181. Lent - Missing the Mark

This is part 3 of our Lenten series, where we’re walking with Catholic parents through the real struggles of family life during the season of repentance, mercy, and renewal.

Parenting often feels like a daily examination of conscience. We lose our temper. We forget a commitment. We say the wrong thing, again. Many Catholic parents quietly carry guilt and shame after these moments, fearing that repeated missteps mean they are failing their children or falling short of God’s call.

In Missing the Mark, we explore failure, sin, and imperfection through a deeply Catholic lens. Lent reminds us that “missing the mark” is part of the human condition, but it is never the final word. Through humility, repentance, and grace, our failures become invitations to growth rather than sources of despair. If you’ve ever worried about being a “bad parent,” struggled with shame after losing patience, or wondered how holiness is possible in the chaos of family life, this episode is for you.

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome back to another episode of Two Become Family. We are walking with you this Lent. I am wearing a Marvel sweatshirt because I'm 37, but I'm trying to continue to look young forever because that's my goal in life. Absolutely not. It's the opposite, but actually, I don't know. I'm wearing this because it's comfortable today.

SPEAKER_01 0:15

The kids gave it to you for your birthday.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Yes, and you're wearing purple because it's appropriate for what we're doing. Is that why you wore it?

SPEAKER_01 0:20

That is absolutely not why I picked it, but it works.

SPEAKER_00 0:24

It's her colors.

SPEAKER_01 0:25

I haven't done that either.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

I don't know if that's your color. But we should definitely do that. I want to see, is this my color? Gray and white pattern, graphic novel pattern. Is that my couple color? Alright, so we are in episode three of our Lenten series that we have not named, and I'm probably not going to name it when this goes out. Um, because I I'm you know, I know we have to do the social media, I'm playing with my T here, the social media uh podcast game, but I really don't want to like it's amazing how social media just blew up in the last like couple days of like, this is what you could do for Lent. Come be with me, Lent. Listen, if you don't want to be here for Lent, totally okay. It's okay, it's okay. You don't have to be here for Lent.

SPEAKER_01 1:01

I'm not gonna try to convince you.

SPEAKER_00 1:02

No, it but like in more in our minds, like we'll provide you with something that we think would be cool, uh, but if it's not your thing, like I'm not, I don't know. It's okay.

SPEAKER_01 1:11

You can fast from this if that's what you're fasting from.

SPEAKER_00 1:13

Listen to a podcast, that's totally fine. We totally actually recommend that. More silence, very good. But if your house isn't silent because you have so many kids and you just want to find a way to be able to navigate parenthood and not hate yourself at the end of the night every night, that's what we've been doing this um podcast, uh, this last series, not hating ourselves, but trying to work on reframing everything so that we hate ourselves a little bit less and allow God's mercy to work a little bit more in our lives. So today we're gonna go over today's episode is about what we do when we miss the mark. So we talked about in the first episode about humility, last episode was about uh magnimity. And now when we try to change our aim and we still stink and we miss the mark, what do we do? Do we just do we just give up? Are we is this our New Year's resolution where we're like, I'm gonna be a better parent, and two weeks later we're like, well, that was good A for effort. I'm just gonna be the C in my follow-through.

SPEAKER_01 2:02

We just want to talk about some maybe common ways that like you've made some good positive changes in your parenthood. Maybe you've had some strategic moves, you've implemented some new, you know, new hacks, new routines, or what have you. You've been praying more, you've been offering up more, you've been doing all the things that you're gonna do.

SPEAKER_00 2:21

You did all the things we said last episode.

SPEAKER_01 2:23

You think you've been doing all the things that you think, and then yet you're still blankety blank. We kind of wanted to give some um solidarity, some encouragement of like when you try to set everything up for success, and yet you still uh you still miss the mark. You're not alone, we're still missing the mark, but we just want to offer some encouragement and maybe some some more ideas. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 2:44

So before we go into the five things, I just remember this. Um, I'm gonna try to explain something and then Monica's gonna fix it. Uh so we talked about this, I think, in the first episode, the difference between guilt and shame. Um, this is we pulled this directly from Brene Brown um in her book, Daring Greatly. She's got a great lecture on YouTube on shame and the power that shame has. Um, and when it boils down to it, so you know when you're experiencing shame, when you do a thing that you wish you didn't do. So, for example, say you lose your patience with your kid, instead of saying to yourself, I am gonna do better next time, I'm gonna apologize and do better next time, um, that would be the guilt response. Instead of feeling that way, you feel like I'm such a bad parent, I can never follow through, I'm always yelling at my kids, I'm just a yeller, right? You start identifying with the behavior you wish you didn't do. So you start kind of changing your identity. Uh, that is shame.

