The Mars Method: The Saving Habit That Helped Her Son Buy a House at 24 | Deb Kierstead

#080. In this episode, Justin sits down with Deb Kierstead - educator, homeschooling pioneer, and creator of the Live Skills Money programs — to talk about why most kids graduate without the financial skills they actually need in life, and what parents can do about it right now.

Deb shares her framework for building real money confidence in kids of any age, the three saving strategies she teaches (including the Mars Method — her favourite), and why budgeting is actually about freedom, not restriction.

Her son used these habits to buy his own home at 24. This episode is the playbook.

What you'll learn:

• Why financial habits start locking in by age 7
• The three-question spending test that eliminates guilt
• How to model healthy money habits even if you didn't grow up with them
• Why good debt and bad debt are conversations worth having with your 8-year-old

Show notes and more at:

https://moneydadpodcast.com/session080

Transcript

Justin: , [00:00:00] today I'm excited to welcome Deb, Kierstead to the show. Deb is an experienced educator and the creator of the live skills money programs, practical, engaging classes designed to help kids and teenagers build real world financial skills.

Justin: With years of experience working with youth and families, Deb has developed life skills, money for high school students as well as life skills. Money Junior for elementary age kids, helping young people learn the fundamentals of budgeting, saving decision making, and money confidence. Deb is passionate about equipping the next generation with skills that they don't typically learn in school, but absolutely need in life.

Justin: Really looking forward to diving into how we can better prepare our kids to be capable, confident, and financially literate adults. Uh, she's the proud mother of four children and based in Dundas, Ontario. Deb, welcome to the show. I'm so glad you're here. 

Deb: Thanks. Thanks for having me. It's really great to be here.

Justin: It's wonderful to have you on. I want to maybe start off with your background a bit. You know, many people [00:01:00] working in youth education have. A defining personal journey that led them there. Can you share your personal journey? Maybe what led you to focus in on youth education and specifically financial literacy?

Deb: For sure. You know, I, I didn't take the straight road. It's not like I, I went and became a teacher or anything. I kind of had this, uh, different road to coming to teaching and educating kids. But I have four kids and my oldest, uh, when she was a toddler, was a very energetic kid and I used to take her to the library.

Deb: Week. And, uh, the one day there was a stack of parenting books and, you know, I was chasing her, so I just quickly grabbed a book and it turned out that it was a book that was about homeschooling a series of essays by some of the greats, John Holt and others like that. And so I read the book cover to cover and I said.

Deb: I'm gonna homeschool. I had no background in homeschooling. My father was a teacher. I had a lot of resistance from my family and at that time, homeschooling was not very popular. But you know, it just kind of worked and [00:02:00] fit in. So I did it. And, uh, you know, that was. 31 years ago. So then I ended up homeschooling all of my kids.

Deb: My oldest, uh, she actually never went to a brick and mortar school other than to a ballet school and an osteopathy school, but the others did go for one year just to make it easier to get their diplomas. Um, but I'm a very shy and introverted person, and I decided, okay, I'm not gonna be that stereotypical.

Deb: Typical homeschooler that is just home with their kids all the time. And antisocial, I'm sure you're familiar with the kind of antisocial homeschooler stereotypes out there. How are you gonna socialize? 

Justin: Right. 

Deb: So I made sure that we were out in the community. Obviously we did community activities, but then we were part of homeschooling groups.

Deb: And then every time I saw a need for something, uh, you know, because I was, you know, kind of a pioneer homeschooler, every time I'd see some, oh, you know, there's a bunch of melodramatic kids, I better start a drama program. So for 20 years I've been running drama programs. I just did a Christmas Carol in December.

Deb: Great group of kids. So much fun. Even though I'm [00:03:00] not actually personally homeschooling, I'm still working with a lot of these kids. Then I'm like, okay, wait. You know, my kids are playing hockey. There's. There's some issues in the hockey system. I'm like, whoa, why don't I start a homeschool hockey program again, still running a homeschool hockey program.

Deb: And then, uh, it happened that my older son, uh, he was a part of a co-op and I ended up getting stuck with teaching the co-op class 'cause nobody else wanted to do it for the high school age. So we had done, we had done some, you know, Canadian history, civics, some kind of more curriculum based courses. But had a lot of fun with them. Like we did elections and we did like a whole election. Things like that. Like I really like to get the kids doing things, you know, real hands-on actually jumping in there. So we did a whole election and, and my goodness, it was just fascinating to see these kids literally turn into kind of, you know.

