{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":5.275,"endTime":10.966,"body":"This talk will be filled with very disturbing and unpleasant imagery of very disturbing and"},{"startTime":10.966,"endTime":11.725,"body":"unpleasant things."},{"startTime":12.025,"endTime":15.822,"body":"And it will also contain a lot of extraordinarily strong foul language because that is"},{"startTime":15.822,"endTime":16.076,"body":"the language we have developed in the way we have developed language to express our"},{"startTime":16.076,"endTime":16.329,"body":"horror at the disgusting and foul things that I have to deal with on a"},{"startTime":16.329,"endTime":23.925,"body":"daily basis."},{"startTime":24.665,"endTime":28.337,"body":"If you are likely to find all of that offensive and you don't want to"},{"startTime":28.337,"endTime":28.582,"body":"be offended, which is something we'll be getting onto later, um, I strongly recommend you"},{"startTime":28.582,"endTime":33.725,"body":"either turn off or, or you leave."},{"startTime":33.725,"endTime":36.725,"body":"But you can't ask your money back because no money has so far changed hands."},{"startTime":36.785,"endTime":38.605,"body":"And as far as I know, it never will."},{"startTime":39.185,"endTime":45.045,"body":"But another way in which I have purposefully and deliberately chosen to lower the tone"},{"startTime":45.045,"endTime":50.125,"body":"is I have provided no transcript of this talk because it doesn't exist."},{"startTime":50.785,"endTime":53.005,"body":"Uh, it's not just because I'm too lazy to write it down."},{"startTime":53.035,"endTime":54.525,"body":"It's because I'm actually too busy."},{"startTime":55.265,"endTime":61.853,"body":"And also because I am a visual satirist and I am a great believer in"},{"startTime":61.853,"endTime":66.685,"body":"us as a species recognizing exactly what we are good at."},{"startTime":68.375,"endTime":72.739,"body":"The Gresham College lecture that you're listening to right now is giving you knowledge and"},{"startTime":72.739,"endTime":73.03,"body":"insight from one of the world's leading academic experts, making it takes a lot of"},{"startTime":73.03,"endTime":77.395,"body":"time."},{"startTime":77.895,"endTime":81.101,"body":"But because we want to encourage a love of learning, we think it's well worth"},{"startTime":81.101,"endTime":81.315,"body":"it."},{"startTime":82.255,"endTime":85.435,"body":"We never make you pay for lectures, although donations are needed."},{"startTime":85.935,"endTime":87.275,"body":"All we ask in return is this."},{"startTime":87.825,"endTime":89.995,"body":"Send a link to this lecture to someone you think would benefit."},{"startTime":90.295,"endTime":94.378,"body":"And if you haven't already, click the follow or subscribe button from wherever you are"},{"startTime":94.378,"endTime":95.195,"body":"listening right now."},{"startTime":96.255,"endTime":97.835,"body":"Now, let's get back to the lecture,"},{"startTime":100.325,"endTime":106.9,"body":"Because we have been drawing, making marks more or less for as long as we"},{"startTime":106.9,"endTime":108.215,"body":"have been speaking."},{"startTime":109.165,"endTime":110.215,"body":"It's one of the things we do."},{"startTime":110.555,"endTime":114.255,"body":"We are extraordinary amongst animals as well as being terrible amongst animals."},{"startTime":114.755,"endTime":120.317,"body":"And we are probably unique in the fact that we observe the world around us"},{"startTime":120.317,"endTime":123.655,"body":"continuously in constantly pouring through our organs of perception."},{"startTime":123.655,"endTime":125.255,"body":"We have no way of controlling this and this."},{"startTime":125.255,"endTime":131.046,"body":"We stop up our ears and we then hear the sounds in our heads, and"},{"startTime":131.046,"endTime":134.135,"body":"we control the world by re narrativizing it."},{"startTime":134.235,"endTime":135.095,"body":"That's what we do."},{"startTime":135.675,"endTime":137.975,"body":"We recreate it in safe mode, if you like."},{"startTime":138.155,"endTime":140.335,"body":"We tell stories, we do pictures."},{"startTime":141.635,"endTime":146.752,"body":"One of the things we didn't do until very, very recently was write them down,"},{"startTime":146.752,"endTime":147.093,"body":"because writing was only invented following the creation of the first states about five and"},{"startTime":147.093,"endTime":153.575,"body":"a half thousand years ago."},{"startTime":154.235,"endTime":157.775,"body":"Uh, and the purpose of writing is as a subset of accountancy."},{"startTime":158.675,"endTime":162.618,"body":"The point of writing is to make a list of the harvest and who has"},{"startTime":162.618,"endTime":162.881,"body":"paid their taxes on the harvest and who has not paid their taxes on the"},{"startTime":162.881,"endTime":169.455,"body":"harvest, and must therefore be executed by the tyrant in charge."},{"startTime":169.715,"endTime":174.735,"body":"So writing is about theft and murder, whereas drawing is about being human."},{"startTime":175.965,"endTime":176.975,"body":"It's what we do."},{"startTime":177.835,"endTime":182.485,"body":"We are, as I said, an extraordinary, varied, amazing and terrifying species of animals."},{"startTime":183.105,"endTime":185.365,"body":"And, uh, you know, we are very good at certain things."},{"startTime":185.365,"endTime":186.125,"body":"We're good at jumping."},{"startTime":186.255,"endTime":187.365,"body":"We're good at drawing."},{"startTime":187.375,"endTime":188.205,"body":"We're good at jokes."},{"startTime":188.425,"endTime":189.525,"body":"We are really good at jokes."},{"startTime":189.975,"endTime":191.125,"body":"We're good at genocide."},{"startTime":192.105,"endTime":196.805,"body":"Um, but as I said, we've been drawing for a very, very long time."},{"startTime":197.545,"endTime":201.725,"body":"So this is a drawing from the Chauvet Cave System in southern France."},{"startTime":201.785,"endTime":205.765,"body":"It was the subject of the film, uh, cave of Forgotten Dreams by Vanna Hertzog."},{"startTime":206.425,"endTime":210.371,"body":"Um, and this was drawn almost certainly by women because they left their hand prints"},{"startTime":210.371,"endTime":210.635,"body":"close by, and the width of their spans of their hands suggest that they're drawn"},{"startTime":210.635,"endTime":214.845,"body":"by women."},{"startTime":215.665,"endTime":219.285,"body":"Um, 35,000 years ago."},{"startTime":219.705,"endTime":227.358,"body":"35, that's, that's 30,000 years before we organized ourselves in states and we started living"},{"startTime":227.358,"endTime":227.869,"body":"under hierarchies, and we started having to bend to the will of priests and princes"},{"startTime":227.869,"endTime":239.605,"body":"and politicians and prefects of police and other pricks."},{"startTime":239.605,"endTime":241.405,"body":"His job description begins with a p \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":242.185,"endTime":245.845,"body":"Um, but it's by no means the oldest known drawing."},{"startTime":246.035,"endTime":252.442,"body":"Currently the oldest known drawing is this, uh, which is, uh, um, a, it, it's"},{"startTime":252.442,"endTime":255.005,"body":"a pig Deer isn't that nice?"},{"startTime":255.005,"endTime":258.165,"body":"It's a pig deer on the wall of a cave in Indonesia."},{"startTime":258.235,"endTime":259.685,"body":"It's 45,000 years old."},{"startTime":260.225,"endTime":264.965,"body":"Uh, that's 40,000 years before we set, started living in society's run as hierarchies."},{"startTime":265.705,"endTime":273.055,"body":"Um, and that's by no means the oldest hominid drawing because this is a drawing"},{"startTime":273.055,"endTime":276.485,"body":"by a Neanderthal done 113,000 years ago."},{"startTime":277.225,"endTime":280.95,"body":"And we can sort of tell there's something that looks a bit like some kind"},{"startTime":280.95,"endTime":281.199,"body":"of vid or ox there, but what the hell any of the rest of it"},{"startTime":281.199,"endTime":284.925,"body":"means."},{"startTime":285.025,"endTime":287.205,"body":"We will never know because we are not neandertals."},{"startTime":288.235,"endTime":291.241,"body":"Some of us have some neandertal blood and probably makes us nicer than we would"},{"startTime":291.241,"endTime":293.245,"body":"be otherwise, but we just don't know what it means."},{"startTime":294.425,"endTime":300.561,"body":"Anyway, as I said, the point about all of this is that it's how we"},{"startTime":300.561,"endTime":300.97,"body":"wrangle our way through reality and navigate our way through our lives without going insane"},{"startTime":300.97,"endTime":307.925,"body":"with existentialist dread."},{"startTime":307.955,"endTime":312.525,"body":"Because we can control it by recreating it and re narrativizing it."},{"startTime":313.745,"endTime":320.37,"body":"And in that process, as that information pause through our organs of perception, it passes"},{"startTime":320.37,"endTime":320.812,"body":"through that infinitely vast space inside our heads where we romp in our dreams when"},{"startTime":320.812,"endTime":329.205,"body":"we go mad every night."},{"startTime":330.585,"endTime":337.19,"body":"And so we exaggerate things, and this again from the show case system, the woman"},{"startTime":337.19,"endTime":337.63,"body":"who drew this 35,000 years ago got to the very heart of what Renar is"},{"startTime":337.63,"endTime":338.07,"body":"about because she, in seeing one of these rhinoceros who then wandered around the plains"},{"startTime":338.07,"endTime":356.565,"body":"of southern France 35,000 years ago, recognized the most important thing about a rhinoceros."},{"startTime":356.595,"endTime":359.605,"body":"It's in the name in the Greek nose horn."},{"startTime":360.425,"endTime":362.005,"body":"And so she drew this rhinoceros."},{"startTime":362.005,"endTime":367.641,"body":"But what she did, although she created a visual parable in the exaggeration, she drew"},{"startTime":367.641,"endTime":368.017,"body":"an animal which could not actually ever really exist because the nose horn is so"},{"startTime":368.017,"endTime":376.285,"body":"big, it would fall flat on its face."},{"startTime":376.955,"endTime":380.725,"body":"Nonetheless, it gets to that deep truth about the nature of ouris."},{"startTime":380.725,"endTime":384.085,"body":"It's the hall and its bloody nose, just like a parable."},{"startTime":384.085,"endTime":386.285,"body":"It gets to a deeper truth through exaggeration."},{"startTime":386.465,"endTime":394.045,"body":"And this next image, which I find is quite extraordinary, is a drawing 35,000 years"},{"startTime":394.045,"endTime":399.605,"body":"ago, replicating movement, drawn in a cave in almost pitch darkness."},{"startTime":399.605,"endTime":403.569,"body":"We have no idea whether they were drawing these animals to identify them, to appreciate"},{"startTime":403.569,"endTime":407.005,"body":"them or just for the sheer joy of it, or to control them."},{"startTime":407.185,"endTime":407.645,"body":"Who knows?"},{"startTime":407.905,"endTime":408.365,"body":"Who knows?"},{"startTime":408.365,"endTime":414.875,"body":"But as I said, as all that information ceaselessly pours through our organs of perception,"},{"startTime":414.875,"endTime":417.045,"body":"it picks up on madness."},{"startTime":417.785,"endTime":423.463,"body":"All that mad teretic shit we have inside our heads, which is why we have"},{"startTime":423.463,"endTime":423.842,"body":"skulls to keep it inside, except when they invented the internet \u003claugh\u003e and we had"},{"startTime":423.842,"endTime":424.221,"body":"a collective id we could pour all this into it picks up mad things and"},{"startTime":424.221,"endTime":439.365,"body":"we started drawing things which have never existed except in our heads."},{"startTime":439.785,"endTime":441.205,"body":"And these are fear Andros."},{"startTime":441.655,"endTime":446.165,"body":"These are creatures drawn on a cave wall in Australia 10,000 years ago."},{"startTime":446.515,"endTime":449.725,"body":"They are human beings with animals heads."},{"startTime":449.955,"endTime":455.889,"body":"They have never existed except in the dreams and then the shared dreams of the"},{"startTime":455.889,"endTime":456.285,"body":"artist."},{"startTime":457.185,"endTime":463.292,"body":"And a few thousand years later, that fact that we could make stuff up in"},{"startTime":463.292,"endTime":463.699,"body":"our heads was so extraordinary to us that the ancient Egyptians actually deified ce the"},{"startTime":463.699,"endTime":464.106,"body":"jackal headed God of the ancient Egyptians, and started a trend which actually then carried"},{"startTime":464.106,"endTime":478.765,"body":"on for thousands of years in Western art."},{"startTime":479.585,"endTime":487.285,"body":"It was the standard practice in the Eastern Orthodox Church always to represent St."},{"startTime":487.285,"endTime":487.685,"body":"Christopher."},{"startTime":487.745,"endTime":492.28,"body":"You know, the guy who carried Christ across the Jordan on his shoulder with a"},{"startTime":492.28,"endTime":492.885,"body":"dog's head."},{"startTime":493.515,"endTime":497.725,"body":"Because at some point somebody had misunderstood the fact that St."},{"startTime":497.725,"endTime":501.245,"body":"Christopher came from Canaan and wasn't a canine."},{"startTime":501.905,"endTime":504.245,"body":"It was genuinely true, genuinely true."},{"startTime":506.305,"endTime":510.765,"body":"And throughout medieval Europe, it was assumed where people were born in villages."},{"startTime":510.765,"endTime":514.405,"body":"They then died in, they never went anywhere except possibly on a crusade."},{"startTime":514.585,"endTime":516.205,"body":"And that was only a tiny proportion of them."},{"startTime":516.825,"endTime":523.795,"body":"The people who lived over the hill, over the hill were all assumed to have"},{"startTime":523.795,"endTime":524.725,"body":"dog's heads."},{"startTime":525.835,"endTime":531.143,"body":"It's just what we assumed they were empiricism had yet to rear its ugly head"},{"startTime":531.143,"endTime":532.205,"body":"in Western thought."},{"startTime":532.985,"endTime":538.79,"body":"And of course, a few thousand years later after that, we get Wal Disney with"},{"startTime":538.79,"endTime":539.565,"body":"another doghead."},{"startTime":539.905,"endTime":540.125,"body":"God."},{"startTime":541.025,"endTime":544.085,"body":"Anyway, so that's, that's the art side of my craft."},{"startTime":544.865,"endTime":546.245,"body":"The next bit is the humor bit."},{"startTime":546.245,"endTime":550.482,"body":"And uh, this is a drawing by the great Ronald Soul, who I'm sure many"},{"startTime":550.482,"endTime":550.765,"body":"of you will be familiar with, uh, without question, the greatest British cartoonist of the"},{"startTime":550.765,"endTime":555.285,"body":"20th century."},{"startTime":556.105,"endTime":561.121,"body":"And, uh, about three months before he died in 2011, I, uh, I used to"},{"startTime":561.121,"endTime":562.125,"body":"correspond with him."},{"startTime":562.165,"endTime":562.645,"body":"I never met him."},{"startTime":562.685,"endTime":563.805,"body":"I used to correspond with him occasionally."},{"startTime":563.805,"endTime":568.045,"body":"Anyway, I received a package through the door and I thought I recognized that handwriting."},{"startTime":568.705,"endTime":573.1,"body":"And, uh, it was a box of pens he'd bought in Paris in 1962, which"},{"startTime":573.1,"endTime":575.445,"body":"he'd found at the back of a cupboard."},{"startTime":576.065,"endTime":580.122,"body":"And he, with a little note in his familiar scroll saying, found these in the"},{"startTime":580.122,"endTime":581.205,"body":"back of a cupboard."},{"startTime":581.675,"endTime":583.005,"body":"I've got enough to last me out."},{"startTime":583.625,"endTime":585.165,"body":"Um, hope you enjoy using 'em."},{"startTime":585.165,"endTime":589.637,"body":"Which believe me, for a British cartoonist to be sent pens by Ronald souls like"},{"startTime":589.637,"endTime":591.725,"body":"receiving a high five from God \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":593.145,"endTime":597.604,"body":"Anyway, Sol had a quite extraordinary life, which I hope nobody in this room has"},{"startTime":597.604,"endTime":599.685,"body":"lived, has led a life like his."},{"startTime":600.505,"endTime":602.205,"body":"Uh, he was born in Cambridge in 1920."},{"startTime":602.785,"endTime":607.595,"body":"Um, started doing drawings for Grantor Magazine when he was still at school when he"},{"startTime":607.595,"endTime":612.085,"body":"was 16, um, under the editorship of Eric Hobbs, born the future Marxist historian."},{"startTime":612.985,"endTime":617.853,"body":"And, uh, then he, uh, went to the College of Technology in Cambridge and started"},{"startTime":617.853,"endTime":620.125,"body":"doing cartoons of the Cambridge Evening News."},{"startTime":620.365,"endTime":620.845,"body":"Invented the St."},{"startTime":621.035,"endTime":626.382,"body":"Tris girls in about 19 38, 39, and and then joined the Army and was"},{"startTime":626.382,"endTime":626.738,"body":"posted to Singapore and was taken prisoner when Singapore fell to the Japanese at the"},{"startTime":626.738,"endTime":627.095,"body":"end of 1941, and was then a prisoner of the Japanese for the rest of"},{"startTime":627.095,"endTime":640.285,"body":"the war, uh, experiencing at a very young age."},{"startTime":640.855,"endTime":643.205,"body":"Truly, truly horrific things."},{"startTime":644.085,"endTime":646.125,"body":"I mean, genuinely horrific things."},{"startTime":646.345,"endTime":652.333,"body":"But the point was, he instinctively understood what I said earlier on, that, hey, the"},{"startTime":652.333,"endTime":656.725,"body":"way we wrangle reality, that he had to make a record."