Ep. 80 Amanda Edmiston

On this episode I am joined by Amanda Edmiston.  Amanda is a herbalist and storyteller based in Scotland. She first learnt about plants and recipes from her grandmother who still remembered traditional remedies and folklore. After studying law and then herbal medicine, Amanda found it natural to start bringing together stories, plants, and magical places, drawing on the Scottish storytelling tradition, but in her own unique way. She has been showcasing her own work for over 10 years, performing and creating art in museums, libraries, forests, castles, schools and universities around the world under the banner Botanica Fabula.

We discuss her book: The Time Travelers Herbal, Stories and Recipes from the Historical Apothecary Cabinet. Steeped in history, the herbalist's art paved the way for modern science - but didn't necessarily need to have been replaced by it. In The Time Traveler's Herbal, the traditional remedies and recipes that were passed down through the ages are offered to the modern reader as a means to reconnect with the natural world, while reaping the benefits. Steeped in the stories through which these remedies have been passed down to us, our connection to the past is fully explored in a romantic and meandering journey through the plants and flowers that have healed and helped us through the ages. 

Amanda has offered a special discount (CURIOUSHERBAL25) for her Very Curious Herbal online courses. 
 https://www.botanicafabula.co.uk/online-courses

We discuss her upcoming "Remedy for Valentine's Day" event. If interested in participating:  https://www.eventbrite.co.uk/manage/events/796895464787/details

Botanica Fabula
Amanda Edmiston BotanicaFabula (@amanda.edmiston) • Instagram photos and videos
Botanica Fabula | Substack

Ashley (@filledupcup_) • Instagram photos and videos
Filled Up Cup - Unconventional Self Care for Modern Women

Transcript

0:00

Welcome to the filled up cup podcast. We are a different kind of self care resource, one that has nothing to do with bubble baths and face masks and everything to do with rediscovering yourself. We bring you real reviews, honest experiences, and unfiltered opinions that will make you laugh, cry, and most importantly, leave you with a filled up cup.

Ashley: 0:30

I'm very excited. Today I have Amanda Edmonston joining me. Amanda is the author of the Time Traveler's Herbal Stories and Recipes from the Historical Apothecary Cabinet. Thank you so much for joining me today.

Amanda: 0:44

You're very welcome. It's lovely to talk to you and to be invited on. I've been really enjoying your podcast.

Ashley: 0:50

Oh, thank you so much. Can you tell us a little bit about the book?

Amanda: 0:55

Absolutely. So it came about really because I've been what I call a herbal storyteller, which is kind of, I knitted my own job. I made it up for about 14 years since my eldest daughter was little and I needed to find something to do with myself. I'd studied herbal medicine at college, but I didn't want to go into clinical practice. What I wanted to do, it turned out, was sort of connect people to plants in a natural environment. And Talk about how we've used these plants that we live with all around us, even in cities in a way that made people excited and interested and engaged with them. And so, because my mum's been a storyteller for 35 years now I already I grew up with stories, you know, stories were an incredibly important part of every aspect of my life from fairy tales, ancient mythologies, legends, folklore, and I knew that there were plants in all those stories, but other people didn't necessarily see it. And I guess I just have this whole thing about plants and stories. And. The connection between them and I'm very aware because I work with community groups across Scotland and very fortunately around the world. Where I realized that this was a common thread. Everyone knew stories and everyone knew or lived alongside plants or when you mentioned plants wanted to know more. So I started to weave in social history as well. I'd been doing this, I guess, as a workshop. I'd been creating performance pieces. It kind of felt natural for it to come together as a book. And that's exactly what I do. I explore stories. folklore, community traditions, herbal medicine, plants that we live alongside over a period of history. so that's what the book is about and kind of a little bit of my own journey because there are lots of little excerpts from my storytelling adventures and a little bit of a biography woven in there too.

Ashley: 3:20

I really love the fact that it ties all those things together. I think that. We're always looking for that connection piece of learning new things, but also seeing how we fit into it. And I think sometimes with plants, I think we've created this story that we tell ourselves that, Oh, it's complicated or, you know, talking about having a green thumb or a brown thumb or things like this, that I think when we bring it back down to these have been around forever, you're probably utilizing them in ways that you don't even realize. And making it so that it is something that they can feel that connection to and feel like, Oh, maybe I can learn this way and I'm not going to feel stupid, or I'm not going to feel whatever to ask, and have that place where they can really feel open to learning, I think is so needed.

Amanda: 4:05

Yeah, absolutely. And I think that goes into a lot of my work, is I want to reassure people that they maybe don't realise they know a lot about plants, But they do. And, you know, at any given moment, you're probably wearing two or three different plants or the fabric of your house is made of them. And, you eat them even if you're, a massive carnivore and you have a really meat and carbohydrate kind of diet you're probably eating wheat, you know, and the animal that you're eating will have eaten a load of plants and there will be plants. It's all around you and in your life. And I guess it's also about reassuring people that it's all okay. I feel like the further we get from that relationship the more concerned people are, the more fear creaks into their interactions with plants and they feel like, Is it safe to take this, herbal medicine? Is it safe to you know, pick something that I have passed in the hedgerow or in my garden? I feel like we need to, take back that power to be able to engage with plants when most of them are very benign, most of them are really giving and not be afraid. So yeah, there's both of those sort of elements are woven in.

