Women & Money: The Shit We Don't Talk About!
Women & Money: The Shit We Don't Talk About!
The Sh*t We’ve Learned as a Mother-Daughter Duo with Barb and Maggie
What’s it really like behind the scenes to build a business with your mom or your daughter? And how do the money stories we grew up with shape the way we lead, spend, and show up today?
In this special Mother’s Day episode of Women and Money: The Shit We Don’t Talk About, it’s just us- Barb and Maggie! We’re the mother-daughter duo behind Purse Strings, and today we’re opening up in a more personal way. No guest, no script, just an honest conversation between the two of us about what it’s like to build a business together, what we’ve learned (and unlearned) about money in the process, and the moments that have challenged and shaped us along the way.
We kick things off with some real talk about the money beliefs passed down through generations, how those beliefs influenced us, and whether we’ve kept them, or pushed back. We also dive into the origin story of Purse Strings: how we started it, why we built it together, and what it’s like to work side by side as family (including the times we didn’t exactly see eye to eye).
🎧 Listen to the full episode to hear how our experiences shaped Purse Strings, the shifts that helped us grow, and the small but powerful steps you can take to claim your own financial voice.
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Maggie: [00:00:00] Us working together as a mother daughter duo, like kind of staying in our lanes or moments we don't see eye to eye. The one thing that we always do that makes us both laugh every time, we both want each of us to always do better in our work.
And so we do have this saying that, it goes, I say this with
Barb: I know, something's coming, but,
Maggie: But, and then it's usually like the nice piece of constructive criticism which is. It went over better before, and now it's just always like, alright,
Barb: All right. What do you want?
Gloria Steinem once said, we will never solve the feminization of power until we solve the masculinity of wealth. Barbara Provost and Maggie Nielsen are the team at purse strings that will help you navigate the ins and outs of financial independence so that you can be financially fearless. This is women in money, the shit we don't talk [00:01:00] about.
Barb: Today is just Barb and Maggie Day, and in this episode we're opening our story about what it's like because so many people ask us what it's like to be a mother-daughter duo running a business. I mean, we get that question all the time and how our own money stories have shaped the work that we do today. so
Maggie, I have a question for you.
Maggie: Hit me.
Barb: What's a money belief. you inherited from MO or the other women in your life and have you kept it or challenged it?
Maggie: A money belief. We didn't talk about money growing up much so like, no offense, but I don't think I learned anything from you on that, like right when I was a kid, until we started doing this work. The one that I guess that's always been, I've been working on just canceling out some of those money sayings that we always have.
Like money doesn't grow on trees, you gotta [00:02:00] work harder to make more. And I'm just like, let's cut all those out. First of all, paper does grow on trees. Let's be realistic. And we just print money so it does kind of grow on trees, and just to work harder to get more doesn't always equate.
You can work less and still earn more money, and that's the manifestation I'm telling myself right now.
Barb: Yeah. But when you were growing up and when you were a little girl and went to school and did things and we went shopping, did you ever have any thoughts about money or what we were spending, or if it was scarce or if we were thinking about it or bills, or did it even cross your mind?
Maggie: Not really. I knew shopping was always done with you. I knew never to go ask Dad for things. And I remember one time you were like, oh we didn't wanna talk about it 'cause we didn't wanna make you guys nervous. And I was like. Why should I be nervous? Is that something I'm supposed to be feeling.
So I didn't really have any feelings until then. You mentioned that you didn't wanna make us feel nervous, so we didn't talk about it, but then you kind of shared your story of like, growing [00:03:00] up we never had money, so, you just didn't wanna make it a thing for us, which I also then understood.
But no, I didn't really have too many feelings about it. I knew we always had enough, but I knew it was never like. We were balling out all the time either, it wasn't just like lavish this, lavish that, but it was like, I knew there was always gonna be dinner on the table and it was gonna usually be pretty good too.
Barb: Yeah, and we did things. We went to Disney. We did the Disney cruise, and I took both of you and Ed to Italy.
Maggie: and I feel like we did more like.
Looking back, I can see how things were more like either,
trips or like, more quality purchases. It wasn't just like, oh, we wanted really nice shoes or really nice, like, I don't know, materialistic things, that was never kind of fad, but it was like we did, kind of save that money and go on better trips or we flew to someplace instead of driving or so like looking back at it, I can definitely see how we had the money, but we spent it in ways that were not just like [00:04:00] materialistic.
Barb: Yeah, true.
Maggie: What money beliefs did you inherit from your mom or, I know like you had also six other sisters that helped raise you as well, so maybe from them.
Barb: Yeah, so my upbringing was quite different than yours since I'm one of 13 children. But I will say, I mean, it was so different in the sense I was thinking about this since my parents owned seven 11, and that was from when I was like in fourth grade till I was in. Sophomore in high school. So all of us children worked there.
It was when it was still open from seven to 11. so the shifts were from seven to one, one to six, and then six to 11, and we all had shifts. Now, of course we went to school, but after school you. had to be at the seven 11. So there was a lot of time that we spent so many hours working in that. Realm. And so we learned a [00:05:00] lot about running a small business from a very young age.