},{"startTime":656.945,"endTime":661.539,"body":"He had to recreate what he was seeing in order to control it and to"},{"startTime":661.539,"endTime":662.765,"body":"make sense of it."},{"startTime":663.385,"endTime":667.953,"body":"And somehow or other, he managed to find some paper and pens and he would"},{"startTime":667.953,"endTime":668.258,"body":"do drawings of genuine atrocities of the cruelties wrought out to him and his fellow"},{"startTime":668.258,"endTime":674.045,"body":"prisoners on a daily basis."},{"startTime":675.265,"endTime":678.565,"body":"And he would've been executed on the spot had the Japanese guards discovered this."},{"startTime":678.945,"endTime":683.325,"body":"But what he did, he would hide the drawings underneath the mattresses of his fellow"},{"startTime":683.325,"endTime":683.617,"body":"prisoners who were dying of typhoid or cholera, knowing that was the only place the"},{"startTime":683.617,"endTime":689.165,"body":"Japanese guards would never search."},{"startTime":689.665,"endTime":690.645,"body":"And so they survived."},{"startTime":691.345,"endTime":697.555,"body":"And this is one of them showing Japanese, sorry, showing British and Australian, uh, prisoners"},{"startTime":697.555,"endTime":703.765,"body":"of war being treated like beasts of burden in the construction of the Burma railway."},{"startTime":704.385,"endTime":706.045,"body":"And this is, this is a, this is a war crime."},{"startTime":706.045,"endTime":707.445,"body":"This is against the Geneva Convention."},{"startTime":708.625,"endTime":715.595,"body":"Um, and when he was repatriated in 1945, what sur did next is the really"},{"startTime":715.595,"endTime":716.525,"body":"extraordinary thing."},{"startTime":718.145,"endTime":724.868,"body":"He took that trauma, which he had re narrativized on paper, and he played it"},{"startTime":724.868,"endTime":725.765,"body":"for laughs."},{"startTime":726.945,"endTime":730.805,"body":"He reinvented the Saint Tris, but they were much, much darker than it was before."},{"startTime":731.545,"endTime":733.205,"body":"But he played it for laughs."},{"startTime":733.305,"endTime":736.965,"body":"So here is this image drawn in the Burmese jungle."},{"startTime":737.785,"endTime":742.55,"body":"And four years later, here is this image of the same thing of the Cent"},{"startTime":742.55,"endTime":746.045,"body":"Tris girls pulling a garden roller saying Bloody sports Day \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":747.705,"endTime":751.809,"body":"And this is an image of a, this is a genuine, this is like Goya's"},{"startTime":751.809,"endTime":753.725,"body":"images of war, the horrors of war."},{"startTime":754.395,"endTime":759.951,"body":"This is Japanese soldiers standing around a collection of the heads of Burmese peasants who"},{"startTime":759.951,"endTime":763.285,"body":"have been beheaded for pilfering off the Burma railway."},{"startTime":763.285,"endTime":764.725,"body":"This is evidence of a war crime."},{"startTime":764.725,"endTime":767.165,"body":"This is truly horrific image."},{"startTime":767.385,"endTime":771.763,"body":"The young Ronald drew and hid and kept and was able to show the rest"},{"startTime":771.763,"endTime":772.055,"body":"of the world after the war and after the war, he also drew this cent"},{"startTime":772.055,"endTime":776.725,"body":"Tris cartoon."},{"startTime":777.435,"endTime":779.765,"body":"This is Bertha, our head girl."},{"startTime":780.405,"endTime":782.805,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e, yes."},{"startTime":783.015,"endTime":783.885,"body":"Laugh, laugh."},{"startTime":783.905,"endTime":784.725,"body":"You have to laugh."},{"startTime":785.185,"endTime":786.325,"body":"That's the whole point."},{"startTime":786.355,"endTime":792.845,"body":"That again, is we redeem ourselves through recording it and transcribing it and recreating it."},{"startTime":792.865,"endTime":795.565,"body":"We also redeem ourselves through laughter."},{"startTime":796.665,"endTime":798.085,"body":"We don't laugh at nice things."},{"startTime":798.145,"endTime":799.805,"body":"We laugh at the bad shit."},{"startTime":800.505,"endTime":801.925,"body":"And shit is the operative word here."},{"startTime":802.175,"endTime":805.737,"body":"There is a noise, which I believe will make any child on this planet under"},{"startTime":805.737,"endTime":806.925,"body":"the age of one laugh."},{"startTime":806.985,"endTime":808.005,"body":"And it is this noise."},{"startTime":809.985,"endTime":811.405,"body":"And that is the, they laugh at that noise."},{"startTime":811.565,"endTime":814.165,"body":"'cause that's the noise the shit makes as it pours out of our bodies on"},{"startTime":814.165,"endTime":814.685,"body":"a daily basis."},{"startTime":814.745,"endTime":820.1,"body":"And if you think about it for a single second, that happening to all of"},{"startTime":820.1,"endTime":820.457,"body":"us, if we're lucky on a daily or more than daily basis, should drive you"},{"startTime":820.457,"endTime":826.885,"body":"insane with existentialist horror."},{"startTime":828.185,"endTime":833.182,"body":"Except we joke about it, the fact that from the age of three onwards, we"},{"startTime":833.182,"endTime":833.515,"body":"almost all are aware of the fact that we personally will die, should fill us"},{"startTime":833.515,"endTime":839.845,"body":"with existentialist horror and terror."},{"startTime":840.745,"endTime":841.925,"body":"And yet we laugh at it."},{"startTime":842.145,"endTime":843.445,"body":"We laugh in the face of death."},{"startTime":843.505,"endTime":844.405,"body":"We laugh at the shit."},{"startTime":844.745,"endTime":852.037,"body":"The fact that we have had David Cameron, Theresa May, Boris Johnson, Liz Truss, and"},{"startTime":852.037,"endTime":852.524,"body":"Rishi soak in absolute control of our personal and political destinies, should drive us into"},{"startTime":852.524,"endTime":865.165,"body":"realms of madness with existentialist terror, except we can laugh at them."},{"startTime":866.225,"endTime":870.885,"body":"And when you laugh, as George Orwell said, every joke is a tiny revolution."},{"startTime":871.425,"endTime":874.525,"body":"It evens up the balance because it releases the endorphins."},{"startTime":874.525,"endTime":877.445,"body":"My job is not to improve the behavior of the people I draw."},{"startTime":877.785,"endTime":882.565,"body":"My job is to actually license you to laugh at the bastards."},{"startTime":883.545,"endTime":885.605,"body":"Anyway, talking of war crimes."},{"startTime":886.035,"endTime":892.127,"body":"This is, um, this is Alistair Campbell, as I'm sure you're aware, was, uh, Tony"},{"startTime":892.127,"endTime":892.533,"body":"Blair's, director of communications in the early years of the new labor governments of the"},{"startTime":892.533,"endTime":892.939,"body":"1990s and two thousands said to me, the second most powerful man in the country"},{"startTime":892.939,"endTime":910.405,"body":"after Rupert Murdoch, obviously now from 2000 until 2005, I had a really nice gig."},{"startTime":911.145,"endTime":914.885,"body":"Um, you know, I, I like getting out in the wild occasion."},{"startTime":915.005,"endTime":916.565,"body":"I like drawing from the life as it were."},{"startTime":917.345,"endTime":921.088,"body":"Um, it, it's always quite nice to draw somebody because I know exactly what I'm"},{"startTime":921.088,"endTime":923.085,"body":"doing and, and I show it to somebody."},{"startTime":923.085,"endTime":924.725,"body":"There is always the element of risk."},{"startTime":924.725,"endTime":925.845,"body":"There's a jeopardy involved."},{"startTime":925.845,"endTime":926.965,"body":"They might actually hit me."},{"startTime":927.465,"endTime":931.05,"body":"And some people actually have, several politicians have actually physically assaulted me after I've shown"},{"startTime":931.05,"endTime":932.485,"body":"them drawings, of which is fun."},{"startTime":932.485,"endTime":934.851,"body":"You know, they were said, they were friends of mine, but I don't think they"},{"startTime":934.851,"endTime":935.325,"body":"like the drawings."},{"startTime":935.865,"endTime":941.656,"body":"Um, and there's a, there was a fantastic restaurant in Soho not far from here,"},{"startTime":941.656,"endTime":942.042,"body":"called the Gay Who Are, which was a Hungarian restaurant set up in the 1950s,"},{"startTime":942.042,"endTime":949.765,"body":"uh, closed in 2019, 2018, sorry."},{"startTime":950.265,"endTime":955.17,"body":"And, um, in its heyday, in the sixties and seventies it was, and lingering into"},{"startTime":955.17,"endTime":955.497,"body":"the eighties and a bit in the nineties, it was where the political and journalistic"},{"startTime":955.497,"endTime":962.365,"body":"elite would go to gossip and conspire."},{"startTime":962.365,"endTime":965.285,"body":"It said that Har wasn't entire cabinet would go there for lunch."},{"startTime":965.985,"endTime":970.047,"body":"And, uh, Victor sassy, the manager would have to place them in such a way"},{"startTime":970.047,"endTime":972.485,"body":"they couldn't overhear each other, conspiring against each other."},{"startTime":972.885,"endTime":977.885,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":973.425,"endTime":977.305,"body":"And also it is rumored, but I believe it is true, that, uh, George Brown,"},{"startTime":977.305,"endTime":977.564,"body":"when he was foreign secretary, started feeling the knee of the woman sitting next to"},{"startTime":977.564,"endTime":977.823,"body":"him in the banquette and was thrown out of the restaurant, the only foreign secretary"},{"startTime":977.823,"endTime":978.082,"body":"known to have been thrown out of a London restaurant, which is, well, so far"},{"startTime":978.082,"endTime":989.725,"body":"as we know."},{"startTime":990.385,"endTime":994.676,"body":"Um, anyway, one night I was, I was process of leaving and I, and I"},{"startTime":994.676,"endTime":994.962,"body":"said to the then manager, um, uh, John Bel, I said, uh, Hey John, how"},{"startTime":994.962,"endTime":1000.685,"body":"about I draw your celebrity patrons?"},{"startTime":1001.075,"endTime":1002.925,"body":"Because this is a really interesting place."},{"startTime":1002.925,"endTime":1005.889,"body":"This is, you know, the history of this place is really important, and we should"},{"startTime":1005.889,"endTime":1006.285,"body":"record them."},{"startTime":1006.425,"endTime":1009.365,"body":"We should record these peoples during the course of their lunchtimes."},{"startTime":1009.825,"endTime":1011.325,"body":"And, you know, I didn't wanna get paid for it."},{"startTime":1011.445,"endTime":1013.902,"body":"I just wanted to sit there as a, as an artistic process, and then we"},{"startTime":1013.902,"endTime":1014.885,"body":"could hang them on the wall."},{"startTime":1015.385,"endTime":1018.325,"body":"And I used to get paid in, in Central European food."},{"startTime":1019.145,"endTime":1023.925,"body":"Um, so I'd spend the afternoon drinking bull's, blood and eating a lot of carbohydrate."},{"startTime":1024.105,"endTime":1030.861,"body":"And in the evening, I'd try and sober up with this chain male fist squeezing"},{"startTime":1030.861,"endTime":1035.365,"body":"my heart, uh, as the roast goose was slowly digested."},{"startTime":1035.545,"endTime":1036.605,"body":"And we got all sorts in there."},{"startTime":1036.645,"endTime":1040.939,"body":"I got Michael Foot, got Michael Howard, Michael Hesseltine, lots of Michaels, Michael Portillo on"},{"startTime":1040.939,"endTime":1042.085,"body":"some of these occasions."},{"startTime":1042.085,"endTime":1042.325,"body":"Amazing."},{"startTime":1042.345,"endTime":1045.045,"body":"The pen didn't leap outta my hand and drive itself through my eyeball."},{"startTime":1045.505,"endTime":1049.405,"body":"Um, the room was dark, it was about the length of this stage."},{"startTime":1049.405,"endTime":1050.725,"body":"And going out to about the front row."},{"startTime":1051.225,"endTime":1057.147,"body":"Um, I got, uh, David ett having lunch with a beautiful blonde American woman without"},{"startTime":1057.147,"endTime":1061.885,"body":"realizing this is the woman with whom he was having an affair."},{"startTime":1061.885,"endTime":1063.005,"body":"So I missed a scoop there."},{"startTime":1063.425,"endTime":1065.765,"body":"Um, and there were 60 of them ended up there."},{"startTime":1065.765,"endTime":1067.365,"body":"They are now all in the National Portrait Gallery."},{"startTime":1067.465,"endTime":1071.082,"body":"I'm happy to say after a dispute about ownership with the former owners of the"},{"startTime":1071.082,"endTime":1071.565,"body":"Gay Hua."},{"startTime":1071.945,"endTime":1078.15,"body":"But on the third 21st of May, 2002, I remember it was my daughter's birthday,"},{"startTime":1078.15,"endTime":1079.805,"body":"we got Alistair Campbell."},{"startTime":1080.785,"endTime":1087.555,"body":"And in drawing Alistair Campbell, it was the first time I genuinely understood, having, by"},{"startTime":1087.555,"endTime":1094.325,"body":"that point, been a professional cartoonist for 20 years, precisely the nature of my craft."},{"startTime":1095.465,"endTime":1102.897,"body":"It was because unlike all the other people like Drawn, unlike Roy Hattersley, unlike Jack"},{"startTime":1102.897,"endTime":1103.392,"body":"Jones, unlike Rodney, unlike Keith Waterhouse, unlike Glenda Jackson, who got on with their lunch"},{"startTime":1103.392,"endTime":1103.888,"body":"and chatted to their mates, as I sat over the other side of the restaurant"},{"startTime":1103.888,"endTime":1121.725,"body":"from them, Campbell sat there glowing at me."},{"startTime":1123.305,"endTime":1124.565,"body":"It was a very hot day."},{"startTime":1125.265,"endTime":1127.923,"body":"But you could have kept, and it was very crowded that day in the restaurant,"},{"startTime":1127.923,"endTime":1130.405,"body":"you could have kept a side of beef in there for about three months."},{"startTime":1131.185,"endTime":1132.845,"body":"The atmosphere was so chilly."},{"startTime":1133.865,"endTime":1138.209,"body":"And at one point he shouted across the restaurant, you just won't be able to"},{"startTime":1138.209,"endTime":1141.685,"body":"stop yourself from making me look a really bad person, will you?"},{"startTime":1142.465,"endTime":1145.525,"body":"To which I replied, Alistair, I draw what I see."},{"startTime":1146.705,"endTime":1148.525,"body":"And that's what I saw \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":1149.865,"endTime":1154.733,"body":"And I then, as was my custom, and I, I would do this without practicing"},{"startTime":1154.733,"endTime":1157.005,"body":"beforehand, without, um, you know, making sketches."},{"startTime":1157.045,"endTime":1158.405,"body":"I would just draw exactly what I saw."},{"startTime":1159.185,"endTime":1160.525,"body":"Uh, and it would take me about 40 minutes."},{"startTime":1161.425,"endTime":1165.8,"body":"And I would always take it up to my, uh, victim sitter, whatever you choose"},{"startTime":1165.8,"endTime":1166.091,"body":"to call them, and to get them to sign as a true record of them"},{"startTime":1166.091,"endTime":1171.925,"body":"during the course of their lunchtime."},{"startTime":1173.025,"endTime":1179.22,"body":"And I gave it to Campbell who said, and I quote, exactly, this is a"},{"startTime":1179.22,"endTime":1181.285,"body":"good picture of Jeremy Paxman."},{"startTime":1181.285,"endTime":1183.165,"body":"Where the fuck is the one of me \u003claugh\u003e?"},{"startTime":1184.225,"endTime":1186.685,"body":"And this was a really amazing revelation."},{"startTime":1186.925,"endTime":1189.285,"body":"'cause I suddenly realized the nature of my craft."},{"startTime":1189.725,"endTime":1193.805,"body":"I was engaged not just in drawing somebody, but actually in sympathetic magic."},{"startTime":1194.235,"endTime":1199.21,"body":"This was deep, dark, voodoo damage at a distance with a sharp object, in this"},{"startTime":1199.21,"endTime":1200.205,"body":"case, a pen."},{"startTime":1200.205,"endTime":1206.805,"body":"But nonetheless, he understood that I was taking the way he presents himself through no,"},{"startTime":1206.805,"endTime":1207.245,"body":"with no power over it himself, almost entirely taking his face and recreating it, re"},{"startTime":1207.245,"endTime":1207.685,"body":"narrativizing it, but also controlling it by changing it through a kind of like anthropy"},{"startTime":1207.685,"endTime":1208.125,"body":"through actually changing it and creating him anew and therefore taking control of him and"},{"startTime":1208.125,"endTime":1231.885,"body":"stealing his, for want of a better word, in his case soul."},{"startTime":1234.465,"endTime":1236.005,"body":"And he knew it."},{"startTime":1237.085,"endTime":1242.328,"body":"'cause if nothing else, Alistair Campbell, who I actually know quite well, and I quite"},{"startTime":1242.328,"endTime":1245.125,"body":"like, to be honest, he's a control freak."},{"startTime":1245.385,"endTime":1248.565,"body":"He knew exactly what I was doing and he hated it."},{"startTime":1249.225,"endTime":1252.3,"body":"And when he said, where the fuck's the one of me, he was saying, your"},{"startTime":1252.3,"endTime":1253.325,"body":"bad magic has not worked."},{"startTime":1253.525,"endTime":1254.805,"body":"I have regained my soul."},{"startTime":1254.805,"endTime":1256.765,"body":"And then stuffed it back wherever he keeps his soul."},{"startTime":1257.585,"endTime":1258.805,"body":"So those are the ingredients."},{"startTime":1258.835,"endTime":1261.245,"body":"It's the art, it's the ization, it's the control."},{"startTime":1261.795,"endTime":1262.765,"body":"It's the humor."