Autism 360™
Autism 360™
Building Independence in Daily Living Skills
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welcome everyone. Hi, my name is Rachel Young and I'll be your host today. I am a board certified behavior analyst with over 15 years of experience working with children and adults with multiple neurodivergent diagnoses. And as someone who is neurodivergent myself, and as a parent of a neurodivergent child, I bring a personal and a professional perspective to our discussion today. Currently, I'm also working towards my doctorate in clinical psychology. So I am here, not just to share my knowledge, but to foster a supportive community where we can all learn and grow together. Today we are focusing on a crucial aspect of caregiving and development, and that is building independence in daily living skills. Our objective is to explore practical ways to support our children in acquiring the skills necessary for daily living from basic hygiene, To handling tasks and chores, we are going to discuss the appropriate stages to introduce these skills, how to effectively support their development and understand why this foundation is so critical for their future independence. The target audience that I'm really addressing today are the parents of neuro diverse children, but also anyone eager to learn more about fostering independence and neuro divergent individuals. So whether you're here to gain insights for personal application. or to enhance your professional toolkit. This webinar is really designed to equip you with actionable strategies that you can begin to apply right away. Okay this is our exploration of daily living skills or DLS, as you might say. Sometimes see it referred to these are the essential activities that are that every individual performs to effectively manage their personal needs, maintain the homes and engage with their community. And these are from personal care to household chores and community interactions. Mastering these skills are pivotal for fostering independence. Especially for individuals with autism and a lot of people ask, why are these skills so crucial? Why do we have to teach these? For starters, it's really critical to empower individuals to live independently and this reduces their reliance on. Other caregivers, moreover, mastering these skills significantly can enhance the individual's quality of life and pave their way for better opportunities and things like employment, education and social participation. Understanding and developing these skills can transform lives and really enable people to contribute meaningfully to their communities. So as we're deepening our exploration of the daily living skills, we want to consider the critical areas that make up these skills, the domains. So let's start with personal personal self care, which involves things like hygiene and grooming practices, like bathing, dressing, brushing teeth. These are foundational skills and not just about maintaining cleanliness, But it's really about fostering personal dignity and promoting health. If you can imagine fostering personal dignity is really important. Having somebody have to do these things for you on a daily basis can be really difficult for some people to have to do. There's domestic skills, which include all tasks necessary for household maintenance. So cooking, cleaning, doing laundry. These are activities that contribute to living in a well managed environment and they're really crucial for maintaining a healthy lifestyle. Finally, there's community skills, which are about effectively navigating social spaces, things like using public transportation, shopping, managing finances, even crossing the street can be 1 of them and these skills are really indispensable for just successful integration into the community at large. And they're really important for fostering a sense of independence. So we need to be able to understand these domains for. Individuals who are caregivers and individuals who are those providing therapeutic resources. So we can tailor our educational efforts a little bit more effectively and we can ensure that the people that we serve can lead more autonomous lives. Just a quick little interaction that I'd like to have with you guys. This is an opportunity for you guys to share some of your interests with the group. And on your screen, you're going to see some of the domains that I just talked about. So think for a moment, which one of these is really most important for your family to address. And I know this is a really difficult question because we have to address all of them at some point. But sometimes it's really important to prioritize which needs to get worked on first. So think for a moment before responding and so maybe categorize them one, two, three in your head and then enter in the chat like which one is the most important that you would find that you need to work on first in your family? Which one would you want to target first? Oh, personal care. That's a good one. Community skills. Yeah community skills is really good because there is those involve safety. Those involve safety skills, knowing how what, stranger danger, all those kinds of things. Personal care. That's super important. That involves things like, being able to toilet by themselves, being able to take a shower by themselves. So these are all things that are very important and individualized to each family, because sometimes kids can be really good with personal hygiene, but they're really not good with community skills. So you have to know which one to target individually. And you have to have that the targeted skills, there you go. 1, 2, 3. Perfect. There you go. Some people are saying, my, my kiddo is really young. So sometimes I go 1, 2, 3. That's a good response right there. We want to target personal care, domestic skills, community skills self care is important, followed closely by community skills and domestic. Everything's important though. So correct. Okay, so how do we assess all of these different things? The assessment tools that are used assessing daily