{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":1.366,"endTime":5.2,"body":"this episode was made possible by our incredible donors"},{"startTime":5.266,"endTime":6.866,"body":"their faithful support"},{"startTime":6.866,"endTime":9.3,"body":"allows us to continue the work of amplifying"},{"startTime":9.3,"endTime":11.866,"body":"the voices of religious abuse survivors"},{"startTime":11.866,"endTime":13.0,"body":"we committed early on"},{"startTime":13.0,"endTime":15.266,"body":"never to monetize any of the stories"},{"startTime":15.266,"endTime":18.966,"body":"so we rely solely on donations from people like you"},{"startTime":19.0,"endTime":21.666,"body":"if you value the work and are able to contribute"},{"startTime":21.666,"endTime":23.6,"body":"you can become a monthly donor"},{"startTime":23.6,"endTime":25.2,"body":"at the link in our show notes"},{"startTime":25.2,"endTime":27.333,"body":"another way to support bodies behind the bus"},{"startTime":27.333,"endTime":31.333,"body":"is by following rating and reviewing the podcast"},{"startTime":31.333,"endTime":32.666,"body":"it only takes a moment"},{"startTime":32.666,"endTime":35.366,"body":"but has a tremendous impact on our reach"},{"startTime":35.366,"endTime":38.433,"body":"thank you for daring to listen"},{"startTime":51.0,"endTime":51.766,"body":"hello"},{"startTime":51.766,"endTime":55.266,"body":"and welcome back to the Bodies Behind the bus podcast"},{"startTime":55.266,"endTime":58.366,"body":"we have an interesting episode today"},{"startTime":58.866,"endTime":61.3,"body":"and I say interesting because 1"},{"startTime":61.4,"endTime":64.2,"body":"this is going to be on video as well"},{"startTime":64.266,"endTime":65.666,"body":"so if you're just listening to us"},{"startTime":65.666,"endTime":68.966,"body":"and you would rather experience this conversation"},{"startTime":68.966,"endTime":70.566,"body":"with our faces attached to it"},{"startTime":70.566,"endTime":74.833,"body":"you can go to the links in the bio right now and see us"},{"startTime":75.3,"endTime":77.566,"body":"um we felt like this conversation was important to have"},{"startTime":77.566,"endTime":81.2,"body":"face to face so that's why we're doing this reluctantly"},{"startTime":81.366,"endTime":82.866,"body":"especially Jay reluctantly"},{"startTime":82.866,"endTime":84.566,"body":"he is it's"},{"startTime":84.566,"endTime":87.8,"body":"he's hard pressed to get onto haha"},{"startTime":87.9,"endTime":89.5,"body":"like every single zoom call"},{"startTime":89.5,"endTime":92.9,"body":"it's just J's the black square that's nothing there"},{"startTime":93.133,"endTime":94.2,"body":"and you know"},{"startTime":94.2,"endTime":96.866,"body":"every once in a while we get like an unmute"},{"startTime":96.866,"endTime":99.0,"body":"if we're lucky um"},{"startTime":99.666,"endTime":102.066,"body":"but anyways we decided to have this conversation"},{"startTime":102.066,"endTime":105.866,"body":"we are four members of our six member board"},{"startTime":106.3,"endTime":107.166,"body":"um"},{"startTime":107.533,"endTime":111.466,"body":"to talk about what it has been like living in America"},{"startTime":111.766,"endTime":114.966,"body":"um from our different spaces that we inhabit"},{"startTime":115.7,"endTime":118.166,"body":"after the election and you know"},{"startTime":118.166,"endTime":121.2,"body":"it hasn't even just been like a week of processing this"},{"startTime":121.2,"endTime":122.9,"body":"I think all of us have been processing"},{"startTime":122.9,"endTime":124.366,"body":"processing this for years"},{"startTime":124.366,"endTime":126.3,"body":"some of us on this call lifetimes"},{"startTime":126.7,"endTime":131.033,"body":"um but in particular it feels like"},{"startTime":132.733,"endTime":135.9,"body":"for me the end of a season in a sense"},{"startTime":136.066,"endTime":138.9,"body":"and the beginning of a very unknown"},{"startTime":138.9,"endTime":140.433,"body":"very scary season"},{"startTime":140.566,"endTime":142.933,"body":"and I don't even think everybody on this call"},{"startTime":142.933,"endTime":144.466,"body":"would feel that same feeling"},{"startTime":144.466,"endTime":147.266,"body":"that's just how my body is experiencing this"},{"startTime":147.466,"endTime":148.3,"body":"um"},{"startTime":148.4,"endTime":153.1,"body":"so today we have Robert and Emily and Jay with us here"},{"startTime":153.1,"endTime":156.5,"body":"and we're gonna be talking about what I just said"},{"startTime":156.6,"endTime":158.766,"body":"what does this look like for us as individuals"},{"startTime":158.766,"endTime":161.266,"body":"to engage in the spaces that we're in"},{"startTime":161.4,"endTime":162.4,"body":"and then in particular"},{"startTime":162.4,"endTime":164.4,"body":"what does this look like for bodies behind the bus"},{"startTime":164.4,"endTime":166.666,"body":"and how does this affect the survivor community"},{"startTime":166.9,"endTime":168.766,"body":"and what does it look like to be"},{"startTime":169.6,"endTime":172.733,"body":"a survivor of different types of abuse"},{"startTime":172.733,"endTime":174.0,"body":"within religious spaces"},{"startTime":174.0,"endTime":176.933,"body":"but then also if you're adding on top of that"},{"startTime":176.933,"endTime":178.766,"body":"what does it look like to experience abuse"},{"startTime":178.766,"endTime":180.4,"body":"and be from a marginalized community"},{"startTime":180.4,"endTime":182.066,"body":"or multiple marginalized communities"},{"startTime":182.066,"endTime":185.7,"body":"we wanted to open the space for that conversation"},{"startTime":186.0,"endTime":190.8,"body":"so after that very long winded intro to the episode"},{"startTime":190.933,"endTime":193.033,"body":"welcome Robert and Emily"},{"startTime":194.2,"endTime":195.0,"body":"hey"},{"startTime":196.866,"endTime":197.966,"body":"hi"},{"startTime":199.0,"endTime":200.733,"body":"we're feeling a lot of feelings this week"},{"startTime":200.733,"endTime":205.6,"body":"we're not as peppy as our normal selves um"},{"startTime":205.766,"endTime":209.433,"body":"and that's okay we're showing up where we're at"},{"startTime":210.266,"endTime":214.4,"body":"I love to kick off with that question"},{"startTime":214.4,"endTime":215.9,"body":"just to start us off"},{"startTime":216.666,"endTime":220.7,"body":"where are you guys at and how are you doing"},{"startTime":220.7,"endTime":222.966,"body":"how has this week affected you"},{"startTime":222.966,"endTime":225.766,"body":"and you can be as vulnerable as you want"},{"startTime":226.066,"endTime":228.966,"body":"or as guarded as you want with that answer"},{"startTime":228.966,"endTime":231.366,"body":"but let's start off the conversation with that"},{"startTime":231.366,"endTime":232.466,"body":"well I mean"},{"startTime":233.0,"endTime":237.233,"body":"this kind of says it all I am emotionally unavailable"},{"startTime":238.133,"endTime":239.433,"body":"um"},{"startTime":242.6,"endTime":247.166,"body":"so I vacilate between being numb and being angry"},{"startTime":249.5,"endTime":251.766,"body":"and I'm a little worried about that"},{"startTime":251.766,"endTime":253.0,"body":"because I know about myself"},{"startTime":253.0,"endTime":254.766,"body":"that I'm a delayed processor"},{"startTime":255.933,"endTime":258.433,"body":"so I know that at some point in time"},{"startTime":259.066,"endTime":261.0,"body":"this is going to hit me"},{"startTime":261.0,"endTime":264.6,"body":"and I can't really predict where it went and how"},{"startTime":264.966,"endTime":265.2,"body":"but"},{"startTime":265.2,"endTime":267.866,"body":"I still have to go through the depression part of it"},{"startTime":268.4,"endTime":269.266,"body":"and"},{"startTime":270.733,"endTime":272.966,"body":"I think there's disappointment"},{"startTime":273.0,"endTime":277.233,"body":"I think that there's moments of denial"},{"startTime":277.666,"endTime":282.966,"body":"but really sitting in the gravity of what just happened"},{"startTime":283.933,"endTime":288.3,"body":"I haven't really been able to do that mentally"},{"startTime":288.3,"endTime":289.566,"body":"I've had the space to do it"},{"startTime":289.566,"endTime":292.066,"body":"but I just can't enter into that place"},{"startTime":292.766,"endTime":295.4,"body":"and it's gonna be real bad"},{"startTime":295.933,"endTime":297.266,"body":"yeah I"},{"startTime":297.966,"endTime":299.666,"body":"I think for me I"},{"startTime":300.9,"endTime":303.866,"body":"I mean I was just kind of numb at first"},{"startTime":304.566,"endTime":309.666,"body":"and then really like the weight of the effects"},{"startTime":310.9,"endTime":312.566,"body":"and what those effects are gonna be"},{"startTime":312.566,"endTime":314.366,"body":"has started to hit me um"},{"startTime":314.366,"endTime":317.5,"body":"especially for my students um"},{"startTime":317.966,"endTime":323.066,"body":"and so I mean really just oscillating between"},{"startTime":324.366,"endTime":328.6,"body":"anger and worry and"},{"startTime":328.9,"endTime":333.666,"body":"and also a sense of like in my heart"},{"startTime":334.1,"endTime":338.466,"body":"I kind of thought this was gonna be where we were"},{"startTime":338.733,"endTime":339.933,"body":"because what"},{"startTime":339.933,"endTime":342.966,"body":"because of what we watched of the past few years"},{"startTime":342.966,"endTime":345.666,"body":"especially with the church's response to"},{"startTime":346.0,"endTime":346.766,"body":"to me to"},{"startTime":346.766,"endTime":348.6,"body":"and church to to covid"},{"startTime":348.7,"endTime":351.2,"body":"to all of these things like at"},{"startTime":352.466,"endTime":358.666,"body":"I felt angry at myself for being surprised by it"},{"startTime":359.2,"endTime":363.3,"body":"um because there's a pattern and"},{"startTime":363.866,"endTime":368.666,"body":"and I I usually see the pattern like and"},{"startTime":368.666,"endTime":370.933,"body":"and and so just balancing that"},{"startTime":370.933,"endTime":372.566,"body":"like anger at myself"},{"startTime":372.566,"endTime":375.766,"body":"but also giving me space for like hoping that"},{"startTime":377.2,"endTime":379.166,"body":"that what I think is gonna be really"},{"startTime":379.166,"endTime":382.633,"body":"a worst case scenario in a lot of situations"},{"startTime":383.533,"endTime":384.533,"body":"and then also just like"},{"startTime":384.533,"endTime":387.033,"body":"what it says about us and our character"},{"startTime":387.466,"endTime":389.566,"body":"like as a nation"},{"startTime":390.333,"endTime":391.833,"body":"and and especially"},{"startTime":391.866,"endTime":394.066,"body":"you know 81% of evangelicals"},{"startTime":394.066,"endTime":395.466,"body":"which is where I come from"},{"startTime":396.333,"endTime":397.4,"body":"um"},{"startTime":397.966,"endTime":401.6,"body":"like what that says about our character and who we are"},{"startTime":402.066,"endTime":403.633,"body":"like that's"},{"startTime":405.166,"endTime":406.3,"body":"the football team that I"},{"startTime":406.3,"endTime":408.666,"body":"like is having a really hard season"},{"startTime":409.1,"endTime":410.8,"body":"very bad um"},{"startTime":410.8,"endTime":412.633,"body":"worse than we thought we were gonna be"},{"startTime":412.966,"endTime":415.5,"body":"and I was thinking about that on Saturday"},{"startTime":415.5,"endTime":418.6,"body":"as I was watching us lose a game that we should win"},{"startTime":419.166,"endTime":424.9,"body":"like this like this little like disappointment"},{"startTime":424.9,"endTime":426.366,"body":"but also why am I not surprised"},{"startTime":426.366,"endTime":428.9,"body":"cause that's just how things are going right now"},{"startTime":430.2,"endTime":435.466,"body":"that's how I feel all the time about everything"},{"startTime":435.733,"endTime":438.8,"body":"but it's not sports it's consequential"},{"startTime":440.1,"endTime":441.933,"body":"and and just that like"},{"startTime":441.933,"endTime":443.6,"body":"uh can't catch a break"},{"startTime":443.6,"endTime":446.266,"body":"like is is like how"},{"startTime":446.266,"endTime":448.966,"body":"how I feel like I can't I can't catch my breath"},{"startTime":448.966,"endTime":453.366,"body":"I can't catch a break I I can't"},{"startTime":455.266,"endTime":457.966,"body":"I can't find like Robert said space"},{"startTime":457.966,"endTime":462.566,"body":"like I cannot find a space"},{"startTime":464.2,"endTime":467.533,"body":"a thing to make me feel like no"},{"startTime":467.533,"endTime":469.6,"body":"that's it's not as bad as I think"},{"startTime":470.366,"endTime":470.8,"body":"like"},{"startTime":470.8,"endTime":473.133,"body":"I'm Roberts wearing his emotionally unavailable shirt"},{"startTime":473.133,"endTime":476.066,"body":"I'm wearing my potato shirt like that's where I'm at"},{"startTime":477.9,"endTime":480.3,"body":"is in and again"},{"startTime":480.3,"endTime":482.4,"body":"like I said like I just think"},{"startTime":483.7,"endTime":487.266,"body":"for me I'm just trying to regulate myself"},{"startTime":487.933,"endTime":491.233,"body":"and the heaviness and worry that I feel"},{"startTime":491.966,"endTime":496.466,"body":"so that my students are not taking any of that from me"},{"startTime":496.933,"endTime":498.5,"body":"um and"},{"startTime":498.5,"endTime":501.833,"body":"and honestly just preparing myself to do that long term"},{"startTime":502.066,"endTime":504.866,"body":"can I just add something to what you said Emily"},{"startTime":505.4,"endTime":510.566,"body":"I feel like the hope is the frustration"},{"startTime":510.566,"endTime":511.7,"body":"it's it's"},{"startTime":512.2,"endTime":513.533,"body":"it'd be one thing"},{"startTime":513.533,"endTime":516.633,"body":"if I had to jump off this building from the first floor"},{"startTime":517.1,"endTime":518.466,"body":"but I was on the eighth floor"},{"startTime":519.6,"endTime":527.033,"body":"and since 2,016 I have just immaculately"},{"startTime":527.866,"endTime":531.633,"body":"scrubbed my algorithm of all negativity"},{"startTime":531.666,"endTime":538.633,"body":"of everyone who doesn't add joy to my life in some way"},{"startTime":538.933,"endTime":540.933,"body":"and so I have"},{"startTime":540.933,"endTime":545.5,"body":"I've had this wonderful cocoon of positivity"},{"startTime":545.6,"endTime":548.533,"body":"of people who I pour into their life"},{"startTime":548.533,"endTime":550.1,"body":"and they pour into mine in some way"},{"startTime":550.1,"endTime":553.8,"body":"and so I was just surrounded by people that were saying"},{"startTime":553.8,"endTime":555.166,"body":"I understood the assignment"},{"startTime":555.166,"endTime":556.5,"body":"I completed the assignment"},{"startTime":556.5,"endTime":557.366,"body":"I understand the assignment"},{"startTime":557.366,"endTime":558.1,"body":"so like there was"},{"startTime":558.1,"endTime":562.266,"body":"just so much positivity and encouragement"},{"startTime":563.0,"endTime":566.433,"body":"across all platforms in my feed"},{"startTime":566.566,"endTime":569.8,"body":"that I I started to believe the hype"},{"startTime":571.366,"endTime":573.233,"body":"and I don't"},{"startTime":574.133,"endTime":578.166,"body":"I'm not upset with myself for hoping"},{"startTime":578.666,"endTime":581.0,"body":"I'm upset with myself"},{"startTime":581.266,"endTime":586.766,"body":"for not realising that I was in a bubble of my own"},{"startTime":587.1,"endTime":589.266,"body":"making and of course"},{"startTime":590.166,"endTime":591.233,"body":"of course"},{"startTime":591.4,"endTime":596.466,"body":"that's not what reality looked like because like"},{"startTime":596.533,"endTime":600.033,"body":"I had to I had to create a safe space"},{"startTime":600.4,"endTime":602.733,"body":"so of course"},{"startTime":602.733,"endTime":604.333,"body":"we were in the minority why"},{"startTime":604.333,"endTime":608.7,"body":"why would I ever not think that we were in the minority"},{"startTime":609.4,"endTime":612.066,"body":"because that's what history has proven"},{"startTime":612.2,"endTime":615.833,"body":"and so I guess that frustration"},{"startTime":616.166,"endTime":618.3,"body":"I don't consider it an echo chamber"},{"startTime":618.3,"endTime":619.166,"body":"and if even if it was"},{"startTime":619.166,"endTime":620.866,"body":"I don't care because where I've been"},{"startTime":620.866,"endTime":625.2,"body":"I've needed that support that echo"},{"startTime":627.5,"endTime":631.466,"body":"but I'm I'm so frustrated that it's like"},{"startTime":631.466,"endTime":636.166,"body":"I woke up from just the best dream and here's reality"},{"startTime":636.166,"endTime":637.033,"body":"and it sucks"},{"startTime":637.566,"endTime":638.166,"body":"yeah I mean I"},{"startTime":638.166,"endTime":639.266,"body":"I would say I mean"},{"startTime":639.266,"endTime":640.8,"body":"that's so profound both of you"},{"startTime":640.8,"endTime":642.333,"body":"I think what you said are so profound"},{"startTime":642.333,"endTime":644.666,"body":"and I think I can speak to like thinking"},{"startTime":644.666,"endTime":646.4,"body":"you know again"},{"startTime":646.4,"endTime":650.033,"body":"where I live is more progressive in the sense of"},{"startTime":650.266,"endTime":652.466,"body":"where I live is is predominantly