A Queer Understanding

Becoming a Family Against All Odds: Dr. Lane Igoudin's Story

• Dr. Angelica & Cassy Thompson • Season 7 • Episode 5

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When Dr. Lane Igoudin and his husband Jonathan decided to become parents in early 2000s California, they stepped into a world of uncertainty and prejudice that would challenge them to their core. Dr. Igoudin's memoir, A Family, Maybe: Two Dads, Two Babies, and the Court Cases That Brought Us Together, chronicles how this interracial gay couple navigated the labyrinthine foster care system during pre-equality times, fighting to create a family against daunting odds.

https://laneigoudin.com/

#lgbtq #lgbtqia #gay #gayadoption


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Speaker 1

Dr Laney Gooden is the author of a recently released memoir A Family Maybe Two Dads , two Babies and the Court Cases that Brought Us Together which depicts Lane's and his husband's life-changing journey adopting kids from the foster system . Against many odds and prejudices , lane and his husband adopted two kids a one-year-old and her sister , a newborn . Their daughters are now 18 and 20 , wonderful human beings , and it was never a given . During their three-year rollercoaster process , lane and his husband faced a double stigma as adopted parents , they were shut out of the court cases affecting the children they were raising , and as an interracial gay couple attempting to foster Latinx mixed-race children . During the pre-equality times times , they were treated as

Introduction to Dr. Laney Gooden

Speaker 1

second-class citizens , as their relationship and their family were not legally recognized . Thus , a Family Maybe also depicts the rise of the first wave of out gay families and the struggle for equal rights for the LGBTQ community in the 2000s , something Lane and his husband were very much involved in at the time .

Speaker 1

Lane has spoken at multiple gay history events , queer writing gatherings and has written for LGBTQ media such as Queer Nation and Lambda Literary Review . His 2024 12-Stop Book Tour included appearances on WeHo , west Hollywood Reads , creating Queer Families and Communities panel , palm Springs Pride on the Page . We Are Family panel , as well as One LGBTQ Archive at USC . A Family Maybe has received endorsements from California Senator Sheila Kuehl , founder of the California LGBTQ Legislative Caucus , ceo of Family Equality , queer writers like Tristan Reese and Joe Bauman , and social work professionals . Here's our conversation , so we have with us today Dr Lane Igudin , the author of A Family Maybe , two Dads , two Babies and the Court Case that Brought Us Together . Welcome , dr Igudin .

Speaker 2

Thank you , I'm glad to be here .

Speaker 1

Great . So this is a really fascinating story . It's a memoir of your struggle with adoption for you and your husband back in the early 2000s . So there's a lot to dig into here . But I want to kind of get a little bit of an origin story about you and your husband meeting and then how long you were married and then deciding to , or even coming to the realization that you could be parents at that time .

Speaker 2

Right , so well , I'll start at the end . My husband , Jonathan , and I have been together for almost 28 years . We met in 1997 in San Francisco . At the time I was a graduate student at Stanford and living in the city and

Meeting and Deciding on Parenthood

Speaker 2

he was living in the city as well and we met and we had this nice kind of very romantic dating for that one for a few months and moved in together .

Speaker 2

And I mentioned to John early on that I see myself as a father and that is something that I knew , that I wanted to be a dad , probably as early as when I was a teen . I helped to raise my younger sister and that was a very important , really precious experience to me , and so in the future I saw myself as a single dad with two kids . Well , I ended up being a married dad , but with two kids , so in a way that sort of the prophecy came true . So when we met I mentioned to him my desire to have children . He wasn't ready , so it took him a few years and then he began to warm up to the idea , and I do describe his process of getting on board with that in the book as well , because it wasn't exactly a streamlined process . It took him some time , but once he did we went into the process and we've been dads to our two girls , who are now 18 and 20 . But I can tell you a little bit about the landscape of what gay parenting was like before it became sort of as well-known and as commonplace as it is today . I was in my 20s in the 1990s and what I'm going to read is a chapter from my book . It's called Pathways to Parenthood . So I'll just tell you where I started in terms of being a parent .

