In the Club
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In the Club
EP45: The Rise of Cheerleading: Beyond Pom-Poms
Get in touch with us directly today
The world of competitive cheerleading is nothing like what you see in movies. Forget pom-poms and sidelines – All-Star cheerleading is a dynamic, athletic discipline that's just earned Olympic status and is rapidly growing across the UK.
Charles from the British Cheerleading Association joins us to pull back the curtain on this often misunderstood sport. Founded in 1984, the BCA provides cheerleading and dance events throughout the UK, with their season running from December to June across ten major competitions. Charles explains how All-Star cheerleading differs from sideline performances, focusing on teams competing against each other rather than supporting other sports.
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So have you seen the new version of the Office?
Speaker 2:I haven't, but I have asked for your Now TV subscription details so I can watch it.
Speaker 1:I'll give you it, but you've just told the world that we're about to pull that illegal. Now TV move Oops. No, we won't do that. We won't do that. No, we won't Right. Oh, it's going. Hello Charles From the British Chain Association, I can't see it. No, I can't say it. You're right. What's that? Yeah, rebecca's here. Yes, you can hear us Hang on. Sorry To put you on, there's nobody there. It was all a big ruse just to introduce our guest. It's going to be coming soon. Oh, it's.
Speaker 2:Charles from the British Cheerleading Association.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is indeed. How are you anyway?
Speaker 2:I'm good. How are you?
Speaker 1:I'm not bad. What have you been up to Today?
Speaker 2:or I'm not bad. What have you been up to today?
Speaker 1:or more generally, speaking well generally, we've not sat and done this actually for about nine months, yeah. I think we've done maybe one, not an intro, have we?
Speaker 2:yeah, I think we've done one intro. I'm that forgettable yeah, well, I've been off having a baby back oh, we did do it.
Speaker 1:I remember this chat boring, boring, my child is boring, how is said child, said child is good.
Speaker 2:He's now at the stage where, when I tell him no he's 10 months, for context, and I've been trying to gently encourage him. When he's doing something I don't want to do, he's saying ah, ah, no, thank you. And he's now starting to laugh and also cry when I do these things, depending on his mood.
Speaker 1:So what do you do? You say no.
Speaker 2:I turn normally to him and I'll be like no, ah, ah, ah. And then I say no, thank you.
Speaker 1:You've made his name a bit too near a no.
Speaker 2:That's what my dad keeps saying.
Speaker 1:So it's like you go no, ah, and he'll be like and you're like no, a no.
Speaker 2:I know. So anyway, other than painting and working, I don't think there's much else I've been up to.
Speaker 1:That is it holiday, have I?
Speaker 2:no, I'm going away this weekend and I'm going to Espanol very nice, very good.
Speaker 1:Well, I'm going to Spain as well, but I'm going with the company and they don't allow babies on the trips no, no, well, they're letting you that was just primed. That was primed. Who have we got this week right enough, although we identified on my mystery phone call which isn't plugged in.
Speaker 2:I'm sure the viewers and the listeners had to really try really hard to come up with that Suspend the disbelief. We have Charles from the British Cheer Association.
Speaker 1:We do. We first bumped into Charles when we were at the I think it's called the Regionals, the All-Star Regionals, and it was a huge big cheer competition that we went down to. We had Jack and Caitlin down there. We met this lovely man that was in charge of the association's events and we have been in touch with him since he came up because we were doing he was actually doing an event over the weekend. We um attended that as well. But, yeah, I think that we're going to be doing a lot more in this space and with bc as a whole.
Speaker 2:Charles is a lovely guy yes, it was really nice to sit down and chat with him, and you know I'm not going to say too much because we're about to get into it. But we are lots of good pieces of information and just a little bit of a background on who the BCA are as well and I would have pulled out pom-poms and whatnot and done a bit of a cheer here, but we won't.
Speaker 1:And you'll find out why. As Association, we have with us today Charles from BCA with an amazing represented hat on as well. Bca Originals. Bca stands for British Cheerleading. Association it does indeed, and thank you so much for coming up today.
Speaker 3:It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 1:You came all the way from.
Speaker 3:The Midlands Northamptonshire.
Speaker 1:Okay, I can't remember where it was.
