On The Gutter
A bowling podcast where we bring on guests such as professional bowlers and people within the industry to talk all things bowling. We will be covering current events in the bowling world along with any trending topics.
On The Gutter
NEW PBA Elite Regional Tour and Major Champion Alex Horton interview! Ep196
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The PBA introduces the ALL NEW PBA Elite Regional Tour. This introduces a brand new format to regionals and how some players can now make their way to the PBA Tour. We sit down with 2-time and major PBA champion, Alex Horton. His rookie campaign this year has been phenomenal and he etched his name in the PBA history books!
What's poppin' everybody? Welcome back to another episode of On the Gutter brought to you guys by Motive Bowling. Uh, we mentioned it the last couple weeks. We have some incredible pieces out right now, including the Jackal Ghost V2. Uh, this ball is a little bit stronger than the original Jackal, has more continuation than the original Jackal Ghost. So um, I so far I've been a big fan of it, put up a decent score last night or last week out at league. Obviously, we have the full range of bowling balls still with the covert VIP, along with the Sigma Tour Pearl, which is just brings back so many memories. The Superline, of course, is one of the greatest of all time. And then we have our thrills. I do know that we have something coming that is going to be very exciting to help you set fire to the lanes. So if you guys are looking for the best bowling balls on the market, make sure you head on over to motivebowling.com. Uh, check out your local pro shop, hit up JMO, go visit his pro shop and uh order your Jackal Goes V2, and then maybe what's coming out next. Um, of course, this is DJ. Welcoming back to the podcast, Mr. Jameson Payton. JMO, what's good, dude?
SPEAKER_02Hello, how are you?
SPEAKER_00I'm doing okay. How about yourself?
SPEAKER_02I'm having a time out here in uh in Ohio.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, the state that nobody likes. And if you're from Ohio, we're sorry.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Anyways, uh no.
SPEAKER_00Uh J Mo, what are you doing out there? Uh I am I am watching the women bowl. Yeah, this week is the championship week for the PWBA. Um, as you're listening to this, we're probably already one event in. Uh, so I guess we'll see how that plays out. Uh very interesting. You know, the Lucy uh happened a couple weeks ago, and of course that's an amazing event. Um saw some incredible bowling out there that I thought was really intriguing. J-Mo, did you have a chance to watch any of the Lucy?
SPEAKER_02I got to watch exactly none of it for the most part.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_02Um I have been uh, believe it or not, the whole like coming home and then having everything to do in the shop, but like specifically all at once. That has been uh that's been taking up a lot of my time, unfortunately.
SPEAKER_00That's fair. Yeah, I mean the Lucy's a dope event. Like you get to see a lot of cool teams, a lot of great bowling. Uh the winners of that were Spencer Robarge uh taking home his second PBA title and Annalise O'Brien, who is a fantastic female bowler. I obviously I think that's her first PWBA title. So uh yeah, two young kids coming out and just whacking them all week. They just bowled insanely well. So um a big congrats to Spencer and Annalise for that one. Uh yeah, and then like JMO said, he's out in Ohio watching the women's tour final championship week. Uh, this is always set to be, I think, one of the best weeks of bowling because with the women's tour, and the PBA 50 just uh concluded as well, um, but with the women's tour, this is kind of the make or break event, more years than not, of who's gonna take home player of the year. So uh there's three events all wrapped into this week. I'm super stoked to sit here and watch it. Uh J Mo, any uh insights so far that you can tell?
SPEAKER_02Uh nothing really. I mean, we I just watched the practice today. Um I think uh I think the Cleveland pattern is going to be the harder of the two, but I also think they're probably gonna make it harder on themselves than they need to.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um I don't I don't think either of them is gonna be play super, super difficult. I think the ones that get them figured out are gonna hit them pretty good.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that makes sense. Um, yeah, I mean, as far as the women's uh side goes, uh it's I would say a four-person race technically. It's uh we have New Way Fen uh leading the pack at 73,400 points. Right behind her is Lee Jane Sin uh looking for another player of the year at 71,000 points. Then we have Miss Jordan Snograss at 65,550, and then Shannon Fluhowski is at fourth place at 62,345. So truthfully, I don't remember exactly how the points work, but I think that it's between those four women of who can come out on top this week of potential player of the year.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, I think uh it's always cool when it comes down to like the last couple events, and especially when those events are all in the same building in the same week.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, a hundred percent. So uh super stoked for that one. And um, like I did mention, the PBA 50 uh also did just conclude. Um you know, can't talk too much, but I know JMO and I have heard uh some differentiating rumors uh in regards to the PBA 50 tour. However, this year, the 2026 PBA 50 player of the year was none other none other than Mr. Chris Barnes, old Barnes. Uh the rookie of the year for the PBA 50 was Mike Machuga. The uh PBA 60 player of the year was Amleto Monticelli. So uh pretty stacked, I would say, uh awards given out this year from those three players. J-Mo, what do you think?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, very well deserved. I know Tom Hess was in the running. Yeah, uh, yeah, I mean, just another another situation where it comes down to uh kind of who makes the show and whatnot. Hess finished, I think, sixth that event, so he didn't win. You know what I mean? Like it's it's absolutely freaking crazy. Yeah. Um just to see all that stuff shakes out. But um it's actually it's actually so crazy that there's that many people in contention. Uh, I would not want to be bowling the 50 tour.
SPEAKER_00No, I I mean I feel like 50 years old, more days than not, and with no hair, I probably um but yeah, no, those guys are insanely talented still. And uh, of course, you know, shameless plug here, whether it's a PBA tour, whether it's a PWBA tour, or the PBA 50 tour, if you are looking for a custom jersey, make sure you head on over to m5gbrands.com. Uh, they have done an incredible job with jerseys. I was just looking at all of mine and I cannot get enough. Of course, if you guys are looking for a discount, you guys can use code on the gutter20 at checkout. It will save you 20% off and help you uh support the podcast and and like I said, get a good discount on some jerseys. Of course, of course, if you guys are looking for designs, bowling is the season is coming up probably in the next three weeks. So make sure you guys head on over to h5g brands.com, pick out a custom jersey, plenty of other apparel, hoodies, backpacks, anything that you guys could possibly need can be found over at h5gbrands.com. So, Jmo, let's get into the meat. Uh, I would say that I guess we're kind of done with the potatoes per se of the episode. Um, well, yeah, we'll go with that green beans, maybe. Uh, either way, so some huge announcements from the PBA tour. Um, specifically the PBA regional tour, PBA elite regional tour. PBA is making some changes. Um, initial thoughts before we get into the depth conversation of this. What do you think uh this looks like from the PBA? I have no idea.
unknownOkay.
