ADHD at Work and Home: Friction, Focus & Finding Your Rhythm

We bring clinical insights, workplace tactics, and personal stories to make sense of adult ADHD, from screening and treatment to meetings that won’t stay on track. The talk blends compassion with structure so you can lead better, think clearer, and show up with more ease.

• ADHD as a spectrum across childhood and adulthood
• Adult screening and what it reveals
• Overlap with anxiety, depression, and sleep loss
• Medication timing, side effects, and controlled status
• Therapy, coaching, routines, and sleep hygiene
• Meeting design: agendas, action items, and time boxes
• The “lion suit” method for steering conversations
• Managing distraction from technology and noise
• Relationships, punctuality, and shared expectations
• Gender patterns and help-seeking behavior
• Practical takeaways: structure, compassion, and honest self-audit

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Transcript

David Liss 0:03

I think about a Seinfeld, and there's this episode where Lorge is working for the Yankees, and George gets his instruction from his boss, and he misses the instruction. And then for the rest of the episode, he tries to figure out what it was that his boss told him to do and what he needed to do to get it done. And for me, like a lot of my life has felt like that. I felt like I'm in a meeting, I'm taking notes, but at the end of the day, I missed something. And then I'm trying to figure it out through notes or hieroglyphics or whatever kind of juju I can figure out what I need to do and what kind of instructions I need to identify.

Defining ADHD Across The Lifespan

Adult Diagnosis Trends And Screening

"Aussie" Mike James 0:48

Hello and welcome to the Wellness Musketeers podcast, where we explore health, wellness, and the art of living. I'm Ozzy Mike James, writer, speaker and longtime fitness professional who's led teams since the 1990s. And today's topic is there is one that touches a lot of our lives. Whether we realize it or not, ADHD, or attention deficit hyperactive disorder, manifests itself not only in children, but also in adults. And as maybe not good fortune would have it, but coincidence, I guess, one of the leading researchers in, or leading uh practitioners or treatment people for ADHD, a psychologist by the name of Thomas Brown, just recently passed away, unfortunately, and he's in this weekend's Washington, I mean the Wall Street Journal, and he's quoted as saying ADHD is not an all or nothing deal like pregnancy, with either you are where you're either pregnant or not, and there's nothing in between. He explained that all the characteristics of ADHD are problems everybody has sometimes. It's just with some people who have ADHD, they have a lot more difficulty with it more of the time. So you can see it's a very wide encompassing topic, and I think we've all got a unique angle on this topic, and we're looking forward to unpacking it with you guys. But first, let's do a round table of our fellow musketeers, and I'll introduce each, and they can give us uh a little brief rundown on their experience with ADHD. Firstly, to Dr. Kennedy.

ASRS Questions And Clinical Nuance

Lived Experiences: Workplace And Focus

Dr. Richard Kennedy 2:21

How's everybody this afternoon, this evening, depending on where we are? And uh good to see everyone again. And as a clinician, I've seen patients with ADHD, and I think it's important for us to at least understand what's the definition of it. What is it that we're describing or about to talk about? It's is considered a neurodevelopmental condition that's characterized by the persistent patterns of inattention, which means difficulty sustaining focus, disorganization, forgetfulness, hyperactivity, where you have excessive movement, restlessness, fidgeting, and impulsivity, where you're interrupting, you're always interrupting things, you never get through things, acting without thinking, shints. Um, and it typically begins in childhood and can persist into adolescent and adulthood, typically after the age of three, uh between three and twelve years old. So that's typically what we see. Now we see that there recently there's been, and I say recently, maybe in the last 25, 30 years, there have been more adults with the disease. And we find this out with people who come from all walks of life, have it, many of whom were never diagnosed when they were children, but then when they became adults. And for me, as an internist, I would see people who would come in and their their comments would always be, you know, gee, I'm I'm really having trouble getting through the the the topics that I've been tasked with at work, with lawyers, with economists, with teachers in every every walk of life. And so, you know, you you know, we asked them all of these questions to, and it's called the the adult ADHD self-report scale, which or briefly ASRS V1. And it basically asks six questions that they have to ask themselves, they have to answer themselves. And I'll, you know, sort of go through this briefly. How often do you have trouble wrapping up the final details of a project once the challenging parts have been made? And this is typically a yes or no answer, you know. And it gives you, it says, choices never, rarely, sometimes, often, very often. Same thing. Question two, how often do you have difficulty getting things in order when you have to do a task that requires organization? Number three, how often do you have problems remembering appointments or obligations? Number four, when you have a task that requires a lot of thought, how often do you avoid or delay getting started? And that as in, I say that because I'd say 70% of the people who would come to me at ADHD, that would be the one question that would almost always be in the positive and constantly in the positive for them. And so you see this all the time. And, you know, question five is how often do you fidget or squirm with your hands or feet when you have to sit down for a long time? Now you saw this you see very commonly with children. This is what they were telling my telling my five-year-old son that he had in kindergarten because he'd sit down, but then he'd want to be on the floor. He'd pick up a toy that was over there while the teacher, and the teacher would always say he's not focused. He can't concentrate, he can't step. I think he has ADHD. And so, of course, you know, as a parent, you kind of take that personal. You know, just a little. Of course, he tended not to have, he actually didn't have it. That was just his ability. He could be completely look like distracted, and actually be the only one in the room that could answer the questions. So, you know, it's a fascinating thing. And question six, how often do you feel overly active and compelled to do other things like you were driven by a motor? And so these are so these are those typical questions and in the well World Health Organization with a psychiatrist, psychologists, educators, all came up with this format. And it actually expands out to 18 questions. If those well, those are the primary ones, but there's a lot of other secondary stuff.