Ashley: 5:31

Thinking about the fear aspect of it, we're not being taught to feel safe to you know grab that flower and put it in your tea or and again This has been around for thousands of years that it's like that is a safe option Doesn't mean that other options aren't Things to be explored or if you're somebody who wants the door dash to come and bring your dinner, you can still accompany it with like seasoning from your garden or things like that. It's just we can have the best of both worlds.

Amanda: 5:59

Absolutely, and I think that's really important. I mean, even though I've studied herbal medicine, even though I use plants all the time I use them medicinally, I use them just in cooking, all kinds of ways, I still struggle sometimes if I'm taking herbal medicine on prescription, for example, to drink enough tea. And it wasn't until I was working with another friend of mine, another herbalist, who I've collaborated with on one of the courses I've been writing recently. And she said to me, Why don't you just mix the herbs that you want to take for medicine in with your usual cup of tea? Okay, I tend to prefer a green tea anyway. I can buy that loosely and I'm just like, I don't know because in the West we have a real fear of tea and coffee because it's caffeinated and we immediately think bad, bad, bad, you know. But actually the Traditional story that goes with green tea is all about health and well being, you know, it's a beautiful Chinese story and its place as a spiritual Healing lee is very important. It's a pivotal story And she's right. She's scottish indonesian. She's currently Working nomadically she's out in Malaysia, I think at the moment and she's like, I have, I've been fortunate enough to tell stories in China. I know for well that in the sort of native home or the places where this plant is cherished most, they don't fear it in the same way that we do in the West. And that's maybe because they add its reverence still, you know, it's still seen as given a bit more importance. We don't just buy it off the grocery shelf. Part of that then becomes infused with a bit of fear and so now I need to take my nettles for their ability to boost your iron levels and stop you being low in vitamins I'm currently taking rose petals in my herbal tea prescription because they're really restorative to the heart. They're really soothing and beneficial. There's some lemon balm, I think, which is again a nice uplifting mood enhancing herb. But now instead of thinking, Oh, I can't drink my herbal tea. I'm just adding a few of those herbs in with my cup of green tea. It's that simple, you know, off the shelf, supermarket, green tea, but with some herbs mixed in, so the herbs keep going, or as you say, once spring arrives here, what I love nothing more than like grabbing a few leaves as I pass, you know, I've got a dog, so I'm out walking, my spaniel and I grab a few leaves and I just Pop them on top of a salad. Food doesn't always have to be fancy, but plants and natural herbs that we can get for free. I feel that's one of the reasons that we fear them a bit as well. You know, big companies, big industries would quite like us to pay for everything rather than think that we could feed ourselves or heal ourselves. without giving them money. So, you know, a little bit free herbal enhancement goes a long way.

Ashley: 9:29

Yeah, I definitely agree with that. I think it's just getting back to who we are as ourselves and just really leaning into it's okay to trust ourselves.

Amanda: 9:37

Absolutely. And we all have, busy lives and we don't always have time to do everything we would like to. I would love to have a small holding and have chickens and grow all my own vegetables and all my own herbs and have a beautiful apothecary full of tinctures. The reality of that. is I would find that incredibly hard to work alongside two children and the dog and my husband who's also self employed and, you know, elderly parents in different parts of the country and all those other things, bills to pay. And I do have a beautiful herbal cabinet full of things that I've picked for free, but I don't have the time at the moment or the energy to have. Everything. And I think we quite often feel it has to be perfect before we can do it. And it doesn't. You can just do a little bit. And a little bit can make so much difference to your life, you know. I think stepping away from the all or nothing approach quite often frees up quite a lot of time and energy and gets rid of the guilt.

Ashley: 10:47

Agreed. And there is no perfect time. Like nobody's going to pass us a boatload of money and say, do whatever you want with it. I wish that they would, but it's just, it's highly unlikely that that will be the case. So I do think it is, it's like dipping your toe in and just seeing what works for you and what doesn't. And if somebody was like, all of that sounds great, but I don't know where to start. What is some simple ways that you can kind of. Start researching or start getting interested in herbalism in your day to day life.