SPEAKER_01 3:34

Really, the the core difference between guilt and shame, just as a reminder, is that the guilt is focused on the behavior and the ability to like move past a certain situation and go to the next one, and that one doesn't carry over and influence the next. Whereas shame is more based on identity. So your behaviors become your identity, and then you are trapped in that identity. You cannot change that identity. And so we really want to make sure that as we're thinking about and talking about our parenting, that our shortcomings are missing the mark in our parenthood, is really focused on our behaviors and not our identity as a parent, and that you always have the next moment, you always have the next opportunity. And and you would want that for your kids too, like right. You think about your kids and you want to be careful not to label their behaviors as their identity because you don't want them to live that way too. So we just want to remind you of that in case that's a a cycle that you're trapped in, that um it's possible to come out of that. Like you don't have to be trapped in that, but you feel that way. So with that in mind, so with that in mind, the first um piece of parenthood where we might miss the mark that we want to talk about is losing your patience or reacting poorly to our children's behaviors or tones or language or I don't know, whatever the heck they might be doing. So that might be with anger and yelling and slamming doors, or I don't know, then I can list a lot of things that I do when I get short-tempered.

SPEAKER_00 5:03

So, and then uh so and this is a very common experience, I think, for a lot of parents. So what advice would you give if that's well, this is the advice I would give.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

If you feel you should never feel hot when I do feel I feel I like I'm feeling my face turn red.

SPEAKER_00 5:18

No, I feel hot. I don't I get I get mad and I yell, and I do I have in the past reacted in ways I wish I didn't and then done that again. Um I so two things. I think you'll give better examples of what to do so that doesn't happen. But I found it very easy to apologize and then work on doing better the next time. Which sounds super easy. However, there are some people who have a hard time apologizing and feel like they should never have been in that situation in the per first place. Like I should never have had to yell. So therefore, I'm gonna give you, child, all the reasons why this is actually your fault and you did all these things to me.

SPEAKER_02 5:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:57

Therefore, I had to yell because you are in full control of your faculties and I am not, even though I'm an adult. So like there's there's a lot of that can happen. So we we can run the risk of rationalizing, and I think it takes a lot of humility, uh, episode one, to not rationalize about the things that we're doing. So, like when when this happens and you've lost your patience again, which you're going to, um, I think being honest about the what is it, the antecedent that led to it. So, like be being more being willing to step back and like look back at the whole situation and how could you have handled it better next time. And you can't do that if you feel shame every time you yell. Like you might feel feel good to yell, you might feel like you're back in control or whatever. Um, but then afterwards, you just if you start getting into a shame cycle and be like, I'm such a bad parent, this person's, you know, this child's gonna feel like this forever, I'm I'm doing the same thing my parents did to me. Like you start thinking of all these things, you are not gonna be able to actually grow in patience and build the habit of patience and and build up that virtue because you're not actually viewing yourself correctly. You are viewing yourself through the lens of shame, which just tells you like you're just garbage.