But I will also say that what I saw from my mom was she also had money of her own. Like she had her own account. She also had her hair done every week. And I remember her saying, I want my own money 'cause I don't want my. Father to ask me why am I spending money on my hair or my nails or whatever it is she wanted to do for herself.
And I thought, good for you. I mean, it was pretty bold because my dad was pretty tough. But my mom stood up to him in that way and was independent, later in her life from my dad in that way that she wanted her own spending money and things like that. And I thought. That was super cool that she did that.
And she was independent in that way.
Maggie: How did she make that money?
Barb: well, even when we sold the store, she went and got a job. [00:06:00] Yeah. So she was like an admin and she still wanted her own money, earned her own money and did that kind of work so I learned hard work ethic for sure. And earn your own money and, always make sure you're presentable looking and take care of yourself for the most part. And yeah, so that was important. it was different times though. People were not buying designer bags and, all that fancy stuff and people were not getting their nails done every week.
It was only like if there was a wedding or something like that did you do something extra special like that? So. I think it was, work hard earn your own money?
take care of yourself, type thing. I would say.
Maggie: I love
our family events. 'cause every time there's a different story that comes out of all of you guys working at the seven 11 and I remember one of your brothers who's like asking somebody if they're gonna pay for those oranges, they stuck in their pocket or things like that And so it was like calling out people kind of on their money sometimes if we're even stealing.
[00:07:00] And so having some of those conversations where I think people today would still be like so nervous or like afraid to ask for the money? And you guys were just holding down shop like you were told to do.
Barb: We really were, I mean, as young children, we were grade school, high school, but we made that place run like an engine and it was clean. It was well, because my parents, they insisted on it. Right? So, and a lot of it. What I learned, I'll go into another store and think, oh, they need to face these shelves, or they need to get more help behind this counter.
Or they're not paying attention to their customer. It's all the things I learned as a child with customer service and a lot of it running a small business. And we even, gave out change without having to calculate it through a register. We did it all in our heads and, making the deposit to the bank at night and all of that.
I mean, I learned it old school, so, it wasn't, automated the way it is today. So I learned a lot of lessons, but we really all worked very hard.
Maggie: Yeah, I know you're even like delivering papers [00:08:00] before that, so you've been working since you came outta the womb. Lucky you. And so I'm not surprised that you then like ran your own business like the whole time I was growing up, you were an entrepreneur, which was Different than most of my friends' moms.
And what they did, most of 'em didn't work, which was fine, but you did and held your own job or like your own business. And then we got to today where we're running purse strings together. So clearly entrepreneurship is in your blood. And so let's talk a little bit about like how we got here and really that spark of an idea started with you.
And I remember you told me to like, go get your computer. I got great ideas, take note for me while like, blow drying your hair. 'cause all great ideas start in the bathroom for women. So do you wanna kind of share like what lit that spark?
Barb: Yeah, and you knew me as an entrepreneur, but really I never thought of myself as one because I always had a nine to five job while you were little and before you were born. And it wasn't till I was [00:09:00] really working my nine to five when I realize that. I could do more and earn more and be more in charge of my own wellbeing and earnings to a greater degree if I started my own consulting business.
'cause I saw the consultants that were being hired and I knew I could do better. And so I did take a step on that skinny limb to go out and open my own consulting practice, which I think was scary, but. I look back and think I did it. I mean, what's the worst that could happen? Go back and get a job.
I guess I thought that, but it was very successful and so, I did well. And so you always remember as a little girl, me working from home as an entrepreneur. It was during that time working in the financial industry where I saw a disconnect between women and the financial industry as I was blow drying my hair one day and I'd just gone through divorce and you were living with me and you were, I think you were either a senior in high school [00:10:00] or freshman in college around that time.
And you grabbed your computer and we were talking and it was kind of this whole idea about women being underserved by the financial industry and what we could do about that. And you just started taking notes and that's where I decided to hire a researcher to dig deep on the real good literature and came back with all the information that was the groundswell for everything that led us to focus groups and move forward with what became our purse strings model.
Maggie: Yeah, I didn't even know, I guess that you could like hire a researcher and then we started hosting these focus groups and I was just the scribe. But then I just remember like sitting at the dining room table and having like three branding documents and it's like, what branding do you like? And it's like, okay, I think we should call it purse strings.
Like how should we make the design? And I remember like Amanda, who does a lot of our verbiage, came over and just like laughing at the table with her and, it was cool just to seeing it built like, okay, I guess this [00:11:00] is the next step. Like neither of us, it was kind of the blind leading the blind, but you definitely, knew more than I did at that time, of course.
But it was just funny how it was like, I guess this is the next step. We picked some colors. I guess this is the next step. Like we picked some verbiage
Barb: Yeah, I hired some really great professionals around us at the beginning and invested some money in them and so great that I did that because still all the branding and the messaging that we use today. Fantastic people and it really stuck our branding is everything that I love. And so glad that you were at the table to see, this is kind of the impetus of a small business and these are the beginning decisions that you start to make.
And the data that we got, the input that we got, and it was kind of all coming together at the time. So it's kind of super cool that you saw all the pieces starting to come together yet at such a young age.
