Gilbert's It's All about the MEDIA
I talk about certain things in the media such as filmmakers, studios, movies in general, and Q & A's with YouTubers and other people.
Gilbert's It's All about the MEDIA
Episode 43
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Jesus and Gilbert talk about the 40 year screen presence of one horrors famous cannibal, Hannibal Lecter.
All right, guys, and welcome to today's episode of the podcast. I are back together for the year or for the new year. And um today we're gonna talk about something that um I mean, one, I need content. The other is, I mean, I was just like for the first time ever, I was watching a movie, and then I thought, what if we'd use this as content? And I feel like the like the theme of today, um, I know some of y'all could have could have figured, like, hey, why aren't you why aren't you wait till you know October of this year? And I could have. It's just I feel like if I did wait, I'm probably gonna forget about it. So might as well just talk about it now. And yeah, that that way I can't just it won't be like another Indiana Jones thing where I just talk about, say, I'm gonna talk about Indiana Jones, and it took me like two years to actually talk about it. So today we're gonna talk about um a character in horror that this year has been uh on the screen for 40 years, and that is Hannibal Lecter. And I know some people are gonna be like, wait, hold on. They're gonna go back, they're gonna look at Silence of the Lambs, and they're gonna be like, Gilbert, you're off by five years, it's been 35 years. Yes, true. Like Hannibal Lecter is known or um is famously played by Anthony Hopkins, who won his Oscar um for the role. But what a lot of people don't know is that Anthony Hopkins isn't the first person to ever play the silence, I mean, the yeah, the silence, but he's not the first person to ever play uh Hannibal Lecter. The the very first person to ever play Hannibal Lecter is Brian Cox in a movie called Manhunter. And when I told his seos like about this idea, and when I said I started watching Manhunter for the first time, I was jokingly saying, Where's the Martian? Again, if you get it, if y'all get the joke, you get the joke. Which by the way, James, if you're listening to this, I doubt you are, but if you're listening to this, we gotta get him on that in that universe you're building up because we've kind of already had him, and Zach kind of messed it up there. But to my point, um, yeah, so it's gonna actually be 40 years of Hannibal Lecter. Like I said, um, or th or 35 years of the Silence of the Lambs. And weirdly enough, could this can actually go well because um if I had maybe waited a couple of weeks, but maybe again I probably would have forgotten. I know the Silence of the Lands came out in February of 1991. Um, but I figure, you know, let's just it's still earlier in the year, let's still talk about the Hannibal Elector because one, he's famous, he's a very famous, um, what is it? Like a very famous character in horror. I mean, what did you say, or wouldn't you like kind of rank him like somewhere in the top 10 or 20 history? Because I know I probably would.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, definitely I would. Um, even if it's like a lot of the new generations may not know who Hannibal is. Um, I mean, i even if they have never seen it, it's something that is mentioned uh in a lot of a lot of lists. So yeah, I would definitely think he's on top there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so let's just start it off this way. So, first of all, in case most people don't know this, um the Hannibal Lecter movies were based off books by Thomas Harris, who wrote all of the um the Hannibal Lecter books. I mean, as you would say. Um, the thing though is that um, so I don't know when the book of The Silence of the Lambs came out, but Red Dragon was the very first book to feature Hannibal Lecter, and um that's what Manhunter is actually based off of uh Red Dragon. And eventually down the line, when they continue with Anthony Hopkins' version of the character, they do Red Dragon, but they create it as a prequel. Like it's the first book ever, but then you know they decided to go with the Silence of the Lambs. But the Silence of the Lambs is not a sequel to Manhunter, it's just a different storyline. Um, to you know, um, I forgot the director's name, but the silence of the lambs, but to Hannibal's uh storyline, it's different from the Manhunter Hannibal. I know that's a that's very confusing. I don't know why they chose to do it like that rather than remake um I think simply because um my bad.
SPEAKER_00Uh but uh I think they chose to do that ultimately is because uh they're released under two separate companies. So I think Manhunter was released under the Dino Dino the Dino Dino Lent Dino Lentris group or something like that. I mean they they they're they were well known for a lot of films back in the 70s and uh uh I guess in the 80s. Um and then as soon as like Orion Pictures uh had rights to it to at least make their adaptation, they didn't want to essentially just hire the same actors to replay their parts, or at least in this case, they didn't want to hire Brian Cox. I think Brian Cox wasn't even available at the time. Maybe he was because he's more of a Broadway um you know actor. So uh he's done some shows in in previous years, but the point is he I think at the time they just wanted to go in a different direction with a whole different cast. So they they that's why it it's it is what it is.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so we're gonna kind of talk about first uh the Manhunter Brian Cox version as well as the storyline, and then we're gonna go into um Anthony Hopkins, and well, just for a little bit, we'll talk about the other two, which was Matthew Mickelson and um I forgot the other guy's name who played him in the prequel. Um, the reason why we're not gonna go too depth in those uh characters is because I just started watching the Hannibal series. Um, only just a few episodes in, but it's actually pretty interesting. And Hannibal Rising was one of those movies that you look at and you just go, nope, and then you just never bother to pick it up, or at least even try to finish watching the movie, because um Hannibal Rising is what you call an unnecessary prequel. Um, because the good thing about Hannibal Elector is same thing with a lot of um villains per se, especially like horror villains, is that you don't need like to create the backstory of why they are. It's uh it's always interesting just to see them from where they started. So even if you we you would see them from Brian Cox's perspective, where you just saw it from Brian Cox, I'd rather just like my for the first time see Hannibal Lecter like that, even though obviously the first time the first Hannibal Lecter movie I ever saw was The Silence of the Lambs. Um but also just for uh another thing, it's it's garner cultural impact, um, specifically, yes, the silence of the lambs. Um especially like recently with Utopia 2 with um who was it? I forgot it's the sheep. I think she's the sheep, the sheep's name, I think it's Melweather or something like that. And they kind of yeah, they imitate um Hannibal Lecter. Um, and it's pretty funny too. Um, even I was gonna say iCarly, but it wasn't iCarly, it was Salmon Cat, which was the spinoff of iCarly, where um what's the name again? Neville, like that that kid that kept trying to mess with the Carly show, ended up making like a Hannibal Lecter is kind of um storyline because he got affected with I think a porcupine disease. But yes, it's funny to see those references and like what's supposed to be kids shows, despite all the Dan Schneider thing that was happening then, or even kids' movies. But I think it's funny how like one of these days, you know, a father was is watching that with their kids, and obviously it's gonna be a father because I I don't know a lot of girls that watch The Silence of the Lambs unless they're like super horror fanatics, but majority uh a dad's gonna watch The Silence of the Lambs or any Hannibal Lecter, and their kids are gonna be asking, What is all this, dad? And then it's gonna be like that meme from Malcolm in the Middle where like if anybody knows what I'm talking about, it's like Brian Cranston just looks at Malcolm and then like the background just turns black. It's like, Are you ready, son, for what you're about to witness? That's that would be me as a dad. Um, like I mentioned in the past, I became a surrogate father uh at these kids that I for these girls that I've worked with. I tried doing that, never succeeded. But um, then again, they were already about to be in their 20s. But uh to my point, we're gonna start off with talking about um Manhunter. Now, there's not too much to talk about because I've just seen it. Um, like literally for the first time, and I watch a little bit of clips just to prepare myself. But if I remember, do you own it or do you just have you just seen it a long time ago? No, uh, I own it. Um I should have gone to you first, real quick, but I wasn't thinking about it really. But um, were there any feature rats? Um I'm now I'm curious.