Amanda: 11:18

Well, I think really because I love stories, I've always said that even reading a story where, or reading, I don't know, a sort of magazine article or anything, anything simple that you can engage with helps. Take your mind and your mindset into the place where it becomes easy to access. I guess my book doesn't come with a massive plant ID section. If you go into any bookstore, or look at, you know, any of the online retailers, you will find beautiful, incredibly well written plant ID books, relevant to where you live. And so there's no point in me repeating that. I do, however, put in Latin names so that people We call plants different things in different places, so that people can be sure of what I'm talking about. So I think get yourself a good plant ID book, if you're not a book person or you're traveling a lot, there are really good plant ID apps. double check, you know where you're going. So if it's a plant, I work with schools a lot. And I always say to the kids, they go, what's this? What's this? And I say, this family of plants all looks incredibly similar. And a couple of them are big hitting poisons. So we're not going to look at those, but there are plants like a dandelion which grows widely across a lot of countries in the world, or a nettle, most of us have nettles where all the near relatives. that look similar are also non toxic. So start small with the things that are hard to get wrong, you know? Get yourself a plant ID app or a really good book or both, double check and go and start looking at them and then smell them, if you know, They're definitely edible. Get a really good basic forager's guide saying this is edible, don't take it if you've got this profound health condition and start there. Start small. And find something. I mean, I feel like the really, the heavy duty Scientific, accurate, really factual stuff is vital. But one of the reasons I wanted to write my book was because when I work in museums or botanic gardens, I'm super aware that people are put off by that really sort of academic, heavyweight, approach. I know that if I talk about them using rose hips that they found in the garden, They don't feel put off by that. If it's in a story, they want to go and do that, whereas if they've read a big, you know, herbal medical book and the heavyweight plant ID book, they're like, they're put off by the volume of knowledge, whereas if they've heard a story about, you know fairies and fabulous Creatures that live in lochs or, up mountains and that feels easier to relate to, I guess it's lighter, it lights up your brain in a different way. So I guess start by knowing what you're looking for. Start small, maybe ask your, family, maybe ask older people around you in your neighborhood and sort of say, what plants? do you recognize around here? And there will be berries in hedgerows. Older people in their maybe 70s and 80s remember picking when they were children and using. Or maybe, you remember yourself. I certainly went picking berries with my mum when I was little still. So start with those really simple things and then build on it.

Ashley: 15:03

Well, and I think that talking to people, especially our elders, is something that I don't know whether the internet has moved us away from, but it's such a valuable resource, not just It's not necessarily to learn about, you know, skills that we want, but just all of it, just having that connection of like this person has been around for so long. They know all of these things. And again, like what you're saying when you read a super scientific book, you're like one, either this is probably boring or two, it can be so much that you're like, I'm never going to learn this. It's never going to stay in my head and it becomes this intimidating practice where it's like, if you can sit down and just. read something that does feel more relatable or is the story is sent to you in a way that it's like digestible, but it doesn't make you feel like I'm not going to understand this or I'm, you know, dumb or just feeling like you're going to embarrass yourself. And I think that there's so much fear. of admitting that you don't know stuff or admitting that you want to learn stuff instead of this assumption that we have to know it all and be all of the things that I think that I totally agree with you. Having a story that's sent to us in a digestible form, whether it's about fairies or whether it's about something that's like, Hey, this is what I went through. Maybe it'll work for you. I think is so much better than just having it in a science form. And again, there's some people that that side of their brain, they might like that better. But again, best of both worlds to try to find something that works for you to spark that interest.

Amanda: 16:35

Absolutely. And I love that you used the word intimidating. I think that it does become intimidating. And I've said to people before, we've told these stories about how we use plants for thousands and thousands of years, and people will remember a 5000 year old story about a phoenix. Like Creature, a Bennu in Egypt that uses frankincense to help restore its body. They won't read the latest free 700 page research document from the University of Mumbai, talking about how frankincense facilitates cell renewal. They'll remember the phoenix. A child will remember the phoenix. You're going to need a science degree before you can even handle a heavyweight medical. Research document. And that lost intergenerational knowledge and oh, I mean the internet kind of makes us all instant experts, doesn't it? If you follow herbalists, which obviously I do, but a lot of people give you a huge body of information and it's quite easy to feel like this is not for me or, you've been handed all the information all at once. I think that, you know, we forget the vital sort of element of communication that we've shared with. People around us for a very long time where you get a tiny bit of information and then you build on that. And then if you want to go and explore and research more, it builds up and up and up rather than just getting all dropped in front of you. I think bite sized amounts it also makes it more accessible. It stops alienating people, it, Stops there being that fear factor again, that, you know, that we started off talking about, which for me, I think it's really important. I think we need to feel like plants are a normal, easy, accessible, friendly, that we can get out there and enjoy them. And that there's no sense we have to do it properly all the time,

Ashley: 18:39

well, and that each person's practice can be different. If you are, say, following different herbalists or you're picking up different books, to know like, I can take this little piece from this and this little piece from that. I love that storytelling is such a big part of your book. When you were researching and deciding to actually publish, was there a favorite story that you wanted to make sure you definitely shared with the world?