Speaker 2:I had no idea, but we did discover it was a six-hour drive.
Speaker 3:Yeah, six hours left at half five.
Speaker 1:We must have been near it before, like Nottingham near.
Speaker 3:Keep going about an hour.
Speaker 2:Oh really Loughborough.
Speaker 3:Close.
Speaker 2:Oh well, that's where Access HQ is, and we are part of the.
Speaker 3:Access group. Oh, oh well, that's where Access HQ is, and we are part of the Access group.
Speaker 1:Now we kind of know roughly where we're talking about. I know we could have. Well, there's always next time. We know that because any time we've had to go to the HQ.
Speaker 2:It's kind of like a planes, trains and automobiles effort, or planes and taxis, planes and taxis. What happened? Well, a few things happened. First of all, Stephen and I were flying down to Loughborough for an access training thing and the captain comes over the tannoy and he's like this is what we're expecting, arrival time, and just so you know, your cabin crew, rebecca and Stephen, will be on board to assist you. So immediately we were like oh. And then we were like oh, our part-time jobs. And then we were getting off the flight. We were like to this other, stephen and Rebecca, which must have been so weird?
Speaker 1:We had had a drink.
Speaker 2:We were like, can we get a photo with you? And they were like what?
Speaker 1:And we were like we're Stephen and the Bigger and they were like okay, so we've got this awkward picture of these people going.
Speaker 3:So what you thought was hilarious?
Speaker 2:they were just like yeah that is a common feeling for Stephen and I. We will find things then. On the way back, we were nearly in a car accident. The taxi driver was literally falling asleep at the wheel.
Speaker 1:It just was like like that, right across lanes of traffic and be like, ah, and then he's like I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine, please pull over I know it's kind of trauma, I think so you had a drink on the way there and the taxi driver.
Speaker 2:I think it's just been working so long, so we were just thankful to touch back down in sc soil Kind of no roughly we are. It comes with some baggage and trauma, charles, if you ever come down, I'll make sure no one's drinking.
Speaker 1:If you could pick us up, that'd be great. Yeah, I'll pick you up. I'm not really reliant on the taxi services.
Speaker 2:Yeah, actually you could make some money off us when we go to Loughborough next time Well welcome to Glasgow Not your first time in Glasgow.
Speaker 3:No, I've been here many a times this year.
Speaker 2:This year alone.
Speaker 3:This year alone, I've been up here many a times With BCA, with BCA and visiting dance schools, chilling gyms and, yeah, doing showcases and other things like that.
Speaker 1:So what is your role at BCA?
Speaker 3:So my role in the BCA? I'm the head of merchandise and logistics, so I control all the merchandise at events, produce it in-house, as well as dealing with people like in china, um, india, turkey, all that kind of thing. There's a wide variety of suppliers, um, and then logistics. I do make sure everything gets to the competitions on time run the events yeah, and sorting out. Well, people rock up to the. They see all the venues set up. My job is to get all the equipment there and do that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's part of, on a much, much smaller scale, what we do here, and the logistics side of it is very tricky if you've not got an infrastructure in place and whatnot.
Speaker 3:Oh yeah, so I've worked with the BCA since 2017. I did their photography and their media because I used to own a company that did that so you're no stranger to this environment no stranger to this environment. I've got one of these at home.
Speaker 3:I love it nice, excellent, excellent but no, yeah, so I used to run all that for them as a separate company and then 20, january 24, I came on full time as the merchandise and logistics. So I'd never done logistics, so I learned everything from scratch. I know all the types of lorries now, which was quite interesting because people were talking to me about it and had no idea, but it's a very adaptable environment to work in.
Speaker 2:Now most of our listeners, if they're tuning in from the dance kind of cheer space, will know what the bca is.
Speaker 3:But just in the off chances, a few people listening or watching the podcast out there tell us a little bit about the bca and give us a boilerplate so the bca started in 1984 and they are an event provider in this country and they provide cheerleading and dance events to the all-star world all over the uk except for ireland.
Speaker 2:We're not in ireland yet yet yet maybe some stuff to come, that's, that's a market we're definitely looking at I know plain whatever we're going to do to get there yeah, no.