Deb: Liars, I guess, in some ways because they would say whatever they, you know, had to, to get people to vote for them. So after that experience, I'm like, well, how do I top this? This was a pretty, you know, engaging, fun, but [00:04:00] educational class. And then I'm like, well, what's another controversial subject? Money.

Deb: Right. You know, money is so, uh, you know. People have very different feelings about money. There's a lot of anger, fear, stress, so many things associated with money. I'm like maybe I should teach these kids about money. You know, like, and I was a person who always had a budget, who was always, you know, looking at the numbers, checking my bank account.

Deb: So I'm like, well, why don't I introduce this to the kids? So that was about 10 years ago, and that was. That was when, at the time I called it live skills math, but then I decided to change the name to Live Skills money because a lot of kids were being scared. They're like, math, oh, I don't wanna do that.

Deb: Mm-hmm. I changed the name and I, I worked on the program over the last 10 years. Five years ago the pandemic hit and suddenly I had to finish. I was halfway through some sessions. I had to finish over zoom, so that forced me to get really creative and come up with some really fun games to make it even more engaging.

Deb: So that was, you know, how it was born, how it developed, and [00:05:00] then I wanna reach more kids, so I decided to create some online versions. So now I have, uh, actually have a complete curriculum that teachers in schools, uh, learning pods. Uh, homeschool groups can purchase and they can run the whole course themselves.

Deb: It has everything they need, videos, games, worksheets, it's all there for them. I've had, uh, a school teacher run a session, a homeschool teacher do it. They found it very easy to use. And then I also wanted to create something that families could do at home. So I've just recently launched my Home edition, which is the complete, uh, life Skills Money Academy that people can do at home with their kids.

Justin: That's wonderful. I, wanted to dig into a couple of d different things there. So, homeschooling, it's funny, I've, I've always thought in the back of my mind, and maybe it became more prevalent during COVID, but the thought of homeschooling, like I, . Kind of had that in the back of my mind.

Justin: I've never, I've never pulled it off. I never decided to, 'cause I just thought it, it was gonna be a lot of work and, and I didn't know if I was [00:06:00] gonna be able to do it. But so great on you for, being a pioneer in that regard and. 30 years ago. And, and doing that and taking active, not antisocial, but a, a very social sounds like approach to homeschooling.

Justin: And to do that with all four of your kids, that's wonderful. That's amazing how you, you were able to do that. You talked about you always had a budget. I'm curious. So, you know, a lot of times you know, as kids we don't necessarily get that financial education or. Teaching or learning at home?

Justin: Whe how did you start in terms of, you know, have you always had that financial sort of budget mindset early on, or is that something that kind of developed over time? 

Deb: So, you know, like my parents never taught me anything in terms of finances. It, uh, in fact they probably gave me a really kind of negative mindset about it.

Deb: You know, money in my home was always stress, never enough. Fighting unhappiness. You know, which is, which is really unfortunate because money, and [00:07:00] this is something I like to teach the kids, money is neutral. Money is something that humans created to make our lives easier. So I think it's always important to be talking about it, you know, in a positive or at least neutral way.

Deb: Um, but, so yeah, I did not get the education at home, but I, I was just always the, you know, I was a very good. Student in school, I would always do my work and things like that. And so it kind of just continued. And when I, uh, went to university, I went to university for just one year, but when I went out and was living on my own, I, you know, like I just kept track of everything and I just started making budgets for myself and keeping track of my spending.

Deb: And then, you know, once I had a family, I just kept doing that. And, you know, to this day I still do it. I have budgets, I keep track of every, you know, everything I spend, I write it, you know, I have. Some, a spreadsheet on my computer and I also write it in the old fashioned bank book. You know, like, I think it's really important because, you know, like I think now it's so easy to not even have a clue of what you're spending like with cards and, you know, and I, I think it's really unfair to children who, you know, a lot of times aren't touching any physical [00:08:00] money anymore, so they just see their parents.

Deb: Tap that card, get that thing. They have no clue. There's no association between the work involved to earn that money and buying that item. And I think that's really, um, I was talking to a mom recently and she was saying, you know, like she remembered back when she was a kid and you know her. Her friend's mom used to send them to the corner store for smokes.

