WEBVTT 00:00:14.346 --> 00:00:15.814 Hello. Good morning. 00:00:15.814 --> 00:00:18.184 Good afternoon. Good evening, everyone. 00:00:19.118 --> 00:00:20.887 This is our friend, the computer. 00:00:20.887 --> 00:00:22.021 I'm here. 00:00:22.021 --> 00:00:24.923 This is Ana. I'm here with Camila, as I. 00:00:25.658 --> 00:00:27.626 How are you doing, Camila? 00:00:27.626 --> 00:00:30.096 I'm tired because we started really early. 00:00:30.096 --> 00:00:32.765 Yeah, we did. It was because we had a scheduling mistake. 00:00:32.765 --> 00:00:34.167 That was my fault. 00:00:34.167 --> 00:00:36.603 So I can't complain about being tired now. 00:00:36.603 --> 00:00:38.871 It's now you've got things going on in the day. 00:00:38.938 --> 00:00:42.408 No, that's not your fault. 00:00:42.408 --> 00:00:48.048 Yeah, it's a good thing, though, because like I was saying earlier, I really like the sound of morning voices. 00:00:48.048 --> 00:00:50.850 I wish I could have my morning voice. 00:00:50.850 --> 00:00:57.557 I mean, I don't like my morning fights. I'm listening back to it, but, like, I find them quite soothing. 00:00:57.890 --> 00:01:01.960 Okay, well, I'll try to be soothing and not croaky. 00:01:01.994 --> 00:01:04.063 Not croaky. How you doing? 00:01:05.432 --> 00:01:06.766 I'm good. 00:01:07.233 --> 00:01:16.742 I thought you would be interested because I went to see a cricket game last weekend, and it was Australia versus England. 00:01:16.742 --> 00:01:18.510 It was the Ashes. 00:01:18.510 --> 00:01:19.445 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:01:19.445 --> 00:01:23.016 And it was the last game and it was very thrilling. 00:01:23.016 --> 00:01:23.783 We won. 00:01:23.783 --> 00:01:28.421 England Well, Australia, they are the better. 00:01:28.421 --> 00:01:31.490 They are the that team. 00:01:31.490 --> 00:01:32.292 But it was fun. 00:01:32.292 --> 00:01:35.295 Yeah, it was like I was, we were there for like 5 hours. 00:01:35.295 --> 00:01:38.631 I get kind of long realize that it's, it's long. 00:01:38.631 --> 00:01:39.899 Yeah, it's very long. 00:01:39.899 --> 00:01:40.400 It's kind of. 00:01:40.400 --> 00:01:42.135 Which is really nice. Yeah. 00:01:42.135 --> 00:01:43.536 Because it's so chill. 00:01:43.536 --> 00:01:45.638 I really enjoy going to the cricket. 00:01:45.671 --> 00:01:47.573 I like the cricket. 00:01:47.573 --> 00:01:50.609 I like having it on in the back grounds. 00:01:50.609 --> 00:01:51.611 Oh, really? Yeah. 00:01:51.611 --> 00:02:03.989 It's something that I guess I grew up having on in like the summer months and it would just be on and like, like the Olympics, you know, in the Olympics is on and it's just on the telly all the time. 00:02:05.525 --> 00:02:18.170 And then I've been to a few matches with my mom and I've been with some friends and yeah, it's just it's just really chill and relaxing and you sit and you just bring food and drinks and. 00:02:18.204 --> 00:02:19.605 Yeah, yeah. 00:02:19.605 --> 00:02:26.913 And in the sun you just watch like this massive green field and so strip in the middle. 00:02:26.913 --> 00:02:27.312 Yeah. 00:02:27.312 --> 00:02:31.783 I find it really hard to track the ball like when it's. 00:02:31.783 --> 00:02:33.385 I can't really see it very well. 00:02:33.385 --> 00:02:35.388 So I had like yo what's the reaction. 00:02:35.388 --> 00:02:37.590 It's not used to. Yeah. 00:02:37.590 --> 00:02:39.092 Yeah. 00:02:39.092 --> 00:02:49.836 Both us have was really, there was a little bit of like a spectator like beef between England and Australia because it's the Barmy Army. 00:02:50.103 --> 00:02:51.538 Is that cricket. 00:02:51.570 --> 00:02:55.241 What, the Barmy Army. 00:02:55.241 --> 00:02:56.442 It's that will you. 00:02:56.442 --> 00:02:59.711 So it's the, it's the fans of England. 00:03:00.246 --> 00:03:02.949 Oh I was sitting with people that were. 00:03:02.949 --> 00:03:03.515 Yeah. 00:03:03.515 --> 00:03:05.884 But it was so fun. I go again. Definitely. 00:03:05.884 --> 00:03:07.753 Oh let's go sometime. Yeah. 00:03:08.788 --> 00:03:10.590 Computer excursion to the cricket. 00:03:10.590 --> 00:03:12.792 Yes, that would be fun. 00:03:12.792 --> 00:03:14.961 Bring our little minotaur with us. 00:03:14.961 --> 00:03:18.031 Oh, how. How about you? 00:03:18.031 --> 00:03:18.698 How are you? 00:03:18.698 --> 00:03:20.332 Or do you just want to go straight? 00:03:20.332 --> 00:03:23.770 I might just go straight into it because to be honest, I don't know if I've been doing much. 00:03:23.770 --> 00:03:28.373 Well, this is our last episode about education. 00:03:28.407 --> 00:03:30.310 Oh, computers season. 00:03:30.310 --> 00:03:31.343 Yeah. 00:03:31.610 --> 00:03:32.110 And I've. 00:03:32.110 --> 00:03:34.781 I've really enjoyed this season. 00:03:32.110 --> 00:03:34.781 Yeah, I think it's good. 00:03:34.813 --> 00:03:36.481 We've met a lot of friends. 00:03:36.481 --> 00:03:37.449 Fun friends. 00:03:37.449 --> 00:03:45.358 Mhm. So for our last episode of the season we're going to go on a trip to New Zealand. 00:03:46.758 --> 00:03:49.162 Speaking of cricket, I guess they picked it. 00:03:49.861 --> 00:04:00.006 Yeah, and New Zealand is my favorite accent, so this is really fun for me because I got to watch lots of eighties New Zealand stuff, New Zealand stuff. 00:04:00.539 --> 00:04:01.473 It's my New Zealand accent. 00:04:02.609 --> 00:04:03.376 Good, good. 00:04:03.376 --> 00:04:03.977 Thank you. 00:04:03.977 --> 00:04:07.513 Pretty good for an Aussie fashion chops. 00:04:07.513 --> 00:04:10.015 That's the classic one to say so. 00:04:10.182 --> 00:04:20.759 So we're looking at another home grown microcomputer that's funded by a government program, but this one was crushed by corporate interference. 00:04:20.759 --> 00:04:25.464 So we'll be discussing what that looked like and then we'll be a little sad about it. 00:04:25.632 --> 00:04:27.033 Like I said, vote for her. 00:04:27.033 --> 00:04:29.235 Yeah, I'll be so. 00:04:29.369 --> 00:04:32.805 Our friend today is called the Poly one. 00:04:33.206 --> 00:04:35.375 Cool. So name? 00:04:36.141 --> 00:04:36.875 Yeah, my name. 00:04:36.875 --> 00:04:39.312 It's not a micro B, but it's fine. 00:04:40.812 --> 00:04:54.661 So we're in the late seventies, early eighties, New Zealand, two guys, Neil Scott and Paul Bryant, electrical engineering teachers at Wellington Polytechnic, which is like a vocational college. 