living skills, it's really important. Primary tools that we use are things like the Vineland Adaptive Behavior Scale, which is an absolutely invaluable tool for measuring a wide range of adaptive behaviors across personal, domestic, and community scales. Another method that we employ is the Goal Attainment Scale, which helps us set and evaluate. Personalized goals based on an individual's baseline and performance. And our assessment doesn't just stop at the formal tools. It also includes direct observation. And so this is where we monitor how individuals manage tasks in real life settings. We'll go in and we'll see. Can the individual actually perform the task and can they do it without anybody's help? That's one of the biggest things is we want to make sure that there's nobody actually assisting because that's what's important. We want them to have this autonomy and this ability to do it independently. Parent and caregiver reports also play a crucial role in getting that insight from, hey, what is it that we need help with? What is it that where we feel like we're really good at? But what is it that we feel like we really are struggling with? And in some cases, individuals self reports are used and this allows the individual that we're working with to tell us from their own perspective, what capabilities they feel they have and what they feel their challenges are. So let's just really quickly talk about the developmental milestones and some of the expectations that we would want to see at each age. So understanding those development, these developmental milestones is really key in setting some realistic expectations and tailoring our support to that. effectively. In early childhood, so from ages like three to five years, our focus is on supporting basic self care tasks, such as feeding oneself, toileting with prompts, things like that. We don't want to not work on the other domains, however. We still want to bring them into the conscious awareness. As we move into middle childhood, so from 6 to 12 years, the goal shifts towards increasing independence and personal care, and then adding in some more of those simple household chores, such as making the bed or setting the table. During adolescence, from 13 to 18 years, we aim for mastery of more complex skills, such as cooking simple meals and Managing personal hygiene routines and by the time the individuals reach young adulthood at like 19 years or older, our focus really expands to achieving full independence in daily living tasks, managing finances and navigating community environments independently. And we want this progression so that it ensures each phase of development is supported with these targeted interventions that builds on the previous skill and paves the way for that whole lifetime of success and integration through the community. I have 1 more. A little listener engagement poll and this is just an opportunity for us to get a better idea of what age group that people are falling into similar to the last poll go ahead and put the the letter of where your family falls into, or if you have to put two letters, that's fine. ABC? So let's talk about the significant impact that independence has on enhancing self esteem and confidence. So for children and adolescents, especially with autism, mastering daily living skills is really transformative. Each skill learned and each task completed independently does more than just tick a little box. It cultivates a positive self image. And this growth in skills shows them that they're capable, which is a powerful boost to self confidence. The sense of empowerment that comes from this independence can't be overstated at all. When these individuals complete tasks by themselves, they don't just feel self sufficient. It's a sense of strength and Capability this empowerment can reduce their feelings of dependency on others, and it can foster a stronger sense of self and self identity. Each independent action serves as a motivation as well. It can propel them to set new goals for themselves and achieve more, which can contribute significantly to their personal growth and resilience. As we cultivate daily living skills, we're also promoting autonomy and self reliance. These are essential components for lifelong success, and these skills can teach decision making at a fundamental level. Imagine the daily boost in confidence when an individual can Finally, choose what they want to eat, or what they want to wear, or decide how they want to spend their day. This autonomy and decision making can allow them to navigate their daily activities and routines more independently. With each decision they make, they also learn about that responsibility and they begin to understand the, that their actions have consequences and this instills a sense of accountability for their own well being. As you can see, it has a lot of cognitive impacts. Another critical aspects of building these skills are the impact that it has on the family dynamic as individuals, especially on the spectrum, become more self reliant. This really relieves the burden on caregivers and it creates a more balanced and less stressful environment for the family. It really does allow the family dynamic to become a little bit less dominated by those caregiving duties. These types of skills are definitely ones that need to be promoted a little bit more. I feel in some of our therapeutic programs. There's definitely a lot of long term benefits to increasing our direct intervention on a lot of these skills as well. So the benefits of mastering daily living skills extend way beyond just the basics. The home and a lot of the skills that we're teaching so proficiency in these skills are directly linked to an improved quality of life in individuals who can live independently and manage their personal care and handle daily tasks. They're more likely to live with dignity, satisfaction, they gain independence, their opportunities for social interactions and community participation increase. This integration is crucial, and it enhances social inclusion, and it also