Maggie: Yeah, and I do agree like that was probably some of the best money spent is like kind of getting that name and the foundations and the logos and stuff like it's so important. We didn't wanna come [00:12:00] off cheesy with like purse strings with dollar signs or like something like that. But sometimes when I do like our systems and stuff, I'm like. God, if I had to go through and redo all our branding just because we changed it,
I would hate it. So I'm glad we got that right the first time.
Yeah. But us growing up in money what were your thoughts about teaching me about money?
Barb: Well, you know, we like we were saying, we didn't talk a lot about money and I think maybe it was because, well, I was making pretty good money that was sustaining the household and so there weren't money issues that you needed to be aware of, and. I wasn't big into spoiling children in terms of more than you needed.
But you got plenty. And I always know, like on Christmas, I always wanted to make sure you got plenty. And then everybody always got like one special gift, like when you first got your phone, or something like that. I wanted to make sure you felt special and everything was a surprise, but I was not over the top.
[00:13:00] Like I don't believe in going over the top, like being crazy. But on the other hand, we did things like, remember we tied all the packages up with Brown paper and string. Remember we did that one year?
Maggie: tied up with string. Yeah, that was a fun year.
Barb: Yeah, we've done some volunteer work around the holidays as well, so I try to ebb and flow, like give and get so that there's a balance there as well.
Maggie: Yeah, definitely. Those were some fun Christmases. You did always like to throw in a surprise. Now and then I figured them out prior, but some years I didn't.
Barb: Yep. Well, You were pretty keen and could kind of watch me way too closely to figure things out, so still to this day.
Maggie: Yep. And that's, like us working together. Really like, it can be hard as a mother daughter duo, like kind of staying in our lanes or, moments we don't see eye to eye. But, both kind of growing together as a team. And so I think the one thing that we always do that makes us both laugh every time, but [00:14:00] we both want each of us to always do better and be better in our work.
And so we do have this saying that, it goes, I say this with
Barb: I know, something's coming, but,
Maggie: but, and then it's usually like the nice piece of constructive criticism which is. It went over better before, and now it's just always like, alright, what are they gonna,
Barb: all right. what do you want?
Maggie: Yeah, just cut to the chase here. But it works, it is kind of funny like working with family and like, I know we were kind of talk about like boundaries or the lack thereof or it's just hard that you know me so well sometimes where it's like, I'll show up to work and it's just like, not all days you're.
Sunshine and lollipops, right? And so you're just like, what's wrong? And I was like it's nothing. And you're like, no, something's wrong. And it's like, I can't even hide it 'cause you're my mom. And so like you already know, or the one time we ever record I like will not forget this, the one time we were recording a podcast for somebody else, and we usually do them, even if they're just audio, we usually do 'em like on a Zoom so we can [00:15:00] see each other.
But it wasn't even that. And so it was. US two and a third person who is, the host. And we usually know like who's gonna take what question. But at the end I was like, how did you always know? Like that I was gonna answer, and you didn't. talk over me. And you're like, oh, I could just hear by your heavier breathing.
And I was like, God, she knows me too well. Like, don't just know me by my breathing. Like you can't hide anything.
Barb: I, you're my baby. I know you so well. But I would say the same is true for you. I mean, you finished my sentences.
Maggie: Yeah. I mean sometimes you're like, did you, I was like, yes. I called them. I did this. I can run down your list for you. Do you know? Yes. I called Tina. Don't worry about her. Like whatever it is, it's just, you can kind of run down the list. But I think that's even different than working maybe with like an aunt or like someone who's still family, but a little farther apart is like, God, your mom knows you're breathing.
Like, dear God.
Barb: Well, you just know someone so well. You just know kind of like their minute body [00:16:00] movements and what that means or what's coming your way. but it's the good, the bad and the ugly. But I'd say, 90% of it is good and fun and we love creating together. We're both passionate about the work.
We love the work that we do. We're both impatient. Would wish it would move faster right? And grow bigger and things would move faster. That's what I kind of love about both of us, is we really want, we work fast and we work hard, both of us together. If one of us was flagging that, I think would drive each other nuts.
Maggie: Yeah, a hundred percent. And that's a problem sometimes when we work with like, bigger companies you have to talk to. All a thousand people who work at their company for, I don't know what reason, but it's just like, well, our team chatted about it. We sent a text, we're good to go. And Molly's on vacation and Betty's sick and Billy has meetings until two and you're just like, my God, can we get this moving?
Barb: Yeah. 'cause we're lean,
Maggie: yeah. Really and inefficient. And so [00:17:00] it is kind of hard working with others, but, yeah, we're both runners, which I like, but we can't wear ourselves out.
Barb: we do play different roles.
Maggie: Yeah, a hundred percent.
Barb: What would you say your role is?
Maggie: My role is more like operations, day to day systems technology of any sort. You're really like our big thinker, which is good. Sometimes I have my head down too much, just getting on the day to day where you're like, we gotta think of these bigger ideas. And I'm like, oh yeah she's probably right.
I'm glad someone's looking up and farther beyond. 'cause right now I'm getting these todos done.
