Fertility Insurance? The Money Conversation Women Need with Laura Mcdonald

In honor of Women’s History Month, we are celebrating 100 Women. 100 Power Moves, spotlighting women making powerful financial decisions. Join us today, March 27 at noon CT, and nominate someone!

Starting a family can come with a financial reality most women are never prepared for.

In this episode of Women & Money: The Shit We Don’t Talk About, we sit down with Laura McDonald, Co-founder & CEO of Flora Fertility, to talk about one of the most overlooked financial challenges women face today.

Fertility treatment can cost $20,000, $30,000, even $50,000 or more out of pocket. And yet most women never think about the financial side of fertility until they are already in the middle of a stressful and emotional journey.

Laura shares how her background in finance led her to see fertility not just as a health issue, but a major financial gap that women have been left to navigate alone.

If you have ever wondered how fertility intersects with money, planning, and your future family goals, this episode will open your eyes.

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Transcript

Maggie: [00:00:00] Mom, I'm shitting my pants. 

Barb: Excuse me.

Maggie: Sometimes when we have these podcasts, I get so nervous for those who don't know, I'm and then I'm like, God, am I gonna have all these fertility issues? Not like they're bad, but you just don't know what's in store.

Barb: Oh, that's what you meant. You were nervous about having to use fertility treatments?

Maggie: I don't know. I'm nervous. Do I want kids? Do I not want kids? Well, I regret not having them. Am I gonna have 'em too old? You had us old.

Barb: Excuse me. I had them at a very perfect time 

Maggie: 35 

Barb: Yeah,

Barb: that's not bad. 

Maggie: not when these people are talking about 20 year olds having babies. 

Barb: they shouldn't have babies at 20. It's too young.

Maggie: I saw these funny videos of like how my generation that show 16 and pregnant really just instilled in all of us that we're not having babies, and this girl's I still, she's I'm 30 and I'm gonna be a teen pregnancy.

Maggie: I was like, girl, tell me about it. 

Barb: Yeah. It's a big decision to have a [00:01:00] baby. You try not to, and then all of a sudden when you wanna have a baby, like you say, then it, sometimes it's a real struggle for people. But what I love, love, loved about this podcast

Barb: finally, there's an insurance product where we're addressing a concern that women have around infertility.

Maggie: we should be the focus all the time.

Barb: Can we just have a moment? That's a first. It's a first. I've ever heard about it.

Maggie: Yeah, and I love that because God, if I see one more commercial about some Viagra,

Maggie: We got all their problems taken care of. What about me? What about me?

Barb: Right, so now this wonderful woman and her co-founder are putting together a product, an insurance product that will help women, with infertility and when they have to go for treatments, this insurance will back it up, which I think is great.

Maggie: the other thing I love about this is we talk to so many people about like serving women and stuff, and they're like, well, [00:02:00] there's no different policies for women. There's no special things for women. All the investment vehicles are the same. 

Barb: False.

Barb: Finally, right? Finally, we're addressing an issue that's women focused, women based, and we have a policy around it that's being sold right now in the United States.

Maggie: Yeah, I'm excited to share this with the audience. I might need to go get a policy and if I don't use it, I know that all that money's going back to other women who are creating families.

Barb: Even better. It's a win situation. So, 

Barb: yeah, let's dive in and see what it's all about. I.

Maggie: Let's get started.

Gloria Steinem once said, we will never solve the feminization of power until we solve the masculinity of wealth. Barbara Provost and Maggie Nielsen are the team at purse strings that will help you navigate the ins and outs of financial independence [00:03:00] so that you can be financially fearless. This is women in money, the shit we don't talk about.

Maggie: Laura, we are thrilled to have you on the podcast today. I think this is gonna be an interesting one. It's very unique and different. So before we dive in, can you explain a little bit of who you are and what you do, 

Laura: so great to be here. I'm thrilled that you reached out and yeah, excited for this conversation. I am Laura McDonald. I'm the co-founder of Flora Fertility. Little background on me, co-founder and CEO of that, along with my partner, Dr. Christie Lane. Diving into to my background a bit.