Amanda: 19:03

There were two or three. So I started. When I was commissioned to write the book, the lovely commissioning editor that phoned me up, I, honestly, I was that person that wanted to write a book when they were a kid, and I always read these how to be a writer columns, and I'd be like, oh, you're meant to write a synopsis, and you've got to send it off to a load of publishers, and everyone's always like, you get turned down by 60 odd people before you get a book deal, and I am the lucky person who got phoned up by someone who went, I really love you what you do. Can you write a book? And I went, yes. And she went, great. What are you going to write about? And I'm like okay. I want to do what I do online and in my storytelling sessions. But turn it into a book. And she's like, brilliant. I love what you do online. Right. Do that. So fabulous. But the project I've been working on when. The editor made that call was called the very curious herbal project and I'd been looking into the life of an incredible pioneering Scots woman who was born in Aberdeen in Scotland, where I grew up. was born as well Elizabeth Blackwell. And in 1737, she became the first woman to publish a herbal. She eloped with a man who basically turned out to be not great. He spent all her money. And left her penniless with a child. And she was, you know, middle class and educated. And instead of doing what I would have done if I'd been in her shoes, I'll be honest. Which is leaving London with my child and going back to my mum and dad's. She decided she would Start drawing the plants in the Botanic Gardens, Chelsea Physic Garden, near where she lived to support herself and her child and ultimately, bless her, pay off her husband's debts and get him out of debtor's prison. But she had this wonderful story and for years academics have dismissed her work by saying that her husband wrote all the words, all the bits of medical knowledge about plants from prison. And I was just like, this is not possible. So I went down to Chelsea Physic Garden and I spoke to some people there. I worked with a couple of wonderful heritage librarians, a wonderful librarian up in Aberdeen was super helpful. And the library staff at the Royal College of Physicians and Surgeons in Glasgow were wonderful. I didn't find any solid evidence. I just threw it out there that this was probably rubbish. There were enough people saying, this is unlikely to have happened. What's more likely to have happened is she was working with apothecaries in this herb garden drawing plants. She would have had access to books. We know she was very educated for a woman in those days. And there's no evidence to suggest the husband wrote it. Another wonderful herbalist that I know who has written a lot about women healers in history, Elizabeth Brooke, said that she had spotted evidence that Elizabeth Blackwell went to weekend workshops and learned about midwifery from some of the leading practitioners of the day. So I built up this picture. It's wonderful, inspiring woman. I thought I would write an entire book, not about her, but with elements of her life woven through it and elements of my own journey, but about the plants that she wrote and wrote about and illustrated. Because she wrote and she drew and wrote about an amazing 500 plants at a time when Britain was experiencing the end of the witch trials. Scotland was notorious for burning more witches than nearly anywhere else. And medicine was becoming more and more regulated. And so knowledge was being shifted, you know, the power struggle was shifting who held knowledge about how to heal. our autonomy over our own health. was starting to be lost. But also they were horrendous empirical white middle aged men with a lot of money going into other people's countries and making off with their plants. But the shift was happening so that she drew Coco. When it had just arrived in the country, she drew a tamarind and turmeric and plants that would've been seen as exotic. She drew an illustrated lemons and oranges before they were spotted by James Lund as being vital to prevent scurvy on long voyages. So, you know, she was. writing about nettles, dandelions, chickweed, oak trees, simple everyday native plants that would have been here for thousands of years, but she was also drawing the plants that were just arriving. And she sold this book episodically so that she could keep earn a living for herself and her child. So she kind of made the knowledge accessible to a lot of people. So clearly, you know, picking up on what we've been talking about already, this kind of resonated with me a lot. I wanted to tell her story, but when Lizzie approached me, the editor from David and Charles to ask about me writing a book, I felt that there were so many other stories that I wanted to tell. I wanted to tell one of my grandfather's. Stories that he told me when I was really little about a woman turned to stone. He was a stone carver, a sculptor near my hometown. I wanted to tell other stories and they were nearly all about people that had traveled to or from Scotland. It's all connected back up really to the place I live and the place I'm most familiar with and the plants I know, but yeah, there were a couple of real family treasures. That had to go into the book, but as you can probably tell by the amount of passion and how long that bit of chat has been Elizabeth Blackwell was really important for me to get in there.

Ashley: 25:13

Anything that brings people so much passion that they just have to share it. I think those are the things that we resignate with so much. And I think we are all craving authenticity so much that finding those real stories and finding people's passion, I think it lights up our souls in a way that is so needed and listening to you talk about her. I just also get so frustrated because it's like, we think we've come so far and we push that needle of women's rights so much further. And then you really think about it and we really haven't. And a lot of those things that she dealt with are things that in 2023 2024 are very, very relevant, especially when it comes to autonomy. Not so much in Canada yet, but I know in the U. S. there basically got rolled back 30 years in women's health care. And in education, I feel like it is still very much the idea that we should just be pretty and sit in the corner and that men should Do whatever they're going to do I think it's still this idea that they don't want women to be seen as equals and that we can't be, better than in certain industries that it really is still that power struggle that I think good for her for being able to be brave enough to be That way back then and shame on anybody who just thought a husband was going to be the one to do all of these things like it's just, it's so frustrating, but also so empowering to know that women have pushed through these boundaries and not had that fear and just said, you know, I'm going to do all of the things because we really only have one life to live. It's getting rid of that fear and just saying, I'm going to do this, whether people feel comfortable with it or not.