Barb: Yes, but the yin and yang of that is, I'm like, Maggie, how come I can't get this link to work? And you're like, mom, share your screen.
Maggie: Yeah, I think sometimes we could use a third tech person just to step in there and support on some of those issues.
Barb: yeah. but it works right? We have patience with each other. I think I run fast and you pull me back sometimes. 'cause you have a lot of, you're [00:18:00] more of a strategic thinker about operations and how it's gonna work. And I'm like, I haven't thought about that. I'm just thinking about, but I think we should go big here.
And you're like, but mom, that means we have to do these 10 things. And I'm like, Ugh. Here she goes again.
Maggie: It is true, and it's just sometimes, when you have a smaller team or a smaller business, but it's growing. You gotta think of where your energy's gonna go, and so some things it's like, well, let's just assess. And it's like, I don't mind doing these 10 things, but like, is this where our energy is best allocated or is it best allocated somewhere else?
Or, do we write these list of 10 things and pawn it off to, an assistant or somebody else to kind of get that taken care of? 'cause that's not our strong
suit.
Barb: Let's call it Delegate that Pond.
Maggie: Okay?
Whatever.
Barb: Yeah. So at what point, Maggie, did you think we're really doing this?
Maggie: I mean, I knew we were really doing this like once covid hit and once I really stopped job searching and I was like, no, this is just what we're doing. But sometimes I'm still like, we're doing this. More when I hear it almost from other people who are like, oh, I listened to your podcast.
I'm always like, oh God, what did I [00:19:00] say? Or like they're like, I download this all the time. And I'm like, do you really? Like, I'm always just surprised. I don't know why, but then I'm always like, oh yeah, I guess we are putting that out there. I guess we are 90 episodes deep, I guess we are, five years in.
It's just it's crazy 'cause you're just so used to just head down to the grindstone.
Barb: Yeah. When people come back to you and say, oh, I hired one of your professionals, I'm like, yay. I'm so excited. when I learned somebody's gone to our website, downloaded a guide, hired one of our professionals just means the world to us.
Right. I mean, it's just. Work in our mission and really getting out there and letting women know we're here for them and they're using the tools and resources that we work so hard day in and day out. It's not only we're really doing this, but this is really working and serving its purpose. So that's fantastic.
Maggie: When did you kind of think we're really doing this?
Barb: Before you and I even started together, was the first time I saw my website go live. When I saw it, like out there on the [00:20:00] internet was kind of a, wow, that's, I mean, there's different demarcations. That was one of them. I think another one was, when we launched our podcast, that was really kind of another fun demarcation, I think when some of our broker dealers started jumping in, we started growing in that realm.
And then people started asking us to speak and all, I mean, every little increment. Is helping us see that what we're doing is important and that people are heeding our message and that they're finding it important and that we're really doing this.
Maggie: Yeah. But it hasn't always been rainbows and sunshine. So let's talk about some of these challenges of being, a women-owned business in this? financial space and really kind of how we push through because we've had some tough days for sure.
Barb: Oh Yeah it's been hard. It's really hard. I mean let's face it, more than 80% of the financial professionals are men, and we're not trying to convert those who are not interested in learning about the power of [00:21:00] the female market. But it's hard when all the facts and figures point to the fact that women will hold the purse strings of America and men.
Yet 70% of women leave their financial professionals not only when they're widowed, but also when they go through divorce. And so women are leaving, and even though the financial industry know this, they're not doing anything. So I don't know, after all these years and all the data and all the times we've been out there pounding the pavement.
What's gonna get through to them to say they really need to learn how to be different in order to engage the female market.
Maggie: Yeah, I mean that has been hard, especially a lot of people who are very like confident that they're doing everything spectacularly and you're just like, eh, I can tell you some ways to improve. But even just dealing with some compliance departments, that has been like a huge hurdle for us. [00:22:00] And as much as we love to talk about money I forget sometimes how hard it is for other women to talk about money.
And for that to be like, as much as we say, with a safe space, we're open. We're not judgemental. It's still very hard for women to open up. And sometimes I forget. How hard it is to kind of crack that open and to make people feel comfortable and be part of it, just because I'm so used to it.
So in it talk about money every day it's, you gotta like really get back to your, to the roots. And remember like it wasn't always this easy, right? It took a while to kind of warm up and talk about this. And so, just kind of remembering that it takes a while for these other women to warm up and talk about it too is just always something that I always gotta, like, bring myself back and ground myself with.
'cause none of it happens overnight.
Barb: Right, right. Yeah. And we think, oh, we have such great information and tools and resources and. Financial professionals, and I guess we thought women would more easily be attracted to that, but I think the biggest thing is overcoming fear. [00:23:00] So many women have fear about talking about money or addressing their money concerns, and we find it difficult to really overcome that hurdle for them.
We can't overcome it. For them. They have to be the ones to take the step forward and just take. Advantage of all that we have to offer. So, we keep calling them in and opening the door and welcoming them in lots of different ways that are very comfortable and warm to help them out. So we're just gonna keep heating that message and hoping women who get us and understand us, take others by the hand and bring them in as well.