Laura: I've actually been involved in, around the, I guess, the Women in Finance discussion for a really long time. it started, let's say in 2010 I was, I had had a career. I was doing a little bit of investor relations for a financial services firm. I had dabbled in a, not related, a little bit of acting very when I was young.

Laura: You know, I was kind of like floating a little bit all over, figuring things [00:04:00] out. And I also had three children back to back, so three daughters in three years and, and I had a son later. I had four kids. But as I was going through that, I was always leaving, let's say the. The financial decisions up to my husband.

Laura: It's really, that's what I felt like. I just, I was, I'm so busy mothering that I didn't get as involved as I should be. And so I happened to meet somebody who I knew from years ago, and she was an investment advisor, and I said, you know, the way the financial industry speaks to me, it's just not resonating.

Laura: I'm not prioritizing it. And so we sought out to create, essentially create this new voice around finance. Again, this is back around 2010, maybe even before that. And it was really looking at the existing models around women in finance tended to be budgeting but not really about building wealth, not about risk solutions, not about what's happening in the stock market.

Laura: 'cause every purchase we make essentially affects the market. So we need to understand this big things. [00:05:00] And so we created a digital media platform. I'm actually based in Canada and so that grew to be the largest in Canada in that space. And we quickly developed partnerships with the, you know, Yahoo Finance and have post, and I figured out how to have a couple books published by Wiley around personal finance and.

Laura: I really grew to understand finance through that entity because if it resonated with me who was outside of the industry, then I knew it would resonate with others like me. And I ended up having an exit. When I then ended up working with an insurance company and kind of fell in love with insurance and how do we create new products for underserved markets?

Laura: And that led me, you know, essentially to a few years ago with my co-founder founding Flora Fertility. And what we're really addressing is the fertility access and affordability. And how do we make treatment affordable for the next generation of parents because one in six people will be affected and the cost can be 20, 30, $50,000 [00:06:00] or more in out-of-pocket expenses. People don't even have 10,000 set aside in emergency savings. They definitely don't have 50,000 set aside to pay for fertility treatment. And if you do, I mean, you need that when baby arrives. So that was the problem that we're looking to solve, and we have actually launched, but happy to dive in further.

Laura: And that's really me. And I had a son after my three daughters. So I'm a mom of, four kids. 

Maggie: Wow. That's quite the story.

Maggie: Just to give an overview, flora is an insurance company.

Laura: Yeah, we are an insurance company, so we are fertility insurance that is owned by the individual and this is really a first, the existing models, which I think. Opened up the market are the big group benefits models typically available through Fortune 500 companies. And those are fantastic if you're lucky enough to work for a Google or a big bank, but most of us don't or we won't our entire careers or we're being let go, we're seeing massive layoffs, right?

Laura: And benefits are being cut back. And so the gap is. 60 to 80% of people don't have [00:07:00] access to those type of benefits and any sort of state coverage is, is quite limited. And so we're really think of it like our flora is very similar to critical illness, but around fertility or even pet insurance. It's a weird analogy, but.

Laura: For fertility, we are making it affordable. So for as little as $15 a month, up to about $70 a month, you proactively buy this or you buy it for someone you love. And if they need fertility treatment down the road, they have 50,000 of coverage available to them to pay for that coverage. And so it really is fertility true insurance and fertility insurance.

Laura: And we're backed by global reinsurers who are really exciting about bringing this product to market. 

Barb: That's fantastic. I love that you've created a product for women. 

Laura: thank you. Yes, absolutely. I do wanna say around, around women, 

Laura: fertility is not a woman's problem. We know that this often comes up that, you know, male infertility or unknown infertility can cause the need to get treatment. But we really believed [00:08:00] that women are looking to own their health outcomes more than ever before. They're more likely to buy this proactively because, for example, they're already looking at egg freezing. That has gone up tremendously and even as the high, as 72% are worried about their fertility at age 23. So we thought that is our primary policy holders.