"Aussie" Mike James 7:15

Thank you, Dr. Kay. That sort of gives us a good framework. Um, Kettle, as an economist with 30 years of 35 years of experience across global institutions. What's been your uh experience with AD?

Ketil Hviding 7:28

So now I just got this questionnaire, which I hear for the first time. I I I'm not so sure, but I'm also hypochondriac. That's what definitely proved. So I would probably try to score uh full score on this. No, no, definitely the joke aside, you know, I I think definitely you can recognize the uh procrastination thing. Do I have HCHD? I don't know. I definitely interrupt people. Uh that's what didn't seem to be a part of your uh questionnaire. I uh was a joke with my uh when I uh I I worked at the IMF and the people working for me, I needed to have a point being made in one, two, three seconds. If not, I lost interest. I don't know if that is the HD, but definitely uh problems of keeping concentrated uh, you know, was a part of my my life.

"Aussie" Mike James 8:24

Great. David, our media professional, what's been your experience with ADHD?

David Liss 8:29

Well, I think that most of my life I had a lot of the symptoms, and I had been on my own trying different things to cope with different things that I perceived as shortcomings or problems or things that were, I think, at the end of the day related to what someone with ADHD would have. And I was just randomly looking at uh something. I don't remember where I found it, but I I saw this notice if you have these symptoms, we're doing a a medical, a new new medication trial for ADHD. And so I filled out this survey, and then they called me in, and then they did a diagnosis that I have ADHD. And what the trial was doing was the medication worked for four hours, and they wanted it to work for six or eight so they could extend the patent. So I got to meet with some psychiatrists and do ongoing things with dosage and things like that, and that's how I learned as an adult and how I first tried to try and work with it. Okay.

Medication Trials, Sleep, And Anxiety

"Aussie" Mike James 9:30

Interesting guys, it obviously looks like we'll each uh bring a different lens to the table today, the lived experience, clinical, and workplace, and leadership and day-to-day living, and all grounded in real stories, not just theory. But before we jump in, listeners, if this conversation resonates with you, hit subscribe so you don't miss upcoming episodes. We also share bonus clips, expert tips, and behind the scenes insights in our free Wellness Musketeers newsletter. The link will be in the show notes. But jumping right in here, maybe, Dave, maybe you can explain expand a bit more on your uh history and maybe uh Dr. K can ask you a few of those uh probing clinical questions about um how you found out how what how it's manifested, etc.

David Liss 10:16

Yeah, I always think about an episode of Seinfeld. George is walking for the Yankees. George gets this instruction from his boss and uh he misses the instruction. And then for the rest of the episode, he tries to figure out what it was that his boss told him to do and what he needed to do to get it done. And for me, like a lot of my life has felt like that. Like I felt like I'm in a meeting, I'm taking notes, I I but at the end of the day I missed something, and then I'm trying to figure it out through notes or hieroglyphics or you know, whatever kind of juju I can figure to kind of figure out what I need to do and what kind of instructions I need to identify. And I think uh I'm very measily distracted. I think it's been an issue with different relationships and things like that. And uh it's uh on the other hand, I'm very creative. It's I I think everything is a mixed bag. In any situation, you have to always kind of look for the positive in it. Absolutely. It's not it's not like as things go, there are worse much worse circumstances I could find myself in.

