086 From Child Bride to Survivor: Ruby's Journey to Healing

Ruby's story begins in Wales where she enjoyed a seemingly normal childhood before her world was turned upside down by family honor codes and cultural expectations. When her older sister eloped with her boyfriend, Ruby became the family's new focus of control. At just 15, she was taken to Bangladesh under the guise of a family holiday, only to discover the devastating truth – she was to be married off to restore the family's honor.

Despite her resistance, Ruby was forced to marry a man twice her age. The trauma that followed included sexual assault, isolation, and pregnancy through rape. She also contracted cytomegalovirus (CMV) from her husband, which would later affect her unborn child's development. When Ruby became severely ill, the family returned to the UK where she gave birth to a daughter with special needs.

Ruby's journey toward freedom reveals the tremendous resilience of the human spirit. After attempting suicide and feeling utterly trapped, she made daring escapes from her family's control. Though her first attempt at freedom led to another abusive relationship that lasted five years, Ruby eventually found the strength within herself to break the cycle of trauma.

At 27, she made a conscious decision to heal for herself and her children. She returned to education, studied counseling theories, and applied them to her own recovery. Through modeling and pageantry, Ruby found her voice and began using it to help others who have experienced similar trauma. Today, at 42, she describes feeling more at peace than ever before.

Ruby's powerful testimony demonstrates how one can transform unimaginable pain into purpose. Her ability to understand multiple perspectives of her trauma without excusing abusive behavior shows profound wisdom. Her message is clear: no matter how dark your circumstances, healing is possible, and your past doesn't have to define your future. Listen to Ruby's extraordinary story of survival, healing, and reclaiming her power.

Transcript

Ruby: 0:04

What is the best way to get rid of the shame and bring some honour back? We're going to get this family, send them to Bangladesh and then Ruby's going to get married over there. I had no idea, no idea at all, until it was too late. For me, Getting married wasn't enough. It's like having a baby was enough. I was thinking no, where am I going to be Cook, a cleaner, a slave and live in someone else's house? I can't take this and I decided to commit suicide. I couldn't bond with my child I know that's such a big thing for a mother to say about their child and I left Wales to come to England, but that's when I ended up in a five-year domestic violent relationship. Karma will do it all for you.

Jennica: 0:57

Ruby, welcome to Multispective. I am so excited to have you on air with us today. Thank you for having me. I'm so glad that we finally make this happen. You have such a powerful story, and I think it's one that trigger warnings do need to be given. I also think it's a really important story. It's someone, that's your reality and it could be someone else's reality that's listening to this today. So let's begin with maybe your very beginning. What was your childhood like with your family?

Ruby: 1:25

Oh, my childhood was amazing. It was so fun as you can imagine. I've got so many brothers, sisters. It was kids running around, you know, in the parks and you know pulling each other's hair, making fun of each other like being proper rebels. And it was very fun our arguments amongst the siblings but it was exciting.

Jennica: 1:48

Yeah, yeah, so you were born and raised in the uk.

Ruby: 1:51

Yes, I was born and raised in the uk in a place called wales. It's in the countryside, and it was a little town called swansea. It's right by the coast. Uh, the beach, stunning beaches. A lot of people actually come surfing as well in Rossilly for surfing.

Jennica: 2:09

And your parents were they also born in the UK? No, so?

Ruby: 2:12

my father did come to the UK when he was about five, six years old. The reason being is because he came with his father. My grandfather came over for work, so my father came with him and my father went to school here. So he's quite westernized. He knows how to speak fluent English. He's very intelligent, he's got a very high IQ. I mean, he applied to be a judge and he missed out on two, three marks of being a judge, and when you want to be a judge, I believe that you only got one shot at it. He's a very intelligent man and he went over to Bangladesh when he was 18 to get married arranged married to my mom. So you've got an arranged marriage which does work.

Ruby: 2:58

Arranged marriages do work when both people, both parties, have consented to that marriage but, it changes when one or both parties do not consent and everybody else consents, and that's where you get problems.

Jennica: 3:14

Yeah, I find this fascinating because you mentioned that your dad was more or less raised in the UK, even though he went back when he was 18, but it seems, knowing your story and and you know we will get into this, the listeners are not too familiar with this right now but that he still kind of maintained quite a traditional kind of mindset in the way sort of even the way that he raised you and your siblings.

Ruby: 3:37

Yeah, yeah, which was quite fascinating for me because I was always thinking you grew up here, you know what it's like, you know the British culture. Every Friday night all the British people love going to the pub and just socializing and things like that. So he was quite aware of everything and it was very daunting to me how he still had embedded the whole old traditions. And the old traditions are mainly dominated by the male perspective, you know. So tradition, culture is a beautiful thing.

Ruby: 4:12

Traditions are a beautiful thing but, it's when it gets and chopped up and made into something that it's not did your family and your dad and mom?

Jennica: 4:21

did they look for another Bangladeshi sort of community where in the UK where your family was, or was he quite open with his social community?

Ruby: 4:33

My father was actually looked up to in our community because he knew how to speak English. He was fluent at, you know, reading, writing and things like that. And the other extended families of cousins or etc. They probably would have had a harder time like even reading letters that come through the post. So they would always come to our house and I would always see my father reading it out, explaining it to them. I mean, my father used to do work for the police interpreting, so he was multi-skilled, very multi-skilled.

Jennica: 5:06

Tell me about what happened with your sister that sort of changed the entire dynamic in your family.

Ruby: 5:13

So she's three years older than me and we were in a secondary school which would be your high school in America I had a secret boyfriend. She had a secret boyfriend, but she was at that age to go and get married. So she was in college and I was in secondary school. But she was at that age to go and get married. So she was in college and I was in secondary school and she was at that age to get married and she just was deeply in love and she just thought, yes, I want to tell my father about it. And so she did.

Ruby: 5:37

But his whole idea about it just went completely south. She thought she was doing a good thing, but my father was totally against it. Um, I think the idea was he wanted to choose a suitor for her and he wanted to choose someone out of the community. So you're extending the family basically to like another city or completely different families and bring them together. That's what you wanted.

Ruby: 6:06

But, yeah, he turned against her and he he beat her really bad, like when she told him, and it wasn't pleasant at all. So that's when, like two weeks after, she actually eloped and we had no idea where she went, no idea at all I didn't know. Everybody thought I would know, but I didn't, because they were like you two you always hang around with each other. You must know where she is and I didn't have a clue. All I knew that was she needed to do what she needed to do and she didn't tell me. For a reason it's because I would have told my family where she was being like. I want my sister back, not in the fact that I think what she did was wrong in any other sense.