Maggie: So let's be a little vulnerable and share our money stories just to make people feel a little bit more comfortable. And let's talk about like, what's a financial decision that like you are proud of and what's one that you wish you did differently?
Barb: So I was thinking about this and when I was out on my own at like 18. Living on my own. I had some roommates and I had a job in a [00:24:00] bank and every time I got paid, I'd pay my bills, which I didn't have a car, but I had rent and utilities and not much else. But by the time payday came and I paid my bills, I'd be overdrawn $40 every time.
And I was like, crap, I'm not making enough money here. And I applied to get. Promotions so I get more money, but they'd say you don't have a college degree, so I get a second job, a waitress at night, and then I also went back to school. So not only did I work.
During the day, but I took three courses and waitress at night, and when you waitress, you get cash right in your pocket. So I was able to pay my bills and then I went to a junior college so I could pay for my tuition. And I did that for a long time and was able to pay down my bills, pay my.
Tuition and get my undergrad took me seven [00:25:00] years to do that. But that really launched me to a point where I could then teach and work. So I always had two jobs and then, buy my own condo and all of that. So. I'm really proud of the fact that I tracked my money because I didn't have a lot, so I had to know where it was going.
And we always had checkbooks, so you always had a log where your checks were going, but I was able to see that I had quite a deficit and I need to do something else about it. Step by step. I got a car which got me around to the different places I needed to go because I needed to work, I needed to go to school, I needed to get a degree, I needed to do some things to help me move ahead in life.
So that's what I'm most proud of.
Maggie: I love that. And it's funny 'cause I remember you kind of telling stories about that and it was like, well, at least I had a meal, I think you said one time you were living with aunt Julie, you're like, we had no furniture, but we use that just to rollerblade through our apartment and
Barb: Yeah.
Maggie: like, gotta turn everything, to a [00:26:00] positive because seven years it gets lengthy.
It sounds now it's like you can tell that story in a small snippet and it's like. I did the thing, but seven years is a long dragged out period, especially when you're doing the grind day in, day out, you're exhausted. But to have some of those also like fun or funny times thrown back in there, I always think is like a great positive.
Like it wasn't all bad. You have no furniture, but you gotta roller rink like.
Barb: I know we did, we roller bladed 'cause it was hardwood floors. I'm sure the people downstairs didn't love us but you know, we turned on some good music. I don't even think we had a tv, but we had a stereo 'cause we love music And so, yeah, I mean, you do what you gotta do, right? To make it through.
I had no choice and I never ever thought, never has it crossed my mind at that time. Like, I'll just get married. Like never crossed my mind. And from then on, of course I went on and got more schooling and all of that, but it wasn't until I am most proud of my undergrad. 'cause that was the hardest one to get.
Maggie: Yeah, definitely.
Barb: So, how about you, Maggie? let's talk about [00:27:00] what money mindset you had to unlearn as you stepped into this work.
Maggie: Yeah. That was really, it's like you gotta money to make money. You have to be willing to take that risk that risk is not always gonna pay off. I mean, if you tried entrepreneurship, you will try a bunch of different things through it, and some will work great and some won't. And you just have to kind of live with that and be okay with that and be like, well, I lost two grand there.
That's just the way that's gonna go and keep on tracking So I just I've really learned that you can't kind of sulk in some of these things that you spend or. Wait to spend till, you know it's gonna be a hundred percent guarantee. 'cause it's never gonna be that. And so I think I've been able to learn more to take that risk and just know like, we're gonna bounce back from it, or it's gonna pay off and be really great.
But really one really great thing make up for the other eight, mistakes along the way and it's never gonna be perfect. But I think then the other interesting thing I've learned, just working with all these different women we've talked to is like, more money doesn't mean [00:28:00] your problems go away, which has just always been so interesting to me.
I mean, we've heard stories where people are earning like, I don't know, it seems like a 100k month, and they're still paycheck to paycheck, like they're still, one paycheck away from bankruptcy or whatever it is. I always had this notion where it's like, well, if I earn more, then I wouldn't have these problems, and it's like, Nope, that's not true. Not always, and I think that's just so interesting. And sometimes grounding where it's like, all right, you've gotta learn how to spend just this three grand before you learn how to spend 30 grand. Because if you don't know how to do it, you're just gonna blow away more money.
And, it makes you kind of think like, alright, this problem is not just 'cause I'm not earning enough, or whatever it is. It's, you just have to learn how to manage it no matter where you're at. It's not a more money problem.
Yeah. because we've heard those stories, right? And then you even hear stories in the news people who win the lottery and then they blow it all and go broke. Or like even professional athletes who make all this money and then they go broke 'cause they've blown it on things that didn't make sense.
And yeah, it's not about what you earn, it's what you [00:29:00] keep. So, yeah, that's so true. It's really so true.
Barb: I was a single person for a long time. I mean, I didn't get married till I was 34, so I had to advocate for, buying a house for buying a car, for getting that next, job or career. And you know it, and I think that's why I quit my job is because I felt like I was so overqualified for the level I was at and the pay I was making, that I just thought I can't depend on other people to be responsible for the work that I'm doing and the pay that I'm making.