SPEAKER_00So, from what I understand, uh the version that I have uh was the Shell Factory release that's been out of print for like a long time. I I got it I think in 2017, 16. No, sorry. Uh uh it was around 2018 or 17 when I I got a copy off of Best Buy. Um, I mean the the time of time that I looked at it, I think there's two versions. There's a theatrical cut, which is what you probably saw. Probably. And there's an extended version that I think was only released in TVs, but they were able to like remaster it or at least keep it in the best presentation that it that they could put it as and put the put the scenes in there. So like uh, you know, um in terms of featurettes, there's probably maybe like a 25-minute one or even less. And it was with uh William Peterson, I believe. Who plays uh Will Graham as I'm the main character in Manhunter.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, so just to just to like get everything, if this is all based off Red Dragon. And if you wonder like why isn't it called why is it called Manhunter and not Red Dragon? I think it's because the director did a movie called The Year of the Dragon, I believe is what it's called, and he felt like he just didn't want to like have those two movies confused, which even Brian Cox said that was the dumbest decision any director he's he's worked with ever made. Um, it's just because like Red Dragon sounds a lot cooler than uh Manhunter.
SPEAKER_00Another thing too, um I think this was in the featurette, but again, uh anybody out there who's listening, uh feel free to quote us wrong, quote me wrong on it. If you tell me out, call me out if it's wrong. But I think I remember, um, just like how you said, like the producer did not want to name it Red Dragon because of like the year the dragon. I think there's another movie that had came out a couple years back with I think the similar, similar like moniker in terms of the title, and uh it didn't do so well. So the producer was like, okay, we can't call it Red Dragon because anything with the word dragon doesn't sell.
SPEAKER_01I'm trying to think if um if there is a good movie with the the dragon title. I can't think of anything right now, but I don't know. Um, but yeah, so it yeah, so Manhunter is based off of Red Dragon. Um now just to make a disclaimer before we actually get started. I know I get I keep saying we're gonna get started, but I I always want to put like a side note on everything because it's might might as well just get it all out of the way first before you get into it. Hannibal Leictor, yes, is the more famous um horror, like horror icon, even though like I've I've openly admitted that I would never I've never considered most of those movies that he's in like horror, more like the thriller, like suspenseful thriller or crime thriller. It just depends on what you put. Um, because even to most people consider Seven a horror film, which I never put together as, but um Hannibal Lecter, yes, is a famous character in those films, however, he's never the main villain in any of the movies. Maybe, maybe Hannibal, the the sequel, but majority it's never like Hannibal isn't the killer that um like FBIs are hunting for. So Red Dragon um is is literally about them hunting down a killer named the Tooth Fairy. And Will Graham, yes, is um an investigator trying to uncover like who is this uh Tooth Fairy who's in you know going into people's houses and murdering the family. And what's an interesting thing about Will Graham Um specifically is that he puts his mind in the or yeah, in the killer's mind. Basically, when he looks at a crime scene, he says, like, this is what the killer probably did and said, and then step forward and then murder this one person, step to another place, you get what I mean? Like he's putting himself in that mindset. Um, I would know that, like, again, I've only just I'm barely halfway through the first season of the Hannibal, but it goes a lot more in depth in the show. Um, but despite that, yes, the actor who played um Will Graham is actually like out like the better of the three, because obviously there's three people there's him and then Edward Norton, and then the actor from the show. Um and uh Will Graham is a survivor of Hannibal Elector. Um, it was during a case where he was nearly killed by Hannibal Elector, and it came to a point where they needed to have Lecter's help again. And obviously, like Elector is already in this universe is a very famous like serial killer and can cannibal. I was about to say cannabis. He he was a very famous cannibal and of course, of course, murderer. But the thing is that like Elector is so subtle. If you watch like watch any version of the character, he's so subtle on what he does and what he says. And I think most of that has to do with him just being a psychiatrist. Where like he was a psychiatrist by day, killer by night. But I think like that's that that's what makes people kind of creeped out about Electra is just how subtle he becomes, you know what I mean? And and it's interesting, Brian Cox got the role because of all people who um who like auditioned for Hannibal Elector for Manhunter, what he decided to do was actually interview or do the audition was his back face towards the casting agent and all that. Because if he ever when you go back to Manhunter, like if you've ever started with Manhunter before you ever get to the silence of the lambs, you don't see um Hannibal Lecter's face because, like, this little lock area where it's a cage that's keeping him in kind of guards his face, and all you just hear is that's the same cologne that you wore back in the court or something, something uh along those lines. Um, and it's interesting because like Will Graham has to do this, even though he it just gives him terrible memories of like I nearly the last time I I faced this person, I nearly died. Um, you know, so they just needed his information on how to find um you know the tooth fairy whose whose name is actually called Francis Dollar High, who works at a video store. Um, I think what they do is they get like family videos and then they put them in a in a VHS tape. And it it's a very it's a very interesting performance. I forgot the actor's name, but I'm gonna let you know his height and his mannerism actually works with um the Francis Dollar High character, and he has a soft spot. Um, I don't remember if Manhunter gets too much into the childhood trauma as um drag uh dragon red dragon did, but um it's kind of like Red Dragon, the movie that also has Hannibal Lacter. They're the same plot. I'm gonna go back to it again, but they're the same plot. Like Francis Dollar High loves this woman who's blind. And the very interesting thing is that he takes her out to see to feel a tiger, and that's an actual tiger that that's on set. Um, not tame. They just I think they had that tiger sedated, but apparently that like the actress literally liked like having to feel the tiger. Now, if if somebody asked me, would you like to do a scene with a tiger? I'd say no, first of all, because I mean, are you serious? Look, I think they're cool. I'm just not gonna be dumb enough to go face to face with one. All right, that and let let the actors do that, but um, but I it's still pretty interesting how they were able to, especially for 1985, when I think this movie was filmed. Um but to the to to get this all out, Francis Dollarhyde is also like a or the two spare, however you want to say. I'll say Francis Dollar Hyde for now on. Francis Dollar Hyde is some it's a character you don't want to mess with because in the in the movie they trick uh Freddie Loud Louds, I think that's how you pronounce his last name. Um they tricked Freddie Louds, who uh which was a surprise to Jesus when I told him that he was played by Stephen Lang from Avatar. Um uh he they tricked him into making a um a report saying that like a tooth fairy is gay, that he like I think like he assaulted one of the the male victims, and that and that came to the point where the tooth fairy came out, the tooth fairy or Francis Dollar Hyde came for Freddie Lowndes. And it's interesting because like Lecter is known, even though like Lecter is not like the main main villain in each of the movies that he's in, he has somewhat of a connection to them. Like, even they said Francis uh Dollar Hyde is a is a fan of Lecter. Um but the the big thing that and what I mean is that like Dollar Hyde is somebody you don't want to mess with. Like if you've ever seen a video or a clip of somebody burning on a wheelchair and then rolling downhill, that's that's from the movies, from both of them, actually. Um, and another interesting side note is that I love how they like how people how easy things were were to hack back then. What Hannibal Lecter did with um the phone call, all he did was just tap it with a phone, what is it, foil?