Speaker 3:So we're in england, wales and scotland. We run what this season. We've got 10 events going on all over. We also. What else do we do? I haven't got a clue.
Speaker 2:You know lorry types. I mean that's a pretty impressive set of skills.
Speaker 3:I know lorry types yeah.
Speaker 1:What do you class as a season?
Speaker 3:As a season. So our season runs from December to June Okay, the all-star season, because there are other event providers, but it tends to run from November to July. But yeah, our specific season is December to June. We have 10 events in there.
Speaker 1:And when you say All-Stars, that's what's interesting to me, because we've met and dealt with a number of cheer clubs over the years Tycoon All-Stars. We have Cheer London All-Stars, who we know less than so long, but I just thought that they were all naming themselves the same name.
Speaker 2:I thought it was really odd. Yeah, I mean, I did too. Actually, that's me, they're really lazily just going.
Speaker 3:Oh, we'll just call it all-stars, but it's not that there's a reason so, to my understanding, because I'm not clued up on the scoring side, however, there's different types. So if you was, the biggest stereotype to someone that doesn't know is a pom-pom. Yes, you don't see that.
Speaker 2:That's right. I remember discovering that with Sophie, we bought boxes of them.
Speaker 1:We've got pom-poms. And they're like we don't do pom-poms.
Speaker 3:Yeah, from my understanding, pom well, pom is a certain type of dance in the all-star world and it's my favorite type of dance because it's very energetic, very poppy, and they use basically you've got sidelines, so the stuff that you'll see at like Dallas Cowboys or the side of an NFL game, that's sideline cheer, whereas this is all-star, they're competing against each other. They're not cheering for someone other than themselves and the spectators in the arena. Yeah, that's my understanding and it's very, it's not um.
Speaker 2:It's not what we thought essentially um, no, not that side of it, but one of the surprising things. Or maybe not surprising, maybe just a little bit of a different take, but sophie was very much when she was up.
Speaker 2:She was talking about, you know lots of different things, but one of the things we were curious is of how are you going to expand? Are you looking to go, you know, to a new location? It was like no, like she was like we are, you know, the cheer club for this specific area of london and actually there's a bigger, I guess, sense of community amongst that team, which shouldn't be surprising, but it is, you know, like sometimes you have this view of competitiveness but actually the community building within the team is kind of the thing that it's amazing to see we so like.
Speaker 3:Part of my role is I go out to the gym, showcases and during event days I'm walking around and I'm talking to coaches and everything.
Speaker 3:And these clubs, they're like family yeah they like the kids, they do spend a lot of their time in the gyms and we're like going into those gyms and seeing it. They are very close knit, very community based and it's generally really lovely to see. But yeah, it's also very competitive as well. And me coming into the world having never done it before. My sister-in-law was, she was a cheerleader, she was a judge. That's how I got into the industry but I thought it was so small. But it's such a hidden world it's unreal.
Speaker 1:That's what I think exactly. We're finding. You kind of lift the lid on it a little bit. Obviously, we met you initially when Jack Lather from our sales team and Caitlin were down at your event. When was that now? In April.
Speaker 3:That was in May, so that was at our All-Star Nationals, that's your big, big event, yeah, where they were quite like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, this seems exactly like that. We've lifted a curtain here and there's something behind it which seems to be really really big and really powerful. Yeah, and also, bc has been going since 1984. Yeah, going since 1984. Yeah, but there was a big change in the sport this year was there With the Olympic status?
Speaker 3:It was the last year, right? So, yeah, for several years now they've been trying to get into, get Olympic status, which has now been given. Yeah, it just has to be elected as a sport. Uh-huh, this well. Actually, last month, the World Games took place. Duo cheer um went over there and represented team gb. It was four athletes, two from up here and then two from telford, and the guys from telford.
Speaker 2:they went onto the stage, absolutely smashed it and, um, yeah, represented the sport very well yeah because I think we worked with tyke or tycoon all-stars I think it was vanessa and jane and they were up gosh, maybe about two years ago now, and at that point they were getting ready to go to the states, yeah, to do competing. So it's kind of this like I think we've heard rumblings of cheer for a couple of years but, as steven sort of alluded to there, kind of this year we've been like whoa, like this mat, this market's massive and, um, to kind of see, it's not just even within the uk, it's like worldwide and we've got clubs like from Scotland, from England, going over to the States to compete in these kind of things that you do think sometimes like oh, movies, like America, like cheerleading, but actually there's this kind of community here and there's community within the clubs and it's all different. And the fact that we've got clubs going over to the States to compete is just I find that quite mind-blowing oh, it is.