00:04:55.194 --> 00:04:55.795 I looked it up. 00:04:55.795 --> 00:05:02.168 It's since been subsumed into like various other institutions, but that's what it was at the time. So. 00:05:02.435 --> 00:05:03.702 Neil Scott, Dr. 00:05:03.702 --> 00:05:08.940 Neil Scott, it's a lot of information about him, but less about Paul Bryant. 00:05:08.940 --> 00:05:18.884 Sorry to Paul Bryant, but he had been working on projects at Wellington Polytechnic to make computers more accessible for people with disabilities. 00:05:19.151 --> 00:05:31.363 So he was interested in developing natural language interfaces and also seems like different methods of navigation and interaction, such as gesture controls. 00:05:31.798 --> 00:05:38.204 So the first computer that he built was for a school student who and the references are kind of old on this. 00:05:38.271 --> 00:05:41.940 It sounds like they had maybe a non-verbal learning disorder. 00:05:42.240 --> 00:05:47.146 So he built a computer which could be controlled through the knees and used Morse code. 00:05:47.146 --> 00:05:48.480 I have no other information. 00:05:48.480 --> 00:05:50.016 Please don't ask follow up questions. 00:05:50.016 --> 00:05:52.951 Okay. 00:05:52.951 --> 00:05:55.454 Through the needs. Yeah, I guess Maybe. 00:05:55.454 --> 00:05:57.990 I guess. Maybe. Like the buttons. 00:05:58.557 --> 00:05:59.492 Mm hmm. 00:06:00.158 --> 00:06:01.994 Yeah. Yes. At the knees. I don't. 00:06:01.994 --> 00:06:02.627 I don't know. 00:06:02.627 --> 00:06:05.264 But apparently it was useful and worked. And. 00:06:05.298 --> 00:06:08.800 And he built a few things like this ergonomic. 00:06:08.800 --> 00:06:10.370 Yeah. Yeah. 00:06:10.370 --> 00:06:20.612 And he also was working on projects that more generally looked at how technology could be used to make math and science more appealing to schoolchildren. 00:06:20.612 --> 00:06:33.425 And yeah, I really couldn't find much about Paul Bryant, but there was more until Scott because he ended up after this project moving to the United States and he became the director of the Archimedes Project. 00:06:33.425 --> 00:06:37.096 So there's like a lot more information about him out there. 00:06:37.262 --> 00:06:40.432 And truly I couldn't find stuff about Paul Bryant. 00:06:40.432 --> 00:06:49.541 So Paul Ryan, if you are out there, tweet us or email us and we'll we'll add some information of how you got tonight. 00:06:50.076 --> 00:07:04.891 I'm sorry, of so from all of this sort of background and experience, Scott and Bryant saw a gap in the market this gap that many people around this time around the world was starting to see. 00:07:04.891 --> 00:07:18.771 And for them, it was perhaps like less of a gap in the market and more of an opening up of potential learning and accessibility opportunities to make a computer for education. 00:07:18.771 --> 00:07:30.916 So and this computer, I think I saw this mentioned one time, it was the first or one of the first of these government funded educational computers. 00:07:30.916 --> 00:07:38.423 It was released 18 months before the BBC Micro Account computer from the Computer Literacy Project. 00:07:38.423 --> 00:07:39.257 Okay, cool. 00:07:39.257 --> 00:07:43.129 Because most of the stuff we've seen has been inspired by. 00:07:43.463 --> 00:07:45.831 Yeah, yeah. The BBC Micro. 00:07:45.831 --> 00:07:47.533 Yeah, that's interesting. 00:07:47.533 --> 00:08:03.382 I, I like how we're just doing this very not chronologically like we're just going based on by into Yeah deeper and deeper into the edge of computers thing and just finding out more about the kind of predecessors of the models. 00:08:03.382 --> 00:08:31.576 But yeah, it's also, I guess another thing that I wanted to talk of I guess like reflect on it being the last episode is that it's always so weird to see how a lot of these projects were just undeniably well-intentioned and had experts leading it that were more just interested academically and in practice, in accessibility and like helping others and kind of, you know, squashing the disparities. 00:08:31.576 --> 00:08:39.150 And then these motives soon got swept up by, you know, venture capitalists or whatever. 00:08:40.886 --> 00:09:06.312 And obviously, I'm not saying that's like necessarily a bad thing, but yeah, it just must have been a crazy time for academics who specialized in these things because it must have been like inevitable for them to get approached for business, like it just must have been such a wild time for for academics that were pursuing the subject of computer literacy, which I'm sure that there was quite a lot of them. 00:09:06.312 --> 00:09:06.511 Yeah. 00:09:06.511 --> 00:09:26.065 I wonder if they felt like this is something that they wanted, you know, they're doing something yet doing this because they see that, oh, this is maybe like it could turn into a thing or they're just developing it and then they're like, Oh, wow, okay, I now have the opportunity to actually put this into practice and yeah, send it around the round the country. 00:09:26.698 --> 00:09:27.066 Yeah. 00:09:28.600 --> 00:09:35.674 So it's called the poly one because it was originally developed and designed at Wellington Poly. 00:09:35.674 --> 00:09:46.985 Technik Oh, I just, I love how it sounds like a Star Wars, but character like a it was for like maybe a BBA. 00:09:47.019 --> 00:09:49.322 C3PO Mm hmm. 00:09:49.322 --> 00:09:56.128 Polyone So in 1980 they pitched it to the Department of Education. 00:09:56.729 --> 00:10:02.067 The government liked the idea, and so they began a company called Poly Poly Corp. 00:10:02.067 --> 00:10:03.134 Poly Corp. 00:10:03.134 --> 00:10:04.235 Yeah. Cool. 00:10:04.235 --> 00:10:06.572 Love, love these Disney names. 00:10:08.307 --> 00:10:14.980 I just it's so funny to see that like these names in the eighties and nineties when companies were still called something Corp. 00:10:15.014 --> 00:10:21.721 which now just sounds blatantly evil, but I'm sure they I'm sure they were nice. 00:10:21.721 --> 00:10:24.289 I'm sure they were nice people, yeah. 00:10:24.322 --> 00:10:41.941 POLYCARP Which was a partnership between the Development Finance Corporation, which was a state funded venture capital enterprise and a New Zealand software company called Progeny Computers per Progeny Progeny Progeny Computers Ltd. 00:10:41.941 --> 00:10:45.443 So it was part of it. 00:10:45.477 --> 00:11:07.600 I mean that sounds even more evil, but it was, I guess the government was and we saw this in Canada as well, had this yeah, this like venture capital investment part of what they were doing and so that joined up with her, Jeannie and with the guys from Wellington Polytechnic and made public. 