Laura: And essentially our treatment covers the majority of the costs born by the female partner. So often the cases of male fertility, the treatments are still happening to the female partner. And so that's really what the treatment covers. But we just really wanted to say, this is your choice.

Laura: This is your reproductive autonomy, and we want you to own this. And we think the tailwinds are strong for this type of product right now.

Maggie: We love reproductive autonomy. Love it. We love it. We can't say enough about how much we love

Maggie: it. And so when did you realize like fertility wasn't just a health issue, but a financial one? 

Laura: The eye-opening thing was I didn't experience infertility. I think your life journey, I will say to any young woman, you have no idea what your [00:09:00] life journey is gonna be. You think you're never gonna get married, you think you never gonna have kids. Life will

Laura: be the complete opposite in many cases for you. And so, my co-founder and I, our fun fact is we have seven children between us and, we're the same age, but our kids range between the ages of five and my on, on my end, like almost 21. And so again, you are just, there's so many different paths to motherhood.

Laura: I ended up meeting my husband when I was quite young, had my first three babies and my, you know, really quite young in my twenties, my partner was getting her PhD. She delayed having kids, you know, she ended up need fertility treatment and so ultimately though you just don't know your. Path.

Laura: And for me it really hit home seeing my cousin, as I said, go through fertility treatment and her support group became mothers going through it and I was hearing their stories and I was approaching it from that financial angle. 'cause that's my background. But it's like, you know what? I've depleted my savings.

Laura: And if it doesn't work, it [00:10:00] doesn't work. There's no guarantees that treatment's gonna work and you're gonna be out of pocket. And so, this was in a major city and fairly high income earners. So think about all those who don't even have, you know, that degree of income to lean on.

Laura: this is crazy that we have not solved for this. And I. I really believe in the value of insurance. I think sometimes it gets a little bit, I'm not gonna say a bad breath, but you know, we look at it as just kind of throwing money away and maybe not getting value. But in many cases, insurance is something you do not wanna claim on.

Laura: It is there to give you peace of mind. It should almost be the worst investment you ever make you like. You don't wanna die. I don't wanna get disa like all of these things, but too often it's focused on the Uber negative, which is of course, death's death, disability, or the transactional, which is home auto.

Laura: You know, all those things that don't have a ton of personal relevance or emotional relevance to our lives. And we kind of said, let's think about this positive impact insurance where we can bring essentially people together to fund one another's [00:11:00] risk for something that's really important to them now or in the near future.

Laura: And that was this big idea. And I, I think when we were telling a lot of people this, they said, well, good luck finding, you have to create net new models. You have to try to accurately predict risk that reinsurers are gonna be willing to come on board and put aside tens of millions of dollars to pay out future claims.

Laura: But we really believed it's this is the right model and the right time for it. And so I'll, I'll give it so much credit to my co-founder, Dr. Lane, because she had been studying fertility data, building those journeys, studying wearable device data. She was a profit Stanford Medical school. It was that that was really our unfair advantage in building these models on top of bringing in a lot of other experts and then really believing we could also position it correctly in the market and distribute it.

Laura: And, and we are new to the market. It's been three years of build. But again, the, the momentum that we're seeing is really strong for this product.

Laura: We have been in the market just a few months since we were able to launch. We've been in development three [00:12:00] years prior. We've just started partnerships with menstrual tracking apps, gen Z finance apps and starting to work closely with some employers in the flex and voluntary space at levels of playing fields for them to offer this outside of traditional group plans.

Laura: And that's really, and then we've got some amazing venture investors on board. So it's a long journey incredibly meaningful, but we're very purpose driven and passionate about this model. 

Barb: I love it. And so tell me you know, we make some assumptions about our benefits and what they're gonna cover when the time comes. So what's the reality of what fertility coverage will be with Flora 

Laura: So with Flora we have 50,000 of lifetime coverage that is broken down by 10,000. You have a 10,000 maximum annual 50,000 lifetime. Actually about double most group plans, most group plans are kept in about 20 to 30 lifetime. So we often get asked, well, how would that cover even multiple rounds of IVF?