Speaker 2

My earliest knowledge about gay parenting comes from a once very popular magazine , newsweek . Back in 1996 , working a student job at Stanford News Service , I picked up a glossy issue from a stack of magazines that came in , intrigued by the cover blurb gay families come out . Those were different times for gay people in America . While the decades of criminal persecution had largely ended , full equality was still years away . Just two months before the article got published , president Clinton signed into law the Defense of Marriage Act , doma , prohibiting federal recognition of same-sex unions . But the Newsweek's five-page feature , complete with a star interview , melissa Etheridge and her partner , and a normalizing , the kids-all-right narrative of a daughter of a gay mom , gave the readers the true lay of the land . In 1996 , only 13 states allowed lesbian women and gay men to adopt California , my home state , along with Ohio and some New England states . California , my home state , along with Ohio and some New England states were colored the highly tolerant green on the map accompanying the article Quote . Even then , the writers noted usually only one partner is the parent of record , leaving the other in legal limbo . Courts allowed adoption by a second parent in some of those states , although the law is still in flux . End of quote .

Speaker 2

Flux characterized the state of being a gay parent . In some states one could still lose a child , even one's own biological child , because of being a homosexual . To protect their children and families , many gay parents had to stay in the closet , but some began to confront their kids' schools and other public institutions to demand acceptance . The Newsweek article sparked hope in me . There was a way for gay men to have children and luckily I was living in a green state . I saved the clipping and started a file , but I wasn't ready .

Speaker 2

As a single grad student living in San Francisco , I never saw myself as anyone's husband . Relationships would come and go without affecting me deeply , but what I saw like a prophecy within was an image of a single father with two kids . Entering the adoption process years later was simply following my inner path . I knew I would never be fulfilled if I didn't have kids . Gay men with children were still rare , a novelty fitting poorly into the sexual politics of the time , when refusal

The Landscape of Gay Parenting

Speaker 2

to procreate remained the pillar of homosexual identity , an unambiguous divider between the oppressor and the oppressed . Be gay , don't breed . Read bridge magnets sold in the city's gay neighborhoods . Really , parenting wasn't for us Persecuted , marginalized , disempowered and discriminated . We were at least freed from the toils of raising children . Would gay parenting be the ultimate betrayal of our special destiny or the ultimate proof of our emancipation ? The community's attitude was ambivalent .

Speaker 2

One year later , in 1997 , john and I met in San Francisco and fell in love . Our dating was breathtakingly romantic and our relationship grew ever more passionate with every week and month . But from the very start John made it clear that becoming a dad was not on his agenda . Quote with nine siblings and 25 nieces and nephews , he told me , I don't particularly feel like I need to have my own children . His lack of interest in parenthood couldn't dampen my curiosity .

Speaker 2

Two years passed , and in the midst of John's transferring with his company to Southern California to live with me . I dropped by a maybe-baby meeting in West Hollywood for prospective gay parents , adoption options , support groups , helpful attorneys In Los Angeles . The process seemed less politicized and much more manageable . I scribbled down as much information as I could , along with the phone number of a representative . Helpful attorneys In Los Angeles . The process seemed less politicized and much more manageable . I scribbled down as much information as I could , along with the phone number of a representative from the Pop-Lock Club , la's gay debt organization .

Speaker 2

The following month , john moved down the coast and after two years of weekend commutes , we were finally living together and in true bliss . Outside our spacious apartment , the city lights never dimmed , nor did the palm trees ever stop swaying gently by the sandy beach across the street . Neither of us had ever lived with a partner , so it was time to really get to know each other , to scale down personal demands , to divide the household minutiae , to interweave our cultures . But the good times didn't dim my vision of becoming a father . I joined an online gay adoption list , serve , entering a pipeline of stories , questions and tips .

Speaker 2

California was still a highly tolerant state compared to those places where people like me had to hide their partners during homestead inspections . A gay dad got profiled in a local magazine . I highlighted his story throughout his step-by-step foster-to-adopt path his desire to have a set of siblings so that the kids would always have a blood relative , no matter what happened . The resource list accompanying the article , including the Foster Parent Recruitment Office of Los Angeles County . Now in my early 30s , armed with information , I felt ready to pursue parenthood . But I wouldn't be enough .

Speaker 1

It had yeah , what was that ? Like you said , you always wanted two kids , you also always wanted to have siblings . Did you your kids when you adopted them ? Tell me a little bit more about that . I know that you said that the one-year-old and a newborn , which we're talking about like roughly 2004, .

