To highlight Mental Health Day, Vita Health Group’s Phil Adkins and Lucie Ironman discuss the topic of mental health and provide practical advice and guidance on maintaining mental wellbeing, what to look out for and how to get help.
To highlight Mental Health Day, Vita Health Group’s Phil Adkins and Lucie Ironman discuss the topic of mental health and provide practical advice and guidance on maintaining mental wellbeing, what to look out for and how to get help.
Enjoy a moment of relaxing calm with the Vita Health Group well-being series of podcasts to make you feel good, keep you healthy, help you make changes to your life. Vita Health Group is an award-winning market leader and has been at the forefront of healthcare for the past 30 years. Vita Health Group making people better.
Speaker 2:Hello, I'm Glenn Thompson and welcome to the Vita Health Group podcast. This is the first in a series of podcasts where we'll be delving into a number of different health-related topics with various experts in their chosen field, and in today's episode, we're going to be talking about how. Moot With us on the podcast today. I'd like to welcome Philip Adkins. Philip is an IAPT clinical lead and also Lucy Ironman, who is a psychological well-being facilitator. They both work for Vita Health Group. Welcome to both of you. Let's start with you, Lucy. First of all, Tell us about your role within Vita Health Group. Then. You are something called a psychological well-being facilitator and a bit of a tongue twister, isn't it? What does the work entail exactly? What do you do?
Speaker 3:Absolutely. It's a bit of a mouthful. So my trade, if you like, is as a psychological well-being practitioner, also known as a low-intensity cognitive behaviour therapist. So my current role at Vita Health Group is as a psychological well-being facilitator. That involves running mental health awareness sessions for corporate organisations, and it could be anything from a half-an-hour webinar to kind of our full two-day mental health advocacy course.
Speaker 2:OK, that sounds great. And Philip Adkins. Philip, as I mentioned, is an IAPT clinical lead. Explain what that means, phil?
Speaker 4:Well, thanks for having me. Yes, well, first of all, iapt is Access to Psychological Therapy and their IAPT services up and down the country that provide treatment for common mental health conditions, and my role within Vita Health Group is I'm the national clinical lead of the number of IAPT services that we provide up and down the country, so I guess my role really involves overseeing the clinical delivery within those services, making sure it's of a high quality and that we're delivering good mental health care to the communities that they look after.
Speaker 2:OK, tell us about Vita Health Group. What exactly do you do at Vita Health Group? What's it all about?
Speaker 4:Well, vita Health Group is an organisation that takes pride in delivering excellent health care, not just in mental health, but in physical health as well. We deliver NHS services and corporate services for mental health conditions, but also a large part of the company delivers physiotherapy as well. So we're a physical and mental health provider for corporate NHS and, to some extent, private delivery as well.
Speaker 2:You know, mental health. This is a huge issue now, isn't it? What we've all been going through with the Covid and everything the last 20 or so months, lucy, I mean huge issue for people like yourselves now, isn't it?
Speaker 3:Absolutely. I think we all have mental health and we always have had mental health, but I think perhaps over the last two years or so we've all been talking about our mental health more, which is so important because of what a really difficult time it really has been over the course of the pandemic.
Speaker 2:You know, it's been a tough time, hasn't it, the last couple of years. As we established at the top of the podcast, at the beginning of the podcast, feeling down or experiencing depression is completely understandable, but how do you know when you do get depression? I mean, I'm a fairly I think fairly buoyant sort of person. I have sort of days where I feel a little bit down. Mostly I'm quite an up sort of guy. But there is no doubt over the last two years, you know, I do get days where I think, god, it's the same day today as it was yesterday, as it was the day before, it's time last week, this time last month, and you do start to sort of feel like the world is imploding on itself. I mean, how do I know? How do you know when you've got depression? It's a tricky question, I know, but it's different for everybody, I guess, is it?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, and I think, like you said there, absolutely.
