In this episode, I'm talking with Dr. Ryan Brown, managing director for measurement at the Doerr Institute for new leaders at Rice University in Houston, Texas. What it means is that Ryan measures the success of programs aimed at growing the leadership skills of young adults at risk.

As a social psychologist, Ryan has a unique perspective on what humans bring to their sales work because Ryan also happens to be my spouse. I like to joke that I have in-house counsel for all things about current psychology research. I am grateful for his influence in shaping my own perspective. On how to use modern psychology research to understand how people change so I can help people sell better.

Music composed and arranged by Luke Brown. Find him on TikTok @lukasaftermidnight