Speaker 2

2005, . We have multiple parenthood options available to us . First of all , surrogacy . We were a professional couple . We could do it if we wanted to . There are also some countries where you could adopt internationally . There are also some options for private adoption . When you go through a lawyer and a woman who is looking for a couple or an individual to place a baby with will be matched and so things will go from there . But that's not what we wanted . We wanted to open our home to one or two children from this community .

Speaker 2

We're very much aware that Los Angeles had , and still has , the largest foster care system in the country . At that time , in the early 2000s , it was anywhere , depending on the year , between 30,000 and 35,000 kids in Los Angeles County which needed a home , which was about a quarter of all the foster kids in California and a large chunk of all the foster kids in the United States , which was about half a million back in 2005 . The number has gone down . Then it went up , so we're not exactly where it used to be , but it's still pretty high . It just breaks my heart to realize how little things have changed , to be honest . So at that time the state of California , I would say , starting in the mid to late 1990s , began to open on the down low like opportunities for and I want to say LGBTQ , because it wasn't really that diverse back then . I would say for gay men and lesbians Right , single or partnered , to take in children , to foster and adopt if they weren't available for adoption , and not because it was like really out there for our rights . It's because there are so many kids that needed a home and they realized , okay , we're not going to advertise , but there are some responsible adults who really want to have kids and who can provide for those kids , so why not ? So at the time like , for example , I described this first when we went for an orientation with a county and there's all this language thrown into the brochures that we could read between the lines addressed to us but not really naming us openly this was the time when our struggle for equal rights intensified , for same-sex marriage early 2000s Remember Massachusetts was 2003 , I think was the first state to pass the same-sex marriage law and all of a sudden all the gay families were being pulled out of the kind of the shadows where we were semi-hiding , I should say , trying not to attract too much attention way out into the public spotlight .

Speaker 2

We exist because our existence was countering the whole Save the Children narrative . So the same time as we went into the process was also the time we were very active with PopLock , with a gay debt organization , and other organizations like Equality California , like Family at the time it was called Family Equality Council , now it's called Family Equality , so all these advocacy organizations . And so once we had the kids placed , yes , we would march in gay prides pushing a double stroller , we would write , we would demonstrate , we would conduct , and this continued . Well , I wouldn't say to this day , because we do have equal rights but we went as far as to testify before the Judiciary Committee of the Senate when they tried to repeal DOMA the first time , which was in 2012 .

Speaker 2

So it's like we did all we could and at the time , our community was very organized and very much in the fighting mode , and so were we , and honestly , in a way , I kind of look back at those times with some nostalgia . Our lives had more meaning than just being responsible adults and good fathers . We're making history . We were fighting and getting the equal rights that we deserved . So those are great times . Those are great times . I'm afraid we might be back in the same situation Right , given the current administration and the climate , and I hope it won't happen . But at least , if it happens , some of us remember what it was like to be there when we were discriminated and marginalized , and so we do remember and we do have the tools .

Speaker 1

Right . So you and your husband ? Well , you weren't married at the time .

Speaker 2

You and your partner . Actually , we weren't all the way to the finalization of the first adoption , but we're still . This is how bizarre the whole thing was that , in the eyes of the federal government , we were two single individuals raising two sisters , two related kids . I can't even think of a situation where that would have really happened , where two single men would be raising . I was like , well , I mean , it's hard to wrap my mind around it and it would get into crazy things , for example , when we went to get a social security number after the adoption for our older daughter , and then the same situation repeated with the second one . Because we're still not recognized , we're told that basically , we only have father and mother , and so either one of you wants to be the mother or there'll be only one parent , only the father , on the social security card . And I said , well , I'll be the mother because I'm as close to the Jewish mothers as anyone should ever be . So , yeah , those were the days .

Speaker 2

And so when , in 2008 , california passed the same-sex marriage , well , it was actually done through the Supreme Court of California . So in June , same-sex marriage became legal in California and we got married in San Francisco the city of our youth , I should say , where we met . In November of the same year , same-sex marriage was outlawed in California through something called Prop 8 , or a proposition passed by the voters . So during that time , 18,000 couples got married , including us , and we ended up in this limbo when we were married in the state , but we were single outside of the state in many states which formally refused to recognize same-sex marriage and in the eyes of the federal government , and this continued for the next , what is it ? Eight , nine years , I think , till 2015 .

Speaker 1

Okay .

Speaker 2

Till Albert Goeffel decisions over the US Supreme Court . So we were in this legal limbo . I do mention that , but that's kind of at the end of the book because that's after the end of our process . But yes , the entire time we were together , we were just partners .