blue"},{"startTime":652.466,"endTime":653.933,"body":"I guess but it's also progressive"},{"startTime":653.933,"endTime":655.066,"body":"a lot of different ideals"},{"startTime":655.066,"endTime":656.5,"body":"but there's still a lot of conservatism"},{"startTime":656.5,"endTime":660.866,"body":"and I see it I was surprised about how much"},{"startTime":661.5,"endTime":665.866,"body":"um support he had across different"},{"startTime":665.866,"endTime":666.366,"body":"you know people"},{"startTime":666.366,"endTime":668.166,"body":"groups and across different states that"},{"startTime":668.166,"endTime":670.4,"body":"historically have not supported him"},{"startTime":670.933,"endTime":674.5,"body":"not only was I surprised I left that night thinking"},{"startTime":674.7,"endTime":675.866,"body":"you know like"},{"startTime":676.066,"endTime":679.033,"body":"what is it really going to take for"},{"startTime":679.6,"endTime":680.4,"body":"for"},{"startTime":680.7,"endTime":683.366,"body":"I guess the religious or the Christians or those that"},{"startTime":683.366,"endTime":686.066,"body":"you know claim some sort of mortal majority to care"},{"startTime":686.066,"endTime":688.166,"body":"to care just to care about"},{"startTime":688.5,"endTime":688.9,"body":"you know"},{"startTime":688.9,"endTime":691.766,"body":"another human being to look at something and say"},{"startTime":691.933,"endTime":695.366,"body":"I have concern for this person"},{"startTime":695.366,"endTime":697.733,"body":"because it is a image bear of god"},{"startTime":697.733,"endTime":699.6,"body":"and that is No. 1 priority for me"},{"startTime":699.6,"endTime":703.833,"body":"I heard all the excuses about cheaper gas or groceries"},{"startTime":704.2,"endTime":706.5,"body":"heard all of it and in all reality"},{"startTime":706.5,"endTime":708.133,"body":"when I at the end of the night"},{"startTime":708.133,"endTime":709.3,"body":"I was like it's just"},{"startTime":709.666,"endTime":711.0,"body":"the vote to me was that"},{"startTime":711.0,"endTime":713.8,"body":"were further apart from really loving one another"},{"startTime":713.8,"endTime":717.166,"body":"like we should and the Celebration too"},{"startTime":717.166,"endTime":718.833,"body":"I saw a lot of celebrating"},{"startTime":718.966,"endTime":721.466,"body":"and what they were celebrating were just some"},{"startTime":722.1,"endTime":724.0,"body":"horrifically hateful things"},{"startTime":724.266,"endTime":725.0,"body":"and so I mean"},{"startTime":725.0,"endTime":727.466,"body":"I would ask both of you or anybody like"},{"startTime":727.566,"endTime":732.433,"body":"like as we move from this world now if"},{"startTime":732.7,"endTime":734.8,"body":"I mean how is that impacting both of you"},{"startTime":734.8,"endTime":736.566,"body":"because there is rhetoric now"},{"startTime":736.566,"endTime":739.066,"body":"about all different types of people groups"},{"startTime":739.333,"endTime":740.666,"body":"especially toward women"},{"startTime":741.266,"endTime":742.266,"body":"uh especially"},{"startTime":742.266,"endTime":744.833,"body":"toward those that may be illegal in this country"},{"startTime":744.933,"endTime":746.5,"body":"there's rhetoric there's hate"},{"startTime":746.7,"endTime":748.4,"body":"and I mean there's just an uptick"},{"startTime":748.4,"endTime":749.466,"body":"I saw on Twitter"},{"startTime":749.466,"endTime":752.7,"body":"there's like an uptick on like 4,000 some percent of"},{"startTime":752.7,"endTime":755.5,"body":"like hateful to hashtags that were present"},{"startTime":755.5,"endTime":757.033,"body":"so I mean"},{"startTime":757.166,"endTime":758.166,"body":"how does that I guess"},{"startTime":758.166,"endTime":760.1,"body":"how does that both land for both of you"},{"startTime":760.1,"endTime":762.033,"body":"in your spaces and in your"},{"startTime":762.266,"endTime":763.266,"body":"you know in your circles"},{"startTime":763.266,"endTime":764.4,"body":"like how are you"},{"startTime":764.533,"endTime":765.5,"body":"I mean how are you"},{"startTime":765.5,"endTime":765.766,"body":"I guess"},{"startTime":765.766,"endTime":768.9,"body":"digesting that or even trying to make sense of it"},{"startTime":768.9,"endTime":771.566,"body":"because it is like once he won"},{"startTime":771.566,"endTime":775.666,"body":"we just turned that faucet on again as loud as we could"},{"startTime":775.8,"endTime":777.2,"body":"and it's just coming out like"},{"startTime":777.2,"endTime":780.4,"body":"people feel like they have the ability"},{"startTime":780.733,"endTime":782.7,"body":"to protect their hate openly"},{"startTime":782.7,"endTime":784.366,"body":"more now and that"},{"startTime":784.366,"endTime":785.366,"body":"to me is appalling"},{"startTime":785.366,"endTime":786.933,"body":"but it's also devastating"},{"startTime":786.933,"endTime":789.8,"body":"yeah I think as a black male that's"},{"startTime":790.266,"endTime":791.466,"body":"that's the"},{"startTime":791.466,"endTime":797.033,"body":"that's one of the very concrete fears that I had"},{"startTime":797.266,"endTime":798.8,"body":"and that's what I experienced"},{"startTime":798.8,"endTime":801.4,"body":"during Trump's first election"},{"startTime":801.533,"endTime":804.933,"body":"and even his run the second time is"},{"startTime":804.933,"endTime":806.166,"body":"is just that"},{"startTime":806.166,"endTime":811.666,"body":"he emboldens other people to feel like they"},{"startTime":811.7,"endTime":812.566,"body":"they have the room"},{"startTime":812.566,"endTime":818.1,"body":"in the space and the permission to be their full"},{"startTime":818.1,"endTime":819.433,"body":"vile selves"},{"startTime":820.566,"endTime":822.566,"body":"and it"},{"startTime":823.2,"endTime":827.066,"body":"it turns out that this very thin veneer of humanity"},{"startTime":827.066,"endTime":830.4,"body":"that so many people have been wearing"},{"startTime":830.766,"endTime":831.7,"body":"I mean it just"},{"startTime":831.7,"endTime":835.666,"body":"it only takes the smallest thing for it to come off"},{"startTime":836.733,"endTime":839.1,"body":"and I think that"},{"startTime":840.533,"endTime":844.833,"body":"that's that's the real import of this election"},{"startTime":845.366,"endTime":849.2,"body":"is not about policies and economics and all that BS"},{"startTime":850.166,"endTime":854.0,"body":"it's about who we are as a nation"},{"startTime":854.2,"endTime":858.133,"body":"what we are going to communicate about the world"},{"startTime":858.133,"endTime":862.266,"body":"and about ourselves what we allow in society"},{"startTime":864.2,"endTime":865.366,"body":"and so"},{"startTime":866.333,"endTime":867.833,"body":"you know I I just"},{"startTime":872.7,"endTime":874.866,"body":"there there are things that"},{"startTime":877.1,"endTime":879.066,"body":"we lived through that I just"},{"startTime":879.066,"endTime":880.8,"body":"I do not wanna go back to"},{"startTime":882.3,"endTime":884.733,"body":"and like it it just doesn't matter what I want"},{"startTime":884.733,"endTime":885.766,"body":"I mean weird"},{"startTime":886.733,"endTime":888.5,"body":"we have to deal with it and so I"},{"startTime":888.5,"endTime":889.633,"body":"it's um"},{"startTime":890.066,"endTime":892.3,"body":"it's a lot to process it's hard still"},{"startTime":892.733,"endTime":893.066,"body":"I mean"},{"startTime":893.066,"endTime":895.1,"body":"I've been thinking obviously a lot about my students"},{"startTime":895.1,"endTime":897.2,"body":"that's gonna be something that I keep going back to"},{"startTime":897.2,"endTime":901.666,"body":"because I live in a place where"},{"startTime":902.8,"endTime":905.133,"body":"my students are already vulnerable"},{"startTime":905.133,"endTime":907.866,"body":"because of the political climate and culture that were"},{"startTime":907.866,"endTime":909.533,"body":"in um"},{"startTime":909.533,"endTime":911.266,"body":"you know I'm in a Title 1 school"},{"startTime":911.266,"endTime":914.1,"body":"I have a lot of students from poverty"},{"startTime":914.1,"endTime":915.666,"body":"students who are minorities"},{"startTime":915.666,"endTime":918.433,"body":"students from trauma um"},{"startTime":918.5,"endTime":921.4,"body":"students who are immigrants and"},{"startTime":921.4,"endTime":925.8,"body":"and so what what I really seen is"},{"startTime":925.8,"endTime":928.366,"body":"is kind of in the same vein as that"},{"startTime":928.366,"endTime":930.366,"body":"of this emboldening"},{"startTime":930.733,"endTime":935.166,"body":"of this culture that we're already navigating of like"},{"startTime":935.166,"endTime":938.066,"body":"now that now the election has happened"},{"startTime":938.2,"endTime":944.0,"body":"like that political climate has been so intensified um"},{"startTime":944.0,"endTime":945.833,"body":"around like"},{"startTime":946.5,"endTime":950.4,"body":"around threatening our students like"},{"startTime":951.0,"endTime":953.266,"body":"you know threatening to take food away from them"},{"startTime":953.266,"endTime":955.133,"body":"threatening to have them deported"},{"startTime":955.133,"endTime":958.0,"body":"threatening to not provide them with the education"},{"startTime":958.0,"endTime":960.0,"body":"that our state constitution"},{"startTime":960.3,"endTime":962.666,"body":"dictates that they be allowed"},{"startTime":963.066,"endTime":965.1,"body":"um and"},{"startTime":965.1,"endTime":968.7,"body":"and so and so there is that emboldening"},{"startTime":969.0,"endTime":970.766,"body":"you know and that um"},{"startTime":970.9,"endTime":971.5,"body":"in in a"},{"startTime":971.5,"endTime":972.3,"body":"in a"},{"startTime":972.8,"endTime":974.5,"body":"and not like a taking the mask off"},{"startTime":974.5,"endTime":977.1,"body":"cause there was already not a mask right"},{"startTime":977.1,"endTime":980.8,"body":"but it's just that it's so intense"},{"startTime":980.8,"endTime":982.866,"body":"like I've been feeling in my body"},{"startTime":983.1,"endTime":986.033,"body":"like just this deep like"},{"startTime":987.066,"endTime":988.6,"body":"what will I do"},{"startTime":990.166,"endTime":991.733,"body":"if I'm in school"},{"startTime":991.733,"endTime":993.866,"body":"and these things that have been talked about"},{"startTime":993.866,"endTime":996.2,"body":"openly by people in leadership"},{"startTime":996.8,"endTime":999.9,"body":"federally and locally start to happen"},{"startTime":1000.7,"endTime":1001.6,"body":"like"},{"startTime":1002.733,"endTime":1004.933,"body":"what is that gonna look like for me"},{"startTime":1004.933,"endTime":1006.866,"body":"like is that gonna cost me my job"},{"startTime":1006.866,"endTime":1007.933,"body":"is that gonna cost like"},{"startTime":1007.933,"endTime":1009.666,"body":"what is that gonna cost me"},{"startTime":1010.266,"endTime":1011.266,"body":"um"},{"startTime":1012.3,"endTime":1018.166,"body":"and and what does caring for my students and"},{"startTime":1018.9,"endTime":1019.866,"body":"and loving them"},{"startTime":1019.866,"endTime":1024.6,"body":"and providing a safe person who values them look like"},{"startTime":1024.6,"endTime":1026.9,"body":"in light of that I mean that"},{"startTime":1026.9,"endTime":1028.133,"body":"that's really where I'm at and"},{"startTime":1028.133,"endTime":1030.2,"body":"and I think um"},{"startTime":1031.1,"endTime":1032.233,"body":"I think there's"},{"startTime":1032.7,"endTime":1035.666,"body":"there's such a complexity of all of these things"},{"startTime":1035.666,"endTime":1037.1,"body":"like Robert you know"},{"startTime":1037.1,"endTime":1039.866,"body":"is seeing it from his experience as a black man and"},{"startTime":1039.966,"endTime":1041.666,"body":"and I'm seeing it from my experience"},{"startTime":1041.666,"endTime":1042.933,"body":"as a public school teacher"},{"startTime":1042.933,"endTime":1044.066,"body":"and then also"},{"startTime":1044.9,"endTime":1046.166,"body":"you know as a woman"},{"startTime":1046.166,"endTime":1047.966,"body":"like I'm not a survivor"},{"startTime":1048.6,"endTime":1050.366,"body":"um and"},{"startTime":1050.966,"endTime":1052.733,"body":"and seeing people say things like"},{"startTime":1052.733,"endTime":1054.666,"body":"your body my choice made"},{"startTime":1054.7,"endTime":1058.1,"body":"made my stomach hurt made my body hurt"},{"startTime":1058.2,"endTime":1060.766,"body":"like I had a trauma response to that"},{"startTime":1061.466,"endTime":1063.7,"body":"um as not a survivor"},{"startTime":1064.7,"endTime":1067.8,"body":"and and so um"},{"startTime":1068.166,"endTime":1068.866,"body":"and so yeah"},{"startTime":1068.866,"endTime":1075.066,"body":"I just I think the the emboldening of"},{"startTime":1076.466,"endTime":1079.233,"body":"of gleeful cruelty"},{"startTime":1080.866,"endTime":1082.5,"body":"and and people"},{"startTime":1082.5,"endTime":1084.866,"body":"and especially people doing that"},{"startTime":1085.133,"endTime":1087.433,"body":"with the name of Jesus on their lips"},{"startTime":1088.4,"endTime":1089.466,"body":"like I mean"},{"startTime":1089.466,"endTime":1090.066,"body":"where I live it"},{"startTime":1090.066,"endTime":1095.033,"body":"it's Christians it's church people um"},{"startTime":1095.266,"endTime":1096.166,"body":"and"},{"startTime":1096.933,"endTime":1099.866,"body":"and and that it"},{"startTime":1099.966,"endTime":1103.266,"body":"it's so antithetical to what"},{"startTime":1104.1,"endTime":1108.166,"body":"to what I am convicted that our faith demands of us"},{"startTime":1109.0,"endTime":1110.266,"body":"and that's the thing that"},{"startTime":1110.266,"endTime":1112.366,"body":"I'm having trouble reconciling"},{"startTime":1112.533,"endTime":1114.5,"body":"like I expect people to be terrible"},{"startTime":1114.5,"endTime":1116.866,"body":"people have been terrible all throughout human history"},{"startTime":1116.866,"endTime":1119.0,"body":"that is the through line of human history"},{"startTime":1119.0,"endTime":1120.366,"body":"is people are terrible"},{"startTime":1123.466,"endTime":1129.133,"body":"but I expect believers in Jesus to lay themselves down"},{"startTime":1129.133,"endTime":1131.6,"body":"to protect the vulnerable from terrible"},{"startTime":1131.6,"endTime":1133.866,"body":"not be the ones gleefully doing it"},{"startTime":1136.666,"endTime":1139.166,"body":"and I cannot reconcile that"},{"startTime":1139.166,"endTime":1142.666,"body":"I can't I don't know where to put it"},{"startTime":1143.066,"endTime":1145.1,"body":"it doesn't make sense to me"},{"startTime":1145.1,"endTime":1147.9,"body":"and I will never get over it never"},{"startTime":1148.933,"endTime":1151.066,"body":"and Emily let me validate what you said"},{"startTime":1151.066,"endTime":1155.166,"body":"like it's not just your understanding of the gospel"},{"startTime":1155.266,"endTime":1158.8,"body":"that is the objective true"},{"startTime":1159.266,"endTime":1162.033,"body":"accurate understanding of what the gospel is"},{"startTime":1163.166,"endTime":1166.2,"body":"you're not crazy we're not crazy"},{"startTime":1166.933,"endTime":1167.866,"body":"so"},{"startTime":1168.9,"endTime":1173.2,"body":"the majority of the US has lost their mind"},{"startTime":1174.166,"endTime":1175.166,"body":"is what it comes down to"},{"startTime":1175.166,"endTime":1177.6,"body":"these people did not hold their nose"},{"startTime":1177.8,"endTime":1179.666,"body":"they cheered uh"},{"startTime":1179.666,"endTime":1182.4,"body":"I wanna interject it is not technically a majority"},{"startTime":1182.4,"endTime":1184.633,"body":"it's like 49 point something percent"},{"startTime":1185.7,"endTime":1186.766,"body":"the voting that"},{"startTime":1186.766,"endTime":1189.2,"body":"I'm not gonna give them more credit than they deserve"},{"startTime":1189.766,"endTime":1190.933,"body":"well I mean"},{"startTime":1190.933,"endTime":1192.5,"body":"that's fair enough I just"},{"startTime":1192.5,"endTime":1195.8,"body":"I feel like it's a representative sample"},{"startTime":1195.8,"endTime":1199.266,"body":"I like how could it not be because of the jury"},{"startTime":1199.266,"endTime":1200.2,"body":"the church"},{"startTime":1200.966,"endTime":1203.966,"body":"jury church voted for him 100%"},{"startTime":1203.966,"endTime":1207.166,"body":"so there's a pastor there was some Mrs"},{"startTime":1207.166,"endTime":1208.066,"body":"Stone back that"},{"startTime":1208.066,"endTime":1210.366,"body":"there was someone who put up a map of the US"},{"startTime":1210.366,"endTime":1212.6,"body":"on social media and the blue dots"},{"startTime":1212.6,"endTime":1215.066,"body":"as he indicated that those were mission zones"},{"startTime":1215.066,"endTime":1215.866,"body":"or places where"},{"startTime":1215.866,"endTime":1217.9,"body":"we need to send missionaries in the States"},{"startTime":1217.9,"endTime":1220.266,"body":"and I and to your point Emily"},{"startTime":1220.266,"endTime":1221.666,"body":"like I think that's how"},{"startTime":1221.7,"endTime":1223.166,"body":"and to to Robert's point"},{"startTime":1223.166,"endTime":1224.433,"body":"like that's how"},{"startTime":1225.066,"endTime":1225.6,"body":"that's where"},{"startTime":1225.6,"endTime":1228.533,"body":"that really speaks volumes or where we're at and"},{"startTime":1228.533,"endTime":1232.366,"body":"and what we see and how closely we