Chris P. Testimony

Dr. Chris Peterson's extraordinary journey from childhood church pews to ministry leadership reveals how divine calling withstands human rejection. Growing up in a deeply religious household where church attendance was nightly, Chris's relationship with God transformed from family tradition to personal commitment during a pivotal youth camp experience. What follows is a masterclass in perseverance through adversity.

When three separate ministry mentors—people he deeply respected—told Chris he wasn't qualified for worship leadership, the wounds cut deep but didn't derail his calling. "Every time I stepped on stage," he confesses, "I would hear those voices telling me I wasn't good enough." Yet something within him knew God had other plans.

The financial testimony woven throughout Chris's story provides profound insight into biblical stewardship. During a church campaign called "All for One," he and his wife Leslie committed to doubling their tithe despite significant financial constraints as new parents. For two years, they sacrificed through tremendous hardship—sometimes literally crying on their staircase wondering how bills would be paid. Then exactly two years later, to the day, they received a financial blessing matching exactly what they had given.

Perhaps most moving is seeing their values transfer to the next generation. When Chris's daughter recently gave money to help a friend at camp and was asked why, she simply responded, "Because our family is generous. That's what we do." Without prompting, she embodied the principles her parents had modeled.

Chris's testimony illuminates how God's calling survives rejection, financial testing refines our faith, and our greatest accomplishments might be what we pass on to those who follow. If you're facing opposition to your purpose or questioning God's provision, this episode will reignite your confidence in the One who qualifies the called rather than calling the qualified.

TODAY WE CHOOSE TO SPEAK LIFE AZ!!! GOD BLESS YOU 

Transcript

Introduction and Family Background

Speaker 1 0:18

all right, everybody. Welcome back to the speak live az podcast. Testimony of jesus and everyday people. I'm your host, eddie, and always with me is my son, rowdy Jesus. What up, dude, let's go bro, what's up, dude when? Do you want to go?

Speaker 2 0:31

Wherever God's taking us, man, we're on a mission from God and we can't be stopped. Bro. Who's brothers? We're the God brothers, man. They sent us out by two, bro. How they sent us out by two, bro. How was your day, dude?

Speaker 1 0:42

It was all right, man, it's a little muggy. Yeah, it's getting hot bud. It's not getting hot, but it's muggy a little bit 118 in the summer, Arizona Welcome.

Speaker 2 0:50

Was it 118 today? I don't know. It feels like hell.

Speaker 1 0:53

It's all good Swamp coolers and water baby.

Speaker 2 0:59

Yeah, man, what man? I uh what came back from? I don't know what. I was running errands man and the big old monitor delivery that I got was sitting out front the door.

Speaker 1 1:08

I'm like, oh no, that's supposed to be inside porch pirates, but they'll get you man, not at our house, it's protected, buddy amen, dude, I'm so excited for this.

Speaker 2 1:18

We got rocks in our yard.

Speaker 1 1:19

They say pray I'm excited for this one too. Yeah, this is gonna be great, this is gonna be fun, this is gonna be exciting man.

Speaker 2 1:27

This guy had a huge part In helping change my life. Man Crazy, he saw some stuff in me that I didn't see Are you gonna cry. I'm gonna try not to Come on, please don't cry.

Speaker 1 1:37

It's encouraged. It's encouraged.

Speaker 2 1:40

Keep the emotions At a minimum bud. Well, who'd you bring with you, man Dude, we got a brother, chris. What's up, man? What's?

Speaker 4 1:48

going on, guys, Pastor Chris what's going on, brother? Honored to be here with you guys here today.

Speaker 1 1:52

Likewise my friend. When we started doing this man, especially when we started doing video, god made it very clear to us to honor his sons and daughters, man, because you know as well as I do some people don't want to tell their stories, some people think they don't have a story, hello um. So when somebody does give us their yes, man. And god just said honor them, man. So we just thank you for your time. We don't, we know it's a commodity that you don't get no more of. It's not at all, man.

Speaker 3 2:14

You know you can't buy more at the store you can't get no more.

Speaker 1 2:16

You're only limited to 24 hours in a day, so the fact that you're giving us a couple hours of your time is very appreciated, man we thank you for me, man.

Speaker 2 2:27

Jesus, dude, our relationship was a little different for me. I had just come out of rehab and out of a hell and came back to this place and I'd be sitting out in the front door, you know, for a little bit, until they let me in the building and I come in and just what do we need to do? Man, um, but you, uh, you were a huge instrument that God used in my life. When you were here, friend Um, you, you called things out of me. You saw things in me that I didn't believe were there, I didn't know were there. And, uh, man, I just for, for your yes and coming on here and just sharing your story, uh, with the world and with our listeners, um, it means a lot to me, bro, thank you, yeah, um, have you ever listened to one of these before?

Speaker 4 3:15

I have, I all right crash course, several of them nice prior to getting here.

Speaker 2 3:21

So I've heard they're like good books. So if you ever like in a workout or a run or a walk or something, flip one on man, you'd be amazed. I had somebody dude. They drove from here to where was it? It was Ohio, california, all the way across the country, bro, in one episode and they're like dude. I listened to you for hours I was like, wow, that's crazy man.

Speaker 1 3:40

It was like a nine hour trip. They listened to three episodes. I'm like, I'm like, oh God.

Speaker 4 3:45

It took me three, three gym sessions to get through one. Yeah, Um, and I wasn't. I would originally to the time. I'm like, Ooh, I don't know. I don't know if this is gonna be worth it but I found that you said it's kind of like a good book, like you can. I got to see what's up with this guy.

Speaker 1 4:02

man, I got to be honest. I've never went back and listened to one. Yeah.

Speaker 4 4:05

Okay.

Speaker 1 4:05

I do not like the sound of my own voice, so to hear myself talking is like nails on a chalkboard for me, so I just whatever goes out, goes out man, I get it.

Speaker 4 4:15

I sound like that.

Speaker 2 4:20

Well, man, let me, let me just pray, we'll just get into this thing. Jesus man Holy Spirit.

Speaker 2 4:28

Thank you, god. Wow, I thank you, god. Thank you for what you're getting ready to do, thank you for all the people who are going to listen to this story. God, this testimony of what you've done in someone's life, god, I just thank you for my friend, my brother, my family. I just I bless him and right now, if there's any nerves or anxiety, just fall away. Yeah, god, I thank you that you're getting ready to help your people, you're getting ready to encourage your people. God, you're getting ready to stir some faith. Lord, I can feel it.

Speaker 2 5:01

God, some people are coming back into alignment just through this testimony, lord, god. So I just thank you, jesus, for how you do things and when you do things, because your timing is perfect. So I just pray for an anointing on this, god all the way through. Break yokes, break the bondages, set your people free through a testimony in Jesus' name. Amen. Your people free through a testimony in Jesus name. Amen, amen, amen. Um, when God gave this to us, man, it was uh, uh, speak life, az. And it was in COVID, when the Lord handed a lot of people podcast. It seemed like man, um, but uh, we, we, we kind of did what we wanted to do for a little bit, you know we're gonna preach, I think I even connected with you how do I set up my studio?

Speaker 2 5:46

but when we, when we and we paused and we're like man, what it would, and we started to do what god told us to do, yeah, which is the testimony of jesus in everyday people, that's the podcast. It don't matter if you're like dad welding on cars, mufflers, cutting up steel, myself here in facilities, man cleaning up, throw up on carpets or windows floors, or yourself and what god's called you to. I know you've got your hands and a lot of different things. Man, we're all everyday people. Yeah, we've all got a story.

Speaker 2 6:17

And the cool thing about this podcast, man, is it lets people really relate to you. I would not be surprised if you end up getting messages through social media or people that know you end up reaching out. Man, I had no idea, I didn't know that we get people, man. I had somebody come on and share, somebody reached out from 30 years ago that I was with, wow, yeah, so you got no idea how God uses this stuff, man, but it's just cool that you got a yes and you're willing to come in, man, sure, but basically, what we want from you today, man, is who is Chris? Where was Chris born? Brothers and sisters, mom and dad, what's your relationship was like in the home God, was God involved in your childhood? Definitely get into some stories with your brother, man.

Speaker 2 7:05

We've got a previous episode already on the log for Nate Peterson. Go check that out, man. You'll get his side of the story. But it's going to be great, man. But we just want to know who Chris is, man, how life was like growing up. You know me and dad serving in recovery and working in a church and stuff, man, a lot of the stuff that adults kind of heal from and have to have to work with God and the Holy Spirit with a lot of that stuff comes from childhood traumas, childhood hurts, stuff like that.

Speaker 3 7:41

If you have any of that, man, let the Holy Spirit lead you in that, please. We recently, yeah, no, no.

Speaker 2 7:45

we recently, yeah no crazy dude, Um, but just uh. I think the coolest thing we want to get today is your personal encounter with God. Um, because the way that God met you and he drew you to him, it was personally just for you. The way he got me and he spoke to me in teen challenge, it was just for dad in a prison cell. The way god gets us man, it's one of a kind. They're so personal and they're so unique.

Speaker 1 8:11

God showed me recently about that part of the of what we do is how it shows. God is a personal god, you know. He's not just some one thing. Everybody gets to see the same thing. He's personal.

Speaker 4 8:23

You know what I mean you're not got got a one one.

Speaker 1 8:25

This thing, right yeah yeah, but but he's really helped me see that lately, that when people listen to these, they get to see that he really is just a personal god. For sure it's not. It's not our god, it's chris's god, it's eddie's god, it's rowdy's god.

Speaker 2 8:38

It's unique to us, man and that's so important for people to understand I think I I'm going to have to give it my first disclaimer. We're sitting down with a theologian here. People, I love you man.

Speaker 3 8:54

Is it Dr Crispy?

Speaker 4 8:56

Officially it is I actually just told my daughter that the other day I just reminded her she's like we need to call a doctor.

Speaker 2 9:04

You've got one right here, honey. No, you're not.

Speaker 1 9:09

Those that don't know, he used to be one of our teachers in theology man.

Speaker 2 9:12

Deos Bible.

Speaker 3 9:13

College man A lot of stuff.

Speaker 1 9:14

we know. Yep, he was my teacher.

Speaker 2 9:18

I think he even wrote a couple classes, didn't you? I used to get the. Are you watching Suns games or are you listening to me? I'm watching the new buddy.

Speaker 4 9:25

He was watching Suns games, Just so you know I asked that question already knowing the answer Now that we're out of school.

Speaker 1 9:30

he was watching Suns games.

Speaker 2 9:31

It was muted, though it was muted, the class was.

Speaker 3 9:36

Roddy's really into this lesson on Romans right now.

Speaker 4 9:40

He's like oh, the Suns are playing, it has nothing to do with that god help us, man.

Speaker 2 9:43

I knew this was going to be a fun one holy smokes but so, after, after your encounter, um the life change, transformation, the transformation, that's what dad always says. Man is a real encounter with the living, god says it in romans.

Speaker 1 9:58

Someone says the other day it says it in romans. It talks about transformation, it leads to life change man.

Speaker 2 10:02

It's the evidence. It's the evidence of God that we had an encounter with.

Speaker 1 10:05

Jesus. If you say you met Jesus and you're still living the same, I'm going to have to question whether you really met Jesus or not. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 10:11

And we're in process. Just because you come to Jesus Don't mean you're perfect right away, but there is some things that God calls you to let go of.

Speaker 1 10:20

Yeah.

Speaker 2 10:26

Amen, yeah, amen, um. But so, uh, your life changed. How that changed, man. And then, um, at the you're still young, you got a lot of life left in you. I know god's put some things in you for the future, um, and so we want to know what you're hoping for, what you're believing for in life and ministry and your family career, um, just what you're believing and hoping for so we can pray for you. And then we've got listeners who pray for you as well, man.

Speaker 4 10:47

Yeah absolutely.

Speaker 1 10:49

So what was it like growing up buddy?

Speaker 4 10:51

Yeah, so I was born in Santa Rosa, california. I'm kind of by Napa Valley. Don't hold that against me. You can't choose where you're born, but you can choose where you're from.

Speaker 2 11:01

Yeah, so what do you call home?

Speaker 4 11:03

think leslie nope said that uh, yeah so uh yeah, I mean, I also don't really necessarily want to claim mesa as my home either come on now, even though I grew up there yeah, I like gilbert gilbert's cool yeah yeah, uh, born in and sounds better coming from mesa dude, because now people see oh wow, you were from the hood now you're from mesa.

Speaker 2 11:24

Gilbert. Gilbert is like. You don't want to be from Gilbert, you don't want to be bougie dude Well, hold on. I might.

Speaker 3 11:30

I might, I might. I've seen both sides of the equation Amen, bud, I've done, gilbert.

Speaker 1 11:36

Mesa and.

Speaker 4 11:37

Santan Valley.

Speaker 1 11:39

Bougie has its benefits, bud Good living.

Speaker 4 11:42

But yes, I grew up there. I lived there until I was around seven, mom and dad around my brother.

Speaker 1 11:50

California, california.

Speaker 4 11:52

Until seven, yeah, until I was seven, California until I was nine, but in Santa Rosa until I was seven. Yes, I got one brother. He's officially three years nine months older than me.

Speaker 3 12:04

I love that. If you've heard the previous episode, I just want to set that straight.

Speaker 4 12:09

Three can never be four.

Speaker 3 12:12

Three years and nine months, nate, that's it, that's not four bud.

Speaker 1 12:16

That doesn't equate bud.

Speaker 4 12:18

Anyway, I just want to set that straight.

Speaker 1 12:22

Also, why were you guys in California? Were you down in the military?

Speaker 4 12:25

I didn't have any choice in that I was born there why were your folks there? My dad originally was in the Navy. He was out before we got there but you know he grew up in the Bay Area he lived there for a while. They traveled around for a bit. They lived in Maryland and Texas and done ministry school and all the stuff ended up back there he's working for State Farm. Maryland and Texas and done ministry school and all the stuff. Oh wow, Ended up back there. He's working for State.

Speaker 3 12:47

Farm.

Speaker 4 12:48

Yeah, yeah, I don't have a ton of memories. The only thing I know I remember of that time is just the weather being awesome. Yeah, so we'll get to it, probably a little bit later, but when I first started dating my wife Leslie, I asked her like hey, in Kansas do they have air conditioning?

Speaker 3 13:05

yeah, she thought I was making like a hick joke and she's like well, yes, we've got air conditioning we wear shoes, like we have indoor plumbing, and I was like no, no, hold on, like where?

Speaker 4 13:12

I grew up, yeah there was no air conditioning because it never got hot like two weeks out of the year kind of thing so that. So it was definitely a big change. We we lived in, you know santa rosa moved to bakersfield. You know state farm moved us over there and it was always kind of cool.

Speaker 4 13:26

As an adult it was sad to move because when state farm moved us um, they packed the whole house for you oh, wow the house into the truck and then drove it and so, um yeah, when you're an adult, that doesn't work that way you gotta pack it yourself, yeah yeah, that's pretty fun moving sucks, it sure does.

Speaker 2 13:44

He just moved in the summer bud, jesus, I had a state farm.

Speaker 1 13:48

His name was rowdy with the truck yeah, moving weight yeah I just did it last october and uh that's

Speaker 4 13:57

a good time uh, it was still pretty warm yeah, but um, yes, we moved to bakersfield when I was seven. We lived there for two years, um, and that was a little bit challenging because, uh, we moved from like santa rosa where, like my parents, each worked like two jobs just to live in a really bad apartment really um to move to bakersfield, which was like in the oil fields and still expensive, but also like very hood yeah um, and so that was there there's not a lot.

Speaker 1 14:27

It's kind of like Bakersfield's, like kind of Hicktown, California, right.

Speaker 4 14:30

Kind of yeah, Highly Hispanic neighborhood.

Speaker 1 14:34

The only thing I know about Bakersfield is Dwight Doakum buddy. That's where we bought the church.

Speaker 2 14:38

That's where we got the church for Living Word. That's where Robert sent that check.

Speaker 3 14:43

All right.

Speaker 4 14:46

So word, that's where my robert sent that check. Yeah, all right, so yeah, um, so live, live there two years. And then they're like, hey, we want to move you to arizona.

Speaker 2 14:52

And so it's like, okay, um, that summer was being growing up in california, did it was it just you and your brother a lot, or did you guys have a lot of friends, or was that? How was your childhood? Um, were you guys all at the baseball fields on the weekends? I mean, what were you? Or was it something where, with gangs?

Speaker 4 15:11

no, we weren't necessarily any gangs per se. Okay, um, yeah, it was. Uh, we did not do a lot um they call you weto, probably.

Speaker 1 15:22

Yeah, I don't know exactly what that means.

Speaker 3 15:24

I feel like I actually I do know what that means.

Speaker 1 15:25

Hey white boy, I'm just kidding, man yeah Um no so we actually.

Speaker 4 15:30

so my mom managed an apartment complex and so we hung out there a lot, actually it's. It's funny, like how you know I'm raising my kids today and how I was raised and how I would never ever do it Like my parents did. Not that it's bad, like you know I, I firmly believe that you know, just like I'm doing the very best I know how to do as a dad right now it's good I'm still messing my kids up, I'm sure of it um just thinking of my parents.

Speaker 4 15:53

I know that they did the best, but like really good like, like I didn't know how to swim, but my brother and I would just hang out in the pool when my mom, my mom was working oh, wow um, and I essentially just taught myself how to swim. It was like you're not allowed to go in the deep end until I come out and watch you, kind of thing.

Speaker 3 16:07

Yeah.

Speaker 4 16:08

You know, and what mama doesn't know doesn't hurt her Sink or swim boy Sink, or swim.

Speaker 2 16:13

I was in the deep end, mom. Yeah, yeah, we had like life jackets.

Speaker 4 16:19

But the interesting thing is like check on you in a couple hours, you know, it's just like make sure you put a life jacket on. Yeah so, but yeah so, we did a lot of that and even then, like you know, my, my dad, he, you know, he worked at state farm and then he did, like the facilities, maintenance at the apartment office when he got home so so really like yeah, so we, I mean we did.

Speaker 4 16:37

We always had church right. I've been in church since I was, you know, two weeks old. Um, I think Landry suggested was it six weeks for our kids.

Speaker 3 16:45

Yeah.

Speaker 4 16:45

I think we pushed it to three. But yeah, two weeks old, I'm in church and I don't. I mean, I could probably miss 10 Sundays in total in my entire life.

Speaker 2 16:53

Wow, Ever Faithful man.

Speaker 1 16:56

Is that where you and your? Brother learned your how to do things with your hands.

Speaker 2 17:00

Oh.

Speaker 1 17:01

Huh.

Speaker 2 17:10

Because, you hands? Oh huh, because you guys are pretty good with your hands as far as building stuff and fixing stuff.

Speaker 4 17:11

No, no, no, so well, I guess later on. Yeah. So my dad, like he's good at fixing things, but you know he was, our time with him was typically watching either lawn order or x files and drinking iced tea before he went to bed I figured he'd drag you around while he was working on apartments and stuff.

Speaker 1 17:19

No, he didn't do that he did always.

Speaker 4 17:21

He did always take us to church. So If anything was going on at church, if he's fixing something, if he was, you know, counting the offering, if he was being an usher like I, have fond memories, you know, in Santa Rosa of uh, there's always a song we'd always in the service with, called a victory in Jesus.

Speaker 1 17:35

Come on now.

Speaker 2 17:36

Yeah, victory in you guys should join the choir.

Speaker 1 17:41

What's going on here? We're trying, no we're not.

Speaker 2 17:44

We're not really.

Speaker 4 17:45

I don't want us up there, I know the scoring system.

Speaker 2 17:49

You scored mine man, I got a 3.25.

Speaker 3 17:52

I said it was a group score. It wasn't just me, pastor Sheree. I love you buddy. He was a part of it, but yeah anyway, but yeah anyway but yeah, so I would.

Speaker 4 18:02

We'd be at church so much that I would fall asleep underneath the pews.

Speaker 2 18:05

Come on man.

Speaker 4 18:06

And. But when that song would go off, I'd know okay, church is rapping and I'm ready to go. So yeah, so we were always at church.

Speaker 2 18:12

Was it a Baptist church?

Speaker 4 18:13

No, we grew up. Assemblies of God Okay, mostly Assemblies of God are four square.

Speaker 3 18:29

We went to one non-denomin church, but it was typically in that kind of. So you've always been exposed to the holy spirit and in the power of god and yeah, okay, yeah, wow, some real weird stuff.

Speaker 4 18:33

There's the there's the things I've experienced, there's the things that are biblical, and uh uh, there's there's probably a mix of those in there, but but, honestly like a lot of um did you see people breaking out dances and stuff?

Speaker 2 18:42

oh yeah oh yeah, bud, he grew up in that real.

Speaker 4 18:45

My mom was always the one that would stand up in the middle of a pastor's sermon and start like you know, should have bought a Honda, like start speaking in tongues. And I'm like, oh mom, just sit down, mom, bring it down.

Speaker 2 18:57

At least she didn't pull out the flags bud. No, thank God, no flags I drew the line of flags Amen.

Speaker 1 19:06

Yeah, we're a flag team. See Chris tackling his mom. You're not bringing these.

Speaker 4 19:10

But it really was cool kind of watching some of that. You know, and there was always a response, and it was always in King James English, it was always like I don't know just some parts of that where, like you know, you look back on it and you're like was that?

Speaker 3 19:23

real?

Speaker 4 19:24

Yeah, probably parts of it was so anyway, there's a long like history of, so I my memory is pretty good.

Speaker 3 19:31

Yeah.

Speaker 4 19:35

That's not a brag, but I just like remember tons of things. So I remember almost everything that, like I learned in church throughout the years. Wow so there's a lot of bad wiring.

Speaker 2 19:41

I've had to undo, Undo wow, because I there's a lot of bad wiring.

Speaker 4 19:43

I've had to undo because I and the same thing I was talking about my parents like I think well, I think most of these pastors that I that I sat under throughout the years, they meant well, but I think a lot of like what they taught was based in tradition and um, and not even like talking about like the patristics in, like that type of tradition, but just like what they've heard, as opposed to like what does the Bible actually?

Speaker 4 20:02

say and so so while I've grown up in church my whole life and you're like, oh, you must know a lot of things, Like I've experienced a lot of things and I've had to undo a lot of things too, throughout the years.

Speaker 3 20:14

So so it's.

Speaker 1 20:15

It's been it's been, and that's difficult. It really is that's difficult man.

Speaker 4 20:19

Yeah, the difference between deconstructing and learning is if you're trying to take it apart, to get rid of your faith yeah if you're trying to take it apart to figure out what does this actually mean and how does it apply to my life? Wow, that's good so you're learning should be something we always do.

Speaker 3 20:32

Yeah, you know what?

Speaker 4 20:33

and there's, there's things that I probably, when we were, you know, doing more life together, that I would probably say like this is 100 doctor and yeah and I'd probably be different today on that, you know all of the essentials are still the same, but yeah. So yeah, growing up in that you had a lot of just cool stuff that you witnessed. Some things were kind of strange Always lively though.

Speaker 2 20:55

Did you personally ever have any crazy encounter? Or like would one of the women in the church come over and pray and bah, god just showed up. Anything like that for you at a young age?

Speaker 4 21:06

No, not necessarily I. I, to be honest, I wanted to be slain in the spirit so bad Like I was, just like you know, just to hear people's experiences and be like so I'd like go up there, because you know you go up there every Sunday and they push, put their hand on you and they push you to the ground.

Speaker 1 21:20

I'm like.

Speaker 4 21:20

I don't want you to push me down.

Speaker 1 21:22

I want this to actually be a thing.

Speaker 4 21:24

And so, while I'm not saying that isn't, I think that that is possible for all that to take place.

Speaker 1 21:30

I've only had that happen once. I've had people push me down.

Speaker 4 21:33

But only one time that.

Speaker 1 21:34

I've the dude's hand was on my head and I felt like I got kicked in the chest by a donkey and poof, yeah, and I was like, okay, that one was real. Yeah, the other dude who pushed me down.

Speaker 4 21:48

I appreciate the effort but yes, I'm not here. I'm not here to be pushed down. Yeah for sure. And honestly I think, as a minister, like there's a part of that. That's kind of almost like a faith deal, like right, when you're like, when you're pushing someone. If you're pushing someone for show, that's one thing, but if you're like no, you're gonna have an experience with god god I think it could be potentially a faith move, but it never worked for me. I wanted it to desperately, but it just never.

Speaker 2 22:09

Wow, even as a kid, even as a young kid, you wanted that.

Speaker 4 22:14

I remember being filled with the Holy spirit when I was man. I would have been maybe seven, no way Like a kid's camp, yeah, and that was taking place.

Speaker 3 22:23

That didn't happen maybe seven, no way Like a kid's camp. Yeah, oh my God, and that was taking place.

Speaker 4 22:26

It didn't happen like again. I didn't get slain in the spirit, but it was like all of a sudden just start speaking in tongues. Yeah, wow.

Speaker 2 22:33

It wasn't those exact words. My first ones were like ba ba, ba, ba ba, ma, ma ma. It was like this yeah, it's kind of funny, I have some friends now that don't believe like that.

Speaker 3 22:44

The tongues are a gift for today yeah and uh, cessation.

Speaker 2 22:47

They're like start speaking and start speaking in tongues. Now I can't, just I can't work that way. Yes, it does. It's not for you.

Speaker 4 22:56

It's a light switch on off, on off but yeah, I mean honestly a lot of the, a lot of stuff we did. Like I said, my what I'm used to which you probably check out for how my adult life has turned out is we were at church every night.

Speaker 2 23:09

Wow, Wow bro.

Speaker 4 23:11

So my mom taught like an aerobics life group one night, and that was usually the night. My dad counted the offering. So, I just like roamed the church. The church we were at had a really cool. The sound booth was upstairs in like a closet, and so I'd like you know, just mess around.

Speaker 2 23:24

How many people are at this church? Is this a big family church or a big church? A couple hundred people, okay, okay.

Speaker 4 23:30

Yeah, not crazy, but yeah, we'd be there or, like you know, we'd always like with the pastors. I remember the pastor was a really big smoker I didn't know that because he wore the original Old Spice scent.

Speaker 1 23:42

Yeah, yeah, yeah, and like that covers everything. One bottle per day.

Speaker 4 23:45

Yeah, yeah, funny story. We actually, like my grandfather, was in the hospital for a heart bypass, whatever, and we were trying to find his name was actually Tom as well. So we're trying to find Pastor Tom and we literally walked the hospital smelling the cologne and we located him, based off of where he was in the aftershave.

Speaker 1 24:05

I think it worked as a disinfectant too it probably yeah probably a lot of things yeah yeah or yeah anyway so yeah, so yeah, so we.

Speaker 4 24:15

But we, you know we'd hang out at his house, we would. I mean, man, we were at church every single night every night, um and so like that. We just got in the habit of that.

Speaker 1 24:23

Like, it's almost like, like that's what we do, so let me ask you this yeah, so we know from having people on that there's going to church and then there's living out your faith. Would you say your parents lived out their faith? Was it something that was in the home as well, or was it just while you were at church? Because a lot of times kids, kids understand we go to church, but they don't understand that church comes with us, bring it home too.

Speaker 1 24:48

Yeah, you know what I mean because a lot of times people they go to church and their parents are one way they get home and then dad's drinking a beer while he's the only time we pray is for the food and don't ever see it. We're not reading together, living it out in the house as well.

Speaker 2 25:02

Did you see mom and dad reading bible? Did you got? Were you guys a part of reading it, or prayer time or anything?

Speaker 4 25:07

you guys have asked a lot of questions. Um, no, uh, I think, uh so, yeah, lots of stuff, uh. So my mom I have vivid memories of of like going into her room and finding her like asleep on her bible like just like spending time with jesus? Yeah, come on and just going there and like, like it was actually funny. I just recently got her Bible and have been trying to go through and look at notes and different things. Wow, but she's worn it out Really.

