Chon T. Testimony

Ever wondered how faith can become a transformative power in your life? Join us as we welcome on the SpeakLifeAZ Podcast our special guest, Chon, an inspiring boss, friend, and brother in faith, who shares his remarkable journey of encountering Jesus and witnessing life-changing transformations. From a spirited childhood in Chandler, Arizona, to the profound impact of growing up with Christianity, Chon's stories capture the essence of faith and family, reminding us of the importance of relationships during the holiday season. Alongside my son Rowdy, we explore the idea that prioritizing heartfelt connections over material concerns can lead to a more fulfilling life.

In this episode, we unravel an adventure-packed narrative that reflects on boyhood escapades, family dynamics, and the lasting impressions of early spiritual encounters. Through Chon’s captivating storytelling, we revisit the neighborhoods and shared cultural moments of his childhood, from bike rides until sunset to cherished television shows. The conversation touches on the emotional landscape of a split family and the unwavering support they provided, highlighting the power of unconditional love amidst challenges. As we navigate through personal struggles, including a transformative path to redemption and the complexities of youthful relationships, this episode offers a heartfelt reflection on the journey of healing and growth.

Our dialogue doesn’t shy away from addressing life's adversities and the profound influence of faith and community. From fatherhood and the significance of words in shaping lives to the power of vulnerability in overcoming self-doubt, we uncover the lessons learned from walking through pain and healing. With themes of brotherly support, emotional resilience, and a legacy of faith, this episode is a testament to the enduring bonds of community and the strength found in shared experiences. As we express gratitude for the blessings in our lives and the eternal impact of the SpeakLife ministry, listeners are invited to reflect on their own spiritual journeys and the role faith plays in overcoming life’s challenges.

Chapters

• 0:18 Encountering Jesus and Life Transformation
• 8:35 Childhood Adventures and Shared Memories
• 14:04 Family, Childhood, and Unconditional Love
• 27:01 Early Encounters With Christianity
• 32:38 Faith Through Generations and Friends
• 46:07 The Path to Redemption
• 57:29 The Transformative Power of Faith
• 1:10:37 Relationship Struggles and Life Changes
• 1:19:19 Emotional Struggles and Relationship Realizations
• 1:27:11 Journey Through Adversity and Redemption
• 1:38:38 Finding Love and Following Destiny
• 1:46:28 Fatherhood and Unconditional Love
• 1:52:57 Parenting and Apologies
• 2:05:51 The Power of Community and Service
• 2:14:13 Father-Son Bonding and Emotional Goodbye
• 2:29:21 Life and Death's Impact
• 2:43:48 Navigating Grief and Faith
• 2:52:04 Walking Through Pain and Healing
• 3:06:26 Brotherly Support and Overcoming Adversity
• 3:11:17 Overcoming Self-Doubt and Taking Action
• 3:22:09 Legacy of Faith and Service
• 3:30:35 Brotherly Love and Gratitude

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:18

all right, everybody. Welcome back to the speak life az podcast testimony of jesus and everyday people. I'm your host, eddie, and always with me is my son, roddy.

Speaker 2: 0:26

Jesus, what up, dude, man, dude, how was your day, buddy? It was all right, man.

Speaker 3: 0:30

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 0:30

Busy Just a lot of sitting around rocking in the chair. It's holiday season, man. People are spending money on gifts and stuff.

Speaker 2: 0:36

Yeah, right, the last thing to do is go in and spend $800 on a muffler that's needed for their vehicle.

Speaker 1: 0:41

It's needed for their vehicle. Unless you want them for Christmas, come on down, we'll do it for Christmas too.

Speaker 2: 0:45

They're just smelling the eggs bud.

Speaker 1: 0:46

What about you, man?

Speaker 2: 0:48

Oh, it was great bro. I was working on the podcast schedule for 2025, man, I got us up into. I think we're in. April now.

Speaker 1: 0:57

Already.

Speaker 2: 0:58

Yeah, the list just keeps growing. The waiting list, dude, it's like man. God, what are you doing? Have your way, Lord. Yeah, that's it, Just stay low, buddy, stay low.

Speaker 1: 1:12

I'm excited about this one, bro.

Speaker 2: 1:14

Yeah, this is man. I'm not going to cry I know we say they're all special. But they are all special, they are as we were setting up you know I I said, uh, dude, I got a bunch of heavy hitters and 25 and it's gonna be a special. And I felt the lord and you at the same time. You said it, but I felt god saying they're all they're all special to me and I was like oh, man, but for us personally, we, we have relationships buddy, and those ones are always.

Speaker 1: 1:42

Yeah, I love those ones. They're good. Yeah, who'd you bring with you?

Speaker 2: 1:45

bro, we got my boss, my friend, my brother, the guy that tells me what to do, my dude man Joan. What's up, what's going on, guys?

Speaker 5: 1:57

Joan how you doing, brother, I'm doing great.

Speaker 1: 1:59

God made it very clear to us to make sure that we honor his kids when they give us a yes, and so we just want to honor you, brother. I mean, we do life together, man. So there's already. I'm not going to cry either. Holy crap, what's going on?

Speaker 2: 2:13

It's real. God is here.

Speaker 1: 2:16

For me personally, I don't get to open up much because just a fear of how people will judge me. You're the one person that I've actually had intimate conversations with and opened up with so for me, this is awesome dude. You know what I mean, because you're my dude, you're my homie. You know what I mean Appreciate that. And so we thank you for your yes, man, and we just pray that God just blesses and does his thing for you today.

Speaker 5: 2:37

Yeah, Well, you guys have been chasing me. I had to make you earn it.

Speaker 2: 2:43

I was talking with DA earlier, man. I was like DA, honestly, bro. We invited Joan I think it was 23, man, because we had your wife Mary on. For any of you who are getting ready to listen to this you can go listen to hers.

Speaker 2: 2:57

She's one of our first ones, Mary, thank you. And I remember asking him because I was like, bro, we've got her side, but we need your side. And uh, at the time it just it wasn't the right timing. Um, and I remember it was kind of around the, uh, the testimony series that pastor Dave did, Um, there was a few other people and he was one of them, and it's just kind of when, when it's when it's God's timing, it's it's right, yeah.

Speaker 1: 3:25

And and the lord's gonna use this big time.

Speaker 2: 3:26

Sounds like what al said hello somebody um for me, bro man, I have had some less than good bosses in my life um I've. I could tell you some story he knows all of us.

Speaker 2: 3:39

They've thrown broomsticks at me Jesus, but here, the healthiness of the team, the way that we do things together, how it's not all on just me or you, it's more of an us, how we do things here, and that for me, bro, is just a beautiful thing to be a part of, with the military in my background and the street life, you know, and hanging out with the homies dude, it's a us first, them kind of thing, um, but it just you for me, um, and how I really feel, uh, protected by you, man, I feel, um, like you really help me and aren't trying to just use me, um, but you care, and having somebody that I can work with, that actually cares, man, that makes all the difference in the world, bro. So for me, this this is beautiful. Yeah, um, you've I'm sure you've listened to a few of these, sure you uh probably listen to your wives what'd you say on there?

Speaker 5: 4:40

I listen to her every day.

Speaker 2: 4:45

But so basically, this is when God gave this to us during COVID. It took a little bit for us to obey what he actually told us to do. We kind of did our own thing, man, and how we do it, though.

Speaker 1: 4:59

We take what God tells us to do and try to make it our own.

Speaker 2: 5:03

But it wasn't until the beginning of 23 when we really sat down and just started getting what he told us to do, and it's Speak Life AZ Podcast, the testimony of Jesus and everyday people. It doesn't matter if you're like Dad and you're over at the auto shop man cutting on cars, welding metal, or you're like us and you're making the wheels spin at a local church. We are all everyday people. We've all got a story, we've all got. We've all got something, and when we encounter Jesus, things change. So that's basically kind of what this is. We just want to know who Chone is. We want to know where you were born. We want to know, mom and dad, what the home was like growing up Was there, church in the home.

Speaker 2: 5:50

Was there church? Was God in the home? Is that something you? Were you a church kid, Did you? How was school for you? How was the grades? Sports, Were you bullied? Were you a bully, Just kind of you know? How was your childhood? We just want to get to know.

Speaker 1: 6:07

John, us working in recovery. We know that a lot of the things that we deal with as adults take place in our childhood and we carry them into adulthood. That's why we have places like CR and things like that, because we carry stuff over.

Speaker 3: 6:17

We got a group for that.

Speaker 2: 6:19

So let God lead you in any of that.

Speaker 2: 6:31

If you want to share with any of that, let god lead you in that. Man, um, but I I think honestly, man, the coolest part of this whole thing is we get to capture people's encounters with jesus. Yeah, um, we, we want to know your encounter when god became real to you and you knew without a shadow of a doubt that, wow, jesus is real, jesus loves me. Um, and what that cause? Cause, the way that he, he got you. It was different than how he got me. I was literally he. He found me in 1515 West Grand and team challenge in 2014 at a three foot blue altar. He met dad in a prison cell, you know. So he meets us all right where he knows he can get us.

Speaker 1: 7:02

And it's unique to you man, so unique about it.

Speaker 2: 7:05

You know what I mean. You know what I mean. So we want to know your encounter and then how your life changed afterwards. Because real Dad always says on these things, man, a true encounter with Jesus brings life change, transformation.

Speaker 1: 7:18

Evidence is transformation, Transformation that's how you know somebody met God.

Speaker 2: 7:25

And not saying we're perfect. Please don't hear that. That way, man, we are broken and we all fall short every day, man. But we have changed, but we have changed, Thank God dad, we have changed, buddy. Only by the grace of God, dude, no more drugs and alcohol and shooting guns and robbing people. Oh my God, we're not mean. We don't beat people up, right Dad? Unless we have to.

Speaker 1: 7:51

We love Jesus, but we'll still throw down.

Speaker 2: 7:52

That's right, baby, oh God. But then at the very end, man, what we really want to capture is what you're hoping for in the future. Yeah, man, because you're a part of this team. You, yeah, man, because you're a part of this team, you're on staff, man, and God is taking you places. Yeah, and it's just getting started, bro, come on, so maybe kind of what you're hoping for in life, in ministry, maybe in your family, and just kind of go there because we are going to pray for you. And then our listeners we've had people on and we ask them do you pray for the people and what they share?

Speaker 1: 8:24

at the end, and they we've had people on and we ask them do you pray for the people and what they share? At the end, and they all do, yeah, um, so our listeners are going to pray for you as well.

Speaker 2: 8:34

Man, yeah, yeah, pray, buddy, pray as soon. Man, oh, jesus, man, I don't know why, but I have anxiety and nerves.

Speaker 4: 8:38

God, holy spirit thank you, god, for what you're getting ready to do.

Speaker 2: 8:45

Thank you, lord. Thank you so much for your son, joan. God, thank you for what's getting ready to be shared, lord. Yeah, he has been through some things, god, through what we've talked about here and there, but I just pray, holy Spirit, you just come and get his words and share what needs to be shared so whoever watches this or whoever listens to this God, they can know that man, if you, if that guy can get through that with Jesus and God, you can get them through what they are going through right now, thank you. So I just pray, actually for an opening in the prophetic realm right now in the name of Jesus, actually for an opening in the prophetic realm right now in the name of jesus. Um, angels, come heaven, come, holy spirit, just have your way in all of this in jesus name, amen, amen so what was it like growing up, chone brother?

Speaker 5: 9:34

so for me, growing up, um, I, I was, I was, I was all about the adventure. Yeah, um, I was, you know, knowing that this was coming up. I was kind of looking back to how I grew up and you know, typical growing up 80s, early 90s yeah, there was no oversight to anything.

Speaker 4: 9:58

No.

Speaker 5: 10:00

So I was out and about on my bike, with all my friends on their bikes.

Speaker 2: 10:05

The streetlights. Come on, get inside. Do you remember the commercials? Maybe Do you remember the commercials.

Speaker 1: 10:10

It's 10 o'clock. Do you know where your kids are?

Speaker 2: 10:12

Oh my God, that was real people, it was, it was For sure.

Speaker 5: 10:17

Yeah, man, I was one to adventure all over the place.

Speaker 4: 10:22

If.

Speaker 5: 10:22

I adventured by myself, um, or with my friends, didn't matter to me, as long as I was out, you know, trying to find something, yeah. And so I've tried to keep that um kind of sense in my of adventure my whole life. Come on now, okay, and I think I have my wife always jokes at me and she's like I feel like every week you're telling me a new story something I didn't know about you before.

Speaker 5: 10:43

Yeah and uh. You know, it's kind of like that. Things pop up in my mind. Sometimes it surprises me of all the stuff you know. You see movies of people that you know they've done all of these crazy things in life. And sometimes, when I think back, it's like I somehow inadvertently end up in all of these crazy situations doing crazy stuff. Yeah, and it's no surprise to me today that I am here doing what I am doing because I would never have seen myself.

Speaker 5: 11:20

Come on, I really just the Lord, I think, think, has just allowed me to stumble through a lot of stuff and, uh, kind of helped me to stumble right into where I'm at now. But all that to say uh, my childhood was pretty adventurous. Yeah, where were you born? Uh, chandler, arizona baby.

Speaker 2: 11:44

And uh brothers and sisters.

Speaker 5: 11:46

Uh, nope, only child, so spoiled my whole life. I wouldn't say I was spoiled, but I was well taken care of Um. I never, ever in my life um felt unloved by my parents or anything like that. When I was a teenager I was a pretty big knucklehead.

Speaker 5: 12:03

So me and my dad butted heads a little bit, but doesn't every teenager yeah yeah, and, and you know my dad was um looking back, I think he was probably, uh, a lot better to me than how I felt at the time, I mean, he was old school, yeah dads talked different to their sons back then. Oh yeah, you know um grandpas definitely talked different to their.

Speaker 5: 12:26

It was men yeah you know I was, I was told on many occasions that if I ever touched this tool or that tool, my fingers would be broken next time, right, yeah? So it was definitely different um and and so it's part of chandler uh, so we lived in? Um, okay, let me think back now. Let me try to remember the name of this. It was a mobile home park in. South Chandler, uh Sunshine Valley mobile home park on uh um Arizona Avenue. And is it Willis? I think it was off of Willis road.

Speaker 4: 12:58

So, now it's all shopping Plaza and all that stuff, but back in the day it was just cotton fields, and then this little trailer park plunk.

Speaker 5: 13:10

So, that's where I kind of Run in the muck. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 13:15

What was Through our conversations? It was the hood right. Oh, yeah, oh yeah.

Speaker 5: 13:20

Yeah, it was definitely the hood.

Speaker 2: 13:22

That was the place you stayed out of. Oh yeah, you didn't go over there. He was a Mesa boy. Mesa boys didn't go in the channel Right there on Mesa.

Speaker 1: 13:29

Drive and Chandler Boulevard. Oh yeah, what was it? Mayo Day something. Apartment complex we knew to stay out there, dude.

Speaker 5: 13:39

Well, you know looking back, I'm going to get back to my early childhood because I want to touch on the first. Like you talked about, how early in life where did I meet Jesus at? But you know, we said the same thing about your area.

Speaker 2: 13:54

We don't go over there.

Speaker 5: 13:55

You know, so it's probably good we stayed out of each other's areas.

Speaker 1: 14:04

I remember going to what was the elementary school right there on mesa drive and probably fry maybe. But I remember playing like little league softball and I had to ride my bike there to go play softball sometimes, man, and it was nervous yeah, going through.

Speaker 2: 14:17

You know what I?

Speaker 3: 14:17

mean once you got past baseline, you were like oh, come on, it was a pretty wild area.

Speaker 5: 14:22

I, you know, saw some things go down over there.

Speaker 2: 14:25

Yeah, for sure oh, that's when you were living over on eighth avenue. Yeah, oh, okay, back in the day. Yeah, all right, yeah had some adventures in that area.

Speaker 5: 14:32

I bet yeah, crazy, yep, so yeah um, but before all that, um, I lived out in maricopa. Um, I was born in Chandler but we lived in Maricopa. So back then Maricopa was just a farming community. It was nothing like it is now. All of those houses to me, when. I think of Maricopa and where all those houses are. That was all pecan groves back in the 80s.

Speaker 1: 14:55

That's where we used to go dove hunting. Yeah, exactly.

Speaker 5: 14:58

And it was all.

Speaker 2: 15:00

That city wasn't there. Well, the town was, oh, but it was kind of like Florence, I guess Just a little town, probably even smaller.

Speaker 5: 15:08

Oh wow, you drive through it kind of thing Like he said it was just farmland brother.

Speaker 1: 15:11

Okay, a couple farmhouses here and there.

Speaker 2: 15:14

Now it's a city. I mean it's one of our stops. When we go to California, Right Mexico, we stop there. Yeah, so it's totally different.

Speaker 5: 15:21

It was nothing like that.

Speaker 2: 15:22

And.

Speaker 5: 15:23

I actually lived even further past, south of that. I think it was called Thunderbird Farms back then. I don't know what it is now. But anyways, it was way out there the people that you knew and people were around you. Those were your friends, my family. Well, you know, I only lived there until I was like. Well, when I was in kindergarten, we lived in Tempe with my mom. Okay, so kind of going back, back, back.

Speaker 2: 15:52

Your young, young years.

Speaker 5: 15:53

Yeah, young, young years. So you know three, four, five. I think I probably moved to Tempe with my mom when I was four or five Around kindergarten, yeah, around kindergarten. My parents split up. But I think when I was like two I want to say so real young but I stayed with my dad every weekend. I kind of just stayed everywhere.

Speaker 5: 16:22

My mom was single trying to raise me up and just trying to survive. So I stayed with my grandparents a lot on my mom's side. I stayed with my nana and my tata on my dad's side and they were all in Maricopa. My dad lived in Chandler. My mom was kind of doing her thing so I lived with her and I lived with my grandparents during the summers, type of thing.

Speaker 2: 16:47

Being that you were two when they divorced and got separated you, you weren't really old enough to like he was a teen.

Speaker 1: 16:52

Yeah, he was a teenager it went.

Speaker 2: 16:55

It crushed him I was like eight, I think, and it ruined me, yeah, um, while you were growing up, knowing that they were divorced was, was that something for you? Or it was just like oh, mom's over here and dad's over there, it's just what it is.

Speaker 5: 17:09

I think for me it was kind of normal, I didn't know anything else. I mean going and spending the back in the day. My dad was pretty wild, so for me going and staying with my dad was amazing Adventure.

Speaker 2: 17:25

Man, he's this crazy dude right and all of his friends Was he at Chicano yeah.

Speaker 5: 17:33

So you know, he had this one. All of his friends were crazy, and I mean he had. So, just, for instance, one of his friends, all I knew him, as was Pat the Parachutist.

Speaker 2: 17:43

That sounds cool yeah.

Speaker 5: 17:47

So anytime I was with him, it was an adventure, and so, yeah, you know I love my dad. He was an amazing dude. He didn't care what anybody thought about him taking me around with him, they just had to do it Come on boy, so yeah he was cool. He brought me on all the adventures.

Speaker 2: 18:03

So you, you said that um, you did not feel unloved when you were growing up yeah. So what did that look like? I mean, were, was your family huggers? Was it a verbal I love you, boy, I'm proud of you? Was it? Um? How did you, how? How was that love shown?

Speaker 5: 18:21

well, I mean, I mean it was kind of different for everybody my mom, um, who I spent most of my time with, and so my parents weren't always they split up when I think I was two I might I might, you know, I might be a little off on that but I'm pretty sure I was two yeah okay and um, I I remember the argument they had and I remember how all of that went.

Speaker 3: 18:42

Yeah, crazy, right.

Speaker 2: 18:43

I don't remember a lot of things when I was that young, but there's you remember that?

Speaker 5: 18:47

I remember that night, wow, so, um, but uh, once they split up, they actually. My mom promised me, if I remember, how this all worked out. I believe my mom promised me, um, at one point that she was going to get us in a house together whatever, and however things worked out, I don't know, but her and my dad got back together in order for her to get me living somewhere kind of stable.

Speaker 3: 19:14

Not just staying wherever it was work.

Speaker 5: 19:17

And so they ended up back together.

Speaker 2: 19:23

And that happened, I think, when I was in fourth or fifth grade.

Speaker 5: 19:24

So they were apart, just for a little while and then came back together. Yeah, um you know, and it was, it was kind of rough sometimes they're you know, kind of looking back, I could see they did the best they could.

Speaker 2: 19:32

Yeah do you think that they came back together for you?

Speaker 5: 19:37

a hundred percent. Oh wow bro that's cool.

Speaker 2: 19:40

I've heard. I've heard we've had testimonies of parents staying together, sure, for their kids yeah, but I don't. I've heard we've had testimonies of parents staying together for their kids yeah, but I don't think I've heard of one where the parents separate and they come back together for the kid. That's cool man, that's special bro. Yeah, wow, yeah it wasn't always easy there was lots of arguments. Oh yeah, I got to deal with this guy again, her again, yeah.

Speaker 5: 20:09

You know deal with this guy again her again. You know it was good because it, um, I was with my grandparents a lot, yeah and uh, the times that I was with, I was with my I don't know. It's kind of interesting looking back. I I think I kind of just stayed with my mom when she was at a place where I could stay with her she was never into drugs or anything like that or drinking.

Speaker 2: 20:25

She was just a single woman right, yeah Was dad. My dad was single, but was he into the nefarious stuff? Was he drinking with his boys and doing some stuff? He probably.

Speaker 5: 20:36

To the yes.

Speaker 2: 20:38

Yeah, okay.

Speaker 4: 20:40

I got you.

Speaker 2: 20:41

All right, buddy it was adventurous.

Speaker 5: 20:42

It was adventurous, it was adventurous man, it was adventurous. Yeah, it was pretty crazy.

Speaker 1: 20:48

Was your family close, like your grandmas and grandpas?

Speaker 2: 20:51

Yes, Everybody was. They're Mexican bro. They love family and parties. Yeah.

Speaker 5: 20:56

So on my dad's side it was all Mexican, On my mom's side it was white. But big family events, they all came together, you know they had a big. Uh, what kind of tree? Was it? A cottonwood tree, maybe out in the front? Anyways, that for me, family um was always good. Yeah, I never had bad experiences with family that's special um and I think that's kind of why I've always felt loved um being part-time between different sides of the grandparents and mom and dad.

Speaker 5: 21:29

My times with them was always good times because that was the time they had me, so I kind of had, you know, between my mom and dad. I know things weren't always so good, you know. I only know what they allowed me to know right, that's good parenting.

Speaker 2: 21:44

They didn't do it all in front of you. Yeah, only know what they allowed me to know. Right, right, you know that's good parenting. They didn't do it all in front of you. Yeah, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 5: 21:47

And so you know, my dad, looking back, I mean like my dad loved me and um anytime I was with him, I was, I was, you know, like his, I was his boy.

Speaker 4: 22:00

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 22:01

And so um for as crazy as he was. And I look back and you know my dad was not, when he was younger, before he came to Christ. You know, going by, I can only go by what I've heard. My theos talk about, and it just really seems to me he wasn't the best guy.

Speaker 4: 22:20

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 22:21

You know, and you didn't want to be on his bad side. So I remember that side of him, but I also remember the side of him after he came to christ, um this guy was pretty mean and angry before jesus too, buddy yeah it was the littlest things.

Speaker 2: 22:37

Man would just set him rage, bro, it's like whoa yeah my dad didn't rage so much as much as he was.

Speaker 5: 22:44

I think he was more of a partier and, um, you know, there's there's a lot of drugs, um, but even in the midst of all of that, like a lot of times dads get pretty nasty, yeah, you know, but my dad fortunately for me, you know, he even even when I was around, when he was doing all that kind of stuff.

Speaker 2: 23:05

He made sure you were good.

Speaker 5: 23:06

He made sure I was good.

Speaker 1: 23:10

Never took anything out on you, no, never. Never, I mean he never spanked me or any of that kind of stuff.

Speaker 5: 23:17

Later on he told me it's because he was afraid he would lose control.

Speaker 1: 23:20

Wow, amen, he used words.

Speaker 2: 23:24

Yeah, I mean, I got yelled at I'm sure, I'm sure um I got threatened many times but he never touched me.

Speaker 5: 23:30

Amen um and and you know as as a young kid he was, you know I never felt anything but love coming from him I can't you know? It wasn't until I was a teenager that harsh words were said and those sorts of things.

Speaker 2: 23:43

Probably earned you said that dad was a different man before he came to Christ. Did he come to Christ before you were born? No, oh, so it was after.

Speaker 5: 23:54

Okay, he came to Christ after I did when I started going to church.

Speaker 2: 23:57

He was an atheist. Okay, he said he was.

Speaker 5: 23:59

I don't know how much he really was or not. I think he was just kind of angry.

Speaker 5: 24:03

Yeah, okay, how much he really was or not. I think he was just kind of angry. Yeah, okay, I don't know what all happened. He, you know he didn't typical. You know that he didn't open up a whole lot to me about stuff until right before he passed away he started opening up about some things. So I, you know my dad was, I didn't. All I had was pictures of him that gave me some hints as to what he was about, maybe some of the conversations I heard between him and my theos. Growing up I kind of got bits and pieces of who he was. I know you definitely wanted to be loved by him. You did not want to be on his bad side.