Speaker 3:no, it is incredible. Um, yeah, I mean when, as soon as you say cheerleader, it's definitely you think of America. Yeah, like straight away, it's America. It's the side of a football pitch, but yeah, over here there's so much talent. And yes, you mentioned the World Championship, which happens every year in.
Speaker 3:April in Florida. Like there's guys over here that they've globed, which effectively is you get it's bronze silver, gold if you globe. You get one of those three, so you're one of the best in the world, and there's teams in this country that have got all of those and it's incredible I think it's that recognition of how much of a sport it actually is.
Speaker 2:And, like you know, gymnastics we refer to sometimes it's the foundation for many other things that kids will do gymnastics and then they go on to other sports and achieve great things. And actually I think cheerleading kind of falls in that category as well. Of you know, when you do think of cheerleading as that kind of American movie side of a pitch, but actually like the skill, the technique, the performance, the determination of these kids.
Speaker 3:These guys are athletes. It's insane to watch and, like Caitlin and Jack that came like I, could see that they had to pick their jaw up because they were just like I did not realise yeah like these guys can do that, or we've seen the footage.
Speaker 1:Like I say and I spoke to you before we came on here Caitlin, our social media expert, yes, yes, when she was down at the event, done lots of little reels, or whatever the kids call these. What do they call them stories?
Speaker 2:No, it depends like reels TikTok whatever she was doing. She was doing TikTokies and they actually really blew up, but that doesn't surprise you at all, because this community is super engaged they love a good reel on TikTok, no matter who it is they love yeah, there was no even if they tell you they don't, they do and I think one of the things that kind of surprises me most is that it's a sport in its own right but there is a lot of crossover between dance and gymnastics. Am I right?
Speaker 3:and kind of there is there is in a sense, yes, um, that's so. When with the olympic status, um, that was the sort of roadblocks that they were coming up against because they wouldn't accept it, because they were like, oh well, it clashes with gymnastics, so they found a way around that and then it was a case of right.
Speaker 3:It clashes with dance now and eventually they found a way around that. But in my opinion it is a sport in its own right and these guys are athletes. Yeah, and they're without swearing, they're really good they're really good.
Speaker 2:We can bleep, but no, I'd like I.
Speaker 3:I respect every athlete that goes out there and does what they do, because I know for sure I couldn't and it's like incredible.
Speaker 2:So do we typically then tend to see cheer as sort of the all-stars academies by themselves, as standalones, or do we tend to see actually like there's opportunity for you know dance schools and gymnastics clubs out there to have you know break offs and branches into other sessions?
Speaker 3:so a lot of them do now have. So there's a lot of gymnastics um clubs and dance schools that are incorporating it now okay, um?
Speaker 2:there's additional revenue streams for them, isn't it?
Speaker 3:it's expanding, it is another stream of revenue and it is. It is a growing sport in this country. Um, it tends to be that if there's a cheerleading gym, they do eventually branch into dance, and it is starting to go the other way as well, and I have come across recently gymnastics are branching into it, like my daughter's gym. They're looking for a cheerleading coach right because they've seen like the opportunity and the recreational side is effective where the gyms that are standalone, they recreational is their back burner and it's how they develop these kids into world's athletes.
Speaker 3:It's not necessarily like well. It's how they develop these kids into world's athletes. It's not necessarily like well.
Speaker 2:It's, like you said, the community base yeah it's rec where it starts yeah and it's yeah, because I think like sometimes if you're thinking about expansion or business growth, the easy thing to think of is, right, well, we'll get a new venue in a new location, or we could try this type of you know, this type of dance. But actually expanding into a market that's already growing, that there's demand for, is probably actually the savvier decision, which I guess. Or we could try this type of dance but actually expanding into a market that's already growing, that there's demand for, is probably actually the savvier decision, which I guess kind of brings us on nicely to the reason that you're in Glasgow and the event that you're hosting and opportunity. So are you seeing like a rise in the number of, maybe attendees at those events coming not only from the discipline of cheer but actually seeing a cross-discipline between dance and gymnastics as well?