SPEAKER_02I don't have a clue, dude. Um, the the problem we keep running into is the fact that everybody says they're doing it wrong, and then they say, We're gonna do something completely different, and then they say, No, you're doing it wrong, but this time a different way. So, what do you like? What do you want from them?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's I how do I say this? Um poorly. I I well yeah, so I don't know how to say this like correctly. The the PB elite tour is is basically what's being happened. So the the main thing I think that they're trying to broadcast is that there's bigger prize funds. So there's seven regions and 21 events, so there's only three events per region uh kind of coming up. And I think that the main thing that I I guess we could say that we can take away from this brand new announcement from the PBA Elite Regional Tour is very much that this feels like a business move. Um, so they're taking away less events. Uh, I do know that there is quite a bit of fluctuation with the costs associated from not only the proprietors but the bowling alleys and total entry. Um, I think you know most of the regionals used to be like between 265 if you were a member and like 325-ish if you weren't a member. And now entries I think are $500 for this elite tour. Um, so how much of a factor do you think that's gonna play in, JMO, just the cost alone from bowlers who are looking to bowl these events?
SPEAKER_02Uh I'm gonna tell you right now, I don't think it's gonna change anything um for the vast majority. Um, maybe this this is going to sound this is going to sound bad, maybe it isn't, but I guess kind of the way I look at it is if you're willing to go up and you're gonna you're gonna spend $245 as a member. You're going to then go get an Airbnb or a hotel room for two days, gas, get time off from work so that you can get there for the practice session, whatever. I mean you're every bit five hundred dollars in, you know. And uh if the difference there is two hundred and fifty dollars and that's gonna make or break you, then I don't I I don't want to say that you shouldn't be bowling, but it's like that to me shouldn't be the difference on whether whether or not you bowl, especially considering the prize fund effectively doubles in addition to the entries. So this is the equivalent of I mean let's say it basically think of it this way you're bowling two regionals at once, and you only have to stay once somewhere once. So the way I look at this is okay, so you're bowling fewer events, but like the overall cost of bowling those two events that you were gonna bowl is identical. You actually save money. You know, so I mean I I don't see this as a like a net negative in in any way, shape, or form. And I do think it's really important to remember that we're we're working with the remain the schedule for the remainder of the year, which we have September, October, November, and December. Yeah. And we have three of these big events per region in each one of those months.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02So you know, everybody's losing their minds, but who's to say that this isn't going to be like nine of these a year? You know what I mean? Like nine of these a year when previously to have to have that be uh financially the same thing, that would be 18 stops a year. Yeah. Yeah. Do you see where do you see where I'm getting with this? No, I yeah. A hundred percent. I don't I don't think it makes sense to sit there and complain about the price. I do think it makes sense to complain about the price if the reason you're bowling is because it's in your backyard and because you thought it would be cool to bowl a regional. Yeah. Um but I also think that the PBA is making the presumably correct decision and making it so there are fewer people out there for the experience versus people that actually want to bowl and compete.
SPEAKER_00And I think that's almost exactly it, right? Like, truthfully, it's like and they said in their statement, they're like, we strive to remain, like the PBA strives to remain the number one spot in the world for professional bowling. I mean, I I've seen like a murmur of another organization or something coming up like soon, but like truthfully, unless there's something overseas like EBTs or something that really steps it up, like the PBA is the the top echelon for pro bowlers. Um so I I completely agree. And it's very much like, hey, if you're gonna pay pay $320 for a regional as a non-member, you're gonna pay $500 either way, but now you have to get your membership because I just want to highlight a couple of the main things here um as far as the PBA Elite League goes on. So the PBA Elite Regional Events will consist of 75% of max field size for PBA standard division and 25% of max field size for PBA senior division. So the the seniors will have a tournament within the regional to bowl, which I think is it's not anything new, but I think it's it was worded differently. It was usually like one senior got paid, or the top senior in the regionals got paid, uh, depending on what regional it was. I believe I could be wrong in that. Um, and then the the next big thing is that uh players from any region may enter any of the 21 elite regional events, however, home regional home region players receive entry priority. If the field fills entirely with players from the home region, the event is closed outside region entrance. I know that a lot of tour guys travel, you know, to go see friends or to go bowl, you know, amateur events or whatever it may be. If they think that they're gonna be banking on bowl in some regionals, there's a good chance that they might not be able to. Um, because uh it's after a pre-event cutoff day of 21 days. If the field is not yet full of home regional players, entry opens to players from other regions to fulfill uh remaining spots. So that is kind of cool. You have three weeks basically, but uh again, a lot of these guys travel with months in advance and so on and so forth. 2027 PBA tour priority status player participation rules. So this is uh anybody who's basically the top 75 on the PBA tour. So uh they may enter three PBA elite regional tour events limited to two in the home region and one outside of the home region. Again, um, I think that's kind of good because again, you have players who aren't there for the experience necessarily, who are there to try and compete and win a regional. Um, but now they don't have to worry about facing EJ Tackett if they travel to different regionals for events or whatever. Like, who knows? Um, they compete for the full prize money and may win the tournament title if they finish first. However, they are not eligible for the RPI qualifying credit under any circumstance. So we won't see any tour players uh in the top 75 bowling the RPI this year. Again, pretty interesting because I think in the past we've had like Pat Dombrowski, Graham Fah out there, um, Mikey Schleiball when he was touring. I don't know if he was ever in the top 75 when he was full out on the PBA tour, but he was out of the RPI. Um, we've seen like it's been an interesting mix of players out there. Um so again, they won't be able to qualify for the RPI at all. Um, and then of course, uh the uh status definition of the priority players are finished the top 20 in the top 75 on the 2026 points list. Uh, they have won any PBA national tour title within the past 10 years. So it's kind of like the majors, I think. It's like if you've won in the last 10 years, you're a priority player. Uh remember the PBA Hall of Fame, top three from collegiate bowling, PBA points list. Brandon Bone, Bryce Oliver, and Carter Street, which is kind of intriguing. Uh, medical exempt exception is Matt Taylor, top three who qualify via regional players invitational. So that's from last year, and then top four who qualify via PBA Combine, which is another thing that they are introducing in this year is a PBA combine. So um, yeah, it's going to be kind of interesting to see how this all plays out. This is a big move in the grand scheme of things for competitive bowlers, regional players on the PBA tour and for the PBA tour. So, JMO, given all those um, you know, notes and statistics, anything that stands out to you in regards to that?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, I don't really I don't really dislike the the theory behind the combine because at the end of the day, I mean these these guys can uh we're we're usually pretty able to see who's gonna have something and who isn't. And the the whole um the whole thing we did what two years ago now was it where we did the one giant PTQ or what basically what it was for the whole season. Remember that thing? I don't remember what it was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Uh tour trials.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, tour trials. Yeah. You know, the thing is is um you have people who qualified through tour trials that you know let's I'm not I'm not gonna say this is what happened. Um but if we continued running tour trials and we continued basically using that to get people who weren't previously on the tour on the tour, um you're likely to end up with a bunch of people who are um uh uh essentially like kind of one-hit wonders or um players who are a little bit more uncoachable, or you know, like you just end up with a whole bunch of people that maybe tour reps don't want to deal with. You know what I'm saying? So I don't really hate the idea, and I don't know who's gonna be in charge of basically you know how a combine is gonna work. Is this gonna be like tour reps who are gonna be like, hmm, I want to work with that guy, you know? Yeah. Um I could I I'm really interested in seeing how that's gonna shake out. But just like as a whole, I do think this is probably better than the trials because I mean look at look at team USA trials. I mean, you you you have you know, we're not gonna say it's a com a complete and total popularity contest, but we are going to say that there's a lot of people who make that team based off of things that had nothing to do with that week. That you know, everybody just bowled. And at this in the same in the same conversation, I'm not really sure that you can say, Oh yeah, well, this guy had a really uh this guy had a a really bad week at tour trials, so he doesn't belong out on tour. I mean, what if that was Ryan Barnes?
