"he had a stepfather,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2799.57,"endTime":2801.973,"body":"who we know taught him some mathematics,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2803.11,"endTime":2807.733,"body":"but I think most of his education,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2808.57,"endTime":2811.333,"body":"not uncharacteristically for the period,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2812.43,"endTime":2814.843,"body":"he educated himself,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2816.035,"endTime":2821.035,"body":"and a lot of that happened"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2816.035,"endTime":2821.035,"body":"in the early 1790s."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2822.73,"endTime":2826.649,"body":"The other interesting thing"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2822.73,"endTime":2826.649,"body":"just to throw in here is that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2826.649,"endTime":2829.57,"body":"you may have noticed that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2829.57,"endTime":2831.55,"body":"for the first 50 years of his life,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2831.55,"endTime":2834.22,"body":"I didn't say anything about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2831.55,"endTime":2834.22,"body":"his military training,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2834.22,"endTime":2835.17,"body":"he didn't have any,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2836.021,"endTime":2841.021,"body":"and slaves weren't allowed to own weapons,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2841.72,"endTime":2844.8,"body":"it was a very dangerous thing if they did,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2844.8,"endTime":2846.61,"body":"so before 1791,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2846.61,"endTime":2848.68,"body":"he had zero military training,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2848.68,"endTime":2851.95,"body":"yet he rose to become a general"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2851.95,"endTime":2854.05,"body":"in the French Republican Army,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2854.05,"endTime":2858.4,"body":"and he beat the British, the Spaniards,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2858.4,"endTime":2862.0,"body":"and laid the ground for"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2858.4,"endTime":2862.0,"body":"the defeat of the French,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2862.0,"endTime":2863.5,"body":"someone with zero training,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2863.5,"endTime":2866.41,"body":"all of that, self learning."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2866.41,"endTime":2869.77,"body":"- [Questioner] I was interested"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2866.41,"endTime":2869.77,"body":"in why this revolution,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2869.77,"endTime":2873.91,"body":"why the revolutions in enslaved"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2869.77,"endTime":2873.91,"body":"territories were so rare?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2873.91,"endTime":2875.08,"body":"You spoke to that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2875.08,"endTime":2880.08,"body":"about how the numbers were on their side,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2880.27,"endTime":2882.97,"body":"but that must have surely been common,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2882.97,"endTime":2884.62,"body":"that, in most slave territories,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2884.62,"endTime":2887.8,"body":"there were far more slaves"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2884.62,"endTime":2887.8,"body":"than there were settlers."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2887.8,"endTime":2891.94,"body":"So maybe you can say a little bit more"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2891.94,"endTime":2896.94,"body":"about why slave revolutions"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2891.94,"endTime":2896.94,"body":"didn't tend to be successful?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2898.3,"endTime":2899.66,"body":"- Thank you."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2899.66,"endTime":2901.69,"body":"I went fairly quickly."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2901.69,"endTime":2904.143,"body":"Numbers, I think, is one of the factors."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2904.143,"endTime":2905.14,"body":"In Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2905.14,"endTime":2908.863,"body":"the disparity was perhaps"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2905.14,"endTime":2908.863,"body":"greatest than anywhere else,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2912.04,"endTime":2915.04,"body":"it's just that Saint-Domingue"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2912.04,"endTime":2915.04,"body":"had become so profitable"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2915.04,"endTime":2917.17,"body":"by the late 18th century"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2917.17,"endTime":2920.32,"body":"that the French just"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2917.17,"endTime":2920.32,"body":"brought in masses of slaves,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2920.32,"endTime":2924.76,"body":"so they basically prepared"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2920.32,"endTime":2924.76,"body":"the ground for the revolution."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2924.76,"endTime":2927.52,"body":"In no other slave society"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2927.52,"endTime":2929.41,"body":"was there such a big disparity"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2929.41,"endTime":2933.303,"body":"between the settlers and the slaves."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2936.16,"endTime":2937.69,"body":"But I think it's also to do with"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2937.69,"endTime":2939.82,"body":"those other factors that I talked about,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2939.82,"endTime":2942.763,"body":"leadership, military training,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2943.81,"endTime":2946.96,"body":"and also, the one other"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2943.81,"endTime":2946.96,"body":"factor that I didn't mention"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2946.96,"endTime":2949.48,"body":"is that the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2949.48,"endTime":2952.09,"body":"is not the starting point"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2952.09,"endTime":2956.383,"body":"of the resistance by the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2952.09,"endTime":2956.383,"body":"slaves of Saint-Domingue."