Deb: Now not being an advocate of sending your kids for smokes, but the fact was they had to go and then if they had money left over, they could use that money however they wanted, but they were actually touching money. They were, yeah. You know, there was that association and now there's just, there's no association and I think it's really, I think it's harmful for the kids to really have no clue.

Deb: You know, it's just. Things just appear right. They just, you know, it's, it's Harry Potter, right? You know, you're just, oh, I want that thing. And it just, it just comes and, and I think they're not getting, you know, the skills they need because there's no association there. 

Justin: Yeah. It's so important to have , that tangible aspect of things to, to see where your money's going.

Justin: I remember. [00:09:00] Actually as, as a kid, as an elementary school kid one of my teachers would give me, uh, cash to go to the to the convenience store to or store to pick up like beef patties, you know, whatever. It was something. But he, what he would say is, if you can go to there, pick it up for me, you can keep whatever leftover change you have.

Justin: And, and so, uh, yeah, sure, of course. Why not? But yeah, it's so important. In this day and age, you mentioned, you know, where everything's digital, where everything's tapped, that if you don't keep track of what you're spending, it is so easy to get lost in what you've spent. Like, it just, you know, comes in, goes out.

Justin: Right. Um, so important in that regard. And, you, you talked about, um, or I guess financial habits are , better to start off when it's early, when kids are young, as opposed to when, you know, we're adults. Why is it so important to start financial education so early, even before high school?

Deb: , First of all, like I've read that, you know, that the habits are [00:10:00] already starting to lock in by age seven, so these habits are, they're locking in. Um, and I think it's, you know, again, as I touched on the mindset, right, like I think developing a healthy money mindset from a young age. Like, I don't even know how to say, like, how important that is, like the value of that, because that, that sets you up for life.

Deb: And I like to say like money is not about how much you earn. Everyone's like so obsessed with how much you earn, but it's not, it's how much you keep, right? It's, you're spending habits and how you learn to use the money. So I think it's really important and, and I'll share like my own sons.

Deb: Like I said, my older son, he was a part when I first started, uh, running my program. And he actually ended up going through it twice because, you know, he was a long, you know, he was around and the second time he did it, like his ha he went from being like an absolute spender to saving his money. Mm-hmm.

Deb: And both of them, uh, they both got part-time jobs when they were about 12, 13 and they started using what I call Mars method, which is the savings strategy that, [00:11:00] uh, I'm really fond of. And because of that, my older son, he's 24 and he just bought his own house. Um, and that's because he started putting aside half of his, like half of every single dollar he earned got put aside and not touched.

Deb: Like when he was younger, I would take it. Yeah. Um, and through doing that habit, he was able to buy a house at 24 and you know where we live that's. There's people, you know, twice his age who can't afford a, to buy a house here because the prices are not cheap. 

Justin: Yeah. 

Deb: Um, and then my younger son as well, he's only 19, but same thing.

Deb: He started doing it and setting that habit. Um, so he recently, uh, in a, in bad weather, he wrecked his car, so he had to get a new to him car. Well, he was able to do that because he had enough money, saved up to be able to get himself a new car. It was, there was no stress to it, right? Mm-hmm. For most of us, it's like, oh, it's a big stress.

Deb: You have this. You know, this unforeseen expense, but when you're prepared and when you've been doing it, I think because of how much it costs to live these days. 

Justin: Yeah. 

Deb: You have to [00:12:00] start when you're young, right? So if you start when you're young, you first of all get into those habits of putting that money aside and you learn to live with less money, right?

Justin: Yeah. 

Deb: Um, and then second of all, you're building up those savings and also, you know, obviously starting to invest part of your savings as well is a good. Choice as well. So yeah, those things, it just puts you, when you start young, it puts you in a completely different position. And, um, recently there there's a, um.

Deb: Uh, it's called Catch the Ace, a little fundraiser thing that's in my community. And it's actually gotten quite, uh, the, what you win if you win it is quite a lot of money now. But I talked to my younger son and I said, you know, if you won this, you know, and at the time it was $300,000. Now it's actually a million and a half.

Deb: But I said, what would you do if you won $300,000 right now? And he's like, I would change nothing. He would keep his job. Mm-hmm. He would keep, mm-hmm. Doing what he's doing with his money. He wouldn't change anything because, you know, he's, he's just living the life he wants. He's got the financial habits he wants, he's [00:13:00] just gonna continue doing that.