Speaker 3:Massively of cheer but actually seeing a cross discipline between dance and gymnastics yeah, there's such an increase in it and everyone it's rather than going off finding a new location, everyone is trying to use what they've got, and it is. Yeah, there is the crossover from gymnastics, because you've already got the tumbling skills, you've got the location, you've got the location. So it is a case of right. How can we do this and like that's something as a company we do. We've got the bce, which is our education side, offering the coaches qualifications. Yeah, that's where we've seen a lot of growth in.
Speaker 2:They're coming over, they're wanting to be a coach and, yeah, progress well, because then you've not only got the opportunity to upsell to your current customers, get you know the kids that are already there involved in these classes. But then there's that opportunity, but then there's the opportunity of a brand new set of customers that have this unique interest in cheerleading.
Speaker 3:So it just makes sense to do it so what would you advise?
Speaker 2:if there's a listener out there just now either watching or listening to the podcast, if they're thinking, say, they're a dance tutor, or they're thinking you know, say they're a dance tutor, or you know they're a gymnastics coach and they're curious to know more about this, what? What should they do?
Speaker 3:reach out, reach out to us and we can. Yeah, we can have a chat and go through that, and yeah, because everyone's different, so I could say something specific yeah but it may not be necessary to them. So it's yeah, reach out to us and we can have a chat. Great.
Speaker 1:So the rest of your year, then actual calendar year, let's say so you've got. We're going to be attending an event with you guys on Sunday in Glasgow and then the following week in London. Yep, and that's conferences, that's kind of teacher-based.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so that's our coaches conference, that's our education side, that is basically giving back to our community and offering seminars and workshops from a variety of speakers and you said there was americans flying in for that yeah, so we've got uh, coaches from american teams coming over and they're delivering workshops this year. They're very they've got a massive reputation for yeah over there. Yeah, they're coming over helping the kids out, showing them different things, and coaches can learn from it and so what kind of workshops do you run?
Speaker 2:then give us an idea of what the day looks like so we have got tory from denver.
Speaker 3:He is in colorado. You actually look and sound a bit like him.
Speaker 2:I hate to break it to you.
Speaker 1:I've been modern in your work.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, you went too southern there.
Speaker 3:He'll probably kill me if he watches this and he'll correct me on this as well. He choreographed the Hip Hop World Champion and one of them, because there's certain divisions Hip Hop he is amazing at. But then he scared me last year because he came over and he started doing a lyrical workshop as well and I never knew he could do that because he's very much. If you saw him you'd think hip-hop straight away yeah but then all of a sudden, he was busting out these lyrical moves and you're like that, oh wow full of surprises.
Speaker 1:I didn't know what lyrical meant until I mean, do you know yet? Like if lyrical dance was to be performed in front of you the difference is Potentially not Essentially, it's in the word, isn't it? I mean, I might be wrong. What?
Speaker 2:is it quite like? Flamboyant, yeah, that's the kind of thing I'm picturing.
Speaker 1:Imagine Pink Pony Girl.
Speaker 2:Right, okay Are you are you happy with that analogy, charles?
Speaker 3:it was the song really oh yeah, stephen's favourite.
Speaker 1:I cut you off. I'm sorry no, it's fine, come six hours that's right, so you have actually travelled six hours.
Speaker 3:We'll get that in because that is some dedication, and you came a few days before the conference which is on Sunday.
Speaker 1:Today it's Friday. At the time of recording I don't even know what camera I'm looking at. There's too many. No, we really appreciate you coming up, and so the rest of the year. That's what I was talking about. We are going to chat after this as well about where else we can get involved in some of the events you're putting on, you've got.
Speaker 3:So to kick off our season is blackpool, which is at the winter gardens.
Speaker 1:It's a really good venue we've been done back a few times, many stories, good and bad, but the winter gardens itself, that's lovely.
Speaker 3:Oh, it's amazing like we kick off every year in blackpool in in the ballroom, and like it's amazing that the atmosphere is brilliant because I mean winter gardens dresses it up like christmas yeah, yeah and then obviously you got the lights, yeah it's amazing and, yeah, the atmosphere is incredible.