"Aussie" Mike James 11:23

Absolutely. Absolutely. So Dave, if you went under medication, did did you notice that helped you?

David Liss 11:27

Um it's kind of weird bec uh to me because there are different parts of it because like there are different kinds of medications, and the medications are to help you focus for a fixed period of time. But if you're not sleeping well and you take it, then you're gonna be sort of uh it sort of messed me up. And I also figured that I have some anxiety in in the long term and that that the ADHD was a trigger for it. And if I could control the anxiety better, then I could function better overall.

"Aussie" Mike James 12:03

So it just the question uh have they prescribed some anti-anxiety medications for your people?

David Liss 12:08

Yeah, yeah, I uh actually that was just Yeah, that's just in the last in recent times. But um I have tried different ADHD medications and uh you know, I do know people like um friend of mine's sister as an adult, she got diagnosed in the last couple of years and she takes um uh what's it Adderall or they what's the common ADHD? Adderall, yeah. Adderall, and it's been really helpful for her, you know. So it's I guess everybody's different. And I think everyone has their own coping structure to try and figure things out. You know, some are more effective, obviously.

Risks, Misuse, And Controlled Substances

Dr. Richard Kennedy 12:47

Yeah. I think I I you bring you bring up a really good point with your with yourself, and that it's important to exclude other things that could mimic ADHD. So anxiety for sure can mimic it, so can depression in that regard. And so as a clinician, one of the things we have to make sure is that you know, it could be easy to put a person on a stimulant drug, but if you don't ask the person from the beginning, well, how do you sleep? And so if you're a person who sleeps four hours a night on average, five hours a night on average, and then you give them this drug, which is a stimulant for the most but these these these drugs are stimulant. And so one of the things is since it for most people, I won't say most, some people have to take the drug at least twice a day to get a benefit, right? And because the the effect of the drug doesn't always last more than four, four or five hours max. Um, some people longer. And of course, they've come out with extended release forms that are supposed to give you a longer benefit of time, but uh every individual's different. But one of the things is it, you know, it brings up I've I've had a couple of attorneys as patients who would needed to be alert and functioning till late afternoon. And they were in the morning, they were fine. They were right on point. They could read their cases, they could read documents, they were right on point. But then they would start to be easily distracted by three three four in the evening. And if they took the second dose of the drug after four in the afternoon, they wouldn't sleep. Yeah. And then it becomes this revolving door.

David Liss 14:54

That that's what I was kind of getting to. It was sort of like on the one hand, if I if I had slept right and took the medication at the right time, I thought it was helpful. But like you said, if I have to take it twice a day and I had a cup of coffee sometime during the day, then it would throw me off. I couldn't sleep, and then I I get up, I'm still tired, I can't focus anyway because I'm exhausted. I take this medication, I'm on I'm an alert zombie, is what I was. And then one other thing I just wanted to ask about was that like I think for me uh the longest time was I wasn't sure if I was anxious or depressed, or anxious because I was depressed, or depressed because I was anxious. And and how did people figure out you know which it is that they have? And and I had a doctor someone say to me, Well, everyone in your life, you're living your life, you're gonna have a certain amount of anxiety and depression. And when it is it that you need to address it, or or take medication, or go to a doctor. It's like mental health.

"Aussie" Mike James 15:52

Okay, that's two that's two things that I just discovered at or which is kind of interesting facto. I I and and and we can be uh we can be uh I can be corrected. One is it apparently is illegal for athletes in certain sports, and the other one is illegal in Europe. Yeah.

Dr. Richard Kennedy 16:09

I don't well the it's a drug that has become a be, you know, you see it a lot in the college, and in the college and the in the in the later years in high school, where because what it did is it gave people the ability to focus, you know, like they have to cram for a big exam or a final, or they have to write a paper that they have to get done by a certain amount of time. And these drugs would allow them when they take it to be focused and go hours and hours without any rest. And you would and you could you could see that it would help them academically because they were already smart to begin with, but now that they could focus in preparation for their exams or their or their term paper, they could knock it out. They could just be so, so much more involved. But the side effects of the medicines are real, and that's why there's this constant thing. It's an amphetamine. This is to us on the street, it's called speed.

"Aussie" Mike James 17:13

Yes. Oh, yeah. So Dr. K and uh and David, I'd address this to both of you. With a psychological intervention, if that's the word, when would you recommend that? Would you refer people on, Dr. K? And uh Dave, did you have talk with a psychologist about this? If you don't mind us probing into it, I mean yeah, I'd like to hear Dr.