Speaker 3 25:35

She was in it all the time Come on man.

Speaker 4 25:37

I think, and as far as I mean, he definitely had a relationship with Jesus and I think there's lots of aspects of being a Christ follower that he did well at showing, so obviously like how to be a servant leader. As well as, like my dad's, one of the most generous people I know. Probably to a fault, but he's, you know.

Speaker 2 26:00

That's real. He'd probably give you the shirt off his back if he, you know One of the I don't know who, but there's a dude that we know through I don't think it's through CR, but he got connected with Mike somehow and brought him up to the church over there, dude, that they're all going to. I'm like you know Mike. So, yeah, your dad, he's making moves, man and doing things for the kingdom.

Speaker 4 26:22

Yeah, I feel like he. Yeah, I feel like, yeah, gosh, what is that guy's name?

Speaker 2 26:25

no, you don't know him. I do know him.

Speaker 4 26:28

Uh, yeah, I do, he friend requested me I.

Speaker 3 26:32

I've met him a couple times yeah, it's a trip, but yeah anyway, wow it is when you start to look at friend friends that are on facebook and you're like mutual friends how do you?

Speaker 2 26:40

know that guy this is a strange it's a small world.

Speaker 4 26:44

Yeah, but you know, I will say for my dad one of the things he really felt called to ministry.

Speaker 3 26:49

Yeah.

Speaker 4 26:49

And I think for the most part he battled the. You know that every man goes through as far as like.

Speaker 2 26:55

Worthiness, no, no, it's more like I have to provide for my family. I need to provide for my family, yeah.

Speaker 4 26:59

Okay or be in ministry, and unfortunately those are real things as someone who was in full-time vocational ministry for 12 years, I can tell you this God always provided, it always came through. But really, as a provider for your family, that's one of the first things God calls you to.

Speaker 3 27:20

Love ministry. Your family is your first ministry.

Speaker 4 27:23

And so I think there was a lot of that. Later on makes a switch and we we'll get to that at some point, but but I think there was a lot of that in his life of like I want this, but I'm in this now yeah, I'm taking care of my family, and so I think there was a lot of that, that like there was probably some unhappiness there.

Speaker 4 27:40

yeah, um, but again I think know, like you definitely had a military background. Like our childhood vacations, summer vacations we had a family cabin. It sounds cool, but it was like my great great grandparents built it on this like leased land in California, and so our summer vacations were going up and to take care of the cabin like to like fix the shingles yeah.

Speaker 2 28:01

Yeah, and like we didn't like stay going up to work clean the land. Yeah, that's it, that was all we did.

Speaker 4 28:07

So, yes, some of you are like thinking, like, like, oh, chris had a really strong work ethic, I had no choice. Yeah, like we worked on our vacations. We were at church every night.

Speaker 4 28:16

Like that's been instilled for me you know, as a, as a child, so so, yeah, so I, I think that you know they both had a relationship with Jesus, Um, and I think that, like, even if you ask them, they would say, hey, you know, I think we would have done some things differently, Um, but but again, I think you know they had Amway, they had, you know the tape subscriptions that would come through and so all you had was your local pastor and if that guy wasn't good at discipling like what are you going to do?

Speaker 4 28:54

If you don't have a man from the pulpit saying hey, man, get in your Bible pray what does the Bible say you? You're struggling with this if you don't have that in your life and you don't have the resources we have today, like that's just what you had so so I so, yeah, no, I, I don't.

Speaker 4 29:07

There's no fault in that, um, and there's a lot of life lessons I picked up from both of them, um. I distinctly remember there's one saying I, I uh from my mom. Anytime, nate and I would fight my brother and I when we fight um, and we like we would get at it pretty good. Yeah, nate and I did not like each other until we moved out. We just can't live together.

Speaker 4 29:27

Yeah, we didn't figure that out, but we would be in a huge argument. My mom would go do you? Praise Jesus with that mouth. And I think for her it like, held a lot of weight for us.

Speaker 3 29:35

It was a joke, like we were like, yeah, but like we didn't say anything bad either, yeah, kind of thing.

Speaker 4 29:41

But yeah, so, yeah, so they kept us in church. We were already part of the you know the minority the fact that our parents didn't get divorced, Come on, man you know. I'm sure if you were to chat with them about it, they'd say, hey, not everything was perfect all the time. In today's standards. I don't know if they would have necessarily made it.

Speaker 4 30:09

But I remember distinctly my mom and my dad saying, hey, we made this commitment, we're not getting divorced. Amen, be faithful to each other. And they were and they are. Man, it's real. You know they're still together and so, uh, you know, in california, like that was a thing coming out here, like most of my friends divorced yeah, my parents are divorced and so they're you know they talk about how great it is having multiple christmases, but you know the end of the day like they don't have their family together come on man so I remember growing up

Speaker 1 30:27

in mesa it was. It was like that my neighbor had a single mom, my best friend down the road had a stepdad and I still had my mom and dad and as a young boy it was like I felt like my family was special. Yeah, I still got mom and dad, yep, until I didn't. Then it just crushed me. You know what I mean. But I can remember being in elementary school and thinking I still got my parents. They've only got a mom. He's got a stepdad that he hates.

Speaker 1 30:54

My family's still together and just I don't know, I just remember feeling special you know what I mean that our families were still together.

Speaker 4 31:00

Yeah, that's real. Yeah, yeah, yeah, um, yeah, I'm really grateful for so. Childhood was good. Yeah, excuse me, sorry if I sound dumb. By the way, I uh had a. How do you sound dumb?

Speaker 2 31:16

oh, there's ways use the wrong words what people say.

Speaker 4 31:21

There's no dumb questions. I guarantee they're right. I've asked a few of them do you know I'm not watching sports.

Speaker 4 31:29

You think I'm watching sports right now. Uh, but yeah, childhood was. Childhood was good. Um, you know, lots of, yeah, lots of lots of good memories. I remember a lot with my, with my grandfather. Um, you know, on my, on my mom's side of things, they, you know, they, lived a few states away. We saw them maybe once a year. They're not a huge kind of relationship. You know, there's my mom has, you know, I think it's 11 brothers and sisters like, and then multiply all the kids and wow, so it's like that's a big family, yeah, yeah but on my dad's side, my papa, um, like, like he, he was the man like he.

Speaker 4 32:03

Like we go up to his house, he would have, um, he had, he had a, you know, wood shop in the backyard and he would have little scraps of wood and he would be like you know, do whatever you want. You want to screw these together, you want to glue them you want to paint them. You want to he'd paint rocks gold and he would always have something for us to do and remember that being a a great like relationship. Um, he taught me a lot of how to cook.

Speaker 3 32:24

Yeah.

Speaker 4 32:25

Um, he was a really good cook. Um, uh, how to fish. Do some of those things.

Speaker 2 32:29

Come on man.

Speaker 4 32:30

Um, I don't enjoy fishing. Uh sorry, I know that you guys do.

Speaker 2 32:34

Yeah, no, he's a hunter. He liked the hunting.

Speaker 4 32:40

I do like the hunting all about it.

Speaker 1 32:42

Um come right out of the water, yeah, so we.

Speaker 4 32:45

So I think every other weekend we go see him and all that stuff. But yes, we we move. I'm nine years old.

Speaker 1 32:50

We moved to arizona you guys do any sports when you're in california uh you got sports people, you and your brother.

Speaker 4 32:55

No, no no, not because we didn't want to be, but again, my dad was really into drinking iced tea and watching law and order yeah, okay so that that's the that's our fun.

Speaker 3 33:04

Yeah, and church. I mean lots of church.

Speaker 4 33:06

And we did Royal Rangers at church too growing up, and so you know there were. You know we never went on a camp out, but we got to learn knots and fires and you

Speaker 1 33:14

know all that kind of stuff Amen.

Speaker 4 33:16

Yeah, all good stuff. The summer before Arizona we had a treehouse. I did not hear this in Nate's story, so you guys will get into this.

Speaker 2 33:26

Yeah, we're getting some insight.

Speaker 4 33:28

So we had a treehouse and it was a sweet treehouse. You know like when you're a kid and you look back at something as an adult and you're like that was underwhelming, but as a kid it was like this is the best thing ever. Yeah it was sweet we played with so much fire up in the treehouse which as an adult is like probably not the greatest Right.

Speaker 2 33:45

You could burn yourself in the tree.

Speaker 4 33:47

Well, we came up with this cool invention. It was a rope elevator. So we took a cushion and we, like, put rope around it and then threw it over a branch and we would just like I would go down. I'd you know nade up and back down. And then he'd do the same thing for me, and so he had one of his friends over and, as his friend is there, he goes watch this, as I'm up in the tree, and he just goes. Oh wow, and it's goes, and let's go the rope. Oh wow, man.

Speaker 3 34:15

Nate, I landed like this oh, it broke my arm. Oh wow.

Speaker 4 34:23

And I remember just being so angry at him, and Still to this day, maybe a little bit when it rains, I can feel it. Yes, I broke my left arm, got a cast up to here, not crazy but, I, love. How God works Growth plate, I don't know.

Speaker 1 34:38

Cade broke his growth plate. I think it was up in here.

Speaker 4 34:41

I don't know God's so faithful. The next week Nate was riding on his skateboard and fell, and broke his arm.

Speaker 2 34:50

God's so faithful, he'll get you back.

Speaker 4 34:53

He'll get you back. His cast went up to here.

Speaker 2 34:58

Don't be mean to the Lord's anointed, even as a kid.

Speaker 1 35:01

He did say vengeance is his bud. He sure did.

Speaker 4 35:06

He sure did, that did, and so I just yeah it was.

Speaker 1 35:07

That's funny it was a fun he did, he did leave that out of his it was a fun thing, so but.

Speaker 4 35:13

But meanwhile we're moving to Arizona in the summer, yeah, with casts on our arms, and I again, I like I'm. Most people either think I'm funny or think I'm really mean, because they don't realize that my humor is really dry.

Speaker 1 35:26

I love your humor. Thanks, man.

Speaker 4 35:28

We were at the grocery store and the lady's like, hey, what happened to your arm? And I was like, oh, my dad beats me.

Speaker 3 35:34

My mom goes.

Speaker 4 35:35

No, no, everything's fine, nothing happened and I was like, oh yeah, and she's like, you can't say that in public, so anyway, so we get, my dad has a, a, a, uh, probably mint green toyota trussell stick shift and you know, state farm packs up the, you know the whole house yeah we get in that with. So it's. It's my mom and my dad, me and my brother. Um, we have two dogs and a cat in that toyota trussell and we begin our 12-hour journey to big dogs.

Speaker 4 36:06

Uh, one was small and one was really fat, yeah, um, and so yeah, he was, but like it already didn't have room yeah, and then a little car and we added all of our stuff and then animals wow so made the truck to you know we had to ride with the fat dog all of us it was on somebody's lap, obviously all the animals were in the backseat, with Nate and I Really yeah, so we got all of them.

Speaker 1 36:27

They give you the fat dog and you got the little one, or what. They went back and forth, did they? Yeah, it was not great, not great.

Speaker 4 36:36

Yeah, we make it to Arizona. And you know we grew up in, you know, downtown Mesa. You guys moved from there straight to mesa. Yeah, really yeah culture shock um. You know I, for me it was very similar to bakersfield really um a lot more mormons.

Speaker 1 36:54

Yeah, um, I've never been to bakersfield so I don't know what bigger feels like.

Speaker 4 36:57

It'd be like mesa, yeah um, maybe a little less stabby all right, um, but but still not great. But yeah, so we downtown Mesa, and you know when we moved in? Not a terrible time yet.

Speaker 3 37:09

Yeah.

Speaker 4 37:09

It definitely got real bad before we got out of there.

Speaker 1 37:13

It was that not direct. What year was that?

Speaker 4 37:14

Oh, man, that that's a good question. 27 years ago, so 98.

Speaker 3 37:24

Oh, wow.

Speaker 4 37:24

Yeah, that's not right, is it? Yeah, something like that.

Speaker 2 37:28

That's when we lived there. Yeah, it's 98. Wasn't it 99. That's when I got out of prison.

Speaker 1 37:32

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 37:34

Yeah, and it was heading that direction.

Speaker 1 37:35

It was just starting to get bad right about that time, yep.

Speaker 2 37:51

Yeah little limburg elementary school, broadway in uh southern and stapley broadway and stapley right. It's on the other side of mesa high, next to mesa junior junior right, yeah, no, that's, that's low.

Speaker 1 37:56

Oh, maybe I think a long fellow maybe yeah yeah, it was right, it was right in.

Speaker 4 38:01

Um, yeah, it was pretty close to mesa high on that on that side, but all right, um, yeah, oh yeah, right, it was right in. It was pretty close to Mesa, high on that side All right, but yeah oh. Yeah, it was on Lozona, yeah, right by the Grove Circle house.

Speaker 1 38:11

Yeah, yeah All right, yeah.

Speaker 4 38:13

So we went there. That's when I got my first taste into politics. I ran for student body president. Oh really, Wrote a fantastic speech and I got it. Wow, and I realized that. So we were the Lindbergh Flyers, but we were named after Ann Lindbergh, who was a advocate for endangered species, and her husband was Charles Lindbergh, the airplane guy. And I was like this is not right.

Speaker 4 38:35

So, my first order of business was to change the mascot because, like we have to be correct, Not much has changed since then, I still have the same drive. So we got the mascot changed and that's my claim to fame. If you drive by the school, you'll see the the snow leopards. Now really um, so we got that changed, uh, so I feel good about that. That's my first step into politics but yeah, and so this you know.

Speaker 1 39:00

Yeah, there's because it was named after her, not him, right? Yeah, yeah, that's actually a good. That was actually pretty smart of you dude.

Speaker 4 39:05

So yeah, Because it was named after her, not him, right?

Speaker 1 39:05

Yeah, yeah, that's actually good. That was actually pretty smart of you, dude.

Speaker 4 39:07

Yeah, thank you.

Speaker 2 39:09

As a what ninth grader?

Speaker 1 39:11

No, sixth grader, Sixth grader, fourth, fourth grader. Really man dude, wow dude.

Speaker 2 39:15

God gave you a brain. Yeah, sometimes it doesn't work in my favor.

Speaker 4 39:26

I think you can attest to that I know, buddy, there's a way that seems right to a man. It's interesting as an adult you look back at your childhood. I remember there's several times we were talking Eddie. Before this we were talking a little bit about Bible college I remember having to write up my testimony and going. I don't have much. I've been in church my whole life.

Speaker 3 39:44

I've never really been been bad.

Speaker 4 39:48

Things change. Yeah, but, but, but overall like you know, my childhood was good. Like you know, there there's things like I didn't like walking home in the in the middle of summer from school.

Speaker 2 39:59

Yeah, cause were you getting chased by the Mexicans, or was it just hot?

Speaker 4 40:04

Oh no, it was just hot.

Speaker 2 40:05

Okay, yeah.

Speaker 4 40:06

No, I was you guys live at right there off of like a La Zona and eighth. Yeah so right, right, there and again you were in the yeah, the.

Speaker 3 40:15

M and.

Speaker 1 40:16

M mark.

Speaker 2 40:16

Yeah, oh yeah, yeah, right there, bro. That's why I Okay, I remember us getting.

Speaker 4 40:22

Indian food one time and I was like so I'm not interested in buying it. But if I had to buy it, where?

Speaker 3 40:26

would I? I don't even know what to do, I'd get caught just finding out and he's like, that guy can sell it to you, that guy can sell it to you. That guy knows a guy that can sell it to you.

Speaker 4 40:42

Yeah, so it's one of those things that I probably not until I've gotten to junior high, of those things that you know I probably not until you know, I've gotten to uh junior high.

Speaker 2 40:48

I went to uh macy jr. Yeah, the eagles golden eagles.

Speaker 4 40:49

That's where you went right there?

Speaker 1 40:50

yeah, no longer exists.

Speaker 4 40:51

No longer exists, it's a soccer field that's okay, because that's even worse mesa yeah um, and so there I actually started a um a christian club on on campus wow, and so we're as a middle schooler yeah, wow, yeah, I got in a mormon church, in a mormon school.

Speaker 2 41:06

Well, I'm just back. Then it was Wow as a middle schooler, yeah Wow, in a Mormon church, in a Mormon school. Well, back then it was real Mesa was real Mormon.

Speaker 1 41:10

For sure yeah, and they had a seminary right across the street.

Speaker 4 41:14

Yeah, yep, yeah, yeah, and also a gun store.

Speaker 1 41:18

Yes, that's right, the barbershop. Which is funny because that wall right there is where everybody would go to smoke cigarettes and stuff. So you had the Mormons and then people smoking cigarettes all in the same place. It was kind of fitting. A little communal, I like it.

Speaker 2 41:31

A little communal yeah.

Speaker 4 41:33

I went to a, so again, it's kind of cool like the youth camp. I think the students here go to it. My daughter goes. There's a kids camping up in Prescott and it's kind of cool Like that daughter goes. There's a kids camping up in prescott and it's kind of cool like that's the camp I went to yeah, wow, as a kid, um, and so my kids are going to it now.

Speaker 2 41:48

So cool man, nephew were going to it and it's like this is the one that it's like weeks, three weeks, and they go up a different thing and yeah, yeah yeah.

Speaker 4 41:56

So it was really, you know, the summer before I started that I remember, like, going up to this and this is kind of like the first like there's this. There's this weird thing of like, you know, growing up in church and your parents going to church and you thinking I have a relationship with Jesus because my parents do, Um, and making that shift to it's not because my parents do, it's because I actually know Jesus.

Speaker 3 42:18

Like I can't.

Speaker 4 42:19

I can't ride their coattails anymore and really I remember that some some 13, um at this point and I go to this camp and, um, it's like, it's, it's cool, it's worship. It's a lot of freedom. You know, just like you know, I'm going to hang out on the rocks with my friends and talk to all hours of the night and just do whatever I want and you know, just really cool.

Speaker 4 42:40

But I remember like there was this service and there you know the pastor's talking and doing an altar call and right before we had gone up to that camp I'd asked my dad.

Speaker 4 42:47

I was like hey, so I don't ever remember like being saved yeah, ever, and he's like oh yeah, when you were six, I was like okay cool, I don't remember this yeah you know kind of thing, and so no, no doubt that you know six, that I'm sure that actually happened and that was a real life change and it's not like I'd stopped living from for god or any of that stuff, but it was one of those, like those crucial moments for me of like come on hey it's, I'm gonna rededicate my life.

Speaker 4 43:12

Yeah, one was like a little bit of like fire insurance of like I just want to make sure you just don't want to go to hell, yeah, but at the same time it's like, hey, I actually want this relationship with jesus so so I rededicate my life there, um really kind of feel like a a real God moment in that spot. And so I get back and kind of on fire and start this Christian club. And you know it's, it's wild, the guy that, uh, as a youth alive, I think that's still an AG thing.

Speaker 4 43:37

Um and so the guy that was like leading at the time was a. It was a used car salesman.

Speaker 3 43:42

And so he only worked off a commission. And so he was like.

Speaker 4 43:44

I was like hey man, I don't know what to do, and he's like well, I can't really come and help you because if I don't, work like I don't get paid, kind of thing. So I kind of just figured on my own. But you know some of it was kind of fun. I you know I'd be on the announcements every morning like making weird. Like you know, I got the the news to come out and you know they took photos, everything we got to lead, you know, prayer in front of the squad do this stuff.

Speaker 4 44:09

So it was, it was really cool to kind of you know, explore that and and there it led to lots of conversations. I kind of almost like rode this like I was in band too and I just putting it out there like there are cool kids in band and there are the band kids that you were thinking about when I said that there's cool kids you're like they don't exist, they do exist it's the ones that you see that give us the bad names.

Speaker 1 44:32

There are cool band kids trust me it's just not everybody in bands a dork, not every a lot of them, a lot of them, a lot of them but yeah, so I so I was somewhat in the cool things and also like my, again like my brother, really popular in school. Like everybody loved him.

Speaker 4 44:50

And so I think they were thinking the same thing from me. But we are different people, although I've been told recently we sound exactly the same, so that's kind of strange. I'm going to listen to the recordings back to back to see if this is true. Yeah, but anyway, um and so, uh. So the they're like connecting with me, like oh, you're another Peterson, you're really cool, and I'm like no, I follow the rules. Uh which is kind of interesting Cause. Then the one that didn't follow the rules becomes the cop.

Speaker 3 45:19

Not that he didn't follow the rules.

Speaker 4 45:20

I liked getting good grades and doing the right things, so anyway, it was this weird thing where I was kind of popular in a band because of my brother and at the same time starting this Christian club. So we really got to make a lot of cool memories and influence and different things there.

Speaker 1 45:36

Remember any PE coaches that were there.

Speaker 4 45:39

I remember what they looked like. I probably recognized their names.

Speaker 1 45:43

I'm trying to think what that dude's name was, the guy that did football, and he was a PE coach Harmon, coach Harmon.

Moving to Arizona and Finding Purpose

Speaker 4 45:50

Hmm, yeah, I know, it probably looks like it, but I wasn't big into sports for that either. Yeah, he's a ball-headed guy.

Speaker 1 45:57

Yeah, I don't know. He might not have been around by then. That was probably 30 or 40 years ago, bud, that's probably eight, nine years after I was there. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 46:05

Yeah, it is kind of weird. Next year I'm coming up on my 20 year high school reunion.

Speaker 1 46:07

Man isn't that crazy. It was pretty weird. Yeah, it goes quick bro.

Speaker 4 46:12

Yeah, uh, so that's. So that's kind of junior high. You know, that stuff I uh fit in with a lot of mormons you know, because that's just the easy path of like they're not messing up, they're. You know it's not exactly the same, but we not a lot of people I know go to church and you know I was friends with them because they always had food. Oh, I'd never tapped into that.

Speaker 1 46:37

No, it would have been cool yeah, they were so they had this neighbor family that was mormon and they were always baking stuff can I get some of your bread?

Speaker 2 46:45

I'd be out front playing.

Speaker 1 46:46

I'd be like, oh, that smells so good so I'd go knock on the door. Hey, is jesse here, come on in. Yeah, come on in. I'm like man, that bread smells good. You want a slice? Yes, I do that's awesome I became friends with jesse just so I could have some baked goods I'm sorry, jesse, I love you buddy but you're planting seeds. That's all, and he was the only first kid in the neighborhood that had a computer. Okay, so I'd go there and play computer games and eat bread.

Speaker 4 47:07

There you go. It was the best.

Speaker 1 47:09

It was the best Cool. Then I learned I could just break into their house. Oh my God.

Speaker 3 47:13

And have all the bread I want.

Speaker 4 47:17

We don't recommend doing that and not have to be friends with.

Speaker 1 47:20

I think just go for it If you're good at it.

Speaker 2 47:22

I served three years in prison for it there are some consequences if you don't do it right If you get caught. Yeah, there you go.

Speaker 3 47:32

Fair enough.

Speaker 2 47:33

God help me.

Speaker 4 47:35

Yeah, the Lord doesn't see it.

Speaker 2 47:36

Make me invisible.

Speaker 1 47:37

God, I didn't know the Lord at the time. You knew Jesus, I did, but he used to jump me. Okay, yeah, I was riding my bike, so me and him didn't get along fair enough. Yeah, yeah, fair enough um and and uh, javier, there was a couple of them that started with a j, that used to like to jump us yeah, run yeah, you didn't get to meet that when the you no, they probably weren't around when you were in the neighborhood.

Speaker 4 48:05

I kept my head down, yeah, and kept to myself, and if I saw people I walked the opposite direction. Just all the things 8th Avenue and Frazier. Yeah.

Speaker 1 48:15

There was a two-story house right there on the corner. Yep, that was the 8th Avenue locals house.

Speaker 4 48:25

Okay, yeah, awesome, yeah, yeah. I stayed away from a lot there. There's only one time I remember in our, in our neighborhood riding, I had a, a cool like bmx kind of bike. I'm sure it was like a, a vmx, like from walmart. That's like the knockoff yeah but I had pegs and whatever. I remember one kid like stopping me and going this is kind of a nice bike.

Speaker 2 48:39

I was like it sure is. I punched him in the stomach and rode away.

Speaker 4 48:42

I know where this is going, yeah, um did they still have the hills behind them?

Speaker 1 48:45

in mart, when you were there, they used to have little hills out behind them and then that you could ride.

Speaker 4 48:50

No, no, yeah, I think they cleared that out probably yeah, I do walk through there to go to mesa high or so mason jr um 7-eleven.

Speaker 1 48:59

Right there used to have video games 7-eleven. Yeah, right there at horn or, uh, stapley and eighth avenue, there used to be a 7-Eleven. Yeah, right there, at Horn or Stapley and 8th Avenue, there used to be a 7-Eleven right there they used to have video games. Oh man, I was always late to school. I'd stop at 7-Eleven, play video games and, oh my god, I gotta go yeah, that's awesome, yeah, so, yes, that's.

Speaker 4 49:18

You know, that's kind of junior high high school.

Speaker 1 49:21

You, being from Mesa, is going to take me down memory lane, so there's going to be a lot of little things that pop in my head, brother, that I'm going to share.

Speaker 4 49:26

Let's go, let's go, yeah yeah, um yeah, uh, high school is cool.

Speaker 1 49:31

Um you know, we live a lot closer now um I I get a car good grades of course, yeah, when you first went there and you saw the bridges getting to the second level. Did you think that was cool?

Speaker 4 49:44

it kind of intimidated me a little bit yeah to be honest, like I, um, if I don't, if I'm not comfortable with something, I tend to not want to do it yeah and so that always gave me even the first day of school of like having your little, like print out and you're like, oh yeah, where do I go?

Speaker 1 49:58

where's all the classes? What do I do? Yeah, you follow the one road you're on and no and it was weird because they had the classes that were in the trailers and stuff over here. Yep, they weren't always here or downstairs, some of them were over here, so you're like trying to get here and got to run over there to get to class.

Speaker 4 50:11

You got like three and a half minutes to get there. It's like don't talk to anybody yeah.

Speaker 1 50:15

I remember getting there and seeing the little bridge going from the sidewalk to the second story, yeah, and thinking this is cool.

Speaker 4 50:21

Yeah, you know what I mean. I love the driving course they had there.

Speaker 2 50:24

Oh, yeah, so did.

Speaker 1 50:26

I.

Speaker 4 50:26

I definitely did that, didn't they have the hill. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 1 50:30

Yeah.

Speaker 4 50:30

I learned absolutely nothing.

Speaker 1 50:32

Did they have the simulators too?

Speaker 4 50:33

Yeah, the simulators, the key to that is if you want to go to the speed limit you put a second gear in for it and you just aced the whole thing. I only did it for insurance purposes. I got like a discount or something for doing it.

Speaker 1 50:49

I just did it because it was a fun class. I wanted to drive For sure, yeah it was cool, yeah.

Speaker 4 50:54

so I think you know, towards the end of my sophomore year I get my license, get a car. I had a Chevy Lumina a super old one, the dash lights did not work. I had a little clip-on light that would light up the dash, get that going and I got my first real job at Office Max. Really I worked there over the summer doing overnight stocking and then school starts and I did the sales stuff and really liked it Because again good memory I knew where everything was at so somebody would walk in and be like I need rubber bands, Like that's on aisle six halfway down on the right, and I feel like Dwight Schrute right now, but anyway, what about Pizza Mart, the office?

Speaker 1 51:33

Oh yeah, you ever do Pizza Mart. Oh yeah, oh dude.

Speaker 4 51:38

We'd do Pizza Mart or pennies yeah we would do um that'd be after church yeah we'd go there, and then my brother and I would walk to the mervins wow uh like we had christmas money, whatever yeah, target gift cards worked at mervins that's where I got all my school clothes.