Deb: So I think if we're, we're locking these things early, it literally changes their lives. 

Justin: It does. And and that's amazing that you're, you know, you 24 old bought a house at that age. The fact that he was able to save from an early age and, and to do that, 'cause you know, you hear. You look at, um, you know where the housing market is now and how expensive it is to purchase a house.

Justin: So the fact that if you don't start saving from a young age to do that, you often will find that most people don't have enough in terms of a down payment and just don't. You know, you know, you look at, a lot of times a lot of young people these days are looking at renting as the option, and I think , a lot of times that comes down to, they haven't really put aside that cash that they need for the down payment and start same early on.

Justin: So they're, they are behind the eight ball in terms of not having those funds. So it's fantastic that, you know, both your kids, uh, you know, I guess your older one, your 24-year-old, uh, did that, that's wonderful. , What are [00:14:00] the common money mindsets, , or mistakes that you see in kids or teens before they take your class?

Deb: , A lot of them, they really don't know a lot about money at all, and they don't, uh, they don't see money as a tool. Like I've heard it said like, you know, sometimes people think, oh, budgeting, right? Oh, , that's controlling. That's, you know, that's limiting the kids.

Deb: But actually when you start using these tools and when they start using these tools, it actually. Frees them up. You know, having a budget, having plans for your money is not limiting. It actually gives you way more opportunities because you actually know where your money's going. So just like get, giving them that awareness of, of money and you know where it's going.

Deb: And also, you know, because of the things we do in the course, it's like they actually get an understanding of how much things cost. Like, that's one of the biggest things of feedback I get is they're like, oh, I didn't know that's how. How much that costs. And that really can change the dynamic at home too, because the kids suddenly [00:15:00] understand, right.

Deb: You know, when they ask their parents to buy them this, they're like oh, now I understand why you don't buy them this. You know? Yeah. Well, you won't buy me this. And they stop nagging them so much. Right. Um, and also learning these, you know, like I. I think it's really important to give the kids strategies, right?

Deb: Everyone's always like, you know, oh, you know, just save your money, kids save your money. Well, what does that mean to a kid, right? They're like, I'm gonna buy this, this, and this, and then whatever's left over, I'll save. We know he is, even as adults, we just end up spending most of what we have, right? So teaching them a strategy.

Deb: I have like three strategies that I like to teach for saving. One is dime dash. Put aside 10 cents for every dollar you earn. The next one is Quarter Quest, 25 cents for every dollar you earn. And then Mars Method, my favorite 50 cents for every dollar you earn. But doing that and having them learn to do that first and like I like to call it, pay themselves first then after that, they can do whatever they want with the rest of the money, right?

Deb: So first of all, they're learning a really healthy habit that they can continue doing for the [00:16:00] rest of their life. And then it frees them up and it takes away that guilt and shame. You know, like I tell parents, like, you know, if they wanna buy that, that whatever, that toy, that whatever, don't say anything because they've put that money aside first.

Deb: Mm-hmm. So then they can do it with no guilt, no shame. And I think we all know that guilt and shame tend to get associated with money too. Right. You feel bad for buying that thing. Yeah. It's like, well, no, you've taken care of things you've provided for yourself, then you can buy that thing. It's not, you know, it's not about never spending money or never getting things you want.

Deb: It's about. Making the choices so that you're able to, and also realizing that it is a choice, right? Like, I am choosing to buy this thing, not, I have to, or I can't or whatever. Yeah, it's, I'm choosing right now, I'm going to buy that thing and that means I won't get this, or, you know, those types of things.

Deb: But making it about choice for them and then, you know, then they feel in control of their finances. They feel like they're, you know, doing the things they want with money. I think a lot of money issues come down to control where people feel like [00:17:00] they don't have control. They just ha you know, I have to take that job because I need the money.

Deb: I have to. I have to do this, I have to go without this because I need the money. Right. You know, from a young age, they're learning that they do have control over those choices. It's, you know, it just changes their mind and changes the results over the long term, I think. 

Justin: . The awareness and the conscious choice of being able to set aside a plan, figure out how you're gonna allocate your dollars after you've. Uh, page yourself first. Uh, and then yeah, having, having no guilt on, on spending, because money is a tool. It's not, you're right.

