Episode 85: The red carpet roll-out

Becky takes us back in time when we had our first experiences of tabletop gaming and what our "gateway games" were that brought us in.  Has those games defined our tastes, how did we step stone through to games we play today and do we still go back to them.

FIRST PLAYER: Becky
OTHER PLAYERS: JP, Rob & Dan

In this episode you'll learn:
- more about a Scout like card game called Odin by Helvetiq as Becky explains all
- how JP has been trying to stop children from freezing in Frostpunk by Glass Cannon Unplugged and failing miserably
- Rob has ventured deeper into the Lacerdaverse with his first impressions of The Weather Machine by Eagle-Gryphon Games
- Dan has busted out Nucleum: Australia for the first time and his thoughts
- about our gateway games and how they have influenced our journey through the hobby

LINKS REFERENCED IN THE SHOW
UpgradeMyGame Etsy Store as mentioned by Rob -  https://www.etsy.com/uk/shop/UpgradeMyGame

EPISODE CHAPTERS

0:00 - TURN 1 - Player Count

3:58 - TURN 2 - Let's Talk About Hex

4:10 - Rob - The Weather Machine

11:31 - Dan - Nucleum Australia

15:07 - JP - Frostpunk

24:01 - Becky - Odin

28:04 - TURN 3 - Main Event: The red carpet roll-out

35:15 - Did our gateway games shape our gaming tastes for today?

44:08 - Have we ever gone back to gateway games after delving into the heavy stuff

48:04 - Can playing gateway games still be rewarding?

1:01:40 - Do we still play our first gateway games?

1:12:13 - TURN 4 - Konn4ct F4ur

1:16:56 - TURN 5 - Penultimate Turn: What's Coming Up?

1:24:35 - TURN 6 - The Final Turn

Chapters

• 0:00 TURN 1 - Player Count
• 3:58 TURN 2 - Let's Talk About Hex
• 4:10 Rob - The Weather Machine
• 11:31 Dan - Nucleum Australia
• 15:07 JP - Frostpunk
• 24:01 Becky - Odin
• 28:04 TURN 3 - Main Event: The red carpet roll-out
• 35:15 Did our gateway games shape our gaming tastes for today?
• 44:08 Have we ever gone back to gateway games after delving into the heavy stuff
• 48:04 Can playing gateway games still be rewarding?
• 1:01:40 Do we still play our first gateway games?
• 1:12:13 TURN 4 - Konn4ct F4ur
• 1:16:56 TURN 5 - Penultimate Turn: What's Coming Up?
• 1:24:35 TURN 6 - The Final Turn