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2956.383,"endTime":2958.93,"body":"From the mid 1740s,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2958.93,"endTime":2963.07,"body":"you have several instances"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2958.93,"endTime":2963.07,"body":"of them revolting,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2963.07,"endTime":2965.35,"body":"and so this is, in a sense,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2965.35,"endTime":2970.12,"body":"the culmination of four or"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2965.35,"endTime":2970.12,"body":"five decades of resistance"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2970.12,"endTime":2972.46,"body":"by the slaves in Saint-Domingue,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2972.46,"endTime":2975.34,"body":"and that, I think, is also very relevant."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2975.34,"endTime":2979.18,"body":"They tried out various"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2975.34,"endTime":2979.18,"body":"other forms of insurrection,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2979.18,"endTime":2982.393,"body":"and 1791 is the sort of culmination of it."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2983.62,"endTime":2984.453,"body":"- [Questioner] I wanted to know"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2984.453,"endTime":2986.733,"body":"what you felt about Toussaint"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2988.274,"endTime":2989.193,"body":"from a personal aspect,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2989.193,"endTime":2991.78,"body":"because you talk quite"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2989.193,"endTime":2991.78,"body":"passionately about him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2991.78,"endTime":2992.613,"body":"and his lifestyle,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2992.613,"endTime":2994.12,"body":"but on a personal level,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2994.12,"endTime":2998.23,"body":"how do you feel about him as a person,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2998.23,"endTime":2999.063,"body":"if that makes sense?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":2999.063,"endTime":3000.993,"body":"- What do I feel personally about him?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3004.26,"endTime":3007.74,"body":"Having spent basically"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3004.26,"endTime":3007.74,"body":"three years researching him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3007.74,"endTime":3012.74,"body":"and trying to get to know"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3007.74,"endTime":3012.74,"body":"him as closely as I could,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3013.8,"endTime":3015.84,"body":"I feel, firstly, I suppose,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3015.84,"endTime":3019.32,"body":"admiration for all the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3015.84,"endTime":3019.32,"body":"things that he achieved,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3019.32,"endTime":3020.943,"body":"and if you compare him,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3021.81,"endTime":3024.81,"body":"there are many big revolutionary leaders"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3024.81,"endTime":3027.278,"body":"who are emerging at this time,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3027.278,"endTime":3029.22,"body":"this is a period"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3029.22,"endTime":3031.86,"body":"that is sometimes called"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3029.22,"endTime":3031.86,"body":"the Age of Revolutions,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3031.86,"endTime":3033.27,"body":"you have revolutions in France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3033.27,"endTime":3037.77,"body":"in America, in Latin America,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3037.77,"endTime":3040.23,"body":"Toussaint didn't have"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3037.77,"endTime":3040.23,"body":"any of the advantages"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3040.23,"endTime":3042.9,"body":"that even these great"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3040.23,"endTime":3042.9,"body":"revolutionary leaders"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3042.9,"endTime":3044.25,"body":"in other places had,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3044.25,"endTime":3049.11,"body":"that's why I think he and"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3044.25,"endTime":3049.11,"body":"Haitian people are so special."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3049.11,"endTime":3051.46,"body":"This is someone who isn't born"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3052.44,"endTime":3057.44,"body":"with any of these either material"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3052.44,"endTime":3057.44,"body":"or educational advantages,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3057.57,"endTime":3061.95,"body":"so I think that makes him"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3057.57,"endTime":3061.95,"body":"somebody quite remarkable,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3061.95,"endTime":3065.88,"body":"and that's the main"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3061.95,"endTime":3065.88,"body":"feeling I have about him."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3065.88,"endTime":3067.98,"body":"I do sometimes find him frustrating"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3067.98,"endTime":3069.15,"body":"because one of the things"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3069.15,"endTime":3072.15,"body":"that he does try and do, systematically,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3072.15,"endTime":3076.533,"body":"is to be obscure,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3077.43,"endTime":3078.69,"body":"he tries to stop you"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3078.69,"endTime":3083.07,"body":"from actually finding out"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3078.69,"endTime":3083.07,"body":"exactly what he's thinking,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3083.07,"endTime":3084.51,"body":"and he's very good at that,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3084.51,"endTime":3089.51,"body":"so sometimes, I feel"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3084.51,"endTime":3089.51,"body":"I don't know for sure."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3090.0,"endTime":3093.0,"body":"Did he want Saint-Domingue to"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3090.0,"endTime":3093.0,"body":"be independent, for example?