Speaker 1 51:54

Yeah, mervins, it was.

Speaker 2 51:55

It was horrible, that was a long time ago, corduroy pants all the way up till junior high school my mom. Finally, let me get a pair of levi's.

Speaker 3 52:01

Yeah it was worse.

Speaker 1 52:03

Oh oh, I got some school pictures, bro, You're going to be like what the who?

Speaker 2 52:08

was dressing you, buddy, my mom.

Speaker 3 52:11

Love you, grandma you remember penny loafers.

Speaker 1 52:13

You old enough to know penny loafers. Oh yeah, Always penny loafers.

Speaker 3 52:16

Okay.

Speaker 1 52:16

I didn't get my first pair of sneakers until junior high school. I was penny loafers, corduroys and weird printed car shirts.

Speaker 4 52:25

Now, this makes a lot of sense. I'm putting pieces together. Oh, dude, it was horrible dude.

Speaker 1 52:30

I look back now and I'm like no wonder you got picked on, dude. For sure you know what I mean. You look like a dork yeah.

Speaker 4 52:35

Yeah, yeah, I did the. I similarly, in a sense of like I guess I skipped over this a little bit, but you know my, my mom got sick when I was really young, yeah, and so from about age nine, 10 and some aspects kind of on our own like school shopping and all that stuff and um, I think, I think my fashion sense is much better today. I'm not saying I have any, but I'm saying it's much better today than when I was that age.

Speaker 3 53:00

Same. Thing.

Speaker 4 53:05

I'm just in myself from the clearance bin and like trying to figure stuff out and, uh, I was never cool in school um, but yeah, so I you know, uh, 16 years old, I'm working at office. Max, I have a buddy he works at. Um, I won't necessarily call it out in case we're not past the statute of limitations, but there's an old bowling alley in mesa that we probably have all been to. Yeah and um, he's working there, and so I, uh he's like, hey, do you want?

Speaker 4 53:27

to remain well, again, I I can't confirm okay, I love you, dad.

Speaker 1 53:32

It's not there no more it is currently not a bowling yeah, it's a four by four shop or something. I don't know it used to be officially.

Speaker 3 53:38

I have no idea what you're talking about amen, we can talk about later, but anyway, so so our buddy starts working there.

Speaker 4 53:44

He's like a supervisor there.

Speaker 1 53:45

We're 16.

Speaker 4 53:46

Yeah, Like and so. So it's me, him and one other dude. We're working at this bowling alley. No one else is in charge. It's us three. Yeah, Okay, oh Jesus.

Speaker 1 53:58

You're kids, yeah, yeah, really, yeah, really responsible kids though and you know what?

Speaker 4 54:02

I would say a little bit inventive as well. What we did is we memorized the prices, and so when somebody would say, hey, I'd like an hour of bowling, you know with the rental, and we're like, oh, that's $31.50. No sale? On the register It'd pop open.

Speaker 4 54:19

We'd take their money and we'd put it on one side of the register. The next transaction. We'd do it correctly and put it in another spot. Yeah, so then there was a dead spot in the camera, so at the end of the night we would slip the cash and we had awesome things Like we had man, we had cool subwoofers in our cars.

Speaker 3 54:36

Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 54:37

We could buy whatever we wanted, like that was cool as well, as we were really cool friends with the bartender. Anytime they needed a cake change, we would go into the walk-in freezer and there would be Jager bombs just lined up for us or he'd have like a big thing of Sprite and hypnotic like ready to go for us. I don't know you guys sponsored by hypnotic. I don't know, if.

Speaker 4 55:02

I'm honest so that'd be lined up ready to go for us. And so we go in there, slam whatever's in there, nothing needed to be changed it's just the code, word can't change. Yes, so we would get done with the night and I don't think we were actually drunk, but we, you know, 16 you don't really know what's what yeah so we would drive home in a formation because we live like relatively close to each other and we'd be on the phone talking like okay, I'm peeling off, go to my neighborhood.

Speaker 4 55:27

So we did this for like I don't know three or four months and at that time I was a youth leader in our youth group naturally, yeah, and my youth pastor's like hey, something's up like I don't can't put my finger on it, but something's not right with you and you need to quit that job yeah and I was like well I well.

Speaker 4 55:42

I think I'm doing okay, like this, it's pretty, it's pretty fun, yeah, you know, and he goes yeah, okay, well, let me, let me make it clear for you you can be a youth leader or you can work that job. Yeah, which one do you want to do? Wow, so ecosystem works and there's probably a lot of like setback in that season based off of that yeah. So, uh, when I say it's cool, like it felt cool in the season, yeah.

Speaker 4 56:08

Not my, not my greatest moments, um, yeah, so, so you know, you start this. This is where, like the, the like, hey, this is where I'm designed to go. This is like the flesh kind of stuff of like the testimony, where it's like, yeah, you're fighting that.

Speaker 1 56:22

I the war I have some freedom.

Speaker 4 56:24

You know my parents. They didn't know anything yeah I knew what the right things to say like I was home by the right time, or I would check in by a certain time, or I'd you know whatever, and like they never play the game?

Speaker 2 56:34

yeah, play the game.

Speaker 4 56:35

Yeah, you were the good son yeah, yeah, and still probably most people would try to look at it and be like you know, that's not that bad yeah but still like. For me it was like like I do something wrong. I'm a classic like overthinker. I mull it over for months and not be able to sleep.

Speaker 3 56:49

Oh, wow.

Speaker 4 56:50

Like God, I'm so sorry, Like I messed up, kind of thing. So so, yeah, so so this is, this is kind of happening at the same time. Now I'm at church. I'm, you know, I played saxophone all through high school, my saxophone, all through high school, my. What church were you guys going to? We're going to, uh, at that time, new life family church, actually right up here on um.

Speaker 2 57:10

It's now uh, living word living word gilbert, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 57:14

And so, uh, my, my youth pastor comes up to me and goes hey, um, we're starting a youth band. I need someone to play bass. Can you play bass? It's like I play saxophone, but I mean it can't be that hard and probably figure, figured out. Yeah, so I figured out get a bass learn. It started a band and we started doing worship. Wow, um, and, and really this whole time, my entire life I've wanted to sing and lead worship. Yeah, it's my thing, and there's a moment, um, and sorry, dad, if you're listening, but um, there's a moment. I remember, you know, we're living in arizona. My mom, my mom was always known for doing specials at church.

Speaker 3 57:47

Yeah.

Speaker 4 57:48

You know it's offering time, she'd have the track and she'd play it and she'd do the. You know friends are friends forever.

Speaker 3 57:53

The Lord's the friend of them or whatever your mom sang oh yeah, oh wow.

Speaker 4 57:59

She was a special lady. She would always sing at special moments at church yeah, yeah, yeah and so there was one time where I'm like I'm gonna sing with her, and so my mom was like working with me, and my dad just looked at me and goes son, you sound real bad, wow like you can't get up there.

Speaker 1 58:12

Yeah, I was like and it's like to shoot any confidence or any hope I'm developing.

Speaker 4 58:18

So it's like like to me it sounds good and I I grant you to record yourself and you listen back. You're like okay, but there's like that, that first, like that doesn't feel great. So anyway, so we're, you know, doing this here and I'm, I'm, I'm playing bass, and we're in this youth band and writing songs and you know having fun, and you know I sing, but I don't have enough projection in my voice.

Speaker 3 58:42

And so.

Speaker 4 58:42

I just kind of get passed over. In fact, I had good stage presence and so I would be on stage, but my mic would be off. Oh, man, so that like and it was one of those things like I know, I think I know sound.

Speaker 3 58:54

Yeah.

Speaker 4 58:54

Right, like I got started in like production.

Speaker 3 58:56

Yeah.

Speaker 4 58:57

Because no one else would run it. And I was at church all teach myself how to, you know, do the stuff, and so I knew it was happening. But I'm just like, all right, I'm going to keep pressing after this. And so, um, you know, we're probably, you know, 18 or so, go to a. Um, there's a conference in Colorado Springs, a desperation conference. So I go to that and I really felt God call me into ministry.

Speaker 4 59:25

Here's the cool thing is I found out later on Leslie's at that. My wife is at that same conference. Wow, she's living in Kansas at that time.

Speaker 3 59:33

I'm from Arizona.

Speaker 4 59:34

Ron Luce was one of the speakers there, which I don't know if he's still alive, but I imagine he is, and so he's talking about destiny and calling and all this stuff she feels called into ministry at the same conference, at the same place.

Speaker 2 59:47

We don't know each other.

Speaker 4 59:48

Wow, no, no idea, so um man yeah, so pretty wild stuff. So I come back and I'm like, all right, I'm going to do school worship at you know, new life, colorado Springs, that's what I'm doing. And my youth pastor goes yeah, have you heard yourself sing? And I'm like, yeah, he goes. No, they have a great internship like a leadership college. I'd recommend that Really. You won't do it at worship. Wow Dang, there's another like man, this hurts.

Speaker 1 1:00:21

To know now what I know about you now that's crazy that they it gets worse really really bro yeah yeah, I'm, I'm currently walking people just kept shutting you down.

Speaker 4 1:00:33

Yes, really very significant people in my life. Wow, dude like influential people huge wow.

Speaker 2 1:00:40

Dude, you cared about what they said, man. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 1:00:43

Damn. Yeah, we're getting close.

Speaker 2 1:00:46

Man, those hurt bud yeah, those ones crush you.

Speaker 4 1:00:49

Yeah, so I end up not going. Obviously, dang, I don't go to this, you know, and there's some You're not good enough.

Speaker 2 1:00:55

No, that's what you start telling yourself I'm not good enough.

Speaker 4 1:00:58

To be honest, probably wasn't, like there was a lot of training that needed to take place and there's a lot of like.

Speaker 2 1:01:03

Preparation. So you're ready to go?

Speaker 4 1:01:05

Yeah, you know, and Leslie, one of the things she says all the time is you know you don't doubt in the dark what you heard in the light. Yeah, but you know, at that time it was like I know God's called me to hear. Oh, that's good, but at the darkest moments it's really easy to doubt everything that's going on and you. You go back to what did God say last?

Speaker 1 1:01:33

That's what you go back to, until you hear him say something different.

Speaker 4 1:01:36

That's what you go back to.

Speaker 1 1:01:37

And it's up to you to receive what someone speaks over you. I know that now, yeah, as a kid. Though, man, yeah, god, it's devastating dude For sure, wow, bro.

Speaker 4 1:01:46

Well, and they're the people that I'm with 24-7. Yeah. You know, yeah, and so and.

Speaker 2 1:01:51

I'm believing and trusting for them to speak and raise me up. They're leaders in your life, yeah.

Speaker 1 1:01:56

People that you Dang For sure.

Speaker 4 1:01:57

All oh dang bro, yeah, so you know we make a well, I say I make a church change. My youth pastor at the time. He actually grew up with Chone, really and I don't know if you remember you know Scott Ogles, that was his youth pastor.

Speaker 3 1:02:13

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:02:13

And so you know the Ogles are a fan favorite around here. Yeah, man there's some real good people.

Speaker 2 1:02:21

Getting ready to schedule.

Speaker 4 1:02:22

Elva. Okay, have her come on, bro.

Speaker 2 1:02:23

I can't wait, she's like I was having a dinner with. I was like you got a good memory.

Speaker 4 1:02:27

She's like I remember everything I was like I believe this is great yeah, you're coming on yeah I think any ogles that you get to come on the podcast is going to be a win yeah amen, they're, they're, they're fun bucks, we got to sit down with her and her husband it was just the four of us at a table having dinner.

Speaker 1 1:02:41

Yeah and God, what a great conversation man. Yeah, him trying to get stuff out of him was a little hard. Yeah, she talked up a storm man. But I was more interested in what's your story, dude. Tell me your story, bro. You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 1:02:56

You want to talk about, like what a man should look like.

Speaker 1 1:02:59

Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 1:03:00

That's that dude, oh yeah.

Speaker 1 1:03:01

Yeah, he's still got the greatest hair. Oh yeah, I've never met a man his age that still has great hair, bro, for sure, it's still just luscious and full.

Speaker 4 1:03:10

Now looking at his next boy, like that didn't pan out well for him, but as someone who's follicly challenged myself, I can say, like there's nothing we can do about it. It is what it is. Love you, jim. That's fantastic, but yeah, so we're looking for churches. And at that time, like anytime, you know, we're.

Speaker 2 1:03:33

What year are we around right here? 18?. You were born. My age You're 86? 87. 87, okay.

Speaker 1 1:03:39

Yeah, so this is probably when you say we are you talking, you and your mom and dad no, so yeah, he made the church change.

Speaker 4 1:03:44

Yeah, so my parents, they had actually so my dad, he had actually moved to Colorado anticipating me like going to school there, oh wow. And then like coming back when I was just like, hey, this isn't going to work out, whoa, and so so hold on.

Speaker 2 1:03:59

My dad believed in you, or what God was calling you to, for sure that he went before to go get a place so that you guys would be good as you take this step of faith. Yeah, wow, mike, I love you bro. Yeah, you know there's a.

Speaker 4 1:04:16

I guess there's a little part of that. There's a season, while we're at that church at new life, where my dad ends up quitting state farm and, you know, cashes out 401k, does all the things to go into ministry, yeah and that's honestly the first time I can in my head think like like you are really happy wow wow there's been funny there's been good moments and stuff, but but.

Speaker 4 1:04:37

But that's the first time I can see like, hey, you're doing some of the things that you feel like you're supposed to do there's a difference between enjoying moments and walking in your call and being in your lane man.

Speaker 4 1:04:47

There's a difference, yeah so he's there for a little bit. You know he works. You know after that he worked for tbn for a little bit. Um, he was, he was at the switcher doing you know different stuff oh, nice man the the turner, wow, trinity, trinity, yeah, wow over there in phoenix okay so he had a couple of those things. But yeah, he'd moved out to colorado or to uh yeah, colorado springs and uh was were you living by yourself?

Speaker 4 1:05:10

no, I was living at home oh wow time and uh paying lots of rent yeah and uh um kudos to your parents for that.

Speaker 2 1:05:16

That's right. It's how they start. It's how you start your first taste of responsibility. Your parents were raising adults. Hello sure they were they were teaching you. I was raising kids Shut up, dude. We were getting high together, but we're raising nothing.

Speaker 4 1:05:30

I can step out if you guys need us.

Speaker 2 1:05:34

We need you to pray for us at the end bud.

Speaker 3 1:05:38

We need witnesses yeah, so there's that piece.

Speaker 4 1:05:42

You know, and I'll say this, like there, and there's's lots of people in my corner, but my dad's one of the ones when it comes to ministry. That's like always in my corner wow like anytime there's a ministry, something like you know, I'm here like he. Anything we need to do to help like he's in for and I love you even in this current season, like if we, you know, even if it's as simple as like hey, can you watch the kids for a couple hours?

Speaker 3 1:06:00

kind of thing I got to go do yeah.

Speaker 4 1:06:02

Yeah, whatever that is, would you?

Speaker 1 1:06:03

say that your dad knew there was a calling on your life, for sure, really.

Speaker 4 1:06:07

Yeah, and he encouraged that. Oh yeah, I love that. Yeah, for sure, I got that, I got that here.

Speaker 3 1:06:13

Yeah.

Speaker 1 1:06:14

Me and his mom know there's a calling on this dude's life. That's why we allow so much to go to, because we know God has great things. You should start charging him rent. He does, they do, we do now their house costs us more money, so everybody else had to pitch in. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 1:06:29

That's awesome.

Speaker 1 1:06:30

Shut up, Chris he pays it in a lot of other ways. Brother, I do bud, he cleans the house, he does the grocery shopping, I cook. I take care of the pets, oh, but you can't put a price on that. I don't have to do it. So.

Speaker 3 1:06:44

I would pay somebody good money to do all that for me.

Speaker 4 1:06:46

So therefore, yep, and that's why you have kids, right.

Speaker 1 1:06:50

Yes, yes. I don't know why I have kids.

Speaker 2 1:06:54

I do, I don't know if you like nevermind.

Speaker 1 1:07:00

That's probably the main reason I still question the decision, though I'm just kidding. Yeah, I love my cat.

Speaker 4 1:07:07

Oh, my God, that's funny, but yeah, so my dad's a huge supporter of all that stuff. But you know, at that time they're kind of doing their own thing. I think at that time they were actually going to Without Walls, really.

Speaker 2 1:07:22

Good church.

Speaker 4 1:07:22

Before they moved to their Mesa location uh, without walls really.

Speaker 1 1:07:25

Um, good church. Before they moved to their mesa location, then you know. So, when you were at the one here, was just you by yourself or were they there with you? No, just me, really yeah 18 19 when did you? Start doing church on your own, away from your parents, probably 18, really wow, wow, yeah, it was what made you decide to do that.

Speaker 4 1:07:42

You know youth leader thing well, you know they, they felt called to leave, and you know one thing about me, and even Leslie, is that we're loyal people.

Speaker 2 1:07:50

You really are Faithful.

Speaker 4 1:07:53

It takes a lot to get us to leave anywhere. Like it's not a and so we just didn't feel released to leave there. And you know at that point actually. So my youth pastor and I we were actually working at like creating like a campus ministry in high schools. Wow and something happened with him and basically the instruction was like hey, you know, Chris, you're welcome to be here, as long as you're not with him. And I was like well, that doesn't feel right so.

Speaker 2 1:08:18

I was like see ya.

Speaker 4 1:08:21

So we're looking for churches. Scott Owens was like hey, there is like, hey, there's this cool, like kind of startup church they're on like Higley and Chandler Heights. He's like just follow the signs and true, like Scott Ols fashion of like hey, it's just over there somewhere, like just kind of look for stuff and you'll figure it out.

Speaker 2 1:08:37

I love you.

Speaker 3 1:08:37

Scott we did follow the.

Speaker 4 1:08:40

A-frames man it was just enough information that we were able to follow the A-frames, get there.

Speaker 4 1:08:45

So here's kind of the cool thing is, we get there and I'm like kidding there's a, there's a girl that's singing on stage, um, and I'm like man, she looks familiar, like I've seen her somewhere, she has like red hair and I'm like I've I don't like I feel like I know her from somewhere and so I started kind of looking and I realized that. So I had done camp with. So at the church when I was at New Life, we did camp with when Scott and Dee they were actually over the youth at a little church called Christ Life and we did camp together and they just had new pastors come in at Christ Life.

Speaker 3 1:09:21

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 1:09:22

I don't know if you've met them, Pastor David.

Speaker 3 1:09:23

Sheree yeah, yeah, I don't know if you've met them, pastor David Sheree yeah, yeah, and so we did a camp together with them.

Speaker 4 1:09:26

Wow, and Lacey was singing there at that camp.

Speaker 2 1:09:29

At the camp.

Speaker 4 1:09:30

Oh wow, Much younger because it's like a few.

Speaker 2 1:09:33

you know, I think she's still in high school at that point and so we get there and I'm like whoa, this is crazy Sunday, following the signs and you see what are the chances, and so there's one so remember William his sister Adela she comes up to me, she goes I know you from somewhere and I'm like, oh, it's probably from camp.

Speaker 4 1:09:56

Okay, so I have a rebellious side of me, yeah.

Speaker 3 1:10:01

I'm not going to confess this here, but if I tell you this, you can't think differently about me. It'll make me love you more. So at this camp I really had a habit of I'm not going to confess this here, but if I tell you this, you can't think differently about it.

Speaker 2 1:10:05

Never, brother, it'll make me love you more, so at this camp I really had a habit of mooning people oh, that's great dude. Nice like full ass.

Speaker 4 1:10:14

Yes nice, so I was known as the great white hiney oh my god, this is great dude, and it was right. When I turned 18, I'm at this camp and my youth pastor pulled me aside. His name was Tony and he's like he goes hey. So a couple things You're at a youth camp and you're an adult now.

Speaker 2 1:10:32

You're showing your butt to kids. This could get weird Flash forward. We're at. Lifelink Adela goes hey, I remember you. Oh my God, oh goes. Hey, I remember you. Oh my god, oh my god, you're the great white hiney.

Speaker 4 1:10:49

Oh no, I'm never going back there. Oh no, I think I made it like one or two sundays before I was recognized by my rear end and I wasn't showing it obviously. Um, so that was fine but, there's enough connections that are. There's like we've done a lot with scott Scott and. Dee, just the proximity that we were with them. Seeing Lacey on stage, we'd be like, okay, that's cool, We'd actually done worship before together just didn't realize it and then Adele is there and I'm like and here's another cool.

Speaker 4 1:11:17

Thing about that camp that we were at. There's actually a drummer I play with now. He was just starting then and was terrible. He's fantastic now but I told him. I was like yeah, I was like do you remember doug and laurie? And like, uh, like I was talking about this camp, he goes. Hey, I was at that camp and I was like, yeah, he goes. Did you have a red bass? I was like I did yeah, he's like you play saxophone.

Speaker 4 1:11:36

I did because that's me and I'm like, wow, you're like one of our best drummers right now yeah and like so. Anyway, it's just, it's just weird how like god works. You never know which season you're in and what pieces and what people are going to be a part of it, like how that's going to come out don't burn bridges, that's right.

Speaker 2 1:11:51

Man don't burn bridges, and yeah yeah, so.

Pursuing Ministry and Facing Rejection

Speaker 4 1:11:54

So, yes, we're, you know we're at lifelink I'm great white that's gonna be the title the great white heinies testimony unfortunately.

Speaker 1 1:12:03

Unfortunately that every time I see you now, that's going to be the first thing that pops into my head, brother.

Speaker 2 1:12:08

Change your contact info.

Speaker 1 1:12:10

Every time I see you I'm going to be like, oh, what's up? Great White Heine, yeah. You're no longer Dr or Pastor Chris. You're now the Great White Heine.

Speaker 4 1:12:17

Can we do, dr Heine?

Speaker 2 1:12:20

Dr Heine, this is great. I love you bro.

Speaker 4 1:12:24

We've officially lost the audience.

Speaker 1 1:12:26

They're intrigued now.

Speaker 2 1:12:28

They're loving this. They can't wait to come back tomorrow.

Speaker 1 1:12:33

You're probably going to get a couple text messages.

Speaker 2 1:12:35

Yeah, you really are bud For sure.

Speaker 4 1:12:38

Yeah, so we're at LifeLink, we're attending on Sunday.

Speaker 1 1:12:44

You keep saying we. What do you mean by we? Yeah, so my youth pastor and I like it's just the two of us.

Speaker 4 1:12:48

Like it was one of those things where, like literally, I was at his house probably every night. All right, you know, friday nights, you know I'd go to Blockbuster and rent a movie. Go to his us I guess he had a family, six of us, whatever yeah, anyway, was he raising you up?

Speaker 2 1:13:06

was it something that he saw the call in your life and he's like okay, so, so, yeah, so what am I?

Speaker 4 1:13:10

he was pouring into you, yeah, one of my first jobs. It wasn't like an official kind of thing, but he was a drywall, you know repair kind of guy, and so he had me be his apprentice one summer. I've never thrown up more in my entire life, oh yeah, drywall is not fun well, he did lots of remodel the heat buddy. He's talking about the heat I remember one specific, one, specific thing, where we, we were working on a roof in the middle of summer oh my god and so I went to circle k and I got a chocolate milk oh

Speaker 1 1:13:37

jesus I got a banana bread. Oh, what are you doing?

Speaker 4 1:13:40

a like a danish, oh wow, pounded all of it, got up on the roof and I know if you know, if you can see where this is going, but it did not last very long man so it was all that and that heat. Yeah, so it's tony chone yeah uh, chone was working with me on this job too. Wow, we're all working on this roof. I throw up everywhere. Uh, basically almost pass out, um, and this is. Yeah, it was just, it was amazing.

Speaker 3 1:14:05

This is my perfect summer like everything I could have wished for.

Speaker 4 1:14:08

Yeah so, um, so anyway. So, yeah, so we're. So we do a lot of life together. He teaches me a lot of like how to build things and um this is tony yeah, tony, yeah, even in the. You know, if you're in the mountains and it's like here, here's how you like switch lanes and drive so that you're not like putting extra strain on your car. Here's your downshift.

Speaker 3 1:14:24

Here's like you know, do all these things, oh wow.

Speaker 4 1:14:26

Yeah.

Speaker 3 1:14:28

So a lot of the things and even lots of leadership things.

Speaker 4 1:14:31

Even in there, like again, like I think, as a youth leader, as a youth pastor, he taught me everything he knew how to do. He met the best. There were some things that I think again some bad.

Speaker 2 1:14:40

Some unwiring. Yeah, that happens with everybody, everybody, I'm sure.

Speaker 4 1:14:44

In fact I can tell you in my young 20s there's probably a lot of things I would have changed about what I told people to do and not do Amen. So no condemnation, no pressure, any of that stuff.

Speaker 4 1:14:53

But yeah, so he taught me a lot of that stuff. So yeah, so we did a campus. So we were at our last church, we did a see you at the prayer and this dude he did not fit in whatsoever. He shows up. He's wearing like bright white cowboy boots, the tightest jeans with like crosses in the butt like a bolo tie His name's Kerry Robinson.

Speaker 1 1:15:19

Oh whoa yeah, oh my God.

Speaker 4 1:15:22

So he showed up at this before we even at Lifelink. Yeah, so again God. So he showed up at this before we even at, at at lifelink. Yeah, so again, that's another connection we get here. And I was like I know you we've done some stuff together.

Speaker 2 1:15:31

We've done some youth ministry together.

Speaker 4 1:15:33

So, um.

Speaker 2 1:15:34

God will always give you signs. Yeah, God will always give you signs to show you and remind you and let you know you're right where I want you son and you know it was great.

Speaker 4 1:15:43

And even then, like some of the annoying things, like pastor dave, he he's. You know they had a worship audition thing up there he goes. You know, none of us are, none of us are professionals and I'm like are you, are you high? Like you are a professional? Yeah you ever? I don't know if you guys ever pastor you play keys. Oh yeah, it's man yeah, it is absolutely infuriating if you're like I don't really play keys and he does the Immediately starts playing, perfect everything.

Speaker 4 1:16:09

Gospel that kind of thing. And so I was like, okay, well, I play bass, I can jump in here. So I do. So I jump in. I have three auditions. The first time I brought my saxophone, my acoustic guitar, my bass, and he's like cool, we could use bass. I'm like great, I'm the whitest player you've ever met. And Pastor Dave, nothing but gospel. So we played this song. It's called who Is Like the Lord and I just drove that song all the way through. But it's like who is like the Lord? Nobody.

Speaker 4 1:16:37

It's lots of syncopation lots of stuff going on and like I don't know how to play it. So he like writes out all these notes and he's like this is what you have to do. He's like come back next week. So I come back the next week and it's better, and he goes that's great, this isn't what I told you to do.

Speaker 2 1:16:51

So change the stage, here comes the rebellion.

Speaker 4 1:16:58

Next week and he goes. Okay, great, Okay, I think, if you guys still do live banding.

Speaker 2 1:17:01

Oh yeah, oh yeah, Confused.

Speaker 4 1:17:03

This was started in 2008.

Speaker 2 1:17:06

Wow.

Speaker 3 1:17:06

Pastor Dave was doing this, yeah, so then I'm playing at CTA.

Speaker 4 1:17:10

I'm playing through a bass amp that's not going through the house.

Speaker 3 1:17:13

No one can hear me.

Speaker 4 1:17:17

Pastor Dave's playing the bass on his left hand on the keyboard and a lot of people come to me after service and be like the way that you played bass today just like touched my soul you.

Speaker 2 1:17:26

Those lines were so pastor was up there. It wasn't me at all, it was him, so that's why I guess it's just annoying he's like oh, we're not professionals.

Speaker 3 1:17:29

Like come on, you're a professional, wow so, um, yeah so.