Transcript

TURN 1 - Player Count
0:00
[Music]
0:17
Welcome to Whose Turn Is It Anyway, a board gaming podcast where we discuss all things mele shaped and we all own
0:23
more little plastic baggies than seems right without belonging to some dodgy underground chemical manufacturing gang.
0:28
I'm Becky, your first player. And this episode, I'm joined by Dan. Hello. Rob.
0:33
Hello. And JP. Hello. In this episode, we're going to take it right back to Gateway Games. These are
0:39
the games that hooked us into the hobby. Are they still good fun? And are you still up for playing them even when you've leveled up into a big boy gamer?
0:46
Before we dive into all of that, how are we all? Yeah, pretty good. Pretty good. I am I am groovy with a side order of
0:54
awesomeness. Oh, side order of baby. I thought you were going to say I thought you were going to say like chest wig or something
1:00
like that. You're all good. Very nice. We all seem pretty in pretty good
1:05
spirits then. Yeah. Actually, you got me in a good recording day cuz if we did this yesterday, I would have been in a foul
1:11
mood. Oh, why? What happened to you yesterday? Work shenanigans. Don't talk about it. Just I'm not opening myself up cuz I'm in a
1:18
good mood. So, yeah. Well, we qu that down. You're in a good mood today. We're all Less work, more board games.
1:23
Fantastic. Yeah. Um, what have we all done lately? Anything exciting? Uh, me and Rob were working in London,
1:30
so we we did a little uh trip to Orcs Nest, didn't we? Been there. I' never been to Orcs Nest.
1:36
I've been there once and I realized it was the same place after I saw your picture. Yeah. And it's nice. I've heard of Orcs Nest. I didn't know where it was in
1:42
London. I thought it's somewhere in London. And then we cuz we're it's it's basically near Soho Coffin Garden.
1:47
Yeah. And uh and yeah, we were happy to work in Soho and just walked down the street and went, "Oh, there's Orc's nest." We
1:52
had a little look. Weren't we in a restaurant? We were we were eating food and we were opposite in in an Indian, weren't we? And we said I just went
1:59
that's the Orc's nest. I have no I had no idea what orcs Nest was. I just thought he'd had some sort of like
2:05
allergic reaction to the current. The food's really hot and he's just like saying random words. Or nest. Or Nest. So no, we we popped in
2:12
had a look and uh it's quite a small place, but it's got like two tiers, two levels. Yeah. And Yeah.
2:18
I very nearly bought a game, but I didn't What What did you nearly buy? The Witcher. Oh, yeah. You're looking at The Witcher.
2:23
Um, the path of destiny is something. I was like, "This looks really cool." And you were like, "Do you know what
2:29
it's Do you know? Do you know what it is?" I said, "No, it's got the Witcher on it. I want it." I mean, I'm not going to lie, Rob, I'd
2:34
be tempted as well. It's got The Witcher on it. You not got Gwent yet? No. Bought that already?
2:39
Not yet. You're looking to get that? Yeah, probably. Yeah, I'd play Gwent cuz I played it in
2:45
Witcher 3, but I always was at it. I I I did all right, but Paul Grogan
2:50
said that it's sweet spot is 2v2. The board game apparently it's very good 2v2.
2:56
So um so no I' I'd be up for definitely up for for getting it. Yeah. Nice.
3:02
Nice. I went to another board gaming group again. We're really kind of Are you cheating? No, no, we're just broadening our
3:08
horizons, aren't we? So last uh Friday I went to the Madera Meeples board gaming group that plays twice a month at the
3:14
Alifford in in well Norton Fitz Warren which is outside Taton. They were a really lovely bunch of guys and everyone
3:20
was so friendly. There was a lot more female representation than I'm used to in a board gaming group which was really
3:25
nice to see and I will definitely be going there again. Refreshing and good. Yeah, really nice. We played Clank
3:31
Catacombs and uh Katie absolutely won by a West Country Mile. Poor Barry was
3:36
almost out of the dungeon. He died with his hand on the door handle which was a shame but it was good. It was really
3:42
good. That's what clank is. Exactly. It was just load of good fun. I nearly made it but you still have zero victory points.
3:47
Yeah. Well, he got some victory points. I got zero victory points cuz I died in the debt. So I I was absolutely KO'ed.
3:53
Yeah. I was definitely done. But yeah, it was really really nice. And I would definitely be back. Nice.
TURN 2 - Let's Talk About Hex
4:06
So let's talk about Hexen. What's been in our gaming calendars recently? Rob, I'm going to start with you.
Rob - The Weather Machine
4:12
I got a bit of a dilemma because there's two new games. So, oh, oh, such a dilemma. Oh, first world
4:19
problems. First world problems there, Rob. So, I've been venturing lately into the
4:25
Lasserverse. Yeah, you've changed. I I approve of this.
4:31
I only I did I think I've spoke about it before. I only joined because you needed one extra player. So we ended up playing
4:36
Lisb. So it gave me the confidence to try another one. So we tried Weather Machine. Uh bit bit of a step up in
4:43
complexity. But um I absolutely loved it. I thought it was fantastic.
4:48
Oh, Rob, you I'm missing out now cuz I feel like the little little runty one at the back of
4:54
the the back of the group. Honestly, it's it's the thought of it is more scary than actually playing it.
5:00
Is it? Yeah, it was really good. So, it's a game about um basically some mad genius
5:06
has created a weather machine that has helped but made everything worse. I
5:12
think he's just made everything worse. Oh, okay. So, he's made everything worse. So, then you're brought in to help. So,
5:19
there's there's kind of three lanes. You can help the government, you can help the machine that's already running, and
5:25
you can run research and development and build your own. And it's um yeah, and it's it's worker placement style game,
5:34
but you have to get the workers first. So that there's kind of like a there's
5:40
there's a natural rhythm to the game that you'll kind of flow down. And I found that rhythm quite quickly and I
5:47
thoroughly enjoyed it. It all made sense to me, which I think was the scary point cuz what when I think I figured it out,
5:53
I was like, am I just doing this wrong? like you know that you're waiting for that penny moment to drop. I thought it
5:58
was I thought it was this thing, but actually it's this thing. Um uh I I had a very fortunate few turns
6:06
where I needed to do three things and something happened that I had no idea would lead to something else which
6:11
actually led to something else enable enabling me to do all three actions. Um
6:17
so I actually won the game. Wow. You did. Well done. Not not just slightly won. He
6:23
absolutely beats everyone's ass, but it feels like bit of a hollow victory cuz I don't quite know how I did it.
6:29
Just just go with victory. It's all good. Sometimes it is better to be lucky than good. And and but I I thoroughly enjoyed
6:35
it. I thought it was absolutely fantastic. So yeah, I was a little bit apprehensive at the beginning. Um cuz the board looks a lot
6:43
um all of Lerta's boards look a lot. It looks like someone's just thrown up on them. Yeah. But I kind of like it.
6:50
I look at it and I think, "Oh, how the hell am I going to figure this out?" And then I do and then it's it's that feeling. It's that
6:56
you know it's it's that kind of when when the penny drops you I get it and and yeah I loved it. I thought it was
7:01
absolutely fantastic. So um tempted to try on Mars which is what I
7:07
said that I'd never do. Why not? Just because the I I get lost in games very easily and if there's only certain
7:13
actions you can do in one place and then you can't do them in others. Yeah. I'm going to get lost. But
7:19
you won't. Playing the other two has given me more confidence to play it and you know and and because I played the
7:25
gallerist which I did not enjoy by accident. By accident. Lots of people say is the weakest of them all. Ironically,
7:31
I would agree with that. I really like the look of it. I really like the style. I like the board. I like the the easels. The little easels are
7:37
cool with the with the paintings. I really like it. I just didn't enjoy the game. And I think it's because I couldn't figure out the puzzle. I kept
7:44
getting on the on at the wrong point which then you know you have to wait another turn for it to start again and
7:50
and yeah so that that kind of threw me but the other two I've absolutely loved there's always an economy
7:55
absolutely loved there's always an economy in Lera games that like a production wheel or
8:00
something that it's like his core every game has it and it's trying to understand how you ride that wheel
8:07
around and around and around. So, the one that always res resonates to me is Lisba cuz I just get it. It's like,
8:12
yeah, I know. Doesn't matter what entry point it is, I know how to ride that thing around. Um,
8:18
yeah, Weather Machine. I had my shittest game ever. It's the worst game I've ever played at Weather Machine.
8:23
Did you enjoy it? Yeah, I enjoyed it, but it was god awful. It's because he was concentrating on me understanding the game, so he didn't
8:29
focus on his own game. I don't know what happened if we're being honest. To be fair, you you spent a long time keying up this big move and
8:36
then something happened which I don't know what but it meant that it didn't trigger.
8:41
It's it's the the weather machine bit in the middle which is the lab and it has lativ which is the mad person
8:48
Val backwards by the way. Um, nice. And uh, basically this thing he has an
8:54
assistant like a robot with wacky arms and there are five branches of this weather machine which is like, you know,
9:00
the sun, rain, fog, snow, whatever. Wind. Wind. Thank you. See, I was paying attention.
9:05
He was paying attention. And um, and at the end of every round, this thing will
9:10
attempt to run and it depends on certain check sums that's got to do. So it's like, well, is there a tile at the top
9:16
of the corresponding weather where the assistant is? Yes. Is there robots in the entire branch? Yes. Then it will
9:22
run. And if not, it goes, "Oh, well, I tried." And it moves on. And if you don't predict that that program of what
9:30
it's going to do, it screws you, which is what happened to me. This sounds like exactly what happened to me. And I don't think I would enjoy
9:36
it. And it's a it's a lera that's not forgiving. If you mess that up and the whole kind of core is is built around
9:43
this this kind of middle section. So yeah, but it it's fun. It's It's probably one of the um Lerardas that has
9:50
the most sexiest of playerboards. It's very The playerboards are
9:55
spicy. The conventions is quite nice though. Yeah. Just there's lots going on with it and uh yeah, it's just a satisfying
10:02
puzzle. But like most Lord, when you get it, they make you feel good cuz you I get
10:08
this. Yeah. I thought I kind of thought you'd have to plan like five moves ahead. You have to plan ahead, but just in a
10:15
general direction and kind of see what happens when you get there, which nudging. Yeah. Which I really like. So, um, I
10:22
thoroughly enjoyed it. I thought it's absolutely fantastic to the point where if you said, "Would you play again?" I'd play it in a heartbeat. And not just cuz I won.
10:28
You sure? So, watch the space then. That bit in the middle that JP was talking about that absolutely screws you
10:34
if you don't get it right. That's the bit I accidentally got right. Well, well done though, mate. And Yeah. So, I mean,
10:40
a win's a win. Wins a win. Absolutely. So on Mars is your next thing and you're going to be off. I think so.
10:45
The surgery. Will Kylie still be my friend? Don't know, mate. You'll have to ask him. I'll be your friend cuz I think it's great. Then that's cool.
10:51
Yeah, that's fair. You're basically just proving him more that he is wrong and that's fine by me.
10:56
Yeah. He says he says it's a big sandbox and and I don't think it's that big a sandbox.
11:01
Um the whole game evolves around that turn order. If it's puzzly, that's what he's not going to like cuz he doesn't like puzzle
11:07
games. No. And if it's too puzzly, that's probably what puts him off. I don't think it's that bad, but but it's it's just I think
11:13
it's just clever. But it is the heaviest lassardo on mask. Well, if I it's like if I enjoy that,
11:19
then that's a marker of how far I've come in in the last few years. But no, I I
11:24
thought it's fantastic. I'd play again in a heartbeat. Easy gateway game.
11:30
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Dan, what have you been playing? Um, I recently got to the table Nucleium
Dan - Nucleum Australia
11:37
Australia, which I've been dying to get to the table. I've had it for a while now. Um, I love the base game. Um, been
11:43
playing the base game to death. For me, I bought it. Um, loved it after JP taught it to me and then went, well, I
11:50
don't need brass anymore. So, I sold it because brass, I think, is a step down version of it and not as kind of
11:56
complicated or cut or crunchy. So, I sold brass. Although, they've got a new brass coming out soon on Kickstarter.
12:01
Pittsburgh. Pittsburgh. Yeah, I might get that. Um, but nucleum Australia um is basically
12:07
just a new map. So, new new look of skin with with a new map of Australia. There's a couple of new mechanics. I've
12:13
been I think I've been putting it off for a while cuz I was kind of like cuz I get quite tired because of my job to
12:18
bring something new out to the table. It has to be like really special or I've really got to be in the mood. Um, so I
12:24