Ruby: 6:49

But, yeah, I really wanted to help her as well as not disclose anything. And, um, the whole family's eyes just turned on me and they were like well, she's got a secret boyfriend as well, so she's going to do the same. And I did not have that in me at all. I was only 15. I was like what, how would I even get from here to from A to B without any money? Do you know what I mean? I was, I wasn't thinking that way at all in eloping at all.

Ruby: 7:19

So I was quite naive, very naive.

Jennica: 7:22

Was it commonplace for your father to hurt, to hit family members, or was that the first time you'd ever experienced or seen it?

Ruby: 7:29

No, he was quite violent towards my mum. The reason being is because he remarried, but he remarried in Bangladesh, not in the UK. I have no idea why he did that. He did that when I was eight years old and that's when the dynamics actually changed towards the family, and he was very violent towards my mother, my elder brother, him and my elder brother would get into scuffles, but he never did anything to the rest of us until that day he actually hurt my sister and I was like, what Like?

Jennica: 8:02

yeah. So you mentioned that he'd seen your sister had eloped. She ran away. Nobody knew what was going on. And the next thing is your parents are now all eyes on you, knowing that you have a secret boyfriend as well, and they're starting to get a bit nervous around this idea that, hey look, there's a possibility that ruby might also elope, even though that was not something that had occurred to you yeah, what happens next so well as you can imagine, the heat in the house was very, very high and there was a lot of tension.

Ruby: 8:36

There was a lot of shouting arguments. You know, my father was like having arguments with my mom, saying you must know where she is, or ruby must know where she is, or Ruby must know where she is. You know, you're always together, you're always in the house. You must know something. And we didn't, we didn't know anything. And it was like that for a while and it wasn't nice. It was so horrifically, you know, tense, like you could cut the air with a knife. That's how bad it was. And then I remember he owned his own restaurant and all the cousins and everything worked there with him and he would have meetings, bringing them back to the house in the middle of the night, and these meetings would go on for like two weeks straight and I couldn't quite understand why. But I thought, yeah, they must be trying to figure out where my sister is and, you know, trying to figure out some plan or something like that. I don't know, it was just like talking on top of each other and I could never get a clear dialogue out of it.

Ruby: 9:36

But then it was soon after that. My father was like okay, so we're going to go to Bangladesh for the six weeks holiday. So our six weeks holiday is in the summertime, so we have a break from school and then we go into the new year in September. So in that six weeks he was like saying we're going to Bangladesh. For me it made sense because it was so tense in the house and the community wasn't being nice to us. We had a lot of tension from the community also and a lot of spitefulness marks.

Ruby: 10:11

You know, as you can imagine, when communities come together they think they know best and they hold a lot of honor codes. You know everyone looks out for each other, but then it's like a pyramid. It's like the ones on the top control everything else and we're just puppets. And and that's what all the meetings were about it's like they were all. It was all male dominating. In some families it's female dominated, but in mine it was male dominated. And that's what all the meetings were about. They were all like trying to figure out what is the best way to get rid of the shame and bring some honor back. And that was their ultimate conclusion of like, right, we're going to get this family out of sight, out of mind kind of thing, send them to Bangladesh and then Ruby's going to get married over there. I had no idea, no idea at all, until it was too late for me.

Jennica: 11:01

So going to Bangladesh at that point you thought was sort of just like your family getting away from the situation.

Ruby: 11:06

The a holiday, yeah holiday, a break, just get away from everything, and you know my sister's gone. The shame is like on top of the family. That's what it was like it's like that was my idea of this is why we're going away and. I honestly thought I would be back for the new year in September, because that was my final year of secondary school and I, you know I would have done my GCSEs and finished school then and hopefully gone to college.

Jennica: 11:37

But that never happened was this your first time going to Bangladesh as well?

Ruby: 11:40

yes, first time abroad, wow ever so this would have been like we never went on holidays I mean, we lived by the coast and that was like a holiday in itself, a super beautiful place, yeah, to grow up in, but other than that we would never go away anywhere ever. So going there was like, wow, you know, okay, I'm going. I said, yeah, fab, this is cool. And I told my secret boyfriend and he was like, oh, okay, so you'll be back in the summer after some holidays. And I said, yeah, and it was exciting, not knowing anything in the world, like if I knew, then I'm sure a lot of things would have been different. But no, I went along with it, I was happy. I was obviously manipulated and lied to like if I was in the airport and I knew what I was going to get myself into, then I wouldn't have never gone, never.

Jennica: 12:27

I would have eloped. Probably it's with that paranoia in their head that if we do tell her she's going to leave and while we're in the UK, there's nothing we can really do about this situation. So we have to get her out of the UK and make sure that she's sort of alone, away from her, her comfortable zone, before we spring something like this so big on her.

Ruby: 12:48

And at that point.

Jennica: 12:49

you did have a concept of what marriage would look like or what it would mean to be married. So again, if they would have told you this earlier, it would have changed everything for you, so sense.

Ruby: 13:01

Absolutely. I mean, what person would agree to go in if they didn't want to get married?

Jennica: 13:07

no one no it wouldn't happen at all so after how long after getting to bangladesh did it? Did you kind of find out? How did you find out, and who was this person that you were being told to marry?

Ruby: 13:18

so, um, when I went, got to bangladesh, it was such a culture shock, in a beautiful way it got. My mom used to always tell us stories about how she grew up and her extended family and the way she was brought up. So it was very, it was like stories that she would told us when we were children, like coming alive and it was like making sense of like, oh my god, this is where my family's from. It's. It's great, you know, I even got to meet my great, great grandma and that was beautiful. She passed away that year as well, but it was a privilege to meet her.

Ruby: 13:55

Um, everything that I experienced going on a little boat, uh, going miles and miles and miles down the stream, like for hours, just to get to a little village which would be our extended family, and, obviously, because my father was so lucky to be in Britain, the rest of my family were poor in Bangladesh, so we went and mingled with them in the villages. We lived in mud houses, like mud huts, proper mud huts, and we went through, walking through bamboo bridges. It was amazing, you know, and it's like just laying there on a little wooden boat that's got no engine, just gliding down the stream for hours and hours just to get to a destination. Oh, it was an adventure, it was amazing and like, the food there is like more flavourful, and the heat is amazing, the sunsets are beautiful, the sunrise, everything there was just like exaggerated so much to what we usually know in Britain, because in Britain it rains a lot. So there it was amazing.