},{"startTime":1262.875,"endTime":1269.371,"body":"It's making us laugh through exaggeration through ridiculous scenarios you create once you've got the"},{"startTime":1269.371,"endTime":1269.805,"body":"caricature."},{"startTime":1269.805,"endTime":1273.268,"body":"And here he is spinning Tony Blair here he is, saying, if I sex you"},{"startTime":1273.268,"endTime":1274.885,"body":"up in 45 minutes, will you come?"},{"startTime":1275.105,"endTime":1275.725,"body":"And so on."},{"startTime":1275.865,"endTime":1279.868,"body":"And here he is in that wonderful story that broke in two th again in"},{"startTime":1279.868,"endTime":1282.805,"body":"2002 when the Queen mother died laden with age and honor."},{"startTime":1283.345,"endTime":1288.338,"body":"And a story broke that Alistair Campbell was putting pressure on black rod, the public"},{"startTime":1288.338,"endTime":1288.671,"body":"official who was, uh, been given the task of organizing the Queen Mother's state funeral"},{"startTime":1288.671,"endTime":1289.004,"body":"to give Tony a bigger role in the funeral because he played such a blinder"},{"startTime":1289.004,"endTime":1299.325,"body":"at Diana's funeral."},{"startTime":1299.545,"endTime":1303.157,"body":"We dunno what the role would've been carrying the spare wheel to the gun carriage,"},{"startTime":1303.157,"endTime":1305.325,"body":"possibly snuggling up the beside her in the casket."},{"startTime":1305.625,"endTime":1311.255,"body":"Anyway, the story broke, and I remember that wonderful description by John Biffin of, uh,"},{"startTime":1311.255,"endTime":1311.63,"body":"Bernardine and Margaret Thatcher's press secretary, who was described as the sewer, not the sewage,"},{"startTime":1311.63,"endTime":1321.765,"body":"because he was briefing the lobby with damaging stories about Thatcher's cabinet colleagues."},{"startTime":1321.985,"endTime":1325.645,"body":"But the sewage, the shit came directly from Thatcher."},{"startTime":1325.825,"endTime":1327.765,"body":"And I suddenly thought, yes, that's it."},{"startTime":1327.945,"endTime":1330.125,"body":"The, you know, the sewers."},{"startTime":1331.305,"endTime":1332.645,"body":"Sewers finally got blocked."},{"startTime":1332.705,"endTime":1338.026,"body":"And there is Alistair Campbell, but it's recognizably Alistair Campbell through the magic of caricature"},{"startTime":1338.026,"endTime":1339.445,"body":"that is recognizably him."},{"startTime":1340.345,"endTime":1341.685,"body":"And there he is, he's blocked up."},{"startTime":1341.745,"endTime":1344.85,"body":"And the man who broke the story is my friend Peter Oborne, who was then"},{"startTime":1344.85,"endTime":1345.885,"body":"political editor of The Spectator."},{"startTime":1345.905,"endTime":1347.525,"body":"And there he is down there as a turd."},{"startTime":1347.785,"endTime":1351.558,"body":"And the man who tried to kill the story was the then chairman of the"},{"startTime":1351.558,"endTime":1352.565,"body":"Labor Party, Charles Clark."},{"startTime":1352.825,"endTime":1354.805,"body":"And he's down there as a tampon."},{"startTime":1355.065,"endTime":1358.285,"body":"Now, this is frankly disgusting filth."},{"startTime":1359.545,"endTime":1364.468,"body":"And I've shown this image in talks I've given in India across Europe, in Amer"},{"startTime":1364.468,"endTime":1365.125,"body":"in America."},{"startTime":1365.155,"endTime":1369.445,"body":"They go, \u003claugh\u003e, how the hell you get away with that?"},{"startTime":1369.485,"endTime":1372.103,"body":"I say, well, we get away with that 'cause we have no First Amendment guarantee"},{"startTime":1372.103,"endTime":1373.325,"body":"of freedom of speech in this country."},{"startTime":1373.325,"endTime":1374.445,"body":"That's why we get away with it."},{"startTime":1374.985,"endTime":1379.979,"body":"And the real reason we get away with it is because we've been doing this"},{"startTime":1379.979,"endTime":1380.645,"body":"for centuries."},{"startTime":1381.595,"endTime":1385.325,"body":"This was described on the Today Program on Radio four as frankly Sulfurous."},{"startTime":1385.405,"endTime":1387.805,"body":"I said, yeah, that will do, frankly Sulfurous, that will do, that's fine."},{"startTime":1387.805,"endTime":1388.725,"body":"TripAdvisor comment."},{"startTime":1388.905,"endTime":1389.125,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":1389.985,"endTime":1395.796,"body":"Um, and it's thanks to a beautiful moment in world history, which we've all forgotten"},{"startTime":1395.796,"endTime":1396.184,"body":"about, if we ever knew, uh, which happened in 1695 after the glorious revolution of"},{"startTime":1396.184,"endTime":1406.645,"body":"1688, when they were meant to renew the Royal Licensing Act in parliament."},{"startTime":1406.665,"endTime":1409.325,"body":"Now, the Royal Licensing Act basically was press censorship."},{"startTime":1410.145,"endTime":1415.359,"body":"And, uh, when this college was founded, if somebody like me had done some drawings"},{"startTime":1415.359,"endTime":1415.707,"body":"of the founder of this college, I would've been hanged, drawn and courted, by which"},{"startTime":1415.707,"endTime":1416.055,"body":"I mean, I would've been strung up by the neck, but lowered while I was"},{"startTime":1416.055,"endTime":1426.485,"body":"still alive."},{"startTime":1426.545,"endTime":1428.445,"body":"I'd then have my arms and legs chopped off."},{"startTime":1428.505,"endTime":1429.605,"body":"I'd then be castrated."},{"startTime":1430.305,"endTime":1433.516,"body":"Uh, I would then have my guts wound out while I was still alive, and"},{"startTime":1433.516,"endTime":1436.085,"body":"then I'd be beheaded, uh, because he wouldn't have liked the drawing."},{"startTime":1436.485,"endTime":1437.285,"body":"'cause that was the punishment."},{"startTime":1437.545,"endTime":1440.565,"body":"The milder punishment was having your ears sheared off by the public hangman."},{"startTime":1440.795,"endTime":1445.074,"body":"John Print, the Puritan Pamphleteer during the Civil War, was sentenced to have his ears"},{"startTime":1445.074,"endTime":1445.645,"body":"sheared off."},{"startTime":1445.945,"endTime":1449.714,"body":"And, uh, a forgetful judge sentenced him to have them sheared off again, much of"},{"startTime":1449.714,"endTime":1451.725,"body":"the confusion of the public execution of it."},{"startTime":1452.785,"endTime":1457.619,"body":"But in 1695, because this was such a draconian law, it had to be renewed"},{"startTime":1457.619,"endTime":1461.165,"body":"every two years, a bit like the Prevention of Terrorism Act."},{"startTime":1462.265,"endTime":1468.733,"body":"And somebody deliberately or otherwise forgot to put it on the parliamentary timetable to be"},{"startTime":1468.733,"endTime":1469.165,"body":"renewed."},{"startTime":1469.165,"endTime":1469.925,"body":"So it lapsed."},{"startTime":1470.705,"endTime":1475.365,"body":"And suddenly in 1695, there was this eruption of a free press."},{"startTime":1476.485,"endTime":1482.287,"body":"I mean, it wasn't that free, that the state still had many powers at its"},{"startTime":1482.287,"endTime":1484.995,"body":"disposal, but the actual legislation wasn't there."},{"startTime":1484.995,"endTime":1487.115,"body":"They spent 20 years trying to get it back on the statute book."},{"startTime":1487.115,"endTime":1489.275,"body":"But they realized people rather liked all this stuff."},{"startTime":1489.815,"endTime":1494.54,"body":"And they brought in the stamp act instead to try and tax journalism rather than"},{"startTime":1494.54,"endTime":1496.115,"body":"just terrorize it into compliance."},{"startTime":1496.695,"endTime":1501.809,"body":"But it meant that not only was there eruption of Grub Streep, but there was"},{"startTime":1501.809,"endTime":1502.15,"body":"also like Pandora's box, this sudden eruption of satire that suddenly all these people were"},{"startTime":1502.15,"endTime":1502.49,"body":"taking at last the chance without the protection of a powerful patron to laugh at"},{"startTime":1502.49,"endTime":1502.831,"body":"the power, which, as I said, is the thing we do to stop us going"},{"startTime":1502.831,"endTime":1518.515,"body":"insane with existentialist dread."},{"startTime":1519.775,"endTime":1527.688,"body":"And so, throughout the age of reasons throughout the enlightenments, throughout the 18th century, there"},{"startTime":1527.688,"endTime":1535.075,"body":"is this open sewer of satire running from Pope and Swift up to Gilroy."},{"startTime":1535.575,"endTime":1541.155,"body":"And this magnificent image, um, which was produced by an anonymous printmaker."},{"startTime":1542.055,"endTime":1547.787,"body":"Uh, anonymity was still quite a good idea for satis even, you know, even though"},{"startTime":1547.787,"endTime":1552.755,"body":"they dropped the act, um, in 1720 of the Prime Minister Robert Warpole."},{"startTime":1552.815,"endTime":1554.995,"body":"Now Prime Minister's, one was interesting constructions."},{"startTime":1555.535,"endTime":1562.054,"body":"Um, the phrase was first invented as an insult, like the words Tory and Christian,"},{"startTime":1562.054,"endTime":1566.835,"body":"and it was invented to describe what Warpole was up to."},{"startTime":1566.835,"endTime":1571.155,"body":"He's also known as old corruption, because the king who spoke no English and was"},{"startTime":1571.155,"endTime":1571.443,"body":"in Hannover anyway, had basically devolved all power onto Warpole, who was gathering all the"},{"startTime":1571.443,"endTime":1576.915,"body":"offices of state to himself."},{"startTime":1577.215,"endTime":1581.835,"body":"So he was the prime minister as he mook them dry."},{"startTime":1583.135,"endTime":1583.795,"body":"He was a crook."},{"startTime":1583.815,"endTime":1584.475,"body":"It was a heist."},{"startTime":1584.735,"endTime":1587.595,"body":"The British state is, the British constitution is based on the notion of a heist."},{"startTime":1588.015,"endTime":1590.915,"body":"The whole fact we have prime ministers is so they can rob us blind."},{"startTime":1591.145,"endTime":1593.835,"body":"Well, they try and disguise that, but you know, that's essentially what it's about."},{"startTime":1594.055,"endTime":1597.205,"body":"And here you have somebody who has to kiss his ass to get up the"},{"startTime":1597.205,"endTime":1597.835,"body":"corridors of power."},{"startTime":1598.655,"endTime":1603.075,"body":"And soon the streets of London were a wash with images like this."},{"startTime":1603.865,"endTime":1610.506,"body":"And they brought in theater, uh, censorship under the Lord Chamberlain to prevent something like"},{"startTime":1610.506,"endTime":1610.949,"body":"the Beggar's Opera being written again, which was just laughing at Warpole all the time,"},{"startTime":1610.949,"endTime":1619.805,"body":"laughing at him all the time."},{"startTime":1619.805,"endTime":1621.205,"body":"They couldn't bear the laughter."},{"startTime":1621.225,"endTime":1623.685,"body":"But, you know, after a while, they had to, they had to stomach it."},{"startTime":1624.105,"endTime":1630.847,"body":"And very soon you have this history, this tradition of visual satire being exemplified by"},{"startTime":1630.847,"endTime":1632.645,"body":"the great William Hogarth."},{"startTime":1633.345,"endTime":1639.613,"body":"Uh, the grandfather of the grandfather of the political cartoon who here early on in"},{"startTime":1639.613,"endTime":1640.031,"body":"his career, um, is actually Ping Swift's Gulliver's Travels 1727, absolutely phenomenally successful book read,"},{"startTime":1640.031,"endTime":1640.449,"body":"as they said, everywhere from the cabinet room to the nursery, to the point where"},{"startTime":1640.449,"endTime":1657.165,"body":"a bishop wrote to another bishop, said, I've just read God's travels."},{"startTime":1657.245,"endTime":1659.525,"body":"I don't believe a word of it, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":1661.625,"endTime":1667.419,"body":"And uh, this actually is one of the very few obscene scatological images, which doesn't"},{"startTime":1667.419,"endTime":1668.965,"body":"appear in guavas travels."},{"startTime":1669.025,"endTime":1672.535,"body":"Guavas used as a dildo at one point in guavas travels, but here he is,"},{"startTime":1672.535,"endTime":1672.769,"body":"been given an enema by the Lilliputians, uh, because Hogarth is just trying to make"},{"startTime":1672.769,"endTime":1677.685,"body":"some money by, by ping something off."},{"startTime":1677.945,"endTime":1683.782,"body":"Um, and Swift, uh, to his credit, didn't mind because, um, 10 years later, he"},{"startTime":1683.782,"endTime":1687.285,"body":"just broke the fourth wall in, uh, a perm."},{"startTime":1687.285,"endTime":1691.965,"body":"He was writing about the perty of the Irish parliament in cutting church tithes."},{"startTime":1692.785,"endTime":1695.765,"body":"And he was describing all these appalling people in the Irish parliament."},{"startTime":1695.765,"endTime":1699.87,"body":"And he suddenly, I said, breaks the fourth wall and directly addresses Hogarth and said,"},{"startTime":1699.87,"endTime":1700.143,"body":"how I want the humorous Hogarth, thou, I hear a pleasant rogar were, but you"},{"startTime":1700.143,"endTime":1706.165,"body":"and I acquainted, every monster should be painted."},{"startTime":1706.625,"endTime":1709.445,"body":"You should try your graving tools on this odious group of fools."},{"startTime":1709.445,"endTime":1712.925,"body":"Draw the beast as I describe them, form their features while I jive them."},{"startTime":1713.355,"endTime":1716.725,"body":"Draw them like far, I assure you, you will need no caricature."},{"startTime":1716.875,"endTime":1719.965,"body":"Draw them so that we may trace all the soul in every face."},{"startTime":1720.045,"endTime":1723.325,"body":"I mean, it's just such a beautiful love poem to my profession."},{"startTime":1723.665,"endTime":1728.69,"body":"And sadly, Hogarth and Swift never collaborated as a kind of Georgian version of Hunter"},{"startTime":1728.69,"endTime":1730.365,"body":"s Thompson and Ralph Steadman."},{"startTime":1730.585,"endTime":1734.365,"body":"But if they had, you know, they would've drawn the soul in every face."},{"startTime":1734.945,"endTime":1739.876,"body":"Um, and, um, Hogarth wasn't specifically a political cartoonist, he was more of a social"},{"startTime":1739.876,"endTime":1740.205,"body":"cartoonist."},{"startTime":1740.705,"endTime":1745.778,"body":"But he produced, I think, one of the most important images of the 18th century,"},{"startTime":1745.778,"endTime":1746.116,"body":"which is this, which is gin lame, which actually boils it down to what my"},{"startTime":1746.116,"endTime":1752.205,"body":"craft is truly about."},{"startTime":1753.675,"endTime":1760.782,"body":"Because this image which was created or printed rather on the 15th of February, 1751,"},{"startTime":1760.782,"endTime":1761.255,"body":"my minus 208th birthday, uh, was part of a campaign by Hogarth and Henry Fielding"},{"startTime":1761.255,"endTime":1761.729,"body":"the novelist, but also a magistrate in Covent Garden, against the pernicious influence of gin,"},{"startTime":1761.729,"endTime":1762.203,"body":"which was seemed to be responsible for the collapse of society, which appeared to be"},{"startTime":1762.203,"endTime":1783.525,"body":"happening around everybody."},{"startTime":1783.525,"endTime":1787.89,"body":"In fact, the collapse of society was due to an economic downturn, a huge number"},{"startTime":1787.89,"endTime":1788.181,"body":"of unemployed soldiers who had been thrown onto the scrap people after the suppression of"},{"startTime":1788.181,"endTime":1795.165,"body":"the Jacobite rebellions four years, four or five years earlier."},{"startTime":1795.825,"endTime":1799.409,"body":"Um, it was said in London, you could be held up by a highway man"},{"startTime":1799.409,"endTime":1800.365,"body":"in Piccadilly at noon."},{"startTime":1801.545,"endTime":1807.015,"body":"And rather than looking at the nature of London, which was at the time the"},{"startTime":1807.015,"endTime":1807.38,"body":"greatest city the world had ever seen, with no flush toilets, where every morning the"},{"startTime":1807.38,"endTime":1807.745,"body":"night soil man would come round and collect the contents of the cess pits and"},{"startTime":1807.745,"endTime":1821.605,"body":"the, and the, uh, what do you call those things?"},{"startTime":1821.605,"endTime":1827.516,"body":"You put under your bed, um, chamber, chamber pops thank you and trundle out to"},{"startTime":1827.516,"endTime":1832.245,"body":"the suburbs and dump them in enormous piles of shit in Islington."},{"startTime":1834.675,"endTime":1835.565,"body":"It's an easy laugh."},{"startTime":1835.565,"endTime":1835.965,"body":"Come on."},{"startTime":1836.205,"endTime":1842.265,"body":"You know, um, what were called the dust heaps in Dom and sun, which we"},{"startTime":1842.265,"endTime":1844.285,"body":"then use to make bricks."},{"startTime":1845.265,"endTime":1849.64,"body":"And in fact, when Moscow burnt down was burnt out by the Muscovites in 1812,"},{"startTime":1849.64,"endTime":1853.725,"body":"they rebuilt it with bricks from London, made out of a shit of Londoners."},{"startTime":1854.685,"endTime":1856.245,"body":"I don't think Putin knows that, but he does."},{"startTime":1856.245,"endTime":1863.325,"body":"Now, if he's watching this \u003claugh\u003e, Londoners would sleep 15 to a cellar."},{"startTime":1863.325,"endTime":1865.565,"body":"They'd wear clothes until they rotted off their backs."},{"startTime":1866.165,"endTime":1869.733,"body":"Gin was the way they made life just about bearable, but it was considered to"},{"startTime":1869.733,"endTime":1870.685,"body":"be a pernicious evil."},{"startTime":1871.145,"endTime":1875.82,"body":"And so Hogarth produced this image at the same time as he produced the stages"},{"startTime":1875.82,"endTime":1876.131,"body":"of cruelty, a series of four images of how people are cruel because they drink"},{"startTime":1876.131,"endTime":1882.365,"body":"and they, uh, do terrible things."