Speaker 3:Any one of us can experience depression at any time of year, not just particularly in January. What we find with symptoms of depression is that what we do is we often withdraw to look after ourselves, and this helps in the short term. However, in the long term, we may fall into what we call a maintenance cycle of depression, which is based upon the less we do, the worse we feel, because we're kind of not getting an opportunity for a sense of reward and achievement. So, for example, if we're thinking particularly about the January months, where it's particularly dark, a lot of the time we may stay in bed with the curtains closed, which means we get less sunlight and therefore we get an increase in our melatonin, which is our sleepy hormone, which happens when we get less sunlight. That then impacts on our motivation.
Speaker 3:So, because we're struggling with our motivation, we're perhaps not doing the things that we enjoy, like doing our hobbies or seeing friends or family, or not getting a sense of achievement from our routine things, perhaps like housework, and so the less we do, the worse we feel. So I think of depression a little bit like cogs in a wheel, and once the cogs are turning one way, they can build quite a lot of momentum and speed, but we can get those cogs turning back the other way. So what I would say really for recognition, is that noticeable change in ourselves, what difference is, if we notice, from our kind of usual self?
Speaker 3:and I'm guessing it's important to seek help the moment you do feel depression coming on yeah, absolutely, and I think there's a difference between kind of having one off down days, which we all have because we're human beings, to kind of a clinical diagnosis of depression. But absolutely that kind of self-awareness when we're not feeling ourselves is so important to recognize that and definitely to reach out for some support so, philip, what is good for and important for good mental health?
Speaker 2:what should we be doing really?
Speaker 4:there are lots of things I guess we can do from a very basic point of view. There are fundamental things that are really important to good mental health, and for me the two that stick out the most are sleep and exercise. This is a mental health podcast. You're talking to mental health professionals and you know we could get into the nuts and bolts of mental health, treatments and therapies etc. But just for general well-being and good mental health, normally people who experience good sleep and people who get regular exercise tend to have better well-being.
Speaker 4:In general, sleeps are really interesting one, because a lot of people have poor sleep for lots of different reasons. But there are some really quite simple things you can do to really get better sleep. Sticking to a routine is important where sleep is concerned. Talk a little bit already about light, natural light in relation to being depressed. In January that was kind of one of the things that originally contributed to this idea of blue Monday, a kind of seasonal, effective type thing, which Lucy touched on. So actually getting into a place where you can experience natural light during the time when you are awake, particularly in the morning, is good for sleep.
Speaker 4:And then things that people know but maybe don't consider or aren't aware of the impact on, such as things like use of caffeine, especially in the afternoon. You know people are generally aware that any energy drinks and coffee contain caffeine and may have an impact on sleep, but tea also contains caffeine. Cola contains caffeine other things do as well. So really limiting your caffeine intake, particularly towards the end of the day, screen time before bedtime as well, and, of course, using alcohol to sleep is, is a bit of a no-no.
Speaker 2:It is a bit of a chicken and egg though, isn't it? If we focus in on sleep, for example, a lot of depression comes out at night. You wake up, thinking you're anxious, anxiety kicks in. Your brain kicks in. You're thinking of all sorts of crazy things that always magnify at night, don't they? Compared to the daylight hours. You lay there tossing and turning in bed at night. The stress levels build up, the anxiety builds up, the depression sets in. So unless you can get that decent night's sleep, then you're in trouble, aren't you Lucy?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely. Sleep is a bit of a double-edged sword, isn't it? We don't sleep when we're not feeling ourselves, but then we don't feel ourselves if we're not getting a good night's sleep. So yeah, absolutely. And, like you say, we usually find our mind comes to life a little bit at night time. It's usually because we've not got any other distractions in front of us.
Speaker 3:I like to think of our thoughts when we're experiencing depression a little bit like an old-fashioned filing cabinet, so you know the ones that we can only open one drawer at a time, and the drawer that we've got open is the drawer that's full of all of our kind of negative, self-critical thoughts. And because we're struggling with our energy and our motivation, we don't have the energy to push that drawer back in and open the other drawers that are full of our more rational thoughts that we're actually doing our best despite how we're feeling. So we kind of see the world in ourselves in this really kind of difficult light. A nice way to challenge our thoughts that I always find is asking ourselves would I ever say that to a friend? And often we talk to ourselves in a way that we'd never dream of talking to anybody else. So why do we deserve to talk to ourselves in that way?