I need to do it for myself. And I had the confidence that I could do it. So that's where I just started my own business and, took it into my own hands, and I'll never forget, someone said to me, Barb, aren't you afraid? And I said, afraid of what? And they said, afraid of leaving. And I said, I'm afraid of staying.
'cause you know when people stay too long then. You kind of get enculturated to what golden handcuffs or whatever they call, so dependent on, the mother organization or the mothership, and then you're [00:30:00] never taking a risk outside of it. And the risk I took was. So much worth it. Not just in terms of money, but in what I've learned people I've met, places I've gone to, and the work that I've done like consulting with the World Bank And lots of different things that I never, ever would've had the opportunity to do had I been still sitting behind a desk, taking orders from somebody that I felt wasn't as qualified as I was.
So you need to advocate for yourself. You need to really understand who you are and the work that you wanna do. And I think that was my biggest, way that I advocated for myself.
Maggie: And it's funny 'cause I know people from that organization who've been there, 20, 25, 30 years who were just let go. And it's like, all right, I won't see you tomorrow. and you're like, I had all this loyalty towards you, and there was none back towards me.
And so I think sometimes we forget about that, how it's like they could just cut us tomorrow.
Barb: Yeah. And they have time and time again.
Maggie: yeah, I mean, we've seen it and a bunch of people who are still connected in that area who are just kind of [00:31:00] let go and it was, say lobby, and it's just. Okay, then, and so I'm, you've gotta be able to take that risk on yourself.
'cause you just never know. You can't put all your aches in that basket.
Barb: Right, right.
Maggie: Yeah.
Barb: When have you had to advocate for yourself?
Maggie: this one came to me real quick. When I was going through school, I was working with this lady who, the way her business ran. She was an entrepreneur and more money came in right in August, right before the school year started. She always got more money and so she's like, you work all summer and I'll pay you at the end of the summer.
And I was counting on that money. I did most of the summer on credit cards. It's probably not a financial move I'd recommend to anyone. But I was banking on that money and at the end, her cashflow didn't come through like planned and she didn't have the money. And so, when you're 23, 5 grand it's a lot of money, especially when you've been, putting your money on credit cards.
So remember I had to like, take her to court and get that money back and I really had to like advocate for myself and I felt so like who am I? Like this woman is [00:32:00] like a grown woman, running a business and I'm the one having to take her to court for like five grand, and I just, knew it was important to A, get that money so it wasn't in a hole. But B like I always know, like now as a business owner, like the first things is I would pay everyone else first before myself, especially if I signed a contract like that. And so I just remember having to go and really advocate for myself there, and that was really scary.
They wanted us to do like a quick mediation and. She came in pregnant and I was like, I don't know what to tell you right now, but I need the money. It was really uncomfortable. But it was definitely like a growth period and some time I really needed to just step up for myself.
Not something I was planning on doing, but I really had to just advocate for myself financially and make sure I get paid for the work that I put in.
Barb: Good for you. I was so proud of you that you did that because I know it was scary for you and I couldn't go with you. I wasn't gonna go hold your hand. You had to do it on your own and you did.
Maggie: I brought my roommate and it was like the blind lady and the blind, but I was like, [00:33:00] well, you just hold my hand.
Barb: well, we need to support one another, but we need to move forward and really advocate for ourselves because in life no one's gonna take care of you. You need to take care of yourself. So. what do You think are some good takeaways for listeners? Based on our own experiences?
Maggie: You gotta do it when it's scary. I mean, you gotta keep doing it even when it's scary and when you come through the other side, you're gonna kind of be on a high like, shit, I did that, but it's not always glitter and sunshines. It's not great. But I would rather advocate in those five to 30 minutes and get what I deserve than.
Just letting it blow by and, either having to always work harder or make up that debt or never get paid enough or hate every day. 'cause I know I'm getting underpaid or whatever that is. You gotta go do that scary thing and have people around you that are gonna support you. Not everyone around you will support you, but you gotta have those people who will and loop 'em in, and have them be there to be that team because you can't do it alone.
You need that support system. [00:34:00] And we'll be that for you if you need it.
Barb: Yeah. Purse strings is here to be that safety net, that go-to professional, that can help you. And yeah, I mean, you do need to make a plan. If you see that like I did, I was in dire straits, right? I had a big gap in my income. No one was gonna come by and give me the money and I needed to go make a change.
So, sometimes it's pulling back to move forward and making some changes and, just doing it, doing the thing, right? Working a little bit harder or making some changes in your budget, whatever it is, but advocating for yourself and knowing your numbers and knowing what you need.
Maggie: So what has been the hardest mindset shift or kind of habit to change and what's like a small, habit or mindset shift that's made a big impact?
Barb: So for me, as I was out on my own doing my own thing, watching my pennies and going to school and all that, I didn't have a lot of extra money to do travel and things like that. But I was [00:35:00] happy in my life doing my thing, but I could see with some friends who had more, maybe a nicer apartment or they were getting married and planning big weddings, or maybe they were starting their families or going on lavish trips.
I knew that I had to keep my eye on the prize that I had for myself
Not be thrown off by what other people were doing in their lives because that was their life and I was really creating my life. And I think that's so important even today, even more important because we see so much more coming at us with social media.