},{"startTime":1882.955,"endTime":1889.232,"body":"This is particularly interesting because usually Hogarth, who was a very astute businessman, would produce"},{"startTime":1889.232,"endTime":1891.325,"body":"a a, an oil painting."},{"startTime":1891.395,"endTime":1893.085,"body":"He'd then make an engraving of it."},{"startTime":1893.105,"endTime":1895.965,"body":"He would sell the engravings of prints, make prints."},{"startTime":1896.075,"endTime":1899.045,"body":"He'd usually try to get paid three times for one image."},{"startTime":1899.835,"endTime":1901.885,"body":"This exists only as a print."},{"startTime":1902.345,"endTime":1907.105,"body":"The original of this is a copper plate, which may possibly ended up as being"},{"startTime":1907.105,"endTime":1909.645,"body":"used as shrapnel in the first World War."},{"startTime":1909.645,"endTime":1914.287,"body":"Certainly what happened to an awful lot of copper prints from the 18th century, um,"},{"startTime":1914.287,"endTime":1915.525,"body":"it is therefore journalism."},{"startTime":1915.825,"endTime":1920.085,"body":"It exists solely to be reproduced, which is more or less the definition of journalism."},{"startTime":1921.065,"endTime":1925.219,"body":"It was there to be printed on cheap paper to be hung up in the"},{"startTime":1925.219,"endTime":1925.496,"body":"workshops of the City of London as a lesson to young apprentices to avoid the"},{"startTime":1925.496,"endTime":1930.205,"body":"evil drink gin."},{"startTime":1930.395,"endTime":1935.801,"body":"There's a companion piece to this, which is called Beer Street, which is unbelievably boring"},{"startTime":1935.801,"endTime":1939.405,"body":"and goody goody because this is an extraordinarily powerful image."},{"startTime":1940.035,"endTime":1946.405,"body":"It's extraordinarily powerful because it's funny, it's funny throughout it's very, very dark humor."},{"startTime":1946.425,"endTime":1947.485,"body":"But nonetheless, it's funny."},{"startTime":1947.715,"endTime":1950.805,"body":"It's filled with incident, it's teeming with these wonderful incidents."},{"startTime":1950.985,"endTime":1953.565,"body":"So here's a ballad cellar who's died of drink."},{"startTime":1954.175,"endTime":1957.591,"body":"There is a woman pouring drink down a baby's throat, cripple having drink, pour down"},{"startTime":1957.591,"endTime":1960.325,"body":"her throat, a man fighting, fighting with a dog over a bone."},{"startTime":1960.525,"endTime":1965.025,"body":"A carpenter pawning the tools of his trade in order to buy more gin bodies"},{"startTime":1965.025,"endTime":1965.325,"body":"being disinterred, a drunken baker impaling his own child, a barber hanging himself because nobody's"},{"startTime":1965.325,"endTime":1973.125,"body":"coming in to have their heads shaved to have their wigs fitted."},{"startTime":1973.825,"endTime":1978.575,"body":"And this central image was inspired by one of the most notorious crimes of the"},{"startTime":1978.575,"endTime":1979.525,"body":"early 18th century."},{"startTime":1979.565,"endTime":1984.491,"body":"A woman called Judith Dfor French, mark my words, whose daughter was taken into the"},{"startTime":1984.491,"endTime":1985.805,"body":"care of the parish."},{"startTime":1986.585,"endTime":1989.485,"body":"Um, and, but Judith Dufour had visiting rights."},{"startTime":1989.485,"endTime":1993.975,"body":"So one day she and her co-conspirator went to visit the daughter in the poor"},{"startTime":1993.975,"endTime":1994.275,"body":"house, took her out for the day, murdered her in order to sell her clothes"},{"startTime":1994.275,"endTime":1999.365,"body":"to buy gin."},{"startTime":1999.905,"endTime":2004.911,"body":"It still resonated as one of the most horrific court cases of the early Georgian"},{"startTime":2004.911,"endTime":2005.245,"body":"period."},{"startTime":2005.465,"endTime":2008.885,"body":"So that is Judith due for, but she's more than Judith due for."},{"startTime":2009.345,"endTime":2010.725,"body":"She is the Madonna."},{"startTime":2011.225,"endTime":2012.485,"body":"She is an icon."},{"startTime":2012.485,"endTime":2017.155,"body":"She is a pastiche of one of the central images of Christianity as the Madonna"},{"startTime":2017.155,"endTime":2017.466,"body":"who is dropping the Christ child, the Redeemer, to his certain death of the original"},{"startTime":2017.466,"endTime":2024.005,"body":"sketches of this, that was the ground."},{"startTime":2024.315,"endTime":2027.325,"body":"Hogarth removed that so it was clear he was going to die."},{"startTime":2027.855,"endTime":2029.205,"body":"There is no hope here."},{"startTime":2029.555,"endTime":2033.165,"body":"This you can go to where Gin Lane was."},{"startTime":2033.275,"endTime":2036.805,"body":"It's just the continuation of Dreary Lane Bo below near Oxford Street."},{"startTime":2037.355,"endTime":2039.845,"body":"It's about 300 yards from where Fagan's Kitchen was."},{"startTime":2040.595,"endTime":2044.992,"body":"It's about eight 80 years difference in time because there is an absolute difference between"},{"startTime":2044.992,"endTime":2047.045,"body":"a Dickensian slum and a hogarthian slum."},{"startTime":2047.245,"endTime":2053.165,"body":"A Dickensian slum is filled with horror and pity and hope, and hope is dashed."},{"startTime":2053.625,"endTime":2059.125,"body":"And then all you can do is weep in a hogarthian swam."},{"startTime":2059.175,"endTime":2061.485,"body":"There is no hope to begin with \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2062.025,"endTime":2063.764,"body":"And all you can do is laugh."},{"startTime":2064.275,"endTime":2066.165,"body":"That is the truth of satire."},{"startTime":2066.505,"endTime":2071.045,"body":"We laugh at the horror because we can do nothing else."},{"startTime":2072.344,"endTime":2076.209,"body":"And of course, I've pinched it over and over again as a perfect template for"},{"startTime":2076.209,"endTime":2076.725,"body":"urban decay."},{"startTime":2076.745,"endTime":2077.405,"body":"So here we are."},{"startTime":2077.665,"endTime":2078.685,"body":"Um, this is hoodies."},{"startTime":2078.824,"endTime":2083.005,"body":"Um, uh, this is when, uh, what's his face opened the pubs again."},{"startTime":2083.945,"endTime":2089.328,"body":"Um, this is, uh, a pastiche, uh, about, uh, the cocaine use in the media"},{"startTime":2089.328,"endTime":2090.405,"body":"world of London."},{"startTime":2090.875,"endTime":2095.405,"body":"This is, hang on, this is hen Knights in Central London \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2096.185,"endTime":2099.396,"body":"And, uh, at the moment I'm actually working on a, working on a book where"},{"startTime":2099.396,"endTime":2101.965,"body":"I'm, I'm drawing on a kind of pal est of Gin lane."},{"startTime":2102.265,"endTime":2105.325,"body":"And so this is, this is Gin Lane being discussed by property developers."},{"startTime":2105.625,"endTime":2109.645,"body":"And uh, this is a nice image of Gin Lane Tube Station, which \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2109.985,"endTime":2114.887,"body":"Um, so there's Hogarth and he cast an enormous shadow and he cast it onto"},{"startTime":2114.887,"endTime":2115.214,"body":"our next great hero, who is James Gilroy, who, uh, was flourishing at the end"},{"startTime":2115.214,"endTime":2124.365,"body":"of the 19th century, end of the 18th century, beginning of the 19th century."},{"startTime":2124.905,"endTime":2131.491,"body":"Uh, and who produced if Gin Lane brings all the qualities of a political cartoon"},{"startTime":2131.491,"endTime":2135.005,"body":"together, Gil Ray sets in concrete the template."},{"startTime":2135.745,"endTime":2139.592,"body":"Uh, and this is more or less a type specimen of political cartoon where you"},{"startTime":2139.592,"endTime":2141.645,"body":"take, as I described, recognizable real human beings."},{"startTime":2141.645,"endTime":2146.499,"body":"You transform them through the magic of caricature into marionettes being set up in a"},{"startTime":2146.499,"endTime":2146.823,"body":"narrative of the caricaturist or cartoonist's own devising in order to mock them to make"},{"startTime":2146.823,"endTime":2152.325,"body":"a political point."},{"startTime":2152.865,"endTime":2159.3,"body":"And this is the plump putting in danger and it's pit, and b, apart dividing"},{"startTime":2159.3,"endTime":2161.445,"body":"the world up between them."},{"startTime":2161.705,"endTime":2166.452,"body":"Now, the point about this is, of course, like every other cartoon, it is an"},{"startTime":2166.452,"endTime":2167.085,"body":"allegorical image."},{"startTime":2167.985,"endTime":2173.735,"body":"Uh, and it could work as an allegorical image painted on the side the wall"},{"startTime":2173.735,"endTime":2174.885,"body":"of a palace."},{"startTime":2175.105,"endTime":2180.125,"body":"It could be 80 foot, 80 foot, 50 foot pillars."},{"startTime":2180.795,"endTime":2185.525,"body":"Gods statesmen in togas, a plum pudding in the middle, fighting over it."},{"startTime":2186.105,"endTime":2187.165,"body":"It would've stunk."},{"startTime":2188.275,"endTime":2190.525,"body":"This works because this is that big."},{"startTime":2191.785,"endTime":2195.757,"body":"He has taken these two men who are fighting over the destiny of the world"},{"startTime":2195.757,"endTime":2198.405,"body":"and reduced them as a long, tall streak of misery."},{"startTime":2198.405,"endTime":2200.525,"body":"And a short ass in exile."},{"startTime":2200.595,"endTime":2203.845,"body":"Bonaparte said Gil Ray was more dangerous to him than 12 generals."},{"startTime":2203.925,"endTime":2205.285,"body":"'cause he always dreamed about that tool."},{"startTime":2206.905,"endTime":2208.645,"body":"And they're engaged in a food fight."},{"startTime":2209.195,"endTime":2211.325,"body":"Look at these great men, these great men."},{"startTime":2211.365,"endTime":2212.725,"body":"They're just engaged in a food fight."},{"startTime":2212.725,"endTime":2216.085,"body":"What a ridiculous thing for them to do."},{"startTime":2216.625,"endTime":2218.045,"body":"It brings them down to size."},{"startTime":2218.065,"endTime":2222.885,"body":"It, ret controls them, re narrativize, it evens up the score on our behalf."},{"startTime":2223.105,"endTime":2225.765,"body":"And this is the image which actually inspired me to become a cartoonist."},{"startTime":2225.765,"endTime":2226.525,"body":"When I was 10 years old."},{"startTime":2226.565,"endTime":2228.965,"body":"I saw it in my sister's history textbook."},{"startTime":2229.545,"endTime":2233.495,"body":"And I just looked at this and all the other Gil Rays and Crookshanks and"},{"startTime":2233.495,"endTime":2234.285,"body":"Rowlands and tens."},{"startTime":2234.285,"endTime":2236.165,"body":"And I thought, God, this is so wonderful."},{"startTime":2236.755,"endTime":2237.565,"body":"This is so wonderful."},{"startTime":2237.765,"endTime":2240.698,"body":"'cause we're taking the piss out of the power and we are doing it in"},{"startTime":2240.698,"endTime":2241.285,"body":"a beautiful way."},{"startTime":2241.285,"endTime":2244.354,"body":"And I went to my father's old desk and I found some nibs, and I"},{"startTime":2244.354,"endTime":2246.605,"body":"started trying to cross action the way that Gil Ray etched."},{"startTime":2247.625,"endTime":2253.736,"body":"And it's, um, he's a man we honor, he almost certainly committed suicide, having gone"},{"startTime":2253.736,"endTime":2254.143,"body":"previously mad through drink, basically, um, killed himself two weeks before the Battle of Water"},{"startTime":2254.143,"endTime":2260.255,"body":"loom."},{"startTime":2260.795,"endTime":2264.191,"body":"And on the 200th anniversary of his death, we, uh, as God was chairman of"},{"startTime":2264.191,"endTime":2267.135,"body":"the British Cartoonist Association at the time, we had a Gil Guray dinner."},{"startTime":2267.275,"endTime":2274.986,"body":"And I commissioned from the Cumbrian Plumb Pudding Company, a genuine plumb pudding, weighed three"},{"startTime":2274.986,"endTime":2276.015,"body":"stone \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2276.735,"endTime":2281.47,"body":"I got, uh, my two colleagues, uh, Bob Moran, who was sadly gone to the"},{"startTime":2281.47,"endTime":2285.575,"body":"bad recently and Ben Jennings to dress up as pit and bonaparte carving."},{"startTime":2285.775,"endTime":2286.655,"body":"And then we ate it."},{"startTime":2287.555,"endTime":2288.135,"body":"It was great."},{"startTime":2288.915,"endTime":2297.006,"body":"Um, and, uh, the point about Gilroy is he never flinched from the central purpose"},{"startTime":2297.006,"endTime":2297.545,"body":"of satire, which is not as, and Martin said, I might explain why I've never"},{"startTime":2297.545,"endTime":2307.255,"body":"worked for private eye."},{"startTime":2307.255,"endTime":2309.015,"body":"It's because he in hislop hates my guts, basically."},{"startTime":2309.015,"endTime":2309.775,"body":"That's the simple reason."},{"startTime":2310.355,"endTime":2314.031,"body":"Um, and probably because I've repeated this line many often, very often, he, I've in"},{"startTime":2314.031,"endTime":2314.276,"body":"hislop often said, the purpose of satire is to puncture pomposity, which I believe to"},{"startTime":2314.276,"endTime":2320.405,"body":"be one of the most pompous phrases in the English language."},{"startTime":2320.905,"endTime":2324.287,"body":"The purpose of satire is in the lines of the old joke about the kid"},{"startTime":2324.287,"endTime":2324.512,"body":"who comes back from his first day at work and complains to his mum about"},{"startTime":2324.512,"endTime":2324.738,"body":"what a bastard the foreman is, said, well, if he's so smart and clever, come,"},{"startTime":2324.738,"endTime":2332.405,"body":"he shits and he's gonna die."},{"startTime":2333.025,"endTime":2333.925,"body":"And that's what it is."},{"startTime":2333.995,"endTime":2337.309,"body":"It's reminding those people who think they're more powerful than us, that they're better than"},{"startTime":2337.309,"endTime":2337.53,"body":"us, they're wiser than us, they should be richer than us, and more powerful than"},{"startTime":2337.53,"endTime":2340.845,"body":"us."},{"startTime":2341.065,"endTime":2344.71,"body":"Uh, they should be in control of our destiny, that they like us shit, and"},{"startTime":2344.71,"endTime":2345.925,"body":"they like us will die."},{"startTime":2346.865,"endTime":2347.685,"body":"Simple as that."},{"startTime":2348.035,"endTime":2350.005,"body":"It's the great leveler, shitting and dying."},{"startTime":2350.025,"endTime":2354.725,"body":"The great leveler, great leveler and Hogarth instinctively understood this."},{"startTime":2354.905,"endTime":2359.324,"body":"So this image, which I, I love this so much, it appears to be a"},{"startTime":2359.324,"endTime":2362.565,"body":"jingoistic celebration of our victory at the Battle of the Nile."},{"startTime":2362.795,"endTime":2367.981,"body":"There's Jack tar, the naval avatar of John Bull Bipping Bonaparte on the face, sitting"},{"startTime":2367.981,"endTime":2369.365,"body":"a stride the globe."},{"startTime":2369.785,"endTime":2372.125,"body":"Uh, and, uh, but it's called fighting for the Dunhill."},{"startTime":2372.465,"endTime":2373.765,"body":"It just all sort a load of shit."},{"startTime":2373.765,"endTime":2375.885,"body":"And this is a very early Gil Ray."},{"startTime":2375.965,"endTime":2378.552,"body":"I discovered this for the first time two years ago in a print shop in"},{"startTime":2378.552,"endTime":2378.725,"body":"London."},{"startTime":2378.785,"endTime":2379.445,"body":"I'd never seen it before."},{"startTime":2379.445,"endTime":2382.725,"body":"I thought I'd seen every single Gil Ray and what it is."},{"startTime":2383.145,"endTime":2384.325,"body":"Who did this when was about 22."},{"startTime":2384.505,"endTime":2390.493,"body":"It is the only image I'm aware of, of a serving prime minister in this"},{"startTime":2390.493,"endTime":2395.285,"body":"case case, the Marcus of Rockingham, um, both vomiting and defecating simultaneously."},{"startTime":2396.955,"endTime":2398.645,"body":"This should be on the bank notes."},{"startTime":2398.675,"endTime":2403.085,"body":"This is what being, this is what being British is all about, believe me."},{"startTime":2404.465,"endTime":2408.312,"body":"And another early Gil Ray, this is just a sort of cheap J at the"},{"startTime":2408.312,"endTime":2410.365,"body":"Scots 'cause they're always good for a laugh."},{"startTime":2410.665,"endTime":2414.845,"body":"Uh, um, this is a, a Scotsman failing to understand how to use a latrine."},{"startTime":2415.665,"endTime":2419.895,"body":"Um, but more to the point I'm kicking up against the power is this fantastic"},{"startTime":2419.895,"endTime":2424.125,"body":"image of pick when they first introduced paper money to help pay the Napoleonic wars."},{"startTime":2424.585,"endTime":2426.965,"body":"And he's king Maass in reverse."},{"startTime":2427.985,"endTime":2434.257,"body":"So, um, so everything he touches turns to paper, but he is, again, this is"},{"startTime":2434.257,"endTime":2434.675,"body":"tearing aside the raymonds of power to show the stinking pissing, shitting, sweating human being"},{"startTime":2434.675,"endTime":2445.965,"body":"underneath where he's literally vomiting money and shitting into the Bank of England."},{"startTime":2446.505,"endTime":2452.578,"body":"And, um, this image about Char, uh, George II and his consort being told by"},{"startTime":2452.578,"endTime":2452.983,"body":"Pitt, the younger about the assassination of the King of Denmark, there is no reason"},{"startTime":2452.983,"endTime":2464.725,"body":"whatsoever for the king and his consorts to be shown at stool beyond the fact."