Ruby: 14:58

But we were supposed to come back for the September and my father said well, we spent a lot of money coming here, so we're going to stay here for a bit longer. That made sense to me because I think what he told me then was like we'll be back before Christmas and I was like, oh, ok, and that made sense. I thought two, three months out of school doesn't matter, I'm enjoying what I'm experiencing here. It's lovely. And we were so looked up to as well. And you know, it made me really humble myself and like, wow, I'm so lucky to have been born in the UK my family, were here and you know.

Ruby: 15:36

So we've got like three generations here, now four generations here. It's. It's amazing, you know and. I felt really humbled to be British and go over there and see how they live in and it really made my heart soft of like this is how people live, because I didn't know anything else yeah but that grounded me and I loved it but, then, um, things started changing, because when you go somewhere for a holiday, it starts to become like living there.

Ruby: 16:07

And three months is like, right, you're starting to live there now. And it was coming to a point where the younger siblings were getting frustrated. They couldn't bear the heat any longer. Obviously, weather changes over there as well. It gets hotter and then it gets cooler.

Ruby: 16:23

And we were just like, oh, we just want to eat normal British food. Now you know, we're done with it. We loved it, but we we don't. Our bodies were not used to it. You know, we're British kids, we used to rain, we used to British food and going over there it was like, yeah, enjoyed it, but then it became living and we wanted to go home. And I remember then my father came from the village and he came to the house and we were all having food and he just sat down casually, just said, oh, wouldn't it be good if we got Ruby married, just like out of the blue. Out of the blue, and my body went into shock. My mind, my spirit, my soul, everything just went in shock. It's like it's like I got hit by a bus, but I'm still standing and I'm like what's just happened yeah and I couldn't comprehend it.

Ruby: 17:17

but then the um, anger started shooting out through my body. It was like a dwelling and I was like shouting. I was throwing things in my room, I was being a 15-year-old having a tantrum.

Ruby: 17:32

You know, that's all. In a way I was like how dare you say that without even saying a word to me? Oh, it just wouldn't have been good if we got really married. Oh, okay, you already made the decision. So what's the point in saying anything to me? Oh just, they wouldn't be good if we got Ruby married. Oh okay, you already made the decision, so what's the point of saying anything to me? It just didn't make sense to me at all.

Ruby: 17:49

And then it wasn't long after that that I got engaged, the person that I got married to. I did see him briefly because all the men were having a meeting in front of the house. We got an extension in front of this beautiful mansion that my mum and father built over the years, sending money back abroad, and they built it from scratch, bought the land, built it from scratch and it's such a beautiful place to live in. And outside there was an extension, a glass extension dome kind of room, and from the outside you can't see it, but from the inside you can see it out. It was stained windows.

Ruby: 18:25

I was going to the kitchen and my mom's whispering she goes, come here, come here. And I'm like, well, I knew there was a meeting going on, but I didn't know what about, because I think at that point I was very much so like depressed, numb, isolated. As you can imagine, I'm used to speak english as my first language, not bengali. When I I got no one to talk to my age there's no one there, my age, you know and I was become really, really depressed. So for me I was just like, yeah, what's going on? And she goes oh, um, that's the guy you're going to get married to. She pointed him out and I was like, oh, okay, and all I remember is that he looks young, he looks very young, and it did for a flash in my head, think is he going through the same thing that I am? Right.

Ruby: 19:10

Because he looked young. Like your age like 15, 16 at that time, yeah, he had a proper baby face. Yeah. I just thought is he going through the same thing as me, like because he's young, or is he like I've hit the jackpot because I'm going to get married to a British girl? Right, you know because a lot of people do. They would get married at the age of 12, 9, even younger if they've got a British partner that they're going to get married to Right, because that's the jackpot. Yeah, money.

Ruby: 19:45

It's like follow the yellow brick road, you're coming to a good destination.

Speaker 3: 19:47

That's what they think, right, but it's tough times here as well as it is over there.

Ruby: 19:49

So but for them I can imagine, because I was lucky to be born here, and for them it's like wow, we're going get married to this person and I'm going to the uk. But but going back to that moment, I was just like whatever didn't matter to me Because if it wasn't him, it would have been someone else.

Ruby: 20:07

If it wasn't someone else, it'd be someone else. So there was no way out for me. Because I pleaded with him. My father and I got my male cousins and everything to like really beg my father and say things like she'll get rid of that secret boyfriend she's got, she'll go back to school, she'll finish everything properly, she'll do as you say. I really really begged through other people to ask him not to get me married and it was always a no.

Ruby: 20:34

I was like it had to happen. This is gonna happen, final that's it, no other choice. So the marriage soon happened after that initial meeting. Now we have the engagement and the marriage. The engagement happened around November, marriage happened in December.

Ruby: 20:52

It was that quick, but my father did match everything up properly. It's like he only lived two streets away from our house. He can speak English Not brilliant, but he can. So he can speak english not brilliant, but he can so you can communicate with me. He went, he was at university and there you can go to university at any age. And I was like thinking like these little like droplets of like facts weren't registering with me because I was just ignoring everything, because I didn't want it anyway. But then when I actually saw the marriage certificate that they frauded because they waited till I got 16, turned 16 and I turned 16 in the January. They had to fraud them because it was done when I was 15. They had to remake them and change the date and everything. And I remember, look, saw it just like a corner of my eye and his date of birth was on there and I was like, oh my God, he's twice my age like.

Jennica: 21:53

So you found out his age after you were already married? Yeah, yeah, and your dad knew well and clear his age.

Ruby: 22:00

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's your age. So he was like twice my age. I was 15, he was 30, but yeah, he looked a lot younger. But the thing is he even knew how old he was. Getting married to a 15 year old you know it's disgusting.

Ruby: 22:14

My body was still a child and I remember on the wedding luckily I was on my period and luckily one of our uncles he's very young, in his age as well he used to live with us and so he would be our like chaperone to go and get things from the shops if we needed anything, because women are not allowed out on their own. So if I needed anything I would tell him and he would go and get it for me. And I remember he got me the pill and that was his way of like protecting me. And he said, please, every single day and I was like, okay, what is it? I didn't even have sex education in school so I was like, what is it? See my mum take them, but how's that gonna help me? Like?

Ruby: 22:57

I couldn't quite understand, I was a young child myself. But he explained it and he said you won't get pregnant, you know, etc. Etc. So I was like, all right, I'll take them. And then, um, on the wedding night anyway it was on my period, but it wasn't long after that that's when all the rape started started happening and it was continuous, and I soon then started hearing things from his sister saying oh, would it? You know it'd be nice to have little baby feet running around and I'd be like in my head I'm a baby myself. How am I supposed to bring a baby into this world like?