00:11:08.466 --> 00:11:22.648 So they had a development team of six engineers and technicians and it's kind of wild, but they built 50 working machines, I guess prototypes in under eight months. 50. 00:11:23.349 --> 00:11:34.393 Wow. So in 1981, they're just like ready to go in some of these 50 prototype IPS were already being trialed in local schools. 00:11:34.894 --> 00:11:45.604 So then the Education Department agreed to purchase a thousand computers over a thousand computers a year, over five years for $10 million. 00:11:46.438 --> 00:11:51.777 HUF And I've also seen this described as 16 poly ones for every school in the country. 00:11:51.777 --> 00:11:54.245 Yeah, that's got to me. That's a lot. 00:11:54.447 --> 00:11:54.813 Yeah. 00:11:54.813 --> 00:12:04.590 It's weird how it's becoming more and more clear that school children were also just like literally lab rats for testing computer machines. 00:12:04.590 --> 00:12:05.024 Really? 00:12:05.024 --> 00:12:08.660 Because this was like, that's a lot of money to spend it in schools. 00:12:09.095 --> 00:12:10.562 Yeah. 00:12:10.562 --> 00:12:19.672 And just to suddenly have the government allow enable this amount of spending in schools is kind of straight like unpredictable. 00:12:19.672 --> 00:12:24.076 There must be some kind of there must be something else going on in the background, right. 00:12:24.076 --> 00:12:28.614 Like there must be more beneath the agenda of just, just pure accessibility. 00:12:28.614 --> 00:12:37.123 Like it I mean, obviously helping the economy grow for the future, educating the young minds, blah, blah, blah. 00:12:38.791 --> 00:12:47.600 But also having these models being trialed and tested in schools is kind of a smart thing to do. 00:12:47.966 --> 00:13:04.482 Yeah, And I guess with this the government could say that, yeah, it's like computer literacy stuff so that New Zealand can, you know, have a, have a place in the future, but also that it was a homegrown thing. 00:13:04.482 --> 00:13:14.393 So it maybe was an easy sell to say, oh where we're doing this in New Zealand, everything is made in New Zealand, it's supporting New Zealand kids. 00:13:15.594 --> 00:13:15.927 Yeah. 00:13:15.927 --> 00:13:18.429 So at the time I guess the government was was into it. 00:13:19.230 --> 00:13:28.139 I think as well to, you know, make a little prototype, go in to meet with the government and like yeah, his $10 million. Mm. 00:13:28.774 --> 00:13:34.413 And also I think at this point it meant that schools could only use public ones. 00:13:34.413 --> 00:13:39.118 The idea was like this was, this was the school computer in New Zealand. Hmm. 00:13:39.118 --> 00:13:43.121 So let's take a little break and look at the public one. 00:13:43.589 --> 00:13:54.200 So the first thing that it had was color graphics, which is something that we've seen as an important component for most of these educational computers. 00:13:54.600 --> 00:13:59.171 Yeah, I mean, that's it, like you mentioned in the last episode, is just a huge selling point. 00:13:59.171 --> 00:14:07.379 Well, for children, that's like because all of these had teachers and experts kind of giving advice. 00:14:07.379 --> 00:14:10.081 And I think that was the first thing for everyone. 00:14:10.081 --> 00:14:48.888 This is it's got to be in color and something something written in a comment on classic computers that all the NZ from JEM standards who seem to be involved was at the screen used a teletext display chip and had five layers text graphics, second text second graphics and solid background color, and then a comment from someone called Manukau on a on a different blog post mentioned that even though these graphics were chunky teletext graphics, teletext didn't arrive in New Zealand until 1984, so they seemed really fresh and new to New Zealand users. 00:14:48.888 --> 00:15:15.681 I like seeing the teletext stuff come in and, and you know, we did our first season looking at quite a few teletext and video text networks and it's, it's cool to see that sort of changeover period where we had sort of teletext graphics and, and, and display chips and things can, you can see how they're being used in computers which will, you know, eventually get, get taken over by newer technology. 00:15:15.681 --> 00:15:18.750 But there's just this like one moment where they thought like crazy touch. 00:15:18.750 --> 00:15:20.719 Yeah. Yeah. Mm hmm. Yeah. 00:15:20.719 --> 00:15:26.392 So the poly one had 64 kilobytes of RAM and an enhanced eight bit CPU. 00:15:26.892 --> 00:15:43.207 And then I think like we saw in our last episode with the icon, correct me if I'm wrong, but they could be networked by Daisy chaining them together with like a floppy disk drive for storage and then you could add a printer on there if you want. 00:15:44.043 --> 00:15:51.649 And I did see someone mention, but I don't know if this actually happened that they were actually hoping for to create. 00:15:51.649 --> 00:15:54.385 So that's like a network within a classroom or within a school. 00:15:55.287 --> 00:16:00.458 But they were kind of hoping to do something with networking schools together as well. 00:16:00.491 --> 00:16:01.259 I'm not sure. 00:16:01.259 --> 00:16:05.931 I don't think they ever managed to do that, but would have would have been would have been nice. 00:16:05.931 --> 00:16:15.106 Yeah, it would have made sense If you're all using the same hardware and I know that you are probably dying to talk about it, Let's talk about charisma. 00:16:15.740 --> 00:16:16.307 Oh, yeah. 00:16:16.307 --> 00:16:19.979 And this computer has charisma, so I'm going to send you a link. 00:16:20.011 --> 00:16:20.778 Oh, like you. 00:16:20.778 --> 00:16:21.513 Here is the link. 00:16:21.513 --> 00:16:22.280 Oh, yeah. 00:16:22.280 --> 00:16:23.182 Thank you. 00:16:23.182 --> 00:16:25.183 To a picture of it. 00:16:25.384 --> 00:16:28.386 Yeah, that is it. Cut off. 00:16:28.419 --> 00:16:31.724 Oh, What do you think? 00:16:31.724 --> 00:16:37.129 It looks so eighties by it's form. 00:16:37.129 --> 00:16:41.833 It just looks like the kind of materialization of eighties. 00:16:42.900 --> 00:17:02.354 I don't know eighties esthetic like they started doing these kind of graphics for TV adverts and I don't know, it just looks like the physical version of 80 special effects where graphics are protruding from the distance to the foreground, leaving graphic trail behind. 00:17:02.354 --> 00:17:04.823 You know what I'm talking about? Yes. 00:17:04.823 --> 00:17:09.461 And I don't know, it just really shows the time of 3D graphic discovery. 