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3093.0,"endTime":3096.33,"body":"That's a question that historians,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3096.33,"endTime":3098.16,"body":"and indeed the people in Haiti,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3098.16,"endTime":3101.79,"body":"are still arguing passionately"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3098.16,"endTime":3101.79,"body":"about to this day,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3101.79,"endTime":3103.2,"body":"we don't really know,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3103.2,"endTime":3104.4,"body":"because he never wrote down"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3104.4,"endTime":3106.323,"body":"what he really thought about that."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3107.25,"endTime":3108.66,"body":"His basic line was,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3108.66,"endTime":3110.37,"body":"no, no, no, I don't want independence,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3110.37,"endTime":3112.38,"body":"I just want us to remain French"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3112.38,"endTime":3117.38,"body":"and continue to benefit from"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3112.38,"endTime":3117.38,"body":"this association with France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3117.72,"endTime":3121.74,"body":"but maybe he did think, in the long run,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3121.74,"endTime":3123.57,"body":"Saint-Domingue would become independent,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3123.57,"endTime":3125.073,"body":"but he never actually said it."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3126.99,"endTime":3127.92,"body":"- [Questioner] Thank you."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3127.92,"endTime":3130.86,"body":"I'll finish with a teacher"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3127.92,"endTime":3130.86,"body":"question from Mulberry School,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3130.86,"endTime":3131.693,"body":"just down the road,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3131.693,"endTime":3133.977,"body":"thank you very much for having us."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3133.977,"endTime":3138.977,"body":"I'm interested in why there's"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3133.977,"endTime":3138.977,"body":"been an upsurge in interest"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3139.08,"endTime":3141.15,"body":"in Toussaint Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3141.15,"endTime":3143.07,"body":"over the last few years,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3143.07,"endTime":3147.0,"body":"and also how he's constructed"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3147.0,"endTime":3150.57,"body":"in Western historiography in particular."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3150.57,"endTime":3152.79,"body":"Is he a sort of comfortable leader,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3152.79,"endTime":3156.33,"body":"i.e. the Martin Luther King of the story,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3156.33,"endTime":3158.16,"body":"and are there other stories"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3158.16,"endTime":3159.36,"body":"that we're not so familiar with"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3159.36,"endTime":3161.51,"body":"because they're perhaps"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3159.36,"endTime":3161.51,"body":"not as comfortable?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3162.39,"endTime":3164.613,"body":"- Thank you, that's a great question."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3165.93,"endTime":3167.193,"body":"For a long time,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3168.87,"endTime":3170.13,"body":"people just didn't talk about"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3170.13,"endTime":3171.78,"body":"the Haitian Revolution that much,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3171.78,"endTime":3176.43,"body":"it was just regarded as"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3171.78,"endTime":3176.43,"body":"this kind of minor tremor,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3176.43,"endTime":3177.9,"body":"and then the big earthquakes"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3177.9,"endTime":3180.775,"body":"were the French and the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3177.9,"endTime":3180.775,"body":"American revolutions."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3180.775,"endTime":3182.46,"body":"Now, we see that, actually,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3182.46,"endTime":3184.86,"body":"the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3182.46,"endTime":3184.86,"body":"was much more radical"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3184.86,"endTime":3188.218,"body":"than both the French and"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3184.86,"endTime":3188.218,"body":"the American revolutions,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3188.218,"endTime":3192.087,"body":"so I'd say, over the last 15 to 20 years,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3192.087,"endTime":3195.898,"body":"the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3192.087,"endTime":3195.898,"body":"is now taken seriously."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3195.898,"endTime":3196.731,"body":"And of course,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3196.731,"endTime":3198.499,"body":"the main reason it's taken seriously"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3198.499,"endTime":3200.896,"body":"is that it was about slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3200.896,"endTime":3202.507,"body":"and we're now,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3202.507,"endTime":3207.12,"body":"through our reexamination"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3202.507,"endTime":3207.12,"body":"of our own colonial past"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3207.12,"endTime":3209.91,"body":"in countries like Britain and France,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3209.91,"endTime":3212.1,"body":"or in the case of America,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3212.1,"endTime":3216.24,"body":"the history of its own very"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3212.1,"endTime":3216.24,"body":"problematic relationship"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3216.24,"endTime":3217.44,"body":"with slavery,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3217.44,"endTime":3222.44,"body":"we're now looking at these"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3217.44,"endTime":3222.44,"body":"revolutions much more closely,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3222.72,"endTime":3225.24,"body":"and one the things that we're also finding"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3225.24,"endTime":3228.03,"body":"is that the Haitian"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3225.24,"endTime":3228.03,"body":"Revolution had a major impact"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3228.03,"endTime":3230.793,"body":"on American politics too."