Ruby: 23:29

yeah are they off their heads? And I was.

Ruby: 23:31

I'd be like laughing in my brain like these inner dialogues were happening all the time because I couldn't express myself and I'd be swearing and cursing and all sorts of things in my head.

Ruby: 23:43

You know, at them with a poker face and you know it was quite bizarre of how I was living like that, because I was depressed. You know, I had no one to speak to, so I was going inwards and in my head I was like saying, haha, but I'm on the pill, that's never gonna happen, you know. So like a child I would say these little dialogues and it wasn't long till they actually went through all my belongings while I was at my mother's house and I came back to his house and they we sat down to have tea and his sister threw the pills on the table and she said this is why she's not getting pregnant, because she's taking these. And she embarrassed me in front of everybody. She even brought my mother and father there as well just to do that, and for my mother and father it was like more shame came on to the family.

Jennica: 24:27

They were like so like they were also expecting you to get pregnant, like asap sort of my yeah, asap.

Ruby: 24:35

And I think that's the whole thing of like bringing you because of the shame apparently my sister brought on to the family. It's like me getting married wasn't enough. It's like having a baby was enough, so it's like smooth the shame over with a new family built family and a baby coming as well. What's more perfect for them?

Jennica: 24:59

and maybe there's the other aspect as well, as like, if you have a child then there is no way you can leave and run away. So even if that means now if you with the family go back to the uk, you're still going to be kind of stuck with him because now you, you have a child.

Ruby: 25:14

That's going to they wanted me to stay in Bangladesh till I had the baby and then come as a family.

Ruby: 25:21

But I got really sick in the early stages. As you can imagine, I was so depressed because I got pregnant very quickly. I got depressed and in my head I was just thinking wait till you go home and then you can get an abortion. That's what I was thinking. That was my dialogue, inner dialogue, all the time. Just let them do whatever they want, let them have their parties, celebrations, whatever it is that they want. I don't care, I'm just gonna wait till I get home, because I felt like as soon as I'm back on British soil, you know I'll get some sort of like help and get my power back, etc. But, um, yeah, I got really really sick very fast. My father just came home to the UK just before I got sick, so he knew I was pregnant and then he came back to the UK because at that point we were away for almost a year out of the UK.

Ruby: 26:13

So, as you can imagine, the household bills were piling up. He needed to sort, like sort up the nest, basically for us to come back. Yeah and um, that's when I turned sick and my mother was getting doctors from far and wide and, for it being a developing country, um, she couldn't get the right sort of medicine for me because all the doctors were saying we've never come across anything like this.

Ruby: 26:38

We don't know what's wrong with her. The best thing to do is for her to quickly get home to seek medical advice. So within a week, my father booked the tickets and we came back because I was on my deathbed there. I was in and out of consciousness. I didn't know whether I was sleeping, I didn't know what day time of the day it was. I was like zoning in and out. I felt like a zombie. I was in so much pain. I was just having blackouts. I didn't know what was happening to myself.

Ruby: 27:10

All I remember is like my gran, my nan, was by my bed. She didn't leave my side at all. So, yeah, I was very, very, very sick and I couldn't understand what was happening to my body. Nobody could, nobody was. Everyone was like in shock. Um, my nan bless her, she's not with us anymore. She never left my bedside and all I remember is her singing, and that's what kind of like gave me a bit of calmness when I was really, really sick and the tickets were booked within a week and I don't know how I got the energy to get up and do anything, because I didn't have the energy my mom actually dressed me and when we were going to the airport I was picked from the bed to the van to the transport going to the airport.

Ruby: 27:57

I was picked from the bed to the van, uh, to the transport going to the airport because I was so out of it, I wasn't well at all and I just remember getting to the airport and I don't know where I got the adrenaline from. It just kicked into my body because I saw, as soon as I saw, the arch, you know, the security arch, I was there, I ha, I'm going home, I'm going home, I'm going home. It was like a golden arch for me to walk through.

Ruby: 28:24

And somehow I'm going to be transported back to the UK and I'm going home and that's what I did. That's where the drone kicked in. I walked through. I didn't look back at them. I heard his family were crying and stuff and I was like like I don't care, I'm going home. When I got onto that plane I actually slept all the way. I slept so peacefully for a long time. I can't remember what that felt like no but. I slept so peacefully on that plane for 12 hours.

Jennica: 28:46

I slept and did your husband at the time also join you to the no?

Ruby: 28:51

no. So he was in Bangladesh and because their, their main priority was what's going to happen to the baby, because I was so sick, I needed medical advice, attention urgently, and when I did get home, it's like I was home, but I still felt powerless.

Ruby: 29:09

I felt like where am I going to get help from? What am I going to do? I haven't seen my friends for ages. I wasn't allowed out of the house. Everything was restricted. I wasn't allowed to go back to school. I wasn't allowed out of the house. Everything was restricted. I wasn't allowed to go back to school. I wasn't allowed to do nothing and not even get a job. I knew all these things were going to like soon come flooding towards me and I just thought I can't take this and I decided to commit suicide. And I didn't succeed, obviously, but I thought that was my way out.

Ruby: 29:34

Because, I didn't't like myself, I didn't want the life that I had.

Jennica: 29:38

So and you were.

Ruby: 29:40

You were pregnant as well at this point, so yeah, I thought, if the universe wants me to die, let me just die. That's how I felt, because I felt like what else is, what else can shock me? Nothing, because I already endured a lot of trauma a a lot of nightmares that came with my reality.

Ruby: 30:00

I was numb to it all and I thought I don't care, I'm just going to try and take control of the one thing that I can, and that's what I did, naively. But I ended up being in hospital and there was this one nurse that came up to me and she said after my family were gone, obviously she said you want abortion, don't you? Because I think she said after my family were gone, obviously she said you want abortion, don't you? Because I think she looked at my age and she could see I was in a lot of physical pain. She could see I was trying to find a way out by trying to commit suicide and she just knew and she asked me what is it that what you want to do?

Ruby: 30:30

and I was got yeah, I want an abortion. And she there was an appointment the following morning while my family are still not there because it was done in secret and I had a scan and I saw my daughter's heart beating and I thought I can't do this, I'm not taking this life away from me and to have two hearts beating in one body is such a blessing and I thought I'm not doing it.