I mean a million times more than when I was your age. And I think we need to really figure out what do we want for ourselves and our own goals and not be thrown off by what other people have or show. And for me, I am just a person that's not impressed by a car you drive or a purse you have. [00:36:00] Or a vacation you go on.
I'm like, happy for you. Oh, that's great. If you're happy for that, I'm happy for you. I'm not jealous or envious because I would never want that, and I think to myself, what is it that I really love to spend my money on? And maybe it would be a nice trip with my kids, but it would never be a car.
Like to me, a car is a depreciating asset. I don't even know much about cars. I know the color. Right.
Maggie: would be hiring a driver, like, I don't even wanna buy a car. Let me pay for a driver.
Barb: Right. So It's everybody has their own values and their own whatever. I just realized that from my upbringing, my values are so much more around experiential time with my children having a nice, cozy home. Maybe having my doggy know that we have a dog, but I don't really need a lot more than that. Where some people are like, we're buying a boat, we're getting a second home and to me I [00:37:00] think, whoa, that's just heavy. It's almost heavy. You know what I mean? I'd be like, oh, I'm glad I don't have that, because that would be a lot of work. I just wanna keep things on a scale of comfort and ease.
Maggie: It's so you.
Barb: It's just how I love to live my life, so when all that stuff comes at me, where other people need, all the things, it's just not my thing. Just who I am. And I think for some people who feel like they need to keep up with that or be impressed by other things, you really have to focus on what is it you want for you in your life.
That's what all you need to focus on.
Maggie: And I think it's a little easier said than done, but it gets easier with practice.
Barb: And I think with age, ' cause you see over time that boat or that car or that whatever doesn't make anybody happier. You have to look internally and I've been through my own stuff, as we all do when we age. And you have to realize what grounds you. For me, it's not that stuff.
So, that's why I just think those are my kind of [00:38:00] growth lessons for myself and advice I'd give to people around all the stuff coming at us these days in terms of marketing and purchasing and things like that.
How about you, Mags,
Because you're in a different age range. I mean, you're in that place where things are coming at you fast and furious around a lot of that stuff,
Maggie: Yeah, it's definitely harder 'cause there is a lot of that and a lot of like where you quote unquote should be or have or do you know, married kids, home paid, all your debt paid off or whatever it is. So it's definitely like kind of grounding of like where you are and then like how your values are different.
Like I also know a lot of people my age aren't building a business, and taking that risk. So it is different. But. This is gonna go in a totally different direction, but you know, this mindset shift that I've been trying to like kind of embrace is that, that some of these things that are known as being like cheap don't have to be identified as cheap.
They can still be like really fun and enjoyable. And some of those examples are just like [00:39:00] cooking at home and learning to sew and crochet and like, it sounds so grandma of me, but I used to always think like, oh, they sew their own clothes. They must not have a lot of money.
I don't know where that thought came from, but it just used to be like that where now it's like, these are like little things that I really enjoy and they take time and I love being able to just cook at home besides the fact that it saves a ton of money. Like I love how to be healthier and I enjoy that time just at home and being in the kitchen.
And it's just these things that people say are like. Cheap or poor people activities are just like, no, they're just really enjoying and relaxing. I love to go for a nice meal out, but like, I also love that I could cook a really good meal at home and there's actually nothing more disappointing of when you go out to a meal and you're like, God, I can cook this way better at home.
But, it helps your budget, but it also keeps me really grounded and it's just something. I really love to enjoy to do, and so some of these things, yeah, that people just kind of, I would say, used to judge or poo even I would too. It's just like, no, this is actually what brings me joy.
and that's not wrong.
Barb: Love it.
Maggie: so what keeps you going when things get tough [00:40:00] besides your little dog?
Barb: I know my dog? is so sweet and cute. I can't stand it. I surround myself with people who have a really good sense of humor, and you're one of 'em. And my husband's another one of 'em, and we just laugh a lot. I mean, we just find a lot of humor in a lot of things, and that just keeps me going because, life is too short to be miserable. And I know at the end of the day there are a lot of people in this world that have a lot worse than I do. And I just give thanks and so much gratitude for everything that I have. So, yeah, I might have a bad day or something might happen, but I know I'm so blessed. And I have wonderful loved, and funny people around me, which I feel so blessed about.
It sounds like Sparky agrees with me.
Maggie: Yeah. When things get tough, we just cry in the corner a little bit. No. Thank you Sparky for that. Yeah. When things get tough, I'm also just about a good laugh. A good laugh and a good workout, and just remembering it's all gonna get better. It's just a bad day, or a bad couple hours.
It's [00:41:00] go to bed, try it again tomorrow.
Barb: But all things considered we're pretty lucky. I mean, look how similar we are. We just like to laugh.
Maggie: there's nothing wrong with laughing. But yeah. Before we wrap up here, let's give a piece of advice for women navigating finances and family relationships.
Barb: Well, finances are harder or easier, I think, than family relationships. ' cause finances are just money, right? It's just dollars and cents put down on paper, know your numbers and act accordingly. It's simple. Like somebody said, people think money is hard or it's too overwhelming. It's not. It's the easy part.