},{"startTime":2464.795,"endTime":2468.403,"body":"It's just funny to see the king having a dump because he shits and he"},{"startTime":2468.403,"endTime":2468.885,"body":"will die."},{"startTime":2469.425,"endTime":2476.078,"body":"And, uh, this wonderful, wonderful image where it is actually a genuinely patriotic image where"},{"startTime":2476.078,"endTime":2476.522,"body":"the king literally embodies the nation, his head up in Northumberland, repelling the French invasion"},{"startTime":2476.522,"endTime":2486.725,"body":"fleet by shitting out of his asshole in Portsmouth."},{"startTime":2487.025,"endTime":2490.085,"body":"If you've been there recently, it could be a photograph \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2492.505,"endTime":2495.245,"body":"And let's, let's move beyond, beyond the Cloacal here."},{"startTime":2495.305,"endTime":2497.445,"body":"So, you know, let's not forget the rest of it."},{"startTime":2497.465,"endTime":2502.142,"body":"So this is the, uh, this is the Turkish ambassador presenting his credentials to, uh,"},{"startTime":2502.142,"endTime":2504.325,"body":"George III at the quarter of St."},{"startTime":2504.325,"endTime":2504.525,"body":"James."},{"startTime":2504.585,"endTime":2509.188,"body":"Uh, which is of course a similar vein to this dirty postcard by Donald McGill,"},{"startTime":2509.188,"endTime":2513.485,"body":"which was by inspiration for this cartoon about the collapse of Northern Rock \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2513.485,"endTime":2518.967,"body":"Um, and you know, it's not just the Brits doing, this is obviously the death"},{"startTime":2518.967,"endTime":2524.085,"body":"of Mara by the great French revolutionary painter, David, who likewise did this image."},{"startTime":2524.585,"endTime":2527.645,"body":"Um, and that's, that's the British establishment there."},{"startTime":2527.705,"endTime":2529.685,"body":"You can tell that by its black leathery wings."},{"startTime":2530.505,"endTime":2534.827,"body":"And you can also tell because it's, it's it's asshole is the face of George"},{"startTime":2534.827,"endTime":2536.845,"body":"ii, uh, shitting bayonets on the po."},{"startTime":2539.345,"endTime":2544.541,"body":"And a a hundred years later, this is another French, uh, French cartoonist at the"},{"startTime":2544.541,"endTime":2548.005,"body":"time of the Anton cordial when Edward III visited Paris."},{"startTime":2548.025,"endTime":2550.725,"body":"And there's Britannia lifting up her skirts, showing his face."},{"startTime":2551.305,"endTime":2555.107,"body":"And, uh, this is a frankly disgraceful image I did at the time of the"},{"startTime":2555.107,"endTime":2555.361,"body":"London Olympics because they were threatening to sue anybody who used the Olympic rings in"},{"startTime":2555.361,"endTime":2559.925,"body":"an unauthorized fashion \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2559.925,"endTime":2563.741,"body":"So I just, I was just rather hoping they'd sue me in a test case"},{"startTime":2563.741,"endTime":2563.996,"body":"and we could get a, a kind of veterinarian proctologist to being a, bring a"},{"startTime":2563.996,"endTime":2569.085,"body":"real five assed pig into court."},{"startTime":2569.085,"endTime":2570.245,"body":"But unfortunately, they never sued."},{"startTime":2570.665,"endTime":2575.525,"body":"And this was an image I did the day before in Obama's inauguration, where they're"},{"startTime":2575.525,"endTime":2578.765,"body":"hosing, uh, Bush and Cheney off the stars and stripes."},{"startTime":2578.765,"endTime":2581.365,"body":"That's a, that's a Tony blessed skid mark there, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2582.025,"endTime":2588.085,"body":"And, um, this is a cartoon I did just before on the first anniversary of"},{"startTime":2588.085,"endTime":2592.125,"body":"nine 11 when they were planning to, uh, invade Iraq."},{"startTime":2593.025,"endTime":2596.845,"body":"And Blair recalled parliament momentarily."},{"startTime":2596.865,"endTime":2600.874,"body":"Oh yes, I remember Parliament and Bush went to the United Nations and they were"},{"startTime":2600.874,"endTime":2601.141,"body":"basically engaged in a conspiracy lit of the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people"},{"startTime":2601.141,"endTime":2605.685,"body":"they'd never met."},{"startTime":2606.225,"endTime":2610.666,"body":"And interestingly, um, not only did several readers complain about this, but so did the"},{"startTime":2610.666,"endTime":2610.962,"body":"editor of the Guardian, Adam Rusbridger the next day saying, oh dear, couldn't you have"},{"startTime":2610.962,"endTime":2616.885,"body":"put some underpants on them, \u003claugh\u003e?"},{"startTime":2619.235,"endTime":2623.156,"body":"Because we all know that bear, I mean, amongst all primates, bearing your buttocks is"},{"startTime":2623.156,"endTime":2624.725,"body":"a way of taunting somebody else."},{"startTime":2625.185,"endTime":2627.605,"body":"So, you know, Alan Rusbridger with the greatest respect to him."},{"startTime":2627.665,"endTime":2630.992,"body":"And the readers were more offended by the prime ministerial and presidential bottoms than they"},{"startTime":2630.992,"endTime":2631.214,"body":"were by the fact that these men were engaged in a conspiracy to led to"},{"startTime":2631.214,"endTime":2637.205,"body":"the deaths of hundreds and hundreds of thousands of people they'd never met."},{"startTime":2638.265,"endTime":2639.965,"body":"And, uh, this along the same theme."},{"startTime":2639.995,"endTime":2643.845,"body":"This is there about, about to, to lick the presidential bum."},{"startTime":2644.785,"endTime":2648.019,"body":"And I filed this and my then editor that day was Steven Moss, very good"},{"startTime":2648.019,"endTime":2648.235,"body":"friend of mine, and he phoned me up and said, Martin, Martin, I've just seen"},{"startTime":2648.235,"endTime":2651.685,"body":"the cartoon."},{"startTime":2651.955,"endTime":2653.605,"body":"I've got a terrible hangover today."},{"startTime":2654.265,"endTime":2657.845,"body":"Um, any chance of making the tongue of its, it's making me feel sick."},{"startTime":2658.605,"endTime":2660.565,"body":"I said, my aim is to please."},{"startTime":2660.705,"endTime":2667.845,"body":"And we should now have some look at that, look at that Disney, nothing."},{"startTime":2667.985,"endTime":2670.965,"body":"Anyway, cartoon, let's get to that cartoons, a bit of, you know, art history here."},{"startTime":2671.155,"endTime":2675.026,"body":"Cartoon Gilroy had no idea what you meant if you said, oh, you are a"},{"startTime":2675.026,"endTime":2675.285,"body":"cartoonist."},{"startTime":2675.325,"endTime":2679.614,"body":"I said, well, you know, cartoon is a preparatory sketch for an old painting, first"},{"startTime":2679.614,"endTime":2679.9,"body":"coined 1841 and the pages of Punch Magazine, when they were having cartoons sketches for"},{"startTime":2679.9,"endTime":2680.186,"body":"the new, um, murals in the New Houses of Parliament, which were being built at"},{"startTime":2680.186,"endTime":2688.765,"body":"the time."},{"startTime":2689.425,"endTime":2694.937,"body":"And Dickie Doyle showed the London poor Huling from the economic downturn trying to keep"},{"startTime":2694.937,"endTime":2698.245,"body":"warm in the studios where they were showing up."},{"startTime":2698.245,"endTime":2699.285,"body":"And that's the origin of the word."},{"startTime":2699.285,"endTime":2700.565,"body":"That's what cartoon comes from."},{"startTime":2700.775,"endTime":2701.925,"body":"Every day is a school day."},{"startTime":2702.265,"endTime":2706.945,"body":"And, um, it's been an extraordinarily powerful and dominant form."},{"startTime":2707.085,"endTime":2707.785,"body":"The punch."},{"startTime":2708.495,"endTime":2713.962,"body":"70 years later, tenal, the illustrator of Alice Wonderland, does this image of Bismarck being"},{"startTime":2713.962,"endTime":2715.785,"body":"sacked by Kaiser William ii."},{"startTime":2715.895,"endTime":2722.597,"body":"Both of them thought this was an absolute appropriate comment and the best comment imaginable"},{"startTime":2722.597,"endTime":2724.385,"body":"on what had happened."},{"startTime":2724.965,"endTime":2727.345,"body":"And again, it's an image which we've nicked over and over again."},{"startTime":2727.345,"endTime":2731.185,"body":"This is when Boris Johnson was sacked for lying by, uh, Michael Howard."},{"startTime":2731.565,"endTime":2734.305,"body":"And this is when Liz Truss resigned."},{"startTime":2734.485,"endTime":2736.865,"body":"The boat sunk by this point, so she's floating up to the surface."},{"startTime":2737.645,"endTime":2740.505,"body":"And 40 years on, you get the date."},{"startTime":2740.505,"endTime":2746.138,"body":"The great David Lowe, the greatest political cartoonist of the 20th century, uh, who produces"},{"startTime":2746.138,"endTime":2747.265,"body":"this extraordinary image."},{"startTime":2747.805,"endTime":2749.945,"body":"Um, the Bitters cartoon of his career."},{"startTime":2750.045,"endTime":2754.489,"body":"He said, when Hitler and Stalin greet each other over the slain corpse of Poland"},{"startTime":2754.489,"endTime":2754.785,"body":"after the ribbon tr Molotov Pac at the beginning of the Second World War, a"},{"startTime":2754.785,"endTime":2755.082,"body":"cartoon, I then pared pastiche, uh, when Tony Blair invited Margaret Thatcher to number 10"},{"startTime":2755.082,"endTime":2755.378,"body":"before James Callahan, after he won in 1997 that died in the wall arch socialist"},{"startTime":2755.378,"endTime":2769.305,"body":"archer of Brussels, I believe."},{"startTime":2769.455,"endTime":2772.265,"body":"Yeah, the callus, uh, record of the social fabric."},{"startTime":2772.425,"endTime":2773.945,"body":"I presume would you have some brioche?"},{"startTime":2774.645,"endTime":2776.785,"body":"And that's John Major under the welcome Matt."},{"startTime":2777.165,"endTime":2780.745,"body":"Um, also there's Boris and Putin."},{"startTime":2781.515,"endTime":2785.854,"body":"Boris at the beginning of the Ukraine War after, you know, the tour is just"},{"startTime":2785.854,"endTime":2789.905,"body":"about acknowledging that they've been bankrolled by the Russians for the previous 15 years."},{"startTime":2790.125,"endTime":2791.705,"body":"Sh cut that out."},{"startTime":2792.245,"endTime":2797.505,"body":"Anyway, um, late 1920s, three men had three simultaneous insights."},{"startTime":2797.825,"endTime":2797.985,"body":"Interesting."},{"startTime":2798.405,"endTime":2802.059,"body":"The first was Conrad Laurenz, the Ologist who rec, you know, established the fact that"},{"startTime":2802.059,"endTime":2802.302,"body":"if a gosling hatches out of an egg, you can hold a wooden spoon up"},{"startTime":2802.302,"endTime":2802.546,"body":"to it and it'll imprint on the wooden spoon, and it will follow it around"},{"startTime":2802.546,"endTime":2810.585,"body":"thinking is its his mother."},{"startTime":2811.525,"endTime":2820.836,"body":"Um, Walt Disney invented Steamboat Willie Mickey Mouse realizing that Mickey Mouse absolute brilliant icon"},{"startTime":2820.836,"endTime":2827.665,"body":"because Mickey Mouse can be reduced to three circles, fantastic trademark."},{"startTime":2828.365,"endTime":2833.369,"body":"And almost exactly the same time, one of Hitler's henchmen before Hitler came to power"},{"startTime":2833.369,"endTime":2836.705,"body":"said, Hey boss, what's with the stupid Charlie Chaplin mustache?"},{"startTime":2837.095,"endTime":2841.453,"body":"They said, my mustache is very political, by which he meant not only did I"},{"startTime":2841.453,"endTime":2841.744,"body":"identify him as an ordinary bloke, but also it meant that he could be turned"},{"startTime":2841.744,"endTime":2847.265,"body":"into his own auto icon."},{"startTime":2847.645,"endTime":2853.323,"body":"He could be turned into his own idio Graham, he could be reduced to a"},{"startTime":2853.323,"endTime":2853.701,"body":"black square and a black triangle, and be instantly recognizable that he was in fact"},{"startTime":2853.701,"endTime":2863.165,"body":"collaborating with his caricature, which politicians have been doing for centuries."},{"startTime":2863.675,"endTime":2867.569,"body":"Because the worst thing for a politician than appearing in a cartoon and is not"},{"startTime":2867.569,"endTime":2870.685,"body":"appearing in a cartoon 'cause it means they're insufficiently important or interesting."},{"startTime":2871.425,"endTime":2875.085,"body":"And, um, David Lowe Hitler was a great fan of David Lowe's."},{"startTime":2875.275,"endTime":2879.685,"body":"Lowe sent him a cartoon in 1930s, signed it, saying from one artist to another."},{"startTime":2880.025,"endTime":2883.962,"body":"And then when Hitler came to power, he started doing cartoons like this, the difficulty"},{"startTime":2883.962,"endTime":2886.325,"body":"of sharing shaking hands with Gods a good gag."},{"startTime":2886.745,"endTime":2891.942,"body":"Um, and, uh, as a consequence, Lowe was placed on the Gestapo death list, along"},{"startTime":2891.942,"endTime":2892.289,"body":"with about 20 other British cartoonists who would've been shot on site, had the Nazis"},{"startTime":2892.289,"endTime":2900.605,"body":"invaded, including Heath Robinson, who did political cartoons for punch."},{"startTime":2901.505,"endTime":2904.79,"body":"Um, one wonders if the cartoon Loe sent to Hitler was there in the bunker"},{"startTime":2904.79,"endTime":2905.885,"body":"with him, we don't know."},{"startTime":2906.385,"endTime":2910.804,"body":"But this cartoon, I think was, that is without question the most immediately effective cartoon"},{"startTime":2910.804,"endTime":2914.045,"body":"of the last 50 years by Nick Garland of the Telegraph."},{"startTime":2914.075,"endTime":2919.071,"body":"This appeared in The Spectator when they did an interview with Nicholas Wrigley about German"},{"startTime":2919.071,"endTime":2919.405,"body":"reunification."},{"startTime":2919.905,"endTime":2924.805,"body":"And had they just run the interview where Ridley was saying, you know, Cole's like"},{"startTime":2924.805,"endTime":2926.765,"body":"Hitler, it probably would've got away."},{"startTime":2927.145,"endTime":2933.279,"body":"But doing this, this image, Wrigley was out of office on the day this hit"},{"startTime":2933.279,"endTime":2939.005,"body":"the news stands because instantly you could see what the point he was making."},{"startTime":2939.025,"endTime":2940.765,"body":"He could not argue his way out of this."},{"startTime":2941.665,"endTime":2945.045,"body":"And, you know, in terms of cartoons, everybody's doing it."},{"startTime":2945.045,"endTime":2952.218,"body":"This is the unfortunate Giorgi pov, uh, who was the comma of mines and was"},{"startTime":2952.218,"endTime":2956.045,"body":"murdered by Stalin in the Purges in 1937."},{"startTime":2957.025,"endTime":2963.445,"body":"And this is a drawing of Giorgi POV by Joseph Stalin because as the poll"},{"startTime":2963.445,"endTime":2963.873,"body":"bureau were meeting in the 1930s and transporting entire nations into Siberia and signing off"},{"startTime":2963.873,"endTime":2976.285,"body":"the deaths of millions, they would do drawings of each other on their position papers."},{"startTime":2980.485,"endTime":2982.885,"body":"I didn't say all my colleagues were fun, you know, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":2983.225,"endTime":2985.645,"body":"Anyway, I'm talking again of, of war criminals."},{"startTime":2985.645,"endTime":2987.525,"body":"Um, this is, uh, Tony Blair ethics."},{"startTime":2987.715,"endTime":2992.301,"body":"Getting back to the Disney Point, the three things you have three things, Blair, mad"},{"startTime":2992.301,"endTime":2993.525,"body":"Eyes, big ears, teeth."},{"startTime":2994.345,"endTime":2998.109,"body":"Um, a point I proved when I was sitting at a Oxbridge High table once"},{"startTime":2998.109,"endTime":2998.36,"body":"that I was doing, I'd been commissioned to do a drawing of the fellows at"},{"startTime":2998.36,"endTime":2998.611,"body":"Feast, um, which I then did, and they, the master refused to hang it in"},{"startTime":2998.611,"endTime":3007.645,"body":"the senior parlor, which was quite an achievement."},{"startTime":3008.145,"endTime":3012.857,"body":"Um, the bloke sitting opposite me was an entomologist whose entire career was given over"},{"startTime":3012.857,"endTime":3015.685,"body":"to teasing Beatles outta the bark of tropical hardwoods."},{"startTime":3015.705,"endTime":3019.045,"body":"He said, you do drawings of politicians for newspapers."},{"startTime":3019.045,"endTime":3020.085,"body":"Now I don't get that at all."},{"startTime":3020.135,"endTime":3020.965,"body":"Don't get it at all."},{"startTime":3021.745,"endTime":3025.422,"body":"Uh, and the cheese course came along and I just did some things and handed,"},{"startTime":3025.422,"endTime":3028.365,"body":"he said, oh, fucking hell, it's Tony Blair as indeed it was."},{"startTime":3028.365,"endTime":3028.845,"body":"And I ate it."},{"startTime":3028.845,"endTime":3031.285,"body":"And here is Blair as a skull."},{"startTime":3031.395,"endTime":3035.005,"body":"Here is Blair as a skull chewing Corbin's leg."},{"startTime":3035.585,"endTime":3039.925,"body":"Uh, here is Obama, here is not Obama \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3040.305,"endTime":3043.194,"body":"Um, this was turned into a poster by some anarchist friends of mine who hung"},{"startTime":3043.194,"endTime":3043.965,"body":"it up in Uxbridge."},{"startTime":3043.965,"endTime":3045.165,"body":"It was there for 24 hours."},{"startTime":3045.365,"endTime":3046.165,"body":"You're in the rush hour."