Speaker 4 1:17:35

So that kind of started the journey of kind of getting in and you know doing different things. I at that time actually I think you know lacy had actually gone off to the school I actually wanted to go to. And so I got to actually lead worship for our youth band. Wow, before we went to a Saturday night service, we did our youth on Saturday nights.

Speaker 4 1:17:53

And so there's probably a couple of months I got to lead worship Jeremy Russell. He played bass. I believe Josh Russell was a singer. We had another piano player. Anyway, it was a cool kind, yeah, another piano player. Anyway, it was a cool kind of deal and we start this up and at this time, one of he comes to be my mentor, but his name is Jonathan. He comes into the picture and he moves. Here he's from. He's played with Israel. He's played. He's a fantastic.

Speaker 1 1:18:20

Again, another annoying musician, I'm going to murder his last name, name.

Speaker 4 1:18:24

but you're telling us yeah, so he's another annoying musician who's phenomenal that like he's the guy yeah, he can he'll listen to a song, be like oh, uh, that's in the key of c, uh, those chords are like one, six, five and maybe a four, uh, maybe a five over seven, and like I'm like okay and just, you're just listening to this and just picking this up that kind of thing.

Speaker 4 1:18:47

So anyway, so I start working with him a lot. He's kind of you know, I'm trying to pick his brain. He's phenomenal at bass. He slaps and pops and does all the things. He makes up chords on the guitar that aren't actual chords, but he just understands music theory and puts it together and figures it out.

Speaker 3 1:19:01

So anyway.

Speaker 4 1:19:03

so we're working together and I'm trying to. You know, we actually went through the same membership class together at lifelink. That's how we were kind of there. And so, um, you know, there's talks of like this, this school of ministry that's going to take place in the school of worship. That's a part of that, and so he's like, but I'm going to work with Chris on this, and so I oh, so he's going to like lead it.

Speaker 4 1:19:25

Well, yeah, and he wrote a lot of the curriculum. Him and Pastor Sri wrote a lot of the curriculum for worship. And a lot of stuff really like it. It's one of those things that are just ingrained in you and for anybody that went through school of ministry, school of worship was harder.

Speaker 3 1:19:39

I just want to officially say that.

Speaker 2 1:19:40

Everybody know that we better Um because they had to make sure to throw that one in there.

Speaker 3 1:19:44

They had one day a week.

Speaker 4 1:19:46

We had two days a week, amen and so, um, so it's kind of funny, like getting into it, like at this point, I lived in an apartment and actually my roommates were Josh and Jeremy Russell. We lived, we lived together. Now, did we get along? Absolutely not. We hated each other so much. Like it was not like pastor Kerry came in I can't tell you how many times to mediate, because all of us wanted to live completely differently than the others.

Speaker 2 1:20:08

It's real man, it's real buddy.

Speaker 4 1:20:10

So I thought I was clean, jeremy thought he was cleaner, he probably was, and then Josh was.

Speaker 3 1:20:15

Um, he's a different man today than we love you, bro, we all are yeah.

Speaker 4 1:20:28

Josh you've come a long way, josh became one of my really good friends, so, um, yeah, definitely an awesome, awesome thing but anyway uh, so we're, you know, we're in this apartment and I had to record a demo and we're just kind of. I showed my kids the other day and I was like this is not very good, but I had to record a demo of me, um, uh, playing a song, singing the song, doing harmonies of the to audition to be in this school.

Speaker 3 1:20:46

Wow.

Speaker 4 1:20:46

And it's kind of funny because I remember thinking, man, I really hope I get in. Now, being on the other side of things, I'm like there was no chance I wasn't going to get in, but I get in school of worship, and so this is like we did a cool retreat. I don't know if you guys have been to the. There's a place up in Flagstaff that Pastor James and I really like. There's a mountain inn or something like that. There's like a bunch of cabins in the forest where, like you know, there's a big whatever.

Speaker 1 1:21:11

We did a big retreat up there for the school administration.

Speaker 4 1:21:13

They go there for staff sometimes, yeah yeah, yeah for sure, there's been some good memories up there and some memories where Leslie got really sick and we had to take him back home and come back home, um, and that was not great memories, but anyway, whole different, whole different story but anyway, um, yeah, so we go do that and we're in this and so kind of my schedule, what it looks like. I'm working full-time at a company called insight. I'm making fantastic money. I have nothing to show for in that season because I spent every dollar I ever earned um, making really good money. I get done with work.

Speaker 4 1:21:41

I go to floridino's because it was over off of like Amos School in Ray Amos School in Elliott, whatever over there. That's where the school was at and actually at that time the office Chone was managing. We met in that office and so I go to Floridino's. I kind of, you know, work on a blog because that was cool at that time, and then I'd go to school ministry and I'd, you know, learn for three hours and then when that got done, then I drove over to Pastor Jonathan's house and then he mentored me for another couple hours and so he worked through singing playing guitar.

Speaker 4 1:22:11

He worked through learning how to record things on a computer using my garage band and you know I had assignments and different things I had to do Meanwhile.

Speaker 3 1:22:20

Wow, dude.

Speaker 4 1:22:22

Yeah, so this is, this is happening. So that's tuesdays and then thursdays is all together. Then thursdays there was um gosh. Was there four people on our track? I think there was four people. So danielle russell myself, I want to say it was mary, I feel like that's fuzzy for me, but I'm pretty sure she was there and then diana firman, which you guys I don't know if you guys know, anyway those were. That was a school of worship that we went.

Speaker 4 1:22:43

And so we'd have to lead worship for the Thursday night where the school of ministry everybody was together, we'd lead worship for them. There'd be a nugget, all that kind of stuff, and so what's interesting is so, I guess, kind of going back a little bit the spring break before all that happened Lacey comes back from school of worship and she brings a girl with her named Leslie, and I remember looking at her and being like, oh my gosh, like I'm going to marry this chick. Really First time you saw her, oh yeah.

Speaker 2 1:23:12

Really yeah, you just knew.

Speaker 4 1:23:14

Just knew Like. I and so I told Pastor Kerry and I was like no, he will not admit to the story, but it is 100% fact. So if he's listening to this this like just know, this actually did yeah so I said, man, that I'm married that chick, and he goes, man, she's way out of your league, he's not wrong but, you always tell people but he goes hey, this other chick over here, though that you're really good friends with.

Speaker 3 1:23:37

Yeah, date her really, and I'm like all right, so I did, so I went for this other girl yeah okay.

Speaker 4 1:23:45

So now we're back school ministry, I'm dating this chick, we're going through it and we get to like december, um, things are off and on with this girl. It's like like we we didn't break up, but it was like I'm just not feeling it, like it's. You know, I was not a good man, like if you've seen me with my wife, like you'll think like oh man, he's a great husband.

Speaker 4 1:24:04

Well, hopefully you think he's a great husband I gotta watch you for a little bit, but I was a terrible boyfriend like the absolute worst I did not honor her in any to this girl I was dating I did not honor her in any way. Like like it was bad like and so um, and anybody that was around that season would be like yeah, that's chucks out.

Speaker 2 1:24:25

You only know what you know.

Speaker 4 1:24:26

Man, for sure you gotta learn this stuff one is the first, like, the first, like, real, like relationship I had where, like, like it was reciprocal, and then I'm living on my own and there's not a lot of rules and I remained like sexually pure until I got married yeah, wow, but there were still a lot of lines that got crossed.

Speaker 3 1:24:44

Oh yeah, a lot of honoring, that didn't happen with this girl, not with Leslie.

Speaker 4 1:24:49

I just knew I'd lose Leslie if I made any mistake, so anyway.

Speaker 2 1:24:52

She's a rule follower, she for sure is God knew what you needed, so we get to.

Speaker 4 1:24:57

December, and in December I feel like the Lord dropped the is it Proverbs 4, 3, 5, and 6. Trust I feel like the Lord dropped the is it Proverbs 4, 3, 5, and 6? Yeah, Trust the Lord with all your heart. Lean on your own standard.

Speaker 3 1:25:06

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:25:06

Knowledge him in all your ways and he'll make your path straight.

Speaker 3 1:25:08

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:25:09

And so it's really this idea of trusting the Lord. And so January comes around and Pastor Dave's like hey, can I meet with you? We met at Firebirds out by Chandler Mall.

Speaker 3 1:25:19

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:25:27

And so he's like, hey, he's like, so this, there's this girl, marcy, uh, who was, she was doing a lot of the it and web stuff at the church and she's like, hey, she's getting ready to kind of move on to her kind of own thing. And you know, at the same time they had another like office manager person, karen. She was moving on her thing and he's like we're having the spot open like would you be interested in this? Yeah, so, meanwhile, I'm making about 130 000 a year at this time. Wow, whoa. And so I don't think maybe people knew this or not. And so, um, again, nothing to show for it whatsoever. I, I went to tilly's every weekend. I bought every black shirt they had. I went to dillard's and bought every clone. They have the clone I still have and I'm working through, um, but everything else, like leslie got rid of, she's like all your shirts are ugly and they're all gone.

Speaker 2 1:26:05

So, um, yeah, so, anyway, so, so just said earlier, you didn't have taste, man. So you're, you're, just, you're getting better.

Speaker 4 1:26:13

So yeah, so trust in the Lord. So pastor day he goes hey, this, this job's coming up Would you be interested in? And I'm like, maybe, um, you know what does it pay? And so he's like, well, what are you making? And I tell him he goes, this is going to feel like a mini, a missionary kind of pay.

Speaker 3 1:26:27

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:26:28

And I was like and so when I finally like I'd go negotiate with Dave Dave Alley's on the mix already, I negotiate with him. I was like you're not wrong. Um and promotion, wow, and this promotion is going to add like probably another 100k a year to my check holy crap so look at that, yeah, look at that the enemy.

Speaker 2 1:26:50

Look at that man. That ain't that how the devil will work. Man will, because he knows you're getting ready to make this transition into the kingdom, into god's house. So he's like no, I gotta give him more money. I gotta give him more to make it to where it's like the gap gets bigger. Don't go into ministry, the sacrifice is gonna get even bigger.

Speaker 4 1:27:12

Stay in the world wow, dude, it was really one of those decisions where I in my head I was like I can't, I'm not gonna, I can't make myself process this, because I'll process myself right out of it so. I go back to like what's what's been the drive of my life. I've always wanted to be in full-time ministry.

Speaker 1 1:27:28

Like that's what I've wanted to do Did you think about your dad at all in that moment? No, really, I really.

Speaker 4 1:27:34

I go back to like worship and singing. Yeah, and God you told me to trust you. Like there's like a very strong trust me, wow. So I'm like okay, so I go and I put in my two. So I say, okay, I'm in, I put in my two weeks at. Insight Wow, dude they literally offer me even more Wow. And I'm just like oh, please stop, I can't.

Speaker 4 1:27:54

I can't do this, Wow so and it's kind of funny the last time I look back because like girl I was with, like she got treated awesome as far as like we got to go and do things you know like we went out to living it up. Yeah yeah, when it wasn't an object I didn't treat her well, but we got to do nice things and so, um Leslie's like man, I kind of wish I could have been a part of that era at some point.

Speaker 2 1:28:16

So anyway, so that, so that it's common sense that takes place, so I, so I get.

Speaker 4 1:28:20

Yeah, I believe I received amen um, so we're so, yeah, so. So I'm in this insurance lap too, right where I'm like I need to get my wisdom teeth taken out and, uh, the church insurance isn't picking up yet and I still have it. So I'm like I'm I have like three weeks of vacation. I'm gonna use vacation to get my wisdom teeth taken out, so, with your, the insight insurance yeah, so I go to get that taken out the same time.

Speaker 4 1:28:42

You know, james and lacey they're still, they're engaged, but um, no, I think so I don't know. Whatever they're together and uh, passion tree, we're out of town, and so same thing, like they're in the same boat, where that's like hey, we're, we're gonna remain, like pure, and all that stuff and so he's like hey, can I stay at your apartment? Yeah you know and he we still don't necessarily know him a bunch yet. Yeah, you know Leslie's. You know here she's interning.

Speaker 1 1:29:06

It all just came back from school.

Speaker 4 1:29:08

She's teaching at the thing, I think James is still in Canada. He's working on a citizenship to come down, and so we're all kind of still hanging out getting to know him. I'm like sure you can come hang out.

Speaker 3 1:29:17

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:29:17

And you know, because I think it, I'm hopped up on Vicodin, on ibuprofen which is like that was a great mix for me in that time. And I'm laying on the couch. My mouth hurts, I remember just like like laying, like turning my head over. You know, josh, I think let's see Lacey, leslie, josh, james, jeremy I don't think Daniel's there yet, but they're all like there and I look over and open my mouth and all this blood just starts oh man, oh wow then followed by an expletive that comes out of my mouth, which I don't really curse um, but in that moment I did and um, and that was a a very fun time.

Speaker 4 1:30:04

I don't remember a bunch about that, but what's crazy. So this is a friday, saturday, so friday. I have a dream. In my dream I with this girl, I break up with her, I marry Leslie, and this girl goes crazy really and it's like vivid. Okay, this is Twitter, this is Twitter realm. I guess X is back now, but you know, twitter's really a big deal.

Speaker 4 1:30:27

All the hipsters use it so I post it like man, I had a real crazy dream last night, man, I felt so real. It's still high out of my mind right, just post this so then I go to set up at the school, right?

Speaker 4 1:30:38

so I met, I met, set up and my girlfriend walks up. She goes hey, what's your dream about? I was like, oh now, meanwhile she's been questioning the whole time like, are you interested in leslie? Are you not interested in leslie? Like this feels like there's something there and and I'm like, no, there's nothing there. And you know, I'm attracted to her. But like I'm not talking to her Like I'm trying to, like you know all that stuff Make this work.

Speaker 4 1:30:57

Yeah, uh and so, and so I tell Pastor Kerry, I'm like hey, so what do I do? Like, uh, do I just lie to her or just not tell her? Cause, like if I tell her the dream fighting yeah we've already been fighting. So much about leslie, so much um, and and granted rightfully so.

Speaker 4 1:31:17

Again, I was not a good guy yeah and so um, so yeah, so I, I, uh, he goes, yeah, well, you can't lie to her obviously. So I guess tell her I don't, yeah. So we go to um after church that night where there's a taco bell around the corners, we're gonna taco bell, the whole youth group's there, we're hanging out and all that stuff, and so it's just the two of us in the parking lot and I was like, okay, I'll tell you.

Speaker 4 1:31:40

It's like you can't freak out, but I'll tell you yeah so I walk her through everything she didn't take it well, it wasn't, it wasn't great yeah um, but you know it's like all right, we're not broken up, like whatever we'll get through this. So the next day lifelink's on on a real big growth spurt. There's no seats at this school like, so there's the, the benches in the back.

Speaker 3 1:32:00

Those are the seats you actually want it, because the chairs are awful my butt fell asleep every time, I sat every time and then when you're dealing with that now, but your butt falls asleep and you think, like, did I pee myself because I can't feel much um, I was like I looked forward to overflow so I could sit in those benches.

Meeting Leslie and Building a Life Together

Speaker 4 1:32:17

So I'm playing in the band. Right, I'm playing I think I was bass or acoustic, whatever I was doing and I go to sit down and there's literally one seat left. No, leslie, she has no idea what's going on. She thinks she's best friends with this girl yeah no clue whatsoever. She walks in. There's one open seat next to me. She sits there. The next moment my girlfriend walks in and sees me and leslie sitting right next to each other. Wow, I don't know if you can imagine.

Speaker 2 1:32:41

This didn't go over very well nah, bro, not after the day before. You just told her about this dream, right about leslie, I'm still high.

Speaker 4 1:32:48

Wow, I'm still. I still have my wisdom teeth taken out. My doctor I'm not joking prescribed 90 pills of Vicodin for my wisdom teeth. Wow, dude. I had a buddy who was like you know what you can get for those Five bucks a pill? He was offering 30. But anyway. So that night again hopped up and she comes over and we just fight and fight, and fight, and fight and she's like what do you want to do? Just break up. And I'm, I have got all the liquid courage on board that I need and I'm just looking and go yeah, yeah, all right.

Speaker 4 1:33:18

She's like really and so, and so she leaves. She ends up coming back. She's like I'm gonna take it off my facebook first, okay cool so she and honestly, that's the thing people do.

Speaker 4 1:33:30

For me it wasn't like, like I was heartbroken that I wasn't with her at all but I hate the feeling of like making her hurt. And so that was kind of a challenge. So I actually went into Josh's room and woke him up. I'm like, hey man, we just I guess we just broke up, so anyway. So and he was there like, like you know, josh, like a hug from Josh is like awesome, he's one of the best encouragers I know Um, and like he just knows how to like when you're low just like bring you up, even if you're having the worst day of your life.

Speaker 4 1:33:56

Like he's, just he's the guy. And so um, so anyway, uh. So you know that next week's a little little kind of rough. I go out to, we go out to after school worship. You know cause? Lacey and Leslie, they're interning at the school of worship yeah and so we went to.

Speaker 4 1:34:10

We would always go to sushi brokers out in scottsdale after 10 o'clock it was like half price sushi, yeah. So we go do that and and and I'm kind of like a little weepy, little, like you know like glad this isn't whatever. And I'm describing, like you know, my the perfect mate for me is someone who's like you know doing uh, you were doing ministry together, really in worship together, and it almost felt like you guys watch the Office.

Speaker 3 1:34:32

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:34:33

There's the when they're going to the wedding and like Andy's driving, and is it? Kelly and Aaron are sitting in the back. It was that Like Lacey and Leslie were in the back seat and I was in the front. Nobody was in the front seat and I'm just like this is strange that I that's so nice, like that's Leslie's dream too, and I was like, oh interesting, like Lacey was a big advocate for like us getting together. She will tell you she has journals about like, like, willing us to get together, that kind of.

Speaker 3 1:34:59

Thing.

Speaker 4 1:34:59

And so, um, so, anyway. So we uh, yeah, so so we're kind of chatting a little bit. Um, I had promised Jonathan that I would not date anybody for three months, Three months. So Leslie's working at the office. The office is at Pastor James Tree's house, yeah, so I'm there literally every day, so I come in and Pastor Kier gave me the strict rules.

Speaker 4 1:35:23

You don't come in before 9 o'clock. You're there right at 9. You take your shoes off at the front door, you go right to your desk. You work. At five o'clock. It becomes their house again. So you leave, you pick up your shoes and you're out of there. And so same thing, but I'd see Leslie every day. She'd come home. So so, and actually Pastor Free's mom, jan, we actually would have lots of girl talk.

Speaker 3 1:35:39

So at that point.

Speaker 4 1:35:39

Jan was dating, you know, and so I would hear about her dating and her hairstylists.

Speaker 4 1:35:45

This is the two of us like all day in the office you know I'm printing bulletins, she's doing care stuff and you know she's making calls and doing stuff and so, um, so Leslie sits down at the table and you know Jen's like hey, so you know what's going on. She's like yeah, she's like you know, I'm doing college at Starbucks and there's this. There's this guy that's kind of interested in this barista. That's kind of interesting. I don't know if you remember like hey, what's going on with this? Is this like is there something here? And he's like I don't know. And and so she's like so I find out like she's single but like potentially not going to be. So I like flip a switch.

Speaker 4 1:36:18

So it's like literally been one week. Yeah, Flip a switch and I'm like all right, I was like I don't know if I have enough game for this, but I'm a. I'm a shoot my shot.

Speaker 3 1:36:31

Let's see what happens.

Speaker 4 1:36:32

So, um, I think I was actually like sitting for Nate and Danielle and I was texting with her and like you know, really flirting, throwing it on thick, and and she was like like responding and like almost like flattered that we're talking and I'm just like, okay, normally most, most women have like told me to pound sand by now.

Speaker 2 1:36:49

Yeah, most women have told me to pound sand by now. I like you as a friend.

Speaker 4 1:36:52

Yeah, I was like she's actually interested.

Speaker 2 1:36:54

Wow.

Speaker 4 1:36:55

So we're, talking. Man there's some ups and downs that happen along the way. The other girlfriend tries to sabotage and all this stuff. I drive over to Pastor Dave's house, but I'm like it's his house so I can't just like I can't barge in.

Speaker 4 1:37:09

It just kind of works anyway, but like I can't barge in, like you know, just kind of anyway, um and so. But leslie, she finds out, because she's like all right, let's, you know, let's you're gonna talk to my parents and all that stuff, but she finds out that I've made this commitment to jonathan and she's a rule follower.

Speaker 4 1:37:21

Oh, and so we sit down with jonathan and I was just like hey, I appreciate your role in my life and everything, but you know, I'm I. I haven't decided if I'm to follow that rule or not. Leslie looks at me and she goes I have, we're going to follow that rule. Wow, I'm not a big fan of that. You know, yeah, and so whatever. So this is just February now.

Speaker 3 1:37:43

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:37:44

I've already quit my job, I've already broken up with my girlfriend. Yeah, I don't really know what's next, wow, and so, um, yeah, so we wait, you know the three months. Uh, in that time we're doing a camp together and this is where, like the famous camp that a lot of people talk about, where everybody kind of like met their spouse, and so my, my project in school ministry, school worship was to create this set for worship and to create this worship experience and an opener and all this stuff. So I do all the things I get to lead a couple songs. You know we're there. James actually comes in from Canada, plays drums, leslie's playing keys. I think I played guitar, jonathan, I think, played bass and it was kind of a cool thing. We do this thing, but in the meantime Leslie and I have been talking and she's just like all of a sudden, not interested in me at all.

Speaker 3 1:38:29

Oh, wow and I'm like well, how do?

Speaker 4 1:38:31

we like fix that, yeah. And so at this camp, god like opens her eyes and is like no, hey, this is your husband, wow. And so we get back and she like tells me she's like okay, hey, like this is it, we can date. And I'm like good news.

Speaker 3 1:38:46

Yeah so.

Speaker 4 1:38:47

I had to like. I think at that time we Skyped her parents. I don't think Skype's a thing anymore, but I had to Skype her parents, ask her dad permission to date her. Wow, and he said yes, wow. So this was I want to say. It was June 21st. I love that June 21st and I'm like, yeah, and we had strict rules because we're like hey, I've made mistakes in the past, we're not making mistakes on this one.

Speaker 4 1:39:10

And so, like if there was nobody in our apartment sorry, leslie and I did not live together, but in the apartment that you know with my roommates. If none of the roommates were home, we weren't in the apartment together. So we actually spent a ton of time at Pastor David and Sheree's house, cause you know they're there. We can hang out.

Speaker 1 1:39:27

And so yeah, do you appreciate that now looking back? Do you appreciate that now looking back? Do you appreciate that? Just the tradition and the being right and all that stuff, it's great.

Speaker 4 1:39:37

Yeah, because you know. You look at people who haven't waited and haven't done that stuff and you see the baggage that they have. Yeah, man, you know, and God always has a redemptive plan if you're willing to go his way. And so you know, there's people who have made mistakes before they got married. You know, there's people have, you know, made mistakes before they got married. Like you know, god can redeem that, but you know it just. It tends to be easier going God's way.

Speaker 1 1:39:57

It commands a blessing, man, when you do it right and you honor his way. Man, it's just I mean knowing you guys the way I do and seeing that you guys' relationship I mean it's just blessed beyond measure, man. You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 1:40:11

For sure, yeah, and there's been challenges.

Speaker 1 1:40:13

Obviously Was that the first girl you ever had to ask her dad to date her.

Speaker 4 1:40:16

Yeah.

Speaker 1 1:40:17

Was that nerve-wracking for you?

Speaker 4 1:40:19

It wasn't so much him, it was that her mom wanted to be on the call too, and that's just like and her mom, now that I know her mom and know how she operates like. I have a different view of it, but in the time it was like she's very stoic and very hard and she's not that way at all. But in the Skype call I don't know either one of them.

Speaker 1 1:40:37

Oh man, so yeah, that was. Was that your first time meeting them?

Speaker 4 1:40:41

It wasn't the first time meeting them. They had come down before and I had met them, but I was just a friend. Before your date out. Like you know, we had there's no rules Like come hang out as long as you want and we'll watch stuff and grill or whatever. So, like if you everybody, literally everybody from youth group like hung out.

Speaker 2 1:41:01

That's cool.

Speaker 3 1:41:01

At our house.

Speaker 4 1:41:02

That was the cool thing, but yeah, so we started dating in June.

Speaker 4 1:41:18

And it was like one of those things where we, we knew we know each other. God spoken to us. We knew. So, what year is this? 2011? Wow, yeah, 2011. So you're over at. You guys ain't even here yet. Huh, you're at perry. Yeah, we're at perry. Wow, yeah, we're at perry. And yeah, so we, um, so this is june. And so I'm like, hey, I need, I need to see your world right, like I, I don't know she's from kansas, like. And so in August we did this tour. It was funny At that time, the church office was actually out of.

Speaker 4 1:41:35

I don't know what it's called now, but I think it was CCC. It was a Lutheran church off of Chandler Boulevard and almost Dobson. And I remember Leslie's. I think she's doing something with connection cards and different things and I'm getting ready to print the bulletin for the next week. So we run out of town, realized what time we had to be in New Mexico we're going to see her grandparents and I was like, oh, hey, we have to leave in like six hours. It's like okay. So I picked her up from her house, like pastor Dave came out and you know, I've seen that one time, oh, really One time.

Speaker 4 1:42:09

Wow.

Speaker 3 1:42:13

And it's funny.

Speaker 4 1:42:13

Pastor Dave was just as pastoral at two in the morning as he is at any other time.

Speaker 3 1:42:18

Really Same dude.

Speaker 4 1:42:20

I think he had like a little bit of tired you could see in his eyes, but same thing. And he prayed over us and he's like, okay, you guys want a road trip?

Speaker 3 1:42:27

Like take this here's a battery charger, typical Pasadena fashion. Here's everything you need to be prepared. Yeah, come on, and so we began our journey.

Speaker 4 1:42:36

So we went out there. We saw her grandparents in New Mexico. We visited her grandparents in Colorado. We went to Kansas. We saw some friends, Some friends of hers basically said hey, Chris isn't the right person for you. You should break up, man bro.

Speaker 2 1:42:52

there's been a lot of people speaking against you your whole life. We're actually good friends. Now we left.

Speaker 4 1:42:58

Leslie's like wasn't that such a nice visit? I was like no. In front of me they said, hey, how about you guys don't be together anymore and like Leslie, you can do better? No, she could.

Speaker 1 1:43:07

No doubt I love, no doubt I love you, man, you don't have to agree that quick, eddie. I said you're, you're a wonderful man, brother she's lucky to have you dude.

Speaker 2 1:43:16

Okay, somebody always said I'm not agreeing with them. Somebody always settles bud.

Speaker 1 1:43:19

It's a fact in a way of life but anyway but yes, we, just for the record.

Speaker 3 1:43:24

I'm glad you settled, brother yeah oh, oh yeah, so I asked her dad, so we're there.

Speaker 4 1:43:30

We've been dating for two months. I asked her dad hey for her hand yeah, wow I just know, and you knew my parents dated like three weeks and got engaged. Her parents dated like two months and got engaged.

Speaker 3 1:43:43

I'm like we're in good company.

Speaker 4 1:43:44

Yeah, this is gonna work out well so this is like the last night before we like drive back, we'd done worship together at her church, home church and she's like, he's like, um, okay, well, I did think this was coming, but, um, I guess I don't really know you, so not yet.

Speaker 4 1:43:59

No, granted, that was the right choice yeah no, no, nothing held against him yeah but, um, he's like, yeah, not yet, but there's like all the air left the room and it's like, unless he's like, so how'd it go? I was like not, not, not great, yeah, and like we didn't, like the four of us didn't talk the rest of the night oh no, it just got awkward okay, we're driving back to arizona, see, see you later.