Speaker 5: 24:40

That's probably put it lightly.

Speaker 1: 24:42

I don't know what was school like for you.

Speaker 5: 24:47

School I was pretty smart.

Speaker 3: 24:49

I think in school up until I started doing drugs.

Speaker 2: 24:54

Don't do drugs, kids Don't do drugs. But.

Speaker 5: 24:59

I think, because you know, first, second, third grade was I mean, I don't remember a whole lot about it yeah, um, I, I, I can, I think, because of my parents being split, not being with them, I, the biggest if I could say a negative thing I remember about growing up as a really young kid and in school, was just having some fear of being away from my mom.

Speaker 4: 25:27

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 25:28

You know. So I think I struggled with that as a little guy.

Speaker 4: 25:30

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 25:31

A lot, yeah, and I think that was just part of that whole situation.

Speaker 1: 25:36

Yeah, amen.

Speaker 5: 25:37

But you know, kindergarten was just having fun, right.

Speaker 1: 25:41

Yeah, you know, and I just remember kind of coming up with some of the same few guys and we were just all buds, yeah, um, oh that's cool yeah kind of the same group of friends growing up together did you live in the same house most of your childhood or was it just, I know, when you were really young you said you moved around a lot, but once your parents got settled, it was like yeah, once.

Speaker 5: 25:58

Once my parents got settled, then yes, we were from the time I was in fourth grade until I was like 16 or 17.

Speaker 2: 26:07

That was where you were stability yeah, about 16.

Speaker 5: 26:14

Yeah, it was about 16 that we finally moved out of the trailer park. All right, yeah, and I'm glad we did, because I think that trailer park I probably would have ended up in jail. Although the place we moved into wasn't.

Speaker 3: 26:24

It was a neighborhood but it wasn't.

Speaker 5: 26:26

Yeah, that moving into that neighborhood only introduced it, just took everything I was doing to a whole new level. Man, it was so, by the grace of God, right.

Speaker 2: 26:38

Bad company corrupts good character. Growing up in that trailer park.

Speaker 1: 26:41

you were in that one location for most of your childhood. Yes, so you had like a lot of the same friends, a lot of the same people. Yeah, we were all stuck together.

Speaker 4: 26:49

So, if you.

Speaker 2: 26:50

you know, yeah, Out when the sun came up and come back in later. Amen.

Speaker 5: 27:01

But I want to talk about my. So, like I said, my growing up, you know, and finally coming to Christ. I would say, I had certain touch points where Christ showed himself to me, and the very first one I can remember is and I'm not sure how old I was I think I was probably four. I don't think I was in school yet.

Speaker 5: 27:21

So my best guess is I was three or four years old. I don't think I was in school yet. So my best guess is I was three or four years old and my nana this is in Maricopa went to this little church that was there forever. It was just on the south side of Maricopa, as you're kind of leaving. There's this little I think it was a Baptist church and that's where she went, and whenever I stayed with her, she would always take me to church with her, and so this really cool situation happened. I remember one time I went with her and I don't know if he was a Sunday school teacher or a pastor, but he grabbed all of us little guys out of the Sunday service, whatever it was, and pulled us into a little room and we sat around a table like this.

Speaker 5: 28:01

There was like maybe five of us, six of us, and we're all sitting in our little chairs and he tells us the gospel, he tells us about christ wow and he kind of takes us through the whole thing with christ and, um, I remember he kind of was drawing the picture of of christ being crucified and I had an encounter with christ when he talked about him being crucified at that moment, even just as a little, like I said, three yeah, I'm pretty sure I was probably like three or four yeah, yeah and uh, definitely was not in kindergarten yeah so and I, I had, and and I felt god's love towards me wow even as that little guy yeah

Speaker 2: 28:39

and I started crying while he's like describing what Jesus went through on the cross.

Speaker 1: 28:45

Yes.

Speaker 2: 28:45

And why he went through that for you. Wow, Wow bro.

Speaker 5: 28:49

Totally had a moment of clarity. I have never forgotten that moment.

Speaker 4: 28:53

Wow.

Speaker 5: 28:54

And um and it's. It's interesting. I don't think I saw the picture I have in my head at the moment he talked about it, the picture I have in my head at the moment he talked about it. I just had this internal encounter, realization of what Christ on the cross. But when I think back to that time, all I can see is Christ on the cross looking down on me as a little child.

Speaker 2: 29:18

So anyways, I had this encounter. I started crying. Pastor was like hey, you okay.

Speaker 3: 29:19

What's wrong and I told him I had a really bad stomach ache.

Speaker 5: 29:21

I didn't. I started crying. Pastor was like hey, you okay, what's wrong? And I told him I had a really bad stomach ache.

Speaker 2: 29:27

I didn't, I didn't know, I didn't know.

Speaker 1: 29:29

What was going on.

Speaker 5: 29:31

So I told him I had a stomach ache. He took me back to my nana.

Speaker 4: 29:33

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 29:34

You know, and the rest is history From you know. So, I don't remember Anything else around that, I just remember that moment, that encounter yeah, wow, I was.

Speaker 2: 29:42

I was in. I think I was in teen challenge in 2015 and somebody came in and was talking about salvation and I was in one of my prayer times at the altar at that blue altar I was talking about and I was like god, when was I saved, when did I actually become yours? And he showed me a vacation bible school at Phoenix Community Church up in North Phoenix and there was a group of kiddos, man, and we all had these little paper Ladmo bags that they gave us for treats for VDS.

Speaker 5: 30:14

And we all had our hands raised. I have not heard. I know nobody that grew up here in Arizona.

Speaker 3: 30:19

That did not grow up here in Arizona has no idea they have no idea. Oh yeah, Bro Ladmo.

Speaker 5: 30:24

Wallace and Ladmo.

Speaker 4: 30:25

Don't get me started on that.

Speaker 1: 30:27

I want my Ladmo bag.

Speaker 2: 30:28

Yeah, they cheated me out of a Ladmo bag.

Speaker 3: 30:30

I'll make you one buddy.

Speaker 1: 30:32

You know how, when they would give away Ladmo bags, they'd say okay, third row, fifth seat, yeah, yeah. So I go there with my Boy Scouts.

Speaker 2: 30:38

They cheated him out of the bag, bro so they call third row fifth seat.

Speaker 1: 30:45

It was him.

Speaker 4: 30:46

That's me.

Speaker 1: 30:48

Sitting in the fourth seat was a buddy of mine with his sister on his lap. So they go one, two, three, four, counted hers five, gave her the bag and I'm like, oh man.

Speaker 2: 30:59

That's not the fifth seat.

Speaker 1: 31:01

I'm 52 years old and that still messes with me, bro.

Speaker 3: 31:03

I want my Lambo bag.

Speaker 2: 31:10

Yeah man, the fifth seat I'm 52 years old and I still mess with my limo bag. We will need release from that.

Speaker 1: 31:12

Yeah, dude, we have a group for that because growing up, growing up in arizona, that was a huge show yeah, you know what I mean and and you always see kids getting limo bags and as a young kid, you're like I want to be on limo, I want to get a limo bag and have that moment where you're bro, you're like I want to be on Lattimore.

Speaker 2: 31:24

I want to get Lattimore back and have that moment where you're bro, you're seen. Yeah, it's okay, buddy. What was the?

Speaker 5: 31:28

one ambiguous character's name. Was it Gerald? Yeah, Gerald.

Speaker 1: 31:32

Yeah, the guy that dressed up kind of like a.

Speaker 5: 31:34

Yeah, like I said, ambiguous. Yeah, I don't know what the hell.

Speaker 2: 31:37

I'm sorry, guys I caused. That was a great show. It was dude Because they would do their little skits and they would show cartoons for a little bit, and they'd come back and do their little skits.

Speaker 1: 31:46

And yeah, man, they were around forever.

Speaker 5: 31:48

I think Captain Kangaroo was on after that, yeah.

Speaker 1: 31:51

They were part of Legend City and all that Remember Legend City no.

Speaker 3: 31:54

I don't.

Speaker 1: 31:55

No, oh wow, it was the first amusement park we ever had here. Oh, it was before cartoons, I know that Legend City was an actual amusement park Roller coaster rides and all that stuff. Bro, okay, legend.

Speaker 2: 32:12

City. Look it up. So you have moved into this house in the fourth grade. Yeah, you start to find some stability with mom and dad back in the home. We've got a little encounter. Did your mom and dad ever go to church? That's what I was going to no.

Speaker 5: 32:29

none of us went to church until later on?

Speaker 1: 32:32

Yeah, not until I was in high school. So you just had the encounter with Nana when you went to Maricopa and stuff like that.

Speaker 5: 32:36

That's right, and I had another encounter.

Speaker 1: 32:38

What about your mom's side? Any church over there?

Speaker 5: 32:40

yes, well they were. They were catholic okay and so we went. So when I stayed with them um, which it seems like most weekends, I was probably over there yeah um and uh um catholic church.

Speaker 2: 32:53

Dad's like I could get the boy out. Man, it's gonna be a long weekend, so yeah we'd go to catholic church um and uh.

Speaker 5: 33:02

You know, and I remember one time we were sitting on the center row and when you go to their services I don't know about all how it works everywhere, but where we went, the father and all of the boys that would come up holding the craw and all that whole thing, right. Before the service would start they would all come up down the center and it was kind of like this event almost.

Speaker 3: 33:31

Like a ceremony yeah.

Speaker 5: 33:33

And I remember I was sitting on the very outside row and as he was coming down the aisle with the whole entourage behind, him Like you're on the outside and they're coming down the middle.

Speaker 2: 33:42

I was in the middle, you're on the outside and they're coming down the middle, or you're, I was on the in the middle.

Speaker 5: 33:46

oh wow, on that side and as he was coming down, I was just looking at him. He stopped and smiled at me and shook my hand and I really felt the love of christ during that time, wow so yeah, so that was very interesting and because he didn't do that with everybody coming in no, he just, and I've been many, many times and I don't ever remember him seeing that. And I'm not saying there's.

Speaker 2: 34:08

I'm just saying he happened to see a little kid and he shook his hand for him, for me I felt.

Speaker 5: 34:14

Christ, I felt Jesus' love on me, and that was probably the second time that I can recall.

Speaker 1: 34:22

After that I was starting to get a little bit older.

Speaker 5: 34:24

I was trying to get your attention at a young age Young age I think you know, I can only guess and make you know, probably projecting a little bit.

Speaker 4: 34:31

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 34:32

But it just feels like he was saying remember me, yeah, you know, because I'm going to. I was you know. I didn't know I was going to walk through a few things, most of it because of my own.

Speaker 1: 34:44

Oh yeah, most of it is yeah, right, right.

Speaker 2: 34:48

Not more than most. There's a way that seems right to a man. That's right. That's right.

Speaker 5: 34:51

So anyways, but I think it made it easier for me later on down the road when I had the opportunity to really chase after God and learn more about him. I had those couple experiences.

Speaker 1: 35:07

Those seeds.

Speaker 5: 35:08

So even between the time that I had those experiences as a young little one and until I really actually went to church Well, I don't want to say that, because I went to church with my nana as a little- one. I went to church as a kid with my grandparents. So I don't want to say I didn't ever go to church.

Speaker 1: 35:28

But going to church under your own there you go, that's it, yeah.

Speaker 5: 35:32

So as a teenager, yeah right, yeah, um I never, I never questioned like to me god and and jesus was a given you always, always, believed, always.

Speaker 2: 35:43

That's how I was, bro. I grew up in the church. I've always just believed. Yeah, okay.

Speaker 5: 35:49

So but I didn't associate God with church. For me, yeah, because church was not a lifestyle at all, it was just something. When I was with my nana, I went to church with her.

Speaker 4: 36:03

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 36:04

And it was just something I had to go do, because that's what she did, and then I got home to go play in the ditch out front as soon as I could.

Speaker 1: 36:10

We grew up in the same era. You're only three years younger than I am, I think. Do you think at that time that because I didn't grow up in church but I still knew God, I still knew I? Still when I was mad it was still like, oh God, help me, lord, you know what I mean. There was still that, even though I never had church, you think in that era of time we were growing up, it was just easily projected through television and the things around us? Or because that seems like kids that grew up in our era just kind of knew God existed? Or nowadays it's more challenging to for kids to believe?

Speaker 2: 36:45

you know I well, faith was huge in this country when, like your, your grandparent, my grandparents, our faith was huge back in the day, man, it was everything they were.

Speaker 5: 36:57

They were on well, you know, for me it was because I spent so much time with my grandparents. Now, as far as my mom and dad goes, my dad was not a believer, my mom, she just never talked about it, so I really couldn't tell you where she stood.

Speaker 2: 37:13

It was her personal relationship with God.

Speaker 5: 37:16

I don't even know if there was that.

Speaker 2: 37:17

I mean my mom, the way.

Speaker 5: 37:18

I remember it, she was pretty worldly growing up.

Speaker 1: 37:22

It might have been that I grew up in Mason. There was Mormons and Baptists all around me, so God was always a conversation.

Speaker 5: 37:34

I mean, yeah, I, I. You know, for me the the only place that I was really hurt anything about being God or not being God, but about God was with my grandparents, yeah, um were those your dad's parents, or were those your mom's parents? So when I refer to my grandparents, that's my On my mom's side, when I'm thinking about my Nana, my tata.

Speaker 2: 37:53

That's what my dad said. I caught on to that. Shut up, dude. Some stuff, bro, just goes right over.

Speaker 5: 38:03

The whole.

Speaker 1: 38:04

I've learned to just wait. He's working with me. Bud, shut up dude Some stuff. Bro just goes right over there. I've learned to just wait. I just wait, he's working with me bud.

Speaker 4: 38:13

Just relax.

Speaker 1: 38:15

You're a better man than I am to deal with him all day, brother.

Speaker 3: 38:18

I've sent him home a few times he does great man.

Speaker 2: 38:20

He does it with such grace and encouragement and empowerment. You can do this, bro. It's like like an empowerment, like you can do this, bro. It's like yes.

Speaker 1: 38:26

I can, of course you can. He doesn't have to live with it.

Speaker 2: 38:30

That's a whole different game right there. I get it Well while you're talking about your grandparents, bro, I'm like, oh, that's why maybe your mom didn't necessarily have, because your grandparents could have forced it on her. And when she got time to choose, it's like she's some. I'm not doing that anymore. Yeah, I don't know. I couldn't tell you. I don't know.

Speaker 5: 38:53

I really don't know. With my mom and my dad, God was just never even a thing.

Speaker 4: 38:57

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 38:57

Okay, it just wasn't. So it was all from my grandparents, from my grandparents, um, and then, and then, during the through the way, I had a friend named scott when I was in first, second, third grade. Um, I lived with my mom in tempe in a little apartment right there off of you guys. Remember smitty's used to be oh, yeah, yeah we lived right in those apartments right behind I don't even know what it is now baseline and kyrene something like that, I think I think I'll car wash there now.

Speaker 5: 39:25

Yeah, so there used to be a Smitty's there and then maybe it became a Safeway or Fry's I don't know what it is. I haven't been in that area for a while, but there are some apartments or townhouses, I guess. And anyways, I had a friend that I had there and he was a Christian. I didn't know really what that meant, but he always told us he was a Christian. Amen, you know whatever. And you know it wasn't. Until my mom and dad got back together, we moved to the trailer park, and is that okay to say? Are you allowed to?

Speaker 2: 39:54

say that oh yeah, you're good. Yeah, we've said worse. That's a bad thing to say.

Speaker 1: 39:57

Mobile home, mobile home To me, it's the trailer park I don't know. If they want to get offended, that's their problem, brother.

Speaker 5: 40:09

So when we live in the trailer park. Um, I had a, my best friend that I've had since then.

Speaker 2: 40:13

His name is jb um jb man, yeah, you guys have met him, jb love you, jb miss you bro so, um, he is as far as non-family.

Speaker 5: 40:25

He's the one that actually introduced me to Christ as the Savior.

Speaker 4: 40:29

Really.

Speaker 5: 40:29

When I was old enough to really understand it.

Speaker 4: 40:31

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 40:32

Gave me my first Bible. Oh, wow, even though I didn't know what to do with it.

Speaker 4: 40:35

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 40:36

So, anyways, but he, you know, I attribute me that door to Christ really being open to him.

Speaker 2: 40:43

Wow.

Speaker 5: 40:44

He was the one that used to tell me about Christ all the time and then we'd go off and do crazy stuff. But you know, he told me about Christ and he really he never drank the whole time. We were friends. We still are but, during that time. We knew each other from the time we were in fourth and fifth grade. He was always a year ahead of me, I was in fourth grade he was in fifth.

Speaker 5: 41:08

Oh, so once you moved into that place, you met I moved there, I think a year after I did, but he was just a year older. A little bit older than me, but we were best friends from then until now.

Speaker 4: 41:20

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 41:20

You know, he's my bro. Till the wheels fall off, that's good now, yeah, you know, um, he's my bro till the wheels fall off. You know what I'm saying? Yeah, um, but uh, that's how I really. And then, and then I had another friend in high school that actually invited me to church, so he didn't go to church.

Speaker 5: 41:33

He had a relationship with christ, but he didn't go to church oh wow, you know, and there was a reason that everybody lived in that trailer park. You know there's reason you live there, yeah, you know. So, um, his mom didn't go to church, so he didn't go to church, but you know, he knew christ, amen, and so, anyways, he was the one that that really started introducing me. And then I had another friend in high school that invited me to his youth group and that's where I finally met christ really yeah, okay, what church was that? Uh, um living word, bible, church really.

Speaker 5: 42:02

Yeah, in mesa going on uh not the big huge dome was before that the littler one on gilbert no, no, they were on um southern and mesa drive right there with that um skate park the not skate park, the uh skating rink is right there off the railroad tracks yeah yeah, skate land skate lane, yeah. So that used to. The church used to be right there, just across the street from there off of Center or Central yeah Center. Yeah, so right there, there's what's that manufacturing place right behind Fox.

Speaker 1: 42:39

Foxworth, gabriel, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 42:42

So it's good to meet a homie that knows all those areas.

Speaker 2: 42:47

Yeah, man, I'm around too many people that know all those areas. You guys are long lost brothers.

Speaker 1: 42:51

Born and raised buddy.

Speaker 5: 42:53

So, anyways, that's where I actually started going to church.

Speaker 2: 42:57

This is what I, because you've had these encounters and these moments, but there wasn't really any. The family doing the church thing encounters and these moments, but there wasn't really any. The family doing the church no, it wasn't until you said that dad had an encounter with jesus that you guys all started going well, no, I had been going to church for a little while before he did he didn't want anything to do with church.

Speaker 5: 43:20

You know he was atheist. As far as he was concerned, did his salvation.

Speaker 2: 43:26

Was that something that you remember?

Speaker 5: 43:28

did that, yes, okay, yes, oh yeah, wow yeah I remember, um, uh, so I would go to church, and uh, he would go bowling a lot of guys sit on the couch and watch football.

Speaker 2: 43:41

He's bowling, yeah, so they would go bowling and drink right right, that's what you did.

Speaker 3: 43:47

Do you drop you off at church and go? No, no, no, I would go with one of my friends. I'd catch a ride somehow.

Speaker 2: 43:51

You know, I'd spend the night at someone's house. Really, you're a teenager and setting up rides and figuring out ways to go to church. Dude, there's a lot of girls there, bro.

Speaker 4: 44:13

Okay, okay, it was before you were saved.

Speaker 5: 44:14

He just said he knew jesus. He didn't say he was saved. Amen, buddy, amen, yeah, that's good stuff, okay, so yeah, but I, I remember, um, one day, uh, getting ready for church, he was getting ready to you know he, he, he liked to wear hawaiian shirts, right, yeah, and anyways, he was getting ready to you know, he, he liked to wear hawaiian shirts right, yeah, and anyways.

Speaker 5: 44:25

He was getting all dressed up and uh, but he wasn't like heading out to like he would normally do. I'm like what are you doing, you know? And he was like going to church what? Yeah, I'm gonna go to church and I I don't remember exactly how it all went down um, I think my mom I don't think my mom was going to church with me at that point, but he just decided one day he was gonna go to church and um he like I just you and him no, no, no, I think my mom went yeah I don't know if they had talked about it before beforehand or something but, but anyways, they went to church with me and I I think at that time at Living Word they weren't having people like go up front.

Speaker 4: 45:08

Yeah, altar call. Yeah, like an altar call.

Speaker 5: 45:10

But he just like got up and went up front and got saved. Wow, it was pretty crazy. Wow, when he got saved, he got really saved.

Speaker 2: 45:20

You were at that service when he went up front. Yeah, Was he the only one?

Speaker 5: 45:25

That's the way I remember it. Oh, my goodness bro.

Speaker 2: 45:28

That's a man that's going to church, that just wants something from God. Yeah, he needed something, wow.

Speaker 1: 45:33

How long were you going to church before that I?

Speaker 5: 45:35

think like a year or two.

Speaker 1: 45:37

Oh my.

Speaker 5: 45:37

God, joan, exactly, but it was a while you could have been the light bro.

Speaker 2: 45:40

You could have been the light bro. You could have been the influence, the very reason why he's like maybe I need to go. You could have been the conviction that God used bro to get him in the house.

Speaker 1: 45:50

Do you ever remember coming home and talking about the things that you were learning or hearing? Do you ever remember having conversations in the home about wow man, we're talking about this today?

Speaker 5: 45:59

No, because he didn't believe in God. So I just wasn't he didn't believe in god, so I just it wasn't, and I think I was still figuring. This is where things get kind of blurry for me, because I think for the first couple years I went to church. I think I was 16 when I started going. Yeah and um, I was still drinking a lot.

Speaker 2: 46:17

I think the first it was for the girls. So, yeah, yeah, I was going for the girls.

Speaker 5: 46:21

I I was still drinking a lot, getting high, okay, and when did you? Start using. I think it was pretty early because I had my dad always had weed in the house, so I just had easy access.

Speaker 3: 46:38

It was nothing.

Speaker 5: 46:39

And he never hid anything. Yeah, that was just part of life, like for me. Okay, growing up Kind of like me. For him up I didn't know.

Speaker 2: 46:51

like to me, everybody's dad smoked out in front of them, with all their friends, what they did and, and it wasn't until I was like over, I think, I think in fifth grade.

Speaker 5: 46:59

Remember the dare program oh yeah and so I remember they taught about that and I was like what I went home? I remember I remember going home and asking my dad if he was a pusher because that's what they called him back. Then he got really mad at me no, who told you? That? Where are they at?

Speaker 1: 47:18

yeah, so I remember having a conversation with my younger kids and be like, hey, and now they're gonna bring this up oh yeah don't be like oh, my mom and dad what happens at the house stays at the house.

Speaker 2: 47:29

I taught them very young that you don't talk about what happens here.

Speaker 3: 47:32

Yeah, they start talking about their program too, and I'm like okay, listen, they're gonna bring this kind of stuff up you don't be rinsing nothing about mom and dad.

Speaker 5: 47:41

You know what I mean oh my god, yeah, protect the home so I think the first time I probably drank I was probably sixth grade something like that, I think, the first time I smoked pot, you know, marijuana. I was probably in sixth grade. Okay, and I think really heavily like every chance we could, I was probably in seventh grade it, and I think really heavily like every chance we could, I was probably in seventh grade. It didn't take long before that blew up.

Speaker 2: 48:09

So how old were you when dad went down at service? Do you remember how old you were? I think I was 17.

Speaker 5: 48:15

Oh, so you were oh okay, so I think I probably went to church about a year before he got saved. That sounds about right.

Speaker 1: 48:23

Did you ever get in trouble?

Speaker 2: 48:25

Like arrested, sent to juvie or anything.

Speaker 5: 48:28

No, I never got caught.

Speaker 2: 48:29

Yeah.

Speaker 4: 48:29

Hello.

Speaker 5: 48:31

I stayed in the areas where I knew no one could ever catch me, because I knew those areas so well, we got chased many, many times, had a few close calls.

Speaker 5: 48:45

Thankfully the Lord got a hold of me because I was getting into the point where I was getting in gunfights and that sort of thing, I was going that direction with it because, I was kind of I don't know if I was trying to follow my dad's footsteps a little bit, but my family guns was always a thing, so it wasn't strange to me to walk around with one, yeah, um.

Speaker 5: 49:06

so, anyways, I was starting to go that direction with it, yeah and um, I was starting to get a little bit of a reputation for going that way so yeah, you were one of those kids, those uh, opportunities were starting to show up more and more, oh, yeah and um, fortunately, I think, the lord in his grace, and fortunately I think the Lord in his grace got a hold of me before anything got too real. You know what I mean so there was only a few times where I got into those situations, but I was just lucky enough to never get caught.

Speaker 5: 49:41

Yeah, buddy, Amen yeah just lucky enough to never get caught, and it was. It was getting close, though, because it was to the point where um chandler pd was starting to.