SPEAKER_01 6:59

Yeah. I think for me, one of the big things that has helped me in this area of parenthood is distinguishing between yelling at and yelling to. Um, and I do think that my experience, our experience in coaching has helped a little bit in this to like make it a little bit more clear for us. But like a raised voice doesn't necessarily mean that you are yelling at your kid. You might be yelling to your kid. So there are certainly times where your children are so hyper focused on whatever they are doing or they are in because of their brain development, they they are locked in. And a raised voice is such a stark change from what they're doing or how they're behaving or how they're thinking that it snaps them out of it. So yelling to someone, like yelling to an athlete to hustle or to move or to, you know, to get to get over in a different place, like you can do that with your kids. Stop, no, you know, like when they're in certain situations of danger, or even when they're being unkind and they need to quit talking to their sibling like that or what have you. You can yell to them to really emphasize that this is important right now, versus yelling at, where we're typically we we pull them aside, we've got their attention, and we're still at a raised voice and we're still hammering into them why they did what they did and why that's wrong and why they shouldn't do that. And that made me feel this way, or right. So it's like it's not the raised voice itself, but it's the the wholeness of it. So I think sometimes people lump that together and they just feel like I should always use a calm voice with my children no matter what. And it's like, no, you should use a you can use a calm voice and and good eye contact and and like like hold them, hug them, like when you're going through the the why they needed to stop what they were doing or the or the redirection, you could do that in the teaching part. But sometimes you do need to raise your voice to like call out the whatever is happening. Um, so I think that was really important for me. Um a couple other things was to um to try to just be a little bit more aware of the things that led to the thing that I started yelling about um and noticing my kids' uh tendencies, their habits, their kind of little that twinkle in their eye before you know they're about to do something that they shouldn't do. Or, you know, if if if they've been left alone too long, or if they if they're trying to craft if if they're if they're bored and distract easily distracted, what have you, but like knowing your kids a little bit and helping to prevent the situations?

SPEAKER_00 9:38

I'm very good at this because I was raised, my father was national police in my country of origin, and he was very good at noticing if there was terrorist threats around, if there was any potential violence and machine guns. I'm being completely serious right now. No, I'm being completely serious. But like he went so serious all of a sudden. He was very he was very good at then. So Renzo knows that potential. He was very good at bestowing the like, you need to be ready and aware of everything and situational awareness. So therefore, I've transferred that knowledge to like I can tell, oh, and I'll say, like, and people have noticed when when we do that, like I'll say a kid's name, like, don't do that. How did you know they were gonna do something? I was like, Oh, I just know. Yeah, I just I feel it. And I tell the kids I have dad powers completely now. I just was traumatized as a three-year-old told how to fight people with machine guns. It's fine.

SPEAKER_01 10:23

Yeah, no, I just think like use you use your knowledge of your kids to your advantage so that like you can you can cut off certain things before they happen. Um, I love what you said though. Like, there's still gonna be times where you you you yell at instead of yell to, or it started as a yell to and then you started yelling at and you apologize for it, and you're like, I I then overreacted. I was trying to keep you safe, but then I just kept going because I was really angry.

SPEAKER_00 10:47

Monica also does a great job of I think this is like the in-between. So, like you talked about like how to address beforehand, so like before you see the thing, yeah, get used to that. Um, how to address after, like apologize, whatever, but also right before you do the thing. Um, Monica's done a great job in you don't know what I'm gonna say. I'm nervous, but you got like today, like taking deep breaths and not addressing it while she's upset. Yes, you've done a really good job of that. Yeah, I can still tell because like it sounds like Harry from Home Alone muttering to herself, like I'm like, it's all right, it'll come out at a little bit.

SPEAKER_01 11:22

It's like when all of the mess is overwhelming me, and I just want to rage clean, but I don't want to rage clean. I want everyone to rage clean with me. And I just like mutter to myself like a psychopath, and I'm like, it's all right.

SPEAKER_00 11:35

But then eventually is here in the and then you come very kindly to them, like so-and-so, can you please clean up this? Yeah, and then it's it it that's just again, you're not like the emotions aren't gonna go away, but like you're not controlled by them. Like, there's a freedom in like, all right, this is how I'm gonna handle it.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

Yeah, I we have one kid who's particularly sensitive to loud voices uh in his direction. He does not like to get yelled at. And so just the threat of mommy is using her words right now, and the next time I have to say something about this, I will be yelling. And and that makes him stop sometimes because I'm like, I'm I'm using my that's a lot of times why you yell. Like, I've used my words seven times. I wanted to say six or seven, but I'm not oh you're saying it you did it anyway. Saying it, and then you yell. So for him in particular, I'm like, the next one it's gonna be the yell. Are you ready? And then he'll stop.

SPEAKER_00 12:30

And then again, these are all ways to hopefully build habits so that we don't like we're still growing this in ourselves. Oh, sure.

SPEAKER_01 12:37

All right, next one is feeling guilt or shame over our children's behavior or temperament because we feel responsible for their struggles or we feel responsible for how they are.