Speaker 4 1:44:20

And they're like okay, well, if you get stuck, we'll pay for hotel, like two hotel rooms, so you guys don't have to stay in the same room. You're like okay, like so we left, um, and it was probably getting closer to a few months after that.

Speaker 1 1:44:33

Her parents were real church-going people. Kind of too right 100%.

Speaker 4 1:44:37

Yeah, and very much in tune with the Holy Spirit. They hear from God. For us, even as of now, there's still some of our godly wisdom If we're facing a big decision they're one of the people that we're like hey, what do you think?

Speaker 3 1:44:51

facing a big decision.

Speaker 4 1:44:52

They're one of the people that were like, hey, what do you think? So yeah, so definitely again as a dad that has a young girl that hopefully will always just be a missionary and never want to get married but if she does, I started feeding her butter every day just to kind of help with that.

Speaker 2 1:45:08

I'm going to fatten you up, honey.

Speaker 4 1:45:13

She's beautiful and that's going to be something I have to challenge. I challenge that to face one day, but anyway, Get some tattoos and put a shotgun at your front door.

Speaker 1 1:45:20

That's that trust God thing again.

Speaker 4 1:45:22

That seems to be coming right around, just so you know For sure, and it's all about how you parent to get there. That's good and the example you set.

Speaker 2 1:45:30

Right.

Speaker 1 1:45:33

That's what she's gonna be looking, because they're gonna. They tend to kind of look for something that resembles what they see it's not how my dad was.

Speaker 2 1:45:38

I mean, you know, yeah, how you're talking to mom and how you're talking to the kids. Well, if you treat them right, you're gonna be right and they see good in you.

Speaker 1 1:45:47

They're gonna be like man.

Speaker 2 1:45:47

I want someone just like my dad dad treated my mom yeah well, and they say you know, bro Well and they say, you know, more is caught than taught.

Speaker 4 1:45:53

And that's what we're seeing right now in this season, Like you're watching. You can say whatever you want, right here, buddy, they mimic what you do oh yeah. But yeah, so her dad ends up calling me hey, son, I just want to let you know, you have my.

Speaker 2 1:46:07

A couple months later.

Speaker 4 1:46:08

Yeah, a couple months later and we've been working on relationship and all that stuff.

Speaker 2 1:46:13

You and dad, they prayed about it. Oh, for sure, they prayed about it.

Speaker 4 1:46:16

And I think they realized that, like you know, like Leslie's had other boyfriends before and if I see any of them I'll murder any of them. Yeah, but they've had, she's had other boyfriends and it didn't work out. And so he calls me and goes hey, yeah, my blessing. You know, we go back to Kansas for Thanksgiving and her grandpa, there's a like a Zales commercial that comes on TV and we're watching football. I'm not a big football guy, but man when we go back to Kansas for Thanksgiving.

Speaker 3 1:46:46

you're a football guy, Um, and so that?

Speaker 4 1:46:48

Zales commercial comes on and goes hey, I think she wants one of those, and I'm like, I'm working on it, let's see it also giving me specific things of like hey, if we're going to get engaged, both of our families have to be present, which is cool. If her family lives in Kansas and mine lives in Arizona, yeah, um, and like all the my dad has to approve, like all these different stipulations, and so it turns out her family's coming down for christmas and so on my birthday.

Speaker 4 1:47:13

It's the day after christmas. I set up the scavenger hunt. So my buddy gerson he's a mailman at the time. Her dad is fantastic at writing poems, so I have him write all these different like riddles and poems and I have gerson deliver the mail to her.

Speaker 4 1:47:25

Wow, our first date was at all of an ivy at scottsdale fashion school and so like it's like hey, and, and you know, you know lacy's there helping um her, her, you know sisters there, uh, her mom, dad there, whatever all the people she knows and loves and cares about. Everybody's there, yeah you know, I think even after like like james facetimes me afterwards like hey, man, I heard the great news, all that stuff. But anyway, scavenger hunt's like hey, go to go to um aldo. I don't know if that's a store anymore, but they can buy some shoes go to mac and get some makeup.

Speaker 4 1:47:55

Here's a little bag of toilet your kid to like freshen up, and it takes them all the way to all of an ivy where our first date was at oh, man don't like we didn't like the restaurant, but it's like. This is the first place first day got down on one knee wow she said I'll think about no.

Speaker 2 1:48:07

She said yes I was like oh no.

Speaker 4 1:48:10

And even then for any guy listening that hasn't proposed yet, I did do the like fake proposal, like oh, I'm just tying my shoe kind of thing and she hated it, but I'd highly recommend it to anybody.

Speaker 1 1:48:20

Like, fake proposals are great until it's time for the real one. Okay, so, yeah.

Speaker 4 1:48:24

so this started the thing, and like so we got married. So you know, in 11 months we were dating, engaged and married. Wow and um within a year.

Speaker 2 1:48:32

Within a year.

Speaker 4 1:48:36

And so there's lots of things along the way. You know like as we're married. Like you know, I'm working full time at the church again like missionary status, with you know income. Leslie's working part time at the church. She's also cleaning houses. She's also teaching lessons. She nannies kids. There's like three or four nights a week.

Speaker 4 1:48:49

We don't see each other because we're working all these weird jobs doing all this stuff, but it's like it's one of the things, like god called us both to ministry. Come on, we're supposed to be at. Yeah, we did a budget before we got married and it's like this is worst case scenario. We've never been there and no, there's been definitely challenging times along yeah but you know, we, we just this is it?

Speaker 2 1:49:06

god provides, god provided, and so there's um.

Speaker 4 1:49:09

I know we know we're probably like five hours in already, but no, we're just a couple bud.

Speaker 2 1:49:13

We got a couple more to go, guys, Hold tight, oh boy.

Speaker 4 1:49:17

So I think, like you know, so we're married, I'm getting to. You know lead worship. We have a thing called the Mix and it was like once a month we'd bring all the students together and we'd do a worship night. So I'm great, I'm leading leading worship of this stuff and I actually get done leading worship at this one and I was like this is the best one I've ever done, like like I felt like prepared and there's no confidence monitor too.

Speaker 4 1:49:40

And I'm terrible with words- and so I get to memorize everything, and plus I'm playing guitar and.

Speaker 3 1:49:45

I memorize the chords.

Speaker 4 1:49:46

And I'm just like you know, and that's after, like we're at Perry High School. We've had church. We set up church because we didn't do like a Saturday and then have church on Sunday. It was like Sunday morning. You show up at you know 5 am. And you're set up oh yeah, have church, and then I'd go home and like get a power nap for an hour.

Speaker 4 1:50:11

We lived in Santan Valley, so it's like was so it was like in my head it's like mental load, I got to memorize these things and but I have like the best like worship experience I've had, Wow. So then the next day, um, uh, Jonathan pulls me aside and goes hey, I need to tell you I don't think worship is something you should do, Because you don't really have the vocal strength for it. Wow, you don't have the right tone for it Wow. And granted again because he's listening as well, like he didn't mean anything bad by it.

Speaker 2 1:50:41

It's just back. Then you weren't ready, you didn't.

Speaker 4 1:50:43

He's just seeing.

Speaker 2 1:50:52

He's like it's not good enough and he's like yeah, he goes.

Speaker 4 1:50:54

Hey, I can I consider like switching to a different ministry, Like worship's not for you. Wow, now I will tell you in that moment that was the nail in the coffin for me of like I don't Every time.

Speaker 2 1:51:12

That was the third one. Yeah, that was the third one, for sure.

Speaker 4 1:51:15

Dang, and you know every time. You know there's times I led a worship here and every time I got on stage. As I walked out on stage, chris, you're not qualified to do worship. You can't do it Like, you're not called to this. You're not talented enough for this. Nothing you can do will do this even here here, every single bro every time.

Speaker 2 1:51:35

That time you sung uh, what is the one about? I've seen, uh, the plates disappear. I've seen you sung it up there, bro, it was uh, what's the name of that song, man, that dude talks about? I've seen the metal plates dissolve. I've seen backs heal. I've seen, oh my god don't you tell me he can't do it dude really yeah, so it.

Speaker 4 1:51:59

It's like just soul crushing and like I can't get past it in my head. Um, and so it's so.

Speaker 1 1:52:06

That's there, right and so uh, this is the guy that's been mentoring you.

Speaker 4 1:52:10

Yeah, oh yeah, and he's like. He's the guy like he has he knows everything about me. Yeah, like he's like, yeah, damn bro, yeah, and so, like just crushing it, I'm telling you like I like, hey, let's say I need you to drive home tonight, like I I got, I'm emotionally done I just got donkey kicked man, yeah, yeah so that was fun um I can feel it, man.

Speaker 4 1:52:34

Yeah, that was a, that was a big, that was a big blow, and so, um, you know that I just carried that around for a little bit, um, actually, uh, up until like a couple years ago, I think. I just recently got over that wow man and so, yeah, so that, so that was, that was a big thing, and there's a redemptive part to that story.

Speaker 1 1:52:52

There is, we'll get into it.

Speaker 4 1:52:54

And so.

Speaker 1 1:52:56

There sure is buddy.

Speaker 4 1:52:57

So at LifeLink we're doing a giving campaign called All for One.

Speaker 3 1:53:02

Yeah.

Speaker 4 1:53:03

And so it was kind of funny. The slogan was All for One it's double your time, talent and treasure.

Speaker 1 1:53:09

I saw a sticker the other day on the back of a car that had that on there. Oh okay, I told Roddy I'm like I remember that.

Speaker 4 1:53:14

Yeah, yeah, you had the license plate, the key chains.

Speaker 1 1:53:16

Yeah, man.

Speaker 4 1:53:17

The little car charger, the little green things.

Speaker 1 1:53:19

Was that here or at? I was here. I remember that.

The Financial Test and God's Provision

Speaker 4 1:53:22

Yeah, I remember being here. I was here for that dude and I queen creek, you know, I think that was a part of it. Yeah, I remember that and so it was kind of funny. This is before harper's born. Yeah, this is this, would be less. He's pregnant with her, so probably 2016. Yeah, it's happening and, um, you know past years, like double your time to launch your treasure. I'm like, okay, well, okay, we work at church, so there's no treasure to give yeah we're at church all the time every night, you know.

Speaker 3 1:53:50

So you got no more time to give.

Speaker 4 1:53:52

And I don't think I could serve in another team. I serve in all of them.

Speaker 1 1:53:56

You did a lot.

Speaker 4 1:53:57

There's nothing to do, so we get down with it. Leslie goes all right, so what are we doing? I was like nothing, there's nothing to do. And she's like no, no, no, we're participating in this. And I'm like Leslie we Look at our budget, we're about ready to have a kid. She goes no, no. So I didn't know this. Now, and actually it's kind of funny. Pastor Dave and I've had this conversation. I remember being young and married and saying, like you know, I like to come to things on my own. I think Leslie will tell me things that I need to work on or things that, like, we need to do but I don't do that.

Speaker 2 1:54:37

My wife is a gift listen to her great, great.

Speaker 3 1:54:38

Now he.

Speaker 4 1:54:38

Maybe he didn't say stupid he probably, in fact, I can't remember the words we don't say, but I feel like that may be one of them, but anyway, um, so, yeah, so, so, so we're here and I'm like I didn't really know the time, but leslie has a very strong gift of faith, yeah, and I, and I've learned that that's a strength, and so that's something now I tap into.

Speaker 4 1:54:56

So good, buddy, but at that time, I didn't necessarily know, and so she just said that it was one of those things where I'm like, okay, like what am I going to do? Like say sorry, leslie, like you feel like the Lord's leading our family to do this. You know, I was like I didn't feel a strong. No, it was more like my logic side of me.

Speaker 4 1:55:11

Yeah you're trying to figure it out, honey, we can't right so so then you know that next sunday, you know it's time to tithe, and so I double their tithe. And she was what are you doing? I was like I'm doing what you just told she was. I thought we'd do that after we had harper. I was like, oh okay well, you got to communicate.

Speaker 2 1:55:26

Yeah, you gotta tell me that, honey.

Speaker 4 1:55:28

Yeah, but I'm like if god told you to do that, then we're not waiting, we're doing it, wow you're that guy yeah let me tell you come on, buddy. We did this for two years. It was the hardest, one of the hardest seasons we've ever been through. No, and it's the people that you're in your life that push you forward, that you really need around you so one of the things. My father-in-law, again very godly guy, um he had told me we tied'd tithe our whole life.

Speaker 4 1:55:51

So, no, no, no issues in tithing. But he told me he goes hey, you know, when you first start tithing, you don't necessarily. Sometimes you see the fruit right away, but not necessarily. You know there's seed time, there's harvest time and sometimes it takes a while, it takes a, and this is going to be a thing.

Speaker 4 1:56:09

And so I have that in the back of my head. We're going after this. We're doing our double our time, talent and treasure. We're doubling our tithe. We don't really have the money to do it. I ended up we had two cars at that time Ended up giving one of the cars away, wow, and we're down to Leslie's car. I remember in that season one time it broke down like it was just it would stop you, would you? Would you know, stop at a stop, stop light or whatever.

Speaker 2 1:56:36

Turn off I used to have one of those, but it's a spark plug, yeah but, you literally had to pull the engine apart to get to her spark plugs.

Speaker 4 1:56:46

So I remember like sitting in our house in santana valley the middle of the night, there's no options. I don't have money to take this to a mechanic, I have to fix it. People are like how are you so handy?

Speaker 2 1:56:54

it's like I was broke there's no other option, right, come on, buddy I have the car apart.

Speaker 3 1:56:59

Wow, I gotta figure this out, are you? I don't have any other option.

Speaker 2 1:57:03

I don't have another vehicle to get anywhere uber and lyft aren't really a thing at that time up to this point, I have not heard of you working on cars and fixing cars and you just took this on and we're like I'm just gonna do it.

Speaker 4 1:57:16

There's no other option wow bro, that's how you learn.

Speaker 2 1:57:20

Yeah, shut up, amen. So I pulled it apart, put a plug in your tire I figured it out.

Speaker 4 1:57:27

I had actually broken the air intake hose like it was brittle oh yeah. And so it threw a code and I'm like I don't know what to do.

Speaker 4 1:57:33

So I grabbed a bunch of duct tape and like duct tape the whole thing, and the code cleared and I was like all right, I think we live to fight another day. You know, there's another time where it's like we don't have, there's no money in your, and usually there was a time where both of us would be able to be like no, hey, we got this, we can go, we can make this. And you know, if that person was low, the other person was low.

Speaker 2 1:57:56

One of you is up.

Speaker 4 1:57:57

Yeah, so our house in San Diego Valley. We always call it the landing, but there's, you know. You walk up a couple of stairs, there's a flat spot. Turn and there's more stairs. Yeah, yeah, we both yeah, we had nothing left in the tank. We just laid there we cried we're like we. What do we do like we're? We're called to ministry. We have no more time to work another job. Um, the church isn't in a spot to like increase more money.

Speaker 3 1:58:23

Yeah, you know you know, pastor david and shreya are some of the most generous people really.

Speaker 4 1:58:27

They could have, they would have um, it's just, there's nothing to do, so you're just crying. You're like god. We heard's just, there's nothing to do, so you're just crying. You're like God. We heard you clearly. And there's no movement. And so, you know, life moves on. We, you know we eventually pick ourselves up, and you know we.

Speaker 2 1:58:41

Did you keep tithing and keep doubling it, so that stayed? We never stopped.

Speaker 4 1:58:45

Wow, never stopped all the time, wow. So here we are two years later I'm not joking To the day. Two years later To the day.

Speaker 2 1:58:52

To the day my.

Speaker 4 1:58:53

God, I get into it's Super Bowl Sunday. I'm at a friend's house and I have someone call me and they go hey, I'm supposed to give you a car. I'm like okay, let me tell you about my car situation. So we have our Sentra. At that time, actually, nate had given me his old green uh forest service green tahoe and that that thing was pretty sweet.

Speaker 3 1:59:19

Yeah, I like that it'll get anywhere.

Speaker 2 1:59:21

Yeah, the problem is leslie centra.

Speaker 4 1:59:23

The air conditioning went out and the windows wouldn't roll down and it was summertime oh god we've got a new baby, so leslie got to drive the green car that had high school air conditioning and I got to drive the car with like nothing yeah, and just sweat 11 bucks. Amazing, yeah, so so, anyways, this person calls us up and said hey, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're just gonna actually give you money to go and buy the car yeah, wow okay, that's pretty cool.

Speaker 4 1:59:48

so they tell me how much it is. I'm not joking, it's everything we've given over those last two years Wow. Everything, wow. So we double tithe off that, because here's the thing, the campaign's over. Yeah, god hasn't released us from double tithing. Yeah, oh, geez God hasn't said it's time to stop, because I'm like in my head, I'm like okay.

Speaker 2 2:00:06

Campaign's over. Finally, we're in a little bit different spot. I might have a little extra money for it.

Speaker 4 2:00:11

Yeah, I have a few hundred extra dollars. I can throw this through some debt. I can do this, you can buy a gun.

Speaker 2 2:00:16

You're not done yet.

Speaker 4 2:00:19

Okay, so this is now probably 2018. At this point, we are licensed ministers. There's a whole other podcast probably on all of that. But you know, we went through Bible college, we got our degree and probably in all of that. But you know, we went through Bible college, we got our degree and we were licensed ministers. We went through like a big pastoral class here's. You know, here's how you defend the statement of faith.

Speaker 3 2:00:37

Here's how you operate as a pastor.

Speaker 4 2:00:38

Here's how you care for people. Here's what not to say. Here's how to not be a dummy.

Speaker 3 2:00:48

Here's hey, these people left the than what it was. It's real. That's the Chris version.

Speaker 4 2:00:51

It's real and so, anyway, the pastor was like hey, it's time to ordain you guys. I'm like, okay, this is great. So we're still double tithing, we're still doing all this stuff. I think it's September, if I'm not mistaken. We actually get ordained, as we're getting ordained ministry in with no debt. Wow, whatever you have left on debt, we're just gonna pay it off. Wow. I'm like jesus, okay, wow, free. So I tell them the exact amount. Yeah, we haven't stopped double tithing yet, so they give it to us.

Speaker 4 2:01:24

It's an increase, yeah, so I double tithe now we don't have enough to pay off our debt. Yeah, so that's kind of cool. So we're like November, december, we're so close. We actually get a bonus that year for Christmas and that amount is everything we need to pay it off. So in that one year God redeemed everything that happened.

Speaker 4 2:01:46

But here's, the thing is that this is and this is like yeah, my father-in-law brilliant dude, he talks about the money test. This is the and this is like yeah, my father-in-law brilliant dude, he talks about the money test. This is the money test. If God can trust you with money, then he can trust you with anything Right, so he can put more into your hands if he if you're going to do with it what he says.

Speaker 4 2:02:00

So this is where, like, we went two years with like not a lot. It was a real bad season. It was like, you know, our friends are buying houses. We're not Because we can't. We're doing X, y and Z, and so it's cool. You get to the end of the season, you're like, okay, god, I see you, and so that's just the beginning of it. There's so many more things. So that you know this is so again, that's 2018.

Speaker 2 2:02:35

You know we ended up, you know, a couple years.

Speaker 4 2:02:35

The next year we go to buy a house and we have another thing come through where they're like hey, are you out in santan still, or is this where you're coming into gilbert? Come closer, we moved into gilbert. We put 75 000 miles on our car in one year.

Speaker 2 2:02:40

So we realized it's a 55 minute drive people. Yeah, it's not as cost effective as people say it is we like santan valley, we like the area like the people, the drive sucks the drive man. So um, a church that's alive is worth the drive sucks the drive man, it is so bad. So a church that's alive is worth the drive.

Speaker 1 2:02:54

It's true, it's worth what was I saying? 70 miles a day.

Speaker 2 2:02:57

Yeah, thank God for a brand new car. Yeah, and we had a dog. We had a dog that we had to let out once a day.

Speaker 3 2:03:03

Oh wow, yeah, that was cool.

Speaker 4 2:03:12

So, yes, we were trying to. So we're looking to buy a house because our rent's going up and we're like, okay, and so we had a family member go. Hey, we can give you like a personal loan to like buy the house. Wow At like 1% interest and I was like cool Because we were getting ready to head back out to Santan Valley, Cause that's all we could do.

Speaker 2 2:03:29

Yeah, afford.

Speaker 4 2:03:30

Yeah, so we ended up getting to this house in you know Gilbert, where you know we actually just moved this last year, and, um, through everything, they ended up actually just giving it to us. Come on man A hundred percent, wow, and that takes a lot of pressure off of things, but along the way, it's like you know, there'd be times where we even be here. Unless you know, come with a system. Now there is one time we gave a couple that we thought god said, hey, give this couple a thousand dollars.

Speaker 4 2:03:57

And we always try to do it in private, like we don't want to like draw attention to us really good the first time I pulled it out of the bank and I put it into a ziploc bag and I was like, hey, god really wants us to do this for you. Here's this. Unless he's like, what are you? A ziploc bag? What are you?

Speaker 3 2:04:10

doing this is the most thing you could.

Speaker 4 2:04:12

She's like from now on, I handle this because we don't do checks I like I've. My last check was like I love you, leslie we've come a long way.

Speaker 2 2:04:24

The women handle the money and so yeah, so we begin like this this season of like giving where it's this money.

Speaker 4 2:04:29

Test where it's like god's like okay, hey, will you do where it's this money test where it's like God's like okay, hey, will you do this? And it got to the point where there was even a time where I remember like I felt like God said hey, give this amount to someone. I'm like, are you I was just looking at that amount somewhere else Like, maybe that's just a carryover in my brain.

Speaker 4 2:04:59

And so asking you to bless this person with more money or less money, like, is that satan telling you to give more? Or god hello. Okay, that's god, all right, so let's, let's, do it. You know, every time god came through, every single time like it with, without fail. And so now it's got to the point where it's like god says to do it, we just do it come on this, we give that, and so yeah, so this is it's just ingrained now into what you do exactly and your kids are seeing this man.

Speaker 2 2:05:12

Yeah, I got a story for that.

Speaker 1 2:05:13

Wow, dude, there's this time when rowdy was in teen challenge this guy needed some glasses and so my wife's like I think we're supposed to pay for this guy's glasses, right?

Speaker 1 2:05:22

so we asked him how much it was. It was only like 60 bucks. So my wife put 60 on his books. Come back the next week, hey, get your glasses. I haven't been yet. Come back, like the next week. Hey, did you get your glasses? Oh, I haven't been yet. Come back, like the next week. Dude's gone and me I'm like that's what I can do. You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 2:05:39

Put money on your books and you left. You're using the money. I'm dope.

Speaker 1 2:05:42

Well, I was like what? Are you getting upset for Hello I'm. I did what God told me to do. Yep, once I left my hand, it was no longer my responsibility, that's it. He has to answer Ever since then. Bro, yeah, Once it leaves my hands, God, whatever happens is none of my business man.

Speaker 4 2:06:01

Yeah, we're responsible for obedience.

Speaker 1 2:06:03

God's responsible for the outcome. Yeah, it's great.

Speaker 3 2:06:05

Yeah, great, a hundred percent.

Speaker 4 2:06:06

Yeah, that's the way it's supposed to be. It is, yeah, so so so that's kind of like our like our, our big like thing.

Speaker 2 2:06:15

We start really kind of getting into. Like you and and leslie's big thing in your marriage and ministry is giving, giving. Yeah, come on, man, you know you can't give god.

Speaker 4 2:06:24

Yeah, one of the spiritual gifts of like giving, and it's one of those things where okay, so, so here's. So we're still at lifelink. This is probably the. The two things come together probably 2021 and 22. But in 2021, we have Bishop Egbo come over to our house. I think you see Bishop now, reverend Obi.

Speaker 2 2:06:45

I just call him Doc.

Speaker 4 2:06:46

What's up, doc? Reverend Dr Obina, yeah, so him and Jay come over to our house and you know we're like just connecting, no agenda that kind of thing. You know we're telling about some of these things like we're really getting excited about giving, and so at the end of first of all I think I have to put this on the record is that I cook them really nice ribeye steaks, and when I tell you like I smoked them for an hour, Wow. And then I did a nice season on them.

Speaker 2 2:07:13

He really put his time into it.

Speaker 4 2:07:16

Perfectly medium rare seasoned perfectly. And they looked at it and they were like, oh, we only eat well-done steaks.

Speaker 3 2:07:22

I got to tell you.

Speaker 4 2:07:23

I won't do this for anyone. I will do this for them, but I cut that steak up, I put Blackstone and I made it well done for them. Wow, and it took everything inside of me to do that. It was like a small part of me died.

Speaker 2 2:07:33

But anyway, he's one of those guys, man Well done. There is a right and a wrong way to eat steak, but anyway.

Speaker 4 2:07:41

So so we're getting you know. The night's almost over. They get ready to leave our house. And so they look at us and they say, hey, uh, we really feel like God has put this anointing on you to do 10 times what we've been able to do financially, 10 times what we've been able to do, and we're like that sounds great like okay, because we know they've, they've done yeah, we, we don't we don't know at that point like what that looks like for them.

Speaker 3 2:08:03

We can assume some things but we know like okay like okay, I got chills right now, man.

Speaker 4 2:08:11

Okay, it gets better Jesus 2022, actually one of my last encounters at lifeline church. There is a situation that had happened with a property that had to sell, kind of up north. That was a cabin that had been given to my brother and I and I hadn't told a lot of people about it. We're at this encounter and actually, right, you came up to me and actually might get a little emotional about this, but you told me a couple of things. You say, hey, I really feel strongly about god, this. I have this number in my head, this 10 times number in my head, because I've been going through my head of like, hey, god, you give me this word. I don't see fruit from this yet. Is this still in that moment? Like, is this still something that we're doing? Yeah, and like that night, you're like hey I get this thing.

Speaker 4 2:08:49

Excuse me, jesus, he's like rod. You're like hey, I get this number 10 times. I don't know if that means anything to you, but god wants you to know 10 times. And he's like also, there's this thing happening with this red house. We called it the red house and, um, whatever is going on on that, god's going to totally redeem that and do something better than that's ever happened before. I didn't share that with you, wow, and so in that moment, my, it's like there's a couple of things that are like confirmed.

Speaker 4 2:09:13

Like okay you know this, this is cool, cause it cause, really, when you, when you're working in in full-time ministry and you feel like God's going to let me do like I'm going to be making multi-million dollars a year travel the world feels, silly to say it.

Speaker 2 2:09:26

And it feels like a pipe dream.

Speaker 4 2:09:28

But and so, like we hadn't said a lot of it and so, so this is happening. So and then you know, in 2022 we actually transitioned out of lifelink and you know, honestly, probably one of the most painful seasons we've ever had not because it wasn't time to go. It was time to go, yeah, um, if for if, if I um. Again, we're loyal people. We kind of needed things to kind of blow up, to leave yeah um, and we love pastor david shree, we love the church.

Speaker 4 2:09:52

You know, we made it a goal Like hey, when we were leaving, like you guys left the right way, bud, we're not we're not taking anybody with us Like there's several people that had dinner with us that were like okay what really happened and we're like sorry, like we're not, we don't in be that person. I don't want to be the person responsible for taking someone out of the spot they were supposed to be in Um cause I mean blood's on your hand.

Speaker 2 2:10:20

I'm on the hook for that. I don't want that so honestly it was really painful, painful, really painful season.

Speaker 4 2:10:27

Um, we lost everything we knew. Uh, we had no plans of ever leaving here whatsoever. Our plans were to die here, like we were going to be with Pastor James Shree, until the very end. No plans to leave. And so even the day that we resigned the day before, we still had no plans to leave, and so, for the record, no moral failures, nothing like that. It was time to leave.

Speaker 2 2:10:49

It was time.

Speaker 4 2:10:50

And you know, honestly, if I look back at it and I was thinking about this the other day of, like the Theos Bible College recordings that I had done, my cadence actually changed in some of those recordings. I think I knew our season was ending but I didn't realize it.