00:17:09.461 --> 00:17:12.230 Like the camera's always moving in and out of things. 00:17:12.698 --> 00:17:20.305 And this is what the form of this computer represents to me, like the discovery of playing with space. 00:17:20.305 --> 00:17:24.843 It looks like that because a chunky boy, it is a long computer. 00:17:25.109 --> 00:17:32.884 It's really long and it has these handles and then it does kind of go it gets smaller at the back. 00:17:32.884 --> 00:17:33.317 And I. 00:17:33.317 --> 00:17:34.752 I know what you mean. That it. 00:17:34.752 --> 00:17:37.823 Yeah. It kind of looks like a trail. 00:17:37.923 --> 00:17:38.289 Yeah. 00:17:38.289 --> 00:17:42.560 Sort of feigns perspective like one point thing. 00:17:42.627 --> 00:17:43.996 Yeah. 00:17:43.996 --> 00:17:51.036 And it's a bit similar to the icon in that it says of all in one situation, but this, this guy's like really smooth. 00:17:51.269 --> 00:17:52.503 It's really big. 00:17:52.503 --> 00:17:53.605 It looks very simple. 00:17:53.605 --> 00:18:02.080 It has a fiberglass shell with these sort of rounded corners that is very futuristic, very syverson, very Star Trek. 00:18:03.147 --> 00:18:12.257 And then on the sides to make it even chunkier, it has these long handles like rails, almost along each side. 00:18:12.257 --> 00:18:15.294 And I guess the idea is that it could be moved easily. 00:18:15.294 --> 00:18:17.462 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:18:17.462 --> 00:18:29.273 I mean, I was wondering, like, why does it have such an elongated computer case or a computer chassis and what I can do and I just, it looks fairly normal inside so I don't, I safety. 00:18:29.273 --> 00:18:31.375 Yeah. I wonder it's all in there. 00:18:32.243 --> 00:18:34.113 Just a suitcase of a computer. 00:18:34.113 --> 00:18:36.115 It's amazing. 00:18:36.115 --> 00:18:53.699 Well it does have a full keyboard so that takes up space at the front and it has a numeric pad and has arrows and some of those keys are like bright colors and the computer itself came in six friggin colors and it was the iMac. 00:18:53.965 --> 00:18:57.402 G3 Yeah, yeah. 00:18:57.402 --> 00:19:01.973 I was going to say, but it's a very G3 to have it in all these colors. 00:19:01.973 --> 00:19:06.144 I can't find the list of colors, but the photo I sent you is cream. 00:19:06.144 --> 00:19:09.882 And then there's one other image on line and it's yellow. 00:19:10.382 --> 00:19:11.048 Nice. 00:19:11.048 --> 00:19:15.721 And I presume wear cream, yellow, blue, red, green. 00:19:16.622 --> 00:19:17.256 Yeah. 00:19:17.256 --> 00:19:18.056 Something else. 00:19:18.056 --> 00:19:21.192 Well, I mean, it's got to have plasma if it's going to be going into schools. 00:19:21.192 --> 00:19:23.194 Yeah. Different colors. Yeah. 00:19:24.262 --> 00:19:24.563 Yeah. 00:19:24.563 --> 00:19:28.299 It has very similar features also to IMAX. 00:19:28.299 --> 00:19:33.739 Like, I don't know, the rounded corners, beveled edges and it looks very similar. 00:19:34.006 --> 00:19:34.472 Yeah. 00:19:34.472 --> 00:19:44.816 And the fact that it has a high graphics card as well, the fact that you could look at the machine and kind of assume that things will just run smoothly is very, very yeah, very iMac. 00:19:45.017 --> 00:19:49.421 So it was also relatively simple to like set up. 00:19:49.621 --> 00:19:55.560 It had two cards, one for power and then one to connect to other computers for networking. 00:19:55.661 --> 00:19:58.130 So it was easy for teachers to set up. 00:19:58.730 --> 00:20:04.502 There was some mention online in comments talking about how it was actually kind of difficult to maneuver. 00:20:04.769 --> 00:20:09.807 I saw someone saying that it was too big to fit through doors easily. 00:20:10.209 --> 00:20:15.713 That's hilarious because it's just got a massive bubble, but it's just too vague. 00:20:16.882 --> 00:20:18.083 So good. 00:20:18.083 --> 00:20:26.525 And that commenter Monica said as the quote, It may have looked sexy, but the units did not break down into easily handled modules. 00:20:26.758 --> 00:20:34.499 They needed to people to carry them even between benches and a single teacher setting out could not usually move one even between classrooms. 00:20:34.700 --> 00:20:40.471 I speak from experience having put my back out with a 100 meter lug to a carpark. 00:20:40.905 --> 00:20:58.022 It's just amazing to me how when you think of a large computer, you think of it extruding outwards, like from the sides, like the, you know, the size of the screen, but you'd never think of it extending on that kind of z-axis as if, like backwards or forwards. 00:20:58.856 --> 00:21:02.760 Yeah, it's just a whole new re-imagination of computer hardware. 00:21:02.760 --> 00:21:04.096 It's fabulous. 00:21:04.096 --> 00:21:12.804 Like, you know, I don't want big screens, I want big chassis when it comes to my computer. 00:21:12.804 --> 00:21:16.474 And so the other components of the poly one was software. 00:21:16.474 --> 00:21:19.044 So we've talked about the hardware. 00:21:16.474 --> 00:21:19.044 This is the software. 00:21:19.044 --> 00:21:34.393 I think that what all of these educational computers have shown us is that before there was sort of a designated way that software existed, there was so much room for creativity and and especially produced styles of software for the poly. 00:21:34.393 --> 00:21:42.366 One poly quote worked with someone named Kevin Hurley at the Education Department to produce software and course material. 00:21:42.800 --> 00:21:46.471 This is a quote from a blog called Kiwi Nuggets. 00:21:47.071 --> 00:21:49.740 Excellent. Yes, excellent name. 00:21:49.740 --> 00:21:57.115 60 teachers worked through the 1982 81 summer holiday to right course content into shells created in the software. 00:21:57.582 --> 00:22:10.261 Polycarp presented their product as a reliable, robust network teacher and student friendly closed system, specifically designed to deliver computer assisted learning across curricula, as well as computer awareness. 00:22:10.261 --> 00:22:13.832 Computer studies and support for school administration. 00:22:14.398 --> 00:22:22.673 So these shows were software that individual teachers could then like fill in with their specific content or curriculum. 00:22:22.874 --> 00:22:30.315 So it made it really easy to individualize the software for each classroom and for each set of students and for each teacher. 00:22:31.383 --> 00:22:34.586 While COVID era teaching could never. 