thought, okay, I'll give it a go, but if if it if there's too much change, I'm probably just going to put it back in
12:30
the box and wait. Luckily, there really isn't. There isn't a lot. It adds boats. Um, so you've got like port lines um uh
12:37
to to to um to transport um goods with. Um and there's coal mines now that you
12:43
can kind of acquire on the map which you couldn't do on the original. Um but that other than that, that's about it other
12:48
than some new tiles and some new new bits. New layout. New layout. Yeah, new layout. Um I got
12:54
my ass handed to me. I only played a two-player game. Um I played Nate front of the pod. He um he him and I are quite
13:01
equally matched when it comes to board games. And the last time I played him on the original up, I I I I ruined him and
13:07
this time he returned it back to fold and he won. Um but yeah, really really enjoyed it. It's it's a it's a nice it's
13:14
it's not that much of a step up from the original. Um I I've still got um the
13:19
other two expansions to play. The political one, Core Progress. Core Progress and the Energy
13:25
Research Institute. That's that one. Yeah. I've just recently got that and popped all the bits and looked went, "Oh, this looks
13:31
very spicy." just to change those experiments up. The experiments are one of the key mechanics of the game that
13:36
make the game run with the technologies. Um, so yeah, I love it. Love Nucleium. And I don't think I'll ever get rid. I
13:43
just love playing it. I like the crunch. It's not larda crunchy, but it's it's turkeys crunchy.
13:48
It's clever. It's definitely clever. I love it as well. Same. Ironically, Nucleon was the gateway game
13:54
for me to play more complex games. We played it. We played it at Gridcon, didn't we? We sat down. Yeah. I love it.
14:01
Absolutely love it. Yeah, that I think that altered your DNA somehow that game. It did. I think it genuinely did. We played it at GCON, didn't we? And we did
14:08
a four player and I was like, oh, I didn't do that well, but I was I can do this. And we've played it since. And I I we played two player, didn't we?
14:14
Yeah. On the Euro final. It was the Euro final. The football Euro final. I come around, we played Nuclear, we stopped for the
14:20
game, and then afterwards we came back and finished it off. I mean, you kicked my ass, but I get it's one of those games I I just thoroughly enjoy it.
14:26
It's a good two-player game. I like playing a two-player. On Australia, that map's better for two players as well
14:32
because it's tighter. Yeah, it is tighter. It is tighter. Yeah. Which is kind of what you want for two player cuz on the base map on two
14:38
players there's a lot of room for you still. Yeah. To to kind of do what you want to do, which is quite nice if you don't want
14:43
the contention. Yeah. And you just want to race on efficiency. But even though we didn't get a lot of contention even then, we a little bit,
14:50
but not not massive amounts. Um but but that's up to you in how you play,
14:55
right? because you can you can absolutely going I'm gonna go next to you. Yeah, me and we me and him don't often
15:01
play it like that so we tend to not but um but still yeah great game loved it and I want to get it back to the table again pretty soon.
JP - Frostpunk
15:07
Nice JP. How about you? So a few weeks back Dan and I think
15:13
Curly and Tambo and Stuart Fred of the Pod all played a game of Frost Punk and
15:19
and I was kind of on the the WhatsApp group going I fancy playing Frost Punk. Did you win?
15:25
No. Yeah. How did you die? We died early. We didn't even hit the storm. It wasn't good. Um, and I thought, you know what?
15:32
I'm going to dig Frost Punk out. It's been so long since my copies hit the table. And I've just really fancied it
15:38
after they were talking about it. And we play it last when we play two play. God, ages ago. Yeah. And then Stuart, as Stuart does
15:44
sometimes, does writeups of games. They're fantastic. And you know, he he basic he's a DM, right, Stuart? So he he basically just
15:51
puts this narrative together about what's happening in the game. and I read through it and I was like, I really fancy playing this now. So, that's what
15:58
I did. I kind of busted it out and uh had a a few uh solo games cuz I actually
16:03
quite like playing Frost Punk solo. It's a glorified solo game. It is a glorified solo game cuz, you
16:09
know, it doesn't matter how many players. You just you do scale certain things around the the cards and things, but but yeah. And I forgot when I got it
16:16
to the table, I went Jesus Christ, I forgot how many boards are in this. There's like 17 boards or something all
16:22
doing different things. So anyway, if you don't know what Frost Punk is, very quickly, it's uh based off a video game
16:27
IP and it's basically you're trying to um it's like steampunky
16:33
theme where I don't know, it's like an ice age perafrost has happened in the UK somewhere and and you're trying to build
16:41
up a civilization around this generator, this big towering generator that sits in the middle of your your your kind of
16:47
town, heating everybody or trying to because everybody's freaking cold and
16:53
dying of frostbite and and god knows whatever. And you're basically just surrounded by snow and you got to send
16:59
workers off to clear the snow and find resources that you can bring back and build buildings and and basically
17:05
increase your chance of survival. But anything that can go wrong in this game will go wrong in this game. And the
17:12
board game adaptation is fantastic to the point where actually I prefer playing the board game um because it's
17:18
just such a an experience to to kind of get yourself in. And uh what's cool with
17:24
it is actually um Glass Cannon Unplugged to publish it. They they've got a companion app and I always use it
17:30
because it puts the little theme music on and it drives the game through all of the phases. It tells you exactly what
17:35
you to do. So it's really, you know, it's really cool. You just kind of go through it. And the first game I played,
17:41
which was on the normal difficulty, I didn't do very well like I like I
17:47
usually do. I think the kids got sick to the point where cuz when kids die, obviously that's really bad.
17:53
It's more punishing, but it's more punishing if a child dies, you lose more hope, right? And one of the trackers in the game is
17:59
hope. And if you lose all the hope, everyone basically just doesn't want to
18:04
carry on. And so civilization is ending. just take a long walk out into the cold basically. Yeah. Game over. And because
18:10
too many children died, that's what happened. And uh so I was thinking, you know what, there are easy uh there's
18:17
like an easy mode that's not in the the the game box base box or the the base um
18:22
box or the expansion, but they did release it as digital print files. Um
18:28
it's called explorer mode. And I thought I suck at this game and I kind of just want to win. I want to die. I just want
18:34
to know how this works and and have a bit more breathing room to figure it out. Uh, so I played another game on the
18:40
explorer mode. And you still died? No, I managed to do it. I managed to to skin in my teeth. It
18:47
wasn't like a Oh, yeah. This was easy. I literally just managed to to to kind of get through it. But I I kind of um I did
18:54
the advisor that allows you to social advisor. I think allows you to uh look at this dust deck. Um and it allows you
19:01
to draw three cards and then basically discard one of them before you shuffle it and then reveal the dust dust card at
19:08
the uh part of the phase. And the dust cards are always a bit of like god what's going to happen and this thing
19:13
will grow over time. So depending on what morning events happen and the choices you make will seed these cards
19:19
in the dust deck or laws that you put into place. So every game is always a different twisty path which consequence.
19:26
I love it. But every decision has a consequence. Good. Choose your own adventure kind of. Yeah. And it's like, you know, that
19:31
decision you made like 3 days ago. Yeah. Guess what? This is happening. The chickens come to roost.
19:38
Yeah. There's now lots of murders that are happening because of a choice you've made. God, I got to deal with this. And
19:43
I I just love it. I just bring it on. Um, and yeah, I managed to get through.
19:48
And I had some advice as well. I kind of read online which is that the hope and discontent tracks are probably the most
19:56
vital of of the things you need to keep your eye on because as soon as you keep take your eye off the ball of those the
20:02
game just goes and everything feeds off these these two things. So managed to do
20:08
it managed to get a load of automatons which is the first time I've ever had three or four automatons just running
20:15
around and that was brilliant cuz like send them to the cold places don't get sick. Yeah. don't get sick. They can work the
20:21
mines. They can get the coal. They can do this. And yeah, I had a blast with it. And I'm ready to step back up now
20:26
cuz I think I know the game a bit better. I'm not saying I'm going to win on normal, but I think I've got a better
20:32
chance cuz I know I've only beaten it once. Yeah, only beaten it once out of about 12 games I've won once on normal.
20:39
But I kind of think there's so many scenarios in this book. I've only played the tutorial one, the
20:45
main book. Played two. First one and the second one. And I want to play the old I want to play through it and it's like I can't I feel like I can't until I beat the
20:52
damn thing. I want to do the arcs one where you got to try and keep the green got to keep the the green houses alive. Yeah,
20:57
with all the plants. I'm really keen to give that one a go. Um but I want to get the second cuz I've
21:02
done the first one on normal but I haven't done the second one. It's the same but you just the generator is not in the middle. It's just slightly lower
21:08
down. So the back you got the steam hubs, right? So you've got um so the the to to heat further away you need steam hubs
21:15
um which is difficult. So, but I I still can't stand sand beat him. But I still like the way this the heat
21:22
system works in this game is genius because you've got buildings at different insulation levels. You got
21:27
yellow, uh, orange, and red. And then you got generator board off to the side, one of the 775 boards that you have
21:34
that's tracking basically how much coal you're pumping into the generator, which increases your heat marker. And then the
21:41
little um really hard to explain uh on a podcast, but they've got little sections
21:46
on the generator which are individual pieces which rise up throughout the game. Um so it'll show you where the red
21:52
level is, the orange level is, and the yellow level is. So if you heat past that, that means every red building is heated because it's insulated enough.
21:59
And then you keep pumping up, you'll eventually heat all of the other buildings. So it just means that when you're sending workers to those areas,
22:05
they're not getting sick. Because if everything's cold, no matter what you do, worker gets sick. Send them to the
22:11
snow, worker gets sick. Send them to that building, they're sick again. Guess what's happens? And if you get too sick, then they start getting ill. And then
22:17
guess what? They start dying and then bad things happen. So that track and the the way that those
22:23
counters work up that track are a brutal, but bor. It's clever how they've just they've
22:29
simplified a system. Like in the video game, it would just be done on Yeah. It's done on like a range of of
22:35
where your generator is, but it's and it's both actually on on this track. It's it's the heat level that the
22:41
colors, but also the ranges away from your generator. Really hard to explain, but trust me, it's it's cool.
22:46
It works. JP and Dan have done a very good job of explaining this game. I'll I'll put it another way. Imagine spin spinning plate
22:54
simulator where if you drop a plate, you get punched in the throat and you die immediately.
22:59
That that that is the game. It's not the throat. It's the ball. piece of balls. But Becky's right for that. Yeah.
23:05
I I think Becky, I think I think you'd really enjoy it. Would I? Yeah, I think you would. Whenever I read, like I say, Stuart's
23:11
sort of little narratives are brilliant, I have to say. But it I remember texting about saying, "This game sounds utterly
23:18
wretched." It reminds me emotionally. Why are you playing this? It sounds horrific.
23:23
Everybody Everybody's dead, Dave. Everybody's dead. That's it. They're all gone. Yeah. And I tell you what, when I beat
23:29
that game and there's a video online about a solo game and when they win and they just stand up and go, "Yes." And
23:34
then what? Literally on their own in a living room because no one really cares. No, that's exactly what happened. I was like, "Yes." Just I was so elated. I was
23:41
like walking around the house like I won the bloody lot doing that little sideways kick that I can't do that. Like my wife was like,
23:47
"You're right." Said, "Yeah, just watch just just won Frost Punk." So, great. Great.
23:53
Um, you do you, babe. But I It was a good moment. Nice. It's a nice board gaming moment. I'm glad I'm glad it worked out for you.
24:00
But anyway, that's me. Nice. How about you, Beth? Well, the game I was going to talk about is very very tame compared to the uh
Becky - Odin
24:06
absolute crushing sadness of um of Frost Punk. It was a game just called Odin.
24:13
Now, this is not Feast for Odin or any other ramifications of the word Odin. It's
24:18
just called Odin. And it's very very similar in play to scout. So Emma who
24:23