},{"startTime":3046.235,"endTime":3047.125,"body":"It's great \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3047.385,"endTime":3050.021,"body":"Um, this is, uh, you know, you can do this at home, make your own"},{"startTime":3050.021,"endTime":3050.725,"body":"Boris Johnson at home."},{"startTime":3051.205,"endTime":3054.765,"body":"I made another one for the Cartoon Museum there with Kenneth Baker, big cartoon fan."},{"startTime":3055.265,"endTime":3057.365,"body":"Um, there they are again with a pinata."},{"startTime":3057.845,"endTime":3062.202,"body":"I pimped, uh, of, uh, Nigel Farage, which, um, got severely beaten by the comedian"},{"startTime":3062.202,"endTime":3062.493,"body":"Mark Steeler party we had and was then thrown off the end of Hern Bay"},{"startTime":3062.493,"endTime":3068.885,"body":"Pier during a cartoon festival stuffed with chips."},{"startTime":3069.105,"endTime":3072.21,"body":"We threw him out, he floated on the water, floated out about 300 yards, and"},{"startTime":3072.21,"endTime":3073.245,"body":"then the seagulls swooped down."},{"startTime":3073.315,"endTime":3074.045,"body":"It's great \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3074.305,"endTime":3077.005,"body":"Um, here's a cartoon I did in 2016."},{"startTime":3077.065,"endTime":3078.565,"body":"I'm very proud of very prescient."},{"startTime":3078.865,"endTime":3083.521,"body":"Um, you know, as I said, you know, the worst thing that been appearing in"},{"startTime":3083.521,"endTime":3086.005,"body":"a cartoon is not appearing in a cartoon."},{"startTime":3086.175,"endTime":3089.527,"body":"These two, as I said, at an American festival, I was at once, they're two"},{"startTime":3089.527,"endTime":3090.645,"body":"cheeks of the same ass."},{"startTime":3090.645,"endTime":3093.685,"body":"Then took me 15 minutes to explain what that phrase means, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3094.185,"endTime":3097.165,"body":"But both of them are narcissists."},{"startTime":3097.235,"endTime":3100.165,"body":"Both of them hate being laughed at."},{"startTime":3100.165,"endTime":3105.47,"body":"They love attention, they hate being laughed at, which is why they have tried to"},{"startTime":3105.47,"endTime":3106.885,"body":"control the laughter agenda."},{"startTime":3107.645,"endTime":3112.445,"body":"I mean, Boris Johnson lands a punchline like the R 1 0 1, to be"},{"startTime":3112.445,"endTime":3112.765,"body":"honest."},{"startTime":3113.565,"endTime":3116.125,"body":"I mean, he is, as I've often said, a Tory's idea of funny."},{"startTime":3116.355,"endTime":3117.085,"body":"He's not funny."},{"startTime":3117.105,"endTime":3117.965,"body":"He can't tell jokes."},{"startTime":3118.545,"endTime":3123.397,"body":"Um, but he plays the fool because, you know, it will endear people to him,"},{"startTime":3123.397,"endTime":3124.045,"body":"he thinks."},{"startTime":3124.705,"endTime":3126.925,"body":"Um, but in fact they hate it."},{"startTime":3126.925,"endTime":3129.045,"body":"Their skin appears to be inches thick."},{"startTime":3129.045,"endTime":3132.125,"body":"It's microns thin because they're narcissistic sociopaths."},{"startTime":3132.705,"endTime":3138.75,"body":"Um, and, uh, here is, here is, uh, Johnson, the day he resigns, surrounded by"},{"startTime":3138.75,"endTime":3140.765,"body":"his various ideas of himself."},{"startTime":3140.765,"endTime":3145.982,"body":"And here is a 2016 that year of infamy with, um, Trump as a pool"},{"startTime":3145.982,"endTime":3148.765,"body":"of puke on the bonnet of the car."},{"startTime":3148.875,"endTime":3150.725,"body":"Here he is, top of the world, ma."},{"startTime":3151.355,"endTime":3152.605,"body":"Here he is coming back."},{"startTime":3152.625,"endTime":3153.805,"body":"Oh God, this is so depressing."},{"startTime":3154.005,"endTime":3159.005,"body":"Arch."},{"startTime":3154.045,"endTime":3154.685,"body":"Let's cut him up."},{"startTime":3154.685,"endTime":3156.445,"body":"Let's mark, look, raise the tone."},{"startTime":3156.665,"endTime":3158.285,"body":"So I'm kind of slightly overrun."},{"startTime":3158.325,"endTime":3158.965,"body":"I hope that's okay."},{"startTime":3158.985,"endTime":3159.445,"body":"So yeah."},{"startTime":3159.825,"endTime":3162.045,"body":"Um, this of course, obviously is better."},{"startTime":3162.045,"endTime":3165.045,"body":"Botticelli's Venus, uh, this isn't, um, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3166.075,"endTime":3168.565,"body":"This is, uh, more noticeably."},{"startTime":3168.625,"endTime":3171.285,"body":"Uh, Anne Whitcomb, you might recognize her, uh, who's a nice woman."},{"startTime":3171.365,"endTime":3176.525,"body":"I mean, Anne Weum and I disagree on that, absolutely everything, probably including breathing."},{"startTime":3176.985,"endTime":3178.805,"body":"But I like her."},{"startTime":3178.825,"endTime":3181.177,"body":"She likes me, you know, and I drew her once for a thing I was"},{"startTime":3181.177,"endTime":3181.805,"body":"doing for the spectator."},{"startTime":3181.925,"endTime":3185.0,"body":"I drew her from the, I was interviewing her at the same time, and she"},{"startTime":3185.0,"endTime":3186.845,"body":"said, it's just all jolly good fun, isn't it?"},{"startTime":3186.845,"endTime":3187.485,"body":"All these car?"},{"startTime":3187.605,"endTime":3188.485,"body":"I said, no, no, no."},{"startTime":3188.545,"endTime":3189.325,"body":"And it's not jolly good."},{"startTime":3189.325,"endTime":3191.845,"body":"This is, this is assassination without the blood."},{"startTime":3191.855,"endTime":3193.125,"body":"We're trying to destroy you."},{"startTime":3193.225,"endTime":3193.805,"body":"No, no, no."},{"startTime":3193.885,"endTime":3195.005,"body":"Of course, you'd have to think that."},{"startTime":3195.935,"endTime":3196.725,"body":"You'd have to think that."},{"startTime":3196.965,"endTime":3200.745,"body":"'cause otherwise you would, they would go mad with existentialist dread thinking, you know, people"},{"startTime":3200.745,"endTime":3204.525,"body":"like me are doing these horrible drawings of things, and I know what it's like."},{"startTime":3204.565,"endTime":3208.492,"body":"I mean, I've been drawn by fellow cartoonists at, at, at cartoon festivals, and, you"},{"startTime":3208.492,"endTime":3208.754,"body":"know, somehow they managed to miss the young Harrison Ford I see in the mirror"},{"startTime":3208.754,"endTime":3213.205,"body":"of him \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3213.545,"endTime":3215.485,"body":"And it, it's, it's truly transgressive."},{"startTime":3215.485,"endTime":3217.205,"body":"Anyway, getting back to Botticelli's Venus."},{"startTime":3217.205,"endTime":3217.645,"body":"There we go."},{"startTime":3217.645,"endTime":3218.085,"body":"That's him."},{"startTime":3218.585,"endTime":3219.485,"body":"And there he is again."},{"startTime":3219.665,"endTime":3221.845,"body":"And, uh, there, there she is."},{"startTime":3222.145,"endTime":3224.485,"body":"Um, and you'll see various things."},{"startTime":3224.485,"endTime":3226.845,"body":"You, you may notice these, these things on the horizon here."},{"startTime":3226.845,"endTime":3229.205,"body":"They, they, they occur now and again."},{"startTime":3229.305,"endTime":3230.725,"body":"Um, those are fur cups."},{"startTime":3231.825,"endTime":3237.948,"body":"Um, an homage to merit, Oppenheimer's Obje, which is a fur cup and saucer, A"},{"startTime":3237.948,"endTime":3238.765,"body":"surrealist obje."},{"startTime":3239.065,"endTime":3242.565,"body":"And as an homage, it needs to be pronounced with a thick French accent."},{"startTime":3243.265,"endTime":3250.077,"body":"And it's therefore Aup Aup Aup, uh, which is how I've managed to get that"},{"startTime":3250.077,"endTime":3250.531,"body":"obscene sexual epithet onto the page of the pages of the guardian on a almost"},{"startTime":3250.531,"endTime":3261.885,"body":"biweekly basis for the last 12 years, which may offend you."},{"startTime":3262.985,"endTime":3264.365,"body":"And now we get to the crux of the matter."},{"startTime":3264.365,"endTime":3265.045,"body":"It may offend you."},{"startTime":3265.165,"endTime":3267.295,"body":"I mean, as I've warned you, if you're gonna be offended, if you don't wanna"},{"startTime":3267.295,"endTime":3268.005,"body":"be offended, you should leave."},{"startTime":3268.005,"endTime":3268.565,"body":"But you're still here."},{"startTime":3268.565,"endTime":3272.125,"body":"So presumably you want to be offended and, and people do want to be offended."},{"startTime":3272.245,"endTime":3273.325,"body":"I know this to my cost."},{"startTime":3273.585,"endTime":3277.525,"body":"Um, but, uh, you know, it's partly my job."},{"startTime":3277.635,"endTime":3281.576,"body":"It's my job to give offense, not to have offense taken, but to give it"},{"startTime":3281.576,"endTime":3282.365,"body":"to target offense."},{"startTime":3282.385,"endTime":3284.485,"body":"And, and, you know, it's about lowering the tone."},{"startTime":3284.485,"endTime":3285.525,"body":"It's about making it gag."},{"startTime":3285.565,"endTime":3290.965,"body":"I mean, in this case, this is when, um, the boss of Apple, whose name"},{"startTime":3290.965,"endTime":3293.845,"body":"has just escaped me, what was he called?"},{"startTime":3293.845,"endTime":3294.405,"body":"Steve Jobs."},{"startTime":3294.575,"endTime":3295.525,"body":"Steve Jobs, thank you."},{"startTime":3296.545,"endTime":3298.805,"body":"Uh, a truly horrible man actually."},{"startTime":3299.025,"endTime":3302.943,"body":"And when he became the CEO again of Apple, he, he canceled all their charitable"},{"startTime":3302.943,"endTime":3303.205,"body":"donations."},{"startTime":3303.545,"endTime":3307.245,"body":"He shortened his own life by refusing to be treated by proper oncologists."},{"startTime":3307.965,"endTime":3310.485,"body":"I mean, he was a sort of psycho nerd, like most of them."},{"startTime":3311.145,"endTime":3311.965,"body":"But, and he died."},{"startTime":3311.965,"endTime":3315.222,"body":"And I thought, well, you know, this is, this is quite a clever visual conceit"},{"startTime":3315.222,"endTime":3316.525,"body":"of an iPad with his coffin."},{"startTime":3317.185,"endTime":3322.111,"body":"But on the Guardian website, people were soon saying, he is not even called in"},{"startTime":3322.111,"endTime":3322.44,"body":"the ground in this disgusting cartoon because they didn't like the grief app down here,"},{"startTime":3322.44,"endTime":3322.768,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e, until somebody posted a link to the genuine Apple grief app where you could"},{"startTime":3322.768,"endTime":3323.096,"body":"take out your, you know, handheld device and you could have a picture of a"},{"startTime":3323.096,"endTime":3338.205,"body":"guttering candle on it."},{"startTime":3338.225,"endTime":3341.765,"body":"You could hold like an icon outside an Apple store."},{"startTime":3342.965,"endTime":3347.306,"body":"I mean, genuine, likewise, when the Pope died, I thought this was actually quite a"},{"startTime":3347.306,"endTime":3347.885,"body":"sweet cartoon."},{"startTime":3348.555,"endTime":3349.085,"body":"What do you mean?"},{"startTime":3349.085,"endTime":3352.245,"body":"In my pro-life, I got death threats for this."},{"startTime":3353.515,"endTime":3354.125,"body":"Genuinely."},{"startTime":3354.125,"endTime":3355.645,"body":"People wanted me to die."},{"startTime":3356.195,"endTime":3359.892,"body":"They told me they wanted me to die, and they wanted to do the killing"},{"startTime":3359.892,"endTime":3361.125,"body":"bit because of this cartoon."},{"startTime":3362.245,"endTime":3367.165,"body":"Likewise, this cartoon, which I did for an atheist magazine, I've forgotten bloody Mother's Day."},{"startTime":3367.165,"endTime":3367.845,"body":"I go, don't worry about me."},{"startTime":3368.225,"endTime":3373.43,"body":"Um, one of the board of trustees resigned in disgust because it was so horrific"},{"startTime":3373.43,"endTime":3375.165,"body":"because it was so offensive."},{"startTime":3375.305,"endTime":3376.485,"body":"It was so, it's not offensive."},{"startTime":3377.345,"endTime":3378.405,"body":"Um, I mean, this is offensive."},{"startTime":3378.405,"endTime":3379.485,"body":"This is deliberately offensive."},{"startTime":3379.545,"endTime":3382.125,"body":"You know, it's sort of putting the fundamental back into fundamentalism."},{"startTime":3382.545,"endTime":3387.729,"body":"Um, and, and this one was pretty offensive, but it wasn't as offensive as what"},{"startTime":3387.729,"endTime":3388.075,"body":"these, this was another child sex abuse scandal, um, on the ca part of the"},{"startTime":3388.075,"endTime":3393.605,"body":"Catholic church."},{"startTime":3394.145,"endTime":3399.504,"body":"And, and of course this image, which was at the time of the Danish cartoons"},{"startTime":3399.504,"endTime":3399.862,"body":"row in 2007, um, when we had the beginning of something which now stalks the"},{"startTime":3399.862,"endTime":3400.219,"body":"earth, which we are living with all the time, where increasingly large numbers of people,"},{"startTime":3400.219,"endTime":3400.576,"body":"mostly thanks to that thing I referred to earlier on about how we've managed to"},{"startTime":3400.576,"endTime":3418.085,"body":"download our collective eed into the internet."},{"startTime":3418.085,"endTime":3421.332,"body":"And we can just look at it in wonder all the time and hate each"},{"startTime":3421.332,"endTime":3421.765,"body":"other forever."},{"startTime":3422.345,"endTime":3427.707,"body":"People think I should be allowed to say whatever I like about whoever I choose"},{"startTime":3427.707,"endTime":3430.925,"body":"whenever I feel like it, with no consequence whatsoever."},{"startTime":3432.425,"endTime":3436.365,"body":"But also I myself must never be even remotely upset."},{"startTime":3438.225,"endTime":3445.168,"body":"And believe me, there are huge swathes of our species who believe those two things"},{"startTime":3445.168,"endTime":3449.335,"body":"simultaneously inside their heads and the Danish cartoons business."},{"startTime":3449.495,"endTime":3454.128,"body":"I actually thought that Yanas Postan shouldn't have commissioned those cartoons because it wasn't about"},{"startTime":3454.128,"endTime":3455.055,"body":"freedom of expression."},{"startTime":3455.055,"endTime":3460.569,"body":"It was about continuing a decades long campaign against immigrants into Danish society, in this"},{"startTime":3460.569,"endTime":3460.936,"body":"case, targeting the small Danish Muslim population, many of whom live in dire poverty and"},{"startTime":3460.936,"endTime":3470.495,"body":"clean the toilets and empty the bins at the islands Postan offices."},{"startTime":3470.965,"endTime":3476.239,"body":"However, once politically motivated Imams started peddling those images, including three more images, one of"},{"startTime":3476.239,"endTime":3476.591,"body":"which was of a Muslim at prayer being sodomized by a dog, which I presume"},{"startTime":3476.591,"endTime":3486.085,"body":"they must have commissioned themselves 'cause it was never in the island's Postum."},{"startTime":3487.025,"endTime":3488.765,"body":"Um, it changes."},{"startTime":3489.065,"endTime":3489.525,"body":"It changes."},{"startTime":3489.965,"endTime":3491.725,"body":"I know several of the Danish cartoonists involved."},{"startTime":3491.725,"endTime":3496.804,"body":"One of them, my friend Lar Rein, who did a cartoon of an Arab boy"},{"startTime":3496.804,"endTime":3497.142,"body":"called Mohammed, smiling with a big grin, having written on a blackboard behind him in"},{"startTime":3497.142,"endTime":3506.285,"body":"Arabic, the editor of Y's, Postan is a provocative racist idiot in Arabic."},{"startTime":3506.945,"endTime":3509.405,"body":"The editor of Y's, Postan cannot read Arabic."},{"startTime":3509.635,"endTime":3516.042,"body":"Neither can presumably the Muslim imams who have sentenced last to death, which suggests this"},{"startTime":3516.042,"endTime":3518.605,"body":"has nothing to do with cartoons."},{"startTime":3518.605,"endTime":3520.165,"body":"It's nothing to do with representations of images."},{"startTime":3520.235,"endTime":3521.325,"body":"It's about power play."},{"startTime":3521.355,"endTime":3522.245,"body":"It's about power play."},{"startTime":3522.245,"endTime":3527.849,"body":"And we are just the pawns that get kicked around to the point that five"},{"startTime":3527.849,"endTime":3528.223,"body":"of my colleagues and many other people who were murdered by men wielding assault rifles,"},{"startTime":3528.223,"endTime":3537.565,"body":"shouting God is great, including a man we should never forget."},{"startTime":3537.565,"endTime":3542.568,"body":"Frederick Buzo, who was the caretaker at the island's post's offices, who was the first"},{"startTime":3542.568,"endTime":3542.902,"body":"person to be murdered by those men wielding assault weapons, shouting God is great because"},{"startTime":3542.902,"endTime":3543.235,"body":"bystanders, we must never forget the bystanders who have to die for these people to"},{"startTime":3543.235,"endTime":3556.245,"body":"pursue their political agendas and about whom they do not care."},{"startTime":3556.425,"endTime":3557.085,"body":"One jot."},{"startTime":3557.905,"endTime":3563.055,"body":"And on this occasion, normally I would bring up the paper on the morning, I'm"},{"startTime":3563.055,"endTime":3564.085,"body":"gonna do something."},{"startTime":3564.085,"endTime":3567.906,"body":"And this occasion, at the end of the week this happened, I, I wanted to"},{"startTime":3567.906,"endTime":3568.925,"body":"do a particular cartoon."},{"startTime":3569.725,"endTime":3573.18,"body":"I wanted to do a cartoon of the prophet Mohammed with his head in his"},{"startTime":3573.18,"endTime":3576.405,"body":"hands, so you couldn't see his face wearing a, not in my name, t-shirt."