Speaker 3 2:11:08

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:11:08

Because I started talking differently. It was like not like Lifelink Church, but was like not like lifeling church, but like the church that I'm currently attending.

Speaker 3 2:11:14

It's like I would.

Speaker 4 2:11:15

My phraseology was changing.

Speaker 2 2:11:17

You can go back and watch it and hear it and see it.

Speaker 4 2:11:20

Yeah, and it's like, it's like okay, like so so I knew the season was over, but I, I honestly don't think we would have left unless happened the way it did and so, um, so we're. The only thing I regret is not like just saying, hey, our season's over and all our relationships are intact. You know, I lost, you know, one of my best friends. You know you call me up, say we can't be friends anymore, and I'm like that is soul crushing. In that time of like, hey, I, we have no one. It felt like a divorce.

Speaker 4 2:11:46

We just cried for months it probably took us, you know, six months to a year to like fully heal from all of that stuff and um wow bro but at the same time, like we just know, like you know how kingdom works, you know, how you know all this stuff happens and you know when. I know a lot of people were probably like, hey, how come you didn't jump into back into ministry when you left?

Speaker 2 2:12:08

yeah, we had opportunities yeah, I know you could have. We had new people bud. For sure you had relationships and connections.

Speaker 4 2:12:14

Oh yeah I had a job offer actually at a church that I've already mentioned in this podcast and I was like hey, let me, let me go to your church first and like see if this is it yeah, no kind of thing and I.

Speaker 4 2:12:25

We didn't even make it through worship and we're like this isn't for us wow so um we you, we were kind of church hopping in uh we we a very strict set of rules. You'd be surprised there's not a lot of spirit filled churches here in Arizona, let alone Hello buddy, there's really not.

Speaker 4 2:12:42

Yeah, we have three churches on our list. We just crossed one of them off by that one and we had two left and so we ended up going to a church out in Mesa and it was one of those things again, like our kids are used to being at church all day, like Harper grew up in the nursery with all the other staff.

Speaker 2 2:12:59

Yeah, like that's all she knows she doesn't have any other friends.

Speaker 4 2:13:03

We didn't go anywhere else, like all of her friends, you guys were always here. Yeah, she, you know, and so she's not really having any friends and so that first church we went to she's like it's not lifelink and just crying and just like I'm like as a dad, I'm like I know that we've made the right decision, this I know that, that this is correct.

New Seasons and Redemptive Opportunities

Speaker 3 2:13:23

This is the right spot for our family.

Speaker 4 2:13:24

But I don't know how to handle this, and so I tried to channel my inner pastor day. I'm like, okay, we need to change some mindsets, and so I so. So I'd look at Harper. I said, okay, harper, we're going to check out this church tomorrow.

Speaker 1 2:13:33

I love this part of the story. Yeah, I want. I mean I told you this, I love it.

Speaker 4 2:13:37

So I was like hey, so I want you to think of five good things that happened today, If 20 he's born uh, right in covid.

Speaker 3 2:13:53

We had him, I, leslie, and I had to wear masks in the hospital the whole time.

Speaker 4 2:13:55

Amazing. If I never see a mask again, it would be too soon, yeah, so, um so anyway. So so levi, he's been a great sleeper yeah like sleeps through the night, no problems.

Speaker 4 2:14:02

The night before he cannot like get to sleep. He won't stay asleep. We were planning to go to the first service. Um, just did not work out. So he we're like, okay, we're gonna go to the second service, we go to the first service. Just did not work out. So we're like, okay, we're going to go to the second service. We go to the second service, and so we're there. I'm a big theology guy. I'm listening to the pastor preach and I'm like say something wrong? Give me a reason to not come back here.

Speaker 4 2:14:28

Give me a weird tradition a weird something Turns out, he's listening to all the same guys I'm listening to. He's a big Nathan Finocchio guy. He's a big Theoshu guy he's like I'm like okay, I just heard that on a podcast. Like okay, we're chatting here, Worship comes on and it's like all the songs that I've wanted to sing and there's no shade at all, like every church is designed for the culture, the people that they're leading.

Speaker 3 2:14:54

Yeah, of course.

Speaker 4 2:14:54

Like, we need everything. All the churches need to happen, and so, but for this specific one, I'm like this is what I've kind of always dreamed of and I look over and Leslie's just bawling having an encounter with God.

Speaker 1 2:15:06

So we go pick up Harper and Harper's.

Speaker 4 2:15:07

So out of go. And she's beaming, she. How to go? And?

Speaker 1 2:15:12

she's beaming. She goes. Dad, my best friend from school, is here today.

Speaker 2 2:15:13

We weren't supposed to go to that service yeah, like that wasn't part of you, would have went to the first service you would have she would have missed completely.

Speaker 4 2:15:20

Come on, man so I'm just like and so I had the night before I'd actually had confirmation from the lord like this is where you'll be going to church. I don't know if it's forever, like I don't have plans to leave, to leave, but it's like, at least for this season, this is where you're going Come on and so like okay, and so like all these things take place, and I'm like here we are, we're here and so in this time I'm going through counseling.

Speaker 3 2:15:49

I'm just to process things that have happened.

Speaker 4 2:15:51

Yeah, here we talked about and the counselor he's a Christian counselor, actually, the same one that Nate talked about in his podcast, and I'd be like hey, here's this and he goes oh man, that's a great idea, like where's that at in the Bible? And I have my PhD at this time in theology. And I have to go.

Speaker 3 2:16:10

Ugh, I guess it's not there and have to just undo all this stuff.

Speaker 4 2:16:12

So I jump on to some of the kind of the redemptive stuff is is um. So it's, it's November. There's auditions I had on purpose. We'd said, hey, we are not joining a staff, we are, um, we're healing, yeah, and we're going to be toxic anywhere we go. We're going to hurt wherever we're at.

Speaker 2 2:16:33

It's like for you to be able to be that aware and present and know you to take some time.

Speaker 4 2:16:36

That's good, that's that's wise we we had to. It was um because, again, like we had no plans of leaving, like, yeah, all the relationships like again like we. We, that was the right call, but people are people and we yeah we said we did life with people. It wasn't just like we had to do that on sundays we, we did life with people.

Speaker 3 2:16:53

It wasn't just like we had to do that on Sundays.

Speaker 4 2:16:56

We actually did life with people and actually had relationships and so we're going through counseling and I feel like it's time to join the worship team. My buddy Gerson, you know I've known him, he I was in his wedding, he's at my wedding, we know each other forever, and so he's like he's been telling the worship pastor like hey, you got to check out Chris, like he's going to be great, and so you know, every Sunday he's like hey, so when are you ready to audition? So finally I was like okay, okay, I'll audition.

Speaker 2 2:17:22

I remember your post and you pulled out the one with the, I think a butterfly or a bird on it, like pulling her out, yeah, yeah so pull it out, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 2:17:32

So pull it, pull it out. Um, I start practicing. I'm going to have to memorize the words that we do, the song we praise you by I think it's Brandon Lake or whatever and so we're doing this, this um audition, and I'm not sure exactly what to expect. And they're like hey, you know you're going to, I only know what I know, and so I'm going to go for it.

Speaker 4 2:17:54

So, we got there, they're actually moving um auditoriums. At that time the sound system doesn't work. Like hey, you have to go to the chapel, which is like not the same monitoring system. So, like like Jeremy when he went through, like digital app, you pull up and you're able to like see the monitors and change it. And I'm plugging into like this weird system whatever.

Speaker 4 2:18:16

So I do the, I do the audition and we get back, uh, you know, back down and and I'm like, okay, well, like what do you guys think they're great? Do you want to leave worship on Sunday? I was like, uh, like this isn't a small church Like this, is a church of like 3000 people, and I'm like one you don't know me, you know like you don't know me at all. Like we have, like we don't even have mutual like acquaintances.

Speaker 3 2:18:39

Like.

Speaker 4 2:18:39

I've sent them videos of me leading worship, but it's not good. Like you know, it's like. It's like me, I didn't like the last couple of on. I'm like, and it was god encountered that, that service, but it wasn't great, yeah you know, and so so I'm like, okay, so like it's like we're going to kansas for that week come back in time to leave back on saturday?

Speaker 4 2:19:02

I've never been to rehearsal. I've never been to a sunday morning like like a week rehearsal or a sunday morning rehearsal. So I show up and I'm like I don't know what I do because I'm used to the culture here and it's completely different. And so it began this like weird, like journey, and um, you know meanwhile, um, you know when I, you know I when I'm, we're in between, you know ministry and work, and you know this. And this is all I knew.

Speaker 1 2:19:30

Right.

Speaker 4 2:19:30

I didn't know anything else. I remember having this thought specifically of like what, what am I going to do? What marketable skills do I have? My degrees in theology, all of my trainings in theology. I only know church stuff. I know church stuff really well.

Speaker 3 2:19:43

I know how to like put a service together, but like what do.

Speaker 2 2:19:46

I do, and so.

Speaker 4 2:19:49

I had a couple of people reach out and they're like hey, we can, you can work for the department of fence in Tucson. It's going to be we'll pay you like 50 grand a year and you'll have to live in Tucson for three to eight, three days a week and I'm like I, if I never go to Tucson again, that's great. And so I talked to my buddy, Patrick, and, like we, actually work we so you guys work well together.

Speaker 4 2:20:09

When we were here at LifeLink, they actually did life groups and we worked well At that time. Leslie's like hey, I feel like we're supposed to start a small business. He's the only dude I knew, so I asked him and he's like hey, why don't you help me with my business? So we started working together in 2021. And so 2022 happens. I call him and I'm like hey, I don't know if you know anybody that's hiring right now. He goes, funny enough, he's like I'm starting a company and I need some help. Interested in joining? Yeah, I'm like and it's construction. I was like I did facilities, like maybe that's something. And so we start this company together and again I'm. I'm like I'm hurt, I'm healing, I'm doing all this stuff. And he gave me all the grace. There were summer times. I'm like hey, man, fire me. Yeah, like I'm not providing you any value whatsoever yeah, I'm not helping you make.

Speaker 4 2:20:54

I'm just costing you money right now like fire me, and he's like no, I was like this can't affect our relationship, like if it ever does like, fire me, no problems, I'll figure something out. So I'm going through like it's basically like nothing I know right, it's all unknown yeah everything about, about is unknown.

Speaker 4 2:21:12

I don't know how I'm gonna be able to provide for my family. Um, I don't know what ministry looks like. I don't know if I'll ever do ministry again and and so now, but now I'm leading worship and I do that for a little bit and then they actually pull me in. They're like, hey, um, you're doing great at leading worship, no problems, but we really could use your help being the music director at our South Mountain campus. Would you be willing to do that? And like we'd pay you to do it. Wow, and I was like you want me, like you want to use my musical ability to like at a campus, at a church, that's like huge. And they're like, yeah, I was like suckers, I would have done it for free, but sure, yeah let's do it, and so we start this journey there, and so I'm actually leading worship at CR's, really yeah.

Speaker 4 2:21:57

And yeah, because they're doing the worship and the meal and all that stuff.

Speaker 1 2:22:01

Did you stay for any classes?

Speaker 4 2:22:02

Yeah, I stayed for two because there was worship at the end.

Speaker 1 2:22:04

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:22:05

Other than that I didn't, but I honestly stayed through a couple of them and it's a thriving ministry.

Speaker 2 2:22:11

It's a great group of people. It is, yeah.

Speaker 4 2:22:12

Great group of people.

Speaker 1 2:22:14

Join a small group. One time, man, you'll love it. Sit in a small group. I've done a couple of those.

Speaker 2 2:22:19

And they really are good stuff.

Speaker 4 2:22:21

And, honestly, the hunger. Even in worship it's different when God's delivering you for something and you encounter worship.

Speaker 3 2:22:30

As opposed to like my life's always been awesome. Oh yeah, it's nice to add on.

Speaker 2 2:22:33

Yeah, you know, you feel the difference. Yeah, we just heard about that in Sunday message.

Speaker 1 2:22:38

When people are broken and seeking God. It's different than people who the worship gets a little loud.

Speaker 4 2:22:42

You know what I mean.

Speaker 2 2:22:54

It's crazy. We just have videos, okay, and man, we've had people come in from other CRs and other big churches, dude, there is more life and fire here than bigger CRs.

Speaker 1 2:22:58

We're like we don't know what's going on at this CR man, but we feel the spirit of God when you guys are worshiping and you guys just have videos. Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:23:05

You know what I mean. I'll go back to you. There's not a lot of spirit-filled churches here in the valley yeah and a lot of crs are not at spirit-filled churches, you know what I tell them.

Speaker 2 2:23:13

It's our covering yeah, yeah, it's our house, man 100 it's got nothing to do with us, this, this house this house. It's a pastor.

Speaker 1 2:23:19

Everything that our prayer that was done prior to us starting cr it's got nothing to do with me and rowdy, it's our covering man.

Speaker 4 2:23:26

Yeah yeah, crs are awesome and, honestly, that that's where I got a lot of my training at freedom of worship.

Speaker 1 2:23:32

Yeah, come on.

Speaker 4 2:23:33

Because I'm learning. When I tell you this, I'm not joking. I knew no songs. They did. I don't listen to K-Love. Had I listened to K-Love, I'd probably know a lot.

Speaker 1 2:23:53

There's lots of Phil Wickham, lots of Bethel, lots of stuff, but no Planet Shakers, no Israel, no belonging, no belonging yeah what do you listen to?

Speaker 4 2:23:56

ktar I listen to podcasts? Yeah, basically yeah. If it's not, if it's not like building knowledge, I don't usually listen to it or unless I'm preparing for a set like I don't that's interesting.

Speaker 1 2:24:02

So when you're in the car you have podcasts going 100 I got sports talk so I I understand, yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, if it's not better, I don't think I've ever listened to a podcast Interesting. I wouldn't even know where to go to find one.

Speaker 2 2:24:13

YouTube. Yeah, Sean Ryan Show. Yeah, you can go to. Yeah, you have an app, probably.

Speaker 4 2:24:18

Oh, you don't have an iPhone, you have an Android.

Speaker 2 2:24:20

No, I don't. He hasn't joined the dark side yet.

Speaker 1 2:24:23

I refuse to get an iPhone bring him over god. So one of my phones went bad one time and ratty had his old iphone, so I take my my card out and put it in his iphone and I'm like, I'm like what the hell is this dude had to show him the iphone he's like it was the worst thing ever. That's awesome I literally went back to a flip phone. Because of that I'm, I'm like I'd rather have this flip phone than that dude.

Speaker 4 2:24:53

I'm old bro, I think you're 40 showing.

Speaker 1 2:24:55

I'm 50 showing buddy. I'll be 53 on Tuesday. Hey, there you go.

Speaker 4 2:25:01

You don't look a day over 52.

Speaker 1 2:25:02

Thanks, man, it was the drugs Crushing it.

Speaker 2 2:25:07

A lot of life ahead of you.

Speaker 1 2:25:12

You've got all your hair. You've got something up on me. I've got more hair than I do teeth bud For now. So you've got me there, man, You've got beautiful teeth For now Praise. God.

Speaker 4 2:25:24

Yeah, so we're stepping into this season and it's really cool Like we're developing relationships. I actually find two of my best friends. And they are. You know, like you know, when you find your people, that you can just be you. Yeah, and it's like I don't have to worry about anything I say being taken out of context, because they know me yeah. They know me, I'm still looking for mine bud.

Speaker 1 2:25:49

Yeah, they're hard to find. They are but it came through, you were probably the closest thing I had, like that dude.

Speaker 3 2:25:54

Yeah.

Speaker 1 2:25:55

Literally our sarcasm that we have together. It's just, you were like, I'm like, I get this dude.

Speaker 4 2:26:00

You know what I mean. I haven't died, I'm still around. I know, I know.

Speaker 2 2:26:07

But yeah, pick it back up. Yeah, let's do it. He needs a friend, bro, because I speak sarcasm too.

Speaker 1 2:26:12

Yeah, and it's hard to find people who understand sarcasm, for sure, and don't take offense to it. Yes, you know what I mean.

Speaker 4 2:26:17

So let's do it. Let's do it Before we leave tonight. Let's get some of my books. All right, let's do it. He's very smart. It wouldn't shock me if he has autism High spectrum.

Speaker 3 2:26:23

Yes, and it sounds like I'm making fun of him, I've told this to his face and he probably will listen to this podcast and laugh at what I just said.

Speaker 2 2:26:40

But anyway, he is a.

Speaker 4 2:26:41

Calvinist.

Speaker 1 2:26:42

Yeah.

Speaker 2 2:26:43

Oh God.

Speaker 4 2:26:44

One of those. He's very generous, but he doesn't believe in tithing.

Speaker 2 2:26:48

And so it's kind of cool.

Speaker 4 2:26:49

I'd be like, hey, I wrote this course, check this out. Or I did this, check this out. And it's one of those things where he's the guy that when you talk to you, you better come prepared.

Speaker 3 2:26:57

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:26:58

Because he's like he's on his end.

Speaker 2 2:26:59

He didn't call you on your.

Speaker 4 2:27:01

Yeah, well, he's actually researched it and he's done all the things and he like his name's Taylor, like he. So Hunter, great dude, phenomenal drummer. He played for Vertical Worship, went to Liberty University on a drum scholarship.

Speaker 3 2:27:19

Wow.

Speaker 4 2:27:20

Like super awesome drummer.

Speaker 3 2:27:22

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:27:22

Taylor, great dude. He's a worship leader. He actually just moved out to Nashville and, it's funny, one of the guys that offered me the job is now out there at the same church he's at in Nashville.

Speaker 1 2:27:31

Wow.

Speaker 4 2:27:32

Weird stuff, yeah, but anyway it's again weird how like it all works together.

Speaker 2 2:27:36

Yeah, it's a small world man, you can't get out of it. But don't burn the bridges, yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 2:27:42

For sure. Well, and so we developed this friendship where it's like we're talking, we're laughing, we're like having the best time.

Speaker 2 2:27:49

You're serving God For sure, serving God together.

Speaker 4 2:27:51

Amen.

Speaker 1 2:27:52

And so.

Speaker 4 2:27:53

Taylor is leading worship, I'm his music director and then Hunter's playing drums, nice Leslie's playing keys, so she jumps in, probably January of that next year. She put off a long time of jumping into. She jumps in on keys, so we have this band. Everyone saw Gerson Danielle are singing with us Like this is cool.

Speaker 2 2:28:12

Look what God has done Wow.

Speaker 4 2:28:15

And so um, so we're, yeah, we're, we're building, we're, we're having fun, we're doing life together, and then you don't. I don't feel like you ever find this, but all of our wives get along Like I feel like if you find a good friend, that's a dude.

Speaker 3 2:28:27

Usually the wives like don't crush it, it's like yeah all of our wives get along.

Speaker 4 2:28:31

And so like now we're like we have this like cool friendship where, like, the girls are meeting every other week and doing Bible studies and the guys are meeting every other week and we're doing Bible studies and we're hanging out and we're like growing.

Speaker 2 2:28:41

It's like again redemptive like your people, we'd lost everything, yeah.

Speaker 4 2:28:54

And this is great. Great, we find this again and we find this healing and so um and so anyway. So so work's going really well. Uh, finally figure out how to do my job. You know, I was at you ground and and really the big thing was I realized I had ADHD.

Speaker 2 2:29:02

So, once, once Adderall was introduced you can I'm not joking, but more focused you can literally see our profit, our line started to go up and to the right wow um, I guess if you're on the podcast this week, yeah

Speaker 3 2:29:14

anyway, um, from like just getting focused and like start crushing it and so work's going really well and then I get this opportunity.

Speaker 4 2:29:22

Our worship pastor comes up to me, goes hey, chris, I have this worship leader at fountain hills and he is he's. He's new, he doesn't really have any training and he has a fantastic voice great musician, but he's young, he's new, he doesn't really have any training and he has a fantastic voice great musician, but he's young, he's 20 he needs like some guidance and he goes. I think you're the guy to go to fountain hills and lead worship. Wow, I'm like, okay, cool, it's fountain hills, yeah I'm in gilbert right, so it's a 40 minute drive.

Speaker 4 2:29:48

yeah, um, I won't do life with any of those people, not because I don't want to, not because they're not great people, it's just we live 40 minutes away. Yeah, it's a retirement community. My kids aren't going to have anything there. So I just thought it was like, hey, I'd be willing to try it out for a few months.

Speaker 1 2:30:02

Like Dan Bickley and Sheriff Joe live there.

Speaker 4 2:30:05

Yeah, even that and everything I told you know all of the leaders that are there I was like, hey, listen, I want to be the person for you that I always wish I had for me.

Speaker 2 2:30:15

When I was serving in ministry.

Speaker 4 2:30:17

Like I want the person to show up, to be, like you know, early. I want them to like communicate, and so I'm like I'm going to if my schedule allows it. I will say yes to anything you ask me to do.

Speaker 3 2:30:26

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:30:27

You have it, and and so they definitely took me up on that for sure. But anyway, so I prayed about it and I said, okay, I'm willing to do it, but Leslie's my MD. Leslie's doing it Because we try that for the longest time of like, hey, like, leslie's a very great musician, she's a worship leader. So, she understands the flow that happens as a worship leader Now granted at this church. Like no one knows hand signals but Leslie and I know hand signals from lifelink.

Speaker 4 2:30:53

Like you know, if I throw a three to someone, they're going to think that's a three cord at the church I go to. But if I throw that three to Leslie, she knows we're going to the bridge and so. So I'm like okay, so let's so I start training her on to be an MD before I leave South mountain.

Speaker 4 2:31:07

I'm like, okay, here's how you like, here's the calls I would make here's different things, and so then we would get the set and we would practice and I would say, okay, hey, let's see, this is kind of what I'm feeling, and she's a worship leader, so I, and at this campus there's so much more freedom. Um, it's an older crowd. They like the.

Speaker 2 2:31:24

I say like older songs, but songs I grew up with yeah like to them that feels like home oh, yeah, them red hymnals, yeah, like yeah, yeah, yeah, some of that stuff you know like even like you know, I'm coming back to the heart of worship like I, you know, end a song with that.

Speaker 3 2:31:38

Or like so draw me close to you, or you know the things that I grew up in church with like to them is like it just feels like home and so as the deer panting, yeah, for sure 100 as the deer.

Speaker 4 2:31:51

Yeah, so we, so, we, so we, so we go out there and like, and we and, and it's this cool thing of like all of the training that we've had, like, when you think about the years of training we sat underneath come on, bro. We did the school of worship, we did the internships, we did the fill in the blank we've kind of done. We've learned how to build teams.

Speaker 2 2:32:09

We've had to do the leadership so.

Speaker 4 2:32:12

so we show up to this campus and there's no singers and there's no band. Wow, the band is all hired contract musicians.

Speaker 3 2:32:19

Really.

Speaker 4 2:32:19

I've come around on that. I know that a lot of people don't like contract musicians. I've come around some that are real terrible and I've come around some that love Jesus with all their heart and had a Sunday off and wanted to serve the local church.

Speaker 3 2:32:29

They're day off and wanted to serve the local church and they're fantastic, so so there there are good contractors that are out there that are perfect to put in like a different spot.

Legacy Building and Future Vision

Speaker 4 2:32:36

Um, I've come around on that. That wasn't always my thinking on that, but after working with some of them, like, and so so it is, we have contractors come out and if they were great people, we'd work on making them join the church yeah like we would start, like we know how to be pastors.

Speaker 4 2:32:48

and one of the great things I appreciate about Pastor Dave is, before we got ordained, he told us that you'll be ready to be ordained. When people look at you as a pastor without you being a pastor, like they already see you as a pastor and unfortunately that was so frustrating in the moment. But as I'm here now, I can tell you like you can't turn that off on me If I like I'm, I have my license and I'm ordained and all that stuff. But if I lost all of that it would not matter whatsoever it's just who you are.

Speaker 2 2:33:15

It gets me a discount on my kids education right now.

Speaker 4 2:33:17

But like outside of that, like I'm a pastor, you can't take that out of me.

Speaker 3 2:33:21

So it's a heart bud for sure. It's a heart exactly.

Speaker 2 2:33:24

Yeah, you can't you can't change, can't can't teach that.

Speaker 4 2:33:26

I guess you can't change it, but you don't want to yeah, so we start pastoring this team at Fountain Hills.

Speaker 3 2:33:32

Wow.

Speaker 4 2:33:33

And so like there's singers that are coming out and there's a drummer that's there, that is just like, hey, help me. I'm like, okay, let's do it. I don't play drums I've always wanted to but I'm like I can, like I know what I want, I can help describe what I want. So we start building this team and so like it's this redemptive spot. So I go back to Leslie and I Leslie Lacey and I are going to sushi. We're talking about I want to do ministry with my wife, leading worship with her. Now, leslie has always been the singer and I've been the band guy.

Speaker 4 2:34:01

This season I'm the singer.

Speaker 2 2:34:03

She's the band.

Speaker 4 2:34:04

Wow, we're doing ministry together.

Speaker 3 2:34:07

We're doing worship together Wow. Not only that, I'm the guy.

Speaker 4 2:34:11

And it's like it took me a second to like realize this is where, like God, like perfect redemption of like this, this spot, this, this soul wound that you had is gone, wow, like you're actually stepping into where you're supposed to be at and like there's no consequence. Like you have freedom, like I'm submitted to the house. I know what's going on here. I know what's going on here. I know what's allowed and not allowed. Let's go for it. And so we start the season of like leading worship, building a team together and even, like you know, like the, there's sometimes Leslie and I disagree, but it's like one of those things, even as a husband of like no, she's in this role, so I'm like, if we disagree, like, unless I felt like really strong MD when I lead worship.

Speaker 4 2:34:57

I want her, because she knows where I'm going, she knows what I'm going to do, and she got so like she was already phenomenal. She got so much better, like we're like Nashville. Numbers like that, that's the only thing we use now. Um, we're like doing this. I don't know. It's just crazy. We're developing teams because every person that goes out to the fountain Hills they don't live in fountain Hills.

Speaker 3 2:35:16

They're coming from Mesa Wow.

Speaker 4 2:35:18

So we're developing relationships, we're building the team, we're building this whole thing up and um, it's this cool. Yeah, it's just it's a really cool season. And so we we got to this spot where I started to feel again like there's a shift coming, kind of thing. And I heard this on a podcast. I've been chewing on it ever since. But they said, like you know, your season's changing when the grace is lifted.

Speaker 2 2:35:40

When things that used to be very easy start, getting hard, start hard, that's good.

Speaker 4 2:35:49

So it's like, hey, this all day, sunday used to be no big deal, but now it's really grinding on me. So granted some of those times it's time to push through. Some of those times it's like no hey, it's time to change.

Speaker 4 2:35:55

Could be an indicator, so our pastor and it's so weird because it's like you know, our church, I think we're like around 6,000 people or so on a Sunday and so like, not that he's necessarily a celebrity, but like he just got, he went to the White House twice this year. I met with President Trump he's getting all these cool speaking opportunities and his assistant reached out and was like hey, pastor Ryan, I would like to meet with you.

Speaker 3 2:36:20

I was like with me, he's just a guy.

Speaker 2 2:36:21

He's just a dude. They're just a guy.

Speaker 3 2:36:23

Just a dude, but in your head you're like. I know I've been with Pastor Dave for the longest time. Pastor Dave would he would like to meet. I know he's like superman.

Speaker 4 2:36:31

You know people avoid him well and then you get around talking with there and you're like I'm stuttering and like sounding dumb and he's staring through my soul right and he's just a dude. He's a weird man. Yeah, I love you, pastor.

Speaker 1 2:36:42

Yeah I mean he's very much like jesus but let me ask you this, looking back at the seasons where people that you allowed to have influence in your life said man, find something else, dude. And looking, and where you're at now, jesus looking back, are you? I mean, obviously you're glad that you didn't let that stop you right oh yeah, I mean god, could you imagine what life would be like if you were like let that hurt, really just control and take you down from that spot?