goes to the um Torton board gamer guild on in holiday and every Friday she kind
24:29
of blatantly she taught us how to play this whilst she was playing I think it was was it Galactic Cruise and it was like she'd had her turn and then she was
24:36
coming to oh why don't you go guys play this. So you've got a deck of cards in your hand that are various different
24:42
suits I guess for one of a better word but actually they're cool little Viking pictures which is really nice and the
24:48
cards are a really interesting shape. They're really sort of long and thin. Yeah. Um, which is nice. And
24:53
like fish fingers. Like fish finger. Exactly like the dimensions of a fish finger. Yes, it really is. That's what went through
24:59
my head. I say, "What size are they?" Fish fingers. Fingers. Yeah. No, they are absolutely are. And um so yeah,
25:04
different colors and different numbers just like a regular deck of cards, I suppose, but more Viking and fish
25:11
fingery. And fish fingery. Yeah. And you're basically trying to play a higher card
25:16
group than your the person before you. just like scout only you they're not
25:22
kind of people in a circus they are just Vikings. So you then if you can beat the
25:27
previous like hand you take one of theirs just like scout and it goes into your hand. So the car the ones that
25:34
you're trying to beat it's either the same number or the same number of cards. So if you've got two cards that are a
25:40
seven and an eight that becomes 78. So then you either have to play 79 or
25:46
higher or three cards like 178. So you are getting a higher number,
25:52
but then it quickly ramps up. But those numbers have to be the same color if it's 178 for example. Or you can play
25:58
three threes or four threes or something like that. So it's a really kind of it's very very easy to to grasp even though
26:05
I'm not doing perhaps a great um description of it. So you it's really quick to to play. You're picking up the
26:11
cards and very very quickly if you can't play a card, you just miss a go. And so
26:16
many times you miss a go and you're like, "Well, I can't go now." No, not again. Not again. If it gets back to that first player again, they kind of
26:23
start again from almost from zero. They can basically then get rid of any card cuz the whole premise is get rid of your cards,
26:29
win. So, it's just nice and simple, but I loved the the kind of simplicity of
26:35
it, but the way that you're kind of drawn in and you get really kind of focused on what that person is going to like you get really involved and you
26:41
really care about it. Yeah. Like, don't don't play 433. Please do not play that. God damn it. They went
26:47
70 63. Oh, god. I can't not do anything. Yeah. And it's just it's just really fun. I really liked it. It's in a small
26:54
little box, like I say, just like Scout. So, uh yeah, could strongly recommend Odin people. You put it in the freezer?
27:00
No. Oh, I didn't have tarta sauce with it either. Captain Bird's eye. It wasn't like real fish fingers, but
27:06
yeah, it could have been anything. The theme is very, you know, it could be anything at all, but I like the fact
27:12
it's little kind of Scandinavian kind of. Yeah, it's it's pleasant. Yeah.
27:17
Whereas Scout, the theme is whatever. Like I I'm looking at numbers, which you probably will do in Odin. But
27:23
does it have a theme, Scout? It does. Oh, it does, doesn't it? Different circus performers. They might
27:28
be cannonball people. They might be trapeze artists. You kind of don't care cuz you're like six six and three or whatever.
27:35
Um but yeah, with this one it's Yeah, I enjoyed it. It surprised me. I didn't think I would enjoy it as much
27:41
as I did. I haven't bought it yet, but it is definitely it's in the it's in the uh Yeah, in the locker ready.
27:46
I remember you and project it was insta buy two turns in after I taught you the game. I've bought this now
27:52
while I was playing the game cuz I just loved it. Yeah, it was good that one. Yeah. So that's what I've been playing recently.
27:57
Cool. and lots of clank catacombs. But I've talked about that lots before, but I've played a lot of that recently.
28:03
So, here we go. [Music]
TURN 3 - Main Event: The red carpet roll-out
28:15
Gateway games. Then, we all got our own specific gateway games that got us into the hobby. There's probably quite a few
28:21
common ones amongst us all, I'd imagine. I know XCOM was one of JP's which isn't usually a beginner friendly game.
28:27
That is not a gateway game. That is that's also stress in a bloody box. Jesus Christ.
28:32
If you're all stressed together. Yeah. But it but it was on Frost Punk as well. XCOM. Frostbunk.
28:37
It was one of his first games, wasn't it? It was one of your gateway games, mate. You'd probably hear Katan and Carcasson mentioned a lot if you did a poll of
28:44
people's introduction to the hobby rather than XCOM. Um, so other than XCOM, we're not
28:49
mentioning that one. What is a gateway game? What do we think? Well, the definition of it. Yeah. What's what's the important things
28:56
about it? I think for me, a gateway game, without sounding obvious, it needs to be
29:03
simple. Like this rule set needs to be simple enough. Doesn't mean the game has to be simple, but the rule set needs to
29:08
be simple that you're not giving a player, here's 57 options that you do on your
29:13
your turn. It's a simple rule set that you can teach quickly, i.e. 5 minutes.
29:18
Yeah. So you're not alienating the table, which is usually your family. Let's let's face it. If you're trying to
29:24
get a gateway game, it's probably with family members and just something you can get into quick and it's not going to
29:30
last long. Yeah, that's what I think of a gateway game is. Yeah, I'd agree with that. I think accessibility. So it doesn't have to be
29:37
easy necessarily, but it's got to be easy to understand and quick. That was some of the things
29:42
that I think if you can play a second version of it again or you know play get
29:48
it out to the table a second time in the same evening people are already a bit more sort of on board and geared up and
29:54
know what the point of it is a bit more. So I think yeah that quickness is definitely we used to have a saying in the early
30:00
days when I was you know cuz I've been gaming for a while now. Um, old man.
30:05
The old man. Old damn. Um, in the early days, we used to say that board gaming
30:10
was like like a religious cult where you were all in your own little castle
30:15
playing your your games and having a great time and then every so often you'd lower the drawbridge and you try to recruit as many newbies as you can.
30:22
Yeah. To your cult. Um, however, in the recruitment process, if you dumped on them um something like
30:31
Venos that you're going to scare them away. Yeah. Yeah. So, you had to find that balance of
30:36
something easy for them to understand, not too long, not too many options as you said JP, and enough for them to
30:42
hopefully wet their appetite enough to go, "Ooh, I want to stick around. I want to find out more."
30:48
It's like the first one's for free. And if you want more, there is more over here. There is more. Yeah. Isn't there another
30:53
industry that does that? Yeah. I believe there's a few. And I think the the money involved can kind of sort of be
31:00
pretty cheap. I think it'd be cheaper and we've got loads of plastic baggies like I mentioned. So, we're all pretty good for that.
31:06
Weird parallels to the drug industry. So, what what do we think are some of the actual gateway games? I mean, I've
31:12
got a little quick list that I completely agree with. Ticket to Ride, Katan, and Carcasson,
31:18
they get there. Splendor, although I disagree with Splender because I hated it and it put me off for ages for no reason, but there
31:24
we are. And like things like Azul, it's got to be quick playing, fast turns. I'm
31:29
not a big fan of Splender. So, if I if anyone says to me Splender, I go, "Nah." Uh, Sentry, play Sentry.
31:34
I'd rather play Sentry. Sentry. I like Sentry. I think the turns need to be quick. It's really important for me as a gateway
31:40
game because I'm taking too long or like kind of you're all playing the turns together. That's Yeah. Simultaneous play games
31:46
cuz if you got to wait 45 minutes for your go, you've already checked out, you just not interesting. It's just not interesting.
31:52
But also, I can find that with gateway games is sometimes the theme isn't strong enough. The theme might be a pace. And if it is a pace and you're
31:58
trying to recruit someone who's new, you need to have a theme that's exciting enough otherwise it might not draw them in. So I mean ticket to ride people
32:06
think oh it's trains or be I love trains but not everyone likes trains. So it's
32:11
like you know you're trying to explain it's like okay you don't like trains fine but actually there is actually a decent course mechanic here
32:18
that is you know everybody likes journeys you might not like a train but you like going places
32:24
and this is about going places. That's a good that's a good argument. Yeah, I like being places, not going places.
32:29
There's a big difference. See, for me, my route into the hobby was very different. I think I've played two
32:35
of those games that you've mentioned. Which two? Uh, Ticket to Ride. But you only played that fairly recently
32:41
with us. Yeah. At um at a convention at Greycon and Carazon, which was
32:46
recent. We we played in Memphis. Yeah. Yeah. This year. So my my route was my the
32:52
first game that I played and I say game, I mean proper game. Yeah. was Netrunner.
32:57
Yeah. That gateway game of Netrunner. But the next one was Arkham Horror. Yeah. And for me it was that was the
33:04
game where you kind of opened your eyes to there's more than Monopoly. When you
33:10
say when you say board game you you don't you if you're outside of the industry or outside of the hobby
33:17
you think Monopoly, you think Cludo, you think and there's nothing wrong with those games.
33:22
No, they're all fine. But they're not games that I want to play on a Friday night. But I think Arkham's a it's a good one.
33:29
You made me think on this one because when you play Arkham Horror the card game and you play the base box, right?
33:35
It's got it's like a tutorial set of free scenarios really
33:40
and it's a good way of kind of entering you into that world of of a card game.
33:46
Um, I'm not saying it's I star people on it, so don't Yeah, I tried that. That's the first game my wife played and
33:52
don't torch me. But it's the card game or the board game. Card game. Yeah. But it's a good way of you kind of
33:58
getting into what what that sort of game does. You know, I'm I'm got my cards. I'm drawing my cards and we've got this
34:04
challenge we got over, but it's really immersive. So, it's like we're in because the first scenario in the base is like we're in the house.
34:10
Yeah. And you're going into this room and you're like, what's going to happen? Oh, there's a seller. Should we go down the cellar? you can, you know, you kind of
34:15
get Resident Evil 1 vibes from it. Um, and it just puts you in in the game
34:21
without you thinking, oh, I'm playing a really complex game. You just you're telling a story with cards,
34:26
aren't you? Rather than and it it did a good good uh kind of good thing in in kind of jelling it all
34:32
together. Now, as you play more of it and you get more cards and you get deck construction, you add all that you're adding so many layers of
34:38
of of stuff in saying, is this the most efficient deck to win the scenario? And then to be honest, I started to check out at that point.
34:45
But for me, it was everything I love about a video game and I'm at a table playing it with my friend. It was the story was amazing.
34:52
It's co-op, which I'd never really played a co-op board game before. Um, you know, and it was it was quick
34:59
cuz your turns are fairly quick and but there was there was enough individuality to it where you're playing as a
35:04
character. You're playing as a um you're playing as a class almost, which I love. And everyone had to do their own thing.
35:11
So for me, that was the game that opened my eyes and was like, "Oh, okay." Do you think those early games sort of
Did our gateway games shape our gaming tastes for today?
35:17
shaped your tastes as they went along? So you're still really into co-op games, aren't you? I think I was going to mention it later on, but
35:23
I think co-op games can be a really great way of bringing people in because they're immediately the kind of pressure
35:29
is perhaps just a little bit lower because everyone can discuss what's good and if you don't feel quite as
35:34
confident, then you can just kind of let yourself be kind of influenced by everybody else or listen to. Yeah,
35:40
absolutely. Whereas it's not all on you to do well or or whatever.
35:45
So that has shaped your taste. How about you? Is XCOM still still the kind of game you like playing? Well, clearly I mean I still like
35:51
stressful games, right? We just talked about Frost Punk. And to be honest, I think Frost Punk's probably Well, is it
35:56
more stressful? It is more stressful, but on a longer burn. Yeah, it's a longer burn. Whereas XCOM's stressful and you've got
36:02
2 minutes to sort this out kind of, oh my god, we got to make decisions really quick. Um, but what I think I found with
36:09
with um like entering into the game via via XCOM is it's a stepping stones. So
36:15
like XCOM led me to Game of Thrones mainly because of publisher. Game of Thrones led me to Mansions of Madness,
36:21
right? And then something led me to something that led me to something and I'm like, "Ooh, try this."
36:27