00:22:35.354 --> 00:22:43.295 I wonder how different that is to the kind of lesson where idea that the icon promised with the hope. 00:22:43.295 --> 00:22:44.730 That sounds very. 00:22:44.730 --> 00:22:53.704 Yeah, but this sounds like very efficient and very yeah this doesn't sound hypertext, but it does sound useful. 00:22:54.472 --> 00:22:54.873 Yeah. 00:22:54.873 --> 00:22:58.109 And like, sharable and kind of modular. 00:22:58.210 --> 00:23:00.010 Yeah. 00:23:00.010 --> 00:23:20.432 And it was interesting because it seemed to be a thing that they wanted it to be a really stable, functional, easily upgradable system from both the hardware and the software perspective so that the schools could get these computers and essentially not need to buy anything else for a really long time, says a quote. 00:23:20.766 --> 00:23:35.846 Dr. Scott says it was designed as industrial embedded technology, similar to the computers that run everyday processes such as traffic lights, so that unlike other PCs, the poly one would keep working without becoming obsolete. Hmm. 00:23:37.715 --> 00:23:55.733 And so while this is admirable and useful and all things great, it kind of ushered in the downfall of the Polyone and poly colt because as you can imagine, a technology that does have become obsolete is not something that corporations necessarily want in the world. 00:23:55.967 --> 00:24:03.275 Yeah, and there's a few things that play in this part of the story, and it goes off on some tangents, and some of those tangents are a bit dark. 00:24:03.275 --> 00:24:09.213 So I tried to I tried to put it in an order that makes sense. 00:24:09.213 --> 00:24:13.384 So let's get into the topic section of this podcast. 00:24:14.152 --> 00:24:29.334 So we're in New Zealand where in late 1981 and there is an election, the National Party, which is a Conservative party and who had already been in power, narrowly wins the election by one seat. 00:24:29.334 --> 00:24:39.845 So business interests have a little more, are a lot more lobbying power over the government, particularly about how the government shouldn't be involved in business. 00:24:40.612 --> 00:24:48.886 And it turns out surprise, surprise us companies like Apple and IBM aren't super thrilled that this government deal with Polycarp. 00:24:48.886 --> 00:24:53.391 It's essentially locking them out of the New Zealand market, educational market. 00:24:54.092 --> 00:24:58.730 And also, like you said, the schools are only allowed to polyone in them, right? 00:24:59.130 --> 00:25:08.038 Well, yeah, but also even if I'm wrong and they could buy other computers like the poly ones for free. 00:25:08.038 --> 00:25:08.405 Yeah. 00:25:10.075 --> 00:25:27.959 And also I guess Apple and IBM and things would be upset not just for that market, but you know, when children are growing up with a particular brand, they're more likely to continue buying those products. 00:25:27.959 --> 00:25:40.070 And also, I guess maybe establishing a trend that they didn't want to extend to other countries of home grown computers and then not being able to get into those markets. 00:25:40.238 --> 00:25:47.211 So they lobby the New Zealand government and the government rescinds its purchase agreement with Polycarp. 00:25:47.679 --> 00:25:52.049 So no thousand polygons each year for five years. 00:25:52.651 --> 00:26:00.592 Of the ten yea of the $10 million, Polycarp only received $64,000. 00:26:00.991 --> 00:26:06.798 Wow. Which I think was probably the money that they used to make those 50. 00:26:06.798 --> 00:26:10.468 Yeah. Which is again, not that much, no way. 00:26:10.468 --> 00:26:19.678 So like evil sounding, but in reality good Polycarp is defeated by Keith sounding, but in reality, evil Apple and IBM. 00:26:19.711 --> 00:26:21.579 Yeah, yeah. It's really sad. 00:26:21.579 --> 00:26:23.315 And this is like this is late 81. 00:26:23.315 --> 00:26:25.349 So I think they pitched it. 00:26:25.349 --> 00:26:29.086 Oh, it was accepted in 1980, 82, 81. 00:26:29.086 --> 00:26:30.121 They, they built that. Yeah. 00:26:30.121 --> 00:26:36.560 The fact that the pitch was accepted and the budget was made and then suddenly they're like, well, we've got the budget, we're not going to give it to you. 00:26:37.362 --> 00:26:52.844 And a quote from that Kiwi Nuggets article was Cabinet Minister Warren Cooper told Perth's Pearse Hartman that he and his colleagues, quote, could see no reason why government should spend money so the teachers could do even less work. 00:26:53.577 --> 00:26:56.647 Oh my God, that now that's evil. 00:26:56.647 --> 00:27:00.884 That's Warren Cooper is the antagonist in this Desmond Disney movie. 00:27:01.152 --> 00:27:02.621 No, I don't want to get sued. 00:27:03.821 --> 00:27:06.023 Cooper Court Yeah, Allegedly. 00:27:06.657 --> 00:27:07.826 Allegedly. 00:27:07.826 --> 00:27:18.269 There was also in that blog post a little chat about how perhaps there were some connections between Ex-national party ministers or workers who were stakeholders in the U.S. 00:27:18.269 --> 00:27:19.170 computer companies. 00:27:19.170 --> 00:27:25.009 So there's like some other stuff going on, I think I'm sure they've got their hands in loads of pies. 00:27:26.611 --> 00:27:37.588 There's also another strange side to this story, so that $10 million promised by the government and I guess where it went instead. 00:27:37.955 --> 00:27:42.359 So I only saw this mentioned one time in my research. 00:27:42.359 --> 00:27:53.404 It was in the slides of a presentation by Bob Doran and Andrew Trotman, and it said that the $10 million went towards funding the Springbok tour. 00:27:53.672 --> 00:27:56.473 Do you know about this? No. 00:27:57.075 --> 00:28:10.355 So speaking of sport, I guess the Springbok, the South African Rugby Union team and rugby is really big in New Zealand and there is, I think, a rivalry between the Springbok and the All Blacks, which is the New Zealand team. 00:28:11.321 --> 00:28:17.961 And there was a planned tour so the South African team would be coming to New Zealand to play New Zealand. 00:28:18.630 --> 00:28:19.364 Mm hmm. 00:28:19.431 --> 00:28:28.873 But this is 1981, which was during apartheid to shoot and other kind of I don't want to swear on this either. 00:28:29.339 --> 00:28:35.079 Other countries had a sports boycott for South Africa, but I guess not New Zealand. 00:28:35.579 --> 00:28:38.182 And the government was in favor of this tour. 00:28:38.415 --> 00:28:42.353 They were saying something like, Oh, we shouldn't mix politics and sport or something. 