SPEAKER_00 12:49

And I think, well, I think that's important to differentiate. I know it's like together there, but like behaviors we don't, I don't think we necessarily mean like a thing they did wrong that they know is wrong and that we told them not to, like, not like defiance, but more of like my the way my child is, they do these things. And like I, you know, feeling that like I must be a bad parent because they do it, they do things like this. Um, I think that again, this is a common struggle for parents, but they are their own person and learning to like parent them well within what their struggles are, I think is important versus like making it about because you just made it about you and not about your kid. Like, oh, I wish they were better at reading. Like, we have one of our kids who Monica is has taught to read, and he can read now, but he did not know the names of the letters, he didn't know what they were called.

SPEAKER_01 13:31

Yeah, but he knew the sounds, he knew all the sounds of the letters, but you would say, like, write the letter um L and he's like, What's L? And I'd be like, write ul. And he would then write an L. But he didn't know L was.

SPEAKER_00 13:45

Yes, and and I if we took all of those little quirks that all the kids have and made it seem like, oh, it's because we're such bad parents, I think we would never feel peace in parenting at all. Because like there's just so many things, like that's just a small one. Like they have so many other things they do. A lot of them they get from us because of like I did not realize some of the things that like are just uh genetic. Like they just do the same things that we do, and it's like, oh, this is just the way I am.

SPEAKER_01 14:09

Yeah, that nature versus nurture, and you felt like there's a lot more nurture to it.

SPEAKER_00 14:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_01 14:14

And then you're just like, how or I mean, and it also could be the nurture, and they just are really seeing the stuff, they're not listening to you, they're seeing the stuff that you do. They watch better than they hear. Um, but I think I think you've mentioned it before, but the difference between like engineering our kids versus shepherding our kids too, and that like we can't we can't mastermind the perfect kid and and have all the right thing. Like, we you could be the perfect parent and your kid would still be their own person. So then again, like it's this idea of like guilt versus shame, and that like if your kids being the way that they are is a reflection of your identity as a parent, you are living in shame. You are not living in guilt, and you're not that's that's not productive, and that's not, it's not even for their their well-being and the well-being of your relationship, because it's important to also just like learn to love our kids for who they are and how they are.

SPEAKER_00 15:10

Pope Francis has had a really good reflection about that in Patrice Corday when he wrote about Saint Joseph. Um, he talked about how like he took he took Saint Joseph's chastity in a different direction than when people usually take it. And he talked about how he lived a he lived as a father and didn't uh live out his fatherhood in possession. So like he didn't see Jesus as somebody he possessed, like somebody who needed to do things for him in the way he wanted, but more lived it out in chastity and like the freedom of like I'm gonna father him, but he's gonna be his own person. And clearly like the Jesus is gonna be his own person. Um, but I thought that was a very like instead of saying like, and then he pointed out like fathers can't live vicariously through their kids. And I think sometimes we try to live through our kids in a way of trying to shepherd them or trying to engineer them to live to have certain attributes and do things in a certain way that like we would hope we were like when we were little. So therefore, like easy examples, like so they end up being popular in high school, right? Oh, like, oh, maybe they'll be really good at all these things so they were they could have a great time in high school because I didn't, for example. And I think all of those things are in a way us possessing our kids and feeling like they're our property when they're not, like they're their own person that we are we've been given to steward and and yeah and um kind of guide for their own good, but they're not ours at all. Yeah, so they should not I they should not hold our identity in their behavior either, because again, they're not us, they're not ours. Um, they are our children.

SPEAKER_01 16:29

No, and I think often we can, yeah, this this like even this projected identity of like what I wish I was, I want my kid to be who I wish I was. And so I'm gonna try to like correct all of my failures through him and like instead of myself. Right. And then I think that sometimes for me, there are certain things in my children that I just like I want to purge out of them because I'm like, you can't have this as an adult. Like you can't function this way as an adult. And I have to remind myself that like they are not an adult, they are a child. So this is a process. So like I kind of just I just want to like squeeze it out of them so that they don't have it anymore. I I'm thinking of like tantrums at the worst times, and you're just like, you can't be this irrational and like disregulated right now. Like you can, you just have to suck it up and hold on to it until later and then be upset about it. Then this goes after number one where we're having our own temper tantrums and yelling at our kids, right? But like you just won't want, you don't want that for them. It's it because it kind of it kind of comes from a good place. Like, I don't want that for you later in life. So I want to get rid of it now. And and it's really like the process of learning how to regulate. And it's the teaching through the tantrum, not the like get rid of the tantrum altogether, but like, how do you process your feelings? How do you process your environment, your surroundings, what things can you do to help you not feel overwhelmed? And and and this is this is why like healing work and not having your own things be your identity is so important so that you can help bring healing to your children and helping growth to your children. So if there are things in you that could require that could use some healing, like to lean into that so that you can then be a part of that healing for your children.