It's funny cuz you're mentioning that because obviously with Rob as well that you're mentioning these games and when you entered the hobby at the height of
36:33
FFG. Oh yeah. when they were at their absolute best they were. No, then obviously the acquisition with Asma day
36:40
and and they kind of fizzled out. They're still there but not in the same capacity. Um but like
36:45
talking 10 years ago. Yeah. If you're going from Monopoly to another game, then FFG they had it all.
36:51
It was it was if you wanted themes it was it was just there. There was something for everyone. So like I think
36:58
you know you joined at the right time. Mhm. Cuz there was so much there on offer. Yeah. It was mad. You mentioned obviously the
37:04
the Arkham Horror. You mentioned about obviously um your wife not being able to cope with the card game. I instantly
37:11
thought El Elders time which is the same game is the dice one. Yeah. I went straight again. FFG.
37:18
At the time Arkham Horror was the only game I had. Yeah. And Amy basically was like, "Oh, I'm really bored. Let's all right, let's try
37:25
this board game. Started. I was so bored. She must have." And yeah, I've never I've never seen her
37:31
so stressed in my life. just couldn't agree with it. But what you were mentioning a minute ago, I I've recently sorted out my Arkham Horror card
37:37
collection to to move on and the little pamphlet fell out of other FFG games
37:43
that that are available and X-wing was on there and Mansion. It's the infamous catalog. The little the little pamphlet of all
37:49
the games on I miss. It's like like with CDs when they had the books that you pulled out and was
37:56
like, okay, what's you know, what's this about and everything else and I loved it. So, but you're right, Becky. Like I don't
38:02
think mine and maybe Rob's is not your atypical approach in but I suppose that
38:08
that's okay. Like there are many roots into this hobby and that's the great thing about this hobby. It's not like oh
38:14
you can only play this if you play Carcasson or you can only you do whatever the hell you want that makes
38:19
sense to you for a quite a popular gateway game potentially. It's stuff like would be Wingspan and a lot of
38:25
people played it in lockdown. Yeah. games like, you know, that we think of as higher not higher complexity
38:31
games, but not not necessarily gateway games that people have got these games, especially in lockdown.
38:38
Um, you know, played them and and kind of got in the hobby that way. Here's an interesting question for all
38:43
of you. How did you get into the hobby? Which direction did you go? Was it
38:50
someone giving you a gateway game to play here, play this with me, come along? or you weren't that way. You were
38:57
maybe a video gamer and you wanted to try something based on maybe an IP or
39:03
you wanted to go in that way cuz it seems to me it seems to me that those two are the kind of the most common ways of kind of going in.
39:08
I was attacked with chloroform and dragged into an alley. Yeah. Bye-bye JP. Hello. Yeah.
39:14
How did you How did you then get into I didn't have anyone? No, I didn't either. No, I I basically chloroformed yourself.
39:20
Yeah. I think I've told this story before, but very quickly I I was looking for a different form of entertainment
39:26
for friends coming over that used to come and visit us from I know three odd hours away. And I I kind of got to the
39:33
point where I'm bored of them coming and we watch a film and we don't talk to each other and then they go home the
39:38
next day and just think it's stupid. They're I was I was the same but bored of drinking. Yeah. I was bored of going out and get on the
39:44
lash. So it was like well let's do something that's different. I just Googled board games cuz oh, you know, I
39:49
can't remember playing board games. They were fun. And I was expecting just to to browse through the the usual Monopolies,
39:54
the Cludos, the Risks, the all the other stuff. And then, weirdly, I stumbled, it's on Amazon, I think. I stumbled
40:00
across XCOM. Went there's a board game of XCOM. I love XCOM. And then
40:05
I just took I took a punt on it. I literally went 40 quid. I thought, s I'm going to do it. And I said, right, guys,
40:11
you're going to come over. We're going to play a ball game. I have no idea what it is. I'll learn it. and they were like, "Yeah, we're up for it." Because
40:17
it was like something different. And you know what? Like, and I wouldn't ever do this now. I wouldn't ever um tell people
40:23
to do this with that particular game, but somehow it worked. I don't know how it worked, but it
40:29
worked. And we had a laugh. Mine was three games, all of which are not gateway games. No.
40:34
Uh, one was The Walking Dead by Zman Games, but it was based on the comics, not the video, not the TV series. Um
40:42
because they had that and they had they had the the Walking Dead TV series board game that was done by um I can't
40:48
remember the name another company game beginning with C but the game was awful. I thought I've been told this is this is
40:54
not very good. Let's go for the comic book one. So I went for that which is like a pick up and deliver style of game. Gears of War because I absolutely
41:00
again FFG because I absolutely love Gears of War. Yeah. And the IP and Civilization. I get the 2012 one.
41:07
Um is it 2012? 2010 10. Uh again because of the IP. So again FFG and that I went
41:14
for those three. Two of those games was very very difficult and they were they
41:20
were like oh this might put me off. And luckily I did have a couple of people that used to go out drinking but then
41:25
wanted to actually spend the time to learn it together and play together and then we enjoyed them I think for the IP.
41:33
Yeah. Then after that I then did go gateway a little and I went to Gricola. That was
41:40
how I went in. A great game. Yes, I think it is. I think you're going back from the you
41:47
have to go back to that time frame. So, this is like, you know, 2010, 2011. I played it a few years ago. Loved it. Thought it was fantastic.
41:52
It's cutthroat. But for me, I think that is a gateway game. It's slightly more complex than the
41:58
likes of like Katan and the likes of Carcasson, but for me, that was kind of a gateway
42:03
game for me. I think there's been a real change from, and you alluded to it earlier with talking about Wingspan,
42:09
those kind of classic gateway games such as, yeah, Ticket to Ride, Carcasson, Katan, which I have to be honest were my
42:14
kind of sort of ride in, but I've played Carcasson once and I play Katan once,
42:21
but that was enough to make me go, "Ah, this is this is great." So, I think those classic games are quite I don't
42:28
want to say basic, and that's I will say basic, but it's not doing it down. The rule set is simple. It's got a quite a
42:34
good theme. That's clearly quite an important thing to bring people in. But the modern gateway games like with some
42:39
we've just mentioned like Wingspan, like Azul, like just one, Quacks of Quedlingberg, those kind of games,
42:46
they've all got much much more difficult mechanics, but they're really they're really ramped up
42:53
compared to those originals, but yet the originals are still absolutely sold massively.
42:59
One of the things I was wondering is with the advent of things like YouTube and those sorts of things where you can
43:06
get really easy and easy to watch instructional videos whereas back in the
43:11
day that was just not really a thing, was it? Maybe maybe it's easier to learn to get
43:17
into those other games. And I think maybe rule books have become different now. Yeah, I mean I mean I can't speak for
43:24
every board game, but I think rule books are definitely better now than they ever have been. I I can sniff out a bad one
43:29
easy. We still get them. Yeah, we still get them. But generally on the whole, rule books are better.
43:35
JP's gonna be quite proud of this, but I've started reading rule books. You have changed, Rob. Who are you? Who
43:41
is I'll read a rule book, right? And then I'll watch a video. But I'll skim through the video. I'll be
43:46
like, "Right, okay. I know I set this game up, so I'm just going to skip that bit. Watch like a round or two being played
43:52
and go like, cool, got it. I'm in it." Yeah. And then I'll set the game up. He has changed. I've played so many new
43:57
games lately and it's one of those weird things that the more games you play, the more comfortable you become learning how
44:04
to play new games completely agree to that. Yeah, definitely. Have you ever gone back to a gateway
Have we ever gone back to gateway games after delving into the heavy stuff
44:10
game after delving into the heavier titles? Yeah. Yeah. Does it How does it feel like is it the nostalgia that brings you back? Is it
44:16
because it's just downright a good game? It's it's basically what Dan said. It's about indoctrination mainly. I I I don't
44:23
tend to play gateway games for me. Yes. Anymore. Yeah. Yeah. That doesn't mean I won't play them, but
44:29
I don't. For me, I get less out of a gateway game because of my tastes are in the much heavier uh pool. That's just
44:36
where my tastes are. But I still will play them and I will still use them to to help others in, you
44:43
know, to lure people to lure people sadistically into my lair of board games.
44:49
There's a there's a comforting kind of aspect about it, isn't there? Yeah, like I really enjoy playing Wingspan
44:55
because I know exactly what's going to happen. I'm not going to win, but it's a very very familiar game.
45:02
Rob's never played it. Still haven't played it. You played Worms Span. You never played Worms. I mean, yeah, it's that's the
45:07
same really. I I actually out of all three of them, I actually prefer Wingspan. I still prefer
45:13
Wingspan. I like Worms Ban. Finsspan's okay, but I I prefer Wingspan.
45:19
Yeah. Yeah. Um, and I'm that invested now. Yeah. With a with a nesting box, which is also
45:25
it's a double-edged sword. That is like it's so great, but I can't take this anywhere cuz it's so large.
45:31
Start him off. Calm down. Don't start me off. Well, that's we're in a good thing with too many bones now. So JP's got every
45:37
single possible thing they've ever made ever in the history of ever. Yeah. And I've just got the basic box. Does it fit in that Does it fit in that
45:44
chest? All of it. All of it fits in there. Everything. I mean, it's packing. It's packing. Yeah.
45:49
So, if we want to take Too Many Bones to a convention, me or Rob can take our copy and and it's still okay to play.
45:54
It's like you've got the travel version of Too Many Bones. Yeah. The pocket version. You can take it on a plane. No, you can't. You can't.
46:01
No, you can't. But it that's how I see your copy, Rob, and yours back. It's like, yeah. Oh, isn't that cute? 20 bucks or too many
46:08
bones. And off he goes. And I'm like, yeah, I've got this massive trove chest is not moving. No, it cannot move.
46:13
Takes up one thump of a collax. Is it? Yeah, but when I do take bits out, I do have
46:20
one of the expansion boxes um that I put some of the bits in pack and that's my travel pack.
46:27
I borrowed a couple of characters and every time they're in that box like
46:32
I I find now look at my shelf and my shelves are just big boxes.
46:37
Yeah, it's voiceful. It's anacrony. It's perseverance one and two and three and four and it and it's I'm looking at I'm
46:42
like scythe and they're all wingspan. They're all massive. Nucleum needs a big box. David
46:48
Turxy, if you're listening, please make it happen. Please. I know you only do the solar mode, but please.
46:54
So, there's a solar mode of Nukem coming. Yeah. No, it's already there. It's in the box. Done by Dave. Oh, his little face. His little face is
47:00
lit right up. It's very good. Have you played it? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The Baron. The Baron. Yeah. Not played.
47:06
It's good. Sorry, off topic. Yeah. So, talking about that shift in enjoyment, you just said you don't play the lightweight games. I say
47:13
lightweight, the gateway games for your own enjoyment. you tolerate them. I won't say tolerate, but there's
47:19
there's bits like, right, I'm going to sound like a pretentious now and I don't mean to, but like when when
47:24
someone we all sit around and we're like, should we play just one? A little part of me dies and that's just and
47:29
that's just because I've played it so many times. You want to play leard and I just want to play something a bit more meaty. But I also am self-aware
47:37
enough around the table and emotionally aware enough that I can't just force what I want to play on people. Also, you
47:44
can't play an eight player version of that. And you can't play an eight player, but you know, and and it's fine, but that's just because of my taste. That's just
47:50
Yeah. Also, the more player count, the more gateway it becomes. It generally either it goes party
47:55
Yeah. or it's it's Yeah. It's a gateway game. Ti is a gateway game.
48:00
There is There exceptions. There's two exceptions. That's one. Mega Civ is the other. So, do you think playing simple games
Can playing gateway games still be rewarding?
48:05
can still be rewarding? Yes. You still going to You'd still buy them. Would you still buy a gateway game now? A new one?
48:10
Yeah, I have done recently. I still do it. What have you bought recently, Rob? Quacks. Oh, okay. Yep. What about you?
48:17
I haven't bought anything recently, but I, you know, I've still got Tickets to ride 10th anniversary and Tickets Ride Europe 15th anniversary on my shelf and
48:23
I'll never ever get rid of them. Nice because I like playing them now and again. I can't put them in a top 10
48:29