SPEAKER_00Right, right.
SPEAKER_02You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_00Like Yeah, and and it that's so funny because a lot of the times, I don't know if you've ever watched a live stream for team trials or recently. The the favorite part that I have during the team USA trials is based on their performance and their resume, Sean Rash, and it's like Sean wasn't bowling this week, but like that's the way it is. The team USA has the entire greatest bowlers of all time to choose from in the grand scheme of things. So they're never gonna have a bad team. Um, it's just it's so funny because like Team Canada, they have two selections, I think, and the other six spots go to the top six of the week at trials. So, like more times than not, you're gonna have Frankie, Mitch, Graham, and then usually Zach or Jordan Jung, whoever Darren Alexander, whoever decides to bowl. Um, it's just like it's a pretty standard team, but it's just so funny because the USA can just click pick whoever they kind of want um throughout the week and whoever bowls well that week, along with you know, whoever's been on the team for a while. So um, yeah, uh in regards to like the the regional tour or the the combine, I should say, uh it says uh in addition, the PBA Elite Regional Tour will tie into the PBA's annual regional player invitation, the RPI, in December. Alongside the RPI, the PBA will launch the first ever PBA Combine designed to measure, identify, and recognize top regional players who will be selected for the PBA national tour. So this kind of feels like it's the same thing like you were saying as Team USA. It's like, hey, they had a really good regional tour, they didn't blow out the RPI, but they deserve to be out there. Here's your card.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, I don't so I'm gonna tell you right now, I don't really see an issue with this. Um, we both know our industry is so much. What have you done for me lately? Yeah. So um if a person earns their spot out there and somebody says, yeah, they should be out there because they have been good and not they had a bad season, let's kick them to the curb, you know, it's like I'm pretty here for that. I really am. Like I think I think that's actually gonna give a lot of people um a lot of opportunities, especially considering the fact that it sounds like we have um we have an we have the RPI, which is going to basically put people who did very well in their respective regions on display. Then we have the combine on top of that. You know, it's not one or the other. I think we're really kind of touching all the bases here. I think that's a really good thing. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's gonna be uh a very intriguing mix of players um who I think are gonna earn tour cards through these different streams. Again, we're not necessarily saying it's good or bad for the PBA, it's different. And we've mentioned it a hundred times on this podcast before, throughout different episodes, throughout different years. The PBA stays consistent with throwing noodles at the wall to see what sticks, is the best analogy I can use. They have constantly made changes, done different things, tried new avenues, you know, born to bowl, you can throw it in there. Um, different oil patterns, like they try doing so many different things to see if any of these stick, to see if any of these become the the way to do it and actually hone in on say, hey, listen, we have a good thing cooking here. We're gonna do this for the next five years and continue to grow whatever uh format they have going for creating the next talent. So who knows? Like I said, this could be the greatest thing. This could be like a corn fairy tour for the PGA, or it could just be an absolute flop, kind of like team trial our uh tour trials was and. we may see it a one and done and and move on to something different next year.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, you know, one thing one one bit of credit I feel like you have to give the PBA is uh they're not just sitting here doing the same thing over and over and over again and hoping it works. Um which I feel like would be really easy to do. You can say ah it's good enough. It's good enough. It's good enough and then you know hope something happens right but the PBA is not afraid to throw some people for loot. And they don't really care if you're gonna sit there and say well this is a terrible idea. Because at the end of the day you may maybe you said that but what what is what are your suggestions? You know like what what what what are you saying? What you're not you're not really helping, you're just critiquing. So um as far as I'm concerned I mean the PBA has all the opportunity in the world to do something really good for this work. And they're they seem to be trying every single angle. So as far as I'm concerned you know as when I first when I first heard like the you know the the the whispers oh the regional tour is going away. You know there was a there was a little bit of terror inside first of all because I was like yeah I'm gonna come back and start bowling again. And it's like oh perfect just in time no revolt. But you know at the end of the day um the the PBA tour does not want to cease to exist because that would mean that the PBA tour ceases to exist. You know so I feel like they have to keep doing things that they genuinely believe are going to either grow it or at least keep it alive.
SPEAKER_00Yeah you know 100% and again I don't know there's things that J Mo and I can't say publicly I I don't think we're allowed to or you know whatever the situation might be. From my understanding some of these changes do come with a financial benefit for the PBA tour as well in full transparency or half transparency I should say um it does sound like yeah it does sound like the PBA is going to be saving some money slash making some money. I don't know exactly where the the breakoff is there but basically what I'm saying is like the PBA are making these changes it's definitely an intriguing POV versus eight to 12 regionals per year if not more with you know the same payout the same funding so on and so forth like this is a change that is going to add a different element to the PBA tour but if it's also saving them some money maybe some of that money can be used to working out a partnership with somebody big for the national tour or whatever maybe and there's like some people who are gonna be like oh you're just being an elitist like you only want to see the PBA tour survive it's like no we we do need uh a pipeline from you know college from high school to regionals to the PBA tour like we do need to see some of these kids like Landon Jordan Brandon Bones Spencer Robars Ryan Barnes I mean I could go on for days about kids who have either gone from college or don't bowl college or you know whatever it's been a traditional route basically a lot of time except for like any international players or EJ Tackett um or Simonson even like so there are so many different ways that you can bowl on the PBA tour and this is just another different variation for people who want to bowl some regionals and try and win some money and then you know get their tour card from the RPI at the end of the year. So either way it's going to be it's gonna be different whether it's good or bad is yet to be seen but we will start the schedule off next month in September with uh I think the first like PBA elite regional tour events. So I think that's a really good thing. Yeah Jamar are you gonna pull any of these you're gonna get your tour card back because you do have to be a good standing member with the PBA tour aka member of the PBA tour to bowl these unfortunately I'm a great standing member.
SPEAKER_02Not good at sitting so yeah um yeah it is it is what it is no I'm gonna bowl all of them all 21 no I'm kidding uh no I'm gonna I'm gonna bowl all two and a half that are in the that are in the Midwest yeah there's two events and a TBD in the Midwest right now.