reduces feelings of isolation. And it's also linked to reduced feelings of depression and anxiety as kids grow older the mastery of daily living skills has a profound impact on educational and employment outcomes as well. Being able to handle practical demands of these environments. makes a significant difference. It opens doors to new opportunities. It paves the way for success in various facets of life, and it can even improve personal and interpersonal relationships. So when to start teaching adaptive living skills. So as we want to start thinking about what to teach and when it's really essential to first identify the readiness in our children. So observing signs of interest in specific tasks is a crucial starting point. So what we want to start to watch for cues such as curiosity about daily tasks, attempts to imitate adult behaviors, even in the slightest. Or even a desire to try new activities. These might not be the same activities that you want the child to learn, but if they're willing to learn maybe an activity adjacent, that could be a gateway to learning more about similar activities. These signs can often indicate that a child is ready to start learning more about managing their own needs. So if a child's ready to start climbing into their own car seat, maybe that child is ready to start learning. Oh, okay. Maybe I can start buckling myself. First, that might lead to other safety concerns, but that's a movement towards autonomy. If a child is interested in picking out their own shoes, maybe they're starting, maybe they're beginning to become ready in learning how to tie their own Another key aspect to consider is whether the child has reached those certain developmental milestones that would support these new learning skills. Do they have the basic motor skills? Do they have at least some communication abilities? Or can we understand their communication abilities? Is there cognitive understanding of what it is that they need to do? All foundational for the daily living tasks that we might want them to start doing. Also we really don't want to hesitate to use those assessment tools that I mentioned. And if, we have somebody who has the ability to assess them, that is very important. You want to use these assessment tools. They are a guide for us. These tools are designed to gauge the child's current and abilities at comprehensively, and they can provide that clear indication of that readiness. So is the child ready to begin learning these things? I really want to talk about early intervention. Early intervention to begin teaching these skills. Somebody earlier on mentioned that, my kiddos really young. So I really want to focus on the personal hygiene tasks. That's great. We do want to start teaching those skills really early. But, early intervention for all of the domains is actually really important. It's highly beneficial, and it cannot be emphasized enough that early intervention exploits the critical developmental window during which the brain's plasticity is actually high enough, and it allows for more effective learning and skill acquisition. So by starting early, you can enhance the. Actual outcomes, the learning outcomes way more significantly, and this can actually reduce that gap that sometimes we see in our kiddos between their developmental skills and their chronological age early intervention programs often include parental support, which is amazing. And this is crucial because, having that parental support can actually equip the parents to support their child's development right in the house. So that way, it reinforces all of that learning, which is taking place, maybe somewhere else and it continues that learning and development 24 7, which is exactly what we want to see. Tailoring the approaches to each child's individual needs and developmental stages ensures the effectiveness of teaching the process. It's important to develop personalized intervention plans. So we can't just have a 1 size fits all. You actually have to personalize this to each child's developmental needs. And it has to consider the child's unique strengths, challenges, and their interests. A lot of our kiddos, they're not going to want to engage if they're not interested. And each plan should guide the child step by step across the progression of tasks, starting with simple activities and then gradually increasing in complexity as they master each level. Flexible strategies in this is going to be key. So they might need visual aids or video modeling or hands on practice. Adapting the methods to fit. Make a significant difference in how well the kiddos are going to learn the new skills. We really can't just have that one size fits all model with a lot of this. We really have to make sure that we're looking at each kiddo and we're breaking it down specifically for each one of them. So I know let's get to the part that I know everybody really wants to talk about. How do you actually teach the skills? So one of the most powerful approaches that I have seen or I have used in my own personal practice involves the use of visual supports and specifically one method that I really personally like is video modeling or video prompting and this is a particularly effective strategy. So this technique involves showing or having a video showing it to the child or showing it to the kiddo that models the task being performed correctly. And sometimes you can even take a video of the kiddo and edit out the parts that were done incorrectly. And so it's just one seamless video of the kiddo themselves doing the task correctly. And they're watching themselves perform the task correctly. and then they can do it themselves. It's almost as if we're capitalizing on them liking to watch videos, and so they're watching themselves, and then they're imitating that skill. We're capitalizing on that. They like doing that anyway, so they're going to watch themselves do it and maybe they'll use that. It actually has been shown to work very well. And the beauty of these videos is they can be paused and they can be replayed as needed. And it