Amanda: 26:55

Yeah, absolutely. And I mean, if you take on board that in London in 1730s, women, unless you were very poor and there were certain jobs inevitably that women ended up doing, but middle class, Educated women did not work. And not only that, but botany and the study of plants was seen as an absolute no-go area. Another 60 years later, Mary Walston Craft, who wrote the Vindication of Women was told off by the church for saying women should study botany. He said it was absolutely appalling behavior for women to be thinking about plants and the reproductive system. I was just like, okay, you know, wandering around pregnant, but whatever you do, don't think about reproduction, I do think it really does it stays irrelevant people say, you know, is it still relevant and I'm like Absolutely. Because we are still wading through those layers of restraint and having our autonomy taken away from us. And a little bit of a parallel there with Canada and the US and women's rights. You know, the difference there. In her day, in Scotland, when you got married, Women were allowed to keep their own money. In England, they had curvature. So if you got married, all your money became your husband's. And so he had right of your absolutely everything. And one of the things that's. It's sort of quite important in the early stages of Elizabeth Blackwell's adult life is that even though she gets married and to a man she had to elope. The family were not for a marrying Alexander Blackwell. He was. definitely already seen as a bit of a problem. He came from a wealthy family, but she clearly kept hold of her money. I mean, she clearly tried to bail him out quite a lot, but she was already a strong woman who was acting with a degree of autonomy over a number of areas in her life before she even decides to make this quite revolutionary step of getting out there and doing something. previously unheard of, it's a really great story about resilience, but also about how history keeps being relevant and relatable. Do you know, I mean, the more I have worked with her story and the plants that she'd looked at, it was so relatable because, there were parallels about how I'd designed and created herbal storytelling as a single mum with my first child. Incidentally, in the same garden that Elizabeth Blackwell wrote her herbal. So it keeps being relevant. And I think that's one of the vital things about stories and about social. History that we shouldn't dismiss them. We have such a fast turnover of culture these days, and news, and social media that we forget sometimes how vital. Incredibly important elements the old stuff still has.

Ashley: 30:02

As we age, we sort of realize like, hey, I still have value. Like, I still know all of the things where I think when you're younger, I feel like. You have this age in your head and you're like, that's an old person. And then once you reach that, you're like, that's a very young person. And so I feel like it is just that wisdom of sharing our stories and sharing our connections. I think it's amazing that we're able to have online connections and meet people that you would never meet, but it's also having just that connection in your life. I feel like. Picking up the phone and actually using it to talk to people instead of texting people. Sometimes it's still creating that connection within your life that is going to build value. It's talking to elderly family members. It's doing your research and saying like, in your day, what was school like? What were relationships like? And just, I think every generation sometimes has the idea that it's just us. Like we've never gone through this. And I found even as my daughter, when she was in her middle school ages, and she was having fights with other girls. She was like, this didn't happen when you were younger. And I'm like, it did. And it happened for my mom and so on. And it's a cycle that repeats. And I think sometimes when we get too in our egos or just not educated enough in those relationships and having those conversations, but it's like, we do realize that we're more like than different and that we need to build on those likenesses so that we can see what worked for you. What should I try and just. not feel like we have to be on this little island alone doing all of the things and having all of the knowledge that it's really beautiful to look back and be like, there were these, ball busting women that were brave in their day and doing things that nobody else had done. It almost gives us permission to be like, I'm going to try to take this class, or I'm going to read this book, or I'm going to say no to this job. Or this date or this whatever you're telling yourself that you should be doing and just take those chances.

Amanda: 31:55

Actually you've just reminded me of something really important you touched upon earlier, which is if you have those conversations and those moments, which as mothers that we do a lot of, or just actually as older people, maybe talking to people of saying, someone says, oh, you know, I've got this thing going wrong with my body, and if someone else has been through that experience and found something that helped then you have that autonomy of your own health. You don't necessarily have to go to a doctor or into a pharmacy and buy something that just masks the symptoms. You maybe will find something really simple on this occasion. I use a blend of. obviously go to the doctors for the big stuff. But there are some things that it's cheaper, easier, quicker to use that, or, you know, a friend will say this is, I had something really similar. Have you tried this? You're like, Oh, why did I never think of this before? This is wonderful. It's a really, really valuable thing that we need to keep and build on really in all our lives, I guess.