because they just hold a special place in my heart because they are a gateway game and what they've led to and they're
48:34
so pretty. Yeah, they are. Um, my my 10th anniversary one is absolutely shagged to buggery now. I've
48:40
played it so much. The cards are worn. The box is worn. That's like a nice worn paperback, isn't it? It shows that it's been
48:46
It's been loved. It's been loved. It's like my Avalon copy. Yeah. I think that box that box is
48:52
particularly prone to to knackering, but it set on fire. You seen my Game of Thrones? My Game of
48:57
Thrones is Weathered. And it's that that's probably the game in my collection that's been played the most. Yeah, it's cool. What about what's your most recent
49:04
gateway game that you bought then? Recent one was Flip Seven. Okay. Yeah. Oh, yeah. I bought that yesterday. I I
49:10
just literally bought it I think on your recommendation. Um and the weekend I literally was playing it as Dan was
49:16
performing at a gig in our local teaching not teachings they played it but I was playing um helping my son and
49:23
my nephew and my daughter and her boyfriend all play flip seven whilst Dan was cruning over
49:30
them with swing music as he does. And uh do that. And uh yeah, and they were having they're having fun
49:36
with it. And it's games like that I will buy. Um and I think family were like that.
49:41
Yeah. So and so were like that. And I had the mind as well, didn't you? The mind was on the table. Yes, Josh. That's actually Josh's copy.
49:46
I've never played that. Yeah. I can't do it. Once you've figured out how you do it,
49:52
no spoilers on here, but once you've figured out how you do it, then it there's no game anymore. There's no game anymore. You completely
49:58
made it's there's nothing there. I'll look into it more then because I've heard about it but I've never played it. I had a copy and I once I' once once I
50:05
figured out how you actually do it and the rules book tells you the rule book actually gives you the solution and once
50:11
that then it becomes an activity not a game. Yeah, fair enough. I think I still buy them because I want to get my friend
50:19
more into games. So I'm think Katherine will like that. Yeah, Caff will like that one. I'll be able to teach her that and she'll get it. And like it's really
50:25
nice to see a new person, not she's not a new person to me. I've known her for past 26 years, but it's
50:33
nice to see a person like starting to understand gaming and and noticing the similarity in mechanics. She's like,
50:39
"Oh, well that's a bit like this." I'm like, "Oh, look at you there. You've got the thing. Yes, that's yeah, that's
50:44
resource management. That's set collection or whatever." And it's really nice to see. I really like how gateway games kind of give you the little primer
50:51
to that. Like Project L is a really good one. She hasn't played that yet, but I'm sure she's going to like it. I'm going to
50:57
make a great game that is. Yeah, I really enjoyed that. It's really easy to understand. You can
51:02
only do a very set list of things and you're basically using Tetris pieces to fill a little shape. It's It couldn't be
51:09
easier. But your options are upgrade a thing to make a bigger piece. um pick
51:15
another silhouette shape. Yeah. Or you get to do that like mega powerful thing where you
51:21
can put a piece in each one. So it it's starting to teach you that kind of programming. Get all your ducks in a row
51:27
then boom do the special move. Like it's starting to teach you those things. And I put it in the same family as a zool. I
51:34
think a zool is a good gateway game. I love I love I've got the first edition of a zul where the first player token is
51:40
a cardboard token, not a tile. Oh. Um, so I've had it in my collection for
51:45
ages. Um, and um, I think Project L is just slightly better than us all. Fit,
51:51
but it sits same family for me. I'm talking about the original as well. But I mean, I like Stained Glass with
51:56
Cint as well. I've only played that once like that. I bought it after playing it once at your house, Dan. Actually, um,
52:02
Oh, how many times have you done that? Oh, yeah. I know. I can't remember getting as bad as Adrian is setting me, you know, games I like and more
52:08
ridiculously good looking. Well, I couldn't possibly comment on that. Um I I will.
52:16
Yeah. So it it means that I can't really remember how to play Cra, but I remember thinking, "Oh, I think I prefer this."
52:22
But now I've got no re no way of knowing why I preferred it. I owned all four and I sold the third
52:27
and fourth. Oh, okay. Because the first and the second just was just better ones for me. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
52:32
See, for me, I'm coming back to these games and experiencing them for the first time. How is that as a as a big boy game? I
52:39
don't look at them now as, oh, that's new and exciting. I look, that's nice and chill.
52:44
That's something I can do on my own. We played um Sigrada for the first time at this year's expo.
52:51
I love Sigrada. Sorry. Ironically, I think that's a game my wife would love. I think she would,
52:57
but she'd never admit it and never play it in front of me. So, so she'll be secretly playing
53:04
two-handed. I really like this. And every time I do this, I think my family would really enjoy this game. And then I got to fight
53:10
to get it to the table. I've got to go through I don't get it every second that I'm trying to do the
53:17
teach. We got to play the game and at the end of it they all go, "Yeah, that was really good." Do you know what I mean? There's so much
53:23
resistance to getting these games to the table, even though I know they'd really like them that I don't look at them as
53:30
my family would enjoy this. is like, would I want to do this when I've got a spare hour on my own? Yes or no? And
53:37
that for me is where I'm coming at these games from is, you know,
53:42
would would it make it would it be a good game for a game day or a convention game? So, you're not coming to it from
53:48
nostalgia cuz you don't have nostalgia for it. So, it's almost like you're I don't want to say discovering these games for the first time, but they're
53:53
not an introduction to it, but they're different. They're not Well,
53:58
you know, not every game has to be a really intense puzzle. It's funny though, you mentioned Cigar. For me, the reason why I don't like
54:04
Sigrad is because it's a gateway game. Really? Yeah. It's too light for me. It's too light for me. Chill. But it's something that like I
54:11
that's why I really enjoy 20 strong is because it's just something that I can sit on my own and just shut the world
54:17
out for an hour. I see why people like it, but it's just too it's too vanilla for me. So the next
54:22
one I go it is colorful but if I wanted something colorful with dice I could roll player. You can make anything strip you know
54:30
strip in front of it. Strip cig every time you place a a dice you take
54:37
off an item of clothing or something. We're not advocating strip. I just want to put that right out there.
54:42
I think we are. Yes we are. Um yeah. No you've now pricricked my interest on
54:48
the game. Maybe an item of clothing off the color of the dice you just put in or something. So, I don't know. But I've done my red pants.
54:54
There's ideas. But the fact that these gateway games are still around for me to enjoy Yeah. is kind of their testament, right? The
55:00
fact that they are still popular. They are still accessible. Um, you know, that makes me want to see
55:08
what they're about. So, yeah. And I think the the modern ones, the maybe not your ticket to ride
55:14
because that came out in 2004 or something. Flamecraft's a good one actually. Yeah,
55:20
I think it might be a little bit you've got to understand the not the
55:25
programming again. Well, I suppose it is programming, isn't it? You you're moving your thing. You then have to decide whether you upgrade that shop or you run
55:32
the this card, this card, this card. So, there has to be a little bit of forward thinking. So, I don't I don't think I'd
55:38
unless someone's really into dragons and I was using that as the the tag, the hook. Yeah.
55:44
I don't know. I don't know if I'd necessarily try and teach some flamecraft. Although, that teach I did
55:49
on your 24-hour board game marathon at 3:00 in the morning. Holy crap. That was that was not a good teach. I remember it
55:56
well. Yeah. So, I don't think I I'm sure Yeah. Sure. to watch somebody just crying inside their mind going, "What is
56:02
happening? Who am I?" After doing that teach then maybe I probably couldn't teach it to anybody
56:07
after that point because it was just so horrific. It is easy but I think you do need a little bit of understanding.
56:13
Not easy at 3:00 in the morning. No, it's not. No, I think you need a little bit of knowledge of mechanics for that. Like oh
56:20
I understand. You only need that to do it well. Yeah. You don't need it to play the game. Yeah, you're right. You're right. Yeah.
56:26
I think though it's maybe this is just coming from my point of view, but as someone who is competitive yet crap at
56:33
games, I a good combination. Yeah. It's great. Especially Especially when your husband's Andrew Curley.
56:39
Yeah. But I think when you're playing a game for the first time, you have to accept
56:44
you're probably not going to win, but there needs to be a little chance. Like it needs to not absolutely drop you to
56:51
all insanity. you need to have not a million points less than everybody else because then that feels quite punishing
56:56
and you feel like you're being crap. So I think with Flamecraft you could end up really far behind and that looks a bit
57:04
not satisfying like that would make quite a bad taste in your mouth. Whereas a Zull because you're making a little Yes, you've got a score marker but you
57:10
still got lots of tiles on your table. I don't know that probably wouldn't feel quite as bad to me. I prefer the first play of a game to the
57:16
second really. Yeah. The first game there is no pressure to do even well at it. Oh, see
57:21
I feel the opposite. I feel the same as you. Second the second play for I'm like, "Oh crap, I can't kind of know
57:27
what I'm doing now." It's taken me years to get to that level to that point in my mind that all I need
57:33
to do on the first play is push buttons, pull levers, and and just have a good
57:38
time. And then at the end of that go, do I like it? Yes, I do. Was it fun? Did I enjoy myself? Would I
57:45
play it again? Can I see what I would do if I played it again? Can I see it? do it, but can I just see the puzzle?
57:51
I think I'm I'm a bit more like that now. Can I see what I This is what you should have won. This is why you should have done it. I get that. But I think
57:59
I tend to do much better on the first play when I am just going I don't know, let's go yellow, for example. Then when
58:06
I feel like I should, oh, I've actually got a I understand what the point of it is now, right? Let me try a strate strategy. I've it. And then it
58:12
just is absolutely crap. I'm like, but I get to the third play and I have and I have indeed it. That annoys that
58:17
annoys me that I've played this twice. What am I doing? It starts building in the So, I think
58:23
you need to have be able to remove that somewhat for a gateway game, especially if it's
58:28
for someone who is a little bit resistant to playing any kind of sort of
58:34
not depend. It depends on their makeup, right? And their personality. Yeah, if you got an ultra competitive person
58:39
where score matters, then you might need to think about what games you're putting in front of them
58:44
cuz you might go, "Yeah, you've not played this type of game before. You're not likely to do well and therefore you
58:49
might come away going, never doing that again." Yeah, that's it. So, I think and I've done that with people with newbies. I've
58:55
done that. I think that's where co-op games really come to the front. And I think because we've got so much better co-op games now
59:02
perhaps than we ever have had, maybe they serve as better entry points now than Katan Carson. I remember my
59:08
first go of katan. I was controlling the the baddaddy or the robber or whatever he is. And it
59:15
just absolutely stopped Curly from being able to do anything at all, which was gleeful at the time. Now he didn't
59:20
really care because he was not putting all his eggs in one basket of loving katan because he's not really that bothered about it. But if that hadn't
59:26
have happened and he'd have absolutely wiped the floor with me like it was a complete random fluke that I controlled
59:31
the I didn't know what the point of it was like now I would intentionally be trying to stop him getting whatever it
59:37
is but if I had have lost really bad I think I probably still lost but if I had have lost really bad
59:43
would I be here now? Don't know. Yes. Yeah. Maybe you're right. You you you had very little choice in
59:48
that. Well, I don't know because for me and Curly it was, and I know we've told this story before, so this is the short
59:53
version, but for me and Curly, it was a way that we could when we kind of got back together, it was a way that we were
59:59
actively deciding we're going to do some stuff together. We're going to yeah, find a hobby that we both like. And we
1:00:06
both liked games of some description. He's obviously more of a video gamer. Um, I kind of liked puzzly games on
1:00:12
computers. And so it was something we actively sought out and yeah sort of carcasson and katan were the first
1:00:20
things like lots of people are. It's it's g there's enough complexity there but you know not to take it too