SPEAKER_00Yeah I'm gonna bowl the TBD for sure yeah yeah no so I mean the the PBA listed their schedules it's all over their social media so if you are looking for something like this obviously the first part is to kind of get your um your PBA tour card collegiate bowlers are allowed to bowl these but they're not allowed to bowl the RPI I believe and it's the same thing with the uh priority list of the top 75 those guys are not allowed to bowl the RPI either so again we're gonna see probably a new winner last year was Manny Farrell uh obviously had a pretty solid year on the PBA tour and I'm sure he's looking to continue that for next year but uh speaking of kids who made a splash out on the PBA tour of course we do have an interview this week with none other than two time and PBA major champion Alex Horton uh I sat down with Alex had a great interview with him man that kid is so well spoken and he's been around and he's seen the game of bowling so um it's a great interview I I love sitting down with him uh so make sure you guys stick around to the interview with him uh JMO any closing parts on this PBA elite league uh elite tour um anything that you've seen this week that is like oh this is different any news from the bowling world I just think it's gonna be really exciting I think this is something different than any of us at least in my generation um you know our generation of competitors have ever had the opportunity to really see so yeah you know I I don't care if you know grandpa Tater Todd saw this in the 70s or whatever you know this is a totally different world we live in right now so I'm I'm excited man I I'm not gonna say that I'm expecting negativity out of this you know me I've always been Mr uh Mr. Cautiously optimistic about just red everything so um but I I'm not gonna lie to you I I feel I almost feel like I need to be less cautious about this because I'm seeing I'm seeing a lot more positives than I am negatives um as somebody who you know we've said for a long time the regional tours for the weekend warriors and uh you know I think it's a okay for uh for there to be again half as many events with twice as much money yeah it it works out the same and you know I get a couple more weekends off with my family or if I want to go bowl something you know like I don't see a problem with this I think this is gonna be really good yeah yeah so uh if you guys are listening drop uh in the comments what your opinion is on this let's get a general consensus because uh like James said he seems to think it's more positive and more positive comments towards this um I'm up in the air I I I've seen a lot of good a lot of bad and unfortunately in the world of bowling you can't do anything without being criticized so it doesn't really matter they could post that the PBA was just awarded 20 billion dollars and you know now we're gonna be able to fund a 200 bowlers lifestyles and there's gonna be somebody negative saying something about it. So um it truthfully doesn't matter in that sense but uh yeah uh it's gonna be it's gonna be a shakeup again like I mentioned we do have the PWBA uh championship week happening right now so if you guys are listening to this you guys can head on over to Bowl TV and subscribe there and watch the PWBA's finest uh as well like I said PBA 50 national tour is now officially done um and as I already mentioned as well uh stick around to the interview with Alex Horton of course all interviews are brought to you guys by turbo grips we have our brand new turbo next gen um switch grips those things are incredible uh it's so amazing to have that mechanism now in all of our bowling balls of course if you guys are looking to prep yourself and you want to bowl some of these PBA elite regional tours you guys can head on over to Turbotech in Chesterfield Michigan set up a lesson with anybody over there and they will help you work on your game to figure out exactly what you need to do to be more successful. But of course like I said stick around to the interview with Alex Horton and as always thanks J Mo. Thank you all right so we are joined by one of only two people this year to win two titles on the PBA tour not only that he did it as a rookie and he is now a major champion we are joined by none other than Alex Horton Alex what's going on man hey thanks for having me on the show I love to be able to hop on podcasts and talk talk to people about the story uh thanks for having me yeah of course bro it is uh insane to see what you you've done this year we had Brandon Bonta on and just talking about his insane uh season that he had as a rookie as well but like you both did incredible things this year and it kind of a quite a bit of a different story and very different ends of the spectrum as far as actual bowling goes and how you guys were you know throw a bowling ball. So um the first question I ask everybody is how did you get into the game of bowling?
SPEAKER_03Yeah so uh I've been bowling I'm 22 years old now so I've been bowling since the age of two so um bowling was something that was kind of put on me by my by my dad at a very very young age and because I started so small you know started so young I was so small two years old I could only throw with two hands. Okay. So um as a result that's kind of how we picked up the two handed delivery I tried to do the one-handed swing it didn't quite fit because I was so young and so we kind of just developed as a two-handed bowler and um you know obviously it kind of stuck with me and then from that standpoint as I was growing up it was kind of the prime of of Belmo breaking through Belmo wins those three uh three Pete masters and and that's when I was like hey you know maybe I'm doing this two-handed thing right like you know I shouldn't change because obviously people are always trying to say hey you know what is this kid doing being a two-handed bowler but at the time the best bowler in the world was Belmo and he's doing it two-handed so I'm like hey um there might not be many people who throw it two-handed but you know the best in the world does it so I'm gonna continue with it and and that's kind of how we are where we are now so okay because everybody's kind of got like a different story and it usually revolves around Belmo.
SPEAKER_00It's either I started one-handed saw him be successful that so then I switched to two handed or it was like hey listen I started throwing the ball two-handed and then Belmo made it really cool so I just stuck with it and you're in the latter part of that.
SPEAKER_03Yes sir yeah I mean his influence goes I mean beyond anything like anyone can imagine and like I said as as a 10 year old as an eight year old watching bowling highlights watching bowling on TV you see someone that's throwing it two handed on TV and he's winning time and time again yeah you want to do that.
SPEAKER_00So yeah no that's completely fair. So you started at a young age you were I assume a kind of a gym rat in the bowling alley right like how often were you in the bowling alley practicing bowling league whatever it may be?
SPEAKER_03Yeah so um as a kid we were I was bowling about three, four times a week obviously Saturday morning leagues was like the biggest thing um I would bowl all day Saturday and then I would bowl usually Tuesday and Thursday nights as well but um Saturdays were like the the big kind of days that we would grind and get practice and obviously as a kid the huge thing was bowling on sports shots for me. A lot of kids didn't want to bowl on sports shots it was kind of difficult to find sports shot leagues because they were difficult. A lot of kids want to just go out and strike on house shots. So um we had to actually drive about an hour away an hour and 20 minutes away to be able to find a sports shot league that was actually able to put out difficult patterns and I feel like that's where a lot of my development came from at the the youth level because I was bowling on difficult patterns at a young age.
SPEAKER_00Okay I got you and and that's it's refreshing to hear because there is a a misbalance an imbalance I should say of people uh as they're getting as they're growing up right it's like hey listen I want to strike I want to shoot 800 I want to shoot 300 as much as I possibly can and then it's like hey I'm okay shooting 180 190 on a sports shot because that means I'm developing touch I'm getting used to it so um it's really cool that you were so persistent on trying to find harder patterns to bowl on to be a better bowler overall. Now we've seen you have a lot of success we even saw you on a commercial growing up so how did you get into being affiliated with bowler X and being on a on a bowling commercial yeah so um I was fortunate enough to have a decent amount of success at a very young age at I think at 10 in my first junior gold I came in second and obviously that's like the big youth tournament.
SPEAKER_03So then coming back home it was kind of like okay my dad was like hey we've got something special here we're gonna try and take the take the next steps to continue to to push bowling on me. So um Lee and Chris Desant at Bullrex they're about an hour from me and they had seen me have several good performances at the youth stages and they're like hey you know you want to be in a commercial and uh you know you don't think anything of it at the time but it's like kind of the stars were aligning right then. It's like okay you be you'd be in a commercial with Parker Bone, Ryan Simonelli, EJ Tackett, Kelly Kulik, and uh and here's this, you know, at the time some random kid that's like putting the whole commercial together. And then now you fast forward you know 10 12 years later and now that the random kid is now a PBA champion it's it's just a crazy story. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah it's really one of those things and you know you you just talked about how you finished second at junior golds and and we talk about it a lot on the podcast is like maintaining that level of success from a young age because we see a lot of kids a lot in in not just in bowling but different sports get really really good like you know 10 11 12 13 maybe even into their 15s and all of a sudden it's like where did those kids end up like who are they now and it's so cool that technically we've been able to see you like grow from the time you were in a commercial finishing you know grade I junior goals to all of a sudden a PBA major champion. So um there's a lot of stuff to cover in between that I assume you did high school bowling correct? Yeah yep okay and then you ended up at Indiana Tech University uh who they're near and dear to my heart I was very close with Indiana Tech um in our division they uh they went through some trial and tribulations with the bus crash that they had back in I think it was 2015 and um yeah I've always had I've my heart is huge for Indiana Tech. So how did you end up at that program?