Speaker 3:Um, and this year we're actually we've got the ballroom and normally there's like a little conference type room next door, but we've actually taken on olympia as well, right, okay, yeah, so we've got pretty much the back end of winter garden, so it's going to be a much bigger event this year, and is that like the clubs that are coming themselves?
Speaker 2:are they bringing young people with them? What does that look like on the night?
Speaker 3:it's a wide variety, okay yeah, so you've got all at the minute. I mean, like our registration opened this week and I think we're seeing around 25 different gyms coming at the minute um, from all over the country because purely for the fact that they love blackpool and when you say that as well, you say 25 different gyms.
Speaker 1:How many people per gym? Is it not like a lot?
Speaker 3:it can vary.
Speaker 1:That's fools, though it can be a lot.
Speaker 3:Oh, yeah, yeah yeah, I mean wouldn't recommend a bus in Winter Gardens because you can't get down those streets. But yeah, you're talking anything from 20 kids up to 150. I say kids, but it varies from like five year olds to the master's division, which is our age. Yeah, if not older, I did get probably a bit older than you think well, I did.
Speaker 3:Uh, there was one that I can. I can't remember the team, but we used to. We used to photograph the event still do but one of my photographers was sat in the center of the mat and a master's team came on and it was a dad that was probably mid-50s, massive like white beard, did a roly-poly forward and then winked at my photographer and he's wearing a bow in his beard and everything. It was brilliant. And she couldn't photograph the rest of the routine because she was in stitches.
Speaker 3:Oh, really, because he it was brilliant and she couldn't photograph the rest of the routine because she was in stitches, because he winked at her, she was gone.
Speaker 2:But it's great fun great fun to watch as well but I love that it's not the stereotype of what you would picture for cheerleading, and I love that. I love that it kind of breaks down that stereotype and actually anybody can do it oh yeah, massively yeah, yeah there's a lot of fun to be had in it, not just performing it but learning it.
Speaker 1:It's a fun class.
Speaker 1:I got that from Sophie Bastock, which is Cheer London All Stars what you mentioned earlier on about the community thing was very much because when we spoke to her we were like so it sounded like such a tight thing she had. So are you thinking about franchising this? Are you thinking about what's your next steps? And she's like I'm happy. You know, it was kind of like I've got my community, we've got this kind of area locked off and I can't remember what area she's in, but she's like we are South London, south London.
Speaker 2:So she's like we are South London and that's what we want to be known for. We don't want to go North London or East London. It's like we are in the South. But yeah, she had us doing all sorts. We had to, what you'll do later on our Friday at 4. We won't get you to do that, but we did get physical that day, in that we went into two teams and we had to learn a cheer and perform it in front of everybody else. Remember the cheer? No, I can't actually. You do it.
Speaker 3:I don't remember. No, he does, he does, he just wants to do it on camera.
Speaker 2:It was like doing like we are class for kids or something like that. I was really cramming. No.
Speaker 3:I wasn't no, no, no. Class for kids.
Speaker 2:It was something like that but there was like loads of people who weren't in that day, so we were like we should literally all do this on Monday, like the people that were there just stand up and literally just do it and sort of cult. But it was really fun, it was a good way to get us involved and our partner was there and we filmed lots of it and things like that as well, so it's a nice introduction.
Speaker 1:It's very fun, yeah, and then you've got event wise, the Scottish Sensation, and that's is that next year yeah, so that is taking place in March right, and that's not far from here, literally a stone's throw from here, isn't it Literally a stone's throw? Yeah, you could watch it from the window.
Speaker 3:What is?
Speaker 2:it, the Radisson.
Speaker 3:At the SEC. Oh is it you wouldn't be able to fit it in the Radisson.
Speaker 2:No, I was wondering when you said that.
Speaker 3:No, that's where we held our conference. That's where we held your conference yeah. Oh nice, yeah no, which again that's growing as well. We're taking on the biggest hall in the SEC. We used to be in the Armadillo, but it just wasn't big enough right okay for what we were offering it wouldn't be right either, really would it?