00:28:42.554 --> 00:28:43.922 Oh my God. 00:28:44.255 --> 00:28:47.892 But it was widely opposed by New Zealanders. 00:28:47.892 --> 00:28:55.066 There was widespread protests and it ended up being like the major issue of the 1981 election. 00:28:55.799 --> 00:29:07.511 And the quote is more than 150,000 people took part in over 200 demonstrations in 28 centers, and 1500 were charged with offenses stemming from these protests. 00:29:07.612 --> 00:29:09.413 So it's like a really big deal. 00:29:09.413 --> 00:29:10.115 Huge. Yeah. 00:29:10.115 --> 00:29:13.518 Yeah, I guess the government went through the like they won. 00:29:14.118 --> 00:29:17.821 And then there's that money to fund the Tories. 00:29:17.821 --> 00:29:20.191 So twisted I. 00:29:20.525 --> 00:29:27.731 Yeah Lucky was up and yeah, there was like a whole international sports boycott like, like a global. 00:29:28.232 --> 00:29:30.034 But I guess. Yeah. 00:29:30.034 --> 00:29:34.672 Ri rerouted computer money said eff that. 00:29:34.939 --> 00:29:35.773 Yeah. 00:29:36.039 --> 00:29:38.910 I mean I'd love to God it's so bad. 00:29:39.042 --> 00:29:41.179 But truly it was just a line. 00:29:41.179 --> 00:29:44.182 It was in I think it was in brackets as in parentheses too. 00:29:45.150 --> 00:29:49.653 It was like used for the Springbok to a like okay, God. 00:29:50.721 --> 00:29:52.757 So let's go back to the poly. 00:29:52.757 --> 00:29:54.491 Oh yeah. 00:29:54.491 --> 00:30:01.900 The result of this was that schools were allowed to purchase whatever computers they wanted, essentially. 00:30:02.834 --> 00:30:21.219 So the whole idea had been that with every school using the same computer and teachers developing this software, the shows curriculum could be shared and developed and there would be consistency in the hardware used and schools wouldn't need to keep purchasing new expensive hardware and software every few years. 00:30:21.219 --> 00:30:32.363 It was meant to be an investment, but with the government reneging on the deal, the stream was essentially down the drain and public hope was kind of on their own. 00:30:32.830 --> 00:30:36.334 And this is when the cost comes into play. 00:30:37.134 --> 00:30:45.876 The poly one was really, really, really expensive and it wouldn't have been an issue when the government was funding the program. 00:30:45.876 --> 00:30:53.951 But it became a really big problem once schools could buy their own, like make their own choices and the computers that they bought. 00:30:53.951 --> 00:31:03.060 So like once the schools computer program was open to the market, ah, I guess like they didn't get the free one from the, from the government. 00:31:03.060 --> 00:31:07.365 And so they had these, they had options. 00:31:07.365 --> 00:31:10.969 I found the cost of the poly from 1983. 00:31:11.001 --> 00:31:24.147 So in 1983 the cost of a poly one is $8,090 and the cost of an apple two for schools is 4800, which is already like a big difference. 00:31:25.316 --> 00:31:31.521 And then this just goes to show how seriously Apple was taking this threat. 00:31:31.823 --> 00:31:41.199 Apple gives every New Zealand school a free apple to and then it offers additional computers if they want them for 1200. 00:31:42.099 --> 00:31:43.667 Oh, wow. 00:31:43.667 --> 00:31:45.002 Sorry. 00:31:45.002 --> 00:31:45.702 Yeah. 00:31:45.702 --> 00:31:57.648 Molycorp did have some luck in protesting this and got customs to put an additional fee on these computers, but still only brought up the price to 20 $22,020. 00:31:58.082 --> 00:32:04.188 So it's 20 $20 versus $8,090 and you already have a free one time. 00:32:04.489 --> 00:32:06.723 Yeah. Yeah. There's no winning that. 00:32:07.157 --> 00:32:15.599 Another big blow to the project around this time was a media smear campaign, and I don't know who started it, but it definitely existed. 00:32:17.468 --> 00:32:33.017 So essentially when when you, Scott and Paul Bryant at Wellington Polytechnic started the project, they made a prototype out of like off shelf components, which is I guess what they showed to the government to get the deal, to make the WiFi. 00:32:34.085 --> 00:32:51.035 And they gave it a, they had a name, the name was poly wog, which is another name for a tadpole or the love of a frog or a toad, but unfortunately sounds very similar to a racist term that is very dated and no longer in use. 00:32:52.670 --> 00:33:04.115 And the media was sort of saying that it had a racist name, which, you know, it sounds similar to it's one letter off this racist slur. 00:33:04.648 --> 00:33:04.882 Yeah. 00:33:04.882 --> 00:33:20.365 So the media like why you've why is the government funding why are taxpayers money going towards a conflict as it's like racist so the schools weren't super inclined to purchase the poly one. 00:33:20.832 --> 00:33:23.768 There's a lot of weird like racist stuff in this. 00:33:24.434 --> 00:33:27.270 So yeah if I be this era. 00:33:27.704 --> 00:33:29.941 Yeah, sounds very. 00:33:29.941 --> 00:33:36.646 But you know, it's called the poly because it's poly for poly they were trying to find a that's like a normal word. 00:33:36.646 --> 00:33:40.351 They were trying to find a word that used poly from polytechnic. 00:33:40.518 --> 00:33:40.817 Yeah. 00:33:40.817 --> 00:33:52.296 And I guess they saw this word and it means the tadpole which is good for students like children and growing up. 00:33:53.064 --> 00:33:55.432 Right. Like being hatched. 00:33:55.432 --> 00:33:59.069 They just maybe shouldn't have used it, shouldn't have done it. 00:33:59.303 --> 00:34:02.673 They changed it was to poly one, two, poly one. 00:34:03.007 --> 00:34:04.642 Oh right, right, right, right. 00:34:04.642 --> 00:34:06.576 You know, I guess they were trying to be cute. 00:34:06.576 --> 00:34:10.148 We had the micro bee in Australia so like, oh, it's like a tadpole. 00:34:10.847 --> 00:34:16.387 But um, but they, you know, they weren't very Todd Poly. 00:34:16.387 --> 00:34:17.320 I know. 00:34:17.320 --> 00:34:20.425 Look, it was a bad choice. 00:34:20.425 --> 00:34:23.494 They've said that they were pretty racist in articles. 00:34:23.760 --> 00:34:26.164 I mean, alongside all the, like apartheid. 00:34:26.630 --> 00:34:26.963 Yeah. 00:34:26.998 --> 00:34:28.865 Conversation it was, it was. 00:34:28.865 --> 00:34:31.402 I can see how it was fun. 00:34:31.402 --> 00:34:36.606 There would be more of Yeah, that would be more of a focus on that. 00:34:36.840 --> 00:34:37.307 Yeah. 00:34:37.742 --> 00:34:47.085 And I'm glad that that wasn't the name of this to say it was kind of the death knell for the poly one. 00:34:47.585 --> 00:34:55.393 And at this point, most of the original poly team had left, leaving the progeny software company to take the reins of the project. 