Laura: 'cause there is a lot of focus on IVF [00:13:00] and, and, and with good reason IVF is very expensive. And if somebody were to need, you know, five rounds of, of treatment, that could be a hundred thousand dollars. what's important to note is that actually when you look at, and this is part of our actuarial models, when you look at a likelihood of needing treatment, treatment paths, treatment success, outcomes, it's actually about 90% of people are successful pre IVF.

Laura: That doesn't mean that it's, you know, it's not costly to them, but they, we can look at diagnostics, we can look at medication IUI that would cover their treatment in full across several years, and if they get to IVF, they would've a good portion covered. 50,000 would fall short of the 10,000 annual if you were going through multiple rounds of IVF.

Laura: But it will still have a big impact and it's more than anything else offered in the market today. We do hope to increase that coverage over time for people who can afford more premiums or their, their risk pro profile makes sense. But that's an amazing start. And for the vast majority of people, it should cover the bulk [00:14:00] of their costs to successfully conceive. 

Maggie: So is fertility treatment not typically covered as much on health insurance? I haven't had to use it, so I guess I'm just not as sure. 

Laura: it's very spotty at best. There's some states that have some degree of mandated coverage, but usually with any sort of coverage like that, there can be wait lists attached to it. Certain in-network clinics that you have to use, which limits availability. Or it might exclude medications or only kick in at the stage of IVF in which you've got 90% of the people are underserved.

Laura: The same with employer plans. They're very expensive because essentially they're group plans. So what that means is they're almost, they're ensuring everybody in the population with pep fees and such You've got a, 65-year-old man, let's say that is also. On that group plan along with say, the 20-year-old woman.

Laura: And so it becomes very expensive for employers and essentially they're on the hook. Not only for peplum and other fees, but also [00:15:00] when somebody's actually utilizing it and getting treatment. The employer's actually paying for that with some degree of discount, often for in-network care. With us, with our reinsurance backing, we'd remove sort of those utilization costs for employers.

Laura: We are ensuring those who are most demanding it right now, and that's typically women in their twenties and thirties. And we're doing it cost effectively because our reinsurers are backing that risk, and we've done individual underwriting to properly price and assess that risk. 

Maggie: It's like you pay for this health insurance and you think it should cover everything. And then you look at our health insurance and it's like, yeah, but we're not gonna do your eyes, we're not gonna do your ears, we're not gonna do your teeth.

Maggie: And of course for women, we're not gonna do, you know, enough of your fertility. And so it's like, what is included? You know, so it's so hard. So I'm so glad that your company is here and is doing that. It's like you wish. It didn't have to be the case. But now we do have these tools and resources, which are so great.

Maggie: And it's funny, I don't know if you've ever read that Michelle Obama becoming book and she wrote in there about how like, you know, there's such a period of [00:16:00] your life where you're like, don't get pregnant, don't get pregnant, don't get pregnant. And then as soon as she wanted to get pregnant, she really struggled with it.

Maggie: And she's like, God, this thing that I've been trying to avoid and as soon as I want it, you know, I can't have it. And so it's just interesting 'cause you don't really know. Until you go through it. And so you don't know if you're part of the 90%, the 10%, some middle percent, maybe it's on him like you don't know.

Maggie: Right. And so it's just always this real complex equation. 

Laura: I can absolutely relate that we've actually had some pharmacies reach out about wanting to engage their customers at a time of contraception, right? Like if we start engaging with populations around fertility and insurance when they're already undergoing treatment, that is too late, you cannot attack a problem from a financial perspective when you're already in that state of crisis.

Laura: So again, like how are we thinking about it proactively? And we do go those first 10, 15 years of our life doing everything we can, trying not to conceive thinking when we. Turn on that switch, that it'll come easy. And my co-founder said it really, it was on a [00:17:00] call. It was really interesting. She said she knew in life whatever she put her mind to, she could accomplish, right?

Laura: Like, if I'm gonna get my PhD and I'm gonna publish these papers and I, you know, I'm gonna teach at Stanford. But then when she went to do that, when it was time to build a family, whatever she did, no matter how hard she tried, It wasn't working. And I think a lot of times we have that mentality ' cause we're the these driven, ambitious women.