Therapy, Prescribing Rules, And Monitoring

Speaker 1 17:32

Kennedy's thoughts about this mental health referral and then it's changed a little bit, and now that and then now that I'm out of the loop and retired, but when I was practicing, that one of the things that you needed to in the past, you used to have to every six months or so make sure that the person met with a psychiatrist slash psychologist. Okay. Verify the need for it. But then when people were when people were getting, they became it became such a drug of choice, and it's still a control, they're all control substance drugs. So in other words, they're they're considered like narcotics. So you used to have to, you literally used to have to give the person would have to come in every 30 days to get a prescription. You ask a series of questions to see how they're tolerating it, are they benefit from it, et cetera? Are they abusing it, et cetera? Are they, you know, as they say, sharing it with whomever, um, because because of the illegal substance that it could become out on the street, because it is a, you know, it it's a like you said, Kettle, it's speed. And so you give it to the wrong person who doesn't need it and they take it, they could have some really significant adverse effects.

Speaker 2 18:57

Yeah, like like for me, I think that was pretty much that's my experience is that I had to find a psychiatrist who could prescribe the medication, and then I would go on some kind of whatever the recommended interval was, you know, and period of months or month, and then I would make adjustments based on that. And then the recommendation was is that I should find someone else that I could speak with on a regular basis as a counselor for therapy to develop strategies to deal with the things that were related to the ADHD symptoms or whatever.

Speaker 1 19:35

Yeah, and they changed they changed the rules because when I first started in practice, the only people who could write those prescriptions were the psychiatrists. Primary care doctors couldn't do it, anybody, you know. But then I I don't know, maybe 15 years, 10, 15 years ago, they started allowing us to be internist, family practice doctors to be able to write the prescription. But still the requirement meant that periodically, and the patient has to sign a at the beginning of the year a document that they're not gonna abuse this, they're not gonna sell it, that it is for them, they agree and understand what the side effects and the consequences of taking this drug chronically could do, et cetera. And, you know, the pandemic happened. And then when the pandemic happened, when we couldn't be face to face with people and people still needed their medications, um, then they changed, they they fudged the rules a bit so that people could, as long as the provider had a, you know, a DEA license that was current and that the patient was following up on a regular basis, you could write the prescription for 30 days, never more than 30 days. It's the it pretty much is the other than other than narcotic medications like codeine and stuff like that. It's the only other medicine that you can never write a refill for. And no, and no pharmacist would ever refill it. Because you know, patients learn how to be smart. They go into the pharmacist and say, Look, I need you to uh call my doctor and have them refill this for me. I'm out. And you know, they were just there 15 days ago.

Speaker 4 21:25

We're talking about adder, we're not talking about pro-second things like that, uh, which might be.

Speaker 1 21:29

No, but there are other, but there all all of the drugs in that class. So there's there's Adderall, there's inserta, there's but they're still highly similar to There's a whole bunch of them.

Speaker 4 21:43

But you you dame you found you found the dealing with the anxiety as being helpful, no? Is that what I understand?

Speaker 2 21:50

To me, that was that's really critical. 'Cause I think that when you're having a lot of these kind of problems, at least for me, my my go to was to tear myself up and get myself in an agitated state and uh and then you know it just I was off to the races and uh have these like loops of disaster and destruction and and personal devastation. You know, I need to find a way to slow that down. True.