Speaker 4: 49:49

You know, there I was seeing him around my house I seen detectives hanging out, yeah, popping their heads around the corners of the street, you know, trying to see who's at my place and then I started at that point, um, I started realizing uh this is not the direction I want to go.

Speaker 2: 50:06

Come on. Yeah, self awareness as a teenager is wow I've.

Speaker 5: 50:11

You know, I've always been pretty self-aware, yeah, um, I think god just kind of gifted me with that, probably too self-aware and it's caused me to have a lot of self-doubt. Yeah, um, but um, yeah, I was.

Speaker 5: 50:24

I was able to see, like, um, I'm probably only a few months away from getting arrested yeah so and I don't think my parents really ever had an idea yeah, um well I shouldn't say that I, I I came home one time you kind of beat up and uh, my mom caught me coming home in the middle of the night and I had my gun on me and she saw that and and, uh, that kind of changed. She had a big talk with me you know, and that kind of kind of woke me up a little bit. Cause I'm realizing I'm sitting here with a gun in my lap and my mom is like you're going to die.

Speaker 4: 51:02

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 51:02

Wow, you know, know. So that that kind of woke me up wow and I was still going to church you know, at that point yeah you know so yeah it took me a little while to work my way. You don't just I'm still living in the middle of all those guys you know what I mean, so you don't just you know, you can walk away from it, but when? When you're living there?

Speaker 1: 51:23

It's hard. It's hard that's when it's all around you like that. Yeah, I was like mom when I went to prison.

Speaker 2: 51:29

She had a little thing and she told him you have to get me out of here or I'm going to get locked up. So he moved her to Queen Creek from Tempe. Yeah, sometimes you got to get out.

Speaker 5: 51:39

Yeah, yeah. So you know going to church in the middle of all that it was weird man.

Speaker 2: 51:46

What did? Because you said dad got radically saved, yeah, so what did that look like and what did it do to the home with you guys?

Speaker 5: 51:56

Never really thought about that before. You know, I think the biggest.

Speaker 2: 52:02

Well, you say radically saved. To me it's like he used dope and I'm good with dope, he was a drunk and I'm good with alcohol. And we're not going to church Now. We're there all the time.

Speaker 5: 52:13

Yeah, I don't know that he ever stopped drinking. My dad's always drank. But I think the way he drank was not as heavily. I don't know if he ever stopped Okay, but not as heavily. I don't know if he ever stopped Okay, but he stopped doing crazy stuff.

Speaker 2: 52:30

Yes, yeah, you could see the change.

Speaker 5: 52:33

Yeah, I mean. I remember many times coming home at night and walking in their room and they would both be in bed reading their Bibles. Oh, my God, bro and I remember coming home and opening up my dad's, you know, walking into the bedroom and he'd be on his knees next to the bed praying oh, wow and uh, at the same time he got saved, my theos, all got saved at the same time wow and and you know not together.

Speaker 5: 53:01

They weren't together but in their own walks. So god did a major move through the men and our family all kind of in that same time I went to church, you know, like I said, probably about when I was 16, because I think I had my driver's license when I started going, or maybe it was right before I got my driver's license but right around that and I know I didn't truly clean up until I was probably 18 yeah so I got saved.

Speaker 1: 53:27

But I was still kind of yeah, exactly that sanctification process do you remember the feeling you had seeing your parents read the bible or seeing your dad on his knee? Do you remember how that made you feel at all? God was there like a wow man. What's what's going on here?

Speaker 2: 53:42

wow, wow, look at dad, I would have been. I, because you've seen him.

Speaker 1: 53:45

You said, he was this wild dude who just had crazy adventures. Now he's On his knees praying, on his knees praying.

Speaker 5: 53:50

I would love to say that I had this crazy revelation and this wonderful feeling of seeing that, but honestly, I just didn't.

Speaker 2: 53:57

I think I was.

Speaker 5: 54:11

In some ways I was kind of still pretty disconnected um from him, because you're still doing your thing too. I was still doing my thing, um, and he was never preachy at me or anything like that. But you know him and my mom got really involved in church. I remember my theo ben started coming to church and I remember him playing bass, yeah, oh wow at church.

Speaker 2: 54:20

Come in and start serving and getting involved.

Speaker 5: 54:23

He was definitely the crazy uncle.

Speaker 4: 54:24

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 54:25

Um and uh, um, you know. So it I do remember kind of being like you know this, you know this escalated quickly Right. Wow Um but, uh, um, I was still walking through some of my own stuff. I was still getting in trouble.

Speaker 1: 54:42

I wasn't smoking anymore, but I was still drinking that one took a while for me to to really kick you look back on that and like man thank you, god.

Speaker 5: 54:52

You know I mean that you did that for my parents yeah, for sure because, my dad died a few years ago yeah and um if he hadn't come to christ you know that that would have been a whole different ballgame, and the time towards the end that we spent together was cool because we were able to pray together and just share a real intimate time, yeah, and I don't know those situations without Christ in it.

Speaker 2: 55:21

So I couldn't say.

Speaker 5: 55:22

you know, I don't think it would have been the same, but my gut feeling is it probably would not have been those last few days probably.

Speaker 2: 55:31

A little different without.

Speaker 3: 55:32

God, Maybe it would have been different right.

Speaker 5: 55:33

But we were able to share that time. That's cool. They were really, you know, both really involved in church through my early, late teenage years and then I think there was some church hurt there.

Speaker 4: 55:48

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 55:49

And so they stopped going to that church.

Speaker 2: 55:51

It's real man? Yeah, it happens, but you know my dad always read.

Speaker 5: 55:56

And even later on in life. He always read Come on, yeah. So he never walked away. And I remember in the last couple of days of his life when we prayed I remember hearing him praying in tongues and stuff. So, like you know it's, even though he didn't go to church, he never forgot.

Speaker 2: 56:12

He's with Jesus now. Oh yeah, there's no question about it.

Speaker 5: 56:15

He's running around with Aaliyah.

Speaker 2: 56:17

Come on yeah man, we'll get there, buddy. We'll get there, buddy, we'll get there man. Did you graduate high?

Speaker 1: 56:22

school.

Speaker 5: 56:23

What's that Did you?

Speaker 1: 56:24

graduate high school, barely, barely, I had to go to I don't know if they have these anymore.

Speaker 3: 56:29

Are you a wolf? Yeah?

Speaker 4: 56:31

Are you?

Speaker 5: 56:31

Well, I didn't graduate from Chandler. I ended up having to go to the accommodation school that used to be on Williams Air Force Base Up there. That's where I graduated from but that was my senior year that I did that, but I probably wouldn't. I don't know that I would have graduated had I not done that and and that that was a crazy experience because that was where you know it was.

Speaker 2: 56:54

It was yeah there's a lot of bad kids over there, buddy. It was put them all together in one place, then they all get bad yeah, I had a couple close calls there for sure, amen, remember.

Speaker 1: 57:05

Remember Mesa Votek.

Speaker 5: 57:06

Yeah, absolutely yeah.

Speaker 1: 57:07

That's where all the bad kids in Mesa went.

Speaker 5: 57:09

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1: 57:11

I didn't go there, but I had friends that went there, yeah.

Speaker 5: 57:13

Yeah, so that's. That's where I graduated.

Speaker 2: 57:22

So you, you's your direction. Where are you headed after graduation?

Speaker 5: 57:25

I didn't have a direction.

Speaker 2: 57:27

Really.

Speaker 5: 57:27

I had no idea what I was doing.

Speaker 1: 57:29

Wow, what did you do after you graduated? Just get a job, or I got a job working at this company named called Silner.

Speaker 5: 57:38

Yeah, and it was even to this day. It was one of my favorite jobs. Basically, I was they packaged, so it was machines, it was operating machines and it was they were what's called surface mount machines and they packaged components for electronics basically, and it was just machine operator working there. I think that's what I did right out of. Yeah, there, I think that's what I did right at it. Yeah, I think that was what I did right out of high school.

Speaker 2: 58:09

I had a couple part-time jobs while I was in school yeah, pizza hut yeah, it was not good for me, because that's where I met my first drug dealer that supplied me. Yeah, because then I had my own money. Yeah, yeah but um.

Speaker 5: 58:21

My first real job after after I graduated was there and I remember walking in and the guy was like well, what experience do you have? And I was like what do you mean?

Speaker 2: 58:29

I don't have any experience. I work at Pizza Hut.

Speaker 5: 58:30

Yeah, right, he was like well, have you ever done any other? Have you worked with your hands before? I was like no, he's like well, I mean, you came here, what do you have to offer? And you have to offer.

Speaker 1: 58:49

And I was like I don't know man I'm just had a thing in the newspaper and he's like have you ever played with legos? I was like yeah I played with legos.

Speaker 3: 58:52

I love legos. He's all right. All right. Now we got some experience right. Oh my god, it was like he was trying. He was pulling for me, trying to help you out here, man but, I worked there for a couple years.

Speaker 5: 58:59

It was. I loved that job it was awesome I love working with my hands so it was. It was like playing with legos, but machines yeah, okay, take apart machines and do some really cool stuff yeah, yeah that, but I I really had no direction, yeah, in my life um still living with your parents yes, I still live with my parents. Um, lived there until I was 21, really, and then Really, and then that kind of goes into my first marriage.

Speaker 4: 59:28

Yeah, ah.

Speaker 5: 59:29

But yeah so.

Speaker 2: 59:32

You meet the woman.

Speaker 5: 59:33

Yeah, I meet the woman. I met her at church. Okay, and.

Speaker 1: 59:37

You still going to church all through this time still.

Speaker 5: 59:39

Yes.

Speaker 1: 59:40

Really Wow, yeah, cleaned up. No more drinking, no more. You said, you drink a little bit still, but no more drugs, no more, nothing.

Speaker 2: 59:46

I really stopped um partying and being crazy when I was about 18 you know I just I really started living for christ at that point wow, it sounds to me like when, when you went from a kid to adult, that year of 17 to 18, that time to adult, that year of 17 to 18, that time you I think because I remember, I remember 17 and then it was like, oh, I'm gonna be an adult yeah, it's gonna get.

Speaker 5: 1:00:14

It gets real. Yeah, it wasn't like I'm becoming an adult, it was, um, just getting really close to j and um really feeling so are you reading in your room?

Speaker 2: 1:00:29

and, yes, like memorizing scripture and listening to worship.

Speaker 5: 1:00:32

I don't know about memorizing scripture, but I can't. I became, um, a voracious reader of the Bible. Wow, and I think that's what really changed. What brought that about, um, and I think that's what really changed me. What brought that about? I got in a fight and got suspended from school, and I also got grounded and so I couldn't go anywhere, and my buddy had given me that Bible so I pulled it out from underneath my bed and I started reading Wow and okay, so here's the Holy Spirit.

Speaker 2: 1:01:07

JB, I hope you're listening to this. That's right, baby Wow.

Speaker 5: 1:01:10

So here's the Holy Spirit. So at this point I hadn't even started going to church yet, but I got in this fight and was suspended, and over a girl, of course right, it's stupid. And so, anyways, I had nothing to do, so I started reading this Bible and I opened up to John 33. And you know what? You know, that's Jesus talking to Nicodemus right. And so he's talking about salvation, and I don't know.

Speaker 2: 1:01:38

I just thought that being born again, yeah, exactly.

Speaker 5: 1:01:41

But I didn't have the spirit, and so I had no idea what I was reading. I had no idea what it meant, but I memorized that entire passage. Wow.

Speaker 3: 1:01:50

From.

Speaker 5: 1:01:50

I think John 3 through, I think 16, something like that. I memorized it, wow. And so later on, when I did come to Christ, all of a sudden it clicked. Oh, that's what that was about. Right Now I have the spirit to be able to open my eyes up a little bit. That was kind of my first in. That was my first foray into reading the scripture.

Speaker 5: 1:02:15

Then once I became you know, then I started going to church at about 16. When I got in that fight and got grounded and suspended, I think I was probably, probably, I think I was in eighth grade yeah something like that seventh, eighth grade somewhere around there and um.

Speaker 5: 1:02:35

So once I did get saved, I was always a reader, even though I was still partying and drinking. Um, I was just really drawn to the word, and so I spent a lot of time in the New Testament and a lot of it. I really didn't know what I was reading or what any of it meant All I knew is I couldn't get enough of it.

Speaker 1: 1:02:53

I just had to keep reading. My challenge is to remember that you still remember those scriptures, john 3.

Speaker 5: 1:03:00

I can tell you what they're about and all of that, but I couldn't, but I couldn't repeat it back to you verbatim Give us a summary. I love you, Dad, Basically he was saying that you had to be born again in order to enter into the kingdom of God.

Speaker 4: 1:03:15

Amen.

Speaker 5: 1:03:16

That's the gist of the whole thing, Nicodemus scratched his head and he's like what are you talking about?

Speaker 2: 1:03:20

How do I go back to my mom?

Speaker 1: 1:03:29

How can I be born?

Speaker 5: 1:03:29

again. What is this born again you're talking about? So, anyways, that was the gist of that man and, um, I had to challenge brother.

Speaker 1: 1:03:32

Oh yeah, it's all good, and you saw that post.

Speaker 2: 1:03:34

All right well, I know his role here, so I'm like okay, come on, dean of students, the dean of the bible college we'll get into some of the so my well, we'll get into this later, but my brain just doesn't work the way it used to.

Speaker 1: 1:03:49

Well, you're pushing 50, brother, it's the first thing to go. There is that.

Speaker 2: 1:03:59

Oh God is good boys, I think there was some trauma also that went into that too.

Speaker 5: 1:04:04

That's the only thing I can think to explain it. But anyways, anyways.

Speaker 1: 1:04:07

I just teased you, brother.

Speaker 5: 1:04:08

It's all good, I appreciate it. I don't remember what I was saying now.

Speaker 2: 1:04:15

How you were a voracious reader. The fight pushed you into the Bible and then, when you really started going to church and actually got saved yeah, then I really started reading.

Speaker 5: 1:04:25

I didn't have a whole lot of understanding, but I just knew I needed to read. So that's, that's kind of. And so, as I started to learn more and I've talked to my old youth pastor, um, about that, I don't know if you guys know Scott Ogles yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:04:39

He was my youth pastor.

Speaker 5: 1:04:40

Really.

Speaker 2: 1:04:40

Whoa dude.

Speaker 5: 1:04:47

Back in the day back in the 90s, wow and so how he never kicked me out of that youth group like wow god must have really gave him some patience for me, man, because the grace of god we were, yeah, wow we were not good

Speaker 5: 1:04:58

yeah anyways, anyways, um, uh man, by the grace of God he was so good and he always took time. I had a lot of questions and so he had to explain a lot of stuff to me over and over again. And the more I learned, the more I felt the need to explain those things to the other guys the other kids.

Speaker 5: 1:05:22

And so that kind of launched me into. Eventually, as I got older I was teaching on some Sunday mornings and on Wednesday nights giving my testimony and teaching a little bit and leading small groups and that sort of thing.

Speaker 1: 1:05:38

That makes sense now, don't it? Yeah, it sure does. So I've always had that kind of God. Knew what he was doing. Back then, buddy, he was preparing you way back then. Oh yeah, it sure does, it sure does. So I've always had that kind of God knew what he was doing. Back then, buddy, he used to play with you way back then. Oh yeah, for sure.

Speaker 5: 1:05:48

I can look back and go okay. I see how, even though I still would never in a million years have been able to imagine that I would end up where I'm at now, doing what I'm- doing.

Speaker 1: 1:06:01

He knew, he knew, but I didn't. I doing what I'm doing.

Speaker 5: 1:06:04

He knew I didn't.

Speaker 1: 1:06:05

If you knew you would have ran.

Speaker 5: 1:06:08

I would have had so much self-doubt.

Speaker 2: 1:06:10

I would have. I'm not good enough for that.

Speaker 5: 1:06:15

I'm not smart.

Speaker 2: 1:06:17

I'm stupid. Wow, so you go there. We talk ourselves out of it so much.

Speaker 5: 1:06:22

My go-to is I'm not smart enough. Everybody's going to think I'm a fake phony, yeah, so much. My go-to is I'm not smart enough.

Speaker 2: 1:06:27

Everybody's going to think I'm a fake phony, whatever that sort of thing. That'd be the last thing I'd say about you, buddy, yeah well, I appreciate that.

Speaker 5: 1:06:35

It was definitely for all you grandpas and dads out there. Man, you've got to watch your words over your kids, oh yeah. I know exactly where that comes from. The holy spirit revealed it to me when I was young, my grandfather um, something happened and I remember he looked at me. He goes well, you're not very smart, are you? Oh, wow. And that always stuck with me and I was probably, wow, maybe four or five years old six years old, very impressionable now I love my grandpa.

Speaker 2: 1:07:10

He was an amazing dude, so I have no ill feelings towards him or anything like that.

Speaker 5: 1:07:14

He was one of my heroes growing up. Yeah, um, he was one of the toughest dudes I ever knew, and yeah, but you respected him and looked up to him.

Speaker 2: 1:07:23

and for those words to come out of his mouth and make you doubt yeah, it hurt. Or am I smart? Am I?

Speaker 5: 1:07:28

dumb.

Speaker 4: 1:07:28

I still remember when he said it.

Speaker 5: 1:07:30

I can visualize it and I remember the feelings I had and all that.

Speaker 2: 1:07:34

And he wasn't even calling you dumb, he was just asking you. No, I think he was just making an offhand remark over something dumb I did, but that's why we have to be careful with our words, because it's something I struggle with now even through college, and doing all of that Every time I go in that room to record. You're going to pray for him at the end. He's going to pray for you at the end. That inner voice, that battle inside of you, that inner critic, buddy, it is raging.

Speaker 5: 1:08:06

I've learned to just ignore it and just work through it.

Speaker 2: 1:08:09

It's good.

Speaker 5: 1:08:10

Because I know it's not the truth. I know a few things. I know I've studied a couple things.

Speaker 4: 1:08:16

It still echoes, though.

Speaker 5: 1:08:19

It never goes away, it's always there.

Speaker 1: 1:08:21

I can still hear a few phrases from my childhood that still you know what I mean. Me and my brothers. We all had brown eyes. I can't use the words they said, but McCurdy boys are so full of brown eyes it's in their eyes.

Speaker 3: 1:08:32

You know what I?

Speaker 4: 1:08:32

mean, and still to this day I hear that yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:08:34

You know what I mean. And just you guys are never going to amount to nothing. You know what I mean.

Speaker 3: 1:08:40

I and it still haunts me.

Speaker 1: 1:08:42

I still think man, would I really ever have mounted anything? You know what I mean, Right, I mean I know I have Come on, buddy, you're in the process.

Speaker 2: 1:08:49

I still hear it, you know what I mean.

Speaker 5: 1:08:51

Those are real brother, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:08:52

Those things are real man.

Speaker 5: 1:08:54

So yeah, you got to watch what you say to the young bucks coming up underneath you, oh yeah. Because, Because what you say, even offhand can be devastating.

Speaker 4: 1:09:03

That's the one.

Speaker 5: 1:09:04

On the other side of that you know when you're encouraging and saying the good stuff to them, the positive things, and when they are doing something good, you celebrate it with them. You know they'll run off of that when I was in fifth grade somewhere around there. So we lived at the trailer park and one of my other I'm going to keep referring to these guys my best friends they were, we were all just brothers yeah, we were living all right there and we had no escape from each other, so you

Speaker 5: 1:09:32

just had to learn to oh yeah and, anyways, one of my other bros that lived across the street from me. His name was sam and, uh, he was a, an athlete. This dude was an athlete even when we were kids. Um, so we knew each other from grade school all the way through high school yeah well, you know, we all went to school together and, uh, I got into playing baseball with him and I remember, um, I'd never played sports, I didn't really see myself as athletic although after that I was in always some kind of sport whatever and um that.

Speaker 5: 1:10:04

But my first experience in sports was baseball and, uh, I got on this baseball team. My friend's dad, uh, he decided to coach, so you know he could watch us yeah and uh on, he had this assistant coach and I was brand new to baseball and I I was having a hard time getting some of the mechanics down.

Speaker 4: 1:10:22

Right.

Speaker 5: 1:10:23

And I remember he yelled at me and told me I was the worst baseball player he had ever seen, right To uh no, so anyways my friend's dad lit into him, so that hurt man. That like that messed me up.

Speaker 3: 1:10:37

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:10:37

Probably turned you off from baseball, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:10:40

Well, no, I played for a couple more years after that. I've just always been like that. I hate quitting.

Speaker 4: 1:10:45

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:10:48

You know, even though for a long time I saw myself as a quitter because there was a lot of things I did. Quit, yeah, that I did not. But at any rate my friend, his dad, his name is Francis he came up and he lit that dude up and I remember up until then like I never had anybody stick up for me you know, stand up for me. He did that, I felt so much love from him, so it was like I got destroyed in one second and kind of you know, had a new experience.

Speaker 5: 1:11:17

The next you know, but Sports is great for kids.

Speaker 2: 1:11:22

Oh yeah, teaches them a lot, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:11:28

Right. Sports is great for kids oh yeah, teaches them a lot yeah, right, so anyways, you know. So, yeah, you, just, you just really got to pay attention to what you say to young speak the biggest, the biggest lie we heard growing up was remember the saying sticks and stones may break my bones words will never hurt me.

Speaker 2: 1:11:39

Oh, those biggest lie growing up.

Speaker 1: 1:11:41

Dude, those things will cut like a knife man.

Speaker 2: 1:11:44

Yeah, the fight, the blood is healed, man, but those words are stuck.

Speaker 4: 1:11:47

Yeah, for sure.

Speaker 2: 1:11:49

Also. You're going to church, man, you're saved, you're doing the thing. They're starting to use you and raise you up in the church and you meet a girl.

Speaker 5: 1:11:59

Yeah, I meet a girl.

Speaker 2: 1:12:01

I got to say first, what did Pastor Bill always say? White, pink and green man, those are the three things pull you out of ministry. So quick man. What was the white part? Oh God Dope, oh okay, never mind, Just go ahead bud.

Speaker 1: 1:12:16

Yeah, I met this girl. I'm a little slow too, bud. Hey, it's all good.

Speaker 5: 1:12:20

It's all good. Anyways, I met a girl, and so I think I'm 20, 20, 21, something like that. It's all kind of that part of my life is a little bit blurry to me. I think I was 21.

Speaker 2: 1:12:38

Still, living with mom.

Speaker 5: 1:12:39

Yes, still living with my parents, and so we kind of just.

Speaker 2: 1:12:44

Working at Silillner.

Speaker 5: 1:12:47

At that time. I don't think I was, maybe I was, I don't. I think I was actually.

Speaker 3: 1:12:53

Yeah, I think I was.

Speaker 4: 1:12:54

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:12:58

Anyways, you know, we fell in lust. And you know, yeah, I these you know through the course of our relationship. She had very abusive parents.

Speaker 4: 1:13:12

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:13:13

And um, one day she got in a fight with her mom and her stepdad and they, they beat her up. Oh, wow. And so, um, I thought I would come in as the knight in shining armor. Like that night was the beginning of the end. We just talked about this before we started, yeah, so I thought women like to change the men and gods like to save them. Yeah, so that was she wasn't trying to change me, but I was trying to save her.

Speaker 2: 1:13:39

So I was going to be the hero and come in and pull her out of that situation.

Speaker 4: 1:13:42

Yeah, and um so I literally pulled her.

Speaker 5: 1:13:43

I went and got her out of that situation and um, so I literally pulled her. I went and got her, me and one of my friends, um, took my truck and, you know, told her dad, you better step back. I'm going to.

Speaker 5: 1:13:56

I'm going to get her stuff and we're going to leave, You're going to stand there. And so that's what we did. And, uh, I brought her back to my house and she lived with us at my parents' house for a little while and then, you know the the idea was just until we can figure something out, and because I had no direction in life and no way to do anything, I thought it would be brilliant to get married. So I was like hey, let's get married, you know? So we were having sex that whole time.

Speaker 1: 1:14:21

Of course Still going to church.

Speaker 5: 1:14:24

Still going to church. Oh yeah, you know.

Speaker 1: 1:14:27

But you remember feeling any conviction.

Speaker 5: 1:14:32

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:14:32

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:14:32

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 1:14:33

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:14:34

Oh yeah. But the pull of the conviction.

Speaker 4: 1:14:37

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:14:37

And the pull of the girl.

Speaker 1: 1:14:39

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:14:41

I was just curious, bud as a young man bud.

Speaker 2: 1:14:43

As a young man bud. Yeah, it's real dude.

Speaker 1: 1:14:45

The reason I asked that was because it lets us and the listeners know just how deep you were in your relationship with God. You know what I mean, because you can go to church and play church and not feel conviction.

Speaker 5: 1:14:55

I love the Lord with all my heart that whole time. That's why I was asking, because if you didn't, there wouldn't be no conviction, it would just be whatever know I mean. So, yeah, yeah, you know. So basically she was not ready to be married yeah I was not ready to be married. I was just trying to be in shining armor yeah and and uh, you know just made a lot married, and so we just had no business getting married, and Was she?