have"},{"startTime":1232.366,"endTime":1232.6,"body":"now"},{"startTime":1232.6,"endTime":1236.2,"body":"tied these political beliefs to our religious beliefs"},{"startTime":1236.366,"endTime":1237.566,"body":"and you know"},{"startTime":1237.566,"endTime":1240.7,"body":"and by doing that we have"},{"startTime":1241.133,"endTime":1243.8,"body":"we have willingly sacrificed"},{"startTime":1243.8,"endTime":1244.966,"body":"in my opinion"},{"startTime":1245.5,"endTime":1249.566,"body":"you know our savior and the beliefs of our savior to"},{"startTime":1249.566,"endTime":1251.1,"body":"to what for power and"},{"startTime":1251.1,"endTime":1254.966,"body":"and only power for a few and it's"},{"startTime":1254.966,"endTime":1258.266,"body":"it's just sad Sunday night"},{"startTime":1258.9,"endTime":1261.4,"body":"it like hit me before the election"},{"startTime":1261.4,"endTime":1263.733,"body":"like this wasn't going how I had thought"},{"startTime":1263.733,"endTime":1264.533,"body":"like"},{"startTime":1265.066,"endTime":1267.2,"body":"I don't know where I'm at with God right now"},{"startTime":1267.2,"endTime":1270.366,"body":"but maybe it was God just like throwing me a bone"},{"startTime":1270.366,"endTime":1272.366,"body":"like prep yourself"},{"startTime":1272.366,"endTime":1275.533,"body":"this is about to get harder than you even thought"},{"startTime":1275.533,"endTime":1276.366,"body":"um"},{"startTime":1276.9,"endTime":1280.0,"body":"and I went on this date with my husband"},{"startTime":1280.0,"endTime":1282.433,"body":"and I'm sitting there and then I just started like"},{"startTime":1282.466,"endTime":1284.666,"body":"vocally ugly sobbing in public"},{"startTime":1286.133,"endTime":1287.2,"body":"and um"},{"startTime":1287.933,"endTime":1288.533,"body":"and I like"},{"startTime":1288.533,"endTime":1289.7,"body":"had to assure the bartender"},{"startTime":1289.7,"endTime":1291.866,"body":"that I wasn't getting divorced"},{"startTime":1291.866,"endTime":1295.866,"body":"that I was crying about the election and our country"},{"startTime":1295.866,"endTime":1297.266,"body":"and really"},{"startTime":1297.266,"endTime":1300.566,"body":"what I was crying about and what I could not get over"},{"startTime":1301.0,"endTime":1302.666,"body":"and it was shocking to me"},{"startTime":1302.666,"endTime":1305.566,"body":"because we have a lot of episodes of"},{"startTime":1305.566,"endTime":1306.466,"body":"stories of"},{"startTime":1306.466,"endTime":1307.866,"body":"this being the character"},{"startTime":1307.966,"endTime":1310.466,"body":"of the people that we were supposed to trust"},{"startTime":1310.466,"endTime":1312.033,"body":"you know or that are"},{"startTime":1312.533,"endTime":1315.533,"body":"supposed to be speaking in Jesus name"},{"startTime":1315.533,"endTime":1318.4,"body":"and following Jesus but just like"},{"startTime":1318.4,"endTime":1322.7,"body":"the layer of betrayal this time hits different"},{"startTime":1323.333,"endTime":1326.1,"body":"and I don't and I think that's partially"},{"startTime":1326.1,"endTime":1329.166,"body":"because my eyes are open more um"},{"startTime":1330.166,"endTime":1332.533,"body":"and partially because I can't believe more"},{"startTime":1332.533,"endTime":1334.2,"body":"people's eyes aren't open more"},{"startTime":1334.2,"endTime":1337.566,"body":"this time I just kind of what you were saying"},{"startTime":1337.566,"endTime":1341.433,"body":"Emily with this inability to reckon with it"},{"startTime":1342.066,"endTime":1342.7,"body":"and like"},{"startTime":1342.7,"endTime":1345.8,"body":"nowhere to hold it and no ability to get over it"},{"startTime":1345.8,"endTime":1350.1,"body":"like it's just like this giant stone that's just like"},{"startTime":1350.1,"endTime":1352.8,"body":"sitting on my chest that just exists"},{"startTime":1353.333,"endTime":1357.833,"body":"and I can I have a place"},{"startTime":1358.5,"endTime":1361.633,"body":"for people who aren't doing it in Jesus name"},{"startTime":1362.2,"endTime":1364.866,"body":"like I have a way to process that"},{"startTime":1365.066,"endTime":1367.033,"body":"I have a place to put that"},{"startTime":1367.066,"endTime":1371.533,"body":"and I even have like more empathy for that"},{"startTime":1371.533,"endTime":1373.9,"body":"as awful as that sound like I can like"},{"startTime":1375.366,"endTime":1378.566,"body":"I I have patience for it in a way that I"},{"startTime":1378.566,"endTime":1382.666,"body":"I have none left for people that claim Jesus"},{"startTime":1382.666,"endTime":1388.166,"body":"and that is a new layer for me"},{"startTime":1388.166,"endTime":1389.666,"body":"where I feel like"},{"startTime":1389.666,"endTime":1394.566,"body":"I have worked exceptionally hard to stay soft"},{"startTime":1395.966,"endTime":1402.666,"body":"um and to hold on to hope and I don't"},{"startTime":1404.366,"endTime":1407.066,"body":"I'm trying not to use totalizing language"},{"startTime":1407.066,"endTime":1408.566,"body":"during these next few weeks"},{"startTime":1408.566,"endTime":1411.466,"body":"because I know I'm gonna be on a roller coaster of"},{"startTime":1412.566,"endTime":1415.366,"body":"all sorts of stuff but I do feel"},{"startTime":1416.566,"endTime":1419.8,"body":"like this giant rock on my chest"},{"startTime":1420.2,"endTime":1423.0,"body":"that is the evangelical church in America"},{"startTime":1423.0,"endTime":1426.366,"body":"and the complete lack of integrity"},{"startTime":1426.866,"endTime":1429.566,"body":"and wickedness that we"},{"startTime":1430.0,"endTime":1432.7,"body":"have decided to get under the blanket"},{"startTime":1432.7,"endTime":1435.233,"body":"and snuggle up with and say kumbaya"},{"startTime":1436.566,"endTime":1437.133,"body":"I just I"},{"startTime":1437.133,"endTime":1439.0,"body":"I can't like I"},{"startTime":1439.0,"endTime":1441.266,"body":"I'm not I don't even know if I have more to articulate"},{"startTime":1441.266,"endTime":1444.233,"body":"but that's where I'm at emotionally and"},{"startTime":1445.7,"endTime":1447.9,"body":"I think that"},{"startTime":1449.166,"endTime":1451.466,"body":"survivors that continue to speak out"},{"startTime":1451.466,"endTime":1452.733,"body":"in the face of this"},{"startTime":1452.733,"endTime":1458.9,"body":"are going to be where I go to find hope"},{"startTime":1459.1,"endTime":1460.066,"body":"um"},{"startTime":1461.2,"endTime":1462.533,"body":"but right now like"},{"startTime":1462.533,"endTime":1463.766,"body":"I'm shaking saying this"},{"startTime":1463.766,"endTime":1468.2,"body":"because I just feel so off kilter and so stuck"},{"startTime":1468.2,"endTime":1470.766,"body":"like I feel like we're in a corner right now"},{"startTime":1471.066,"endTime":1473.366,"body":"and like there is nowhere to go"},{"startTime":1473.366,"endTime":1476.933,"body":"we're just here like what do you do with that"},{"startTime":1476.933,"endTime":1481.4,"body":"like that is so scary if I can just encourage you"},{"startTime":1481.4,"endTime":1484.666,"body":"Jonna as your local friendly Enneagram 8"},{"startTime":1484.666,"endTime":1487.9,"body":"who is ready to just always burn it all down"},{"startTime":1488.7,"endTime":1490.366,"body":"I think it's completely"},{"startTime":1490.366,"endTime":1493.8,"body":"fair to speak in terms of totality here"},{"startTime":1494.066,"endTime":1499.166,"body":"because there is no one if you are an adult who"},{"startTime":1499.166,"endTime":1500.9,"body":"and I'm not saying this flippingly"},{"startTime":1500.9,"endTime":1505.533,"body":"like if you have average intelligence as an adult"},{"startTime":1505.533,"endTime":1507.566,"body":"and you can vote and you did vote"},{"startTime":1507.566,"endTime":1510.333,"body":"or you could vote and you didn't vote"},{"startTime":1510.333,"endTime":1513.666,"body":"or you voted for 3rd party whatever"},{"startTime":1515.366,"endTime":1518.8,"body":"you knew exactly where we are"},{"startTime":1518.966,"endTime":1521.133,"body":"what the consequences would be"},{"startTime":1521.133,"endTime":1524.3,"body":"you knew exactly who you were championing"},{"startTime":1524.3,"endTime":1526.766,"body":"championing however you said that word"},{"startTime":1528.1,"endTime":1530.6,"body":"you knew like no one knows ignorant"},{"startTime":1530.6,"endTime":1533.133,"body":"like we live in the information age"},{"startTime":1533.133,"endTime":1536.9,"body":"I cannot give anyone the benefit of ignorance"},{"startTime":1536.933,"endTime":1538.266,"body":"at this date"},{"startTime":1539.6,"endTime":1546.366,"body":"so I can't accept that people were ignorant"},{"startTime":1546.366,"endTime":1548.4,"body":"that they should have known better"},{"startTime":1548.8,"endTime":1552.6,"body":"like everyone knew like just set everything else aside"},{"startTime":1553.166,"endTime":1555.6,"body":"I don't know who needs to hear this"},{"startTime":1555.6,"endTime":1557.466,"body":"but as a criminal defense attorney"},{"startTime":1557.466,"endTime":1563.9,"body":"I have never represented someone who had 34 felonies"},{"startTime":1564.466,"endTime":1568.633,"body":"and I certainly never represented anyone who had"},{"startTime":1568.966,"endTime":1571.566,"body":"got convicted of 34 felonies"},{"startTime":1571.566,"endTime":1573.4,"body":"and walked out the courtroom"},{"startTime":1574.066,"endTime":1577.866,"body":"I have tried every case you can think of okay"},{"startTime":1577.866,"endTime":1580.8,"body":"I'm talking traffic tickets to murder"},{"startTime":1581.7,"endTime":1584.333,"body":"never have I we had my"},{"startTime":1584.333,"endTime":1585.566,"body":"my business partner"},{"startTime":1585.566,"endTime":1587.933,"body":"just got done trying this huge Rico case"},{"startTime":1587.933,"endTime":1591.0,"body":"where they were like 5 or 6 or something defendants"},{"startTime":1591.0,"endTime":1593.333,"body":"and they were all interacting together"},{"startTime":1593.333,"endTime":1594.566,"body":"was the allegation and like"},{"startTime":1594.566,"endTime":1597.266,"body":"there's allegations of murder and drug usage"},{"startTime":1597.266,"endTime":1598.5,"body":"and burglary and all this"},{"startTime":1598.5,"endTime":1601.966,"body":"none of those guys had 34 counts none of them"},{"startTime":1603.5,"endTime":1605.0,"body":"take away everything else"},{"startTime":1605.0,"endTime":1608.6,"body":"a 34 time convicted felon that's not going away"},{"startTime":1610.366,"endTime":1612.0,"body":"no one's without it's no one"},{"startTime":1612.0,"endTime":1614.266,"body":"no one has an excuse no one"},{"startTime":1615.933,"endTime":1619.3,"body":"I agree and thank you for putting that perspective here"},{"startTime":1619.3,"endTime":1622.3,"body":"I just like I think even with that"},{"startTime":1622.4,"endTime":1625.066,"body":"part of the feeling like I'm in a corner right now"},{"startTime":1625.066,"endTime":1625.7,"body":"is like the"},{"startTime":1625.7,"endTime":1628.1,"body":"knowing a little bit"},{"startTime":1628.1,"endTime":1629.4,"body":"what you were saying in the beginning"},{"startTime":1629.4,"endTime":1633.533,"body":"like I grieved on Sunday but it wasn't even close"},{"startTime":1633.533,"endTime":1636.3,"body":"to what really needs to be grieved right now"},{"startTime":1636.533,"endTime":1641.333,"body":"and knowing that to continue forward for my own good"},{"startTime":1641.333,"endTime":1644.166,"body":"like just as a human and the people I care about"},{"startTime":1644.166,"endTime":1646.833,"body":"I'm gonna have to like grieve so deeply"},{"startTime":1647.3,"endTime":1652.733,"body":"that that wasn't disqualifying to the church"},{"startTime":1652.733,"endTime":1655.466,"body":"that 34 felonies wasn't enough"},{"startTime":1655.7,"endTime":1658.533,"body":"that truth does not matter"},{"startTime":1658.533,"endTime":1660.133,"body":"and that character does not matter"},{"startTime":1660.133,"endTime":1664.333,"body":"like that I don't even have a place or a space"},{"startTime":1664.333,"endTime":1667.233,"body":"or an understanding of how to grieve that"},{"startTime":1667.4,"endTime":1672.266,"body":"like it feels so big and so vulnerable"},{"startTime":1672.266,"endTime":1673.633,"body":"and like can we even"},{"startTime":1674.166,"endTime":1677.166,"body":"I I believe we have to take the time to grieve it"},{"startTime":1677.2,"endTime":1678.066,"body":"like I believe there's"},{"startTime":1678.066,"endTime":1680.466,"body":"it's a non negotiable for all of us"},{"startTime":1681.133,"endTime":1682.566,"body":"especially those of us on this call"},{"startTime":1682.566,"endTime":1684.266,"body":"who are face to face with this garbage"},{"startTime":1684.266,"endTime":1685.7,"body":"every single day"},{"startTime":1686.333,"endTime":1687.566,"body":"but like"},{"startTime":1688.3,"endTime":1689.466,"body":"how and like"},{"startTime":1689.466,"endTime":1691.4,"body":"what are we risking to do that"},{"startTime":1691.4,"endTime":1693.433,"body":"like when you pull that thread"},{"startTime":1693.533,"endTime":1697.8,"body":"and actually let yourself grieve this wickedness"},{"startTime":1698.1,"endTime":1701.4,"body":"like how do you live like"},{"startTime":1701.4,"endTime":1704.1,"body":"how do you keep walking you know"},{"startTime":1704.2,"endTime":1705.1,"body":"I do think there's"},{"startTime":1705.1,"endTime":1708.3,"body":"another layer to what Robert was talking about"},{"startTime":1708.333,"endTime":1712.433,"body":"is that I I agree people are without excuse"},{"startTime":1713.066,"endTime":1714.533,"body":"but I think there are a lot of people"},{"startTime":1714.533,"endTime":1716.433,"body":"who chose not to know"},{"startTime":1717.333,"endTime":1720.7,"body":"who chose to look away who chose not to listen"},{"startTime":1720.733,"endTime":1722.766,"body":"I've had so many conversations where I'll say well"},{"startTime":1722.766,"endTime":1723.6,"body":"what about this and like"},{"startTime":1723.6,"endTime":1725.6,"body":"well I've never heard that well"},{"startTime":1725.666,"endTime":1726.1,"body":"like well"},{"startTime":1726.1,"endTime":1727.4,"body":"I don't read stuff I don't listen"},{"startTime":1727.4,"endTime":1728.766,"body":"I don't watch the whatever"},{"startTime":1728.766,"endTime":1731.333,"body":"like I'm I don't care about that like"},{"startTime":1731.333,"endTime":1731.666,"body":"like"},{"startTime":1731.666,"endTime":1736.5,"body":"they have decided that it's fine for them to not know"},{"startTime":1736.5,"endTime":1738.766,"body":"and not care or"},{"startTime":1739.133,"endTime":1739.9,"body":"and so and so it"},{"startTime":1739.9,"endTime":1740.2,"body":"it it"},{"startTime":1740.2,"endTime":1744.7,"body":"it's this chosen self protective"},{"startTime":1745.566,"endTime":1749.033,"body":"ignorance that they think gives them a pass"},{"startTime":1749.866,"endTime":1750.933,"body":"and and"},{"startTime":1750.933,"endTime":1753.466,"body":"and it doesn't erase their culpability"},{"startTime":1753.9,"endTime":1754.566,"body":"it just make"},{"startTime":1754.566,"endTime":1757.433,"body":"it just erases their cognitive dissonance about it"},{"startTime":1758.166,"endTime":1759.5,"body":"and so like well"},{"startTime":1759.5,"endTime":1760.3,"body":"well I didn't know that"},{"startTime":1760.3,"endTime":1761.333,"body":"well I didn't believe that"},{"startTime":1761.333,"endTime":1762.133,"body":"well whatever"},{"startTime":1762.133,"endTime":1764.8,"body":"and like the the amount of evidence"},{"startTime":1764.8,"endTime":1768.0,"body":"like the speaking as an Enneagram 5"},{"startTime":1768.133,"endTime":1772.3,"body":"I do not understand having the amount of evidence"},{"startTime":1772.566,"endTime":1775.633,"body":"the patterns the receipts"},{"startTime":1777.2,"endTime":1779.3,"body":"and and just being like oh"},{"startTime":1779.3,"endTime":1779.733,"body":"well I"},{"startTime":1779.733,"endTime":1781.4,"body":"I didn't know that I didn't see that"},{"startTime":1781.4,"endTime":1784.633,"body":"I didn't believe that like it's"},{"startTime":1784.8,"endTime":1787.366,"body":"to me that's what makes up my mind right"},{"startTime":1787.366,"endTime":1789.033,"body":"the evidence and the facts and"},{"startTime":1789.266,"endTime":1790.333,"body":"and those things and"},{"startTime":1790.333,"endTime":1792.266,"body":"and I think so many people"},{"startTime":1793.533,"endTime":1796.666,"body":"it it's too internally costly for them"},{"startTime":1798.333,"endTime":1802.0,"body":"to admit that they know and so they've create"},{"startTime":1802.0,"endTime":1804.166,"body":"I think so many people especially in the church and"},{"startTime":1804.166,"endTime":1808.0,"body":"and we see this with with abuse situations right"},{"startTime":1808.0,"endTime":1810.566,"body":"that people have created a bubble"},{"startTime":1810.733,"endTime":1812.466,"body":"of ignorance around themselves"},{"startTime":1812.466,"endTime":1812.966,"body":"so that they"},{"startTime":1812.966,"endTime":1814.4,"body":"create a bubble"},{"startTime":1814.533,"endTime":1816.8,"body":"of not being accountable around themselves"},{"startTime":1816.8,"endTime":1817.6,"body":"as well"},{"startTime":1818.3,"endTime":1819.166,"body":"and well"},{"startTime":1819.166,"endTime":1820.5,"body":"I didn't know that so"},{"startTime":1820.5,"endTime":1822.7,"body":"or it's not my fault I didn't