just is the same repeated clear instruction over and over again. And they significantly improve the independence of children with autism and in completing a lot of essential tasks like handwashing, tooth brushing, breaking down these tasks but it's actually really quite awesome. And now with the invention of, a lot of our phones can take these videos and they can we can do these videos ourselves. It's quite easy to make these ourselves at home. You can also make static picture schedules, which can serve as another effective tool. By using these visual schedules with static pictures just, it's just a picture of each little step by step, which you can take and you can make them at home, where you just, you do the task and you take a picture of yourself at each step. And this is a simple and cost effective little guide that can provide simple and consistent cues. And these visual aids can help kiddos just remember and follow each step task by task with very minimal props. Sometimes we just need to point to pictures and just say, Hey, there's the next step. There's the next step. So for example, if we're doing toothbrushing, sometimes it's just remembering to take the cap off or it's. Putting the toothpaste on. And so we're just pointing step by step. If it's putting the dishes away, sometimes it's just like a picture of where each type of glass or, item goes in each cupboard. And so you pick it up and you're like, all right, where does it go? Oh, it goes over here. So you're just the picture of where each one goes in the cupboard, glasses go where the glasses go, plates go where the plates go. And so sometimes it's just, that, and then you can remove those pictures after a little while. Another critical strategy involves behavioral interventions. Task analysis and chaining. Task analysis, it's something that can really easily be done at home. And it just breaks down a step or a complex task into smaller and more manageable steps. I know it, it seems brushing your teeth. It's just simple. You just put the stuff on and you scrub your teeth. But there's actually a lot of steps to it. If you think about it, you have to get the thing and you have to pick it up and you have to take the thing off and you have to do this and you have to squeeze it. There's a lot of steps to that if you think about it. And it can really get confusing sometimes for somebody who really doesn't understand what they're doing. Task analysis really helps to break down those steps into smaller, more manageable steps, and it teaches them individually. And that's why we have those picture cues. It helps to put those picture cues in order. So you might take a picture of each step of grab the toothpaste, Take off the top, put the top down. Sometimes we need it broken down into smaller, more manageable steps, and that's helpful. And this method can ensure that children with autism can understand and master each component of a task before moving on to the next, before they get that muscle memory. Chaining is also similar to this, where each step is then squished together and stuck on to the tail end of the last step, so you put the toothpaste on the toothbrush. What are you going to do with it now? Obviously, you need to put it in your mouth, so it's 1 step links to the next step links to the next step. And. There's different types that can be used. We either do forward chaining or backward chaining, and these are all things that can be taught to you if you have somebody who's working with you as a behavioralist. And these progressively build on each other as a sequence, and so it's just sequence stepping things together in very small steps. And so to reinforce these skills, positive reinforcement. Every time they get a little bit of that step, a little step complete, you want to use that positive reinforcement. Whether it's a tangible reward like a toy or social praise is huge. Just do it. High fives, hugs, giving them a little party every time they get a step correct access to preferred activities, jumping on the trampoline, stuff like that. Just providing those immediate reinforcers after a child successfully completes even just a little tiny step can really reinforce that desired behavior and that motivation will continue. Okay. The next 1 is involving parents in the teaching process. This is. Clutch parent implemented interventions, ensure that the child receives consistent practice and guidance in their natural environment. Honestly, we can't do any of the work that we do without parents. In these parent implemented interventions, parents are taught to use the strategies, such as the visual supports the task analysis, the reinforcements, and we're teaching you guys to use them at home. And additionally programs there's one like surviving and thriving in the real world. That was one that I read in the paper. They, these types of things offer concurrent sessions for parents and adolescents focusing on teaching specific skills and strategies for home practice. So what these programs do is they might have home sessions and they might have Sessions at a center and then they'll put these two things together and they'll see okay how do I, how do we mesh them together? And these things are for like teenagers and young adults, I believe. So these sessions will provide those practical skills and they'll also give parents the supportive community where we can learn from each other. Lastly, I do want to touch on leveraging technology through things like interactive apps, online games, things like this can dramatically enhance engagement and provide additional practice opportunities. These tools are tailored really to the individual learning preferences and their needs and it. really tags onto that whole fun and interactive way to learn these interact, these essential skills. All of our kiddos love to play games. And so why don't we just use that to our advantage? There's assistive devices and such as our tablets, they can deliver visual supports. They can use the video models. They can have interactive tasks. They're portable. They're versatile. They