Anxiety, Self-Talk, And Coping Loops

The Lion Suit: Managing Meetings

Presentation Drift And Distraction Traps

Speaker 22:19

Okay. Well you know that really thank you though for uh sharing all of that. I mean it's nothing to hide from but it's just uh great to hear you uh just give us an insight into it and I think a lot of people wouldn't have that insight so I really appreciate that and as we talk along please feel free to jump in and I want to just share with uh share with you a little uh about my what I call my lion suit moment with ADHD I go back to uh managing my teams way back in the early 1980s is when I started and uh I'm just uh reflecting on what Dr. Kennedy said that was the ADHD term wasn't even known especially for adults and of course you'll hear the baby boomer generation my generation will say it wasn't even around when we were growing up it's yeah yeah it's not even doesn't even exist well I beg to differ there wasn't social media around in those days so and everything everyone they'll tend to blame social media certainly it's distracting but I don't think it's the total cause but what I what I found with my management career, the groups I was managing um I only they were basically part-time workers only working for two or three hour stents so you didn't really get exposed to that lack of attention because you would have tasks they had to do and then they were gone. I'm sure it was around in fact I know a lot of people from that time and you know I'm not a doctor but I'm absolutely positive that it was around at that time. Where I became more familiar with it was when I came over here to the States in 93 and I started managing full-time people, you know, teams of about eight to ten to twelve sometimes of full-time employees. And it manifested itself in a lot of ways and it it was really overwhelming for me. I'd never seen it before but one of the key habits I saw along with some of the things that Dr. Kennedy mentioned was it was very hard to keep some people and some individuals focused in a conversation or a meeting on one topic. It would jump around everywhere. It would you know ricochet into a different topic a different subject at the click of a finger and you'd almost finish each uh meeting saying what do we talk about in that meeting? I don't really know. I mean everything was losing focus. So I I was really concerned but I I really couldn't get a handle on it. And even in the early 1990s ADHD wasn't as recognized as it is now. So I happened to go to a fitness conference that was held as luck would have it at the Johns Hopkins University and there was a a female psychologist who was there giving a talk on this attention deficit disorder and I thought great I'll go along to this and obviously she's a very experienced woman. She did some uh like role plays with us in this more we had a group of about 10 people in there and I guess while she was doing this she was getting a mini psychological profile on all of us and I approached her after the uh session and mentioned that problem I had that I had some individuals one in particular who I just couldn't keep on track he jumped around in the meetings and changed topic at the drop of a hat and etc etc and to my surprise she said well you realize you're a big part of the problem here right I said oh really she goes yes yeah because you're from uh you know it's from one of these Commonwealth nations as she called them that tend to be uh pretty laid back and tend to not interrupt people and tend to let people just talk on and on. You're a little bit averse to sort of coming down hard. So she said to me you to you know you're not going to solve this issue but for your your uh problem to keep it on track you've got to put a lion suit on and call this out when it happens so you've really got to interrupt don't let it flow on I thought oh wow and another psychologist who we both knew Dr. Jim Stryker said that I needed to pause for five seconds just stop everything and let the people get it into the people's mind that hey we're changing topics. And I I did do that and I was quite forceful with it. I'd say hey stick to the topic we're jumping around everywhere you're sidetracking again let's get back on topic and it was quite effective. So that indicates to me that it's you know the issue is how you handle it as well. It really changed my management style because it made me realize that hey you know I'm being a bit lazy I'm not really leading I'm following I'm being too polite if that's the word you've got to really take the leadership and direct the conversations and I would certainly have these people uh can refer them on to a Jim Stryker or one of our psychologists or so forth. Wouldn't solve the problem but for our issue it would get things certainly back on track uh in running you know the the fitness centers without about 3,000 members you don't need to be sidetracked they sidetrack you enough. So that yeah that was my sort of experience with it and I I realize that silence isn't kindness you've got to direct things and become you know a leader not just have a laissez faire management style that lets let's it all just run. So with that in mind Dr. Kennedy if you had any questions about that one guys but that was my experience with it but Dr. Kennedy have you seen that sort of behavior manifest as well with people with ADHD they sort of change topics and are very hard to focus in a conversation.

Speaker 1 27:24

Yeah or sometimes it's not even that they're changing topics it's it's it's that that they is that that they are they'll get started with something but they cannot focus they cannot focus on the topic at hand whatever that is they really have a lot like they have every intention of starting this particular topic to discuss this. And you don't see it as much because like for instance when you take for instance someone who has to give a presentation and they have to get up in front of a an a group of audience and the subject is matter now there are some people who have the topic in their head it's completely in there they got it to memory they've done it so many times so they don't need slides they don't need anything they can go from one point to the other continue the topic but if you're the kind of person who allows the audience to ask a question while you're in the midst of your presentation and you start off answering that question you almost never get back to the point where you initially started. Yeah and you you see that a lot and I and I've I've had patients come in and say look I I I just can't you know I start out I have to finish reading this document and I've been it's taken me three days and I can only read the first page and I get ready to go to the second page and the phone rings or I had this thought about something I should have done earlier in the day and I run and go do that. Like the person who starts out with I'm gonna go do this, I'm gonna go read these four, five pages, but in the back of your mind you're saying I have to remember to take the trash out.

Agendas, Action Items, And Deadlines

Speaker 2 29:12

Like like the internet and technology really enhances your ability to get distracted because you can go down like uh you have this fleeting thought about good fellas and you start to look at Ray Leota and then you read about Ray Leota's parents then you read about how he got along with Robert De Niro when they're filming the movie and then it's three hours later and he didn't do that thing you said you were going to do initially.