Laura: But this, this is one thing that can really throw us for a loop. And so this is why also we're seeing that young women are thinking about this earlier and, and one of the most interesting reasons is that it's the first generation coming into adulthood and masses that were born. Because their parents went through fertility treatment, like people IVF babies in their forties, but it wasn't normalized until 20, 30 years ago.

Laura: So that's why it is so, such a hot topic right now that university students are talking about it. They're thinking, do I need to freeze my eggs already? [00:18:00] They're having those discussions and thinking very much for being proactive about it. 

Maggie: Yeah, and that kind of leads us into the next of kind of like we're in this moment where women are, you know, taking the time to build the careers longer and have families later and do all these different things. So how does that shift the financial conversation around fertility?

Laura: This kind of goes into our underwriting model. Like what are the things we look at that allow us to offer you a policy and to predict risk? And so age is definitely one of the, it's the single most important factor in, in fertility. We are have more, it's the first time in history that we have more women in their thirties having their first baby than in their twenties.

Laura: With every decade, even with every five years, with every year after age. 30, 35, your risk goes up. And so first, and for as we are delaying having kids as we're as housing and just has become unaffordable in your twenties or delaying having family, that is very much increasing your risk.

Laura: And particularly if you want multiple children. So for example, with a Flora policy. Let's say [00:19:00] you have your first child and you don't need fertility treatment, you might just keep your policy going if you're planning to continue to build your family. ' cause the risk increases with age. And so it's just really important that we look at that.

Laura: We wanna have flexibility in our life. We wanna build our own, like, have our own timeline, not feel that pressure that we have to lock into a relationship earlier than we want to or be able to afford everything or put our career on hold. ' cause certainly we can talk about the financial ramifications of.

Laura: You know, having children and, and the motherhood penalty if you will, so to speak. There's, in a lot of cases, you do wanna focus on building your career into your thirties. We're living longer, so we do have time to have kids a little bit later, but our fertility is very much affected and we need to plan for that.

Barb: So, at what point do women consider buying the Flora insurance? Is it, I think I'm gonna start having children, so I'll buy it now, or, you know, can they buy it right when they wanna start having children, just in case they can't? Or is there any timeframe on it?

Laura: [00:20:00] Yeah, there's really the spectrum. So we can offer a policy with this, with our current model to a woman between the ages of 20 to 34 years old. We'll probably be extending that up to age 40 soon, but right now it's 20 to 34. They have coverage up till age 45 if they buy it. But that is when you. At the time of application, you have to be between 20 to 34.

Laura: And we really market it differently depending on that age. Why you would lock in the policy at an earlier age is that it's priced similar to life insurance. The, the younger you buy it, the cheaper it is. There's no, you're not a subject to age adjusted underwriting every year. And your, your underwriting's a little bit less stringent.

Laura: Your risks are lower. So if you're 20, now, I have a 20-year-old daughter, they start to think about around 23, 24, 25, but at age 20, I'll buy it for her. I'm her mom. We're finding that for many parents, actually, it has become on top of paying for your child's education, often helping with down payments on homes.

Laura: Fertility is the next big expense that parents are covering because of course you would do it, [00:21:00] right. You may not help pay for their car, but you will help them build a family that's very emotionally relevant and to your legacy and so forth. So that has become a big expense for parents. So I'll pay for that for my daughter.

Laura: Now it's $15 a month. She's gonna get underwritten, get it. She can go online, apply. Five minutes, she'll probably have the policy and she locks in that pricing for the life of it with some inflationary increases, but not an age adjusted underwriting. If you're choosing to buy the policy when you're in your twenties your mid twenties, late twenties.

Laura: And that's often when maybe you're pursuing. Other degrees or you're focused on your career, it's gonna be more expensive. It could be 30, $40 a month, and if you're buying it, 

Laura: in your thirties, at that point, you're really quite aware, it could be as high as $70 a month or you may not be able to get a policy depending on what risks you've already uncovered about yourself.