SPEAKER_03Yes so um let's see here it was shout out to James Bennett actually he was the one who introduced me. So kind of to give you some context obviously all the the really good youth bowlers tend to become friends with each other. So we all became friends me, James Bennett Michael Harman Jr at the time and Parker Laubach so we were all friends through Boeing Junior Gold and stuff like that. And James was the one who actually went out to visit at Indiana Tech and he was like hey I really like Indiana Tech we should check it out as I was looking at schools to try and decide where I wouldn't go I was like looking at Weber, Kyle Met some other places and I was like oh okay we'll we'll check out Indiana Tech and it was a good fit and at that at that point James had already committed saying that he was going there. And I was like hmm well it would be nice to actually go to a school in which I I already know someone and we've been friends for multiple years at this point. So I decided to to go to Indiana Tech and then Michael Harman and Parker Lovbach decided to follow me.
SPEAKER_00And so from that standpoint it felt like it made the decision to join India Tech the best decision because I'm signing with three great friends at this point, you know okay because and again like not to harp on the success of being a younger bowler or have being a younger bowler who has had success is like a lot of those times like Cameron Doyle Greg Young Wesley Lowe like all the kids that we knew growing up with Spencer Robars same thing is like when you see these young kids it's like they end up at Wichita they end up at Weber sometimes McKendry like there's these powerhouse schools that like immediately like if you're on our team for like 2040 like you're 10 years later you're on the team no worries so what was it like for you to kind of sit down and be like hey listen like I probably have the potential to go to Wichita Weber anybody like that.
SPEAKER_03What was that like for you to try to contemplate yeah uh I mean I never specifically looked at Wichita just because it was kind of far from home from Pennsylvania so I didn't want to go like that far away from home. I did consider heavily Weber. But you know just there's just some other things that kind of go into deciding a school whether it be the education or the the the coaching fit or whether it be the current people on the team. And for me I was just like I'm just gonna you know try and write my own story maybe not join those necessarily big powerhouse schools even though I might have been talented enough to pull with them but kind of do my own thing. And like I said signing with three other great friends at the time really felt and fueled that decision because I was like hey you know we're gonna create our own little powerhouse here and we're gonna we're gonna do our own thing. So I think that that ultimately helped lead led me to the decision to not join one of those big powerhouse schools.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And you guys also made uh I think it was one of the national TV shows uh at Indiana Tech.
SPEAKER_03So what was that like to be in that arena with your closest best friend that you had decided to go to school with yeah I mean uh you want to talk about the first of life changing experiences that's that's the first one was getting getting a whiff of being on TV obviously college bowling is like no other because you share that moment that stage with seven other guys and you never have anything like that on tour you have you never have anything like that after college bowling. So from that standpoint the those memories are near and dear to my heart because hey we're competing for a national championship you're bowling on TV with some of your best friends just kind of kicking it and having fun. So that was a great experience for sure.
SPEAKER_00Yeah so and again like Indiana Tech is a great school I know that their education system is pretty solid there. Like their curriculum is great. So during college like again you had success at the college level and again before that what was the decision was it always to be out on the national tour or was it like hey listen I have my college degree maybe I look towards doing something and bowling on the side walk us through your thought process.
SPEAKER_03Yeah so obviously going through college and having success I was like okay there could be a future of being out on tour but I'm not 100% set and stone of going out on tour. And then I bowled it was my junior year I bowled the masters and made the cut and I was like oh okay like you know maybe maybe maybe we could we could try this a little bit and um yeah it was always just kind of up in limbo. And then ultimately as I graduated I was like you know what I'm gonna take this summer off. I'm not gonna work a job or anything I don't want to nail anything down take the summer off and bowl and see what happens and it was actually crazy because I had gotten two pretty decent job offers over that summer. And um you know I was like no you know I'm gonna turn them down. I'm gonna continue bowling and thankfully have a great support system at home with my parents because obviously if I was not allowed to come back home or if they were to were like hey like no you basically should take this job bowling is not a real job. In that case I would have never had the story that I have now. So I definitely owe a part of the part of my success to them because they're like hey you know you got a unique unique opportunity go go take that so from that standpoint um yeah we just kind of graduated from school obviously having that success and was like hey let's take this summer and then um you know the the tour season comes around and we watch Bonta go out and win and obviously Bonta was someone that I competed with in college and in junior goal in those days before and I was already kind of on the bubble of deciding if I wanted to go bowl out or anything. And watching him win definitely was like hey you know I wanna I want to be out there and be competing because obviously this is someone I competed against so in a way Bonta propelled you to like kind of nail down the decision of like I'm going out there.
SPEAKER_00Like if he can do it I can do it.
SPEAKER_03Right. I mean yeah and like I said I I think I signed up for like a couple PTQs um beforehand but definitely it was like yeah once I saw him when I was sitting downstairs in the living room I see it shot 300 on TV and I'm like hey yo that's that you know that's crazy. So um yeah I'm like hey I I want to be out there competing and and and see what happens for me too as well.
SPEAKER_00I gotcha. Well so okay let's jump into it a little bit right so you had the Illinois classic I think was your first one then the Indiana Indiana would have been after that then the Masters we talked about it last week with Bonta the Masters can you know basically Thunder Bowl as the the bowling center is it either is your favorite bowling alley to bowl at for a week straight or is your biggest nemesis and you never want to see that bowling alley again until uh the next year rolls around and uh the Masters I I don't think was too great for you even though you've had success in the past um and then we go to the Ohio classic then we go to the New York Classic which you you bowled very well in um and then you had the uh Roth Holman doubles which you guys bowled well in uh as well and then we take it down to the tournament champions where you actually had to bowl the PTQ to get in the field so what was that week like for you to say damn I got to bowl the PTQ just to get into the field right so yeah to kind of give you some context we've been grinding the whole season as you mentioned with all those tournaments uh I hadn't missed the PTQ at that point so it's been a pretty decent season I hadn't cashed either up until New York so right it's been I hadn't bowled bad I'd missed most of the cuts by like 20 or 30 fins.