Ashley: 33:02

It's keeping things accessible. If you know, Simple things that could help you with, you know, improving your sleep, improving your stress. Family doctors are rare to find like a regular GP that you would go to about things that weren't like a big emergency. And sometimes if you don't have one, it can take you five to 10 years to be able to find a regular doctor to see. It's a really big problem right now and then they're trying to kind of change it so that we have online doctors, but again, it's kind of a complicated thing because in Canada, essentially our health care is supposed to be free. So the online doctors are now a way to introduce a paid version, pros and cons to both. And then if you do end up having something severe enough that you have to go to emergency there's like staffing issues and emergency room wait could be on average like 10 to 12 hours to be able to get back in to be seen. So again, A lot of people either don't wait and then run into different issues or that once you even get in, it's so slammed and so busy that they're missing things and it's very broken right now. So it's always nice, I think, to have different options, not to say don't ever go to the doctor, maybe have this as an option first, so that if you can't get into a doctor or you don't have walk in clinics where you live, then it isn't something where you have to feel like alone and scared. It's something where you can kind of take back some of that fear and go, let's just see if this is what works for me. Because it does feel like there's not a ton of options depending on what ailment you're trying to cure.

Amanda: 34:40

we have a less dramatic, but we're also struggling with shortage of doctors in health service at the moment. My mum, I know, for example, lives in Highest Village in Scotland. It's quite remote, it gets cut off quite easily by bad weather, but they don't have a village doctor anymore. So she's got to travel to go to the doctor. There are some things that you will travel to go and see a doctor for, if you are lucky enough to have a family doctor. There are some things I mean, I know from speaking to friends who are nurses and have worked in emergency rooms that there are people that turn up in emergency rooms with things that you think, Why on earth have you, come all this way for something that's not an emergency? And at which point, yeah, if you've got a few simple things you can turn to at home or maybe you have friends or books and you're confident enough to be able to explore some other options, you maybe save yourself a load of money, a load of time, can treat something that nobody else would have noticed. And take back that autonomy and I think it probably also then completely boosts your self confidence and how you value yourself, how you value your health. And then, if you can help look after people around you, then That's an added bonus. You don't necessarily need to be a fully qualified clinical herbalist, but a few simple things that you can turn to make a world of difference.

Ashley: 36:11

Maybe once you start really doing that research, maybe you find that you do actually have a registered herbalist in your area. I feel like if we don't step out of our comfort zone or step out of the little box that we created for ourselves, there's a whole big world out there that there are a lot of services that you can lean into and get help.

Amanda: 36:30

Absolutely. And I think we've also in a lot of Western cultures stopped treating ourselves in a preventative way. We firefight and our health services firefight their way through those dramatic, scary you know, life affecting problems. But there's so much more that we can do just to prevent us. Suffering from dreadful things in the first place, or even things like talking a little bit about having a cold or a bit of a bunged up nose. I have techniques, I have herbs in the cupboard, I have essential oils, I have various different things that I can use that are plant based that will make me recover quicker and not suffer as badly. And it's that simple. It's stopping, you're being able to take preventative steps that then stop you having to go to emergency room or go to a doctor. And as you say, you can do a piecemeal approach. I'm not going to suggest that you avoid going to the doctor if you've broken a limb or you've got something life threatening, you pull all the sources in, don't you, to help you build a solution. Yeah, absolutely. But definitely multifaceted is the way to go. And I think, yeah, there are, there are likely to be good herbalists near most people in the world, I would imagine. I think most of us will have someone that we can access that will know a bit more if we feel like plants may have an answer, but we don't have the knowledge or resources to be able to work on our own.

Ashley: 38:03

The great thing is like you said, we do most likely all have them in our community. And then that's also where the internet comes in, that it has sort of made this like big community. So if you say, find somebody and they're not local to you, you can still talk to them. You can still reach out to them. You could still potentially take their classes and workshops like what you offer and create your own community, wherever that may be.

Amanda: 38:28

Yeah, and also the internet allows us to see all kinds of wonderful connections that we may not have noticed. I had a lovely woman in one of my workshops in Edinburgh just before Christmas. And she was studying sort of herbs and ethnobotany kind of direction. So a sort of anthropological view of herbal medicine alongside a herbal medicine studies. She told me where she was from in the States and she'd been traveling and I said, oh, actually, I think you are possibly near enough to my friend Erica, this is her herbal practice. You should probably give her a chance. She went, that's funny. How do you know Erica? And I said, well, we studied at college together. And she went, she gave me a list of people I should look up in Scotland when I was visiting and one of them recommended I come and see you. And I was just like, okay, that's really peculiar. You know, I've got an audience of people I'm working with. And someone in the audience went, I'm really interested in what you do. And then it turned out we knew a herbalist in common somewhere thousands of miles away. And so it is a great community. There are governing bodies, if you like, that ensure that people have appropriate qualifications and appropriate levels of knowledge and skill and work safely. So if that's a concern, you can make sure that you seek out people who are, really have really good credentials. But yeah, also, but the internet is wonderful for that. You can check things out. And also you make these. wonderful community connections with this wider community, which is really exciting. So I love that combination of the small, but also the expansive and how inclusive and accessible it makes everything.