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, he was given uh I think a piece of gum um by uh Peterson or sorry uh by Graham because after the after their initial meetup, so he uses that piece of foil aluminum to kind of hijack the wire and you know keep on silent.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, but I don't know. Uh for some reason that looks more easier than now, but even then you got hackers that could easily hack into anything nowadays. But to my point, I think I think that's a very interesting thing. And again, just how subtle Brian Cox did it, just like getting all the information that he needed from like the post and all that. Again, um, I think it's pretty cool. But um, and I'll and I'll explain a lot more differences once we get to like the Hannibal version of Red Dragon, but it does end obviously with like the kill the the cops fat uh catching the killer. Um apparently I didn't even know this when I saw this uh the movie. Um, and for some reason this song is usually synonymous synonymous with like a lot of horror media. Um, and that there I think they were playing Anagata Davida by the Iron Butterfly uh during the shootout. And in case y'all don't know what Anagata Davida is, it's a very, very famous um old school rock song that came out in the late 60s. The song is actually called In the Garden of Eden, but the front man at the time was stoned. I mean, like stone stone. Actually, I think everybody, including the audio engineers, were stoned. It was the 60s, guys. So he couldn't sing in the Garden of Eden. He it was he was just slurring it in the Gata de Vita, and they just kept it. Um, and if you've like I'm I'm not a big Simpsons watcher, but if you've ever seen an old episode of The Simpsons where um Bart is handing out hymns as a joke, he makes it in the Garden of Eden, and then there's a while they were singing the hymn, it's not really him, obviously they're singing the song. Um, you see a title that says 17 minutes later. That's how long the song is. It's full 17 minutes. Obviously, they cannot play the 17 minute the full 17-minute version because for a lot of obvious reasons. Um, but that song is a very it's a banger. Um, you should you should go check it out. But it's also synonymous with some horror media, um, like this one. Um, they did it, I think, with three, uh, the three from hell and uh an American, not American American Horror Story. They did it also with Titans, even though Titans isn't really uh a horror, a horror show per se. Do they they do have horror elements? But um to my point, if y'all do love Hannibal Elector and you haven't seen Manhunter, uh, you should check it out. Um, it's pretty interesting too. Like, if you ever watch it, there's so much white going on. And what I mean is like there's like walls and stuff that are just so blank. That's kind of like the emotion of um, no, I don't know if that's what the director's intentions were, but that's it's like the emotion of William Graham because like everything is so blank towards him. But the thing is that he has a lot um to fear Hannibal being one of them, and knowing like how far will you will you go if you're still in that mindset of the killer, which again, I'm only a few episodes into the the show Hannibal, but he it shows him like that that fear of like I'm in those mindsets of every serial killer we're hunting down, but how far you think I would go to make sure I don't end up as being one of them. And to me, that I think that's the scary thing. And uh man, Peterson actually pulls that off. Um, again, a lot more than uh Norton and everybody else. But do you have any other final thoughts uh before we go on break and move on for about Manhunter?
SPEAKER_00Um, I guess I would say that uh the the last piece of uh so I think overall Manhunter is the better film of the two. Um, but I do think the ending of Red Dragon is like really like honestly tops the ending of Manhunter, just because it adds that extra piece. And I I don't know, I think that was from the I think the ending of Red Dragon is taken from the book. Whereas um I'm not sure what's the reason why Michael Mandin decided to direct the ending that way, but uh yeah, I mean I really did like that. Call it a twist kind of ending if you want uh for Red Dragon. That was it was really nice.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we'll we'll definitely get into Red Dragon um when we go on break. Cause I just want people to get familiar with like Hannibal Lecter, like besides the Anthony Hopkins version. Don't get me wrong, Anthony Hopkins is the more synonymous one. You know, he'll he's up there, like like his version of the character is up there because um when people think like whore Hannibal Lecter, obviously they think of that version, which nothing wrong with uh Anthony Hopkins, because for a while by default, my favorite Hannibal Elector was Anthony Hopkins because he was the only one I saw. I didn't see the show, I didn't see Manhunter until recently. For now, it's still Anthony Hopkins. Um, but I've seen people actually turn to Matt's Mickelson. Um, and I'll explain in a couple in a couple of minutes, uh well, more than just a couple of minutes, but I'll explain why. Um, well, for one obvious reason, it's Matt's Mickelson, the dude's a Shakespearean actor, in my opinion. Um, like if you've ever seen him in any like villainous roles, he is such Tremendous actor, and again, um, they all bring that subtleness towards the character, um, which to me would be very frightening. Like, people would be like, 'It's so I always have this problem with uh scaring.' I gotta put this can down before it the microphone catches it. But the I always say, like, when people say like that movie wasn't scary, then well, what's trying to scare you is the question. Like, again, Silence of the Lamb doesn't scare me, but if you think about like what if you were face to face with somebody like Elector, who's like very subtle, who kind of gives you that eerie, that not so great smile at you. You get what I mean? Like, sometimes you gotta put yourself as if you were a character in that movie, but um, yeah. And for a record, Manhunter isn't really like a horror film either, it's more like a thriller or murder mystery. Um, but uh anyway, um, we're gonna take a little break right now. Um, and then we'll be back. We'll definitely talk about Anthony Hopkins in a bit. So all right, let's break. All right, and we are back, and now we can actually talk about now. This one's gonna be a lot more talking about because it's the fame, the more famous Hannibal Elector, and that's the Anthony Hawkins version. Um, so yeah, so I mean, like I said, I don't personally could call um the silence of the lambs uh a horror horror film. Again, more like suspenseful thriller. But I got nothing wrong if people call it um horror. It's like it just depends on what you consider horror. But if if we were to call it, if I personally would call it horror, it is the only horror film um to win the best picture award, and still the only one. Fingers crossed the centers can uh do that, but not holding my breath on it too much. And um, it's the it's the last film to win the big five awards, which is best director, um, picture, actor, actress, and screenwriting. So Anthony Hawkins is the more famous Hannibal actor. We've we all know that one. He's played the character three times, um, and obviously three different films, and then there is a prequel film, like I said, that uh nobody watched. Um but so this uh I'm not gonna go to the plots on these ones a bit more because I think you should actually watch these movies like for yourself. But um it's not uh like we said, this one's not a sequel to Manhunter. As you said, they're they were made by different