1:00:25
seriously. Yeah. Yeah. And that for me that that kind of when I'm in that mood or you know we we
1:00:30
played it the four of us didn't we me and Amy the last time I played it and Amy got to see how what a he is
1:00:38
when he's close to winning. You were nice already. Yeah. She thought he was really nice and he was like, "I got the longest row, bitch."
1:00:46
Call his wife a J. I probably did because you just sit the down. I think she was being one.
1:00:52
She might have been enough. Does it Does it bring out the worst in her? Yes. Yeah. The only reason why I didn't buy Katana
1:00:59
or invest in Katana is because because it was two players and I wanted to find a game that was maybe similar but for
1:01:04
two players so me and Vicki could play together. And that's why I went a Gricola. Yeah. And also the fact that work worker
1:01:10
placement, you mean you place something down and you block a space and you take an action. That sounds amazing.
1:01:16
Revolutionary. This is great. I've never heard of this mechanic before. Does it play well? Get the game. Oh my god, it does. It's so
1:01:21
great. It's not got dwarfs, though. Has it? It's not Ca. It's not Cavverna, but a Gria came first. Yes.
1:01:27
I've never played Cavverna. It's the same as a Gria. Only it's dwarfs. It's not the same. It's the same.
1:01:32
Let's Let's not get Don't No, that's a debate. That's a 15inut argument. We've done this before.
1:01:38
It's about the same. So, do you still play your first gateway game? I haven't for a while. And like you with
Do we still play our first gateway games?
1:01:47
Katan, I have moved it on, but took a while. You moved XCOM on.
1:01:52
Yeah, I've still got my copy. Um, and it's and I had the expansion for it, which is quite hard to get hold of. Hard to get.
1:01:58
Um, but no, I moved it on. Um, would I still play it? Yeah. Yeah, I would. Yeah. Um, but I felt like I got what I
1:02:06
needed out of it. I've finished it a number of times and yeah, it's I'm kind
1:02:11
of like I'm done with it and that's cool. It needs to fly and go away. It's someone else's gateway.
1:02:17
Gateway gateway is not a gateway. Rob, how about you? Do you still play yours? I'm just about to get rid of mine.
1:02:24
Oh, maybe we're all at this point then. We're all at the only because Arkham Horror the because it's the story narrative. Once you've
1:02:31
done the story, there's multiple ways of playing that game, but the story is going to be the same.
1:02:37
But I think it really shines through that that kind of game has stood strong for you. You love a storytelling. You
1:02:43
you love a narrative. Me sorting it out has gone, h Do I really want to sell it? Do I really want to sell it? And it's
1:02:49
it's going for a bargain price as well. So I'm like, oh, but no, it's time to get on. I'm never going to play it
1:02:55
again. We had an absolute blast playing that for over a year. Yeah.
1:03:00
And again for me it was a way of me and Alex who I played my Xbox pretty much
1:03:06
every single night with it in person. Yeah.
1:03:11
As well and us all four of us getting around the table and it was a real event. It was you know and
1:03:17
we played like what every other week because at the time there were only like two game nights.
1:03:22
Yeah. We It wasn't as frequent as it is now. It literally do every Fortnite. Are you sure? That's a bit crazy.
1:03:28
Yeah. to be to be honest three nights a week and the rest now it's mad but yeah you're right
1:03:33
and it was it was such a blast and and yeah and when I was sorting out all the cards for it and I've seen the artwork
1:03:39
again which is fantastic and I was yeah spot for Wendy
1:03:44
don't sell it then Wendy no I need to I need to make I I sell I sold a regular and regretted
1:03:49
it I'm I'm not going to bought it again I'm not going to play it again that's the problem I'm not if I was going to if
1:03:55
I was going to buy it again I'd probably buy mansions Yeah, fair enough. Same characters.
1:04:01
They had the first edition of Mansions and did enjoy it, but never never invested in the second, but the second is better because it's appdriven.
1:04:07
Yes. I was always We had this conversation the other day, right? I Yeah, it was when we were in Orcs Nest,
1:04:13
actually. It was when was in Orcs Nest. I kind of said I think second edition is the
1:04:19
better version of the game. Hands down. I can't argue with it. Y, but I weirdly still prefer the first.
1:04:25
And it's the reason is because you can play as the evil Yeah. And you can't play as an evil twine, don't you?
1:04:30
Like that character playing the the the malevolent um house or or whatever. The forces of evil
1:04:37
whilst all they go, "Oh, should we go into this room?" And you're like, "Trap."
1:04:42
And that is is so much fun when you're just trying to orchestrate evil and and get your grand plans out. Love it.
1:04:49
You can do that in Imperial Assault if you've got you can be the emperor, but it's just like it's not the same.
1:04:54
It's just really fun. And we've had some really good fun first edition Mansions game. The first time we played with Tambo.
1:05:01
Yeah, it was was Mansions. And JP was like, I'm really sorry. I know I've just met you today, but I'm going to have to kill
1:05:06
you. I'm really sorry, but you got to die. But I really have to murder you right
1:05:12
now. And the time where Chris when Chris was playing the villain and all these cultists were just walking by us. They
1:05:18
weren't attacking us or anything. We're like, Chris hasn't really understood the game. And then he gets them all into one room and they summon something. They all
1:05:24
summon this massive thing that just then like wipes us all and he's just sat there giggling.
1:05:31
Loved it. Love that. So yeah, real memory games. So um well it sounds like JP you still like
1:05:37
your style of first ever game that pressure that stress that oh I've got to okay maybe that it isn't a time kind of
1:05:43
constraint on you now but it's a complexity of my brain is melting because I've got this stress of trying
1:05:48
to figure out yeah what to do. I think it's that um it's that games that create
1:05:54
stories and memories and memories like you can always remember certain game night even those
1:06:00
one Rob's just mentioned it just takes me right back and the really warm fuzzy gaming moments where you know and I love
1:06:08
Euros I I will always play Euros and I have a satisfying Euro game it's a diff
1:06:14
it's kind of a different part of my brain that it satisfies where you got your other games like your Nemesis and
1:06:20
you know your mansions and the more thematic sides where we created this event and this night and we all did this
1:06:25
thing and you remember when that and remember when this and that. It's just still some of the reasons why
1:06:31
I do love those sorts of games. Um and it'd be quite sad if they all kind of
1:06:36
dissipated away and that is down to you know how I got in. Yeah. Because I didn't know it existed.
1:06:43
Twilight Imperium takes another part of your brain. Yeah. And that that just sits in the corner in the back. But yeah,
1:06:49
holding space. Holding space. Waiting for me. The third game I ever played was Game of Thrones.
1:06:56
The fourth game I ever played was um Battle Star. Yeah, true. I mean, it was the you know those so
1:07:02
very backstabby, very aggressive, which is not your favorite kind of game normally. Stories around the memories. The
1:07:08
memories the best times. Yeah, we always go back to memories of Game of
1:07:14
Thrones and we remember different games. Do you remember when we when we annihilated him on turn one? Yeah. You
1:07:19
know, it always goes back to those stories and and it's it's it's you know, Game of Thrones and games like that like
1:07:25
they create memories and ticket to ride although it's a gateway game, it still creates memories of bringing people into
1:07:31
the hobby. I've taught people ticket to ride and they brought and they've gone, "Oh, I've really enjoyed that. What else is there that I can play?" And that
1:07:38
leads to, you know, good memor. Yeah. Yeah. Come and look at my trench. Look inside my trench because look at all
1:07:43
these wonderful games on here. So, do you still stranger? Do you still own your sort of gateway
1:07:49
games? I know you just mentioned that you got rid of a Griller, but of Well, I re got I got a Griller again. Game of Thrones is kind not a gateway
1:07:56
game, but it's one of the early games I played. I've still got that. Of the three that I bought, Walking Dead, uh
1:08:01
Gears of War, and Civilization, I own none of them. Uh and I'm very sad about
1:08:08
two of those. I wish I still had them. Two of them are massively out of print. Absolutely. Absolutely. I wish I had
1:08:15
them still. That's why you don't sell your games, people. And there's a lesson to be learned. True. Do you know where I bought game? Do you
1:08:20
know where I bought Gears of War? Water St. Bristol. Wow. That's who had it. And I thought,
1:08:27
let's go this cuz I love Gears. Let's do it. And um I sold it. I guess I guess Stones
1:08:33
is probably a a more accessible and and easier shop to go into. Doesn't look
1:08:39
quite as maybe Oh, that looks like a bit of a dark dungeon.
1:08:45
It was Forbidden Planet back then. It was Forbidden Planet in Bristol in um in Cleveland that used to sell lots of
1:08:50
decent ball games. And I used to come buy the odd thing in there in the early days. Um and I think I bought um what
1:08:56
did I buy in? I bought um I bought some of the Mansions of Madness stuff in there. uh like first edition stuff. Um
1:09:04
but yeah, Water St. No, no, there was no decent water stones out there other than
1:09:09
the Bristol one cuz they sold some board games that were a little bit, you know, more hobby on the edge.
1:09:14
On the edge. But those places, the other kind of places you just mentioned can feel quite um uh daunting to go into if you're I'm
1:09:23
sure the people in there are lovely. Well, I know they are cuz I've worked next door to those people for many years of my life and had a great time. But it
1:09:30
can feel a bit gatekeepery. Not intentionally, I'm sure. But just literally walking through that door,
1:09:36
you got all these different sights and smells. Sometimes not quite as nice ones. And you can feel a little bit like, "Oh
1:09:43
god, everyone's looking at me. Oh no, I don't know what these things are. I don't know what to ask. I don't know
1:09:48
what they're like when I walk into a lingerie shop." Sure. I Exactly the same thing. Speak for
1:09:53
yourself. Yeah, I know exactly what to look for. I I bought in Forbidden Planet, I bought
1:09:59
the Resident Evil TCG game. Yeah. In there. Um, which is massively out of
1:10:05
print now. Sold that as well. Idiot. God damn. Keep them all forever and you'll never
1:10:10
have that happen to you. That was made by Bandai. Bandai made that. Wow. Yeah. And there was there was um there
1:10:17
was the main game. There was four different expansions and the artwork was was basically from the games and it was stunning. It was just it wasn't a TCG.
1:10:23
It was it was a deck builder deck building game. Yeah, I've heard about this. Uh, and it and I sold it. There it goes
1:10:28
for mega money now. Oh, you idiot. I had it all. I had it all. I had all of it and I and I loved it. Shame.
1:10:35
But I think as games become a little bit more mainstream, it opens it up, doesn't it? Party games
1:10:41
are massive now comparatively. Yeah. And I think that does kind of when you say you're a board gamer, you still
1:10:48
get kind of weird looks and oh, Monopoly a little bit, but people are a lot more
1:10:53
they they've heard of Cards Against Humanity, which I know is not necessarily a game that we would perhaps play in our hobby space, but it's shown
1:11:00
that there's more than you know the old adage that everyone always hear, you know, the Monopoly and
1:11:05
the Cludo and that sort of thing. So, I think it is I think gateways happening. It makes me laugh because when someone when people
1:11:12
when you tell people you're you're a hobby hobby board gamer, not with those words, but you say that I like board games and I play a lot of games about
1:11:18
different things or whatever. Um I get quite I get asked quite a lot, oh have
1:11:23
you ever played Cards Against Humanity? It's gone northern again. It's gone northern
1:11:29
and and then I just roll my eyes. Yeah. It's like it's not a game as an activity. It's been there, done that.
1:11:34
It's like for God's sake, you know, is at least people are aware of it. they've heard of it and they know it's
1:11:40
it's something that you do together like playing poker or something like I would put it in the same kind of category. Yeah. It's not a board game. It's it's
1:11:46
it's an activity you do together. Sometimes you get you get you get you get like a little little little
1:11:53
counterattack and you go, "Oh, I play board games." And they go, "Oh, have you played Wingspan?" And you go, "Oh, do you believe that? My ears are now
1:11:58
freaked out. I've heard my mating call. Let's go." And then and then and then then the conversation starts and then it
1:12:04
evolves from there. And then sometimes if you're lucky and they're a decent person, then bring them in now in your board gaming group. And
1:12:10
there we go. [Music]
TURN 4 - Connect Four
1:12:23
So our next section is connect four. This is where we take four random cards from a deck that Adrian carefully
1:12:29
created which has all sorts of gaming related words on it such as types of mechanics and components and genres and
1:12:35
stuff and we try to think of a game that can fit as many of the selected words as possible. Our randomly selected words