Ashley: 40:20

I think that it is so funny how, again, it does become that small world of like, how did they even know me? And how do I even recommend them that it, it does become like like minded people sometimes feel like, I don't know who to talk to, or there's nobody in my life that has the same interest or whatever. So it can be like, I can find my people outside of my immediate friend group if that's needed, and I just think it's really beautiful that as bad as the internet can be at times, there really is that positive side of it, of that building connections, of seeking out people, and being like, I'm not alone in this, or I'm not weird to think this way. I do like what you said to is to make sure because there is a lot of misinformation online to look for the governing groups of things so that you are. Not just taking any advice, but again, from people that you can kind of back up that they're knowledgeable, especially if you're still learning.

Amanda: 41:14

Absolutely. Yeah. but then also not to dismiss the whole idea of saying that conversation with people who've experienced it, who may say to you, yeah, I went, oh, this person who's wonderful. There were a lot of opportunities to tie it all up out there and learn in different ways, and it's quite exciting, I mean, talking about community, one of the reasons the book came around, as I said, is because the commissioning editor had seen my online stuff, but really, again, I've got bigger social media pages and following, but my tiny thing. Facebook group. You can join it if anyone wants to listening. It's called Botanica Fabulousness, it's kind of like Botanica Fabulous School of Herbal Storytelling. It's something I'm developing along with online courses, not to go down the like purely medical route, but to look at those elements of folklore and stories and a little bit of the medicine, a little bit of the social history that kind of engage you with plants and draw you in. But that group where we chat about the courses and what we're doing on that, because they're all remote, you can just follow them in your own time. But that group is incredible. That's where the commissioning editor saw me. That group involves people having really good conversations, sometimes off to one side, meeting up with friends. It's developed a community, but a worldwide community, of, a few hundred people that really connect over this. And so I think the community thing is life changing. It's been absolutely wonderful. And what would we have done through COVID without, our online communities? I feel like there are people that have come along to my workshops and that I've seen at events now for years that feel like old friends. I had a lovely woman come up to me in one workshop and say, I hope you don't feel like I'm stalking you. I genuinely come to everything. And I'm like, no, it's so lovely to see you, you know, honestly, I'm really pleased to see people, it really does feel like, I have great friends, but we're friends because we like the same writer or they're friends because our children are the same age, or we've known each other since childhood, but I also have this Wonderful community now of crazy plant people. Basically we all wander around going, Oh, have you tried this? And like, Oh, look at this nice plant. And I'm like, that makes me happy. It's all about community. I think that's where I'm going with that.

Ashley: 43:44

That is so true. Now I know that you had kind of touched on it, the botanica fabula. You are doing online workshops and in person as well can you let us know a little bit about the services or what that would look like?

Amanda: 43:58

Sure. So I work in two ways. One is what I've done for the past nearly 15 years which is as a herbal storyteller. So I go out and I create performance pieces for say museums, heritage organizations, botanic gardens, work with schools a lot. Usually under the guise of herbal magic and potent potions, but I do a wonderful Victorians workshop, for example, looking at Britain in the Victorian era, or I do One all about nettles, which is sort of nettle stories. We drink nettle tea and we write on nettle paper. So those sort of things with schools. The school sweatshops were so popular and grown ups kept saying, do you do this with grown ups? I started doing it with grown ups too. We're always in heritage organizations or, you know, as I said, community gardening places botanic gardens, museums. But, more and more people were coming to me saying, will you mentor me? Or will you teach me? Or wanting me to guest lecture on herbal medicine programs? Where they felt like the folklore and the legends were a really vital, vibrant part of learning about plants. holistically and knowing all about them. I had an odd experience. I got plagiarized quite a lot. by a couple of people, and I was quite hurt. I felt like they'd seen that I had quite a niche area of work and was getting quite a lot of work because I was working in one specific area rather than broadly being a storyteller. And pretty much had my work replicated. And I started off being quite. Angry about this and upset and I decided the best way to deal with it was to kind of take ownership of it and that maybe this was a sign I needed to step up basically and just sort of change my game slightly and embrace it and just go, okay. You want me to teach you to do what I do. I can't really teach you to do what I do. This is my grandmother's knowledge. This is my grandfather's knowledge. This is my mum's knowledge. This is 14 years of practice, a herbal medicine degree, a law degree, a lot of travel, a lot of study. You can't just do what I do and you can't copy what I do, but I can teach you enough to make. you have ideas and be inspired and then make it your own journey and take it in your own direction. So I decided to trademark myself, which was a big step, and make it Botanica Fabulous School of Herbal Storytelling, which is now a parallel Part of my storytelling world. I'm taking that inspiration from Elizabeth Blackwell and The Curious Herbal. And I'm sharing the bits that didn't go into the book as The Very Curious Herbal online course. blend that you'll find in the book, the layers of history, folklore, fairy story, herbal medicine, and a little bit of something else. I don't quite know what it is. A little bit of sort of narrative and a personal journey and inviting people to connect, I guess, that is woven into the book. And I've turned it into an online course with audio recordings. Some films, some of it's curated from other bits that I've filmed on my tours, but some of it is new films some written material, some ways to work with plants, and some prompts to get out there and engage with the plants near you, and create what I've called a lorica. materia botanica, a little bit like the classic materia medica, you know, that book full of plant information. But this is kind of more like, this is a seed that I found that I want to grow into a tree one day, or, you know, this is a recipe the lady down the road told me to make with damsons, or, this is a dried. Flower I pressed between two pieces of paper and wrote a poem about and bring it all together. So the online course is to reflect that and they're looking at different sort of areas of plants They're self study, but I'm always here to talk to people and I talk to people a lot on social media about what they're doing on the courses and add elements and they're going to grow over time. So they're all on my website, which is Botanica Fabula. Co uk but I'm still touring. I'm in Hudson Valley as I mentioned next week doing workshops in upstate New York. And then I'm back to the National Library of Scotland on the 8th of February. Yeah, so I'm still performing, still running workshops live, still working with schools and museums. That's always been a thing I love. But I'm also creating online courses and running slightly longer workshops, where I'm inviting really small numbers of people to come and work quite intensely on small blended workshops that bring together traditional herbal techniques. But, as part of a story, I'm not going to turn people out to do my job for me. But I'm hopefully going to inspire them to then go and create art of their own, or write their own different form of work. And just bring plants. And this connection into their own work. It's all there on my website alongside the book. There's films on there and things people can tap into or find out about the projects I've created because, I've been working a while and I've created. Bespoke packages for ethical businesses looking to promote products. I've worked with a lot of schools, a lot of online stuff. I do all sorts. I'm a self employed mum. I want to make the world a happy, plant loving place. So if that sort of gels with me and people are friendly and lovely and are interested in what I do, then I'm always happy to collaborate and create something new.