Speaker 2:And Phillip, I mean, is it a lack of routine? You touched on this earlier. Is it a lack of routine that causes depression to maybe kick in? Is it that lack of, you know, getting up at a certain time in the morning, getting in the car, getting on the bike, going to work, doing what you do at work, then coming home having tea? Is it that lack of almost routine that is causing that depression to kick in?
Speaker 4:Well, potentially it could be. I mean, a routine is an important thing for your mental health. I wouldn't say it was the cause of poor mental health for a lot of people, but human beings are creatures of habits fundamentally, and changes in habit, changes in routine, do impact on your mood In a way that you can normally get through. You know, we're also adaptable. We adapt to changes eventually. So a change in routine isn't necessarily the problem, although it does have a short-term impact on your mood.
Speaker 4:I think what's probably more of an issue with routine is, you know, particularly with some of the changes that we've experienced due to COVID and also the changes that people instigate on themselves when they feel depressed, for example, you know, I don't really feel like going out seeing friends at the moment.
Speaker 4:I'd rather stay in bed, keep the curtains drawn, those kind of things. If those things become the new routine, you're actually denying yourself the opportunity to get some of the facets that are really important to keep your well-being up. You know you limit your opportunity to interact with other people and socialise, you limit your opportunity to engage in activities that give you sense of pleasure or a sense of achievement, and these are things that are really important ultimately for good well-being. So I think routine in isolation perhaps isn't the reason you know, lack of routine why people experience poor mental health, but it's probably underlooked at the same time in terms of something which helps keep people grounded, keep people with a sense of control over what's going on around them and you know, with a sense of what's happening next, what to look forward to and so that, so they can plan, you know. I think it helps contain people a bit.
Speaker 3:I think some of the things there that I feel mentioned are really important, like thinking about our sleep routines.
Speaker 3:Physical exercise as well is so important, not just for our physical health but also for our mental health, and I think coming back to that routine, like you've mentioned, is important. And if we are finding ourselves perhaps struggling with motivation, can we kind of slowly and gradually look at the activities that we do, build them back in at what feels a manageable level. So we have three different types of categories of activities in our life. So we have routine pleasurable and necessary and it is so important that we have a balance across the three to make sure that we have work not all work and no play, but equally, not all play and no work and starting off with goals that feel achievable, because if we set ourselves goals that we can't achieve, that's just going to feed into that maintenance cycle of depression that we looked at a little bit back. So it's about making sure that we're doing what feels manageable for us and slowly and gradually working towards those goals, but also, like we mentioned, not being afraid, not suffering alone, reaching out for that support that is around us too.
Speaker 2:I was going to mention that, phil. I mean it is important if you're facing that black hole of depression. I mean it's so important, isn't it, to, as Lucy says, talk about it to somebody.
Speaker 4:It's really important. You know there's lots of other campaigns out there with. You know high profile support as well. It's good to talk with Prince William in particular. There's two things really. It's about socially connecting with people, because that has such a positive impact on your well being, but it's also about letting other people know how you're feeling so that they know they can support you, and also that you've had an opportunity to talk and unload things that can become a burden if you don't share them.
Speaker 2:And if anybody wants help, where can they go? What's your advice, lucy? Where should they go to get support?
Speaker 3:Yeah, absolutely, and I think it is about knowing that their support is out there, that you don't kind of have to suffer with how you're feeling or struggle with how you're feeling alone. I think whenever it comes to our mental health, it comes back to that fundamental that we all have mental health, purely and simply because we're all human beings. So I think it's about recognising that and if we're not feeling ourselves, then reaching out to support around you. Particularly UGP GPs are there for our mental health just as much as our physical health, and they'll be able to guide you to what support might be most appropriate In terms of IAP services that Phil mentioned at the beginning, and also what other organisations are around locally. It varies kind of wherever you are in the world, in the UK, but, yeah, making sure that you reach out to those professionals.