Laura: You know, we don't, if you're, the knockout questions for us are if you are already seeing a fertility specialist or undergoing treatment. That's too [00:22:00] late. We do look at underlying medical conditions, so some we can't underwrite, like a very severe endometriosis is more challenging for us. If your chance is a hundred percent that you'll need to do using insurance, it's, it's probably unlikely that we can offer a policy as much as we would love to.

Laura: But there are a lot of conditions that we can underwrite, like PCOS is getting a lot of attention right now and it should be, that's a condition we can generally underwrite diabetes dysmenorrhea. Like these are things that we take into account, into our model, but generally we can offer policies to individuals who are identifying these problems within themselves and looking for solutions. 

Maggie: I think about like endometriosis and like by the time you're 20 you might think you have it or start, you know, but like there's no way your doc, your doctor probably diagnosed you with it by then. And so it's like, yes, I know I have it, but it's not diagnosed where like if you waited five more years, you might actually be diagnosed with it and then it kind of cuts your chances there.

Maggie: But it is one of those things like it takes so long to diagnose sometimes that it. It, [00:23:00] it covers. So I kind of want to talk about egg freezing 'cause that's different, you know, than, than some of this or pulls in differently. And so I know egg freezing is expensive. We've had somebody else come on the podcast before and talk about egg freezing retreats and doing it, you know, in Canada or in Mexico because it's a cheaper rate.

Maggie: But how does the fertility insurance compliment or provide like alternatives for egg freezing? Does it. How is it folding? Getting into the fold?

Laura: Yeah. That's such a good question. And we're asked that so often there's been so much like egg freezing. Nobody talked about this five, 10 years ago, right? Or, you know, it was just wasn't being used as much, but now it's all you're hearing about is the only way to preserve your fertility.

Laura: And actually at a young woman say to me. That, that's all she's hearing. But she thought, I just need to actually insure it with an insurance policy like Flora. So that was nice to hear from her. But we are really an alternative or complimentary to, adjacent to egg freezing. We do not cover it with our policy.

Laura: [00:24:00] I would love to, but that would represent a hundred percent anti-selection, our insurance term, right? So the math doesn't add up. If you're gonna pay $30 a month for a policy in the next year, spend 15,000 on egg freezing it. There's no capital to do that. We need to reserve the capital for those who are eventually undergoing treatment and need I UI or IVF.

Laura: And so, we would say in your twenties, you don't necessarily need to look into egg cruising. You can if you want, but the alternative is to buy a Flora policy for, again, 15, $20 a month and know that you have coverage for treatment down the road if you need it. With that said, if you've already opted to freeze your eggs, what you need to understand is that it's a hundred percent commitment to IVF.

Laura: If you're gonna use those eggs in the future, and I don't know if everybody fully realizes that, and so you've already invested 10, $15,000, you're paying for monthly storage fees. Like in many cases, we can still offer you a flora policy, and that means if you need to use those eggs in the future, you'll [00:25:00] have the dollars to do it.

Laura: And the reason is because it's actually only about 6 to 15% of people who freeze their eggs actually use them. So they're making a huge financial commitment. It can be quite invasive. Totally understand why we're doing it. You wanna preserve your eggs, can understand that, but most people don't end up using them, which makes it a risk that we can ensure.

Laura: But if you need to, you have the dollars to pay for it. So, that's where we're looking at offering, you know, how can we incorporate egg freezing to some degree with another iteration of the product. But right now we've kept the premiums very affordable. so that way it kicks in at the time of needing medically required fertility treatment, which is when you're generally trying to conceive and having challenges, and then you're going down that path of diagnostics, medication.

Laura: IUI IVF. 

Maggie: yeah, what changes like emotionally for women when she knows she has this fertility coverage in place? I feel like it must be a sigh of relief for some people just knowing I have this, if I need it. 

Laura: yeah, it's really that safety [00:26:00] net that sort of weighed off of your shoulders. I had a young woman say to me, you know, she was approaching 30 and she, her engagement just ended and she said, you know, I'm more disappointed that this is just delaying like, less about losing him and more that this is kind of delaying my timeline further.