Speaker 1

So I'm curious did you adopt your daughters at the same time , or did you adopt one and then the mother became pregnant and gave up the second child for adoption as well ?

Speaker 2

What happened was that we decided to go through a foster adoptive agency , a nonprofit , which served the LGBTQ community I mean , it was not exclusively , but they were very welcoming and a lot of the staff were also LGBTQ and after we got certified , for the whole year the county would call us or they would call us with all kinds of matches year . The county would call us or they would call us for all kinds of matches with potential kids and for various reasons things were not working out . There'd be like the sibling set was too large for us to handle , because it's just the two of us , okay . Or there'd be some medical issues that we knew like we're completely unequipped to deal with . So there are things for a whole year .

Speaker 2

And then the agency itself told us about a child which was not in the system but which was abandoned in one of its foster homes , was not free for adoption . The parental rights were never terminated on that child . So the child was not in foster care officially but was unofficially left in a home . And so they offered us to meet her because they said she'll be detained any day now and because she's so small she just turned one , she's an infant , she'll go straight up for adoption and we said , okay , let's meet her . So we met her in that foster home and we fell in love with her . She was absolutely adorable , a little baby crawling around , very rambunctious , and we thought , okay , well , it's only one child . We kind of wanted two , but maybe we'll go back into the system later . So we said yes and we took her in . We took her over as her foster parents .

Speaker 2

Then she got officially detained and then her birth mother reappeared , pregnant and demanding the return of her older daughter , and the state said , okay , you need to go through this reunification process

Choosing Foster-to-Adopt Path

Speaker 2

for you to get the child back . And so our older daughter was already living with us when , all of a sudden , sort of the gates of legal hell opened up , because we ended up in a process where there are multiple parties involved , where the mother laid the claim to both her older daughter and her younger daughter . The father of the younger daughter came into the scene trying to get that child . There were criminal proceedings that were supposed to be initiated against him on the mother's behalf . So that was a whole other layer of complexity .

Speaker 2

And there was a county with its counsel in the court representing the interests of the county , making sure the county doesn't get sued , the children's attorney that was representing the kids , who would quit right before the court case , and of course there was a judge who was very much pro-reunification , to whom we were never more than just paid caretakers , and we as foster adoptive parents , because we're considered to be non-related caretakers , were shut out of the process completely . And in children's court you can't just walk in and watch the proceedings of the children's court . It's completely closed to public . If you're not parted to the case , you will never be inside the courtroom .

Speaker 2

So we actually , as my book describes , after our daughter had been with us longer than she should be with her mother and in foster care prior to us , we went in asking for the de facto parent status on her so at least we could be in the courtroom , even though it didn't take away any of the rights . But we were thrown out within three minutes , oh wow . And so we ended up in a situation where we were powerless to participate in the decision-making about the children that we took in to raise and shout out of the legal process . And this went on and on and with many ups and downs and all kinds of strange and really hard to comprehend turns of the case . So this core drama is at the center of the book .

Speaker 1

Okay , wow , so you really had no idea . Did you have anyone ? Was there anyone who kept you apprised of what was going on inside the courtroom at all ?

Speaker 2

foster care system in the country . So by the time the court order trickles down to the county social worker , by the time they pass it on to the agency , by the time the agency gets it to us , it could be weeks . Very often there would be a critical court date , let's say , deciding whether to take one of our children , remove them from our home and then give it to one of the birth parents . And with the younger one it happened almost four times , actually Four times came close to losing her and the court would come and go and would have no idea what happened . And I'd be calling everyone I possibly can to try to find out what happened and I still couldn't get the answer . And sometimes I'd get the answer from very unexpected places , and so it was very Kafkaesque in that sense . But I also like , like when I was writing the book , I mean , I just want to , kind of , I'd like to look at , have a little bit more complex view of the whole situation , because we're dealing with a system which is so overstretched and overburdened , how can it possibly , given the size and given the way it is set up , really serve the kids the way it should , right ? So when I looked up to see , for example , let's say , the judge , which to me , was just giving one chance after another to the birth parents who really needed a chance to really get their own lives together . First because I had a lot of doubt that they ever could , given all the circumstances that they were facing , on their own . They couldn't take care of themselves on their own and here she's trying to push one or two children towards them . And the time goes on and the fact that it's having the toll it's taking especially on our older daughter and on us as a family , the trauma that is escalating . So I couldn't believe this , but , critical as I was of her when I looked up the statistics , that in California a children's court judge is supposed to have 160 cases and they would handle up to 600 cases .