Speaker 1:because the Armadillo, because it's more of a theatre based, you'd be kind of it worked.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but it just it yeah what a nice story, though, like we used to be here right next door, but actually we've outgrown this and now we're taking on the biggest hall in what was one of Scotland's main music venues before the hydro came.
Speaker 1:I think it's still Scotland's biggest exhibition space.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, the biggest exhibition space. That's where you went and see all the bands that toured the world come there, and now actually, you're taking over one of those halls so it's showing how it's growing.
Speaker 1:Oh it's amazing, like I did the armadillo, and it is nice I've been doing it. Well, the armadillo for those that are not glaswegian or people are frequent glasgow visitors, it's just a big building. It kind of looks like sydney opera house. Yeah, yeah, and it's a it's actual at the opera house kind of concert venue that looks just like an armadillo. So glaswegians call the armadillo.
Speaker 1:Very, very quick side note in this the venue next to that is the Hydro, which I've seen, when they built that, everybody in Glasgow started calling it the Pie, because it looks just like a pie.
Speaker 3:It looks just like a pie.
Speaker 1:But then they had a massive influx of marketing money to try and get that, get rid of the pie. I didn't even know that it was called the Pie, yeah, yeah totally, but everyone, oh, we'll call and the pie we just like to name, after things, the squinty bridge yeah, yeah, so we've got a bridge, which is just slightly squinty and there's the squiggly bridge just down.
Speaker 2:Squiggly bridge which one's the squiggly bridge so the squiggly one's like closer to town, closer to where the Radisson is, and it's kind of like it, kind of squiggles, like that, it's like oh okay, and if you're having, you can take a wander down that way and you can see the squiggly bridge from the squinty bridge and vice versa so that's Glasgow everybody welcome to Glasgow.
Speaker 1:Charles, thank you so much for coming up no, thank you for having me. I can't wait to see what we can do more of together event space and kind of beyond. And then we're going to have some conversations later on today about thank you once again, and I'm going to need to somehow kind of wangle away to get one of those cool caps off them.
Speaker 2:I don't know if you're cool enough to wear it, though that's the problem. I think I'm pretty cool we'll talk about this in the intro.
Speaker 1:We won't mention the fact that I had to put on a blue top, because when I sat next to that, I faded in because I had an orange top on. So we'll keep that away from it.
Speaker 2:I know, but you also said, you look like an iron brew.
Speaker 1:I was gonna say what did you look like an iron brew.
Speaker 2:I was going to say what did you look like? Just like a head. No, I think you are very much like iron brew colours. I think we should try and end with a cheer. I mean, why are you looking at us, charles? It's the cheering. No, no, you and I cheering. Oh no, please, we'll be here all day, awkward.
Speaker 1:CFK BCA okay, okay, but you lead, I don't know. Okay, I'll judge you. Yeah, okay, you be the judge, right, I'll do one, you do one.
Speaker 2:No, no, no, no. I don't like this pressure. No, I don't. I have to get off this camera, right?
Speaker 1:now. I don't want to do this. I've walked everybody in an awkward situation and we're just going to end it there. Guys, what?
Speaker 2:coming on, charles, and for saving me from that. You're very welcome. You want me to do it? That would be good yeah is that what I'm here for? No, what a great interview with charles, great person to meet, great partnership potentially coming absolutely you talk about, and lots of good ideas there for cheer schools are listening and but also for dance schools and gymnastics clubs as well yep, he's a great guy.
Speaker 1:I mean, it's always for me when we're getting into these relationships. It always helps when the people are cool, and when we first spoke to Charles after we'd met him initially, we'd done like a teams call with him and his quote from then was if we're going to do anything together, it just needs to be awesome, and I think that that sentiment is kind of what I'm kind of saying, is that because doing how to be cool? Well, yeah, I've always tried to be cool yeah, this is abuse on camera.
Speaker 1:If you are listening, this is not fun anymore yeah no, no, um, be awesome. I think that and we will end up doing things with them, hopefully very soon, maybe this year, if not very beginning of next year um, and yeah, I just want to do it.
Speaker 2:Awesome, that'd be good and I think like the main thing in it for our listeners was the way Charles kind of spoke about how cheer is its thing within its own right. I think there's a lot of stereotypes around cheer and I wanted to ask we carried them all? We did. We carried them. We had Sophie from Cheer London All Stars attend and we had pom-poms ready to go and she was like, ah, that's that's what I did. My she was like, nope, that's not, that's not what cheer is.