Speaker 29:35

Every day I'm gonna slap myself in the face about that one.

Speaker 2 29:38

I think with meetings though also I think one thing is is having an agenda. I think the meetings that I think weren't effective that I've been to were meetings that enabled me to be to get everyone else distracted was when there wasn't an agenda. You know and when there weren't action items you know when I when there's action items when I'm assigned something I know I have accountability and I have to get something done. I I think that you know deadlines also allow for a lot of room for things with ADHD where you know it's like okay I gotta get this done in five days and then at midnight the night before it's due I'm I'm up till three in the morning finishing it where I had had all these false starts along the way.

Speaker 30:20

I thought it was interesting in what you said about presentations Dr. Kay I learnt there you have to be a lot more assertive as well because you can have some uh let's just face especially in where we worked there's a lot of control mentality sort of people who take over the whole presentation yes so you have to be very assertive and say well look you know that's not really what we're talking about here we'll address it after or maybe you can come and see me after it but we're really going to stick on topic here. And I'd I'd discourage questions in the middle of the presentation if it warranted it. That was my one tactic anyway.

Speaker 1 30:52

What about you Kettle and the audience, the people you're working with yeah because there are some people you can do that with and they can ask a question that's a little bit off topic but at the same time they it will allow you to keep going forward. Whereas other people will grab the reins and automatically think it belongs to them at that moment.

Speaker 4 31:16

Yeah yeah for sure I mean both agenda as well as some limit on time because everybody thinks time is free. Yes and uh you know another problem can be at the IMF all meetings tend to be one hour at the minimum and if there's not enough to discuss one hour people can just waste their time easily. So you have to kind of say half an hour or something like that and we're gonna reach an agreement on something specific. Another thing that I haven't didn't try a lot that I know people have tried the stand-up meetings. But introduce a little pain the cost of what one thing I was gonna wonder in in the financial sector like morning meetings stand up because they're gonna have to you know and basically they go through the uh b uh the the the events that day and what's going on.

Time Boxes, Stand-Ups, And Meeting Design

Speaker 2 32:07

Could can we talk a little bit about like ADHD and ADD kind of things with uh how that was the next topic yeah what what's the difference Dr. Guy and and with relationships with friendships and the maybe in and in the workplace and we talked about the workplace but how it relates to those other parts of your life.

ADD vs ADHD And Daily Function

Sleep, Technology, And Focus Hygiene

Speaker 1 32:27

So my understanding and and and this is again my personal understanding of it is ADD is is the is the individual who they have difficulty in staying focused on anything. They don't necessarily have hyperactivity they don't necessarily have a bit of anxiety. In other words giving them a task to do you almost have to always stay on them in order to complete it. So if you were to say to them at the beginning of the day look I need you to do this by 12 o'clock can you make sure that this running at this time and if you don't go and check they'll actually be doing something completely different. And it's not that they not that they've forgotten it's that that they they're just so easily distracted because if you somebody came right behind them or they had a particular thought in mind of doing something else they'll say I got to do this first. I got to do this first I got to do this first. And so they'll always tell you that they have trouble getting things done. Almost always so to me and and I tend to think of them both as the same thing in essence because the treatment is pretty much the same thing. You know the treatment for sure is pretty much the same you know that therapy works for those who have the milder forms because it's giving them sometimes you have to give people focal points of things to do. This may go back to what Dave was saying by taking notes that simply by taking notes helped you and then allowed you to stay a little bit more focused at times. Now sometimes it didn't work you know but there but it was another the other thing is simple thing making sure you get enough rest. And as Kettle said earlier look we all are gonna have some degree of anxiety during life it just you know we're all but most people's anxiety doesn't last all day or that it restricts you so much you can't do anything that you sort of stop.

Speaker 4 34:46

You know you go in this tailspin that it seems to you know less sleep because you're an anxious and because you got less sleep you're more prone for an anxiety next day. Yes and then and then you don't get things done that you're supposed to done and somebody starts screaming at you it might be family member or might somebody else and you get to be more anxious and it just goes down from there.

Speaker 3 35:09

Yes.

Speaker 35:09

Yeah absolutely yeah absolutely so Dave in your uh personal uh relationships let's just say what did you find what was the best approach to you I mean I I don't imagine you'd want someone screaming at you or well I I mean I I think that uh it's it's funny I don't know if this is have you ever had a a friend and they they you've known them for a long time and then and then then they decide to tell you that they're they're gay or something.