studios. Um so with the basis of each film of the each film is that with this film, um Clarice Darling, who's uh junior junior FBI, is uh searching the case of a bunch of uh missing women or even women that come that are found dead. Um and the the killer is famously known as Buffalo Bill. His real name is James Gum. James Gum. Um, I think I know it's James Gum because they never put the S at the end of the name. So it's James Gum. Um Ted Levine is the famous character or the famous actor to play him. Um, as you know, um one of the big inspirations of um, well, two of them really, of the character of um Buffalo Bill was uh one Ted Bundy, um, and then the other Ed Ging. Um, I read somewhere that like because in the past uh with that character, um, the uh the trans community has seen it as a bit controversial. You understand why too, because there's that famous scene with him um dancing naked with um what at first I thought was a wig, but then when I look closely, it's like, oh, that's a scalp. He went full Indian on that girl. Hopefully, I don't get canceled for saying that, but um, yeah, no, he's dancing with the the head of like a dead person or the scalp of a dead person. Um, people have interpreted um Jim Gum in a different way, and I know we say we're talking about Hannibal Lecter, but if you're gonna be talking about the silence of the lamb or any of the other movies, um, chances are you're gonna be talking about a lot of people. And Buffalo Bill, I think I liked calling him Buffalo Bill a lot more. Buffalo Bill is the more famous um like killer villain in the entire Hannibal series. Um, yeah. Um, and again, it he had been a very controversial figure to the trans community because he wanted to in in his cases be a woman. Um, and his his idea was to actually make like a woman suit, which is supposedly what Edgeen did to bring his mother back. In his cases bring his mother back. Um, again, I should have put a bunch of disclaimers about this because it does get pretty gory and ugly um just describing it. Because when you watch the movie, uh it's pretty tame on gore. Um, even Manhunter. Um, I don't remember too much if uh Hannibal and Red Dragon is maybe just a little, maybe a little bit more gory than the Science of the Lamb, but um this was like the 90s. Uh this was like you know, the NPAA is always spot on when it comes to blood and stuff. Um but to to the point um people have already are now grown more to the character. There's some interpretation that uh Buffalo Bill is probably not a closeted gay man, but a closeted um an inner closeted homophobe, which I it took I had to figure out what like what he meant by that. Um I'm still trying to figure that part out, actually. But um the obviously the more famous line that he said was, you know, what was it put the lotion in the basket? That's that's the part I remember. I just I don't remember the rest of the the line. Um but it's like that scene, you just like because he kidnaps this one girl in the movie, and you feel bad for her, like the way she's screaming and crying, and you see Buffalo Bill even get like emotional himself. Um which I remember, I think if I can remember, I think they said that he was also a former patient of uh Hannibal Lecter. Um, unless that was just a book thing or a movie thing. I don't remember for sure. I just know Lecter knows a lot more about him. Um going back to um to Hannibal Lecter, uh Hannibal Hannibal Lecter is um to a lot of people that's when they're actually introduced to the character. Uh because again, uh The Silence of the Lambs is the more uh popular uh film of the entire Hannibal franchise. So the and obviously the the more famous thing about Hannibal Lecter is the mask that he wore in the um the movie. And the movie, like he he is um who is he talking to? He was talking to the senator about trying to find uh her daughter because the the daughter is the one that's kidnapped by um by Buffalo Bill. And um there's that scene where like he they're interviewing him, but obviously to make sure that he's contained in a way, um, they put that mask on him, and they worked through so many things to figure out like what can we do? And thank god they went with that mask because it was the more uh it's it's literally like the trademark of Hannibal Lecter was the mask. So um, yeah. So if you know the story, then you know that like Clary Starling is hunting down um Hannibal Elect oh not Hannibal Lecter, Clarice Starling is hunting down Buffalo Bill, but just like um Will Graham, they uh she needs to get information from Hannibal Lecter. The first time we ever are introduced to Hannibal Lecter, like like I said, Silence of the Lambs is like most of the people that's when they're introduced to the character. So if you've seen the silence of the lambs before we've ever seen um Manhunter, then obviously our first introduction was when in uh current uh Clarice Darling's point of view, she's seeing him for the first time, and he's just like standing there with his arms behind his back, just like smiling, going, hello Clarice. Um, but he's again, he's a very like subtle. I get I keep saying this all the time, but it's so true. They're so subtle. He's like Anthony Hopkins, Brian Cox, Matthew Mickelson. Um, they're just subtle with the character, and maybe that's something that that is described in the book. I've never read any of the books, so um but he's just basically like he's just uh the subtleness is what intimidates everybody who ever encounters him. But through time, he they pretty much like they keep using Hannibal as a way to um get to get to the bottom of Buffalo Bill. And um another thing is that like for for for you okay?
SPEAKER_00No, no, you're good. Sorry.
SPEAKER_01No, I was gonna say for a long time, um we thought this was gonna be Anthony Hopkins' only Oscar win. Um he eventually won um about five years ago for uh The Father, but for a while this was his only Oscar win for Best Actor, and it's funny because he's not even in the movie that much. Um, and he he's he's up against like actors that were probably in the movie like 90% of the time than what he was in. Um because obviously the main character was um was Jody Foster. Like maybe like now, probably now he would have gotten like the supporting actor nomination if the silence of the lamb came out in today's uh context. Like he would have gone best supporting actor. How I said Tom Holtz would have gone best supporting actor now if um Amadeus was was uh released in this time. But majority we do follow Clarie Starling. And if you ever wonder what the silence of the like what this uh the silence of the lamb, um it's basically like an old story of Clary Starling, how when her father died, she um I think she lived with uh her aunt like her aunt and uncle, and she was talking about a time when like I think her uncle was slaughtering a bunch of lambs, and you don't see it, but you can imagine like what everything she's saying, and she's talking about how like she she can hear the cries of the lambs, and eventually she decided to um try to free one, but uh she just couldn't. Um just because she was so apparently like I think she was so little, and I think the lamb just weighed a lot more. And she said like she would just she would always hear this the screams of the lamb. And that's yeah, that's a very I know that sounds very brutal, but that that moment to me, that moment where Jodie Foster talks about that, that's how I knew that's how I knew she she that like she deserved that Oscar win pretty much. And she was only 27, and she that was her second Oscar like win ever. She won for another film called Um The Accused. I don't know too much about that one, but um, but anyway, um one of the other famous scenes about that was Hannibal Lecter's escape. And oh my gosh, man, I would say like when you just see Lecter gnawing that one dude's face, and yeah, that's uh that's when people realize that Hannibal Lecter is uh as a legit a madman. Um but yeah, I think I saw this film when I probably I was like in middle school, and this is back then when like YouTube can get away with um putting or people on YouTube can get away with putting movies on on the on YouTube. Um but yeah, I mean what was I mean what was your first impression the very first time you ever saw The Silence of the Lambs?