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3235.68,"endTime":3237.03,"body":"The revolution in general,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3237.03,"endTime":3239.25,"body":"and Toussaint Louverture in particular,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3239.25,"endTime":3241.11,"body":"have benefited, I suppose,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3241.11,"endTime":3246.11,"body":"from this reconnection"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3241.11,"endTime":3246.11,"body":"that we've now made,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3247.35,"endTime":3249.03,"body":"and I think it's a good thing,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3249.03,"endTime":3254.03,"body":"with our own colonial and slave histories."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3254.16,"endTime":3255.27,"body":"And there's another reason"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3255.27,"endTime":3259.8,"body":"why I think Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3255.27,"endTime":3259.8,"body":"and the Haitian Revolution"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3259.8,"endTime":3263.58,"body":"are back in our horizon,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3263.58,"endTime":3266.25,"body":"and that's the issue of reparations."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3266.25,"endTime":3268.23,"body":"One of the very big questions"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3268.23,"endTime":3270.18,"body":"that we're now talking about is,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3270.18,"endTime":3275.18,"body":"do we owe reparations to the"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3270.18,"endTime":3275.18,"body":"people who were enslaved,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3275.46,"endTime":3277.77,"body":"to the countries that were enslaved?"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3277.77,"endTime":3280.53,"body":"And this is a particularly"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3277.77,"endTime":3280.53,"body":"acute question in Haiti"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3280.53,"endTime":3283.59,"body":"because when the French left Haiti,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3283.59,"endTime":3285.574,"body":"they left physically,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3285.574,"endTime":3287.94,"body":"but 15, 20 years later,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3287.94,"endTime":3290.88,"body":"they basically blockaded the island"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3290.88,"endTime":3294.15,"body":"and forced the independent"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3290.88,"endTime":3294.15,"body":"Haitian Government"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3294.15,"endTime":3298.08,"body":"to basically pay the French settlers,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3298.08,"endTime":3300.183,"body":"who had left the colony by then,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3302.04,"endTime":3305.97,"body":"to compensate them for"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3302.04,"endTime":3305.97,"body":"the loss of their slaves."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3305.97,"endTime":3309.06,"body":"And that debt has been estimated,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3309.06,"endTime":3311.22,"body":"by a leading French economist,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3311.22,"endTime":3316.22,"body":"to amount to 30 billion"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3311.22,"endTime":3316.22,"body":"euros in today's money."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3316.26,"endTime":3320.699,"body":"It took the Haitians 150 years, basically,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3320.699,"endTime":3325.38,"body":"to pay this debt."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3325.38,"endTime":3327.03,"body":"If you calculate the interest,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3327.03,"endTime":3327.863,"body":"it's even more."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3332.01,"endTime":3335.91,"body":"I don't have any problem"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3332.01,"endTime":3335.91,"body":"calling this a crime,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3335.91,"endTime":3338.55,"body":"this was a crime against"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3335.91,"endTime":3338.55,"body":"the Haitian people,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3338.55,"endTime":3341.37,"body":"and the French should pay."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3341.37,"endTime":3342.203,"body":"They don't want to,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3342.203,"endTime":3343.705,"body":"they don't even want to acknowledge"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3343.705,"endTime":3345.84,"body":"that this is a debt"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3343.705,"endTime":3345.84,"body":"that they should honor."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3345.84,"endTime":3347.82,"body":"So these are the kinds of conversations"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3347.82,"endTime":3349.89,"body":"that we're now having,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3349.89,"endTime":3351.995,"body":"and Haiti and Louverture"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3351.995,"endTime":3356.76,"body":"are very important not just"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3351.995,"endTime":3356.76,"body":"for historical reasons,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3356.76,"endTime":3359.19,"body":"but because the impact of"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3356.76,"endTime":3359.19,"body":"the things that were done"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3359.19,"endTime":3362.31,"body":"in the 18th and 19th centuries"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3362.31,"endTime":3363.99,"body":"are still continuing to be felt"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3363.99,"endTime":3368.99,"body":"by peoples all over these"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3363.99,"endTime":3368.99,"body":"formerly enslaved societies today."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3371.07,"endTime":3372.78,"body":"- Thank you so much, Sudhir,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3372.78,"endTime":3374.94,"body":"I'm afraid we are going"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3372.78,"endTime":3374.94,"body":"to have to stop there,"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3374.94,"endTime":3377.589,"body":"that was absolutely fascinating."},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3377.589,"endTime":3379.244,"body":"(audience applauds)"},{"speaker":"and he describes him as follows","startTime":3379.244,"endTime":3380.244,"body":"- Thank you."}]}