can be used in various settings and they're really good for skill development. There's also things like AI devices. There's the Oculus where you There's games on the Oculus that involve picking up things and putting it away. My daughter plays one. There's a lot of things that are out there right now, which actually integrate a lot of real world activities that can be used for applications such as this. So incorporating the technology that simulates real world scenarios where children can practice these skills in a controlled environment assists in bridging the gap between the learning and the practical application. There's a bunch of tablet applications out there as well, for the iPad, there's, the checkout. Games and things like that. These are all very fun for kids and they do assist in bridging that gap. So I do want to touch on modeling demonstration, consistency and routine. So demonstrating these tasks in real life settings is crucial. Not only does it allow children to observe the actions and the actions necessary but it also allows them to observe them in the context and the sequence in which the tasks are performed. This approach enhances both comprehension and practical application, providing children with a clearer understanding of how to integrate the skills into their daily lives. So this means that you have to actually model what you want for the kiddos to do. You can't just say, go do this. We have to show them. We have to demonstrate and we have to demonstrate in the environment. We have to show them what to do and how to do it first. Real life demonstrations offer these invaluable opportunities for the immediate practice and feedback. So it's I show and then you do. I show you do, and then as soon as you do, I will give you some feedback on how you did. And when you, when I give you feedback, then I want you to try it again. So that way you can implement the feedback and get it correct. And then we want to observe the task being performed and practicing it in the real world context, because we want to bridge the gap between the learning and the doing. We want to model it for them. We want to have them copy us doing it. We want to provide them feedback on it. We want to try, have them try it again. I also want to talk about the role of consistency and routine. Really establishing predictable routines is incredibly beneficial for children with autism. Consistency builds predictability, which in turn reduces the anxiety and predictability. Improves the child's ability to anticipate and understand what comes next in their day to day activities. I have to say that again. Consistency builds predictability, which in turn reduces anxiety. This is imperative. We really need to make sure that we are practicing things and doing things with consistency. When children know what to expect, their environment becomes less threatening, and then they can focus more on learning and less on navigating the unknown. This is a really important concept. We have to make sure that we have these routines because sometimes it's just really hard to understand what's going on around us, and so having that routine and that predictability is very important. And predictable routines create a structured environment that significantly supports children in learning and performing tasks. Not only does the structured approach help in managing daily activities, but it fosters a sense of security and confidence. The importance of consistent practice also cannot be overstated. Regular repetition and application of these skills reinforces their skill acquisition, helping them not only to develop, but also retain the skills. If you take that and you couple it with positive reinforcement, like praise or tangible rewards, all of that consistent practice encourages that ongoing effort and all of that skill acquisition. So this reinforcement solidifies the behaviors that are learned, and it just makes them a natural part of the child's routine. I know that sometimes there are some challenges in teaching, daily living skills. It comes with a set of challenges, and so here's some common difficulties that we have seen that parents and caregivers face along with effective strategies for overcoming them. I really just first wanted to address there's behavioral issues. Sometimes we have externalizing behaviors like aggression, noncompliance, tantrums. These can significantly hinder the teaching and practice of daily living skills. Sometimes it's just, we just don't want to do it. We're going to get out of it anyway we can. Sensory sensitivities this may cause distress during tasks like brushing teeth that doesn't feel good, wearing certain types of clothing, tags complicating, this complicates learning process another major challenge is the lack of motivation. So children with autism may show very little interest in daily living tasks or resist participating in them due to just a lack of intrinsic motivation. This can stall progress in learning essential skills. And then sometimes we do have that inconsistent practice due to busy family schedules. 1 parent's doing it 1 way and other parents doing it another different way. And sometimes there's just a lack of reinforcement. And so this impacts everything. So to address the behavioral issues using positive reinforcement, I can't get over it enough. There's a saying where reinforcement goes positive or behavior flows. So if you reinforce it, it's going to go that way. Whatever you reinforce, that's how the behavior is going to go. It goes along with the saying, you're going to catch more flies with honey than you do with vinegar. If you want that behavior to increase, you want to reinforcement. So use praise. Use anything that will, that your child is motivated or happy or makes them smile or laugh or giggle. Use positive reinforcement. When it comes to routines, you definitely want to establish consistent routines, and this will help you to reduce anxiety. You also want to make sure that you touch on finding sensory friendly items that your kiddo can work with. So maybe softer