Ruby: 30:53

I don't care how it happened. I'll just put the rest of my specks of positivity that I've got left and I'll put it into my baby. And then I started having something to live for, because it was a baby growing inside me and I knew that I had to be there for the baby. You know.

Jennica: 31:12

I mean, at such a young age, you had that kind of strength, that maturity and that fortitude to be able to put that anger aside for a moment and just give love to this life that was growing inside of you, and you kind of have that ability to sort of even conceptualize that. Okay. Look, trauma has happened to me and it is something that will be dealt with, but it's right. In this moment, what I can say is it's worth living for, and so I'm going to do that, which is huge considering your age and your condition, and I was only 16 and I made that decision and I don't regret it at all.

Ruby: 31:48

But the pregnancy was kind of heavy as well. My daughter wasn't moving as much. Somehow. I knew I was going to have a girl. Even without the scans I was like a girl. Even without the scans. I was like, no, I'm having a girl.

Ruby: 31:58

And I started to visualize all the good stuff that was going to come my way and, um, you know, like just plaiting her hair and wearing the same matching outfits and things like that, as you do, we all do that. You know, we have these visualizations. And um, that's what I did. And but the pregnancy was very, very slow in what. She was underweight and I thought, maybe this because I'm depressed, that's why it's happening. But it wasn't until more close to the time, the due date, that the baby wasn't breech. She was breech, she wasn't a headstand. And um, they were saying, right, we're gonna set a date for a cesarean and that would be the day that we induce you and you have your baby. And I said, oh, okay, because the baby's head was just not engaging. But she came three weeks earlier than that. She was like emergency cesarean, like literally, her feet were coming out of me, literally the nurse. When she did a check she could tickle my baby's feet, so that's how emergency they had to get her out, because if her head got stuck.

Ruby: 33:01

That's it. But, um, it was the most painful, traumatic thing ever, because when they did the epidural in my spine they did it in the wrong place, so that had to come out. And then they did it in the correct place for the second time around, and it's not pleasant at all. And then there was an incubator right next to me and as you can imagine, there's lights everywhere and I could see them cutting me open. I could see the reflection gosh yeah cutting me open and I was got.

Ruby: 33:30

I was like, oh, I'm gonna be sick. It was like stuff you've seen horror movies and you're just actually watching yourself being chopped open. And I was like, oh my God, this is disgusting. And my mum was like don't look, don't look, don't look. And she was covering my eyes. I was like I want to see this.

Jennica: 33:48

It's traumatising, but it's intoxicating as well.

Ruby: 33:52

I was like going for it. I was like, mum, I've already seen it, I'm going to carry on seeing it. And then I saw, when they pulled her out, they quickly showed me her and she had these beautiful big eyes and she didn't cry or nothing, nothing at all. She just had these big, big eyes. And I was like you've just caused me a lot of trouble here, you're not even crying, you know.

Ruby: 34:21

And then they took us straight away to the icu, the special care units, and I didn't, couldn't even bond with her, I couldn't even hold her and nothing and that was traumatizing again for me, because I was got, I just gave birth.

Ruby: 34:30

Where's this baby gone? You know, just taken away from me and um, yeah, so she was in special care unit for three months. So I was a mom on the ward. Yeah, I was a mom on the ward for the first two weeks, like just healing from the actual operation. I was breast, I was um, pumping milk, um to go and feed her in the special care unit in a bottle. I wasn't allowed to like let her latch on or anything.

Ruby: 34:56

Because they started to investigate then why and how I was sick and I couldn't quite understand why are they talking about something that happened in Bangladesh? And I remember they're like there was like 10 doctors, nurses, that just flooded around me as I was on my bed and they were like did you ever get sick? Did you ever do this? Did you ever do that? Blah, blah, blah, blah blah. And I was like yeah, yeah, yeah and yeah. And they were like did you ever get sick? Did you ever do this? Did you ever do that? Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And I was like yeah, yeah, yeah and yeah.

Ruby: 35:20

And they were like okay, so they started to investigate what actually went on was went on and on the medical perspective about my daughter, because that's when we found out my daughter's got special needs.

Ruby: 35:32

Back then they used the word handicapped oh she's, she's handicapped, we don't know what's wrong with her. And I was going well, what you mean? You don't know. You're the professionals. And that was another trauma for me because I was like I visualized all these good things, all these happiness stuff, and now that's been taken away from me. It's like I'm not allowed to be happy at all. Every little speck of happiness was just taken away from me and it wasn't fair. I found it really unfair. I thought life was just being horrible to me and, um, I couldn't bond with my child. I know that's such a big thing for a mother to say about their child. I couldn't bond with her because I became so isolated again in myself. I distanced myself from everything, even from my child. I was like I can't cope. I was a child.

Jennica: 36:24

That's the thing you know. The reality is that you were also a child at this point, and not only had you gone through something so traumatic with a husband and then moved back home, but now you have a child, and from a very traumatic situation, but also this child has certain things that you're unaware of, you're not able to bond with, and then you're being told things by a doctor and you have no control over any of it. Did they ever try to investigate what actually happened to cause you to get pregnant at such a young age?

Ruby: 36:54

They did not investigate why. I don't think, I don't even think they knew I was married anyway, I think they just thought I was pregnant and that's it.

Jennica: 37:04

Right Because.

Ruby: 37:04

I was in England. It wasn't even recognized as a marriage here anyway. Right. Because it was underage. Because when I did decide to keep my baby, I did write a letter to the high commissioner keep my baby. I did write a letter to the high commissioner in Bangladesh, in Dhaka, which is the capital. I don't know how I got the brains to do that at 50, 60. I wrote a letter and I gave the husband's name, address, birth, everything and I remember this so clearly. I wrote in capital he's a horrible man.

Ruby: 37:38

I don't want him to ever come to the UK. He had sex with me forcefully, this, that and the other. I remember saying that, writing that in that letter, and I did get a response. Well, you did, I did. Yeah, I got a response and they said thank you for letting us know. So I was like wow, but I had to hide that letter.

Ruby: 37:56

Obviously I was waiting for a response and I used to get quite early anyway and I would run downstairs as soon as the post comes. And I remember I got it and I quickly hid it and I did get a response from them. But uh, yeah, when going back to the, when the doctors were investigating, they never questioned that part because they they didn't know I was married.