SPEAKER_00 18:17

Things that are not healed are transmitted, transmitted.

SPEAKER_01 18:20

Yeah. Sister Miriam, I think.

SPEAKER_00 18:23

Yes, number three.

SPEAKER_01 18:24

All right. Another is fear that struggles with faith or doubt hurt their children. So as a parent, you have your own struggles. Okay, so our own wounds. Maybe I was leading into number three by accident. Um, or even like doubts of our fa in our faith, um, not knowing enough about our faith, and we're afraid to damage our children because of the way that we are, um, and bring that to them.

SPEAKER_00 18:46

Yeah, and I think the temptation there becomes to put on a face and put on a front and just go through the motions so that we live what we think a good Catholic life would look like instead of actually trying to get there ourselves, whether it be through our doubts and fears or whatever anything else. Um, and again, I think our kids do best when we are authentically human and they see us go through the process of a thing. Um, because I think they it doesn't mean you have to tell them about your struggles, but more of just um if you live it out honestly with yourself, I think that makes I think they can sense that you are living out a thing honestly through yourself and not just trying to do it all on I don't know, not and not trying to like fake it, because I think kids can tell if things are real or not.

SPEAKER_01 19:28

Sure. Yeah, and they might not ever be able to articulate that, right? But they can they can tell when this is not steady ground, that this is like a facade and and that can that can actually be more damaging than just like being a human for them and like because that that's part of the gospel, like to actually show them the human side of the gospel of like this is why Jesus needed to come because of me, you know, instead of being the perfect parent now, we are being perfected through our parenting. Like instead of being the perfect spouse now, we are being perfected through marriage. And so to like expose that a little bit to our children that this is the perfecting process happening here, and we're doing this together as a family, and we're kind of inviting each other into all of it, um, I think is really important for them so that it can lead them to faith instead of hurting their faith.

SPEAKER_00 20:20

Yeah, I know the question, I know this is specifically about faith, but I know for us and for me, um, one of our kids struggles with anxiety, and I think they had a good box to put it in because of the different conversations we had around anxiety. And I know like today I was able to say, um, can you turn this thing off that they were using? Because I said, like this noise plus all the noise that now we're trying to give directions to everybody and everyone's asking us questions is is very overstimulating for me. And I get anxious and I can get really frustrated with it, and I can end up being unhappy and yelling because it's just a lot right now. And it's not because there's something wrong with me, but like, that's just the way I I interpret the environment. And I, you know, they were very good about like, okay, I I know, I know what that's like, and I'm gonna help you in it. Um, and I think that that's I think being able to be share enough of like what's going on in our lives, not in a in a way that's age appropriate, but not in a way that's like, I need you to fix this for me, but what more of like this is what I'm going through. Um, so that then if they struggle in the same way, they will feel like, oh, our my parents understand, so therefore I can go to them with it too.

SPEAKER_01 21:18

Yes. That it's like it is a shared experience that we have. I can understand when you bring this to me because I've given you glimpses into times where I've understood in a deep way. Um yeah, so I think I think that's really important. Number four, comparing ourselves to idealized forms of Catholic parenting.

SPEAKER_00 21:39

We talked about this in the last one too. But we can miss the mark even though we heard it. We might still do it because we will see Instagram or see just a ton of things, especially during Lent. You see like so many people doing so many things during Lent, and you may be like, We're only listening to this podcast is all we're doing for Lent.

SPEAKER_01 21:54

Um Saints Alive, Miracle Hunters.

SPEAKER_00 21:56

Yes, go to Saints Alive, Miracle Hunters, they are great, doing so many great things.

SPEAKER_01 22:00

You need to do.

SPEAKER_00 22:01

But like that's it, just I think the comparison trap is there all the time. Um, and then no, even like your kids might be crazy at mass, and you see other people's kids and you're like, why are they great at mass? Or like, why can they I don't know, receive the sacraments well? Like, why are my parents, why are my kids never brushing their hair? Like, whatever. And I just think that that's very unhealthy. Yeah. Trying not to get there.