00:34:55.393 --> 00:35:06.237 And while they did sell some to schools with the Apple twos and IBM clones taking over the education market, prettiness signed a deal with Guess who? 00:35:06.737 --> 00:35:11.742 The Australian Army Gray. 00:35:12.275 --> 00:35:15.012 And so that would lead to the creation of the poly too. 00:35:15.413 --> 00:35:32.630 And I guess that the army had like the muscles to carry the computers around and then they expanded into China through a deal with a Chinese mining company, which would lead to the creation of the policy for which Padini apparently developed the world's first graphics processor for Chinese characters. 00:35:32.630 --> 00:35:33.998 Oh wow. 00:35:34.364 --> 00:35:40.605 However, the Chinese do ended up falling through because it was 1989. 00:35:40.605 --> 00:35:45.976 You know what happened in 1989 and know the Tiananmen Square protests. 00:35:46.110 --> 00:35:48.945 Yeah, it fell through in the eighties. 00:35:49.146 --> 00:35:51.949 Yes, sure. Time. Yeah, I did. 00:35:52.483 --> 00:35:58.121 Every every step of this second half of this research, I just was like, Oh, no. 00:35:58.121 --> 00:35:58.922 Okay. 00:36:02.293 --> 00:36:06.063 So I think Polycarp was so trying to continue in some way, you know, like late eighties. 00:36:06.063 --> 00:36:24.581 Yeah, but it was too late, you know, by this point, the, the big, the big corporations have kind of settled into the market and both the I think they were there was plans but then both the development Finance Corporation from the government and progeny computers became insolvent. 00:36:24.748 --> 00:36:26.717 So then Poly Corp. 00:36:26.717 --> 00:36:30.353 closed 1990 as a consequence. 00:36:30.353 --> 00:36:31.621 Yeah, yeah, yeah. 00:36:31.621 --> 00:36:40.764 It's interesting to see the progression here and how it was later, how the computer was later used in industries like all its different models. 00:36:40.764 --> 00:37:01.652 Because, you know, we talked about this the other day reflecting on our pre-Internet net network session where online networks do not just come from the kind of classic narrative of them being routed in the military and defense advanced research projects, which we know is the story of the US World World Wide Web. 00:37:01.652 --> 00:37:53.103 But in fact you can kind of go further back than that and discover these untold stories of socialist or accessibility projects like Cyber Sin and OJ. Yes, and I guess you could say the same for the evolution of the poly ones where it's from 1 to 2 to see, like, I don't think young humanitarian Neill Scott would have predicted, you know, that he'd be making the machines for the Australian Army but it's yeah, it's, it's it's good that we're like uncovering the story of poly one and these kind of like the true intentions of the, the initiation of it rather than the fact that the later just that the fact that the later models were used in in all these other projects. 00:37:53.103 --> 00:38:24.668 Yeah. I mean it's, it's been really nice to see physically how much teachers were involved in a lot of these projects and, you know, bringing in experts and trying to develop specific software and hardware for like that countries children and it, you know, there's some nationalistic sort of parts of all of this as well. 00:38:24.702 --> 00:38:39.516 But yeah to look at the individuals and and thinking about these teachers they're just like excited about computers and into learning to code so they can teach better and you know be able to engage students more. 00:38:39.516 --> 00:38:45.989 And I don't know it's it's it's nice it's just sad that every single time it crashes and burns. 00:38:46.523 --> 00:38:47.057 Yeah. 00:38:47.057 --> 00:39:01.172 And it's also really telling that that you know, the quote that you had from Warren Cooper, you know, where he's like could see no reason why government should spend money so that teachers could do even less work. 00:39:01.172 --> 00:39:21.358 Like the fact that this was this is said and this was published shows that this was really this could have been like a revolutionary kind of technology for for making lives easier for teachers or to kind of have a positive stance on automation is always very difficult to achieve. 00:39:21.358 --> 00:39:31.469 But yeah, the fact that this was like a big point of a debate is I think, quite telling of, of, of where this could have gone and how how much potential it had. 00:39:31.768 --> 00:40:08.773 Yeah, there was I think I saw Neil Scott talking in an article about how New Zealand, the new Zealand government just kind of missed a really big opportunity both financially in terms of the software that they were developing, but then also kind of just long term thinking about education in New Zealand and that it could have been something really great and instead ended up in something that New Zealand, you know, could control for themselves but ended up being this of U.S. 00:40:08.773 --> 00:40:09.672 corporate thing. 00:40:09.672 --> 00:40:17.815 There's a there's an article from 2006 about Neil Scott, which is where a lot of the Neil Scott stuff comes from. 00:40:17.815 --> 00:40:26.690 And there's a quote quoting the article now, 25 years after the Polyone schools have the same problems with computers. 00:40:26.690 --> 00:40:33.664 They're paying too much for hardware and software that's too complicated for the teachers to use properly and getting more complex each year. 00:40:33.664 --> 00:40:34.731 And then a quote from Dr. 00:40:34.731 --> 00:40:38.869 Scott Obsolescence is the theme for running the computer industry. 00:40:39.068 --> 00:40:41.806 That's how the computer industry makes money out of schools. 00:40:42.005 --> 00:40:44.340 The education system is a cash cow. 00:40:44.541 --> 00:40:48.012 Most of the problems we addressed with the Polyone are still there. 00:40:49.079 --> 00:40:49.780 Hell yeah. 00:40:49.780 --> 00:40:52.048 Preaching to the crowd. 00:40:52.583 --> 00:40:54.784 He's not wrong. This is so true. 00:40:55.052 --> 00:40:57.320 It's funny because it's still happening today. 00:40:57.320 --> 00:40:58.789 It wasn't just happening in the eighties. 