SPEAKER_00So I will say this um the poster, like the infamous poster of like you know Clara Starling's face but her mouth covered with the moth. Um, it used to freak me out so much that I just never wanted to actually see the film or ever hear anything about it. And then, you know, when we had our talks about all these villains and stuff like the like Freddie and stuff and bring up Hannibal Hannibal Lecter, I would go, Oh yeah, I've heard about that. It's from that movie. So I figured I think I finally saw it in what is it, the high school, uh probably 10th or 11th grade. Um, and I think it was on a VHS tape that my dad had owned. And again, it's one of those things like he owned it for years and I just never wanted to touch it. I was like, you know what? This is how bad could it be? Man, I wasn't expecting that that that part when he was escaping. That was crazy. Yeah. But um the movie itself was actually like frightening in the way that it's a thriller. I mean, that this is why people can that's why people can claim it as a horror film. And I mean, yeah, I understand that. It's especially like towards the end when she's um I mean when when she's finally like when she finally reaches um his house and you can see everything's all pitch black, and you can just see him like stalking her as she's just trying to find a light switch or trying to find anything that resembles something that she's familiar with, that's pitch black. So kind of kind of really like it's heart pounding. And I remember that's how I first felt the first time because I was like, wow, like I didn't I didn't know if she was gonna make it or not. And of course, when that finally happened, she like she could see the eyes. I was like, Oh yeah, there you go. So it was such a great film overall, the first uh finally watching it. But for years I just sat there going, yeah, I don't know if I want to watch this film because of this poster. So just that alone was like thought provoking.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. So it's it's another thing is that like I mean, it's up there with a lot of people's favorite best picture winners. It's definitely up there with mine. I think it's like number five for me. And then same thing with Nasty Hopkins for the best actor win of all time. It's number five for me. Unfortunately, it's funny because like Jody Foster isn't even like on the top five, maybe top ten. I think there's just some performances I like a lot more. Um but yeah, um, it's really it's it's a really great film if you've never seen it. I I I think you should watch it just for the the way it's directed. Um who was the director, by the way. I have I need to look that up.
SPEAKER_00Oh, Jonathan Demi.
SPEAKER_01Jonathan Demi?
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Just the way he directed it. Um, like if you know how to make a tense situation uh more tense and to the point where you you don't know when to breathe, you you're actually a really great director. Just after Sefti Brothers or uh Paul Thomas Anderson or anyone else that can make a tense situation even more tense. Um but um yeah, it's uh it's a it's a really great film. Everybody in the film community, every horror fan, um, every film student like I used to be. We all love this movie because it's a very synonymous, um, it's a very famous film. You get a lot of uh references. I think this movie and The Shining are like the most um referenced film of all time, and go back to Zotopia too. Um but yeah, no, this is uh this is really great film. Um what I do know is that I I don't think Thomas Harris intended on writing a third book about Hannibal. Like I think he wanted to leave the book open to interpretation with the silence of the lands when Hannibal says, I got an old friend coming for dinner. Uh hint it's probably that doctor from the psychiatric hospital, guess which at this point we all know he probably killed at eight. But um, they wanted to see more. So Thomas Harris wrote Hannibal. Um the thing is that like a lot of the Johnson Demi, uh, who who else, Jody Foster, all the crew, all the people that are that were part of the Silence of the Lands, except for Anthony Hopkins, left. Um, they didn't like how the characters were written um in the in the movie, I mean, or in the book, and then especially how they they did it in the movie. Uh really Scott would eventually take over. Yeah, by the way, the Ridley Scott, you know, Gladiator and Aliens, really Scott. Um, he eventually took over directing roles for Hannibal. Um, I think Hannibal's a fine movie. I mean, it's definitely like, in my, in my opinion, one of the lesser well-known ones. Um the the the picture does freak me out a bit. It's like half of Hannibal's face with red eyes. Um, but yeah, I mean it's a it's an all right movie. Definitely something I do kind of forget about. Um unless you have uh another thought about the Hannibal, the the sequel to the sequel movie.
SPEAKER_00I mean, if you're gonna I guess my recommendation is if you're gonna watch Hannibal right after watching Silent Stone Lambs, don't. Um, because it's it it really like the whiplash of seeing the characters that you're you're supposed to that you saw from the previous film, um they're different. I mean they don't they don't sound they don't feel the same. So even if it's Claire Sterling being played by uh Julian Moore, I mean she's a great actress. Um but overall it she plays a really different Claire. Doesn't feel the same as Jody Foster's interpretation. Uh and again, I mean really Scott, for what he for what he had and the people that he casted, it's a pretty good film. Um but I don't recommend watching the sequel just after you watch Silence. I I'd say give it maybe a couple of I'd say give it a couple of actual watches if you're gonna watch Hannibal before it sticks in and you'll sit there and go, it's pretty good. Because the first upon first watching, you'll probably sit there and go, what was that? Like, you know, like like it didn't have to be made. But after you watch it again and again and again upon those various rewatches, then you you can start thinking, oh, you know what, this is a this is pretty good.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Um so I think this is also the first film I was ever introduced to uh Ray Leota, and Ray Ray Le Ota at this time was already first of all R.I.P. I know I'm like what is it like about to be four years too late? Still R.I.P.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, RIP to that man, R.I.P. to who else? Uh Jonathan. Jonathan Demi passed away re uh also a couple years back.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Um, but yeah, this was the first film I was ever introduced to Ray Liotta. He was already famous at this point, obviously from Goodfellas. Um, and yeah, his character is already is one of those characters where you just want to die because he is such a douchebag, like the entire like the entire film, he's such a douchebag. So if you've ever like seen like uh a famous, like if you randomly just saw a video of somebody like picking out Ray Leota's brain, that's the movie. Um it's I think it's the more infamous thing. I think I feel like if we're gonna talk about infamous scenes, um with was both to me, with both Red Dragon and Um Manhunter, it's the um the wheelchair scene with silence of the lambs, it's probably either to put the lotion in the basket or the breaking out scene. With Hannibal, it's um the scene where it's the dinner scene. Um, so if y'all ever want to know what it is, I'll probably tell y'all tell y'all about it too. Um, I'm pretty sure I'm probably this is the only film I'm gonna go in the desk because it doesn't really hold a candle to the silence of the lambs. Like, I would say like I consider Red Dragon the better sequel, even though it's a prequel, the but the better sequel, in my opinion. Um so it's pretty much like at this point, nobody knows where Lecter is, but he's actually hiding out in uh Italy. Um and Clarice Starling is under some heat. So what she has to do is continue finding