Ruby: 38:15

The only question the parts were can you remember where, a time when you were sick, and this and the other was there anybody around you that was sick and I was like, yeah, well, actually the baby's father was very sick, like a week before I got sick, and they put it down to like old wives tales, the woman's pregnant, so the male feels the pregnancy as well that's what they were saying. They were saying like, oh, it's all wives tales and stuff like that. So when the husband feels the woman's pregnancy, he gets sick as well.

Ruby: 38:50

And I was like, oh, whatever and then he was sick and I was going what all these little things they did pinpoint? Yeah, that is what happened. And then they obviously tested my baby and so many like scans, hearing tests, like full, like MOT, you know, for a human being, and then they found out that she had obviously I had contracted cnv from him clitomelagovirus. So clitomelagovirus is a very common virus. Um, everybody does get it at some point, um.

Ruby: 39:29

So I could get it as a cold, you could get it as a cough but, if the mother contracts it while she's conceiving and it destroys the embryo, basically the development of the embryo. So it can cause hearing loss, it can cause slow development in the brain, Physically the baby. There could be abnormalities, you can lose the baby. But the baby's life could be absolutely gone.

Ruby: 39:52

And all sorts of things like that, and that's what they said. They said I contracted that and I'm like well, what is that? Like they only gave me a leaflet, this leaflet which had just one page of like writing on it, and that was it, and I did not know anything else to it. Um, and I was like well, what do I do?

Jennica: 40:11

yeah, what? What does this, even you know, entail? What am I supposed to do from this point on?

Ruby: 40:16

and because I because I had to leave my baby in hospital anyway because she needed to like, grow, she needed to grow good weight before she came home um, it's like I just went into my own world. You know, I came home finally and then I felt like, well, my baby's not here. Usually, when you come home with a baby, everyone's celebrating there's balloons around, there's cards around, there's balloons around, there's cards around, there's flowers around. I had nothing and I felt like nothing was celebrated because she's a handicapped child.

Ruby: 40:45

That's how I felt Like they blamed me as well. You know his side of the family blamed me Like I did something to the child. Oh, when you took the pills and tried to commit suicide and kill yourself, you destroyed the pills and tried to commit suicide and kill yourself. You destroyed the baby and I was like no, I didn't.

Ruby: 41:01

I didn't destroy the baby. The doctors have said what it was. They investigated everything New stuff about me that only I would know and I've seen and witnessed in Bangladesh. But they did it through such a medical way of right. Well, and plus they've got the test results and everything that is CMV. So they did advise me that I shouldn't get have any more babies because it can pass on to the next one as well, because it can stay in your system for a long time, so all sorts of things.

Ruby: 41:30

And I was going. Well, where am I? Am I diseased? Where am I? You know, I couldn't understand it, really couldn't understand it. But finally my baby came home then and I started to like kind of bond with her. But I started to hear little whispers around the house that they wanted me to move to a different city, to a city where the husband's uncle lives it's a place called Bedford and I was thinking, no, where am I going to be cook, a cleaner, a slave, and live in someone else's house? I'm not doing that. I had too much of a personality to go down that route, even before the marriage happened.

Ruby: 42:08

Even before, you know, my personality could develop even more because I was a rebel. I was always like Ruby's going to do whatever she wants to do. You know, I had such a strong personality within my siblings growing up. I wouldn't take crap from anybody, I'm just like right okay, and I think I learned that because I had so many brothers and sisters yeah, you have to stand up for yourself and you know, I thought to myself no, I'm not, I'm not moving to anywhere, I'm not going anywhere do you reckon that they were?

Jennica: 42:37

they were considering moving you there because probably the the uncle was there, but also were they worried that you were gonna reconnect with your secret boyfriend I think that was a possibility.

Ruby: 42:48

Yeah, because he. He only lived a street away from me and I think they knew that I did meet up with him a couple of times. We we were best friends when we were kids and that's how I knew him. I still talk to him now, do you know? I mean, it's like it's. Why did they still see that as a threat?

Jennica: 43:05

because I was a married woman now and that would be it, that would be, that would be really yeah volcano or on a rocket.

Ruby: 43:14

Tie me up to a rocket and shoot two stars, that's how much shame I would have brought on. Yeah. So I think they did have that insight. Yeah, but I actually developed a relationship with somebody else through the phone because my younger brother was working in a restaurant and I used to ask him to bring food, you know, back with him, like takeout, and I sparked up a relationship with this person because he had a different accent and I eloped with him actually, wow, that's crazy. Okay, hold on, we need to go back to this.

Jennica: 43:47

So, before we get to that part, you, your daughter's, come back home and you're slowly starting to kind of bond with her and connect, and all this while you're building a relationship with this other, this other guy I'm guessing at this point being even more secret than you'd ever been before like really careful making sure, because I saw I was desperate and I needed a way out right, that makes sense, especially like it wasn't yeah, well, it really wasn't about love.

Ruby: 44:15

It was like he can get me out of here.

Jennica: 44:17

Right.

Ruby: 44:21

Because all those whispers were happening for me to move and I was just like. You know, that's what I'm going to do, that's my plan.

Ruby: 44:26

And then I did elope and then my family tracked me down. It was because, you know, the community is so tight-knit. Yeah, they're like FBI agents that's the best way that I can describe it. If they want to find out where you are, they'll just tell you about the family name and that's it. And everyone has little clusters of fbi agents in every community and that's how they find you. Honestly, it's scary. And when they tracked me down, they brought me back home and they said, right, where's your passport? Because my cousin, she was going to Bangladesh. And they said well, you want to be with this new guy? Okay, then you're going to go to Bangladesh, you're going to get a quick divorce, come back and then you can do whatever you want. But I was too clever for that. I was like it's a one-way ticket, I'm never coming back.

Ruby: 45:14

And then I ran away again.

Ruby: 45:16

And you're taking your daughter with you the second time yeah, okay, I took my daughter the first time and then the second time I saw one of my friends across the road. We lived in a busy main road and there were shops and everything there. And I saw my friend and I thought she can help me because her family well connected in the community. She was welsh, obviously not the same race as me, and um, I was got her family can help in the community. She was welsh, obviously not same race as me, and um, I was got her family can help me. And I ran across the road and I said you gotta help me, gotta help me. So that's when I got the police involved.

Ruby: 45:47

That's when the police didn't come that day. They thought I was having a tantrum because I'm a young girl. They came the next day to my father's house and then my friend took me with her parents to my mother and father's house. The place didn't know what to do. They were like we don't know how to deal with this situation. I was like I just want my baby and I just want to go. And this is where I'm going, because I already had his address.