Speaker 1: 1:15:32

about your age too.

Speaker 5: 1:15:34

She was, I was. I know I'm messing these years up. I think I was 21.

Speaker 4: 1:15:41

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:15:43

Maybe almost 22. I don't remember exactly, but I think she was two years, I think she was 19.

Speaker 4: 1:15:48

Oh right, 18 or 19.

Speaker 3: 1:15:50

No, she had just graduated, so you guys were just kids really yeah, oh, yeah, oh yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:15:56

And so you know. First of all, having sex blinded me to all of the signs that this was not a good idea.

Speaker 2: 1:16:06

When you're blinded, those red flags look green. Yeah, so there was that.

Speaker 5: 1:16:12

And then there was my immaturity and thinking that I was going to rescue her out of her situation.

Speaker 4: 1:16:18

Yeah. Just doomed the whole thing Amen. Amen.

Speaker 5: 1:16:22

And so, um yeah, so we got married and right away started having problems, because I was still a kid and I wanted to be out running around fishing I would take off for the day, not coming home until the next day. I wasn't out drinking or doing anything wrong I was just out with my bros doing what we always did yeah yeah

Speaker 5: 1:16:42

and uh that it just it was not good and so we fought all the time anyways. Um, after about a year we were married. I started wanting to. I had always wanted to be a police officer, even though I was crazy and running from the cops all the time.

Speaker 2: 1:16:56

Yeah, growing up I'll become one. I wanted to be you to do that, so I started testing at the different departments here.

Speaker 5: 1:17:06

And her dad lived in Texas and worked for the city in Texas and he was like why don't you guys come check it out over here? Why don't you live over here? It's a beautiful place to live, whatever. So we were like, hey, let's go check it out. So we stayed up there for a week and it was beautiful there.

Speaker 2: 1:17:26

So even after you went to his house and took his daughter with her stuff, no, stepdad, no, no no, her stepdad who lived.

Speaker 5: 1:17:32

Okay, yeah, okay.

Speaker 1: 1:17:34

This is a real dad that lives in Texas. Yeah, yeah, okay, so when? Where at in Texas?

Speaker 5: 1:17:38

Copper's Cove right off Fort Hood by Killeen Texas Never heard of it, Dead center Texas.

Speaker 2: 1:17:43

Killeen. That's where Jade was at for a while. I don't know yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:17:48

So anyways, we liked it so here's the adventurous part of me. I was like, let's go for it.

Speaker 2: 1:17:55

Let's just do it. What do we got to lose? Right, had a lot to lose, so anyways went there um started testing right away. Um, yeah, because it's a process you got to go through. Yeah, yeah, it took a while.

Speaker 5: 1:18:08

Yeah, it took a while, and the economy there wasn't very good you're living with dad, no, no, we had our own place oh okay, wow, we had our own place and um it was not going good, you know did you get a different job while you were testing and all that other stuff? Yeah, I had two part-time jobs in texas, oh no no, I'm sorry, let me think about this for a second. So it takes about a year.

Speaker 1: 1:18:27

It takes about a year to get get into.

Speaker 5: 1:18:29

No, it wasn't that long, no, but um, I think I got a job that was uh working for a place that built student desks or something like that Because there just wasn't a whole lot going on Building desks again.

Speaker 2: 1:18:46

Bud Right Can't get away from it.

Speaker 5: 1:18:50

So anyways, long story short. You know, we were just always at each other.

Speaker 2: 1:18:55

It was not a good situation.

Speaker 5: 1:18:58

I started testing for the different cities there and I ended up getting on with Copper's Cove, Went through the academy and about that time, when I was getting ready to start, my wife at the time was just kind of like hey, I just don't want to really be married anymore.

Speaker 3: 1:19:19

I don't need you here.

Speaker 5: 1:19:20

Because she basically got out of that bad situation and into a place where she had family that was good to her yeah she started making good friends. She had a good job, yeah and uh, she just didn't really need me anymore, right? Because she got out of that situation and uh, she pretty much, you know, I was like whoa, wait a minute, what's going on? And she pretty much straight up know I was like whoa, wait a minute, what's going on? And she pretty much straight up told me I don't need you anymore.

Speaker 2: 1:19:44

Yeah, you know so.

Speaker 5: 1:19:46

I'm done Wow.

Speaker 4: 1:19:47

Right yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:19:48

So, anyways, we ended up splitting up and eventually got divorced. Wow, and I was pretty broken and miserable and trying to learn how to be a cop at the same time. Wow, and I just was at the point where I was starting to drink a lot again.

Speaker 4: 1:20:06

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:20:06

And, uh, a lot of my bros, um, I, uh, um was hanging with um, you know that's. That was the answer to everything, was um? Now you got to understand in that part of Central Texas there's nothing. You're either in the military or that's pretty much the only reason you're, or you grew up there you know, and whoever, your parents were probably in the military.

Speaker 3: 1:20:32

That's why you're there. So Fort Hood is right there.

Speaker 5: 1:20:36

And so, anyways, there's nothing there, but.

Speaker 2: 1:20:40

I'm not going to say, say it, but never mind, but basically it's.

Speaker 5: 1:20:45

It's so anyways, the lifestyle as a man. There was bars, strip clubs and work. Wow, and all the guys I was there with it was you know it was, bro, don't, don't worry about her yeah let's go drink go to the strip club, whatever right and so I. That was not what, that was not me yeah, I did not want to be like that and but it was kind of like I was so miserable and broken at the time.

Speaker 2: 1:21:12

It's just hurt, it just wasn't a lot going on.

Speaker 5: 1:21:15

so so you know, I just I, I stayed away from that a lot, but sometimes I just needed to be around people and so I would go out with them, you know no church?

Speaker 2: 1:21:23

That's what I was wondering when you moved to Texas.

Speaker 5: 1:21:25

So initially we were going to church but, the church we went to was her grandfather's church.

Speaker 4: 1:21:31

He was the pastor there.

Speaker 2: 1:21:32

Oh, wow, and.

Speaker 5: 1:21:33

I just really felt so ashamed of myself.

Speaker 1: 1:21:37

I just couldn't go Amen. And.

Speaker 5: 1:21:39

I went to church on and off while I was there, um, but I was working a lot of sundays at that time, uh, because I was, you know, rookie, whatever oh yeah, you get the crap shifts.

Speaker 2: 1:21:51

You get the worst of the worst.

Speaker 5: 1:21:52

So I was either asleep or I was working you know, and so, um, I just didn't have a whole lot of opportunity to be able to go to church, so I went when I could, did you like being an officer who. I think, being in Texas central Texas in the late 90s, there was a lot of racism happening there, oh yeah. There was a lot of racism happening there, oh yeah. I used to have billboards on there my training sergeant. He definitely did not like me. He wouldn't even say my last name.

Speaker 2: 1:22:36

Really, let's put it that way.

Speaker 5: 1:22:38

My last name, for you guys that don't know me, is Tarango.

Speaker 2: 1:22:41

Very Mexican.

Speaker 5: 1:22:42

He didn't even want to say my last name. For you guys that don't know me is Tarango, very, very, you know Mexican. He, just he, you know. He didn't even want to say my last name and he treated me like he hated me the whole time. Wow, my first couple of FTOs were just I thought. I thought eventually they would get me killed. They just you know it was just.

Speaker 2: 1:22:56

That's just how it was.

Speaker 4: 1:22:57

And it's all good you know Amen and it's all good. Amen, you were learning, I got through it.

Speaker 3: 1:23:02

And it is what it is right.

Speaker 5: 1:23:04

And so yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:23:09

First few years as an officer.

Speaker 5: 1:23:09

I was only there for a short time. And then the divorce happened and I was just miserable and you know, with being treated the way we were treated there. It just wasn't good there, um, it just wasn't good and I felt myself like getting to the point where where, honestly, I just didn't really want to be alive anymore.

Speaker 5: 1:23:28

yeah, and so I've been there buddy yeah, and so, you know, I was kind of talking to my dad through this whole thing and he was kind of like you know, stay there, don't come home with your tail between your legs, conquer all this, and then if you want to come home, come home. Yeah, but I but I got to the point where I was just like man, I'm miserable. And you know, working for the city, here I'm, I'm having to do stuff that's kind of hurting my heart, hurting my conscience, and, um, I'm I. You know this is, it's starting to not be good, yeah, unhealthy, and you know this is starting to not be good.

Speaker 5: 1:24:01

Yeah unhealthy and that you know, my dad was just like, hey, you need to come home now.

Speaker 4: 1:24:05

Come on now.

Speaker 5: 1:24:06

And I literally resigned, I think that next day. Wow and turned in all my equipment and drove the 20-hour drive straight home. I did not stop.

Speaker 2: 1:24:17

Oh, so you and her were done. Yeah, we were done. At that point, you were done.

Speaker 5: 1:24:20

She did not want to get back together. Amen, and so there was no hope.

Speaker 3: 1:24:24

No reason to stay there.

Speaker 5: 1:24:25

Yeah.

Speaker 4: 1:24:26

Yep.

Speaker 5: 1:24:26

Okay, so we moved back. Now let me just back up a step with that. As far as she goes, I don't blame her for anything. Yeah, I take full responsibility. Yeah, for what happened through that whole thing.

Speaker 5: 1:24:45

Um because I chose to start having sex before we were married and uh, that just totally blinded me from, uh, all of the obvious um signs, you know, um, and from what people had to say, yeah, um. There was only a couple people in my life that really said, hey, this is not a good idea. Everybody else was just kind of like, whatever, dude, yeah you, do you yeah um, but for the most part there was only a couple guys that really spoke to me and were like hey, this is not good right but, you know, I was, I was well, there's a reason the bible specifically tells us to abstain from that.

Speaker 2: 1:25:23

Yeah, absolutely. It messes up our thinking, it blinds us.

Speaker 5: 1:25:27

I've been. I've been very because of my experience with that, with my daughter and my not so much with my son, yet he's not really dating yet. But with my daughter I've been straight up with her and her boyfriend, hey guy, like sometimes they're home and I'm leaving. I'm like, don't have sex.

Speaker 3: 1:25:44

Yeah, yeah, you know, I tell him straight up and I go.

Speaker 5: 1:25:46

I've been straight up with my daughter it will ruin your relationship. It really will, Because for him it'll only be about sex after that yeah, right, yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:25:57

And so she doesn't like to hear it, but you know it's real.

Speaker 5: 1:26:00

I don't want her or him to walk through what I walk through, so I'm just honest with them. I love both of them, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:26:08

She's got a really cool boyfriend. From my experience man, a marriage based on sex when sex is no longer fulfilling, usually it doesn't end well. Yeah, you know what I mean. And so there has to be some kind of establishment of relationship, friendship, some kind of connection outside of just sex.

Speaker 4: 1:26:26

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:26:26

To sustain a marriage beyond just sex. Absolutely, because eventually it becomes a little less about sex and a little more about hey, this is kind of. And then now, what do you got? You're like who?

Speaker 5: 1:26:40

are you.

Speaker 1: 1:26:41

It's real though I mean. That's why it's so important, man. Yeah, Because if that's the foundation of it, eventually that fades away a little bit or the interest, or the intrigue of it, and then you're left with what you have, and if it's just sex, then you have nothing and it ends up just being nothing.

Speaker 5: 1:26:56

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah, that's a big part of it, yeah, so so anyways, I just I wanted to say you know, I don't want to be another one of those guys that just blames it all on her right, it takes two to tango.

Speaker 2: 1:27:09

Absolutely yeah, um, and it did. You were at a place in your life where you were so young and new to this thing. You thought the marriage was gonna fix the thing, bro, and help it. And then and we'll even go to texas you can be close to your parents and parents. You're making a lot of changes and sacrificing, trying these things, man, and it just wasn't working. So you come back home to dad. You're 23?

Speaker 1: 1:27:34

22, 23. Just so you know nothing you said ever indicated that she was at fault. Just so you know. Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:27:39

Yeah, we both I mean know I was I was working a lot of hours because we were really short on uh on, on uh staff yeah, and so you know, I look back to that, I realize what we were doing was so sketchy because as police officers. Yeah, because that whole city we might have had five officers on a shift and like when things went down you were on your own, dude, that's crazy bro.

Speaker 3: 1:28:16

It was wild man Back up.

Speaker 2: 1:28:18

No, Figure it out.

Speaker 5: 1:28:22

Best case scenario is maybe one of the SO guys were pretty close.

Speaker 4: 1:28:26

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:28:27

It could come in Maybe. Man Some of the state guys could come and help A lot of times we were on our own.

Speaker 2: 1:28:37

But looking back on it, now you're like I probably shouldn't have put myself in some of those situations. It would have been a little crazy. Now you're like I probably shouldn't have put myself in some of those situations.

Speaker 5: 1:28:43

I've been a little crazy, yeah you know, we were so short that we were all completely reactionary, so there wasn't a whole lot of like I'm patrolling around and doing that sort of thing. It was we were hopping call to call Wow, but yeah, we were just really short. So we were working long shifts and working late a lot of times. So you know? Hey, it is what it is and it's nothing any different that no one else is going through. That's in that line of work anywhere else in the world what's your analogy?

Speaker 5: 1:29:15

what doesn't kill you makes you stronger well, it can mess you up pretty bad, so it might make you stronger if you choose to walk that road. I'm I'm not a big believer in what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. I've seen a lot of pretty messed up people, so you have to choose that road amen um, or or you just I mean there's a lot of victims out there and a lot of defeated people, so I I don't think that what you go through makes you stronger necessarily.

Speaker 3: 1:29:42

It can.

Speaker 2: 1:29:43

It can, but you've got to choose your way. Yeah, buddy, you've got to choose, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:29:47

Amen, I like that. So, anyways, all of that I just never want to come across. I take 100% responsibility for that failed marriage because I messed up in the beginning and because I'm the one that pushed it, yeah, right so so she let into me yeah, you know, and so um, I pushed it, and so that started um the ball, the ball, the snowball rolling down the hill oh yeah, and then was not ready to get married and then, so I was a knucklehead the whole time.

Speaker 5: 1:30:21

I wasn't out doing anything bad. I was just out.

Speaker 1: 1:30:25

Yeah, you weren't home with your wife, which you're also 21 years old. Yeah, yeah, that's not an excuse, though. No, it's not, it's not.

Speaker 5: 1:30:32

But I was just out.

Speaker 1: 1:30:33

I was still trying to hang out with my friends and being a kid Amen.

Speaker 5: 1:30:44

So you come home you come home.

Speaker 1: 1:30:45

Um was just broken for the next, I don't know two years, three years just wrecked. Where are they? I came home wrecked. Yeah, were they still in the trailer park?

Speaker 5: 1:30:51

uh, no, no, no, we were living in. No, no, we were living in um still in chandler, okay, over by erie park. Um off of uh in that neighborhood. Off of uh, let's see alma school, and um oakland, or no, not oakland, um knots yeah, yeah, that area which was. There's a lot of gang stuff going on over there, but but that was once I moved back. Yeah, um, some of those guys were still there, but it wasn't light really like they had pretty much grew up at that point.

Speaker 5: 1:31:23

But yeah, I was broken and I started going back to Living Word.

Speaker 4: 1:31:28

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:31:29

But didn't. Now I'm trying to remember that time was a blur.

Speaker 2: 1:31:34

Yeah, you were broken.

Speaker 5: 1:31:35

But I was pretty broken and luckily enough I had some really good friends that kind of just dragged me through with them for that first little bit, because I'm sure I wasn't fun to be around.

Speaker 2: 1:31:49

Is that like JB, come back in at this time? Yeah, all those guys, same guys, all the guys that you grew up, okay, at church.

Speaker 5: 1:31:57

The guys that I didn't go to church with. They were all gone, but the guys I went to church with, yeah, they were still there.

Speaker 2: 1:32:02

Amen and yeah, so anyways, did you try to get into police here?

Speaker 5: 1:32:09

No, I was done. My experience in Texas, it was so bad those FTOs screwed you up, man, yeah it was pretty wild. We won't go into that.

Speaker 2: 1:32:18

So they let you mom and dad let you come home. You go go into that. So they let you mom and dad let you come home. You go back to church and what are you doing? What are you just? Existing working first little bit working at all.

Speaker 1: 1:32:28

Yeah, I was working, but nothing special. Yeah, I wasn't doing anything special going through the motions.

Speaker 5: 1:32:32

I think, um, uh, I just worked some odds and ends stuff and then I think I started, um, I ended up going back into the trades yeah and got into carpentry using your hands union for a little bit nice. Then um one of my bros that I grew up with, um tony, he, uh, he started his own remodeling, residential remodeling business and good money yeah, and my parents were moving to minnesota so my mom could go take care of her dad, or help take care of her.

Speaker 5: 1:33:08

Yeah, okay and so they moved, and so I moved in with him and um lived with him for a while and uh helping remodel work with him. Yeah, that's we just kind of it was just me and him, yeah, and we just went and did these jobs.

Speaker 2: 1:33:20

Oh, that's cool yeah so that's where you learned a lot of the stuff you do around here.

Speaker 5: 1:33:25

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:33:25

Yeah, oh, all right, all right, still drinking.

Speaker 5: 1:33:31

Once we moved in, because we were drinking Rose before, yeah, and so once I moved in with him, that was kind of yeah, that started happening again.

Speaker 2: 1:33:39

Yeah, we started drinking. It's what we do, man. Yeah, I'll pick up the 12 tonight. Bud you get it tomorrow? Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:33:47

So, yeah, there started to be a lot of drinking again. Just didn't have anything else to do. Really, I was still going to church. I still loved the Lord.

Speaker 4: 1:33:56

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:33:57

Still served. Yeah, did all the things, just drank a lot see, I think that's what's amazing people don't understand.

Speaker 1: 1:34:02

Is that, like I get a lot of flack from people that know me that are like, oh, you call yourself a christian, but you still whatever you know. I mean, you should have seen us before. It's like I'm still a messed up person. Yeah, just because I love god and I'm trying to be a better person doesn't mean I still don't have things that I'm clinging to or holding on to. Yeah, you know, I mean and people don't understand that that basically, just because you claim to be a christian, that you're supposed to have to be perfect perfect, you know.

Speaker 5: 1:34:31

I mean it's like, oh dude, yeah, yeah, yeah well, certainly uh wasn't as successful or as effective or um whatever other term you want to throw on it as a Christian as. I probably could have been, but because I always had that one thing holding me back from really you know, stepping in that thorn.

Speaker 2: 1:34:54

Yeah, yeah sure.

Speaker 5: 1:34:56

But you know, I mean, what can I? I just it was what it was.

Speaker 4: 1:35:01

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:35:02

Um came a point where um just had to remove myself from that and just really something had to change.

Speaker 4: 1:35:10

Not anymore, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:35:12

So that's where um, at that point, had been I don't know a couple more years.

Speaker 2: 1:35:16

What are you? 28, 29, 28, 29?, something like that. Yeah, okay.

Speaker 5: 1:35:21

And then I met Mary. Oh, really, yeah. So at this point we were all going to a different church. I wasn't going to Living Word anymore. I was going to a church called New Life Family Church, and a couple of the guys that were pastors there and the lead pastor there were people that I had kind of grown up with in church.

Speaker 2: 1:35:42

Oh, you knew them.

Speaker 5: 1:35:43

Yeah, okay, yeah, so they asked me to come down and you know.

Speaker 4: 1:35:47

Help us, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:35:49

And so, anyways, that's where I met Mary, yeah, and so I was still drinking a little bit then, but kind of casually, but once we started getting serious, I stopped.

Speaker 3: 1:36:00

I didn't really.

Speaker 5: 1:36:08

And.

Speaker 3: 1:36:09

I haven't really since then, and it's been almost 20 years.

Speaker 2: 1:36:10

Come on, bro. I mean in 20 years I may have.

Speaker 5: 1:36:11

I've had a handful of yeah, beers, single beer, you know what I mean. So I just and and I just really didn't care to anymore, just whatever the headaches, the next day suck yeah, I mean, I like to wake up and feel good bud yeah for

Speaker 3: 1:36:22

me.

Speaker 5: 1:36:23

I guess for me it wasn't so much that it was I just it just wasn't important to me anymore.

Speaker 3: 1:36:30

I just didn't really care.

Speaker 5: 1:36:31

I can't say that I had some big deliverance away from it, because for me, unless it tastes like piss. Yeah, yeah, and you know, for me, drinking and um smoking was really more of uh, I was never, I wouldn't, I wouldn't say I was ever addicted, because I never went out looking for it, I never did it by myself.

Speaker 2: 1:36:52

um, it was more like if when you were with the boys is what we were doing.

Speaker 5: 1:36:56

Yeah, okay if I didn't have access to it.

Speaker 2: 1:36:58

Whatever, whatever I mean, I would go months and months and months yeah for sure, amen um, yeah, you're very self like you said, self-aware, self-conscious you're, you're able to, from what I'm hearing in your testimony man in different places in your life, whether early, early high school very very able to catch himself.

Speaker 2: 1:37:21

And where am I right now? What am I doing? And that in itself, man is huge. I didn't have that, bro. I was two sheets to the wind. Ooh, that's good. So that's really kind of almost like a gift from God to help you, keep you from stepping into a lot of stuff that you could have stepped into.

Speaker 1: 1:37:42

Yeah sure, I didn't know what moderation was.

Speaker 2: 1:37:45

Yeah, nothing says excess like excess.

Speaker 5: 1:37:48

Moderation that's for the weak ones. For me, I think, because of my relationship with Christ. As I got older and still drinking, I never allowed myself to get drunk.

Speaker 4: 1:38:02

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:38:03

Um, I just, I just didn't want to. Man Um so yeah, even even while I was still in Texas, I never allowed. I was just trying to be around people. So I wasn't, you know, by myself, but I never like they would all get wasted, you know, but I wouldn't so I ended up you know driving everybody around a lot.

Speaker 4: 1:38:23

Oh, wow.

Speaker 3: 1:38:23

Wow.

Speaker 2: 1:38:24

Okay.

Speaker 1: 1:38:26

So tell us how you're married.

Speaker 4: 1:38:29

Tell us how this all went down.

Speaker 1: 1:38:31

How'd you meet your better half bud? She went into pretty good details about it.

Speaker 5: 1:38:34

Yeah, yeah, so she probably did a lot better job than I could. But, I'll tell you this the first time I met her and introduced myself to her, she was like ah, whatever, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:38:44

She had no interest in me whatsoever.

Speaker 5: 1:38:46

I had to work at it for a while, but um uh did you have a?

Speaker 2: 1:38:52

this is the girl I'm going to marry. Yes, Wow.

Speaker 4: 1:38:56

Yeah, wow.

Speaker 5: 1:39:02

I don't know why or what it was, but you just saw her and you just knew her. Yeah, I met her and then I actually knew her dad before I knew her. Oh wow, her dad kind of well, her dad kind of introduced me to her a little bit. But she was also new to the church and my bros were always every time a new girl came to the church they're trying to set you up.

Speaker 2: 1:39:20

Yeah, they were all trying to set me up.

Speaker 3: 1:39:21

a new girl came to the church. They're trying to set you up. Yeah, they were all trying to set me up. Yeah, that was interesting.

Speaker 2: 1:39:26

Where are you at, Come on.

Speaker 1: 1:39:29

Life Linkers.

Speaker 3: 1:39:32

Ain't anybody got a friend?

Speaker 1: 1:39:33

Please help me out. Amen, buddy.

Speaker 5: 1:39:41

Amen, dude. So anyways, I don't know. There's just something different about her and, uh, we're friends, we did date and you guys know that. You know, you know her, you heard the story. Um, I'm probably a lot more oblivious to a lot of this stuff than she was because, I'm just a dude right and um, but uh, we were friends for a long time and before we actually got married, but I mean, you know that's good.

Speaker 2: 1:40:06

She does a much better job. You weren't in no hurry to get married again because of what you just came out of, bro In fact, when she started talking, like hey, you know. Marriage, You're going to marry me. Commitment Damn she started.

Speaker 5: 1:40:17

I was like see ya.

Speaker 4: 1:40:20

I literally broke up with her.

Speaker 5: 1:40:21

Wow. I was like see ya, I literally broke up with her.

Speaker 2: 1:40:25

Wow, bro, because I was like I was still Trauma.

Speaker 3: 1:40:26

Response you hadn't healed.

Speaker 5: 1:40:27

I was like yo I'm out Right, not again. I'm not doing that again, and the poor girl standing there in my dust right, oh man, I mean I jet dude.

Speaker 2: 1:40:36

I was like I am out.

Speaker 3: 1:40:37

Wow, I am not doing that again.

Speaker 5: 1:40:39

Whoa, and so, anyways, we were friends for like three years, oh wow. Really and then we started dating again and I think I asked her to marry me like real quick.

Speaker 2: 1:40:48

Oh, so you were dating. The whole marriage thing came up. You dipped out Still friends, still friends.