know"},{"startTime":1822.733,"endTime":1824.533,"body":"well like"},{"startTime":1824.533,"endTime":1825.533,"body":"you know now"},{"startTime":1825.533,"endTime":1827.8,"body":"what's stopping you from knowing now"},{"startTime":1827.8,"endTime":1832.6,"body":"and I think that people will choose not to know"},{"startTime":1832.733,"endTime":1834.333,"body":"choose to close their eyes"},{"startTime":1834.333,"endTime":1836.3,"body":"choose to close their ears"},{"startTime":1836.666,"endTime":1840.566,"body":"because then they do not have to be held responsible"},{"startTime":1840.566,"endTime":1842.633,"body":"for what they do with the knowledge"},{"startTime":1843.2,"endTime":1846.166,"body":"and and I actually think that that"},{"startTime":1846.166,"endTime":1848.066,"body":"that is a bigger problem"},{"startTime":1848.533,"endTime":1851.566,"body":"because then we're just screaming into the wind"},{"startTime":1851.933,"endTime":1855.466,"body":"with people who in to"},{"startTime":1855.466,"endTime":1859.3,"body":"to take words from Jesus have hardened their hearts"},{"startTime":1859.733,"endTime":1861.0,"body":"and have turned their ears"},{"startTime":1861.0,"endTime":1863.0,"body":"and eyes away from the truth"},{"startTime":1863.533,"endTime":1864.366,"body":"and"},{"startTime":1864.9,"endTime":1866.266,"body":"and like it's"},{"startTime":1867.1,"endTime":1869.966,"body":"it's a whole lot easier to say"},{"startTime":1869.966,"endTime":1872.0,"body":"this is what God wants"},{"startTime":1872.566,"endTime":1875.8,"body":"when you just pretend that you've never heard or turn"},{"startTime":1875.8,"endTime":1883.2,"body":"or turn it off or or refuse to believe the multitude"},{"startTime":1883.7,"endTime":1888.0,"body":"and decades long patterns of wickedness"},{"startTime":1889.166,"endTime":1890.4,"body":"like and"},{"startTime":1890.566,"endTime":1894.566,"body":"and and my experience with people has been"},{"startTime":1895.666,"endTime":1898.033,"body":"they have convinced themselves"},{"startTime":1898.3,"endTime":1900.2,"body":"that they're not trying to hear that"},{"startTime":1900.7,"endTime":1902.3,"body":"and if they do accidentally hear"},{"startTime":1902.3,"endTime":1903.766,"body":"they don't have to believe it"},{"startTime":1904.566,"endTime":1909.166,"body":"and there is no convincing that it matters"},{"startTime":1909.866,"endTime":1912.433,"body":"to know the truth and be changed by it"},{"startTime":1913.166,"endTime":1917.666,"body":"so I think that when you're talking about like the"},{"startTime":1918.466,"endTime":1920.066,"body":"like the five stages of grief"},{"startTime":1920.066,"endTime":1924.0,"body":"you know like denial bargaining anger"},{"startTime":1924.0,"endTime":1925.866,"body":"depression acceptance"},{"startTime":1927.133,"endTime":1930.433,"body":"I think that are saying"},{"startTime":1930.966,"endTime":1932.933,"body":"that there are people out there"},{"startTime":1932.933,"endTime":1935.0,"body":"that have turned their ears off"},{"startTime":1935.366,"endTime":1938.9,"body":"who their algorithm isn't giving them information"},{"startTime":1938.9,"endTime":1941.766,"body":"who are informed and don't want to be informed"},{"startTime":1942.166,"endTime":1945.6,"body":"I think that's our version of denial"},{"startTime":1945.966,"endTime":1948.166,"body":"if you don't know like again"},{"startTime":1948.166,"endTime":1950.966,"body":"I go back to I don't think anyone's uninformed"},{"startTime":1950.966,"endTime":1951.933,"body":"but let's just say"},{"startTime":1951.933,"endTime":1955.3,"body":"they didn't know about 34 felony convictions"},{"startTime":1955.6,"endTime":1958.266,"body":"you know something"},{"startTime":1958.966,"endTime":1961.2,"body":"you lived through his first term"},{"startTime":1961.9,"endTime":1964.1,"body":"you know what he's about yeah"},{"startTime":1964.1,"endTime":1965.166,"body":"if you didn't hear"},{"startTime":1965.166,"endTime":1967.333,"body":"if you didn't hear him say anything about his"},{"startTime":1967.333,"endTime":1970.0,"body":"policies or anything about commerce policies"},{"startTime":1970.166,"endTime":1973.5,"body":"you've heard him speak and you know that he's a"},{"startTime":1973.5,"endTime":1976.133,"body":"you watch January 6th right"},{"startTime":1976.133,"endTime":1978.0,"body":"we all watched that right"},{"startTime":1978.2,"endTime":1979.166,"body":"you know that he well"},{"startTime":1979.166,"endTime":1981.166,"body":"that's why I keep saying choosing"},{"startTime":1981.166,"endTime":1984.2,"body":"they're choosing to just erase it from their brain"},{"startTime":1984.2,"endTime":1985.466,"body":"so that they don't have to deal with"},{"startTime":1985.466,"endTime":1986.766,"body":"their responsibility in it"},{"startTime":1986.766,"endTime":1987.266,"body":"I mean I"},{"startTime":1987.266,"endTime":1989.0,"body":"I just I can't excuse it"},{"startTime":1989.0,"endTime":1989.933,"body":"like if if nothing"},{"startTime":1989.933,"endTime":1990.6,"body":"if you didn't know no"},{"startTime":1990.6,"endTime":1992.5,"body":"I don't think it's an excuse"},{"startTime":1992.5,"endTime":1993.966,"body":"I just I just think that it's"},{"startTime":1993.966,"endTime":1996.466,"body":"I think that people are intentionally"},{"startTime":1997.6,"endTime":1999.8,"body":"refusing to hear the truth"},{"startTime":2000.0,"endTime":2000.966,"body":"and I think that"},{"startTime":2000.966,"endTime":2004.366,"body":"it's so reflective of what we see in churches"},{"startTime":2004.366,"endTime":2007.066,"body":"like of you know"},{"startTime":2007.066,"endTime":2008.466,"body":"in like I"},{"startTime":2008.466,"endTime":2010.166,"body":"I was in an SBC church"},{"startTime":2010.166,"endTime":2013.866,"body":"at the time that the Houston Chronicle thing came out"},{"startTime":2013.866,"endTime":2017.633,"body":"and I had so many conversations with people who said"},{"startTime":2017.666,"endTime":2019.466,"body":"well but that's not a problem here"},{"startTime":2019.466,"endTime":2022.7,"body":"and like they would not listen and"},{"startTime":2022.7,"endTime":2024.466,"body":"and one of those people like"},{"startTime":2024.466,"endTime":2026.066,"body":"their own daughter"},{"startTime":2026.266,"endTime":2030.666,"body":"was a victim of sexual abuse in a church setting and"},{"startTime":2030.666,"endTime":2031.466,"body":"and and still"},{"startTime":2031.466,"endTime":2035.133,"body":"there's just the refusal to take in the information"},{"startTime":2035.133,"endTime":2036.6,"body":"not that you aren't exposed to it"},{"startTime":2036.6,"endTime":2038.133,"body":"but that like I"},{"startTime":2038.133,"endTime":2041.3,"body":"I just think that there's so many people who have this"},{"startTime":2041.3,"endTime":2043.2,"body":"self protective"},{"startTime":2043.9,"endTime":2044.866,"body":"like"},{"startTime":2045.9,"endTime":2048.366,"body":"that thing isn't real"},{"startTime":2048.366,"endTime":2051.4,"body":"because I want this other thing to be more important"},{"startTime":2051.7,"endTime":2052.666,"body":"that and"},{"startTime":2052.666,"endTime":2054.733,"body":"and so I and so I don't hear me"},{"startTime":2054.733,"endTime":2056.0,"body":"don't hear me excusing it"},{"startTime":2056.0,"endTime":2057.433,"body":"that's not what I'm doing"},{"startTime":2057.466,"endTime":2058.966,"body":"I'm saying that like"},{"startTime":2058.966,"endTime":2061.966,"body":"I think that people are in a prison of"},{"startTime":2061.966,"endTime":2065.0,"body":"of this bubble around themselves"},{"startTime":2065.2,"endTime":2068.666,"body":"that they refuse to interact with reality"},{"startTime":2068.933,"endTime":2071.1,"body":"in a way that makes them responsible"},{"startTime":2071.1,"endTime":2072.966,"body":"for how they interact with it"},{"startTime":2072.966,"endTime":2074.066,"body":"does that make sense yeah"},{"startTime":2074.066,"endTime":2074.966,"body":"I mean I hear that"},{"startTime":2074.966,"endTime":2077.866,"body":"and so I hear that I guess my point is"},{"startTime":2078.1,"endTime":2081.4,"body":"at the point that you are exposed to the truth"},{"startTime":2082.3,"endTime":2083.633,"body":"you are without excuse"},{"startTime":2084.266,"endTime":2088.133,"body":"when you see reality and you"},{"startTime":2088.133,"endTime":2090.166,"body":"if you if you decide"},{"startTime":2090.3,"endTime":2093.066,"body":"that you're going to accept a different reality"},{"startTime":2093.066,"endTime":2096.2,"body":"because reality makes you uncomfortable"},{"startTime":2096.2,"endTime":2099.633,"body":"at whatever level of cognition that happens"},{"startTime":2099.933,"endTime":2101.766,"body":"you are without excuse"},{"startTime":2102.466,"endTime":2108.433,"body":"and the the only way for the rest of us who have"},{"startTime":2109.733,"endTime":2113.333,"body":"some semblance of sanity to get ourselves"},{"startTime":2113.333,"endTime":2116.9,"body":"out of this abusive relationship with these people"},{"startTime":2117.566,"endTime":2121.366,"body":"is to understand that whether it is intentional action"},{"startTime":2121.366,"endTime":2123.8,"body":"knowing action whether it's negligent"},{"startTime":2123.8,"endTime":2125.3,"body":"they should have known better"},{"startTime":2125.3,"endTime":2127.9,"body":"the reasonable person would have known better"},{"startTime":2128.066,"endTime":2129.9,"body":"whatever level of cognition"},{"startTime":2129.9,"endTime":2132.0,"body":"whether it's intentional or reckless"},{"startTime":2133.166,"endTime":2133.966,"body":"there's"},{"startTime":2133.966,"endTime":2138.766,"body":"there's some level of culpability that's involved"},{"startTime":2138.766,"endTime":2142.7,"body":"that we can incite that we can assign to them and say"},{"startTime":2142.933,"endTime":2143.9,"body":"you should have known better"},{"startTime":2143.9,"endTime":2145.066,"body":"you should have done better"},{"startTime":2145.066,"endTime":2148.4,"body":"you didn't if you didn't know anything about the man"},{"startTime":2148.4,"endTime":2150.533,"body":"his policies or anything else"},{"startTime":2150.533,"endTime":2152.466,"body":"you just you know that as"},{"startTime":2152.466,"endTime":2153.7,"body":"especially in the church"},{"startTime":2153.733,"endTime":2158.0,"body":"you know what the scriptures say allegedly right"},{"startTime":2158.5,"endTime":2160.866,"body":"and you know that he doesn't add up"},{"startTime":2161.766,"endTime":2163.633,"body":"you're without excuse"},{"startTime":2164.166,"endTime":2166.266,"body":"and so I so I"},{"startTime":2167.0,"endTime":2168.366,"body":"I have a question on top of that"},{"startTime":2168.366,"endTime":2169.333,"body":"cause I think both of you"},{"startTime":2169.333,"endTime":2170.766,"body":"this has been something I've"},{"startTime":2170.933,"endTime":2172.533,"body":"I've really you know"},{"startTime":2172.533,"endTime":2174.1,"body":"thought about his exhaustion"},{"startTime":2174.1,"endTime":2175.366,"body":"you know especially"},{"startTime":2175.566,"endTime":2177.3,"body":"you know for Robert is a black man"},{"startTime":2177.3,"endTime":2178.5,"body":"other people of color like"},{"startTime":2178.5,"endTime":2180.166,"body":"there has to be a level of exhaustion"},{"startTime":2180.166,"endTime":2182.266,"body":"to this whole thing because it's like"},{"startTime":2182.5,"endTime":2184.0,"body":"it's just it's"},{"startTime":2184.0,"endTime":2185.666,"body":"it's just the same it's just it"},{"startTime":2185.666,"endTime":2188.666,"body":"it's just the same story especially in the church"},{"startTime":2188.733,"endTime":2189.8,"body":"and then I also think from"},{"startTime":2189.8,"endTime":2191.3,"body":"like a survivor's perspective"},{"startTime":2191.3,"endTime":2192.866,"body":"if you're an abuse survivor in the church"},{"startTime":2192.866,"endTime":2195.2,"body":"there has to be a level exhaustion too"},{"startTime":2195.266,"endTime":2196.533,"body":"going back into this so"},{"startTime":2196.533,"endTime":2198.166,"body":"I would love to understand"},{"startTime":2198.366,"endTime":2200.733,"body":"where does exhaustion fit on tiny that"},{"startTime":2200.733,"endTime":2203.833,"body":"that paradigm of grief and then what is"},{"startTime":2204.2,"endTime":2204.933,"body":"if people"},{"startTime":2204.933,"endTime":2207.766,"body":"if people are feeling that level of exhaustion"},{"startTime":2207.866,"endTime":2210.833,"body":"what are some things to do to really"},{"startTime":2211.7,"endTime":2212.166,"body":"I guess"},{"startTime":2212.166,"endTime":2214.9,"body":"acknowledge it and name it and have space for it"},{"startTime":2214.9,"endTime":2217.7,"body":"because I know that that is something that is there"},{"startTime":2217.7,"endTime":2219.766,"body":"and has to be there for most people"},{"startTime":2220.166,"endTime":2221.066,"body":"I mean"},{"startTime":2221.766,"endTime":2225.466,"body":"I know I'm tired um my"},{"startTime":2226.766,"endTime":2232.4,"body":"newsfeed is just black person after black person"},{"startTime":2232.4,"endTime":2233.266,"body":"I mean black people we"},{"startTime":2233.266,"endTime":2235.2,"body":"we are we are exhausted"},{"startTime":2235.2,"endTime":2235.3,"body":"we we"},{"startTime":2235.3,"endTime":2236.566,"body":"we've been tied"},{"startTime":2237.333,"endTime":2238.5,"body":"um"},{"startTime":2240.4,"endTime":2246.966,"body":"there seems to be a a consensus right now that"},{"startTime":2248.2,"endTime":2251.366,"body":"you getting what you asked for and"},{"startTime":2254.266,"endTime":2255.933,"body":"I on one hand"},{"startTime":2255.933,"endTime":2259.066,"body":"I don't know what to do with"},{"startTime":2260.6,"endTime":2265.966,"body":"I've never been in the position of seeing"},{"startTime":2266.6,"endTime":2269.633,"body":"a place where my help was needed"},{"startTime":2270.6,"endTime":2274.666,"body":"and intentionally turning my back and saying"},{"startTime":2275.466,"endTime":2278.566,"body":"not my problem I've never done that before"},{"startTime":2279.533,"endTime":2282.7,"body":"but there is a self preservation"},{"startTime":2283.266,"endTime":2286.8,"body":"like a cocoon instinct right now"},{"startTime":2287.1,"endTime":2289.733,"body":"that I think that a lot of black people"},{"startTime":2289.733,"endTime":2291.5,"body":"in particular are feeling"},{"startTime":2291.5,"endTime":2293.1,"body":"that's just kinda like"},{"startTime":2293.333,"endTime":2296.2,"body":"I'm done telling you that the stove is hot"},{"startTime":2296.8,"endTime":2301.233,"body":"touch it like I can show you better than I can tell you"},{"startTime":2301.966,"endTime":2303.9,"body":"you just gotta figure it out on your own"},{"startTime":2303.9,"endTime":2308.7,"body":"and I think that a lot of us are trying to figure out"},{"startTime":2309.733,"endTime":2314.7,"body":"yeah what does that look like while we are still within"},{"startTime":2314.7,"endTime":2316.666,"body":"like we're still on this boat together"},{"startTime":2316.966,"endTime":2319.933,"body":"so what does that mean you know"},{"startTime":2319.933,"endTime":2321.333,"body":"does it mean like you said"},{"startTime":2321.333,"endTime":2324.533,"body":"that I'm just concentrating on my family"},{"startTime":2324.533,"endTime":2325.833,"body":"is it mean that"},{"startTime":2326.533,"endTime":2327.966,"body":"um you know"},{"startTime":2327.966,"endTime":2329.8,"body":"I'm building a community"},{"startTime":2329.8,"endTime":2332.8,"body":"I talk in the book about the importance of"},{"startTime":2332.866,"endTime":2335.2,"body":"not hunting for community"},{"startTime":2335.2,"endTime":2337.2,"body":"trying to find community and like"},{"startTime":2337.2,"endTime":2339.533,"body":"turning over rocks and church hopping"},{"startTime":2339.533,"endTime":2341.166,"body":"and putting your heart on the altar"},{"startTime":2341.166,"endTime":2342.0,"body":"week after week"},{"startTime":2342.0,"endTime":2344.3,"body":"hoping that you're gonna find a safe space"},{"startTime":2344.3,"endTime":2349.4,"body":"but rather creating a safe community so that"},{"startTime":2349.4,"endTime":2350.266,"body":"you know people that"},{"startTime":2350.266,"endTime":2351.1,"body":"you know are"},{"startTime":2351.1,"endTime":2351.9,"body":"are like minded"},{"startTime":2351.9,"endTime":2354.8,"body":"that we don't have to strive and struggle"},{"startTime":2354.8,"endTime":2355.1,"body":"like"},{"startTime":2355.1,"endTime":2358.066,"body":"we're just gonna gather together and then do our thing"},{"startTime":2358.066,"endTime":2359.466,"body":"I what does that look like now"},{"startTime":2359.466,"endTime":2361.466,"body":"I don't know like I just"},{"startTime":2362.166,"endTime":2363.8,"body":"I'll be completely honest with you"},{"startTime":2363.8,"endTime":2366.7,"body":"I mean we are um"},{"startTime":2367.366,"endTime":2369.8,"body":"you know just this week we got passports made"},{"startTime":2371.133,"endTime":2372.733,"body":"so you know"},{"startTime":2372.733,"endTime":2377.666,"body":"there's no telling what the future will hold and"},{"startTime":2377.733,"endTime":2378.466,"body":"you know I"},{"startTime":2378.466,"endTime":2382.3,"body":"I I can't afford to not be ready to pivot"},{"startTime":2383.333,"endTime":2389.4,"body":"so I