Relationships, Punctuality, And Fit

Speaker 2 35:35

And then it's the kind of thing where you knew that the whole time and then you say to them well tell me something I didn't already know and I think that with women I I've been in relationships, you know, some things just kind of like show themselves and then it was the same thing. Okay tell me something I didn't already know. I think the other part is you know that if you finding someone that you can be in a relationship that can tolerate that and work with you. I think that's the thing with any relationship. I'm in the job market. When I when I look at different job things like I've had occasional ones where they ask about neurodivergent and I had I hadn't really heard that word till the last year but that I don't I don't volunteer any shortcomings in in my in many place I've ever worked or any place probably ever will work. I'll let them figure it out themselves. Don't let them watch this podcast and you shouldn't because it's discriminatory. Yeah. But I do think that that for me punctuality is hard. You know and it's not like I'm trying to be disrespectful. It's like some of my these when one job I had I would we'd be having to go I was working for a congressman at one time we have to go to the floor to do something and it where it's Dave is doing Dave things. I had to do these little odds and ends it wasn't like obsessive compulsive had to wash my hands three times and knock on the door but I had to pull together these little odds and ends I felt I needed to be with the congressman when we went to the floor. I mean I think there are strategies needed to help you be able to be a better friend to be in a relationship with someone to be a son of brother of father you know like because there's gonna be things where you got to find a way so that you're on top of things in the same way as anyone else.

Speaker 37:21

Yeah yeah I always found with uh friends humor helps I think if if I found people were uh you know late or any of the other manifestations of interesting topics or as you can sort of always try to frame it in the joke, whoa, where are we going here with this conversation now? Well we're covering a lot of areas I mean rather in in the work situation it would be a little bit more forceful but in friendships I think uh you know no one's perfect and uh I think uh to treat it with a bit of humor and care I always found was I I thought it was effective but anyway. Or would my friend just insult someone? Well I guess in certain tribes that that probably works too I don't know.

Speaker 3 38:01

So looking at all of this Dr.

Speaker 38:03

K, what would you say there's is there a gender disparity? Is there more males than females? Is do you know you're aware of anything like that?

Gender Patterns And Help-Seeking

Speaker 1 38:11

In the younger age it seems to be more more boys than men than girls but with adults it's probably 50-50 close to 50-50 um and and I think the other thing that is that women in general are just more proactive with it with relationship to their well-being than men and in general and so they tend to get things addressed in earlier stages whereas as guys a lot of times we say if it's not if it is not stopping me from doing what I do every day I just keep going I just keep going. Yeah I just keep going and I'll I'll get to it next week. I know I should go and see someone about this. I know I should talk to them about it. Or you'll go into the doctor's office what normally happens and if the significant other's not in the room with them you'll say how you doing today oh I'm good I'm good is anything else you want to talk about today beside what we've already addressed oh no I'm good I'm perfect and they'll go out and meet with their significant other later say well what did the what did the provider say he said I'm good don't worry about it.

Speaker 39:27

Kevin on a lot of topics there guys I mean can we sum it up Dr. K, what would you think are the key takeaways to say like coping strategies for people with ADH ADD?

Practical Coping Strategies

Speaker 1 39:38

Well the first thing always is is when you find that you're having difficulty focusing staying on point with things or you get or you get anxious all the time when you're trying to finish things staying targeted the first thing I do is always go and ask someone so start with your primary care consider psychotherapy because psychotherapy has been very helpful because it helps people target the executive dysfunction that they're having helping them to deal with the emotional regulations coaching you know seeing having a having having a a life coach someone who can help you with time management goal setting organization you know lifestyle you know they've always been anything that will help to enhance our cognitive function and give us support so things like zinc omega 3s magnesium figuring out a structured routine for you so you know if you know that you like to do A, B, C, and D at different times, then this is how I set my routine up exercise always is beneficial and thereby also getting adequate amounts of sleep. This goes back to something Kettle mentioned earlier is that with and within the workplace, you know, have accommodations that are beneficial. Like he said earlier some people can't deal with a lot of noise around them when they're working. So maybe when they're working they need to put headphones on tasking things that they need to to worry about. And also understanding what what your family history is because if there are people in the family who who had ADHD there's a chance that there's a proponent people have sleep disorders all of those things and also making sure we exclude and rule out the things that can be confused with it anxiety mood disorders things like that because they have overlapping features and so sometimes if you treat the the mood disorder then the ADHD might actually lessen or disappear because it wasn't really ADHD to begin with. So those are things that would would be helpful. Okay.