Speaker 2

Any wonder that all of this is even after the , at the end of the three years saga , when we come into the courtroom to to sign basically for the adoption decree and she says , oh , I remember you here to finalize the adoption of the child Elizabeth , I was like what , elizabeth ? Right ? It's like , oh , is that , wait a minute , is that Jenna's daughter ? And she remembered the birth mother . She couldn't for the life of her . Remember the name of the child . She never met the child . She never met the child whose life she'd been mangling for all this time . But then to her it's just a file , one of I don't know how many hundreds on her desk ,

The Legal Battles Begin

Speaker 2

so it's a yeah .

Speaker 1

I have some familiarity with the system and in college I was a guardian ad litem and as an adult I was a child and adolescent therapist and I dealt with kids who were in foster care and also some who weren't .

Speaker 1

They were in hospital level four treatment facility for various reasons and you had the side where you had kids who were in acute care , who had insurance and their parents were involved and you had the whole other unit where they were in foster care or some kind of limbo from their parents and some kids were there for up to a year .

Speaker 1

And there were situations where I couldn't believe they were working on reunification , where I had to deal with parents who had done some really horrible things to their kid and I'm trying to serve as this mediator and counsel and try to help them follow the steps they needed to follow so that they could get their child back . And , as you say , sometimes you're just like they have their own things that they need to work on before you try to bring a child back into that picture . So it's really tough . So for you , where your children were with you and you had no idea whether you get a call from the agency or a knock on the door or the county to say sorry , you have to give one or both of them back at any moment .

Speaker 2

That's the reality you have to get used to and it's heartbreaking , and I also realized that this was putting our relationship in jeopardy .

Speaker 1

Yeah .

Speaker 2

And I've been talking to quite a few podcasts that have to do with relationships and with parenting , mindful parenting , things like that , and this is one thing that always comes up how did you make it through ? And the thing is there are some things I realized , and I think we're both I mean I don't want to just say just me , but I think because it was only the two of us , jonathan and I right , his family lives in Central Valley , so they couldn't really help us in any way and my mother , basically she refused to have anything to do with it , and that whole side story is also in the book about how having a child in a gay family can actually kind of exacerbate the tensions that are already there , which was , interestingly , what happened here . So it was just the two of us , so working together , basically picking up the slack all the time , really brought us closer together . On one hand , it brought us closer together . On the other hand , I realized that the nucleus of our family is John and me , and I need to do all I can as a partner to make sure that , whatever happens , we're still together , which means that I should never take him for granted . I shouldn't be taking out my emotions on him . I should love take him for granted . I shouldn't be taking out my emotions on him . I should love him more because basically this is where it starts and that's where it should end , no matter what happens .

Speaker 2

And so that really helped us , because there was a moment when I realized at some point I may have to choose between , like , keeping the child or children or keeping my partner , because it does take a huge emotional toll . Now , does it have to be that dramatic ? No , and that's the thing about the system . It's the luck of the draw . You never know . We had friends for whom , from the foster placements to the signing of the adoption papers , would be like seven months and no drama , actually , with that particular family four times in a row . We also have friends , a wonderful couple , two women who took in a deeply traumatized actually physically traumatized child from a foster with intention to adopt , and the pro-reunification judge took her out of their home after six months , when she barely recovered , and threw her back into the family and then she was killed .

Speaker 2

Oh , wow the only reason the story actually got out is because one of our friends is a publicist and so she was able to get the story out and the story made kind of like regional news in some ways . But ultimately it didn't make that much of a splash because for a system this huge , the loss of a few kids a year is minuscule compared to the numbers they're dealing with .

Speaker 1

Yeah , so , yeah so sad , yeah , so sad . Well , I'm glad that you all were able to maintain a strong bond , because , with something like this happening , it had to be very taxing individually and as a couple . And so now , at this point , you two have been married , or let's say , together how long ?