Ruby: 46:13

You know the one that I eloped with I said I want to go there and, um, I don't know how call it the universe he had a bad inkling. Something happened to me, so he got in touch with the police and found out what's happening just out of the blue because I didn't have his phone number.

Ruby: 46:31

I left it in the house and, um, that's when everything's just started syncing up and my father was trying his best to get rid of the place. He was like saying she's just having a tantrum, she doesn't know what she wants. And I was no, I do know what I want. I want to get out of this hellhole. Um, yeah, it was very fascinating because it took them six hours to make a decision of what's going to happen with this situation. And then, finally, a lady police officer escorted me into the house. I got my baby. I had one little grocery bag of her clothes. I had no money to my name. I think my friend's parents paid for my train ticket I can't even remember and I left Wales to come to England. But that's when I ended up in a five-year domestic violent relationship with him yeah with this person that I loved with, because I didn't know any better.

Ruby: 47:27

I was disowned by my family. I was young, I had a newborn and I got trapped in that cycle for a very long time, five years, and then a further five years after that.

Ruby: 47:38

There was court cases and everything. I did have a son from him as well, and then I was just trying to get him off my back because it was a groundhog day. The violence was bad and I took him to court. Nothing happened to him, nothing. But the best part was he wasn't allowed in my children's fam in my children's life at all.

Ruby: 47:59

They they barred him from coming in because he wasn't mentally stable. But then, um, you think it would stop there and what? He didn't stop there. I got myself into a lot of dysfunctional relationships because I was dysfunctional, so I was attracting what I am and I was just digging a more deeper hole for myself. And it wasn't until I was like 27. I actually, 10 years after, I thought to myself no, I'm going to stop the cycle, I'm stopping it now I'm done with it.

Ruby: 48:29

I'm done with, like, looking for a person in a to get within a relationship that reminds me of my father. I'm not doing this and it took a lot of strength to do that, and that's when I had to revert to the eight-year-old me to find out what she would have wanted, because I missed out so many years and I just went back into theory theories of counselling and that's what I did, because I then I obviously went back to do my finish my schooling off, I went to university and I did integrative counselling.

Ruby: 49:05

So I started to apply all those theories to myself and heal myself, and that's when I started getting on the ladder then of my mental health, my self-awareness development, everything yeah and then I carried on, um, but it wasn't until 2016. I had another bombshell that my daughter's father had come over here to the UK with a work permit.

Ruby: 49:31

No, and I was like how did he get over here when I wrote that letter to the community commissioner in Dhaka. But his uncle sponsored him to come over, so he had two years here. He saw his daughter once and that's another thing. I allowed it to happen because I thought I don't want nothing to do with you. But my family was like let him see her. He hasn't done nothing to her. And I was like, okay, he can see her. He saw her once when she was seven years old. Never gave her a penny, never gave her any support, nothing.

Ruby: 50:03

His aim was she's a British girl, I'm going to stay here with a work permit. No, I'm going to go, and when my time's up I'm going to go undercover. Because that's what he did. And he couldn't be found for years after. And then they finally found him, detained him in London and then he took me to court. He took me to court saying that he sees his daughter every single weekend and he's got a brilliant bond with her and that's why he's got a right to stay here in the UK. I was like you don't have a bond with your daughter at all because my daughter's got a lot of professionals involved with her for her development and you know her special needs.

Ruby: 50:38

Um, obviously they know who's involved with my family. They know who's involved with shiloh, they know who's around shiloh. You know all these things are documented from the get-go and there's no trace of him.

Ruby: 50:49

And I had to go to court and I was. I was very scared because I was like I don't want to see this person. I never wanted to see him again. Luckily he wasn't there and I was sitting there and there was three people. There was three judges and they were looking over the paperwork for like five minutes. They said Miss Marie and I stood up and they were like um, he's banned from coming here to the UK ever again. He will not be coming back here. We're going to deport him. And I was like like result that's what I wanted.

Ruby: 51:19

That's what I wanted from the beginning, but it came after what, 20 years after? So the universe played, but 20 years after.

Jennica: 51:28

It was almost like another test to be like okay, we're going to put this guy in front of you and see sort of like what's going to happen, almost.

Ruby: 51:38

And I think that's what majority of my life is like. Okay, you've been through this situation, but we're gonna put you in this situation, but how are you gonna look at it differently now? What choices are you gonna make? Yeah and it's always been a learning curve for me always and I think that's that shows my wisdom and my growth towards a lot of trauma stuff, because I did put myself through the grueling tasks of healing my mental health yeah because if I'm not going to do it, who is? Yeah. I mean it's like.

Jennica: 52:09

It's quite a lonely journey, quite a lonely experience, but yet at the same time it can be so fulfilling when you know that you've conquered it sort of on your own right.

Ruby: 52:18

Yeah, I did it for my kids. I honestly they were my driving force. I did it for them because I was like saying to myself no more of this crap, no more. Only I can change the dynamics now. I can change the energy now. So I'm going to change it.

Jennica: 52:35

And.

Ruby: 52:35

I cried so much like looking back on my life and unpicking every single little detail and going through it again and healing through it and then going back to it again. And no matter how many times it took me to go back to those traumatic times, I made sure that I went through it again. Yeah. I had to for my children's sake. Yeah.

Ruby: 52:58

And then that's when I started finding my voice and I fell into like doing some modeling. Because that's when we, the camera phones came out and I it's like you could have like a makeover day where you could feel nice and glamorous and everything. And I my friend bought me one and she was like go and enjoy yourself, and we did. We had amazing time together. And then I built go and enjoy yourself, and we did. We had amazing time together. And then I built my confidence through that and doing more modeling and photo shoots.

Ruby: 53:23

And then pageantry fell in my lap and then that was a platform which I just found my knack of talking and I found that people stop and listen to me and I was going you know, I've got something here, I've got a knack here, I've got I've got an essence to me where I can bring something to the table and people listen. But I never used it like to advance me and everything, anything. Or you know, I remember my one of my pageantry interviews. I said, oh, I've got a big toolbox here, because life's taught me a lot of wrong cards, but I've gone through those cards every single cards of them cards.

Ruby: 53:57

But I've gone through those cards, every single cards of them, and I've worked myself through it and I know if there's anyone out there that needs help. I can just pick up a tool and say, right, come on, let's sit down and let's talk yeah because I know how it feels and I started doing more and more of that and that's when I found my voice, and then I started speaking, getting involved with media charities.

Jennica: 54:21

That's what's led me here today 10 years of talking it's amazing do you feel like talking about your story, and the more you talk about it and share different perspectives of the trauma, do you feel like you also kind of understand it in different ways every time. You talk about it and process it differently and kind of have new revelations?