SPEAKER_03So it's been like a a pretty successful season for for me for my standards. So I was like let's just see what happens. So um and then obviously the huge thing is to get in at that point it was to get into the top 35 in points. So that way you'd be exempt for next year. So that way you don't have to bowl the PTQ. So heading into the TOC is huge because you've got a lot of bowlers that you normally don't bowl PTQs won. So that's the first thing and being a major and you know you just want to get out of that PTQ because you get much inexperience and the points are huge because at that point if I had basically made it out of the PTQ I had just about solidified myself to be in top 75 to be exempt. So that was my goal was just to get out of that PTQ. And um you know it's a gauntlet of a PTQ because you've got great bowlers that are bowling that and we got out of there and and anything after that truly was a bonus for me because I was like I just get some much needed points essentially and that's where my mindset was and then you know when you're kind of playing on house money in terms of being free flowing uh of already basically reaching my goal I mean the sky was the limit at that point you know so yeah I mean it's it like like you said it it sums it up so well because you're somebody who's bowled PTQs all season round and and like they always talk about like bowling a PTQ is so different than bowling on the main field.
SPEAKER_00Like it is a tournament within a tournament but it's also its own separate thing. And if people aren't used to it like if they're like hey I'm exempt and the only tournament That I have to bowl a PTQ for is a TOC. It adds a whole nother element to the situation. And you were able to accomplish that again, you know, obviously make it through the PTQ. And then you make the show. Talk us about making the show at the TOC, what qualifying was like. Like how nerve-wracking was that for you?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah. So qualifying of the TOC. Um, it was pretty smooth sailing to be honest. I love throwing Eurythane, and Eurythane matches up great with that center. So for me, I was kind of like doing my own thing in my own world. Um, and then you know, the next thing you know, it's like, oh, you just made the cut at the TOC. Round Robin match play. Anything can happen. So um it's funny because the first regional I won was also round robin match play. So I'm finding about myself that hey, I like round robin match play. And so, you know, heading into match play once again, uh for me, I'm just on house money. I'm pretty much on cloud nine. I'm just happy to be there competing against some of the best bowlers. Um, get another check, obviously, as well. And and you know, it was uh the one block where I started off great with Urethane, and and that's when I started realizing and people started coming behind me and watching. I was like, oh, okay, like we're we're starting to bowl, you know, pretty decent here.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_03And um, I think it was yeah, I can't remember exactly the point, but uh at one point I had checked my phone and it was blowing up, like, oh, you're in the show. And this was like probably with like another uh eight games to go, a couple blocks or something to go. So I was like, okay. So then at that point, it had it had kind of flipped, had uh the switch had flipped in my head. I'm like, oh, I've got a chance to make a TV show. Like, let's get this done now, you know. So so now I'm starting to bowl with a little bit more pressure because I'm like, I have the goal of, yeah, I want to make the TV show because I'm already in this. And um yeah, I mean, I had great ball reactions, so that was that was a huge thing, is that a lot of success and a lot goes into having a winning week, and you have to have good ball reaction, you have to match up, and and that's what I did that week, and we took advantage of that. And then when it comes to the TV show, everyone's asking me, like, oh, are we nervous on the TV show? And it was like a little bit for the first two shots, I was a little nervous, and getting to like the TV set, obviously, the first time being on TV individually. I'd been on TV in college, but for an individual standpoint, it's a little different. But once we got those first two shots under me, it was just like bowling any other time because it's like, hey, it's you in the lanes, you you execute good shots, I'll live with the result, whether it be a win or loss. And I think that that mindset of uh me being at peace regardless of whatever the result was really helped loosen me up to be able to execute the best shots I could.
SPEAKER_00So yeah, I mean that that's incredible. That's super dope that you were you had that mindset and that you were able to, I guess, calm yourself and calm your nerves during that time. Now, you talked a little bit earlier about your support system and your dad was there, but also PB3 was there. So, what was it like having Parker Bone in your corner kind of sitting behind you cheering you on?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, he's the GOAT, man. He's uh he's the second father to me for sure. I mean, I'm best friends with obviously Justin and Brandon, but when it comes to asking anything about tour or just how to be a good person in life, I mean, I go to him for questions, and um he's taken a huge, you know, I I owe a lot of success to him because as a youth, he kind of took me under his wing, and that's something that um, you know, it's truly special. And then to be able to have him come to my first event where I made a TV show and win and everything, I mean, that story in itself is just amazing. So um, yeah, you know, him being in my corner is truly awesome.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you looked super composed the entire show. Like you looked like you just it was like you had been there before, and I appreciate somebody who's able to do that, like not getting too hyped up, not screaming, not yelling, like you act like you you've been there before, you seem calm, cool, collected, and obviously, you know, you had success. Now, um, I want to ask you, you became the fourth African American to win a PBA uh major title and title in general. How does that make you feel?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I mean, to etch your name and history as as you know, the fourth African American to ever win a title, and to do it at such a young age as well is something that that truly is near and dear to my heart because you know, now my next goal is like, okay, well, George Branham has six titles, you've been through one season, you've won twice already. Let's go break that barrier. Let's have let's at the end of when everything's said and done, your name can be the one that that has the most winning titles. So um, you know, that's definitely something that I've thought about and I've considered. And, you know, to be able to continue that legacy is truly special. And you know, to be a black bowler out here, there aren't very many to begin with. So um, you know, you kind of feel like you you shoulder the burden of the whole community when you go out and win like that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, it like I said, it's super cool. And I feel like every year we we get to see a new generation. Um, you know, we had Gary Faulkner out there for quite some time, and it's still kind of intermittent. Obviously, D-Ron and you know, we said earlier in the episode, like our our thoughts and are with D-Ron and his fight against leukemia and everything like that. But then you also have now you have yourself and Cam Crow, uh, who are the two predominant names, I would say, out there. So it's it's always cool to see like the new generation, a new wave of bowlers and and variations of bowlers coming through because it's like you never know who's gonna become the next star, who's gonna lead somebody like being an African-American bowler, two-handed bowler. Like I'm sure when Belmont came out, he had no idea if he was gonna be the next star, but it's so cool to see what could be happening next in the world of bowling.
SPEAKER_03Right, right. Like you said, I mean, the the unique storylines, and you know, I'm a bowling guru, I'm a bowling fan. That was something that always kind of attracted me to bowling was there's all these different storylines of okay, this person had a job, they quit their job to go out bowl out on tour, or this person was a prodigy and they they were all the way through, they were meant for this life. So those type of stories are are things that you get captivated to as a fan, and me personally to have my own unique story, I'm glad to be to be living it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, bro. It's it's super dope. Um, and and so then we move on from the TFC. Obviously, you know, there's I I have to assume there's a huge high in your life. You're like, oh my gosh, like this this is crazy. Like you achieved like the the goal, the dream of what most people do when they go out and bowl a PBA tour event. Um, you get into the World Series of Bowling and you're bowling solid, like it's it's fine. Like you you bowled uh well um at the Cheetah uh World Championship was good, uh chameleon championship, Scorpion was alright, and then you get the Shark Championship, where you come away with your second title in like basically a month. I I think it was even less than that. So, what was that like for you to be like immediately back into the winner circle?