guess to to add to your thought"},{"startTime":2389.533,"endTime":2390.133,"body":"um I"},{"startTime":2390.133,"endTime":2397.066,"body":"I don't know what it looks like to live in community"},{"startTime":2397.066,"endTime":2399.566,"body":"and to love people and to care for people"},{"startTime":2400.533,"endTime":2401.8,"body":"while at the same time"},{"startTime":2401.8,"endTime":2406.7,"body":"being too tired to expend any effort to do so"},{"startTime":2407.0,"endTime":2409.233,"body":"I think that"},{"startTime":2410.466,"endTime":2416.866,"body":"white X evangelicals have more of a responsibility"},{"startTime":2416.866,"endTime":2421.233,"body":"over the next 4 years to stand on the front lines"},{"startTime":2421.733,"endTime":2426.9,"body":"because it was us it was our families"},{"startTime":2426.9,"endTime":2431.8,"body":"it was our people that created this space"},{"startTime":2431.8,"endTime":2434.466,"body":"and that voted for this for our country"},{"startTime":2434.566,"endTime":2435.5,"body":"so"},{"startTime":2436.266,"endTime":2437.3,"body":"I do feel like"},{"startTime":2437.3,"endTime":2440.966,"body":"there is a different weight of responsibility"},{"startTime":2441.0,"endTime":2444.566,"body":"depending on how we enter this next four years"},{"startTime":2444.566,"endTime":2446.3,"body":"how we engage like"},{"startTime":2446.5,"endTime":2450.966,"body":"I feel responsible to have these conversations"},{"startTime":2450.966,"endTime":2454.333,"body":"where I don't feel like you're responsible for that"},{"startTime":2454.333,"endTime":2455.133,"body":"Robert"},{"startTime":2455.966,"endTime":2456.966,"body":"um"},{"startTime":2457.566,"endTime":2459.466,"body":"does that make sense what I'm saying"},{"startTime":2459.7,"endTime":2461.166,"body":"yeah no you're"},{"startTime":2461.166,"endTime":2462.333,"body":"that's exactly what I was gonna say"},{"startTime":2462.333,"endTime":2462.566,"body":"I was"},{"startTime":2462.566,"endTime":2464.866,"body":"I was thinking about your conversation with Tiffany"},{"startTime":2464.866,"endTime":2465.866,"body":"thick pin"},{"startTime":2466.4,"endTime":2467.9,"body":"um and"},{"startTime":2467.9,"endTime":2469.4,"body":"and how she said that like"},{"startTime":2469.9,"endTime":2470.566,"body":"she was talking about"},{"startTime":2470.566,"endTime":2475.866,"body":"that they want you to give up and just go away and"},{"startTime":2475.866,"endTime":2479.766,"body":"and that's something that I really stress a lot in"},{"startTime":2479.766,"endTime":2482.5,"body":"you know in SBC things is that like"},{"startTime":2483.4,"endTime":2487.1,"body":"what matters is for people who are not survivors"},{"startTime":2487.166,"endTime":2489.766,"body":"to step into the work to pick up the baton"},{"startTime":2489.766,"endTime":2493.766,"body":"and to carry it to the end because survivors are tired"},{"startTime":2494.3,"endTime":2496.3,"body":"like they they've been doing it"},{"startTime":2496.3,"endTime":2499.5,"body":"and I and I think this is parallel to that like um"},{"startTime":2499.5,"endTime":2500.7,"body":"to what both of you are saying"},{"startTime":2500.7,"endTime":2505.966,"body":"like the people who who have been bearing the weight"},{"startTime":2506.5,"endTime":2509.433,"body":"of these hidden things that have been revealed"},{"startTime":2510.933,"endTime":2513.266,"body":"they don't need to be the ones who have to do"},{"startTime":2513.266,"endTime":2515.866,"body":"continue the work of carrying that"},{"startTime":2515.866,"endTime":2519.7,"body":"like other people need to step into it and"},{"startTime":2519.7,"endTime":2521.066,"body":"and and so"},{"startTime":2521.1,"endTime":2522.066,"body":"you know I"},{"startTime":2524.166,"endTime":2524.8,"body":"like yeah"},{"startTime":2524.8,"endTime":2526.666,"body":"I mean basically"},{"startTime":2526.666,"endTime":2527.1,"body":"I mean I"},{"startTime":2527.1,"endTime":2529.966,"body":"I live in a place where every county"},{"startTime":2531.7,"endTime":2532.633,"body":"voted"},{"startTime":2533.266,"endTime":2535.533,"body":"like saw everything and said yes"},{"startTime":2535.533,"endTime":2537.6,"body":"that's what we want right"},{"startTime":2537.866,"endTime":2542.066,"body":"and and so I think there is this"},{"startTime":2542.533,"endTime":2544.5,"body":"this desire for well"},{"startTime":2544.5,"endTime":2546.366,"body":"now you're just gonna get what you want"},{"startTime":2547.133,"endTime":2548.366,"body":"right and"},{"startTime":2548.366,"endTime":2550.2,"body":"and you maybe if you just get what you want"},{"startTime":2550.2,"endTime":2553.066,"body":"then you'll like be reflective about or whatever"},{"startTime":2553.066,"endTime":2553.666,"body":"but first of all"},{"startTime":2553.666,"endTime":2555.6,"body":"I don't know if that's necessarily true"},{"startTime":2555.9,"endTime":2560.7,"body":"like that my experience is not that people are"},{"startTime":2561.333,"endTime":2563.666,"body":"are going to be reflective um"},{"startTime":2563.666,"endTime":2565.066,"body":"they're gonna double down"},{"startTime":2565.666,"endTime":2566.533,"body":"um but"},{"startTime":2566.533,"endTime":2570.633,"body":"but the other thing for me is that like"},{"startTime":2571.166,"endTime":2574.966,"body":"I feel that like you know to"},{"startTime":2575.366,"endTime":2576.466,"body":"to quote the Old Testament"},{"startTime":2576.466,"endTime":2579.166,"body":"to turn people over to their evil desires"},{"startTime":2579.366,"endTime":2581.066,"body":"and let them deal with the fall out of that"},{"startTime":2581.066,"endTime":2582.5,"body":"like I get that"},{"startTime":2582.966,"endTime":2588.1,"body":"but again I teach pre K and a Title 1 school"},{"startTime":2589.766,"endTime":2594.766,"body":"if we turn the department of education over to the"},{"startTime":2594.766,"endTime":2598.233,"body":"evil desires here then my students stop getting food"},{"startTime":2599.466,"endTime":2602.166,"body":"my students stop having IPS"},{"startTime":2602.666,"endTime":2605.3,"body":"my students stop having 5 O fours"},{"startTime":2605.333,"endTime":2608.166,"body":"my students stop having a school counselor"},{"startTime":2608.466,"endTime":2611.5,"body":"my students stop having things that they need"},{"startTime":2611.5,"endTime":2613.533,"body":"not just to thrive in school"},{"startTime":2613.533,"endTime":2615.766,"body":"but to literally survive"},{"startTime":2616.166,"endTime":2618.566,"body":"and there are so many layers on top of that right"},{"startTime":2618.566,"endTime":2620.466,"body":"because it's not just school"},{"startTime":2621.133,"endTime":2624.166,"body":"it's immigration things it's"},{"startTime":2625.333,"endTime":2626.966,"body":"you know like other"},{"startTime":2627.166,"endTime":2630.9,"body":"it's Medicare and Medicaid and Social Security"},{"startTime":2630.9,"endTime":2631.666,"body":"and so you know"},{"startTime":2631.666,"endTime":2632.766,"body":"I have a student that"},{"startTime":2632.766,"endTime":2635.366,"body":"if I have a student who lives with grandma"},{"startTime":2635.366,"endTime":2636.4,"body":"and they're on Medicare"},{"startTime":2636.4,"endTime":2639.833,"body":"Medicaid and live off Grandma's Social Security and"},{"startTime":2640.066,"endTime":2643.133,"body":"and someone in their family is an illegal immigrant"},{"startTime":2643.133,"endTime":2647.466,"body":"and they get free and reduce lunch and they are on IP"},{"startTime":2647.466,"endTime":2648.533,"body":"and they like"},{"startTime":2648.533,"endTime":2651.566,"body":"there's all of these layers of vulnerability"},{"startTime":2652.666,"endTime":2657.5,"body":"that my innocent four year olds bear the cost of"},{"startTime":2657.5,"endTime":2659.266,"body":"just letting it burn down"},{"startTime":2660.466,"endTime":2664.366,"body":"and so what and so for me like"},{"startTime":2667.2,"endTime":2669.0,"body":"yes I want people to recognize"},{"startTime":2669.0,"endTime":2671.4,"body":"the consequences of their actions"},{"startTime":2671.966,"endTime":2675.166,"body":"but also I'm gonna do everything in my power"},{"startTime":2675.3,"endTime":2676.966,"body":"to prevent the innocent children"},{"startTime":2676.966,"endTime":2679.533,"body":"whose charge I am whose care I am charged with"},{"startTime":2679.533,"endTime":2681.233,"body":"for suffering those consequences"},{"startTime":2681.933,"endTime":2682.766,"body":"and and so"},{"startTime":2682.766,"endTime":2684.766,"body":"and so I think there's a complexity to that"},{"startTime":2684.766,"endTime":2687.666,"body":"and an acknowledgement of like well"},{"startTime":2687.666,"endTime":2689.066,"body":"people just need to like"},{"startTime":2689.066,"endTime":2691.966,"body":"my students cannot survive tariffs"},{"startTime":2692.666,"endTime":2694.633,"body":"they already can't buy food"},{"startTime":2696.0,"endTime":2696.8,"body":"and and"},{"startTime":2696.8,"endTime":2701.9,"body":"and so recognizing the layered vulnerabilities and"},{"startTime":2701.9,"endTime":2704.1,"body":"and who is going to bear the brunt"},{"startTime":2704.1,"endTime":2706.466,"body":"of it because it's not going to be white"},{"startTime":2706.466,"endTime":2708.466,"body":"suburban evangelical women"},{"startTime":2708.933,"endTime":2710.8,"body":"like we're gonna bear some of it"},{"startTime":2712.166,"endTime":2714.566,"body":"but the brunt of it is gonna be"},{"startTime":2716.3,"endTime":2719.0,"body":"the immigrant students in my classroom"},{"startTime":2720.0,"endTime":2721.866,"body":"the students from trauma in my classroom"},{"startTime":2721.866,"endTime":2724.1,"body":"the students in a cycle of poverty and violence"},{"startTime":2724.1,"endTime":2727.0,"body":"in my classroom who are not getting the resources"},{"startTime":2727.0,"endTime":2729.966,"body":"that our community has promised to give them"},{"startTime":2732.1,"endTime":2737.266,"body":"because we wanna let other people f around and find out"},{"startTime":2737.8,"endTime":2739.2,"body":"they're not the ones finding out"},{"startTime":2739.2,"endTime":2740.666,"body":"my kids are finding out"},{"startTime":2741.566,"endTime":2742.266,"body":"and and I"},{"startTime":2742.266,"endTime":2745.166,"body":"I don't know what I'm gonna be able to do about that"},{"startTime":2745.166,"endTime":2747.933,"body":"but I'm gonna stand in front of everything"},{"startTime":2747.933,"endTime":2751.866,"body":"I can do about it because that's my responsibility"},{"startTime":2753.366,"endTime":2756.533,"body":"sick irony is that the you know"},{"startTime":2756.533,"endTime":2759.0,"body":"the people that'll say are pro life"},{"startTime":2759.3,"endTime":2761.7,"body":"what you just described is pro life"},{"startTime":2761.7,"endTime":2763.266,"body":"it's pro it's"},{"startTime":2763.266,"endTime":2765.266,"body":"that is the essence of pro life"},{"startTime":2765.266,"endTime":2765.5,"body":"but yet"},{"startTime":2765.5,"endTime":2769.5,"body":"we turn our eye to that because of political gains"},{"startTime":2769.5,"endTime":2773.066,"body":"and rhetoric and in hate speech and things like that"},{"startTime":2773.066,"endTime":2773.766,"body":"and you know"},{"startTime":2773.766,"endTime":2775.166,"body":"I would say to like you know"},{"startTime":2775.166,"endTime":2777.133,"body":"when you look at some of the things he's proposed"},{"startTime":2777.133,"endTime":2778.7,"body":"and especially like the immigration ban"},{"startTime":2778.7,"endTime":2781.066,"body":"or the immigrant deportation of people"},{"startTime":2781.066,"endTime":2783.9,"body":"which is just appalling on so many levels"},{"startTime":2784.1,"endTime":2784.733,"body":"I I mean"},{"startTime":2784.733,"endTime":2786.866,"body":"like I would I would say this"},{"startTime":2786.866,"endTime":2787.466,"body":"like if you"},{"startTime":2787.466,"endTime":2790.766,"body":"if you were a leader in the church and you are"},{"startTime":2791.166,"endTime":2792.2,"body":"you are not"},{"startTime":2792.933,"endTime":2796.6,"body":"you are not speaking out against what is happening"},{"startTime":2796.6,"endTime":2797.166,"body":"right now"},{"startTime":2797.166,"endTime":2800.533,"body":"and I'm not talking about like speaking out mildly"},{"startTime":2800.533,"endTime":2803.6,"body":"boldly boldly speaking out"},{"startTime":2803.6,"endTime":2806.5,"body":"and telling your congregation the truth"},{"startTime":2806.666,"endTime":2811.166,"body":"about what is going on then this is on you as well"},{"startTime":2811.166,"endTime":2814.366,"body":"because you are a critical role in this component"},{"startTime":2814.366,"endTime":2814.5,"body":"and"},{"startTime":2814.5,"endTime":2817.4,"body":"I do believe that there are church leaders who don't"},{"startTime":2817.766,"endTime":2819.266,"body":"agree with what happened"},{"startTime":2819.266,"endTime":2821.466,"body":"but if you are silent right now"},{"startTime":2821.466,"endTime":2824.966,"body":"if you are silent and you refuse to speak"},{"startTime":2825.333,"endTime":2826.266,"body":"you are I mean"},{"startTime":2826.266,"endTime":2828.066,"body":"the guilt is just as bad for you"},{"startTime":2828.066,"endTime":2828.866,"body":"because"},{"startTime":2829.066,"endTime":2831.633,"body":"part of the reason that I believe that we got there"},{"startTime":2832.3,"endTime":2835.2,"body":"here is because church leaders just decided well"},{"startTime":2835.2,"endTime":2837.0,"body":"we're just gonna preach the gospel"},{"startTime":2837.3,"endTime":2840.833,"body":"and by doing that they basically ignored the humans"},{"startTime":2841.2,"endTime":2842.333,"body":"ignored everyone"},{"startTime":2842.333,"endTime":2844.533,"body":"and we just focused on our Sunday service"},{"startTime":2844.533,"endTime":2847.533,"body":"and writing our sermons and then leaving no"},{"startTime":2847.533,"endTime":2850.133,"body":"this is the work like this is what matters"},{"startTime":2850.133,"endTime":2851.733,"body":"and I just I mean"},{"startTime":2851.733,"endTime":2854.3,"body":"I just wanna say like I'm just heartbroken"},{"startTime":2854.3,"endTime":2856.866,"body":"that these conversations even have to have"},{"startTime":2856.866,"endTime":2858.9,"body":"we even have to have in communities"},{"startTime":2859.1,"endTime":2862.4,"body":"and it it breaks my heart when I hear you speak"},{"startTime":2862.4,"endTime":2863.666,"body":"Emily breaks my heart"},{"startTime":2863.666,"endTime":2865.7,"body":"Robert it breaks my heart just to hear your exhaust"},{"startTime":2865.7,"endTime":2867.0,"body":"I can see your exhaustion"},{"startTime":2867.0,"endTime":2870.033,"body":"like it breaks my heart like it breaks my heart"},{"startTime":2870.2,"endTime":2872.433,"body":"and we have got"},{"startTime":2873.0,"endTime":2877.7,"body":"we have got to stand up we've got to stand up"},{"startTime":2878.1,"endTime":2881.666,"body":"we cannot allow this just evil"},{"startTime":2881.666,"endTime":2882.1,"body":"and this"},{"startTime":2882.1,"endTime":2886.866,"body":"just reduction of humanity to exist in our churches"},{"startTime":2886.866,"endTime":2888.566,"body":"because they aren't churches"},{"startTime":2888.566,"endTime":2889.366,"body":"then"},{"startTime":2889.4,"endTime":2893.566,"body":"they're just places we go to check the boxes and get"},{"startTime":2893.666,"endTime":2896.133,"body":"I don't maybe go to dinner or whatever"},{"startTime":2896.133,"endTime":2898.166,"body":"they're not churches they're not of the gospel"},{"startTime":2898.166,"endTime":2900.866,"body":"they're not of Jesus they're not of Jesus"},{"startTime":2900.866,"endTime":2903.8,"body":"if you're promoting pro Trump policies in your church"},{"startTime":2903.866,"endTime":2905.466,"body":"your church is not of Jesus"},{"startTime":2905.5,"endTime":2908.833,"body":"and it said that 1,000% is not of Jesus"},{"startTime":2909.1,"endTime":2910.8,"body":"Jay I think you made a really good point"},{"startTime":2910.8,"endTime":2912.333,"body":"and it's something that I thought of"},{"startTime":2912.333,"endTime":2916.1,"body":"because I try to avoid feeling"},{"startTime":2916.466,"endTime":2918.7,"body":"hard things as much as possible"},{"startTime":2918.7,"endTime":2921.966,"body":"as a human being my brain automatically goes to like"},{"startTime":2921.966,"endTime":2923.066,"body":"well who's gonna do"},{"startTime":2923.066,"endTime":2924.566,"body":"like how what are we gonna do"},{"startTime":2924.566,"endTime":2926.8,"body":"who's gonna be who is gonna be on the front lines"},{"startTime":2926.8,"endTime":2927.6,"body":"like who's gonna"},{"startTime":2927.6,"endTime":2928.533,"body":"who are they gonna believe"},{"startTime":2928.533,"endTime":2929.366,"body":"they don't even believe me"},{"startTime":2929.366,"endTime":2931.066,"body":"like they're my like family"},{"startTime":2931.066,"endTime":2933.5,"body":"like who who is gonna get through to them"},{"startTime":2933.5,"endTime":2936.033,"body":"and again not sure anyone is"},{"startTime":2936.366,"endTime":2939.133,"body":"maybe a lightning bolt from the Lord himself"},{"startTime":2939.133,"endTime":2941.8,"body":"but like immediately I was like"},{"startTime":2941.8,"endTime":2944.6,"body":"we need pastors we need pastors"},{"startTime":2944.6,"endTime":2947.666,"body":"we