Speaker 5: 1:40:54

But then it comes back around, and when you come back around, that's when you're like no, this is this is yeah, oh wow, Like why you know we had been friends, We'd seen the good and the ugly.

Speaker 1: 1:41:05

Most of my ugly that she got to see and she still wanted you.

Speaker 5: 1:41:11

Still dude, wow man yeah so.

Speaker 1: 1:41:13

That's pretty special.

Speaker 5: 1:41:15

I am blessed beyond anything I deserve. That is absolutely for sure.

Speaker 1: 1:41:20

When a girl sees all your junk and still wants you. Yeah, man, that's pretty special bro.

Speaker 5: 1:41:25

Yeah, I never. I'm the type of person I'm not going to hide who I am, yeah. So take it or leave it.

Speaker 2: 1:41:32

Yeah, man, it's got to be like that, yeah. And so she saw you know, because you know we were, we served in ministry together that you know we served in ministry together that whole time we were just friends, oh yeah, so there's a lot of times where we were just like always working together.

Speaker 4: 1:41:46

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:41:47

And so I'm the type of person and this kind of goes back to that knight in shining armor mentality is because we dated I always felt a responsibility to make sure that she was okay Come on now. And so the whole time we were friends I always kind of had an eye out. You know, she needed something.

Speaker 1: 1:42:05

I tried to be there, amen.

Speaker 5: 1:42:07

And I'm kind, of you know, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm just, I'm like that for for.

Speaker 2: 1:42:10

I just I'm like that, I don't know what it. I see that when you guys work together, oh yeah, I tell him dude I'm like man.

Speaker 5: 1:42:26

you're not going to believe what Sean did, bro. Yeah, so, yeah. So I asked her to marry me. She said yes amazingly, what are? You 30? Sounds about right. Wow, sounds about right. So you?

Speaker 2: 1:42:36

come into your Jesus, because he was 30 when his ministry became public and now you're 30.

Speaker 3: 1:42:41

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:42:41

You're getting married? Yeah, all right. Yep got married and I was actually ready to be married, and so we got married and then, like Were you a little more mature A little more.

Speaker 2: 1:42:53

Yeah, yeah bro. Oh, he'd been a cop Totally different. That don't mean nothing, bro.

Speaker 1: 1:43:00

Oh yeah, and they still like got no luck.

Speaker 5: 1:43:03

I was shut up, dude I you know, I just you know, it's all Christ.

Speaker 4: 1:43:11

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:43:13

He was really there, I had a whole different outlook. Yes, the experiences played a big role.

Speaker 2: 1:43:19

They mature you.

Speaker 5: 1:43:20

You know, christ changed me in some ways that I wasn't as afraid of things. I wasn't trying to run away from stuff, but I definitely those three years I had to get myself right.

Speaker 2: 1:43:32

All this time. So you're over in Texas, married officer, and then the divorce, and then you come home a couple years broken. I'm trying to find yourself marry. You meet her at the church, all this time voraciously reading are you reading?

Speaker 1: 1:43:52

yeah, really bro really yes.

Speaker 2: 1:43:55

Are you a nighttime reader or morning time?

Speaker 5: 1:43:57

uh, nighttime, for sure, yeah yeah, yeah, I was always working man, I didn't have time to read in the morning.

Speaker 4: 1:44:02

I'm working dude.

Speaker 5: 1:44:03

Okay, yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:44:04

So, and and this guy tries to get me to get up at five o'clock and read with him.

Speaker 2: 1:44:08

I love it. There's nothing.

Speaker 3: 1:44:10

So I like to sleep coffee and it's quiet and yeah that's great.

Speaker 5: 1:44:19

I'm not getting in the middle of that you're helping us bud.

Speaker 2: 1:44:25

I love you dude.

Speaker 1: 1:44:25

I'm glad he has a life, don't get me wrong.

Speaker 2: 1:44:29

I thank God for where I am. I was telling somebody man I'm literally living the best life that I've ever lived, right now.

Speaker 1: 1:44:35

I've literally had pastors tell me you need to tell that boy to get a job. I'm like what the hell are you talking about?

Speaker 2: 1:44:41

dude, worry about yourself, man, I'm I'm a I'm I'm very slow on the uptake on things um.

Speaker 5: 1:44:50

To some it may seem like I drag my feet a lot but I've. I've learned because of my propensity to try to come in and save the day on things.

Speaker 4: 1:45:02

Right.

Speaker 5: 1:45:03

Um I've, I've screwed myself every single time. And so I've learned to really slow down on stuff. And so and it drives my wife crazy because it takes me forever to make a decision because I'm like I have to know that God is saying yes this is.

Speaker 2: 1:45:21

This is the right the right thing, and so God is saying, yes, this is the right thing.

Speaker 4: 1:45:26

Come on.

Speaker 5: 1:45:28

And so, yeah, it takes me a while to do things sometimes because I'm just not going to do something until I know that this is the road that you know.

Speaker 1: 1:45:36

Well, me and his mom know that he's called to ministry.

Speaker 2: 1:45:38

Yeah, we know that Pastor Dave just said it. So why are? You gonna make somebody who's called for go get a job at a bar secular job yeah where it's not gonna be any good for what god has for him.

Speaker 2: 1:45:50

You know I'm telling you chone, anytime I've ever had it outside of the military, anytime I've ever had a job whether it was dairy queen or working at the queen creek cafe, or working at the mexican food restaurant, any of the retail shops that when I was in sales none of it ever worked. I got fired from them. All, all of them. I met bad people at. None of them were any good for me. It wasn't until I came here, bro, and I didn't even come here to start working. I came here just so that I'm getting you out of the house two days a week, dude, I'm dropping you off on Tuesdays.

Speaker 1: 1:46:22

I'm like you're going to church. He dropped me off at 7 am. He dropped me off on Thursdays. You ain't sitting here all day. You can go sit at the church.

Speaker 2: 1:46:28

But just doing that, just doing that showed me really what healthy looks like. Seeing all these guys how they talk and how they work together, I'm like, oh, oh man, it is possible to, to, to have a good place to to be a part of, and it made me like I want to be a part of that. I want to go back and help. Oh, you need a baptism set up, all right. Oh, you need snow All right, you need payment, whatever. Dude, it was where I am now and I saw this thing on social media where it was like, oh, you wanted to get into full-time ministry. I told you it was a picture of this cleaning cart.

Speaker 2: 1:47:07

It was like that's where you start bud Cleaning.

Speaker 3: 1:47:12

So it's just.

Speaker 2: 1:47:12

God's got me and his timing, it'll all go.

Speaker 4: 1:47:17

Yeah, we ain't talking about you man.

Speaker 1: 1:47:21

This is a challenge, interview bud, I'm just kidding.

Speaker 2: 1:47:22

I yeah, we ain't talking about you, man, this is a challenge interview, bud. Come on baby, I'm just kidding. You're good, bro, all right.

Speaker 3: 1:47:26

So where are we at?

Speaker 2: 1:47:27

We're with Mary a couple years to really get right. The alcohol no longer, you're good, the knuckleheads are no longer, you've got your bros, but you are ready at this time for a woman and giving a woman what she needs yeah, okay, yeah, best I could, oh yeah, yeah, with what you had and with what you knew right, because you only have and what you know, with what they gave to yeah, yeah, so um we get married and uh, right away, um I get this thing um through my friend jb, working for fema, uh contracting with fema and hurricane katrina hits down south

Speaker 4: 1:48:17

yeah yeah, 2004 yeah.

Speaker 3: 1:48:19

So right after we got married, I got employed out to uh oh you went mississippi.

Speaker 5: 1:48:25

Yeah, whoa yeah and um, I was down there in the rubble for about a month and then mary calls me one night and says, uh, I'm pregnant, and so it was like all right, homies, I'm out so I came back home and uh, kind of, we kind of had, just because we just got married, we're only married for I don't know she probably told you guys, yeah, um, for just a short amount of time, and then I got deployed yeah and then came back and it was like we kind of started over again, which was kind of weird yeah um, yeah, so yeah, and then right, you know, and, and then she was pregnant with Maria, and so then the adventure really started.

Speaker 4: 1:49:06

Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:49:07

So that was a lot of healing for me through having kids, yeah Because it was like Maria being born for me and I've kind of told her this before but her being born for me. The first time I held her it was like I felt like and I know everybody says this with their kids but like when I looked at her and held her for the first time. It was like I felt so much love that I'd never felt before man. It was it was a trip.

Speaker 2: 1:49:43

I never like, I don't even know how to describe it. And uh, do you think that that's kind of how god feels about us? I'm sure what you felt right there in that moment, yeah absolutely, absolutely.

Speaker 5: 1:49:51

But I remember like, like all of the hurt that I had in the past and that sort of thing um went away yeah, like that, just In that moment, holding your girl, the word says love covers a multitude of sins, and I know that that is specifically talking about Christ's love and it's talking through the lens of what the work done on the cross, but I also believe that that also applies to our love that we experience.

Speaker 2: 1:50:20

Our teachers, our mess ups, it doesn't necessarily fix those things.

Speaker 5: 1:50:25

We gotta work through those things and fix those things.

Speaker 1: 1:50:27

But that certainly and holding her in my arms for the first time was pretty amazing, and I'll never forget that moment, just holding her in her little lip yeah, it was a trip man I'd never, felt that way before and so it's that feeling of this is the one person I would die for oh yeah, you know I mean as much as we love our wives, it's not the same as seeing that first kid and being like I will protect you, I will kill for you, I will oh yeah absolutely. Yeah, you touch this one and I will do do violent things. We don't want to bring that guy, but it's true, that's that's in that, in that moment, you're literally like it's a piece of you brother.

Speaker 1: 1:51:11

Yeah, there's nothing like seeing a piece of you.

Speaker 5: 1:51:12

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 1:51:13

It's. There's something different that there's a, because this is mine. I made this. You know what I mean. It's special bro.

Speaker 5: 1:51:22

Yeah, absolutely yeah, yeah, yeah. So she was my pride and joy.

Speaker 4: 1:51:28

Yeah, man.

Speaker 5: 1:51:29

And I loved sitting with her on the couch and just holding her. Yeah, and playing with her, yeah, and I really miss those days because now she's 18.

Speaker 2: 1:51:38

Wants nothing to do with that. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:51:42

Now she's 18 and she won't let me hug her anymore, so I still got pictures of me.

Speaker 5: 1:51:46

We have really great conversations.

Speaker 1: 1:51:47

Yeah, I got pictures of me and my youngest boy, when he was my first born, and asleep on the recliner, with him laying on me. We're both sleeping together and it's like those moments right there, bro, were just I don't know For me, like you said they were, they were just special moments that I never thought I would get to have, but there they were, you know, I mean it's, it's very special, bro.

Speaker 5: 1:52:09

Yeah, yeah, it is absolutely yeah, but one one thing that I saw, um when she was little was because of the way my dad acted towards me when I was little. Like he loved me, he was always throwing me around and wrestling with me and just you know like to me, my dad always loved me and was just a big ball of you know, just a big teddy bear towards me all the time. You know he would love me and wrestle me and punch some dude out in the corner.

Speaker 4: 1:52:45

You know, and then come back and love and hug me, you know it was just weird like that.

Speaker 5: 1:52:49

And so, um, so it came real easy for me to be like that with my kids.

Speaker 4: 1:52:57

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 1:52:57

I like like that was a big fear of mine growing up because I was the only child. I was never really around kids, you know, I just had no experience Like babies and toddlers and young ones was like.

Speaker 3: 1:53:10

I was going the other direction, right.

Speaker 5: 1:53:12

All my friends were having kids and I was like, yeah, that's great for you. But once we started having kids, just that experience with my dad really really just came out come on you know and towards my kids come on, man, so it's like man, it's it's. It's taught me how important it is yeah you know, because I know how I'm treating my kids.

Speaker 5: 1:53:31

They're gonna treat their kids, and that's always been something that I, you know, I I always, you know, think about when I'm with them. Amen, you know, because my dad, like I, never felt unloved around my dad, that's for sure. I knew he was pretty pissed at me sometimes, um, but he always loved me, you know. So so I I'm I I'm not perfect with my kids, obviously, you know. But but, uh, I hope that my kids know, like, to them. They know that I love them.

Speaker 5: 1:54:01

There's no question, and I'm sure they do. Amen. I've always had a pretty good relationship with my kids my son's 17 and my daughter's 18. Nice.

Speaker 2: 1:54:11

You tell them often I love you. I'm proud of you.

Speaker 1: 1:54:13

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:54:14

That's the whole key man. You know, it's just those words of affirmation, bro, and letting those get, because our words, as much as they tear down and destroy and can hurt, yeah, they also build up and encourage.

Speaker 2: 1:54:26

And that speaking those words of affirmation over the young ones, man, just does something for me I couldn't tell you how long I just lived for just to hear my father robert, I'm proud of you. It didn't happen till I was after mil, after way later. So it just telling your kids I'm proud of you. And it didn't happen until I was after way later. So it's just telling your kids I'm proud of you and I love you, and it's just good.

Speaker 1: 1:54:48

You know what's crazy is? I'm 52, right, and I just recently had a conversation with my father and he was like Eddie, you know I'm proud of you, man. Oh yeah, I was like, thanks, dad, that really means a lot. You know what I mean. And he said you had me worried there for a little bit.

Speaker 4: 1:55:08

That's all of us you went off the rails.

Speaker 2: 1:55:09

I said I'm sure I did.

Speaker 1: 1:55:11

I gave you lots of reasons to be concerned. You know what I mean. And remember I've never seen my dad step into a church, but my dad told me. He said I'm sure glad the Lord got you.

Speaker 3: 1:55:21

And I was like dang dude.

Speaker 1: 1:55:22

You know what I mean. So even at 52, still hearing that from my dad still touched my heart. It's still one of those words that I longed to hear, because I was always such a screw-up. You know what.

Speaker 4: 1:55:32

I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:55:33

And even at 52, I went home and told my family dude, you ain't going to believe what my dad said today you know what I mean of the day I mean. So that's a lot I saw this video the other day. It said do not, because it's talking about being careful with your words. And it said because in the moment, you don't want to be the voice of criticism in your child's head when they're doing something, all they hear is your voice saying something critical, you know I mean.

Speaker 1: 1:55:57

It's talking about being that voice of encouragement in their head versus the critical voice in their head. So what we say to our kids is going to resound. You know what I mean. So if we're saying critical things in a moment, they're going to hear your voice in their head. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2: 1:56:12

Criticizing.

Speaker 1: 1:56:13

Yeah dude. So it's so important man.

Speaker 5: 1:56:15

Yeah, for sure I know that's something I struggle with with my kids is I don't feel like I criticize them. I'm sure they take it as me criticizing them, but I do try to maybe a little bit of tough love. I've never told them you know you're dumb or you're an idiot or anything. Joking around when they're joking around back.

Speaker 2: 1:56:43

That's a little bit different, but I could see you challenging them. I definitely challenge them. Figure it out.

Speaker 5: 1:56:52

I definitely you know that part you know. And then just from past experience you know, working in the trades, working for the city, you know it's a harsh world, right, yeah. And so that side of me comes out a little bit, and so my daughter's kind of sensitive, and so it's man, it's, it's, it's, I'm. Oh, he has that one I times have I had to go back to the bedroom. My wife goes, you know you really should go apologize. And then I got to suck up my pride for 15, 20 minutes and then, I go stomping back down all the way to the bedroom.

Speaker 5: 1:57:30

Hey baby, I'm sorry.

Speaker 2: 1:57:30

I came across.

Speaker 5: 1:57:32

That's that's that wasn't my intent, yeah.

Speaker 2: 1:57:35

Those girls are special man.

Speaker 5: 1:57:38

It kills me it kills me when I feel like I've hurt my daughter's feelings, you know because it's just like I got to go in the other room and, you know, swallow my pride a little bit because you know I don't feel like I necessarily said the wrong thing, but I just didn't say it the right way. And I came across kind of tough With my son. I can come across a little bit tougher with him, my daughter. It's just, it's different. Yeah, it's different.

Speaker 1: 1:58:08

Them girls bud, my daughter's only a few years older than yours and I run into the same problems, bro.

Speaker 4: 1:58:13

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:58:15

I try to say things, honest things, not in a critical way, but they come across as being critical. And I get these texts from my wife. You know you really hurt her and I'm like what did? I say you know what I mean. And same thing I got to go back and maybe go. I didn't mean it that way. You know what I mean.

Speaker 3: 1:58:34

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 1:58:34

Yeah, it's fun, it's fun.

Speaker 5: 1:58:36

Yeah, I'm getting pretty good at eating humble pie. Oh yeah, Well, kudos to you for apologizing bro because that's huge

Speaker 2: 1:58:43

man, it's really good.

Speaker 1: 1:58:45

Because I told this before. But, like with my son, I used to be a screamer, a yeller you know what I mean Thrower, and I'd have to go back and eat humble pie and I'd go back and tell him hey, I apologize, I shouldn't have acted that way. I was, you know. This is the situation. They explained to him like well, you know why I did that. But in return he turned into a little bit of a screamer and when he would yell at me and then five minutes later he'd come back around hey dad, I'm sorry, man, I shouldn't have yelled at you, you know. So being the person who apologizes has led to my children understanding that it's okay to come back yeah apologize, acknowledge that you were in the wrong, and now they do that now.

Speaker 2: 1:59:25

So kudos to you for that, bro, because you're teaching your kids, setting the example, bud, you know what I mean Trying trying.

Speaker 1: 1:59:31

And I think as parents. I don't ever remember my dad ever apologizing for anything. You know what I mean. I'm serious bro.

Speaker 2: 1:59:39

I don't ever remember my dad coming back.

Speaker 1: 1:59:40

Your dad ever apologized to you boy and saying hey, I didn't mean to snap your skateboard and smash your stereo, you know, but you were in the room, it was just. That's the way.

Speaker 4: 1:59:49

Yeah, take it or leave it you know what I mean, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 1:59:52

And so having that thing with my kids now, where I learned how to apologize and now I get it in return, it's a beautiful thing, because now they're learning how to talk and communicate. It's okay to make a mistake if you come back and apologize. It's not okay to make a mistake and not say nothing at all. You know what I mean.

Speaker 5: 2:00:08

So kudos to you for that brother. That's really good.

Speaker 1: 2:00:11

Yeah, yeah. What did you do for work after you got married?

Speaker 4: 2:00:14

Were you still doing the FEMA thing, my father-in-law.

Speaker 5: 2:00:19

He recruited me. No, I wasn't doing the FEMA thing anymore, because it's pretty crazy. You're walking into a disaster zone.

Speaker 2: 2:00:28

Yeah, rich does that. It's crazy man.

Speaker 3: 2:00:35

Well, he works with Red Cross. What?

Speaker 5: 2:00:36

he does is a little bit different than what I did. I was actually going out into the field. No, I wasn't clean up I was actually going out into the field. No, I wasn't clean up. What I was doing was going into the areas that had been destroyed.

Speaker 4: 2:00:49

Are you looking for?

Speaker 5: 2:00:50

survivors.

Speaker 2: 2:00:51

No, no, no.

Speaker 5: 2:00:52

Assessing the properties and so, but a lot of those areas, especially in Mississippi, wasn't always the best places. And so there was a lot of gang activity.

Speaker 2: 2:01:08

And so it was just it was crazy, and so you know, I just never went.

Speaker 5: 2:01:12

It was good pay, but it just it was pretty nuts because you're by yourself and a lot of risk, and I'm sure not everywhere was like that. It just I don't know, for some reason, everything. I do is always, yeah, so intense yeah so so I just never really did it again. Um plus, we had kids and I didn't want to be gone for that because a lot of times.

Speaker 2: 2:01:35

I mean you were gone for a month minimum um yeah, that's a lot with the pregnant white kid and right, right so so my father-in-law recruited me into um selling insurance.

Speaker 5: 2:01:49

Oh nice, and so I did that um 14 years, something like that yeah, so I didn't like it I didn't because, it was.

Speaker 2: 2:01:58

yeah, no, didn't sound like you were brother. No, I didn't. You're actually working with hands. Yeah, do stuff.

Speaker 5: 2:02:03

But it I mean it paid the bills.

Speaker 1: 2:02:06

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:02:06

I'm still reaping the rewards for it, so I'm not complaining yeah. A lot of the skills in working with people and managing crazy situations and stress. I think crazy situations and stress, I think um and learning how to work really hard towards one direction and then having to pivot to something else um has helped me to be very successful in the ministry in full time vocational ministry. And so I wouldn't go back and change it for for anything.

Speaker 2: 2:02:40

Yeah, that's good Cause we did that log going full anything. Yeah, that's good Cause we did that a lot going full bore. Okay, let's go.

Speaker 3: 2:02:46

So yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:02:49

So I sold insurance for a long time. Wow Did Medicare. Yeah, working with senior citizens.

Speaker 2: 2:02:56

All through your thirties, all up into your forties.

Speaker 5: 2:02:58

Health insurance yeah, yeah, sure, really Medicare all up in your 40s, health insurance yeah, really medicare.

Speaker 1: 2:03:02

yeah, wow, care insurance so I I like usually, when someone says they sell insurance, you think car insurance and stuff right, right, no, no so this would have been medicare, so health insurance yeah through medicare wow did a little bit of life insurance yeah, yeah, were you guys still going to the same church, the family church? Yeah, for a couple of years but, then we started coming here so how'd you guys find lifelink?

Speaker 5: 2:03:22

um my friend tony that I lived with for a couple of years but then we started coming here. How did you guys find LifeLink my friend Tony, that I lived with for a while?

Speaker 1: 2:03:27

he started coming here, and he was the one that told us about it.

Speaker 5: 2:03:30

That's a tall guy. I don't think you ever met him.

Speaker 1: 2:03:33

You never met him Because there was a guy named Tony that was here when I first started coming, him and his wife.

Speaker 3: 2:03:39

I can't remember what his wife's name is 2013.

Speaker 1: 2:03:42

Bl wife's name is 2013.

Speaker 5: 2:03:44

Blonde-haired wife nope, no, no, no, all right yeah no, that was before you guys yeah he didn't come here for very long. I think god had him here to get me here that was still at the cta, the cta wow cta wow okay, that's south yeah wow, so you went to the cafe gemitorium.

Speaker 2: 2:04:03

Yeah, I've been here for a while, wow.

Speaker 1: 2:04:04

Where were you and Mary living when you guys got married? Is Chandler still Gilbert Gilbert, really yeah.

Speaker 4: 2:04:09

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 2:04:10

Like south Gilbert, north Gilbert, geographically.

Speaker 5: 2:04:16

That time we were off of power and so you guys were out there by CTA area actually you know what we were in Gilbert, but at that point we were living off of Ray and Gilbert yeah, because CTA is like what over by Perry right yes, yeah, yeah, a little bit of drive, but it was. We loved the church. Yeah, what?

Speaker 1: 2:04:39

did you guys like about it when you first came?

Speaker 2: 2:04:40

yeah, how did you find?

Speaker 3: 2:04:43

it oh.

Speaker 5: 2:04:43

Tony, yeah, what was it?

Speaker 1: 2:04:45

about it that kept you coming back because you had been the new family.

Speaker 2: 2:04:49

You've been the living word, bible. You've been, you've been a different one.

Speaker 5: 2:04:52

Yeah, so, um, um, I think it so. The whole time I was going to living word and going to new life, um, I was very involved, yeah, and uh, when we switched over to um here, uh, I wasn't involved in anything, so I actually had what made you leave the other church?

Speaker 1: 2:05:24

Um, if you want to get into that, I other church. If you want to get into that, I don't know if you want to get into that or not.

Speaker 5: 2:05:32

I'm sorry Joan. I'm sorry buddy.

Speaker 2: 2:05:35

I just want to honor the pastor yeah, that's good, that's really good.

Speaker 5: 2:05:39

It just wasn't working for us anymore, I'm sorry. No, that's all good, it just wasn't working for us anymore Amen.

Speaker 1: 2:05:43

I'm sorry, I made a mistake.

Speaker 5: 2:05:44

No, that's all good. It just wasn't working, yeah, and so I needed to.

Speaker 2: 2:05:49

A bigger pot Time to you. Outgrew it On to the next thing. Just needed something new. I didn't need to outgrow anything.

Speaker 5: 2:05:55

I think I had room to grow there. It just wasn't the place for us anymore. They needed to grow in some areas and we needed to go somewhere where I had a young family.

Speaker 2: 2:06:07

Well, that place was with your friends.

Speaker 5: 2:06:10

Yes, you know what I'm saying.

Speaker 2: 2:06:12

That's different when you're under leadership of your bro dude.

Speaker 3: 2:06:15

Right.

Speaker 2: 2:06:16

So it's like okay, let's go find our thing for our family.

Speaker 5: 2:06:19

Yeah, pretty much.

Speaker 1: 2:06:23

So back to the original question. What was it about LifeLink that kind of made you want to stay around?

Speaker 5: 2:06:28

It was the. It wasn't so much that there was something special about LifeLink. It was that I could go to LifeLink and just worship Amen, because I wasn't in charge of safety, I wasn't in the usher and part-time sound guy.