Speaker 2

We've been together for almost 28 years . We've been married since 2008 . So literally the day that we were allowed to Okay . So in such honestly , I mean , I mean , of course it's wonderful to be married and we got married , but it didn't have that much as much significance to us because , well , it did , but also it didn't because we had been together 11 years but and our kids were two and four . So now we're going to declare to the world our love for each other . So , yeah , it was important and of course we wanted the rights and we're glad we have them and we hope we'll get to keep them .

Speaker 2

But the thing is , honestly , because I'm an outsider in many ways . I came to this country as a refugee from the Soviet Union with my family you can hear some of my accent , I'm sure . So and as a gay man , as an immigrant , looking at that system , I mean I was really clearing the system as I was going through it , because there are a lot of assumptions that are sort of taken for granted in the way it's set up . That I wasn't taking for granted . I was like , well , that's not , doesn't seem like the right way to do things , or the only way to do things to me and I started looking at the history of the institution . And the institution is not designed by the queer parents for the queer community , right . It's designed by the straight people for the straight people and run by the straight people predominantly . So we were not really part of the original equation .

Speaker 2

So historically , it might be interesting to you , the first state to pass the adoption statute in the United States was the same state that would invariably

Fighting for Rights as Parents

Speaker 2

pass the first liberal statutes , be that abolishing of slavery in the state or interracial marriage or same-sex marriage Massachusetts , roughly 1850 . In 1850 , they passed a statute which in a way kind of sets certain precedents , certain basis for future adoption laws in other states , because in the United States family is a state prerogative , not the federal prerogative , and one of the basis for that was to treat children as property . Very much and I'm kind of thinking that very much like to treat wives as property . I don't think there was any difference . What is it ? The Chattel system , right ? So basically it was property that is adjudicated by a judge , a regular judge , going through this kind of regular process and you get back your other types of property and you also get your children and they're much the same way and so to me it was like , well , that's not how it should be and I think it's the most productive and the most human way of treating the life of a human , because we see what happens . My story illustrates that .

Speaker 2

So I was queering that Also as a queer couple back then even more , of course , more so than now . The side of the two of us my husband is African-American , I'm white , our kids are Latina and Latina white , and also a lot of them is part mixed race we were like a walking straw of light . Wherever we went People , even in California of light , wherever we went People , even in California , I knew they were looking like look , get used to . Sometimes people give you dirty looks but honestly , because we're two kind of like tall men , they wouldn't most of them wouldn't dare like to our face , but I knew it , I could feel it . Yeah , sometimes I would catch it like sideways . So , yeah , we're very visible , we're very visible and I realized we should be visible . No-transcript , they would assume correctly , there was a lot of love going on here .

Speaker 1

And so I'm curious . I might have missed , when you were able to . When you were granted custody of the kids , was it directly to adoption , or you were still foster parents and then the adoption happened later ?

Speaker 2

In the foster to adopt process , and it's pretty much the same in every state . First they have to terminate the reunification Right , and then they give the birth parents at least four months to contest that , because they do not set the termination of parental rights until at least four months after the termination of reunification and only after the parental rights of the biological parents are terminated . Only then will the children become available for adoption . So then from that point on it's a few more months until the adoption hearing . In our case , of course , everything got postponed and delayed and delayed , and the judge would still , by the way , grant the visits with the children even after the termination of reunification , all the way to the termination of parental rights . So it's a process .

Speaker 2

So some people going into who would like to adopt from foster care , they only adopt those kids who are free for adoption , whose parental rights have been terminated . But you have to realize that by the time they get there it's like there are much fewer of them left , and we wanted a sibling set of two , hopefully younger kids , and so I don't know how long it would have taken us to get to that point , to be honest . So the more risk you take , the more you can think about exactly what kind of parameters do you set for the child that you want to adopt . Yeah , so we took quite a lot of risk . Yeah , In the end it worked out .

Speaker 1

Yeah .

Speaker 2

So maybe I don't want to scare anybody off . I mean , it could be a nerve wracking , a roller coaster experience , or it could be something that is easy and simple and wonderful , but the thing is you're doing much more . You're doing so much more when you are giving that forever home to a child who does not have a home . Right In that sense ? Yeah , yeah .

Speaker 1

So fast forward , I guess maybe 14 , 15 years into the future . What made you decide to write this memoir ?