SPEAKER_01 22:20

I think that we really live in a like highlight real time, and whether or not you're like on social media often, but even just the like only see this family at mass. I only see this family in these certain circumstances, and we're not seeing the wholeness of their life. And then my my other like really big point of this is like your family is not supposed to look like anybody else's family. Otherwise, the world is missing out on your family. Like the you, your combination of people was created by God on purpose. Like your dynamic is so necessary for your family, for your parish, for your community, for the world. And so, like, yeah, maybe maybe brushing your hair is not a top priority for you before mass because like your cult, your family culture, your family mission, that that's just like that's not as important as it is for some other people. And that doesn't make you less holy. It just means you're different. And so, like, I think for us to like pick out on the external things and and one, it like limits the deeper rooted parts of that family, but then it's also totally distracting from the deeper parts of your family that like are not supposed to be visibly visible externally.

SPEAKER_00 23:34

Like and I would like it's it's a there's a it's a tight or it's a tight rope, I guess. It's it's a very fine line to walk to like you don't want to also put down other families in your head, be like, well, they like they seem great, but they must struggle with XYZ. Like that's not helpful either, right? Is again it's not about them and it's not about how you compare to them, but more of just if you see a family that's doing great, like just you know, praise God that they're able to do that. And like, I'm not, but like it's just great that they are able to. Um, and so you could find joy in other people's successes, and in the same way people can find join yours instead of making like feeling like the only way you can make yourself better is by tearing other people down, yeah, for sure. Intellectually or physically, yeah. Don't do that, don't touch people. Don't touch people. That's illegal.

SPEAKER_01 24:19

No, yeah. I just think, yeah, the so cheesy, it could probably use over like way too much, but comparison is a thief of joy. So, like, just just be happy for them being happy in that moment or whatever that you're seeing them, and like praise God that your family is who they are, and ask for the grace to like live that to the fullest. All right, and then lastly, we worry over children not fully embracing their faith as adults. So we have these little ones and we are thinking about their future, and we are yes.

SPEAKER_00 24:51

The best thing you can do, this is again from our youth ministry experience, the best thing you could do to make sure that your kids are still Catholic in college is go to mass every Sunday as a family. And those are the kids that we've seen are able to remain Catholic in college. If you have like, if you're able to surround them with like good mentors in the Catholic faith as they go through high school, I think that's a it's even better. Um, if you're able to connect in with mentors in college, like the focus missionaries or good Catholic Center, I think that's super important as well. Um, but the kids that we've seen that are still able to go to Mass after they left the house are the usually the ones whose parents just kept going to Mass every Sunday. Not saying it's perfect, it's not foolproof. Obviously, you have to do more within the house, and that's what the whole London series is about, but I do think that that's one of the main things.

SPEAKER_01 25:33

Yeah. Another one that I think that we've seen when uh Catholic hoods staying Catholic in college is like you said, having good Catholic mentors in their life. And that could be youth ministers, that could be a coach, that could be um the one thing. One place I've really seen that go well too is other Catholic families just being friends with one another too, so that they have like this other example of Catholic family life. They weren't the only ones. They have those parents as people they can maybe talk to and turn to. I think of like the the little group of fellas that like if they go to mass on their own as a young adult, they'll sit with this other set of parents because they just know like they just know them. And I think that they may or may not have deep theological conversations, but they just know that there's other adults that are that love them.

SPEAKER_00 26:23

I think what's important too is that in in terms of I'm thinking about within the home, if you want your kids to stay Catholic in or just to stay within their faith um for the rest of their lives, I think don't like be careful how you use your faith to parent. Um, because if you end up making like their if you end up like conflating the two of like you made a mistake and like, oh now God is gonna be angry with you, like instead of like you try using God as a I don't like like a as a if you try using God as like a rod to correct your kids with every time they make a mistake, they're going to then associate God with somebody who's always looking to correct them, always looking to see something's wrong. Um, and you're gonna put up a lot of barriers between them and God where you and your parenting should be a reflection of God's love to them. So like you working on yourself, everything that's great. Um, but if you start using God as like the correction tool for or like contextualizing everything they do within the faith and over-spiritualizing everything and be spiritually bypassing everything, if their entire existence seems to always be looked at a lens from are you making a spiritual mistake? Are you under spiritual attack? Are you like all of the things that we that that we that are true? If you misuse those things, then you are gonna set them up to being like, I need freedom from this because this is overwhelming. Rather than letting God be who he is and our family being founded on his love and we mirror reconciliation because he, you know, all those things like we can we can forgive each other well, we can treat each other well because God loves us without having to actually mention the reality that like it's because of God. Because I think if you do it too often, it could be overwhelming for kids, and then they'd be like, I need a break from this. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:54