toothbrushes, whole mouth brushes, tagless shirts these might help with some of those sensory sensitivities. Personalized rewards. So this can increase motivation. And this is another big area. You want to make sure that you're asking your kiddo, what is it that they want to work for? What is it that's helpful to you? What is it that you want? You're not going to want to go to work if they're paying you in popcorn. You want to go to work if they're paying you in money. So it's really important for you to ask your kiddo what is it that they want to get paid in. So incorporating these things and then incorporating a variety of tasks and activities in the learning process to make sure that you keep things fun and engaging. You want to vary it up. Maybe have things like, okay do you want to do this task first or this task first? Ask them, Hey, we have to get all these things done today, but which one do you want to do first? Lets them have a little bit more agency. Giving them choices about which one lets them have that sense of control. And then again, ensuring consistent practice is crucial for skill development. Integrate daily living practices into a family's routine to ensure that there's these consistent opportunities for practice is really important. Having the communication between caregivers, whether it's mom and dad, whether it's Dad and grandma, whether it's babysitters, having all of that consistent communication, making sure that everybody is on the same page is really important. So making sure that you're having those, having that text message group, having those weekly emails, having that meeting down where everybody knows what we're doing. All of these different things can make sure that everybody is on the same page. And then lastly, the use of visual supports such as visual schedules and prompts can provide reminders and guidance. So that way not only the kiddos can stay on task, but it also helps the parents to stay on task and to do things similar ways. Here I have a few suggested resources. There's books, and these will be in the in the show notes. But so I have books teaching life skills to children with autism or Asperger's. There's the new social story book. Websites and online platforms are just some, Just a few general ones, Autism Speaks, National Autism Center, the Autism Society, and then mobile apps and technology. We do have a few minutes at this point for some questions. Some Q and a, we also have resources available. I've handmade all the resources myself. There's some really cool downloads available. So if anybody has any questions, please feel free to share. Okay. So we have how many hours how many hours screen time for a 9 year old? Honestly, it is completely up to the parent. It's up to the parents how much screen time is appropriate for that individual or for that child. If it's becoming a functional problem that's something that I believe that you can discuss with other care providers. But in this context, I don't have a personal say on it but if it's becoming an issue for learning, if it's becoming an issue for engaging and socializing, then that it needs to be reduced. Question my 15 year old, who is high functioning autistic wants to walk to the local large shopping center by herself, which is about half a kilometer away. Our area isn't too great. And sometimes we have some interesting people in the area. We have had assaults and even a murder happened there. I'm not too keen on the idea, but she says I can't keep her wrapped up in cotton wool. I let her go to the city with friends, et cetera, and other shopping centers with friends. Just not keen on her walking alone. What are your views on this? Am I being overly cautious? I don't want to let my guard down as I would never forgive myself. So I cannot give you any personal recommendations. That is completely up to you. However some of the things that I would think about when you are trying to teach these skills do we have the knowledge of safe versus dangerous? So do we understand okay, I can be safe with crossing the streets, right? I can do that. So do you feel comfortable with that? Do you feel comfortable that she's okay to walk alone in a safe neighborhood? Do you feel comfortable that she knows how to defend herself or reject people who she doesn't want speaking to her? Is she not naive enough to speak to people who she shouldn't be speaking to? I just think that's the thing that I'm trying to get at. My brain's not functioning at the moment. Stacy says she wants to make a comment. Go ahead. Stacy needs more. Okay. I just wanted to chime in because I actually worked on this recently. And so just, like I said, we can't individualize it. However, these are some of the things that came up 1, respecting the fact that, Your child is becoming an adult and wants to have some independence. That's a good thing, right? But as parents, we worry about our Children. We always think it's safe to have. It's easier when they grow up, but when they grow up, they're away from us. So it's a little harder, right? Because we have to relinquish that sort of protection, which is difficult. I have, grown children now, so I understand. One of the things that we worked out was parent and teen sat down and came up with a list of why it was important for them almost like stating your case, right? 3 reasons why this is important to you, 3 reasons why I'm resisting. And then with the safety coming up with
GMT20240530-010059_Recording_as_1600x900:guidelines, there's just 3