Ashley: 50:14

I love the fact that it's like, that you don't have to be one thing. You can be a storyteller, you can be an author, you can teach courses, you can speak publicly. I love the fact that it shows people that You can be all of the things as long as that's what you want. You had mentioned your website. Can you also mention where people can find you on social media?

Amanda: 50:37

Of course. So, on Instagram, I am Amanda Edmiston. That's E D M I S T O N. Or, if you look up Botanica Fabula, so herbal stories in Latin, basically Botanica Fabula. You will find me on Instagram and if you write Amanda Edmiston, Botanica Fabula, you will no doubt find me on Facebook. I still like Facebook. I love a Facebook group. It does all the things, you can do videos and just like. Switch it on when you're on a walk and go, Hey, look at this tree. This is where I am at the moment. Really easily. So I'm still very active on Facebook, Facebook and Insta are my two big platforms at the moment. I am on sub stack when I get back from the Hudson Valley, I'm going to put more writing on my sub stack. And so there is quite a lot of paywalled content on there. Old films, old podcasts, episodes, recordings from live workshops. So my substack is the other one, but I'm on all the social media platforms, honestly. Here I am. I'm starting off a conversation with you saying we need that community. We need that connection and to talk to people are older than us and find out about the plants growing locally, but I confess, I do love social media as it's just the connection with people that share your passions, it makes it really easy to use,

Ashley: 52:07

it's like to have those like minded conversations. It isn't always as easy in our real life to, you know, grab a tea or a coffee with somebody and have that time to sit down where it is kind of nice to have that moment of like, Oh, I can go on live and I can show you this cool thing and share it with you. And then also maybe make a date down the road to do coffee. It's the best of both worlds.

Amanda: 52:29

It's the best. Absolutely, and I love doing events. I mean, for grown ups, kids need the in person sessions. So, schools and you know, family sessions in museums really, really help. Children thrive on you being there in person, you hold their engagement a lot more. But adults, because I run my own events on Eventbrite sometimes, or at the moment I'm doing a monthly book club with a medical museum, but it means that people can join us from around the world. And with my own events, so if you find me on social media particularly You will spot that I release an event online on Eventbrite fairly regularly because I can record them. And so if, you know, the kids get sick or you have to work a different shift or anything, you know, life throws up one of the things it does when you're a grown up you can tap back into the recording for the. week following the event. So, you know, my next one is the 13th of February and I'm doing A Remedy for Valentine's Day, make of that what you will, a Herbal Storyteller's Guide to Seduction, A Remedy for Valentine's Day. So yeah, it means that, you know, a couple of lovely people who come to a lot of my events in Canada and in the United States can make it along. And it's not just people that can make it to Edinburgh or wherever I am. There's all sorts of ways you can join in and, and connect in my work.

Ashley: 54:05

I love that so much. Amanda, thank you so much for having this conversation with me today.

Amanda: 54:10

It's my absolute pleasure. It's been so lovely talking to you. And I'm delighted as I say that I found your podcast. I've been listening to it in the car all week. It's been an absolute joy. And I will, I will keep listening in.

Ashley: 54:25

Oh, thank you so much.

54:29

Thank you so much for joining us today for this episode of the filled up cup podcast. Don't forget to hit subscribe and leave a review. If you like what you hear, you can also connect with us at filledupcup.Com. Thanks again for tuning in and we'll catch you in the next episode.