Justin: Like a lot of times, uh, it can get emotional because , people come from the frame of there's not enough money, right? And so you're coming from, it's the stress around not having enough. It's the stress around not being able to provide. But if you can, trust away the motion from it and have a have a solid plan for it.

Justin: It's a tool to help you get. And putting the right strategies into place that it's such a, it's such an effective tool. I wanted to [00:18:00] get into your, so your life skills, money programs. , For parents and educators out there who are hearing about the programs for the first time can you walk us through perhaps the core structure, the format of, you know, whether it's life skills, money, life skills, money, junior, maybe the home program and, and how they differ, you know, whether it's the audience or the format of how you, how you go about it.

Deb: So my main program and the, the one that I think gives kids full, uh, financial literacy is the Live Skills Money Academy program. So it's, um, it's based on my 12 step framework. So I usually like to teach it in like 12 classes, or sometimes I'll do it in a condensed version. But, so each class is like one month of the year.

Deb: So in the first class, they'll create their own adult budget. We pretend that they're getting, you know, $50,000 a year and. So it's so much per month. And so they create, I walk them through creating their, their first budget and then, so in each class they're gonna go through and they're gonna do that budget.

Deb: Now to make it like real life. [00:19:00] Um, they also have to have a life card. So there could be an unexpected expense, occasionally an unexpected extra bit of money. If they own a car or a home or a pet, then they have pet or home cards, and they have to do that because just like life, right. You know? Yeah. If you own a home, you know.

Deb: The pipe breaks, you have to pay the plumber to fix it. So that uh, in each class they'd go through the budget, they do those cards, so they get a full 12 months of budgeting experience. I can say probably there's not a lot of adults who have actually done 12 months of budgeting and by going through the whole 12 months, then that gives them an idea of what happens after a year and what the implications are for, you know, how much money they have left in the bank.

Deb: So then also in each class there's a topic, so we might talk about needs versus wants, goals, insurance, investing, taxes. So there'll also be one of the topics. We'll do a worksheet on it, there's a video on it. And then I like to have a fun game because I think it's really important, like because of the mindset, like I want them to associate money with a positive thing.

Deb: So I want them having fun. I [00:20:00] want them smiling, laughing. Enjoying it. So we'll lock it in with a game. So that's how the process goes. So the Life Skills Money Academy, uh, like I said, I have a curriculum that can be purchased that a group or, uh, can do on their own or a school group. Um, and then the home version is to, for parents to do at home with their kids.

Deb: I also have smaller money missions and a crash. Course, just kind of smaller things that people can do to get their kids started. But I do, you know, I really love to see them go through the academy because I think that's really where they get the major transformations. 

Justin: And, and just to clarify, so these, , classes are meant to be done in person, like in person, or they've meant to be done online. What's the format of the class? 

Deb: So I personally, I have run them in person and on Zoom. But the curriculum that I sell, so like a school group could purchase a curriculum and do it in their classroom. 

Justin: Right. Okay. Um, 

Deb: or a homeschool group could do the same. And then the home Edition is just, you know, at home with your family, you know, you can have a friend or two or just do [00:21:00] it with your own family.

Justin: Gotcha. Okay. That's good. That's helpful In terms of, so financial concepts, you know, you talked about whether it's insurance, budgeting saving how, what financial concepts do you prioritize for, whether it's younger kids or high school kids, is how do you differentiate between that? 

Deb: So my, like I have a 12 step framework, which has all of the kind of key topics and that doesn't change based on the age or level of the kids.

Justin: Oh, I see. Yeah. 

Deb: Um, because I think that all of those things are important and I think even if, you know, even a younger kid, I think. They can still understand debt or insurance or any of those concepts. And so just introducing them and even, it was interesting because when I was running one session, the one family after they were done their dad was in a car accident and they already knew and understood some things about the process because of what they'd learned in the class, even though they were, you know, about eight or 10 at the time.

Deb: So 

Justin: yeah, 

Deb: I don't think kids are ever too [00:22:00] young. The only difference between the ages is I'll just, you know, go deeper into concepts. So say we're doing interest, I'll talk more, you know, go more deeper into the process of, you know, compound interest or things like that. Yeah. But the basic topics and the basic format is the same because, you know, like the budgeting portion, it's that repetition and, and going through it multiple times that, that locks it in.