Speaker 2

So we went into the process like very clear-eyed , like very bright-eyed and want to change the world and all that . And after the placements everything was like fine and great . Things began to go wrong with the whole court situation and I decided to start taking notes and keep everything . I thought , okay , one day , when we make it to the end , whatever that end might be I would like to share our story with other parents , but also kind of like with the general community , so they know what's actually going on this children's courts , that nobody people hear about them but they really don't know what , how they're set up and what's going on in them . And so I so I had like several boxes I would throw like the court orders in faxes . Back then we had faxes . Faxes were very important because faxes were the written proof that you delivered some piece of information into the courtrooms and I was also keeping a diary . And so we finalized adoptions and I couldn't face it . I just couldn't face it . I was going through such PTSD . After three years of dealing with this

Marriage and Legal Recognition

Speaker 2

I'm like , oh , the last thing I want to do is look at any of those files . So it took me about four years until I was finally able to well like , okay , let's go and see , because I know the story is there , I just want to see , like , what can I do with it ? And then it took me another eight years to write the first draft .

Speaker 2

And this was the book I never planned to write , because I'm trained as a linguist and I do write quite a lot on sociolinguistics and publish quite a bit . I mean , I write other things too , but back then this was a new thing for me and so I was learning how to stitch a narrative together . It was great . So once I finished the draft I was looking for a publisher and my publisher it's a traditional press housed at Portland State University , but it's a very interesting press . It's a teaching press , so it's affiliated with a master's in publishing at PSU , at Portland State University .

Speaker 2

So we talk about graduate students who are working on your book , editing it , designing , coming up with a marketing plan , all those things but under the supervision of professionals from the field who are teaching them how to do that . So I have this sort of a double benefit of having the professionals but also having , like , very enthusiastic students putting their blood , sweat and tears into my book and they only put out four books a year , like there are 30 of them . So I got a lot of attention so it so it was a great process . It was a great process , so I'm very pleased with the way the book came out and all that . But after it came out , I would say the most of the marketing and promotion is kind of lies with me . So I did a book tour last year with 12 stops . We started in portland with a launch and I gave two lectures at portland state and then went down the west Coast , la Palm Springs , all the way down to Mexico City . Oh , wow , yeah , and so now I'm talking about different radio channels and also podcasts .

Speaker 1

Okay , that's where I am with the book . Yes , all right . And where can people find your book ? Are you on Amazon , are you ?

Speaker 2

Yeah , it's on Amazon Bookshop . If you'd like me to sign it for you , you can also go on my website . I have a pretty active website which is laneigoodincom L-A-N-E-I-G-O-U-D-I-N . Laneigoodincom . I'm also active on social media , on Instagram and Facebook , so you can find me there . I've been also writing , because the thing is like with parenting , like just when you finally learn how to deal with a certain age group , right , they're on to the next .

Speaker 1

It's like catch you up , catch you up .

Speaker 2

So , like barely , did we learn how to deal with preteens ? Now we've got two adolescent girls in the house . Right , you're in for it for a few years and finally , okay , now I got it down . Now there are young ladies like young women . Boyfriends and boyfriends have families . It's just like this whole whole new reality . So I've been writing quite a lot on parenting , but also on LGBTQ issues . With parenting . I just published a piece on empty nesting in the Jewish Journal here in Los Angeles , which was very , very interesting because it's like this is something new to us . It's just the two of us . Our younger daughter is off to college and the older one is living on her own , but nearby , so it's different . And I also write for the gay media I actually access from . The book appeared on LGBTQ Nation and some other publications , and I reviewed books for Lambda Literary Review . So it's like I'm switching . I started as a linguist but I'm now switching more into writing and I've written Family Equality several times three pieces there . So I enjoy that so much more .

Speaker 1

Yeah Well , thank you so much for sharing your story and I hope that the way that you've told your story is inspiring for people who are considering the adoption process , especially looking in their local community . I definitely respect that . I mean , there are , of course , children all over the world , but starting at home , in your local community .

Speaker 2

Starting at home . Exactly , yeah , exactly .

Speaker 1

Thank you , Dr Agudin , for coming on the show Again . The author of A Family , Maybe Two Dads , Two Babies , and the Court Cases that Brought Us Together . You can find the book on Amazon Bookshop or on his website . I'll link everything in the show notes . Go out and get the book and learn about maybe a time before you were out and a time where equality was not the norm , and hopefully we can learn from history so that we can address some of the issues that might be coming along now in this current administration .

Speaker 2

Absolutely . Thank you for having me on your show , Angelica . Thank you .

Speaker 1

All right , take care .