need all your pastors in your pulpits"},{"startTime":2947.666,"endTime":2949.633,"body":"to start bearing the cost"},{"startTime":2949.866,"endTime":2951.766,"body":"you've got to start bearing the cost"},{"startTime":2951.766,"endTime":2954.4,"body":"and there's no excuse there's not one excuse"},{"startTime":2954.4,"endTime":2956.6,"body":"I don't care how damn tired you are"},{"startTime":2956.6,"endTime":2958.1,"body":"we're all tired"},{"startTime":2958.9,"endTime":2961.766,"body":"stand up and speak to this crap"},{"startTime":2961.9,"endTime":2963.766,"body":"you need to be the front lines"},{"startTime":2964.1,"endTime":2966.266,"body":"you need to be telling your people"},{"startTime":2966.266,"endTime":2968.2,"body":"because they don't listen to us"},{"startTime":2968.533,"endTime":2970.6,"body":"they're not listening to us"},{"startTime":2970.666,"endTime":2973.666,"body":"and I know you pastors are listening"},{"startTime":2973.666,"endTime":2976.266,"body":"to us cause I know pastors listen to this podcast"},{"startTime":2977.1,"endTime":2979.7,"body":"you have to start bearing the cost"},{"startTime":2979.7,"endTime":2981.3,"body":"and you're gonna lose ties"},{"startTime":2981.366,"endTime":2983.266,"body":"and you might have to close your doors"},{"startTime":2983.266,"endTime":2984.9,"body":"and you might have to go to a park"},{"startTime":2984.9,"endTime":2987.833,"body":"and start talking from a park table bench"},{"startTime":2988.0,"endTime":2991.5,"body":"I don't care anymore it's not worth it"},{"startTime":2991.533,"endTime":2993.566,"body":"none of the crap is worth it"},{"startTime":2993.566,"endTime":2998.966,"body":"if the cost is our soul and you are double responsible"},{"startTime":2998.966,"endTime":3002.133,"body":"if we believe the Bible you are double responsible"},{"startTime":3002.133,"endTime":3005.7,"body":"for what you are not discipling in your congregations"},{"startTime":3006.133,"endTime":3008.033,"body":"or what you are discipling"},{"startTime":3008.066,"endTime":3010.233,"body":"which is hyper individualism"},{"startTime":3010.466,"endTime":3013.833,"body":"hate that you have masked in love"},{"startTime":3013.966,"endTime":3016.7,"body":"and masked in the language of Jesus himself"},{"startTime":3016.7,"endTime":3019.6,"body":"and it is disgusting and it's time to stand up"},{"startTime":3019.6,"endTime":3021.233,"body":"we're done we're tired"},{"startTime":3021.366,"endTime":3023.2,"body":"this is tired Johnna talking right now"},{"startTime":3023.2,"endTime":3025.366,"body":"we're tired it's gotta be you"},{"startTime":3025.566,"endTime":3027.3,"body":"it has to be you cause we"},{"startTime":3027.5,"endTime":3029.8,"body":"our voices don't matter I'm a woman"},{"startTime":3030.6,"endTime":3033.066,"body":"especially in white evangelical churches"},{"startTime":3033.533,"endTime":3035.266,"body":"to be honest Robert"},{"startTime":3035.266,"endTime":3037.366,"body":"has more of a voice in most of those spaces"},{"startTime":3037.366,"endTime":3039.5,"body":"than I have in those spaces"},{"startTime":3040.1,"endTime":3041.366,"body":"and that's complicated cause"},{"startTime":3041.366,"endTime":3043.1,"body":"there's other complicated parts that"},{"startTime":3043.1,"endTime":3045.333,"body":"are involved in that that are intersecting"},{"startTime":3045.333,"endTime":3046.6,"body":"but it's a reality"},{"startTime":3046.733,"endTime":3050.133,"body":"like I can't walk into the room and say these things"},{"startTime":3050.133,"endTime":3053.3,"body":"I'm not allowed to say these things"},{"startTime":3053.3,"endTime":3055.3,"body":"my voice matters is nothing"},{"startTime":3055.866,"endTime":3058.4,"body":"you have to say it white pastor"},{"startTime":3058.933,"endTime":3060.4,"body":"you have to say it"},{"startTime":3061.1,"endTime":3063.833,"body":"sorry yeah and I just wanna"},{"startTime":3065.1,"endTime":3065.766,"body":"say you know"},{"startTime":3065.766,"endTime":3069.9,"body":"Jay said something that I think is really critical"},{"startTime":3070.933,"endTime":3072.433,"body":"but also incomplete"},{"startTime":3072.7,"endTime":3076.8,"body":"is that people chose to just preach the gospel"},{"startTime":3079.7,"endTime":3081.166,"body":"but the gospel"},{"startTime":3082.366,"endTime":3086.666,"body":"is turning upside down the economy of this world"},{"startTime":3087.9,"endTime":3090.6,"body":"for the sake of other people right"},{"startTime":3090.6,"endTime":3092.5,"body":"like I mean the"},{"startTime":3092.6,"endTime":3095.5,"body":"the Gospels starts with Matthew"},{"startTime":3095.5,"endTime":3097.8,"body":"and it's Mary's magnificot right"},{"startTime":3097.8,"endTime":3101.8,"body":"and Mary's magnificot is this prophetic retelling"},{"startTime":3103.366,"endTime":3106.6,"body":"of of these strains from the Old Testament"},{"startTime":3106.7,"endTime":3110.7,"body":"of god upturning the empires of this world"},{"startTime":3110.7,"endTime":3114.533,"body":"and setting up an economy of the lowly being lifted up"},{"startTime":3114.533,"endTime":3117.2,"body":"that is the beginning of the gospel"},{"startTime":3119.066,"endTime":3119.966,"body":"and"},{"startTime":3120.666,"endTime":3123.533,"body":"and and when we say just preach the gospel"},{"startTime":3123.533,"endTime":3125.766,"body":"if we are not preaching that"},{"startTime":3125.766,"endTime":3128.666,"body":"we lay ourselves down to lift others up"},{"startTime":3128.666,"endTime":3130.466,"body":"then we're not even doing that"},{"startTime":3131.066,"endTime":3134.0,"body":"right like I had a conversation with a"},{"startTime":3134.533,"endTime":3138.066,"body":"with a fellow believer that I am close to who said well"},{"startTime":3138.066,"endTime":3140.0,"body":"Emily you can't expect people"},{"startTime":3140.333,"endTime":3142.5,"body":"to vote against their own interest"},{"startTime":3142.5,"endTime":3144.2,"body":"I absolutely can"},{"startTime":3144.966,"endTime":3147.833,"body":"that is exactly what I should expect"},{"startTime":3148.0,"endTime":3150.3,"body":"from the people of Jesus"},{"startTime":3150.7,"endTime":3154.4,"body":"to lay themselves down against their own interest"},{"startTime":3154.4,"endTime":3156.1,"body":"for the sake of other people"},{"startTime":3156.1,"endTime":3158.633,"body":"that is exactly what the gospel is"},{"startTime":3159.066,"endTime":3160.866,"body":"it is I take up my cross"},{"startTime":3160.866,"endTime":3163.966,"body":"I crucify myself I lay down my wants"},{"startTime":3163.966,"endTime":3167.166,"body":"my desires I give you more than I'm required to"},{"startTime":3167.166,"endTime":3169.166,"body":"more than you ask of me"},{"startTime":3170.4,"endTime":3173.3,"body":"and I follow after Jesus as he does that"},{"startTime":3173.3,"endTime":3175.6,"body":"as he empties himself and lowers himself"},{"startTime":3175.6,"endTime":3179.5,"body":"to lift other people up and so when pastor say"},{"startTime":3179.5,"endTime":3181.166,"body":"well we're just concentrate on the gospel"},{"startTime":3181.166,"endTime":3183.766,"body":"then preach the whole gospel"},{"startTime":3184.3,"endTime":3186.766,"body":"preach the whole council of Scripture"},{"startTime":3186.933,"endTime":3190.2,"body":"where god has a special concern for the marginalized"},{"startTime":3190.2,"endTime":3195.433,"body":"and the vulnerable where god has a special concern for"},{"startTime":3195.6,"endTime":3198.866,"body":"for mistreatment of those people"},{"startTime":3198.866,"endTime":3202.266,"body":"and his harsh judgment upon his people in"},{"startTime":3202.4,"endTime":3205.1,"body":"when they when there is corruption"},{"startTime":3205.1,"endTime":3208.133,"body":"and mistreatment of the vulnerable and the lowly"},{"startTime":3208.133,"endTime":3210.8,"body":"like that is the whole council of Scripture"},{"startTime":3212.3,"endTime":3213.1,"body":"and"},{"startTime":3213.533,"endTime":3215.1,"body":"and if we're gonna say"},{"startTime":3215.133,"endTime":3217.333,"body":"if pastors are gonna say if preachers are gonna say"},{"startTime":3217.333,"endTime":3218.366,"body":"if churches are gonna say well"},{"startTime":3218.366,"endTime":3222.333,"body":"we're not political you you cannot be partisan"},{"startTime":3222.333,"endTime":3225.066,"body":"that's fine but you are political"},{"startTime":3225.066,"endTime":3226.9,"body":"because political literally just means like"},{"startTime":3226.9,"endTime":3228.7,"body":"things about groups of people"},{"startTime":3229.0,"endTime":3231.066,"body":"and that's literally what a church is"},{"startTime":3231.1,"endTime":3233.466,"body":"it's things about groups of people right"},{"startTime":3233.566,"endTime":3237.666,"body":"and and the gospel is is innately political"},{"startTime":3237.666,"endTime":3240.966,"body":"that's why Rome killed Christians right"},{"startTime":3240.966,"endTime":3241.466,"body":"because"},{"startTime":3241.466,"endTime":3244.966,"body":"because it is an innately political message to say"},{"startTime":3244.966,"endTime":3249.066,"body":"the empires of this world crumble and kneel"},{"startTime":3249.066,"endTime":3253.166,"body":"because of the complete upheaval that the life"},{"startTime":3253.166,"endTime":3255.566,"body":"death and resurrection has done"},{"startTime":3256.3,"endTime":3258.633,"body":"to the reality that we live in"},{"startTime":3259.333,"endTime":3263.566,"body":"and so if our if our version of that is only"},{"startTime":3263.7,"endTime":3265.866,"body":"our personal transformation"},{"startTime":3265.9,"endTime":3267.3,"body":"our personal piety"},{"startTime":3267.3,"endTime":3271.066,"body":"our personal whatever we are not preaching the gospel"},{"startTime":3272.3,"endTime":3275.166,"body":"we we are not preaching it in our in its wholeness"},{"startTime":3275.166,"endTime":3276.3,"body":"and Scripture tells us that"},{"startTime":3276.3,"endTime":3277.466,"body":"if we remove things from it"},{"startTime":3277.466,"endTime":3278.866,"body":"we're not preaching it at all"},{"startTime":3279.866,"endTime":3281.5,"body":"and so there is this heresy"},{"startTime":3281.5,"endTime":3282.4,"body":"I'm gonna straight up say"},{"startTime":3282.4,"endTime":3286.533,"body":"there is this heresy in the white evangelical church"},{"startTime":3286.533,"endTime":3289.0,"body":"that the gospel is this narrow thing"},{"startTime":3289.0,"endTime":3291.033,"body":"when scripture makes it clear"},{"startTime":3291.1,"endTime":3294.866,"body":"that the gospel is Jesus entering into the world"},{"startTime":3294.866,"endTime":3296.366,"body":"that he made good"},{"startTime":3296.5,"endTime":3299.933,"body":"flipping it upside down to set things right"},{"startTime":3299.933,"endTime":3303.7,"body":"and one of those main things that he sets right"},{"startTime":3303.7,"endTime":3307.666,"body":"is how we treat the low and the vulnerable"},{"startTime":3307.666,"endTime":3309.166,"body":"and the marginalized"},{"startTime":3309.7,"endTime":3311.333,"body":"and so if the people of God"},{"startTime":3311.333,"endTime":3314.2,"body":"excuse mistreatment of those people"},{"startTime":3314.3,"endTime":3316.7,"body":"because we're just focused on the gospel"},{"startTime":3316.766,"endTime":3319.466,"body":"we are we are lying"},{"startTime":3320.4,"endTime":3322.633,"body":"we are lying period"},{"startTime":3322.7,"endTime":3325.2,"body":"we are using Jesus as a shield"},{"startTime":3325.5,"endTime":3329.2,"body":"and an excuse to not do what god requires of us"},{"startTime":3329.4,"endTime":3332.0,"body":"and to not follow after Jesus"},{"startTime":3332.0,"endTime":3334.233,"body":"in the life that he calls us to"},{"startTime":3335.333,"endTime":3337.9,"body":"and and I'm just gonna say like"},{"startTime":3338.333,"endTime":3342.9,"body":"it's a false gospel a gospel that does not require us"},{"startTime":3343.466,"endTime":3345.7,"body":"to lay down our preferences"},{"startTime":3347.166,"endTime":3351.566,"body":"in our in our own things for the sake of the lowly"},{"startTime":3351.566,"endTime":3354.4,"body":"is a false gospel full stop"},{"startTime":3355.5,"endTime":3361.5,"body":"and you cannot elevate corruption power"},{"startTime":3362.0,"endTime":3364.8,"body":"power at the expense of the well being of other people"},{"startTime":3364.8,"endTime":3365.266,"body":"right and"},{"startTime":3365.266,"endTime":3366.766,"body":"and there's this through line of that"},{"startTime":3366.766,"endTime":3369.433,"body":"with the sexual abuse in the"},{"startTime":3370.333,"endTime":3371.933,"body":"you know the immigration stuff and"},{"startTime":3371.933,"endTime":3374.133,"body":"and even just like the personal business dealings"},{"startTime":3374.133,"endTime":3376.6,"body":"there's this through line of power"},{"startTime":3376.6,"endTime":3378.366,"body":"at the expense of other people"},{"startTime":3379.1,"endTime":3382.466,"body":"and and scripture makes it really clear that"},{"startTime":3382.466,"endTime":3385.0,"body":"that is a thing that God takes seriously"},{"startTime":3385.566,"endTime":3388.5,"body":"and we cannot turn our eyes away from that"},{"startTime":3389.3,"endTime":3394.8,"body":"or hold hands with it we cannot hold hands with"},{"startTime":3394.8,"endTime":3397.2,"body":"with empires to ourselves"},{"startTime":3399.666,"endTime":3402.366,"body":"and and also hold hands with the Jesus"},{"startTime":3402.366,"endTime":3404.7,"body":"who was crucified by that empire"},{"startTime":3406.3,"endTime":3410.033,"body":"we cannot hold hands with the spirit of this world"},{"startTime":3410.566,"endTime":3411.366,"body":"and be into well"},{"startTime":3411.366,"endTime":3412.766,"body":"by the Holy Spirit"},{"startTime":3413.4,"endTime":3414.966,"body":"and so I'm gonna straight up"},{"startTime":3414.966,"endTime":3416.566,"body":"and this is something that I've been saying"},{"startTime":3416.566,"endTime":3416.9,"body":"I mean"},{"startTime":3416.9,"endTime":3419.266,"body":"Covid really was the beginning of this revelation"},{"startTime":3419.266,"endTime":3419.8,"body":"for me well"},{"startTime":3419.8,"endTime":3420.466,"body":"that's not true"},{"startTime":3420.466,"endTime":3422.966,"body":"covid was like the breaking point of this realization"},{"startTime":3422.966,"endTime":3423.966,"body":"of this realization for me"},{"startTime":3423.966,"endTime":3427.5,"body":"that most people in the white evangelical church"},{"startTime":3427.566,"endTime":3431.966,"body":"have been discipled into following themselves"},{"startTime":3432.7,"endTime":3434.7,"body":"their own desires their own wants"},{"startTime":3434.7,"endTime":3436.3,"body":"their own well being"},{"startTime":3437.166,"endTime":3439.4,"body":"and the gospel of Jesus Christ"},{"startTime":3439.4,"endTime":3442.533,"body":"calls us to radically lay those things down"},{"startTime":3442.533,"endTime":3444.166,"body":"for the sake of other people"},{"startTime":3446.666,"endTime":3452.766,"body":"and we cannot elevate and rejoice in the elevation"},{"startTime":3453.2,"endTime":3456.8,"body":"of a person who tramples other people"},{"startTime":3458.266,"endTime":3460.3,"body":"and call ourselves preaching the gospel"},{"startTime":3460.3,"endTime":3461.566,"body":"we just cannot"},{"startTime":3462.1,"endTime":3463.9,"body":"there's something that um"},{"startTime":3464.5,"endTime":3466.0,"body":"both of you touched on"},{"startTime":3467.533,"endTime":3471.766,"body":"and it reminded me that I think that white pastors"},{"startTime":3471.766,"endTime":3474.766,"body":"in particular feel like"},{"startTime":3475.5,"endTime":3477.8,"body":"it takes so much bravery"},{"startTime":3478.366,"endTime":3482.7,"body":"to be able to speak on topics of race"},{"startTime":3482.9,"endTime":3486.333,"body":"and the marginalized in their congregations"},{"startTime":3486.333,"endTime":3489.3,"body":"especially in a white church community"},{"startTime":3490.5,"endTime":3494.4,"body":"and I remember begging"},{"startTime":3494.7,"endTime":3496.733,"body":"the pastors of the church that I was at"},{"startTime":3496.733,"endTime":3498.4,"body":"in 2,016"},{"startTime":3499.166,"endTime":3505.666,"body":"which was a multi racial church but not multicultural"},{"startTime":3507.6,"endTime":3510.0,"body":"I remember begging them to say something"},{"startTime":3510.0,"endTime":3511.866,"body":"and they just refused to"},{"startTime":3511.866,"endTime":3513.466,"body":"and there was the sense of like oh"},{"startTime":3513.466,"endTime":3515.066,"body":"you're so brave if you can"},{"startTime":3515.066,"endTime":3516.766,"body":"speak out all those things"},{"startTime":3517.066,"endTime":3519.066,"body":"and when I finally left that church"},{"startTime":3519.066,"endTime":3521.066,"body":"and I went to a congregation"},{"startTime":3521.4,"endTime":3524.9,"body":"we're talking about the marginalized"},{"startTime":3524.9,"endTime":3527.0,"body":"and the application of the gospel"},{"startTime":3527.266,"endTime":3530.2,"body":"to the oppressed within society"},{"startTime":3530.366,"endTime":3535.033,"body":"was just a standard ethic of the congregation"},{"startTime":3535.4,"endTime":3541.3,"body":"it made me realize that it's not a lack of bravery"},{"startTime":3541.866,"endTime":3547.5,"body":"that keeps white Christianity