},{"startTime":3577.265,"endTime":3580.771,"body":"And I pitched this to the paper and to their credit, they took it incredibly"},{"startTime":3580.771,"endTime":3581.005,"body":"seriously."},{"startTime":3581.005,"endTime":3585.905,"body":"And they discussed it with Islamic scholars and they discussed it with members of the"},{"startTime":3585.905,"endTime":3586.885,"body":"British Muslim community."},{"startTime":3587.665,"endTime":3591.005,"body":"And they said, well, yeah, okay, we, we know what you're doing."},{"startTime":3591.305,"endTime":3595.752,"body":"Um, and we appreciate it, but it could lead to the lives of guardian staff"},{"startTime":3595.752,"endTime":3598.125,"body":"in the Middle East being in genuine danger."},{"startTime":3598.265,"endTime":3600.005,"body":"So I said, okay, okay, well let's rethink this."},{"startTime":3600.385,"endTime":3603.713,"body":"And instead I came up with what I think is actually a better cartoon, which"},{"startTime":3603.713,"endTime":3603.935,"body":"is this one, which is me slumped on my drawing board saying, well now Space"},{"startTime":3603.935,"endTime":3604.157,"body":"cat here, my, here's my cartoon of Mohammed wearing a, not in my name T-shirt,"},{"startTime":3604.157,"endTime":3604.379,"body":"except that some of my loved ones, rather bizarrely don't want to, uh, me to"},{"startTime":3604.379,"endTime":3614.365,"body":"risk getting murdered."},{"startTime":3614.365,"endTime":3615.845,"body":"Affording a few of you, lot of rice."},{"startTime":3615.845,"endTime":3616.645,"body":"Smile weird."},{"startTime":3616.785,"endTime":3617.005,"body":"Ha."},{"startTime":3617.915,"endTime":3621.333,"body":"When I was doing or proposing to do the, the first cartoon, I had to"},{"startTime":3621.333,"endTime":3622.245,"body":"check with my family."},{"startTime":3622.275,"endTime":3622.885,"body":"This was okay."},{"startTime":3622.965,"endTime":3623.925,"body":"'cause I would've had to go into hiding."},{"startTime":3624.425,"endTime":3627.285,"body":"And my children who were then in their twenties were apparent."},{"startTime":3627.445,"endTime":3629.005,"body":"I mean, my daughter was in Amsterdam at the time."},{"startTime":3629.475,"endTime":3630.765,"body":"Were were sick with worry."},{"startTime":3630.765,"endTime":3631.445,"body":"They, they were genuine."},{"startTime":3631.645,"endTime":3635.765,"body":"I had to, I apologized to them afterwards for putting them through that."},{"startTime":3636.205,"endTime":3638.965,"body":"Although my son did send me an email saying, well, if Rose says it's okay,"},{"startTime":3638.965,"endTime":3641.725,"body":"I suppose it is so long as I can be the person to kill you."},{"startTime":3641.725,"endTime":3643.285,"body":"Which I thought was rather heartening, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3643.865,"endTime":3648.879,"body":"Um, and um, when this appeared, of course, everybody said, this is the most cowardly"},{"startTime":3648.879,"endTime":3650.885,"body":"hearted in the history of cartooning."},{"startTime":3651.005,"endTime":3653.88,"body":"'cause you haven't drawn the prophet Muhammad, who, so there's people over there who want"},{"startTime":3653.88,"endTime":3655.605,"body":"to kill me for drawing the prophet at Mohamed."},{"startTime":3655.605,"endTime":3660.405,"body":"There are people over there who want me to be killed by drawing the prophet"},{"startTime":3660.405,"endTime":3660.725,"body":"Mohamed."},{"startTime":3661.825,"endTime":3666.229,"body":"And a couple of weeks later, Nick Cohen, then observer, a journalist, said, um, oh,"},{"startTime":3666.229,"endTime":3668.285,"body":"you've had your head above the parapet."},{"startTime":3668.285,"endTime":3669.645,"body":"You've been on TV a lot talking about this."},{"startTime":3669.835,"endTime":3671.125,"body":"Have you got police protection?"},{"startTime":3671.125,"endTime":3671.725,"body":"And I said, no."},{"startTime":3671.825,"endTime":3674.979,"body":"Oh, well, I wrote an article and they sent me a, you know, asked me"},{"startTime":3674.979,"endTime":3675.189,"body":"if I wanted police protection, but you've done lots more than that, but you've had"},{"startTime":3675.189,"endTime":3678.765,"body":"no police protection."},{"startTime":3678.765,"endTime":3681.321,"body":"And I said, no, well, there's, there's people over there who, who wants to kill"},{"startTime":3681.321,"endTime":3682.685,"body":"me because I might draw the Prophet Muhammad."},{"startTime":3682.685,"endTime":3685.473,"body":"There are people over there who want me to die because I haven't drawn the"},{"startTime":3685.473,"endTime":3685.845,"body":"prophet Muhammad."},{"startTime":3686.625,"endTime":3690.205,"body":"And the Metropolitan Police force couldn't give a shit."},{"startTime":3691.145,"endTime":3694.784,"body":"And then I thought, maybe I shouldn't have said they're the best police force money"},{"startTime":3694.784,"endTime":3696.725,"body":"can buy quite so often in print \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3697.065,"endTime":3698.845,"body":"Anyway, a picture of the prophet, there we go."},{"startTime":3699.385,"endTime":3700.685,"body":"Uh, picture of another prophet."},{"startTime":3701.305,"endTime":3703.285,"body":"And so everybody, everybody, everybody hates me."},{"startTime":3703.285,"endTime":3704.125,"body":"Everybody wants to get me this."},{"startTime":3704.315,"endTime":3708.885,"body":"This was, uh, the cover of, uh, new Humanist again, atheist Magazine."},{"startTime":3708.885,"endTime":3714.201,"body":"It's about the new humanists, uh, the new atheists, Richard Dawkins and, uh, Christopher Hitchens,"},{"startTime":3714.201,"endTime":3714.556,"body":"uh, which was described as the most grossly homophobic cartoon ever published on the chat"},{"startTime":3714.556,"endTime":3721.645,"body":"rooms on the new humanist website."},{"startTime":3722.345,"endTime":3727.473,"body":"Um, apparently I drawn Dawkins as a stereotypically gay man, which he, he isn't gay,"},{"startTime":3727.473,"endTime":3729.525,"body":"uh, because of his limp wrists."},{"startTime":3729.555,"endTime":3730.325,"body":"They're not limp."},{"startTime":3730.325,"endTime":3730.765,"body":"They're like that."},{"startTime":3731.065,"endTime":3732.325,"body":"And they were saying, this is disgusting."},{"startTime":3732.325,"endTime":3732.965,"body":"This is disgusting."},{"startTime":3732.965,"endTime":3734.885,"body":"The worst cartoon ever, ever, ever published."},{"startTime":3734.965,"endTime":3736.325,"body":"I needed to die because of this."},{"startTime":3736.745,"endTime":3739.801,"body":"And a Brit came in and said, no, no, no, no, he's, he's just being"},{"startTime":3739.801,"endTime":3740.005,"body":"happy."},{"startTime":3740.005,"endTime":3740.885,"body":"It's like fathering infant Thomas."},{"startTime":3740.895,"endTime":3741.565,"body":"Hello clouds."},{"startTime":3741.565,"endTime":3741.725,"body":"Hello."},{"startTime":3741.875,"endTime":3742.525,"body":"He's just being happy."},{"startTime":3743.345,"endTime":3747.485,"body":"And they just carried on arguing about this until somebody said he is wearing sandals."},{"startTime":3747.605,"endTime":3750.285,"body":"A well-known gay signifier \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3752.305,"endTime":3756.093,"body":"And you just sort of despair and you just despair and you despair went you"},{"startTime":3756.093,"endTime":3759.125,"body":"get wander the lone shark who, uh, I created during the coalition."},{"startTime":3759.125,"endTime":3763.325,"body":"It was a nice, nice sort of big teeth named after the Wonga Payday Loan"},{"startTime":3763.325,"endTime":3765.845,"body":"Company, uh, who donates money to the Tory party."},{"startTime":3765.865,"endTime":3769.765,"body":"And every time Wonga appeared, somebody said this was a disgraceful libel on these Harris"},{"startTime":3769.765,"endTime":3770.025,"body":"creatures of the deep, hundreds of thousands of whom are killed each year to provide"},{"startTime":3770.025,"endTime":3774.965,"body":"the ingredients for Chinese cuisine."},{"startTime":3775.105,"endTime":3776.165,"body":"And I get the point."},{"startTime":3776.225,"endTime":3779.565,"body":"But if a shark objects, they can show it in their own uniquely sharky ways."},{"startTime":3780.045,"endTime":3785.546,"body":"Likewise, in that foul, foul week just before the referendum, the beginning of which an"},{"startTime":3785.546,"endTime":3785.913,"body":"alleged jihadi murdered dozens of people in a gay disco in Florida, at the end"},{"startTime":3785.913,"endTime":3786.28,"body":"of which Joe Cox was murdered on the streets of an English town by an"},{"startTime":3786.28,"endTime":3799.485,"body":"English Nazi who stabbed her and shot her."},{"startTime":3799.485,"endTime":3803.402,"body":"And a week later, Nigel Farrah said We'd had a revolution without a shot fired"},{"startTime":3803.402,"endTime":3803.925,"body":"in anger."},{"startTime":3810.315,"endTime":3815.259,"body":"And they, of course, they were described as lone wolves, lone wolves, nothing to do"},{"startTime":3815.259,"endTime":3819.875,"body":"with the fact they've been radicalized on the internet where we've dumped our id."},{"startTime":3820.935,"endTime":3823.195,"body":"And so I did this cartoon of the lone wolves looking"},{"startTime":3826.015,"endTime":3831.958,"body":"At the internet being radicalized by this madness, this retic madness, these endless lies and"},{"startTime":3831.958,"endTime":3832.355,"body":"fantasies."},{"startTime":3833.775,"endTime":3837.66,"body":"And, um, again, Nick Cohen went on Twitter and said, occasionally Rosen does a cartoon"},{"startTime":3837.66,"endTime":3838.955,"body":"that sticks in the mind."},{"startTime":3838.955,"endTime":3839.675,"body":"This is one of those."},{"startTime":3839.695,"endTime":3844.795,"body":"And about 12 comments down, somebody said, but don't you think it offers a very"},{"startTime":3844.795,"endTime":3847.515,"body":"negative view of wolves and other canid species?"},{"startTime":3851.235,"endTime":3855.573,"body":"Likewise, when I did this cartoon on the anniversary of the Battle of Passion, Dale,"},{"startTime":3855.573,"endTime":3858.755,"body":"somebody said, this is the most offensive cartoon of all time."},{"startTime":3859.775,"endTime":3862.635,"body":"It wasn't the most offensive cartoon in that afternoon, for God's sake."},{"startTime":3863.235,"endTime":3864.355,"body":"I mean, just taking offense."},{"startTime":3864.595,"endTime":3866.595,"body":"I am imp I I think therefore I'm offended."},{"startTime":3866.735,"endTime":3867.235,"body":"I'm offended."},{"startTime":3867.235,"endTime":3868.035,"body":"Therefore, I am."},{"startTime":3868.895,"endTime":3873.877,"body":"Uh, whereas this one was deliberate, absolutely deliberate again in 2017, after the disastrous election,"},{"startTime":3873.877,"endTime":3874.21,"body":"after the Refall Fire, which is the most significant political event in this country for"},{"startTime":3874.21,"endTime":3882.515,"body":"40 years, if we were only smart enough to realize why."},{"startTime":3883.415,"endTime":3886.47,"body":"And I wanted to do a cartoon of a great lead cloud, about to crush"},{"startTime":3886.47,"endTime":3886.673,"body":"Britain, the shape of Britain, about to crush it, just being kept off from crushing"},{"startTime":3886.673,"endTime":3891.155,"body":"it by the shell of the Grenfell Tower."},{"startTime":3891.735,"endTime":3892.515,"body":"And it wasn't working."},{"startTime":3892.515,"endTime":3893.515,"body":"Sometimes it's in my head."},{"startTime":3893.515,"endTime":3895.275,"body":"I can't get onto a piece of paper that big."},{"startTime":3896.255,"endTime":3901.587,"body":"And so I saw this after the Finsbury Mosque attack when a Welsh Nazi this"},{"startTime":3901.587,"endTime":3901.942,"body":"time drove into a group of Welsh was outside the Finsbury Mosque, murdering one of"},{"startTime":3901.942,"endTime":3907.275,"body":"them."},{"startTime":3908.495,"endTime":3912.447,"body":"And the murder weapon, which is the truck, had been holed up and it was"},{"startTime":3912.447,"endTime":3914.555,"body":"waiting for the forensic teams to come up."},{"startTime":3915.135,"endTime":3917.86,"body":"And I just rang up my editor at The Guardian Huu and I said, Hey,"},{"startTime":3917.86,"endTime":3918.405,"body":"let's do this."},{"startTime":3918.405,"endTime":3919.405,"body":"And he said, yeah, why not?"},{"startTime":3919.405,"endTime":3920.245,"body":"Ah, let's do it."},{"startTime":3920.905,"endTime":3923.71,"body":"And so it says, you know, read the Son and the Daily Mail because they"},{"startTime":3923.71,"endTime":3924.645,"body":"too have politicized these people."},{"startTime":3924.715,"endTime":3926.085,"body":"They have radicalized these people."},{"startTime":3926.085,"endTime":3927.085,"body":"It's part of their agenda."},{"startTime":3928.225,"endTime":3934.325,"body":"And, um, two days later, the Daily Mail wrote a full page editorial."},{"startTime":3935.565,"endTime":3939.405,"body":"I wasn't named 'cause it was written by a friend of mine, actually, Roger Ton."},{"startTime":3940.185,"endTime":3943.8,"body":"Um, I was imagining I was just a sort of glove puppet on the end"},{"startTime":3943.8,"endTime":3944.765,"body":"of Cath Weiner's hand."},{"startTime":3945.465,"endTime":3956.685,"body":"And, um, it contains the phrase describing me disgusting, deranged, sick and offensive words."},{"startTime":3956.845,"endTime":3959.005,"body":"I will have carved into my gravestone."},{"startTime":3959.365,"endTime":3960.645,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e Martin Rosen."},{"startTime":3960.645,"endTime":3961.165,"body":"Let's be generous."},{"startTime":3961.405,"endTime":3963.645,"body":"1959, 2025."},{"startTime":3963.695,"endTime":3964.285,"body":"Let's be kind."},{"startTime":3965.175,"endTime":3968.405,"body":"Disgusting, deranged, sick and offensive, the daily male \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":3970.025,"endTime":3971.725,"body":"And was it ever thus?"},{"startTime":3972.665,"endTime":3974.525,"body":"And was it a bit worse?"},{"startTime":3974.535,"endTime":3977.085,"body":"Quite often, again, we get back to Gilroy."},{"startTime":3977.235,"endTime":3983.443,"body":"This is a cartoon he did about the wig opposition coming to pay homage to"},{"startTime":3983.443,"endTime":3984.685,"body":"the Prince Regent's."},{"startTime":3984.785,"endTime":3986.325,"body":"Uh, happy News."},{"startTime":3986.325,"endTime":3992.191,"body":"This is the colorized version, um, of, uh, his daughter, princess Charlotte kissing her bottom,"},{"startTime":3992.191,"endTime":3993.365,"body":"called the presentation."},{"startTime":3993.545,"endTime":3996.965,"body":"And Gil Ray rather foolishly then called it the Wise Men's Offering."},{"startTime":3996.965,"endTime":4001.165,"body":"And on the basis of that, he was arrested for blasphemy."},{"startTime":4001.705,"endTime":4006.087,"body":"Now this is when in the 1790s if you stocked a copy of Thomas Payne's,"},{"startTime":4006.087,"endTime":4009.885,"body":"the Rights of Man, you could be transported to Australia for five years."},{"startTime":4010.665,"endTime":4012.445,"body":"So blasphemy was a big deal."},{"startTime":4012.645,"endTime":4013.685,"body":"I mean, it was a big deal."},{"startTime":4014.625,"endTime":4020.823,"body":"And actually, Gil Ray got off because a very ambitious young Tory MP called George"},{"startTime":4020.823,"endTime":4024.955,"body":"Canning, said, I'll get you off, I'll get you off."},{"startTime":4025.535,"endTime":4031.548,"body":"Um, and did a Faustian Pact, Gil Ray Dian Pact and started working for the"},{"startTime":4031.548,"endTime":4034.355,"body":"anti Jacobin, started doing car pro-government cartoons."},{"startTime":4034.355,"endTime":4038.983,"body":"At the same time he was drawing pit as a toad stall, appearing out of"},{"startTime":4038.983,"endTime":4042.995,"body":"a dung heap, uh, and canning understood, had to appear in a cartoon."},{"startTime":4043.295,"endTime":4046.035,"body":"And he kept on getting his friends and his agents to petition."},{"startTime":4046.135,"endTime":4047.355,"body":"Gil Rad said, put me in a cartoon."},{"startTime":4047.415,"endTime":4048.515,"body":"Put me in a cartoon, put me in a cartoon."},{"startTime":4048.735,"endTime":4052.355,"body":"And he finally produced this magnificent image, promised horrors of the French in Beijing."},{"startTime":4052.415,"endTime":4054.515,"body":"You could step into this cartoon and walk for days."},{"startTime":4055.255,"endTime":4060.146,"body":"And it's just magnificent of Jacobin army marching down the Mao Pal Mao and barely"},{"startTime":4060.146,"endTime":4062.755,"body":"noticeable hanging from a lamppost is canning \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":4062.935,"endTime":4063.675,"body":"So he is put him there."},{"startTime":4063.675,"endTime":4068.435,"body":"But he said, forgive the phrase, fuck you, fuck you."},{"startTime":4068.435,"endTime":4070.035,"body":"And this is how I said goodbye to Tony Blair."},{"startTime":4070.385,"endTime":4072.115,"body":"This is the last slide very, very briefly."},{"startTime":4073.445,"endTime":4078.047,"body":"After Tony Blair, after leading, you know, being responsible for the death of hundreds of"},{"startTime":4078.047,"endTime":4078.354,"body":"thousands of people he'd never met, um, making Serial Misjudgments goes on a sort of"},{"startTime":4078.354,"endTime":4078.661,"body":"leaving tour that last six months, finally resigns and uh, hey everyone, look at these"},{"startTime":4078.661,"endTime":4078.968,"body":"great retirement presence, A fork earth from everybody at the eu, a fur cuff from"},{"startTime":4078.968,"endTime":4079.275,"body":"Gordon and Fair Cop in Die From the Grateful People of Iraq, Afghanistan, all you"},{"startTime":4079.275,"endTime":4096.765,"body":"guys."