Ruby: 54:40

every. Yeah, I think I've dissected every single trauma and every single part of my life.

Ruby: 54:48

I looked at it and analyzed it, and from multi perspectives yeah, for sure, I love it yeah because I understand like even to his point of view, I can understand what it would have been for him, like he didn't care. He was like no, I just want to follow that yellow brick road and get to you know uk. And this is the best thing that's ever happened to me, because I can get to a country that's going to be more fulfilling, and I've got a baby now. And blah, blah, blah. No matter how badly he wanted to do it, he did it badly. That was his aim and goal to do that right so I understand that.

Ruby: 55:26

I'm not saying I accept it. I understand it. I understand my father's perspective. I understand how he would have got pressurized from the community to make this decision because I was daddy's girl. I me and my father had an amazing relationship before all that happened so I couldn't quite understand why he was doing it, but then I do now, do you have?

Jennica: 55:50

a relationship with your dad and mom now not with my father, not really.

Ruby: 55:54

He was very sick a couple of months ago Well, good, six months ago now where he needed heart operations. He had like four major heart operations within two weeks. And I did go down and he thought I was my sister at first, because we all look alike, we look like clones and he thought I was my elder sister and I was like no, it's me, ruby. And then he just looked at me and I and you could just tell he's like like this man's on his deathbed now. I didn't even need words, I just kissed him on the forehead and I said right, let's get you fed. And I started feeding him food. I was like, right, eat this now.

Ruby: 56:29

And then, um, I remember he was complaining about something and I was like it's too late for you to complain about things, don't you think you should just let all that stuff go? And I was talking to him like a child, like I was the adult, he was the child and I know he will never, ever admit it. I know he will never come to saying sorry, but I know he lives with it every single day and that's his karma. That's the way I live. It's like I don't need to do nothing.

Ruby: 56:59

Karma will get you karma will do it all for you. I'm very in tuned with the spiritual universe world and I don't need to wish ill upon anyone, not even my daughter's father. I don't.

Jennica: 57:09

You'll get served what you need to yeah, like just trusting that the universe will give it to. Yeah, and you know what?

Ruby: 57:16

it's never failed, me never failed me honestly throughout the years, I'm like, ah, universe, yeah, I'm like thank you, like thank you, do you know? I mean, we know why that's happened yeah so what about your sister?

Jennica: 57:31

did you ever hear back from her at any point?

Ruby: 57:33

yeah she, she, um, connected with the family not long after she, because when I got pregnant she got pregnant as well in similar times and, um, yeah, she connected back with the family because obviously she wanted the grandparents involved with her baby and you know, or etc. And she was a married woman then by then as well. So she wanted all that and she took advantage of it and she did it.

Jennica: 57:57

So she got her family back. Yeah, that's amazing that like that, your dad and mom were able to sort of even find it in the in them to sort of be able to forget and forgive, because it was never my mother, it was always my father and the males in the community.

Ruby: 58:14

My mother is such a warrior. She she's such a kind-hearted woman. She will take a stray off the streets to feed them. My mum is so given. Even though she might not have like, she will give a last penny to the poor.

Jennica: 58:33

That's what she's like.

Ruby: 58:35

And I have gained a majority of attributes and I love that. I love that I can carry on that. You know what I've learned when I went to bangladesh and it's a collective thing as well, because it's not just happened to me it affects everybody in the family, affects my siblings, it affects my friends. It affects everyone. It's I'm the main frontal of it but it does ripple out?

Jennica: 59:01

it really does yeah sure, wow, ruby, that's so powerful and I love how you turned something so hard and so painful into such a power story for yourself that you you eloped to get out of that situation. Yes, you found yourself in another one, but you know what. You found your own within that too as well, and you fought the court cases that you needed to fight and you know, it was kind of like I just kept battling out the way, out, the way.

Ruby: 59:28

I was like no one is stepping over me ever again no one and you know. But I did find myself that I did still carry some toxic behaviors, as you would. You know, no one's squeaky clean Like I did bring that into my thirties and it's like I'm 42 now and I only feel most at peace now than I ever have done before.

Ruby: 59:53

I feel like I only owe myself and my children. I love people and I love them. When they love me back, it's like the energy has to match now. Otherwise I'm not investing in nothing. You know I'm very giving. I will give my time to people. I would always help people out in everything, in anything and everything that they need, but I won't exhaust myself out. I know what my standards are in the fact that if I'm going to get too tired doing this, I'm not going to do it. I've got to be very realistic about things and you know and it's okay to say no, I can't do it. Can we change this? It's okay to do that. You know, I don't feel.

Jennica: 1:00:40

I feel now I'm peace with the universe. I love that. What about in terms of, uh, relationships? Like, do you, are you kind of trusting of men and relationships? You know?

Ruby: 1:00:50

I don't paint men with the same brush. No, I really don't. I've had some crap relationships, but I've also had I've also known why because of the things that I was needing from that relationship as well, and it's a need. It's not I would like or I want right it's like I needed that.

Ruby: 1:01:14

I was needing toxic things because my life was toxic, because that felt familiar to me and, in a way, we become the one thing that we don't want, and that's what I saw. I became the needy person of like my father. I wanted my father so badly back in my life to love me. I looked for him in different men, because my father was my first love was my first love.

Jennica: 1:01:41

Right, and you were also. He was your role model, in a sense. So everything that he was doing to your mom and to to anyone else around you, that was what you were seeking out, without even realizing, maybe deep inside your psyche, that's what you were looking for it's all females first love is their father.

Ruby: 1:01:56

All males when they are born, the mom is their first love. That's what you were looking for. It's all females first love is their father. All males when they are born, the mom is their first love. That's how we learn these things. That's why it's why your father gives you away down the aisle right, he's giving you to someone, to another man that is going to uphold his values the way he loves his daughter and the way that you should love her now as your wife.

Jennica: 1:02:19

Ruby, thank you so much for being on Multispective and sharing your journey, your story, here with us and, yeah, I know, super empowering and I'm sure anyone listening to this as well would have a lot they can take away from your experience.

Ruby: 1:02:32

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

Jennica: 1:02:50

If you enjoyed the episode and would like to help support the show. Thank you for having me. We're human. Also, a thank you to our team who worked so hard behind the scenes to make it happen. Stefan Menzel, Lucas Piri the show would be nothing without you. I'm Jenica, host and writer of the show, and you're listening to Multispective Thank you.