Lecter. And then there's this, I think he's uh PI, at this Italian PI who's uh who is like in investigating Lecter, I think he, but he goes by a different name. Um but uh and uh another character in this movie is um played by Gary Ollman. I forgot his name, I'm trying to remember it right now, but um uh Gary Ollman like a lover, right? I I honestly do not know. Oh, so I know who it is. I know, well, I don't know the name, but he was um he was another patient of Hannibal Lecter, who was um a PDF. Can't say the entire name. I mean the entire thing because of uh certain platforms, but he was um I don't want to say child lover because that just makes it sound worse. Okay, oh Mason Berger, that's the character. So pretty much like they he was hired, Hannibal, he was hired by Hannibal to, I guess, in a way help him um, I guess, cure his uh affections. No matter how many times I'm I have to censor this, it still doesn't sound better. Um but he but what Hannibal ended up doing was drugging him and then handing him a glass shard, and Hannibal's saying you should cut your face, and he ends up getting paralyzed with a disfigured face. And Gary Omen, knowing Gary Ollman, because Gary Ollman's kind of a what do you call it, uh mess it actor, he's he was very into the role. Like he even said, if y'all need to like fish hook my eyes, which they which they actually did for the makeup, he went for it. I can't do that. Um but uh yeah, um Gary Ollman also asked to be uncredited just for the um the mysteriousness. That's what a lot of actors like to do. Like even um Erin Norton for uh Kingdom of Heaven, the movie, which if y'all haven't seen, I think it's actually a really good film. It's also um a really scope film, but he played um very yeah. I forgot what what the what the prince's name was, but he he hides behind a mask the entire what no, yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_00Like like you said, he hides behind a mask, but like if anybody out there who knows the meme, it's like him raising his hand up to to silence the crowd. So it's like a meme says silence some that somebody is speaking.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, but his he but he plays that character, but he also uh um asked not to be credited because he just wanted Everybody like what he means is why he didn't want that to happen, is he's because um everyone's gonna be like oh Edward Norton and picturing Edward Norton behind that mask, but with Edward Norton like masking his voice as well as obviously his face, you don't picture Edward Norton, which it goes really well. Um, but to my point, that's also kind of like what they did with Gary Omen. However, like Gary Omen can change his voice so many times. Um, I can still know it's him. Um, but the um the per the thing is is that like Mason Berger, um, he has a vendetta uh against Hannibal because of his disfigurement. And um, yeah, let's just see there's a scene that involves him getting uh mutilated and eaten alive by pigs. Um it's actually really cool if he uh if you ever watch that. Um it yeah, this movie got a lot gorier because I mean by the time the 2000s hit, um, the NPA didn't care too much about blood now. So everyone was like, let's go, let's get gory and every movie gets gory and gory throughout the years. Um but again, famous scene that involves Ray Leota with his brain getting picked. Um and it was supposed to end the book ends with both um uh Hannibal Lecter and Clary Starling um going on a trip, or not going on a trip, like riding off into the sunset on a boat and then just spending the rest of their lives together. Because I can understand why now this because this book, even the movie, kind of makes it like this romantic cat and mouse game kind of film. I mean, again, this was like Thomas Harris was like, okay, people want to know more, I'll give them more. Um, because his last two books were it, they weren't like his passion projects as Red Dragon and The Silence of the Lambs were. Um, and it just got too silly to the point where like just seeing Anthony Hopkins just like playing around. I mean, I don't know. I never picture Hannibal Elector doing any any any of this stuff. Um, and it it does end with Hannibal getting away, and God knows what the hell happened to Clarice after this. She might have lost her job at this point. Um, but yeah, um, they they did fix it with Red Dragon. Red Dragon is literally the same plot as Manhunter, as we said earlier, it's the same thing, but a lot better. Um, unfortunately, the director, not so much. If you're asking, let's just say his involvement was like um Victor Salva, um, who was Roman Pelaski, it's kind of a crime, if you get what I mean. Um, yeah, that it's unfortunate. But despite that, this film did a lot better than Hannibal, Red Dragon, I mean. Um, Hannah again, uh it is a prequel to the Silence of the Lands, but again, this is actually the book came out before the Silence of the Lands book. But I think it's a better prequel than the next prequel that we got after this movie. And I think it's very interesting that we see, like, you know, the how uh Will Graham in this in this in this uh movie is played by Edward Norton that we've been talking about already. Um how like you know him catching Lecter almost costed him his life. Um, but I mean obviously like the I like the version a lot more in Manhunter, but I mean I don't hate Edward Norton. He's a very cool, he's a very cool actor. I just think they could have gotten somebody better, in my personal opinion. But he he does what he he, you know, he does what he does. He he has the role, he just does his best with it, is what I'm trying to say. I did love Ray Fines as um the Tooth Fairy, especially with the tattoos, it just makes them so menacing. And it's funny because I I just um I just finished, or not just finished, but uh earlier and like the day that uh that I recorded this beforehand, I saw the sequel to 28 years later, the Bone Temple. Better bet I thought it was better than the previous film. Um, but Rafe uh at this point, Ray finds of um Red Dragon, he was already a famous actor beforehand. Um, like he was he was known for Schindler's List, um, the Prince of Egypt, and then eventually years later, he would uh play Voldemort. But the way he plays this character is so oh so cool. I mean, what as soon as like he captures this version of uh Freddie Louds played by RIP of uh Philip Seymour Hoffman, the second like he takes off his uh cloak and you see like the tattoos, I was like, Oh, okay, this is definitely redeeming Hannibal, like the film, and then the kill scene after that that involved the um the wheelchair was Freddie being caught on fire. Um, yeah. So I did enjoy it. If I was to rank like just uh the Anthony Hawkins version, it would be Hannibal, Red Dragon. No, sorry, why did I say that? The silence of the lambs, red dragon, and then Hannibal. But I would also rank it as Hannibal, Manhunter, Red Dragon, and um so you mean to split those flip the last two?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, there you go.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, sorry. The silence of the lamb, manhunter, red dragon, Hannibal, and then Hannibal Rising. What's what what would be your ranking actually?
SPEAKER_00Um I I would probably do the exact same way you do it. Exact same way.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah. Um, so yeah, I don't want to again talk too much about Red Dragon because it's literally the same plot, except at the end of the movie. Um so it ends with a shootout at um Francis Dollar Height's house where they found they rescued the blind woman because he kidnaps the blind woman. Um, because I think he thought that she rated routed him out to the FBI. Um and in in Manhunter, it ends with the shootout and the house getting caught on fire and she gets saved. Well, the house I know that the house doesn't get caught on fire. Doesn't it doesn't get no, it doesn't.
SPEAKER_00Okay, so that's how like I guess if you remember, um it Francis Dollar High dies in the shootout in Manhunter.