Speaker 2: 2:06:51

Everything he's doing now. I love you, bro. It's the same thing.

Speaker 1: 2:06:56

Oh, that didn't last very long. But, I could just come and worship.

Speaker 4: 2:07:00

You could just come and worship.

Speaker 1: 2:07:01

Yeah, I'm not going to worship. I miss that sometimes.

Speaker 5: 2:07:12

Here's the reality of it. There's too much that needs to be done. We can't just sit and watch. I think you're losing if you're just sitting and watching.

Speaker 2: 2:07:22

Personally, you're missing. You don't get out of it what you can when you give yourself to it.

Speaker 1: 2:07:29

Oh yeah, the best thing I ever did was get out of my pew and start serving man, that was the best thing I ever did.

Speaker 5: 2:07:34

Absolutely.

Speaker 1: 2:07:34

Because then I knew what community was, I knew what serving was. Absolutely it's easy to come and show up on a Sunday morning and get your little church on and go back home and not have no connection.

Speaker 5: 2:07:43

Absolutely, that's easy to get and having that connection when we lost Aaliyah, having that connection is what saved our lives through that. If it hadn't been for that, I don't know. I don't know anybody at this church or any of my old friends that walked through the same thing and stayed married Wow. So I'm sure there's lots of people or any of my old friends that walked through the same thing and stayed married. Wow, so Wow. And I'm sure there's lots of people out there that went through that same thing and did stay married.

Speaker 5: 2:08:07

But I'm just saying of those that I know none of them are married today Amen. Amen. So serving is good because it helps the church. It's good because it sows into other people's lives, but it also creates bonds and community and community.

Speaker 1: 2:08:24

Well, for me, it became my church yeah, oh yeah, absolutely, when I got out of my seat and started serving, it became my church, and not just in the sense of this is my, it's my church, you know, I mean, and when I was coming, just on sundays it was, yeah, I called it my church, but it didn't really feel like my church, you know. I mean, it was just a place I went to worship, but when I started serving it was like my church and these are my people.

Speaker 1: 2:08:46

I began to take ownership of the church itself, you know, I mean the people in the, in the community and all that. And it was huge, bro. It was a game changer man. Yeah, yeah, absolutely if anybody's listening. You're just in a seat.

Speaker 5: 2:08:58

Man, get out and serve man yeah, you're missing out on so much fun, so much um growth to, to be able to be part of someone else's life change.

Speaker 2: 2:09:10

Come on, buddy is amazing.

Speaker 5: 2:09:12

It makes I know, I know the excuse right it's hey, you're, I work all week, yeah, and then, and then you're asking me to come in on Sunday and volunteer all day long on Sunday, so I only get one day off.

Speaker 2: 2:09:27

Come and talk to my dad man.

Speaker 1: 2:09:29

I only get one day off.

Speaker 5: 2:09:30

That's like the excuse that people have.

Speaker 1: 2:09:32

I work six days a week and serve one, three and five buddy. You know what I mean.

Speaker 5: 2:09:38

But getting to be part of someone else's life change. People come in completely broken and watch them walk through reconciliation and sanctification and reunification, sometimes with their families and those that is to be part of that is like worth it, oh yeah, like you won't even feel the busyness anymore.

Speaker 3: 2:10:06

Well, maybe you will a little bit but you'll just have a different perspective on it.

Speaker 5: 2:10:10

I'm working more now than I have in a long time, and even on hard days I never come home feeling never come home feeling um I should say I, I work here at um at church um full time, um and uh. I love it. We work a lot of hours, we work hard, right and um but I love it every day I go home I feel energized I feel um I just so fulfilled Even on. You know, there's been many 12-hour days, 14-hour days, 16-hour days.

Speaker 4: 2:10:49

There's all kinds of those to be had, oh yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:10:52

And I never come home at the end of the night going. I just man. This is this job sucks.

Speaker 3: 2:10:57

Yeah, I never feel that way.

Speaker 5: 2:10:59

I'm always super excited about getting to go back and do it some more because of how much life changed and also you know just the church has sowed into my life. You know, especially walking through the loss of my dad and then walking through the loss of Aaliyah. The church was there for all of that.

Speaker 4: 2:11:20

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:11:21

You know, and being part of sowing into the church or partnering with the church.

Speaker 4: 2:11:29

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:11:30

And you know the church was able to partner with me. Come on Through those times Better than if I was just showing up checking the box going home. Yeah, I know LifeLink, and even if that was the case, they would be here. Yeah, they would have been there for us through that but it would not have been the same if I hadn't connected with everybody by not just going to church but also serving those same people in my time of need they're able to come serve us, because you know we had that relationship.

Speaker 1: 2:12:00

Yeah, so that would have not happened I've seen it time and time again at this church, brother, where people were in a situation and the church rallied around them and did things and made that situation just a little easier for them. And yeah, I don't think you get that, just showing up on sundays and not making connections for sure, I mean so it's really important that we Relationships.

Speaker 1: 2:12:22

You know yeah, I know I was a person who would come in just as worship was starting. Sometimes they're like you know, okay, we're out of here, I'm out the door. You know what I mean and I did that for God. Probably the first 10, 15 years of my Christian walk Didn't understand why I felt so alone. You know what I mean Until. I started serving you know what I mean. And then I realized wow, there's people actually here. You know what?

Speaker 5: 2:12:44

I mean.

Speaker 1: 2:12:45

It was pretty cool bro.

Speaker 5: 2:12:46

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 2:12:48

So you guys go to CTA, you start going to LifeLink there. You have your son at LifeLink there, yes, or?

Speaker 5: 2:12:56

is he already born? No, he was already born, but I think he was only a few months old by the time, because he was still in diapers, barely crawling. Yeah, I don't even think he was crawling yet. So lifelink is all he knows that's crazy.

Speaker 2: 2:13:10

Yeah, same same with maria. Lifelink is all she knows. Really amazing, a real son of the house oh for sure, absolutely.

Speaker 1: 2:13:16

How long were you there before you started like jumping in?

Speaker 2: 2:13:21

you said you liked going because you could just come worship how long that lasted a couple months they're really good bud about getting them in, getting them in a couple months um and then, uh, what'd you start doing?

Speaker 1: 2:13:36

what was the first safety team? They?

Speaker 5: 2:13:37

didn't have a safety team at that point, amen, and they just needed and it wasn't a safety team at that point. Amen, and they just needed. And it wasn't a safety team then either. Basically they just needed someone because there was a like a back hallway area that had like computers and everybody's stuff and they just wanted someone who would kind of watch that area, and so that's where I started, amen.

Speaker 2: 2:13:56

That was back there yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:13:58

And then the safety team was really born out of that All right Wow. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:14:02

So I pretty much was I've done safety teams since I've been here You're the.

Speaker 1: 2:14:06

OG. I took a short break.

Speaker 5: 2:14:07

Wow, I took a short break. Let's see. I think after Aaliyah passed away, I started feeling like God was calling me away from that for a little bit, and that's when Nate stepped in, which was great for the safety team. The safety team needed him, and I think it kind of helped him get into men's ministry too a little bit. So it was God was working on a lot of good things there. But then eventually I came back to the safety team just a couple years ago.

Speaker 2: 2:14:36

Time to start serving again.

Speaker 5: 2:14:38

Oh, I was during that, so while I stepped off the safety team, you were still serving we became elders. Yeah and uh. What else was I doing um elders? And then we were also the coaches over the prayer team yeah and um, I started in theos. I was going back to theos yeah so I don't know if I would have done that, because at that point I was kind of. You know, I like to do my one or two things and then just leave me alone.

Speaker 5: 2:15:07

Yeah, you know um, but um, I just really felt compelled to get back on the safety team amen.

Speaker 2: 2:15:15

So you have talked about it a couple times, man. Um, do you want to get into alia?

Speaker 2: 2:15:22

yeah, absolutely yeah, I, I was actually when I was driving in today, man, I was praying and, um, I just felt god's saying I'm really gonna use this today. Um, I feel like, like you will, like you're saying, man, there's people out there that have been through this and it destroyed them, yeah, it ruins them. Um, there's women who go through it, man, and it just just it kills who they are. It's just women and just um. So you, we heard your wife's um, and now we we get to hear yours, man, um, and from the man's side, and yeah, yeah, totally different.

Speaker 5: 2:16:06

Take on it from her um yeah but I can't tell that story without backing up a little bit and talking about my dad okay because my dad so kind of. What led up to that was um, my dad got cancer and then passed away like within a couple months I'm not gonna say he got cancer and then passed away in a couple months because he had it, he just didn't know he was an alcoholic, yeah, and so you don't go to doctors right getting checkups.

Speaker 5: 2:16:36

So basically, the way what kind of happened was my dad. I had helped my dad pull a battery out of his truck and because it was just too heavy for him he couldn't get it out, so I replaced it for him. But the next day he started complaining about having a pain in his back and we just thought he had pulled a muscle, wasn't going away. So I was like, dad, you have Medicare, go to the stinking doctor.

Speaker 2: 2:17:01

It's not going to cost you anything.

Speaker 5: 2:17:01

He's like Dad, you have Medicare, Go to the stinking doctor, it's not going to cost you anything, yeah. So he went and the doc was like, hey, you haven't been to the doc in you know, 50 years.

Speaker 5: 2:17:09

however, yeah, let's just do a full run-up on you. And so they did a blood test and it came back. His white blood cells were. There was a lot of markers there that you know were indicating that something was going on, yeah, and so, um, the doc pretty much knew you. You know right away that he probably had some cancer going on somewhere. So they did tests.

Speaker 5: 2:17:31

He was getting worse and weaker, like like I mean so I think it was like august, the middle of august, when he started having back pains, passed away in September like 23rd man.

Speaker 4: 2:17:44

Or 24th or something like that. Wow, so it happened fast, yeah, wow.

Speaker 5: 2:17:48

But during that time it was just. It was like a shock and awe kind of thing. Yeah, you know, because like all of a sudden I'm calling my uncles, you know, my theos and everybody, all the family, like hey dad has cancer. You know, we're just kind of figuring things out Two like two weeks later.

Speaker 2: 2:18:08

Hey he's going. I'm calling him like, hey, you need to get here and come and see him.

Speaker 5: 2:18:11

You need to get here and they're all like whoa, wait a minute, what? Yeah, like they couldn't you know this ain't going in the right direction, wow. And so they all came down, so, um. So, anyways, we went through that and, um, at right before my dad passed away, we found out mary was pregnant yeah and so we kind of had this feeling, like you know, there's there's kind of a light at the end of the tunnel, like my feeling was one life is going out, but another life is coming in and that's kind of I kept telling mary that I'm like you know, you know this, this miracle is going to happen, even in the midst of this pain and uh.

Speaker 5: 2:18:56

So you know, I got to spend a couple more weeks with my dad and um thank god, he was saved.

Speaker 2: 2:19:03

Like you were saying, bro, god was in it. All I got to and you know.

Speaker 5: 2:19:08

You know, pastor dave was so awesome through this and I remember he sat me down and was like um, talk to your dad, tell him how much you love him, tell him you know what he's taught you, what you've learned from him through life, because you're not going to get to do this right, hey, dude man. Wow, I need to do that you know the you know, so I taught.

Speaker 5: 2:19:35

I spent a lot of time talking with my dad and praying with him and you know, telling him how much I loved him and, uh, you know, just really saying goodbye and um, the last day before he, you know, just there is a certain point where he just wasn't there anymore you know, and that that last day before then, you know, we just looked at each other and just told each other I love you. You know he'd tell me, I love you back. You know I would just tell him I love you.

Speaker 5: 2:20:06

And we just did that back and forth Cause, you know it's funny. It was like, you know, at the end of all things, that was the only thing that mattered between us, you know, and so we just shared with each other. I love you, man. Wow, I love you too, mijo. Yeah, right, so you know, and that it's crazy, you know, all these things we strive for in life, and all of that.

Speaker 2: 2:20:31

It all comes back down to it, and at the very end.

Speaker 5: 2:20:33

That was the only thing that mattered between us was I love you, yeah, you know. And so we shared that time and I just kind of told him you know, like you know, I'm so grateful to you and how much you loved me and you never treated me bad and all the things you taught me, and I just kind of told him about that.

Speaker 2: 2:20:53

You took what Pastor Dave said and you went and did it.

Speaker 5: 2:20:56

Absolutely, and it wasn't easy for me, it was weird.

Speaker 2: 2:20:59

I'm sure it's not easy to open up like that it's different because we're in recovery, we have these tools and we've gone a lot, yeah, but for a father and son, but it's not, it's different yeah, so it was.

Speaker 5: 2:21:12

But, man, I, I cherish those last couple days, as painful as they were. Yeah, um, if, if you have a relationship that you can go out and talk to your parents and, man, tell them how much you love them and appreciate them, and even if you had, you know, some hard times or, you know, relationship wasn't always there, you know where you can connect with them. I would encourage it. Connect with them because my dad passed away and I have no regrets.

Speaker 2: 2:21:45

I have no I wish I could have, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:21:50

There was none of that man, we, we, we laid it all out there to each other. You know cause? I was the only child, yeah, Right, Right. And so I've never outside of you know, being married to my wife and my kids being born. I love for my kids, but a time I spent from I've never experienced Love like that that feeling of it's weird to say intimacy with your dad. Yeah, because it holds different connotations.

Speaker 4: 2:22:23

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:22:24

But the intimacy I had right there with my dad was like so deep. Yeah, I mean, I tell you literally nothing else in the world mattered that last day except for how much we loved each other, yeah, and like Dang dude, oh bro, we loved each other.

Speaker 2: 2:22:48

And like dang dude, oh bro, I just well, you know, I've taken the weekend. I'm going out to be with my father man and I'm. It's not by accident, bud, that this is all happening. Dude, I'm gonna have one of these with mine this weekend, dude when you told me that I was so happy.

Speaker 5: 2:23:06

Yeah, yeah, that's always. My message to two guys is if you have a relationship with your dad and you can. I know that not everybody can.

Speaker 2: 2:23:22

I mean, it is what it is you know, but if you have a relationship with your dad and you can.

Speaker 5: 2:23:26

I know that not everybody can. I mean, it is what it is, but if you can, If you can go to your dad and tell him how much you love him For what you can.

Speaker 2: 2:23:32

Maybe there's rocky times. Well, not every single moment was, I don't know.

Speaker 5: 2:23:37

I don't know. I'm very lucky to have had the closeness with my dad that I did, and so you know just that was. It was hard and it hurt a lot Because like he was there one day and then he wasn't.

Speaker 3: 2:23:59

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:24:04

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So you know, you go through the whole thing. Uh, something's going on with the vehicle or something like that you go to call.

Speaker 1: 2:24:11

Oh wait, he's not here anymore. There's, there's that whole.

Speaker 5: 2:24:13

Thing so, anyways, we're walking through that process and that pain and you know, mary told you guys she was very close with my dad yeah um and, and they talked all the time and they joked with each other all the time.

Speaker 4: 2:24:25

I mean he was her dad right, yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:24:29

So she had to walk through a lot also. Wow, and so you know, knowing that Aaliyah was coming was like a huge light at the end of the tunnel yeah right so. So we had that the whole time to look forward to, and uh, there's kind of a little bit of hope in the grieving, yeah, yeah I mean, you have this, this new life coming in one, one life out one life in Kind of the cycle of how you know, it's just the way it goes right.

Speaker 5: 2:25:07

And so that just kind of brought some peace to the whole thing to know that pretty soon I was going to have you know another little girl holding in my arms and I was just you know, really looking to that moment, to that moment, and so dad passes away, just really like it happened. So suddenly dealing with all of his affairs, did like the family get to come and see him. Oh yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:25:36

Yeah.

Speaker 3: 2:25:37

Okay, so everybody's able to come, okay, we had a huge celebration for him.

Speaker 5: 2:25:40

It was awesome. And there is no part aside from the pain of him passing away, everybody's able to come. Okay, we had a huge celebration for him. It was awesome. Man, there is no part aside from the pain of him passing away. Um, there is no part of that process that wasn't like filled with the spirit all my family's saved now so, you know, um, even like my mom man, she was amazing during this time.

Speaker 5: 2:26:01

So, and we didn't talk about this, but once um, mary and I got married, my parents split up, split up again, yeah, and so my mom moved to oregon. Eventually, my dad moved back from minnesota back down here, and so when my dad got, when he had cancer and was like coming towards the end, I was like, okay, I'm the only child, so I got to take care of my dad while he's going through this. Yeah, and my mom was amazing, um, she came back, moved back here to take care of him. She's like you got two children, you know, because at this time my kids were, you know, my daughter was in kindergarten or first grade.

Speaker 2: 2:26:43

Isaiah's in preschool or something. Yeah, right, exactly.

Speaker 5: 2:26:46

And my mom was just like, and so she came back and took care of my dad.

Speaker 2: 2:26:50

And my mom even she took care of the dad, or she took care of the kids so you could take care of dad. No, no, no no, no, no.

Speaker 5: 2:26:55

She came back and took care of my dad.

Speaker 2: 2:26:57

Oh my God, bro Whoa.

Speaker 5: 2:26:58

They oh my God bro, and so you know they had kind of a rough go of it towards the end.

Speaker 2: 2:27:05

But you know your dad, the love your dad. I never met the man, bro, but just from what you've said and the fact that you shared that, the love that your dad had and exuded it touched people For her to come back down and take care of him it would have been one thing for her to come and take care of the kids so you could take care of him, but for her to that love.

Speaker 1: 2:27:32

It seemed like, in spite of all their problems, she still loved him. Yeah, oh, absolutely, absolutely yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:27:37

And my mom was the love of my dad's life.

Speaker 4: 2:27:39

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:27:39

There's no question about that.

Speaker 4: 2:27:41

Yeah, there's no question about that.

Speaker 5: 2:27:42

Yeah, even though they had split up and got back together and split up.

Speaker 4: 2:27:44

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:27:45

Some things happened in between the way. Yeah, my dad always loved my mom, yeah, you know. So when she came back, you know, that was again another example to me of what love can do. Yeah, if you can get out of your own way, you know, my mom came back, she gave up her entire life, wow, and moved out here, because we at the time we didn't know what the you know, it could have been a six-month process it could have been a three-year process, whatever it was it just ended up being like a three-month process yeah um, uh so, or a two-month process, whatever, but she dropped her whole life to come down and take care of him, you know.

Speaker 5: 2:28:26

so I know I've been talking about my dad a lot uh but my mom is amazing and I've you know to do. That was pretty amazing. You know they weren't married, she didn't have she didn't have to come down here, she had her own life and for her to do that was absolutely amazing. To take care of my dad through that that's special. I don't even think they had really talked much.

Speaker 3: 2:28:49

Wow.

Speaker 5: 2:28:50

So for her just to drop everything and come down here and do that was Wow.

Speaker 2: 2:28:54

This is the second time in your story where I've heard of your parents doing something that was very special. Yeah, them coming together for you and them coming together for him.

Speaker 5: 2:29:05

Man, dude. So she took care of him the last couple months, last few weeks of his life. She was by his side the whole time.

Speaker 2: 2:29:13

And I'm so glad that he was able to.

Speaker 5: 2:29:16

Yeah, he had his love back for sure. I could see it. When I told him she was coming back and when they decided you know she was going to come back, he was like I'm glad that he had her. I wasn't there when he passed away. My mom was, like you need to go home and go to sleep, you know. So I went home and then that morning, early in the morning, he passed away, and and then so my mom called me like hey you know he passed away, you know.

Speaker 5: 2:29:43

So I came over and the uh, the uh, not the coroner um, the person we had everything set up through. She came out, um and uh confirmed that he had passed away and she allowed my uncle and I to wrap him up. She had like these sheets and blankets and stuff and she had us wrap him up and let us carry him out of the house onto the gurney, so it was like I had my uncle and I had this like moment with my dad after he passed away.

Speaker 5: 2:30:14

We're like we got to take care of his body. Yeah, like so we like honored him.

Speaker 1: 2:30:19

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:30:22

Normally that does not happen yeah, but we were able to do that she allowed us to wrap him up and then, you know, take him off and and, uh, she took him to the crematorium and did all that stuff, but but yeah that was really cool. Yeah, that's dope. I man. If, if you are in the place in your relationship or you can be there with your parents like that, yeah, don't shy away from death come on, man um be there for your loved ones, and that because man like I have so much love and good memories out of that yes

Speaker 4: 2:30:56

it was painful.

Speaker 5: 2:30:56

Yes, and I don't want to have to walk through that again.

Speaker 5: 2:30:58

Yeah, it was painful, but like we, did it right yeah yeah, you know, like, like, when they need you most, you were there knowing that I got to share those last moments with my dad, knowing that I was with him you know, up until just a couple hours that he passed away knowing that I was the one that wrapped up his like. There was no time he was not around family until he was in the back of the van and his spirit was gone, and it was just a tent right. His body was honored by myself, and my Theo. Ben.

Speaker 1: 2:31:35

Amen.

Speaker 5: 2:31:35

And we took care of him. My mom was there, so he was like I, just man. We loved him and we loved him until he was out of our custody yeah that's a weird word to use, not custody, but out of our

Speaker 1: 2:31:48

um care care, yeah, yeah, so it was, it was really cool that is special bro, yeah what year was that?

Speaker 5: 2:31:56

uh, that was six years ago now, I think this past september was six years.

Speaker 5: 2:32:01

That sounds about right, yeah, okay, yeah, so, um, so then that mary's pregnant and, um, she starts not feeling good. She's six months pregnant now. She starts not feeling good, and so, um, we decide, yeah, we better take you. She had preeclampsia with maria, okay, and so she was starting to have those same pains, yeah, yeah, so we're like we better go, and so it turned out it was this time she had preeclampsia, but then it turned into. I can't remember what it's called the syndrome, but she was really sick and I remember now her take on this whole thing was different from mine because she was kind of out of it, but she was not doing good. And I remember, um, we had, uh, our specialists and then another um, they called in another, uh, obgyn who happened to be my, my homeboy, tony, that I was telling you guys about his wife happens to work for this guy, he's one of the top guys in the state in the country or something like that.

Speaker 5: 2:33:21

Anyways, in and uh, they're like, yeah, we need to get this baby out of you now. So she would have. So alia was going to be really premature, I want to say 26 weeks wow something.

Speaker 1: 2:33:35

What's the time frame between your dad passing on this time?

Speaker 5: 2:33:37

six months wow so we, so we're still like reeling from that.

Speaker 4: 2:33:41

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:33:42

So, anyways, Mary is like really sick the doctors. She doesn't remember this because she was out of it yeah. I remember this. But the doctors were like hey, if we don't get the baby out of her, she's going to die, like right now.

Speaker 2: 2:33:57

Wow, oh my God dude, yeah Like save my wife.

Speaker 5: 2:34:00

Yeah, exactly, oh my. God. So they were really worried that she was going to stroke out.

Speaker 2: 2:34:08

Did they like make you choose between it's either the baby or your wife? No, no, it wasn't like that.

Speaker 5: 2:34:13

It wasn't like that, but it was like we don't do something now. No matter what, this is not a good situation.

Speaker 4: 2:34:19

Yeah, but I was like I'd choose my wife, right.

Speaker 5: 2:34:24

Because the argument was if we wait longer, then Aaliyah has a better chance right. She'll be a little bit more because they're worried about her lungs not being formed yet. So anyways, I was like, no, let's go ahead and have her do the C-section. So they did the C-section. Aaliyah was born. Mary was still really out of it. So I was kind of going between, for the next couple days, taking care of mary, being with her, but then also going up and being with the baby yeah so um can we say, stroking out like her blood pressure was through the roof?

Speaker 5: 2:35:01

yes, really and and also she was because of the condition she was dropping all of her blood platelets, and so if there was a bleed somewhere, there was no, and that's why they needed to do the C-section when they did, because if she kept losing her blood, she's going to bleed out, she's going to bleed out of the table, wow.

Speaker 3: 2:35:21

So either way, it was not I mean it had to be now.

Speaker 2: 2:35:24

There really was no choice. My God yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:35:31

So Aaliyah was born and then so kind of going back and forth. Mary didn't really get to see her but I was up there with her every day, yeah, Trying to spend a little bit of time going back and forth between. And so she did really good for the first two days. And then the third day they called us or they, they, yeah, they called down to the room cause she was in NICU and they called down to the room and they were just like no alarm. But she is. You know the sign. There's some you know weird stuff happening. Basically.

Speaker 4: 2:35:59

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:36:00

And after that call, man, I, you know, Mary and I both just, you know, not at the moment we didn't say anything to each other, but at that time, that first call, it just felt really weird, yeah, Really off, yeah. And so a couple more hours goes by. Now it's like 10 o'clock at night and they call back down and they're like I don't remember all of the details because I've pretty much disassociated from a lot of it yeah, buddy.

Speaker 5: 2:36:37

I think basically she was having issues with her blood pressure and they were just getting really worried, yeah. And then I remember being in the room, mary was kind of in and out of it because she's still I mean, she's just still like, just because they did the C-section.