SPEAKER_03Right. Uh yeah, I I say to people that that second championship, the shark championship, honestly, low-key means just as much, maybe even more than that first title, because obviously um you don't want to catch the the notion of being a one-hit wonder. Yeah, and for me, um, to be able to continue off of the great momentum I had, obviously just winning the TOC a couple weeks before. Um, so yeah, that that second title truly, truly meant a lot. And um, yeah, I mean, it just kind of goes to show that uh I'm I'm able to compete out here on a regular basis, week in and week out. Obviously, you've won two times in this year that's already been super grueling. And you know, the season's very long. A lot can happen this season. Obviously, I started in the PTQs, came out of nowhere, and now you know we have two titles. So now it's like I'm looking forward to next season being in the full swing of things to see what happens if I got a full season.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, I was gonna say you didn't even get to like bowl all the events either. So it's like what like what could have been obviously like we nobody ever knows because bowling has so many ebbs and flows like throughout the season, but we truly don't know. You could technically have three or four titles this year if you were able to make it to every event. So it's it's so cool that you were in, you know, we just talked about um the the differentiation of people and bowlers and titles and stuff like that, but you won in two completely different centers on two completely different patterns and two completely different tournaments. So it really just shows like how versatile you can be and how um consistent you can be when you're out competing because like you're able to put your name in the the running almost every in any event. Yep.
SPEAKER_03Yep, yep, yeah. And uh, I mean, like I said, it it's it's brutal out here. The everyone out here is a good bowler. Yeah, and so to be able to obviously make another TV show and then go out and be successful again so quick, it just goes to show that hey, you've you've got a real chance to be out here, and this is only year one, so it's like let's just build off of this momentum, continue forward, and and see what can happen.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and then obviously again, you end the year uh with the the Magnum Ice Cream Open, which I think is like if that tournament happens next year, I'm gonna bowl it because like I'm such a sucker for ice cream, dude. And like I think that's just so cool, and yeah, you know, I I would love to go out there and see all the guys, but um, you capped it off. Uh you finished 19th there, uh, made some money, and you shot a 300 game. So, what was that like to be like the end of the regular tour season where you're like, hey, I shot a 300 game as well in my rookie season? Like, what more do you want me to do?
SPEAKER_03Right, yeah. I mean, I think I had four or five 289. So it was like for me, that 300 to cap the season off was like, hey, go out, go out with everything you've got here and to be able to end it, you know. And and people say, Oh, because we're professionals, we shoot a lot of 300s, that 300s don't matter. But at the grand scheme of things, for me, it meant a lot. It's like, yeah, your first PBA 300, like, you know, way to end this this great season that you had. So from that standpoint, you know, we went out with the bang, and unfortunately, the little uh you know, we just fell a little bit short from the TV show, but um, yeah, I mean it was a great season, regardless of you know, everything that's that uh that I've gone through already. And like I said, we're just getting started.
SPEAKER_00So yeah. So yeah, I mean, you saw there's a lot of uh things up for grab still. Um obviously, this is one of the closer races, I would say, for not only rookie of the year, but player of the year um that we've seen. Um, you know, EJ Tag has been so dominant for so many years, and and um, you know, it's just like this is a very interesting year. It's been a lot of changes. And did you feel any of those changes as a rookie? Because we jumped from Fox to CW. Obviously, we had the Born to Bowl. Did you feel any of those changes as somebody who was a bowling guru and knew like what it used to look like versus what it was this year?
SPEAKER_03I would say I probably didn't experience much of a change, being that it was my first year. So like I haven't experienced a Fox set from like an athlete standpoint. Obviously, I'd gone to TV shows and was in the stand watching, but I didn't really feel much of a difference because my first TV set was a CW set, so that was like kind of my standard. Um, so from that standpoint, I probably wouldn't say I noticed much of a difference. But obviously, as you know, with four rookies winning this year, you feel like you're part of the changing of the guard and new generation coming in because to have four rookies win, I mean, five titles were taken by rookies this year, and you know, me being a part of that is it's just goes to show that we're where this game is going.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's we we talked about it so much because last year we had seven new winners, uh, first time winners. And I said, We're gonna have more this year. Or six last year. I said we're gonna have more this year, and we absolutely did. Like this year was an insane season for winners and tournaments and storylines and so on and so forth. Um, so it's it's like again, you've already etched your name in history multiple times, and I think that you're just gonna continue to rewrite your own story as well as the history books for the PBA tour. Um, that all being said, again, you have two other tournaments for the rest of the year. What does the prep look like from now until January for when the the season comes back, the tour season comes back?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so uh first off, we'll finish strong here with the Lucy and Lucky Larson. I'm heading over to Europe to bowl a couple of tournaments as well, bowling in Denmark and Finland. And then after the Lucky Larson, I'm bowling in Korea. So kind of have like a little bit of a European and an Asian vacation. So we come back and that'll be come back in the middle of September. And then um, yeah, I think I'll probably honestly take some time off because that traveled, it'll be my first time going overseas, so I'm sure that I'll be drained after all that stuff. But um, but then after that, then it's just kind of getting ready for next tour season because you know I want to follow up you this this year with something even stronger next year. So that would be the main focus once we get back.
SPEAKER_00Okay. And beyond Parker Bone, again, you know, great person to have in your corner, one of the best, arguably, uh, to ever throw a bowling ball. Is there anybody else that kind of took you under their wing this year or like was like, hey, dude, like, you know, now that you won, do this. Like, is there anybody who you look at who has kind of guided you throughout the season?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, uh, I would say Wes Millot, uh, who also went to the TOC show as well. Yeah, he was uh he's also been in my corner. He uh he's got a shop in Fort Wayne, obviously, and that's uh that's where I went to school. So I'll just always kind of pick his brain while I was at school and stuff like that. And you know, to have him also come to that TOC show meant a lot as well. And I would say after winning, obviously, those guys are reaching out to me saying, Hey, this is how your life is gonna change. This is how you gotta hold yourself to a higher standard when you're in bowling alleys, do this and do that. And so from that standpoint, those are the those people obviously were my corner beforehand. Um, but I would say uh I had a great interaction with Belmo as well at the TOC after I won. He goes out to the back and grabs a pin from the rack and he he gives it to me and says, Hey, here's the pin for winning your first major. I I do this for all of my majors, and you know, this is your first major. Congrats, man. And I I'd like to gift this to you because obviously I wouldn't have known to do something like that, and I don't know that players do that. But the fact that he decided to take the initiative because he had lost in that TV show, he could have been frustrated, he could have just left. And the fact that he stayed to watch and do that to me, that that moment will truly live with me forever. Because, you know, as a being, you know, being I've been bowling forever, I was growing up watching Belmo, and now Belmo's handing me a pin saying, Hey, congrats on your first major. So um, stuff like that, man. And you know, in terms of being out on tour, everyone's kind of giving me more respect after winning. I wouldn't say there's disrespect beforehand, but you know, just when you're interacting with, you know, other competitors and fans and things like that. I mean, I would say that's kind of all correlates to this life-changing experience that I've just had.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, it's it's truly, like I said, it's remarkable. And you know, bowling is one of those games that you can go out there and we see people chase it for five, six years and like truthfully come away with not a lot to look back on. Um, we've seen people who come out like yourself, who's like, hey, first year, like this is better than I could have ever written this in a storybook. Like it's crazy to see the difference that we can see during the game of bowling. So um, that all being said, you've done great. You you've had an insane experience for the last year. Outside of bowling, where can we find you? Like, what do you enjoy doing besides just being in a bowling alley?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so uh I would say I'm a huge tennis athlete, tennis fan. I play tennis on the side, um, and it kind of keeps me active and stuff when I'm not uh bowling per se. And um a huge other thing was like when we're in the offseason, everyone always asks, like, what do you do in the offseason? Obviously, we practice and prepare and stuff, give lessons and stay in the bowling world. But for me, uh my my thing that I was going to do if I wasn't bowling was be a day trader. So that's kind of takes up all my time in terms of like, okay, we're always looking at charts and stuff like that. And then we'll find a way to help fund the next season by by day trading in the offseason. So those are kind of like the stuff that I do when we're in the free time. But um, as of recently, I mean, there hasn't been much free time, it's been a lot of traveling and interacting and doing cool stuff, and you know, we're gonna continue to do that as well.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so I have a few more questions. Uh, just kind of quick follow-ups. Day trading is very analytical for those who don't understand. Like you are constantly looking at charts, you're looking at increases, decreases, what you're selling, what you're buying, so on and so forth. How does though does that analytical part of your brain translate from day trading to your bowling game?