Speaker 42:06

Okay what about new Dad what what's the coping strategies you'd uh recommend as someone who's agree with you agree with everything Dr.

Speaker 2 42:13

Kennedy said I think that if you determine that you have a problem that you can't address by yourself, that some kind of mental health counseling and medication is something to consider. I think ideally it would be in a perfect world it would be both that you'd have you'd consider medication, you'd consider counseling. I think that to kind of frame it from the perspective that as far as horrible things that can happen to a person, this isn't the worst thing. That you just have to find ways to for yourself that help you deal with things that reoccur on a regular basis. I think that the that society we live in everyone is a bit ADHD. I mean everyone is responding to their phone respond responding to kings and messages and this this news story is coming up um what happened to the Kardashians who who did who just you know what did Trump just do? And we're all like ping pong balls uh you know going through different things and that that focus is something that's harder for us all to achieve. Yeah we have to take a breath sometimes and and just kind of pause and and then reset and go forward.

Speaker 43:24

Terrific great okay I guess I guess guys we've covered a lot of topics there. Maybe we can finish off with some key takeaways from each of us. I'll get the ball rolling I would say certainly compassion is a big factor. I mean yes you may have to put your lion suit on but there's also compassion there's leadership required especially in a a work situation um it's not just kindness you've got to lead and set boundaries set constraints and direct and lead which we were paid to do and perhaps I wasn't doing so it's a learning process from both sides. Kettle what about you? What are your key ticket takeaways From this discussion. You're okay to get all sorry in my microsoft.

Speaker 4 44:03

When I listen to all of this, there's a lot of things that uh especially what Dr. K said, or Kennedy said, the things that can help kind of everyone. You know, we have problems with a lot of these things, maybe not all of them, all of us. And so things can help with how people process information, how they deal with deadlines, a lot of deadlines, a lot of people, a lot of interactions. All of these things we're reacting differently, and we are different. And as you've said, Mike, a compassion, being kind helps a lot on this journey. So yeah, this is what my takeaway is.

Speaker 3 44:39

Okay.

Speaker 4 44:40

What about you, Dr.

Speaker 44:41

K?

Society’s Distractions And Reframing

Speaker 1 44:42

Yeah, I agree with everything that's been said, but one of the most important things is I think everybody should be honest with themselves to make sure you take stock. Because we we we all have good days and bad days, but the the bad days shouldn't outweigh the good days to the point where it's harder for us to function in the setting that we're in, be it school, be it work, be it around family. When that when those things start to happen, then one should be interested and inquisitive enough to say, what else can I do? Because there are plenty of resources out here. Um, and people can people can help themselves and it makes such a difference. So if we do those things, it will always be better. Because, you know, particularly in America, drugs always seems to be the answer for a lot of things. Yeah, it's not necessarily what we all need. Sometimes it's it it's it's simple adjustments to what's already going on in our lives, and we just have to figure out what that is. So I always say being honest with yourself and not being afraid to seek guidance and help. Because as they say, last time I checked, none of us is perfect.

Speaker 46:04

Yeah, that's right. And Dave, it might be close to perfect, by the way. But anyway. I thank you.

Final Takeaways And Close

Speaker 2 46:08

I think I agree with everything everyone said. I I think that um you know, self-compassion is really important. I think that it's important to consider trial and error. It's important to take a self-assessment as to what are the things that people are bringing to your attention about things that you may be falling short on, and focus on those things. Like Dr. Kennedy said, you know, people will give you feedback and consider that as where the starting places are. I think that it's important to use technology. Like I I had a big issue with taking copious notes as a way to as a crutch to overcome my my worry about not being able to keep up what was going on in a conversation or missing a direction. But now with AI tools, you know, given whatever circumstance you are with uh technology, you can record a meeting, focus on what is going on in the meeting without having to try and take these copious notes. But use technology, consider the primary things that you need to address and trial and error.

Speaker 47:08

Well, folks, in closing, whether you've worn the lion suit, wrestled with deadlines, or lived with a racing mind, we're all navigating something. Be kind to yourself and don't be afraid to speak up. That's a wrap on this inspiring conversation with the Wellness Musketeers. Huge thanks to all of you for joining us today and for uh our listeners. Now, if you found this episode valuable, folks, hit follow on your podcast app so you never miss what's next. And if someone in your life could benefit from this, share it with them. It helps grow our community and spark new conversations. You'll find links to any resources we spoke of in the episode description. So until next time, stay curious, stay kind, and stay well.