Laura: And now I need to go through a whole, you know, few other years at least of dating and just understanding what those repercussions are gonna be on my ability to conceive and build a family. And so it's really just giving them peace of mind. And I will say on top of that, what we've tried to do is from day one of becoming a policy holder, we've partnered with some incredible women's health partners.

Laura: So we offer free degree premium menstrual tracking and other support. We have discounts, like really impactful discounts on products that you would be buying anyway, whether it's tampons, whether it's, you know, supplements related to women's health, sexual wellness. Because sometimes you're not thinking about trying to conceive, you're thinking about everything else related to your, health.

Laura: [00:27:00] we'll be expanding those benefits over time with talking to some really cool partners right now. So ideally, you're getting incredible value whether you need to actually use the insurance or not down the road. 

Maggie: Yeah. 'cause I was looking at your website and it seems like it's, it's more than insurance. It's like a com. I mean, there's community, there's like some collaboration, which I think can be really great when, like, let's say your friends already had kids or didn't have troubles conceiving like, it's like, God, who can I turn to?

Maggie: Who would get this? And I can just vent for a minute, you know? And so having that community there, as we find like in purse strings, community is everything, right? And to have those people who can relate, who are at the same point. It can be really essential when you're going through a tough time like that.

Laura: Yeah, a hundred percent. That's part of the evolution of the model too, is how do we connect more people at the different stages? And again, really looking at insurance actually again, at again, as community, as people coming together to fund risks. Maybe you don't end up using it, but the fact that you've paid in a small amount of premiums into the pool, if you will, has really allowed others to access the benefits [00:28:00] they need.

Laura: And I think women in particular really lean into that sort of. Sharing economy, if you will that they're willing to support others going through that journey because of the small contribution they've made that they maybe didn't need to use, but they're happy that it's helping the broader community. 

Maggie: And that's why I feel like it's so different than other insurance where you're like, God, I didn't use that health insurance and now it's just going to the man and these companies that are big and kind of screwing me over no matter what. You know, like they're running the system where it's like, at least for this, it's like, I know it's going back to kind of to some other woman who's trying to start a family.

Maggie: Like we have aligned goals. And so Laura, I know you are in Canada. Is this insurance strictly for you, the United States, or tell me a little bit more about like the logistics there. 

Laura: Yeah.

Laura: So I am based in Canada. Our team is spread out across Canada and the us. We had a lot of experience in the US market. My co-founder at Stanford, we worked very closely with InsureTech, New York. And so that was just, it's, it's a huge market.

Laura: I mean, Canada's very much underserved in this space as well, despite [00:29:00] our healthcare systems being very different. We are equally, I would say, underserved. But that said we knew, you know, the opportunity was significant in the us. Our partners were all there.

Laura: and our, we had the reinsurers. Our reinsurers are such a big market that they're more likely to mac back that big market, but we have had interest for the Canadian market that will be secondary for us and overseas as well, because around the world we're all sort of suffering from, to some extent declining birth rates, wanting to increase those and, and funding challenges around offering fertility treatment. 

Barb: Yeah. So where can a woman buy this? Do they go to an insurance broker? Do they get it through their company? Both. Where can they say, wow, I need to get one of these policies? 

Laura: So the fir, it's a Hey, flora.com is the website. This is complete digital application, so there's no need to send somebody into your home to take. Blood and urine similar to life insurance, all done online. For many, it's straight through processing. For some, if they have some degree of underlying condition, [00:30:00] they'll get on a call with our medical underwriter.

Laura: We're very sensitive. We'll ask those questions and we'll get back to them on, on what that looks like for a policy. We're looking at broker integration and we do have some employers we're working with. It's a great, actually, it's one thing you can bring it to your employer and ask them to help pay or sponsor it, and we're happy to facilitate that.

Laura: But the easiest way if they're looking right now is to go to hey flora.com. 

Maggie: And then I know this is new, but this is a question that just popped in my head. Are you guys covering or thinking about covering like surrogacy as well?