Speaker 1:And actually that opened her eyes into how much more the sport is, and just yeah, what you see, or think about american cheerleading, or you've seen in sort of sideline, remember that was the terminology, so sideline is what we think of as cheer yeah, like high school n yeah, yeah but then all-star is, and this is the thing as well. We've dealt with and interviewed a number of cheer clubs over time. They've always had all-star in the name and I've always thought like why have they all got the same name?
Speaker 1:it's kind of a lazy way, it's like, I suppose it's like football club, it's like all-star, but that's the actual discipline, that's the sport.
Speaker 2:And it's wrong to assume.
Speaker 1:It's wrong to assume, because to assume makes An ass of you and me. Do you get it? There you go. You can take that one. You can take that one to the bank. But yeah, it was really good to learn a lot more about cheer. Charles stayed on afterwards and done some stand-up with us, with our MD Dunk, thoroughly embarrassed him in the way that dunk only can do. You missed that part of it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you're lucky, um but the main thing I think that I take away from that as well as it is, it's it's sport in its own right. You know, olympic sport status coming as well into play. Um is the fact that there are opportunities for our existing customers, or you know, customers that might be aligned with class for kids, into thinking, okay, well, there's actually opportunity here for me to upsell, to cross, cross-sell and to make more money and revenue streams. You know, if you're sitting here listening to this podcast or watching it today, it's about what opportunities are there for my dance school to then actually start a cheer element of that, or likewise with gymnastics in the gym. You've got the space to do these things. You already know what it is to have competitive or non-competitive squads or non-competitive squad, so why don't you apply that to a different discipline while you've got the space?
Speaker 1:completely and I think that's where they're seeing the growth in cheer in the UK with things like that kind of bolting it on, they've got the other side to their. The British Cheer Association is the British Cheer BCE, the British Cheer Education, and that's where you, as a dance school teacher or a performance arts or really anybody that wants to get into, can do the step-by-step four steps, four different courses.
Speaker 1:I think there's like seven levels and I think level six and seven very reasonably priced um to allow you to kind of enter into that cheer world and maybe have it as a class initially and maybe grow from there. But that's certainly where, at the event we were at the weekend, a number of the people there were exactly that. They were already dance schools before.
Speaker 2:They were cheer schools, yeah, and they've kind of became cheer because they've adopted that as a new discipline and a new kind of outlet and you look at ways like maybe you've exhausted, you know growth avenues, or you think you have, because you've got all of your class types. You've put on more of the most popular one, you've gone to location that's most you know popular as well, and and that's great. And then you're thinking like what else can I do? And if you don't have any more dance styles to offer, then potentially this is a great route for you to go down, because there's new opportunity and there'll be a. You know you can upsell to your existing customers to attend more classes. Or there's that opportunity to widen the net and bring more customers to you who are, you know, not aware of your offering yet, and things like that so I think the bc, as you said, you know they have the course.
Speaker 2:There's lots of different things around how you install that into your school, like what's the marketing that you need to go around it. And of course they do their day events as well, where teachers and coaches can go and attend and learn.
Speaker 1:I think, there's people from America no, no, completely, and that's it when I say cheat event. The one that we initially went to with them was an cheer do it? Oh, not that, but you know what I mean. Like it was a cheer, cheer class for kids. It's good, but the one the weekend and the one that we're going to this weekend was a conference specifically for coaches and teachers. And yeah, they're flying folk over from America because obviously they've got I think it's genuinely 70 years ahead of us experiencing kind of all-star cheer. But they're very serious as we are, and that's where we do kind of a line about kind of upskilling the people within their stable of not talent but their kind of customer base. But yeah, there's hopefully lots more to come very quickly, particularly in the BC education as well.
Speaker 2:I can't say what's to come can't possibly say but there might be something coming, so we'll just leave it at that that there might be something to look out for that you might want to enter.
Speaker 1:We like to do that, we like to.
Speaker 2:Just one for you, one for you, one for you definitely keep an eye on our social channels for something that could be coming that could help and save money in the long run it's phoning in hello, what's that one?