Speaker 2 2:37:15

Never pick up another instrument again. What would you be doing right now? You know what.

Speaker 1 2:37:18

I mean.

Speaker 4 2:37:19

Well, and that's the thing, is that, like you know, one of the things we talk about is obscurity right. And you know, sometimes you are in seasons you don't really understand why I say for me like I, I, yeah, I would never let those things happen. I think in this last season that's the one thing I've kind of shaken down to the ground is the difference between, um, what god says, the leader, a leader speaking into your life who's just a person yeah, and you know they, they very much could be.

Speaker 2 2:37:50

You know, this is the holy spirit yeah, it could be hearing from god, and they very well could not be.

Speaker 3 2:37:54

Yeah, you know, amen, it's possible.

Speaker 1 2:37:56

No, I don't think they mean wrong, but it's possible yeah so, and then?

Speaker 4 2:38:00

what do I do with all of that? Yeah and so that's the thing where I've kind of I've come to that I feel like I've like grown to the next level of being a man, as far as like excuse me, I don't let what people say necessarily change how I feel or look or do anything yeah, to affect what you're doing and what god's called you.

Speaker 2 2:38:16

I just take it.

Speaker 4 2:38:17

I said, I submit it to god and say okay, god, like, is there something? Because I also don't want to be callous as a leader either yeah, of course gotta care I don't care what you say, I'm gonna do it my way anyway that's a.

Speaker 1 2:38:25

That's the wrong spot but you take what's said and you present it to the lord. And is this from you or not?

Speaker 4 2:38:30

The key, though, is that, in that process, you can't take it personally.

Speaker 2 2:38:35

So good, buddy, you have to like almost no offense.

Speaker 4 2:38:37

Unattached from it, say okay, god here's this.

Speaker 1 2:38:40

So when you first started doing worship, would you, did you feel at the time that that was something that God was calling you to Are?

Speaker 1 2:38:46

you talking about at LifeLink or over there now In general, when you first started doing worship, did you really feel like that was something that God was calling you to? Yes, 100%. So not, so, I don't know. So, you knowing that, and then people that were influencing your life saying, man, you still believe that that was something that God was calling you to. Even with them saying you probably should find something else, you still believe that at the time.

Speaker 3 2:39:12

I don't think it much, as it hurt and it kind of made you want to step back.

Speaker 1 2:39:16

Did you still believe? I know god, you called me to this.

Speaker 4 2:39:18

I'm gonna keep going you know, I think I think it's in the back of your head, but I don't think it's like. I'm still through some of those seasons, still really young in the faith, you know, like, even though, again, I've been in church my whole life. But, like you know, I feel like, oh, I don't know if this equates right, maybe it is in my head, but, like you know, when you're a teenager and your battery dies in your car, like I have to buy a 75 battery, it's like yeah, it's like the end of the world, my world's over.

Speaker 4 2:39:43

Oh my god, yeah I would kill for even a 500 like problem right now like all of my problems feel like one to ten10,000 problems and like, so like when a when a battery goes out, it's like, eh, it's just a battery, but I've lived enough life to be able to see that.

Speaker 4 2:39:59

And that's kind of how I feel about that too, where it's like I've I've had enough relationship with God, where I've seen him come through enough. And you know, there there was a um, a Thanksgiving a couple of years ago where you know, we were talking about like what are you thankful for? And I was really thinking like I'm really thankful for the unknown. Yeah, that that I'm a big control freak.

Speaker 4 2:40:18

Everybody knows me, knows that's the case and I don't like things out of my control, but really this unknown I've, what I've come to actually realize about it is that God really can use that and really when you trust him, like it may not seem good in the moment, but really like I know that hurt. People say this and I'm not, but we are living the best season we've ever had as a family right now, yeah, man Like it's never been better than it is right now What'd you say?

Speaker 2 2:40:50

That hurt people say that Hurt people are like no, we're literally living the best life we've ever lived, right now.

Speaker 4 2:40:56

Because, we are, we are, we really are it's legit? Yeah, some people are like no it's great, trust me.

Speaker 2 2:41:02

Yeah, I know what you're saying. I don't believe you.

Speaker 1 2:41:04

You know what's crazy for me, pastor Chris is. I've been with you. I've been at this church with you for a while, not knowing that those no's were said to you yeah, and watching you progress from you know, a guitar player to a backup singer to be in the center stage here at lifelink. And watching that progress, not knowing that that had happened Every time you were coming across the stage, you lifelink.

Speaker 2 2:41:32

And watching that progress, not knowing that that had happened every time you were coming across the stage.

Speaker 3 2:41:35

You were unqualified and unworthy, not good and then fighting through that to watch you grow, god.

Speaker 1 2:41:41

In that season, when you were slowly coming from you know just a guitar player to you know, uh, second lead over here to center stage and watching that at the time for me was like look at my brother go. Yeah, I remember too good to not believe yeah, yeah and, and I can still remember, uh, one of the first times you got to lead you were center stage, yeah and for me I was.

Speaker 1 2:42:04

I was like that's my brother, you know I mean. But now, seeing that that moment means so much more to me being your friend and your brother, to know that those times, that said, I feel like I'm getting emotional. That sucks.

Speaker 2 2:42:17

It's okay, buddy, you told me not to cry. He's the one that's crying.

Speaker 1 2:42:20

But to see that now and looking back and realizing that moment meant more than I ever realized at that moment, knowing now that people have told you man, maybe you should find something different. And to knowing now that people have told you man, maybe you should find something different, yeah, and to see you just conquer that in that moment, dude and just for me it's like damn bro, yeah, you did it, dude.

Speaker 4 2:42:38

Yeah, you really did man, you fought, the good fight you endured yeah yeah man, I appreciate it, you know, and I think too, like the, to juxtapose that idea of with like there were things I needed to work on yeah you know like it, there there was more vocal strength that was needed and there's.

Speaker 4 2:42:56

You know, I just discovered in the last couple of years, like warming up my voice I've never done that before and like, but as you get older, like your voice doesn't like bounce back like it used to. So you know, like I, I think you know not that looking back is always the greatest thing, but like I think if I would have looked back and be like, no, I'm secure in what God's called me to be, but I can also identify there are things I need to work on, I probably would have got to the season I'm at faster.

Speaker 4 2:43:20

So, that's where I'm at now, where it's like that's what I'm saying when somebody brings something to your attention, it's like I'm going to, let's fix it. I think you had a flannel shirt on that day.

Speaker 1 2:43:32

It's real good. It was like yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, it was red.

Speaker 3 2:43:36

I still remember that day.

Speaker 1 2:43:37

I remember that one dude. Yeah, I was like wow, man, look at my brother.

Speaker 4 2:43:45

He got center stage dude, you know what I mean. Yeah, yeah. No, and I'm and there's something different. I was even thinking about, you know, the opportunities I've gotten to preach here. There's something different when, like you've, built relationship with people and like they know you and like you can provide something in there. It's just, it's a different. It's a different feeling than going somewhere that's not your place.

Speaker 3 2:44:02

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:44:02

Than like being someone, same thing with leading worship, like you're leading worship with and they know you, and it's almost like there's a trust built in to where there's not like a where's this guy going?

Speaker 3 2:44:14

What's his agenda? What is he going to?

Speaker 4 2:44:15

do? They can just, we're here, let's just go.

Speaker 1 2:44:19

You know there's a trust. It's funny to see diehard theologians. I mean not every pastor is like a diehard theologian, but when you get a diehard theologian preaching, it's a little different, bro for sure.

Speaker 1 2:44:34

Like watching you or pastor abel preach is like yeah, it's like it's, it's a little different, it is a little different preacher, and just like uh dave or john, or pastor dave or pastor josh preach, you know, I mean, you know you're gonna get some fire and you're gonna get some good stuff, but with you or dave, it was like no, you're getting ready to get taught something, dude. You know what I mean, and so it's always I don't know, I mean.

Speaker 4 2:44:50

Yeah, that's the difference between a teacher and a preacher.

Speaker 3 2:44:53

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:44:53

For sure. Yeah, yeah and that's yeah, that's for sure I buy that.

Speaker 3 2:44:58

But yeah.

Speaker 4 2:44:59

Yeah, so it's honestly, it's a really redemptive season.

Speaker 1 2:45:04

Do you see yourself ever getting an opportunity to preach again, or have you been offered?

Speaker 2 2:45:13

Or do you see that coming, or I don't know. Do they use screens? Where you're at now Is there screens. Yeah, yeah so all the campuses are getting the same stuff, for sure. Yeah, yeah.

Speaker 4 2:45:19

You know I wouldn't put that out of the question. There's nothing I'm necessarily aware of there. I have got an opportunity a couple times to speak at the Bible college there and that's pretty cool. I did one on leadership and it was actually cool like preparing for that of like I actually I texted pastor Dave and I was like, hey, I can't help, but as I'm preparing this, like everything I can think of, like you've taught, me that's great buddy Um and so there's been some of those where I've gotten to teach on some things, and that's that's definitely.

Speaker 4 2:45:45

Another cool thing is, like you know, you eventually get to the spot here where, like everybody's heard what I have to say Like there's nothing new like, and especially in everything I'd said here, like I'd heard it from pastor Dave. Like it's not, like it's my thing, but it's kind of cool going somewhere else where they don't really know what you know.

Speaker 3 2:46:02

Yeah.

Speaker 4 2:46:03

Um and so like, like on on, yeah for our for our. We do a devotional, you know, for the whole team, and so I'll bring. I was like, have you ever heard of like this, this principle, we win, or this, uh, you know what about? Like the?

Speaker 2 2:46:15

we did that.

Speaker 4 2:46:21

And it's like oh my gosh, this is the best thing I've ever heard. Like, yeah, I was like, but it's kind of cool. It's like, oh man, I actually have something to bring now, you know. So, yeah, so I think, think, I think there's some, some, so definitely some, um, some teaching, that'll, that'll come out of it, but again, for me it's just one of those open palm seasons.

Speaker 4 2:46:38

Our season changed from worship yeah we actually just stepped out of that. Um. I said leslie's still going to be doing keys and md but we're helping kind of launch a new campus um, and we're going to be like the operational pastors, uh, at campus.

Speaker 1 2:46:51

Wow, what could God go.

Speaker 4 2:46:53

Yeah so all of the serve teams will report to us and then we'll get to work directly with the campus pastors. The campus pastors can focus on just the people and we get to focus on operations.

Speaker 2 2:47:04

All the stuff behind the scenes, which is what I was doing.

Speaker 4 2:47:06

That's what you were doing, bud, I had coffee with Pastor Ryan a few months ago and he's like all right. So he's like you've been to Fountain Hills. He's like so what does that look like? I was like I don't think I told you this part of the story, but I was supposed to be there for two months. I was there for a year and a half. Wow.

Speaker 2 2:47:20

You're faithful.

Speaker 4 2:47:28

There was a, there was a problem with goes. How's that going? I was like, well, you know, we were supposed to be there for two months and I kind of feel the season shifting. But it's like you know, we're kingdom people. If you want us to stay there, we will, and he goes wait, hold on. You're not supposed to be there for two months, you've been there for a year and a half at.

Speaker 4 2:47:46

Fountain Hills. I was like, okay, and I think it was like three weeks later, like he's like all right, I'm shifting your assignment and you're going out to help with this campus.

Speaker 4 2:47:54

And he asked he's like. He's like you've earned the right, what do you want to do? And I was like I'd interviewed for a campus pastor job before and I was like, and I actually met with Pastor Kerry and it was like I don't think that's the job for me. I was like this operational job, this is in my wheelhouse. I can do this all day long making stuff get done exactly so you know.

Speaker 4 2:48:13

So work continues to grow and that's kind of a cool thing. Some people ask like, hey, will you ever go back into full time ministry? And it's like my answer is like I don't know. I kind of like bivocational ministry.

Speaker 1 2:48:25

Do you guys use felons? Do we use felons?

Speaker 2 2:48:27

yeah, you're talking about for your construction thing?

Speaker 1 2:48:30

the able maker.

Speaker 2 2:48:31

So if we knew somebody that yeah, I get people in recovery bud that are not the best and they need work yeah, you send them over there.

Speaker 4 2:48:39

There's definitely some spots where there's not a background check that's required. All right, they're good quality people yeah, they'll show up and they'll work hard yeah, that's what we're looking for man so so yeah, so it's kind of this cool, like I'm home with my family, you know, throughout the week, the weekends we're looking for so yeah, so it's kind of this cool, like I'm home with my family. You know, throughout the week, the weekends we're full ministering to people Because your kids got to be getting big.

Speaker 2 2:48:59

Oh yeah.

Speaker 4 2:49:00

Yeah, levi's getting ready to start kindergarten. Harper's getting ready to start fourth grade.

Speaker 2 2:49:05

Wow.

Speaker 4 2:49:05

Wow. Yeah, harper was in kindergarten and Levi was just a little one, yeah wow, yeah, and harper was in kindergarten and levi was just a little one, yeah, wow. And to go back to, like this, this 10x thing, I I had, you know, to kind of bring it full circle, I and I, if we haven't lost everybody from talking yet- but it's okay, they come back.

Speaker 2 2:49:22

Okay, the next workout they come back.

Speaker 4 2:49:26

But really like. We realized that this is all part of god's plan this 10x thing wouldn't have necessarily happened in full-time ministry. In my head, when that word was given to us in my head it was like God's going to drop a bunch of money on our on our laps. No, I'm welcome, that's welcome still. If that would God liked to do, that I would gladly accept that.

Speaker 4 2:49:45

But that's really not it. It's really like God putting us in front of opportunities, trusting us with finances. It's really like God putting us in front of opportunities, trusting us with finances, with just saying, hey, like here's this business. You know what we felt last year God would kind of let us into buying a new house and making our other house into an Airbnb.

Speaker 3 2:50:03

Great.

Speaker 4 2:50:04

Great, one of the most scary things I've ever done six weeks of not sleeping, like I don't know how we're going to pay for this or how we're going to do this. But I go back to that faith gift that Leslie has and it's she's like no, hey, this is I really feel like strongly. This is where God's leading us. And I'm like okay, we took the process all the way through. I was expecting.

Speaker 3 2:50:25

I was praying God, stop this somewhere.

Speaker 4 2:50:27

didn't stop, yeah, it literally we got into spots that we should not have been able to get into. We get into this. We have another business that you know we worked with. You know we eventually met patrick through that kind of business idea. We worked it for three years without making anything like I worked 30, 40 hours a week on.

Speaker 2 2:50:45

It made nothing this is the clay. Yeah, yeah, you fought. You had to go through court, so and like now, that's profitable come on man able maker.

Speaker 4 2:50:56

Same thing where it's like we've done everything we can and every morning I pray god, show me how to do it like you want, you want this too in the beginning you're telling patrick, fire me, dude fire me man. I wanted it, but he wouldn't do it.

Speaker 1 2:51:10

So you still have Shaq shine.

Speaker 3 2:51:13

Uh, it's it looks differently now. It's a pool company. Now, oh is it.

Speaker 4 2:51:18

And it's doing well.

Speaker 3 2:51:19

Amen.

Speaker 4 2:51:19

Um, so yeah, so like so, now that, like so, now that we're on this side, we're in full-time ministry on Sundays, we're, you know, at a able maker. We've got the Airbnb. We've got the clay business, she's doing books for color, a couple other companies.

Speaker 2 2:51:36

You have somebody that cleans your Airbnb for you.

Speaker 4 2:51:39

I do right now, but if if you're interested, we can chat.

Speaker 2 2:51:42

Yeah, I love to bro.

Speaker 4 2:51:43

Yeah.

Speaker 2 2:51:43

Little side hustle. Great cleaner bro, I know I heard the guy he gave me my first shot, bud, nice. I just took it and ran with it. Nice, let's go God.

Speaker 4 2:51:56

So yes, we're seeing this happen, and then this is the kind of the one of the last things is like we're talking at the beginning about your kids seeing things.

Speaker 3 2:52:03

Come on man.

Speaker 4 2:52:04

So, Harper just got back from camp and this picture for me, was the biggest thing and I really do kind of get emotional about it every time is you know? I feel like God's put a big thing on our lives for, like this biblical financial thing and where we're teaching people how to do it, where we want to advance the kingdom, we want to fund politicians. We want to do all the stuff that like it's like God's got all the. You're right there. He owns the cattle on a thousand hills, right, it's all his.

Speaker 2 2:52:32

It's like God's got all the he owns the cattle on a thousand hills right, it's all his. It's all his. He's just looking who he can get his mom buddy.

Speaker 4 2:52:36

And so Harper goes to camp and I send her with 20 bucks, like I was always the kid that like scraped everything I had to go to camp and like hopefully I could buy something kind of thing. So now, as a dad, I'm like I'm going to make sure you go with something and I'll make you earn it later.

Speaker 3 2:52:50

So she goes.

Speaker 4 2:52:51

I give her 20 bucks and she always buys dumb stuff with it Right Like it's, like she's a kid about this sort of this bracelet.

Speaker 4 2:52:57

You could have, like, bought a cool t-shirt. So I'm like so, hey, harper, how'd it go? She's like oh, really good, I had encountered a God and stuff. I was, as I was checking out my friend, you know she was a few dollars short and so I was like I have it, so I'll just give it to her. And so he's like I gave it to her and I still have money left over. I was like why did you do that, harper? And she goes well because our family's generous that's what we do.

Speaker 2 2:53:26

Wow, yeah, don't you cry, it's getting close, but it's like.

Speaker 4 2:53:31

this is what we've been modeling.

Speaker 3 2:53:33

Wow, dude.

Speaker 4 2:53:35

And we do that Every time we give, we pull our side and go.

Speaker 2 2:53:37

Oh, you guys, explain what you're doing. This is what we're doing. Yes, we go to.

Speaker 4 2:53:41

Disneyland Harper, you're going to see some things that don't line up with our family values, and that's okay. They don't know Jesus. So we're going to act like Peter says. We're going to have fun, Harper.

Speaker 3 2:53:56

the reason why we're not going to do this is because we're stewarding God's finances.

Speaker 4 2:53:58

Harper, we gave this to this person not because they deserved it, but because God told us to do that. And even this last week where her CD player broke and I gave that to her and I was like, Harper, come here, Do you know why you got that new CD player? It's kind of funny. She tells me you know why you got that new CD player. It's kind of funny. She tells me, like, do you know?

Speaker 3 2:54:13

what a CD player is. I was like come on.

Speaker 2 2:54:15

I had a disc band before. Yeah, I was carrying one on my shoulder.

Speaker 4 2:54:18

I said Harper, do you know why I bought this for you? She goes I don't know. I was like it's not because you earned it, it's not because you deserve it, it's because I'm your dad. Yeah, I can do nice things for you. Yeah, because not even because you even needed to deserve it.

Speaker 3 2:54:38

You are my kid and I take care of you.

Speaker 4 2:54:39

Wow. So she tells me this story with camp and she's like that we're just our family's generous. And I said what do you have left? She goes I have a dollar left. It's like that's your dollar, don't give it back, that's yours now and it really came to my, in my head, of like, hey, we steward what's god's, we use it on what we, you know. We feel like God's leanest to and it's there's leftover and we get to do with what we want.

Speaker 4 2:54:56

But, the reality is that dad's got more, like dad can give us more. Right and so if we're holding onto things because we're like we don't know when the next thing's going to come, then we're not going to get more of that. But if you're actually using it of like hey God, whatever you want to do with this, we're going to do with it. So that's where we're at, and I like to say that this is easy for us. God lays something on our heart and we just immediately do it. Most times it's like that.

Speaker 4 2:55:19

Sometimes it's like oh God, I have other plans for this, but what's the coolest thing for me is seeing my kid get it. I'm not necessarily teaching them like do these things.

Speaker 2 2:55:31

They're just watching. When you have this amount of money, do this with it.

Speaker 4 2:55:34

It's like she just did it and I was like, oh my gosh, wow.

Speaker 2 2:55:37

Yeah, you weren't even there, bro, it's working.

Speaker 4 2:55:39

She was representing our family and our family values, without us even being there.

Speaker 3 2:55:44

We weren't even seeing it.

Speaker 4 2:55:45

We wouldn't even have known about it. Wow, she's doing it. And so it's like, okay, god, you're, you're, you're taking care of the financial thing, you're, you're breaking generational things off of our family. This next generation is going to be even more exact. Really, our, our kind of dream is we kind of set this thing up, that we change generations and we allow generations to like, um, not the church, but, uh, the, the generations of our family, to be set up to be able to actually bless other people and we set it up in such a way that they know how to handle it and you know.

Speaker 4 2:56:18

Normally it's like one generation works for it, the next generation spends it.

Speaker 3 2:56:22

And the generation after that pays for it, and then they have to redo it.

Speaker 4 2:56:27

I want to stop it.

Speaker 2 2:56:28

I want to like.

Speaker 4 2:56:29

We're building this, this legacy.

Speaker 2 2:56:31

It's going to last.

Speaker 4 2:56:32

I want to stop it. I want to like. We're building this, this legacy.

Speaker 1 2:56:37

It's going to last, and it's going to last for sure, and so, um, yeah, so that's, that's kind of right, man, you know what's funny? Check this out. So what you're just saying right now is for me, just so you know.

Speaker 2 2:56:44

Yep, because right before you got here, we were about tithing but and by the way he said to tell you hi, okay, yeah, he did, he wanted to stay, he tried to stay long enough to see you, but his little one, get a chance to pull him out, and dave alley too.

Speaker 1 2:56:57

He was waiting to see you too, um, but I was talking to him about my wife. My wife just got a promotion, man, now she's making almost six figures a year, right, and I'm like, and you know, this woman barely comes to church but she's faithful with her tithing, and he he was like, oh good for her. I'm like polar opposite of me.

Speaker 2 2:57:12

I come to church, I'm faithful to church, but don't touch my money.

Speaker 1 2:57:14

You know what I mean. And he was like, oh, we need to work on that.

Speaker 2 2:57:17

You know what I mean. He's laughing as he walks away and gives him a bump.

Speaker 1 2:57:22

And now we're sitting here and you're talking about this and I'm just like, because I am, yeah, is that's?

Speaker 2 2:57:29

how you've had to be your whole life Like literally.

Speaker 1 2:57:31

I could have money in my pocket, but I'm going to put just enough gas in my car for the day, I'm going to get just enough food for the day and I'm going to hold on to the rest, cause I don't know what's coming. Yep, instead of just filling my tank up and knowing that it's going to last me all week, I've always had this got to hold on to because I don't know what's coming. I need to make sure I have something.

Speaker 1 2:57:51

In case something happens, I have money to cover it, and the crazy part is is, god has challenged me a few times with my tithing and he has responded in ways that are undeniable, but yet my mindset is still hold on, Cause you don't know. I mean like literally, I mean he challenged me, tie that, Test me. You know what I mean. And so at the time my tithe was $75 a week. So I was tithing $75 a week and literally my landlord comes to me and says hey, this is October, You're a good dude man, I'm going to knock $75 off your ramp for the next three months.

Speaker 1 2:58:32

And I'm like weird number, weird number. Okay, god, I see you, and then I go tithing, for you know, because I see God move. But then I have this moment where something happens and I'm like yeah, and I I gotta hold it all again because, oh god, that was close. I almost didn't make that. You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 2:58:49

For sure and yeah that's, that's human nature, though. Like that's, like, that's the self-preservation it's that and that's like you know, like ultimately blaming on adam and eve, but you know, there's like, there's, that's just the way we are I I grew up that with that too. Like we live paycheck to paycheck, growing up and it's like but at some point you're like at some point that you have to change it it becomes a trust in god, you trust in god.

Speaker 2 2:59:13

trust he either comes through or he doesn't.

Speaker 1 2:59:15

It's a poverty mindset.

Speaker 2 2:59:16

Yeah, totally Totally From not having nothing.

Speaker 1 2:59:19

Yep, as long as I've been an adult and I've been on my own, I've barely ever just gotten by yeah. You know what I mean. So I've always had to like just kind of cling to what I had, because you know what I mean and yeah, we're not in that season anymore.

Speaker 2 2:59:35

I'm not. I can feel it, dad is that mindset?

Speaker 4 2:59:37

you know I can say, when I worked at inside I made fantastic money yeah um, I didn't have anything to show for it. I had more to show for my money working in ministry 75 to 80 percent less just because of like implementing God's principles but it really it really honestly. It comes down to like do you trust God?

Speaker 4 2:59:58

I know you do, but like can you trust him with everything and like he'll come through with that stuff? And at the end of the day, like again we talked about in the beginning, like if you're responsible for their obedience, he's responsible for the outcome?

Speaker 1 3:00:09

He's got to come through. The crazy part, bro, is it's not like my tithe would hurt me right now? Yeah, that's the crazy part.

Speaker 4 3:00:16

Man, I get it, it's security.

Speaker 1 3:00:18

Like I could literally tithe my 10% and it would not affect me at all.

Speaker 4 3:00:24

Yeah.

Speaker 1 3:00:24

But it's just this. I don't know.

Speaker 2 3:00:27

Jesus, something I really need to work on. You're going to pray for him at the end, something I really need to work on Jesus and.

Speaker 1 3:00:32

Pastor Dave said one time, you know, I'll help you. You know what I mean. We can sit down and do a little thing.

Speaker 2 3:00:37

He really will, but in my mind.

Speaker 1 3:00:38

I'm like I do not want you seeing my bank account. You know what I mean, because you'll see all the stuff that I'm spending money on and places I shouldn't be spending money in, and I'm not letting you in my budget, pastor Bad.

Speaker 2 3:00:49

MGM. It's it's okay.

Speaker 1 3:00:52

Remember recovery.

Speaker 2 3:00:54

We got a group for that.

Speaker 4 3:00:57

That's all that's all real stuff.

Speaker 2 3:00:58

It's real.

Speaker 1 3:00:59

It's real.

Speaker 4 3:01:00

No, for me.

Speaker 1 3:01:01

I'm honestly it's, it's I have to but the crazy part is my wife gets it. Yeah, you know what I mean and I'm like I don't can you this?

Speaker 2 3:01:09

I like this is something that your friend needs some accountability in bud, and I think you could really come alongside your brother and help him. Man, yeah, for sure, and he would totally receive too yeah yeah, let's get together what it looks like and how I have no idea bro. Yeah, but just real intentionality between you two.

Speaker 4 3:01:31

Yeah come on, god, we, we live for this stuff and it's it really is like again, like I know. For me it's security, like having you know the, the. When you say security, you mean safety to be able to provide for the family for sure, like like for me for like, if I'll, like, if I'm you know I swiping it and you're like I have money to pay this off because I've budgeted for it, but I like the feeling of this money sitting in my bank account and not paying this off, it just to me.

Speaker 4 3:02:03

It just it feels better yeah okay, but logically I go no, no, hold on a second. So let me feel better. But I remember feelings follow focus and you can't trust your feelings like they're they're real, but they're not real good, um, and so like you have to like, adjust that and you're like okay, hey, I'm gonna pay.

Speaker 4 3:02:19

So if it's like a five thousand dollar bill, it's like I'm gonna pay 22 interest on this or I can pay it off and pay no interest on this. That's the fiscal responsible way to handle that situation. But my feeling is this feels better to have this in my bank account yeah I go through that every month and I have to go. Chris, you're being real dumb right now. Stop it, Pay this off, be in the spot you're supposed to be in. Be a good steward of the finance.

Speaker 2 3:02:43

Real good, it's a common.

Speaker 4 3:02:46

I struggle with it all the time but it's one of those things like it just feels good to have it and to not give it away.

Speaker 2 3:02:52

And you've been doing this for years. This is literally a gift or a lane that you feel God's called you to, and you still have this struggle.