1:12:42
this time are sci-fi drafting movies/TV.
1:12:48
Got it. and mythology. Got sci-fi, mythology, and drafting and
1:12:54
movies. Got it. Feel wrong to play at home? Send in your
1:13:00
uh selected games. See if they're better than ours. So, we've got sci-fi, drafting movies/TV, and mythology.
1:13:07
Better still, if you're on the Discord, get in our episode chat channel and talk about what you've got as well.
1:13:14
Oh, this is While I say that, as I think my answers, I think I've got it. Go on. Oh. Oh, I think I might have it as well
1:13:20
and I've never even played this game. Go on, share. Rob got June Imperium. I I used that last episode. I know you
1:13:26
wouldn't know that. I wouldn't know that. You would know that. Um I mean, he's not wrong. Draft. He's not wrong.
1:13:31
Card draft. Draft. Card drafting. What do you draft in June Imperium? You buy from the market row. It's not a draft.
1:13:37
That's not a draft. That's a purchase of market. Drafting is like what you do in terraforming Mars. Draft. Draft.
1:13:44
You call me a fun sponge. Jesus Christ. start calling you. I think you're fine.
1:13:49
I think I think you find a rule. Official rule suggests that this is not section 4, paragraph 3A.
1:13:56
Thanki. You know what? I was venturing on that,
1:14:02
but that's only because it's got mythology and sci-fi. I have no idea if it's movies or TV. I don't think it's not a movie or TV.
1:14:08
Does it draft? But I don't think so. So that's a two out of four. I think that one.
1:14:13
I just can't think of anything with that. Ah, I mean, sci-fi and mythology is
1:14:19
troublesome together. Or I I potentially have got a tenuous other one. Go on. Let's hear your tenuous other
1:14:25
one. Star Wars deck builder. Oh,
1:14:31
well, yeah. Movies, TV, mythology, and sci-fi. Not sure you drafting that.
1:14:37
No, you're right. You don't. It's that drafting. Now, my brain's going. I think three out
1:14:42
of my brain's going. My brain's going hear the words. two with three out of four. Yeah. I mean, Terraforming Mars to me is
1:14:49
sci-fi, has drafting, and it is becoming a TV show or movie. Did I hear that?
1:14:55
Say what? Not. No, I've not heard it. I thought something happening with that was that was a joke.
1:15:01
Oh, okay. Well, because of the sheer number of things that have been made from that, I hope it was a joke. Google it. I'm going to Google it.
1:15:08
How could you make Terraforming Mars into a movie or a TV show? I know it became a book. What? It became a I think there's a book.
1:15:14
There's a role playing game. Obviously, there's a dice game, card game, and the main game. Role playing game. TM. Yeah.
1:15:20
Yay. Yeah, it's on. I think it's on Kickstart. I think that bypass me.
1:15:25
I'm asking AI. I can't I can't get off the fact that the answer should be raped.
1:15:32
Propedo. It could be all of them apart from drafting. Yeah, you can't draft. Can't draft. I'd like to resend my Terraforming Mars
1:15:39
movies and TV statement. I think it's Um, yeah. Okay. That's only two then, isn't
1:15:45
it? That's so I'm going to try and take mythology out in my brain. So, I'm just thinking of sci-fi movies and drafting.
1:15:51
There's got to be a a Star Trek game that involves drafting, right? Possibly. I just can't think.
1:15:58
There isn't many Star Trek games out there. I mean, other than Captain Star Wars, I'm sorry, not Star Trek.
1:16:03
Star Wars. Um, the other the other Star. I like both. I
1:16:08
like both. My brain more than Wars. I'm not going to lie. You froze a shoe.
1:16:15
More trek than wars. You know what? I think now I probably would say the same. That's kind of mad
1:16:21
cuz I love Star Wars as well. Seven of Nine is not in it's treason. Star Wars.
1:16:26
No, she's not in Star Wars. But she's great. Neither does Riker. Reiker and Seven of
1:16:32
Nine aren't in in it. I'm not interested in that. I know. It's hard to get the four, isn't it? Yeah. Last episode we nailed it.
1:16:37
But I think mythologyy's done us. Mythology is the problem. drafting. That's the problem for me. Either or.
1:16:44
Yeah. Well, I'm sure there is. I just can't think. Please put us out of our misery and um
1:16:49
send us your your uh solution to the drafting sci-fi movie/TV mythology
1:16:55
question. [Music]
TURN 5 - Penultimate Turn: What's Coming Up?
1:17:04
It's time for our penultimate turn. What has the next couple of weeks got in store for you all, JP?
1:17:10
Well, I think me and Dan are going to combo on this. Oh, we're going to combo. So, we're talking before recording. Um, so
1:17:16
basically our copies of Perseverance episode 3 and four have landed
1:17:21
in full force and um I Dinosaurs dinosaur heavy stuff. 20 kilos of it.
1:17:28
Dinosaurs dice saddles and dinosaurs. Ride on dinosaurs.
1:17:33
It's It's awesome. I mean, I played episode 3 um couple of years back and I haven't.
1:17:39
And then you're in for a treat. I know. I I deliberately waited. That's what I'm That's what I'm telling myself.
1:17:44
You're in for a treat. But I I got um Yeah, basically all of that sorted. And it spent Sunday just popping in and
1:17:51
sorting. It was great. It was a great time. How long were you there for? How long did it take? Cuz you had one and two as well, didn't you? Yeah, one and two and then three and
1:17:58
four. So I I think it was like three hours, three and a half hours. Question. Does one and two still have all the
1:18:03
standies? No, they've got rid. They've ditched cuz mine obviously has got all the standies. Imagine your old one did.
1:18:09
Yeah, ditched it. That's a good idea because it was a complete waste. Yeah, it was either do you want that or
1:18:14
that. Well, no, I want the minis. Yeah, cool. Um, so no, I I've booked in some gaming
1:18:22
sessions. So, I want to do episodes 1, 2, 3, and four. Mhm. And uh the game comes with a
1:18:28
chronicle uh expansion which was in the original uh episode one and two where
1:18:33
you just played like two games of episode one two games of episode two. I wasn't in love with the chronicle expansion
1:18:38
which I did recently. So I don't want to play one and two again. Yeah I'm I I liked it. I didn't love it.
1:18:43
But I love the individual games as what they're intended to be. But I will do the Chronicle expansion next year at
1:18:50
some point. But I just want to kind of go through standalone one because it's been a while. Two it's been a while.
1:18:55
Three. Woo. Awesome. And four I've never played. So, we've got those in the calendar. So, before Christmas
1:19:02
at some point. We'll get through them all and I'll chat about um Yeah. Experiences are episode
1:19:07
three and four. Chronicles next year definitely for me. Oh, I ain't got time for it this year. No, me either. The gaming calendar's already filled
1:19:13
right up till pretty much Christmas. I mean, we're October now recording. I haven't got time to fit in. I could I
1:19:19
could like do stuff at Gridcon, right? I could say, you know what, at Grid Con, I'm going to devote my whole weekend to
1:19:24
it. I just don't want to do that. That's too much. Could you get one to four in a day? You
1:19:31
probably could. You could start early. God, what a day. I I'd like to do that.
1:19:37
It'd be fun. Yeah, but I'd have to like really psych myself up for it. You'd have to start early.
1:19:42
I need people to cook for me. I need, you know, I didn't want to do anything else. I'd be mentally dead. But yeah,
1:19:47
but could you Yeah. Chronicle mode as well though. One to four. That's a lot in it. That is a lot in one day.
1:19:53
Yeah. Too much. And also if one person's running away with it, it might dampen the Yeah. the session, but maybe Wonderful without
1:20:00
Chronicle might be all right. And then just like you know who won the most separate games, see
1:20:05
what happens. Yeah. Nice. So that's looking forward to it. Yeah. Nice. James. Rob, how about you?
1:20:11
I've been playing a lot of solo games lately. Um we we still love you though. Sorry. You can't play with others. We do. And I
1:20:18
have been my diary has been every night I've been playing games. He's been in trouble with this.
1:20:24
I have. Yeah. Not in trouble, but she said like you're doing an awful me forever.
1:20:30
Last night it was every night. Wow. Like Monday, Wednesday, Thursday,
1:20:36
Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Gaming more than I am. And then this week it would have been
1:20:41
Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. Saturday. Yeah. You all right with me on Saturday?
1:20:47
I um about the Saturday coming. Yeah. Yeah. So um I've got a friend coming
1:20:53
over to play some Blood Bowl. So uh so yeah. So I'm my my days are
1:20:58
round. You're ch but I cannot stop thinking about Star Trek Captain Chair.
1:21:03
He's got the itch. every opportunity to get that to the table, I am taking with two hands and just slamming it on the
1:21:10
table and getting it played to the point where I've done something that I never ever thought I'd do is I've bought some
1:21:16
bling. Yes, Rob, I thought I didn't know you, but you're coming right back now. I've bought some bling and I got I got a
1:21:23
set for you, JP, as well, didn't I? It is very nice. So, there's a person on Etsy who's doing 3D printed um
1:21:29
exhaustion tokens because when you've got a small tableau on the table, twisting cards to indicate that you've
1:21:36
used them is fine. When it's rammed, trying to change one card is an absolute
1:21:41
nightmare. So, I thought I'll have a little look. Found a store online, upgrade my game. Um ordered them from
1:21:48
him, delivered real quick. really nice 3D printed um Starfleet. They Starfleet
1:21:54
signals. It's a Starfleet logo, aren't it? Yeah. And literally pop them on the table. They they were they weren't
1:22:00
overly expensive. They, you know, they're they're really nice for what they need to be. Um I messaged him to
1:22:07
ask questions. He was more than happy to answer back. So I I thought I'd give him a little shout out cuz they were really
1:22:13
nice pieces. Um, oh, I'm all happy and smiling now that you know
1:22:18
you're going on Etsy and you're doing it. Oh, love it. Rob, honestly, if I can get a playmat now or something like that, I'm all for it.
1:22:24
What is it called again? Cuz I'm interested to have a little sniffer. It's called upgrade my game on Etsy and
1:22:29
there's loads of bits on there which is which is awesome. Proud of you. Well, we we'll put him on um we'll put
1:22:35
the shop on the the show notes. Yeah, absolutely. People can have a look. He's really nice and the pieces are really cool. Um, and re like really
1:22:43
reasonably priced because I've seen some stuff on on there and it's so expensive.
1:22:48
I've had Yeah, I know. I wasn't going to mention it. Over 3D edition. There we go. I've ruined it. The whole set, but you can
1:22:55
play ridiculous amounts for Bling, but I love how you're starting on You Wait, how much was that? 300 quid. I don't even want it. I don't even want
1:23:02
to talk about it. It's your campaign ended now. Yeah. Yeah. It's done. It's girl math though cuz it's money
1:23:08
they didn't each. So, it's only it's 50% off. Come on, people. That's how it works.
1:23:13
And it's money they didn't spend in Florida. So, you know, when you think of it that way, it's free. Exactly, mate. I love
1:23:19
300 quid girl math. So, for me, yeah, Star Trek Captain Share. Nice. I'm glad you got the little blingy
1:23:25
bits. That's good. I look forward to using mine. Oddly puts a really exciting spin on it.
1:23:31
You're like, well, it's it's basically what Imperium had is exhaust tokens and Imperium you
1:23:37
get crazy tableau going on. So I was a bit like they missed a trick with with captain's chair.
1:23:43
So yeah, it's nice to just I've exhausting the card and put something on it. Everything stays where it needs to put
1:23:49
it. And it's simple and it's neat cuz it can become very especially when you got cards chaining beam to other cards so they're
1:23:56
under Yeah. And you know you got to turn a planet and it's got four other cards underneath it. It gets messy. Yeah. Yeah.
1:24:01
So um So yeah. So what about yourself? Uh well we're helping to run the Devon
1:24:06
board gaming weekend at the Foxner house. We are in Hersford Devon this October 17th to
1:24:12
19th probably already happened by now but in the crazy Tommy Wy recording a podcast that's what's in my mind.
1:24:18
You just Doctor Who quote. Yeah maybe a little didn't you wibbly wobbly.
1:24:23
I haven't printed the tickets out yet. I haven't printed the looking for players signed yet. So there's a lot of stuff to do and that's kind of sort of sitting on
1:24:30
my brain like do this now. That's along with our podcasting buddies at Devon Dice Podcast. So, and that just about
TURN 6 - The Final Turn
1:24:36
wraps up our episode for today. So, thanks so much to my fellow players around the table this evening, but most of all, thanks to our lovely listeners
1:24:43
for being there and downloading the podcast. A massive big thanks to our coffee supporters as always. Um, your
1:24:49
support really helps us to continue to make this podcast. We have got a coffee account, so if any of you feel like
1:24:54
subscribing or chucking us a few quid occasionally, you'll then be able to get the ability to help shape the episodes that we put out. And there's a special
1:25:00
coffee only section of our Discord channel, the rest of which is open to anybody. So, uh, look us up and jump on
1:25:06
in if you fancy it. As always, follow along with us all on the socials, the details of which are in the show notes
1:25:11
of this episode on whatever podcast player of choice you're listening to right now. So without further ado, whose
1:25:17
turn is it anyway?