00:40:58.789 --> 00:41:18.409 Like it reminds me of this meme I saw the other day about the internet and it's it kind of goes through the, I guess, the obsolescence of the Internet as well and how we're sort of like how we've gone backwards. 00:41:18.409 --> 00:41:27.952 The more it's kind of been used as a marketing tool, the less it's it's retained, It's kind of designed. 00:41:27.952 --> 00:41:33.891 But yeah, the me the meme goes like Reddit is committing Sudoku. 00:41:33.891 --> 00:41:37.027 Musk is turning Twitter into the new gab. 00:41:37.027 --> 00:41:38.228 I don't know what that is. I don't know. 00:41:38.228 --> 00:41:44.134 Instagram is an aging millennial, desperately clinging to what's left of their youth. 00:41:44.134 --> 00:41:45.768 Facebook is a nursing home. 00:41:45.768 --> 00:41:47.871 YouTube is a clickbait farm. 00:41:47.871 --> 00:41:51.041 Tik Tok is a CCP propaganda outlet. 00:41:51.342 --> 00:41:56.347 Data collection Honeypot New media in quotes. 00:41:56.347 --> 00:42:03.320 Companies like Gawker, Vice, BuzzFeed have been absorbed back into the old corporate media ecosystem. 00:42:03.586 --> 00:42:05.456 Google, Wikipedia, etc. 00:42:05.456 --> 00:42:11.728 are getting flooded with bot generated beats after faster than any one can keep up with. 00:42:12.228 --> 00:42:17.934 Zoomers are too dumb to figure out where WordPress blogs with RSS feeds the public internet is over. 00:42:17.934 --> 00:42:20.436 Hope you all had fun. Oh god. 00:42:21.672 --> 00:42:25.576 I mean, you said this episode was going to be dark, so I'm just. 00:42:25.643 --> 00:42:28.579 Yeah, I'm just running along with a theme here. 00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:54.304 I mean, also something interesting to you and that I found was another comment by a maduka that said since this holy one reflection began, I've had quite an involvement with the OPC One Laptop Per Child, XO Laptop, its rise Evangelical hype and now apparent fall during 26,009 era has been very similar to the poorly ones 81 to 84 heyday. 00:42:54.838 --> 00:42:57.373 In spite of neither machines succeeding as such. 00:42:57.373 --> 00:43:01.612 Both, of course, was responsible for new tech trends educationally. 00:43:01.612 --> 00:43:06.849 In the old case the netbook explosion this person knows about as your computers. 00:43:06.849 --> 00:43:07.952 Yeah, I mean it's true. 00:43:07.952 --> 00:43:17.827 I although I criticized them in my episode a little bit, they obviously were ahead of the netbooks for sure so got to give them credit for that. 00:43:18.661 --> 00:43:26.269 And the the polyone was ahead of the G3. 00:43:26.269 --> 00:43:30.940 G3 Yeah, definitely her. Yeah. 00:43:30.940 --> 00:43:32.543 Look, it got dark at the end. 00:43:32.543 --> 00:43:33.978 I'm sorry. I'm ending out. 00:43:33.978 --> 00:43:36.112 No, it's good. 00:43:36.112 --> 00:44:00.269 Sees it on that note, but I guess it just, you know, it goes to show how much computers have always been integrated into kind of questions of politics and yeah, and society like it's a huge, huge discussion topic of debate for for society like it's like an object that people can point to and kind of analyze And yeah, this was it was great. 00:44:00.637 --> 00:44:02.706 I thought I think this was a really good ending. 00:44:02.905 --> 00:44:08.077 I think the really good ending to the to the seeds it I like that it's a little melancholic. 00:44:08.077 --> 00:44:10.280 I think that's a good thing. 00:44:10.280 --> 00:44:14.784 So there is a poly preservation projects. 00:44:14.985 --> 00:44:17.086 If you want to know more. Oh great. 00:44:17.086 --> 00:44:35.239 Andrew Trotman And we'll put a link in the show notes alongside the research links, but they have an emulator and links to a lot of articles and even some PDFs of like training manuals and things. 00:44:35.239 --> 00:44:38.342 I had a little fun rifling through them. 00:44:38.342 --> 00:44:50.420 I might put some of my selected favorite favorite graphics Instagram and yeah, so if you want to know more, that's the place to go. 00:44:50.920 --> 00:45:04.201 You know, it's the end of our season and I'm sad, but I'm excited for the next and I think the next season that we're going to tackle is on mobile phones, on cell phones, right? 00:45:04.201 --> 00:45:07.170 We decided that was a listener suggestion. Mm. 00:45:07.403 --> 00:45:11.541 And I saw a bunch of weird ones at the museum, so we're excited. 00:45:11.541 --> 00:45:12.376 Oh, cool. 00:45:12.376 --> 00:45:13.610 That's not looking into that. 00:45:13.610 --> 00:45:32.362 But we're going to take a little summer break and I think when we come back, we also might change up the structure a little bit and maybe start doing some interviews and get some researchers and computer tech history people on to have some chats as well. 00:45:32.362 --> 00:45:34.530 So yeah, I'm excited for that. 00:45:35.733 --> 00:45:38.534 Thank you so much for listening along with us. 00:45:38.869 --> 00:45:48.746 If you enjoy it and you got this far, please leave a review and some stars in your podcast app of choice. 00:45:49.246 --> 00:45:51.248 Very grateful for that. 00:45:51.248 --> 00:45:55.918 And follow us on Instagram and on Twitter and we have a website. 00:45:55.918 --> 00:45:59.222 What is it, Ana, our friend, The computer. 00:45:59.222 --> 00:46:01.791 Computer, Yeah. 00:46:01.791 --> 00:46:06.697 And I hope you all have like a really wonderful summer or winter, depending on your hemisphere. 00:46:07.764 --> 00:46:10.166 Yeah, Yeah. 00:46:10.166 --> 00:46:12.969 Thank you so much. Yeah. 00:46:12.969 --> 00:46:15.639 I can't wait for what's coming next. 00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:17.039 Yeah, just really excited. 00:46:17.039 --> 00:46:18.007 I've been doing a lot. 00:46:18.007 --> 00:46:20.710 A lot. A lot of research, and I'm going to be on. 00:46:20.710 --> 00:46:24.947 I'm going to be going on holiday in a few days for like two weeks. 00:46:24.947 --> 00:46:32.222 I'll be reading up on all of that stuff and just, yeah, nerding out on the beach, you got to have a balance. 00:46:32.588 --> 00:46:34.291 I have a balance I am for. 00:46:34.291 --> 00:46:39.195 Yeah, it must be netting out in my. 00:46:39.195 --> 00:46:41.465 That's good too. 00:46:41.565 --> 00:46:44.001 Yeah. Thank, thank you so much. 00:46:44.001 --> 00:46:50.574 I can't wait for the next one and hope everyone has a fabulous, luscious, delicious summer or winter. 00:46:50.606 --> 00:46:53.710 Delicious, luscious winter with true. 00:46:54.210 --> 00:46:56.280 All right, thanks, everyone. Bye. 00:46:56.313 --> 00:47:10.327 Thank you. Bye.