Laura: Surrogacy is one that is in the pipeline for us. So at the time we sort of covered that we, it's the clinical workflow from diagnostics medication, IUI IVF. Looking on expanding exactly what is covered. Usually we have an ICD 10 code attached and that's what allows for reimbursement.

Laura: But this is, phase one of the model. We're looking at the expansion opportunities and working really closely with policy holders and clinic partners to find out how do we expand from here? 

Maggie: I think it's a lot of things that women need. It's [00:31:00] getting that ideal coverage and really taking care of those concerns that women have, right? And just helping us have that better financial future. 'cause having a baby ain't cheap either, so if we could save a little money on the front end 

Barb: As the expert Laura in this area, is there anything we haven't asked you that we should know or you'd like to share with our audience? Because this is such unique and interesting topic, and I just wanna make sure it's all covered. 

Laura: we had talked about a question around what does financial freedom look like in general? 

Maggie: Yep. That's our last question always for you is what does financial freedom you to mean to you? 

Laura: I was thinking about this a lot and leaning into my past background and not even related necessarily to fertility, but when I look at women today, lives, and really I wanna highlight access to capital. I think it's financial freedom for women. I think there's still some barriers there, whether that's access to capital.

Laura: In this case, for fertility treatment, we're using insurance to solve that capital need. But as a female founder too, I look at access to capital, how [00:32:00] we actually build wealth. And generational wealth and legacy. It's often by buil building. In many cases, private businesses, and access to capital is one of the biggest challenges we face, I think from a VC side, I might get this number wrong, it's two to 8% of capital actually goes to female founders. 

Barb: Less than, 3% and less than half of that goes to African American founders. So we get nil and I'm right there with you in this conversation.

Maggie: I was like, don't get her started on this. 

Laura: I've had other ventures in the past and sometimes all you're getting offered is like $10,000 to go build business. That's gonna put you in debt that is not gonna build business. And so really we need to remove those barriers to access to capital.

Laura: And we're seeing more and more funds step up and wanting to fund female founders. But we need to not even look at us as female founders. We are founders We need to believe that we can go build businesses that are beyond just often there's nothing wrong with like network marketing and [00:33:00] stuff.

Laura: I believe every, you should pursue any path, but like believe that you can go build something impactful. Take that step and really like, let's get you access to capital to fund building something, building a business Covering your risks and in the fertility space. But this is, again, it's just something that has really resonated with me that I think we lack this and we need to build this.

Laura: and we also need to support women in, in executive positions.

Laura: I know I've been involved where there have been ETFs that have launched that we're trying to support women on boards and there's companies with women on board show higher ROIs. Not even financial advisors would be putting their clients. in these ETFs in many cases. So we are not stepping up to support.

Laura: There's a lot of talk, but we're not actually doing it in stepping up to support. So we need broad change there. And that will really allow financial freedom for the next generation. 

Maggie: Say louder for the people in the back. My God, it just snaps all around. That's exactly [00:34:00] it. 

Barb: I know women we build anyway, but it's so much harder. It's so much harder. And yeah, I mean we could talk all day about that one, but I think with Flora, there's so much need out there. There's so much desire, there's so much

Barb: education, probably women need around this. And how can they leverage this? Because women are trying to do it all and they do wanna have families, but they wanna be in control of creating their family future. So this is fantastic what you're building. I'm so glad we had this conversation and that we're getting this message out to our communities of women as well.

Barb: I know they're just probably jumping outta their chairs because this is so important. Finally, right? Finally. 

Laura: Finally. Is a word, but thank you. There's so much we could talk about to just really appreciate. I would love to connect with your audience. They can always reach out to me even on LinkedIn. We wanna hear feedback, we wanna talk to others. it's important that we create new models that are covering the risks that are really important [00:35:00] to us as women and, and, we guide a lot of the economy and the decisions.

Laura: We need to be spoken to. 

Maggie: Let's do it. Thank you so much, Laura, for coming on today and sharing all about Flora. I can't wait for our listeners to connect with you and your company. And until next time, I hope everyone is financially fearless. 

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