Deb: And again, all the concepts, I think it's I, I'm not. Uh, I always like to say I'm not really a teacher. I'm a facilitator of learning because I think kids, you know, kids know what they need to learn. I'm just there to help them learn it. So I never think a kid is too young to learn a topic. It's just maybe how deep we go into it.

Deb: But I, I don't shy away and, and I love teaching the, you know, let's say for debt. You know, a lot of times parents will teach their kids debt is bad. Well, debt is not bad debt. There's good debt and there's bad debt 

Justin: yep. 

Deb: And if they, I like to say, you know, they're, even if they're young, they're just, you know, I'm planting a little seed in them that's gonna grow later when they need it.

Deb: [00:23:00] So, you know, when they're eight, they're probably not gonna have any direct experiences with debt, but because they've learned the idea, so then, you know, maybe when they get their first credit card, they're like, oh, credit card interest rates are really high. Like that. That little bit of knowledge will be there to come out when, when they need it.

Deb: Because that's the thing is that my experience teaching when kids are learning in ways that are engaging hands-on with lots of movement and activity, they remember things, right. It gets locked in there. It's not like I, I don't know about your experience with school, but for me it was like, you know, memorize all that stuff for that exam and then toss it out, right?

Justin: Yeah. Yeah. 

Deb: So for me. For me, learning needs to be locked in. Like I want them remembering it. So sometimes less is more. They don't need to learn a lot, but they need to learn those key things. So that's why it is really, I always like to say it's fun. It's hands-on, it's engaging. I'm making this a fun topic, something they're gonna look and they're gonna go, money's not bad.

Deb: Money's, you know, debt's not bad. All of these things. And I think it's, it's a huge game [00:24:00] changer when kids learn that from a young age. 

Justin: It is, it's such a huge game changer. Like when you make it fun, interactive. I, I'm the type person, like I know when I was learning I needed to be like visual and interactive so that it does lock it, it's a, it doesn't just float into short-term memory.

Justin: It's you actually embed it and somewhere so that it sticks and you remember that experience, that moment. And, and maybe that's why, I don't know, I've always been a type of person to enjoy experiences rather than just. Things because I think for me it's like, that is how that is the best way for me to like, enjoy and learn.

Justin: And I find, yeah, kids love that. They want, they, they need that right in order to uh, embedded in them and then be able to use those strategies when, when the time comes. And, you know, you mentioned good debt versus bad debt. I think, you know, the mistake a lot of parents make is, , thinking that, yeah, all debt is bad, all debt is not bad.

Justin: Debt can be used, and [00:25:00] debt is very well used to, , build wealth. And you can just, you just have to make sure you use it in the right way and leverage it properly. So, uh, that is, that's a key fundamental principal there as well. Um, wanted to touch on. Practical advice for families, for, for parents.

Justin: Many parents wanna help, but they don't necessarily know where to start sometimes. What would you say are, two or three essential money lessons that every parent should help teach in your case, facilitate for their children before, before they become teenagers? 

Deb: Yeah, I, I mean at first I just wanna say I think they need like, you know, just start talking about money with your kids, right?

Deb: I think a lot of times people don't talk about money. It's a taboo subject. You know, we don't wanna talk, I don't wanna stress my kids out. I don't wanna make them worry about money. It's like, well, no, actually, when you don't talk about it, that's when they worry about it. Right? Make it normal. So I would say my top three things, , that I think parents should teach to [00:26:00] their kids, and again, it doesn't have to be complicated.

Deb: It doesn't have to be stressful. Show them how to make a budget, show them saving strategies. 'cause like I said, it was huge for my sons to start saving when the, the, first time you get a job, or not even just when you get a job, but you know, every, all the money they get in from gifts, whatever. Um, and then spending strategies, right?

Deb: So that they have tools for when they go shopping. There's, uh, I like the three step spending test. Which is, , first decide if it's a need or a want. Then does it fit in my budget? Do I actually have the money to buy it? And three, what is the value or quality of the item if it passes all those three tests.

Deb: Buy it again, no guilt, no shame. Mm-hmm. Um, or the wait test is also a good one. You know, I'm gonna see something. I'm not gonna buy it for 24 hours or a week or whatever. Um, so having those strategies, 'cause like I said kids are kids, right. They're impulsive, they're whatever. Yeah. But if you actually take the time to teach them these strategies, kids are bright.