Speaker 4 3:02:59

This is why I try as hard as I can not to think about it. If it drops on my head, do this I just in that moment.

Speaker 2 3:03:04

Usually we have a big Do you tell Pastor Les when it comes in? Hey God, just told me to do this. I have to tell you I'm not going to do it.

Speaker 4 3:03:13

We're doing it right now. The church we're at they do a back to school drive for um all of these different group homes and uh foster kids great there's something like a hundred different homes coming in the whole church is filled.

Speaker 4 3:03:26

They do like it's all new stuff like hey go to this room, pick out whatever new backpack you want go to this room pick out the snacks you or you need a haircut for school. Go get a haircut you want to you need, and so it's like one of those things where, like I know that there's a group of people in the bible that god, god, talks about the widows and the orphans.

Speaker 4 3:03:41

Yeah, I know they're important to him yeah we're sitting at church a couple weeks ago and they're like, hey, we're, you know, doing school supplies and we're raising funds and I, god dropped in my heart, hey, give him 500 bucks. I'm like I, our b&b right now is like not doing great, like it's it's summertime.

Speaker 3 3:03:55

I don't know about you guys. I don't want to be in it.

Speaker 2 3:03:58

Nobody's coming here, to visit, let alone like.

Speaker 4 3:04:01

But I'm like, so I don't like, I don't want to give up this security of like having this limit count to cover in case somebody doesn't rent this. But I just I put the number into the app and I just send it.

Speaker 2 3:04:15

Okay, this is it Okay.

Speaker 3 3:04:17

So like a lot of she doesn't?

Speaker 4 3:04:18

it's funny, I don't even have to tell her.

Speaker 3 3:04:20

I can just do it.

Speaker 4 3:04:20

And she'd be like duh yeah.

Speaker 1 3:04:23

But, still, I'm like I want her to be a part of that too, Of course man, this is part of it see now, I don't have a problem with God saying, hey, give this person a hundred bucks to help them with their bills.

Speaker 2 3:04:35

I'm like cool no, it's your tithe, it's the tithe, it's literally the tithe.

Speaker 1 3:04:40

I'm generous when it comes to people.

Speaker 2 3:04:42

Yeah, with his kids. But the tithe is where the devil is.

Speaker 1 3:04:47

I still think I have that mindset from that old type of thinking of they just want your money. You know what I mean and I know they don't. You know what I mean and I know they don't.

Speaker 4 3:04:55

You know I mean, I know it takes money to run this place.

Speaker 1 3:04:56

You know, if dave ballet was here, he might say different I love you dave but it's still that kind of mindset, you know, I mean, and just I don't know. I need yeah, because I got something coming my way bro. Yeah, you do bud that.

Speaker 4 3:05:07

Yep, god needs to know that he can trust you with it, and it's something I need to get right, and it's yeah well, yeah Well, let's connect on that, let's meet up. We can. I think there's some areas we can help each other Some practical areas.

Speaker 2 3:05:20

Man, yeah, for real.

Speaker 4 3:05:21

It's not just one way we can do some life together.

Speaker 2 3:05:24

Come on.

Speaker 4 3:05:24

There's things I need from you too.

Speaker 1 3:05:25

Jesus, I got a lot to offer bud man, Besides sarcasm.

Speaker 2 3:05:32

I love you guys. Dude, this is Dre man. I knew we were going to have fun with this, bro.

Speaker 1 3:05:41

How are we doing, man? I sure miss having you around, man.

Speaker 4 3:05:43

Yeah, yeah, I miss you guys a lot.

Speaker 1 3:05:45

Thank you. You and your brother were really special to me, and Rowdy man Yep. Thanks, dude. You were one of the people that kept it real with us.

Speaker 2 3:05:56

Thanks for believing in me, man Loving me too, when I didn't love myself. We had some real conversations. You know what I mean.

Speaker 1 3:06:02

Some good conversations where it wasn't just, you know, you trying to preach at us or you know just, it was real, genuine conversations, man.

Speaker 2 3:06:10

I knew you cared.

Speaker 1 3:06:12

You and your brother really helped us grow as men and as men of. God.

Speaker 2 3:06:17

A faithfulness.

Speaker 1 3:06:18

Yeah, I for one was, you know, I for one was sad to see you go, brother. I even sat down and told you that I went to coffee and I told you, man, cause I knew something was up, I could feel it in you. You know what I mean.

Speaker 4 3:06:32

I don't know if mean and uh yeah, that was yeah, that was the uh. Yeah, that was the day before.

Speaker 3 3:06:38

We told everybody yeah, right before staff meeting.

Speaker 4 3:06:40

Yeah, yeah yeah, honestly, the the people part of it was real real tough because again, like we said, like we actually, did life together, man it wasn't like.

Speaker 1 3:06:51

I thank god I don't have to see those guys again, I was like no we, we did life together, but I was thankful for the conversation that we had, because you made it very clear that you weren't leaving for any other reason than you felt. It was God For sure, because I even asked you what happened. What happened, bro, you?

Speaker 1 3:07:04

know what I mean and you were honest. It's our season. It's time to leave. You know what I mean. And Yep, leaps and bounds man, and sometimes we have to go to grow brother. Yeah, as hard as it is and as uncomfortable as it is to leave family, it's. I think it was the best thing for you guys and I'm thankful that you guys are in the position you are now man.

Speaker 4 3:07:24

Yeah, no, we don't. We don't regret any of our time here. Obviously, all of the teachings we got. There's obviously some lots of learning that we did and, like I said, every season's kind of set up for the next one. And so the things that we're experiencing now. Wouldn't it be possible?

Speaker 2 3:07:41

without what we had here.

Speaker 4 3:07:43

You know it's and so that's. You just realize like God works in seasons. And when your season's up, like you know for you to stay past where your season's at you actually cause more damage than it is just to leave. And so it's better to kind of move on to the next thing and and really, like I said, like the unknown is is weird, but, man, if you can get into that trusting God with like every part of like God wherever you want to put me next like this feels weird.

Speaker 4 3:08:07

I don't want to do it.

Speaker 2 3:08:07

Yeah, I don't know, come on.

Speaker 4 3:08:11

God. But it's like yeah, wherever you want to put me, wherever you want to do. And again, the older you get, you start to put those pieces together. My father-in-law says something that he's like you know in your 20s you don't know anything, but you think you do.

Speaker 3 3:08:24

I can identify with that In your 30s you recognize.

Speaker 4 3:08:27

you don't know anything, but in your 40s you actually start, knew it yeah you know, I started to learn some stuff but I'm you know, I'm only a few years away from 40 and that feels weird, yeah, um, but yeah I'm, we're ready for it. So we just know, like if it weren't for the season, you know, because it's really easy to look back and be like what if I hadn, if I hadn't quit my first job.

Speaker 3 3:08:54

Yeah, what if I would have stayed there? Yeah.

Speaker 4 3:08:57

I know for me I wouldn't have gotten Leslie.

Speaker 3 3:08:58

Yeah.

Speaker 4 3:08:59

I was a slick salesman.

Speaker 3 3:09:00

Yeah.

Speaker 4 3:09:00

I needed things worked out of me yeah. You know we talked about my girlfriend and you know things. I actually had to sit down with Pastor Dave and saying this is everything I've done with this girl and do you still want me to work here?

Speaker 3 3:09:21

Like you're my boss. So there's all of those pieces, but really when you look back and you see how God's been working through every layer of it, from beginning to end and it's not done.

Speaker 4 3:09:33

It's just you know, and you never know pieces, the people that are going to be in your life later on, what's going on, and so, yeah, it's just like if we ever had to leave another church again, we would do it completely different, we would recognize the season we're in and just be like, hey, we love you guys, our season's up. But we didn't know that then we don't know and so you know, there's some of those relationships that we're still hoping or you're still around at some point but, you know, if they're not like, we just know it's in god's hands and it's kind of moving on the next thing.

Speaker 4 3:10:02

But but yeah, we honestly we missed you guys too and still do like it's. You know there's a like I was at. I was swimming with the kids yesterday and I was like hey, harper, you remember rowdy, she goes, jesus that's him. Yes, dude, oh man that honestly works.

Speaker 4 3:10:22

This september will be three years since we left and so, like she, still man remembers you guys, and so, so, yeah, so there, so, yeah, so we we really did life together and yeah, it's, and where I'm at, where I'm at in production is because you and your wife bro that's cool you.

Speaker 1 3:10:36

you really helped me a lot when I first started doing cameras and stuff and it was actually your wife who I saw on camera was like why?

Speaker 2 3:10:44

is the pastor on camera.

Speaker 1 3:10:47

I need to take her spot Right and that's why I jumped on and started doing production. You know what I mean, and I'm still camera guy today. You know what I mean, I mean and I'm still camera guy today. You know, I mean, and it's because of that, and then you, the way that you helped me and not knowing in that season we would be doing this yeah, you know, I mean and all this and and now on cr, I'm the tech guy cool, I'm the one that does screens and I'm one that does the music, and so all that that was you back there I'm teaching this.

Speaker 4 3:11:11

Yeah, yeah, yeah, running the live stream.

Speaker 1 3:11:15

Yeah, bro, yeah that all started, you know, now look, and we're doing podcasts, jesus it's crazy bro, how god works man, you never know what season you're in.

Speaker 1 3:11:24

That's right I didn't know, saying wanting to, getting her out of off a camera and being a pastor would lead to what we're all doing now and it's just. It was just no idea. Got my heart for you guys, as leaders, to say you got other things you need to be doing besides being on a camera man. You know what I mean. That's cool. Yeah, it's been pretty cool, brother.

Speaker 2 3:11:43

Love you man.

Speaker 1 3:11:44

I love you too. Thanks for coming on.

Speaker 2 3:11:45

Yeah, thanks bro. I really appreciate you, man.

Speaker 1 3:11:48

You and me. Oh, what do you believe in God for man there, you?

Speaker 4 3:11:51

go bud yeah man, I've been thinking through that question. Go big.

Speaker 4 3:12:03

We're still believing God for that 10X kind of deal there. That's a big one of like. So I'll just try, to as much as I can, lay it out shortly. But in my head I want to have the home we live in. I want to have another three properties. I want to have a it's going to sound selfish, but I promise I'm going somewhere with it but have a home like a cabin up north, okay. And I want to have two houses here and we rent both of those houses out.

Speaker 3 3:12:28

Okay.

Speaker 4 3:12:29

And create like this legacy kind of trust thing that nothing leaves.

Speaker 3 3:12:35

Yeah, so we rent these houses out and it produces legacy kind of trust thing that nothing leaves.

Speaker 4 3:12:37

So we rent these houses out and it produces income, and then we just every month go God, what do you want to do with this? That's coming in and we start funding ministries building projects going on. We're going to take care of this. We want, um there's again like we, specifically politicians, um I, I'd like to run for office at some point one day. I don't know what exactly that looks like.

Speaker 2 3:12:59

Remember, he was just saying in politics it's a fourth grader, bro. I could see that.

Speaker 4 3:13:04

But I never want finances to stand in the way of a godly man or woman who's supposed to be in office to not be able to get there because of finances, and so I want to create this, this kind of legacy, even the and then you know, at some point we, you know, our kids, get married and we say, okay, these houses are now yours. If you'd like to live in them, great. If you'd like to continue to rent them out, great, you can take the income.

Speaker 4 3:13:30

They never leave the trust no matter what, no we don't want anything. We want their marriages to work and all that stuff. But I want this to be set up to where this never is dissolved, it's never taken, there's nothing that's taken out of it, there's only more that grows in it, and so that we're able to fund whatever God wants for not only our generation, but our kids' generation their kids. You know, the Bible says a godly man leaves inheritance for his children's children.

Speaker 2 3:13:56

Come on buddy.

Speaker 4 3:13:56

And so that doesn't necessarily mean that like and if you think about it, that doesn't mean it goes right to the kids or right to the grandkids. It means there has to be enough for it to go through the kids and make it to the grandkids Come on.

Speaker 4 3:14:11

So we want to build this legacy of like this is what we have, and we want to build this legacy of like this is what we have and this is what God's able to do. You know, with it, that that's, that's really what we're working with and so, and there's a number of like ways to get there and, like I said, all these different businesses are are doing well and you know, we really believe in God for wisdom and how to handle all that. My goal, my really big, hairy, audacious goal for next year, is to buy that second property come on buddy and to essentially retire leslie into just managing the airbnbs.

Speaker 4 3:14:43

Yeah she's, it's tough. She's fantastic at her job. Yeah, she's my administrative assistant for able maker and I never want her to leave and it's not because she's my wife and I'm like sleeping with her.

Speaker 2 3:14:57

She's good, she's fantastic, that's what she did here.

Speaker 3 3:14:59

It's an anointing.

Speaker 2 3:15:02

It's not a pity thing, because she's my wife, she's fantastic and I want her around.

Speaker 4 3:15:07

But I also know that there's more in her too. I know, with the culture of feminism that's everywhere. What is the slogan? The trad wife or whatever, but like a traditional wife she's like I'd like to stay home and like cook dinner and clean the house and do the things and I'm like say less, like that sounds amazing like, and so she's. So that so that's my goal is next year I'm able to retire her to like.

Speaker 4 3:15:29

You take care of the airbnbs, um you take care of our household, take care of our kids are alive.

Speaker 2 3:15:35

They're going to school they're happy um.

Speaker 4 3:15:37

Our life is looking good um. I always say this that, like any accomplishments I ever have in life, only possible because she's doing what she's doing, bro, that's right I can't do anything like tomorrow. I'm I'm headed out um uh 5 am tomorrow to go to louisiana for work wow and she's gonna be home with the kids. Yeah, if it weren't for her, I couldn't go on that trip.

Speaker 4 3:15:57

I can't close new business, I can't do any of the things I want to do, so, um, so, anyway. So I, so she, she. It really is the secret sauce to everything in our life. Um and so that, so that's my goal. I want start funding. What we're doing right now is great. We're giving the most we probably have ever given. Um, you know, there's success in front of us.

Speaker 2 3:16:24

I feel like we have a good head around all of it, but I feel it's minuscule compared to where God wants to take us.

Speaker 4 3:16:26

I would say this too, is that you know where we were at two years ago to where we're at now financially. We could do much more with what's in our hands now than we could have back then.

Speaker 1 3:16:35

Yeah.

Speaker 4 3:16:36

Just because of what we've learned and what we've gone through, and so so that's really one of the big things we're believing for of, like God, make this kind of you know, come to fruition and we'll, we'll get there and, along the way, like you know, ministry, like same thing, like we're believing that God's going way there. I don't know what's next as far as like, is it a full time ministry? Is it this for a little bit? Is it? I have no idea. We're open.

Speaker 2 3:16:58

You just have a yes and you're like whatever you want God, whatever God wants to do, we'll do it's great.

Speaker 4 3:17:04

But yeah, that's kind of the main thing is like we're and it feels like we're there. I always talk about, like you know, what does breakthrough feel like. It feels like hell, yeah, right before you get there. Yeah, like it's like everything is breaking.

Speaker 2 3:17:17

Yeah, nothing's working like my, my dog yesterday.

Speaker 4 3:17:20

I don't know if you know this, but grapes are bad for dogs.

Speaker 3 3:17:22

I didn't know that yeah, they're poisonous even like a couple my dog ate an entire box of them oh

Speaker 4 3:17:27

jesus and the vet's like, yeah, take him to the emergency room, and I'm like for a dog. Yeah, um, and it seems like in our life, like little things like that have begun to like, like, and I'm like I've been here enough times, I know what breakthrough feels like and we're on the verge of it. Come on and, um, yeah, we're just ready for it. So we're ready for, like, this next season. There's enough ambiguity to it, like we just don't know what's next, but we just feel like it's on the horizon. So so that that's kind of the main thing with that. Um, as well as like, I think like this is probably gonna feel like, um, like I have to say this, but I really do mean this is like for my kids to like continue to grow up and like. I find that balance of like I'm home and I see them.

Speaker 2 3:18:10

They love the church, they're involved in ministry, they love Jesus, they love all that stuff Like a good, healthy balance For sure, when they're not like. I got to go to church again.

Speaker 4 3:18:19

Right, I don't want them, even with that like grow like God, growing us financially.

Speaker 2 3:18:23

I don't want them to become brats either.

Speaker 4 3:18:24

You know I want, I want them to, and so we've even you know, you know, like, how did you do this? How are they all good, yeah, so we like every time we go to dinner with them, we just have pages of notes you know for that stuff.

Speaker 3 3:18:39

That's great.

Speaker 4 3:18:40

Yeah, so that's what, honestly, that's what we're believing for Amen. You know, whenever it's God's time, we're ready for it.

Speaker 1 3:18:58

But until then, we're going to do everything that we can to get there until he changes something. The three servants that the master gave money to and one buried it, yeah, and the other ones invested it, yep and I believe he made them governors. Yeah, and it's funny that you're talking about politics and you're a good steward with money. Yep, so I don't know. Let's see that for you something. Yeah, I love that.

Speaker 4 3:19:13

It's the parable of the mind is. I think it's in. Is it in, luke? But it's from the disciples standpoint yeah but it's yeah, they, they were in charge, they got put in charge over kingdoms yeah yeah there's like multiple kingdoms. Yeah, yeah um, and yeah, I, I love that too, because it's yeah, there's a lot in with that, but yeah, I, I 100% receive that you talking, that's what I'm seeing.

Speaker 1 3:19:30

I'm seeing.

Speaker 4 3:19:31

I'm like, oh wow, he's kind of j of in that lane right there, man.

Speaker 2 3:19:34

Thank you God, yep receive it you or me, you buddy Me, all right yeah.

Speaker 1 3:19:38

I'm going to pray for you, brother.

Speaker 2 3:19:39

Jesus, oh man, Thank you God.

Speaker 1 3:19:43

Thank you, lord. Thank you, lord, father God, I just I praise your holy name. Father God, I just I'm so grateful, so thankful. I praise you for your son, chris. God, I just thank you for man, just a friend that's close as a brother. God, I thank you for just the time that we had to spend together, god, not just today, but over the past few years that we were just doing life together. God, I thank you for the bond that was created and let that continue on, god, even though we're at different churches and we're in different seasons in life. Let us be intentional in watering this friendship and this brotherhood. God.

Speaker 1 3:20:31

Even with this brother Nate. Lord, that's not something that we just let go to the wayside and consider it just a season thing. God, I don't want that to be just a seasonal thing. So I thank you for intentionality and watering this friendship and this brotherhood, god, life friends, god Lord, I thank you for their kingdom mindset that they have when it comes to money, god, and I thank you, lord, for the word that was spoken over them, this tenfold, god, lord, I thank you. That was not just a season thing, that was a lifelong something that was spoken over them, god. So I thank you for this next season that's coming in their life.

Speaker 1 3:21:10

Father God, I thank you for just the prosperous in their businesses, god. Thank you for just the prosperous in their businesses, god. I thank you for new avenues to invest in new businesses to start, god, and I thank you, lord, that his dream and his passion and his desire to have his wife be retired and attending to the home, god, is not just his, it's yours too, god. Thank you, lord. I believe that you put that on his heart, god. So if that is the case, father God, you will provide the finances and the resources for that to happen. God, because you do not speak things or put things into place, god, that you do not finance or take care of god. So I just thank you for what you're doing in that area, god. I thank you for just harper and levi. God, just the way that they're being raised up. God, I'm so thrilled to hear that he sits with his daughter and explains why they do things financially.

Closing Prayer and Reflection

Speaker 1 3:22:04

God, so she has an understanding at such a young age of what money is and the resource that it is and that it is meant to be shared and put in good places and to be obedient when God speaks and finances God. If that's something that little girl and Levi can pick up at a young age, god, that's something they'll carry into adulthood and his idea of this being generational. God will take its place because they understand the principle that mom and dad are teaching them God. Its place because they understand the principle that mom and dad are teaching them God. So I just thank you, lord, for just the right people to put in place, god, to help them build this trust, because, doing research myself, god, I understand how this trust is and how it's allocated, and it's not something that can go to probate or something that's just passed on from one seer of the trust to from one seer of the trust to the next seer of the trust, god. So I pray for a connection there with somebody who can help them in that area, god, and help set that up so this can be something that goes on from generation to generation.

Speaker 1 3:23:07

God, lord, I just thank you for this next season in ministry, god, whether it's pastoring a church or just being an overseer or being in worship, god. I pray that you speak to them, that you direct them, that you give them guidance in what to do, god, and where they're going to go and how that looks, god, because from what I'm hearing, he will listen and he will be obedient, god, to whatever it is you're asking him to do, and I thank you that he has that understanding, that he has that ear to hear you and to be obedient God. So speak clearly, father, and I know he will obey, and I thank you for everything you're doing. We praise you and we love you In Jesus' mighty name, amen.

Speaker 2 3:23:47

Amen. I feel like I'm supposed to tell you, bro, that the season you're coming into, it's a season where you're equipping and you're empowering and you're training up Everything you've learned and has been poured in and given to you. This next season you're coming into now, it's time for you to just give it all away to all these people that are coming. Do me a favor, man, and pray for Speak Life Pray for me and Dad, man.

Speaker 4 3:24:14

Well, lord, god, we just thank you for God. What Eddie and Rowdy, what they're doing, or we know that, or God there's. There's lots of things throughout the years, through, uh the guy, that they may not realize that they're doing. God, but they're touching people's lives. God, the, the words of encouragement, lord, the um, the, the, the hugs, the, even the way that you're uh, using, using God, even this podcast, god, the prophetic words that you're delivering, god, I thank you that they're just open vessels and God, I pray for this podcast, god, that you would, god bless it, that God, that every person that comes on, god, I pray that it wouldn't be just another thing to listen to. But, lord, people would be able to identify the ways that you showed up in their lives, the way that you've come through God, the encounters that you've had with him and God. This would just be another building to the testimony.

Speaker 4 3:25:04

God, you said that we overcome by the blood of the lamb and the word of our testimony. And so, father, you've already paid the price. And so, lord, we, we pray that, god, the people that listen to this podcast would become overcomers, god, god, that they would begin to see what's possible. God, that they would realize that nothing is impossible with you. God, I pray for life to come over people as they're listening. God, I pray that even inside, they start to feel something different happen inside of them, god, because, god, you're doing something, god you're speaking to them.

Speaker 4 3:25:33

God, you're using the very words that are being spoken, Lord, to affect darkness. God, you're making and putting a dent into darkness because of this podcast.

Speaker 2 3:25:41

Thank you God.

Speaker 4 3:25:43

God, I thank you for the faithfulness of both Eddie and Rowdy and God, even their family, god, the sacrifice of them being, you know, up here recording for hours and editing, and all the things that go with it. God, I pray, blessings over them.

Speaker 3 3:25:54

God, I pray over Eddie.

Speaker 4 3:25:55

God, I pray, god, I speak into his future. God, the things that the enemies try to take away from him. God, I pray that you would not only bring those back to him, but, god, that you would accelerate that timeline, that this timeline wouldn't feel like it's just out there and at some point it may happen, god, but you would bring an acceleration to that. God, I pray that it would come full circle. God, the things that Eddie may have kicked himself for of saying, hey, I've lost out on that, or I won't get that back, or this won't happen. God, I pray that you would expedite that Come on God.

Speaker 4 3:26:29

Bring that back full circle to show the full redemptive plan that you have for his life, god, that there truly is benefit in going your way and doing the things that you want. So, god, I pray that you would bring that to fruition. God, I pray that you would even continue to speak to him about you know finances and tithing and all the things that go with that. God, as we're, you know every single one of us, god, are a work in progress, god, and you're working through a sanctification process in each and every one of us, god. I pray that in that next step, god, you'd be able to make those next things clear for him of what's next, the next thing to do, and, god, that you would bless him, bless his family, god, I pray that even the things that he hasn't said out loud, god, that just the two of you know that he's believing for God.

Speaker 4 3:27:11

I pray that you'd begin to bring those to fruition as well. We speak life over him and over his entire family. God, we thank you for the work that you're doing. I pray blessings, god. I even pray even at work, god. I pray for new opportunities, god. If there's even ways to grow the business, I pray that you would start to show him new ways to do that.

Speaker 4 3:27:30

God, favor in the customers that he deals with. God, every piece that he deals with. God, we pray that you would bless that Great God over Rowdy. God, we thank you for again, the way that he's shown up in different ways and provided encouragement and all of the things that just make Rowdy who he is. And God, I pray God. Blessings over him, god, as he's in this season and as he's working on himself and following your lead. God. Blessings over him, god, as he's in this season and as he's working on himself and following your lead.

Speaker 4 3:27:59

God, if more ministry opportunities are in his future, god, I pray that you would bring those his way. God, that he would find himself in opportunities and situations and ministry engagements, god, that really felt like they would never be possible. But God, you're working on his behalf. God, you're going before him and setting those things up. God, I pray that you would continue to give him more influence. Uh, lord, that's uh even. Uh. God, I know he already follows your voice, but, god, I pray that you would speak to him even more. Uh, lord, as he's out on the street and he he hears you say, hey, he's talked to this person. Give him this word. God, I pray for more of those opportunities. God, I pray for even now, that he would take a step, even in higher levels of leadership. God, that you would start to begin to reveal to him new ways, new things, new steps, new things that are happening. God, that it wouldn't be just like oh, there's Rowdy giving another prophetic word, but it's like Rowdy, what do you got? What's God speaking to you, right?

Speaker 3 3:28:56

now.

Speaker 4 3:28:56

Because that's what we need for this season. So God I pray for more of those opportunities and, God, I pray over his future. God, I pray over his spouse. God, that you're protecting right now, that you're setting aside for him, God for that right time. God, I pray that you would. If there's things in Rowdy that he's working on, God, if there's things that his spouse is working on, God, I pray that you'd start to align those pieces up perfectly.

Speaker 4 3:29:20

And again, things that felt like they were just gone and not being able to be in this season. God, I pray that you would accelerate those now, god, as he's stepping into even more obedience and just following you forward. God, I pray that you would accelerate the timeline that felt like this season is lost or this is not available to me. God, I got to speak against any of that, god, and just pray that you would begin to move, even more than you've ever done before, over all that and I pray that you'd begin to bring clear picture into what this next season looks like. And, god, even for Speak Life. God, I pray for more opportunities. Guys, as they're reaching out. God, I pray that you would, even if it's across the country, even if it's bringing in other people. God, you know the testimonies that need to be out there.

Speaker 4 3:30:07

You know, the people that are going to be listening. God, you know what's supposed to be there. So, God, we just pray that you start aligning those pieces. God, we just pray that you start aligning those pieces. God, we pray for financial blessing over this ministry as well, God, that you would fully fund it. God, that you would do something really miraculous in it too, that there wouldn't be any need for like, we need this or we need to go grab that because, God, you're already providing for it. So, Lord, we just thank you for what you're doing in this ministry and these men and their families, the church they're at. God, we just again just pray your blessings over all of that and we just thank you for all that you do, Lord, in your name.

Speaker 2 3:30:39

Amen. Thank you, bro, really appreciate you again. Man. Hey, everybody, I sure hope you enjoyed this podcast. Man, I don't know where you're watching or listening from, but if you could, man, go and subscribe to the channel, like and follow us, hit the little bell. If you you're on youtube, you'll get all the uh future notifications for upcoming episodes. Maybe you yourself got a really great testimony or you know somebody that does. You can reach out through social media social media, facebook and instagram. Go ahead and message us, speak life, az. All one word, and I'll get back to you. Maybe, like pastor chris was talking about, you're able, you're blessed and you're able to support the show. On Apple and Spotify, there's a place where you can actually go through Buzzsprout and be a monthly subscriber and support the show. We can use all the help we can get. If you could, please go and comment. Just type one word in there, man, jesus. It helps so much with the algorithms and stuff being seen, but until next time, we're going to continue to speak life, az. God bless you, jesus.