GMT20240530-010059_Recording_avo_640x360:For example, it could be, I want to FaceTime you, you don't have to look at me, but I want to see what's going on around while you're walking, or I want to track you to make sure that's the deal, right? You can go, but I want to track you. So something it's coming up with the balance of. something that works for both folks, right? So that the person feels like they can have some independence because that's part of growing up, but also the parents feel secure with knowing their child is safe, which is extremely important for us as parents. But also knowing that you are, I love the fact that you're asking this question because it's hard to let go of our kids when they grow up. So respecting that you want to allow your child to be independent. And that's a good thing. But how do I keep myself from not oh, my gosh, I want to bubble wrap. My boys are 25 and 27. if I could bubble wrap them, I would right. I live in America. They're very tall black males. I would love to bubble wrap them and be with them forever. But I can't do that because apparently they need to have a life. So coming up with your. Autistic individuals need to know the why so putting that down concretely having a little meeting about that. It's not about convincing the other person and then coming up with addressing those concerns and problem solving them and using technology. For a benefit coming up with guidelines, does that make a little sense? Yeah, that's definitely a good 1. A lot of it hinges upon, do you feel you feel like your child is a capable? Do you feel as if, using technology would work and then like Stacy was saying, wean them into it. And we need yourself out of it. So getting to the point where, you know, using that technology and having those things. And then maybe the 1st, couple of times, okay, my deal with you is that the 1st, couple of times you want to do this. Okay. We use you use the tracker or, my mom would have gone behind me in the car. But, but that was the deal. The first 2 times I'm going to walk, I'm going to drive behind you in the car just to make sure you're not dead. But then, after that, okay, I know you can do it. Now you're on your own, but back in the day, we didn't have technology. But this is, these are some things that you want to discuss with your kiddo and see, okay what's going to work for you and what's going to work for me. And it's not just dropping them into deep end of the pool. It's coming up with different ideas of how can we work together to make this to make you independent, but also every make sure you're going to be safe about it. And I, and this is the last thing I'll say, I'm so sorry. I think the key to remember is. The nature of the developmental stage of teenagers is to push back. That is what they're supposed to do, right? They're becoming into their own. They're like giant toddlers. So think, they're just bigger and they smell worse. But thinking in terms of the more we say, No, you cannot, they're going to find a way, and then that's really dangerous. So coming up with the plan, like Rachel said, sitting down and saying, okay, where's the compromise? How do we take these steps? Because they are going to find a way when teenagers are motivated, they find ways to do things because they're teenagers. That's why it's stressful when you're parenting teenagers. So thinking of what works for you guys within I guess my point is to definitely have the conversation because it's something there's got to be some kind of compromise so that everybody's. Just because it's teenagers and I'm done. I'm going to mute and stop forever. Right now. One last question we have at what age should I start introducing my child to public transportation and how do I prepare them for it? So that's a great question. So remember that we want to model the actions first, and then we want to have them, we want to wean them into it and wean ourselves out of it. You can introduce your child to public transportation at any age. You can take them on the bus or the train as young as you want but if you do it consistently, they're going to see how to do it and they're going to Watch you as you do the steps, and then as they're getting older, you can tell them, okay, now it's your turn, you put the money in, you do this, and then they learn the steps by watching you. So every time you go on, every time you do the public transportation, you say, okay, here's how we do it. Now I want you to do it. For example, if you're trying to have your child ride the bus. Okay, we need to go. From here to here, I need you to look up, sit down with me, we're going to look up the route together. What do I click? Where should I go? What's the website called? Or whatever it is, however you're looking it up. So these are all different ways these are all different ways that you can have your child engage with you. So here, watch me. Now watch me do it again. Now, I want you to do it. So every time you do it, you have them incorporate some of the skills. Do you remember what I did last time? Okay, how do I do it? But you can help them. You don't just throw them into the deep and you help them. Okay, click here, do this. Now, where does the money go when we get on the bus? Give them your pass. You want to make sure you're having them do it step by step until you're watching them do it independently, all by themselves, every time. Another Q& A is, what is your preference as far as teaching gestures, hand signs? I love gestures. You always have your hands on you. Always. I always have my hands. They're always right here. So I will never, I might forget my tablet. I might forget my textbook, but I will never forget my hands. If I forget my hands, there's a problem. Definitely. I love that. I'm not an SLP, but personally, my hands are always here with me. So if I need hand signs, I have them. I think that's a great. That's my personal preference, but I'm not an SLP. What is the best therapist to help kids with self help skills for kiddos who have motor planning challenges? So that would be an occupational therapist, but an occupational therapist and a behavioral therapist can also work hand in hand together. Hopefully I got all of those questions answered. I would definitely recommend on the question with the gestures and the hand signs. I would definitely recommend speaking to an SLP, but I think they might have a similar answer because you always have your hands. That's my thing. Depends on their motor skills. I think that's it. And I think we are at the end of our meeting time. But yes, thank you everybody for coming today. Thank you for attending this webinar.