Deb: And they will. Yeah. They will. Suck it up and, and they'll do it, and then they'll [00:27:00] be excited about it. Right. Then you're going shopping and it's exciting. Well, okay. Does it meet the three criteria of the spend test? Right. So that then it's fun and then 

Justin: Yeah, 

Deb: you take that stress away and then suddenly it's not, you know, like you can enjoy shopping with your kids again.

Deb: Right, 

Justin: right, love that. I love that talk, you know, talk openly about money. Saving strategies, spending strategy is wonderful. How do you suggest, you know, parents sometimes come at it from, they may not necessarily have the themselves have healthy money habits.

Justin: How, how do they go about, you know, modeling healthy, have money habits for their kids? , How would you suggest they get around that?

Deb: Yeah, because you know, it's funny, every time I tell someone what I do, what my business is, they're always like, I wish I'd have had that. Yeah. Like that is the number one response. So yeah, you don't have to be good at it, right? Like, you don't have to be good at money yourself to teach your kids and create a new paradigm.

Deb: , Me as a parent, I had a lot of bad habits for my parents, but. I educated myself and made different choices. So it's choosing to do, you [00:28:00] know, to make it fun with your kids, to talk about your kids, to do these, you know, like do the strategies with your kids, right? Do the spending test too.

Deb: If you want something, go through it with your kids. Saving strategies. Now I know it, it might be harder later to, to come at them. Um, but, you know, put. Put aside one penny for every dollar you earn. And show your kids that you are doing it too, and talk about it. Talk about your mistakes. Say, yeah, when I was your age or when I was this age, I did this and it was a mistake, but I learned this.

Deb: Right? Right. So use what. What, you know, your challenging habits or what happened to you to share it with your kids, but again, in a positive way, not, oh, I did this and then, you know, my life was horrible after that. It's like, no, this happened and then I did this, and then, you know, so, uh, yeah. I think just sharing with your kids and being open, you know, you don't need to go into dark, deep anything, but just sharing the mistakes you made and doing the habits with them and talking about it, you know, just always being open and honest about, you [00:29:00] know.

Justin: , Kids need to know that it's okay to make mistakes, right? And especially if they see that the parents, you know what, yeah we make mistakes all the time. And you wanna make sure that you learn from those mistakes and the lessons that you gain from a, the experience that you gain from it is, you know, so it's, it's not the end of the world, right?

Justin: You don't have to make it necessarily that, oh, you've done a mistake, you've did this in the past, and it's, yeah, it's, you know, life. Threatening or, you know, it, it changes your life in the negative way and, and you can't recover from it. You definitely can, um, you know, make mistakes and learn from it.

Justin: That's part of learning and, and life in general. I 

Deb: think there's a huge problem in our society right now with that, that mistakes are viewed as a bad thing, but mistakes are not. Mistakes are how humans learn. I really love, I don't know if you've ever heard of Sarah Blakely? She's a Oh 

Justin: yeah. The owner space.

Justin: Uh, yes and 

Deb: yes. 

Justin: Love. Yeah. I love her story. 

Deb: Her father used to say, ask her his kids every day, how did you fail today? He encouraged them to fail [00:30:00] because that meant that they were trying. Right? Yeah. And it was more important to try and fail than to not try and be perfect.

Justin: Yeah. 

Deb: So I, I love her story for that because I really feel like, especially in school and especially mindset now, everyone's like, no, don't make mistakes.

Deb: Mistakes are bad. And it's like, no, mistakes are good because you're trying. 

Justin: I know she, Sarah, so she launched, I mean, after she sold Spanx, I believe she launched, uh, another company, which I thought was brilliant actually. I mean, I'm not a woman obviously, but the, the heels, like the having comfortable Yeah.

Justin: Heels. I mean, I don't know how. Sales are going on that, but I, I think it's a wonderful concept and idea. 

Deb: Yeah. Yeah. She, she's a phenomenal woman. Like I, I, I am really impressed by her, you know, her effort, her mindset, her she's hilarious. Like, and it is an inspiration for, for women and, and young women today that, you know, you can have a business and you can be really successful too.

Deb: And you can be a good person too, right? Yeah. I think sometimes there's, I, I think sometimes. That's kind of another thing with money. I think sometimes people have the mindset [00:31:00] that if you have money, you're, you're a bad person for some reason. It's like, it's like there's this sweet spot. If you have not enough money, then you're not good enough.