from addressing"},{"startTime":3547.9,"endTime":3551.666,"body":"the gospel and its application for the poor"},{"startTime":3551.666,"endTime":3554.7,"body":"the marginalized the the people of colour"},{"startTime":3554.7,"endTime":3558.133,"body":"the oppressed it's not lack of bravery"},{"startTime":3558.133,"endTime":3559.766,"body":"it's lack of integrity"},{"startTime":3562.166,"endTime":3566.366,"body":"would you understand what the gospel is really about"},{"startTime":3567.366,"endTime":3571.966,"body":"you have an obligation to preach it and if you're not"},{"startTime":3573.0,"endTime":3574.9,"body":"I think that it's fair"},{"startTime":3575.2,"endTime":3579.633,"body":"to ask whether you are following the ways of Christ"},{"startTime":3580.5,"endTime":3584.5,"body":"whether you are representing Christ"},{"startTime":3585.566,"endTime":3587.833,"body":"and if you're not doing that what are you doing"},{"startTime":3589.933,"endTime":3590.166,"body":"well"},{"startTime":3590.166,"endTime":3593.533,"body":"I'm gonna pivot us to bodies behind the bus as a whole"},{"startTime":3593.533,"endTime":3595.2,"body":"right now sacred wilderness"},{"startTime":3595.333,"endTime":3598.2,"body":"the work that we're trying to cultivate here"},{"startTime":3598.2,"endTime":3601.433,"body":"I might start us into that part of the conversation"},{"startTime":3601.6,"endTime":3604.166,"body":"with just reading what um"},{"startTime":3604.166,"endTime":3608.2,"body":"we have two board members who are not on this call um"},{"startTime":3608.2,"endTime":3612.066,"body":"who are actively also engaged in their own spaces 1"},{"startTime":3612.066,"endTime":3614.266,"body":"who's a therapist 2 surprise"},{"startTime":3614.266,"endTime":3616.5,"body":"surprise has been working overtime"},{"startTime":3616.6,"endTime":3620.033,"body":"to meet with clients over this past week um"},{"startTime":3621.166,"endTime":3622.966,"body":"and then Eric"},{"startTime":3622.966,"endTime":3625.433,"body":"who you guys heard from a few episodes ago"},{"startTime":3625.5,"endTime":3627.466,"body":"incredible human being"},{"startTime":3627.466,"endTime":3631.333,"body":"he sent me this to read to all of you he said"},{"startTime":3631.333,"endTime":3633.2,"body":"I garden in South Florida"},{"startTime":3633.2,"endTime":3634.866,"body":"which is basically a swamp"},{"startTime":3635.766,"endTime":3637.966,"body":"all my gardening friends ask Eric"},{"startTime":3637.966,"endTime":3641.266,"body":"how do you get such good yields on all your plants"},{"startTime":3641.366,"endTime":3642.6,"body":"and what I tell them is that"},{"startTime":3642.6,"endTime":3645.3,"body":"I make sure the roots and soil are healthy"},{"startTime":3645.4,"endTime":3647.3,"body":"that's the most important thing"},{"startTime":3647.533,"endTime":3650.1,"body":"they normally focus on the leaves to kill weeds"},{"startTime":3650.1,"endTime":3652.8,"body":"that matters but not as much as the roots"},{"startTime":3653.266,"endTime":3655.566,"body":"the reason why people don't focus on the roots"},{"startTime":3655.566,"endTime":3658.3,"body":"is because it's slow and not flashy"},{"startTime":3658.966,"endTime":3661.666,"body":"if the roots of your plant are healthy"},{"startTime":3661.666,"endTime":3663.2,"body":"your plant will be healthy"},{"startTime":3663.4,"endTime":3664.966,"body":"if you want to kill weeds"},{"startTime":3664.966,"endTime":3666.8,"body":"you have to kill their roots"},{"startTime":3667.533,"endTime":3670.3,"body":"the work we do at Bodies Behind the bus is critical"},{"startTime":3670.333,"endTime":3672.4,"body":"we address misuses of spiritual power"},{"startTime":3672.4,"endTime":3674.9,"body":"to make the roots of Christian community healthy"},{"startTime":3675.0,"endTime":3677.1,"body":"and kill the roots of Christian abuse"},{"startTime":3677.1,"endTime":3680.266,"body":"including Christian nationalism in its various forms"},{"startTime":3680.666,"endTime":3683.1,"body":"we do this by platforming survivors"},{"startTime":3683.1,"endTime":3684.3,"body":"and bringing academic"},{"startTime":3684.3,"endTime":3686.633,"body":"and professional expertise to this space"},{"startTime":3686.933,"endTime":3689.666,"body":"we're gonna continue to do what we've always done"},{"startTime":3689.8,"endTime":3691.466,"body":"even if it takes forever"},{"startTime":3691.466,"endTime":3694.166,"body":"because it's the best solution to all of these issues"},{"startTime":3695.533,"endTime":3696.5,"body":"thank you Eric"},{"startTime":3697.166,"endTime":3700.266,"body":"I'd love to kind of open up the discussion in the floor"},{"startTime":3700.266,"endTime":3702.366,"body":"to you guys I know we're tired"},{"startTime":3702.766,"endTime":3706.833,"body":"but I also know you wouldn't be here if you didn't care"},{"startTime":3707.066,"endTime":3710.933,"body":"and I can speak to the integrity and the heart in"},{"startTime":3710.933,"endTime":3714.833,"body":"each person on this call and how much they love"},{"startTime":3716.366,"endTime":3720.966,"body":"the survivor community and they love image bears"},{"startTime":3721.5,"endTime":3723.666,"body":"full stop no caveat"},{"startTime":3724.333,"endTime":3726.366,"body":"so let's chat a little bit"},{"startTime":3726.366,"endTime":3726.8,"body":"what is"},{"startTime":3726.8,"endTime":3729.8,"body":"what does this mean for us as sacred wilderness bodies"},{"startTime":3729.8,"endTime":3730.866,"body":"behind the bus"},{"startTime":3731.566,"endTime":3734.433,"body":"how are you feeling with with where we're at"},{"startTime":3735.066,"endTime":3735.6,"body":"uh I mean"},{"startTime":3735.6,"endTime":3738.366,"body":"I can say that I'd love you know"},{"startTime":3738.366,"endTime":3740.066,"body":"Robert and Emily your perspective"},{"startTime":3740.066,"endTime":3741.766,"body":"but I can say I think from"},{"startTime":3741.8,"endTime":3743.166,"body":"from where I where"},{"startTime":3743.166,"endTime":3745.6,"body":"what I see now is that I wanna make sure that"},{"startTime":3745.6,"endTime":3747.6,"body":"the platform continues to be a place"},{"startTime":3747.6,"endTime":3750.0,"body":"where people can come and share their stories"},{"startTime":3750.6,"endTime":3755.1,"body":"and feel safe doing so and hopefully through this"},{"startTime":3755.1,"endTime":3757.266,"body":"you know we can create some sort of"},{"startTime":3757.266,"endTime":3759.3,"body":"type of community for all of us to"},{"startTime":3759.3,"endTime":3762.4,"body":"where we can just help each other"},{"startTime":3762.4,"endTime":3765.366,"body":"whether that be just sharing what we're feeling"},{"startTime":3765.366,"endTime":3766.9,"body":"lamenting uh"},{"startTime":3766.9,"endTime":3768.2,"body":"doing what we're doing right now"},{"startTime":3768.2,"endTime":3769.966,"body":"uh I would love to do that more for"},{"startTime":3769.966,"endTime":3771.433,"body":"for their survivor community"},{"startTime":3771.533,"endTime":3772.6,"body":"I'd also say like"},{"startTime":3772.6,"endTime":3776.033,"body":"I think it emboldens me to just basically be like"},{"startTime":3776.266,"endTime":3778.3,"body":"I'm gonna try even harder"},{"startTime":3778.3,"endTime":3781.3,"body":"and I'm gonna continue to push and continue to write"},{"startTime":3781.3,"endTime":3784.8,"body":"and continue to press and step uh"},{"startTime":3784.8,"endTime":3788.266,"body":"step up to say I'm not gonna tolerate this"},{"startTime":3788.266,"endTime":3791.666,"body":"and the church that I think we need in this country"},{"startTime":3791.666,"endTime":3793.8,"body":"which is not the church that we see today"},{"startTime":3794.066,"endTime":3797.2,"body":"and feel like I'm gonna fight like hell"},{"startTime":3797.366,"endTime":3799.433,"body":"and then we continue to fight like hell"},{"startTime":3799.666,"endTime":3803.133,"body":"and if you're exhausted I'll fight for you"},{"startTime":3803.133,"endTime":3805.533,"body":"I don't care and if you're tired"},{"startTime":3805.533,"endTime":3806.9,"body":"I'll fight for you"},{"startTime":3807.0,"endTime":3810.166,"body":"I will do whatever I can with everything that I can"},{"startTime":3810.533,"endTime":3815.566,"body":"to continue to be someone who advocates for justice"},{"startTime":3815.866,"endTime":3817.533,"body":"and reform and"},{"startTime":3817.533,"endTime":3818.933,"body":"most importantly repentance"},{"startTime":3818.933,"endTime":3820.566,"body":"because that has to happen"},{"startTime":3820.566,"endTime":3823.166,"body":"and it hasn't happened in this country ever"},{"startTime":3823.166,"endTime":3825.633,"body":"so kind of feel like"},{"startTime":3826.3,"endTime":3828.4,"body":"John we've talked about that verse"},{"startTime":3828.4,"endTime":3830.6,"body":"Jeremiah 28 9"},{"startTime":3830.6,"endTime":3832.7,"body":"where Jeremiah is just like"},{"startTime":3832.966,"endTime":3835.166,"body":"every time I talk about the Lord"},{"startTime":3835.166,"endTime":3838.6,"body":"I'm made to feel like a subject of ridicule"},{"startTime":3838.966,"endTime":3840.466,"body":"but if I don't"},{"startTime":3840.466,"endTime":3844.1,"body":"then it feels like this fire that's trapped in my bones"},{"startTime":3844.7,"endTime":3849.0,"body":"and I can't bear not speaking about it"},{"startTime":3849.933,"endTime":3850.8,"body":"as I"},{"startTime":3851.4,"endTime":3856.733,"body":"I guess I feel more of that on a new level now"},{"startTime":3856.733,"endTime":3859.2,"body":"like a different facet of it"},{"startTime":3859.2,"endTime":3860.7,"body":"I already felt that way"},{"startTime":3861.666,"endTime":3862.866,"body":"just about"},{"startTime":3863.666,"endTime":3865.7,"body":"speaking about issues of justice"},{"startTime":3865.7,"endTime":3867.466,"body":"within white Christianity"},{"startTime":3868.133,"endTime":3870.366,"body":"but now it's"},{"startTime":3872.9,"endTime":3876.7,"body":"it's close to home again and I"},{"startTime":3876.7,"endTime":3878.833,"body":"I don't know I think that"},{"startTime":3880.366,"endTime":3885.466,"body":"I know what I can do right now is I can listen"},{"startTime":3887.166,"endTime":3889.8,"body":"and I know that if"},{"startTime":3889.8,"endTime":3894.9,"body":"I have the ability to contribute resources"},{"startTime":3894.9,"endTime":3897.233,"body":"that are not"},{"startTime":3897.966,"endTime":3898.9,"body":"um"},{"startTime":3900.1,"endTime":3901.766,"body":"I don't require"},{"startTime":3903.366,"endTime":3906.466,"body":"me to be on the front lines"},{"startTime":3906.466,"endTime":3910.6,"body":"so if I can contribute financial resources"},{"startTime":3910.6,"endTime":3913.866,"body":"or knowledge or something like that"},{"startTime":3914.1,"endTime":3916.266,"body":"I have the capacity to do that"},{"startTime":3917.966,"endTime":3920.933,"body":"but I I think that just in honesty"},{"startTime":3920.933,"endTime":3926.433,"body":"like I always will be an advocate"},{"startTime":3926.7,"endTime":3928.266,"body":"and I can't turn that off"},{"startTime":3928.266,"endTime":3929.866,"body":"but I I don't know how"},{"startTime":3931.1,"endTime":3932.766,"body":"I don't I don't have"},{"startTime":3933.866,"endTime":3938.033,"body":"the energy to be what I want to be right now"},{"startTime":3938.733,"endTime":3939.933,"body":"so as you can see"},{"startTime":3939.933,"endTime":3941.566,"body":"I'm still at school if you couldn't"},{"startTime":3941.566,"endTime":3943.966,"body":"tell from the colorful buckets behind me"},{"startTime":3944.066,"endTime":3944.766,"body":"um so"},{"startTime":3944.766,"endTime":3945.8,"body":"I had to borrow"},{"startTime":3946.166,"endTime":3948.633,"body":"some equipment for this recording from a colleague"},{"startTime":3949.166,"endTime":3951.333,"body":"and I was talking to him about just"},{"startTime":3951.333,"endTime":3952.666,"body":"what I'm doing today"},{"startTime":3952.666,"endTime":3955.166,"body":"and about sacred wilderness and bodies behind the bus"},{"startTime":3955.166,"endTime":3957.633,"body":"and what we do and he said"},{"startTime":3958.333,"endTime":3964.1,"body":"how do you do that work now when"},{"startTime":3965.8,"endTime":3970.666,"body":"when church people just told the whole country"},{"startTime":3970.666,"endTime":3972.3,"body":"in huge numbers"},{"startTime":3973.466,"endTime":3976.733,"body":"there is no accountability for sexual assault"},{"startTime":3976.733,"endTime":3979.433,"body":"and sexual abuse because that is what happened"},{"startTime":3980.533,"endTime":3982.533,"body":"81% of white"},{"startTime":3982.533,"endTime":3986.266,"body":"evangelical Christians voted for an adjudicated rapist"},{"startTime":3986.266,"endTime":3988.8,"body":"who has dozens and dozens"},{"startTime":3988.8,"endTime":3992.6,"body":"and dozens of credible allegations of abuse"},{"startTime":3992.6,"endTime":3994.766,"body":"and assault over decades"},{"startTime":3996.0,"endTime":4000.7,"body":"and so how did how do you move forward in doing that"},{"startTime":4000.7,"endTime":4002.8,"body":"and I and I thought about it"},{"startTime":4004.0,"endTime":4006.933,"body":"and I think my answer cause I"},{"startTime":4006.933,"endTime":4009.4,"body":"I was thinking about it yesterday after we talked and"},{"startTime":4009.8,"endTime":4010.966,"body":"and I couldn't"},{"startTime":4011.866,"endTime":4012.933,"body":"I didn't have an answer then"},{"startTime":4012.933,"endTime":4013.566,"body":"I was like honestly"},{"startTime":4013.566,"endTime":4014.433,"body":"I don't know"},{"startTime":4014.966,"endTime":4016.6,"body":"but as I thought about it today"},{"startTime":4016.6,"endTime":4017.466,"body":"um"},{"startTime":4018.4,"endTime":4021.9,"body":"I think that it matters for us"},{"startTime":4021.9,"endTime":4024.066,"body":"not just to provide resources for people"},{"startTime":4024.066,"endTime":4025.366,"body":"and things like that which in"},{"startTime":4025.366,"endTime":4028.2,"body":"in a community and that you know"},{"startTime":4028.2,"endTime":4030.333,"body":"that sense of lifting each other up"},{"startTime":4030.333,"endTime":4031.366,"body":"and people not being alone"},{"startTime":4031.366,"endTime":4032.7,"body":"I think that that matters"},{"startTime":4032.8,"endTime":4036.8,"body":"but I also think that it matters to bear witness"},{"startTime":4038.6,"endTime":4043.366,"body":"to to what is true and to name it and to"},{"startTime":4043.4,"endTime":4046.066,"body":"and to say in the face of that"},{"startTime":4046.066,"endTime":4051.0,"body":"in the face of the people who claim the name of Jesus"},{"startTime":4051.0,"endTime":4052.1,"body":"saying actually"},{"startTime":4052.1,"endTime":4055.266,"body":"this doesn't matter like you can"},{"startTime":4055.533,"endTime":4058.166,"body":"you can sexually assault someone and be a pastor"},{"startTime":4058.166,"endTime":4059.866,"body":"you can sexually assault someone and be president"},{"startTime":4059.866,"endTime":4061.2,"body":"like it didn't really matter"},{"startTime":4061.2,"endTime":4064.966,"body":"being a woman is worse like that is the message right"},{"startTime":4065.733,"endTime":4068.166,"body":"um being a person of color is worse"},{"startTime":4068.733,"endTime":4069.466,"body":"um that"},{"startTime":4069.466,"endTime":4071.0,"body":"that's the message whether"},{"startTime":4071.0,"endTime":4072.866,"body":"whether it's the intended message or not"},{"startTime":4072.866,"endTime":4074.033,"body":"it's the message"},{"startTime":4074.966,"endTime":4076.7,"body":"and and so"},{"startTime":4076.7,"endTime":4082.466,"body":"I think it matters for us to call things by their name"},{"startTime":4083.3,"endTime":4084.5,"body":"and to say no"},{"startTime":4084.5,"endTime":4086.2,"body":"actually this matters"},{"startTime":4087.7,"endTime":4090.366,"body":"what happened to you was not okay"},{"startTime":4091.6,"endTime":4093.533,"body":"and there there is"},{"startTime":4093.533,"endTime":4096.566,"body":"and should be justice and accountability for that"},{"startTime":4096.566,"endTime":4101.066,"body":"and there are people who will fight for that for you"},{"startTime":4102.3,"endTime":4103.1,"body":"and"},{"startTime":4103.666,"endTime":4109.0,"body":"and it does not matter the cost for us to say"},{"startTime":4109.0,"endTime":4112.4,"body":"I will be the person who who says"},{"startTime":4112.4,"endTime":4113.833,"body":"this is not okay"},{"startTime":4114.866,"endTime":4118.6,"body":"and who demands that what happened to you be heard"},{"startTime":4118.933,"endTime":4122.633,"body":"and be acknowledged and that justice be sought for it"},{"startTime":4123.3,"endTime":4125.9,"body":"and and that we not allow"},{"startTime":4128.266,"endTime":4131.033,"body":"the elevation of a sexual predator"},{"startTime":4131.5,"endTime":4135.6,"body":"of a financial predator of a racial predator"},{"startTime":4137.133,"endTime":4138.966,"body":"be an excuse"},{"startTime":4140.366,"endTime":4142.5,"body":"for for those in our circle"},{"startTime":4144.2,"endTime":4146.766,"body":"to walk outside of accountability"},{"startTime":4147.066,"endTime":4147.7,"body":"but that we say no"},{"startTime":4147.7,"endTime":4147.766,"body":"no no"},{"startTime":4147.766,"endTime":4148.9,"body":"no no"},{"startTime":4149.666,"endTime":4150.7,"body":"like"},{"startTime":4152.1,"endTime":4155.333,"body":"we