SPEAKER_01Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um and then in Red Dragon, the house does burn down.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, all right. So yeah, the house does burn down. There was a shooting that she thought was Francis um Dollar High, but I think it turns out it was another co-worker of them that he murdered. Um so Francis Dollar High was gonna do what he normally does. So it's a cycle that we never mentioned this in Manhunter. There's a cycle that he does, and then give me a second. Anyway, sorry. Um there was a cycle that he does where he kills a family, I think, every full moon. And he was gonna do this with uh with uh Williams's family, with the Williams' family, was him, his wife, and his son. But they went to a lot more in depth with his backstory, and which I don't I don't think they ever did with Manhunter, which was uh Dollar High grew up with an abusive grandmother. And if it ever came to a point of like uh he pissed himself or shit the bed, um, sorry, mom, uh his grandmother would give him a big cocotazo upside the head everywhere, like very abusive. And it also like all that stuff, like growing up, he still like would hear his grandmother's voice. And knowing that, because remember, uh William Graham is always in the mindset of the killer. So when he's when he saw that like Dollar High had his son and was a knife pointing at his son's neck, he uh or I I think it was a blair or something, and he sees that his son wedded himself, he decided to do do the tactic to use his grandmother to act like how his grandmother did, where he would um and this is the only thing this is the real time that I give Edward Norton his flowers for playing the character was through that. But if you ever but if you ever actually look at it, it fits well with Norton's version, then was Peterson's version. Because I couldn't imagine Peterson's version actually doing something like that the way Norton did, was trying to pretend to be um Dollar Hyde's uh grandmother, but he used that as if like he's being mad at um his son for wedding himself because obviously like his son's life is down the line. So he's like, I can't believe you just pissed yourself. Do you want me to cut that thing off? You know, stuff like that. It's just to anger Dollar Hyde to the point of Dollar High coming at him, and it eventually ends with like Will nearly getting killed again, but this time um his wife was able to put Dollar High down, which I mean, first of all, I get I give props to Ray Feines. I mean, I can't, it's hard to compare the two um the two variations of each actor the way they play them. One play one uses like his height and like his physique to like make everybody intimidating, but Ray Feines is is a really great actor who knows how to play good villains. Obviously, that um as we mentioned before, Schindler's List and Voldemort. So that's uh that's how it ends, and then it ends with um what was it, uh Hannibal Lecter meeting, like hearing from his doctor saying, like, there's a young lady waiting for you, and he's like, What's her name? And obviously we know that's Clary Starling, and then that eventually that's the um the last time you ever heard of uh or the last time we've ever seen Hannibal Anthony Hopkins play Hannibal Lecter. And I don't know how long it's been, but it uh that's the that's the more famous character that Anthony Hopkins is ever known for, and obviously that's the more famous iteration of the character. And um I'm I mean I love I love Anthony Hopkins version. So I gotta give I gotta re-watch Manhunter, and I gotta like get through all of Hannibal to actually like think like okay, who do I who do I actually like which version do I actually like?
SPEAKER_00So so ultimately I think what I have to do is I have to share with you the extended version. All right. So you can see a bit more. I think there's an ex I think there's more scenes with Dollar Hyde in that film. Um so you can get a better idea. I mean, yeah, because honestly, you shouldn't be watching the extended version because what's the point? You it's it's uh it's biased, right? Because if you watch the extended version, there is no extended version for silence, so you're kind of being biased at that point. I'm sorry, Red Dragon. You're you're being biased, you know what I mean? But I mean, my point is if you watch the extended version, I think it's a lot more fleshed out. Um people can disagree with me on it, but I think it's way more fleshed out as opposed to theatrical. And um, yeah, um, if you watch that and then watch you know the version as is, you might you might you might see uh it might change your mind.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, we'll see. Uh I'm gonna go on break. I'm not gonna go on break. I'm just I think we'll just finish this off uh from here, but um just because like I will it wouldn't be too much to talk about after break because I red not red dragon, um Hannibal Rising again is that one movie where you just go nope. Um because like I said, it's a it's an unnecessary sequel. Um and when you watch clips of it, you kind of know what they're trying to do, and it's just very lazy. Like, um, what is it? The it's a a young Hannibal Elector finds uh an old Japanese samurai mask and it's half a face, and it's only covering the mouse half. So what do you think they're trying to do there? You know what I mean? And so what what the basis is is basically like he's going after um and I I can only say this once he's going after uh Nazis that killed his sister, and then eventually it it turned out that they they ate his sister and they forced him to, which is caused his love of cannibalism. So all that just breaks the mystery of Hannibal Elector.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's a good thing when I ever watched that film.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. The thing is, there was a book about that. Um, Thomas Harris wrote it. He did not want to, but money it was it was a stunt, it was a stunt writing because they said um the the Hollywood, I'm I don't I don't know who owned it, but Hollywood was like, either you write a book so we can make a movie out of this or we're gonna do it ourselves. And just with no choice, Thomas Harris said, Okay, I'll write the book. And yeah, so he if you think he didn't care about writing Hannibal, he definitely didn't care about writing uh writing Hannibal Rising. The sad part is that the actor um passed away, I think a year, no, uh back in 2022. Um, I think it was like a skiing accident. Oh yeah, so it's hard to like it, it's not his performance I hate, it's the fact that he was written, it was written as a Hannibal Lecter prequel. You get what I mean? So here here's this thing. I'm gonna like go off topic, but bear with me. I and I'm guilty of this too. I'll be up front first, but I've always hated when people are like, I hate this character and stuff like that. You have to remember characters were written, and I always feel bad for when a character when when an actor is being confronted by people of like, dude, I hated you in this movie and stuff like you get what it's like um it's like uh like if if you if you were to answer this and I can do it plainly simple, um the sequel trilogy.