SPEAKER_03I would say the only part that I would say kind of translates would be like when it comes to getting into the nitty-gritty of layouts and stuff that might be trying to fit a hole in a bag or something. But for me, mainly when I bowl, I like to call it the Zen state of mind. I'm just out there having fun and enjoying it. Um, don't try to add any extra pressure to myself because I'm already at this point after hard after already having success, I just want to be able to capitalize on that and keep bowling. So um, but I would say, yeah, mainly it probably it doesn't translate as much as you think it would, because I day trade all the time, but yeah and bowl all the time. But I try and keep them completely separate in terms of okay, bowling, we just go out there and have fun and see what happens and then day trade, we we lock in, we make our money.
SPEAKER_00I gotcha. Okay. And you talked about tennis. I want two answers. One, who's your favorite tennis player of all time? And two, if you could play in any tennis tournament, which one would you pick?
SPEAKER_03Or a venue, even great questions, great questions. Uh Ben Shelton's my guy.
SPEAKER_00That makes sense.
SPEAKER_03Oh, yeah, yeah. If there was someone that I wish I could meet and like do a collab with, uh whether it be on tennis court or on the lanes, it's Ben Shelton. Please somehow let me just let me win a couple more titles so we can do something. That would be ideal. Um, so he yeah, he's my he's my guy there. And then when it comes to playing at a tennis venue, um you know that stuff. I've been to the US Open, so I've seen what it's like on Arthur Ash. So I probably I probably wouldn't say that that answer. I'd probably say like somewhere. I love to go to Wimbledon and see what it's like to check out the grass and see that venue. But for me, uh take me to take me to the French Open. Let me play on the dirt. Let me slug it out with the Grindfest on the dirt. I would love to to go there. I want to check out all of the Grand Slam venues, obviously, as well. But uh, I would say the French Open having a chance to be there, and if I could even ever play on a clay court, that'd be awesome.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I love I love the Ben Shelton pick. Between him and Tommy Paul, I think those two are are kind of trailblazing uh for American players, I should say. Um obviously we had the Williams sisters do it for so long, but uh yeah, uh and then if you had to pick Rafa, Joker, Federer, or Andy Murray, who would you rather play against? The big four, I should say.
SPEAKER_03Who would I like to play against, or who's like my favorite?
SPEAKER_00No, who would you rather play against?
SPEAKER_03Okay, well, I can tell you it's not Rafa because one, you don't want to catch him on clay, and two, he's his mentality, he'll never let you win. Right. So that's how. Um obviously Andy Murray, it was in terms of like being there, he's not like as big as those other guys, but I still wouldn't want to catch the smoke from him either. I would honestly love to play against uh to rock play against Roger, man. The one-handed backhand to be able to experience uh someone who's been doing that for their whole lives. I think to be able to because that's a dying breed in tennis now. So um I think getting getting an opportunity to share a court with them would be so cool.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's awesome. Uh, a couple last questions uh outside of that. Um again, you're talking about traveling. It's a question I ask everybody. What is that one thing that you have to have when you travel that you cannot forget when you're with yourself? Like it not bowling balls, not a bowling bag. What is that one thing that you have to bring with you?
SPEAKER_03Well, for me, being I'm a day trader and we're always on the charts, it's my computer and my lucky mouse right here. It's uh it's a nice little uh vertical mouse. Um you can kind of pop that up, but but yeah, my computer's got to go with me everywhere I go.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I gotcha. Okay. Um again, you've had a fantastic season. Is there anybody that you want to give a shout out to? Anybody that you want to thank for helping you get to where you are today?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, um, obviously, my support system and my family, I can't state that enough of how big of a difference they made to be able to help create the career that I've had. Um, or you know, just the start to the career. And obviously Parker, Westmallot, those people being in my corner. Um, Brunswick has been super helpful throughout this whole experience as well. So I would say those are like the the main people that have contributed to my success. And uh shout out to my one of my best friends, Jaden Combs, as well. He uh would take the time to be able to teach me how to do layouts and all this kind of ins and outs, and I would be texting him after practice session. Hey, I'm about to drill a vex on the truck. Uh, what's the layout? What's the layout that I need? So um, you know, funny stuff like that, those type of people where I can just kind of have uh nice conversations throughout the tour season, call them a time on the road, stuff like that. Those are the people I'm grateful for.
SPEAKER_00I got you. And the last question I ask everybody, bro, you're 22 years old. You had uh a season of a lifetime, you had a season that most bowlers wish for in their lifetime. If you could give a piece of advice or tip to anybody listening that you think is gonna help them have more success in the game of bowling, what's that one tip or piece of advice?
SPEAKER_03I would say uh one, obviously, is to go for it. I mean, I I'm a success story in itself of someone that was kind of on the fence, but just was like, eh, let's do it, and and obviously we're successful. But two, how you have to come at it with the with the peace of mind that it might not work and you want to live with the result regardless of whatever it is. I truly believe that because I have that mindset of hey, if I go out and bowl a tournament, we miss cut, it it life will it'll be okay. We'll keep moving. And I think because I I try not to add any extra pressure to myself in those moments, that truly is what helps me free up my swing and and go on and just be more successful. So if you decide to obviously bowl or considering bowling, just come at it with an open mind. That's the most important thing.
SPEAKER_00Dude, I absolutely love that. I appreciate you jumping on, man. It's been an honor to speak with you. Um, the next time you do something amazing or you know, if come into the year, we'll get you back on. We can kind of discuss some things that happened at that at that time. If not, um obviously good luck in 2027. I'm sure we'll be running into each other uh sometime soon.
SPEAKER_03Yes, sir, for sure. Thanks for having me. I love doing stuff like this and getting out the word and telling the story. So thanks for having me.
SPEAKER_00Of course. And everyone listening, stick around next week for another episode of On the Gutter. Thanks, Alex.
SPEAKER_03Yes, sir. Take it easy.