we work for justice in our"},{"startTime":4155.333,"endTime":4159.633,"body":"in our spheres and we work for justice together"},{"startTime":4160.066,"endTime":4164.3,"body":"and we stand shoulder to shoulder with people and say"},{"startTime":4164.3,"endTime":4168.066,"body":"you deserve justice and even if it is delayed"},{"startTime":4168.066,"endTime":4169.966,"body":"I will stand with you"},{"startTime":4170.566,"endTime":4171.666,"body":"and and and so"},{"startTime":4171.666,"endTime":4173.233,"body":"for me I think"},{"startTime":4174.933,"endTime":4177.8,"body":"what this looks like going forward is"},{"startTime":4178.9,"endTime":4182.766,"body":"is a lot of anger and exhaustion and"},{"startTime":4183.1,"endTime":4185.1,"body":"I mean does it even matter"},{"startTime":4185.866,"endTime":4186.766,"body":"right"},{"startTime":4187.333,"endTime":4190.4,"body":"that's what that's what it feels and"},{"startTime":4190.4,"endTime":4193.066,"body":"and I think the way that"},{"startTime":4194.466,"endTime":4194.7,"body":"you know I"},{"startTime":4194.7,"endTime":4196.3,"body":"I think that in a way"},{"startTime":4196.3,"endTime":4198.8,"body":"we look at ourselves as people who"},{"startTime":4200.266,"endTime":4206.366,"body":"document the truth of things in the midst of history"},{"startTime":4206.366,"endTime":4209.166,"body":"right because there's those examples of that"},{"startTime":4209.566,"endTime":4212.6,"body":"all throughout history of here's the big story"},{"startTime":4212.9,"endTime":4213.2,"body":"and then"},{"startTime":4213.2,"endTime":4217.566,"body":"here's the small group of people paying the cost"},{"startTime":4217.566,"endTime":4219.2,"body":"telling the truth"},{"startTime":4220.2,"endTime":4220.866,"body":"and and"},{"startTime":4220.866,"endTime":4224.0,"body":"what it looks like to be the keepers of those stories"},{"startTime":4224.4,"endTime":4227.066,"body":"um because I really"},{"startTime":4227.066,"endTime":4229.633,"body":"truly believe that"},{"startTime":4230.466,"endTime":4234.6,"body":"that we are in a historical shifting point"},{"startTime":4235.566,"endTime":4238.2,"body":"and so being the people who"},{"startTime":4239.166,"endTime":4239.766,"body":"you know being"},{"startTime":4239.766,"endTime":4242.733,"body":"the people who told the stories of enslaved people"},{"startTime":4242.733,"endTime":4244.166,"body":"and held those stories"},{"startTime":4244.733,"endTime":4246.733,"body":"being the people who told the stories"},{"startTime":4246.733,"endTime":4250.6,"body":"of indigenous peoples in the colonial period and"},{"startTime":4250.6,"endTime":4252.366,"body":"and held those stories I"},{"startTime":4252.366,"endTime":4254.9,"body":"I I think that this is another thing"},{"startTime":4254.9,"endTime":4256.766,"body":"where we're the people who"},{"startTime":4257.066,"endTime":4258.3,"body":"who hold the stories"},{"startTime":4258.3,"endTime":4261.9,"body":"and tell the stories of abused peoples"},{"startTime":4262.566,"endTime":4264.6,"body":"in in the same way that those enslaved"},{"startTime":4264.6,"endTime":4266.066,"body":"and indigenous peoples were"},{"startTime":4266.1,"endTime":4267.866,"body":"but it's a different kind of abuse right"},{"startTime":4267.866,"endTime":4268.666,"body":"and and so"},{"startTime":4268.666,"endTime":4272.066,"body":"I think that there are some historical"},{"startTime":4272.533,"endTime":4275.933,"body":"significance to telling these stories"},{"startTime":4275.933,"endTime":4277.7,"body":"and naming them for what they are"},{"startTime":4277.7,"endTime":4280.633,"body":"in our larger cultural climate"},{"startTime":4282.366,"endTime":4286.966,"body":"but I also think it matters for us as individuals"},{"startTime":4287.266,"endTime":4289.2,"body":"to name things as they are"},{"startTime":4289.566,"endTime":4290.966,"body":"and to say that they're not okay"},{"startTime":4290.966,"endTime":4292.8,"body":"and to continue to say it"},{"startTime":4293.1,"endTime":4295.1,"body":"because when we don't do that"},{"startTime":4295.1,"endTime":4298.766,"body":"then we become the people who know it and excuse it"},{"startTime":4298.8,"endTime":4301.266,"body":"right cause we all know people who like"},{"startTime":4301.266,"endTime":4306.166,"body":"like that who in 2016 and 2015 and 2021 said no"},{"startTime":4306.166,"endTime":4310.4,"body":"this is unexcusable and then willingly"},{"startTime":4310.4,"endTime":4312.8,"body":"and even sometimes joyfully"},{"startTime":4312.8,"endTime":4317.233,"body":"joined in to what they had previously called wicked and"},{"startTime":4317.366,"endTime":4320.033,"body":"and so for us to continue to tell the truth"},{"startTime":4320.566,"endTime":4323.233,"body":"not just to other people but also to ourselves"},{"startTime":4323.9,"endTime":4329.4,"body":"so that we would not be susceptible to living by wise"},{"startTime":4329.4,"endTime":4331.0,"body":"I think really it's important"},{"startTime":4331.6,"endTime":4332.533,"body":"thank you guys"},{"startTime":4332.533,"endTime":4334.7,"body":"um we can wrap up here"},{"startTime":4334.7,"endTime":4339.5,"body":"I have one thing that I wanna say to specifically you"},{"startTime":4339.5,"endTime":4340.766,"body":"Robert something you said"},{"startTime":4340.766,"endTime":4343.966,"body":"where you're not able to show up right now"},{"startTime":4343.966,"endTime":4345.566,"body":"the way you want to"},{"startTime":4346.166,"endTime":4351.6,"body":"that is such it was like a sacred thing to hear"},{"startTime":4352.1,"endTime":4353.166,"body":"I think"},{"startTime":4353.166,"endTime":4358.966,"body":"because I'm so used to men showing up when they need to"},{"startTime":4358.966,"endTime":4361.366,"body":"not show up in the way that they are"},{"startTime":4361.366,"endTime":4365.366,"body":"and they need to take the time to grieve and to"},{"startTime":4365.366,"endTime":4366.5,"body":"to heal"},{"startTime":4366.733,"endTime":4372.8,"body":"before they start getting on platforms and doing the"},{"startTime":4372.8,"endTime":4375.6,"body":"the forward facing stuff um"},{"startTime":4375.6,"endTime":4378.2,"body":"and I think not pushing through that"},{"startTime":4378.2,"endTime":4384.0,"body":"and acknowledging that is massively impactful"},{"startTime":4384.6,"endTime":4389.1,"body":"and something that we do not see predominant"},{"startTime":4389.1,"endTime":4391.466,"body":"specifically in white evangelical spaces"},{"startTime":4391.466,"endTime":4397.766,"body":"we don't see it and you valuing that is holy work"},{"startTime":4397.766,"endTime":4399.2,"body":"so I want to acknowledge that"},{"startTime":4399.2,"endTime":4399.9,"body":"in you that"},{"startTime":4399.9,"endTime":4401.3,"body":"it's not like"},{"startTime":4401.766,"endTime":4405.6,"body":"you're just too tired and you can't do it"},{"startTime":4405.6,"endTime":4409.633,"body":"like you that in itself is a form of resistance"},{"startTime":4410.3,"endTime":4411.466,"body":"and it's beautiful"},{"startTime":4411.466,"endTime":4413.633,"body":"and I appreciate you sharing it with us"},{"startTime":4414.166,"endTime":4415.9,"body":"one of the things that I first"},{"startTime":4415.9,"endTime":4418.8,"body":"when we had a call as a board this week"},{"startTime":4418.8,"endTime":4421.366,"body":"that my first concern was like"},{"startTime":4421.366,"endTime":4422.6,"body":"what's the risk to"},{"startTime":4422.6,"endTime":4425.266,"body":"survivors that trust us with their stories"},{"startTime":4425.266,"endTime":4426.8,"body":"on this platform um"},{"startTime":4426.8,"endTime":4430.8,"body":"cause we kind of know relatively prior to this"},{"startTime":4430.8,"endTime":4432.933,"body":"what the risk is right like um"},{"startTime":4432.933,"endTime":4434.033,"body":"we're never"},{"startTime":4434.933,"endTime":4438.1,"body":"we're never sugarcoating something with a storyteller"},{"startTime":4438.1,"endTime":4438.566,"body":"in the"},{"startTime":4438.566,"endTime":4441.366,"body":"very first contact that I have with a storyteller"},{"startTime":4441.366,"endTime":4443.7,"body":"I say here are your risks"},{"startTime":4444.4,"endTime":4446.933,"body":"and there is also stuff outside of this"},{"startTime":4446.933,"endTime":4448.7,"body":"that I might not know about"},{"startTime":4448.7,"endTime":4452.1,"body":"like this is the cost and"},{"startTime":4452.7,"endTime":4455.333,"body":"and it's a lot it's a big cost"},{"startTime":4455.333,"endTime":4460.133,"body":"and my immediately my fear was like"},{"startTime":4460.133,"endTime":4462.266,"body":"how much more is it gonna cost"},{"startTime":4462.7,"endTime":4465.3,"body":"to our storytellers to speak out"},{"startTime":4465.3,"endTime":4466.833,"body":"and to share their stories"},{"startTime":4466.9,"endTime":4469.6,"body":"and how much more does that cost escalate"},{"startTime":4469.866,"endTime":4472.3,"body":"depending on other vulnerabilities"},{"startTime":4472.3,"endTime":4476.5,"body":"or if they are part of other marginalized communities"},{"startTime":4476.5,"endTime":4477.7,"body":"how much does it cost"},{"startTime":4477.933,"endTime":4481.066,"body":"for a black woman to trust us with her story"},{"startTime":4481.333,"endTime":4484.566,"body":"for a Latin X woman to trust us with her story"},{"startTime":4484.566,"endTime":4486.166,"body":"right now especially"},{"startTime":4486.166,"endTime":4487.766,"body":"we have that coming we"},{"startTime":4487.766,"endTime":4491.6,"body":"we have those stories recorded and we're holding them"},{"startTime":4491.6,"endTime":4492.4,"body":"and I'm"},{"startTime":4494.7,"endTime":4499.7,"body":"I just wanna acknowledge that like we see that cost"},{"startTime":4500.4,"endTime":4502.833,"body":"our team sees that cost"},{"startTime":4503.533,"endTime":4508.866,"body":"and there's not some like easy platitude for that"},{"startTime":4508.866,"endTime":4510.5,"body":"there's not like this like"},{"startTime":4511.066,"endTime":4512.133,"body":"well you know"},{"startTime":4512.133,"endTime":4514.966,"body":"at least you got friends now to go along with you"},{"startTime":4514.966,"endTime":4515.4,"body":"like no"},{"startTime":4515.4,"endTime":4519.1,"body":"it freaking sucks and we don't know what this cost is"},{"startTime":4519.1,"endTime":4520.866,"body":"and we don't even know like"},{"startTime":4520.866,"endTime":4521.966,"body":"I don't wanna be doomsday"},{"startTime":4521.966,"endTime":4524.766,"body":"but we don't even know how long we can even do this"},{"startTime":4524.766,"endTime":4526.333,"body":"publicly the way that we are"},{"startTime":4526.333,"endTime":4529.366,"body":"that's a reality that is a question Mark"},{"startTime":4529.366,"endTime":4532.4,"body":"that is literally in our brains right now"},{"startTime":4532.4,"endTime":4537.233,"body":"is how long can we do this and be allowed"},{"startTime":4537.866,"endTime":4539.366,"body":"um which is crazy"},{"startTime":4539.366,"endTime":4541.2,"body":"and you maybe are listening to something at that"},{"startTime":4541.2,"endTime":4544.133,"body":"such a radical like you're too in the weeds"},{"startTime":4544.133,"endTime":4544.366,"body":"no"},{"startTime":4544.366,"endTime":4549.3,"body":"like the fact that can even be on the table is insane"},{"startTime":4549.333,"endTime":4550.6,"body":"everyone that's insane"},{"startTime":4550.6,"endTime":4552.4,"body":"we live in the United States of America"},{"startTime":4552.4,"endTime":4554.133,"body":"and that's a fear a real"},{"startTime":4554.133,"endTime":4555.0,"body":"legitimate fear"},{"startTime":4555.0,"endTime":4557.1,"body":"that people have in this space right now"},{"startTime":4559.4,"endTime":4562.6,"body":"and at the same time I know"},{"startTime":4564.1,"endTime":4566.5,"body":"because of the caliber"},{"startTime":4566.533,"endTime":4570.366,"body":"of people that we have gotten to meet"},{"startTime":4570.366,"endTime":4573.633,"body":"and walk alongside as they shared their stories"},{"startTime":4573.966,"endTime":4575.666,"body":"that like Robert said I mean"},{"startTime":4575.666,"endTime":4577.366,"body":"that is my favorite Bible verse"},{"startTime":4577.366,"endTime":4579.266,"body":"it's tattooed down my side"},{"startTime":4579.3,"endTime":4583.0,"body":"there are just some of us where it is fire in our bones"},{"startTime":4583.0,"endTime":4588.0,"body":"we cannot be quiet and they can try to take our voice"},{"startTime":4589.0,"endTime":4590.7,"body":"but you're gonna have to kill me"},{"startTime":4590.7,"endTime":4592.366,"body":"I'm going down with the ship"},{"startTime":4592.366,"endTime":4595.266,"body":"like I am not shutting up"},{"startTime":4595.4,"endTime":4598.033,"body":"they tried to do it in the church I came from"},{"startTime":4598.166,"endTime":4601.1,"body":"and so I just went outside and I got louder"},{"startTime":4601.4,"endTime":4603.133,"body":"and to be honest"},{"startTime":4603.133,"endTime":4605.666,"body":"like that's that's kind of where I'm landing with it"},{"startTime":4605.666,"endTime":4607.866,"body":"like we keep telling the stories"},{"startTime":4607.866,"endTime":4609.6,"body":"we keep standing with the people"},{"startTime":4609.6,"endTime":4612.033,"body":"that are going to bear the cost of this"},{"startTime":4612.5,"endTime":4614.433,"body":"we keep helping to"},{"startTime":4614.866,"endTime":4618.166,"body":"equitably shoulder the cost of what it is"},{"startTime":4618.166,"endTime":4620.2,"body":"to take the next step forward"},{"startTime":4620.866,"endTime":4624.366,"body":"we bolster ourselves up we have these conversations"},{"startTime":4624.466,"endTime":4625.533,"body":"we sit on the phone"},{"startTime":4625.533,"endTime":4629.2,"body":"and we rage together and we cry together"},{"startTime":4629.333,"endTime":4631.966,"body":"and we just sit in silence with each other"},{"startTime":4631.966,"endTime":4633.5,"body":"and stare at each other"},{"startTime":4633.566,"endTime":4635.3,"body":"but we're gonna keep doing the work"},{"startTime":4635.7,"endTime":4637.866,"body":"because this is what Jesus called us to"},{"startTime":4638.266,"endTime":4640.266,"body":"and until I stop believing in Jesus"},{"startTime":4640.7,"endTime":4642.033,"body":"I'm gonna keep doing the work"},{"startTime":4643.533,"endTime":4645.6,"body":"and I'm not ready to let go of Jesus yet"},{"startTime":4648.366,"endTime":4650.666,"body":"if y'all wanna start some work"},{"startTime":4650.666,"endTime":4651.9,"body":"some history lessons"},{"startTime":4651.9,"endTime":4654.9,"body":"some just in general work on the inside"},{"startTime":4655.0,"endTime":4657.333,"body":"and you are in white evangelicalism"},{"startTime":4657.333,"endTime":4659.466,"body":"or coming out of white evangelicalism"},{"startTime":4660.5,"endTime":4662.0,"body":"Robert has a great book"},{"startTime":4662.8,"endTime":4666.666,"body":"that he's currently recording the audio for"},{"startTime":4666.666,"endTime":4668.6,"body":"so you're gonna be able to listen to his voice tell it"},{"startTime":4668.6,"endTime":4670.566,"body":"there it is fire in the hole"},{"startTime":4670.666,"endTime":4672.566,"body":"that's a great place to start"},{"startTime":4672.733,"endTime":4678.4,"body":"bear witness to that story and then ask hard questions"},{"startTime":4678.8,"endTime":4682.766,"body":"don't stop listening don't harden your heart"},{"startTime":4683.6,"endTime":4687.466,"body":"staying soft is so important right now for all of us"},{"startTime":4687.5,"endTime":4690.866,"body":"and I needed Emily to preach at me for a little while"},{"startTime":4691.0,"endTime":4691.7,"body":"before I was like"},{"startTime":4691.7,"endTime":4693.133,"body":"that is the gospel okay"},{"startTime":4693.133,"endTime":4695.133,"body":"I can do this like"},{"startTime":4695.133,"endTime":4699.6,"body":"I hope this conversation was that for this community"},{"startTime":4699.6,"endTime":4700.633,"body":"were sad"},{"startTime":4703.0,"endTime":4704.266,"body":"it's gonna be hard"},{"startTime":4705.366,"endTime":4706.633,"body":"but we've got each other"},{"startTime":4707.766,"endTime":4709.433,"body":"alright I love you all"},{"startTime":4709.766,"endTime":4711.0,"body":"thank you for doing this with me"},{"startTime":4711.0,"endTime":4712.9,"body":"in spite of how tired we all are"},{"startTime":4714.066,"endTime":4716.4,"body":"and we'll see you soon"},{"startTime":4723.866,"endTime":4724.9,"body":"haha"},{"startTime":4733.3,"endTime":4734.5,"body":"the views thoughts"},{"startTime":4734.5,"endTime":4737.066,"body":"and opinions expressed here are the speaker zone"},{"startTime":4737.066,"endTime":4739.2,"body":"and not those of this podcast"},{"startTime":4739.2,"endTime":4741.766,"body":"this content is presented for informational"},{"startTime":4741.766,"endTime":4745.033,"body":"and educational purposes that constitute fair use"},{"startTime":4745.3,"endTime":4748.566,"body":"commentary or criticism while we make every"},{"startTime":4748.566,"endTime":4749.6,"body":"effort to ensure that"},{"startTime":4749.6,"endTime":4751.333,"body":"the information shared is accurate"},{"startTime":4751.333,"endTime":4752.5,"body":"we welcome any comment"},{"startTime":4752.5,"endTime":4754.666,"body":"suggestion or correction of errors"}]}