},{"startTime":4097.585,"endTime":4100.853,"body":"And once more, I got an email that back then I didn't get, uh, death"},{"startTime":4100.853,"endTime":4101.725,"body":"threats on social media."},{"startTime":4101.765,"endTime":4102.484,"body":"I got 'em by email."},{"startTime":4102.645,"endTime":4105.187,"body":"'cause the Guardian asked that I put my email address underneath the Guardian on the"},{"startTime":4105.187,"endTime":4106.205,"body":"website 'cause they're a liberal paper."},{"startTime":4106.205,"endTime":4106.765,"body":"Like, you know."},{"startTime":4107.385,"endTime":4108.645,"body":"And, um, this wasn't a death threat."},{"startTime":4108.645,"endTime":4112.524,"body":"It was saying, why do you have to be so unrelentingly negative all the time?"},{"startTime":4112.885,"endTime":4115.805,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e and I sold this, actually, this is a good cartoon."},{"startTime":4115.875,"endTime":4117.165,"body":"This is what awards this cartoon."},{"startTime":4117.665,"endTime":4120.632,"body":"So I asked, well, why do you have to email a total stranger to complain"},{"startTime":4120.632,"endTime":4123.205,"body":"about things you didn't even have to look at in the first place?"},{"startTime":4124.265,"endTime":4129.885,"body":"And anyway, I think Fair Coffin die 'cause you haven't got it."},{"startTime":4129.885,"endTime":4131.045,"body":"Fuck off, fuck off, fuck off and die."},{"startTime":4132.285,"endTime":4135.205,"body":"I think Fair Coffin Die is a really good gag."},{"startTime":4136.715,"endTime":4140.645,"body":"15 minutes later he replied, I've only just got it."},{"startTime":4140.645,"endTime":4141.805,"body":"That's brilliant, \u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":4142.785,"endTime":4145.635,"body":"At which point I realized that my work that day was done as it is"},{"startTime":4145.635,"endTime":4146.205,"body":"here this evening."},{"startTime":4146.215,"endTime":4147.925,"body":"Thank you very much for listening."},{"startTime":4154.285,"endTime":4158.563,"body":"I was, when we were talking earlier on about how the last few years must"},{"startTime":4158.563,"endTime":4158.849,"body":"have been a, a gift to, um, a satirical cartoon is because of the rate"},{"startTime":4158.849,"endTime":4165.125,"body":"of change and the madness of it all."},{"startTime":4165.345,"endTime":4166.645,"body":"You've said, well, maybe not."},{"startTime":4167.024,"endTime":4168.404,"body":"And explain why."},{"startTime":4168.404,"endTime":4169.885,"body":"Would you like to tell people why?"},{"startTime":4169.995,"endTime":4173.444,"body":"Well, I mean, uh, essentially Martin, it's about demarcation."},{"startTime":4173.444,"endTime":4175.165,"body":"We're the ones meant to be doing the jokes, not them."},{"startTime":4175.845,"endTime":4177.285,"body":"I mean, it's it's simple as that."},{"startTime":4177.625,"endTime":4184.811,"body":"Um, I've been doing this job for 40 years now, and, and I have observed"},{"startTime":4184.811,"endTime":4188.645,"body":"politicians at close, in close detail close up."},{"startTime":4189.145,"endTime":4193.774,"body":"And, you know, at the ends of when they've been in power for too long,"},{"startTime":4193.774,"endTime":4194.083,"body":"they start going mad and they start losing control of the plot because they are"},{"startTime":4194.083,"endTime":4200.565,"body":"sort of immersed in their own obsessions."},{"startTime":4200.865,"endTime":4204.961,"body":"And they, and it's, it was obvious in John Major's government after Black Wednesday, when"},{"startTime":4204.961,"endTime":4207.965,"body":"it was week after week after week after week after week."},{"startTime":4208.505,"endTime":4213.245,"body":"Um, and they became the first postmodern government because they were trading purely on irony."},{"startTime":4213.745,"endTime":4219.166,"body":"Um, and, and so the BSE scandal, um, they'd taken our national dish and through"},{"startTime":4219.166,"endTime":4219.527,"body":"encouraging people to feed the powdered brains of cows to other cows, had rendered our"},{"startTime":4219.527,"endTime":4228.925,"body":"national dish, not only deadly, but likely to drive you mad first."},{"startTime":4229.585,"endTime":4231.765,"body":"Um, which Swift could not have made that up on a good day."},{"startTime":4232.305,"endTime":4239.3,"body":"Um, and this, all the governments, I think actually from Cameron onwards, um, Blair and"},{"startTime":4239.3,"endTime":4242.565,"body":"Brown were entirely different kind of madness."},{"startTime":4242.565,"endTime":4247.612,"body":"But the Blair from Cameron Norman, essentially they've been driven by an urge to troll"},{"startTime":4247.612,"endTime":4248.285,"body":"guardian readers."},{"startTime":4248.705,"endTime":4251.245,"body":"That's the only thing they're interested, they're interested in annoying us."},{"startTime":4251.785,"endTime":4255.285,"body":"Um, which is not a good ground for public policy, I feel."},{"startTime":4255.785,"endTime":4260.496,"body":"Um, but certainly, uh, we now get to the point where, you know, the, the"},{"startTime":4260.496,"endTime":4260.81,"body":"governing party is tearing itself to pieces over a policy which is costing billions of"},{"startTime":4260.81,"endTime":4261.125,"body":"pounds, which will involve about 12 people being sent to a East African country from"},{"startTime":4261.125,"endTime":4271.805,"body":"which they'll probably then be deported."},{"startTime":4272.545,"endTime":4277.984,"body":"And again, you know, in, in the wildest imaginings of Rabbi or something like you,"},{"startTime":4277.984,"endTime":4280.885,"body":"you cannot think of anything quite that mad."},{"startTime":4281.905,"endTime":4287.155,"body":"Do you ever find yourself, um, trying to draw or, uh, a subject which is"},{"startTime":4287.155,"endTime":4291.005,"body":"so depressing and heavy that you don't know what to do?"},{"startTime":4291.245,"endTime":4292.565,"body":"And it kind of, you know,"},{"startTime":4293.425,"endTime":4299.462,"body":"Um, I, I have, well, I I have a sort of rather important consideration, which"},{"startTime":4299.462,"endTime":4303.085,"body":"is if I don't file, they won't pay me."},{"startTime":4304.465,"endTime":4307.965,"body":"And humor is only part of the artillery of a political cartoon."},{"startTime":4308.145,"endTime":4311.125,"body":"You can do poignant moving cartoons."},{"startTime":4311.125,"endTime":4315.365,"body":"But there were, I think it was 2014 where absolutely everything was appalling."},{"startTime":4315.365,"endTime":4321.998,"body":"There was Crimea, there was Isis, there was Gaza, there was other, I mean, it"},{"startTime":4321.998,"endTime":4323.325,"body":"was just relentless."},{"startTime":4323.425,"endTime":4327.23,"body":"And I was doing the cartoon every day for four weeks 'cause Steve be decided"},{"startTime":4327.23,"endTime":4328.245,"body":"to go on holiday."},{"startTime":4328.345,"endTime":4329.765,"body":"And I was actually doing six a week."},{"startTime":4330.265,"endTime":4333.605,"body":"And, and at the end of it, my wife and I ran away to stay"},{"startTime":4333.605,"endTime":4335.165,"body":"with some friends of ours in Greece."},{"startTime":4335.185,"endTime":4339.345,"body":"And I could actually literally feel the weight of the world lifting off my shoulders"},{"startTime":4339.345,"endTime":4341.565,"body":"as I drank the first bottle of Reina."},{"startTime":4342.185,"endTime":4345.325,"body":"Um, and no, sometimes it, it is, it is truly terrible."},{"startTime":4345.445,"endTime":4350.245,"body":"I mean, certainly the last four months have been terrible."},{"startTime":4350.385,"endTime":4351.685,"body":"How do you, how do you comment about this?"},{"startTime":4352.145,"endTime":4355.587,"body":"How do you comment about this particularly as it goes on and on and on,"},{"startTime":4355.587,"endTime":4356.965,"body":"and what new do you say?"},{"startTime":4356.965,"endTime":4358.125,"body":"What do you add to the debate?"},{"startTime":4358.125,"endTime":4359.285,"body":"What do you add to the conversation?"},{"startTime":4359.705,"endTime":4363.543,"body":"Um, and you know, likewise, after nine 11, I remember I was actually working with"},{"startTime":4363.543,"endTime":4363.799,"body":"the Scotsman at the time, and I, and I spent all that afternoon staring at"},{"startTime":4363.799,"endTime":4370.965,"body":"a blank sheet of paper thinking, how the hell do I do with this?"},{"startTime":4370.965,"endTime":4372.445,"body":"This is a mass grave, this is."},{"startTime":4373.025,"endTime":4377.701,"body":"And I ended up doing a cartoon of this sort of skull, like pool of"},{"startTime":4377.701,"endTime":4378.012,"body":"smoke coming out from lower Manhattan and to vouch to bite out the flame on"},{"startTime":4378.012,"endTime":4378.324,"body":"the torch of the Statue of Liberty, which actually on reflection is a pretty good"},{"startTime":4378.324,"endTime":4387.365,"body":"response."},{"startTime":4388.385,"endTime":4393.53,"body":"Um, but, you know, sometimes one feels like, uh, Stein, that of which we cannot"},{"startTime":4393.53,"endTime":4395.245,"body":"speak, we should remain silent."},{"startTime":4395.985,"endTime":4397.085,"body":"But you know, you've gotta file"},{"startTime":4397.865,"endTime":4400.885,"body":"One, one of the striking memories of your talk."},{"startTime":4400.945,"endTime":4406.72,"body":"In fact just dawned on me that there's an enormous number of men that you"},{"startTime":4406.72,"endTime":4408.645,"body":"have satirized the dominantly male."},{"startTime":4408.705,"endTime":4408.925,"body":"Yep."},{"startTime":4408.925,"endTime":4409.365,"body":"Victims."},{"startTime":4410.425,"endTime":4415.325,"body":"Do you think that's accident or just that these are the people in power and"},{"startTime":4415.325,"endTime":4416.245,"body":"As a patriarchy?"},{"startTime":4416.245,"endTime":4416.765,"body":"Martin Yeah,"},{"startTime":4417.245,"endTime":4422.245,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":4417.285,"endTime":4420.045,"body":"Well, I think I know that, but, um, that's why I'm standing here."},{"startTime":4420.105,"endTime":4424.683,"body":"Um, well, uh, I could have shown you lots and lots and lots of cartoons"},{"startTime":4424.683,"endTime":4427.125,"body":"of Theresa May, but we've forgotten about her."},{"startTime":4427.125,"endTime":4430.23,"body":"I could have showed you lots and lots and lots and lots of cartoons of"},{"startTime":4430.23,"endTime":4430.645,"body":"Margaret Thatcher."},{"startTime":4430.865,"endTime":4433.165,"body":"Um, you draw who's there."},{"startTime":4433.515,"endTime":4433.805,"body":"Yeah."},{"startTime":4433.805,"endTime":4435.245,"body":"Basically people say, why don't you?"},{"startTime":4435.245,"endTime":4443.165,"body":"Well, you know, every time there is a government members of the opposition, uh, no."},{"startTime":4443.165,"endTime":4446.336,"body":"When every time there's a government supporters of the government party will say, why don't"},{"startTime":4446.336,"endTime":4447.605,"body":"you do a cartoon about them?"},{"startTime":4447.795,"endTime":4449.205,"body":"Because they're not in power."},{"startTime":4450.385,"endTime":4451.485,"body":"That's the reason why."},{"startTime":4451.785,"endTime":4455.045,"body":"And, you know, people assume I'm on the left, assume I'm on their side."},{"startTime":4455.045,"endTime":4457.045,"body":"Well actually, you know, there's three kinds of politics."},{"startTime":4457.045,"endTime":4461.163,"body":"The politics which seeks to wield power, the politics which seeks to exert power and"},{"startTime":4461.163,"endTime":4463.085,"body":"the politics which seeks to thwart it."},{"startTime":4463.705,"endTime":4466.725,"body":"And the third is the most useless, but the most honorable."},{"startTime":4467.425,"endTime":4472.085,"body":"And I am there to just sort of say, whisper in their ears."},{"startTime":4472.145,"endTime":4476.75,"body":"Not only are you mortal, you've also got really stupid nose and you know, you're"},{"startTime":4476.75,"endTime":4477.365,"body":"you shit."},{"startTime":4477.365,"endTime":4478.005,"body":"And you're gonna die."},{"startTime":4478.545,"endTime":4481.165,"body":"And they will take their revenge one way or another."},{"startTime":4481.225,"endTime":4484.565,"body":"Or they'll pretend it's a matter of, you know, they'll pretend to laugh."},{"startTime":4484.825,"endTime":4488.845,"body":"So I would say my role in relationship to my subjects mind over matter."},{"startTime":4489.555,"endTime":4491.885,"body":"They pretend they don't mind, and I pretend I matter."},{"startTime":4491.985,"endTime":4492.205,"body":"So."},{"startTime":4494.075,"endTime":4494.365,"body":"Okay."},{"startTime":4494.865,"endTime":4498.205,"body":"Uh, thanks for great, uh, talk, uh, a lot of, uh, fun."},{"startTime":4498.225,"endTime":4502.662,"body":"And I, I like also how you talk about how you're often friends or you"},{"startTime":4502.662,"endTime":4505.325,"body":"like the people that you, uh, satirize or draw."},{"startTime":4505.325,"endTime":4510.042,"body":"And I wonder, have you ever, um, regretted a drawing or thought in hindsight, oh,"},{"startTime":4510.042,"endTime":4514.445,"body":"maybe I got that bit wrong, or, oh yes, that was too straight \u003claugh\u003e"},{"startTime":4514.995,"endTime":4518.323,"body":"That you uh, you may or may not be familiar with the fact that I"},{"startTime":4518.323,"endTime":4518.545,"body":"was absent from the pages of the Guardian for four months last summer because of"},{"startTime":4518.545,"endTime":4523.205,"body":"a drawing I did of Richard Sharp."},{"startTime":4523.545,"endTime":4529.325,"body":"Um, which included unbeknownst to me what were in fact, well-known antisemitic tropes."},{"startTime":4529.325,"endTime":4533.375,"body":"And I hadn't realized, and I was so ashamed that I actually asked for time"},{"startTime":4533.375,"endTime":4533.645,"body":"off and when it was worked out and when, and I apologized as a, you"},{"startTime":4533.645,"endTime":4539.045,"body":"know, I've got three golden rules."},{"startTime":4539.225,"endTime":4542.285,"body":"Um, I never attack anybody less powerful than me."},{"startTime":4542.405,"endTime":4544.205,"body":"I only, I never attack people for what they are."},{"startTime":4544.285,"endTime":4545.885,"body":"I attack 'em for what they think and do."},{"startTime":4546.905,"endTime":4553.325,"body":"And if I have offended somebody I haven't specifically targeted, I always, always apologize."},{"startTime":4553.385,"endTime":4556.99,"body":"And I hadn't targeted Richard Sharpe, but people made the observation, well, a guy called"},{"startTime":4556.99,"endTime":4557.23,"body":"Dave Rich, um, with whom I'd since discussed it at length and I had lunch"},{"startTime":4557.23,"endTime":4557.471,"body":"with him and we've done sort of truth and reconciliation because then he sort of"},{"startTime":4557.471,"endTime":4566.365,"body":"said, yes, okay, you have seen go in peace."},{"startTime":4567.065,"endTime":4568.445,"body":"And I said, I'm sorry."},{"startTime":4569.385,"endTime":4573.453,"body":"And if I could rew that cartoon, I would because it ruined my life for"},{"startTime":4573.453,"endTime":4576.165,"body":"about, I thought my career and my reputation were destroyed."},{"startTime":4576.825,"endTime":4582.285,"body":"But, um, I think I've got my honor back because people have accepted my apology."},{"startTime":4582.945,"endTime":4586.645,"body":"Um, for the most part, yes."},{"startTime":4586.945,"endTime":4591.245,"body":"The ones I regret are the ones where I have offended people I haven't targeted"},{"startTime":4591.245,"endTime":4594.685,"body":"when I've targeted somebody and they are offended, that is my job."},{"startTime":4595.625,"endTime":4599.087,"body":"So I give a, I'm giving a, on a tour at the moment where I'm"},{"startTime":4599.087,"endTime":4601.165,"body":"giving a talk, saying, giving the gift of offense."},{"startTime":4601.785,"endTime":4603.125,"body":"I'm giving it when it is taken."},{"startTime":4603.305,"endTime":4607.469,"body":"That's different 'cause I haven't given it, but I actually take the offense, which is"},{"startTime":4607.469,"endTime":4610.245,"body":"normally a reciprocal gift 'cause I've been offended by them."},{"startTime":4610.665,"endTime":4611.805,"body":"That's why I'm a satirist."},{"startTime":4611.825,"endTime":4613.645,"body":"I'm permanently offended by the behavior of these people."},{"startTime":4614.025,"endTime":4618.951,"body":"But I beautifully wrap it up in Crate paper with a lovely silk ribbon, and"},{"startTime":4618.951,"endTime":4622.565,"body":"I place it on their doorstep and I ring the doorbell."},{"startTime":4623.235,"endTime":4627.6,"body":"Then the editor of the Daily Mail opens the door after I've set fire to"},{"startTime":4627.6,"endTime":4628.765,"body":"the present and stamps"},{"startTime":4628.765,"endTime":4631.125,"body":"On it, it and only then realizes it's full of dog shit."},{"startTime":4631.725,"endTime":4636.725,"body":"\u003claugh\u003e."},{"startTime":4633.105,"endTime":4639.005,"body":"So I, I think, um, like me, you know why we open the paper and"},{"startTime":4639.005,"endTime":4641.365,"body":"look for Martin's cartoons every day."},{"startTime":4641.675,"endTime":4643.205,"body":"What a huge privilege to hear you talk."},{"startTime":4643.295,"endTime":4643.925,"body":"We've really enjoyed."},{"startTime":4643.925,"endTime":4644.725,"body":"Thank you very much for listening."},{"startTime":4644.775,"endTime":4645.605,"body":"Thank you very much."}]}