Speaker 1: 2:37:00

She's still battling her thing, yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:37:03

So she's kind of in and out of it. So there's this pressure of is my wife gonna die? I just didn't know what was going to, what was happening and then there's the baby. That's like super preemie yeah um, not as preemie as babies have been yeah but I mean, we're not yeah, yeah, same place at all, either way.

Speaker 4: 2:37:21

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:37:21

And I remember praying and I remember feeling like I was in this bubble that my prayers just couldn't get past. It was a very strange feeling, like just a weird pressure in the room, and then they called back I think it was like 11 o'clock or something like that and they're like you need to come up here, wow. And so by the time we went up there, Mary got to go up too. Yeah, she got to go up. Okay, oh yeah, absolutely Okay so we put her in the wheelchair and took her up there.

Speaker 2: 2:37:51

Up until this point this is. She had not got to see the.

Speaker 5: 2:37:54

She had seen her, I think once before. Okay, so I had been going up there and helping them with like the feeding and that sort of thing. I couldn't hold her or anything like that, but you know, I got to be up there and just kind of talk to her and stuff like that. Yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:38:12

God man, oh Jesus, Jesus man.

Speaker 5: 2:38:25

So, yeah, really, really blessed that I got to do that as much as I could, yeah. So anyways they just basically, they think she had a brain bleed, Okay, and she bled out, okay, and so we, you know, we got to sit there and hold her.

Speaker 2: 2:38:48

You showed me a picture I don't know where. You guys showed me a picture of you guys holding her man.

Speaker 4: 2:38:56

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:38:58

Yeah, we got to hold her and you know, some amazing things happened in that time, so she was pretty much flatlined and they were like, why don't you hold her? Because it was the last couple minutes. And so I was sitting next to Mary and she was in this chair and they handed Aaliyah over to her and they took the tape and everything off her eyes and as soon as they put her in Mary's arms, she like opened her eyes and looked up at her and it was.

Speaker 2: 2:39:35

She knew, yeah, mama, mama.

Speaker 1: 2:39:39

Dang.

Speaker 2: 2:39:43

Life man. Thank God, Wow Dang Life man.

Speaker 5: 2:39:44

Thank god. Wow, it's a pretty crazy moment thank god, you had people so yeah I have no idea how people go through this kind of stuff we were just we were by ourselves, with a couple of the nurses and the doctor and and mary, and so anyways, leah kind of just looked at her and they just stared in each other's eyes and and, um, oh man, and mary just kind of sat there and sang to her and we watched her pass away wow thank god that mary got that time.

Speaker 2: 2:40:27

That yeah, absolutely yeah, yeah you're talking about that love.

Speaker 1: 2:40:41

Earlier you said that she was just looked up at her mom.

Speaker 5: 2:40:43

I just thought about that love that was the craziest thing I've ever seen in my life, because she was pretty much flatlined at that point yeah and uh, she just looked at marie up at m and like they just shared this moment and Mary's just telling her how much she loved her.

Speaker 4: 2:41:01

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:41:02

And was singing to her, you know, and then she just kind of faded out.

Speaker 4: 2:41:07

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:41:10

And that was an easy.

Speaker 1: 2:41:12

Yeah bad brother, a bad man.

Speaker 5: 2:41:20

But I got to say as much as that hurt in this weird way, I still felt God's love on me. Amen. It was really strange.

Speaker 2: 2:41:44

That is strange Like his presence was there.

Speaker 3: 2:41:46

Yeah, wow.

Speaker 5: 2:41:48

I think Pastor Dave showed up just a couple because I called him and I was like we're losing our pastor. I really need you here and of course he killed her, and so he got there and I think she had just passed away and my mom had gotten there by then.

Speaker 5: 2:42:07

So she held her to—she had already passed away at this point. And, you know, pastor Dave was just kind of like why don't you guys say whatever you know you want to say to her? You know, and it was just kind of a strange, surreal moment and I got to say, pastor Dave, yeah, he's special in those kind of moments.

Speaker 5: 2:42:35

He's amazing and I remember so Aaliyah had passed away. He just kind of asked can I hold her? Oh, my gosh, wow. He just took her little body and left on her. Man dude, man dude. I've never seen anything like that in my life. I just remember sitting there my own pain, but being like absolutely amazed at the love that I was seeing there in front of me.

Speaker 4: 2:43:17

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:43:19

With him just holding her like that, almost like it was his own little girl, wow, and he was just like talking to her and praying over her. And I remember he asked us he's like do you want to pray over her? You know, maybe God would raise her. And we did, and I'm glad he did that, because even I had peace, because I've never felt so much faith in my life. In that moment, in that prayer, praying for her to raise, and so when she did it, I knew it was because it just—.

Speaker 2: 2:43:57

It wasn't.

Speaker 5: 2:43:58

I felt like she was already in heaven and she didn't want to come back. I feel, like—and it is probably me just projecting, you know, but—.

Speaker 2: 2:44:09

She was with Jesus. I feel like, yeah, like she don't want to come back. I'm good.

Speaker 5: 2:44:14

I really feel, like you know, with the faith I felt in that room. Um, I felt like it was up to her and she did it, you know. So it was the most painful moment I've experience, but I've also never saw so much love happening at the same time. It's very strange. I still don't know, like, how to even deal with that today yeah, how can you know we? Think of bro we think of death as such a bad thing, so it's hard to comprehend how an amazing of a moment that can be.

Speaker 4: 2:45:11

Yeah, it could come out of that especially when it's you know your baby.

Speaker 2: 2:45:15

Yeah, right, well, you guys were just talking about how much the kids mean to you. Yeah, and for you to have to go through that, yeah, my god yeah, yeah, so it was as a dad, you know it was hard. Did you ever go to a place where you were blaming yourself?

Speaker 5: 2:46:01

There's definitely a piece of me. I felt that I had failed spiritually. I just felt like there should have been something I could do, but you know, I didn't. Now I know, yeah, I mean, I know that, that's not true being where you are today. You can't, you know, in the moment and for a long time after that, that was definitely something. Physically it was out of my hands, there was nothing I could do about it, but I felt like spiritually I had failed.

Speaker 2: 2:46:48

Because there's two ways you can come out of that situation. It's either F you, it's your fault, or it was where you kind of started to go to. Where it was me, what could I have?

Speaker 5: 2:47:01

done yeah, okay. So yeah, that was something I had to you didn't get mad at God no, never yeah, see because you grew up with him, you knew God was good when she passed away. There was a second there where I knew I had to make a decision.

Speaker 2: 2:47:28

Yeah, yep.

Speaker 5: 2:47:29

I had to decide either I was going to be mad at God or I wasn't right. And from when I kind of the same, I had the same place or same point when I went through my divorce. I had to decide, you know, am I just going to be bitter, or am I going to stay the course, right, yeah? And so as soon as Aaliyah passed away, I had that second and I said, I just looked up and I said out loud, god, you are still good.

Speaker 4: 2:48:15

I knew if I did it.

Speaker 5: 2:48:16

I didn't know if I would be able to Wow bro.

Speaker 3: 2:48:19

After yeah. Wow, wow.

Speaker 5: 2:48:27

Oh Jesus, and that was kind of the only prayer. The only thing I had for a while after that was to be able. All I could do is just say God, I know you're good. I don't understand why this happened or how it happened and why didn't you do anything right, because you could have?

Speaker 3: 2:48:56

Yeah, but I know you're good.

Speaker 4: 2:49:00

And so that's all I got right now.

Speaker 5: 2:49:04

That's pretty much what got me through the first several months.

Speaker 3: 2:49:08

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:49:10

I remember at that time I was on the prayer team and I was on strategic prayer and we'd have a lot of people, so there was a lot of weeks.

Speaker 2: 2:49:19

I was behind that stage by myself. Wow, just breaking.

Speaker 5: 2:49:25

And God, just, oh, my god, joan and so I spent a lot of time back there crying healing yeah, bro, while working through stuff, grieving.

Speaker 2: 2:49:37

Yeah, dude, yeah, wow. God knew what you needed in that season. He knew you needed to be behind the wall.

Speaker 1: 2:49:48

Wow, dude yeah, yeah, there's a whole dynamic oh yeah, that did you feel him back there with you, oh, yeah, I well, I could I mean.

Speaker 2: 2:49:55

There's a whole dynamic to that. Could you feel him back there with you?

Speaker 5: 2:49:57

Oh yeah, well, I could I mean it's hard, man, because I was kind of in a place where all I had I was kind of in a place where all I had it's kind of going back to um, being out on the road is they always told you, when you're fighting for your life, you got to drop, go back to your training.

Speaker 4: 2:50:28

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:50:29

And I felt every time I was back there I was fighting for my life.

Speaker 4: 2:50:34

Wow Pain wise Wow.

Speaker 1: 2:50:37

Wow, pain-wise.

Speaker 5: 2:50:39

Wow, wow, and so the only because, like between me and God I had this big question. I never questioned whether or not he was good.

Speaker 4: 2:50:46

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:50:48

But I questioned why didn't he do anything? Yeah, I'm not saying you're a bad God, or?

Speaker 4: 2:50:53

evil or anything like that. I know you're not yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:50:55

But why didn't you do it? You could have. Yeah, you're sovereign right Now. I say all that to know, scripturally, that death is the last enemy to feed it. So I know that we're going to experience death right. So I'm not going to a weird place with it, yeah, but a lot of the times my relationship at that time just kind of turned into I'm just falling back on my training.

Speaker 5: 2:51:21

I know what the word says. I don't feel it right now, and so that's kind of all I had, because it was hard to get out of my mind and like you could have done something, but you didn't. I'm serving you as hard as I can, and now we're here where we're at. You know what is the deal with that, yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:51:46

I just lost my dad.

Speaker 4: 2:51:48

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:51:49

I just lost my daughter.

Speaker 4: 2:51:51

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 2:51:51

I'm in your house, my kids are in your house, we're serving you. Yeah, I'm in your house, my kids are in your house, we're serving you. I can very easily see how you can go to that place of.

Speaker 4: 2:52:02

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:52:04

Wow. So again, I was never mad at God Through that entire time. I'd be the first one to tell you how good he is, Because I know he's good. So that was never a question in my mind. I just questioned why? Yeah?

Speaker 2: 2:52:21

all I can think of right now is the, the tv series the chosen and thomas, where his, his, the lady gets taken out man and he gets dude, and then Jesus raises Lazarus, and that even just messes. We can't. Those are the things, man, that we just have to trust.

Speaker 5: 2:52:44

You got to trust.

Speaker 2: 2:52:45

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:52:46

And you got to not give up. Walk through it. You have to fight every step of the way. You can't. You have to be disciplined with your mind, every step of the way you can't you have to be disciplined with your mind.

Speaker 5: 2:53:02

You can't you just can't let yourself go to that place. Now, that being said, there are some things I didn't do right, and so one of the things where now I'm just now starting to work it out Okay, all right, okay Is I was avoiding that pain. I was getting to the point, especially on prayer team, where I just started kind of turning off the pain and just so they taught us some things when I was, you know, on the road working for the city, and it was kind of an inside thing, like there's no official training on this, but like the kind of the thing was is you just put it on the shelf and you'll deal with it sometime later on down the road? Cause we all got to go back to work tomorrow morning, yeah, got to have our heads on straight, yeah, because you don't know when you're going to be fighting for your life next, right, the next call.

Speaker 5: 2:54:05

Can't be all caught up in stuff or fighting for someone else's life, whatever.

Speaker 2: 2:54:07

Whatever Compartmentalize, yeah Right.

Speaker 5: 2:54:10

And I compartment, compartmentalize that pain a lot. Okay, and the Holy Spirit being what he is, any time I would start to enter into prison, worship or that intimate place with God, a lot of that pain would start coming out. Wow, and so I would turn that off. Wow, and so for a long time you didn't want to feel it. I didn't want to feel it real, bro. I just won't let myself go there, which meant a lot of times I couldn't go there with God either. Right, yeah, I could pray.

Speaker 5: 2:54:48

I could pray for other people I know I yeah, but man praying for myself or allowing myself to go to an intimate place with God during praise and worship, I had to turn that off, and so what that turned into was getting almost to a place where I was starting to just turn myself off towards God In some areas not every area, it's just a strange thing, yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:55:19

But, I have no doubt in my mind that if I had not dealt with it, it would have turned into turning myself off to God completely because what else can you do?

Speaker 4: 2:55:27

Yeah?

Speaker 5: 2:55:28

Can't hide your heart from God forever right, right, so like two man camps ago, maybe three it really occurred to me like there is a problem here.

Speaker 5: 2:55:43

dude, you need to start dealing with this. But I just like I would try. But then that pain would come up and seeing that little girl dying in my wife's arms and wondering again, why didn't you do anything, god, so those things like, and so that would start popping up and then feeling like, well, how come I didn't have enough faith, or I'm the priest of my household is what we're always told, right, you know, where was I failed? Spiritually, spiritually? How am I going to answer to that? And so I didn't.

Speaker 5: 2:56:18

I just would stop, you know, stop letting myself go because I had to deal with those things and I, the holy spirit, was trying to bring that out so that I could deal with it in his presence. Yeah, and I just I'm, you know, I don't want to deal with that pain, so I'll just go out and do safety, all right.

Speaker 2: 2:56:39

Yeah, I'll go work in the garage, yeah.

Speaker 3: 2:56:41

I'll go build something in the garage.

Speaker 5: 2:56:43

So anyways.

Speaker 3: 2:56:47

Man.

Speaker 5: 2:56:47

So just in this last year, this last man camp, God really got a hold of me.

Speaker 4: 2:56:54

And a big part of it.

Speaker 5: 2:56:58

I see my son.

Speaker 2: 2:57:00

Oh god dude.

Speaker 5: 2:57:01

Up there playing guitar for the band.

Speaker 2: 2:57:12

Rather than what you don't have, you're what you have.

Speaker 5: 2:57:16

And so I just felt like, wow, I need to do something, rather than what you don't have, what you have. And so I just felt like God, I need to do something, man.

Speaker 2: 2:57:25

So anyways, I just went up and I prayed, got prayer.

Speaker 5: 2:57:29

I remember he was calling everybody up, and so I went up and got prayer and I just felt like the Holy Spirit was just telling me dude, I'm trying to help you, I'm trying to help you walk through this pain, yeah, and deal with it in a place where I can be here with you, right, and what's more intimate than praise and worship?

Speaker 2: 2:57:52

wow, right in that quiet place oh yeah, buddy, oh yeah, and so I was like I gotta go get prayer and so, um, I went up and had pastor and worship Wow, right In that quiet place, oh yeah, buddy, oh yeah.

Speaker 5: 2:58:00

And so I was like I gotta go get prayer. And so I went up and had Pastor Abel pray and that poor dude, because I just I let him have it right, he probably didn't even hear me. There was just this dude blubbering in front of me because the music was so loud. Anyways, he prayed for me and then I went back and was just kind of back there, just you know whatever.

Speaker 5: 2:58:19

Watching everything, like you do, and then I felt the Holy Spirit tell me you better go tell Pastor Dave, Because you've been hiding this. Wow.

Speaker 2: 2:58:30

And then I was like yeah, right here, Go tell Pastor what yeah buddy.

Speaker 5: 2:58:40

Yeah, so I walked up, you know, pastor dave, he's all you know, he's all smiling oh yeah, oh man what are you gonna share with me? And I'm like you know, and I'm blubbering, I'm like I have to share something with you while I have the guts to do it again, because if I don't, I feel like I'm lying to you at this point, right.

Speaker 5: 2:58:58

So I just told him Wow, because in my mind I'm feeling like I was lying to him Because I didn't say anything. Wow. So, anyways, I told him, like Pastor Dave does. He just smiled. He's like you're going to be fine, man, this is okay I love him, You're in the right spot and he's like we're going to work through it.

Speaker 2: 2:59:24

That's right, we're going to make it through it.

Speaker 5: 2:59:26

And so you know how he is. He's like okay, put your plan together. I want you to send me something tonight with your plan, oh wow.

Speaker 2: 2:59:34

You're very practical and he knows how I am.

Speaker 5: 2:59:37

He knows I'm going to write it down step by step. So, anyways, I wrote it down and I sent it to him that night Come on buddy.

Speaker 2: 2:59:49

So I know my steps and the main thing is Was this the night where he literally told us you go back to your room and write down? It was this, the. Was this the night where he literally told us you go back to your room and write down?

Speaker 5: 3:00:06

it was because there was multiple men that night that night that stayed up all night that couldn't sleep, that were writing yeah, wow, so, wow and so anyways, that's kind of I just kind of had to get to the place of the Spirit where I was like all right, so I'm going to go in there and praise and worship and I'm going to praise you, and if it hurts, so be it, I'll just go up there and I'll hurt through it. I know you're right there with me. So when I have, you know, when I have enough guys and I can let them take care of out front, and I go in there and I just praise our God and.

Speaker 5: 3:00:44

I just go in there and praise and let all the thoughts run right amen, and I just know that I will just face them there in that place, yeah, and I'll just hurt in that place and I'll let the Holy Spirit deal with me, heal me right, Heal you, bud the thing is we work with a bunch of guys, bro, and we always tell them God can't heal what you don't expose.

Speaker 2: 3:01:13

Yeah.

Speaker 1: 3:01:15

What the?

Speaker 2: 3:01:15

Lord is doing in you, is giving you a safe place for you, just to bring this stuff out. Yeah, this, this whole thing, this is all in his perfect timing, bro. We had no idea that the lord was going to do this in man camp. Right, god's doing all this? Right, this is just part of your process, right? Some people? Some people, it happens quick.

Speaker 4: 3:01:37

Yeah.

Speaker 2: 3:01:38

Other people it takes a little longer. You, my friend, you're very smart, you watch, you are one to you. Don't rush in. You're slower. Like you said, you've learned God has had. This is something that it's just been a slower process with you.

Speaker 5: 3:01:59

Slower, but only because I wasn't willing to deal with it. You, you, just you have to deal with it, right? You, you can't put it off and we all know this. The longer you put it off, the bigger it gets. You know, we try to. We think we can hide our hearts from God. Right, but you can't, yeah.

Speaker 2: 3:02:20

You know, so it's better just to get it out there and you know okay it's going to suck.

Speaker 1: 3:02:28

So what? Yeah, you know what's on the other side of pain.

Speaker 5: 3:02:33

What was that?

Speaker 1: 3:02:33

That freedom right Healing, the other side of pain, all is that, that freedom right healing healing yeah, I tell people all the time, man, that you're like most people, that we deal with an addiction. They're they're, they're hiding, they're covering up pain. And I tell them all the time that if you allow that pain to have its place and go through the experience of having that pain, there's freedom on the other side, there's healing on the other side. Yeah, you can stay high for 40 years for something to happen to you when you were 12, but when you get sober, that's still going to be there yeah, absolutely, you still have to.

Speaker 5: 3:03:06

You can't run from anything.

Speaker 1: 3:03:07

No, you can't run from anything and you know me and you had a conversation one time and, uh, you shared a little bit of what you were just talking about with me and I was like it hurt my heart for you, brother. You know what I mean it really did.

Speaker 2: 3:03:21

How could it not, man Because?

Speaker 1: 3:03:22

the Chone, I know, is. I mean, you're my Thales teacher, you're Dean of Students, you're all these to me you're someone I hold. I'm not supposed to hold you up, but I hold you up. You know what I mean. And to hear that your heart was there with God, that you were like because you told me you know a little bit about it, and I was like, oh man, yeah, jones, just like, was, like I was. I'm not going to lie. I was a little concerned for you, brother, because you said something that I was like oh God, don't come on, god, you know what I mean, don't let my brother stay there too long. You know what I mean. Don't let my brother stay there too long. You know what I mean, yeah. And so to hear you say that you're at this place now, man, it blesses my heart, brother, because I was really concerned for you, fred, you know what I mean, yeah, because you had said something and I was like no, god, don't let that stay there long. You know. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1: 3:04:13

So to hear that you've gotten to a place where you're working through it, man, blesses my heart bro yeah absolutely because I love you dude, and I know you're younger than me, but I look up to you, man, because spiritually you're way more mature than I am, and so I look up to you spiritually. And when you look up to someone spiritually who's more mature was that a place that you were? I was like, oh god, this is not a good place for my brother.

Speaker 2: 3:04:37

You know what I mean, and but it just shows us as as people who are looking up to mentors and leaders and pastors in our life who are farther along in their spiritual walk, how, how important it is for us to keep our heart guarded and in tune with god because we can get to that place, yeah, where I'll pray for you, but I ain't spending no time in my prayer closet with god, yeah yeah, there's definitely some.

Speaker 5: 3:05:13

there's definitely a few sides to that and like to me what kind of a couple of things that I got out of. It is, first of all, just like you saying, looking up to me, that sort of thing which is always weird to hear, but anyways you're one of the dudes I call when I have theology questions, brother. That just goes to show you, for all the brothers out there that are walking, for stuff you cannot give up come on, no matter what, because that was one of the main things that kind of kept me going in the beginning.

Speaker 5: 3:05:48

Yeah, you know, because like losing my dad and then losing the baby, like really pulled the rug out.

Speaker 4: 3:05:55

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:05:55

But they're like knowing that all of the brothers are walking through stuff too. Yeah, and if I give up that might make it easier for someone else to give up.

Speaker 1: 3:06:10

Come on, man Boom, come on.

Speaker 5: 3:06:11

And that really drove me. Yeah, Now, just like I just said, I mean I wasn't perfect in walking through that situation. But there was no way I was going to just give up. You know, in that situation Because my wife needed me. I mean, I was hurt. Her level of hurt was different than mine. And there was, you know. So I needed to be there for my family, for my kids, I mean, I had to tell them that next, that morning I had to go to my kids and break my kids' heart.

Speaker 2: 3:06:50

How old were they? God Maria was. They were just little. Yeah, they were little.

Speaker 5: 3:06:55

But they were old enough to know their baby sister was coming.

Speaker 4: 3:06:57

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:06:58

And to tell them what happened. Wow Was poor Nate. Nate was there when I did that, because I needed someone to drive me yeah. So that poor guy was standing there with me when I told the kids. Wow, you know, I love that dude.

Speaker 1: 3:07:13

Yeah, he's awesome.

Speaker 5: 3:07:14

You know, um, I've always felt kind of bad that he had to be there to see that. You know, see those two little kids get their hearts broke like that Wow. But um, you know, I just I there, I just couldn't give up cause I knew that all the brothers were here and I really had it on my in my spirit that if I gave I was.

Speaker 5: 3:07:39

I don't know if fear is the right word but, I, had a massive fear that if I gave up it might give someone else an excuse to give up or permission. Or permission, and I, man, I would rather get in a gunfight than think that I opened the door for someone else to quit on their life.

Speaker 2: 3:08:00

Causing exodus. Bro, yeah, dude, yep.

Speaker 4: 3:08:03

Yep, yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:08:08

Causing someone else to stumble. Yeah, yeah, that's just not something. That's Amen. It's just not an option. Amen, and so that was one. It's just not an option, and so that was one of the driving forces. Yeah, you know that goes back to what was some of the you. Just, you know there's a good reason not to give up it's because of all the brotherhood around you.

Speaker 3: 3:08:28

They need you yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:08:29

And we you know, quitting in my mind, quitting on myself, is also quitting on the brotherhood and quitting on my family. Because we don't know who's walking through what right.

Speaker 4: 3:08:43

You just never know.

Speaker 5: 3:08:45

Like you know, we all look up to each other in different aspects and in different ways. Yeah, but at the same time, we're all walking through something. Oh yeah. No one is. No one's life is perfect yeah right, yeah, and so you know it's.

Speaker 3: 3:09:00

Can't give up.

Speaker 5: 3:09:01

Yeah, absolutely, we just really got to love each other and be humble towards each other and absolutely, no matter what you're walking through like that, like to me, it's just not an option.

Speaker 4: 3:09:12

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:09:13

And.

Speaker 2: 3:09:20

My God man an option yeah and uh, um, my god man. Well, I'm glad you got to a place where you are processing.

Speaker 5: 3:09:23

Yeah, and talk about it, allowing it to have its place, brother because, well, you know, one of the things is I don't want to give the devil that victory, like I didn't walk through all of this, you know, to give him all these, you know these, little victories.

Speaker 5: 3:09:39

I don't want to do that and I remember when I first walked well, I'm still walking through a bit. In the beginning I remember like I don't want this to go to waste. That was one of the other big things that was going through my mind. Through a lot of this is is like I don't want all of this pain to go to waste. I don't want all of these amazing things that God did in the midst of these absolutely horrendous situations to go to waste.

Speaker 5: 3:10:08

You know, so, those driving factors, but it also taught me you know um. We got to love each other Cause you never know who's going through what you know. We got to love each other because you never know who's going through what you know, we saw that with Craig.

Speaker 5: 3:10:20

Yeah, you know you don't know what people are walking through. So we should always be loving on each other and be there for each other as much as we can, and you know, got to love the brotherhood right, Right, Got to love them man. Yeah, we need each other, man, man we need each other man we really do as much as we think we're men we're men

Speaker 2: 3:10:44

we have no idea when stuff like this is coming. It's why we need each other.