Managing family can be a lot harder because it's emotional. It's a roller coaster. You can't control other people. You never know what's gonna happen. I mean, you and I have been kind of peas in a pod since you were born. We've always had a good relationship, had a lot of fun together, and
we're the lucky ones. So I think money is easy because. It's pretty black and white [00:42:00] and there are a lot of people around here purse strings that can help you out of any situation. And I've heard a ton of situations that people have gotten out of It is doable. And if you don't think it is, call me.
'cause I'll tell you who to talk to because it is doable. And the relationship part with family, I'd have to direct you to a different expert on that one.
Maggie: Yeah, it's just gotta understand that emotion, when it comes to family and finances is really understanding that emotion. And I think sometimes bringing in a third party can be helpful just to. Either like, I mean, for us in our business, like we have our, accountant, which is great 'cause it's not like we had much emotion with the finances, but someone to help us kind of set us straight and keep us both on the same line.
But even if it's like your partner or spouse or whatever, there's also people you can bring in there who can kind of help you with that emotion and the money. So it's not just an argument, but a productive conversation. And so always a neutral third party always helpful.
Barb: always helpful. Yes. Good point.
Maggie: And then What's one small step each listener could take this week to be more [00:43:00] financially empowered?
Barb: Know your numbers. I'll never stop saying that. Grab our, where's your money going? Download right on the front page of our website. Work through that. It will just tell you what money's coming in and out on a monthly basis and be as exact as you can. And once you know that, it will give you. So much information that you can then make great decisions out of.
And if you don't know what to do next, call me or call Maggie or look at one of our financial coaches or financial professionals on our site and meet with them and they can help you as well.
Maggie: Yeah, garbage and garbage out. Just remember that when you're looking at your numbers and my piece of advice would just be, have a free 30 minute call with one of our professionals, just so you can kind of get that conversation started. Know what it feels like, know if it's a fit, once you get that ball moving just an inch, it usually starts rolling.
Then a little easier. You just gotta get that first push to get started and there's no money down. It's just a, I sound like an advertisement, no money down. But you know, it's just that 30 minutes. It's not [00:44:00] like, oh, move all your investments right this minute. It's just, spend 30 minutes, have that conversation, see if it's a fit.
Get started. Open up these conversations and it will just give you some food for thought to kind of think about and get going on your finances.
Barb: Yeah, there's always been things in our life where the hardest part was getting started. And then once we got started, it just flowed from there. And I'll tell you, I want you to think, Maggie, what was one thing in your life that was the hardest thing to get started? But then once you did, it was like all the way, like when I walked into my first doctoral class, I thought, I don't belong here.
These people are smarter than me. I'm afraid to even speak up in class. And all I had to do was say my name and that my voice was shaking. But I loved it. I loved everything about it. I never looked back. But to start that, to register and go was the scariest thing I've ever done. And then, defend my dissertation was also the second scariest thing, but [00:45:00] it's all behind me now and I did it.
Maggie: That's why you're Dr. Barb.
Barb: But what's the scariest thing you've had to do that gets you further in life?
Maggie: I probably start going to therapy, really just get my mental health in And that has really just been able to help me get through school, get jobs, hold things down, really get farther. But just like getting my mental health in check is just really launched me forward. And then I was like, wow, that was holding me back.
But it was scary 'cause you don't know what you don't know and you don't want to be like. I don't know. I don't wanna be like, oh, I'm just crazy. But I am and that's great. And so I think that was scary, but it has really launched me forward and helped me every part of the way.
Barb: Yeah. So there are scary things in life that if we just take that first step and get started, I know money's one of 'em for some women. We're here to support you.
Maggie: Yeah. So we encourage our listeners to really, reflect on your own money story and really who influenced it and also what did your mom teach you about money or what didn't she teach you? [00:46:00]
Barb: Yeah,
Maggie: I know you wanna jump in and say that one,
Barb: I did.
Maggie: we encourage you to share this episode with any women in your life who shaped your relationship with money, and we invite you to join our Thursday Money Talk sessions.
They're totally free and totally worth it. Just 30 minutes. We cover one topic at a time, so we want you to jump in and be part of that conversation. And then, we would always appreciate it if you would, like our socials, subscribe to our podcast, leave a review.
Leaving those reviews probably takes you one minute and means the world to us. We will do a happy dance and see those and probably shoot you an email as well. So would appreciate that more than you know.
Barb: awesome. Yeah. Sounds great. Leave us a review. We would love, love, love it. And engage. We can't wait to meet you.
Maggie: Happy Mother's Day mom.
Barb: Thanks sweetheart.
Outro: You've been listening to Women Money, the shit we don't talk about. Now it's time to take what you've learned and make bold [00:47:00] moves towards financial independence. Stay in the know by joining our newsletter for exclusive tools, resources, and updates that keep you financially fearless. Head to PurseStrings. co and sign up today. Need a financial professional who gets it? Turn to PurseStrings Curated Directory, your go to resource for financial experts who know how to put you first. Love this episode? Leave us a review and help us empower even more women to own their financial power. Until next time, be financially fearless.