SPEAKER_00I mean, I like Daisy Ridley, I like the cast that they hired to play these characters. In fact, everybody, I like every person that they hired. It's just they their characters were not written well. And I mean they they had no arc. It was always just let's write it, let's write the script as we're shooting the film kind of thing. So they nobody had clear direction on who these were, and for that reason, you have people who go after them and tell them, you know, you kind of ruined this for me. And it's like, well, it's not their fault. No, it's it's it's their character was just written bad.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I know. People don't know that they're the right. This is also another thing. I'm gonna like I wanna going back to the whole um like Netflix Warner Brothers deal. My other issue is, and again, I've been guilty of this too. So Sue me. Um bootlegging. Um, people think like, oh man, these actors they don't need all this money. I mean, they already get paid enough. People don't know this, but it's not the just the actors that get paid for when a movie hits theaters, it's everybody that was involved in it. But people don't know the the other creatives. So I've and I've been in arguments with this so many times. Um, but again, like I'm the only one in my family that's ever actually been to film school and studied this. But so here's what I mean if you ever bootleg a movie. I mean, look, I could care less if the actors don't get paid and stuff like that because I I can agree with you. Unless they're like A-listers, they don't need billions of dollars more. Starting saying with some of the directors, unless they're really great ones, but you're also taking the pay away from the editors, the sound designers, the VFX artists, um, because they donate so much of their time trying to actually put the movie together. So they every studio relies on that box office performance. And if um and if it makes enough, then the then the editors and the production designers and stuff like that, then they get more of the or then they get more of the pay than they actually got earlier. So that's why I've I've always been like n like in the past, I've been okay with bootleg, but now as I get older, um I'm not so much anymore. And then now that we've gotten this whole deal with cinema, um, where the theaters are gonna be nowadays, it just makes the it makes the case harder even more. I know that that was that was a very um off-topic thing, but um to my point, you don't you don't get films like these anymore like The Silence of the Lambs, but um I can I could talk a little bit about Hannibal, but again, I've I haven't even finished the first season. But Matt Mickelson, as I keep saying, does a really good job. Um he he and it's interesting because like his accent kind of works well with um for those that don't know, I think uh Naz Mickelson, I believe, is Danish. Um and like the way he plays uh Lecter, it it's like humanizes him a bit, but in a good way. Where it's like you where it's like he's a he he's obviously a mad serial killer, but he's more of like an understandable killer. Um like he has he does and he doesn't have morals at the exact same time. Um if I ever finish the show, um I probably I know I am, but whenever I finish the show, I'll give you my thought, and then I can eventually say like who could be my favorite elector. A lot of recent horror fans said Matt's Mickelson, and I respect that. Uh, and that's a good thing is that like you could say like Brian Cox, Anthony Hopkins, or um Matt's Mickelson. Um, but so far the show's pretty interesting. Um, the editing is a bit weird from the first episode, it looks so smooth that it just it just feels weird, and I think they corrected that after everything because Amazon Prime um um started uh streaming the show after uh NBC canceled it. And I don't think it was viewership why it got canceled. I think um there was a lot of rights uh problem to the came to the point where Brian Fuller, the uh the producer of the show, said uh we can't continue this anymore. And so many fans wanted season four because I I looked into the future of it. Uh season three, it it starts it starts the um the red dragon storyline. Um, because like the first two seasons, it's it's more of like the starting friendship of William, um William Graham and uh Hannibal Lecter and knowing where this future's gonna go. Um Brian Fuller said if he ever wants to continue it, he'll he'll what he'll probably want to do is like combine Red Dragon and the Silence of the Lamb storyline together, but like edit it in a way where it's like where it's like we focus more on the silence of the lamb story, but there's come to a point where like um maybe Hannibal Elector remembers a lot more of the um the red dragon. So I would like to see how they did it. I think he said Brian Fuller said he had a a casting idea for Clarie Starling. I didn't look that up, and I know there was a Clarie Starling show that didn't make it past the one season, and it was supposed to be between the silence of the lamb and Hannibal. Um, but um that's uh I think that's all I got for today's episode.
SPEAKER_00Um I was gonna add, I was like, if you think about it, uh Mads is basically like the Dutch version of uh Ralph Fine. I mean, he in in the roles that he plays, the villain, he plays it exceptionally well, just like Ralph.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, I know. And it I think it's like his mannerism, just like the way he moves and stuff like that. Um, but yeah, no, it's it's pretty and it's a pretty interesting show so far. Um I I I and it goes again a lot more in depth into like um how William Graham um like how he always puts himself in the mindset of the killers. Um, but yeah, if I ever finish it, because I remember like when I before I even talked about Welcome to Dairy, I said I'm probably just like when I talked about it, I said this is probably the only time I'm gonna talk about Welcome to Dairy. And then if y'all had just gotten the recent episode before this one, uh yeah, I talked about Welcome to Dairy. But um, yeah, I I'm I have a lot more to talk about this season. Um as for Seuss and I, I don't know what's next. Um, just because I got more plans and stuff, but maybe you and I are just gonna talk about again something on our very last episode. Um, maybe um I want to I want our last episode to be like an Easter episode. You get what I mean? Yeah. Oh well of like the season. Uh before we go on break, I might actually do a bonus episode like what we did last year and probably talk about um the Odyssey because that's my most anticipated uh film of this year coming up. Um it's Christopher Nolan. Of course it's gonna be a spectacle. Well, I'm what we're all curious is how is the Cyclops gonna look? You get what I mean? Because he said no CGI for the Cyclops. So I don't know. We'll we'll see what happens. But um, yeah, um, it's you know, it's interesting that again, most people don't know that it is 40 years since uh Hannibal Lecter rose to the scene, but it became more popular um five years later, 35 years after you know the silence of the lamb uh came out, and people still quote so many things of this specifically the silence of the lamb. Obviously, hello Clarice and uh put the lotion in the basket, and uh I got an old friend coming for dinner. Oh man. Yeah, I think I might just I think I might just watch the movie after this because when you talk about a movie, sometimes you gotta watch it. Um yeah, but anyway, um that's uh that's it for this uh for this episode. Um I just remember how the lamb start stops screaming. Oh, wait, one last thing before I go. The biggest impact of all of the Hannibal Elector, specifically Anthony Hopkins, was like, well, I believe like 10-12 years ago, we got Epic Rap Battles of History with uh Hannibal Lecter versus Jack the Ripper. And honestly, like some of the rhymes still I still remember. It was like Jack or Megalomania, like you haven't mentioned me once in your entire battle rap. I don't know. That's I think that's also one of my favorite of the ERB. I don't know why. I think it's it was like the dark gothic undertone of it.
SPEAKER_00Um Barney, we can't forget about Barney.
SPEAKER_01Barney, take me back. Yeah, he's played by the same man.
SPEAKER_00This is a very underrated character. It's crazy. I was gonna add, the craziest thing is you would like watching those two films, I don't know what it is, but Hannibal, you can tell like Hannibal just may have disdain for certain characters, like his doctor, for instance.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But he has no you don't I don't see him like wanting to kill or even eat Barney. I think he like like I think I guess Barney he respects him to a point where he just I don't know what it is. Like, I I mean I don't know if you see it, but when I've seen those two films, I'll sit there and I'll go, you know, he really appreciates him and respects him. Like I don't think he ever like if he actually like broke out, and I mean he did, right? But I mean, if if any of that time when he was free, I don't ever think he actually like would want to hunt him down.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, I think Barney just treated him like an actual human being. Um, but yeah, yeah, no, he's a he was such a very underrated character. Um, yeah, I think that's our our Hannibal Elector episode. Um I would like to continue talking about like famous care uh characters and stuff like that. I want to do I want to start doing segments called like I guess an Odie but a goodie because when I was talking about James Remar and the Warriors, I was like one of these days I think I'm gonna talk about that movie. Um eventually I'm gonna talk about um the prestige. Um obviously because the Odyssey is coming out, but it's uh this is this year's gonna be, I think, 20 years. And to this day, everybody likes the ending of that movie. Um, which I'll talk about more in the next episode. But um, that's all I got. Um, thank you for coming out, Jesus. Um, yeah, if we do an Easter, yeah, if we do uh an Easter episode, if we do an Easter episode, um I gotta I gotta tell you what movies I definitely want to talk about for that one. Specifically, it's like movies I watch around this time of the year. Um, I think you can guess uh one of them, maybe two of them.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, we can start talking. We can we can start uh getting into that. We can start hyping or start the hype for the sequel.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Yeah. Um, so um, other than that, you guys have a great night, day, morning, whenever you're listening to this, uh signing off.