So an example of that might be like a a bad situation happens with a kid, they make a big mistake, they know they made a big mistake, and then you're like in that moment, like in the corrective environment, you're like, and now you have to go to confession for this kind of thing.

SPEAKER_00 28:08

Correct. I don't think we've ever told our kids they have to go to confession after they've clearly done things that they knew were wrong and did them anyway. And clearly confession for that is not my yeah, at least maybe we're wrong for this. Again, we're we're parenting, we're trying this ourselves.

SPEAKER_02 28:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

But I don't think it's our job to do that. Like they have a form conscious conscience, which that is our job. Yes, to form their conscience. But like it's up to them to go.

SPEAKER_01 28:27

And I think it's okay to like at another time, like when we're preparing to go to confession, or you bring it up like, hey, do you like you know, we're we're we're available right now, confessions are available, or what have you. Like, do you need to go? Because you're their ride. You, you know, do you do you need help going through an examination of conscience? Like, but in the moment of conflict is not the time to like bring up the sacrament, I think is really my my point with that.

SPEAKER_00 28:51

Yeah, but I I agree with completely with that. And I also think, but I don't, I don't think, and this is again, we're experimenting with this too, because like we have three kids that go to confession um and they're that age, but I also don't think it's the time to like I don't ever think it's time to us for us to tell them that they need to go to confession for the thing they did to us. Yes, right? Like, so like because it can end up. So I remind them of like, hey, do you know like you you you you ate this thing, you ate these candies, and then put the wrappers in the toilet and pretended to my face you did. I didn't know we didn't do that. No, but like I've I found comfort in that like at least they they know they have to reconcile with us, and then when their opportunity to confessions come, yeah, they know they have to go reconcile with God. And also, we have said in the past though, hey guys, uh make sure you're not receiving unless you've gone unless if you've committed a mortal sin, make sure you don't receive unless you go to confession. And then just leaving it up to them to like to decide if they don't know they actually have come and asked, like, was this a mortal sin? And I think it's healthier to build that bond so they can come ask us and they'll know that we won't be mad or judge them.

SPEAKER_01 29:50

Yep. Um much more open-ended because that's I mean, that is the point of them waiting until a certain age. They are now reasonable, they have the ability to like discern and evaluate their behaviors, and you can certainly continue to guide them through that and be there for them for that, but you are not their conscience yourself. Like you are not the one that's supposed to tell them that. Um, and like again, later on, you could be like, you can even just use examples in other like in movies and things like that of like that was that was kind of wrong because it, you know, it wasn't totally honest. And you can kind of just like continue to form them, but yeah, you are not their conscience, and you're not the one that's supposed to tell them. And and that can be a little intimidating, but that's that is that's it. They they they are the reasonable ones now, right?

SPEAKER_00 30:34

Well, because if you're preparing them to keep the faith after they're out of your house, you can't, at least in my mind, you can't be their conscience for them until they leave. Like they have to start building that now so that when they leave, they are able to have a properly formed conscience to be able to navigate the world.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

Yeah. So these are pretty common things that parents might be afraid of missing the mark, or they know very well that they're missing the mark in these areas. And um, you again, solidarity, we you're not alone. But these are some of the ways that we've encountered them in our own home, are addressing them in our own home, and have seen it through uh years of youth ministry and now seeing young adults and teenagers who have walked through faith in in this on that other end of parenthood.

SPEAKER_00 31:15

But even with humility, magnanimity, and the ability to reframe and not live in shame and when we miss the mark, there are still gonna be things that we go through that we still need help for. And that's what we're gonna be covering in the next episode how to ask for help and who to get help from. Um, but for now, leave us a like, comment, or subscribe. Give us five stars on Apple and Spotify. And we are gonna keep praying for you this lent, keep praying for us, and we'll see you at the next episode.