Speaker 2:The brain is a very complex bit of equipment, isn't it, philip? I mean, we know if we've hurt ourselves. You know on the external if you've broken your arm or your leg or you've cut yourself, but you know what goes on in your mind. Nobody knows, do they?
Speaker 4:No well, I guess we know ourselves. We don't always share it and we can't see into other people's heads, can we? So depression on its own, though, is hugely debilitating, and there are other common mental health problems PTSD, ocd which you know. If you look on lists of the most debilitating illnesses worldwide, they're right up there in the top 10. So although you can't always see mental health problems, you know they are. They do impact people hugely.
Speaker 4:So it is really important that people do reach out. It's right to say you know your GP is a really good place to go. Gps will know what mental health support is available locally and, of course, they'll be able to prescribe medication as well, which, for people with some of the more serious problems, can be really helpful. But of course, you know I'm an IAP clinical lead.
Speaker 4:I'm a clinical lead for Vita Health Group Psycho Services, and it would probably be remiss of me not to point out that you don't have to go to a GP to access other mental health support. If you really feel you need some medication or you want some other advice, do go to GP, but if you feel actually some of the things Lucy mentioned earlier in terms of groups, guided self-help therapies, some of the other bits that Lucy does. Or if you want other therapies CBT, counselling, mindfulness, those kind of things they're all available within IAP services and most IAP services. You won't need to be referred by your GP, you can self-refere just by probably Googling IAP to your local area and seeing what comes up, and they treat all kinds of mental health problems with lots of different therapies.
Speaker 2:A question to both of you, finally. On today's podcast, you work in this area of mental health. Since COVID has kicked in particularly. What has been the biggest cause of concern for most people with mental health issues, or is that an impossible question to answer, phil?
Speaker 4:Well, it's a very hard question to answer. I think what we see is that some of the social determinants that impact on people's mental health have been changing. We've had to respond accordingly. So we're noticing that although you know people, you can still put them in a diagnostic category of maybe being depressed or having an anxiety disorder. But social determinants such as debt, unemployment, housing issues are having a real impact probably now more than ever in light of COVID on people's mental health. And so adjusting our support so that we're able to treat kind of a broader range of problems treating people who are presenting to services just with slightly less tangible things to a mental health professional, like just general stress it's really important rather than trying to pigeonhole people into certain categories and disorders, which is what often happens when you get treatment. So we've had to be reflexive in that regard and, of course, we've had to create pathways for people who are experiencing mental health problems as a direct result of of Covid as well. So that's been a big change for us.
Speaker 2:And Lucy, same question to you as a psychological well-being facilitator what sort of areas of concern have been most to the fore, if you like?
Speaker 3:I think, like Phil, it's a really difficult question to answer. I think there has been so, so much uncertainty and but to some extent is still so much uncertainty. So I think there's been an awful lot of understandable anxiety about what we've been through in the future, I think, particularly working with organisations. It has been that quick change in terms of the working from home guidance or the return back to office guidance. So I think all of that uncertainty has definitely been difficult. And just going back in terms of what we said about reaching out for support, also, it's always worth looking into your organisation to see what support is available there too.
Speaker 2:All right. Well, a fascinating conversation. Thank you both so much for contributing on the Vita Health Group podcast Philip Atkins Phil's an IAPT clinical lead, and also Lucy Ironman, who's a psychological well-being facilitator. Thank you both so much. I'm hoping you both return on a future podcast because it's been great talking to both of you today. Thank you for having us. Lucy and Philip, thank you so much. I'm Glenn Thompson. Look forward to your company on the next Vita Health Podcast.
Speaker 1:Thank you for listening to this Making People Better Podcast, part of the well-being series from Vita Health Group. Improving your lives, physically and mentally, drives everything we do, and getting you back to doing what you love is our priority. Vita Health Group Making People Better wwwVitaHealthGroupcouk.