Deb: If you have too much money, then then you're greedy. If you're right in the middle, then it's just, well, well, that's not true. It's, you know, what are you doing with your money?

Justin: Absolutely. Absolutely. , What would you think is the biggest myth. About kids and money that you'd love to challenge.

Deb: Uh, the biggest one is that, that kids are too young to learn that either twofold, that they're not smart enough to learn things about money, which I, I 100% believe in kids' ability to learn things again, you know, they might not pick it up at a higher level, but they will learn. Um, and the other thing is that you're going to make their life worse.

Deb: You're gonna ruin their childhood by teaching them about money early. And I think it's the exact opposite. You're gonna free them by teaching it then That's the thing, like we're talking about mistakes. If you, if, and that's what I love about my program, right? You can go through a year of budgeting, you can make all kinds of mistakes.

Deb: There's zero consequences, right? Right. You're not gonna fail my class. You're not gonna, [00:32:00] but having that experience of making those mistakes, while it doesn't matter. You know, so I, I think that's the biggest thing is people are like, you know, oh no, I don't wanna stress my child out. Well, that, that's the exact opposite.

Deb: By giving your kids these skills in fun ways, you're actually taking the stress away. 

Justin: You're taking away the stress away because if you don't talk to 'em about it, if you don't have them make mistakes, if you don't teach them early, later on, it's gonna come and bite them back, uh, once they're adults.

Justin: Because if they don't have that, that training, that foundation to fall back on. And then that's when the stress and the worry will happen. By the time it's, obviously it's not too late, but all, um, it's better to start early and younger rather than. So later I'm with you there.

Justin: , If you could give your younger self one piece of money advice, what would it be? 

Deb: That's a tough one. I probably the money mindset, like just developing a healthy money mindset, [00:33:00] because I think if you have the mindset, then everything else is possible from that.

Deb: But a close second would be the saving strategy. Because, you know, like if every kid starts saving, you know, at least 10 cents on every dollar or even better than the 50 cents. It's completely game changing. Like especially now, like I think, I think there's a difference now like than say when we were younger and starting out because.

Deb: You know, like you, things were cheaper and you, if you made mistakes the cost wasn't as big. But now because of how much everything costs, every little mistake, you know, like can really set you back and, you know, like we see in the world, you know, with the increase in, in unhoused people and, and people struggling to, you know, I think that's a direct result of just how much everything costs.

Deb: So having, you know, having, starting that saving from a really young age, I think just really makes such a big difference. And I, I wish I had, if I could go back, I definitely would've done that. 

Justin: As we wrap up here, where's the best place that my [00:34:00] listeners can go to? You know, stay in touch with your doing or contact you if they want to purchase, , life Skills Money Academy or get involved with your programs.

Deb: , My website is www.liveskillsmoney.com. Uh, they can also find me on Instagram at Ted dot Deb, and on Facebook at Debbie, Ted, um, any of those places, , and you can also email me at support@liveskillsmoney.com. 

Justin: Okay, wonderful. And we'll have all of those links in the shownotes as well. Deb, uh, just wanted to thank you for, uh, coming on the show today and, and really just sharing your insights and wisdom, gleaned from your many decades of experience homeschooling.

Justin: And it's obvious that you're passionate about teaching kids about financial literacy, having them experience it through hands-on interactive sessions that allow them to really make mistakes, learn from those mistakes, and really. Build a solid, uh, financial future. So I encourage everyone to check out your [00:35:00] life skills, money programs today.

Justin: So thank you so much. Is there anything else that we have, uh, that we haven't covered today that you want to just touch on before we sign off? 

Deb: No, I, I think that's good. , Just how important it is. Like I hope more parents will start teaching their kids these skills. I think, um, and this is a bit bit risky, but I, I think learning money skills is even more important than reading because, you know, with the way of the world today, you can live without reading, but you cannot live without money.

Deb: Everybody needs money. So having these skills and you know what, like, I love working with kids and I think kids are awesome. So creative, so. You know, just big sponges to learn everything. So, just get out there and enjoy some time with your kids and teach them these skills. 

Justin: Absolutely Wonderful.

Justin: Thanks so much, Deb. 

Deb: Thanks for having me.