Speaker 1: 3:10:50

I'm thankful for you, man.

Speaker 4: 3:10:52

I'm grateful for you guys.

Speaker 5: 3:10:53

You guys are like a life light.

Speaker 2: 3:10:59

We just make ministry fun, dude, that's all it is.

Speaker 5: 3:11:02

I mean, I guess that's one way of putting it.

Speaker 2: 3:11:07

Dude. So we, man, we've tried. You've shared your moments. Bro, you got something. I see it, I do, I see it, I do.

Speaker 1: 3:11:15

Get it. I want to know how the process was for this dales thing, dude, because we're we were students. Yeah, we know who you are yeah now you're dean of students. Yeah, you know what I mean what, how, what, what made you want to go into that particular field of ministry? Because I've read some of your classes, brother. I've been in some of your classes and and he's a great teacher is.

Speaker 1: 3:11:42

We've had conversations about the temple and things like that and our conversation. I love our conversations when we talk about things like that ethics and your insight, just you know what I mean. Your understanding, your insight to me is just phenomenal. That's why I call you. You know what I mean. So what drove you into that kind of ministry? Because being a safety coordinator is cool and all you know what.

Speaker 2: 3:12:04

I mean whatever, but it's a lot different than being a student, being a dean of students is school dean of students was more of it's not something I ever saw myself doing.

Speaker 5: 3:12:17

It was more of a need that came up yeah, and I was, you know, blessed enough to be in the right place come on um and uh, um. You know when, when there was a vacancy, I was able to step into it. Yeah, um, yeah but you're qualified.

Speaker 2: 3:12:37

That's the thing. As much as that enemy or your mind or whatever, I don't know. I'm down, I'm due to, I'm done. What All that crap? Look at what God did. God said, son, I'm going to open up a space for you in a theology school, for you in a theology school?

Speaker 5: 3:12:56

Yeah, Well, it was it was so, like we already talked about, you know, dealing with and I've talked to you guys, you know outside of here about this a lot. I deal a lot with a lot of like self-doubt.

Speaker 4: 3:13:09

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:13:10

And that little voice that always says you're not smart enough to do this, you're an imposter. Yeah, and so going, going through um lcu first and then um, yeah, we were in the same time and um that's right, you were the tech dude yeah, that's

Speaker 4: 3:13:28

right oh wow oh gosh, god, that was so long ago. That's a long time ago. That was a long time ago.

Speaker 3: 3:13:36

Lots happened since then.

Speaker 1: 3:13:39

And I still haven't graduated Two classes people. No, it's four. It's four. Amen, four classes, I'll get there, I promise. Don't let me slack, bro, don't let me slack. Ride me like a mule dude, all right, try it he needs it dude.

Speaker 5: 3:13:57

All right, come on, he needs it. Yeah, I want to finish. I really do here's the key.

Speaker 5: 3:14:00

You just have to do it, yeah, right the self-doubt is there every step of the way and, um, I fully recognize it and I know it's just a strategy of the enemy. Yeah, um, and it's also something that was, I don't know. Programmed is the right word, but you know, as a young kid that was kind of spoken into my mind and into my spirit, and so it's always there. But I've also learned to be like whatever, so what?

Speaker 4: 3:14:26

Yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:14:27

I'm going to do it anyways. I'll just dumb my way through it, then I guess, I don't know, but um, I don't feel dumb. I'm not. I don't want to make it sound like I feel like I'm dumb or stupid, um, but that voice is just always there and I have to um ignore it a lot and just be like whatever, I'm going to do it anyways, and so that's been, even though it's so tempting, like I said, every time I go in there and record all of the voices for the couple days leading up to that are like.

Speaker 5: 3:15:03

You're an imposter.

Speaker 1: 3:15:03

You're a fake.

Speaker 5: 3:15:05

You know what I mean, and so.

Speaker 1: 3:15:09

He wants to try hard to get you to not go in there.

Speaker 5: 3:15:11

What's that he's going?

Speaker 3: 3:15:11

to try hard to not get you to go in there brother.

Speaker 5: 3:15:18

So it's just you know, know, you just have to make up your mind and that's something I'm so glad that I learned um. You know, in law enforcement is you know, you know you gotta, when you're fighting for your life, right you?

Speaker 2: 3:15:29

can't give up.

Speaker 5: 3:15:30

No, you have to flip that switch and you know in in. You know I've talked to a couple the guys here that were going through some stuff and they were just like I don't know what I'm going to do and I was like you just got to flip that switch and become a killer?

Speaker 5: 3:15:44

Yeah, and you know, for us, for the most part, in most cases, that killer really is just meaning we got to be that in the spirit. Yeah, right, yeah is just meaning we got to be that in the spirit, yeah, Right, yeah. And so you just got to flip that switch and just be like it doesn't matter what's happening. Yeah, I'm going to go and I'm going to do this, no matter what you say to me, no matter what the voices say. I know what God's called me to do, and so I'm going to do what he said Come on.

Speaker 5: 3:16:13

You know I'm called to do amen and so you know those are, that are out there that think that they're not smart enough or I've been through too much or I had my chance yeah you know that's not. That's actually not true. Amen, he's. He's not just the redeemer of your soul, yeah, he's the redeemer of your life.

Speaker 5: 3:16:31

I had a pastor so a guy walked up to him one time. I was standing there and the pastor was like why don't you like usher? I was standing there and the pastor was like why don't you like usher, or something like that. And the guy was like oh, I threw my life away. You know he had been to prison did some things. He's like I threw my life away, pastor I. I. It's super corny and it's old school, but the pastor looked at him and was just kind of like god doesn't have trash cans in heaven yeah you can't throw your life away.

Speaker 4: 3:16:55

Yeah, you know. So that always kind of stuck with me. That's good, you know yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:17:00

But I just, you just can't give up. Yeah, you have to. You know, sometimes it may just be that you're just throwing one foot in front of the other.

Speaker 2: 3:17:08

Yeah, just one step, you know.

Speaker 5: 3:17:10

But if you get yourself in motion, that's like God can do something with you. I had a pastor that was praying over me and he just told me, as long as you go out there and beat feet, god will act on your behalf. Come on, man there's nothing you can't accomplish if you just go out there and beat feet, amen. I think I was 17 when he said that to me, and that's just kind of been my thing my whole life.

Speaker 2: 3:17:42

Got to move.

Speaker 5: 3:17:43

You got to stay in motion If you're in a fight. What happens if you just stand there?

Speaker 1: 3:17:49

You're going to get punched If you're in a gunfight and you just stay in one spot.

Speaker 5: 3:17:55

What's going to happen?

Speaker 2: 3:17:56

You're going to get pinned down and killed.

Speaker 5: 3:17:58

So it's the same thing spiritually, amen. You can't just sit there and take cover, yeah.

Speaker 2: 3:18:05

Got to fight.

Speaker 5: 3:18:06

You got to fight and in some ways that's what I did. I stood there and just tried to hide behind cover.

Speaker 2: 3:18:11

For a while, but recently. Now you're fighting.

Speaker 5: 3:18:17

Yeah, absolutely, but I for a while, but right recently now you're fighting. Yeah, absolutely, yeah, but I'm just saying you know you got to keep moving, and even I mean what's the old saying?

Speaker 1: 3:18:25

a body in motion stays in motion.

Speaker 5: 3:18:26

The body rest, days at rest, yeah right yeah, same thing with our spirit what is that newtonian physics?

Speaker 1: 3:18:31

I don't know but the same way with our spiritual walk.

Speaker 5: 3:18:36

We're not continually pressing in and moving forward, we're falling backwards Even if you're not sure, like if you're not doing anything. How can God redirect you? Or? Correct it, you got to at least do something.

Speaker 4: 3:18:54

Do something Even if you're not sure, well, I don't know what to do?

Speaker 2: 3:18:57

Well then, just be a greeter for a little while Just step into something with a yes, god will move you around.

Speaker 5: 3:19:03

Say this one isn't right for you.

Speaker 1: 3:19:05

Go work in a parking lot. I appreciate what you're doing. Go work in a parking lot, well, that's great.

Speaker 4: 3:19:10

So yeah you just do something I started in the parking lot, bro, with Nate.

Speaker 1: 3:19:15

Yeah, now I'm a video director or whatever label they gave me. Now I don't know. Yeah, now it's. You know what I mean.

Speaker 5: 3:19:21

Well, now you're doing Speak Life. Yeah, I do Right.

Speaker 1: 3:19:24

Yeah, yeah, I do a lot now bro.

Speaker 2: 3:19:26

Yeah, you do a lot Dad.

Speaker 5: 3:19:28

You do a lot, and were you, eddie the, but you did something. I was, I just didn't know it yet. Right, there you go.

Speaker 1: 3:19:36

I was.

Speaker 5: 3:19:36

I just didn't know it yet, but if you just stayed in the place where I'm just Eddie and you know whatever, then you would never have gotten here. But you got to push, you know through. That's all of us. You can't just stay where you're at.

Speaker 1: 3:19:51

I got to finish my damn schooling.

Speaker 5: 3:19:53

Yes.

Speaker 4: 3:19:54

I do. Yes, I'm running from that, bro.

Speaker 5: 3:19:56

You only got. I'm running from that. I make you a file every year. Thank you I love you man.

Speaker 2: 3:20:02

This will be the year you finish bud.

Speaker 1: 3:20:07

Someday I'm going to be able to add these credits in your slot.

Speaker 1: 3:20:09

I'm going to be brutally honest right now. Right, I have this uncanny fear of success that I'm not worthy of it. I don't deserve it because of the. I know the horrible things I've done in my life. And when you were talking earlier about how God can not just redeem your soul, but he can redeem all that your life you convicted me, dude, because in my mind I know what God is calling me to and I know part of it is having this bachelor's degree in theology, because somebody in the future is going to need me to have that, To have the paper for the door to open.

Speaker 1: 3:20:48

And in my mind it's like okay, if I don't get that, nobody will ask me to step up. And I'm terrified of stepping up because I don't want to fail, I don't want to be an imposter, I don't want to be all the things that you're talking about. So as long as I don't finish that, nobody's ever going to ask me to do that.

Speaker 5: 3:21:07

Well, here's the other side of that. You just, you know, pushing through that, those feelings, um also allow someone else to see if Eddie did it, yeah, I'm going to do it too. Right, yeah, and, and, and, uh, so it's again. That's why it's so important to not give a crowd of witnesses because they're watching you never know who will go. Well, if he can do it, I can do it.

Speaker 2: 3:21:38

Maybe your brother, fred bro, will see you get your bachelor's degree Dang my little brother can go get it, I can get mine, you have no idea.

Speaker 5: 3:21:45

There was lots of times where, even in Theos, I was like I can't do this anymore. And then that little voice in the back of my head started saying because I've almost programmed like if you quit, someone else might quit, yeah.

Speaker 1: 3:21:58

Amen. And so I just gutted my way through it. Right yeah, I got to finish this man. Amen, I do Amen.

Speaker 2: 3:22:07

Dang it Well, so give us a. We got a lot, bro. This is a lot man. There's a lot of stuff we didn't cover yeah, well, that's, that's why I love these things, man, we can literally sit down in six months. Six months and record it'll be kind of the same story, but what comes out will be different. Yeah, um, so that's a beauty of a testimony whatever what was shared here, man is for this moment and for whoever's going to listen to it in the future and for yourself, and and for yourself.

Speaker 2: 3:22:36

This is all part of the process of the healing and stuff stepping into new things. Give us what you're hoping for, maybe what you could see yourself doing here in. Let's go five years, and then a 20-year, to your grandpa.

Speaker 5: 3:22:53

Yeah, sure, yeah sure. You know Theos was a very unexpected I don't even know what to say. Like I wanted to be, I wanted to teach. I know I was called to teach. The position I am in now, I never expected. I never expected masters, um, the position I am in now, I never expected. I never expected, um, masters. I never expected doctorates, um, and then, and then now working here. None of that I ever expected. So I'm still coming to grips with the whole Theos thing. I knew. I knew I wanted to be a teacher. You know, I just didn't realize what else was in store for me. Again, man, it's so important not to quit. You have to keep just plugging through. It's not going to always be fun and all the angels aren't always going to be singing you the way through.

Speaker 2: 3:23:56

You'll be taking trash out at 10 o'clock at night. Sometimes you just got to suck it up and keep throwing one foot in front of the other.

Speaker 5: 3:24:04

But you know, you're building character that whole time, you're learning lessons that whole time, you know. So I really, after my bachelor's degree, I was done, I really was.

Speaker 2: 3:24:17

Shut up dude.

Speaker 3: 3:24:22

In your time Lord I don't put my drive on anybody else's, I know buddy.

Speaker 5: 3:24:26

You're good dude.

Speaker 1: 3:24:28

He's running from his too Later in life.

Speaker 5: 3:24:32

Yeah, I just kept feeling like you know. The other thing is like what if God actually did something? Out of this and I closed the door on it because, I was too worried about not being smart enough, too worried about whatever you know, and it's not just necessarily what God, what doors old God can open for me? What if there's something?

Speaker 2: 3:24:58

I could have said to somebody or whatever.

Speaker 5: 3:25:01

I don't want to sound corny, I don't want to go there with it, but you just don't know what God can do If you don't keep going forward Amen.

Speaker 2: 3:25:08

What if it's a door for your boy?

Speaker 3: 3:25:11

Well, you got no idea bro.

Speaker 5: 3:25:15

And that that's one of the driving things for me is now Isaiah. He's taken to learning, he's in Theos right now and he's loving it, and so it's like I am breaking ground in a lot of ways for my family and where I've been, and so I want him like if I'm breaking this ground, what ground is he going, my family and where I've been, and so I want him like if I'm breaking this ground, what ground is he?

Speaker 2: 3:25:40

Come on bro. Right, Wow so the next generation the next generation starts where you end, bro. Yeah, they don't have to go through all the building like you're at. You're putting in the work now so they can start and go. Yeah, so you Putting in the work now so they can start and go.

Speaker 5: 3:25:54

Yeah, so you know, I'm just super excited about my daughter and my son. My daughter is super smart man, she's definitely a Tarango. She's super smart, super witty. Drives me crazy a little bit. But you know she's super witty. And you know Isaiah, just you know he's got a heart for worship, he's got some weird wisdom that God is just walking with him, with it's beautiful. I just feel like I'm breaking ground for them. So they can just run.

Speaker 5: 3:26:38

Working full-time ministry. I love it and I want to do it as long as I can. I've never done anything as fulfilling as this you know, even though in the middle of service I'm pulling three pounds of toilet paper out of the women's one of the toilets in the women's restroom.

Speaker 2: 3:27:00

Gotta love it, bud, and getting the wonderful experience.

Speaker 5: 3:27:04

Oh yeah, oh yeah, it was full, bud, it was a whole row was in there, wonderful experience of toilet splash and all of that you know, and it's like I'm doing this for God.

Speaker 2: 3:27:17

Come on, bro, that's really what it is.

Speaker 5: 3:27:19

And it's, it's a weird thing, it's a weird.

Speaker 5: 3:27:24

I'm still tripping every day I go home. I'm still tripping out when you know I'm breaking down boxes out of the trash can for the hundredth time. You know when we're not supposed to do that and loving it because it's just like you just always have this amazing feeling of like I'm like everybody has a different place. You know how you serve God For me. I'm here now, yeah, but I've worked out in the world for a long time. But I've worked out in the world for a long time and for me personally, I felt like I was just wasting working for the man right.

Speaker 5: 3:28:02

And I'm not doing anything real. I'm just part of the machine that keeps on spinning and getting to do this full-time now is like it doesn't matter how hard it gets. I appreciate and I'm so thankful for how hard it gets, man, because I'm I'm doing something that really makes a difference yeah, you know, and for me it's good because I'm, I'm very, um, uh, I'm blanking on the word now you know I'm I'm not outgoing, that's hard for me, yeah and so I get to serve really hard, though, and I get to know I'm affecting.

Speaker 5: 3:28:38

I might not be the one to get out in front of everybody and whatever. But I get to serve really hard and I love it Amen. I love it, so I hope I can do this for a while. Yeah, after this, in 20 years, I want to be playing with my grandkids, watching them go to school. I hope I'm healthy enough to be able to, you know, do all the things with them, and yeah, that's good bro.

Speaker 4: 3:29:04

Yeah, I mean I'm 50, so yeah, amen.

Speaker 2: 3:29:08

You got a lot of life left in you, bud, but yeah, yeah.

Speaker 5: 3:29:12

Yeah. So I'm like I'm really looking forward to the kids. Yeah, the kids kids, yeah, the kids kids, yeah, my daughter's getting close, she's got maybe another year or two and then she'll be getting married and I'm like don't wait to have kids, Just have those Give me grand babies yeah. My son too, and I'm super excited to watch them become parents and get to experience and be able to.

Speaker 2: 3:29:39

I'm waiting for the day that they go. You know what? You were right about that.

Speaker 5: 3:29:41

Yeah, I told you yeah, I'm in a place where I'm just kind of still digesting everything. Okay, we're blessed bro. Yeah, love you buddy love you too.

Speaker 1: 3:30:02

Thanks for uh thanks for coming on, man.

Speaker 2: 3:30:05

I think you beat mary too that's a lot of talking it is, brother it is, but it's so much fun, dude, yeah when you sit down and just start opening up about where you've been and what you've been through and how god's walked you through it. Man, it just yeah. It comes three and a half hours bud, yeah, but it's powerful dude. These things are like people's books.

Speaker 1: 3:30:29

They drive across countries listening to these things, yeah sure yeah, we have people that drive an hour to work and they listen to them this is what they do. I'm like quit telling me that.

Speaker 2: 3:30:36

I don't want to know that you're listening to me, right are you praying for him or am I? I think we might both have to.

Speaker 1: 3:30:43

Ooh wee but, man, thank you, brother, for being just so real, so honest, so open. Dude, you know me and Rowdy just absolutely adore you, dude, you're our brother, appreciate that, and I love you guys too, I'm I'm honored that we get to do life together absolutely, and I'm honored that I get to call you my brother and uh, yeah, just thanks, man, yeah, let's pray. Man, oh man, jesus, oh man.

Speaker 2: 3:31:13

Jesus.

Speaker 1: 3:31:15

Father, I just sit here in awe of you, god, and just how you operate and how you work, just how big you are, but yet you're so intentional with each individual that loves you and calls you theirs. And so, god, I just thank you for Joan. Thank you, god, theirs. And so, god, I just I thank you for joan. Thank you, god. Thank you just for just the man that he is today. God, I think you just said, for the example that he sets. God, lord, I thank you for just his place in lifelink church. God, I thank you, lord, that, even though he seems to be uh, quiet and reserved, god that there are I know for a fact that there are men that just are watching and just hold them to a place. God, where he is a leader, he is a mentor, he is an example for us. God, and I thank you for our friendship that we have. God, I thank you for the conversations that we shared over the years. I thank you that he's found trust with me and Rowdy God, and the conversations that we have. Thank you, god, and I cherish that. God, I hope he knows just how much those conversations that were had in private just really mean to me, particularly God, thank you, god, had, in private, just really mean to me, particularly God, thank you, god. So, father, I just thank you for um, just the pain. Thank you for the process, thank you for the healing and the freedom that he's working through and walking through.

Speaker 1: 3:32:49

God, thank you, lord, and I thank you, father, that they had moment. As short-lived as it was, god, it was still just a very God moment where love was shared, love was exchanged, love was known and felt. God, thank you for what's to come still God. I thank you, lord, for just his place in Theos. Thank you for the teacher to come still God. I thank you, lord, for just his place in Theos. Thank you for the teacher that he is, god. I thank you for the many classes that I've got to see and hear him.

Speaker 1: 3:33:23

God, and just his knowledge and wisdom. Lord, I thank you for what this is going to take him, god, I thank you that, even though he's a dean of students, lord, that this is just a small step into something much greater, god. So I thank you for what lies ahead. I thank you for the preparation that he's had. I thank you, lord, that you found him faithful and I just praise you, lord, just for his marriage. I thank you for his kids. I thank you for Isaiah, god. I thank you for just the ability to see him on stage playing guitar, god, and just the young man that he is. Thank you for the warriors that he's raised in Moriah and Isaiah, god, and I thank you, lord, that where his pillar ends, their pillar begins, god, that the foundations are laid, or just that he's laid for them, god, are places that they can build monuments for you, god. So I thank you, lord, just for their, their lives. I thank you for what you're going to do through his kids. Thank you for the, the grandkids that are coming.

Speaker 1: 3:34:23

God, I have to see and know that chone will be such an amazing grandfather, amazing god we could see in just the way that he's raised his kids, the way that he loves his kids, god that that same love is going to be transferred to the grandkids. And I thank you for the generations, god, that are coming behind him, god, this bloodline. From this moment on, god will know nothing but Jesus. So I thank you, lord, for protection. I thank you for just a hedge of protection around this generation God.

Speaker 2: 3:34:53

Yeah. This bloodline Lord that each bloodline that comes up behind God will have just warring angels that will surround them.

Speaker 1: 3:35:00

God. Yeah, the enemy is not going to know how to get through this fortress God, because this bloodline, this bloodline, will just strive and serve the Lord. Okay, and I thank you for it. God, I praise you and I love you. Lord, in Jesus' name, amen, I praise you and I love you.

Speaker 2: 3:35:16

Lord in Jesus name, amen. John, will you do us a favor and pray for Me and dad and pray for Speak Life.

Speaker 5: 3:35:21

Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 5: 3:35:22

Thank you, god, father, god, we Praise you, father and we lift you up. Lord, you are so good. Father, I just thank you for this ministry Speak Life. You open up so many lives, or so many, you know, just windows into so many other lives that help us to see in many ways that we are not alone in the things that we walk through, father, that others are walking through those things too, father, and I just pray that this ministry would keep on prospering, father, and grow and grow and grow. I thank you that that waiting list is getting longer and longer and longer, father. Thank you, lord, so Father.

Speaker 5: 3:36:10

I pray in Jesus' name, holy Spirit, that you would just be out in front of this ministry, preparing the way ahead of it, father, lord, god, that you would be just preparing the hearts of those that would also share, preparing their hearts, helping them to see you in it, father, and just speaking in a way that opens up the eyes of those who are listening. Father, thank you, lord. So I just thank you, holy Spirit, that you are all over this ministry. I thank you that they walk in favor, father, god, I pray for Eddie and Rowdy, lord, god, that in their personal lives, outside of Speak Life, father, that they're surrounded by your favor, father, like a hedge protection. Father, lord, god, I pray that you speak loudly to their minds and their hearts, lord, um, even through, um, all the little voices, father, I thank you that, uh, you're the one that speaks clearly to them and and that they would be led by your peace. Father, thank you, lord. So we just thank you, father, that you are so faithful to them, that you're faithful to this ministry. Thank you, god, thank you for everything that you've brought through this ministry and for all the lives that have been changed and helped and just encouraged through this ministry and through what they're doing.

Speaker 5: 3:37:31

Lord, god, I pray that you give Eddie and Rowdy the strength to remain faithful to those things that you have set before them. Father, I just thank you, lord, that you are faithful even when we are not. So, lord God, I pray that you would bless them. I pray that you would bless their families and that they would see you in everything they do, father, and that those that are around them would see you in everything that they do, lord. So we just thank you for the blessing they are to not only this ministry, but to this church and to me. Father, I thank you and Lord, I just thank you for this opportunity to do this, as much as I fought this and try to get away from it.

Speaker 2: 3:38:16

Father, I thank you that I was able to do this much as I fought this and tried to get away from it.

Speaker 5: 3:38:17

Father, I thank you that I was able to do this, and I thank you for your patience with me and us. Lord so good. In Jesus' name. Thank you what you did on the cross, Father.

Speaker 2: 3:38:29

That's really where it is. I don't know where you're listening or where you're watching from, but it all started on the cross over 2, 2000 years ago with Jesus dying. For us. That's really just. A relationship with him is what changes everything, if you've never done that.

Speaker 2: 3:38:49

Romans, chapter 10, verse nine and 10. It says that we believe in our heart and we confess with our mouth. And it's just believing that jesus came to this earth, that he died for you and for me and for us and for all of our sins, and he was raised to heaven and he's seated at the right hand of the father. And it's just faith in him and trust in him, knowing that he's good and he will walk you through all your stuff in life because, just like tone said, he's faithful even when we're not. But that's your first place is just inviting god into your life. Um, and it's just, it's a simple prayer, just, jesus, I surrender here. You can have it, take it. God will do something that only he can.

Speaker 2: 3:39:36

Um, I don't know where you're listening or where you're watching, but please subscribe to the channel, like it, share it with your friends and family. If this touched you, if you could please leave a comment, even just one word, jesus. It does something for the algorithms and helps us get out there. If you yourself would like to come on the podcast and share your testimony, you can reach out through X, instagram, facebook, speak Life AZ. All one word. Until next time, we're going to continue to speak life AZ. God bless you, jesus you.